{"type":"rich","version":"1.0","provider_name":"Transistor","provider_url":"https://transistor.fm","author_name":"80,000 Hours Podcast","title":"#144 – Athena Aktipis on why cancer is actually one of our universe's most fundamental phenomena","html":"","width":"100%","height":180,"duration":11757,"description":"What’s the opposite of cancer? \r\n\r\nIf you answered “cure,” “antidote,” or “antivenom” — you’ve obviously been reading the antonym section at www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/cancer. \r\n\r\nBut today’s guest Athena Aktipis says that the opposite of cancer is us: it's having a functional multicellular body that’s cooperating effectively in order to make that multicellular body function. \r\n\r\nIf, like us, you found her answer far more satisfying than the dictionary, maybe you could consider closing your dozens of merriam-webster.com tabs, and start listening to this podcast instead. \r\n\r\nLinks to learn more, summary and full transcript. \r\n\r\nAs Athena explains in her book The Cheating Cell, what we see with cancer is a breakdown in each of the foundations of cooperation that allowed multicellularity to arise: \r\n\r\n• Cells will proliferate when they shouldn't. \r\n• Cells won't die when they should. \r\n• Cells won't engage in the kind of division of labour that they should. \r\n• Cells won’t do the jobs that they're supposed to do. \r\n• Cells will monopolise resources. \r\n• And cells will trash the environment. \r\n\r\nWhen we think about animals in the wild, or even bacteria living inside our cells, we understand that they're facing evolutionary pressures to figure out how they can replicate more; how they can get more resources; and how they can avoid predators — like lions, or antibiotics. \r\n\r\nWe don’t normally think of individual cells as acting as if they have their own interests like this. But cancer cells are actually facing similar kinds of evolutionary pressures within our bodies, with one major difference: they replicate much, much faster. \r\n\r\nIncredibly, the opportunity for evolution by natural selection to operate just over the course of cancer progression is easily faster than all of the evolutionary time that we have had as humans since *Homo sapiens* came about. \r\n\r\nHere’s a quote from Athena: \r\n\r\n“So you have to shift your thinking to be like: the body is a world with...","thumbnail_url":"https://img.transistorcdn.com/VO1STE7hN95RRg9QdLo4soV2VhhbR9PF5ZZlRhDYcwE/rs:fill:0:0:1/w:400/h:400/q:60/mb:500000/aHR0cHM6Ly9pbWct/dXBsb2FkLXByb2R1/Y3Rpb24udHJhbnNp/c3Rvci5mbS9zaG93/LzQxNDAyLzE2ODM1/NDQ1NDAtYXJ0d29y/ay5qcGc.webp","thumbnail_width":300,"thumbnail_height":300}