{"type":"rich","version":"1.0","provider_name":"Transistor","provider_url":"https://transistor.fm","author_name":"The Question: Design System Collaborative Learning","title":"Episode 072 Deep Dive: Extreme Design System Support with Ben Callahan and Doug Neiner","html":"","width":"100%","height":180,"duration":3054,"description":"Episode 072 Deep Dive: Extreme Design System Support with Ben Callahan and Doug NeinerHost Ben Callahan is joined by co-host Doug Niner, a design system practitioner at Planview, to explore extreme design system support—what it looks like, what gets in the way, and what truly moves the needle with consuming teams. The survey was sent to 1,081 design system practitioners and received 49 responses across four questions: what support do you currently offer; how would you change your program if unconstrained; what prevents better support; and share a story of going above and beyond. The conversation covers the surprising prevalence of dev environment access, the rarity and outsized impact of embedding, the tension between high-touch support and burnout, and why building trust may matter more than any specific tactic.Show Notes00:00 - Introduction and welcome 00:37 - Guest background: Doug Niner on getting into design systems at Planview 01:38 - Topic framing: what is \"extreme design system support\"? 02:07 - Survey overview: the four questions asked 03:34 - Survey stats: 1,081 sent, 49 responses 03:59 - Q1 findings: what support are teams currently offering? 04:30 - Reactions: video vs. written docs, dev environment access 05:27 - Video documentation: perfectionism vs. \"good enough\" screen recordings 06:25 - Q3 findings: headcount, bandwidth, and competing priorities dominate 07:17 - Key insight: teams know what good looks like but lack people and time 09:10 - Embedding: high effort, but potentially exponential impact through advocacy 10:10 - Community discussion: what does \"embedding\" actually mean? 11:07 - Sean shares his team's embedding process: runbooks and buddy systems 15:36 - Alexander: forward embedding failures vs. reverse embedding wins 17:53 - Reverse embedding: consuming team members join the design system team 19:50 - Disruption and ROI: is onboarding a stream of embeds worth it? 21:16 - Turning embedded team members into lasting design system...","thumbnail_url":"https://img.transistorcdn.com/8ZoZhDyVederAFF-YGuNFdyaUvqzao3a6rYS6VFp3F4/rs:fill:0:0:1/w:400/h:400/q:60/mb:500000/aHR0cHM6Ly9pbWct/dXBsb2FkLXByb2R1/Y3Rpb24udHJhbnNp/c3Rvci5mbS9kMjQ2/MjJjYzdiYmY4MWU0/NGQzMjJmOGUyNzlj/YmMwZS5wbmc.webp","thumbnail_width":300,"thumbnail_height":300}