{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":6.25,"endTime":10.09,"body":"Welcome to Demystifying Instructional Design, a podcast where I interview"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":10.09,"endTime":14.05,"body":"various instructional designers to figure out what instructional designers do."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":14.17,"endTime":16.36,"body":"I'm Rebecca Hogue, your podcast host."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":16.69,"endTime":20.98,"body":"If you enjoyed this podcast, please consider subscribing or leaving"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":20.98,"endTime":23.92,"body":"a comment on the show notes blog post and consider"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":23.92,"endTime":26.92,"body":"helping to support the podcast with a donation to my"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":26.92,"endTime":27.97,"body":"Patreon account."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":28.76,"endTime":32.78,"body":"Welcome, Jeremy, to Demystifying Instructional Design, a podcast where I"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":32.78,"endTime":35.36,"body":"interview instructional designers about what they do."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":35.39,"endTime":37.1,"body":"My first question for you is going to be can"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":37.1,"endTime":38.78,"body":"you tell us a little bit about yourself?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":38.99,"endTime":40.31,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":40.31,"endTime":42.14,"body":"And thank you for having me here, Rebecca."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":42.2,"endTime":46.28,"body":"I've listened to a few episodes and I love what"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":46.28,"endTime":49.1,"body":"I'm hearing from it and I'm so excited to join"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":49.1,"endTime":50.87,"body":"the space, join the conversation."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":50.87,"endTime":53.3,"body":"So my name's Jeremy Tuttle."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":53.48,"endTime":58.01,"body":"I'm the Director of Learning Design at Niche Academy or"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":58.01,"endTime":61.61,"body":"Niche Academy, depending on where you live or whether you"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":61.61,"endTime":63.05,"body":"call it a creek or a crick."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":63.05,"endTime":67.97,"body":"Niche Academy provides a learning management system and content"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":67.97,"endTime":70.76,"body":"creation tool primarily to public libraries."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":70.76,"endTime":73.37,"body":"But we can be used by anybody."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":73.55,"endTime":80.33,"body":"And my role within the company is providing learning materials,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":80.33,"endTime":83.72,"body":"what we call tutorials, to our customers."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":83.96,"endTime":84.62,"body":"Awesome."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":84.62,"endTime":87.05,"body":"And can you tell us a little bit about how"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":87.05,"endTime":89.27,"body":"you got to where you are today?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":89.69,"endTime":90.71,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":90.71,"endTime":96.86,"body":"So I started my career back in 2009 working for"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":96.86,"endTime":99.8,"body":"a company called School Improvement Network."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":99.8,"endTime":104.36,"body":"And I started at the very bottom, very bottom rung"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":104.36,"endTime":104.99,"body":"of the ladder."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":104.99,"endTime":110.51,"body":"I was a transcriptionist, so the film crew would go"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":110.51,"endTime":112.7,"body":"out to a location, they'd film something, they'd bring it"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":112.7,"endTime":117.4,"body":"back as well before AI generated transcripts of videos."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":117.41,"endTime":119.48,"body":"So I had to sit down in front of that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":119.48,"endTime":122.99,"body":"computer for four hours a day and type out what"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":122.99,"endTime":124.28,"body":"people were saying."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":124.28,"endTime":127.07,"body":"And fun fact, if you want to get better at"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":127.07,"endTime":129.19,"body":"typing, become a transcriptionist."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":129.2,"endTime":132.41,"body":"I started that job typing 30 words per minute."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":132.41,"endTime":135.29,"body":"I ended at 75 words per minute."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":135.29,"endTime":136.91,"body":"So highly, highly recommend."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":136.91,"endTime":139.46,"body":"As I was working there, I was getting a degree"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":139.46,"endTime":143.0,"body":"in digital film and video production and my plan was"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":143.0,"endTime":146.93,"body":"to move from that transcriptionist position to working on the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":146.93,"endTime":148.61,"body":"film crew in some capacity."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":148.61,"endTime":149.84,"body":"And that's exactly what happened."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":149.84,"endTime":151.94,"body":"I graduated with my bachelor's."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":151.94,"endTime":154.28,"body":"They pulled me on full time and I became an"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":154.28,"endTime":155.42,"body":"assistant editor."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":155.42,"endTime":161.21,"body":"So the videos that School Improvement Network produced was professional"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":161.21,"endTime":165.7,"body":"development videos for teachers, specifically K through 12."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":165.71,"endTime":169.52,"body":"They go find master teachers, figure out how they were"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":169.52,"endTime":174.47,"body":"teaching their best practices, how they incorporated standards, all that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":174.47,"endTime":175.28,"body":"good stuff."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":175.43,"endTime":179.56,"body":"So as I was editing these videos, I started like"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":179.66,"endTime":182.66,"body":"kind of hooking on to to the concepts."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":182.66,"endTime":186.35,"body":"It became interesting to me to see how a specific"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":186.35,"endTime":189.74,"body":"teacher would handle a certain situation or how they present"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":189.74,"endTime":192.17,"body":"information differently from a different teacher."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":192.5,"endTime":196.01,"body":"And over time, the higher ups at the company noticed"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":196.01,"endTime":198.47,"body":"that I was taking an interest and they started to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":198.47,"endTime":199.46,"body":"feed that interest."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":199.47,"endTime":202.64,"body":"I started getting reading assignments and the first one that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":202.64,"endTime":205.01,"body":"I got was, Why are All the Black Kids Sitting"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":205.01,"endTime":206.36,"body":"Together in the Cafeteria?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":206.36,"endTime":212.48,"body":"by Beverly Tatum. A fantastic book, fantastic read on the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":212.48,"endTime":214.73,"body":"impact of race and education."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":214.73,"endTime":218.24,"body":"And once they saw that I actually engaged with the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":218.24,"endTime":220.88,"body":"material, they decided to give me a promotion."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":220.88,"endTime":223.73,"body":"They promoted me to being a writer of the videos,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":223.94,"endTime":228.02,"body":"and that was a really steep learning curve, trying to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":228.14,"endTime":231.8,"body":"effectively teach teachers how to teach, though I've never taught"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":231.8,"endTime":239.27,"body":"myself and it's a really high bar and I spent"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":239.27,"endTime":241.85,"body":"the first year just learning as much as I could."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":241.85,"endTime":245.66,"body":"Luckily, I'd spent the previous five to six years observing"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":245.66,"endTime":249.56,"body":"teachers, whether it was through the transcriptioning, or through the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":249.56,"endTime":250.79,"body":"editing process."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":250.79,"endTime":253.67,"body":"So I had a general,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":253.67,"endTime":258.109,"body":"I absorbed that information over time, but it really took"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":258.109,"endTime":260.93,"body":"actually teaching to really get a grasp."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":260.93,"endTime":267.08,"body":"So I taught film to middle schoolers for two years."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":267.08,"endTime":270.11,"body":"It was through what was called a Discovery Program at"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":270.11,"endTime":272.3,"body":"a local elementary middle school."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":272.63,"endTime":278.12,"body":"And that that was a really fun time, not only"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":278.12,"endTime":282.59,"body":"developing my own curriculum for the class, my own materials,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":282.59,"endTime":286.52,"body":"getting to talk with all the students, see them in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":286.52,"endTime":290.96,"body":"real time, engage with the materials I provided, that I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":290.96,"endTime":296.06,"body":"just I loved seeing that, loved seeing them become better filmmakers,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":296.06,"endTime":299.81,"body":"you know, even though they were ages 9 to 14,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":299.81,"endTime":301.25,"body":"I had a full range."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":301.25,"endTime":304.19,"body":"It was fifth to ninth grade in that class."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":304.19,"endTime":307.16,"body":"And when I did that, I realized maybe this"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":307.16,"endTime":308.96,"body":"is something that I could do more of."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":308.96,"endTime":311.81,"body":"And around the time that I finished with the class,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":311.81,"endTime":315.23,"body":"there was a restructuring at School Improvement Network to where"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":315.23,"endTime":317.63,"body":"we were no longer just providing instructional videos."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":317.63,"endTime":321.11,"body":"We were going to become the learning experience team."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":321.11,"endTime":323.81,"body":"And as part of that transition, I then became a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":323.81,"endTime":325.16,"body":"curriculum developer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":325.37,"endTime":328.04,"body":"I had to take on research."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":328.42,"endTime":333.7,"body":"responsibilities, had to start thinking about how you design for"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":333.7,"endTime":336.94,"body":"online learning, not just video itself."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":337.0,"endTime":339.25,"body":"Video can be a good part of it, but that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":339.25,"endTime":344.02,"body":"doesn't necessarily make it the best piece to deliver something."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":344.02,"endTime":347.95,"body":"And from there I had a great nurturing environment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":347.95,"endTime":351.79,"body":"Great bosses who saw potential in me that I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":351.79,"endTime":354.94,"body":"didn't see myself, continued to feed me more books,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":354.94,"endTime":358.0,"body":"and I wound up near the end of my tenure"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":358.0,"endTime":363.94,"body":"there developing a couple micro-credentials specifically on rubrics and criteria"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":364.15,"endTime":366.55,"body":"and formative and summative assessment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":366.55,"endTime":368.65,"body":"Those two are my favorite ones."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":368.65,"endTime":371.83,"body":"And then the company got sold to another company and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":371.83,"endTime":375.13,"body":"I lost my job more or less, so needing to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":375.13,"endTime":375.94,"body":"go somewhere else."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":375.94,"endTime":378.64,"body":"I had been doing some contract work with Niche Academy"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":378.64,"endTime":383.62,"body":"writing tutorials for their public library customers."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":383.77,"endTime":387.1,"body":"They brought me on and a couple of years later"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":387.1,"endTime":389.89,"body":"we're where we are now and we're building, in my"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":389.89,"endTime":394.54,"body":"opinion, some of the best distance asynchronous learning materials that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":394.54,"endTime":395.32,"body":"you can find."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":395.32,"endTime":397.81,"body":"And I'm super proud of the team that we have."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":398.59,"endTime":401.17,"body":"Can you tell me a little bit more about the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":401.17,"endTime":402.28,"body":"Micro-credentials?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":402.28,"endTime":403.57,"body":"Like what does that entail?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":403.57,"endTime":405.76,"body":"What does it mean to say that you were creating"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":405.76,"endTime":406.96,"body":"Micro-credentials?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":406.99,"endTime":407.89,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":407.89,"endTime":409.35,"body":"Great question."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":409.36,"endTime":414.7,"body":"So the micro-credentials that we were producing at School Improvement"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":414.7,"endTime":421.99,"body":"Network specifically focused on discrete skills for teachers that needed"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":421.99,"endTime":425.38,"body":"more than just a small bit of information."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":425.6,"endTime":430.0,"body":"There was a lot of microlearning discussion rolling around at the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":430.0,"endTime":435.31,"body":"time, and while we did provide Microlearning pieces, the micro-"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":435.31,"endTime":439.57,"body":"credential was meant to really pull a bunch of things"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":439.57,"endTime":444.61,"body":"together, create a solid understanding, and then also the credential"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":444.61,"endTime":447.4,"body":"part of the micro-credential, there was a credentialing process,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":447.4,"endTime":453.07,"body":"so we weren't looking to produce a college level course"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":453.07,"endTime":458.44,"body":"experience, but something that if you had strung multiple micro-credentials"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":458.44,"endTime":462.82,"body":"together, it could equate to a college level course and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":462.82,"endTime":467.92,"body":"the company provided assessors, creditors, all that stuff."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":467.92,"endTime":471.13,"body":"I can't remember the exact details of who was credentialing"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":471.13,"endTime":472.93,"body":"us, but it wasn't ourselves."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":472.93,"endTime":478.54,"body":"And the I'll talk about the formative and summative micro-credentials"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":478.54,"endTime":479.89,"body":"because that one was my favorite."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":479.89,"endTime":482.47,"body":"I'm one of the few instructional designers who hears the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":482.47,"endTime":484.33,"body":"word assessment and I perk my ears and go, oh"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":484.33,"endTime":486.91,"body":"yes, you want to talk, you want to talk assessment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":486.91,"endTime":487.42,"body":"I love it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":487.42,"endTime":492.76,"body":"So that one was encouraging teachers to think outside of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":492.76,"endTime":496.27,"body":"how they did traditional formative and summative assessment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":496.27,"endTime":499.57,"body":"If you go back to your childhood years, it seems"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":499.57,"endTime":501.94,"body":"to be ever present, no matter how old you are,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":501.97,"endTime":504.4,"body":"that the teacher would give you a piece of paper"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":504.4,"endTime":505.9,"body":"with a couple of questions."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":505.9,"endTime":508.93,"body":"You answer the questions that would be your quiz, and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":508.93,"endTime":510.91,"body":"they would treat that as their formative assessment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":510.91,"endTime":513.07,"body":"And then at the very end, there was either a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":513.07,"endTime":517.9,"body":"test or an essay, sometimes a portfolio, but not too"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":517.9,"endTime":518.409,"body":"often."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":518.409,"endTime":523.12,"body":"And those are perfectly fine, suitable assessments."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":523.599,"endTime":526.48,"body":"But there's so many more ways you can get that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":526.48,"endTime":527.2,"body":"across."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":527.2,"endTime":529.96,"body":"Get that information to yourself, get the information back to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":529.96,"endTime":530.77,"body":"the students."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":530.77,"endTime":535.06,"body":"So we were encouraging our learners, the teachers, to apply"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":535.06,"endTime":536.02,"body":"different methods."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":536.02,"endTime":539.38,"body":"So the course material is focused on the difference between"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":539.38,"endTime":542.62,"body":"binary multiple choice questions if you have to go that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":542.62,"endTime":543.31,"body":"kind of route."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":543.31,"endTime":547.63,"body":"And also when a short answer versus a long form"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":547.63,"endTime":552.19,"body":"answer would be better in a more qualitative assessment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":552.19,"endTime":557.05,"body":"And then for summative assessments, really pushing more mastery based"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":557.05,"endTime":563.65,"body":"methods, portfolios being the strongest case or having them do"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":563.65,"endTime":568.51,"body":"a project, do anything related to the course material that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":568.51,"endTime":573.25,"body":"would result in demonstration of mastery. And usually an"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":573.25,"endTime":576.19,"body":"essay, unless it's an English class, doesn't lead to that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":576.19,"endTime":577.27,"body":"demonstration."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":577.57,"endTime":582.07,"body":"So, if you're in a shop class, make the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":582.07,"endTime":584.62,"body":"thing you know, if you are in a social studies"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":584.62,"endTime":589.75,"body":"class, maybe it's a video, a documentary of stuff you"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":589.75,"endTime":593.56,"body":"found while doing your historical research, stuff like that."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":594.01,"endTime":595.9,"body":"At some point in time in your career, you decided"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":595.9,"endTime":596.82,"body":"to go back to school."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":596.83,"endTime":598.75,"body":"Can you tell us sort of how you ended up"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":598.75,"endTime":599.83,"body":"in a master's program?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":600.49,"endTime":601.39,"body":"Ah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":601.39,"endTime":606.61,"body":"So in 2019, I'd been with Niche Academy for two"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":606.61,"endTime":610.96,"body":"years and we were getting to the point where I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":610.96,"endTime":614.47,"body":"felt we were stable in what we were providing, but"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":614.47,"endTime":616.93,"body":"I didn't know what I don't know."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":616.93,"endTime":620.35,"body":"And I felt that there was a gap in my"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":620.35,"endTime":621.07,"body":"understanding."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":621.07,"endTime":623.53,"body":"I'd had a lot of hands on experience through the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":623.53,"endTime":626.35,"body":"work that I did at School Improvement Network making the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":626.35,"endTime":627.94,"body":"micro-credentials, but that was to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":627.95,"endTime":632.6,"body":"a very specific audience with very specific standards and outcomes"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":632.6,"endTime":635.69,"body":"for what I needed to make, and I'd never explored"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":635.69,"endTime":636.77,"body":"beyond that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":637.4,"endTime":640.49,"body":"And as I was building out the team at Niche"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":640.49,"endTime":645.32,"body":"Academy and seeing into the future in my directorial role,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":645.32,"endTime":649.16,"body":"trying to make sure that we we were making progress,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":649.16,"endTime":650.39,"body":"we're going somewhere."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":650.48,"endTime":656.21,"body":"I saw this giant mass of nothing where maybe there's"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":656.21,"endTime":658.79,"body":"something I'm missing and if I'm going to avoid it"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":658.79,"endTime":662.9,"body":"and make something that's less useful or not as good"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":662.9,"endTime":665.57,"body":"for our customers, we're not going to make the impact"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":665.57,"endTime":666.35,"body":"we need to make."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":666.65,"endTime":670.82,"body":"So I started looking around for instructional design programs, so"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":670.82,"endTime":671.96,"body":"they could fill in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":672.95,"endTime":675.17,"body":"that knowledge hole in my brain."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":675.17,"endTime":679.94,"body":"And I stumbled upon the University of Massachusetts Boston program,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":679.94,"endTime":682.34,"body":"and I loved it because of the focus on adult"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":682.34,"endTime":683.07,"body":"learners."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":683.09,"endTime":686.78,"body":"There's so many programs that focus on K through 12"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":686.78,"endTime":691.4,"body":"student experience, and while that's very good and valid to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":691.4,"endTime":694.67,"body":"learn, it just didn't apply to my application."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":694.97,"endTime":698.72,"body":"I have primarily adult learners."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":698.81,"endTime":703.67,"body":"I have learners from all over the nation, various levels"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":703.67,"endTime":704.96,"body":"of education."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":705.44,"endTime":710.57,"body":"I need to really understand how to present to adults"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":710.57,"endTime":714.53,"body":"in that capacity, because unlike students who are stuck in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":714.53,"endTime":718.16,"body":"a classroom, I need to hook in and really engage"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":718.16,"endTime":719.3,"body":"an adult learner."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":719.51,"endTime":721.7,"body":"So I applied, got in, loved it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":721.7,"endTime":726.05,"body":"First class was with you, Rebecca, I took 601 and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":726.05,"endTime":729.5,"body":"602 concurrently, that very first semester and boy was that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":729.5,"endTime":730.04,"body":"a ride."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":730.04,"endTime":733.52,"body":"As soon as I finished those two classes, I knew"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":733.52,"endTime":734.33,"body":"this program."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":734.36,"endTime":738.59,"body":"The program was for me because it immediately filled in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":738.59,"endTime":739.34,"body":"a couple holes."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":739.34,"endTime":742.84,"body":"The first one to come to mind is connectivism."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":742.85,"endTime":746.72,"body":"I had a solid understanding of behaviorism, a pretty good"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":746.72,"endTime":752.33,"body":"grasp on cognitivism, but connectivism never heard of it, didn't"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":752.33,"endTime":753.44,"body":"understand it at all."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":753.68,"endTime":759.65,"body":"So having that understanding really shifted how we presented the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":759.65,"endTime":762.5,"body":"information that we were putting forth for our customers."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":762.74,"endTime":769.85,"body":"Instead of requiring learners to demonstrate understanding of everything put"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":769.85,"endTime":773.21,"body":"in front of them, we instead shifted to can they"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":773.21,"endTime":775.1,"body":"pull that information when they need it?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":775.22,"endTime":778.4,"body":"We have all the information here in the tutorial unless"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":778.4,"endTime":780.11,"body":"they're going to apply it day in, day out."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":780.11,"endTime":782.09,"body":"They don't need to have it in their working memory."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":782.48,"endTime":785.15,"body":"So how do we make it as easy for them"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":785.15,"endTime":787.61,"body":"to find it and connect to it and still be"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":787.61,"endTime":788.27,"body":"effective?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":788.3,"endTime":791.78,"body":"That was the main reason why I wanted to go"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":791.78,"endTime":794.09,"body":"back to school was get information like that and really"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":794.09,"endTime":794.45,"body":"pull it in."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":794.45,"endTime":796.28,"body":"And there are a couple other nuggets here and there"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":796.28,"endTime":798.44,"body":"throughout the program that have really stuck with me and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":798.44,"endTime":799.88,"body":"really improved my practice."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":799.88,"endTime":803.27,"body":"And I'm so glad to have gone through the process."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":803.51,"endTime":805.73,"body":"Can you share another nugget?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":806.12,"endTime":808.1,"body":"I think that's fascinating to hear"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":808.1,"endTime":812.51,"body":"what were those key gaps in that understanding?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":812.51,"endTime":814.76,"body":"Because one of the big questions that comes up is,"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":814.76,"endTime":817.31,"body":"is do I do a master's program or do I"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":817.31,"endTime":819.38,"body":"just do a quick and dirty certificate?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":819.38,"endTime":821.93,"body":"Do I go to something like Idol courses?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":821.93,"endTime":823.79,"body":"Like, what do I do?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":823.79,"endTime":827.27,"body":"And one of the bits of advice I always give"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":827.27,"endTime":829.28,"body":"is you go to a master's program because you want"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":829.28,"endTime":830.18,"body":"a master's, right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":830.18,"endTime":832.31,"body":"Because it you know, it is a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":832.31,"endTime":833.24,"body":"journey, right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":833.42,"endTime":835.1,"body":"Like it is that."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":835.1,"endTime":838.04,"body":"But I'm curious, sort of what were those those gaps"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":838.04,"endTime":839.05,"body":"that got filled?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":839.06,"endTime":840.68,"body":"Yeah, great question."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":841.04,"endTime":846.26,"body":"The structure provided by the master's program forced me to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":846.26,"endTime":848.48,"body":"go through things that I probably wouldn't have done if"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":848.48,"endTime":851.18,"body":"I were doing a self paced environment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":851.18,"endTime":855.92,"body":"One of the classes was research, of course, and the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":855.92,"endTime":860.78,"body":"research it was taught by Carol Sharicz, a lovely, lovely"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":860.78,"endTime":861.41,"body":"instructor."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":861.41,"endTime":864.92,"body":"The the purpose of the course was to explore a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":864.92,"endTime":867.86,"body":"problem in your organization or your life or something, and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":867.86,"endTime":869.63,"body":"then deep dive into some research."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":869.72,"endTime":874.7,"body":"And at the time there were some feedback problems going"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":874.7,"endTime":877.58,"body":"on with some other people within the company, mainly in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":877.58,"endTime":881.3,"body":"the process of providing feedback, not necessarily that feedback wasn't"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":881.3,"endTime":884.72,"body":"being provided or that the feedback was harmful, harmful or"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":884.72,"endTime":886.16,"body":"anything like that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":886.52,"endTime":890.87,"body":"It was just more that the process wasn't particularly clear."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":890.9,"endTime":894.59,"body":"The outcomes of the feedback could have been improved."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":894.68,"endTime":897.92,"body":"So I dug into the research and as I was"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":897.92,"endTime":901.7,"body":"doing that, I stumbled upon a way of thinking about"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":901.7,"endTime":905.15,"body":"feedback that improved the way that I delivered it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":905.15,"endTime":909.35,"body":"And that's the expectation of the person who's receiving feedback."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":909.35,"endTime":911.33,"body":"The way it was described was there"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":911.37,"endTime":914.84,"body":"are two kinds people who just want the answer,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":914.93,"endTime":917.57,"body":"and the people who want to struggle through."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":918.25,"endTime":922.93,"body":"So I call it answer prompted, answer given."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":922.93,"endTime":926.8,"body":"So when you want the answer given, that's really great"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":926.8,"endTime":929.47,"body":"for things like structural engineering."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":929.47,"endTime":932.17,"body":"You have a team who's building a bridge."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":932.17,"endTime":935.23,"body":"They go to a civil engineer and they say, civil"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":935.23,"endTime":938.17,"body":"engineer, is there anything wrong with my bridge?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":938.62,"endTime":942.85,"body":"It would be really annoying for that engineer to say,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":943.21,"endTime":944.74,"body":"yeah, something's not quite right."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":944.74,"endTime":947.11,"body":"What do you think could be improved?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":947.2,"endTime":950.06,"body":"The team there, the construction team's gonna be like, no,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":950.06,"endTime":951.61,"body":"no, no, that's not my job."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":951.61,"endTime":952.6,"body":"That's your job."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":952.6,"endTime":954.49,"body":"Tell me what's wrong and we'll fix it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":954.49,"endTime":954.94,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":954.94,"endTime":956.65,"body":"They need the answer given."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":957.01,"endTime":960.4,"body":"And then the other side of the coin for answer"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":960.4,"endTime":964.18,"body":"prompted is think about a philosophy student."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":964.18,"endTime":967.75,"body":"You know, somebody who's going for the full philosophy PhD."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":967.87,"endTime":970.09,"body":"They've put their thesis together."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":970.09,"endTime":972.94,"body":"They turn it over to their advisor, and the advisor"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":972.94,"endTime":976.36,"body":"says, the way you are thinking about this issue is"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":976.36,"endTime":978.4,"body":"wrong and this is how it should be done."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":978.64,"endTime":979.27,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":979.33,"endTime":982.57,"body":"Philosophy is notoriously not that way."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":982.9,"endTime":986.23,"body":"You know, you figure your own means of thinking and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":986.23,"endTime":988.51,"body":"then there's basic structures."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":988.9,"endTime":990.55,"body":"Maybe you could do that with the grammar."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":990.55,"endTime":992.02,"body":"But when it comes to the idea you want to,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":992.32,"endTime":994.36,"body":"you want to prompt the answer, you say something's not"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":994.36,"endTime":995.35,"body":"working here."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":995.35,"endTime":997.6,"body":"Here's what I think isn't working."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":997.78,"endTime":999.28,"body":"How might you address it?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":999.82,"endTime":1000.27,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1001.05,"endTime":1005.07,"body":"So in thinking of those two different sides you have"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1006.01,"endTime":1008.83,"body":"what people expect, what people want."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1009.4,"endTime":1013.15,"body":"And for me personally, I want answer prompted most of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1013.15,"endTime":1013.69,"body":"the time."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1013.84,"endTime":1015.64,"body":"I want I want to think through I want to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1015.64,"endTime":1017.08,"body":"truly understand what I'm doing."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1017.08,"endTime":1019.75,"body":"But if I forget a period at the end of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1019.75,"endTime":1023.17,"body":"a sentence, I'm totally fine with somebody saying, hey, you"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1023.17,"endTime":1024.91,"body":"forgot a period, right!"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1025.01,"endTime":1025.81,"body":"Right there."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1025.81,"endTime":1026.41,"body":"There it goes."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1026.41,"endTime":1027.31,"body":"Thank you so much."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1027.31,"endTime":1031.089,"body":"So when I was talking with my colleague about how"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1031.089,"endTime":1034.66,"body":"to provide the feedback, it was creating that understanding because"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1034.66,"endTime":1038.38,"body":"what he was doing was always just answer given everything"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1038.38,"endTime":1041.74,"body":"was answer given, doesn't matter because you need"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1041.74,"endTime":1042.04,"body":"help."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1042.04,"endTime":1042.819,"body":"All right, here's the answer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1042.819,"endTime":1044.5,"body":"Just go, right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1044.589,"endTime":1048.64,"body":"And for for the people on that team, it was"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1048.64,"endTime":1051.07,"body":"like, well, I guess I don't have a lot of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1051.07,"endTime":1051.76,"body":"autonomy."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1051.76,"endTime":1054.01,"body":"I guess I just need to do it this way,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1054.01,"endTime":1054.73,"body":"no matter what."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1054.88,"endTime":1059.32,"body":"So helping that person see and understand how they"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1059.32,"endTime":1064.63,"body":"can do more answer prompted get get more creative responses."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1064.63,"endTime":1067.51,"body":"Get them to think about what they need to do"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1068.05,"endTime":1072.27,"body":"and that was a great help, great change in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1072.34,"endTime":1074.92,"body":"my practice and I wouldn't have had it had I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1074.92,"endTime":1076.42,"body":"not been in that research class."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1076.97,"endTime":1077.25,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1077.26,"endTime":1078.4,"body":"That's fascinating."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1078.4,"endTime":1079.9,"body":"That is actually quite fascinating."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1079.9,"endTime":1081.94,"body":"So I'm going to go back to one of my"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1081.94,"endTime":1084.52,"body":"sort of basic questions here."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1084.52,"endTime":1087.55,"body":"What skills do you find most useful in what you"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1087.55,"endTime":1088.0,"body":"do?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1088.36,"endTime":1088.93,"body":"Ah."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1089.41,"endTime":1091.69,"body":"What skills do I find most useful in what I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1091.69,"endTime":1092.01,"body":"do?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1092.02,"endTime":1096.16,"body":"I'm no longer deep in the trenches or as deep"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1096.16,"endTime":1097.87,"body":"in the trenches as I used to be."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1097.9,"endTime":1103.96,"body":"So I recently designed a course for my capstone, but"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1103.96,"endTime":1108.07,"body":"other than that, I'm probably not on on the front"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1108.07,"endTime":1109.66,"body":"line making things."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1109.75,"endTime":1114.28,"body":"So right now for my role, the most important element"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1114.28,"endTime":1115.6,"body":"is project management."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1116.05,"endTime":1118.6,"body":"Just making sure that the people on my team have"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1118.6,"endTime":1121.45,"body":"things that they can work on that they're never sitting"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1121.45,"endTime":1123.52,"body":"idle and that they always feel supported."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1123.52,"endTime":1125.86,"body":"That's that's my biggest thing."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1125.86,"endTime":1131.62,"body":"When I am designing, the biggest skill would have"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1131.62,"endTime":1133.51,"body":"to be understanding"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1134.43,"endTime":1138.45,"body":"how to structure the information so that it is as"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1138.45,"endTime":1140.25,"body":"absorbable as possible."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1140.82,"endTime":1143.97,"body":"Not not to throw shade on any other designer, but"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1143.97,"endTime":1147.0,"body":"there are some courses that I've encountered where it's just"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1147.0,"endTime":1150.66,"body":"kind of throw the information at the wall, and I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1150.66,"endTime":1153.24,"body":"know this information needs to be included, so I'm just"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1153.24,"endTime":1154.26,"body":"going to put it in."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1154.35,"endTime":1156.84,"body":"But there's not a lot of thought put into how"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1156.84,"endTime":1160.02,"body":"it's sequenced, how how a learner would get from point"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1160.05,"endTime":1163.74,"body":"A to point B to point C, It's just here's"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1163.74,"endTime":1164.55,"body":"the information."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1164.88,"endTime":1169.44,"body":"And in some some cases, the ideas are pretty disparate."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1169.98,"endTime":1171.54,"body":"They're not too tied together."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1171.54,"endTime":1174.6,"body":"So it kind of allows itself to do that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1174.6,"endTime":1179.34,"body":"But even in those cases, there are times where you"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1179.34,"endTime":1184.53,"body":"need to think through, if I'm approaching this new topic,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1185.16,"endTime":1188.55,"body":"where do I start and how does that logically progress"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1188.73,"endTime":1189.9,"body":"down the road?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1190.74,"endTime":1190.91,"body":"Mmm..."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1191.06,"endTime":1191.24,"body":"Mmm."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1191.39,"endTime":1191.69,"body":"Mmm."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1192.27,"endTime":1192.93,"body":"That's great."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1192.93,"endTime":1193.86,"body":"That's awesome."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1193.86,"endTime":1196.83,"body":"So let's turn a little bit to... you hire instructional"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1196.83,"endTime":1197.55,"body":"designers."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1197.73,"endTime":1200.61,"body":"Do you have instructional designers on your team?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1200.61,"endTime":1203.76,"body":"What are the things you look for when you're hiring"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1203.76,"endTime":1204.96,"body":"an instructional designer?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1205.32,"endTime":1209.88,"body":"Great question, and I'm going to give a very controversial"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1209.88,"endTime":1210.41,"body":"answer."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1210.42,"endTime":1214.13,"body":"I don't necessarily look for their skills in instructional design."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1214.14,"endTime":1219.06,"body":"I look for their ability to write clear, coherent English."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1219.69,"endTime":1222.24,"body":"That is the very first thing I look at."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1222.39,"endTime":1225.78,"body":"And a big part of that is because the designer"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1225.78,"endTime":1229.83,"body":"puts together all the materials that support the rest of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1229.83,"endTime":1232.56,"body":"the process and eventually gets shown to the customer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1232.56,"endTime":1238.56,"body":"So if they aren't able to clearly and concisely state"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1238.56,"endTime":1244.53,"body":"something, it's really hard for me as as a leader"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1244.53,"endTime":1248.12,"body":"to help other people see that and do that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1248.13,"endTime":1251.61,"body":"It's it's a somewhat ephemeral skill in my opinion."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1251.61,"endTime":1254.1,"body":"It can be practiced, it can be taught."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1254.34,"endTime":1258.69,"body":"But in terms of it being picked up and executed,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1259.53,"endTime":1262.35,"body":"in my experience, and maybe I'm not doing it right,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1262.35,"endTime":1264.57,"body":"it's it's difficult to teach that skill."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1264.57,"endTime":1265.92,"body":"So that's the very top one."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1266.07,"endTime":1266.61,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1266.61,"endTime":1269.46,"body":"And you know what's interesting is, my background, I actually"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1269.46,"endTime":1273.63,"body":"did a certificate in technical writing, for just that reason."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1273.63,"endTime":1274.02,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1274.11,"endTime":1276.99,"body":"Because you do have to, especially when you're creating online"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1276.99,"endTime":1279.72,"body":"and e-learning stuff, you do a lot of writing and"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1279.72,"endTime":1283.2,"body":"you've got to be good at putting it out there,"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1283.2,"endTime":1286.29,"body":"saying it, but also like writing really good instructions and"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1286.29,"endTime":1291.33,"body":"understanding how to make parallel bullet points and that kind"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1291.33,"endTime":1292.19,"body":"of stuff."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1292.2,"endTime":1294.45,"body":"So yeah, I think that I don't think there's any"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1294.45,"endTime":1295.98,"body":"controversy at all in that."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1295.98,"endTime":1297.9,"body":"But how do you find that out?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1298.56,"endTime":1304.41,"body":"So as part of my interviewing process, or the hiring"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1304.41,"endTime":1307.14,"body":"process, the first thing I do is I always say"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1307.14,"endTime":1310.5,"body":"include a portfolio, or a written sample."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1310.5,"endTime":1312.27,"body":"I need to see a written sample."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1312.27,"endTime":1314.34,"body":"It can be provided in a portfolio."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1314.49,"endTime":1317.58,"body":"Sometimes I'll be a little lenient and go with a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1317.58,"endTime":1322.14,"body":"cover letter, because a cover letter is theoretically written by"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1322.14,"endTime":1322.95,"body":"the applicant."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1322.95,"endTime":1326.28,"body":"And I just look at grammar, look at spelling, but"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1326.28,"endTime":1328.35,"body":"I don't look at the substance at all."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1328.35,"endTime":1329.58,"body":"That's the first thing I look for."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1329.58,"endTime":1334.53,"body":"If I see grammar errors, spelling errors, I just I'm"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1334.53,"endTime":1337.02,"body":"going to move on because I got other applicants who"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1337.02,"endTime":1338.7,"body":"are meeting those standards."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1338.7,"endTime":1343.11,"body":"It's a harsh reality as a hiring manager that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1343.11,"endTime":1347.22,"body":"you just can't put too much attention to everybody."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1347.34,"endTime":1351.99,"body":"The last time I hired for an instructional designer position,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1351.99,"endTime":1353.97,"body":"I had 70 applicants."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1353.97,"endTime":1357.51,"body":"And I don't have a HR team that'll go through and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1357.51,"endTime":1361.35,"body":"cull the the applicants down to, you know, these are"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1361.35,"endTime":1362.58,"body":"who we think would be a good fit."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1362.58,"endTime":1364.02,"body":"I have to do that myself."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1364.47,"endTime":1369.81,"body":"So if I'm really critically thinking about all 70,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1369.81,"endTime":1372.6,"body":"it's going to take me a month to go"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1372.6,"endTime":1373.53,"body":"through all those applicants."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1373.53,"endTime":1376.11,"body":"So I really have to do a quick and dirty"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1376.11,"endTime":1377.76,"body":"this is my baseline."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1378.18,"endTime":1378.51,"body":"Is it"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1378.51,"endTime":1379.65,"body":"there? Great."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1379.65,"endTime":1382.8,"body":"Now I can engage my real critical thinking brain."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1382.8,"endTime":1387.96,"body":"How were they applying the principles of ADDIE, SAM, whatever"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1387.96,"endTime":1389.94,"body":"they have in their portfolio or their piece?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1389.94,"endTime":1394.41,"body":"And how are they measuring learner outcomes, if there"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1394.41,"endTime":1398.73,"body":"are any representations of that in the portfolio itself?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1398.73,"endTime":1402.36,"body":"And that'll help me put together the list of who"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1402.36,"endTime":1403.35,"body":"I interview."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1403.98,"endTime":1405.9,"body":"So how does somebody stand out?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1405.9,"endTime":1407.31,"body":"They've got a portfolio."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1407.31,"endTime":1411.0,"body":"How... what do they do to stand out from the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1411.0,"endTime":1412.23,"body":"70 other people?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1413.04,"endTime":1417.27,"body":"Another great question. For what I look for, including"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1417.27,"endTime":1419.58,"body":"a tiny bit of color in the resume..."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1419.89,"endTime":1423.99,"body":"It helps me remember what resumes I have looked at."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1424.11,"endTime":1427.59,"body":"So do a little bit of styling on the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1427.59,"endTime":1428.7,"body":"resume, not too much."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1428.7,"endTime":1434.16,"body":"Don't go adding like a paisley background and giant blocks"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1434.16,"endTime":1436.71,"body":"of shapes everywhere."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1436.71,"endTime":1440.31,"body":"Just just a little thing to help me remember that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1440.31,"endTime":1444.21,"body":"yes, I have seen this resume and cue me in to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1444.21,"endTime":1446.25,"body":"what I had seen in it before."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1446.25,"endTime":1447.09,"body":"Education,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1447.09,"endTime":1450.42,"body":"great. Experience, great. For me."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1450.57,"endTime":1455.31,"body":"I don't really look at the personal interests or the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1455.52,"endTime":1456.6,"body":"stuff like that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1456.75,"endTime":1459.39,"body":"I know that there are some people who say that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1459.39,"endTime":1463.56,"body":"that's a really good way of humanizing you, but also"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1463.98,"endTime":1466.95,"body":"in some ways that can be a detriment."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1466.95,"endTime":1470.37,"body":"Having that in, say, say I don't like Bocce ball"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1470.37,"endTime":1474.54,"body":"and you love Bocce ball. Even if I'm not really"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1474.54,"endTime":1477.84,"body":"thinking about it, it can in some ways the back"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1477.84,"endTime":1482.58,"body":"of my head say I put a little distance between"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1482.58,"endTime":1484.02,"body":"me and the applicant."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1484.32,"endTime":1487.05,"body":"I try very actively not to do that, which is"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1487.05,"endTime":1488.01,"body":"why I don't read them."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1488.01,"endTime":1489.86,"body":"But little thing to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1489.87,"endTime":1492.81,"body":"be aware of with a hiring manager, if there's an"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1492.81,"endTime":1495.12,"body":"element on it that they don't like personally, even though"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1495.12,"endTime":1499.98,"body":"it has no impact on your your work as as"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1499.98,"endTime":1502.59,"body":"a person, it might be there."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1502.59,"endTime":1506.22,"body":"Another element that suggested to hiring managers is like removing"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1506.22,"endTime":1510.45,"body":"the names off, of the applicants because people who have"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1510.45,"endTime":1514.02,"body":"non-Western names typically are selected less."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1514.02,"endTime":1516.42,"body":"That's not on you, that's not on your name, it's"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1516.42,"endTime":1517.74,"body":"on the hiring manager."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1517.74,"endTime":1520.86,"body":"So as part of my hiring practice, if I see"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1520.86,"endTime":1523.44,"body":"a name I can't pronounce, I actively look at that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1523.44,"endTime":1528.12,"body":"resume because maybe somebody else didn't give them a chance,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1528.12,"endTime":1531.0,"body":"which means I get the chance of having a great"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1531.0,"endTime":1533.34,"body":"worker who just happens to have a cool name."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1533.76,"endTime":1537.24,"body":"I agree completely that it really is."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1537.24,"endTime":1542.55,"body":"It is the hiring manager's responsibility to remove that bias."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1542.91,"endTime":1543.75,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1543.87,"endTime":1544.5,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1544.5,"endTime":1546.12,"body":"To actively remove that bias."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1546.12,"endTime":1548.88,"body":"So what are the biggest mistakes people make?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1549.99,"endTime":1553.62,"body":"That's a real good question and it's something that comes"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1553.62,"endTime":1556.32,"body":"up a lot in my hiring process."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1556.47,"endTime":1561.36,"body":"I state very explicitly for instructional designers to include the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1561.36,"endTime":1564.12,"body":"writing sample or portfolio for other people on my team,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1564.12,"endTime":1566.76,"body":"I have various other creatives."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1566.76,"endTime":1567.66,"body":"I have illustrators,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1567.66,"endTime":1570.69,"body":"Video editors. I always say include a portfolio."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1571.26,"endTime":1574.38,"body":"If you don't include a portfolio, I'm not considering you."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1575.1,"endTime":1579.18,"body":"I'm sorry, it's there in the post."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1579.39,"endTime":1583.95,"body":"It's a request, and I hate to think that I've"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1583.95,"endTime":1585.87,"body":"passed up on somebody who would have been perfect for"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1585.87,"endTime":1588.45,"body":"the position only because they missed that piece."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1588.45,"endTime":1592.35,"body":"So read a job, posting through, figure out what they're"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1592.35,"endTime":1598.71,"body":"requesting, and then after that bit, the next biggest mistake"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1598.83,"endTime":1602.85,"body":"is probably overdoing it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1602.85,"endTime":1607.11,"body":"So during my hiring process, I ask the applicant to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1607.11,"endTime":1610.71,"body":"produce something for an instructional designer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1610.71,"endTime":1615.72,"body":"I ask them to write an introduction to a topic."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1616.71,"endTime":1620.82,"body":"I generally choose the topic ahead of time, and I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1620.82,"endTime":1624.99,"body":"provide them an exemplar that we have produced at our"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1624.99,"endTime":1627.57,"body":"company because I want to see how well that applicant"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1627.57,"endTime":1631.56,"body":"can replicate the style without knowing the style explicitly."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1631.71,"endTime":1634.86,"body":"There are things about the way we write that should"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1634.86,"endTime":1636.87,"body":"pop out when reading it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1636.87,"endTime":1638.52,"body":"So that's what I'm looking for."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1638.52,"endTime":1643.29,"body":"And there are people who, when presented that opportunity, will"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1643.29,"endTime":1644.07,"body":"produce"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1644.86,"endTime":1646.51,"body":"practically a novel."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1647.8,"endTime":1651.76,"body":"You did a great job writing 2000 words, but I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1651.76,"endTime":1653.65,"body":"only needed 400."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1653.65,"endTime":1654.19,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1654.31,"endTime":1655.36,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1656.66,"endTime":1658.96,"body":"match the expectation."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1658.97,"endTime":1661.94,"body":"If you don't think you know what the expectation is,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1661.94,"endTime":1662.84,"body":"ask questions."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1663.14,"endTime":1667.04,"body":"If a hiring manager doesn't want you to ask questions,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1667.04,"endTime":1669.11,"body":"I don't think you want to work for that company."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1670.02,"endTime":1674.46,"body":"Because you should feel like you can ask questions and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1674.46,"endTime":1677.22,"body":"get clarification on anything without being judged."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1677.25,"endTime":1680.76,"body":"It's so much better, so much better to have open"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1680.76,"endTime":1686.28,"body":"communication than to have implicit expectations that you may or"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1686.28,"endTime":1688.35,"body":"may not hit and not understand."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1688.59,"endTime":1692.01,"body":"So to tip to people who are applying,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1692.95,"endTime":1695.11,"body":"if you get the sense that you can't ask"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1695.11,"endTime":1696.52,"body":"questions, get clarification."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1696.52,"endTime":1697.12,"body":"Keep looking."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1697.51,"endTime":1698.25,"body":"Keep looking."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1698.26,"endTime":1699.07,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1699.43,"endTime":1701.79,"body":"There is that, you know, that fit thing matters."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1701.8,"endTime":1704.08,"body":"What do you think about video introductions?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1706.16,"endTime":1707.87,"body":"Could you expand on that a little bit?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1708.05,"endTime":1708.86,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1708.86,"endTime":1711.92,"body":"One of the things that we do in the portfolio"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1711.92,"endTime":1715.88,"body":"class is we have students create a video introduction."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1716.21,"endTime":1718.64,"body":"And I'm curious what you think about that."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1720.33,"endTime":1724.89,"body":"I personally wouldn't view it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1725.49,"endTime":1729.39,"body":"Reason being, again, I'm trying to reduce the amount of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1729.39,"endTime":1732.33,"body":"bias that I'm bringing to the situation."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1732.66,"endTime":1735.36,"body":"If I see it's there, I'd probably make a mental"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1735.36,"endTime":1735.9,"body":"note of it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1735.9,"endTime":1738.96,"body":"So later on in the process I might go watch"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1738.96,"endTime":1741.54,"body":"it, but I'm not going to begin my process with"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1741.54,"endTime":1741.69,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1742.35,"endTime":1744.87,"body":"Again, a lot of what I do is trying to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1744.87,"endTime":1748.14,"body":"mitigate the biases that I have because I'm looking for"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1748.14,"endTime":1750.99,"body":"the best person for the position, not necessarily who I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1750.99,"endTime":1753.09,"body":"would jive with the best."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1755.1,"endTime":1756.39,"body":"I really like the way you say."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1756.39,"endTime":1759.18,"body":"I think a lot of hiring managers could learn from"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1759.18,"endTime":1760.53,"body":"what you're saying, I think."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1760.92,"endTime":1761.57,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1761.58,"endTime":1764.97,"body":"What advice would you give to new instructional designers?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1766.37,"endTime":1769.55,"body":"Ooh, that's a question that I have for you as"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1769.55,"endTime":1769.73,"body":"well."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1769.73,"endTime":1771.65,"body":"So I'll go first, and then I want to hear"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1771.65,"endTime":1772.46,"body":"your answer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1772.46,"endTime":1779.96,"body":"Mine is understand that instructional design is much more flexible"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1779.96,"endTime":1784.25,"body":"than you might think depending on the organization and how"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1784.25,"endTime":1786.5,"body":"their training has been delivered in the past."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1786.71,"endTime":1792.92,"body":"Their idea of what training or learning should be is"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1792.92,"endTime":1794.72,"body":"going to be very strict."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1794.72,"endTime":1798.11,"body":"It's going to be very concrete in their minds, right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1798.44,"endTime":1801.89,"body":"If I say the word training to somebody, they might"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1801.89,"endTime":1804.29,"body":"think, all right, so we're going to get together for"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1804.29,"endTime":1807.05,"body":"an hour in the conference room and have to sit"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1807.05,"endTime":1808.46,"body":"and watch a presentation."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1808.88,"endTime":1812.36,"body":"Just because they think training is delivered that way doesn't"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1812.36,"endTime":1815.42,"body":"mean you also have to deliver it that way."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1816.94,"endTime":1817.39,"body":"There..."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1817.46,"endTime":1821.47,"body":"there are so many better ways to get information across"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1821.47,"endTime":1825.46,"body":"than always in person or always online."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1825.55,"endTime":1828.85,"body":"Ask questions about what the problem is."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1828.88,"endTime":1832.36,"body":"Get to the root of the problem and then figure"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1832.36,"endTime":1834.85,"body":"out the best intervention."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1834.85,"endTime":1837.07,"body":"And sometimes the intervention isn't training at all."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1837.07,"endTime":1840.19,"body":"And the company should thank you for finding that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1840.19,"endTime":1842.53,"body":"it's not due to training, because sometimes training is more"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1842.53,"endTime":1845.47,"body":"expensive than what the fix would have been."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1845.5,"endTime":1849.55,"body":"My favorite example is if people aren't clocking in on"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1849.55,"endTime":1852.85,"body":"time, it's not because they don't know how to use"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1852.85,"endTime":1854.65,"body":"the the punch card."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1854.65,"endTime":1858.61,"body":"Probably it might be because it was the punch area"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1858.61,"endTime":1860.17,"body":"was put at the back of the building and they"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1860.17,"endTime":1861.88,"body":"have to walk through the whole building to get to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1861.88,"endTime":1862.21,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1862.33,"endTime":1865.78,"body":"They just moved the punch right to the front door."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1867.04,"endTime":1868.69,"body":"Then people would clock in on time."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1868.7,"endTime":1869.02,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1869.14,"endTime":1869.98,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1870.85,"endTime":1873.04,"body":"You'd save tons of money trying to put training together,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1873.04,"endTime":1875.47,"body":"getting people to understand where it is, how to use"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1875.47,"endTime":1875.71,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1876.13,"endTime":1878.26,"body":"If they already know how to use it, they already"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1878.26,"endTime":1879.16,"body":"know where it is."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1879.7,"endTime":1880.18,"body":"You're not..."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1880.9,"endTime":1883.12,"body":"It's not going to make a difference what you did."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1883.42,"endTime":1885.67,"body":"What's the problem you're actually trying to solve?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1885.67,"endTime":1887.62,"body":"And then is it a training problem?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1887.68,"endTime":1888.55,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1888.94,"endTime":1889.33,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1889.33,"endTime":1890.2,"body":"That is, yeah."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1890.2,"endTime":1891.37,"body":"One of the core,"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1891.64,"endTime":1893.71,"body":"the first question of an instructional designer."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1893.71,"endTime":1894.28,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1894.55,"endTime":1896.44,"body":"Is this actually a training problem?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1896.44,"endTime":1898.09,"body":"And so you were going to ask me the same"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1898.09,"endTime":1900.37,"body":"question, What advice would I give?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1900.55,"endTime":1901.48,"body":"And..."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1902.3,"endTime":1907.37,"body":"in my case, it's much more about what things do"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1907.37,"endTime":1908.69,"body":"you need to learn?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1908.81,"endTime":1913.37,"body":"And in many cases, it's I want you to learn"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1913.37,"endTime":1914.42,"body":"how to write well."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1915.41,"endTime":1917.84,"body":"Like, learn how to write instructions well."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1917.84,"endTime":1920.75,"body":"And so that's the tech writing aspect of it."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1920.75,"endTime":1922.7,"body":"And in some ways I think that we could do"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1922.7,"endTime":1926.45,"body":"more to teach people technical writing, because I think that"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1926.45,"endTime":1929.24,"body":"that is a really it's an important part of the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1929.24,"endTime":1930.74,"body":"job that some people miss."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1930.74,"endTime":1934.19,"body":"The other is learn a little HTML."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1935.23,"endTime":1936.78,"body":"Learn how the web works."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1936.79,"endTime":1937.39,"body":"It doesn't..."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1937.39,"endTime":1939.25,"body":"you don't have to learn a lot, but you have"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1939.25,"endTime":1943.39,"body":"to understand the basics of how the web works because"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1943.39,"endTime":1945.76,"body":"you're doing a lot of design for the web."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1946.53,"endTime":1949.68,"body":"And if you're designing for it, you need to understand"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1949.68,"endTime":1952.26,"body":"it or understand at least a little bit about it"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1952.26,"endTime":1955.59,"body":"conceptually so that you can take advantage of the things"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1955.59,"endTime":1957.45,"body":"and then you know what to ask for kind of"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1957.45,"endTime":1957.87,"body":"thing."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1957.87,"endTime":1960.51,"body":"So those are those are things that I, I don't"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1960.51,"endTime":1963.63,"body":"know I see as gaps if people aren't doing them."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":1964.87,"endTime":1965.77,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1966.43,"endTime":1968.62,"body":"So that's sort of where I would go with that"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1968.62,"endTime":1968.95,"body":"question."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1968.95,"endTime":1971.56,"body":"It's a tough one because I'm not ... like I teach"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1971.56,"endTime":1972.61,"body":"the basics, right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1973.15,"endTime":1975.19,"body":"So I teach the first course."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1975.25,"endTime":1978.13,"body":"I teach people ADDIE, and we walk through the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1978.13,"endTime":1980.44,"body":"whole that, you know, that whole process."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1980.8,"endTime":1983.8,"body":"And part of the questions that always come up because"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1983.8,"endTime":1985.54,"body":"we, it's very tedious when you do it in the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1985.54,"endTime":1989.68,"body":"classroom because you're looking, you're deep diving at each step"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1989.68,"endTime":1990.37,"body":"in the process"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1990.37,"endTime":1993.34,"body":"and the reality is, in the real world, you're thinking"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1993.34,"endTime":1993.61,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1994.5,"endTime":1994.92,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1994.92,"endTime":1997.02,"body":"You think it and you move through."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1997.02,"endTime":1999.36,"body":"And some of the skills that come out are things"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":1999.36,"endTime":2004.28,"body":"like sequencing, and how to actually take information and make"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2004.28,"endTime":2005.06,"body":"sense of it."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2005.33,"endTime":2008.03,"body":"Another skill that I think is super important right now"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2008.03,"endTime":2009.91,"body":"is infographics."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2009.92,"endTime":2014.72,"body":"The ability to use visuals to communicate something I think"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2014.72,"endTime":2016.94,"body":"is is becoming sort of a huge"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2018.12,"endTime":2019.35,"body":"thing out there."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2019.35,"endTime":2020.43,"body":"I don't know how much you use"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2020.43,"endTime":2022.56,"body":"infographics in your work."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2023.22,"endTime":2024.03,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2024.03,"endTime":2031.59,"body":"So a big cornerstone of our philosophy is UDL Universal"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2031.59,"endTime":2032.7,"body":"Design for Learning."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2032.7,"endTime":2039.24,"body":"So every bit of instructional information that we provide is"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2039.24,"endTime":2043.23,"body":"delivered as both a video and text."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2043.23,"endTime":2046.98,"body":"And the text is the exact same as the narration"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2046.98,"endTime":2048.0,"body":"in the video."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2048.0,"endTime":2051.54,"body":"So learners can decide how they want to engage with"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2051.54,"endTime":2052.23,"body":"the information."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2052.23,"endTime":2057.179,"body":"And because of that, we generally only use infographics as"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2057.179,"endTime":2061.29,"body":"handouts and reminders of the information presented."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2061.29,"endTime":2064.32,"body":"So when they're done with the tutorial, they're walking away,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2064.32,"endTime":2066.69,"body":"they're going back to doing whatever they need to do."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2066.69,"endTime":2068.73,"body":"They they have a thing that they can pin up"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2068.73,"endTime":2070.02,"body":"at their desk if they want it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2070.02,"endTime":2074.82,"body":"And part of that is visual literacy, understanding, balance, understanding"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2074.82,"endTime":2078.6,"body":"lines, and understanding color and contrast."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2078.6,"endTime":2081.87,"body":"So when we do decide to make an infographic, all"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2081.87,"endTime":2085.679,"body":"of those things really play in, and I'm very lucky"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2085.679,"endTime":2090.51,"body":"to have such great designers on my team that where"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2090.51,"endTime":2093.78,"body":"if they're just told, here's the copy, this is the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2093.78,"endTime":2096.36,"body":"text that needs to be in the infographic, they can"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2096.36,"endTime":2099.36,"body":"take it and they cam run and make something beautiful"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2099.36,"endTime":2100.2,"body":"memorable."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2100.2,"endTime":2102.87,"body":"You might even frame it, put it on the wall"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2102.87,"endTime":2104.46,"body":"instead of just pinning it up."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2104.46,"endTime":2104.97,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2104.97,"endTime":2107.22,"body":"So all those things."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2107.22,"endTime":2113.34,"body":"Yes, I definitely agree that understanding that, and understanding how"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2113.34,"endTime":2116.31,"body":"to make a visual flow really plays into that."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2118.53,"endTime":2121.41,"body":"Have you had a chance to play with ChatGPT yet?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2122.4,"endTime":2126.18,"body":"I have not played with ChatGPT,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2126.9,"endTime":2131.82,"body":"I will probably play with it when ChatGPT 4 comes"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2131.82,"endTime":2132.36,"body":"out."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2132.81,"endTime":2133.5,"body":"And why 4?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2133.89,"endTime":2134.85,"body":"Why that one?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2134.85,"endTime":2137.37,"body":"It's about 100 times more powerful."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2137.61,"endTime":2138.81,"body":"Approximately 100 times."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2138.81,"endTime":2140.82,"body":"I can't remember the exact..."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2140.82,"endTime":2143.19,"body":"But right now it's just text."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2143.34,"endTime":2147.99,"body":"In the next iteration it'll include audio, video, visual, everything"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2147.99,"endTime":2148.92,"body":"wrapped into one."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2149.43,"endTime":2150.24,"body":"Wow."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2150.45,"endTime":2153.84,"body":"One of the things that I use it for is"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2153.84,"endTime":2158.13,"body":"ideas for graphics to go or images to go with"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2158.13,"endTime":2159.0,"body":"my blog posts."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2159.0,"endTime":2161.7,"body":"So I write the blog post, then I'm like, oh, what image"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2161.7,"endTime":2162.85,"body":"is good with this?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2162.99,"endTime":2164.82,"body":"And so I might throw it into ChatGPT"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2164.83,"endTime":2168.84,"body":"to just, you know, like, oh, let's see, what do"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2168.84,"endTime":2170.1,"body":"you think kind of thing."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2170.1,"endTime":2172.42,"body":"And so I'm finding it kind of interesting."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2172.44,"endTime":2175.74,"body":"Have you used any other AI tools?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2176.78,"endTime":2179.72,"body":"No, I have not."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2180.29,"endTime":2184.1,"body":"There are elements to AI in its nascent and current"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2184.1,"endTime":2188.48,"body":"stage where I felt that it would be a detractor"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2188.48,"endTime":2189.67,"body":"to the process."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2189.68,"endTime":2197.78,"body":"There would be more nonsense, more there'd be more obfuscation"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2197.78,"endTime":2198.98,"body":"of what I need."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2199.67,"endTime":2200.87,"body":"It's not good enough."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2200.87,"endTime":2202.1,"body":"It's not good enough."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2202.64,"endTime":2207.86,"body":"But I do recognize it as a useful tool, particularly"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2207.86,"endTime":2209.36,"body":"for idea generation."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2209.36,"endTime":2213.59,"body":"If you're hitting a wall, you need to just"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2213.59,"endTime":2215.99,"body":"find a way around this obstacle."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2216.74,"endTime":2217.22,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2217.25,"endTime":2217.57,"body":"See,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2217.58,"endTime":2218.42,"body":"see if it helps."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2218.51,"endTime":2220.13,"body":"See if it gets you around that obstacle or that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2220.13,"endTime":2220.7,"body":"wall."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2220.91,"endTime":2226.61,"body":"But when it comes to something like writing instruction, it"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2226.61,"endTime":2232.01,"body":"just makes me giggle because what it produces just a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2232.04,"endTime":2235.97,"body":"little faux pas here and there, having double words."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2235.97,"endTime":2240.38,"body":"Learning objectives that start with understand... it does that all"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2240.38,"endTime":2240.8,"body":"the time."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2240.8,"endTime":2243.02,"body":"I'm like, oh, those are just bad learning objectives."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2243.02,"endTime":2244.18,"body":"Let's move on with that one."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2244.2,"endTime":2244.88,"body":"But I do..."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2244.88,"endTime":2248.57,"body":"I use it to I'm working on a second memoir"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2248.57,"endTime":2252.53,"body":"and all of my text is in past tense and"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2252.53,"endTime":2253.94,"body":"it needs to be in present tense."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2254.66,"endTime":2257.12,"body":"And so it's really great to just throw some text"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2257.12,"endTime":2260.18,"body":"in and say, write this in present tense, and then"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2260.18,"endTime":2263.75,"body":"take that and edit it so that you're editing something"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2263.75,"endTime":2266.84,"body":"that you know it's done a minor step of the"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2266.84,"endTime":2267.98,"body":"edit for you."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2268.1,"endTime":2269.45,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2269.45,"endTime":2274.1,"body":"And in terms of like a tool, wonderful application you"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2274.1,"endTime":2274.82,"body":"just shared."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2275.21,"endTime":2282.59,"body":"I do have concerns that some people, particularly students, because"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2282.76,"endTime":2285.77,"body":"part of my customer base are academic libraries."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2285.77,"endTime":2291.02,"body":"So they're concerned about their students using AI to just"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2291.02,"endTime":2293.39,"body":"write their materials for them."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2293.57,"endTime":2293.96,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2294.2,"endTime":2300.14,"body":"So understanding that element, but also having the critical thinking"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2300.14,"endTime":2304.52,"body":"necessary to recognize that what was produced meets the need"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2304.52,"endTime":2305.18,"body":"or doesn't."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2305.6,"endTime":2309.98,"body":"There's an element that I feel surrounding AI in that"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2309.98,"endTime":2311.69,"body":"what it produces"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2312.56,"endTime":2312.89,"body":"on"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2312.89,"endTime":2317.12,"body":"even the second or third pass is good enough."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2317.93,"endTime":2323.36,"body":"When really the point of the writing itself is to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2323.36,"endTime":2328.01,"body":"build either an understanding or to show a mastery of"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2328.01,"endTime":2331.34,"body":"something, particularly in education learning spaces."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2331.34,"endTime":2334.76,"body":"And that's at the top of my mind in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2334.76,"endTime":2337.28,"body":"the usages is the philosophy."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2337.28,"endTime":2344.51,"body":"The moral element behind it is a response to a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2344.51,"endTime":2348.38,"body":"question that I asked a student .If that response was"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2348.38,"endTime":2349.22,"body":"generated by AI,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2349.22,"endTime":2352.49,"body":"did the student really understand what I wanted them"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2352.49,"endTime":2353.9,"body":"to understand, and do."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2354.59,"endTime":2358.22,"body":"I think it changes or it may change assessment, and"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2358.22,"endTime":2360.35,"body":"assessment practices, because it's exactly"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2360.35,"endTime":2363.08,"body":"it's the example of why are you asking them to"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2363.08,"endTime":2365.12,"body":"write an essay if you don't want if you're not"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2365.12,"endTime":2366.35,"body":"marking their English."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2366.65,"endTime":2367.07,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2367.07,"endTime":2371.72,"body":"Like if if if you're looking for the ideas, why"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2371.72,"endTime":2375.56,"body":"is that the modality that you're requiring?"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2375.56,"endTime":2378.11,"body":"Because I look at it and I go, really"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2378.11,"endTime":2380.39,"body":"I want to teach my students how to write good"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2380.39,"endTime":2381.17,"body":"questions."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2381.17,"endTime":2383.45,"body":"That is, I want to teach the students how to"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2383.45,"endTime":2386.51,"body":"ask the AI properly get it to do what you"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2386.51,"endTime":2389.24,"body":"want because that's where the critical thinking is coming in,"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2389.24,"endTime":2389.63,"body":"Right!"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2389.63,"endTime":2392.69,"body":"Is figuring out how to ask the right questions of"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2392.69,"endTime":2393.86,"body":"it because it's a tool."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2394.1,"endTime":2396.41,"body":"Yeah, it's become this huge."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2397.01,"endTime":2401.09,"body":"It blew up this semester and became became this huge"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2401.09,"endTime":2401.66,"body":"thing."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2402.17,"endTime":2405.35,"body":"So the question that I always ask everybody, my last"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2405.35,"endTime":2408.74,"body":"question is what is your prediction for the future of"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2408.74,"endTime":2409.94,"body":"instructional design?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2410.69,"endTime":2412.31,"body":"That's a good that's a good question."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2412.31,"endTime":2417.71,"body":"So I think in the immediate future, there's more need..."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2417.71,"endTime":2418.64,"body":"absolutely."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2418.64,"endTime":2422.45,"body":"There seems to be a correlation, at least the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2422.45,"endTime":2425.42,"body":"way that I see it, between the state of the"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2425.42,"endTime":2427.67,"body":"economy and the state of education."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2427.67,"endTime":2431.12,"body":"Whereas if the economy is going down, education goes up."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2431.6,"endTime":2435.38,"body":"And as education goes up, the need for instructional designers"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2435.47,"endTime":2436.22,"body":"goes up."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2436.22,"endTime":2443.63,"body":"I also think that organizations are shifting how they see"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2443.63,"endTime":2449.84,"body":"the need of instructional design as it's shifting from an"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2449.93,"endTime":2457.01,"body":"HR function where I need to present very specific skills"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2457.01,"endTime":2461.75,"body":"at specific times, to I want to provide an opportunity"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2461.75,"endTime":2465.92,"body":"for everybody at my organization to engage with stuff they're"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2465.92,"endTime":2468.2,"body":"interested in when they want it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2468.62,"endTime":2471.8,"body":"So as that happens, there's going to be a shift"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2471.8,"endTime":2479.09,"body":"from in-person trainers to, at the very least, instructional designers"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2479.09,"endTime":2483.62,"body":"who could do an in-person but also understand how they"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2483.62,"endTime":2490.28,"body":"can deliver asynchronously, online synchronous, various other blended modes."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2490.28,"endTime":2494.06,"body":"So that's my take for the near future."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2494.15,"endTime":2496.76,"body":"For the far future, I don't know."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2496.76,"endTime":2503.12,"body":"It depends on how much we as a society value"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2504.0,"endTime":2507.06,"body":"human interaction."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2507.9,"endTime":2509.34,"body":"That's a hard way of putting it."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2509.37,"endTime":2516.18,"body":"If we are satisfied with artificial intelligence producing something and"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2516.18,"endTime":2520.95,"body":"then working toward it, then sure, instructional designers might go"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2520.95,"endTime":2523.89,"body":"by the wayside just like the horse and buggy."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2524.46,"endTime":2527.19,"body":"But there's still horse and buggies right now around in"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2527.19,"endTime":2530.16,"body":"the world, so there'd be some opportunity."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2530.82,"endTime":2536.58,"body":"But I still think that there's value in having a"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2536.58,"endTime":2537.75,"body":"human brain."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2538.82,"endTime":2544.76,"body":"Put together this information, structure it, sequence it, produce to"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2544.76,"endTime":2549.89,"body":"it, that it would take a long time for artificial"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2549.89,"endTime":2553.64,"body":"intelligence to grasp and deliver to."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2553.64,"endTime":2556.01,"body":"And even if it did that, what were the quality"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2556.01,"endTime":2556.4,"body":"checks?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2556.4,"endTime":2561.29,"body":"When it comes to computer software, it's only as smart"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2561.29,"endTime":2564.11,"body":"as the person who is using it and put it"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2564.11,"endTime":2564.8,"body":"together."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2564.89,"endTime":2568.31,"body":"So at what point does it shift?"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2569.0,"endTime":2569.45,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2569.66,"endTime":2573.74,"body":"And to me and my hopes, I don't think it'll"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2573.74,"endTime":2574.46,"body":"ever happen."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2575.52,"endTime":2581.16,"body":"I will personally always value a human doing the work"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2581.55,"endTime":2583.14,"body":"over a computer."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2583.65,"endTime":2585.31,"body":"Maybe I'll change my mind in the future."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2585.33,"endTime":2585.87,"body":"I don't know."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2586.38,"endTime":2589.56,"body":"Well, thank you very much, Jeremy, for coming on to"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2589.56,"endTime":2592.62,"body":"the podcast and answering all of my random questions."},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2592.74,"endTime":2593.33,"body":"You bet!"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2593.34,"endTime":2594.3,"body":"No, this is great!"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2594.33,"endTime":2598.11,"body":"I had a lovely time chatting with you and I"},{"speaker":"Jeremy Tuttle","startTime":2598.11,"endTime":2600.72,"body":"hope to maybe chat again."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2601.41,"endTime":2605.07,"body":"You've been listening to Demystifying Instructional Design, a podcast where"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2605.07,"endTime":2608.01,"body":"I interview instructional designers about what they do."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2608.25,"endTime":2609.3,"body":"I'm Rebecca Hogue."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2609.3,"endTime":2613.08,"body":"Your podcast host. Show notes are posted as a blog"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2613.08,"endTime":2615.06,"body":"post on Demystifying Instructional Design."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2615.24,"endTime":2615.72,"body":"com."},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2615.84,"endTime":2618.42,"body":"If you enjoyed this podcast, please subscribe or leave a"},{"speaker":"Rebecca Hogue","startTime":2618.42,"endTime":2620.49,"body":"comment in the show Notes blog post."}]}