1 00:00:00,100 --> 00:00:02,500 you won't let me feel what I feel 2 00:00:02,733 --> 00:00:03,533 hmm 3 00:00:03,700 --> 00:00:06,300 and I was just like blown away by this 4 00:00:06,300 --> 00:00:08,700 here's this four year old kid 5 00:00:08,700 --> 00:00:11,066 and he's got more emotional intelligence than I do 6 00:00:11,066 --> 00:00:12,266 like recognizing like 7 00:00:12,266 --> 00:00:14,266 I just need to feel this for a minute 8 00:00:14,266 --> 00:00:15,900 just you know 9 00:00:15,900 --> 00:00:18,166 stop making me not feel it 10 00:00:18,300 --> 00:00:20,133 yeah and then if you wanna joke about it later 11 00:00:20,133 --> 00:00:21,500 you can right 12 00:00:21,500 --> 00:00:22,000 right it's not like 13 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,000 don't have a sense of humor or joke around 14 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,100 and if that's your way of handling things okay 15 00:00:27,300 --> 00:00:28,000 but he was just saying like 16 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:29,666 give me a second to feel it 17 00:00:29,666 --> 00:00:32,033 we'll joke around later yeah 18 00:00:39,333 --> 00:00:40,933 welcome back to raising Men 19 00:00:40,933 --> 00:00:43,566 today's guest is Ellie Weinstein 20 00:00:43,566 --> 00:00:45,200 he's a therapist an author 21 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:46,433 and a relationship expert 22 00:00:46,433 --> 00:00:51,033 who helps men show up better as partners and fathers 23 00:00:51,033 --> 00:00:54,466 he's the host of the Dude Therapist podcast 24 00:00:54,466 --> 00:00:57,033 and the founder of elevation 25 00:00:57,333 --> 00:00:58,766 where he brings empathy humor 26 00:00:58,766 --> 00:01:01,966 and real talk to conversations about mental health 27 00:01:01,966 --> 00:01:04,466 and connection his new book 28 00:01:04,466 --> 00:01:06,533 From I Do to we do 29 00:01:06,533 --> 00:01:09,566 helps guide couples through the emotional transition 30 00:01:09,966 --> 00:01:11,433 into parenthood Ellie 31 00:01:11,633 --> 00:01:14,566 thank you so much for joining us on Raising Men 32 00:01:15,133 --> 00:01:16,166 thanks for having me you know 33 00:01:16,166 --> 00:01:18,900 I'm so happy that this podcast exists 34 00:01:19,333 --> 00:01:20,066 because 35 00:01:20,066 --> 00:01:21,933 I don't think a lot of men have ever been raised 36 00:01:21,933 --> 00:01:23,166 the right way 37 00:01:23,433 --> 00:01:24,966 and taught the things that they need to be taught 38 00:01:24,966 --> 00:01:26,166 and you opening these 39 00:01:26,166 --> 00:01:28,366 conversations and having these things is so iconic 40 00:01:28,366 --> 00:01:29,466 especially in today's world 41 00:01:29,466 --> 00:01:31,400 so I'm super thank you for that 42 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:32,233 you know I'll tell you I 43 00:01:32,233 --> 00:01:35,566 I haven't been taught what I need to be taught 44 00:01:35,566 --> 00:01:38,733 and the whole purpose of this podcast is really 45 00:01:38,733 --> 00:01:40,133 partially my journey 46 00:01:40,133 --> 00:01:43,766 to go figure out what excellence means in this 47 00:01:43,766 --> 00:01:46,400 in this category I recognize that the 48 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:51,033 the world that my son is going to graduate into 49 00:01:51,033 --> 00:01:54,166 is so fundamentally different from the world that 50 00:01:54,166 --> 00:01:57,000 that I did that I grew up into 51 00:01:57,000 --> 00:02:02,566 that it's just the my reflexes are not tuned 52 00:02:02,733 --> 00:02:05,833 to what he needs in order to be able to thrive 53 00:02:06,433 --> 00:02:08,566 I love that I love like the 54 00:02:08,566 --> 00:02:09,233 the uh 55 00:02:09,233 --> 00:02:12,866 funny selfishness of but also like hey 56 00:02:12,866 --> 00:02:15,033 I need to learn and let's go and let's 57 00:02:15,033 --> 00:02:16,366 let's make something happen about it 58 00:02:16,366 --> 00:02:18,566 that's exactly right I might as well do it in public 59 00:02:18,633 --> 00:02:19,466 yeah 60 00:02:20,966 --> 00:02:22,066 well tell me 61 00:02:22,066 --> 00:02:23,633 you know so your 62 00:02:23,766 --> 00:02:27,366 your book is perfectly suited to this conversation 63 00:02:27,366 --> 00:02:28,133 I think what 64 00:02:28,133 --> 00:02:31,366 tell me about what inspired you to write 65 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:32,966 from I do to we do 66 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:36,133 and what gap are you hoping to fill for new parents 67 00:02:36,133 --> 00:02:37,366 or people in relationships 68 00:02:37,366 --> 00:02:38,066 yeah um 69 00:02:38,066 --> 00:02:38,833 what inspired me is 70 00:02:38,833 --> 00:02:40,933 a publishing company asked me to write one 71 00:02:41,066 --> 00:02:42,000 um I OK 72 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:43,433 I hate writing 73 00:02:43,633 --> 00:02:46,166 and it's just funny saying that now that I'm an author 74 00:02:46,333 --> 00:02:48,600 um how afraid I was 75 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:51,066 and depending on the day still I am writing 76 00:02:51,533 --> 00:02:53,433 I'd rather have a TV show 77 00:02:53,433 --> 00:02:54,200 a podcast 78 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,366 speak in front of thousands and millions of people 79 00:02:56,366 --> 00:03:00,033 on a stage than write a tweet thread 80 00:03:00,033 --> 00:03:02,133 Instagram blog post or whatever 81 00:03:02,233 --> 00:03:04,000 so it was more of a publishing company 82 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:05,666 I'm telling you I'm the exact same way 83 00:03:05,666 --> 00:03:06,766 oh I hate it 84 00:03:06,766 --> 00:03:09,600 you know why cause with speaking to me 85 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:11,433 it's off the cuff even though I prepare 86 00:03:11,466 --> 00:03:14,166 my brain works quickly with my ADHD 87 00:03:14,166 --> 00:03:15,400 that I can come up with stories 88 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,366 I can connect things and I'm in that flow state 89 00:03:18,366 --> 00:03:19,166 with writing 90 00:03:19,933 --> 00:03:23,766 my grammar sucks my ideas are great 91 00:03:24,033 --> 00:03:26,266 how it connects and flow 92 00:03:26,266 --> 00:03:28,166 and does it speak to the reader 93 00:03:28,666 --> 00:03:30,300 it's very static 94 00:03:31,033 --> 00:03:33,100 there's no tone there's no energy 95 00:03:33,566 --> 00:03:34,766 you wanted to be professional 96 00:03:34,766 --> 00:03:35,833 but you wanted to be like 97 00:03:35,833 --> 00:03:38,133 like there's so many other things with speaking 98 00:03:38,133 --> 00:03:39,700 my tone my energy 99 00:03:39,866 --> 00:03:41,800 you can feel it yeah 100 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:42,600 yeah there's a 101 00:03:42,933 --> 00:03:44,233 there's a feedback loop 102 00:03:44,433 --> 00:03:47,133 exactly that happens that you get from the audience 103 00:03:47,133 --> 00:03:50,333 or even just if you if you're just speaking one on one 104 00:03:50,333 --> 00:03:51,633 there's a feedback loop that you get 105 00:03:51,633 --> 00:03:53,366 and you feed off of this other person's energy 106 00:03:53,366 --> 00:03:54,900 we're writing they feed off of yours 107 00:03:54,966 --> 00:03:55,600 it's there 108 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:59,600 and that I have no feedback except this book sucks or 109 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:01,400 wow that really helped me yeah 110 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:02,966 um but uh 111 00:04:02,966 --> 00:04:05,633 it was really like a conversation with the publishers 112 00:04:05,633 --> 00:04:06,000 who 113 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,366 who I guess they found me through my podcast and this 114 00:04:08,366 --> 00:04:09,466 that and the other thing 115 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,566 and I noticed that there are not a lot 116 00:04:13,566 --> 00:04:18,733 of crossover books of parenting and relationship at all 117 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:20,166 there's one book I think 118 00:04:20,166 --> 00:04:21,766 in the 80s called Crib Sheets 119 00:04:21,766 --> 00:04:23,666 that really combines the two 120 00:04:24,066 --> 00:04:25,666 and to me it's secretly 121 00:04:25,666 --> 00:04:27,766 this book is 80% a relationship book 122 00:04:27,766 --> 00:04:29,833 for anyone and everyone yeah 123 00:04:29,833 --> 00:04:33,266 20% through the lens of being a parent 124 00:04:33,833 --> 00:04:35,933 that is what it is and it's the basic 125 00:04:35,933 --> 00:04:38,166 foundational things that I do every day 126 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:40,566 with couples and individuals 127 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:42,266 focused on relationships 128 00:04:42,566 --> 00:04:45,700 I throw individual stories of my marriage 129 00:04:46,033 --> 00:04:49,533 um stories of the craziness of having two little kids 130 00:04:49,533 --> 00:04:53,266 yeah and also the therapeutic stories of my practice 131 00:04:53,466 --> 00:04:56,133 and to me it's just this combo of 132 00:04:57,166 --> 00:05:01,300 things hit the fan so fast when you have kids 133 00:05:01,366 --> 00:05:03,400 yeah and for the most part 134 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,266 your relationship falls to the wayside 135 00:05:05,266 --> 00:05:06,933 because you're in survival mode 136 00:05:07,066 --> 00:05:10,366 of raising a human being that cannot do it themselves 137 00:05:10,366 --> 00:05:14,700 right and we don't really focus on the relationship 138 00:05:14,933 --> 00:05:18,133 and keep that thriving when it is possible 139 00:05:18,433 --> 00:05:20,033 but we're just so damn tired 140 00:05:20,033 --> 00:05:21,533 and we're just so overwhelmed 141 00:05:21,566 --> 00:05:23,133 and we're at each other's throats 142 00:05:23,166 --> 00:05:24,266 and all these different things 143 00:05:24,266 --> 00:05:26,333 that are coming together at one point 144 00:05:26,333 --> 00:05:30,033 and this is the book for anyone in that stage 145 00:05:30,133 --> 00:05:31,066 where there's like 146 00:05:31,066 --> 00:05:34,933 quiet or even very loud noises in our head going 147 00:05:35,066 --> 00:05:36,766 who the hell am I sitting next to 148 00:05:36,766 --> 00:05:41,600 or how did we get here or what relationship 149 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:42,966 who the hell has time for that 150 00:05:43,033 --> 00:05:43,800 yeah that is the 151 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:47,066 this is the book for you and again secretly 152 00:05:47,066 --> 00:05:48,766 it's an 80% um 153 00:05:48,766 --> 00:05:50,633 relationship book for anyone and everyone 154 00:05:50,666 --> 00:05:53,466 but I was asked to make it a little more specific 155 00:05:53,466 --> 00:05:54,766 and niche or nishade 156 00:05:54,766 --> 00:05:55,866 as I say yeah 157 00:05:55,866 --> 00:05:58,233 and hopefully everyone enjoys 158 00:05:58,333 --> 00:05:58,966 you know I'll tell you 159 00:05:58,966 --> 00:06:02,033 I wish I I wish I had this book 160 00:06:02,033 --> 00:06:02,933 that's what everyone tells me 161 00:06:02,933 --> 00:06:05,266 years ago when my boy was born 162 00:06:05,266 --> 00:06:08,333 because I my wife and I 163 00:06:08,333 --> 00:06:10,033 we were it was 164 00:06:10,633 --> 00:06:12,033 I don't know how else to describe it 165 00:06:12,033 --> 00:06:17,266 it was agony we were at each other's throats constantly 166 00:06:17,266 --> 00:06:20,200 we just were not a team yeah 167 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:25,633 and what we ended up having to do is literally I 168 00:06:25,633 --> 00:06:27,866 we sat down and I said OK 169 00:06:27,866 --> 00:06:30,233 you and I have to come to an arrangement 170 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:32,400 and the arrangement is no matter what 171 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:35,233 will not get divorced 172 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:37,333 before the boy is at least 1 year old 173 00:06:37,433 --> 00:06:39,700 like we know the the 174 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:42,066 our lives are 175 00:06:42,133 --> 00:06:44,766 so different now from what they were two months ago 176 00:06:44,866 --> 00:06:46,166 and literally a year from now 177 00:06:46,166 --> 00:06:47,966 they will be so different again 178 00:06:47,966 --> 00:06:50,833 yep and we just can't be making any sorts of like 179 00:06:50,833 --> 00:06:53,366 this feels unsustainable to me 180 00:06:53,366 --> 00:06:54,266 and we can't pretend that 181 00:06:54,266 --> 00:06:56,833 that we just can't draw that line over into infinity 182 00:06:56,966 --> 00:06:58,800 yeah but and so 183 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:00,466 and it and it actually caused a problem 184 00:07:00,466 --> 00:07:02,000 because when the boy was about to turn 1 185 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:03,800 my wife was sort of starting to get upset 186 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:04,066 she's like oh 187 00:07:04,066 --> 00:07:05,566 we're gonna get divorced now 188 00:07:05,733 --> 00:07:06,066 no no no 189 00:07:06,066 --> 00:07:07,166 that wasn't the deal that's not what 190 00:07:07,166 --> 00:07:08,933 I meant I didn't say we are 191 00:07:08,933 --> 00:07:12,366 but we're not going to unless by a certain point 192 00:07:12,766 --> 00:07:13,766 ha ha yeah 193 00:07:13,766 --> 00:07:14,366 and I know and 194 00:07:14,366 --> 00:07:15,666 and I I start the book that way 195 00:07:15,666 --> 00:07:18,233 by the way the book's introduction is 196 00:07:18,233 --> 00:07:19,066 literally 197 00:07:19,066 --> 00:07:22,000 one of the hardest fights my wife and I have ever had 198 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,433 in our marriage we've been together for 11 years 199 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,000 one of the hardest fights we've ever had was the 200 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:29,433 our anniversary 201 00:07:29,966 --> 00:07:33,000 during the first year of our daughter's life 202 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,066 yeah where we live 203 00:07:35,066 --> 00:07:35,566 I I know 204 00:07:35,566 --> 00:07:37,566 and I've maybe other couples have done this 205 00:07:37,566 --> 00:07:38,533 it's not that we don't fight 206 00:07:38,533 --> 00:07:39,833 we get into fights all the time 207 00:07:39,833 --> 00:07:41,566 I'm talking all out screaming 208 00:07:41,566 --> 00:07:43,866 I'm talking sleeping in another room 209 00:07:43,866 --> 00:07:45,400 we were in a hotel yeah 210 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:47,966 like I've never argued that hard in a public 211 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:49,733 not that it was in the lobby 212 00:07:49,933 --> 00:07:52,633 but the walls are pretty thin in a hotel room 213 00:07:52,633 --> 00:07:55,233 yeah we were at each other's throats screaming 214 00:07:55,233 --> 00:07:57,800 we lost it and it was over something so stupid 215 00:07:57,800 --> 00:07:59,133 I wrote that I don't remember 216 00:07:59,133 --> 00:08:00,300 cause I didn't wanna write it 217 00:08:00,300 --> 00:08:00,833 but it was over 218 00:08:00,833 --> 00:08:03,433 like who to go to for the holidays that year 219 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:05,766 like it opened up this can of worms 220 00:08:05,766 --> 00:08:07,333 because we did not communicate 221 00:08:07,333 --> 00:08:08,733 we were so overwhelmed 222 00:08:08,733 --> 00:08:11,266 and we did not know how to talk about it 223 00:08:11,266 --> 00:08:13,266 without stepping on each other's toes 224 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:15,433 I was going through panic attacks 225 00:08:15,566 --> 00:08:16,833 I was going through anxiety 226 00:08:16,833 --> 00:08:18,566 that I never experienced before 227 00:08:18,666 --> 00:08:20,033 um it's actually a thing 228 00:08:20,033 --> 00:08:21,266 that most men don't talk about 229 00:08:21,266 --> 00:08:22,633 or even isn't talked about 230 00:08:22,633 --> 00:08:24,266 is the postpartum anxiety 231 00:08:24,266 --> 00:08:26,766 in men it is very researched in women 232 00:08:26,833 --> 00:08:28,766 it's not very researched in the father 233 00:08:29,033 --> 00:08:30,066 um but it is something very 234 00:08:30,066 --> 00:08:33,333 very common and over the last couple of years 235 00:08:33,333 --> 00:08:34,266 of the work that I've done 236 00:08:34,266 --> 00:08:35,266 in my private practice 237 00:08:35,266 --> 00:08:39,966 I've had men who are in their thirties to high 40s 238 00:08:40,233 --> 00:08:41,866 who finally come to therapy and say 239 00:08:41,866 --> 00:08:43,800 but on their own not pushed by their partner 240 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:44,833 who say hey Ellie 241 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:48,266 this isn't working I wish I had you in my life earlier 242 00:08:48,266 --> 00:08:50,233 I should have called you in my 20s 243 00:08:50,266 --> 00:08:51,666 I should have dealt with this 244 00:08:51,666 --> 00:08:53,066 I thought I could handle it 245 00:08:53,066 --> 00:08:58,200 and I can't or life has changed and I need to adjust 246 00:08:58,200 --> 00:09:01,133 and I don't know how I need to pivot to new skills 247 00:09:01,133 --> 00:09:04,333 I don't have them the things I used to do worked 248 00:09:04,333 --> 00:09:05,333 now aren't 249 00:09:06,133 --> 00:09:07,466 and it's such an honor 250 00:09:07,466 --> 00:09:09,433 to be able to do that with people 251 00:09:09,433 --> 00:09:11,833 but at the same time I need it myself 252 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:12,633 and that 253 00:09:12,633 --> 00:09:17,000 the book was me kind of telling how I worked through it 254 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:18,966 because I was not okay 255 00:09:19,533 --> 00:09:21,800 and I don't think any couple really is 256 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:23,133 and any couple who says oh 257 00:09:23,133 --> 00:09:24,733 we're fine after having a kid 258 00:09:24,733 --> 00:09:26,800 when literally not even two months 259 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:30,866 three days before your world was different is lying 260 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:32,166 it doesn't mean that you 261 00:09:32,166 --> 00:09:34,166 everyone's getting divorced once they have kids 262 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:35,733 but it definitely pushes buttons that you 263 00:09:35,733 --> 00:09:37,900 never knew existed it's such a strain 264 00:09:38,033 --> 00:09:39,233 it's such a strain 265 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:41,933 why do you suppose that men struggle with vulnerability 266 00:09:44,133 --> 00:09:45,833 and asking for help the way 267 00:09:45,833 --> 00:09:48,866 why does it take you until your 30s to 268 00:09:48,866 --> 00:09:50,000 to finally go man 269 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:50,966 I can't take this anymore 270 00:09:50,966 --> 00:09:51,566 why why do we 271 00:09:51,566 --> 00:09:53,000 why are we like that uh 272 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:54,366 such a loaded question and it's so 273 00:09:54,366 --> 00:09:56,733 so hard to answer like in a podcast 274 00:09:57,133 --> 00:10:00,300 and I write in the chapter from dudes to dads um 275 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:01,933 I did some research on it and there's a 276 00:10:01,933 --> 00:10:03,533 there was a new book that came out 277 00:10:03,833 --> 00:10:05,133 after I already submitted 278 00:10:05,133 --> 00:10:06,400 like all the information 279 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:08,200 and I can't really touch the book anymore 280 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:08,933 it's like it's done 281 00:10:08,933 --> 00:10:10,200 it's out of my hands right 282 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:12,366 a boys to men oh um 283 00:10:12,466 --> 00:10:13,933 not the band not the 284 00:10:13,933 --> 00:10:16,866 not the acapella group boys to men 285 00:10:16,866 --> 00:10:18,166 and I forgot who wrote it 286 00:10:18,166 --> 00:10:19,800 the author I have it upstairs in my bedroom 287 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:22,133 it's on my to to read next yeah 288 00:10:22,133 --> 00:10:23,566 um of the 289 00:10:23,566 --> 00:10:25,266 really the social research 290 00:10:25,266 --> 00:10:28,133 and the science behind how men have been raised 291 00:10:28,133 --> 00:10:29,133 over the generations the 292 00:10:29,133 --> 00:10:29,966 what I 293 00:10:30,233 --> 00:10:32,733 and my research and the work that I've been doing with 294 00:10:32,733 --> 00:10:34,833 with a lot of people um 295 00:10:34,833 --> 00:10:39,366 is the envision Sparta right 296 00:10:39,366 --> 00:10:41,533 the movie Sparta where the guy yells like 297 00:10:41,533 --> 00:10:44,566 this is Sparta and like kicks the guy into the well 298 00:10:44,766 --> 00:10:48,333 right every single culture has had tests right 299 00:10:48,333 --> 00:10:49,133 whether it's 300 00:10:49,133 --> 00:10:51,533 certain cultures that have the bees on the hands 301 00:10:51,533 --> 00:10:54,366 or a bar mitzvah or a baptism 302 00:10:54,366 --> 00:10:56,400 whatever religious or even cultural 303 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,833 of going out into the wilds back in the day 304 00:10:58,833 --> 00:11:02,333 or kind of coming of age story of being tested yeah 305 00:11:02,366 --> 00:11:04,733 we don't have that so often nowadays 306 00:11:04,966 --> 00:11:07,466 and we don't know what it's like to really be tested 307 00:11:07,466 --> 00:11:08,000 or pushed 308 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,900 to be challenged to what it means to us to be a man 309 00:11:11,066 --> 00:11:12,400 what it means to be masculine 310 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:14,766 what it means that we accept what that means 311 00:11:14,766 --> 00:11:17,566 not what society defines not what's toxic 312 00:11:17,566 --> 00:11:19,400 I hate that toxic masculinity concept 313 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:21,300 it's so ridiculously and stupid 314 00:11:21,566 --> 00:11:23,466 because just because someone has intensity 315 00:11:23,466 --> 00:11:25,166 doesn't mean they're toxic um 316 00:11:25,166 --> 00:11:28,166 there is quiet toxicity that happens most of the time 317 00:11:28,166 --> 00:11:30,200 but that's might be a whole another podcast 318 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:31,766 in which I'm more than happy to talk about 319 00:11:31,766 --> 00:11:33,333 on those on that note 320 00:11:33,333 --> 00:11:35,666 there's I don't think there's such a thing as toxic 321 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:36,766 masculinity either 322 00:11:36,766 --> 00:11:38,466 it's I think there's just really bad men 323 00:11:38,466 --> 00:11:41,133 there's shitty behavior and then there's masculinity 324 00:11:41,133 --> 00:11:42,133 and those two things 325 00:11:42,366 --> 00:11:43,766 it can't be more opposite than each other 326 00:11:43,766 --> 00:11:46,333 but once they started phrasing it as toxic masculinity 327 00:11:46,333 --> 00:11:48,633 what it did is it attached masculinity to toxic 328 00:11:48,666 --> 00:11:50,200 that's right and that's the problem 329 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:52,533 because there are masculine women who are not toxic 330 00:11:52,533 --> 00:11:54,566 and there are feminine men that are not less man 331 00:11:54,566 --> 00:11:56,666 masculine and so 332 00:11:56,666 --> 00:11:57,600 this idea of 333 00:11:57,600 --> 00:11:59,833 this pressure of vulnerability is this uns 334 00:11:59,833 --> 00:12:01,433 this safety issue of 335 00:12:01,433 --> 00:12:03,600 if I'm gonna open up and be my truest self 336 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:04,633 how will you accept me 337 00:12:04,633 --> 00:12:06,866 because I've been told by society 338 00:12:06,866 --> 00:12:08,466 or culturally over generations 339 00:12:08,466 --> 00:12:09,666 that I have to be the warrior 340 00:12:09,666 --> 00:12:10,766 the protector the 341 00:12:10,766 --> 00:12:11,600 the strong one 342 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:14,466 the loud one the if there is danger in the house 343 00:12:14,466 --> 00:12:16,966 who's going downstairs with the baseball bat or gun 344 00:12:17,033 --> 00:12:20,366 it's the man right and you do you in your relationship 345 00:12:20,366 --> 00:12:21,633 if that's how you want to do it 346 00:12:21,633 --> 00:12:22,433 but the point is that 347 00:12:22,433 --> 00:12:25,633 there is this intensity of the strength and power 348 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:28,433 and it has been taught that vulnerability or openness 349 00:12:28,433 --> 00:12:33,666 or emotions except for anger or happiness is accepted 350 00:12:34,066 --> 00:12:36,733 and it is something that is very pervasive 351 00:12:36,733 --> 00:12:38,566 and a very hard thing to relearn 352 00:12:38,566 --> 00:12:39,933 when you have been taught 353 00:12:40,033 --> 00:12:41,733 now depending on when you grew up 354 00:12:41,733 --> 00:12:42,466 whoever's listening 355 00:12:42,466 --> 00:12:44,566 if you grew up in the 80s and nineties 356 00:12:45,166 --> 00:12:48,266 if you were off or you were not accepted 357 00:12:48,266 --> 00:12:49,600 or you were not masculine 358 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:51,433 you were automatically called gay 359 00:12:51,433 --> 00:12:53,500 or something's a problem with you 360 00:12:53,833 --> 00:12:55,366 being gay is not a problem with you 361 00:12:55,366 --> 00:12:56,033 it's just like 362 00:12:56,033 --> 00:12:59,866 but that was a that was a slur like oh you're so gay 363 00:12:59,933 --> 00:13:01,133 why you're not 364 00:13:01,133 --> 00:13:03,433 you don't fit the box that we as a society 365 00:13:03,433 --> 00:13:07,500 or we as the cool group of men have decided yeah 366 00:13:07,733 --> 00:13:09,333 but in reality 367 00:13:09,333 --> 00:13:11,633 there's a spectrum of who you are as a man 368 00:13:11,633 --> 00:13:13,200 and some days you show up one way 369 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,266 another way you show up different way if you 370 00:13:15,266 --> 00:13:16,866 and the beautiful thing of nowadays 371 00:13:16,866 --> 00:13:17,800 I know I'm going on a rant 372 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:19,566 here but a beautiful day nowadays 373 00:13:19,666 --> 00:13:22,466 is that you see such of these strong athletes 374 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,600 who are the epitome of power 375 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:28,366 a football player running 20 miles an hour 376 00:13:28,366 --> 00:13:30,300 ramming into another human being 377 00:13:31,233 --> 00:13:34,733 a UFC fighter right saying hey 378 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:36,666 I'm gonna show a picture of me as a dad 379 00:13:36,666 --> 00:13:39,700 and be smiley and laughy and jokey and silly 380 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:41,600 I'm gonna be vulnerable and say hey 381 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:43,833 I'm having a hard day I need to take a day off 382 00:13:43,833 --> 00:13:46,533 like that is happening as well today 383 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:48,700 and those things are proving 384 00:13:48,766 --> 00:13:50,766 and showing men around the world 385 00:13:51,333 --> 00:13:53,533 be yourself what is today 386 00:13:53,533 --> 00:13:55,233 what is tomorrow are totally different 387 00:13:55,233 --> 00:13:57,566 even within the same day you have different roles 388 00:13:57,566 --> 00:13:59,666 and different opportunities to be your truest self 389 00:13:59,933 --> 00:14:01,733 and it's relearning that as a society 390 00:14:01,733 --> 00:14:03,733 and it's happening just slowly 391 00:14:04,266 --> 00:14:07,000 there's something that's really beautiful about 392 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,933 bringing your struggle out into the real world 393 00:14:10,133 --> 00:14:11,866 yeah and there's something that's really empowering 394 00:14:11,866 --> 00:14:12,966 about that too 395 00:14:13,266 --> 00:14:14,666 and I I mean 396 00:14:14,666 --> 00:14:17,366 it's like one of the metaphors that I like to use is 397 00:14:17,366 --> 00:14:18,566 who's the stronger boxer 398 00:14:18,566 --> 00:14:21,233 the guy who has an impenetrable shield 399 00:14:21,233 --> 00:14:24,566 or the guy whom doesn't need a shield at all 400 00:14:24,566 --> 00:14:26,666 and you can just whale on his face 401 00:14:26,666 --> 00:14:29,433 and it doesn't affect him Rocky 402 00:14:29,433 --> 00:14:30,866 you know which one of those 403 00:14:30,866 --> 00:14:33,066 literally Rocky right right 404 00:14:33,066 --> 00:14:35,633 Rocky was the guy who took all the shots 405 00:14:35,666 --> 00:14:38,666 right and took it took the beating until he 406 00:14:38,666 --> 00:14:40,400 the other person got tired right 407 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,666 that's the whole all 50 of those movies yeah 408 00:14:43,666 --> 00:14:45,966 right was him getting beaten to a pulp 409 00:14:46,033 --> 00:14:49,366 and then the last ability he had was the strength 410 00:14:49,366 --> 00:14:51,566 the power was I can take all these hits 411 00:14:51,766 --> 00:14:53,566 and I can show that I can bleed 412 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,400 but guess what you're gonna tire out 413 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:56,533 cause when you get tired 414 00:14:56,533 --> 00:14:58,366 I'm jumping on that opportunity 415 00:14:58,466 --> 00:15:00,566 and then you have the other boxers who were like 416 00:15:00,566 --> 00:15:02,166 you know the fast step 417 00:15:02,166 --> 00:15:03,633 you know or the pure power 418 00:15:03,633 --> 00:15:04,966 but had their you know 419 00:15:05,233 --> 00:15:05,933 and of course you know 420 00:15:05,933 --> 00:15:08,900 it's just a movie and based on someone maybe 421 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:10,466 but uh yeah 422 00:15:10,466 --> 00:15:11,333 and it's it's such a 423 00:15:11,333 --> 00:15:14,533 it's such a beautiful experience to be able to 424 00:15:14,566 --> 00:15:15,466 to be yourself 425 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:16,366 yeah it's 426 00:15:16,366 --> 00:15:17,433 it's cause 427 00:15:17,433 --> 00:15:19,066 I've worked with so many men 428 00:15:19,133 --> 00:15:22,266 who are trying so hard to be something else yeah 429 00:15:22,266 --> 00:15:22,666 that that 430 00:15:22,666 --> 00:15:26,366 that pressure is what breaks them not 431 00:15:26,366 --> 00:15:28,566 not the feel not the vulnerability 432 00:15:28,766 --> 00:15:30,733 if they actually just let go and 433 00:15:30,733 --> 00:15:34,066 and were themselves they wouldn't feel so tight 434 00:15:34,066 --> 00:15:35,400 they wouldn't feel so angsty 435 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:36,966 they wouldn't feel so angry 436 00:15:37,233 --> 00:15:39,566 they wouldn't feel so obsessed with that 437 00:15:39,566 --> 00:15:41,533 I need to be for other people 438 00:15:41,733 --> 00:15:42,966 if you were just yourself 439 00:15:43,433 --> 00:15:45,033 there would be this breath 440 00:15:45,033 --> 00:15:48,466 or space to just live your life yeah 441 00:15:48,466 --> 00:15:49,366 but what we're doing is 442 00:15:49,366 --> 00:15:51,966 they're putting on a show and protecting and being so 443 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:53,066 so oh my gosh 444 00:15:53,066 --> 00:15:54,433 who am I now who am I now 445 00:15:54,433 --> 00:15:56,666 who and it's so in their head that they just 446 00:15:56,666 --> 00:15:58,633 they burn themselves out and 447 00:15:58,633 --> 00:15:59,566 then they crash 448 00:15:59,633 --> 00:16:00,933 yeah it it's 449 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:03,933 you know it's like we've been told all our lives 450 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:05,266 maybe even for generations 451 00:16:05,933 --> 00:16:06,400 uh to 452 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:07,833 to man up right 453 00:16:07,833 --> 00:16:10,633 but Manning up what that envisions 454 00:16:10,633 --> 00:16:13,766 or what that elicits in your mind is closing up 455 00:16:13,866 --> 00:16:14,800 yeah and 456 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:16,000 you know putting your guard up and 457 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:16,933 and you know 458 00:16:16,933 --> 00:16:19,566 struggle through it and and shoulder the Grindstone 459 00:16:19,566 --> 00:16:20,566 but you know 460 00:16:20,566 --> 00:16:22,800 the real Manning up 461 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,533 the real masculine move there is really to open up 462 00:16:26,066 --> 00:16:27,666 and there's nothing wrong with 463 00:16:27,666 --> 00:16:29,200 with being tough yeah 464 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:32,833 there's no problem with seeing a problem 465 00:16:33,333 --> 00:16:35,833 and looking at it and not freaking out 466 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:37,433 and standing there and going 467 00:16:37,433 --> 00:16:39,666 here's how I'm gonna here's how I'm gonna deal with it 468 00:16:39,666 --> 00:16:42,933 right but it's also okay to also get freaked out 469 00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:46,033 and then think it through and figure it out yeah 470 00:16:46,033 --> 00:16:47,266 like that's okay too 471 00:16:47,333 --> 00:16:50,066 it doesn't mean you're cowering in the corner 472 00:16:50,433 --> 00:16:53,333 as people envision the joke I always make with uh 473 00:16:53,533 --> 00:16:55,333 like the in the vision of what people think 474 00:16:55,333 --> 00:16:56,666 like having emotions are 475 00:16:56,666 --> 00:16:58,966 is a very famous scene in friends 476 00:16:59,066 --> 00:17:01,333 with Bruce Willis and Rachel and uh 477 00:17:01,333 --> 00:17:04,500 Jennifer Aniston and they're dating 478 00:17:04,566 --> 00:17:08,033 and Jennifer Aniston asks Courtney Cox's character uh 479 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:09,533 Monica like hey 480 00:17:09,533 --> 00:17:11,133 I wanna open up my you know 481 00:17:11,133 --> 00:17:12,500 Paul I think his name is 482 00:17:12,633 --> 00:17:13,566 I don't know how whatever 483 00:17:13,566 --> 00:17:14,600 and she gives her some secret 484 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:16,366 and the next scene is literally 485 00:17:16,366 --> 00:17:19,166 Bruce Willis on Jennifer Aniston's lap 486 00:17:19,166 --> 00:17:20,666 just bawling like a baby 487 00:17:21,366 --> 00:17:22,966 and she can't handle it she's like 488 00:17:22,966 --> 00:17:24,366 I didn't ask for this 489 00:17:24,366 --> 00:17:26,533 and everyone thinks that that is what the envision is 490 00:17:26,533 --> 00:17:29,133 that once we start opening up and being vulnerable 491 00:17:29,133 --> 00:17:31,466 that we just won't be able to control it 492 00:17:31,466 --> 00:17:33,033 I think that's the fear right 493 00:17:33,033 --> 00:17:33,633 yeah that is 494 00:17:33,633 --> 00:17:34,633 that our strength 495 00:17:34,633 --> 00:17:37,033 is in being able to hold all that stuff in 496 00:17:37,033 --> 00:17:39,033 and if we and the fear of the other person going 497 00:17:39,033 --> 00:17:40,600 I don't like that yeah 498 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:41,066 no no 499 00:17:41,066 --> 00:17:42,133 no put that back no 500 00:17:42,133 --> 00:17:42,400 no no 501 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:43,300 no that's ugly 502 00:17:43,333 --> 00:17:45,633 don't do that again yeah 503 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:50,033 how do you suppose we 504 00:17:50,666 --> 00:17:54,966 keep that virus from infecting our sons 505 00:17:55,766 --> 00:17:59,366 I think by two things maybe three 506 00:17:59,366 --> 00:18:01,566 depending on where my ADHD brain goes today 507 00:18:01,733 --> 00:18:04,733 um the first one is you doing it yourself right 508 00:18:04,733 --> 00:18:07,300 kids learn by watching not by being told 509 00:18:07,733 --> 00:18:10,166 they really just soak in like a sponge 510 00:18:10,166 --> 00:18:11,433 everything that's happening around them 511 00:18:11,433 --> 00:18:14,266 so how you love your partner 512 00:18:14,333 --> 00:18:16,866 how you show emotions hugs 513 00:18:16,933 --> 00:18:18,633 kisses uh 514 00:18:18,966 --> 00:18:21,733 tushy squeezes whatever your love language is 515 00:18:21,733 --> 00:18:23,133 however you wanna show it 516 00:18:23,566 --> 00:18:25,533 that's a beautiful thing for them to see 517 00:18:25,533 --> 00:18:28,700 that you have emotions No. 2 518 00:18:29,033 --> 00:18:30,533 are you gonna show the emotions to them 519 00:18:30,533 --> 00:18:33,500 are you gonna hide it like if you're crying 520 00:18:33,533 --> 00:18:35,633 are not that you should be like look 521 00:18:35,633 --> 00:18:37,166 look I'm crying right 522 00:18:37,166 --> 00:18:37,666 yeah but if 523 00:18:37,666 --> 00:18:40,033 but if you're crying and your kid goes 524 00:18:40,033 --> 00:18:41,666 hey dad are you okay 525 00:18:41,666 --> 00:18:43,500 and you're honest with them saying yeah 526 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:45,166 something just made me sad 527 00:18:45,533 --> 00:18:48,733 or I'm really frustrated or overwhelmed 528 00:18:49,233 --> 00:18:51,400 you're not putting that burden on the kid and saying 529 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:53,633 I need you to fix it that's unhealthy 530 00:18:53,833 --> 00:18:56,666 but being honest about it is teaching them that look 531 00:18:56,666 --> 00:18:59,366 dad has emotions and I saw them 532 00:18:59,666 --> 00:19:01,533 and then the other thing is 533 00:19:01,533 --> 00:19:03,466 how you talk to them about their emotions 534 00:19:04,633 --> 00:19:05,866 so if they have an emotion 535 00:19:05,866 --> 00:19:06,733 it's not saying hey 536 00:19:06,733 --> 00:19:09,300 stop crying grow up 537 00:19:09,733 --> 00:19:11,733 my son is three and a/2 yeah 538 00:19:11,733 --> 00:19:15,400 him crying about something that bothers him is 539 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:16,466 hey bud 540 00:19:16,466 --> 00:19:18,133 what's going on why are you so upset 541 00:19:18,133 --> 00:19:19,566 talk to me yeah 542 00:19:19,566 --> 00:19:21,133 it's not stop crying 543 00:19:21,133 --> 00:19:23,266 it's I wanna understand why you're crying 544 00:19:23,266 --> 00:19:25,266 cause that's okay yeah 545 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:26,633 or you're hurt 546 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:28,933 now there is a thing with parents 547 00:19:28,933 --> 00:19:31,400 a parenting about when a kid falls saying 548 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:33,400 are you okay or not right 549 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:35,600 the answer is you're gonna be okay 550 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:37,533 I'm sorry you're in pain right 551 00:19:37,533 --> 00:19:39,033 but you're gonna be okay yeah 552 00:19:39,033 --> 00:19:41,633 it's not get up wipe off 553 00:19:41,633 --> 00:19:42,333 you know your 554 00:19:42,333 --> 00:19:44,266 your body and and keep moving 555 00:19:44,433 --> 00:19:45,766 grow up yeah 556 00:19:45,766 --> 00:19:47,733 so the words and how we express it 557 00:19:47,733 --> 00:19:49,033 how we talk to them 558 00:19:49,066 --> 00:19:52,166 teaches them the value of their emotions and feelings 559 00:19:52,866 --> 00:19:54,433 and helping you understand it 560 00:19:54,433 --> 00:19:57,733 and them understand it is part of that equation 561 00:19:58,033 --> 00:19:59,066 and uh 562 00:19:59,133 --> 00:20:00,666 hopefully that clicks and in the end 563 00:20:00,666 --> 00:20:01,466 it's not up to us 564 00:20:01,466 --> 00:20:02,800 they're gonna do what they wanna do with it 565 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:04,433 you know yeah 566 00:20:04,633 --> 00:20:05,033 you know I 567 00:20:05,033 --> 00:20:09,133 I had an experience like that with my boy going 568 00:20:09,133 --> 00:20:10,666 it was about a maybe a year or two 569 00:20:10,666 --> 00:20:13,633 ago and in my 570 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:15,100 in my family 571 00:20:15,166 --> 00:20:17,633 we always use humor as a shield 572 00:20:17,833 --> 00:20:18,800 yeah right 573 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:19,733 and I remember 574 00:20:21,100 --> 00:20:22,100 you know the worst thing 575 00:20:22,266 --> 00:20:23,733 worst thing that ever happened to me was 576 00:20:23,733 --> 00:20:28,166 was my mom dying of cancer when I was 21 years old 577 00:20:28,533 --> 00:20:31,033 and I remember making a joke 578 00:20:32,866 --> 00:20:34,300 five minutes after it happened 579 00:20:34,733 --> 00:20:35,533 uh huh 580 00:20:35,933 --> 00:20:39,233 and so like two years ago 581 00:20:39,233 --> 00:20:40,166 I was 582 00:20:41,266 --> 00:20:43,966 my my son was having a really hard time with something 583 00:20:43,966 --> 00:20:46,733 and he was and he was very upset 584 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:52,533 and I started goofing around with him 585 00:20:52,533 --> 00:20:54,733 and started making jokes and stuff 586 00:20:54,733 --> 00:20:56,100 to try and get him to laugh 587 00:20:56,333 --> 00:20:59,633 yeah and it was my way of like I 588 00:20:59,766 --> 00:21:02,466 I couldn't handle him being upset 589 00:21:02,466 --> 00:21:04,233 and so I 590 00:21:04,233 --> 00:21:06,766 I was trying to make him laugh to get him out of it 591 00:21:06,766 --> 00:21:08,766 and that's cause that's what I do right 592 00:21:08,766 --> 00:21:10,866 and that's what I want to do 593 00:21:10,866 --> 00:21:13,133 and that's what I want other people to do for me 594 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:16,266 and he says to me he starts laughing 595 00:21:16,266 --> 00:21:17,266 and I said and and 596 00:21:17,266 --> 00:21:19,033 and he and he says 597 00:21:19,166 --> 00:21:21,133 he says dad stop 598 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:24,233 you won't let me feel what I feel 599 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:28,000 and I was just like blown away by this 600 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:30,366 here's this four year old kid 601 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,800 and he's got more emotional intelligence than I do 602 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:34,000 like recognizing like 603 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:36,566 I just need to feel this for a minute just 604 00:21:36,866 --> 00:21:39,900 you know stop making me not feel it 605 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,833 yeah and then if you wanna joke about it later 606 00:21:41,833 --> 00:21:43,400 you can right right 607 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:43,666 it's not like 608 00:21:43,666 --> 00:21:45,733 don't have a sense of humor or joke around 609 00:21:45,733 --> 00:21:48,766 and if that's your way of handling things okay 610 00:21:48,933 --> 00:21:49,733 but he was just saying like 611 00:21:49,733 --> 00:21:51,400 give me a second to feel it 612 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,766 we'll joke around later yeah 613 00:21:53,966 --> 00:21:55,133 yeah yeah 614 00:21:55,133 --> 00:21:56,433 and so and I mean 615 00:21:56,433 --> 00:21:57,166 I like that I 616 00:21:57,166 --> 00:22:00,133 I like the idea of being able to connect back 617 00:22:00,133 --> 00:22:02,000 and there is there is 618 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,233 a strength in being able to joke about your foibles 619 00:22:04,233 --> 00:22:05,166 and joke about the 620 00:22:05,166 --> 00:22:06,600 the awful stuff that has happened to you 621 00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:07,633 there's you know 622 00:22:07,633 --> 00:22:09,166 there's some of that too 623 00:22:09,933 --> 00:22:13,933 but as but avoidance isn't a good strategy 624 00:22:14,533 --> 00:22:16,766 yeah and certainly 625 00:22:17,033 --> 00:22:22,833 like training him to avoid feeling sad is not right 626 00:22:22,833 --> 00:22:24,866 it's not good yeah 627 00:22:25,166 --> 00:22:25,966 that's why like you know 628 00:22:25,966 --> 00:22:27,133 a lot of people when they're 629 00:22:27,133 --> 00:22:28,233 they're raising their kids 630 00:22:28,233 --> 00:22:29,966 a lot of a lot of parents 631 00:22:29,966 --> 00:22:33,266 myself included are all about distraction right 632 00:22:33,266 --> 00:22:34,600 if a kid gets hurt you go 633 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:36,066 you know like you make a funny face 634 00:22:36,066 --> 00:22:40,366 you do a silly thing or or when a kid's upset or a baby 635 00:22:40,366 --> 00:22:42,400 you try to distract them right 636 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,033 but like that's for us yeah 637 00:22:45,133 --> 00:22:45,966 cause we want them to stop 638 00:22:45,966 --> 00:22:48,233 so I don't have to feel bad that you feel bad 639 00:22:48,233 --> 00:22:49,166 yeah or like 640 00:22:49,166 --> 00:22:51,766 I don't wanna listen to you crying right 641 00:22:52,166 --> 00:22:54,366 so like stop it 642 00:22:55,266 --> 00:22:56,666 yeah yeah 643 00:22:57,333 --> 00:22:59,466 it's a great story and so that's 644 00:22:59,466 --> 00:23:02,266 that's one of my little demons that I have to 645 00:23:02,666 --> 00:23:04,166 that I have to work through is 646 00:23:04,166 --> 00:23:06,633 is you know and but you know 647 00:23:06,633 --> 00:23:09,000 he's he's pretty smart kid 648 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,333 he can he can teach me yeah 649 00:23:11,333 --> 00:23:13,333 clearly that that's a yeah 650 00:23:13,333 --> 00:23:15,333 I remember once my daughter 651 00:23:15,333 --> 00:23:16,333 she was learning about like 652 00:23:16,333 --> 00:23:17,800 emotions in school or something 653 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:19,133 I don't know she was in daycare 654 00:23:19,366 --> 00:23:23,000 yeah and she came home and she like patted the 655 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,366 like the couch next to her and she goes daddy 656 00:23:25,466 --> 00:23:27,300 come let's talk about our emotions 657 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,533 I was like aren't I'm the therapist 658 00:23:31,333 --> 00:23:34,600 what are you doing you're a kid daddy 659 00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:36,000 I wanna talk about my emotions 660 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:37,300 I went okay awesome 661 00:23:38,133 --> 00:23:39,766 I love that I yeah 662 00:23:39,766 --> 00:23:41,333 I would yeah by all means 663 00:23:41,333 --> 00:23:42,166 let's do it yeah 664 00:23:42,166 --> 00:23:43,933 let's do it yeah 665 00:23:44,066 --> 00:23:46,733 I man that's great what do you you know 666 00:23:46,733 --> 00:23:50,933 what else can we do to create a home environment where 667 00:23:51,233 --> 00:23:52,566 we welcome 668 00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:54,166 emotions and 669 00:23:54,166 --> 00:23:55,466 and we 670 00:23:55,666 --> 00:23:58,933 we we don't shut them down and and all of that stuff 671 00:23:58,933 --> 00:24:01,166 how can we as as fathers 672 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:03,966 try and create that environment 673 00:24:04,266 --> 00:24:07,566 yeah and I think I think it's having a game plan with 674 00:24:07,566 --> 00:24:09,966 you know your your the home right 675 00:24:09,966 --> 00:24:12,300 and the the the the the partner 676 00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:14,600 I I do this thing with a lot of couples and I 677 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,833 I was taught this by a a mentor of mine 678 00:24:17,833 --> 00:24:20,766 his name is Josh Goller and it was the idea of like 679 00:24:20,766 --> 00:24:23,266 something called the Import Export List 680 00:24:23,300 --> 00:24:26,066 and what it is is sitting down with 681 00:24:26,066 --> 00:24:27,933 you can do it with a friend if you want 682 00:24:27,933 --> 00:24:30,433 if that's the kind the relationship do with your wife 683 00:24:30,433 --> 00:24:34,133 your husband whoever it is and you sit down and go OK 684 00:24:34,133 --> 00:24:36,166 for this home for this unit 685 00:24:36,633 --> 00:24:39,666 what are the imports and exports that we want to keep 686 00:24:39,666 --> 00:24:40,966 as like guidelines 687 00:24:40,966 --> 00:24:43,166 home rules whatever it is yeah 688 00:24:43,166 --> 00:24:44,166 some people 689 00:24:44,266 --> 00:24:47,266 the export is no slamming doors in the house 690 00:24:47,466 --> 00:24:49,200 that is an export right 691 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,133 that that that pushes me in a ways 692 00:24:51,133 --> 00:24:54,366 I don't like an import is we want our house to be open 693 00:24:54,866 --> 00:24:57,233 friends wanna come over people knock on the door 694 00:24:57,233 --> 00:24:59,066 that are our friends or family welcome 695 00:24:59,066 --> 00:25:00,100 like we're not gonna be like 696 00:25:00,666 --> 00:25:02,166 what are you doing here what time is it 697 00:25:02,166 --> 00:25:03,433 get out of the house yeah 698 00:25:03,433 --> 00:25:05,266 of course boundaries and respect 699 00:25:05,266 --> 00:25:07,433 but that is part of that conversation is 700 00:25:07,433 --> 00:25:10,566 how do we want to raise our kids 701 00:25:11,233 --> 00:25:12,600 don't do it before you have kids 702 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,933 cause you have no idea what the hell that means um 703 00:25:14,933 --> 00:25:16,566 it's all theory and that's nice 704 00:25:16,566 --> 00:25:18,866 do it okay there are theoretical things like 705 00:25:18,866 --> 00:25:20,233 don't hit your children and don't 706 00:25:20,233 --> 00:25:21,533 and then you get to laugh at yourself 707 00:25:21,666 --> 00:25:23,033 a year later about what you wrote 708 00:25:23,033 --> 00:25:24,600 we thought we were gonna do this haha 709 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:25,400 you're like what 710 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,233 we were gonna not use TV um 711 00:25:28,233 --> 00:25:30,133 that is insane um 712 00:25:30,133 --> 00:25:33,333 it's okay to watch TV your kids are not gonna be ruined 713 00:25:33,433 --> 00:25:36,366 just do other things also um 714 00:25:36,366 --> 00:25:38,466 but like the import export is a 715 00:25:38,466 --> 00:25:38,600 but 716 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:40,866 it also opens a conversation between the two people 717 00:25:41,166 --> 00:25:44,033 where like what the culture they grew up in 718 00:25:44,033 --> 00:25:46,333 the maybe religious things that they grew up in 719 00:25:46,333 --> 00:25:48,533 maybe the perspectives that they were taught about 720 00:25:48,533 --> 00:25:49,966 emotions feelings 721 00:25:50,366 --> 00:25:52,033 um how to think and 722 00:25:52,033 --> 00:25:52,200 and and 723 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:53,833 and go through the world 724 00:25:53,933 --> 00:25:56,066 so it is a beautiful thing to go oh 725 00:25:56,133 --> 00:25:59,066 you know here's how we deal with holidays or 726 00:25:59,066 --> 00:26:02,766 you know stress before guests come 727 00:26:02,766 --> 00:26:06,366 or the environment and culture that you grew up in 728 00:26:06,833 --> 00:26:08,333 sometimes becomes the norm 729 00:26:08,466 --> 00:26:11,666 and another person goes that's not healthy 730 00:26:11,933 --> 00:26:14,333 no one does that except for you guys 731 00:26:14,566 --> 00:26:16,966 I'll give an example when growing up 732 00:26:17,033 --> 00:26:18,866 travel was very stressful 733 00:26:18,966 --> 00:26:21,666 my mom would get very intense about packing 734 00:26:21,666 --> 00:26:23,533 we would start packing like a week before 735 00:26:24,066 --> 00:26:27,333 when I got married and I was with my wife and I like 736 00:26:27,333 --> 00:26:28,366 okay we're gonna go on a trip 737 00:26:28,366 --> 00:26:31,400 I started getting all tense and angsty and she's like 738 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:32,533 what's we're like 739 00:26:32,533 --> 00:26:34,533 I'm like two weeks out what are you getting antsy about 740 00:26:34,533 --> 00:26:35,966 like I don't have a problem flying 741 00:26:36,233 --> 00:26:37,566 I don't have a problem you know 742 00:26:37,566 --> 00:26:38,600 going places 743 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,600 I love going and enjoying the world and traveling 744 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,033 if I can yeah 745 00:26:43,033 --> 00:26:43,933 my wife's like what's wrong 746 00:26:43,933 --> 00:26:45,066 I'm like I don't know 747 00:26:45,166 --> 00:26:46,200 like I've never thought about like 748 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,333 what do you mean like 749 00:26:47,533 --> 00:26:49,466 she's like are you worried about packing 750 00:26:49,933 --> 00:26:51,533 I'm like yeah 751 00:26:51,866 --> 00:26:54,566 I I overpack because I try to counteract like 752 00:26:54,566 --> 00:26:55,833 not having enough like I'm like 753 00:26:55,833 --> 00:26:57,700 oh my gosh it could rain 754 00:26:57,866 --> 00:27:01,433 um and she started making packing lists 755 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,233 and it took all the anxiety away because I was like 756 00:27:05,233 --> 00:27:06,400 oh I have a clear thing 757 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:06,833 she's like yeah 758 00:27:06,833 --> 00:27:09,033 it helps me be organized and then we have it together 759 00:27:09,166 --> 00:27:11,900 but it's because of my the environment of my childhood 760 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:15,766 of packing equals intensity yeah 761 00:27:15,766 --> 00:27:17,233 so we had a conversation about it 762 00:27:17,233 --> 00:27:19,166 so these things will come up 763 00:27:19,166 --> 00:27:22,000 so tip use pencil on the paper 764 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:23,633 don't use a pen so you can 765 00:27:23,633 --> 00:27:24,433 you know 766 00:27:25,266 --> 00:27:27,166 what's pencil no one use a pencil anymore 767 00:27:27,566 --> 00:27:30,066 but the idea use a digital media right 768 00:27:30,066 --> 00:27:31,533 use a digital or Google DOC 769 00:27:31,566 --> 00:27:34,833 right or apple note is just have these conversations 770 00:27:35,166 --> 00:27:38,200 and when situations come up that you don't agree with 771 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:40,633 or rub you the wrong way yeah 772 00:27:40,633 --> 00:27:42,533 have a meeting with each other 773 00:27:42,533 --> 00:27:43,333 go hey 774 00:27:43,366 --> 00:27:44,366 not in the moment 775 00:27:44,366 --> 00:27:45,666 don't call each other out in the moment 776 00:27:45,666 --> 00:27:48,000 yeah that's a good way to not have the fight too right 777 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:48,666 yeah just remember hey 778 00:27:48,666 --> 00:27:51,033 what happened there let's say that's the Sunday meeting 779 00:27:51,033 --> 00:27:51,600 like yeah 780 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,733 why is that something that you think is 781 00:27:54,733 --> 00:27:56,733 you would do oh well 782 00:27:56,733 --> 00:27:57,666 you know that's what my 783 00:27:57,666 --> 00:27:59,433 my dad didn't like that 784 00:27:59,433 --> 00:28:01,966 when I did that in the house and just came out yeah 785 00:28:01,966 --> 00:28:02,333 oh well 786 00:28:02,333 --> 00:28:03,400 I don't really like that 787 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:04,733 I don't like seeing that in you 788 00:28:04,733 --> 00:28:06,500 that's not how we want to raise our kids 789 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,066 oh I didn't think of it that way 790 00:28:08,066 --> 00:28:09,833 or no I like this 791 00:28:09,833 --> 00:28:13,266 because let's figure out if that's something 792 00:28:13,266 --> 00:28:15,066 that fits for both of us right 793 00:28:15,066 --> 00:28:17,166 or come up with a way to make it fit for both of us 794 00:28:17,166 --> 00:28:18,766 yeah there's some principle here 795 00:28:18,766 --> 00:28:20,666 that we can probably agree on 796 00:28:20,666 --> 00:28:21,833 yeah exactly 797 00:28:21,866 --> 00:28:23,000 yeah you know 798 00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:25,333 I feel like that's a really good way 799 00:28:25,466 --> 00:28:26,000 a really good 800 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,966 practical way to give the kids agency in their lives 801 00:28:28,966 --> 00:28:29,766 too 802 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:33,033 is incorporating them into that discussion 803 00:28:33,033 --> 00:28:34,466 and have it be a family meeting alright 804 00:28:34,466 --> 00:28:37,533 as a family we're deciding to focus on these things 805 00:28:37,533 --> 00:28:39,600 and it's not imposed what worked this week 806 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:41,100 what didn't work this week 807 00:28:41,266 --> 00:28:42,066 yeah like 808 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,833 and of course we gotta take it with what 809 00:28:44,833 --> 00:28:47,033 how old they are and how you know 810 00:28:47,133 --> 00:28:50,000 but if a kid's like 8 to 10 years old 811 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:51,733 they have very 812 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:54,633 clear thoughts of what they like and don't like 813 00:28:54,633 --> 00:28:56,666 they're not like a 3 year old kid who just likes 814 00:28:56,666 --> 00:28:58,533 my son likes dinosaurs and cars 815 00:28:58,533 --> 00:28:59,866 like that's all he likes yeah 816 00:28:59,866 --> 00:29:01,133 right or candy exactly 817 00:29:01,333 --> 00:29:01,833 but like 818 00:29:01,833 --> 00:29:04,033 that also means what are you gonna do on the weekends 819 00:29:04,566 --> 00:29:05,333 yeah you can ask them 820 00:29:05,333 --> 00:29:06,500 it's not well 821 00:29:06,566 --> 00:29:10,200 daddy wants to go watch football for 80 hours and we're 822 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:11,633 you know we can't talk to him 823 00:29:11,666 --> 00:29:13,066 if that's how you do it do you 824 00:29:13,066 --> 00:29:14,633 no judgment um 825 00:29:14,866 --> 00:29:16,433 but have a conversation 826 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:18,566 talk bring them in 827 00:29:18,633 --> 00:29:20,833 if there's a buy in to the home 828 00:29:20,966 --> 00:29:23,166 yeah and it's a buy in out of respect 829 00:29:23,166 --> 00:29:25,633 not you're doing chores and free labor 830 00:29:25,633 --> 00:29:28,000 but a respect for the home for how we do things 831 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:29,266 the enjoyment the love 832 00:29:29,266 --> 00:29:30,233 the happiness 833 00:29:30,366 --> 00:29:32,266 it's not all perfect in unicorns and daisies 834 00:29:32,266 --> 00:29:33,066 of course 835 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,533 but they're bought in and it's exciting 836 00:29:35,533 --> 00:29:36,033 they're like oh 837 00:29:36,033 --> 00:29:38,366 I matter it's not just mommy and daddy 838 00:29:38,366 --> 00:29:38,800 yes mommy 839 00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:39,866 daddy are making the rules 840 00:29:39,866 --> 00:29:41,533 and mommy and daddy keep the chaos and 841 00:29:41,533 --> 00:29:42,633 and control 842 00:29:42,633 --> 00:29:45,566 but I have agency within that framework 843 00:29:45,566 --> 00:29:47,666 I'm not just going along to get along 844 00:29:47,666 --> 00:29:49,533 because mommy and daddy make all the decisions 845 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,533 and again the kids are not making decisions 846 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:53,733 they're children but it's yeah 847 00:29:53,733 --> 00:29:54,200 they can 848 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,166 they can partake and giving up ideas to the board 849 00:29:57,233 --> 00:29:58,266 yeah right 850 00:29:58,266 --> 00:30:00,233 like the thought the thought boards like oh 851 00:30:00,233 --> 00:30:02,533 that's a good idea great job 852 00:30:03,033 --> 00:30:05,066 you know you thought that's a wonderful idea 853 00:30:05,066 --> 00:30:06,433 and they're like oh me 854 00:30:06,633 --> 00:30:08,533 thank you yeah right 855 00:30:08,533 --> 00:30:09,633 that's that's wonderful 856 00:30:09,866 --> 00:30:11,500 yeah so much of 857 00:30:11,933 --> 00:30:13,866 I mean when I watch my son I 858 00:30:13,866 --> 00:30:16,466 I I can see the tension in him 859 00:30:16,466 --> 00:30:17,666 there's so much of his life 860 00:30:17,666 --> 00:30:22,433 is this tension between wanting to be independent 861 00:30:22,566 --> 00:30:25,233 and wanting to be connected 862 00:30:26,233 --> 00:30:28,300 and I mean sometimes 863 00:30:28,733 --> 00:30:29,666 you know it'll 864 00:30:29,666 --> 00:30:33,333 it'll happen where he's screaming 865 00:30:33,333 --> 00:30:34,766 I just want love 866 00:30:35,366 --> 00:30:35,966 like like 867 00:30:35,966 --> 00:30:36,566 I mean you 868 00:30:36,566 --> 00:30:37,500 you you are 869 00:30:37,666 --> 00:30:38,466 at the same time 870 00:30:38,466 --> 00:30:40,733 pushing me away and then complaining that I'm 871 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,833 I'm not next to you and um 872 00:30:43,833 --> 00:30:47,633 and I feel like times when you can get that 873 00:30:48,266 --> 00:30:50,066 it's actually pretty easy for us 874 00:30:50,066 --> 00:30:51,600 at least in our family to 875 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:52,966 to create that connection 876 00:30:52,966 --> 00:30:55,800 we're very physical we're we 877 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:58,000 you know my boy and I wrestle all the time 878 00:30:58,000 --> 00:30:59,566 we're like we're it's 879 00:30:59,566 --> 00:31:01,566 it's that's not a problem for us 880 00:31:01,566 --> 00:31:03,600 but the independence bit that 881 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,433 that is a place where it can be a little bit harder 882 00:31:06,433 --> 00:31:07,800 especially since some of the stuff oh 883 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,000 I just wanna watch YouTube for six straight hours 884 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:12,766 and I really don't want them on YouTube 885 00:31:12,833 --> 00:31:14,833 and so it's 886 00:31:15,933 --> 00:31:19,633 places where you sort of get the independence for free 887 00:31:19,633 --> 00:31:23,133 I always perk up when I see opportunities like that 888 00:31:23,233 --> 00:31:24,200 yeah I love that 889 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:25,000 and then and things 890 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:26,200 and things change you know 891 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:27,000 like 892 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,366 a lot of parents think when they first become parents 893 00:31:30,366 --> 00:31:31,033 that they have to like 894 00:31:31,033 --> 00:31:33,600 be on top of their kids playing with them all the time 895 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:33,833 yeah 896 00:31:33,833 --> 00:31:35,866 and there's nothing wrong with like play with your kids 897 00:31:35,866 --> 00:31:37,666 like enjoy time with them yeah 898 00:31:37,666 --> 00:31:38,433 but my point is like 899 00:31:38,433 --> 00:31:40,966 it's okay if they're in the other room yeah 900 00:31:40,966 --> 00:31:43,666 playing by themselves and enjoying life 901 00:31:44,033 --> 00:31:47,300 I don't need to be in the same room 902 00:31:47,766 --> 00:31:49,833 for them to be happy right 903 00:31:49,833 --> 00:31:52,100 they can be like we have a playroom in our house 904 00:31:52,333 --> 00:31:53,933 there are days where I'm like 905 00:31:53,933 --> 00:31:55,966 where's my son and I look in and he's like 906 00:31:55,966 --> 00:31:56,766 he's just sitting there 907 00:31:56,766 --> 00:31:59,633 playing and talking to himself and having a good time 908 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:01,466 he's being a beautiful child 909 00:32:01,766 --> 00:32:04,033 I don't need to then go in there and and 910 00:32:04,033 --> 00:32:05,733 and play with him right 911 00:32:05,733 --> 00:32:07,533 and then get frustrated that he 912 00:32:07,533 --> 00:32:09,833 I'm not playing the way he wants me to yeah 913 00:32:09,833 --> 00:32:11,766 like it's okay yeah 914 00:32:11,766 --> 00:32:14,033 like embrace that it's wonderful 915 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:16,866 so it's so beautiful to watch 916 00:32:16,866 --> 00:32:17,666 I wanna actually 917 00:32:17,733 --> 00:32:20,200 I wanna drill down a little bit more on this 918 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,866 dude to dad transition 919 00:32:22,866 --> 00:32:27,833 what is I I felt this absolutely 920 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:30,666 I mean that was an absolute cusp for me 921 00:32:30,666 --> 00:32:32,633 and especially since for me I 922 00:32:32,633 --> 00:32:34,566 I kind of had kids later in life 923 00:32:34,566 --> 00:32:36,000 and so I had a whole life 924 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,033 and it was established before my boy came along 925 00:32:39,033 --> 00:32:42,166 and then it my life was totally different 926 00:32:42,266 --> 00:32:42,666 you know 927 00:32:42,666 --> 00:32:46,533 literally 30 minutes after we walked in the hospital 928 00:32:46,533 --> 00:32:47,666 pretty much yeah 929 00:32:47,666 --> 00:32:48,733 and so let's 930 00:32:48,733 --> 00:32:50,000 talk to me a little bit more about what 931 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:51,333 that transition and what's 932 00:32:51,333 --> 00:32:53,666 what's the difficulty and what's important about 933 00:32:53,666 --> 00:32:55,166 and how should we think about that 934 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,766 yeah I think the difficulty for a lot of men 935 00:32:58,866 --> 00:33:01,633 is the idea that they're gonna lose their autonomy 936 00:33:01,633 --> 00:33:03,433 and their individuality they're gonna be like 937 00:33:03,433 --> 00:33:05,066 something's gonna be a problem 938 00:33:05,433 --> 00:33:06,433 that all of a sudden now 939 00:33:06,433 --> 00:33:08,233 they're not gonna be able to be themselves 940 00:33:08,466 --> 00:33:09,866 they're not gonna be able to have fun 941 00:33:09,866 --> 00:33:10,966 they're not gonna be you know 942 00:33:10,966 --> 00:33:12,566 go out with the boys yeah 943 00:33:12,566 --> 00:33:17,133 right and I remember I had a client a couple years ago 944 00:33:17,233 --> 00:33:18,666 like this was one of the reasons why I realized 945 00:33:18,666 --> 00:33:19,600 this book is so important 946 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,233 because of this client and he said like Ellie 947 00:33:22,233 --> 00:33:24,566 I'm gonna lose all the the things that I 948 00:33:24,566 --> 00:33:27,466 love to do uh huh it's gonna go away 949 00:33:27,466 --> 00:33:30,600 I can't do it anymore and I said this line and yes 950 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:31,833 it's there's it's deeper than that 951 00:33:31,833 --> 00:33:33,366 and there's like a classic therapy line 952 00:33:33,366 --> 00:33:36,000 but I was like you're not losing yourself 953 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,433 you're adding a layer like 954 00:33:38,433 --> 00:33:39,533 it's not deleting 955 00:33:39,733 --> 00:33:41,666 the fact that you wanna go snowboarding 956 00:33:41,933 --> 00:33:43,333 on the weekends it's not taking 957 00:33:43,333 --> 00:33:45,166 away the fact that you wanna go to the gym 958 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,433 or read a book or go play sports 959 00:33:47,433 --> 00:33:48,666 or hang out with your friends 960 00:33:48,666 --> 00:33:51,666 or have time with your wife yeah 961 00:33:51,666 --> 00:33:53,000 it's an added layer 962 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:54,866 that now the priorities are shifting 963 00:33:54,866 --> 00:33:58,333 and that's extremely uncomfortable for everyone 964 00:33:58,633 --> 00:33:59,533 so it's okay so 965 00:33:59,533 --> 00:34:02,366 maybe I can't go seven times a year to go skiing 966 00:34:02,366 --> 00:34:04,633 or snowboarding I go twice yeah 967 00:34:04,633 --> 00:34:06,833 and those two times are gonna be awesome 968 00:34:06,833 --> 00:34:09,133 and iconic'cause I'm doing it 969 00:34:09,133 --> 00:34:10,133 at least I'm doing it 970 00:34:10,133 --> 00:34:12,100 it might be that it transitions to 971 00:34:12,666 --> 00:34:14,033 now you do it with your kids 972 00:34:14,466 --> 00:34:15,533 and you're teaching them 973 00:34:15,533 --> 00:34:19,133 you still get to go it's just now shifting again 974 00:34:19,133 --> 00:34:21,000 a different layer on top of it 975 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,633 it's you with your kids yeah 976 00:34:23,633 --> 00:34:24,533 and there's this 977 00:34:24,533 --> 00:34:27,666 this concept in relationship we're called um 978 00:34:28,533 --> 00:34:29,566 interdependence 979 00:34:30,266 --> 00:34:32,866 which is you 980 00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:38,133 your partner and the connection of the two yeah 981 00:34:38,166 --> 00:34:39,766 you're not losing the individuality 982 00:34:39,766 --> 00:34:41,333 just because you get married right 983 00:34:41,333 --> 00:34:43,900 one plus you have to find ways to prioritize it 984 00:34:43,933 --> 00:34:46,066 and to make it a reality and that's a conversation of 985 00:34:46,066 --> 00:34:48,166 hey you know Tuesday nights 986 00:34:48,166 --> 00:34:51,066 I still wanna have poker night with the boys great 987 00:34:51,066 --> 00:34:52,133 I wanna go watch Bachelor 988 00:34:52,133 --> 00:34:53,900 Bachelor red upstairs right 989 00:34:54,133 --> 00:34:55,466 you both are doing your own things 990 00:34:55,466 --> 00:34:56,233 and at the end of the night 991 00:34:56,233 --> 00:34:58,266 who you ending up with your partner 992 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,033 it's not like you're just like leaving and being gone 993 00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:03,400 it doesn't mean you can't go hang out with your family 994 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,900 it doesn't mean you can't do things that you value 995 00:35:05,966 --> 00:35:08,633 it's how you then mix it into the priority shifting 996 00:35:08,633 --> 00:35:09,966 it's still top 10 997 00:35:10,566 --> 00:35:11,933 it just not top one anymore 998 00:35:11,933 --> 00:35:13,966 you are not top No. 1 999 00:35:14,466 --> 00:35:16,733 which is extremely uncomfortable people to admit that 1000 00:35:16,733 --> 00:35:18,033 that's the that's the strain 1001 00:35:18,033 --> 00:35:19,066 it's like oh wait 1002 00:35:19,066 --> 00:35:21,333 it's not just me it's not just my wife 1003 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:22,633 now there's a little child 1004 00:35:22,633 --> 00:35:27,433 that is a blob that I have to worry about and focus on 1005 00:35:27,433 --> 00:35:30,933 but what about me and that you feel pushed out 1006 00:35:30,933 --> 00:35:33,733 your priorities and values feel pushed out 1007 00:35:34,133 --> 00:35:35,466 so it's just like okay 1008 00:35:36,133 --> 00:35:38,500 they're still top 10 they're still top five 1009 00:35:39,166 --> 00:35:40,966 I just have to figure out the rotation better 1010 00:35:40,966 --> 00:35:42,000 I have to I figure out 1011 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,166 I have to adjust and pivot the rotation smarter now 1012 00:35:45,233 --> 00:35:47,533 so that I still get my needs met 1013 00:35:47,833 --> 00:35:51,966 but I'm not deleting me and the other things matter too 1014 00:35:52,466 --> 00:35:54,833 and that's the uncomfortable shift that happens 1015 00:35:56,066 --> 00:35:57,000 yeah and 1016 00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,466 and but the benefit you get for that cost 1017 00:36:00,033 --> 00:36:03,366 is that you now get to experience the world 1018 00:36:03,366 --> 00:36:04,166 a new 1019 00:36:04,933 --> 00:36:05,966 through and all the stuff that 1020 00:36:05,966 --> 00:36:07,833 you're passionate about and all the stuff that you love 1021 00:36:07,833 --> 00:36:10,033 if you love to go snowboarding seven times a year 1022 00:36:10,733 --> 00:36:13,966 and then you start bringing your son or daughter 1023 00:36:14,933 --> 00:36:18,433 you get to now experience that hobby through their eyes 1024 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:19,533 completely fresh 1025 00:36:19,533 --> 00:36:21,566 it's like starting over from scratch again 1026 00:36:21,566 --> 00:36:23,000 and falling in love with the 1027 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,366 the the activity all over again 1028 00:36:26,366 --> 00:36:27,033 it's yeah 1029 00:36:27,033 --> 00:36:29,866 I literally recently just had this experience 1030 00:36:29,966 --> 00:36:31,933 I love hockey hmm 1031 00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:34,533 I didn't say I can play hockey 1032 00:36:34,533 --> 00:36:37,600 I love watching hockey and I 1033 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:40,400 I watch when the hockey season's on 1034 00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:42,533 hockey's on the TV uh 1035 00:36:42,966 --> 00:36:44,466 and for me my 1036 00:36:44,466 --> 00:36:48,100 my son and daughter going let's go Islanders 1037 00:36:49,633 --> 00:36:51,266 seeing the TV guess what 1038 00:36:51,266 --> 00:36:53,466 the Islanders are not on TV at that time 1039 00:36:53,566 --> 00:36:54,466 but they see hockey 1040 00:36:54,466 --> 00:36:57,166 and they associate it to daddy's favorite team 1041 00:36:57,366 --> 00:36:59,133 and cheering and that energy 1042 00:36:59,133 --> 00:37:00,466 and it brings me so much joy 1043 00:37:00,466 --> 00:37:02,333 and my son literally said to me goes daddy 1044 00:37:02,433 --> 00:37:04,333 can I sit and watch hockey with you 1045 00:37:04,633 --> 00:37:05,866 yeah and I'm like yeah 1046 00:37:05,866 --> 00:37:07,033 come on my lap let's snuggle 1047 00:37:07,033 --> 00:37:08,833 and I can and he's asking these questions 1048 00:37:08,833 --> 00:37:11,200 right and he wants to go to a game with me and he wants 1049 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:12,000 yeah 1050 00:37:12,166 --> 00:37:14,166 that's exciting that's fun 1051 00:37:14,333 --> 00:37:17,633 I'm not losing loving hockey 1052 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:21,033 I love reading books my daughter loves reading 1053 00:37:21,033 --> 00:37:23,066 so now I'm reading to her 1054 00:37:23,166 --> 00:37:24,866 now I'm not reading the books that I'm reading 1055 00:37:24,866 --> 00:37:26,866 because they're huge chapter books 1056 00:37:26,866 --> 00:37:29,166 and they're not appropriate right 1057 00:37:29,633 --> 00:37:32,933 but like you can share joys and happiness with 1058 00:37:32,933 --> 00:37:33,900 your kids 1059 00:37:34,333 --> 00:37:36,966 and if they don't like the same things that you do 1060 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:38,700 you can still like your things 1061 00:37:39,066 --> 00:37:40,400 but now you get to see the happiness 1062 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:41,733 and joy of the things that they love 1063 00:37:41,733 --> 00:37:43,966 and they like and that's what makes you happy 1064 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:45,366 yeah and you can actually 1065 00:37:45,366 --> 00:37:47,666 start to enjoy the things that they like 1066 00:37:47,733 --> 00:37:49,500 you will start to enjoy them anyway 1067 00:37:49,633 --> 00:37:51,066 yeah because they are happy 1068 00:37:51,433 --> 00:37:52,233 I uh my 1069 00:37:52,233 --> 00:37:53,233 my son 1070 00:37:53,266 --> 00:37:56,733 he's only 6 and he's decided that he wants to play golf 1071 00:37:56,933 --> 00:37:58,533 which I love that yeah 1072 00:37:58,533 --> 00:38:01,766 I do too but I am a terrible 1073 00:38:01,766 --> 00:38:03,133 terrible terrible golfer 1074 00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:04,766 we all are I 1075 00:38:04,766 --> 00:38:06,266 it's in fact 1076 00:38:06,266 --> 00:38:08,833 I find that golf 1077 00:38:09,533 --> 00:38:11,633 it's just like an exercise in frustration 1078 00:38:11,633 --> 00:38:12,866 it is purely in fact I 1079 00:38:12,866 --> 00:38:14,233 I remember watching 1080 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,233 I remember watching Tiger Woods have a bad round 1081 00:38:17,233 --> 00:38:18,200 one time and I watched 1082 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:20,666 it was in person and after he got down 1083 00:38:20,666 --> 00:38:22,933 he stomped off the 18th hole 1084 00:38:23,233 --> 00:38:24,366 uh the green on the 18th hole 1085 00:38:24,366 --> 00:38:25,466 and went over the driving range 1086 00:38:25,466 --> 00:38:27,200 and he was just like hitting the pitching wedge over 1087 00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:28,966 and over and over again he was so frustrated 1088 00:38:28,966 --> 00:38:30,466 and he was talking to his caddy and all that stuff 1089 00:38:30,466 --> 00:38:32,233 he was clearly just absolutely 1090 00:38:32,233 --> 00:38:35,133 totally pissed off about how poorly he was playing 1091 00:38:35,133 --> 00:38:37,833 and every single one of these balls was landing 1092 00:38:37,833 --> 00:38:38,933 he was hitting his pitching wedge 1093 00:38:38,933 --> 00:38:41,200 and they were landing about 120 yards away 1094 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:43,133 within three feet of the pin 1095 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:45,533 and he was mad because it 1096 00:38:45,533 --> 00:38:47,400 wasn't two feet and I was like yeah 1097 00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,300 I know exactly how he feels 1098 00:38:49,566 --> 00:38:51,266 yeah except for me it's 1099 00:38:51,266 --> 00:38:52,866 you know I can't even hit the ball 1100 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:55,366 the I can't even hit the ball and this guy's mad 1101 00:38:55,366 --> 00:38:56,966 I mean it's just never changes 1102 00:38:57,133 --> 00:39:00,033 you are never ever not frustrated when you play golf 1103 00:39:00,033 --> 00:39:01,833 except for that one hit every day 1104 00:39:01,833 --> 00:39:03,000 one every time you go out 1105 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:04,666 you get that one hit and it's absolutely perfect 1106 00:39:04,666 --> 00:39:06,966 you feel like if I just practiced eight hours a day 1107 00:39:06,966 --> 00:39:08,500 I'd be able to do that every time 1108 00:39:08,733 --> 00:39:09,933 yeah it's a lie 1109 00:39:10,566 --> 00:39:12,566 yeah I get frustrated with golf also cause I'm like 1110 00:39:12,566 --> 00:39:14,533 I know I can hit a baseball that's moving 1111 00:39:14,666 --> 00:39:18,133 yeah I can hit a pickleball 1112 00:39:18,133 --> 00:39:20,666 I can do all these things that are moving targets right 1113 00:39:20,666 --> 00:39:22,766 but a ball sitting static 1114 00:39:23,066 --> 00:39:26,566 I cannot freaking hit the damn thing to save my life 1115 00:39:26,566 --> 00:39:28,633 I can't even hit it and if I do hit it 1116 00:39:28,866 --> 00:39:30,433 I don't hit it well yes 1117 00:39:30,433 --> 00:39:32,566 what the hell and it's so frustrating 1118 00:39:32,966 --> 00:39:34,966 so frustrating it is the worst 1119 00:39:34,966 --> 00:39:38,066 well my son is getting into it 1120 00:39:38,633 --> 00:39:40,166 and now I'm starting to get into it 1121 00:39:40,166 --> 00:39:42,366 yesterday we went to the golf store 1122 00:39:42,366 --> 00:39:45,133 we got him some clubs and he's all excited about going 1123 00:39:45,133 --> 00:39:47,066 and I'm starting to get fitted for clubs 1124 00:39:47,066 --> 00:39:48,933 and I'm starting to get passionate about this game 1125 00:39:48,933 --> 00:39:50,333 that I hate I love it 1126 00:39:50,833 --> 00:39:52,433 yeah but now 1127 00:39:52,433 --> 00:39:53,533 but now you hate it together 1128 00:39:54,666 --> 00:39:56,800 but now you hate it together yeah 1129 00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:58,800 yeah now we can just be frustrated together 1130 00:39:58,800 --> 00:39:59,600 yeah 1131 00:40:00,266 --> 00:40:03,166 so tell me how can listeners connect with you 1132 00:40:03,166 --> 00:40:06,666 and dive deeper into your work uh 1133 00:40:06,666 --> 00:40:06,833 or or 1134 00:40:06,833 --> 00:40:11,066 or your book from from I do to we do yeah 1135 00:40:11,066 --> 00:40:12,966 so the book is on pre order right now 1136 00:40:12,966 --> 00:40:16,266 anywhere you buy books it is available to buy 1137 00:40:16,333 --> 00:40:17,600 you can find it on my website 1138 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:20,766 Ellie Weinstein lcsw.com there's a tab for the books 1139 00:40:20,766 --> 00:40:22,833 all the pre orders there is a 1140 00:40:22,966 --> 00:40:24,266 if you pre order and email me 1141 00:40:24,266 --> 00:40:27,966 you get a a kit of like a parenting kit that I send you 1142 00:40:28,133 --> 00:40:28,966 awesome some like 1143 00:40:28,966 --> 00:40:29,666 basic things 1144 00:40:29,666 --> 00:40:31,966 and worksheets to do with you and your partner 1145 00:40:32,166 --> 00:40:33,500 um so go there 1146 00:40:33,533 --> 00:40:34,833 uh you can follow along on Instagram 1147 00:40:34,833 --> 00:40:36,833 Ellie Weinstein underscore LCSW 1148 00:40:36,833 --> 00:40:37,933 and you can check out the Dude 1149 00:40:37,933 --> 00:40:39,766 Therapist podcast as well 1150 00:40:39,833 --> 00:40:42,666 and all the different things that and I'm doing 1151 00:40:42,666 --> 00:40:44,366 and if you want me to come out to your area 1152 00:40:44,366 --> 00:40:47,033 speak to anyone that's on the website as well 1153 00:40:47,266 --> 00:40:48,000 awesome well 1154 00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,966 the all of those links are in the show notes 1155 00:40:51,166 --> 00:40:54,233 and so so definitely take a look 1156 00:40:54,266 --> 00:40:58,866 pre order the book and and definitely email Ellie 1157 00:40:59,933 --> 00:41:01,266 he will yeah 1158 00:41:01,266 --> 00:41:03,000 I I love the kit 1159 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,633 that's that's definitely a nice sweetener there 1160 00:41:06,166 --> 00:41:07,500 oh thanks for having me 1161 00:41:07,533 --> 00:41:09,333 now let's before the 1162 00:41:09,333 --> 00:41:11,466 the last thing I like to do when I 1163 00:41:11,466 --> 00:41:12,900 when I'm ready these conversations 1164 00:41:12,966 --> 00:41:14,900 I like to ask everybody the same question 1165 00:41:14,933 --> 00:41:16,000 so I'll put you on the spot 1166 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:17,433 feel free to take as much time as you want 1167 00:41:17,433 --> 00:41:19,300 but what is one principle 1168 00:41:19,766 --> 00:41:22,866 that you would like every parent 1169 00:41:22,866 --> 00:41:27,033 or future parent listening to take away 1170 00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:32,433 so I have a motto that I live my life by 1171 00:41:33,033 --> 00:41:33,833 um 1172 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:35,533 that my grandfather taught me 1173 00:41:35,533 --> 00:41:36,366 my mom taught me 1174 00:41:36,366 --> 00:41:38,533 something that is very integral to like 1175 00:41:38,533 --> 00:41:39,866 who I am as a person 1176 00:41:40,766 --> 00:41:42,666 is that if you never try 1177 00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:45,866 the answer is always no yeah 1178 00:41:46,533 --> 00:41:48,866 so read books 1179 00:41:49,466 --> 00:41:53,033 listen to podcasts ask friends advice 1180 00:41:53,133 --> 00:41:56,233 if you never try the answer will always be no 1181 00:41:56,366 --> 00:41:58,100 so that means send that email 1182 00:41:58,733 --> 00:42:00,133 sit down with your kids 1183 00:42:00,733 --> 00:42:04,033 talk to them if you just sit in that state of no 1184 00:42:04,033 --> 00:42:05,866 I'm not gonna do that or it's not worth it 1185 00:42:05,866 --> 00:42:09,000 or it won't work or it will never happen yeah 1186 00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:10,533 of course it won't right 1187 00:42:10,533 --> 00:42:13,533 but if you try something it could be a yes yeah 1188 00:42:13,533 --> 00:42:15,333 you might still get the no yeah 1189 00:42:15,333 --> 00:42:16,766 but it also could be a yes 1190 00:42:16,766 --> 00:42:19,433 so just keep trying cause yeah 1191 00:42:19,433 --> 00:42:20,866 I find I mean 1192 00:42:20,866 --> 00:42:22,000 certainly within my own life 1193 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:28,600 I have so much suffering relating to stuff 1194 00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:31,733 I'm convincing myself not to do and 1195 00:42:31,733 --> 00:42:35,633 and and suffering about what could happen 1196 00:42:36,066 --> 00:42:38,433 if I do the thing I wanna do yeah 1197 00:42:38,433 --> 00:42:39,933 it's insane 1198 00:42:39,933 --> 00:42:42,966 the amount of suffering I have associated with that 1199 00:42:43,033 --> 00:42:44,800 most people and there's no yeah 1200 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:46,233 yeah and there's no sense in it 1201 00:42:46,233 --> 00:42:47,033 I mean it 1202 00:42:47,033 --> 00:42:47,333 it it 1203 00:42:47,333 --> 00:42:49,333 it holds you back yeah 1204 00:42:50,133 --> 00:42:51,733 I get doesn't mean the answer will be yes 1205 00:42:51,733 --> 00:42:52,066 yeah 1206 00:42:52,066 --> 00:42:55,300 but then you can tell yourself that you did your part 1207 00:42:55,333 --> 00:42:56,833 right and you know what and 1208 00:42:56,833 --> 00:42:58,133 and you can live with that 1209 00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:00,933 if I think back on my life I 1210 00:43:00,933 --> 00:43:03,700 I I can't think of a single occasion 1211 00:43:03,866 --> 00:43:07,066 where I did the thing and regretted it 1212 00:43:07,066 --> 00:43:09,833 and I can think of lots and lots of occasions 1213 00:43:10,333 --> 00:43:12,033 where I chickened out yep 1214 00:43:12,033 --> 00:43:14,733 and I still regret it to this day 1215 00:43:14,833 --> 00:43:15,633 yep 1216 00:43:16,033 --> 00:43:18,066 I'm with you five of them come to mind right now 1217 00:43:18,066 --> 00:43:19,666 just as we're talking having this conversation 1218 00:43:19,666 --> 00:43:21,566 five of those things come to mind 1219 00:43:21,633 --> 00:43:23,500 yeah it's crazy 1220 00:43:24,366 --> 00:43:24,766 well Ellie 1221 00:43:24,766 --> 00:43:27,133 thank you so much for being here man 1222 00:43:27,133 --> 00:43:27,933 I uh 1223 00:43:27,933 --> 00:43:33,266 I love how you're helping dads redefine strength and 1224 00:43:33,266 --> 00:43:37,133 and lead with with presence um 1225 00:43:37,833 --> 00:43:39,566 especially that chapter dues to dads 1226 00:43:39,566 --> 00:43:42,533 is such an important guide for men 1227 00:43:42,566 --> 00:43:45,033 stepping into fatherhood the book 1228 00:43:45,433 --> 00:43:47,066 I'm so excited for it 1229 00:43:47,066 --> 00:43:49,366 I'm really grateful for the work that you're doing to 1230 00:43:49,366 --> 00:43:53,233 to help us all show up better for our families 1231 00:43:53,233 --> 00:43:55,266 really appreciate you coming on the podcast 1232 00:43:55,366 --> 00:43:56,466 thanks for having me 1233 00:43:56,733 --> 00:43:58,233 and thank you all for listening 1234 00:43:58,233 --> 00:44:00,366 I'm Shawn Dawson and this is 1235 00:44:00,366 --> 00:44:03,233 raising men you are a great parent 1236 00:44:04,433 --> 00:44:07,866 raising men is produced by Phil Hernandez 1237 00:44:08,133 --> 00:44:11,266 this episode was edited by Ralph Tolentino