Welcome to the Soul Touched by Dogs Podcast, the show for dog lovers who
see dogs not as toys or tools, but wise souls worth our respect and care.
I'm an Herrmann, and I'm your host.
I talk to poor some humans, people who do great work for dogs and their people.
So come and join us for today's conversation.
Anke: Hello and welcome, Michael.
I'm beyond delighted to have you here today.
Michael: You're delighted.
I'm totally excited.
This is so fun.
I love the work you're doing and the message that you're spreading.
Anke: Fabulous.
So before we dig into that really juicy topic that we have, um, give people
like the two minute bird's eye overview.
You know, where are you based?
What's the day job?
What's the business?
How do you help people?
Michael: Yeah, thank you.
Great question.
I live in Fort Collins, Colorado, just about an hour north of Denver.
Um, beautiful location.
I'm very attuned to nature, so it's a wonderful place for me
to live and actually do my work.
So, I'm a canine-partnered men's relationship coach, right?
Like, what the heck is that?
So, I help men.
Create emotional confidence and emotional intelligence working with a relationship
with their dog, right, and taking that into other relationships in their life.
I act as a mentor and a guide.
To help facilitate this process, we already have all of these bits
of wisdom inside of us, but we just don't know how to access them.
So that's where I come in, and I create this other environment
for this to be able to flourish.
So, um, you know, I work with guys on Zoom, I work with guys locally.
I love working one on one locally because we actually take our dogs out
into nature, and we can accomplish amazing things once people...
They get settled and, and feel safe and comfortable and relaxed in nature.
Um, so I, I'm totally humbled by, by what I do because people have helped
me get here doing the same thing.
So, um, yeah, it's just amazing.
There, there's so much out there and our animals give us so much.
We just don't know how to tune into them.
And really pick up on that.
So, uh, yeah, I get to help people with that.
Love it,
Anke: love it.
I mean, that's, that's like what that, just that last bit you said, this is why
I wanted you on this show like so badly.
Because I guess that's the whole message of this, you know, like dogs
aren't just toys or tools like this.
So, you know, they've got so much wisdom.
There's so much to learn for us.
Like it's not about teaching them to kind of, you know, sit
and pull and this and that.
So I think there's so much more depth to that.
So I'd like to, the first thing that jumps to mind is, it's like,
what if somebody doesn't have dogs?
You know, do all your clients have dogs?
Or, um, what if somebody doesn't have, like, will, can you...
Transmit the same message with, with your dogs, for example.
Michael: So I, I prefer that someone already has a dog so that they have
that, that that bond established.
And it's not as deep for every person.
And that's okay, but that's a relationship, right?
Whether you have a dog or a cat or a bird, there's actually a relationship there.
We, we just don't perceive it that way for a lot of us.
Um, I prefer that, but I can bring my dog, um, obviously locally,
it's an experiential thing, to, to someone who doesn't have a dog,
and show them how, how her behavior affects his behavior and vice versa.
And it's like, whoa, I had no idea.
So yeah, I prefer they have their own animal because it's
just, it really helps the work.
But, um, you know, animals are, they're just here, right?
They're just present and they will show us who they are in that moment.
Anke: And they often show us who we are, right?
Michael: Yeah, they're constantly trying to mirror to us or reflect
back to us how we are showing up.
Yeah, there's
Anke: even a book, there's a book by Kevin Behan, Your Dog is Your Mirror.
Michael: Very interesting.
Oh yeah, yeah, go straight to chapter, straight to chapter 20, right?
That's what, to me, that's where the magic is for, for his book.
Anke: Awesome.
So how did you get...
Like, can you share the story, like, you know, obviously, so you, you, you have a
close relationship to, to dogs, to your dogs, you know, you out to work with men.
So when did you, how did that idea come about to combine the two?
Michael: So this started in, uh, 2017, um, you know, I've had dogs my whole life.
And You know, many amazing animals.
I didn't realize the depth of what they were giving me until
after I had, let's say, an awakening after my brother's death.
I grieved him so hard and it opened me up to how I was acting
in the world, how I was showing up.
And I thought, I didn't like that guy.
I'm like, well, I need to change this.
And again, at that time, I had an amazing dog who helped me soften a little bit and
open up to all these other possibilities.
And then I, I started putting it all together.
Like, oh my gosh, when I was 11, my dog helped keep me alive, basically.
Um, when at this age, this dog helped me with this, this age.
So there's all these huge lessons that I didn't put together.
And I'm like, Other people need to know this, that there's help out there and
we don't see that we're being offered.
Anke: Yeah.
So how did you get your first client with that?
So what was the transformation there?
Like, when was the first time, like, when you tried this, like that, you
know, obviously in your own experience, it's a very strong experience and
you can really see through it, right?
So, so how did you get that first client?
You said, well, let's go there.
Let's, let's look in this
Michael: direction.
Yeah, that's a great story.
I gave a presentation on this yesterday to a group.
Um, so, this man contacted me because...
His perception of what I did was that I was a dog trainer.
And I said, well, I'm not really a dog trainer, but I'm happy to meet
and help you sort, sort this out.
Cause his dog was, was escalating and doing all these crazy things.
And we, we determined that he was acting out and his dog was responding and trying
to get him to notice what was going on.
His marriage was in turmoil.
His, his business that he ran with his wife was in trouble.
And, and then the dog was, was going crazy trying to, trying to say,
Hey, there's something wrong here.
And he, he got, he, he got it so quickly and was able to shift that perspective.
And he said, There's nothing wrong with my dog.
And I said, no, there's nothing wrong with her.
And he just broke down crying, you know, because he had this realization that,
that he and his wife needed to, to get into their issues, um, individually, as
well as a couple and work this stuff out.
Anke: Yeah, that's, that's powerful.
And it really kind of shows how, how tuned in they are to, you know,
to, to what we, so what's the.
typical insight that people have that they might not have expected.
Because, you know, when you kind of work with somebody, there's always a certain
outcome that you kind of expect to have.
And I would imagine in your work, I would imagine there'd be a lot
of those that they, that you see them get all the time, that they
don't expect when they come to you.
Michael: It's when we're able to let go of our intelligence to see the
awareness that's available, right?
The dog is constantly, like I said, trying to communicate with
us in their way so that we see that we, we can do something else.
It's, they're not just a comfort measure.
Um, and I'm not diminishing that at all because they bring a lot of
pleasure and relaxation to people.
There's more when you're able to, when you, when you create that curiosity.
My dog, is my dog doing that?
Yes, your dog is doing that.
So it's this aha moment where they go.
Oh my gosh.
So when this happened, and I acted like this, and my dog did
this, that's all tied together.
Anke: And how do people take that awareness in their
human to human relationships?
Like what, what are typical shifts that they experience?
Michael: It's slow, right?
So we all want, we want to create massive change.
Oh, I can do this other thing.
But it has to be a practice.
You know, in yoga, the term is take, take it off the mat, right?
So how do you take what you've now learned and apply it in these other relationships?
So, there may be people at work that you don't get along with.
Well, you can't expect it to all of a sudden be, Yay!
But we do that, right?
Oh, now I have these skills!
So, it takes time and a constant practice.
It's applying this and realizing what works for you and understanding
that it may not work for that person.
So, it's creating this change, not to create other change.
Yeah, I think
Anke: that awareness is really, really powerful.
And to show, I think, I mean, we had obviously, we had a previous conversation
that really stuck with me was that idea that what people often do naturally
in relationship to their dog, like that gentleness, that kindness, that
unconditional love that feels so kind of obvious and natural with your dog.
You know, it doesn't always feel as easy to take it into, you know, into
human to human connections, right?
Michael: Yeah, well, there's, there's all these other expectations that the
other person may have of what this relationship needs to be for them, but
we don't actually communicate about it.
We just, we show up expecting one thing, they show up expecting something,
but we don't get that with the dog.
There's...
They don't have all these rules that they apply to the relationship.
Um, and we, we feel that.
We may not recognize that, you know, mentally, but we feel
it and we respond in kind.
We can be open and vulnerable and soft and gentle and cute and cuddly.
But we can't be cute and cuddly with, with, you know, the guy
in engineering, or, you know, he sure as hell doesn't want that.
So it's fascinating.
Why does that work here, but not over here?
Anke: Right.
It's fascinating.
You know, when you take thought and expectations and judgment out, like
that's like in the real world, right?
You know, it's like when you take thought, expectation, judgment, worry,
guilt, when you take all that out.
Yeah, you know, what are you left with?
Michael: Yeah, compassion, love, you know, nurturing.
I mean, all these things that we all, we all crave so deeply,
but don't know how to access.
And we sure as heck don't know how to ask for it, but that dog's just given it.
Anke: Love that, love that.
So where can people go and find out more about that, you know, because you've
got a book and it's not just for men, so you know, where can people get in touch
with you, find out more about your work?
Michael: Yeah, go to www.
dogsandmen.
com All one word, no spaces.
Um, and what's on there is tons of podcasts and radio shows, um, resources.
And my books are on there for, in PDF download for free.
So, um, yeah, download it, look at it.
And then email me and tell me how crazy I am.
That'd be great.
Um, there's a link to my, there's a link to email me, but it's
also michael at dogsandmen.
com.
And I, I just want to spark curiosity in people.
Some people are going to get it.
Some people aren't, and that's okay.
This isn't for everybody.
Anke: But I think there's so much to see, you know, and I think
it makes life so much simpler and, and kinder and more loving.
And I think there's can't ever be too much of that in the world.
So love what you do.
Absolutely love it.
Michael: Thank you.
And I agree.
We, we, if we could all just do a little better, a little more love, a
little more compassion, and to ourselves as well, not just to the world.
Here's where the change has to start, right?
When Gandhi said, be the change you want to see in the world.
So, and I think that's really true.
I think it is
Anke: true.
We just all need to be a little bit more dog, right?
Michael: Yes, be more dog.
Anke: Awesome.
Well, thank you so much.
And I hope to have you back at some point because we want to see where
you're going and what's evolving.
So I would love to have you back at some point.
Awesome.
Michael: I would love to be back.
Thank you for having me.
Thanks so much for listening.
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Email me at Anke.
That's A N k E at Soul touched by dogs.com.