1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:05,200 Heather, welcome to the Evolved Radio podcast. Oh my gosh, Todd. Thank you 2 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:08,580 so much. I'm thrilled to be here. Listen to your podcast 3 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:12,255 and you bring on the greatest people. So I'm completely 4 00:00:12,315 --> 00:00:16,075 honored that, you agreed to have me on today. Yeah. I I really 5 00:00:16,075 --> 00:00:19,850 did wanna have you on because when we met, I was very interested in 6 00:00:19,850 --> 00:00:23,610 what you did. And and I think it's really really applicable in the 7 00:00:23,610 --> 00:00:26,085 space that that I focus on in the technology space. 8 00:00:27,445 --> 00:00:31,204 So it's an area of focus that I feel like I'm trying to 9 00:00:31,204 --> 00:00:34,850 advocate more for in the industry. It's a very 10 00:00:34,850 --> 00:00:38,690 busy industry. It's an industry that, is sort of synonymous with 11 00:00:38,690 --> 00:00:42,129 people taking lunch at their desk and working wild hours 12 00:00:42,129 --> 00:00:45,914 and under extreme amounts of stress. So what you do I think is 13 00:00:45,914 --> 00:00:49,515 is really important and I wanna bring all of these ideas to light. So I 14 00:00:49,515 --> 00:00:53,280 think it's a really great place to start. If you could tell us what 15 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:56,739 you do and why is this an area of passion for you? Mhmm. 16 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:00,325 Yeah. So I'm, I'm a chiropractor by trade, Todd. I 17 00:01:00,485 --> 00:01:03,925 practiced for 25 years, in Seattle. I'm 18 00:01:03,925 --> 00:01:07,580 Canadian, by birthright, but I I lived in 19 00:01:07,660 --> 00:01:11,260 Seattle while I was practicing. And, I 20 00:01:11,260 --> 00:01:14,560 left private practice because I had a real 21 00:01:15,375 --> 00:01:19,134 leading to speak, write, and 22 00:01:19,134 --> 00:01:22,895 do whatever I could to throw the net wide on wellness 23 00:01:22,895 --> 00:01:25,910 strategy and how to bridge the connection between 24 00:01:26,530 --> 00:01:30,050 personal well-being and professional success because I think those twos have 25 00:01:30,050 --> 00:01:33,795 become people think you can't have both and we need both 26 00:01:33,795 --> 00:01:37,475 in order to perform well in our positions, especially those that are high stress, 27 00:01:37,475 --> 00:01:41,190 like a lot of the folks that listen to your podcast. I 28 00:01:41,190 --> 00:01:44,150 do get asked, you know, how did I get into this? How did I become 29 00:01:44,150 --> 00:01:47,850 so passionate about it? And when I was very young, 30 00:01:47,910 --> 00:01:51,645 this is kind of a funny story, I was about 9. I 31 00:01:51,645 --> 00:01:55,405 grew about 6 inches in a year which is tricky 32 00:01:55,405 --> 00:01:59,150 because Wow. I was like a mastiff puppy growing and and I 33 00:01:59,150 --> 00:02:02,690 I was I was a competitive gymnast at the time and competitive 34 00:02:02,750 --> 00:02:06,350 gymnasts, don't grow 6 inches in a 35 00:02:06,350 --> 00:02:09,794 year. And so I actually that and, 36 00:02:10,354 --> 00:02:13,795 focused a little more on my other sport, which I call Olympic 37 00:02:13,795 --> 00:02:17,155 caliber binge eating. So I put on a tremendous amount of 38 00:02:17,155 --> 00:02:20,750 weight. And by the time I hit college, I was easily 70, £80 39 00:02:20,810 --> 00:02:24,570 overweight. And it also resulted in a lot of other health issues. 40 00:02:24,570 --> 00:02:28,205 I had Raynaud's and ankylosing spondylitis and a gut issue 41 00:02:28,205 --> 00:02:31,965 and thyroid and just went on and on. And I found myself in 42 00:02:31,965 --> 00:02:35,550 my early twenties just standing in this crappy college 43 00:02:35,550 --> 00:02:39,069 apartment shower bawling my eyes out thinking, my God, is 44 00:02:39,069 --> 00:02:42,805 this like the wellness peak? Like I is this the you 45 00:02:42,805 --> 00:02:46,325 know, I'm in a terrible condition. I'm in my early twenties and I 46 00:02:46,325 --> 00:02:49,880 think I have got to figure this out. I have no idea how to be 47 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:53,420 fit, how to feel my body, how to possess self compassion or mindfulness. 48 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:57,720 And I thought in that moment, if I'm gonna figure this out, I'll turn this 49 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:01,444 Titanic of health issues around, I'm gonna need to focus on my 50 00:03:01,444 --> 00:03:05,125 well-being as a priority project. And so right 51 00:03:05,125 --> 00:03:08,629 from that 1st year in college, I started studying and I became became a 52 00:03:08,629 --> 00:03:12,170 chiropractor and a personal trainer and a wellness specialist, and 53 00:03:12,470 --> 00:03:15,935 I practiced for a long time and I practiced in 54 00:03:16,095 --> 00:03:19,935 Seattle right in the center of where Costco, Microsoft, Amazon, T 55 00:03:19,935 --> 00:03:23,750 Mobile, all of those companies were 56 00:03:23,750 --> 00:03:27,590 on my table on a regular basis, and I realized something very quickly. I 57 00:03:27,590 --> 00:03:31,349 used to joke with different company employees coming 58 00:03:31,349 --> 00:03:35,174 in and saying, I I can tell where your work where you work by how 59 00:03:35,174 --> 00:03:38,855 you show up in your body. And they used to laugh 60 00:03:38,855 --> 00:03:42,694 about that. And and sure enough, we wear our stress physically and mentally. 61 00:03:42,694 --> 00:03:43,400 And it got to the point where I was working with people 1 on 62 00:03:51,385 --> 00:03:55,065 and I couldn't do that in a brick and mortar. And so I got very 63 00:03:55,065 --> 00:03:58,569 excited and handed the reins of my practice over 64 00:03:58,569 --> 00:04:02,410 to 2 incredible sisters from Wisconsin. And I started to write 65 00:04:02,410 --> 00:04:05,825 and I started to speak and that's what I do now. And so I don't 66 00:04:05,985 --> 00:04:09,424 that's probably a real long way of telling you why I'm excited about what I 67 00:04:09,424 --> 00:04:12,724 do, but, it's it's the journey. 68 00:04:13,190 --> 00:04:16,550 Yeah. That's great. I I I think that's awesome background sort of 69 00:04:16,550 --> 00:04:20,310 also brings the but that emotional gravity to, and it it's 70 00:04:20,310 --> 00:04:23,974 interesting. Like, I often find people that are that are so passionate about 71 00:04:23,974 --> 00:04:27,595 things like this, not always in sort of a a health or wellness space, 72 00:04:28,375 --> 00:04:32,050 but, like, have, like, almost a calling to these types of things. Like, there's 73 00:04:32,430 --> 00:04:36,030 very often a personal story that it gets involved of, 74 00:04:36,030 --> 00:04:39,724 like, I had to fight my way through this situation and now I understand 75 00:04:39,724 --> 00:04:42,365 sort of, like, how I can be helpful to other people in a in a 76 00:04:42,365 --> 00:04:46,125 similar situation. So I I think that's sort of a commonality that I think is 77 00:04:46,125 --> 00:04:49,930 really really sort of interesting in in that space. The other thing you noted is, 78 00:04:50,690 --> 00:04:54,110 big some of the one of the things that we often joke about is, 79 00:04:54,570 --> 00:04:57,885 you know, work life balance. And if you have to call it a balance, like, 80 00:04:57,885 --> 00:05:01,185 is it really working? Right? It's it's one of those aspects. Right? 81 00:05:02,445 --> 00:05:06,270 So true. So true. I love I I didn't invent this, but somebody said it's 82 00:05:06,430 --> 00:05:10,030 integration. It's not balance. It's it's never going to be balanced. It's just 83 00:05:10,030 --> 00:05:13,855 constant integration and just responding and reacting 84 00:05:21,069 --> 00:05:23,949 when you're meeting with people and and like you said, you've seen a lot of 85 00:05:23,949 --> 00:05:27,789 people in these circumstances working high stress jobs, you 86 00:05:27,789 --> 00:05:31,545 know, sitting a lot, like, not necessarily mobile. They're in meetings 87 00:05:31,685 --> 00:05:35,525 or, at their desk, and then, you know, getting home, 88 00:05:35,525 --> 00:05:39,280 kinda having a quick bite, and then, doing some more work, and 89 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:42,639 then maybe watch an hour of Netflix, have a drink, and then crash out. And 90 00:05:42,639 --> 00:05:46,080 it's, like, it's not a real great recipe for for health and 91 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:49,695 well-being. Right? So I imagine there's sort of some basic things that you 92 00:05:49,695 --> 00:05:53,235 generally can suggest to people that are sort of fighting through this, 93 00:05:54,014 --> 00:05:57,830 work hard, but, you know, I feel like there there should be more 94 00:05:57,830 --> 00:06:01,130 to my life and then and I wanna correct a couple of things. Is there 95 00:06:01,190 --> 00:06:04,825 low hanging fruit that you generally sort of try to steer people 96 00:06:04,825 --> 00:06:08,505 towards in those circumstances? Yeah. You bet. And I mean, we could be 97 00:06:08,505 --> 00:06:12,265 here all day talking about simple, like, easy strategies, but let's 98 00:06:12,265 --> 00:06:15,380 just dive in and you just stop me when you wanna wanna stop me. I 99 00:06:15,380 --> 00:06:18,900 think the first thing, Todd, that I find I've I've coached 1 to 1. I've 100 00:06:18,900 --> 00:06:22,574 I've spoken to big groups, small groups, all sorts of thing. It's consistent in 101 00:06:22,574 --> 00:06:26,095 that those that are are struggling often lack a 102 00:06:26,095 --> 00:06:29,634 tremendous amount of self compassion. And so we start with self compassion 103 00:06:30,830 --> 00:06:34,430 because there's this beating themselves up, this self 104 00:06:34,430 --> 00:06:37,915 shaming. Why can't I get in shape? Why can't I stick to a food 105 00:06:37,915 --> 00:06:41,695 plan, why am I so lazy, why why why. And 106 00:06:41,915 --> 00:06:45,540 when we can start to build up some self compassion, that actually helps in 107 00:06:45,540 --> 00:06:49,140 our wellness strategy. It can be a great motivator. And so we start 108 00:06:49,140 --> 00:06:52,500 there talking about, you know, how do you feel about yourself? How do you support 109 00:06:52,500 --> 00:06:56,324 yourself? How are you kind to yourself? So starting there is really 110 00:06:56,324 --> 00:07:00,085 important. An equally important place is, you know, we can 111 00:07:00,085 --> 00:07:03,770 talk about resilience all day long, and I speak about resilience a lot. 112 00:07:03,830 --> 00:07:07,670 And if you think of resilience as a bucket, the problem is there are 113 00:07:07,670 --> 00:07:11,205 holes in the bucket, and those holes represent places we are 114 00:07:11,205 --> 00:07:15,044 spilling our own energy unnecessarily and unknowingly. And if 115 00:07:15,044 --> 00:07:18,550 we don't shore up those holes in the bucket, however 116 00:07:18,550 --> 00:07:22,150 many resilience building strategies we throw at the 117 00:07:22,150 --> 00:07:25,990 wall, it's not gonna work. And so one of the second 118 00:07:25,990 --> 00:07:29,465 things I do after self compassion is start talking about energy 119 00:07:29,465 --> 00:07:33,005 leakage and this idea that we have energy leakage liabilities. 120 00:07:33,544 --> 00:07:37,290 We have these holes in our bucket and they're different for everyone. But when we 121 00:07:37,290 --> 00:07:41,050 start to really take an energy audit in our schedule, in our 122 00:07:41,050 --> 00:07:44,810 time, and identify those areas where we can shore up 123 00:07:44,810 --> 00:07:48,375 and pull back, then we suddenly have bandwidth and 124 00:07:48,375 --> 00:07:51,895 say, oh, I have 10 minutes to go do a walk or I have 125 00:07:51,895 --> 00:07:55,580 energy to do a breathing exercise or to make a 126 00:07:55,580 --> 00:07:59,340 healthy meal. And I think that's a really important step. 127 00:07:59,340 --> 00:08:03,180 So some examples and we can if you wanna dig into these, we 128 00:08:03,180 --> 00:08:06,615 can. But things like take a take a look at how 129 00:08:06,835 --> 00:08:10,595 decision fatigue. I imagine a lot of your audience has heard of 130 00:08:10,595 --> 00:08:14,370 the term decision fatigue before, and it simply means 131 00:08:14,370 --> 00:08:18,210 having too many decisions to make in a day. And so when 132 00:08:18,210 --> 00:08:21,725 we streamline our schedule, we end up 133 00:08:21,805 --> 00:08:25,505 making less decisions. I'll give you an example. Mark Zuckerberg, 134 00:08:25,725 --> 00:08:29,085 if you Google him, he's in a blue t shirt and jeans almost 135 00:08:29,085 --> 00:08:32,480 90% of the time. And the reason is because he made one 136 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,840 decision a long time ago and said, I am not gonna 137 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,360 redecide every single day what I wear. I'm gonna make one less 138 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:43,105 decision so I have that bandwidth to make down at Facebook where 139 00:08:43,105 --> 00:08:46,485 my decisions matter more. And so when we take a decision 140 00:08:46,705 --> 00:08:49,850 audit on our day and say, look at where are you redeciding 141 00:08:50,069 --> 00:08:53,850 stuff? Do you put your keys in the same place? Are you redeciding 142 00:08:54,069 --> 00:08:57,405 what to make for meals every week? What about if you streamline that? 143 00:08:57,965 --> 00:09:01,345 There's lots of places we can shore up kind of decision 144 00:09:01,405 --> 00:09:05,220 fatigue in our own life and that buys us back a lot of energy. There's 145 00:09:05,300 --> 00:09:09,060 Just just quickly, my own sort of personal experience, and I I I note this 146 00:09:09,060 --> 00:09:11,240 to a lot of people, like, when I'm doing behavioral, 147 00:09:14,075 --> 00:09:17,675 behavioral coaching with people, this comes up, right, that 148 00:09:17,675 --> 00:09:21,355 people often represent are represented differently at home than they are at work. And 149 00:09:21,355 --> 00:09:25,060 my experience of this is, like, I tend to make very few decisions at home 150 00:09:25,060 --> 00:09:28,260 because I'm making a lot of decisions at work all day. And I think that's, 151 00:09:28,260 --> 00:09:31,935 like, primarily a function of decision fatigue where I'm just, like, exhaust 152 00:09:31,995 --> 00:09:35,115 by the end of the day and get home be like, like, okay, like, take 153 00:09:35,115 --> 00:09:38,315 over. I'm happy to have somebody else make some decisions the rest of the day. 154 00:09:38,315 --> 00:09:42,050 Right? A 100%. And I've seen that too, Todd. And and 155 00:09:42,050 --> 00:09:45,329 that's very, very true. And in some ways, I commend you if you have a 156 00:09:45,329 --> 00:09:49,009 partner that supports that and you can say, you know what? I 157 00:09:49,009 --> 00:09:52,035 have a 100 decisions I'm gonna make today and I'm gonna make those at work 158 00:09:52,035 --> 00:09:55,875 where they matter most. And and if your partner is supportive of that 159 00:09:55,875 --> 00:09:59,709 and it works well, that's great. And it does that's a that's 160 00:09:59,709 --> 00:10:03,230 a self preservation tool, subconscious or conscious, that 161 00:10:03,230 --> 00:10:07,005 you've sort of employed. So, I think that's great. And I 162 00:10:07,005 --> 00:10:10,425 think, you know, decision fatigue is a really important starting, 163 00:10:10,964 --> 00:10:14,800 point. I think another one, Todd, where we lose a lot of energy is multitasking. 164 00:10:15,180 --> 00:10:18,699 And thinking that somehow somehow if we 165 00:10:18,699 --> 00:10:21,954 contact Shift, we don't think there's a cost to it. And 166 00:10:22,495 --> 00:10:26,175 and, unfortunately, we know a couple of things now through the data and you're 167 00:10:26,175 --> 00:10:29,870 probably aware of this. You focus on one thing, it's a 100%. You 168 00:10:29,870 --> 00:10:33,550 focus on 2, you think it'd be like a 5050, but you've just 169 00:10:33,550 --> 00:10:37,070 lost 20% in contact shifting. So now you're only at an 170 00:10:37,070 --> 00:10:40,625 80 percent focus rate. Three things, you're down to 60. 171 00:10:40,765 --> 00:10:43,805 And some people are like, well, I never I don't work on 3 things at 172 00:10:43,805 --> 00:10:46,830 once. That's crazy talk. And I think, oh, really? 173 00:10:47,210 --> 00:10:50,970 Spreadsheet, sound of a notification on your phone, 174 00:10:50,970 --> 00:10:54,490 and a meeting request. That is three things that you're working 175 00:10:54,490 --> 00:10:57,904 on. And some of the more recent data tells us it takes us 23 176 00:10:58,045 --> 00:11:01,485 minutes to ramp back up to the level of focus you had prior to being 177 00:11:01,485 --> 00:11:04,900 interrupted. Well, none of us ever are not interrupted every 178 00:11:04,900 --> 00:11:08,660 23 minutes, so it means we're at subpar focus and that's 179 00:11:08,660 --> 00:11:12,495 costly. So I think that just is a big contributor to burnout is 180 00:11:12,495 --> 00:11:16,175 that idea of contact shifting. Yeah. And I I 100% agree. This 181 00:11:16,175 --> 00:11:18,894 drives me crazy because I hear this all the time when I was a manager 182 00:11:18,894 --> 00:11:22,220 in organizations and and even now, like, when I'm I'm, 183 00:11:22,540 --> 00:11:26,060 coaching teams is, the number of people that try to tell me, oh, 184 00:11:26,060 --> 00:11:29,725 no. I I'm actually good at multitasking. It's like, really? Like, come 185 00:11:29,725 --> 00:11:33,084 on. I think I I believe you think that that's true, but I guarantee you 186 00:11:33,084 --> 00:11:36,460 it's not. Like, the actual like, there's there's industry 187 00:11:36,680 --> 00:11:40,440 research on this and it's like like less than 1% or something 188 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:44,195 of Yeah. Of the general population can actually multitask. So the 189 00:11:44,195 --> 00:11:47,875 fact that like the the, the probability that you're 190 00:11:47,875 --> 00:11:51,175 one of those unicorn people is pretty unlikely. 191 00:11:52,070 --> 00:11:55,190 And the the other just, the other point I think I wanna make on this 192 00:11:55,190 --> 00:11:58,550 is that it's driving me crazy lately because in the number of times it shows 193 00:11:58,550 --> 00:12:01,675 up as a problem in teams and organizations is, 194 00:12:02,295 --> 00:12:05,355 notifications and Slack and and teams notifications 195 00:12:05,654 --> 00:12:09,410 is absolutely crushing people because they're 196 00:12:09,410 --> 00:12:13,010 constantly distracted. Right? Like, used to be I used to joke about the 197 00:12:13,010 --> 00:12:16,690 Outlook toaster notification that would pop up from the the task tray from people. I'm 198 00:12:16,690 --> 00:12:19,445 like, I turned that thing off. It is like, even if you don't care about 199 00:12:19,445 --> 00:12:23,045 what's happening there, it's distracting you and you'd watch people, like, they're talking to you 200 00:12:23,045 --> 00:12:26,880 and then you see this and they're like Yeah. Oh, hang on. And then, 201 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:30,720 like, they're it doesn't even matter what that notification was, but they're now off 202 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:34,180 track. Right? And now, like, it's gotten even amp like, infinitely 203 00:12:34,399 --> 00:12:37,875 worse because the one that drives you crazy is people that send a team's 204 00:12:37,875 --> 00:12:41,635 message to somebody else and as one line, like, they type type type 205 00:12:41,635 --> 00:12:44,800 enter, type type type enter, type type type enter. Yes. I think it was out 206 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:48,600 of ding ding ding ding. Ding. Yeah. This this 207 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:51,960 this has to stop. The the the the the multitasking and 208 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:55,705 the distraction within sort of modern work environments, 209 00:12:55,765 --> 00:12:59,365 I think, has reached just an epidemic proportions. It is a big 210 00:12:59,365 --> 00:13:03,089 component of burnout. And let me just mention 2 things. One is those 211 00:13:03,089 --> 00:13:06,870 that think they're good at multitasking, they actually aren't. Here's what they're good at. 212 00:13:06,930 --> 00:13:10,595 Your brain can't focus on 2 things at once. What it can do is 213 00:13:10,595 --> 00:13:14,194 bridge between a and b, but that bridge is costly. It actually 214 00:13:14,194 --> 00:13:18,020 costs you brain glucose. So as you flip between a b AB, 215 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:21,920 AB might be pretty fast at that, but you're costing, brain 216 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:25,445 glucose just constantly. And so you're never actually 217 00:13:25,445 --> 00:13:29,205 working on 2 things, just fast switching between the 2, but there's 218 00:13:29,205 --> 00:13:32,825 always, always, always a cost. So I think that's important. 219 00:13:33,125 --> 00:13:36,790 And then I think the second thing is is that we provide a tool and 220 00:13:36,790 --> 00:13:40,470 one of the best tools that I think for, contact shifting is something 221 00:13:40,470 --> 00:13:43,925 called block and tackle, which, it comes under different names, but the 222 00:13:43,925 --> 00:13:47,764 idea that we pick one task, we pick how much of 223 00:13:47,764 --> 00:13:51,500 that task we're gonna do, we set a time limit, and then we 224 00:13:51,500 --> 00:13:55,340 clear all other notifications and distractions. And some people say to me, well, I work 225 00:13:55,340 --> 00:13:58,300 in a job that that just couldn't be true. And I say I've worked with 226 00:13:58,300 --> 00:14:01,745 some of the busiest people on the planet. 10 minutes is possible for 227 00:14:01,745 --> 00:14:05,365 everybody. So a 10 minute task, turn off notifications, 228 00:14:05,985 --> 00:14:09,790 focus from the time the timer starts until the timer goes off. And when I 229 00:14:09,790 --> 00:14:13,550 say a timer, I don't mean your phone. I mean an analog timer that has 230 00:14:13,550 --> 00:14:17,394 a little dinger or you can use Howler timer, which is a great app on 231 00:14:17,394 --> 00:14:21,235 your, on your desktop. There's lots of different ways to do it without having 232 00:14:21,235 --> 00:14:24,595 to use your phone. But that block and tackle concept, I think, is a real 233 00:14:24,595 --> 00:14:28,209 practical tool we can start with and everybody can start even if it's 234 00:14:28,209 --> 00:14:31,970 just 5 or 10 minutes. Yeah. I like this. Like, I I'm a huge advocate 235 00:14:31,970 --> 00:14:35,695 of a Pomodoro timer for a similar, like like, block focus. Right? It's 236 00:14:35,695 --> 00:14:39,454 exactly what that is. Yeah. That's great. Can you So So do you actually 237 00:14:39,454 --> 00:14:43,279 have the little tomato timer? I don't have a physical one. I've thought about it, 238 00:14:43,279 --> 00:14:47,040 but, like, I almost feel like I would maybe use it less. Well, and 239 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,480 Fair enough. The other part of this that I think you're you're keying into that 240 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:53,795 I think is really important is I think people kind of misattribute sort of where 241 00:14:53,795 --> 00:14:56,915 Pomodoro and a timer can be useful because, like, to your point, like, people will 242 00:14:56,915 --> 00:15:00,115 say, well, you know, for example, a lot of people that listen to this podcast 243 00:15:00,115 --> 00:15:03,530 work in IT organizations. So it's like, well, great, but I've got, you know, 8 244 00:15:03,530 --> 00:15:06,570 tickets that I'm responsible for. So it's not like I can just sit down and 245 00:15:06,570 --> 00:15:10,365 focus for 2 hours on something. It's not practical given sort of the work modality 246 00:15:10,425 --> 00:15:14,025 that I have. But the the fact that you should focus on that single 247 00:15:14,025 --> 00:15:17,550 ticket that you're working on for at least 10 minutes before tasking onto something 248 00:15:17,550 --> 00:15:21,310 else. Like, that's totally legitimate. Right? And I don't think people 249 00:15:21,310 --> 00:15:25,150 tend to think of it as as just remaining focused on a single 250 00:15:25,150 --> 00:15:28,985 activity because we have all these numerous distractions. It's like I'm working 251 00:15:28,985 --> 00:15:32,185 on this ticket. I get a team's notification. I go glance and check at this, 252 00:15:32,185 --> 00:15:35,360 and then I come back to that ticket. Well, your your point about there there's 253 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,980 a mental cost to that making that switch when it's largely unnecessary. 254 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:43,255 Like, like, could that could that notification have waited for 10 minutes or 255 00:15:43,255 --> 00:15:47,015 30 minutes? Very, very likely. Because if it was an emergency, someone would come find 256 00:15:47,015 --> 00:15:50,850 you. Right? 90% of the time. And I think another thing 257 00:15:50,850 --> 00:15:54,370 we have to remember is we are now trained to be 258 00:15:54,370 --> 00:15:58,115 like squirrel and and so distractible and it's like we're at 259 00:15:58,115 --> 00:16:01,635 like a new puppy. We have to relearn how to 260 00:16:01,635 --> 00:16:05,315 focus. And so those little block and tackles, those 10 minute 261 00:16:05,315 --> 00:16:09,140 segments of full focus, then give yourself a second and Pomodoro, you 262 00:16:09,140 --> 00:16:12,920 know, increases suggest 20 minutes and then a 10 minute break. 263 00:16:13,140 --> 00:16:16,805 And that is a really powerful tool to retrain 264 00:16:16,865 --> 00:16:20,645 you back into being able to focus. Nobody blames you for 265 00:16:20,705 --> 00:16:22,550 being distractible. We've been trained 266 00:16:24,790 --> 00:16:28,630 takes some work. And so just be patient and compassionate with yourself when 267 00:16:28,630 --> 00:16:32,435 you start practicing that. Yeah. And that's that's why I like the Pomodoro 268 00:16:32,575 --> 00:16:36,255 timer is is because, like, I am tempted to be distracted. Like, 269 00:16:36,415 --> 00:16:39,760 you know, the this task feels hard. I'm not sure what I should write on 270 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:43,279 the next sentence. So let me just, like, grab my phone and distract myself for 271 00:16:43,279 --> 00:16:46,640 a few minutes. And then, like, when I have a Pomodoro timer running, I can 272 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:50,384 be like, well, no, I need to remain focused because in 5 273 00:16:50,384 --> 00:16:53,904 minutes when this timer is up then I can sit back and start doing some 274 00:16:53,904 --> 00:16:57,600 some social surfing or, you know, go to, like, see what the news 275 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,960 is, those sorts of things. So, like, it helps my brain to contain that idea 276 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:04,232 of, like, let's go look at something else for a minute. It's like, no. No. 277 00:17:04,232 --> 00:17:07,976 No. No. Just stay here for 5 more minutes. Right? It's so good. And our 278 00:17:07,976 --> 00:17:11,721 brain does love to gamify and does love a challenge. So having that little timer 279 00:17:11,721 --> 00:17:15,270 actually taps into part of your brain that will help you sustain that. I 280 00:17:15,270 --> 00:17:19,030 think one thing to think about, is a is a resource I got recently 281 00:17:19,030 --> 00:17:22,385 that I absolutely love. It's called FocusMate. Have you heard of it, 282 00:17:22,765 --> 00:17:25,825 Todd? Yeah. I use, other tools like those. Yeah. RescueTime, 283 00:17:26,285 --> 00:17:29,565 Produce8. It was a group that I work with that has sort of similar efforts 284 00:17:29,565 --> 00:17:33,390 around this. But, yeah, it's super helpful. It is. So the one I use is 285 00:17:33,390 --> 00:17:37,230 focusmate.com, and I'll just ex just super briefly. It's other 286 00:17:37,230 --> 00:17:40,664 people in the world who also wanna focus in the moment, and so you sign 287 00:17:40,664 --> 00:17:44,264 up for a time slot. You're paired with somebody. You get on, and you 288 00:17:44,264 --> 00:17:48,030 both just say, here's what I'm working on. You mute yourselves, but you stay on 289 00:17:48,030 --> 00:17:51,330 video so that the accountability, because we perform 290 00:17:51,390 --> 00:17:55,230 better under the vision of other people, and so 291 00:17:55,230 --> 00:17:58,975 more accurately, more effectively, more speedily. And so that that 292 00:17:58,975 --> 00:18:02,735 idea of that accountability is really key. Are the ones that you mentioned same 293 00:18:02,735 --> 00:18:06,480 sort of concept where you're actually with another person? No. I've heard of 294 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:09,680 that idea. So no. That that's not a not what I was thinking of, but 295 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:13,200 I've I've heard of that suggestion. So it's very cool. It gets to sort of 296 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,615 something that been thinking about a lot recently and this actually came 297 00:18:16,615 --> 00:18:20,134 from from a a a group that we're both in, in commit 298 00:18:20,134 --> 00:18:23,290 action and, Peter Shelby, the guy who runs this, 299 00:18:23,850 --> 00:18:27,530 had this this suggestion that that I guess I think about, like, the word 300 00:18:27,530 --> 00:18:30,455 accountability a lot because it comes up a ton in the in the work 301 00:18:31,414 --> 00:18:34,215 That's probably the most common question that I get asked is how do I make 302 00:18:34,215 --> 00:18:37,735 my team accountable? And, Peter kinda put it as a a 303 00:18:37,735 --> 00:18:41,440 definition around accountability that I'd never really heard before and that and accountability 304 00:18:41,660 --> 00:18:45,500 is inherently a social action. And that is, like like, really 305 00:18:45,500 --> 00:18:48,220 cracked my head open when I heard it. I was like, of course. Like, that 306 00:18:48,220 --> 00:18:52,045 makes total sense. But it it really sort of distinctly describes 307 00:18:52,045 --> 00:18:55,565 why it's hard for people to be accountable because the only person you can be 308 00:18:55,565 --> 00:18:59,120 accountable to is yourself. And that's why it's difficult to make someone accountable to 309 00:18:59,120 --> 00:19:02,880 something unless you draw them into a social contract where, like, now 310 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,555 I'm accountable because there's there's some social link here. Right? So, like, 311 00:19:06,615 --> 00:19:09,895 you have no accountability to that person that you get matched up with in Focusmate. 312 00:19:09,895 --> 00:19:13,015 But the fact that, like, you've sat there committed to this, someone is watching you, 313 00:19:13,015 --> 00:19:13,180 you're 314 00:19:29,990 --> 00:19:33,210 out of that distractible, time wasting, energy leaking 315 00:19:33,830 --> 00:19:37,610 behavior that happens all day long with a lot of our audiences. 316 00:19:37,830 --> 00:19:41,565 So Yeah. Okay. Great. And I guess, like like, well, 317 00:19:41,565 --> 00:19:44,924 maybe step back a bit here because, like, what we're sort of broadly describing is, 318 00:19:44,924 --> 00:19:48,530 like, methods to protect against burnout. Right? And I I think we can continue to 319 00:19:48,530 --> 00:19:51,490 go down the line if you got some other suggestions here. This is great. Yeah. 320 00:19:51,810 --> 00:19:54,995 But I think, like, let's let's sort of couch this in in the idea that 321 00:19:54,995 --> 00:19:58,514 that burnout is pervasive lately. Like, you 322 00:19:58,514 --> 00:20:02,200 know, the stats that I've seen and somewhat validated by the clients 323 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:05,960 that I'm working with is we're generally seeing kind of a 20 to 30% reduction 324 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:09,720 in productivity post pandemic. Mhmm. And it was really fascinating to watch, like, 325 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:13,095 peep the productivity really ramped up through the the pandemic but 326 00:20:13,095 --> 00:20:16,855 there's there's sort of this this slow sort of burnout that's 327 00:20:16,855 --> 00:20:20,700 that's sort of simmering in in the business world that I've seen. Is this something 328 00:20:20,700 --> 00:20:23,899 that you're seeing and and and sort of how do you think about sort of 329 00:20:23,899 --> 00:20:27,488 that term burnout I guess? Yeah. 22 data points that come to mind is Microsoft 330 00:20:27,488 --> 00:20:28,159 put out a signals, their signals kind of report 331 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:40,780 but what has happened since pandemic is notifications, 332 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,920 distractions, meetings way up. And these folks are having a hard 333 00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:48,745 time getting things done. So that's number 1. Number 2 is Deloitte 334 00:20:48,745 --> 00:20:52,585 put out a study last year saying 77% of all employees 335 00:20:52,585 --> 00:20:56,299 have felt or described themselves as burned 336 00:20:56,299 --> 00:20:59,820 out in the last year. And so that's 337 00:20:59,820 --> 00:21:03,580 a very, very high number of people to say, yeah, I could say I 338 00:21:03,580 --> 00:21:07,025 felt burnt out in the last, you know, 6 months to a year. 339 00:21:07,025 --> 00:21:10,865 So I'd also say this and I think this goes unacknowledged so much 340 00:21:10,865 --> 00:21:14,700 is we never as a people have come out of a pandemic before, 341 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,940 and we do not know the long lasting effects of lockdowns, 342 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:22,885 of the pressure, of the fear, of the worry, of all of the things 343 00:21:22,885 --> 00:21:26,565 that happened during that time, we're really not that far from it. 344 00:21:26,565 --> 00:21:30,380 And so there are mental, emotional effects that that I think are 345 00:21:30,380 --> 00:21:34,140 occurring that we will see retrospectively, but I 346 00:21:34,140 --> 00:21:37,420 I want to make sure that, you know, whenever I'm talking to somebody, I talk 347 00:21:37,420 --> 00:21:40,794 about what was your experience during that time and have you had time to process 348 00:21:40,794 --> 00:21:44,635 through that. And so that's I think something to be aware of 349 00:21:44,635 --> 00:21:48,290 as well. So yes, burnout very very prevalent in in the 350 00:21:48,290 --> 00:21:52,070 moment. Okay. So, like, we we've talked about some strategies 351 00:21:52,130 --> 00:21:55,885 here, protecting yourselves against decision fatigue, 352 00:21:56,345 --> 00:21:59,645 the the myth of multitasking, I guess, is the best way to describe that. 353 00:22:00,265 --> 00:22:03,865 And I think wrapped in that, we talked talked about, like, the importance of taking 354 00:22:03,865 --> 00:22:07,130 breaks. Right? And maybe expand a bit of on that if you want to. Like, 355 00:22:07,130 --> 00:22:10,810 the idea of, like, taking those 5 minutes, those 10 minutes. You know, 356 00:22:10,810 --> 00:22:14,615 I encourage people, like like, take your lunch hour. Like, you don't necessarily work 357 00:22:14,775 --> 00:22:18,135 you have to work at your desk. And I I was, like, I was patient 358 00:22:18,135 --> 00:22:21,800 number 1 for this for a long, long time. Like, I rarely took lunch 359 00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,760 away from my desk because I felt like I had so much work to do. 360 00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:28,360 But once I started doing it, I really recognized, like, how much it helped to 361 00:22:28,360 --> 00:22:31,775 break up the day and just gave me a bit of a reset. Right? Any 362 00:22:31,775 --> 00:22:35,535 any further thoughts on sort of that that, that advice around breaking and 363 00:22:35,535 --> 00:22:39,190 taking breaks? Yeah. Yeah. You bet. Break science for some reason is real 364 00:22:39,190 --> 00:22:43,029 passion area for me. I don't know why if it's partly because people 365 00:22:43,029 --> 00:22:45,830 don't do it and a lot of the groups I speak to, it's one of 366 00:22:45,830 --> 00:22:49,405 the biggest things that we talk about because they're they're given them, 367 00:22:49,405 --> 00:22:52,605 they're told to take them if they want to, and they don't. And Right. And 368 00:22:52,605 --> 00:22:56,340 so the first thing is, you know, our brains are 369 00:22:56,340 --> 00:23:00,100 sprinters, not marathoners. So when you push your brain into marathon 370 00:23:00,100 --> 00:23:03,905 mode, your productivity just plummets. Yeah. And you you have 371 00:23:03,905 --> 00:23:06,705 to know that at the end of the day where you haven't had any breaks, 372 00:23:06,705 --> 00:23:10,225 you didn't take a lunch, you didn't get as much done as you thought you 373 00:23:10,225 --> 00:23:13,670 should have. Whereas when we take, you know, 374 00:23:13,670 --> 00:23:17,430 modulated breaks like the 10 minute breaks for the Pomodoro technique and 375 00:23:17,430 --> 00:23:21,155 then a half hour or 45, somewhere in the middle of your day, the 376 00:23:21,155 --> 00:23:24,915 productivity stats, the energy, the joy at the end of the day versus 377 00:23:24,915 --> 00:23:28,410 the just complete flatness, is notable. 378 00:23:28,630 --> 00:23:32,470 So the big question is, what is a good break? Because the problem is 379 00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:36,165 is when we take it in quotations break and we flip over our phone 380 00:23:36,165 --> 00:23:39,705 and we start scrolling, we're actually putting ourselves further into decision fatigue 381 00:23:40,130 --> 00:23:43,970 because every time you scroll like you're making 382 00:23:43,970 --> 00:23:47,730 a decision and so we don't wanna push ourselves into further decision 383 00:23:47,730 --> 00:23:51,555 fatigue, leave your phone on the table. Here are a series of breaks 384 00:23:51,555 --> 00:23:54,455 that are brain amplifying, not brain depleting. 385 00:23:55,075 --> 00:23:58,730 So number 1 is literally just stare out the window. Do 386 00:23:58,730 --> 00:24:02,510 nothing. Number 2, a short nap, a stretch, 387 00:24:03,530 --> 00:24:06,750 a walk out in nature. Nature super sizes 388 00:24:07,245 --> 00:24:10,945 any, the data tells us that if you can get out into green space, 389 00:24:11,325 --> 00:24:15,025 anything you're doing is going to be supersized as far as break taking. 390 00:24:15,460 --> 00:24:19,299 And then, chatting with a trusted friend. And so I say trusted 391 00:24:19,299 --> 00:24:22,475 because if you're chatting with a colleague or someone you don't know that well, you're 392 00:24:22,475 --> 00:24:26,235 actually spending energy kind of, you know, putting the walls 393 00:24:26,235 --> 00:24:29,250 up, being who you think they want to be, answering how you think, you know, 394 00:24:29,250 --> 00:24:32,550 and so Social norms. Right? Social norms. That's right. 395 00:24:32,930 --> 00:24:36,425 And for some of us introverts, that's even more costly, and so 396 00:24:36,585 --> 00:24:39,965 Guilty. Yeah, guilty. And 397 00:24:40,105 --> 00:24:43,885 so just staring out the window, 398 00:24:44,185 --> 00:24:47,980 nature space, napping, stretching, yoga, meditation, these 399 00:24:47,980 --> 00:24:51,580 are all great things to be doing. A healthy snack, getting 400 00:24:51,580 --> 00:24:55,414 yourself away from the station just so you have, seen 401 00:24:55,635 --> 00:24:59,475 change is actually really powerful. So Mhmm. Actually just getting 402 00:24:59,475 --> 00:25:03,309 your eyes and ears looking and listening to something different and then 403 00:25:03,309 --> 00:25:06,750 come back, that's a good break. And so, you know, it's 404 00:25:06,750 --> 00:25:10,350 not complicated, but the problem is is that most of us just reach for our 405 00:25:10,350 --> 00:25:14,175 phones or we do something that's not actually restorative. Yeah. 406 00:25:14,175 --> 00:25:17,875 Path of least resistance in a lot of cases. Right? Yeah. Yes. Absolutely. 407 00:25:18,570 --> 00:25:22,169 One thing you touched on here, like, that that, I know you're keen on. 408 00:25:22,490 --> 00:25:25,610 I'm I'm not sure how much of this relates to to sort of the the 409 00:25:25,610 --> 00:25:29,335 work that you do as well. I assume it does, but, like, sleep underlines 410 00:25:29,394 --> 00:25:33,235 everything. Right? Like, that's that's like, if you had one lever to pull, sleep 411 00:25:33,235 --> 00:25:36,420 is the most foundational. And I think it's a bit of a concern that, like, 412 00:25:36,420 --> 00:25:39,540 a lot of people have sort of gotten into, I need coffee in the morning 413 00:25:39,540 --> 00:25:42,580 and I need a nightcap at night in order to sleep. And, like, the science 414 00:25:42,580 --> 00:25:45,855 says like that. Like, that that you it may help you fall asleep but you're 415 00:25:45,855 --> 00:25:49,054 not sleeping. Right? So Yeah. I'll just sort of leave it at that around the 416 00:25:49,054 --> 00:25:52,300 idea of like like you need sleep and I think that a lot of the 417 00:25:52,300 --> 00:25:55,900 ways that people I think are trying to manage their sleep is really not 418 00:25:55,900 --> 00:25:59,680 beneficial. But I think it goes into this larger category 419 00:25:59,740 --> 00:26:03,435 as well around, like, sort of health and well-being. And I think food 420 00:26:03,435 --> 00:26:07,275 is something that we just don't consider enough about where like, how this is 421 00:26:07,275 --> 00:26:10,930 helping. And the modern office does not help us in this context. 422 00:26:10,930 --> 00:26:14,690 Like, fast food, regardless of sort of how you feel about it, 423 00:26:14,690 --> 00:26:18,045 like, I think everyone can kinda agree, like, it's not sort of the pinnacle of 424 00:26:18,045 --> 00:26:21,505 of health and well-being. It's convenient. It's tasty, whatever. 425 00:26:22,045 --> 00:26:25,800 But we also do ourselves a disservice by, like like, the sort of the 426 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,400 office culture of, you know, we've got snacks, but they're all sort of like 427 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:32,815 highly processed foods and, you know, there's free soda 428 00:26:32,815 --> 00:26:36,015 available for people and that sort of stuff. And then, you know, 429 00:26:36,575 --> 00:26:40,415 we're we're bringing in donuts and pastries for all of the meetings and it's 430 00:26:40,415 --> 00:26:43,680 like, yeah, we kinda love this stuff, but good God, like this is not helpful 431 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:46,980 for us in our productivity. We're spiking blood sugar. Everyone's 432 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,375 crashing by 2 PM. Like your afternoon's kind of a write off. 433 00:26:50,775 --> 00:26:54,055 Like, like, all the things that we think are are kind of beneficial to this 434 00:26:54,055 --> 00:26:57,355 are actually kinda, like, undercutting our productivity. Right? 435 00:26:57,919 --> 00:27:01,760 Yeah. One of the best Christmas gifts I gave my husband and 436 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,320 we were just talking about this the other day, it was many, many years ago 437 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:08,085 when he was working at Starbucks. This was the problem. And so 438 00:27:08,085 --> 00:27:11,924 I got him this cool looking box and 439 00:27:11,924 --> 00:27:15,260 I filled it with healthy snacks like 440 00:27:15,500 --> 00:27:18,860 organic jerky and, you know, seaweed and, 441 00:27:19,260 --> 00:27:22,935 all sorts of, like, little protein bars that he really liked and all sorts of 442 00:27:23,315 --> 00:27:26,755 great things that he could go and grab. And I that is one of the 443 00:27:26,755 --> 00:27:29,955 first things I'll tell folks. If they're if you are in an one of these 444 00:27:29,955 --> 00:27:33,550 environments that it's just constant, have an a 445 00:27:33,550 --> 00:27:37,070 quick alternative because, otherwise, you will grab for 446 00:27:37,070 --> 00:27:40,144 something in a weak moment that you don't want to. But if you have something 447 00:27:40,144 --> 00:27:43,505 else you can reach for, I highly recommend it. And it's kind of fun to 448 00:27:43,505 --> 00:27:47,345 put that together and have it in your office. And so that's something 449 00:27:47,345 --> 00:27:51,059 that I definitely recommend, but you're you're absolutely correct, both on the sleep 450 00:27:51,059 --> 00:27:54,820 and the nutrition piece. Those are big, big buckets to fill as 451 00:27:54,820 --> 00:27:58,525 far as our well-being goes. You're also I wanna affirm you 452 00:27:58,525 --> 00:28:02,365 that sleep is the biggest lever to pull. And if you 453 00:28:02,365 --> 00:28:06,010 as audience are feeling burned out or overwhelmed, I 454 00:28:06,010 --> 00:28:09,610 recommend that's one of the first places we start is just tiny little 455 00:28:09,610 --> 00:28:13,145 movements you can make to make your sleep sleep better. Start by changing a few 456 00:28:13,145 --> 00:28:16,665 things in your sleep cave as we call it. Make it darker, make it 457 00:28:16,665 --> 00:28:20,320 colder, get rid of the screens in there, and then think about your night 458 00:28:20,399 --> 00:28:23,700 time routine. One of the simplest things you can do for a night time routine 459 00:28:23,919 --> 00:28:27,200 is start to cool down the space and turn off all the lights and just 460 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,965 use candlelight or just use a dimmer switch and just start to 461 00:28:30,965 --> 00:28:34,645 get that melatonin coming up as your body temperature drops and as 462 00:28:34,645 --> 00:28:38,399 your eyes start to perceive that, oh, it's dark, we're gonna start to 463 00:28:38,399 --> 00:28:41,059 get ready for bed. 2 easy easy solutions. 464 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,555 Yeah. Yeah. It's it's so huge. And I guess the other piece, 465 00:28:45,555 --> 00:28:48,435 like, more on on food. I don't know why I'm stuck on this right now, 466 00:28:48,435 --> 00:28:51,235 but I'll I'll I'm I'm I'm going to a bit of a rant. The fact 467 00:28:51,235 --> 00:28:55,000 that I had bacon and deli roasted turkey for breakfast and you're like You 468 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,840 made me hungry. So that's why I'm thinking about it. Yeah. The but, like, the 469 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:02,600 other thing, like, I have this experience of, like, living in Canada and then I 470 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:06,434 moved to the States for a couple of years. And, you know, the 471 00:29:06,434 --> 00:29:10,195 the US for anyone that has not visited there, I get the the food 472 00:29:10,195 --> 00:29:13,980 culture is really strange because there's this equation that 473 00:29:13,980 --> 00:29:17,820 that, between volume and value. Right? Like the amount 474 00:29:17,820 --> 00:29:21,565 of food that you get when you've eat out is ridiculous. And I, 475 00:29:21,565 --> 00:29:25,245 like, I I eat myself into a food coma for the first 3 weeks that 476 00:29:25,245 --> 00:29:28,445 I lived there because I just could not get out of this this habit of 477 00:29:28,445 --> 00:29:32,030 finishing what I had available. Yeah. And I think, like, 478 00:29:32,030 --> 00:29:35,790 anyone who recognizes in their team or in themselves, like, you get the 479 00:29:35,790 --> 00:29:39,585 sleepies at 1 PM, like that is, I almost guarantee 480 00:29:39,585 --> 00:29:43,424 you is blood sugar related because Mhmm. Like we're we're we're fueled 481 00:29:43,424 --> 00:29:47,090 on caffeine and sugar all morning and then they have this giant 482 00:29:47,250 --> 00:29:51,090 meal midday and then get back to the office and anyone who's had meetings 483 00:29:51,090 --> 00:29:54,289 at 1 or 2 in the afternoon and you there's that always that one person 484 00:29:54,289 --> 00:29:57,865 in the corner that's sort of like desperately trying to keep their eyes open like 485 00:29:57,865 --> 00:30:00,505 that. Like, a, it's maybe because they didn't get a lot of sleep, but I 486 00:30:00,505 --> 00:30:04,265 think, b, it's also that the like, they're they're just spiking their blood sugar all 487 00:30:04,265 --> 00:30:08,000 day. Right? Yeah. 2 things that I recommend for that sort of mid 488 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:11,840 afternoon slump. 1 is something called lion's breath, and I'll demonstrate it for 489 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:15,325 you as embarrassing as it is. The other is just a huge glass of water 490 00:30:15,325 --> 00:30:19,005 because often we're dehydrated. So Right. If you feel like you want the glazed 491 00:30:19,005 --> 00:30:22,684 donut, hold off for 10 minutes. Drink a full glass of water, do lion's breath, 492 00:30:22,684 --> 00:30:25,870 which I'm gonna show you, and just give yourself a minute to determine do you 493 00:30:25,870 --> 00:30:29,310 actually want that or can you support yourself in another 494 00:30:29,310 --> 00:30:33,075 way. And lion's breath is really simple. It's one of the most energizing, 495 00:30:33,695 --> 00:30:37,375 confidence building, focusing breaths that you can do and it's 496 00:30:37,375 --> 00:30:40,980 just in through the nose and then you stick your tongue out and you 497 00:30:40,980 --> 00:30:43,480 roar from the back of your throat. So it's just like this. 498 00:30:45,220 --> 00:30:48,900 And you did that about 5 or 6 times in through the nose, out through 499 00:30:48,900 --> 00:30:52,654 the mouth, just tongue out full into it, go into the bathroom if 500 00:30:52,654 --> 00:30:56,414 you need to. But you can tell like it already, it made me flush. Like 501 00:30:56,414 --> 00:30:59,780 it's, it is energizing. It's a great a great thing to do 502 00:30:59,780 --> 00:31:03,140 midafternoon when you're feeling the slumpies for sure. Yeah. 503 00:31:03,140 --> 00:31:06,515 So the this is something that I've come to in the last couple of years, 504 00:31:06,515 --> 00:31:10,355 I guess, but breath work has been absolutely revelatory in my 505 00:31:10,355 --> 00:31:14,060 life. So, yeah, familiar with that one more from sort of the yoga history that 506 00:31:14,060 --> 00:31:17,820 I have. I was a part of that practice, but, that is something that 507 00:31:17,820 --> 00:31:21,475 I I I understand more completely now of this connection 508 00:31:21,534 --> 00:31:25,054 between your ability to breathe and how it regulates your heart, your 509 00:31:25,054 --> 00:31:28,414 gut, your brain, like all of those things. Like, they're connected by the vagus 510 00:31:28,414 --> 00:31:32,250 nerve. I've Yeah. I've done a whole talk about this before so I'm super passionate 511 00:31:32,250 --> 00:31:36,090 about this. Like, but just recognizing how you breathe 512 00:31:36,090 --> 00:31:39,425 and being intentional about breathing is the fastest 513 00:31:39,645 --> 00:31:43,485 access point you have to to modifying your body. Because, you know, like, we 514 00:31:43,485 --> 00:31:47,130 want our body to monitor monitor and manage our heart and our breath independently 515 00:31:47,270 --> 00:31:50,790 so that we don't have to do it. So you can't you can't change those 516 00:31:50,790 --> 00:31:54,390 things, but you can absolutely change your pattern of breath and it it is the 517 00:31:54,390 --> 00:31:58,014 fastest way you can create a state change. It's really, really fascinating for 518 00:31:58,014 --> 00:32:01,695 people that wanna get into that. Yeah. It is. I always say it's the 519 00:32:01,695 --> 00:32:05,500 fastest, freest bridge between fight or flight and rest and relax. And 520 00:32:05,620 --> 00:32:09,140 Right. And it's it you have it everywhere you go. It's 521 00:32:09,140 --> 00:32:12,820 completely free and it's Yep. So, so powerful. And so I 522 00:32:12,820 --> 00:32:16,505 appreciate that. That. Microsoft, just had me develop a talk called 523 00:32:16,505 --> 00:32:19,325 breathability. And we what we do is we take this, 524 00:32:19,945 --> 00:32:23,700 fictional executive and we take her through a super stressful day. 525 00:32:23,700 --> 00:32:27,220 And then we take her through the day again applying 5 different 526 00:32:27,220 --> 00:32:31,060 breathing techniques to her day to help her modulate, like you 527 00:32:31,060 --> 00:32:34,755 had just said, kind of her state. And it's such 528 00:32:34,755 --> 00:32:38,535 a cool concept, and so I love that you also do a talk on that. 529 00:32:39,155 --> 00:32:39,580 Everybody 530 00:32:49,375 --> 00:32:52,755 controlling energy, any others that you that you wanna touch on? 531 00:32:53,295 --> 00:32:56,975 Yeah. You bet. I mean, boundaries is always a big energy suck. And so 532 00:32:56,975 --> 00:33:00,770 when we have Yeah. Poorly set boundaries, we tend 533 00:33:00,770 --> 00:33:04,610 to be, like, patching the holes all the time that people are punching through 534 00:33:04,610 --> 00:33:07,465 because we didn't set it clearly, which is very costly. 535 00:33:16,540 --> 00:33:20,299 Them. So I think boundaries is a big energy leaker if we're not clear 536 00:33:20,299 --> 00:33:23,820 on that. And then I also think, one that, you know, 537 00:33:23,820 --> 00:33:27,495 is just sort of tail end is the concept of I don't know if you've 538 00:33:27,495 --> 00:33:31,335 ever seen this. It's called the circle of concern, circle of influence, and it's 539 00:33:31,335 --> 00:33:34,875 3 concentric circles. Innermost circle is that which you can control, 540 00:33:35,095 --> 00:33:38,650 next circle is that which you can influence, and the outer most is 541 00:33:38,650 --> 00:33:42,490 that which you have concern over, but no control. And when I'm 542 00:33:42,490 --> 00:33:46,284 working with someone, I'm off often say, okay, which of these circles are you 543 00:33:46,284 --> 00:33:49,885 spending a fair amount of time in? And if we're out in the circle of 544 00:33:49,885 --> 00:33:53,390 concern where we really don't have a lot of control over 545 00:33:53,770 --> 00:33:57,470 that is energy leakage and we have to dive in deep into that 546 00:33:57,530 --> 00:34:01,365 inner circle on those which we have control. And oftentimes I'll get people saying, 547 00:34:01,365 --> 00:34:05,125 well, I don't feel like I have control over anything. You have control over 548 00:34:05,125 --> 00:34:08,659 your words. You have control over, how kind you are to 549 00:34:08,659 --> 00:34:12,420 somebody. You have control over whether you're gonna do some breathing exercise like we 550 00:34:12,420 --> 00:34:16,244 just talked about. There are plenty of things we have control over that can help 551 00:34:16,244 --> 00:34:20,005 us pull back in on our energy and, create that 552 00:34:20,005 --> 00:34:23,464 extra bandwidth that we want and need in order to, 553 00:34:24,510 --> 00:34:28,190 dedicate to our well-being. Yeah. So I'll address those, in in kind 554 00:34:28,190 --> 00:34:31,790 of reverse order. Like, I I talk I joke about the, the the 555 00:34:31,790 --> 00:34:35,455 serenity rare all the time. Right? Like like know what you can 556 00:34:35,455 --> 00:34:39,215 control, know what you can't control, and and manage accordingly. Right? 557 00:34:39,215 --> 00:34:42,860 And it's incredible. Like, any type of coaching relationship that you have, 558 00:34:42,860 --> 00:34:46,334 like, you you've definitely been privy to this and I see this all the time. 559 00:34:46,334 --> 00:34:49,807 It's like, why are we spending so much thing so much time talking about the 560 00:34:49,807 --> 00:34:53,335 frustrations that are that are not within your control? Like, it's almost self flagellating. 561 00:34:53,635 --> 00:34:57,395 Right? Like like a like, let's focus on some other things. Right? Sure. Like, that's 562 00:34:57,395 --> 00:35:00,830 out of your control. I agree. It's frustrating. I'm not telling you it's not. But, 563 00:35:00,830 --> 00:35:04,670 like, continuing to sort of focus on this, I see this especially, like, in 564 00:35:04,670 --> 00:35:08,355 in a lot of work that I do. I'm I'm working with middle management And, 565 00:35:08,355 --> 00:35:11,955 like, they're frustrated by what their leadership is telling them and their 566 00:35:11,955 --> 00:35:15,430 ability to actually act and execute on that at their level and below. 567 00:35:15,670 --> 00:35:19,349 And it's like, well, you know, that okay. You can debate this, but if that's 568 00:35:19,349 --> 00:35:23,109 a decision of the organization, is it really worth kinda, you know, like continuing 569 00:35:23,109 --> 00:35:26,375 to sort of bitch about it. Right? Like, what are we doing here? Right? Like, 570 00:35:26,375 --> 00:35:29,895 there's the other there's all of these other things that are absolutely within your control 571 00:35:29,895 --> 00:35:32,990 that you can start to manage. How about we focus some energy over there? And 572 00:35:32,990 --> 00:35:36,349 I I think it's a really important reflection to sort of come back to 573 00:35:36,349 --> 00:35:39,869 constantly of reminding yourself, like, what do I have 574 00:35:39,869 --> 00:35:43,415 control over through the course of my day? Because it's not everything and that 575 00:35:43,415 --> 00:35:47,115 shouldn't be the understanding that you should have in this either. Right? 576 00:35:47,734 --> 00:35:51,415 Yeah. And I think that that actually goes to to boundaries really 577 00:35:51,415 --> 00:35:55,260 well. Right? That, you know, what are the boundaries? What are you willing to commit 578 00:35:55,260 --> 00:35:58,940 to? You know, even it's as as simple 579 00:35:58,940 --> 00:36:02,215 as, you know, what hours do you work. Right? And this is the classic case 580 00:36:02,215 --> 00:36:05,095 of my boss sent me an email at 9 PM. I guess I have to 581 00:36:05,095 --> 00:36:08,869 respond to it. And then, like, that was never the intention. Like, they're working late. 582 00:36:08,869 --> 00:36:12,230 They didn't tell you you had to. Like, if they send you a 911 email, 583 00:36:12,230 --> 00:36:15,635 like, need your reply on this immediately. Like, sure. Okay. It's, like, 584 00:36:15,635 --> 00:36:19,235 indicated. But, like, I think a lot of people sort of get themselves trapped in 585 00:36:19,235 --> 00:36:22,215 this relationship where they're trying to service a relationship, 586 00:36:22,995 --> 00:36:26,440 on someone else's schedule that's never really been determined. And 587 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:30,040 you're well within your your ability to set a boundary and re 588 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,805 reengage in that relationship. Right? Love it. Oh my gosh. I love it. 589 00:36:33,805 --> 00:36:37,645 The stories we tell ourselves in our head where we that particular employee that 590 00:36:37,645 --> 00:36:41,325 you're referring to never had a conversation, but assumed 591 00:36:41,325 --> 00:36:44,569 that they had to respond at that time. And I think we spend a lot 592 00:36:44,569 --> 00:36:48,010 of energy playing those stories in our head that we don't actually know are 593 00:36:48,010 --> 00:36:51,785 true. I love what one of my clients did when we talked about this 594 00:36:51,785 --> 00:36:55,325 very subject is she did an out of office 595 00:36:55,385 --> 00:36:58,905 email during her off hour time. So from, say, 6 596 00:36:58,905 --> 00:37:02,560 PM till the next morning, and it said, if you're sending me an 597 00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:06,400 email now, I am offline. If this is urgent, please feel free to use my 598 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:10,195 phone number. And she's never got a call because it was never urgent. And 599 00:37:10,275 --> 00:37:13,175 but that allowed her to put a a level of separation 600 00:37:13,955 --> 00:37:17,620 between her and the responsibility of responding. And I just thought, well, that 601 00:37:17,620 --> 00:37:21,300 was a nice sort of tangible boundary that she put in place to 602 00:37:21,300 --> 00:37:24,660 let people know I'm not responding to your email. If it's 603 00:37:24,660 --> 00:37:28,185 urgent, call me. And of course it's not urgent, so they're not going to 604 00:37:28,185 --> 00:37:31,785 call. But I do like that and I do and you actually bring up a 605 00:37:31,785 --> 00:37:35,590 good point and that is that boundary setting has as much to do with the 606 00:37:35,590 --> 00:37:38,970 fences we kind of put around ourselves 607 00:37:39,430 --> 00:37:43,085 to to modulate ourselves as much as the fences we put to 608 00:37:43,085 --> 00:37:46,625 block out others. And so that idea of, well, 609 00:37:46,765 --> 00:37:50,525 what's what this boundary is for me and only me, and it's just as 610 00:37:50,525 --> 00:37:50,980 important 611 00:38:00,535 --> 00:38:04,135 know, like, hey. If there's an an emergency, then I'm 612 00:38:04,135 --> 00:38:07,655 happy to help you. But, otherwise, after 6 PM, I am now focused on my 613 00:38:07,655 --> 00:38:10,849 family. Right? And if I have other work to do, sure. Like, you got some 614 00:38:10,849 --> 00:38:14,210 time by my all means. But, you know, you're not sort of at this it 615 00:38:14,210 --> 00:38:17,145 it sort of goes through again to this burnout of, like, like this this sort 616 00:38:17,145 --> 00:38:20,984 of hypersensitivity or hyper attention towards things that are not really 617 00:38:20,984 --> 00:38:24,665 urgent. Right? Like you're you're getting these dings on your phone because 618 00:38:24,665 --> 00:38:28,270 people are chatting about something in in your in your communication 619 00:38:28,330 --> 00:38:31,770 channels. Like, do you really need to look at that at 7 PM? Probably not. 620 00:38:31,770 --> 00:38:35,425 Is it gonna stress you out? Maybe. But, like, just the fact that you have 621 00:38:35,425 --> 00:38:37,984 to be aware of it and then it's constantly in the back of your mind 622 00:38:37,984 --> 00:38:41,380 is doing a disservice. Right? Like, it's it's eating away at your mental 623 00:38:41,380 --> 00:38:45,140 energy. So if you need to create that space, create that space. Right? 624 00:38:45,140 --> 00:38:48,785 Like, nothing's gonna happen till tomorrow morning. Like you said, someone will call you if 625 00:38:48,865 --> 00:38:52,305 if the place is on fire. Right? And there's lots of tools to help you 626 00:38:52,305 --> 00:38:54,918 turn off those notifications so they're not rattling around on your phone and interrupting you. 627 00:38:54,918 --> 00:38:55,924 I think also if you are as we're Tom and 628 00:39:02,380 --> 00:39:06,035 idea of this idea of shutting off notifications, not answering 629 00:39:06,035 --> 00:39:09,735 emails, it's worth exploring what's that, what is that 630 00:39:09,955 --> 00:39:13,690 about? What's that coming from? Where is that resistance coming from? Is it 631 00:39:13,690 --> 00:39:17,290 your value? Is it that you don't feel like or you're not 632 00:39:17,290 --> 00:39:20,665 sure kind of, like, you know, where your place is in your 633 00:39:20,665 --> 00:39:24,425 role or whatever. I think it's worth reflecting on if you're so attached to 634 00:39:24,425 --> 00:39:28,240 that, how is that defining you? And so I think 635 00:39:28,240 --> 00:39:31,680 it's really key to just kind of self reflect on that too if you're feeling 636 00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:35,105 a lot of resistance about making those boundary changes. Yeah. And I think that's a 637 00:39:35,105 --> 00:39:38,625 really important point because a lot of what we're talking about here is, like like, 638 00:39:38,625 --> 00:39:42,390 yes, there's some personal autonomy in this, but, you know, can you change the 639 00:39:42,549 --> 00:39:46,230 communication culture of your organization? Maybe. Right? I think there's 640 00:39:46,230 --> 00:39:50,069 there's potentially more influence available there than people think. Like, if you're the leader of 641 00:39:50,069 --> 00:39:53,705 the organization, I strongly encourage you to figure out with the 642 00:39:53,705 --> 00:39:57,485 team, like, what are sort of the modes of engagement and communication that are expectations? 643 00:39:57,625 --> 00:40:01,460 You know, like like just simply telling people like, hey, if I email you late 644 00:40:01,460 --> 00:40:05,060 at night, like, I'm not expecting a reply. Like like, you know, I've seen this 645 00:40:05,060 --> 00:40:08,555 in in some cases where, like, a boss like, they they have set up sort 646 00:40:08,555 --> 00:40:12,395 of, like, send email later, right, to not disturb people. Like, it's better to 647 00:40:12,395 --> 00:40:16,099 just have a like, a communicated policy and expectations around this. So 648 00:40:16,340 --> 00:40:20,119 I love that. Yeah. Sure. Like, make that expectation. But even if you're, 649 00:40:20,420 --> 00:40:24,180 just a a contributor on a team, like, it's worth advocating for these things because 650 00:40:24,180 --> 00:40:27,925 in a lot of cases, these are undefined expectations that no one like, 651 00:40:27,925 --> 00:40:30,965 where we create these narratives of, like, oh, this is the way we work around 652 00:40:30,965 --> 00:40:34,005 here. But if you say, like, hey, this is kinda crazy. Does anyone agree? And 653 00:40:34,005 --> 00:40:36,390 they're like, yeah, this is silly. Like, we should do this a different way. Like, 654 00:40:36,390 --> 00:40:39,349 what do we think we should do? Right? Like the and that won't be the 655 00:40:39,349 --> 00:40:43,185 case in every organization, I admit. But, like, there's I think there's a there's 656 00:40:43,245 --> 00:40:46,845 a necessity for advocating for those things in whatever capacity you can. 657 00:40:46,845 --> 00:40:50,690 Right? Absolutely. And you bring up a great point and that is 658 00:40:50,750 --> 00:40:54,270 that I have found in all of the groups that I've worked with, if the 659 00:40:54,270 --> 00:40:58,110 leaders say, okay, you know, I'm not gonna take any 660 00:40:58,110 --> 00:41:01,915 vacation days. I'm not going to, I'm 661 00:41:01,915 --> 00:41:05,355 not going to have any email boundaries. I might email you late at night. You 662 00:41:05,355 --> 00:41:08,875 don't have to answer, and I'm gonna work at my desk through lunch and all 663 00:41:08,875 --> 00:41:12,700 of that. No matter what you say to your staff saying, but you don't 664 00:41:12,700 --> 00:41:16,300 do that, they will follow what you do because they will not 665 00:41:16,300 --> 00:41:19,325 go, oh, yeah. I'm gonna take all my vacation days. I'm not gonna answer emails 666 00:41:19,325 --> 00:41:23,085 at night, but you are. And so setting that example from the 667 00:41:23,085 --> 00:41:26,770 top down, even just in subtle little things like verbalizing 668 00:41:26,990 --> 00:41:30,830 that you're taking just a day off because you are gonna get your energy back 669 00:41:30,830 --> 00:41:31,730 or verbalizing 670 00:41:41,369 --> 00:41:45,210 being type strategy for themselves. Yeah. Leading by 671 00:41:45,210 --> 00:41:48,405 example is is the ultimate power. Right? Yeah. Yep. 672 00:41:48,885 --> 00:41:52,245 Amazing. Well, this is great Heather. I really appreciate the work that you're doing and 673 00:41:52,245 --> 00:41:56,005 and advocating for this stuff. As I said, I think it's it's crucially needed in 674 00:41:56,165 --> 00:41:59,810 especially in the technical industry. So, I 675 00:41:59,810 --> 00:42:03,650 would encourage, especially any vendors that are are listening to the podcast, you 676 00:42:03,650 --> 00:42:07,175 know, reach out to Heather and have her, as a speaker at some of the 677 00:42:07,255 --> 00:42:10,535 conferences and things and and get this out front and center for for people to 678 00:42:10,535 --> 00:42:14,370 consume. It's it it it goes directly to, your 679 00:42:14,450 --> 00:42:18,130 your company's productivity. Right? Like this is essential for getting people 680 00:42:18,130 --> 00:42:21,890 working, you know, smarter not harder as it were. Right? Absolutely. So we'll 681 00:42:21,890 --> 00:42:25,665 link to everything, Doctor Heather Dennison in the in 682 00:42:25,665 --> 00:42:29,205 the show notes. Any sort of parting words or asks, Heather? 683 00:42:29,345 --> 00:42:32,819 No, man. We have covered some great ground, Todd. And I think just, 684 00:42:33,060 --> 00:42:36,339 you know, we talked very first out of the gate self compassion and then we 685 00:42:36,339 --> 00:42:40,020 talked about identifying where you are maybe spilling some of your energy and just 686 00:42:40,020 --> 00:42:43,725 taking a step back and looking at repeat decisions, boundaries, 687 00:42:44,025 --> 00:42:47,785 circle of concern, multitasking, context 688 00:42:47,785 --> 00:42:51,170 shifting, those sorts of things as places to shore up so then you can start 689 00:42:51,170 --> 00:42:54,530 to build back up your resilience. So that's where I'd probably leave it for 690 00:42:54,530 --> 00:42:58,185 today. Awesome. Appreciate your time, Heather. Thank you, Todd. I 691 00:42:58,185 --> 00:42:59,805 really appreciate you having me on.