GMSB 297
[00:00:05] Antony Whitaker: Hello, and welcome to today's episode of the Grow My Salon Business podcast. I'm your host, Antony Whitaker, and as always, it's great to have you here with us today. And whether you're watching on YouTube or listening as you walk the dog, or driving the car or running on the treadmill, whatever you're doing, I just want to start off by saying thank you for being a listener.
[00:00:24] Antony Whitaker: Now our podcast is growing and we need your help to continue growing because we want to get to help as many people as we possibly can. So if you're on YouTube, give us a thumbs up, subscribe to our channel and share it with your friends. And if you're listening on your favourite podcast app, then give us a five-star review and a follow, and that would be very kind of you and very much appreciated.
[00:00:47] Antony Whitaker: We are soon to be launching our online marketing course where we cover everything to do with the world of salon marketing. So if marketing and growing your business is important to you, then head on over to growmysalonbusiness.com/course/marketing and put your name on the waitlist so that you get priority notification.
[00:01:10] Antony Whitaker: And I'll also put that link in the show notes of today's episode. So with that said on with today's episode. Clients are the lifeblood of business, and I'm yet to meet a salon owner who doesn't want to have more clients. So let's start by asking where do new clients come from?
[00:01:31] Antony Whitaker: Now the answer is that it varies depending on many things, including your location and your business model. But I'm gonna suggest that there are five main drivers that bring new clients into your salon. The first is that they're just a random walk-in and you just happen to be there when they needed a haircut or colour or whatever the service was that they needed at that point in time.
[00:01:54] Antony Whitaker: The second is that they're the result of a offline marketing promotion in whatever shape or form that took. The third is that they came on personal recommendation, meaning a direct referral from someone who'd already been 
[00:02:10] Antony Whitaker: The fourth is that they found you on social media, and the fifth way is that they were driven to you through the internet, and most likely that would mean through Google and it's Google and web traffic that we're going to be talking about in this episode. So my guest today is Phil Evans. He is the founder of Salon Guru, and Phil and his team specialise in websites and digital marketing for the salon industry and have now built over 300 websites all over the English speaking world.
[00:02:40] Antony Whitaker: So he is the perfect guest to be talking with today, especially when it comes to Google and the salon industry. So in today's podcast, we're going to discuss why salon owners need to understand how Google works. We're also going to talk about what the differences between Google search, Google profile, Google Maps, and how to find out what your Google rank is, and so much more.
[00:03:06] Antony Whitaker: And so without further ado, welcome to the show, Phil Evans.
[00:03:10] Phil Evans: Thank you and I'm looking forward to it.
[00:03:12] Antony Whitaker: Yeah, me too. It's been a while since, uh, you know, you've been on the podcast. I actually had a look, it's five years ago. I couldn't believe it was that long. But, uh, for anyone who's interested in, you know, finding out what we spoke about last time, because you know, the world's changed a lot in the last five years, but we did a very.
[00:03:28] Antony Whitaker: Uh, informative podcast. I'll make sure I put the link to it in, the show notes. uh, but today we're gonna talk about something, uh, different to what we spoke about last time. So there'll be, you know, some obvious connections, but, you know, technology and as I say, the world that we live in has changed a lot.
[00:03:43] Antony Whitaker: So, uh, Phil, let me, let me start by saying that. Most of us use Google in our everyday lives, and perhaps, I think most people just take it for granted. But like everything though, Google today, as I just said, it's very different to what it was, uh, five years ago. And digital marketing has changed a lot, and I think that most salon owners are not particularly clued up about how to use Google to specifically grow their business and just how important it's became.
[00:04:13] Antony Whitaker: I know that that rarely is a niche that you and, the team at Salon Guru have, been focusing on and indeed specialise in. So let me just ask you a really broad question to kick things off, and that is why is it important for business owners, salon owners specifically to understand how Google works?
[00:04:37] Phil Evans: I think when most salon owners understand their numbers, where your, where your new client's coming from, they'll realize that the number coming from Google is far, far higher than they realized. Therefore, the importance of Google search becomes really, really relevant. You know, it's likely to be in the order of 80% of the clients coming to the website are coming from search.
[00:04:59] Antony Whitaker: Okay, well that's, that's really interesting 'cause I want to dig into, uh, some of the terminology. 'cause I think a lot of people get confused on the terminology and indeed the terminology sort of changes what it might mean. Today isn't necessarily what it meant before. And uh, I was privileged enough to have you, join me on my event that we did a couple of weeks ago at the House of Sassoon.
[00:05:22] Antony Whitaker: And you did a great presentation on using Google to, uh, grow your business. And during that presentation you shared some. Data. and you just touched on it then, and it was from a, a range of salons, uh, because I know you work with salons all over the world and you had some data from salons in Liverpool, in California, in Dublin and in London.
[00:05:43] Antony Whitaker: So it was very diverse. And within that data there were three statistics, well, two really that add up to the third that really stand out. And that was that one of them was 50% of people. Come now. This is specifically when we're talking about web traffic, okay? That 50% of them came from Google search, and 30% came from your Google profile, meaning that 80% in total.
[00:06:12] Antony Whitaker: Of web traffic clients that are coming to your business are coming via Google. So that in itself is a really important number to get your head around and an important reason as to why salon owners need to understand how Google works. And then the other remaining 20% were things like you, you refer to it as, as direct, and I'll get you to explain what that means.
[00:06:34] Antony Whitaker: And, and then websites and, uh, social. So. Just so we can give that some context. What, what do you mean when you say that 20% came from direct? Uh, what is direct and, uh, some came from websites. What do you mean by that? And some came from social. So, uh, over to you.
[00:06:51] Phil Evans: Right. So direct are people coming directly to your website? So often it's from a, an email you've sent them. So it could be a client newsletter that you're sending out to all of your clients with links in it, book online, buy a tier, check our latest review. So you, you are giving them something to click.
[00:07:07] Phil Evans: So Google. When you're tracking those numbers to your website, they'll say that's come directly to you. So it's clicking a link in an email or possibly in a SMS text message. You are sending messages to clients about bookings, so you might be reminding them about their appointment tomorrow, and if they click a link and come to your website that's direct, they've not searched for you, they've not come by social media.
[00:07:27] Phil Evans: You've given them a link somehow, or they've even saved it in their favourites on their on their browser. So they've got your salon in their favourites and they just click it. And it goes straight there. That's a direct, so that's often your work, what you are doing as a salon owner to get emails and get text messages out there.
[00:07:44] Phil Evans: Social media are people that go to your Instagram and your Facebook and or see you on Instagram and Facebook and possibly like what they see and want to find out more. They wanna find out your prices where you are, possibly a map your phone number, so that is tracked as incoming traffic to your website from social media or Facebook and Instagram separately.
[00:08:05] Antony Whitaker: Okay. And I'm curious about that. Those, so those three make up only 20%. So 80, 80% is coming from Google search and Google profile, and we'll, we'll dig into what that actually means in a minute. But the remaining 20% is coming from direct, it's coming from websites, and it's coming from socials. So out of those three, um, what's the breakdown typically of that 20%?
[00:08:32] Phil Evans: the, the direct, in other words, your text message and your emails is often 10 to 15. The other websites, which can be directory listings. You might be on a local, you could be on Yell, you could be on a, on a supplier guide. So people are finding you on other websites. Um, so it can be a, a wide range of different websites that's often two, three, 4% social media.
[00:08:55] Phil Evans: And I, we, this is up 230 salons over 20 years. I've never seen it higher than 3%.
[00:09:01] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. You see, that's the number that I think is just going to blow people away because, you know, there's, there's, I mean, we're all, we're all on Instagram. I shouldn't say we're all, but I think we're all on Instagram and, uh. I think it's a fallacy that, you know, look, there are Doubtlessly, some people listening to this that will be saying, I get all my new clients from Instagram and I, I get that, but I don't think that that is the norm.
[00:09:24] Antony Whitaker: I think that it's the unicorns that are saying that, and it's interesting. I.
[00:09:28] Phil Evans: all they do. If you only do Instagram, if you don't bother about your website and your Google, of course, that's how they're gonna find you because of Instagram. But that if it's actually only 1% of the potential traffic to your website, you're missing the massive opportunity that's gonna out there Google, because you're relying on solely your Instagram traffic.
[00:09:49] Phil Evans: I, I looked, I looked at a West London salon, two salon locations in central London, uh, who've got a really big Instagram following before it came on this call. Uh, they've got 12,000 Instagram followers, so a nice, very trendy, very social media friend, and I checked their numbers. They had 17,000 visitors on the website last month.
[00:10:08] Phil Evans: 1% came from their Instagram,
[00:10:09] Antony Whitaker: Wow. Okay.
[00:10:11] Phil Evans: and that's 12,000 people on their Instagram, and only 1% of them, or 1% of the traffic to the website was coming from there. 80% was coming from Google.
[00:10:20] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. Now you often, when I'm listening to you, you, you use lots of terminology. Um, and, uh, I've learn to understand the distinctions. Um, but I know that when I look at hairdresser. And you start talking to 'em about this. And the disadvantage we've got, although we're on, we're doing this, uh, as a podcast, and so it will be on YouTube.
[00:10:41] Antony Whitaker: Uh, but predominantly our listeners are just going to be listening to this, typically why they do something else. So we can't share any visuals to, uh, you know, explain what we're talking about. But I think that what I see with hairdressers is they get confused with what some of the terminology means. So what I want to start with at the beginning here is just go through, uh, different.
[00:11:04] Antony Whitaker: Terminology and what things mean. And I want to start off by asking you, uh, about this term, you've already used it, Google search. So what is meant by the term Google search? 
[00:11:17] Phil Evans: So. I mean, Google's not the only search engine, so we should make that note of, however, it's typically 90% of all search traffic is coming from Google. So there are others that bing, there's duck, duck go, there's others. But really the, the number one answer is always Google. So let's talk about Google search.
[00:11:33] Phil Evans: If somebody wants something, me, you or your clients, most of us will get out our phone or go to our computer and we'll search for it. Whether it's a hotel in London, whether it's um, a car mechanic. Whether it's a hair salon, we'll often go and search for it. Now, there's two ways you can search for it. You can search for, well several.
[00:11:54] Phil Evans: There's your phone or your tablet, or your device, or there's your computer. So there's a slight difference in the way that Google gives you the answer, whether you are on a mobile phone or where your computer. But for most salons, 70% of your Google traffic is gonna come from mobile phones. Or tablets, mobile phones primarily.
[00:12:13] Phil Evans: So, so it's important that you look at your salon through the eyes of a mobile phone user, local to your business. So if you are in Tampa, or if you are in Liverpool, get out your mobile phone, search for salon phrases and see what Google gives you as the answer. So you are searching on Google and you're getting a result.
[00:12:33] Phil Evans: What you search for could be salon. best salon. Salon near me. Balayage prices, extension specialists, whole range of phrases. I mean, we typically will check about 200 phrases for all of our salons constantly, every month. Where are we? Where are they appearing? On Google Board. We'll come to that later.
[00:12:53] Phil Evans: is the, it's when you search for something and it comes up on your screen, typically a mobile.
[00:12:57] Antony Whitaker: right. Okay. So you just touched on some examples of what they would search for. What, what are the phrases? That they're typing in to search, like typically what sort of phrases are they putting in there? Like you just threw a few words out there, like, I don't know, extension specialist or balayage or whatever it was, but as a client typing in what is it that they're typing in?
[00:13:22] Phil Evans: We do a lot of research on this 'cause it changes, you know. 10 years ago there was no such thing as balayage, or most people had not heard of it. Suddenly it became a really big trend and it, it probably outranked most of the colour phrases. So we do other lot of research on the current trends or what the current phrases are, but the generic ones are always the first thing That hair salon, hairdressing salon, hair salon near me.
[00:13:45] Phil Evans: Best salon. Now if you are on your computer, you would often add to the end of that, the town name. So if you, you know, hair salon Mayfair, or you might say, um, best salon Tampa. 'Cause you are on your computer and Google doesn't know where you are. So people get used to, when they're searching on the computer saying, I'm looking for a hotel in London.
[00:14:05] Phil Evans: I'm looking for a salon in Tampa. But if you're on your phone, you don't need to do that. because then your phone is very much located, geo-located, they call it. So. Google knows exactly where you are to the metre, so if you say salon near me, it's going to be looking at salons probably within a quarter mile radius if you're in a city, perhaps a bit further, if you are in a smaller town or more rural.
[00:14:29] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. 
[00:14:30] Phil Evans: So you've typed in best salon near me or balayage prices and it's Google's come back with some answers.
[00:14:38] Phil Evans: Now it's going to give you two different kinds of answers, and I think it's really important to understand this. 'cause right at the beginning you talked about the Google search being about 50% and the Google profile being about 20, 30%. They're both actually Google Search. If you type in Salon near me on your phone, the first thing that comes up are your Google profiles as a result of what you asked at the search.
[00:15:02] Phil Evans: So Salon near me, it'll give you a little map and it'll give you typically three local salons. Beneath that, what we call Google Organic, in other words, websites. So in that same question, what's the best salon near me? You're going to get two different kinds of things. You're going to get the best Google profiles for salons, followed by the best websites for salons.
[00:15:24] Phil Evans: So Google Search is giving you two different kinds of answers, and we're going to go into both of those. I know in detail. 
[00:15:30] Antony Whitaker: I get it that from a consumer's point of view, how you measure the effectiveness of Google search because it either tells you somewhere nearby or doesn't sort of thing. So you know that's how you are measuring the effective as a consumer. But as a business owner, how do you measure the effectiveness of your Google search?
[00:15:51] Phil Evans: You check a whole range of phrases, so let's take some examples. Let's assume we're in Tampa, in Florida, and we're a client and we're looking for best hair extension salon, and we now know that Google's gonna give us the profiles followed by the websites. The effectiveness of that salon is, are you? Right at the top of the websites, we'll touch on the profiles later.
[00:16:14] Phil Evans: Is your website coming up first in the list? Because if you've got, we'll go into the, the reasons why in a minute. But the effectiveness is being number one or two or three. Beyond that, it's almost a waste of time being number five, you're gonna get very few clicks. You want to be the first three websites amongst those.
[00:16:34] Phil Evans: Ideally, number one, that comes up when people search. So we, we talked about. Tampa, we talked about hair extension salon, but it could be best salon, salon reviews, um, salon balayage prices. There's a whole range of phrases, hundreds of them that you want to be number one for. 'cause if, when somebody's searching or all these different people with different searches, with different questions.
[00:16:58] Phil Evans: All in Tampa if they're all asking different questions, but every single time, the same salon keeps coming up, which in this case is our client Monaco. They're number one for 217 phrases the last time I looked. So they dominate Google. If a person is searching for a salon service or a salon in Tampa and a wider area around it, they wanna be number one.
[00:17:21] Phil Evans: They want that client to click through to their website. And then their website needs to be impressive. That's further down the conversation, but the first thing is you want to be right there, front and center, top of Google on all the different phrases from the very generic generic hair salon to the more detailed, you know, best salon nearby for blonde balayage.
[00:17:43] Phil Evans: That's, that's a question. Yeah.
[00:17:44] Antony Whitaker: Okay. So it, it comes down to those phrases and you just mentioned how many phrases it was in the hundreds that that particular salon, uh, ranks at number one for. So how do you come up with the phrases? Is that, is that your job or is that my job as the salon owner to go, well, these are the things that people are typing in.
[00:18:06] Antony Whitaker: How do you know what the phrases are? That you want to, you know, dominate, uh, in Google as, as you use that term.
[00:18:14] Phil Evans: it's our job. I mean, for all of our salons, it's our job with the input of the salon. So I might ring the owner at, uh, Monaco in Tampa, Jesus, to say, here's your 200 phrases. And you might go, ah, we've just launched a new kind of beaded extension fixing method, can we include that in the phrases that we're checking?
[00:18:31] Phil Evans: So there's always input from the salon as to the services and the questions and the answers that they're giving clients. So it needs to be unique to each salon. It isn't a preset list of here's a hundred phrases. It will vary depending what products you use, what services you provide, uh, at what city you're in.
[00:18:49] Antony Whitaker: Um, is there one phrase that they all have in common? Is it like, you know, best salon in and then location of town or city? 
[00:18:58] Phil Evans: yeah, the, the, the biggest number often is the most generic hair salon, hairdresser, but it may not be the one that most value. 'cause if somebody's looking, I'm looking for a good salon, I'm a client looking for, the phrase I'm more likely to do is I won't just type in a salon. I'm probably gonna put.
[00:19:15] Phil Evans: Best salon or best salon reviews or before and after balayage pictures, you know, 'cause when clients are ready, I think to make a, an appointment or commit they'll go further than just type in the hair salon. So, although the big number might go an hair salon, I actually, the real value, the clients are in the slightly more complicated phrases like, you know, uh, beaded row extensions.
[00:19:38] Phil Evans: Stylist in Tampa. Don't we go further? We want to really drill down and make sure you're number one on all of those phrases
[00:19:45] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. So, uh, let's move on from Google search and we'll talk about Google profile 'cause you've already mentioned it a couple of times, but I just want to make it clear to people that there. Very different things, and as you've said, 30% of the traffic comes from your Google profile. Now, the first thing I want to ask you and because this was a question that I was confused about, is your Google profile the same as Google My Business?
[00:20:13] Phil Evans: Yes,
[00:20:14] Antony Whitaker: Okay.
[00:20:15] Phil Evans: the confusion comes because Google keep changing the name of it, just like Meta keep changing everything to do with Facebook and Instagram. Google likes to play as well, so. It was Google My Business. It was the Google Map Pack. It was the Google business listings, and now it's the Google profiles.
[00:20:31] Phil Evans: Who knows what it'll be next year? But same thing. Same
[00:20:34] Antony Whitaker: I'm, I'm glad, I'm glad you covered that. 'cause that is a point of confusion for people. They get just overwhelmed by what, what it is that
[00:20:40] Phil Evans: me too, but it's at its basis, it's, it's similar to like Facebook. You, if you're a salon, you may have a Facebook page and you may have an Instagram page or, or an account. Google profile is kind of similar. Google gives each business a profile. Every, every business should have a profile, and it's a, it's, it's an entity, like a Facebook page.
[00:21:00] Phil Evans: It's a thing. You can add pictures to it, you can update it, you can make sure it's in the right position. So a profile is like a bit like a Facebook page. It's a Google listing of your business with key information about where, what times, prices, accessibility, et cetera.
[00:21:16] Antony Whitaker: Right. And do you have to set that up or does it automatically get set up by Google?
[00:21:21] Phil Evans: It is normally automatically set up, but what often happens is it gets misplaced, it gets outta date. It, it's wrong. It could have the wrong name, it could have the wrong phone number. It could even be the wrong place on the map. 'cause these things, just, these things get forgotten about and therefore become wrong.
[00:21:37] Phil Evans: So, and Google can see that if, if it's got a, a profile that seems to not be working well, it just doesn't appear. I. Because you know I said to you that when you type something in, you'll initially get the map and three results. It's the best three results. It's the best profiles that Google will put there.
[00:21:55] Phil Evans: We know that we're getting these Google profiles and then the websites that, how do you force yourself to always be in the top three and ideally be number one? because there's a trick to that. That's what we're going to delve really into. 'cause you want to be number one on the map, number one on the websites.
[00:22:10] Phil Evans: That's the perfect answer.
[00:22:12] Antony Whitaker: Got it. Okay. Um, so when we talk about, I know there's a metric you talk about and it's called profile views. So, what does that mean? Like, obviously you want to get. more profile views. So what does profile views means and and what determines, uh, that?
[00:22:30] Phil Evans: right. So when we first start working on a Google Business profile for Salon, the first metric, we'll often see an improvement in. Is the profile views. 'cause if you are not in those top three results for almost any phrase at all, people aren't seeing your profile. They're searching on the phone for balayage, for salon, for whatever, and you are not coming up.
[00:22:53] Phil Evans: So your profile views, the number of people that see your profile could be really low because it's actually just not visible. But as soon as it starts to improve, and it starts to appear for more phrases in the top three. Your views is the first thing that's gonna really skyrocket. More people are seeing your business on the Google Map results.
[00:23:13] Phil Evans: On the Google profile results.
[00:23:15] Antony Whitaker: Okay. And it's a number. 
[00:23:18] Phil Evans: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So I, we, we send these to every client every month. These are the number of people that saw your profile last month compared to last year, and the difference. So you can see the first positive result of working in your profile. More people will see it. The next measure is how many people click to call.
[00:23:38] Phil Evans: 'cause you can click to call from the profile. So if your calls are going up, this is because your views were going up. People are now clicking to call or asking for directions or visiting your website. So there are three key metrics on the actual profile. Once we've got the profile views up, so it's being seen more, we actually, they're called client interactions.
[00:23:59] Phil Evans: We want real people doing something real, phoning the salon, asking for directions or clicking through to the website. Those are the real, that's the result. That's, it's working. If we can double that every time, then you are getting a lot more business flowing through your Google profile. ,
[00:24:15] Antony Whitaker: Right now, can a salon owner go onto Google and see what their, profile views are? Or is that something that someone techie like you has to do for them?
[00:24:25] Phil Evans: No, everything, nearly everything I'm going to talk about today, a salon owner can do, whether you should, because, doing this really, really well is an investment of time and energy primarily. Um, uh, so most salon owners have got a more important job to do, which is running their business, you know, but the first understanding your profile is a good first step.
[00:24:45] Phil Evans: Search for your name on Google, search for your salon name, and you should see the result come up on the screen with a map and some contact information. if you own that profile, and sometimes this is where it all goes wrong, you'll have somebody have gone and done the profile for you and they've left so you no longer can control it, because the person who had the password to update the profile is no longer in the salon.
[00:25:06] Phil Evans: It happens on social media a lot too, so that's often the first hurdle we'll hit when we talk with new Salon. We can't edit our profile, okay? We have to approach Google. We have to tell them that we've got a problem. Google will send you a postcard. To your business. 'cause it's all about physical locations.
[00:25:22] Phil Evans: It's all about bricks and mortar. So Google will send a postcard with a pin number to your salon. So you can then go to the profile and say, I've got the pin number, I am the owner, I can take this over. So there's a way to get it back. There's a way to take ownership of the profile that you could, you've kind of lost control of.
[00:25:40] Phil Evans: And once you've got it back, you then make sure that it's a hundred percent right. Opening times, accessibility, service list, description, images, et cetera. This is what we do as part of our service.
[00:25:51] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. So, um, I'm gonna join the two, I'm gonna join the dots here. So, you know, consumer in wherever they are, I'm in London, so in London, consumer in London puts into Google search, um, you know, uh, best Balayage salon near me or something similar to that. And that will then. Show them a selection of, uh, a whole lot of salons and humans being humans will look at from the top down.
[00:26:20] Antony Whitaker: And so they'll go number one, number two, number three. And as you've said, you wanna be in those top two or three. You click on one of them. Let's assume you clicked on the top one and that then takes you to the Google profile. Is that correct?
[00:26:35] Phil Evans: yes.
[00:26:36] Antony Whitaker: It does. Right. Okay. And you don't pay anything for that Google profile, do you?
[00:26:39] Phil Evans: the moment there's, there's a lot of conversation with Indian industry because five years ago, Google profiles didn't really exist. You searched on Google and you've got a list of websites and you went there. Google doesn't like that because when you do that, you leave Google. When you click on a website, you've gone, so Google you, you'll see it a lot.
[00:26:57] Phil Evans: Now Google is trying to keep you on Google 'cause you're, they're displaying ads to you, that they're getting you to do other things. So if they can give you, so they created this thing called the Google profile, and they put it above the search results. And then they said, everybody, you've gotta update your profile.
[00:27:12] Phil Evans: You've gotta make it better. The next thing will be you charge a premium. It's definitely coming.
[00:27:17] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. Interesting. So that leads us into something else which, uh, I know you offered to do for people as a, as a free report. I hope I'm okay saying that now on this podcast, uh, and that is this term Google rank, what is meant by the term Google rank.
[00:27:37] Phil Evans: And it, this applies to the profile and your website. The rank is where you are. Are you 1, 2, 3, or 33? For that phrase. 'cause it'll vary. Yeah.
[00:27:48] Antony Whitaker: a Google rank for a phrase, is it not? Right. Okay.
[00:27:51] Phil Evans: you know, best salon tamper hair salon, Tampa balayage prices, Tampa hair extensions, Tampa, you know, halo hair extensions, Tampa they'll all have a different result on Google.
[00:28:03] Phil Evans: you could be number one. You could be number one for all of them. Or you could be, you could be number one, six and 33. So it's tracking the rank against all the important key phrases. I.
[00:28:13] Antony Whitaker: Right. And again, is that something that the salon owner can do themself? can they look at a report or something on Google that will give them that rank?
[00:28:24] Phil Evans: There isn't a Google report, but I mean, we do a free report. So if you go to our website, we actually offer free Google Bank report for anybody that asks for it because for me. Getting a salon is to understand and know their Google rank for all the phrases. It's a really important starting point. So we don't charge for this.
[00:28:43] Phil Evans: We're happy to show salons. How does your salon rank? Where are you on the Google results in your area?
[00:28:50] Antony Whitaker: Okay.
[00:28:50] Phil Evans: 'cause it's really important, it's a foundation for all of what follows.
[00:28:54] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Okay. Um, just another question in terms of when you are putting together that list of questions for how you want to rank on Google, what should you prioritise services or location?
[00:29:09] Phil Evans: Service you when you are, when you are doing your well. And remember there's two things here. There's a profile on your website and we'll, we should probably, 'cause it's a different solution for the two. So let's talk about websites. Your website should just tell a great story. Whether it's about balayage or hair extensions or your salon, because when, when, let's get into the meat of how you get to number one, as opposed to number 33, what makes the difference?
[00:29:33] Phil Evans: This is, this is SEO. Why, why does Google put that salon right at the top of the Google results? Whereas another salon next door could be number 33 and it's about the, the quality of the website. And when I say quality, there are a number of factors to consider. You know, does it load quickly? Does it work well on the mobile phone?
[00:29:53] Phil Evans: But they're almost kind of a given now that your website will be good on a mobile phone and will work and will load quickly. Not always the case, but let's assume that is. Then Google's gonna judge, which is the best website nearby for a question about balayage. It is going to look at the balayage page if you've got one.
[00:30:12] Phil Evans: Most salons won't. They'll have a price list that might mention balayage. Some salons like ours will have a complete page explaining what balayage is before and after pictures, pricing information, frequently asked questions, videos, so really information packed page and Google will see that as that seems to be the website nearby that has the best answers to those questions.
[00:30:37] Antony Whitaker: Right now, let me ask you about that because the SEO was always about putting in lots of keywords. This has evolved, hasn't it, from that, it's not just about, I, I dunno what the right term is, populating a whole lot of keywords for the sake of it.
[00:30:52] Antony Whitaker: It, it's about having a content rich. Sort of website that goes into lots of different areas. And that to me is one of the things that I sort of see with salon owners when you talk about that. I sort of see them, you know, screwing up their face a little bit, that they don't want so much content, they want something that's more, uh, minimalist or whatever.
[00:31:15] Antony Whitaker: Um, and. From what you are saying, they're shooting themself in the foot when they say that, that you need to have a lot of content there so that Google can say, this is the the best one to prioritise. Am I, am I correct with saying that?
[00:31:28] Phil Evans: absolutely. It's a conversation. I was gonna say a battle, but it's not a battle. It's a conversation we have with our clients all the time. Content is king. Content is really, really important. And if you skim back to make it really clean and aesthetically pleasing. Then you are not going to be persuading Google that you've got the answers on balayage or, or even best salon.
[00:31:48] Phil Evans: It's about the depth of content. And if you, if you don't do that right, then you're going to lose out on all the traffic. So, and, and we've done it for so long and for so many people we know this is the result. If we cut back a page, the results drop really quickly. So then we'll often go back to the salon and say, that page that you asked us to reduce in length that's now dropped and you're doing a lot less traffic, which would you prefer?
[00:32:11] Phil Evans: The clients, the traffic, the visitors, or the pretty page with very little information, and most of them always want the clients.
[00:32:18] Antony Whitaker: yeah, of course they do. Okay. Um, now I know, I think I said, uh, earlier on, that you, you've developed over 300 websites all around the English speaking world, so to speak, and you work, uh, very closely with a lot of salon owners with their digital marketing. Let me ask you this question. What is it that determines from your perspective whether someone will be successful or not?
[00:32:41] Antony Whitaker: Because that really plays into what we've just spoken about.
[00:32:45] Phil Evans: Yeah, well, I mean I've been doing this for almost 20 years, so I've really got to understand, I think the, the thinking process when we, when I meet a new client, a new salon, and it comes to us and agrees, I can often see in the early conversations whether they're going to commit, whether they're going to, to go for this with some passion, because that often will define the level of success that we get.
[00:33:09] Phil Evans: 'cause although we can do an awful lot. We can't do it without the input and involvement of the team, the salon team, the owner, possibly other, only two other key people. Because if we, if we can never get images, if we can never get information, if the whole process is too slow and in some ways they're not asking constant questions, what can we do next?
[00:33:30] Phil Evans: It's not gonna work as well. I've got, in fact, my first ever client was in Liverpool and they're still a client now, 18 years on that client. We will do everything, in fact, constantly pesters me. What else, Phil, what else should we be doing? What else can I do? What about TikTok? What about which is good 'cause that, what about ai?
[00:33:47] Phil Evans: They're challenging us. What's next? But they won Best salon website multiple times. Best salon marketing awards. Best online salon. You know, they get something like 17,000 visitors a month and this is a single location salon. So that ambition, that hunger that they have. We'll often define, I think, how well this will flow during the first year and beyond.
[00:34:10] Phil Evans: You've got to be, you've got to commit, you're going to have a website. Make it a good one. Make it work. Know the numbers, really kind of understand how this thing works. 'cause it will be central to your business.
[00:34:22] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Okay. Alright, so I'm sort of joining those dots again. So from Google Search to Google profile, and then they click on that Google, Google profile and then their actual website. Uh, and I know that that's really where you started wasn't, it was Building Salon website. So you've learned an awful lot about what works in a salon website or not, because.
[00:34:43] Antony Whitaker: No matter how good your Google search results are, and no matter how good your Google profile is, I, I've heard you use this expression, which I really like, which is your website should be your hardest working employee. And so the point of what I'm arriving at here is that you've got those first two ducks in a row.
[00:35:01] Antony Whitaker: You know, Google search, Google Profile, then they click through to your website and no matter how much traffic. Is being generated, your website has got to then convert them. So what are the sort of mistakes that you see in websites that mean the conversion rate is really low? 'cause that must frustrate the hell outta you if you've done the first bits and then you're getting them to the website up and not converting.
[00:35:26] Phil Evans: Yeah. Um, websites often and still do to a de a degree. Used to have a lot of stock images from suppliers and I really don't like that anymore. I think you can have a website, tell your story and use your client imagery. You know, although likes Goldwell and Wella produce wonderful imagery. You shouldn't make your website all about those stock images of, of models, make it about the work that you do and your team do, and your clients and the atmosphere and the work, because I think that tells a story and that's the best way to convert.
[00:35:59] Phil Evans: If somebody arrives and just sees Wella images that they've seen on other to other Wella sites, where's the persuasion? Where's the selling? Whereas if it's full of your pictures, that one in Liverpool that I mentioned, if you go and look at that balayage page, it'll be full of balayage images of their work and different kinds of balayage, you know, blonde and brown and root stretch and, and all the variations.
[00:36:20] Phil Evans: That's what a client's looking for. They wanna know, are you good at this? Do you know what you're talking about when it comes to balayage? Can I see some examples? What's the pricing? How do I book? So you make that really easy. You're converting the client that you're selling to them, but you're doing it, you know, quietly on your website by telling a great story about that thing they were looking for.
[00:36:39] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Okay. Uh, now I know that Google also ranks salons or websites rank salons higher. If there's a lot of, um, change if they're active, you know, that there's new stuff being added all the time. Uh, and so to me, that makes me think about a blog. Uh, because a blog's an easy way to be adding new content, whether it's on a weekly or monthly basis or whatever, so that Google the algorithm, uh, knows that this website is active.
[00:37:09] Antony Whitaker: So that's what I want to ask you about the blog component. How important is having the blog component to get that change in there so that Google ranks it higher?
[00:37:18] Phil Evans: Uh, I think it's got all sorts of positives. I think the, the Google seeing new content being added is one big positive. Google can see that this website's being updated, therefore it's going to give you a better Google rank. But also the thing that you are writing about can be a really big positive. You could be writing about.
[00:37:34] Phil Evans: A new colour trend you could be talking about, um, calligraphy cuts. You could be talking about a trend that may not, you may not want it on your main page of your website, but you're talking about something that's, that's rising as a trend, a colour trend or a cutting trend or a service that you are, or a new product.
[00:37:50] Phil Evans: So it's a good way of supplementing information on your website with more information that's actually valuable and will have its own search value. If somebody searches a calligraphy cut within files, miles of your salon and nobody else talks about it. You'll be number one really easily, but possibly over a big area.
[00:38:07] Phil Evans: So choose things to write about that have value for clients coming to you, but also it gets you in the practice of producing content. If you are quarterly thinking about what are we going to write about during the summer, what's our blog going to be? We can talk about some products and new services. 'cause it then almost gives you a structure for your social media posting, for your newsletters to go out via email because you're constantly thinking about what's coming next.
[00:38:32] Phil Evans: Not, not just the next promotion, but the next content. Next story on the website.
[00:38:37] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Okay. Um, that's a perfect sort of segue into talking about. Social media specifically online ads. So, uh, whether we're talking about Facebook ads, uh, Instagram, so meta, uh, or Google and meta ads have a notorious reputation for being a financial black hole for a lot of people. Uh, but now we also have, uh, another phrase I wanna throw in there, which is Google AdWords.
[00:39:06] Antony Whitaker: So what's the difference between Google AdWords? Uh, and meta adverts, and which of the two is better?
[00:39:16] Phil Evans: There's no better 'cause they've got different purposes and different markets and different solutions. Um, they're both bad news if badly controlled. And that's the key to it. And I was talking to a salon yesterday and they were spending 1200 pound a month on Google AdWords. They've got two staff. And I was like, wow, wow.
[00:39:36] Phil Evans: Why are you spending so much money? Well, we were persuaded to do so, and the guy said, we can't stop now. We're doing it. I said, and you're even spending money on an advert for your business name. If somebody types in your business name, you will be number one. So why are you then spending for an advert to be a bit above yourself?
[00:39:54] Phil Evans: So I think it's really important if you're gonna step into online advertising, whether it's meta or it's AdWords, have an understanding of it. Talk first to somebody who understands it because it's the second, third, and fourth thing you need to do. Not the first. The first is sort your website. 'cause that's, that's free traffic.
[00:40:12] Phil Evans: If you're number one on Google profile, your number one Google website, that doesn't cost you anything other than the investment. Advertising is gonna cost you time. Every time somebody clicks it. So spend money later. So the way I, I differentiate between the two, AdWords and meta. Meta is great for really visual, appetizing and really good for something that applies to most people.
[00:40:36] Phil Evans: So a colour offer, a colour offer will apply to most women. And when you do an advert on Meta, you can target just women. You can target just women within a distance of your salon. So you can say, right, I want to target three miles radius of my salon. I want to target all women. You probably split it. So I'm going to target women up to the age of 30 and then 30 plus.
[00:40:57] Phil Evans: 'cause then you can use different images. So you can have [00:41:00] a younger set of images on the adverts for the younger ones and a slightly more mature set of images and different images for the older set. So Meta is great for this, for targeting people in your area that are likely to want to. Find out more, and because it's visual and it's colour that you're selling, it's the perfect, perfect match for me.
[00:41:19] Phil Evans: Using meta to drive traffic to your website when you've got a great promotion and great images, it works. We've done it for 15 years and it's one of the great success stories when it's done well. But go Google AdWords has its role too, because sometimes perhaps you're in London or you're in Tampa and you do hair extensions and your website, that's going to take a long while to really rank well, I.
[00:41:42] Phil Evans: And it's a high value service. So possibly it is worth the investment on targeting people who are searching for hair extensions. 'cause that's a key difference. Meta, you're just putting it out there for anybody to see within your demographic. Women within three mile radius, they're all [00:42:00] going to see that advert.
[00:42:01] Phil Evans: Whereas Google AdWords, it's only going to pop up if somebody searches for the phrase you've targeted. So if I say right, I wanna run an advert in this part of London for anybody searching for hair extensions, my advert pops up. But not for hair colour. 'cause that's not the key phrase for targeting. So AdWords is really good.
[00:42:20] Phil Evans: Google AdWords is really good for higher value services for specific targeting people who are about to buy. So it costs more, so it's more of a, a financial drain if you do it wrong. But doing it right can be a really good way to get new clients, but I think it's horses for courses choose the right one for the promotion you've got for the service you're offering for the target area you're covering.
[00:42:44] Phil Evans: So Gloucester is different to London, so Boston would be different for a very small town in South Carolina. It's a different answer depending where you are and the service you're promoting.
[00:42:54] Antony Whitaker: So does that mean if I've understood that correctly, that you would be better to focus on Google search and investing in that than you would be on Google
[00:43:07] Phil Evans: Totally, totally You shouldn't spend money on advertising online unless you've already done your best with your website and your organic free results, because your website and your profile are two things that does the only. Thing that cost you is the investment time and money and energy getting it right.
[00:43:25] Phil Evans: You're not paying per click. Afterwards that traffic is flowing. Those 17,000 people in West London that went to that salon I mentioned they didn't cost him a penny 'cause he's just got a great website that gave him 17,000 visitors last month, most of which came from Google. So that's an investment that just keeps paying back and paying back.
[00:43:44] Phil Evans: Whereas an advert you pay every day, every click.
[00:43:46] Antony Whitaker: Alright. Um, so two things before we start to wrap up. First one is Google reviews, which, um, are also something that, I don't know how long they've been in existence, but they've certainly, you know, become a very sort of dominant feature, uh, these days. Uh, so how important are Google reviews when it comes to generating, uh, more traffic and, and what's the best way to get more of them?
[00:44:10] Phil Evans: Um, best way to get more awesome is ask, ask your clients for a review. Yeah. In different ways. You could either a QR code at reception, you could ask, make sure that your team are asking, so when the stylist is coming towards the end of finishing the work, they're asking for that review personally. So make, you know, ask for the review.
[00:44:28] Phil Evans: Send an email out, send a reminder, uh, after the visit, you know, we'd love some feedback. Give us a review. So ask for the review. Most salons don't do that often enough. So to get a constant, 'cause it wants to be a constant flow. Google doesn't like to see a thousand review all arrive at once 'cause it thinks that's, that's bad.
[00:44:45] Phil Evans: SEO, that's people trying to cheat the system. So what you want to do is a constant flow. Everything you do has a request for a Google review in it. And they are enormously important 'cause a Google review goes on your profile. So your Google Business listing, your profile that we talked about is the, the first thing that comes up that is highly influenced by reviews.
[00:45:05] Phil Evans: It's not the only thing. There's a lot of other things go into your Google profile to give you the number one spot, but reviews is a very important part of that. But your Google reviews can also be on your website. You can embed them on your website, and Google sees that interaction. It knows what profile works with what website.
[00:45:22] Phil Evans: So making one stronger actually makes the other stronger too. So Google reviews are very positive for every salon.
[00:45:30] Antony Whitaker: Are they all kept on your profile? Like you can click on a link to see more and they'll just keep loading and keep loading,
[00:45:36] Phil Evans: Yeah. So if we manage a salon's Google profile, some, some salons ask us to respond to all the reviews. Other salons, they'll do it, but we chase them. If we can see, especially if it's a bad review. Don't ignore a bad review. Because it will cause you untold damage. Respond, respond in a less polite and civil way, and a prompt way
[00:45:54] Phil Evans: Be on top of your reviews. Get more coming in and manage them. Say thank you, you know, 'cause that all helps make it work better. It makes the reviews more, more live as far as Google.
[00:46:05] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. And so the Google algorithm understands that if you've got a lot of reviews that are positive, then it's more likely to, um, push you up in terms of the Google search results.
[00:46:21] Phil Evans: and it's clever enough. It's clever enough now Google to be reading those reviews. It's a robot, but it reads them, right? I've got a nice flow of constant five star reviews, and a lot of them are talking about hair extensions. A lot of them are talking about balayage. It looks at the wording, the. Actual text of the reviews.
[00:46:36] Phil Evans: So all of those things are building on the the keywords, but in a natural way. If you had a great salon, great extensions, and you asked every client for reviews, you'd get a lot of good reviews that talked about hair extensions. So Google's looking for almost natural growth in your profile, in your website, good things happening, and it'll put you at the top, which encourage even more good things to happen.
[00:46:57] Phil Evans: So once you dominate Google, you can get a lot more reviews 'cause you're getting a lot more clients.
[00:47:03] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Okay. Um, in line with Google reviews, uh, and this is, this is a little bit more American centric, is that Yelp, uh, was huge in the United States, was never that big. Outside the United States is my observation of it. Um, how does Yelp play into this? Because Google reviews seems to have dominated the review side of things at the moment, but Yelp's obviously still alive and kicking.
[00:47:30] Antony Whitaker: Uh, what, what sort of influence does that have on all of this? Or doesn't it have any?
[00:47:35] Phil Evans: I a, a much smaller influence. I think if you like the Google search, Google is 90% of search. I think in terms of reviews, Facebook's reviews are quite important too. 'cause it's, and it's still, you know, a very well used platform. But I think Google Reviews is where the real wait is. If you're gonna put things in order, don't worry about the thing.
[00:47:52] Phil Evans: That's number six in the list. Tackle number one first. 'cause often number one and two are 80% of the problem. So I'd sort out your Google reviews, possibly your Facebook reviews, the others you can worry about later.
[00:48:03] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. Um, so last thing I wanna talk about is analytics. Um, which, you know, hairdressers are sort of notorious for not really looking at their analytics. That's that much. As long as the website looks pretty, then that's, it's, uh, it's doing its job, uh, which we both know is wrong. So what are the website analytics that a salon owner should know and, uh, should track?
[00:48:29] Phil Evans: I am going to do profile and website 'cause there's two, two. So your Google profile analytics, you want to know how many times your profile's been seen and is it increasing, and how many of those client interactions phone call. Directions, clicks to the website. Those are your numbers. Is my profile being seen and are I getting more interactions?
[00:48:49] Phil Evans: We send a report to all of our Google profile clients that we manage their profiles. Every month we send them a report right at the beginning. This is last month. And right at the top we put some great big green numbers. This is your success last month, how much it was up, how many extra interactions you've got.
[00:49:06] Phil Evans: 'cause I think that's it. You don't wanna worry about hundreds of numbers. You want, what's the most important thing? How many client interactions did I get? Was it up? 'cause then, then, you know, you're getting more clients thrown through the door. So that's your Google profile, your, your website. It's your rank.
[00:49:21] Phil Evans: So for all those phrases, know what your rank is. 'cause that you are aiming to improve that over six months, 12 months, two years, 10 years. You want to end up dominating Google for most of these phrases. So you need to track the progress, but that rank produces traffic. Know your traffic number, that's, that's the most important.
[00:49:41] Phil Evans: Analytics when you're running a website. How busy is your website? How many people were on your website last month? You know what the fact, I could tell you that West London Southern had 17,000 visits. Great. But I can also tell you where they came from, the division between Google search, Google profile, that again, is the next step.
[00:49:58] Phil Evans: So you are, once you kind of get to grips with the first number, how busy is your website? Then ask the second question, where are they coming from? And then that's the third question. How does that compare to last year? Once you get into this pattern of knowing your numbers and and enjoying them, you'll be doing a lot more of this in two years time.
[00:50:16] Antony Whitaker: Yeah, definitely. Okay. Well listen, we need to, uh, start wrapping up, um, whereabouts can people connect with you on Instagram or other social media channels or your website? And you also mentioned that you had an offer to give people a, a free Google rank report if they want. That or want to connect with you on social, just tell us whereabouts you wanna send them.
[00:50:38] Phil Evans: All right. The best place to go and learn about us, uh, is our website 'cause that tells the whole story. www.salonguru.net. So go there. All of our clients are there. There's a map of every single salon interactive, so you can look at where's near you. Um, there's, in the top right corner, there's a button that says free rank report.
[00:50:58] Phil Evans: It'll ask you where you are, your email, your salon name, et cetera, and we will produce a free Google Rank report and send it to you for your salon in your town There's no commitment. We just do it. You know, I'll email you after and say, would you like a phone call? Would you like me to explain more? If you don't do that, if you don't follow up, fine.
[00:51:13] Phil Evans: But do that. And then if nothing else, come back in a year and do the same again to see if you've made those improvements. I'm hoping you might be working with us, but if you're gonna tackle this yourself, make that rank report part of your, how do I measure if this is gonna work in the rank report?
[00:51:30] Antony Whitaker: Okay, well, I'll put those links, uh, on our website, growmysalonbusiness.com, and in the show notes for today's podcast.
[00:51:38] Antony Whitaker: So if you are listening to this podcast with Phil and have enjoyed it, do me a favour and share it with people that you know who would also enjoy it. And don't forget to subscribe and leave us a rating and review on the Apple Podcast app. So Phil Evans, thank you for being a guest on today's episode of the Grow My Salon Business podcast.
[00:51:58] Phil Evans: Thank you. I'm sure we'll talk again soon.
[00:52:01] Antony Whitaker: I'll look forward to it. 
[00:52:02] Antony Whitaker: okay, well I hope you got a lot out of this week's episode. And don't forget, we are soon to be launching our online marketing course where we're going to cover everything that we've gone over today in a lot more detail. So if marketing and growing your business is important to you, then head on over to www.growmysalonbusiness.com/course/marketing
[00:52:21] Antony Whitaker: and put your name on the wait list so that you get priority notification. And I'll also put that link in the show notes of today's episode. So until next week, that's me. Bye for now.