1 00:00:00,086 --> 00:00:08,053 All right, we're live. Kuba, how are you sir? Doing great today. We just got finished recording 2 00:00:08,093 --> 00:00:12,517 another, an episode of a different podcast and now into another podcast, the A for Batching, 3 00:00:12,577 --> 00:00:18,242 right? Here we go, Agency Breakthrough. So welcome aboard. You're listening in a little conversation 4 00:00:18,282 --> 00:00:23,627 Kuba and I are having. This is very much not rehearsed as you can probably tell already. 5 00:00:24,247 --> 00:00:28,630 Kuba, let's give the backstory maybe like what is Agency Breakthrough? So Agency Breakthrough 6 00:00:28,650 --> 00:00:36,213 is a new podcast we're starting in cooperation with ClickUp. And me and Gray here will be 7 00:00:36,253 --> 00:00:42,656 hosting. Hi, I'm Jakub, I'm Kuba Krajcer, head of marketing at ZenPilot. And this is Gray, 8 00:00:42,897 --> 00:00:49,039 co-founder at ZenPilot. Gray, say hi. That's me. Okay, so what we're trying to do here is 9 00:00:49,099 --> 00:00:54,334 to start a new podcast for agencies, because that's never been done before. And... try and 10 00:00:54,394 --> 00:01:01,018 tell the stories of the breakthroughs that agencies have had and to help our listeners learn from 11 00:01:01,038 --> 00:01:05,260 that and to kind of, okay, I've got like a whole thing written out about this, can I just read 12 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:12,364 the official show intro? Can you do it and I'll give you your sarcastic undertones, okay? Okay, 13 00:01:12,424 --> 00:01:20,348 so, welcome to Agency Breakthrough where we bring you real gritty stories of agency operators 14 00:01:20,388 --> 00:01:26,368 who found the path to get past the plateau. Green use or plateau? Oh yeah, thank you. And 15 00:01:26,388 --> 00:01:31,431 the alliteration, have you noticed? Yeah. Ask, get past the plateau. Love it. Yeah, I love 16 00:01:31,511 --> 00:01:37,776 it. I love it because I wrote it. Whether it's hitting on a playbook for massive growth, scaling 17 00:01:37,816 --> 00:01:44,020 profit margins or finding a way to have an agency and a life, we're here to share how they achieved 18 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:49,644 it and laugh a little along the way. I love how we kind of signal that this is going to 19 00:01:49,684 --> 00:01:58,337 be funny. Please laugh. Please, please. We beg you. We'll make it put the loud track in. Yeah. 20 00:01:58,357 --> 00:02:03,500 Presented by Zenpilot and ClickUp and your hosts today are Jakub Graizard and Gray McKenzie 21 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:08,243 and just because I mean I put myself first and you second, Gray. Excellent. Well, well written. 22 00:02:09,304 --> 00:02:13,906 I'm super excited for this. I mean, this all kind of stems from a conversation that Gaurav 23 00:02:14,006 --> 00:02:20,474 Agarwal who leads growth at ClickUp and I had we were together in San Diego. at the beginning 24 00:02:20,494 --> 00:02:24,856 of February and just talking about, hey, here's what we're doing in terms of marketing, here's 25 00:02:24,916 --> 00:02:28,417 where you guys are going and how do we, you know, one of, so ClickUp's got, do you know 26 00:02:28,437 --> 00:02:33,019 about the Core 4 at ClickUp? The Core 4? No, you should enlighten me about that. So they've 27 00:02:33,039 --> 00:02:38,261 got these Core 4 market segments, who they, who kind of their biggest segments of customers 28 00:02:38,422 --> 00:02:44,764 are and where their focus goes. And so, the agencies are one of the largest ones. If you 29 00:02:44,924 --> 00:02:49,934 just looked at logos, number of unique companies. Probably the largest. I actually don't know 30 00:02:49,954 --> 00:02:54,096 if that's true today. Let's say that it's true. We'll just make it up. It's only presented 31 00:02:54,136 --> 00:02:57,558 by ClickUp as well. So their endorsement is on this. I don't know if that's true. I would 32 00:02:57,578 --> 00:03:03,261 assume by head count that's not accurate or that it would not be the largest just because 33 00:03:03,581 --> 00:03:10,044 most agencies are, you know, in SMB space. So it's not the big enterprise clients where they've 34 00:03:10,064 --> 00:03:15,442 had a ton of growth here. But anyways, we were comparing notes. And we're like, hey, we should 35 00:03:15,462 --> 00:03:19,685 produce some content together and we should do, like we're trying to target the agencies 36 00:03:20,205 --> 00:03:27,229 who are focused on streamlining their ops and have a heavy interest in ClickUp as a go-to 37 00:03:27,269 --> 00:03:33,372 platform from a technology perspective. And they want more thought leadership so they pick 38 00:03:33,392 --> 00:03:39,195 the wrong people but basically folks who have an inside scoop into agencies which is the 39 00:03:39,215 --> 00:03:43,457 world that we've swum in, the world, the sea that we've swum in, the world that we've lived 40 00:03:43,517 --> 00:03:51,033 in. for the last 12 years or whatever. And so anyways, that led to that was the initial spark 41 00:03:51,514 --> 00:03:55,320 and you kind of took it and carried the ball from there. What was this experience like getting 42 00:03:55,340 --> 00:04:00,494 to the point where we're actually hitting record and we're in the first show? Well, I remember 43 00:04:00,534 --> 00:04:05,779 the key point being actually coming from you. Because, well, we got in touch with ClickUp, 44 00:04:05,799 --> 00:04:10,303 right? We thought about what this is going to be and who we want to reach. And we want to 45 00:04:10,523 --> 00:04:15,047 reach kind of an agency audience here. What we like to call agency operators. I don't know, 46 00:04:15,107 --> 00:04:20,031 at some point, we should have a good piece of content to point you to about defining this 47 00:04:20,131 --> 00:04:26,877 agency operator persona, building towards that. For me, the key moment was when we actually 48 00:04:28,334 --> 00:04:33,038 is going to make this podcast different. And that's the idea of this breakthrough that we're 49 00:04:33,058 --> 00:04:37,321 going to focus on. So it was a lot of back and forth, a lot of brainstorming between the two 50 00:04:37,361 --> 00:04:41,785 of us, and then a lot of feedback about this intro section that you just heard, which I 51 00:04:41,805 --> 00:04:46,849 think is like the sixth draft of this or something. So I thought, I'm trying to think of who might 52 00:04:46,869 --> 00:04:51,794 be listening to this, and how far do we go into definitions. But do you think, Ray, before 53 00:04:51,814 --> 00:04:56,237 we talk about why this is called agency breakthrough and why the breakthrough is, shall we define? 54 00:04:56,866 --> 00:05:02,890 ClickUp, Define, ZenPilot, just you know, the bare basics here so people aren't lost. Yeah. 55 00:05:03,090 --> 00:05:09,835 Why not? So, I'll take ClickUp and you can tell. I'll play ClickUp, you play ZenPilot. Hi. Okay. 56 00:05:09,875 --> 00:05:15,939 My name is ClickUp. I'm an incredible project management software. I've grown just with supreme 57 00:05:16,079 --> 00:05:23,765 velocity over the last five plus years. This is going like seriously. So, I got to know 58 00:05:23,945 --> 00:05:30,764 Zeb. Chris Cunningham, the early team at ClickUp way back like end of 2017, early 2018. And 59 00:05:30,784 --> 00:05:36,287 this is coming out of four guys moving out to a house in Palo Alto together and working together. 60 00:05:37,227 --> 00:05:43,610 And then to go from that to a thousand people and raising all this money and growing just 61 00:05:43,630 --> 00:05:49,953 incredibly fast has been unbelievable to have kind of a, you know, a court side seat to watch 62 00:05:50,073 --> 00:05:55,023 their growth. But ClickUp is... the fastest growing project management platform, they've 63 00:05:55,163 --> 00:06:00,507 probably expanded that. I should go look what's on their homepage right now. Sorry, my homepage, 64 00:06:00,547 --> 00:06:04,330 I forgot I'm ClickUp. Still says one after a bit small, all your work in place. So, there's 65 00:06:04,370 --> 00:06:08,452 all these different names that everyone's coming up with, you know, is it work management, is 66 00:06:08,573 --> 00:06:12,215 it productivity software, is it project management? We don't want to just get bundled down out 67 00:06:12,235 --> 00:06:17,299 of the project management space. And so, ClickUp's built out this incredible product obviously 68 00:06:17,519 --> 00:06:24,047 that's got tooling around all the common project management stuff. tasks and docs and dashboards 69 00:06:24,127 --> 00:06:29,030 but then around kind of the whiteboards and that's been a huge area of investment. We'll 70 00:06:29,070 --> 00:06:33,052 talk about and I think the cool thing about us getting to this from the outside, even though 71 00:06:33,092 --> 00:06:36,734 we're producing this with ClickUp is we can kind of be, you know, hey, critical of hey, 72 00:06:36,754 --> 00:06:41,316 here's the parts that still need to be improved and need the most attention inside ClickUp 73 00:06:41,357 --> 00:06:45,459 and here's the stuff that we're most excited about on the platform. We're kind of able to 74 00:06:45,919 --> 00:06:48,821 call out your school things that other tools have done so we'll talk about some of those 75 00:06:49,241 --> 00:06:54,644 later on. But that's That's ClickUp in a nutshell. What is ZenPilot? OK, so I mean, first of all, 76 00:06:54,664 --> 00:07:00,868 to put you all at ease, the podcast here is not going to be about ClickUp. Just we're working 77 00:07:00,908 --> 00:07:06,311 hand in hand to produce it. And I'm happy to share my own story of how it happened upon 78 00:07:06,331 --> 00:07:11,273 ClickUp maybe later on or in a different episode. What is ZenPilot? Hello, I am ZenPilot. And 79 00:07:11,334 --> 00:07:17,537 I saw and previously I wanted to create my own project management software called DoInbound. 80 00:07:17,657 --> 00:07:23,453 And then. I realized that what agencies have a problem with primarily is not the tool itself, 81 00:07:23,594 --> 00:07:29,378 but the process and the people that are using the tool. So in order to kind of make that 82 00:07:29,418 --> 00:07:36,544 work, I, ZenPilot, decided on the best project management tool for agencies and at the time 83 00:07:36,644 --> 00:07:41,448 decided that is ClickUp and just decided to be the best team when it comes to implementing 84 00:07:41,488 --> 00:07:46,232 ClickUp for agencies and helping them get the most out of this tool and make it do things 85 00:07:46,252 --> 00:07:55,528 that you wouldn't have thought. possible with ClickUp. Why thank you. And I have helped over 86 00:07:55,728 --> 00:08:02,149 2,700 agencies and counting to just streamline their operations in ClickUp and get more visibility, 87 00:08:02,290 --> 00:08:08,171 more productivity, more done faster, and all that good stuff. How did I do? That's amazing. 88 00:08:09,091 --> 00:08:13,093 First of all, I love that you take advantage of me so well. And 89 00:08:16,093 --> 00:08:21,231 great job. Or we're gonna go. Okay, we're dropping the personas. This is getting too confusing. 90 00:08:21,491 --> 00:08:28,273 That's right. All right, Kuba. Okay. Why agency breakthrough? Wow, you're asking me? Well, 91 00:08:28,353 --> 00:08:34,314 okay. So, here's how I am interpreting it. And kind of from what you imparted on me from this 92 00:08:34,454 --> 00:08:39,476 idea, which I want to point to you as the person that first said the words agency breakthrough, 93 00:08:39,556 --> 00:08:44,737 you know, all responsibility rests on you here. Why agency breakthrough? Because sometimes 94 00:08:44,857 --> 00:08:49,907 what you need is that breakthrough moment that changes everything. The moment when you change 95 00:08:49,987 --> 00:08:54,228 one thing and it changes everything is the way I'm trying to phrase it consistently and failing. 96 00:08:55,248 --> 00:09:01,350 So what I mean here is the moment when you find the lever that you can pull that just gives 97 00:09:01,370 --> 00:09:08,532 you outsized results or just the one framework or the one mindset or whatever change, you 98 00:09:08,552 --> 00:09:12,033 know, sometimes it might be higher. Sometimes it might be kind of refocused to saying, going 99 00:09:12,073 --> 00:09:17,484 broader, going narrower. The thing that you do that just changes your agency for the better, 100 00:09:17,584 --> 00:09:23,589 for good, and in a huge way. We want to tell those stories to inspire you, dear listeners, 101 00:09:23,930 --> 00:09:27,613 to find your own breakthrough moment and your breakthrough moment is not going to be the 102 00:09:27,673 --> 00:09:33,077 same as our guests probably. It's not about, oh, they focus on PPC, so we should focus on 103 00:09:33,117 --> 00:09:38,462 PPC or whichever, you know. But just to share kind of the thinking behind what made this 104 00:09:38,502 --> 00:09:42,645 breakthrough possible so that you can have this thinking too. And you can also be on the lookout 105 00:09:42,725 --> 00:09:47,159 for... the levers that you can pull and you know, what you can take advantage of in your 106 00:09:47,239 --> 00:09:51,941 unique situation to have your breakthrough as well. So, we're telling these stories so you 107 00:09:51,961 --> 00:09:56,643 can have your breakthrough. Does that sound about accurate? That's right. So, one of my 108 00:09:56,683 --> 00:10:01,306 breakthrough moments personally is our family started doing this thing where we do special 109 00:10:01,346 --> 00:10:07,328 time is what we call it and it's one-on-one time, my wife or I, one of us will take one 110 00:10:07,348 --> 00:10:11,943 of the four kids and we'll go on a quick date. and every Thursday morning. So, we rotate through, 111 00:10:11,963 --> 00:10:17,808 we have four kids. So, every eight weeks each kid gets to go with my wife and with me one 112 00:10:17,828 --> 00:10:23,212 time. So, my daughter Laurel and I went to the library because she is an avid reader. She's 113 00:10:23,252 --> 00:10:29,076 eight years old and we were sitting in the library. She was reading a series of books. She was 114 00:10:29,116 --> 00:10:32,859 on the third and the fourth books and I was doodling on my sketch pad and I wrote down 115 00:10:33,020 --> 00:10:38,795 agency breakthrough and that's where The idea kind of started as hey, there's all these agency 116 00:10:38,835 --> 00:10:41,998 podcasts. If you want to know a podcast, if you want to listen to a podcast about agency 117 00:10:42,018 --> 00:10:47,242 growth or how to market or how to hire or how to do ops or whatever else or you want to hear 118 00:10:47,722 --> 00:10:52,686 yet another the you know, a thousandth agency owner interview just kind of talking about 119 00:10:52,706 --> 00:10:57,009 the general story and I went to college and then I accidentally started an agency and then 120 00:10:57,029 --> 00:11:00,171 this happened and that happened and now here I am 20 years later and I've got a 50 person 121 00:11:00,191 --> 00:11:06,119 team. That stuff's all out there. There's plenty of that. What I want here is I want kind of 122 00:11:06,159 --> 00:11:12,162 the sweetened condensed version of hey, here's a meaty problem that I was stuck on and we 123 00:11:12,322 --> 00:11:17,544 were bumping our heads and we were scraping our elbows against them while trying to solve 124 00:11:17,564 --> 00:11:21,286 this and eventually we found something that worked really well and I want you to be able 125 00:11:21,306 --> 00:11:26,889 to take that as motivation and inspiration and I also want it to be practical application 126 00:11:27,249 --> 00:11:32,315 of how do I learn from that and some of these are going to be extremely applicable to your 127 00:11:32,355 --> 00:11:37,696 situation. You're gonna say, yes, I should do what Dean and Ryan Atworth did or I should 128 00:11:37,716 --> 00:11:43,358 do what Marcus at Impact did or I should do what Michael and Nicole at Bojo Media Labs 129 00:11:43,378 --> 00:11:49,120 did or whatever those examples are, you know, I can go do that thing. And then part of this 130 00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:56,746 is just, hey, it's just fun to hear other people's stories. The good is exciting. The bad is what 131 00:11:56,786 --> 00:12:00,428 gives it all the context and it's the fun and the ability to kind of, hey, we're all wallowing 132 00:12:00,448 --> 00:12:06,872 through this together and in it together. So, I'm super excited to be hosting this with you, 133 00:12:06,912 --> 00:12:12,015 Kuba, and running it together. Can we talk about the three pieces, like three core pieces of 134 00:12:12,695 --> 00:12:16,998 the show structure real quickly? Yeah, yeah. You're kind of leading to that, right? So, 135 00:12:17,238 --> 00:12:21,600 the breakthrough kind of the storytelling segment, let's say that's gonna be the middle of it 136 00:12:22,381 --> 00:12:28,209 and- for you to be able to contextualize the story, the first segment is gonna be, I mean, 137 00:12:28,229 --> 00:12:32,432 we're experimenting with various approaches here. Maybe we'll talk a little bit first between 138 00:12:32,452 --> 00:12:37,215 the two of us before we bring the guest on. But once the guest is on, we'll first ask about 139 00:12:37,335 --> 00:12:41,118 kind of the context, you know, what is the scale of the agency? What are the numbers that they're 140 00:12:41,138 --> 00:12:45,321 willing to share just so you understand whether you're listening to an agency of 50 or 500 141 00:12:45,761 --> 00:12:50,285 or over many million in revenue so you can kind of contextualize this in your head. So that's 142 00:12:50,645 --> 00:12:56,798 act one. what is the scale of this agency and kind of numbers based and just, you know, giving 143 00:12:56,818 --> 00:13:02,182 an idea of the scale. Act two, what Gray just discussed, the breakthrough story and you know, 144 00:13:02,202 --> 00:13:06,846 just in a simple chronological way. What was like before? What was the breakthrough? What 145 00:13:06,866 --> 00:13:13,031 is life now, you know, after the breakthrough? And also, trying to help you replicate this 146 00:13:13,191 --> 00:13:18,235 or replicate the thinking that led to it, how might somebody else have this breakthrough 147 00:13:18,275 --> 00:13:22,883 as well and what are the pitfalls kind of along the way? things had happened a different way, 148 00:13:23,163 --> 00:13:27,386 this breakthrough never would have happened. So, that's kind of the whole second segment. 149 00:13:27,846 --> 00:13:33,330 And I find it funny that we're discussing this today because also, I mean, one of the parts 150 00:13:33,350 --> 00:13:37,093 of our thinking behind this show is that we want to iterate an experiment. So, I wonder 151 00:13:37,113 --> 00:13:40,595 if we're going to be kind of laughing at this you know, in a few months time that we thought 152 00:13:40,635 --> 00:13:45,979 the show was going to be like this but totally not. But still, the concept is first context, 153 00:13:46,239 --> 00:13:54,405 second breakthrough, third what? We're calling the crisp cornucopia. So just a lot of rapid 154 00:13:54,425 --> 00:13:58,889 fire recommendations, you know, I mean, you must have always experienced this and we want 155 00:13:58,929 --> 00:14:05,715 to help you as well to find new tools, new sources, new people to follow because everybody has, 156 00:14:05,755 --> 00:14:10,138 you know, that secret tool or secret weapon that, you know, they never shared about but 157 00:14:10,198 --> 00:14:14,242 actually, you know, there's this agency that we use for 70% of our content, you know, and 158 00:14:14,262 --> 00:14:19,134 they never shared about it. So we want to uncover that as well to help you find the right. people 159 00:14:19,174 --> 00:14:24,297 to work with, the right tools to work with and that's gonna be kind of the last part of the 160 00:14:24,317 --> 00:14:28,839 show. At the end, maybe some shout outs, maybe some thoughts about who could be the next guest 161 00:14:29,420 --> 00:14:35,783 and you know, interview all of the agencies that way. Right. I think our job is really 162 00:14:35,803 --> 00:14:40,486 to ask the tough questions that people want to know like those second and third and fourth 163 00:14:40,566 --> 00:14:45,809 order questions, you know, really where the magic comes from. Okay, it's great that you 164 00:14:46,149 --> 00:14:50,166 wrote a book. and all of a sudden this stuff pops up. Like how accessible is that to the... 165 00:14:50,206 --> 00:14:55,548 Basically, all the reasons as we're like, and this will be easy for me because I'm in that 166 00:14:55,568 --> 00:15:03,130 situation, hey, I'm running and owning a professional services firm that's this kind of in the typical 167 00:15:03,190 --> 00:15:09,092 size and has aggressive growth goals. But what are all the reasons that we instantly think 168 00:15:09,232 --> 00:15:15,113 this couldn't work for me? Or there's something special about you or your situation or why 169 00:15:15,133 --> 00:15:21,979 you're just so lucky? and kind of throw that at guests and figure out okay, like you know, 170 00:15:22,219 --> 00:15:26,361 how can we help people really see that as something that is practical for them and it's not it 171 00:15:26,381 --> 00:15:32,622 won't be practical for everyone but dig into that. Yeah. I would be happy if you know, we 172 00:15:32,762 --> 00:15:38,784 asked enough questions where our guests to some of them would honestly reply that part was 173 00:15:38,824 --> 00:15:42,445 just luck you know, and that's why you can't replicate every breakthrough exactly you know. 174 00:15:42,942 --> 00:15:48,524 this I prepared for, you know, that other obstacle I kind of surmounted but this other thing if 175 00:15:48,544 --> 00:15:52,465 it had happened, the breakthrough wouldn't have happened and I got lucky. I think, you know, 176 00:15:52,505 --> 00:15:58,308 we have to be honest about these stories too. That's a great framework because I just think 177 00:15:58,348 --> 00:16:02,750 of a couple example breakthroughs. We'll probably have I mentioned Worth earlier, Worth e-commerce. 178 00:16:03,690 --> 00:16:09,512 We'll probably have Dean Dutro and Dean and Ryan will grab one of them at some point and 179 00:16:10,133 --> 00:16:17,166 bring them on the podcast. built an email marketing agency together, email marketing is no longer 180 00:16:17,186 --> 00:16:22,330 the cool way to say it, now you gotta call it retention marketing agency. So, email and SMS 181 00:16:22,370 --> 00:16:26,974 and then whatever else that expands to. The names all change to this stuff about every 182 00:16:27,314 --> 00:16:32,338 18 months or so. So, you gotta make sure that you're on the cutting edge of that. But their 183 00:16:32,519 --> 00:16:37,758 big breakthrough was building the growth side. of the business. So, originally, a ton of the 184 00:16:37,798 --> 00:16:41,600 work came from Upwork and they built a really cool mechanism for taking Upwork clients. I've 185 00:16:41,620 --> 00:16:47,402 seen very few agencies do this but take Upwork clients through a small, very clearly scoped 186 00:16:47,462 --> 00:16:51,884 project and then convert them into a monthly retainer. And typically, Upwork fails because 187 00:16:51,904 --> 00:16:58,127 you've got extremely budget, people are there to find a discount from 90% of Upwork customers 188 00:16:58,747 --> 00:17:03,669 and it's really hard to turn them from being for the I'm here competing on cost to okay, 189 00:17:03,689 --> 00:17:07,084 now I'm... interested in quality and I want to work with you long term at a really profitable 190 00:17:07,124 --> 00:17:13,489 rate for an agency. But they had a model for doing that, layered in outbound and wound up 191 00:17:13,829 --> 00:17:19,834 exiting and selling their agency just a couple years later at over a 7x multiple on EBITDA 192 00:17:19,894 --> 00:17:27,661 which is unusual as well for kind of the early stage agencies. I love the beginning of their 193 00:17:27,701 --> 00:17:33,405 breakthrough because the piece that is harder to replicate is they were one of the first 194 00:17:34,230 --> 00:17:39,895 ones to really gain traction and grow pretty big and so their exit was at a point where 195 00:17:39,915 --> 00:17:43,438 the market was heating up and I'd be curious to hear, you know, hey, if someone else builds 196 00:17:43,478 --> 00:17:49,243 the exact same looking business today, do they get some kind of multiple on an exit and an 197 00:17:49,323 --> 00:17:54,528 exit too that in their case they sold the smart bud but does someone else, are those opportunities 198 00:17:54,668 --> 00:17:59,498 the same? Are they better? Are they not? I don't know. Yeah, when you boil it down, all of these 199 00:17:59,538 --> 00:18:03,700 moves that you're making, they're an investment and to get a return on an investment, you have 200 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:07,722 to time the market correctly, right? So, I do wonder what the guests are gonna say about 201 00:18:07,762 --> 00:18:12,824 that as well. Which, so we've already got kind of the first batch and we'll probably batch 202 00:18:13,084 --> 00:18:18,967 release the first set of episodes. Got our first handful of guests booked. Who are you most 203 00:18:19,007 --> 00:18:23,849 excited about? Are the most excited about Marcus? Share it then. I'm gonna clip this and send 204 00:18:23,869 --> 00:18:29,484 this to everyone else by the way who don't know. Sorry, Gustav, can you say it again? I am the 205 00:18:29,524 --> 00:18:36,509 most excited about Marcus Sheridan of They Ask You Answer fame and from Impact. I don't know 206 00:18:36,529 --> 00:18:42,933 what to say here. I mean, Marcus's book influenced me when I was a young marketer. I mean, still 207 00:18:43,013 --> 00:18:48,697 am by a lot of metrics, right? But you know, at the beginning of my marketing journey, I 208 00:18:48,737 --> 00:18:54,361 followed that book like gospel and like having an opportunity to interview him on the show 209 00:18:54,401 --> 00:18:59,683 is just such a treat. I love it how you didn't even give me a chance to be cool with Marcus 210 00:18:59,743 --> 00:19:03,445 but you already introduced me via email as the resident fanboy but it's like I would have 211 00:19:03,465 --> 00:19:08,627 gone that route anyway. I couldn't sleep when I got the email where he said yes so, yes. 212 00:19:08,787 --> 00:19:13,389 So we're interviewing Marcus and that's the person that I'm definitely most excited about 213 00:19:13,429 --> 00:19:17,431 and he's like also like a consummate public speaker, you know. I'm so passionate about 214 00:19:17,471 --> 00:19:22,333 public speaking. I did Toastmasters for a time and I just love to get on stage so just having 215 00:19:22,413 --> 00:19:27,095 a chance to interact with somebody who is like... so much further on this path and doing keynotes 216 00:19:27,115 --> 00:19:32,537 and all these workshops, everything. Just love everything about that and I can't wait to record 217 00:19:32,557 --> 00:19:37,799 that. Adam I had lunch two weeks ago, this rarely happens to me because we're all remote and 218 00:19:37,839 --> 00:19:45,442 we serve agencies all over the world. But I had lunch with a client two weeks ago and so, 219 00:19:45,482 --> 00:19:49,804 we're talking about kind of the whole business. We spent some time on ops and you know, what 220 00:19:49,844 --> 00:19:54,206 we're doing on top of ClickUp which is super exciting for them. And then we were talking 221 00:19:54,226 --> 00:19:58,468 about marketing and how they were growing and it's mostly referral based but we're really 222 00:19:58,528 --> 00:20:04,670 leaning into content marketing and I specifically really like this book called They Ask You To 223 00:20:04,710 --> 00:20:12,013 Answer by this guy named Marcus and I was like, oh, tell me more. And so, I didn't want to, 224 00:20:12,273 --> 00:20:16,075 you know, you just kill the conversation if you're like, you mean my friend Marcus? And 225 00:20:16,115 --> 00:20:20,257 it was so cool to hear that in the wild, like here's someone else, we've never talked about 226 00:20:20,277 --> 00:20:25,187 this stuff before, I've never made a recommendation. and is reading that. So, I'm super excited 227 00:20:25,207 --> 00:20:31,092 to have Marcus and dig into his breakthrough moment as well. Maybe what we could do is we 228 00:20:31,112 --> 00:20:35,196 could just spend a couple minutes like one of the things that I like throwing at people, 229 00:20:35,216 --> 00:20:40,440 you said Chris Cornucopia and I was laughing but it's like, what are some of the recommendations 230 00:20:40,460 --> 00:20:45,144 that folks have? Maybe we could dig into some tool recommendations. Are you up for that? 231 00:20:45,164 --> 00:20:49,808 Yeah, definitely. I've got some stuff listed. Mine are not necessarily tools. I've got a 232 00:20:50,128 --> 00:20:58,013 course slash book slash podcast and a book slash course. But yes, let's talk tools and other 233 00:20:58,073 --> 00:21:02,996 recommendations stuff you can take away from this. I'm gonna get yours first. But so, I 234 00:21:03,016 --> 00:21:07,238 think tool recommendations, not that unusual but doesn't happen on a ton of shows. But something, 235 00:21:07,258 --> 00:21:10,580 you know, Tim Ferriss, I think I'll popularize this, book recommendations happens probably 236 00:21:10,860 --> 00:21:15,843 even more commonly. Service provider recommendations is one thing that I want to ask people about. 237 00:21:15,903 --> 00:21:20,925 Hey, we're all working in agencies, who do you like for whatever, accounting? Who do you like 238 00:21:20,945 --> 00:21:26,428 for? project management consulting, what do you like for sales consulting? Hiring HR, you 239 00:21:26,448 --> 00:21:32,572 know, one of the best professional services providers who you worked with. What is, so 240 00:21:32,952 --> 00:21:38,835 what do you have to recommend today? Okay, awesome. So the first thing that I have to recommend 241 00:21:39,035 --> 00:21:45,339 is building a second brain. I recently did a launch and learn about this at ZenPilot and 242 00:21:46,019 --> 00:21:46,900 it's a few things. 243 00:21:50,566 --> 00:21:55,248 the person that kind of came up with the concept and popularized it recently turned it into 244 00:21:55,288 --> 00:22:01,711 a book before it was a book. I'm sorry, Tiago, but I feel like the best way to get on this 245 00:22:01,751 --> 00:22:06,673 is the free podcast that's still out there called Building a Second Brain. Just I think it's 246 00:22:06,933 --> 00:22:12,035 around 10 like bite-sized episodes about the various concepts. But the concept in general 247 00:22:12,155 --> 00:22:18,710 is it's a comprehensive note-taking system but... What I like about it is that it leaves a lot 248 00:22:18,730 --> 00:22:26,195 of flexibility and room and a lot of ways you can adapt it to your own needs. So it was a 249 00:22:26,615 --> 00:22:31,117 minor breakthrough for me when I started my second brain and I started just collecting 250 00:22:31,278 --> 00:22:38,282 all of the resources and thoughts and ideas and sources that I have for various areas of 251 00:22:38,742 --> 00:22:43,925 what's in my first brain starting to put that in my second brain. So in a nutshell, the way 252 00:22:44,145 --> 00:22:47,698 it's organized is you've got... and you can adapt it to your own needs, right? But it's 253 00:22:47,718 --> 00:22:51,939 about capturing the stuff that you're seeing online or hearing in a podcast or you know, 254 00:22:51,999 --> 00:22:55,260 you're reading through a blog and something stands out to you, put that in your second 255 00:22:55,300 --> 00:23:00,762 brain. Map it to an area, do it for three months, six months, a year, all of a sudden when you're 256 00:23:00,782 --> 00:23:04,543 supposed to do a talk about like marketing, for example, or leadership, you've got this 257 00:23:04,643 --> 00:23:11,024 whole catalog of like pre-screened content or just your own original thoughts that you can 258 00:23:11,265 --> 00:23:16,138 put together a presentation about whatever area is near and dear to you. in minutes instead 259 00:23:16,198 --> 00:23:20,902 of hours. And you know, in a meta kind of way, when I was supposed to do the workshop about 260 00:23:20,942 --> 00:23:27,246 the second brain idea, I used my notes from my second brain to put that together. So, that's 261 00:23:27,286 --> 00:23:30,808 my first recommendation not to go too deep into it, but you should look it up and I recommend 262 00:23:30,848 --> 00:23:36,552 you start with the podcast, Building a Second Brain. Second recommendation, I love to find 263 00:23:36,692 --> 00:23:42,436 ways to kind of recontextualize what I'm doing day to day to find more motivation, to energize 264 00:23:42,476 --> 00:23:50,016 myself. book that's I don't think super popular because I could talk about like Atomic Habits 265 00:23:50,036 --> 00:23:54,698 or you know or maybe Tony Robbins stuff. I could but here's one that maybe you haven't heard 266 00:23:54,738 --> 00:24:02,702 about. It's called The Alter Ego Effect by Todd Herman. Now, I am super into like comic books, 267 00:24:02,762 --> 00:24:07,064 Marvel, superhero stuff and I have a very active imagination. That's one of the first things 268 00:24:07,084 --> 00:24:12,631 that the teacher said when I was at school like he's... cool but sometimes he just gets lost 269 00:24:12,651 --> 00:24:17,315 in his own imagination and we can't snap him out of it. Anyway, the alter ego effect, the 270 00:24:17,355 --> 00:24:22,579 concept is that for various contexts in your life, so one context might be work, another 271 00:24:22,599 --> 00:24:28,064 might be sports, another might be family, another might be musicianship for example, I play bass 272 00:24:28,104 --> 00:24:35,370 so for me that tracks. For each of those, you come up with like a full persona that you embody 273 00:24:35,570 --> 00:24:41,367 when you're in that activity. So, when you're in family mode... you imagine yourself as one 274 00:24:41,387 --> 00:24:47,551 kind of character. So, like for one character that I'm kind of following when I need to be 275 00:24:47,611 --> 00:24:53,095 kind of tender and caring as I try to be like Keanu Reeves for example, you know. It can 276 00:24:53,115 --> 00:24:56,918 be somebody real, it can be somebody fictional, it can be a character of your own invention 277 00:24:57,258 --> 00:25:01,942 but just this and there's research to back this up actually when you embody this different 278 00:25:01,962 --> 00:25:05,844 persona, you start acting differently, you start having different thoughts and ultimately that 279 00:25:05,884 --> 00:25:09,878 leads to different actions and different. outcomes. So, the alter ego effect, it's a simple enough 280 00:25:09,918 --> 00:25:13,499 concept but I do recommend going through the book because it goes into much more detail 281 00:25:13,539 --> 00:25:17,540 of how to activate the persona, what kind of enemies the persona is that your alter ego 282 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:22,502 is facing. It's just hugely inspirational and it really gives you this huge boost when you 283 00:25:22,542 --> 00:25:27,183 need it the most to activate your alter ego. So, those are my two. I love that. I've never 284 00:25:27,203 --> 00:25:35,526 heard of that before but I wonder if I saw a thread on Twitter here at some point. where 285 00:25:35,566 --> 00:25:39,387 someone had a bunch of different alarms set on their phone and each of the names of the 286 00:25:39,427 --> 00:25:43,989 alarms was that kind of the personality. Does that come from the book or is that someone's 287 00:25:44,029 --> 00:25:53,953 spinoff of the idea? I suspect that- I'm going to work out at 6am so my alarm at 5.45 says 288 00:25:54,233 --> 00:26:00,996 rad dad bod time or whatever identity I want to go adopt. Yeah. The one I saw was like 4.45 289 00:26:01,696 --> 00:26:06,791 was like beast mode and then I think around eight or nine when work starts is like full 290 00:26:06,831 --> 00:26:12,274 focus and then the after work it was like best dad ever. Yep. You know? So and yes, these 291 00:26:12,294 --> 00:26:16,136 are the kind of you know, personalities that the personas that we need to kind of embody. 292 00:26:16,696 --> 00:26:21,059 Is that related to the book? I don't know. I've seen more than one Twitter thread that seemed 293 00:26:21,199 --> 00:26:26,262 very heavily inspired by the alter ego effect but not mentioning, you know, to the point 294 00:26:26,282 --> 00:26:30,605 that it kind of quoted the same research. Like I was I even responded to one of those like, 295 00:26:30,625 --> 00:26:36,843 hey, you seem to be like... referring to something but not naming it by name. Not cool. But anyway, 296 00:26:36,883 --> 00:26:40,285 yes, like people catch on to this and then they share about it as well. I have shared about 297 00:26:40,305 --> 00:26:44,107 this on my own LinkedIn as well and on TikTok. I used to do TikTok for a spell. So, I'm going 298 00:26:44,147 --> 00:26:49,769 to bring that back. I need to find this. That's awesome. Well, I have three all minor tools. 299 00:26:49,849 --> 00:26:56,252 I'll keep these pretty quick. First one is reflect, reflect.app. It is basically where my second 300 00:26:56,272 --> 00:27:01,514 brain winds up. The stuff that's not in, so click up all the team. All the work, all the 301 00:27:01,554 --> 00:27:07,275 tasks, even my personal tasks, birthday reminders, that kind of stuff is inside. ClickUp, Reflect 302 00:27:07,495 --> 00:27:13,417 is all my notes. It's got awesome bi-directional linking and is really easily searchable and 303 00:27:13,457 --> 00:27:18,198 super low friction to use. A tool that I love using in conjunction with it is called Super 304 00:27:18,238 --> 00:27:25,040 Whisper and this is one have you heard of this? No, I haven't. Super early on, I don't even 305 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:30,575 know if this is a business versus just like someone's toying around to build it for themselves 306 00:27:30,755 --> 00:27:36,399 and it's out there. Superwhisper.com. It's probably Mac only, I don't know. I think it is actually. 307 00:27:36,419 --> 00:27:42,583 I had to download it and pull it in. I wish I could screen share right now. So, in my menu 308 00:27:42,603 --> 00:27:46,506 bar, I have this little triangle and when I press the keyboard shortcut or I just tap on 309 00:27:46,546 --> 00:27:52,410 it, all it does is there's a little green dot that's or sorry, red dot that turns on and 310 00:27:52,450 --> 00:27:56,673 it's recording. And then I press it again, I have my keyboard shortcut and it stops it. 311 00:27:57,570 --> 00:28:04,075 and it just copies whatever you said to the clipboard as text. But it is crazy fast and 312 00:28:04,896 --> 00:28:09,320 so it's not instant. I was gonna say instant but it's not truly instant. It's like, I don't 313 00:28:09,340 --> 00:28:14,164 know, have a second or a second behind depending on how much you record. But the transcription 314 00:28:14,464 --> 00:28:21,730 is like 100%. It's perfect transcription of whatever you're doing. I haven't dictated anything 315 00:28:21,831 --> 00:28:28,367 super like I haven't taken you know, a five paragraph thing and dictated that out yet to 316 00:28:28,407 --> 00:28:33,850 see how to slice it up and punctuate it and whatever. But the text itself has been spot 317 00:28:33,890 --> 00:28:37,692 on every single time for me. So, that's super helpful. I just want to record something and 318 00:28:37,712 --> 00:28:42,455 I want to paste it in, do whatever. A Slack message, click up into email, into wherever 319 00:28:42,535 --> 00:28:48,398 else. Superwhisper.com is what I use for that. So, question about that. So, does it trans- 320 00:28:48,478 --> 00:28:53,561 it transcribes word for word? It doesn't do like what AI sometimes does like summarize 321 00:28:53,661 --> 00:28:58,496 or you know, tamper with it? That's all it does right now is just literally word for word transcription. 322 00:28:58,856 --> 00:29:04,940 For a painting. I've used that with chat GPT a good amount. Say my prompt out loud and then 323 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:12,646 just command C, command V in the chat GPT, there we go. My last one and you'll notice the theme 324 00:29:12,686 --> 00:29:16,588 here around productivity but text expander. Do you use a text expander tool and did you 325 00:29:16,649 --> 00:29:22,413 use one prior to ZenPilot? I haven't prior to ZenPilot and actually just this week I started 326 00:29:22,513 --> 00:29:28,428 using it for the first time. Also related to chat GPT, I have this whole, this is a nice 327 00:29:28,468 --> 00:29:33,811 town I hope for the listeners. I have this prompt save that has just a lot of context about ZenPilot 328 00:29:33,831 --> 00:29:38,914 because I mean go figure I end up using chat GPT for ZenPilot at all, a lot, right? So I 329 00:29:38,954 --> 00:29:43,696 don't want to have to explain kind of the target audience, the service lines, the size of the 330 00:29:43,736 --> 00:29:50,640 company, etc. each time. So now I have this prepared kind of this big chunk of text that's 331 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:56,651 like here's what ZenPilot is again. I have saved that as just, you know, zp prompt template 332 00:29:56,751 --> 00:30:01,993 or something and via text expander just paste itself right in there. So, yes, I started using 333 00:30:02,053 --> 00:30:06,095 it recently but that's just the first use case I found for it. You should talk about how it's 334 00:30:06,155 --> 00:30:10,256 used at zempilot because it's like much more comprehensive. So, we use it for a ton of stuff. 335 00:30:11,017 --> 00:30:16,959 I started with text expanders just like if I type QEM, in fact, I was at out at click up 336 00:30:16,999 --> 00:30:22,481 HQ in February and I'm typing in someone else's computer and I'm putting in my email address. 337 00:30:22,934 --> 00:30:29,019 for them and I typed QEM, they left it and they were like, wait, what's your email at? I was 338 00:30:29,039 --> 00:30:32,702 like, what do you mean at? Like my handle? Are you talking about Twitter or something? And 339 00:30:32,722 --> 00:30:37,647 they were like, no, what's your QEM at what? I was like, no, it's not QEM, it's GrazeEmpower.com. 340 00:30:38,608 --> 00:30:42,691 Oh, I typed QEM because that's my email, like that automatically expands GrazeEmpower.com. 341 00:30:43,512 --> 00:30:45,234 Q phone. That's power of habit. 342 00:30:50,046 --> 00:30:54,587 So, there's all the really, really basic use cases like that. Hey, I just want to type three 343 00:30:54,607 --> 00:30:59,528 keys and have it expand. And the powerful thing is about this, like when you have company-wide 344 00:30:59,588 --> 00:31:05,430 adoption of this, if you change anything about your company and everybody's using the short, 345 00:31:05,670 --> 00:31:10,351 you know, form for it, then you don't have to do so much work communicating because people 346 00:31:10,371 --> 00:31:14,232 are going to be using the same shortcut and just getting different output. Like let's say 347 00:31:14,572 --> 00:31:20,334 the official company address changed, you know. You could bury that in a wiki. or just update 348 00:31:20,354 --> 00:31:24,517 the text expander prompt and people are gonna see that the output is different. Like instantly, 349 00:31:24,917 --> 00:31:28,639 everybody gets updated on that, you know? And nobody wants to spend time digging through 350 00:31:28,659 --> 00:31:33,122 a Wiki to find the official company address. So it's faster and it's more consistent and 351 00:31:33,142 --> 00:31:41,387 that's really a rare find. Out of office forms, intake forms, like whatever else, URLs, all 352 00:31:41,427 --> 00:31:46,250 of that stuff. Well, then you take it to the next level. And you can text expander is one 353 00:31:46,270 --> 00:31:50,032 of the most powerful, it might be the most powerful text expander, I don't know. And like I use 354 00:31:50,092 --> 00:31:54,655 Raycast, we can talk about a bunch of different tools that probably have some of this functionality 355 00:31:54,675 --> 00:32:00,118 built in. But what's cool is you can have these little models pop up that pre kind of have 356 00:32:00,178 --> 00:32:05,261 spaces for hey, I need an input here. You can also have any characters on your keyboard. 357 00:32:05,481 --> 00:32:10,744 So for example, there's a form that I have to fill out a couple of times every week and I 358 00:32:10,804 --> 00:32:17,727 type four things, four characters. and it goes through and so it fills out the first field, 359 00:32:17,847 --> 00:32:21,450 all these fields are sequential in order, then it hits tab on my keyboard, automatically goes 360 00:32:21,470 --> 00:32:25,813 to the second one, fills that in, hits tab, hit tab, and then enter. At the end, I actually 361 00:32:25,853 --> 00:32:30,176 have a prompt where I have to enter in something and then I have to hit tab and then it tabs 362 00:32:30,196 --> 00:32:35,419 through the rest and hits enter and submits it for me. So it's just a kind of a really 363 00:32:35,559 --> 00:32:40,523 simple way to automate some of life. You're exactly right, it does help keep kind of brand 364 00:32:41,524 --> 00:32:48,108 solidarity or consistency across the team. but mostly a productivity thing. Yeah. So, any 365 00:32:48,168 --> 00:32:52,771 kind of text that you find yourself grabbing from a doc, you know, in another window on 366 00:32:52,811 --> 00:32:57,114 another screen, you could just be using Text Expander for it. What you're mentioning here, 367 00:32:57,474 --> 00:33:01,597 it really is reminding me to use Text Expander more because once you set it up and get that 368 00:33:01,617 --> 00:33:06,781 habit, it just keeps paying off in terms of seconds and minutes saved. What do you, if 369 00:33:07,021 --> 00:33:12,605 anyone else is listening, I'm sorry, is using Text Expander, is listening, send us an email 370 00:33:12,705 --> 00:33:19,210 to breakthrough at Zenpilot.com and let us know what do you use as your starting key? Like 371 00:33:19,230 --> 00:33:27,657 for me, I use Q a lot or I use a period but primarily Q because I'm never gonna type QEM 372 00:33:27,677 --> 00:33:32,681 for a word or anywhere else. So, pick whatever you want your starting thing to be and then 373 00:33:32,721 --> 00:33:38,886 that allows you to keep your, what your inputs can be extremely short which is super nice. 374 00:33:38,926 --> 00:33:40,668 Have you seen it? Go to typingmind.com. 375 00:33:44,022 --> 00:33:50,523 Have you ever heard of this? I can't. I've never shared this with you before. Better UI for 376 00:33:50,543 --> 00:33:55,745 chat GPT. I'm sold. I don't need to know anything else. So, you can uh, there's a paid version. 377 00:33:56,545 --> 00:34:01,907 You can download this. You can use your chat GPT API key. You can just use the web version 378 00:34:02,067 --> 00:34:09,909 as well. But so this guy Tony who is awesome, he has built a bunch of these different kind 379 00:34:09,929 --> 00:34:15,500 of micro tools. And this one is getting a ton of his attention right now. He's done a really 380 00:34:15,540 --> 00:34:19,923 good job with this. But one of the cool, he's got a bunch of cool features kind of on top 381 00:34:19,943 --> 00:34:26,627 of it. Let me see, in March he hit, let's see, he released the MVP of this thing on March 382 00:34:26,667 --> 00:34:33,192 6th. He hit 10k in revenue on March 10th. I'm trying to see if I've got, I don't have any 383 00:34:33,272 --> 00:34:37,986 inside scoop here on what his revenue is right now. But anyways. TypingMind allows you to 384 00:34:38,046 --> 00:34:41,567 have all these, there's a whole bunch of custom prompts built into it. So you just press that 385 00:34:41,707 --> 00:34:46,148 and your prompt is already there. You can save your own as well. So if you weren't using TextExpander, 386 00:34:46,628 --> 00:34:52,010 something like TypingMind could also work for quickly plugging in your prompts. And then 387 00:34:52,230 --> 00:34:55,891 yeah, you can dial in the temperature and all the other kind of customizations on top of 388 00:34:55,911 --> 00:35:00,352 it that you can do, which is pretty cool. That's great. I need to have a closer look at this 389 00:35:01,033 --> 00:35:04,998 off the call, but always nice to get a tool recommendation like that. All right, we could 390 00:35:05,018 --> 00:35:14,102 do a million tool recommendations. Let's close this thing out. I think format wise with where 391 00:35:14,142 --> 00:35:20,084 we go, I'm super excited to have folks like download all the rest of them that are available. 392 00:35:20,344 --> 00:35:26,587 Go listen to, we're gonna release here the first five of them all together. So, go listen to 393 00:35:26,627 --> 00:35:31,069 those. Let us know. Email us breakthrough at zempile.com. How we can change the format. 394 00:35:31,169 --> 00:35:35,123 What works well for you? What do you love? the recommendations, they're really tactical like, 395 00:35:35,223 --> 00:35:39,506 oh, I can go type this in, I can buy this book on Amazon, I can go download this app. What 396 00:35:39,546 --> 00:35:44,429 questions do you want us to push harder on in the Breakthrough itself? We'll love the toy 397 00:35:44,449 --> 00:35:49,593 around with some of those things. Kuba, what else do we have here as we wrap up? Yeah, definitely 398 00:35:49,773 --> 00:35:55,697 send us thoughts on breakthrough at zempilot.com. It's almost as if we like they ask you answer 399 00:35:55,717 --> 00:36:03,182 as a concept ourselves and we want to serve you, our audience here, right? So... Definitely 400 00:36:03,202 --> 00:36:07,886 share your thoughts and we'll keep that in mind as we're recording these. Even the format itself 401 00:36:08,226 --> 00:36:12,849 right now is, you know, we have an idea but we'll see how it develops over time. So if 402 00:36:12,889 --> 00:36:15,651 you have thoughts about, you know, maybe you could do a segment on this, segment on that, 403 00:36:16,071 --> 00:36:22,216 we're open to that and let's discuss. Other things, I think it would be useful to remind 404 00:36:22,316 --> 00:36:30,181 the audience just who this is brought by just so, you know, to contextualize. So again, this... 405 00:36:30,614 --> 00:36:35,575 podcast, Agency Breakthrough is a cooperation between ZenPilot and ClickUp. At ZenPilot, 406 00:36:35,715 --> 00:36:40,256 we help agencies streamline operations and we do that by helping them implement ClickUp, 407 00:36:40,336 --> 00:36:46,698 but also improve their processes, finally get those SOPs and templates in order, and to train 408 00:36:46,718 --> 00:36:51,759 the team. So there's like a cadence of daily, weekly, monthly checks to make sure that everything 409 00:36:51,799 --> 00:36:56,441 is in the system and tagged right in the system. We help with all of that and more for huge 410 00:36:56,501 --> 00:37:01,966 productivity and profit gains. And great, two words about ClickUp. Yeah, well, I am ClickUp 411 00:37:02,126 --> 00:37:07,848 just to remind you all. I am- Oh yes, yeah. Yeah. The go-to and fastest growing project 412 00:37:07,888 --> 00:37:13,910 management tool for agencies. If you're listening and you're not already using ClickUp, do yourself 413 00:37:13,930 --> 00:37:19,351 a favor and go to ClickUp.com and check me out. I was gonna say check them out but check me 414 00:37:19,431 --> 00:37:25,613 out obviously or go to ZenPilot.com and look for the ClickUp for Agencies guide. We've got 415 00:37:25,633 --> 00:37:30,988 this awesome 47 page. Totally free guide. There's a long 4,000 word blog post that I originally 416 00:37:31,008 --> 00:37:35,291 wrote a couple years ago that's been updated a number of times since then. A million resources 417 00:37:35,311 --> 00:37:39,314 that we're putting out to help you for folks who, whether they want to use our services 418 00:37:39,414 --> 00:37:44,338 or they just want to use all the free stuff, there's not a ton of secrets. There's some 419 00:37:44,378 --> 00:37:47,520 really cool stuff behind the scenes, especially around reporting that we want to do, but there's 420 00:37:47,580 --> 00:37:53,044 really, a lot of this is like, hey, you just got to get the basics in place. The coolest, 421 00:37:53,064 --> 00:37:56,962 I mean, the thing to understand about a tool like ClickUp... You're coming from a trailer 422 00:37:57,002 --> 00:38:03,484 or a base camp or on a sauna or something very simple, you can get overwhelmed by how powerful 423 00:38:04,364 --> 00:38:09,585 ClickUp is. Yeah. And you've got all these, it's the curse of freedom is really what it 424 00:38:09,645 --> 00:38:12,966 is. Like, oh, I'm free to set it up this way, I'm free to set it up that way and that is 425 00:38:13,026 --> 00:38:19,488 exactly what we love about it is, hey, if you're a design team or a dev team and you see your 426 00:38:19,528 --> 00:38:22,289 board view and we're trying to move stuff through and statuses, that's great. And if you're a 427 00:38:22,309 --> 00:38:24,662 project manager, you're going to be like, oh, I'm going to move this thing or you're super 428 00:38:24,702 --> 00:38:28,063 detailed or even like I am and you want a long list or a table view, you've got that and if 429 00:38:28,083 --> 00:38:32,804 you're a creative and you want a whiteboard view but you want to all be using the same 430 00:38:32,844 --> 00:38:37,085 core data, we're still working with tasks and they could all be in the same place, that freedom 431 00:38:37,125 --> 00:38:42,066 is amazing and people who are new to the platform figuring out how to use the hierarchy best 432 00:38:42,106 --> 00:38:46,948 and how to use views and dashboards best, those are the three and custom fields, those are 433 00:38:46,968 --> 00:38:51,469 like the four core key features that you kind of need to wrap your head around and so we're 434 00:38:51,509 --> 00:38:55,723 just trying to short-cut that learning for people and help. Explain hey, here's why and here's 435 00:38:55,763 --> 00:39:01,587 how so then pilot.com. Yeah, look in the header I just don't have this distinct feeling I have 436 00:39:01,607 --> 00:39:05,189 this distinct feeling great that you're like extremely excited about click up Maybe even 437 00:39:05,249 --> 00:39:09,352 enough to start a company all around it without me for it to say I might be a step too far. 438 00:39:09,432 --> 00:39:18,379 All right That's uh, that's absolutely true. I'm uh, I Like to think that I'm a fair fanboy 439 00:39:18,559 --> 00:39:27,553 that I am 100% rooting for for ClickUp and the whole team and at the same time, our job and 440 00:39:27,573 --> 00:39:32,636 who we get paid by is our clients. And so, our job, you can understand since the beginning, 441 00:39:32,756 --> 00:39:35,938 what's the best tool for most agencies most of the time, that's where we're gonna go focus. 442 00:39:36,339 --> 00:39:42,063 And so, that led to ClickUp. All right, anything else for you? Let's wrap this up. Follow ZenPilot, 443 00:39:42,083 --> 00:39:48,338 follow ClickUp, follow me, follow Gray and- Those are the CTAs for today. We're really 444 00:39:48,378 --> 00:39:52,499 excited that you either, you know, listened to the very first episode of Agency Breakthrough 445 00:39:52,599 --> 00:39:57,281 or you went back to listen to the first episode that puts you in a very exclusive club. So 446 00:39:57,821 --> 00:40:03,022 welcome and we hope you're going to enjoy the ride as much as we're enjoying it here. We'll 447 00:40:03,082 --> 00:40:07,464 see you in the next one, probably with our first guests or, you know, whichever else is next 448 00:40:07,564 --> 00:40:11,845 up in your favorite podcast platform. This has been a blast, Gray. Thank you for the time. 449 00:40:12,165 --> 00:40:12,865 Perfect. Thanks, Kuba.