1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,000 Don't cram plenty people on Zoom fluorescent lighted office all day long. 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:09,000 You know, you probably are going to work from home. 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:16,000 Hello and welcome to No Office, a podcast about work technology and life from a remote company perspective. 4 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:24,000 My name is Rafal Sobolewski and as always, I'm joined by CEO of our No Office company and my good friend Michael Sliwinski. 5 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:29,000 Hello, Michael. How are you today? Good. We're back. We're back recording our No Office podcast. 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:30,880 - Yes, yes, I miss recording. 7 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:33,340 You with Magda made some great interview 8 00:00:33,340 --> 00:00:36,720 with Mirek Burnejko, a Polish entrepreneurship 9 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:38,760 in our Polish podcast, and I got jealous. 10 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:42,760 So here I am, I asked you to record this episode 11 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:44,720 because we have some things to share. 12 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:47,640 - Yes, so we are back recording in English as well. 13 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:50,880 Probably we'll try to do like at least one episode a month. 14 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:51,980 We'll see how this goes. 15 00:00:51,980 --> 00:00:53,640 We'll see how much we'll do in summer. 16 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:56,040 Well, when we might take a break, 17 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,720 but I want to be back to podcasting 18 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:01,920 because we have so much more to share. 19 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:03,940 People have been asking me on LinkedIn about it, 20 00:01:03,940 --> 00:01:08,100 about our podcast and they resonate with such content. 21 00:01:08,100 --> 00:01:10,880 So I think we should keep going 22 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:14,120 and especially tell everyone how Nozbe has been going 23 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:16,000 as well, 'cause it has developed 24 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:17,440 and it's being developed very well. 25 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,200 - Yeah, yeah, because the topic of today's episode 26 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,520 is about having meetings with customers, 27 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:24,060 listening to customers' feedback, 28 00:01:24,060 --> 00:01:26,860 which we've done a lot during recent months, 29 00:01:26,860 --> 00:01:30,500 even though some quantitative data showed us 30 00:01:30,500 --> 00:01:35,020 that our podcast doesn't have much impact, 31 00:01:35,020 --> 00:01:39,060 qualitative data from people showed us the opposites. 32 00:01:39,060 --> 00:01:40,900 So yeah, that's interesting. 33 00:01:40,900 --> 00:01:45,020 As I said, we talked to customers during recent months 34 00:01:45,020 --> 00:01:47,660 much, much more than we used to before. 35 00:01:47,660 --> 00:01:49,500 And our company is changing, 36 00:01:49,500 --> 00:01:51,740 our app is changing, it's evolving, 37 00:01:51,740 --> 00:01:53,780 and I'm really proud of it. 38 00:01:53,780 --> 00:01:56,580 We launched Nozbe teams in 2020, 39 00:01:56,580 --> 00:01:59,140 And there's the saying in product management event. 40 00:01:59,140 --> 00:02:02,860 If you were proud of the thing that you launched 41 00:02:02,860 --> 00:02:04,180 then you launched too late. 42 00:02:04,180 --> 00:02:05,020 - Yes, that's correct. 43 00:02:05,020 --> 00:02:07,460 - And now we've got to the point that like last year 44 00:02:07,460 --> 00:02:10,580 when we switched the name from Nozbe teams to new Nozbe. 45 00:02:10,580 --> 00:02:13,740 Then I think was the moment that we were like proud 46 00:02:13,740 --> 00:02:14,820 of our app. 47 00:02:14,820 --> 00:02:16,780 If we had this process like this 48 00:02:16,780 --> 00:02:20,980 that we just launched the thing and don't iterate it 49 00:02:20,980 --> 00:02:22,680 that would be the app, yeah? 50 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:24,220 But we don't do that. 51 00:02:24,220 --> 00:02:25,180 We want to move fast. 52 00:02:25,180 --> 00:02:31,020 to break things and improve, improve ship updates almost every week. And now we are focusing on 53 00:02:31,020 --> 00:02:36,780 listening customers feedback, because I think we implemented all of the features we need for 54 00:02:36,780 --> 00:02:43,980 our internal use. There are maybe some more that are in our portfolio of options still, but yeah, 55 00:02:43,980 --> 00:02:51,260 more or less for us, the app is good. But yeah, now we need more feedback, more input data, 56 00:02:51,260 --> 00:02:56,260 qualitative data to figure out what to do next? 57 00:02:56,260 --> 00:02:59,500 Yes, especially that we are cursed by this success in many industries. 58 00:02:59,500 --> 00:03:08,540 That many companies, in many industries, many small business and medium-sized 59 00:03:08,540 --> 00:03:12,900 businesses are using Nozbe in completely different industries, which means 60 00:03:12,900 --> 00:03:18,100 they have different needs, they have different workflows, and they have different 61 00:03:16,980 --> 00:03:23,980 features or ideas that would work for them or that would help them get stuff done. 62 00:03:23,980 --> 00:03:31,300 And our goal is to be shipping a very simple yet powerful app with many flexible options 63 00:03:31,300 --> 00:03:35,020 to be able to adjust and accommodate to your industry. 64 00:03:35,020 --> 00:03:42,980 So we have to listen to many customers, diverse customers, to figure out what we want to implement, 65 00:03:42,980 --> 00:03:47,980 we want to do it and how we want to see this go through. 66 00:03:47,980 --> 00:03:51,840 So by talking to these customers and asking them good questions and 67 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,240 just figuring out how they work, we are able to identify cool new 68 00:03:55,240 --> 00:04:00,960 features and cool new ideas and cool new implementations that could 69 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:05,800 help them and not as much us, but it could help them and still make 70 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:11,360 a valuable product for everyone. 71 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:13,500 That's a good point because recent updates to our app in this year, 72 00:04:13,500 --> 00:04:19,900 they are mostly features that we don't use that much as a team internally. 73 00:04:19,900 --> 00:04:24,440 Yeah, that is a great indication that we are now focusing on the features. 74 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:28,200 Their goal is to resolve the problems of customers 75 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:32,140 that we learned from talking to them during the meetings. 76 00:04:32,140 --> 00:04:34,640 Because normally we hate meetings. 77 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:35,400 Meetings are bad. 78 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:40,680 But if meetings are well prepared and you have meetings with a customer who cares about the app, 79 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:46,760 these meetings, I love them. For example, you record those meetings. You are the person who 80 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:52,120 has the most meetings with customers. And you record those meetings because we can learn from 81 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:58,600 it. We can rewatch it, for example, with 1.5 or even 2X speed. So that's more efficient. 82 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:06,840 that's productivity hack and turn from it. And they are always so energizing because my brain 83 00:05:06,840 --> 00:05:12,920 already generates idea how to solve problems the customer is talking about during this interview 84 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:18,760 with you or with me or with Magda. Because now we, there are the three people in company talking to 85 00:05:18,760 --> 00:05:23,880 customers directly. - Let's talk about meetings. As we discussed in our pyramid of communication 86 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:30,560 and our previous shows, we try to avoid meetings, have fewer meetings than possible. 87 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:33,520 I mean, as few meetings as possible. 88 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:40,940 And we believe that meetings should be well-prepared, should be regular, and should be optional. 89 00:05:40,940 --> 00:05:44,380 And this is what happens also with the customer meetings. 90 00:05:44,380 --> 00:05:51,420 It's regular, so I have scheduled between one and two-hour window on Tuesdays, Wednesdays, 91 00:05:51,420 --> 00:05:53,440 and Thursdays for my customers. 92 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:54,440 So it's regular. 93 00:05:54,440 --> 00:06:01,560 I know that in these time frames, at these times, I am ready to talk to my customers. 94 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:03,120 So it's regular. 95 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:07,880 Then it's well prepared because whenever there is a meeting with the customer, I see the 96 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:09,460 task with this customer. 97 00:06:09,460 --> 00:06:14,720 I see what plan they are on, how they've been using Nozbe, what customer support has written 98 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:16,380 about them. 99 00:06:16,380 --> 00:06:19,360 So I'm prepared and I'm prepared to talk to them. 100 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:25,200 And then optional, because some of these days customers don't sign up for meetings. 101 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:30,220 So sometimes I don't have a meeting because nobody signed up, for example, for a Tuesday 102 00:06:30,220 --> 00:06:31,440 or a Wednesday. 103 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:33,420 It's exactly how we like it. 104 00:06:33,420 --> 00:06:39,600 And it's fantastic if you can use a tool like we use currently, for example, that you can 105 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:44,000 just specify, "I am available only in these times and you can just book a meeting with 106 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:45,000 me." 107 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:49,800 these customers are doing that and they're happy to be talking to, you know, not just to me, to the 108 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:56,520 CEO, but also to you, to the chief of product, to also to Magda, our marketing executive. So it's 109 00:06:56,520 --> 00:07:04,120 great. And they can just tell us what they feel, how they like using our app, what they don't like. 110 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:10,200 And for us, the most important thing, we can ask them how they work, what they try to accomplish, 111 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:12,360 and how they are accomplishing it using our app. 112 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,280 - If they say they want a feature X, 113 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:18,120 we can uncover, we can ask more questions 114 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:20,720 to figure out what the real problem is, 115 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:22,520 what they are trying to accomplish 116 00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:24,160 by having this feature X. 117 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:28,360 And then with having a lot of those interviews, 118 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:30,160 we can find the common ground, 119 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:32,800 like the most repetitive patterns. 120 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:34,760 And then we can figure out from that 121 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:36,360 what features to implement, 122 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:38,160 but also for example, 123 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:44,560 of things that are our competitive advantage because customers like to share why they've 124 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:51,600 chosen Nozbe over other solutions. Because we're a small company, we cannot compete with Asanas 125 00:07:51,600 --> 00:08:00,000 and ClickUps and other Mondays.com with marketing budget, with all of those ads, aggressive marketing. 126 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:07,840 We cannot burn those money like they do. We need to figure out what's our competitive advantage 127 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:12,840 and focus on that, elaborate on that, 128 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,960 have a marketing communication about that. 129 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:17,920 Yeah, it's so cool to listen to customers 130 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:20,280 because our customers are really smart. 131 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:22,320 They're some really smart people 132 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:23,480 because just by searching for a productivity app 133 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,640 for them or their team, it shows that they're smart 134 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:31,360 because they know that by using just email and stuff, 135 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:34,360 it just doesn't work anymore. 136 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:35,920 So that's one thing. 137 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:36,840 And they are making a conscious decision. 138 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,520 They are checking different apps. It's not like they just see Nozbe and that's it. 139 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:42,120 They don't know anything else exists. So by listening to our customers, one of the things that 140 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:47,240 resurfaced again is that Nozbe's strength 141 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:51,880 is that it's just simple to use. As I mentioned, it looks like a simple 142 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:56,560 to-do project management app, which is very powerful, but 143 00:08:56,560 --> 00:09:01,400 its simplicity, its focus on tasks makes it also easy to get started. 144 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,460 So they say, look, we checked Asana, we checked Monday, 145 00:09:04,460 --> 00:09:05,560 but they're just too bloated, 146 00:09:05,560 --> 00:09:06,880 they're just too many features. 147 00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:09,960 We want something that our team will use quickly, 148 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:12,680 that we can quickly create projects and tasks 149 00:09:12,680 --> 00:09:16,440 and just start working on them without much training 150 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:19,380 or really setups or anything like this. 151 00:09:19,380 --> 00:09:21,220 And we can just go as we go. 152 00:09:21,220 --> 00:09:23,800 And then another thing is that what they highlight 153 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:28,800 is that in Nozbe, you can also have both the work life 154 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:30,520 and the private life. 155 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:35,320 So we can have also private projects and just be a private task and deal with them in the 156 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:37,820 same way, in the same easy to use way. 157 00:09:37,820 --> 00:09:43,340 And also, they highlight that, for example, our mobile apps are very powerful and very 158 00:09:43,340 --> 00:09:44,480 well designed. 159 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:48,460 So they can really have their whole company and their whole life in their pocket and just 160 00:09:48,460 --> 00:09:50,520 manage it from their smartphone. 161 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:55,720 So all these things that just help us figure out where our strengths are and build on these 162 00:09:55,720 --> 00:10:00,020 strengths and figure out how we can serve them better using these strengths. 163 00:10:00,020 --> 00:10:03,220 - That's interesting because it's not like Nozbe is like 164 00:10:03,220 --> 00:10:06,940 just a basic to-do app that has no advanced feature. 165 00:10:06,940 --> 00:10:09,580 It has a lot, but they are not in your face, 166 00:10:09,580 --> 00:10:13,740 like in other apps like this, like Asana, et cetera. 167 00:10:13,740 --> 00:10:17,180 And customers liked it because they can discover them 168 00:10:17,180 --> 00:10:19,700 already during using the app. 169 00:10:19,700 --> 00:10:20,820 Learn as they go. 170 00:10:20,820 --> 00:10:21,780 - It can start very small. 171 00:10:21,780 --> 00:10:24,460 Like the cost of entry for Nozbe is very small 172 00:10:24,460 --> 00:10:26,260 and this is what they were highlighting. 173 00:10:26,260 --> 00:10:27,860 Inviting a person is very easy. 174 00:10:27,860 --> 00:10:29,740 Creating a project with them is very easy. 175 00:10:29,740 --> 00:10:34,740 creating a task, delegating a task, no completed forms, no complicated features, and bells and whistles. 176 00:10:34,740 --> 00:10:40,440 Later you start discovering them. But as you go, it's just easy to use. 177 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:44,220 And we need to make sure that we keep on keeping on doing that and delivering a great powerful app that seems very simple and in practice is very simple to use. 178 00:10:44,220 --> 00:10:55,980 That is true. And another interesting example about data is that we learned from quality data, so talking to customers, that they are 179 00:10:55,980 --> 00:11:01,660 quality data, so talking to customers that they value a lot our mobile app 180 00:11:01,660 --> 00:11:08,380 because it's very powerful. It has like almost 90% of features of web app and desktop apps, 181 00:11:08,380 --> 00:11:16,300 and it works offline. It's super fast, but the quantitative data shows us that like majority 182 00:11:16,300 --> 00:11:21,900 of use is of course desktop. Yeah. But it's important because you don't use mobile app often, 183 00:11:21,900 --> 00:11:25,100 But when you do, you really need those features. 184 00:11:25,100 --> 00:11:30,500 You really need that it works offline, for example, if you don't have coverage. 185 00:11:30,500 --> 00:11:31,860 And it's very crucial. 186 00:11:31,860 --> 00:11:36,100 And I'm really happy with how our mobile app works right now. 187 00:11:36,100 --> 00:11:38,580 And I'm using it more and more, actually. 188 00:11:38,580 --> 00:11:44,660 And when talking to customers, the cool thing is that I get to convert into a child again. 189 00:11:44,660 --> 00:11:45,820 Like, I'm curious. 190 00:11:45,820 --> 00:11:50,580 You know, I think we always say that with children, the best way to teach them things 191 00:11:50,580 --> 00:11:54,740 is to cultivate their curiosity, to make sure that they are curious about things. 192 00:11:54,740 --> 00:11:57,740 They ask questions. They ask how things work. 193 00:11:57,740 --> 00:12:01,740 Yeah, they always ask why and you respond. And there is another why. 194 00:12:01,740 --> 00:12:06,260 And that's how you should talk to customers because you need to uncover what they mean. 195 00:12:06,260 --> 00:12:11,140 That, for example, "Oh, it's just easy to use. What do you mean that's easy? What is easy?" 196 00:12:11,140 --> 00:12:12,340 And so on and so on. 197 00:12:12,340 --> 00:12:17,620 Because they're from various different industries, I really get to learn about them 198 00:12:17,620 --> 00:12:22,620 and step out of my comfort zone and also out of my bubble. 199 00:12:22,620 --> 00:12:26,820 The IT and just Apple geek who's just into computers. 200 00:12:26,820 --> 00:12:29,260 I can talk to completely different industries 201 00:12:29,260 --> 00:12:35,060 who are building things, who are serving different customers, 202 00:12:35,060 --> 00:12:37,980 who are just having completely different workflows. 203 00:12:37,980 --> 00:12:40,820 And I can ask them about it, how you do what you do, 204 00:12:40,820 --> 00:12:44,220 how many people you have and how they are distributed, 205 00:12:44,220 --> 00:12:47,540 how they work, and all that stuff. 206 00:12:44,620 --> 00:12:47,620 And only then, once they start talking about themselves, 207 00:12:47,620 --> 00:12:50,340 and it's really cool because they like talking about themselves, 208 00:12:50,340 --> 00:12:54,900 like everyone does, so then I can just guide them to asking some questions. 209 00:12:54,900 --> 00:12:57,700 Okay, so how do you use Nozbe for this purpose? 210 00:12:57,700 --> 00:12:59,180 Or how do you use Nozbe for that? 211 00:12:59,180 --> 00:13:02,420 Or how do you achieve that with Nozbe or with some other tool? 212 00:13:02,420 --> 00:13:06,140 And this way, I can see the patterns, I can see their workflows, 213 00:13:06,140 --> 00:13:09,900 and I can see where we can be even better or maybe improve it somehow. 214 00:13:09,900 --> 00:13:22,900 those interviews are kind of a training for a customer because very often we can show them how they can use like feature X to accomplish something similar they wanted to accomplish but didn't know how. 215 00:13:22,900 --> 00:13:30,900 Yes, very often. And for us it's indication and okay, so this feature should be more discoverable in that context, in that scenario. 216 00:13:30,900 --> 00:13:34,980 - Also, for example, the value of use cases. 217 00:13:34,980 --> 00:13:37,560 I think we will be publishing now on our blog, 218 00:13:37,560 --> 00:13:41,300 more use cases and also on our help page and in our app, 219 00:13:41,300 --> 00:13:43,100 more use cases, how we use Nozbe 220 00:13:43,100 --> 00:13:45,020 or how other customers use Nozbe, 221 00:13:45,020 --> 00:13:49,080 because they want to mimic how other people use it, 222 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,180 because there are many best practices that we already know 223 00:13:53,180 --> 00:13:54,700 or that we've learned from them 224 00:13:54,700 --> 00:13:56,840 that other customers could benefit from. 225 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,060 So this very often, as you mentioned, 226 00:14:00,060 --> 00:14:05,860 turns out that I can just jump on a quick screen share and show them, "Look, you can 227 00:14:05,860 --> 00:14:08,140 do this like this and this like that." 228 00:14:08,140 --> 00:14:12,600 And also, it's very cool that the customers usually are very comfortable with sharing 229 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:13,600 their screens. 230 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:14,600 So I'm like, "Show me your screen. 231 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:15,820 Show me your Nozbe. 232 00:14:15,820 --> 00:14:18,800 And this way maybe I can help you and I can just help you optimize this." 233 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,940 And they are willing to do that. 234 00:14:21,940 --> 00:14:25,540 All these things that people don't want to share, people don't want to talk to you, and 235 00:14:25,540 --> 00:14:28,180 they will not reveal anything is not true. 236 00:14:28,180 --> 00:14:31,620 and they are willingly talking to somebody who is providing them with a tool that they 237 00:14:31,620 --> 00:14:32,620 use. 238 00:14:32,620 --> 00:14:37,540 In my experience, I've never had a problem with first of all recording the videos. 239 00:14:37,540 --> 00:14:41,900 Nobody said that they wouldn't want to do it, especially I would tell them it's just 240 00:14:41,900 --> 00:14:43,120 for internal use. 241 00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:47,980 But second, very often they would be happy to show me their Nozbe, their screen. 242 00:14:47,980 --> 00:14:51,220 I had once a meeting that I couldn't record it. 243 00:14:51,220 --> 00:14:53,920 No customer could show the screen. 244 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:56,240 But yeah, that's understandable because very often 245 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:59,400 they have their customers data in tasks. 246 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:01,080 So I don't want to see that. 247 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:04,200 - Yeah, but as you said, this just happened to you once. 248 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,740 Usually it's not a big deal because again, 249 00:15:06,740 --> 00:15:08,880 they are not revealing something really confidential 250 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:12,080 or even if they are, they trust me that I'm not gonna 251 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:14,800 abuse it because we are here for a different purpose. 252 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:15,800 - Yes, exactly. 253 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:19,200 And from our power part, like when we are showing something, 254 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,960 we can always have, I have dedicated workspaces, 255 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:30,260 test workspaces, but I can easy switch to so I don't reveal any our data that we have about our customers. So that's very convenient. 256 00:15:30,260 --> 00:15:46,560 I sometimes do. And now that we've learned after talking to so many customers, we there will be a need for us to kind of have like a one click setup of a fictional, you know, Nozbe account. So where we can show so show off different features to a customer and how these work. 257 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:50,560 Yes, that's that's the portfolio of options like many, many things are 258 00:15:50,560 --> 00:15:53,240 - Yeah, but we will be working on that for our purpose, 259 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:57,740 for our, to have like kind of a template 260 00:15:57,740 --> 00:16:02,740 of how we want to show them an ideal or a Nozbe account 261 00:16:02,740 --> 00:16:05,760 to show them how things work. 262 00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:07,840 So we are improving that, 263 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,680 but really sometimes just showing your stuff works 264 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,360 and people don't mind. 265 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,200 - Yeah, and as you said before, 266 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,320 you can manage both private and your work life in Nozbe 267 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,040 thanks to multiple workspaces. 268 00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:22,560 And that's very important to us because we want to learn, 269 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:25,520 for example, from many customers we talk to, 270 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:29,440 they are like they used to use Nozbe personnel 271 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,440 for the private staff, and now using new Nozbe 272 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:34,820 for both the private and work staff. 273 00:16:34,820 --> 00:16:37,000 So that's our ideal scenario, 274 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,160 but there are still many customers from Nozbe personnel 275 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:41,660 who tried new Nozbe, 276 00:16:41,660 --> 00:16:43,960 went back to Nozbe personnel for some reason, 277 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:47,800 and we want to discover reasoning behind it more. 278 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:49,960 So if you are one of those customers, 279 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:52,480 please feel free to write at Rafa@NOSB.com 280 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:53,720 and we can schedule a meeting. 281 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:57,840 I want to learn more about what you were missing in Nozbe 282 00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:59,440 or what problem did you have? 283 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:03,480 Because we learned that this is not only great value for us, 284 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,520 but for all those customers 285 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:08,440 that they can have separate workspace for private life, 286 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:12,120 for private task projects and for work stuff. 287 00:17:12,120 --> 00:17:15,680 We want as many users to take advantage of that 288 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:19,560 because that's really cool to have it all in one app. 289 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:24,560 "Yeah, it turns out that we are a work-life balance company." 290 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:25,840 What you do? 291 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,640 "Oh, I provide an application that helps other achieve 292 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:32,620 or maintain, better said, maintain work-life balance." 293 00:17:32,620 --> 00:17:34,120 (laughs) 294 00:17:34,120 --> 00:17:37,800 So I think, you know, I remember when it was always hard 295 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:39,000 for me to explain what I'm doing. 296 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:40,640 So like, you know, I have this time management, 297 00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:42,440 project management, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, 298 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:43,280 application. 299 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,880 Now I can just tell them, I help small business owners 300 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:51,880 get their work and life organized in a simple way. 301 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:56,400 And I think the answer is good in that sense that it's, 302 00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:00,760 it addresses exactly the benefit, the goal, 303 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:04,120 the ideal state, but also it's vague enough 304 00:18:04,120 --> 00:18:05,560 that people want to ask more. 305 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:06,880 Like, how do you do that? 306 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:08,800 How do you mean? 307 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:10,720 What exactly is that? 308 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:14,680 So I think during this year, our pitch for Nozbe 309 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:18,080 will improve a lot and be more concrete 310 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:20,720 and be more understandable for people 311 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:23,740 and will be more coherent with our mission. 312 00:18:23,740 --> 00:18:25,680 And it's all thanks to talking to customers 313 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:27,600 and I agree asking them how they use Nozbe. 314 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,720 - That's true and we will continue on that. 315 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:33,480 And I think we can go to the part 316 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:36,280 when we can brag about some new features we listen to. 317 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:37,720 - Yeah, let's talk about cool things 318 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:38,960 we've developed in Nozbe. 319 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,840 - Just today I recorded the video screencast 320 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,800 about the features we shipped in January, February, 321 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:45,680 and early March. 322 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,400 And there are actually two features that we shipped 323 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:49,960 like this week, this week. 324 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:52,620 So as we speak, it's March 16. 325 00:18:52,620 --> 00:18:55,760 So long-waited time needed task parameter, 326 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:57,440 and also we added time spent. 327 00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:59,800 So now you can specify in the task 328 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,160 how much time you need to accomplish that, 329 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,960 and later how much time you actually spent on it. 330 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:06,560 So you can compare it. 331 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:09,520 There are of course counters in sections, 332 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:11,820 in project and in calendar. 333 00:19:11,820 --> 00:19:14,700 So you can really, and other tasks, please, 334 00:19:14,700 --> 00:19:16,820 like priority, incoming. 335 00:19:16,820 --> 00:19:20,980 If you use this feature, if you plan your day 336 00:19:20,980 --> 00:19:24,460 based on the time effort, you plan on each task, 337 00:19:24,460 --> 00:19:25,900 and that is the feature for you. 338 00:19:25,900 --> 00:19:28,940 And we know that many users ask for this feature, 339 00:19:28,940 --> 00:19:32,160 especially former Nozbe personnel, customers. 340 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:35,980 And we just introduced it, but we didn't want to have it 341 00:19:35,980 --> 00:19:38,380 in your face, in task details view. 342 00:19:38,380 --> 00:19:41,460 So you can enable it per project basis, 343 00:19:41,460 --> 00:19:44,140 but you can also enable it from task details view. 344 00:19:44,140 --> 00:19:47,020 We've in task menu, there is option to enable it 345 00:19:47,020 --> 00:19:49,860 for the project that task belongs to. 346 00:19:49,860 --> 00:19:52,300 It's very simple to enable it for a project 347 00:19:52,300 --> 00:19:54,580 and then use it where you need it. 348 00:19:54,580 --> 00:19:57,420 And for those of you who don't need it, 349 00:19:57,420 --> 00:20:00,060 it doesn't blow the interface that way. 350 00:20:00,060 --> 00:20:03,420 - This is one of the features that our customers told me, 351 00:20:03,420 --> 00:20:05,420 told us that they really need it. 352 00:20:05,420 --> 00:20:09,380 And in many industries, because in some industries, 353 00:20:09,380 --> 00:20:14,380 People just charge per time spent, 354 00:20:14,380 --> 00:20:16,580 or want to calculate their effort. 355 00:20:16,580 --> 00:20:18,820 Or for example, when they're manufacturing, 356 00:20:18,820 --> 00:20:20,460 it's something they want to see 357 00:20:20,460 --> 00:20:21,860 how much time it really took to manufacture that, 358 00:20:21,860 --> 00:20:24,380 or prepare that, or create this project. 359 00:20:24,380 --> 00:20:26,540 So in many different sets of circumstances, 360 00:20:26,540 --> 00:20:30,720 tracking time is important. 361 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:33,060 Not important enough to have a separate time tracking app 362 00:20:33,060 --> 00:20:37,420 because then it's just additional administrative thing 363 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:37,920 and it's just more work, but important enough 364 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,680 to have time tracking in your choose your app 365 00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:41,720 that you're currently using. 366 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,960 So that's why we introduced this, you know, 367 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:49,080 quite simple time tracking, but more, more already more, 368 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:51,120 I mean, better than the personal version. 369 00:20:51,120 --> 00:20:53,560 So you can have, you can track both time spent 370 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:54,600 and time needed. 371 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:58,160 And I'm sure this will lead to other developments, 372 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,400 other improvements in the future while listening 373 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:03,360 to customers, how they use this feature 374 00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:06,360 and what is it that they really need there 375 00:21:06,360 --> 00:21:08,960 and what's missing there. 376 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:13,740 Again, we don't want to be a fully bloated time tracking app 377 00:21:13,740 --> 00:21:16,080 but we want to enable time tracking when necessary 378 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:17,360 and in projects where necessary, 379 00:21:17,360 --> 00:21:19,760 in circumstances where necessary. 380 00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:20,840 - That's the idea. 381 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,680 All right, moving on, our brand new Windows app 382 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:26,120 is already shipped in Microsoft Store 383 00:21:26,120 --> 00:21:28,520 and available on Nozbe.com/download. 384 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,820 We are finally at this point where we have apps 385 00:21:31,820 --> 00:21:34,660 for four major platforms like Android, iOS, 386 00:21:34,660 --> 00:21:36,820 Windows and macOS, and of course the web. 387 00:21:36,820 --> 00:21:40,180 And I think that's also like the lessons learned 388 00:21:40,180 --> 00:21:44,340 from talking to customers, they value a lot like desktop apps. 389 00:21:44,340 --> 00:21:45,180 - Oh yes. 390 00:21:45,180 --> 00:21:46,860 - It's so much nicer to use desktop app, 391 00:21:46,860 --> 00:21:50,680 but web version, even though they are very similar, 392 00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,940 but desktop app can have more features on top of it 393 00:21:53,940 --> 00:21:55,740 because we control the window, 394 00:21:55,740 --> 00:21:57,740 we control keyboard shortcuts, et cetera. 395 00:21:57,740 --> 00:21:58,740 Yeah, that's really cool. 396 00:21:58,740 --> 00:22:00,020 And speaking of those features, 397 00:22:00,020 --> 00:22:05,460 There is actually one very nice, very useful feature like multiple windows in our desktop 398 00:22:05,460 --> 00:22:06,460 apps. 399 00:22:06,460 --> 00:22:13,360 So by hitting Ctrl+N or Command+N on macOS, you can enable, like, just open new window 400 00:22:13,360 --> 00:22:14,360 of Nozbe. 401 00:22:14,360 --> 00:22:17,260 For example, that's very useful during weekly review. 402 00:22:17,260 --> 00:22:22,860 I can open in separate window my weekly review task with the checklist, and in the main window 403 00:22:22,860 --> 00:22:25,540 I just go through projects and tasks I need to review. 404 00:22:25,540 --> 00:22:30,540 The same is when I, for example, write summary of development cycle. 405 00:22:30,540 --> 00:22:35,340 I prepare a long comment in one window and in the second window I just go through 406 00:22:35,340 --> 00:22:40,440 those projects and see if it's done, if it's accomplished. 407 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:44,340 Or would it require more appetite for the future? 408 00:22:44,340 --> 00:22:48,340 How we cut scope and etc. 409 00:22:48,340 --> 00:22:50,740 The cool thing is that our windows are very flexible so you can really make Nozbe very small or very big depending on your screen size. 410 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:58,440 So you can really have multiple windows open. Some of them can be just containing one task. 411 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:03,640 Yes, even on a small laptop screen. 412 00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:05,240 Yeah, exactly. And then have the bigger window somewhere else. 413 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,940 So it's really, really cool how it works. 414 00:23:08,940 --> 00:23:11,640 So Nozbe can be like a big app on your desktop or can be just a companion on the side with a checklist or with just current project open. 415 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:19,340 So this way Nozbe is out of the way, but it's being helpful. 416 00:23:19,340 --> 00:23:23,240 It's there and you can use it. 417 00:23:20,140 --> 00:23:31,140 And this is one of the reasons people wanted a Windows app and a Mac app. They wanted a desktop app because they don't usually fiddle with windows of the browser. 418 00:23:31,140 --> 00:23:37,140 So normally the browser window is big. And with that, they can just move Nozbe around. 419 00:23:37,140 --> 00:23:44,140 And the Nozbe size doesn't depend on the Chrome of the browser. 420 00:23:44,140 --> 00:23:46,960 Also, another thing is that it's just more dedicated. 421 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:48,760 So you know that if you wanna get stuff done, 422 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,360 you just open Nozbe and it's a different application 423 00:23:52,360 --> 00:23:53,960 and you don't open it within the browser 424 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,960 and then you start clicking and searching 425 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:57,200 and checking things on the web 426 00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:59,320 and you just, you know, your productivity is gone. 427 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:00,160 - Yes, exactly. 428 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:01,600 - Yeah, it's very important. 429 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,040 Now we are only waiting for the Mac App Store 430 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:05,440 to be published. 431 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:07,420 So we hope hopefully we'll get 432 00:24:07,420 --> 00:24:09,160 the Mac App Store version as well. 433 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,380 - But what we prefer if you use our Mac version 434 00:24:12,380 --> 00:24:14,380 that you can download from our website, 435 00:24:14,380 --> 00:24:15,440 Nozbe.com/download. 436 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,480 - It supports automatic updates. 437 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,240 So if you download our Mac application, 438 00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:22,780 it will update automatically anyway. 439 00:24:22,780 --> 00:24:25,560 So the main benefit of Mac App Store 440 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:26,740 that you have the updates, 441 00:24:26,740 --> 00:24:30,240 it's not there because it's still there in our application. 442 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,420 So feel free to get it from Nozbe.com/download. 443 00:24:33,420 --> 00:24:36,440 - Another feature that you are the most excited of, 444 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:40,240 but I'm also, it's assigning tasks to email address. 445 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:41,720 So sharing tasks via email. 446 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:46,720 Yes, I love this feature and we are constantly improving it. 447 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:51,720 For me, the most important thing here is that you can basically create tasks for anyone in the world. 448 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:57,360 And they don't need to be using Nozbe. 449 00:24:57,360 --> 00:24:59,120 So from Nozbe, I can create a task for somebody and just assign it to their email address. 450 00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:05,320 They will receive an email with the task link and they'll be able to open the task 451 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:11,000 and just see just this one task. 452 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,400 They can also choose, of course, to sign up for Nozbe, which would be great, but they 453 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:13,440 don't have to do it. 454 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:18,120 They can just reply in the comments to this task, and this way, this comment goes directly 455 00:25:18,120 --> 00:25:21,380 to my Nozbe, where it's important for me. 456 00:25:21,380 --> 00:25:26,400 And this way, we can interact through Nozbe, even though we started off via an email conversation. 457 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,700 That's pretty cool, because you stay in Nozbe in your task. 458 00:25:29,700 --> 00:25:31,440 You communicate through comments. 459 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,880 And the other person on the other end, they receive notification every time you mention 460 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:42,200 them or reassign this task to them so they can easily click on the link, open it in the 461 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,380 browser and respond in a comment. 462 00:25:44,380 --> 00:25:47,940 So that's pretty cool because you just don't need to switch to email. 463 00:25:47,940 --> 00:25:51,560 Later during the day check if they responded to you. 464 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:52,880 You will see that in Nozbe. 465 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:58,200 These were three main features I wanted to share, I think the three most important ones. 466 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:03,720 The last one we will link to the blog post with my screencast so you can check them out. 467 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:04,720 Let's wrap it up. 468 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:09,980 Thanks for listening and remember to have a weekly review on fly day because fly days 469 00:26:09,980 --> 00:26:15,980 are for weekly reviews and for personal development to learn something new, checking out new tools, 470 00:26:15,980 --> 00:26:17,400 for example, new Nozbe. 471 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:19,220 And if you want, you can follow us on Mastodon. 472 00:26:19,220 --> 00:26:24,900 I'm at sobel@social.lol and Michael is at michael@nozbe.com. 473 00:26:24,900 --> 00:26:29,180 So if you enjoyed this episode, feel free to help support this podcast either by sharing 474 00:26:29,180 --> 00:26:33,040 it with a friend or leaving us a nice review in our podcast. 475 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:34,420 So that's it for today. 476 00:26:34,420 --> 00:26:36,700 So Michael, say some closing words. 477 00:26:36,700 --> 00:26:38,980 - So first of all, yes, we are on Mastodon 478 00:26:38,980 --> 00:26:40,460 and we have our own Mastodon server. 479 00:26:40,460 --> 00:26:43,360 That's why my handle is just like my email. 480 00:26:43,360 --> 00:26:45,180 So my email is michael@nosby.com 481 00:26:45,180 --> 00:26:48,620 and my handle on Mastodon is @michael@nosby.com. 482 00:26:48,620 --> 00:26:49,580 So that's one thing. 483 00:26:49,580 --> 00:26:53,020 And what just Rafo said, when you do a weekly review, 484 00:26:53,020 --> 00:26:54,300 take advantage of the new feature 485 00:26:54,300 --> 00:26:56,380 of getting the new Nozbe desktop app 486 00:26:56,380 --> 00:26:59,060 and put it to work in multiple windows 487 00:26:59,060 --> 00:27:02,620 and make your weekly review even more productive 488 00:27:02,620 --> 00:27:04,220 to go through all of your projects, 489 00:27:04,220 --> 00:27:08,660 of your tasks and make sure to use these two workspaces that you can have the 490 00:27:08,660 --> 00:27:14,500 private tasks only for yourself and the business tasks to work tasks and in the 491 00:27:14,500 --> 00:27:18,540 other space so make sure to take advantage of what Nozbe offers you the 492 00:27:18,540 --> 00:27:23,700 simplicity the sheer art of getting things done and of really managing and 493 00:27:23,700 --> 00:27:27,620 maintaining your work-life balance.