WEBVTT

NOTE
This file was generated by Descript 

00:00:09.690 --> 00:00:13.110
Cailin: Welcome everyone to
Faith and Purpose podcast.

00:00:13.870 --> 00:00:19.050
Each episode of this podcast contains the
personal testimony of an ordinary person

00:00:19.069 --> 00:00:21.810
transformed by an extraordinary God.

00:00:22.480 --> 00:00:25.640
My name is Kaylin and I'm
here to introduce this podcast

00:00:25.650 --> 00:00:27.180
for my friend Jesse Duke.

00:00:27.790 --> 00:00:33.259
Jesse is a husband, father, author,
life recovery guide, lay counselor,

00:00:33.740 --> 00:00:37.820
and small group leader, but his
most important role is disciple.

00:00:38.260 --> 00:00:39.710
As a disciple of Jesus.

00:00:40.190 --> 00:00:44.280
Jesse created this podcast to help other
believers tell their faith stories.

00:00:44.830 --> 00:00:48.629
We'll be hearing the personal
testimonies of all sorts of people

00:00:48.629 --> 00:00:52.560
who have one thing in common,
Jesus has transformed their lives.

00:00:53.465 --> 00:00:57.555
Jesus used parables because he created
us to learn best through story.

00:00:57.985 --> 00:01:02.775
And as we listen to how God has worked
in others lives, we find encouragement

00:01:02.785 --> 00:01:05.075
and inspiration for our own faith walk.

00:01:05.564 --> 00:01:09.935
Whether you are already a believer or
just a curious seeker, we believe that

00:01:09.955 --> 00:01:14.244
as you listen to these stories, you will
be encouraged on your own faith journey.

00:01:14.544 --> 00:01:18.954
We are sure that God can speak to you
through one of these episodes and that you

00:01:18.954 --> 00:01:23.044
will see that our Heavenly Father truly
works all things together for our good.

00:01:23.380 --> 00:01:25.290
When we simply love and trust him.

00:01:25.990 --> 00:01:29.360
If you are currently going through a
trial, we believe that you will come

00:01:29.360 --> 00:01:34.150
to see that your troubles, heartbreaks,
and failures are not gravestones, but

00:01:34.180 --> 00:01:36.750
stepping stones into new life in Christ.

00:01:37.180 --> 00:01:39.170
Here's Jesse with today's guest.

00:01:54.783 --> 00:01:55.833
Hey, this is Jesse.

00:01:56.913 --> 00:01:58.473
Before we get into today's story.

00:01:58.503 --> 00:01:59.163
I need to.

00:01:59.823 --> 00:02:00.963
Do a mayor Copa.

00:02:01.863 --> 00:02:03.363
In preparing for the interview.

00:02:03.363 --> 00:02:08.193
I relied on an old bio that I found
online thinking I was being clever

00:02:08.313 --> 00:02:10.593
to do my pre-interview homework.

00:02:11.673 --> 00:02:12.963
And without asking Mr.

00:02:12.963 --> 00:02:15.413
Marshall first, I use
that old information.

00:02:16.613 --> 00:02:19.613
But to his great credit and
he didn't ask for a retake.

00:02:19.973 --> 00:02:22.163
But used my mistake to praise God.

00:02:22.613 --> 00:02:23.303
As you hear.

00:02:23.993 --> 00:02:27.353
And of course I appreciated this
response and it made the rest of

00:02:27.353 --> 00:02:28.913
his story even more meaningful.

00:02:30.293 --> 00:02:33.833
So I learned another lesson about
how to do a podcast interview.

00:02:35.003 --> 00:02:35.903
Thank you Grayson.

00:02:37.223 --> 00:02:38.243
So here it is.

00:02:38.243 --> 00:02:38.303
Yeah.

00:02:39.722 --> 00:02:43.152
Jesse: Well, welcome everybody
to Faith and Purpose podcast.

00:02:43.702 --> 00:02:48.222
Today, I have a new friend, Grayson
Marshall, who's here to tell his story.

00:02:48.222 --> 00:02:53.892
Grayson is a husband and a father
of three girls and one boy.

00:02:53.902 --> 00:02:56.382
And he's got a lot more
going on than that.

00:02:56.382 --> 00:02:58.212
And I'm going to let him tell his story.

00:02:58.212 --> 00:03:01.499
So, uh,   I'm really
looking forward to this.

00:03:01.509 --> 00:03:03.099
How are you doing today, Grayson?

00:03:03.319 --> 00:03:04.109
I'm good, Jesse.

00:03:04.199 --> 00:03:04.709
I'm good.

00:03:04.759 --> 00:03:07.909
I want to make sure that we stay
integrous and, and truthful.

00:03:08.169 --> 00:03:09.299
I was married for 20 years.

00:03:09.299 --> 00:03:10.339
I am no longer married.

00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:13.679
I've been divorced five years, but
I have three beautiful daughters.

00:03:13.999 --> 00:03:15.629
One son and four grandkids.

00:03:15.639 --> 00:03:19.289
So, life in that space was
an amazing, amazing time.

00:03:19.889 --> 00:03:21.639
I appreciate the time as a father.

00:03:22.129 --> 00:03:25.109
those things will never leave
me when it comes down to it.

00:03:25.649 --> 00:03:27.519
The essence of my kids are who they are.

00:03:29.039 --> 00:03:31.259
what I went through made me better.

00:03:31.839 --> 00:03:35.129
so I look at that all
as a positive for me.

00:03:35.564 --> 00:03:38.974
It's made my new relationship one
of the most amazing ones ever.

00:03:39.374 --> 00:03:43.444
So I'm grateful for everything that
went on because it really allows

00:03:43.444 --> 00:03:47.214
me to embrace my new relationship
with Evie in an amazing way.

00:03:47.604 --> 00:03:51.694
So, I guess that's in light of
what we're talking about here, how

00:03:51.694 --> 00:03:53.804
things change when you meet God.

00:03:56.074 --> 00:04:00.024
my, you know, my story goes back to, I
was born and raised in Washington, D.

00:04:00.024 --> 00:04:00.344
C.

00:04:01.124 --> 00:04:04.494
And, um, uh, my mother was a
principal, my dad was a teacher.

00:04:05.434 --> 00:04:07.374
Uh, so I grew up in an educational family.

00:04:07.404 --> 00:04:11.584
My family was all about improvement,
being the best version of yourself.

00:04:11.634 --> 00:04:13.104
That was what I was raised in.

00:04:13.104 --> 00:04:16.274
I have a younger sister who is
the head of online education

00:04:16.274 --> 00:04:17.234
for the Department of Defense.

00:04:18.104 --> 00:04:21.454
So everybody in my family
was academically inclined.

00:04:21.454 --> 00:04:24.474
Um, that was a part of our DNA.

00:04:24.674 --> 00:04:28.174
And I think that, um, my parents
did the best job they could

00:04:28.184 --> 00:04:30.034
do to give me a blueprint.

00:04:30.454 --> 00:04:31.464
on how to live life.

00:04:32.154 --> 00:04:34.604
Um, I have a unique story,
I think, because I was born

00:04:34.604 --> 00:04:35.654
and raised Roman Catholic.

00:04:36.644 --> 00:04:41.484
So, that was the first introduction
to any sort of, and I'll use

00:04:41.484 --> 00:04:43.394
the term, religion that I had.

00:04:43.424 --> 00:04:48.164
So, because my mother was devout,
every aspect of Catholicism,

00:04:48.234 --> 00:04:49.904
I engaged in, you know.

00:04:49.904 --> 00:04:51.004
So, I was an altar boy.

00:04:51.404 --> 00:04:54.974
I went through my first penance, my
holy communion, all these things,

00:04:54.974 --> 00:04:58.834
and they were ritualistic things
that I just accepted as my life.

00:04:59.514 --> 00:05:03.484
So, it was never about relationship,
it was always about a ritual,

00:05:03.514 --> 00:05:04.504
it was always about a routine.

00:05:05.224 --> 00:05:08.254
And that's what I limited religion
to, that's what I thought it was.

00:05:08.784 --> 00:05:13.494
And, it was introduced to
me as a, it was a qualifying

00:05:13.494 --> 00:05:14.994
prerequisite to do anything else.

00:05:15.344 --> 00:05:17.984
Right, so if I wanted to play
sports, I had to go to church.

00:05:18.469 --> 00:05:21.489
I wanted to go to the Redskins
game on Sunday, I go to church, you

00:05:21.489 --> 00:05:22.749
know, that was always something.

00:05:22.749 --> 00:05:27.149
So God being first in my life, or
put it this way, church being first

00:05:27.149 --> 00:05:28.359
in my life was what I grew up in.

00:05:29.399 --> 00:05:32.369
I didn't really, I didn't
really know God, I knew church.

00:05:32.999 --> 00:05:36.429
And so I did church, I did church the
way that I was supposed to do church.

00:05:36.939 --> 00:05:41.249
Again, I believe that for me
personally, church was just a formality.

00:05:41.349 --> 00:05:45.909
It wasn't an, it wasn't an interesting
search to become, it was just

00:05:45.909 --> 00:05:46.909
something I had to go through.

00:05:47.499 --> 00:05:48.139
Grayson: Right.

00:05:48.139 --> 00:05:52.099
Jesse: But, you know, so I did that, but
I did know that my gifting and talent

00:05:52.099 --> 00:05:57.489
came from God, and as a young guy, I
was very, very athletically inclined.

00:05:57.579 --> 00:05:59.969
So I played everything growing up.

00:06:00.139 --> 00:06:02.039
Um, there was nothing I
didn't play growing up.

00:06:02.299 --> 00:06:05.769
I swam, I ran, I played basketball,
I played football, I played

00:06:05.769 --> 00:06:07.004
baseball, I did everything.

00:06:07.374 --> 00:06:13.794
and because I excelled in sports, I
was able to obtain a, um, a private

00:06:13.794 --> 00:06:17.884
school education, my mom and dad made
the sacrifice because they always gave

00:06:17.884 --> 00:06:21.964
me what they believe was the upper hand
to being the best version of myself.

00:06:22.894 --> 00:06:28.084
Uh, I got to, uh, I ended up going to
a boys military school from seventh

00:06:28.084 --> 00:06:29.754
to 12th grade, all boys military.

00:06:30.534 --> 00:06:32.064
And, uh, it was a choice that I made.

00:06:32.504 --> 00:06:34.974
And I made the choice because I
always wanted to be different.

00:06:35.824 --> 00:06:37.024
Growing up in Washington, D.

00:06:37.024 --> 00:06:41.644
C., sports is something that
is, uh, very well appreciated,

00:06:41.644 --> 00:06:43.294
established, and looked at.

00:06:44.004 --> 00:06:49.054
And there were schools that were
known for success in basketball.

00:06:49.944 --> 00:06:51.764
And everybody wanted to go there.

00:06:51.764 --> 00:06:53.854
Well, I decided I wanted
to go to the rival.

00:06:55.004 --> 00:06:56.574
And so I said, I don't
want to go where you are.

00:06:56.574 --> 00:06:57.604
I want to go to the other side.

00:06:58.369 --> 00:07:02.689
And I convinced a group of my guys
to go to the other school with me.

00:07:03.399 --> 00:07:07.979
And we ended up becoming their rival
and literally winning more than we

00:07:07.979 --> 00:07:09.609
lost against the number one team.

00:07:10.779 --> 00:07:10.959
So I think,

00:07:11.079 --> 00:07:12.469
Grayson: at the military school?

00:07:13.209 --> 00:07:14.149
Jesse: yeah, it was military school.

00:07:14.349 --> 00:07:14.699
Right.

00:07:14.959 --> 00:07:15.289
Grayson: Okay.

00:07:15.299 --> 00:07:16.579
Is that, and that was in D.

00:07:16.579 --> 00:07:17.009
C.?

00:07:17.329 --> 00:07:18.039
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:07:18.079 --> 00:07:18.559
Uh, St.

00:07:18.559 --> 00:07:23.069
John's, which is now COED, but it
was an all boy, 2607 military road.

00:07:23.629 --> 00:07:24.259
Grayson: Okay.

00:07:24.824 --> 00:07:26.414
Jesse: We actually wore full regalia.

00:07:26.414 --> 00:07:29.484
We were in, um, full cadet
uniforms all day long.

00:07:30.004 --> 00:07:35.014
And, um, we actually did inspection
every morning, um, before class.

00:07:35.414 --> 00:07:39.624
And then after school on Tuesdays and
Thursdays, we actually had drills.

00:07:39.624 --> 00:07:42.604
We had to march and practice formation
and do those kinds of things.

00:07:42.904 --> 00:07:44.354
So we did that all growing up.

00:07:44.354 --> 00:07:45.624
So I combined that.

00:07:45.624 --> 00:07:47.684
And the reason people didn't want
to go there is because they didn't

00:07:47.684 --> 00:07:48.424
want to wear the military uniform.

00:07:49.504 --> 00:07:51.934
So I decided, okay, now I didn't
have a military background.

00:07:51.954 --> 00:07:54.954
My dad was in the army, but that
was never an influence on my life.

00:07:55.324 --> 00:07:56.694
I just was going to be different.

00:07:57.014 --> 00:07:58.464
I just like doing what
everybody else wasn't doing.

00:07:58.714 --> 00:07:59.394
That was just me.

00:07:59.622 --> 00:08:06.052
And so, um, I ended up getting, um,
good enough in basketball to, uh,

00:08:06.252 --> 00:08:10.022
be offered a scholarship to play
at the collegiate level, and that

00:08:10.022 --> 00:08:12.752
was done at Clemson university.

00:08:13.382 --> 00:08:17.042
So I was able to go to Clemson
in South Carolina, not real, not

00:08:17.042 --> 00:08:19.122
realizing at the time that my.

00:08:19.637 --> 00:08:22.867
Um, familial heritage was
reared in South Carolina.

00:08:23.397 --> 00:08:26.277
So, um, my grandfather, my
paternal grandfather was from

00:08:26.277 --> 00:08:30.157
South Carolina and my maternal
grandmother was from South Carolina.

00:08:30.197 --> 00:08:33.277
I didn't know that at the
time, um, but figured that out.

00:08:33.277 --> 00:08:35.937
So, obviously, I was going back to
my roots and I didn't know that.

00:08:36.977 --> 00:08:39.597
I ended up going to Clemson
and it was a crazy set of

00:08:39.597 --> 00:08:41.097
circumstances that got me there.

00:08:41.807 --> 00:08:46.022
Because I had actually Committed to
University of Richmond, which was

00:08:46.022 --> 00:08:47.622
90 minutes away from Washington, D.

00:08:47.622 --> 00:08:47.972
C.

00:08:48.332 --> 00:08:52.182
Thought I'd be close to home, my parents
would come see me all the time, play,

00:08:52.192 --> 00:08:53.382
I thought it was the best scenario.

00:08:53.972 --> 00:08:58.782
And I ended up, um, literally auditioning
for Clemson without knowing it.

00:08:59.552 --> 00:09:02.282
And the audition went so well,
because we were playing that number

00:09:02.282 --> 00:09:04.892
one team I was telling you about,
the audition went so well that they

00:09:04.892 --> 00:09:06.422
offered me a scholarship the next day.

00:09:07.267 --> 00:09:07.617
Grayson: Wow.

00:09:08.372 --> 00:09:12.172
Jesse: And I said, I flew to Clemson,
the Albany scholarship, and I took it.

00:09:12.172 --> 00:09:15.072
I verbally committed to it because
that was the best basketball

00:09:15.072 --> 00:09:15.922
conference in the world.

00:09:16.292 --> 00:09:17.442
I said, I'm going to
play against the best.

00:09:19.727 --> 00:09:20.777
I come back home.

00:09:20.837 --> 00:09:21.887
I'm excited about it.

00:09:21.917 --> 00:09:26.247
And about a couple weeks later, the coach
that recruited me took another job at

00:09:26.247 --> 00:09:30.337
the University of Miami, and he wanted
me to go to Miami and sit out a year.

00:09:31.087 --> 00:09:32.977
And I said, I'm not
sitting out for anybody.

00:09:33.297 --> 00:09:35.587
I said, so I went back
and started over again.

00:09:35.587 --> 00:09:36.707
Richmond still wanted me.

00:09:37.387 --> 00:09:38.797
So I'm headed back to Richmond.

00:09:38.807 --> 00:09:43.547
Well, the next day, Clemson
hires Cliff Ellis as a new coach.

00:09:44.807 --> 00:09:47.617
And that year, Cliff, the year
before Cliff had been, um.

00:09:47.972 --> 00:09:50.242
He had been coaching in the
Sunbelt of South Alabama.

00:09:52.762 --> 00:09:57.192
My uncle, who was an excellent basketball
player at the time, was a nationally

00:09:57.192 --> 00:09:58.822
evaluated referees at the time.

00:09:59.072 --> 00:10:00.902
And that year he was
working in the Sunbelt.

00:10:01.802 --> 00:10:05.122
So Cliff Ellis found out that Jim
Hollow was my mother's brother.

00:10:06.432 --> 00:10:11.277
And Cliff calls my uncle and says, I
need to talk to your nephew because

00:10:11.277 --> 00:10:14.457
all the other kids that had verbally
committed left and went to Miami.

00:10:14.717 --> 00:10:15.577
I was the only one left.

00:10:16.867 --> 00:10:21.287
And so he calls me up and he says,
you need to meet with this guy.

00:10:21.957 --> 00:10:24.807
And I said, Uncle Jim, I'll meet with
him, but I'm not going to Clemson

00:10:25.887 --> 00:10:27.237
because I'd already gone through that.

00:10:27.237 --> 00:10:28.387
I don't want to do that again.

00:10:29.087 --> 00:10:30.987
So, but because of you,
I'll meet with him.

00:10:31.107 --> 00:10:33.257
And the next day, Cliff
Ellis was at my house.

00:10:34.252 --> 00:10:38.212
And he talked, we talked for about two
hours and next thing I know is right

00:10:38.212 --> 00:10:41.742
back at Clemson and it's the best thing,
the best thing that ever happened to me.

00:10:42.262 --> 00:10:46.472
And I say that, Jesse, because
even when I didn't know God,

00:10:46.832 --> 00:10:48.282
I can look back and see God.

00:10:49.352 --> 00:10:54.092
Even when I didn't really understand
what I know now, I can actually look

00:10:54.102 --> 00:10:59.242
back over my life and see where he kept
me, how he kept me, how he guided my

00:10:59.242 --> 00:11:00.722
steps when I didn't know he was doing it.

00:11:01.702 --> 00:11:07.562
Um, I can see in my life where I
was walking by faith as a practice

00:11:07.562 --> 00:11:10.582
a long time ago because I didn't
know what I was getting into.

00:11:10.582 --> 00:11:13.622
I was going to a school that
the coach didn't even know me.

00:11:14.572 --> 00:11:16.602
He had never, he had never
personally seen me play.

00:11:17.362 --> 00:11:21.102
He was going on the fact that I
had verbally committed and went

00:11:21.102 --> 00:11:22.402
out and recruited some of the kids.

00:11:22.402 --> 00:11:25.322
So when I got to Clemson, there
were other kids he had recruited.

00:11:25.932 --> 00:11:31.972
And at first I said to myself, I made
a mistake, but I was always raised

00:11:31.992 --> 00:11:33.092
to follow through in your commitment.

00:11:34.212 --> 00:11:38.322
And for me, or for what I was reared
in, school was not about sports.

00:11:38.332 --> 00:11:39.442
It was about getting your degree.

00:11:40.232 --> 00:11:42.152
So I said, all I want
to do is get my degree.

00:11:42.202 --> 00:11:43.932
That was my whole purpose for doing it.

00:11:44.367 --> 00:11:47.807
Grayson: Yeah, I read somewhere
that your goal was to not have your

00:11:47.827 --> 00:11:50.067
parents pay for your education.

00:11:51.007 --> 00:11:53.637
You wanted to get it on your
own, and that was awesome.

00:11:53.997 --> 00:11:55.917
Jesse: Yeah, that was my, my,
my whole purpose for getting a

00:11:55.917 --> 00:11:58.237
scholarship was because so they
wouldn't have to pay for college.

00:11:58.297 --> 00:11:59.497
That was my whole reason for doing it.

00:11:59.987 --> 00:12:00.397
Grayson: Mm hmm.

00:12:00.737 --> 00:12:03.637
Jesse: And when I got that, I
was kind of, okay, I did this.

00:12:03.997 --> 00:12:06.977
So then I have my own little plan
about how I was going to, because

00:12:06.977 --> 00:12:09.977
I wanted to play, but I have my own
little plan about getting it done.

00:12:09.977 --> 00:12:12.077
Cause this is the best
conference in the world.

00:12:12.517 --> 00:12:15.767
The guy who is starting, I've
been starting for two years.

00:12:15.767 --> 00:12:18.117
So I figured I'm going to go compete.

00:12:18.627 --> 00:12:20.057
I'll compete for some time.

00:12:20.447 --> 00:12:22.767
And then by the time I'm
a junior, it's my game.

00:12:23.287 --> 00:12:24.807
Cause that's how it
happened in high school.

00:12:25.347 --> 00:12:25.767
Grayson: Mm hmm.

00:12:25.937 --> 00:12:27.637
Jesse: By the time I was
a junior, it was my game.

00:12:27.657 --> 00:12:29.217
So I said, okay, I'll just
do this all over again.

00:12:29.697 --> 00:12:31.207
Well, God had a different plan.

00:12:31.257 --> 00:12:35.017
He accelerated the process and I
ended up starting as a freshman

00:12:35.767 --> 00:12:38.047
and I started from four years.

00:12:38.617 --> 00:12:42.317
I graduated the all time ACC career
assist leader when I graduated.

00:12:42.947 --> 00:12:45.007
I still hold every
assist record at Clemson.

00:12:45.394 --> 00:12:50.494
I was inducted into the hall of fame in
2009 and named an ACC legend in 2016.

00:12:51.014 --> 00:12:52.174
So I made the right decision.

00:12:52.174 --> 00:12:57.014
But at the time, if I looked at what
I was doing, this seemed to be crazy.

00:12:57.154 --> 00:12:59.284
You're going to play for somebody
who's never seen you play before.

00:13:00.034 --> 00:13:04.164
And so when I look back again,
when I think people, as they really

00:13:04.214 --> 00:13:08.674
evaluate their lives, If they really
take a hard look at where they are

00:13:08.674 --> 00:13:13.334
today, they can really see where they
could have been, and they'll need to

00:13:13.334 --> 00:13:16.454
understand that that was God, because
you could have been somewhere else.

00:13:16.634 --> 00:13:18.564
You could have been in anything else.

00:13:18.774 --> 00:13:21.984
But God kept me through all that, and I
was, you know, I was excited about that.

00:13:22.704 --> 00:13:28.904
I think that going to college and
then getting out, Jesse, was when

00:13:28.904 --> 00:13:34.124
I really began to look for answers.

00:13:35.004 --> 00:13:40.024
I think that growing up, when you're
When you excel academically, when you

00:13:40.024 --> 00:13:45.714
excel athletically, we think we're
the answer and pretty much for, for

00:13:45.714 --> 00:13:49.374
all intents and purposes, because
we're not focused on anything else,

00:13:50.434 --> 00:13:57.044
we rely on ourselves and sports as
a platform is driven by motivation.

00:13:57.754 --> 00:14:01.594
You know, that's the, that's the elemental
mantra of sports being motivated.

00:14:01.624 --> 00:14:01.984
Right.

00:14:02.644 --> 00:14:07.014
And, um, it was for me,
I subscribed to that.

00:14:08.284 --> 00:14:09.314
I even talked to my book.

00:14:09.314 --> 00:14:11.174
I said, I wasn't motivated.

00:14:11.174 --> 00:14:11.794
I was competitive.

00:14:13.504 --> 00:14:17.214
I've always had this thing about
motivation and I never subscribed to it.

00:14:17.344 --> 00:14:18.024
I was competitive.

00:14:18.024 --> 00:14:18.744
I wasn't motivated.

00:14:19.734 --> 00:14:26.884
And the competition was I just had to
be better and it wasn't in comparison,

00:14:26.894 --> 00:14:28.274
it was just, I want to be better.

00:14:28.274 --> 00:14:29.044
I don't like to lose.

00:14:29.074 --> 00:14:33.024
That was just kind of where my
mindset was and I really didn't leave.

00:14:33.244 --> 00:14:38.394
I really didn't understand that
these were mindsets of Christ.

00:14:39.074 --> 00:14:41.004
I can do all things through
Christ who strengthens me.

00:14:41.004 --> 00:14:44.994
When I really look at the mindset that
I had, it was really a Christ mindset.

00:14:46.029 --> 00:14:49.509
When it came down to the foundational
beliefs, because I never bought into

00:14:49.509 --> 00:14:53.509
motivation, I bought into competitive,
I bought into drive, I bought into

00:14:53.779 --> 00:14:57.419
purpose, I bought into will, I bought
into destiny, I bought into faith.

00:14:57.779 --> 00:15:00.129
And I didn't even know what I
was buying into at the time.

00:15:00.129 --> 00:15:00.939
I had no idea.

00:15:02.599 --> 00:15:07.493
So when I got out of school, because
that was my mindset, Jesse, I had

00:15:07.493 --> 00:15:09.443
no aspiration to play pro sports.

00:15:10.453 --> 00:15:13.923
And when I talked to people about that,
they're like, well, you were here, you

00:15:13.923 --> 00:15:15.553
were, you were right, that was you.

00:15:16.293 --> 00:15:17.103
But it wasn't me.

00:15:18.003 --> 00:15:24.378
And probably should have been,
but it wasn't based on where I got

00:15:24.378 --> 00:15:28.278
and what I had achieved and many
estimations what I'd overachieved.

00:15:28.868 --> 00:15:30.548
Why would I not go to the next level?

00:15:31.138 --> 00:15:36.388
Well, because I was married to Plan
B and I'll break that down for you.

00:15:36.928 --> 00:15:39.798
There's a verse of scripture, Jesse,
that changed my life 20 something

00:15:39.798 --> 00:15:43.008
years ago, and it's Mark 7 and 13.

00:15:44.078 --> 00:15:48.218
And it says the traditions of man
make the Word of God in none effect.

00:15:49.928 --> 00:15:50.918
Man's traditions.

00:15:50.918 --> 00:15:51.678
And what does that mean?

00:15:51.908 --> 00:15:56.058
That means what you have
accepted as your path in life.

00:15:56.318 --> 00:15:57.768
What you see around you.

00:15:58.098 --> 00:16:00.668
What you see on a normal basis.

00:16:00.668 --> 00:16:01.488
Man's tradition.

00:16:02.358 --> 00:16:04.868
So man's tradition for me said
go to school, get your degree.

00:16:06.058 --> 00:16:06.388
Right?

00:16:06.778 --> 00:16:09.078
Man's tradition never told
me to pursue my passion.

00:16:10.258 --> 00:16:12.078
I grew up with, again,
with educated parents.

00:16:12.078 --> 00:16:13.368
I grew up with parents who were educators.

00:16:13.638 --> 00:16:15.428
Never told me to pursue my passion.

00:16:15.778 --> 00:16:17.028
Never talked to me about my passion.

00:16:17.028 --> 00:16:17.178
Man's tradition.

00:16:17.698 --> 00:16:19.438
And I believe that's, that's
an element of the world.

00:16:19.438 --> 00:16:20.188
It's not just my parents.

00:16:20.368 --> 00:16:24.118
I don't believe many people have
been taught to follow their passions.

00:16:24.378 --> 00:16:26.898
I believe most people have been
taught to follow what they're good at.

00:16:27.958 --> 00:16:31.458
I mean, I believe most people have been
told to follow what they test well at.

00:16:32.368 --> 00:16:35.528
I believe many people have been taught
to follow what pays the most, right?

00:16:35.598 --> 00:16:38.748
I think these are the prerequisites
for what you do and not your passion.

00:16:39.298 --> 00:16:40.388
So I was just like everybody else.

00:16:40.438 --> 00:16:44.368
I excelled in what I was supposed to
be doing, not my passion, And for the

00:16:44.388 --> 00:16:45.868
most part, I didn't know what that was.

00:16:46.328 --> 00:16:48.508
So it's kind of hard to excel in
something when you don't know what it is.

00:16:49.678 --> 00:16:54.108
So when I talk about being
married to plan B, plan B was

00:16:54.128 --> 00:16:55.548
always something to fall back on.

00:16:55.558 --> 00:16:57.508
Your degree was always
something to fall back on.

00:16:58.768 --> 00:17:02.521
And when I look at God and when
I look at what he has done in

00:17:02.521 --> 00:17:04.111
life, there was no plan B for God.

00:17:04.938 --> 00:17:05.878
It was always plan A.

00:17:06.018 --> 00:17:07.248
It was always just the
way it's going to be.

00:17:07.828 --> 00:17:09.938
But we subsequently live in plan B.

00:17:10.348 --> 00:17:12.058
And here's what I realized about plan B.

00:17:12.588 --> 00:17:15.268
Plan B puts you comfortable.

00:17:17.718 --> 00:17:20.308
I say the greatest adversary that we face.

00:17:20.848 --> 00:17:22.268
It's not a spiritual devil.

00:17:22.598 --> 00:17:23.988
It's not social issues.

00:17:24.118 --> 00:17:25.458
It's not a bad economy.

00:17:25.928 --> 00:17:29.848
The biggest struggle that we face, the
biggest adversary we face is comfort.

00:17:31.358 --> 00:17:32.018
Grayson: Yeah, that's good.

00:17:32.078 --> 00:17:35.168
Jesse: Because when you get
comfortable, you're no threat.

00:17:36.273 --> 00:17:40.273
See, the internet only attacks someone
or goes after somebody who's a threat.

00:17:41.573 --> 00:17:44.733
We've been seduced so much into being
comfortable, we're not a threat.

00:17:45.113 --> 00:17:50.183
We don't strike fear in the end because
all I have to do is get you comfortable.

00:17:50.793 --> 00:17:51.523
How do I do that?

00:17:51.723 --> 00:17:53.623
Maybe I'll give you
some governmental money.

00:17:53.763 --> 00:17:56.143
Maybe I'll put you in a career
that makes you comfortable.

00:17:56.253 --> 00:17:59.293
Maybe I'll put you in a church
that makes you comfortable.

00:18:00.403 --> 00:18:01.183
Now you're not a threat.

00:18:01.443 --> 00:18:03.603
I don't have to buy, I don't
have to worry about you.

00:18:04.743 --> 00:18:09.063
And so I let you literally take care
of yourself and move you away from your

00:18:09.063 --> 00:18:11.073
passion because you're not a threat.

00:18:11.713 --> 00:18:15.333
You've been accustomed to
systems, and you'd rather

00:18:15.353 --> 00:18:17.903
perform than pursue your passion.

00:18:19.368 --> 00:18:21.978
Grayson: So let me just clarify this now.

00:18:22.048 --> 00:18:27.988
So plan B is when we pursue our
strengths, what we, we know we

00:18:27.988 --> 00:18:31.148
can, we can do in our own strength.

00:18:31.818 --> 00:18:33.048
Plan A would be.

00:18:33.618 --> 00:18:35.918
following our passion,
which is God's plan.

00:18:36.313 --> 00:18:36.653
Jesse: Correct.

00:18:36.723 --> 00:18:41.523
So, so when I get to, when I look at plan
B, so like, look at it this way, Jesse.

00:18:43.123 --> 00:18:47.363
Plan A would be to play professional
basketball, if that was my plan A.

00:18:47.743 --> 00:18:49.683
But plan B is my degree to fall back on.

00:18:50.413 --> 00:18:51.013
So here's what happens.

00:18:51.608 --> 00:18:57.208
If plan B is already there, I never
fully engage in plan A, never, because

00:18:57.208 --> 00:18:58.818
I've always got plan B here, right?

00:18:58.858 --> 00:19:05.648
I never, I never do that, but if plan B
is not there, all I got is plan A, that

00:19:05.648 --> 00:19:07.458
means everything I do goes into plan A.

00:19:07.628 --> 00:19:09.908
That means I had to have
total faith in plan A.

00:19:10.128 --> 00:19:13.888
If I have plan B, all my faith isn't
in plan A, it's in both plan A and

00:19:13.888 --> 00:19:17.238
plan B, and faith can't be split.

00:19:19.888 --> 00:19:23.118
The reality of it is for most of
us, this is where we find ourselves.

00:19:23.528 --> 00:19:25.938
And so we find ourselves
not walking by faith.

00:19:26.323 --> 00:19:29.043
We end up walking by sight, even
though the word tells us that

00:19:29.043 --> 00:19:30.993
Corinthians 5 7 don't do that, right?

00:19:32.173 --> 00:19:36.943
We think about what faith is, and by
biblical definition, the Bible says faith

00:19:37.073 --> 00:19:38.873
is the substance of things hoped for.

00:19:39.633 --> 00:19:41.733
The evidence of things not seen.

00:19:42.593 --> 00:19:46.223
Well, in our English language,
Jesse, evidence is faith.

00:19:46.643 --> 00:19:47.593
Is things you see.

00:19:49.363 --> 00:19:51.853
So when we're looking for
evidence, even though we don't

00:19:51.853 --> 00:19:54.013
want to, evidence is what we see.

00:19:54.013 --> 00:19:56.903
So we literally walk by what we
see and we're not supposed to.

00:19:57.643 --> 00:20:03.733
He says the evidence things not seen, but
we're always looking for God to show up.

00:20:03.783 --> 00:20:04.793
I need a sign.

00:20:05.043 --> 00:20:05.983
That's evidence.

00:20:07.393 --> 00:20:08.543
That's something to see.

00:20:09.463 --> 00:20:11.673
Walking by faith is the
things you don't see.

00:20:11.953 --> 00:20:17.713
So when I began to look at where
I was in life, I had to really

00:20:17.723 --> 00:20:19.933
reassess so many other things.

00:20:20.728 --> 00:20:29.368
And once I really got into my Bible
at 27, when I was homeless, then I

00:20:29.368 --> 00:20:33.918
began to grab and understand some
principles that I'd always lived by, I

00:20:33.918 --> 00:20:34.998
just didn't know how to explain them.

00:20:35.978 --> 00:20:39.918
They began to make sense to me, even
though I had lived them, but I didn't know

00:20:40.118 --> 00:20:41.628
where they were, where they came from.

00:20:42.238 --> 00:20:43.408
They just seemed to fit.

00:20:44.088 --> 00:20:49.388
And so when I began to really look
at what it took and things that were

00:20:49.388 --> 00:20:52.528
there, that began to change my life.

00:20:53.418 --> 00:20:55.248
Getting to know Christ.

00:20:55.923 --> 00:20:59.643
Was something that was
unbelievably beneficial for me

00:21:00.233 --> 00:21:02.253
Grayson: let me interrupt you right there.

00:21:02.477 --> 00:21:07.248
I need to ask you, how did you
get from that Catholic upbringing

00:21:07.248 --> 00:21:11.656
to  where you came to at 27?

00:21:11.661 --> 00:21:17.992
Jesse: when I got to 27, I had already
tried to make a life change prior to that.

00:21:17.992 --> 00:21:24.022
So I knew Jesse that when I realized
my degree wasn't what it was

00:21:24.032 --> 00:21:27.882
supposed to be for me, that was,
that was a harsh reality for me.

00:21:27.882 --> 00:21:28.192
Right.

00:21:28.412 --> 00:21:32.922
When I, when I, when I did what they
asked me to do, and I really believe

00:21:32.922 --> 00:21:35.942
I prescribed to the student athlete,
the way it was supposed to be done.

00:21:36.777 --> 00:21:39.867
I get out here, take my degree,
use my degree and go build a life.

00:21:40.767 --> 00:21:45.807
What I found was, is that that
degree was a disadvantage more

00:21:45.807 --> 00:21:47.087
than an advantage many times.

00:21:47.337 --> 00:21:48.966
Grayson: Mm hmm.

00:21:49.727 --> 00:21:53.647
Jesse: has four years experience, and
he's been doing it since high school,

00:21:54.237 --> 00:21:58.267
and Grayson Marshall has four years
of college and has never done it,

00:21:58.647 --> 00:22:02.177
when Jesse Dukes and Grayson Marshall
sit down, Jesse Dukes gets hired.

00:22:02.187 --> 00:22:02.507
Why?

00:22:02.637 --> 00:22:03.787
Because he has four years experience.

00:22:05.152 --> 00:22:07.902
So what did I literally gain from college?

00:22:07.992 --> 00:22:09.392
I gained world experience.

00:22:09.692 --> 00:22:14.432
I gained, uh, access to maybe things
other people don't have, but I'm behind

00:22:14.432 --> 00:22:19.362
the, I'm behind the game now because
Jesse, who didn't even go to college, is

00:22:19.362 --> 00:22:21.242
already making more money than Grayson.

00:22:22.092 --> 00:22:24.942
He's already got a four year head
start in the working world on Grayson.

00:22:25.682 --> 00:22:29.012
So literally what I thought
was a benefit for me.

00:22:29.872 --> 00:22:32.352
Really became a detractor
more times than not.

00:22:33.332 --> 00:22:34.302
So that was frustrating.

00:22:34.602 --> 00:22:37.522
And I knew competitively,
Jesse, I wanted more.

00:22:38.232 --> 00:22:39.732
I knew that I wanted stuff.

00:22:40.212 --> 00:22:41.102
I knew that I wanted life.

00:22:41.102 --> 00:22:43.052
So how are people getting stuff?

00:22:43.212 --> 00:22:44.792
How are people living this dream?

00:22:45.212 --> 00:22:50.392
I, I, um, I sheepishly say that
growing up, I love soap opera.

00:22:51.652 --> 00:22:54.872
I used to watch soap operas growing
up and I watched them because.

00:22:55.327 --> 00:23:00.757
I knew it was TV, but I love the
illusion of what I thought at that

00:23:00.757 --> 00:23:01.957
time, but I knew it wasn't real.

00:23:01.957 --> 00:23:05.997
But being a corporate executive,
you know, walking into boardrooms

00:23:05.997 --> 00:23:09.817
and making decisions and wearing
suits every day, I mean, to me, it

00:23:09.817 --> 00:23:10.687
was the coolest thing in the world.

00:23:11.247 --> 00:23:12.307
And that's what I really wanted.

00:23:12.367 --> 00:23:16.217
I wanted to be in the business
world, but I didn't have anybody

00:23:16.217 --> 00:23:16.947
that was in the business world.

00:23:17.027 --> 00:23:19.177
My parents were both in the working world.

00:23:19.787 --> 00:23:23.937
So I began to pursue business without
a coach, without somebody to teach me.

00:23:24.542 --> 00:23:26.022
And ultimately, when
you do that, you fail.

00:23:26.832 --> 00:23:28.782
Well, I failed miserably at times.

00:23:29.202 --> 00:23:31.442
Success sometimes, misery at other times.

00:23:33.032 --> 00:23:35.012
that's when I found myself
without a place to live.

00:23:36.542 --> 00:23:40.622
And it was at that time that I
literally just was really crying out.

00:23:40.632 --> 00:23:44.292
And I remember my grandmother
giving me a book in college.

00:23:44.342 --> 00:23:46.332
Now, my grandmother was
saved as you can be.

00:23:47.122 --> 00:23:48.942
My maternal grandmother.

00:23:49.392 --> 00:23:52.732
And she gave me a book called
Hind's Feet on High Places.

00:23:53.147 --> 00:23:53.487
Grayson: Yeah.

00:23:53.742 --> 00:23:54.732
Jesse: And it was about David.

00:23:55.012 --> 00:23:57.522
And so I began to really
study the life of David.

00:23:58.592 --> 00:24:04.272
And I began to watch and look and
learn, and then I said, well, after

00:24:04.272 --> 00:24:06.972
reading this and being who I am,
the Catholic Church doesn't help me.

00:24:07.742 --> 00:24:11.622
I just said that now I don't, I
don't reduce the Catholic Church.

00:24:11.882 --> 00:24:13.712
I believe there's salvation
in the Catholic Church.

00:24:13.722 --> 00:24:17.132
There's a lot of Catholics I know that
love God and they, they're born again.

00:24:18.102 --> 00:24:20.502
But, I couldn't go back
to the Catholic Church.

00:24:20.512 --> 00:24:24.542
There was nothing about that that drew me
back, and there was no God for me there.

00:24:24.972 --> 00:24:29.592
So I began to look for a church here
in Jacksonville, and I remember driving

00:24:29.592 --> 00:24:34.172
down the road, and I looked up on a
billboard, and because I didn't know

00:24:34.172 --> 00:24:37.302
anything about church, I figured if
there was a pastor on a billboard,

00:24:38.152 --> 00:24:39.922
then he had to be legit, right?

00:24:40.332 --> 00:24:43.122
So I didn't think he did that,
because I, you never saw a

00:24:43.272 --> 00:24:44.522
Catholic church on a billboard.

00:24:45.007 --> 00:24:48.807
So I'm like, okay, well, maybe this,
so I remember seeing the pastors, uh,

00:24:49.987 --> 00:24:51.697
uh, advertising on the billboards.

00:24:52.037 --> 00:24:56.807
And so I just drove to the church
and I pulled up to the church and

00:24:56.807 --> 00:25:00.237
I tried to pull in the doors to get
in and all the doors were locked.

00:25:01.577 --> 00:25:04.227
And the first thing that went through
my mind, Jesse was this, I've been

00:25:04.227 --> 00:25:06.957
sinning so bad, I can't even get into
the church when I'm trying to get.

00:25:07.827 --> 00:25:09.397
That was my, that was
what went through my head.

00:25:10.437 --> 00:25:13.647
And I turned to walk away and
a guy came and opened the door.

00:25:14.397 --> 00:25:16.727
His name was Drake Johnson,
minister Drake Johnson.

00:25:17.347 --> 00:25:23.417
And, um, he took me and we talked for six
hours, took me to get something to eat.

00:25:23.877 --> 00:25:25.467
And I began to pour my heart out to him.

00:25:25.467 --> 00:25:28.997
And we talked for six hours
and he invited me to church.

00:25:30.327 --> 00:25:31.937
And so I ended up going.

00:25:32.292 --> 00:25:33.982
to church with him.

00:25:34.592 --> 00:25:36.352
And I didn't know
anything about salvation.

00:25:36.352 --> 00:25:37.572
I didn't know anything about anything.

00:25:37.612 --> 00:25:37.952
Right.

00:25:37.972 --> 00:25:40.112
But there was an altar call.

00:25:40.332 --> 00:25:41.422
I didn't even know what that was.

00:25:41.492 --> 00:25:43.222
There was an altar call and they
said, if you want to give your

00:25:43.222 --> 00:25:45.461
life to Jesus, come on down here.

00:25:46.142 --> 00:25:48.802
So I guess I was in a place of brokenness.

00:25:49.762 --> 00:25:53.872
And again, I did not know what I
was doing, but Jesus come to him.

00:25:53.922 --> 00:25:54.662
Sounds good.

00:25:54.732 --> 00:25:55.252
I'm going down.

00:25:56.042 --> 00:25:57.762
So I walked down to the front of church.

00:25:59.017 --> 00:26:03.667
And they began to pray and then they
took us in his back room right now.

00:26:03.667 --> 00:26:08.597
I didn't get, I had no idea what speaking
in tongues was and none of that stuff.

00:26:08.657 --> 00:26:12.027
And when I got to the back room,
Jesse, they took us in his back room.

00:26:12.027 --> 00:26:13.457
And to me, it was kind of spooky, right?

00:26:13.457 --> 00:26:16.297
Cause you go into this room, all
these lights on and all these

00:26:16.297 --> 00:26:17.667
people are praying in tongues.

00:26:17.667 --> 00:26:21.227
And I'm sitting in Jesse when my
hands lifted up with one eye open.

00:26:21.547 --> 00:26:22.917
I'm like, I don't trust you, right?

00:26:22.917 --> 00:26:23.874
I mean, that's just where I was.

00:26:24.263 --> 00:26:27.854
I'm being, I was like, this is
all new to me, but I figured I

00:26:27.854 --> 00:26:30.644
knew what I'd gone through as a
Catholic wasn't gonna help me.

00:26:30.644 --> 00:26:33.004
So I said, Okay, well, I'll
see what this looks like.

00:26:33.864 --> 00:26:36.524
And I got, you know, got there
came back to service a couple

00:26:36.524 --> 00:26:40.214
times and I remember feeling lost.

00:26:41.184 --> 00:26:41.604
Right.

00:26:41.964 --> 00:26:45.039
I remember hearing him
preach and just feeling lost.

00:26:45.659 --> 00:26:48.479
Not like I didn't understand, like,
where are you going with this message?

00:26:48.489 --> 00:26:49.529
Like, it doesn't mean anything.

00:26:49.759 --> 00:26:52.809
It was more of the, it was more
the animations, the antics.

00:26:53.069 --> 00:26:54.799
It was the hooping, it was
all that kind of stuff.

00:26:54.799 --> 00:26:56.969
And I'm like, what,
what, what, what is this?

00:26:57.229 --> 00:27:03.009
So I'm like, I left there and
at that time I was doing radio.

00:27:03.789 --> 00:27:08.399
And my producer on the show, I was telling
him about, you know, getting, getting

00:27:08.399 --> 00:27:10.379
saved and how my heart was feeling.

00:27:10.379 --> 00:27:12.139
And he goes, man, you
need to come to my church.

00:27:13.479 --> 00:27:14.769
And I said, okay.

00:27:15.439 --> 00:27:18.839
And he told me that his church
name was the Potter's house.

00:27:20.109 --> 00:27:22.329
And I said, well, that ain't
no name, no church, man.

00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:24.219
I ain't going to a place
called the Potter's house.

00:27:24.369 --> 00:27:25.079
I don't know what that is.

00:27:25.499 --> 00:27:29.049
So he told me about, he told me about
the book of Jeremiah and being on a

00:27:29.049 --> 00:27:30.649
potter's wheel, and that was his based on.

00:27:30.719 --> 00:27:31.169
I said, okay.

00:27:32.024 --> 00:27:33.394
So he said, well, I
said, when's the service?

00:27:33.444 --> 00:27:34.214
They're Friday night.

00:27:34.214 --> 00:27:35.654
I said, man, I'll go
to my church on Friday.

00:27:35.704 --> 00:27:39.184
Oh, he said, uh, I said, I said,
do you have a church on Sunday?

00:27:39.184 --> 00:27:39.584
He said, yeah.

00:27:39.584 --> 00:27:40.804
He said, uh, I said, what time is it?

00:27:40.804 --> 00:27:41.224
Eight o'clock.

00:27:41.264 --> 00:27:41.924
I said, okay, I'll be there.

00:27:42.834 --> 00:27:46.624
So I remember going into the Potter's
house and they were still in the multiplex

00:27:46.624 --> 00:27:53.164
at the time and Bishop came and preached
at eight o'clock and it was one of

00:27:53.164 --> 00:27:54.724
the most moving things I'd ever heard.

00:27:55.324 --> 00:28:00.554
It was an amazing, amazing, uh, uh,
message that the music was awesome.

00:28:00.604 --> 00:28:01.404
I'm like, okay.

00:28:01.744 --> 00:28:02.334
This is cool.

00:28:02.334 --> 00:28:03.084
I can do this.

00:28:03.304 --> 00:28:04.014
This is all right.

00:28:04.604 --> 00:28:08.104
So I ended up just getting entrenched in
the ministry, entrenched in the message.

00:28:08.564 --> 00:28:11.954
Um, I didn't do anything for
about three years, just be there.

00:28:11.964 --> 00:28:12.484
That's all I was doing.

00:28:12.524 --> 00:28:13.214
I was just there.

00:28:14.314 --> 00:28:17.634
And then shortly after being
there for a while, uh, he asked

00:28:17.634 --> 00:28:19.094
me to take over basketball.

00:28:19.104 --> 00:28:22.914
And then I started the Blacktop,
which is outside street ministry.

00:28:23.119 --> 00:28:27.009
It slowly progressed into just about
everything and then I started a

00:28:27.009 --> 00:28:30.319
basketball program there and built it
to one of the best ones in the city.

00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:34.829
But it was all about, um,
really learning to love Christ.

00:28:35.389 --> 00:28:42.049
But I think for me, um, I always
wanted to really serve God

00:28:42.049 --> 00:28:42.879
in the best way that I could.

00:28:44.144 --> 00:28:48.354
And I was able to hear
scripture and listen to it and

00:28:48.384 --> 00:28:49.724
understand it and retain it.

00:28:49.724 --> 00:28:51.414
And there was so much that were there.

00:28:51.414 --> 00:28:55.134
And because I didn't know anything
about church, I didn't know what to

00:28:55.134 --> 00:28:57.014
look for, but I felt good being there.

00:28:57.064 --> 00:28:57.414
Right.

00:28:57.434 --> 00:28:59.224
And I felt like the
presence of God was there.

00:28:59.224 --> 00:29:01.744
And I felt like, um, I
was learning so much.

00:29:02.424 --> 00:29:09.264
Bishop taught me so much about exegesis
and isogesis and homiletics and

00:29:09.264 --> 00:29:15.008
hermeneutics and every aspect of, sharing
the gospel Bishop Paul McLaughlin,

00:29:15.659 --> 00:29:20.549
an amazing guy and I think that, uh,
when you, when you come into where you

00:29:20.549 --> 00:29:24.859
are in life and in ministry, I think
one of the things that people don't

00:29:24.859 --> 00:29:28.169
do is understand what it really is.

00:29:28.209 --> 00:29:31.919
And I believe that a parent
raises a child to leave his house.

00:29:32.684 --> 00:29:37.744
And I think for most ministries, people
pride themselves on staying there.

00:29:38.074 --> 00:29:38.584
Grayson: Hmm.

00:29:38.884 --> 00:29:41.974
Jesse: And I think that that
becomes a conflict for some people.

00:29:42.424 --> 00:29:44.704
And I think that's why people can't
move into where they need to be.

00:29:44.724 --> 00:29:46.024
But I was a little bit different.

00:29:46.494 --> 00:29:49.904
I knew when it was time for me
to move to somewhere else, and it

00:29:49.944 --> 00:29:51.394
wasn't necessarily another church.

00:29:51.614 --> 00:29:54.104
And I think people have the
misunderstanding of that.

00:29:54.294 --> 00:29:56.949
I think it's time for you to go
and do what God called you to do.

00:29:57.579 --> 00:30:01.209
And oftentimes, um, it's
misunderstood oftentimes, but

00:30:01.219 --> 00:30:02.769
you have to know who you are.

00:30:02.769 --> 00:30:06.809
And I think that's why I'm so
adamant about now sharing with

00:30:06.809 --> 00:30:08.269
people to follow their passion.

00:30:08.849 --> 00:30:09.339
And what is it?

00:30:09.349 --> 00:30:11.229
You've got God to answer to, not man.

00:30:11.959 --> 00:30:15.119
And he puts people in your life
to give you directions, to point

00:30:15.119 --> 00:30:17.969
you in the right direction, to
pull you back and let you go.

00:30:19.084 --> 00:30:24.074
Discipleship is about literally
teaching you to be a disciple of Christ,

00:30:24.484 --> 00:30:26.194
not a member of a church so much.

00:30:26.224 --> 00:30:30.984
And I think that the whole misconception
today is about church membership.

00:30:31.334 --> 00:30:31.904
Grayson: Right.

00:30:32.404 --> 00:30:33.304
Jesse: about baptisms.

00:30:33.304 --> 00:30:35.724
It's about who got saved,
all this kind of stuff.

00:30:35.724 --> 00:30:39.714
And then I think it's, it's a
misleading and a misrepresentation

00:30:40.074 --> 00:30:41.574
of what it really is.

00:30:42.224 --> 00:30:42.294
Grayson: Hmm.

00:30:43.094 --> 00:30:48.434
Jesse: For me, having God in my life,
and Bishop was a major, major piece of

00:30:48.434 --> 00:30:53.684
that, um, gave me the strength and the
wherewithal to go be and do everything

00:30:53.684 --> 00:30:55.544
that I've done, you know, in life.

00:30:56.094 --> 00:30:59.364
I think that, uh, it's really
respecting where things are.

00:31:00.004 --> 00:31:04.574
I think it's understanding, uh, who
you are and growing to be who you are.

00:31:04.984 --> 00:31:08.204
You know, God made us
individually different.

00:31:08.939 --> 00:31:13.179
But school made us alike as possible,
and tradition makes us alike as possible.

00:31:13.729 --> 00:31:15.849
So church makes us alike
as possible, right?

00:31:15.849 --> 00:31:19.799
So if I'm a certain denomination,
I have to be an act Baptist.

00:31:20.319 --> 00:31:21.939
I have to be an act Church of God.

00:31:22.049 --> 00:31:24.489
I'm going to act like a
Church of God person, right?

00:31:24.789 --> 00:31:28.639
So now I become defined by
my label I've accepted, and I

00:31:28.959 --> 00:31:30.639
lose, I lose my individuality.

00:31:30.649 --> 00:31:31.634
I'm not who I am.

00:31:32.204 --> 00:31:36.174
Um, this is who, right, this people
begin to assimilate themselves

00:31:36.174 --> 00:31:41.604
with the larger group instead of
focusing on and really adhering to

00:31:41.614 --> 00:31:43.334
or enhancing their own individuality.

00:31:43.984 --> 00:31:47.544
So again, that's why I said Mark 7
and 13, the traditions of man make

00:31:47.544 --> 00:31:48.784
the Word of God in none effect.

00:31:49.364 --> 00:31:54.724
There's some, there's some things we
accept in tradition that don't allow

00:31:54.724 --> 00:31:55.924
us to be who we're supposed to be.

00:31:57.314 --> 00:31:59.134
And that can be a frustrating thing
at the time, and I think there's

00:31:59.324 --> 00:32:02.404
a lot of people, Jesse out there,
that are frustrated with that.

00:32:02.784 --> 00:32:03.874
Because they don't know.

00:32:04.314 --> 00:32:08.034
Um, we've gotten away from
really sharing the gospel.

00:32:08.034 --> 00:32:09.844
And the gospel isn't just
getting people saved.

00:32:10.344 --> 00:32:11.204
It's more than that.

00:32:11.764 --> 00:32:16.414
It's a way we live and let our light
so shine before men that we might

00:32:16.414 --> 00:32:20.084
seem, uh, they might seem our works of
glorifying the Father, which is in heaven.

00:32:20.524 --> 00:32:24.214
That's what the gospel
should result in, right?

00:32:24.864 --> 00:32:31.484
Because again, if salvation or getting
saved is your ultimate goal, once

00:32:31.484 --> 00:32:33.004
you get saved, you get comfortable.

00:32:33.724 --> 00:32:34.234
Grayson: Right,

00:32:34.494 --> 00:32:36.704
Jesse: And once you get comfortable,
you're no threat to the kingdom.

00:32:37.224 --> 00:32:37.494
Grayson: right.

00:32:37.494 --> 00:32:38.964
Mm-Hmm.

00:32:39.154 --> 00:32:42.834
Jesse: we have to change some things
when it comes down to the messaging

00:32:42.834 --> 00:32:44.704
that we give in today's world.

00:32:45.714 --> 00:32:52.234
You know, so when I look at what God did
in my life, um, he kind of reinforced what

00:32:52.234 --> 00:32:53.754
I was as a little kid, just different.

00:32:54.474 --> 00:32:59.874
I don't want to do like everybody else,
you know, now, again, that to me, models

00:33:00.334 --> 00:33:04.134
of some of the life that Jesus had,
because he wasn't received by his own.

00:33:04.134 --> 00:33:06.194
The Bible says he went into his
own and his own received him.

00:33:06.194 --> 00:33:07.504
Not, he did it different.

00:33:08.594 --> 00:33:10.624
He did it so different
that his own people.

00:33:11.544 --> 00:33:12.774
Didn't know, didn't understand him.

00:33:12.774 --> 00:33:14.604
He said he went into his own,
and his own one received him.

00:33:14.644 --> 00:33:17.614
Now, I mean, how does that feel to be
able to go into your own people and

00:33:17.614 --> 00:33:19.894
say, look, I'm here, and everybody's
like, nah, you're not the one.

00:33:21.724 --> 00:33:23.744
But he still, but he knew
what his message was.

00:33:23.744 --> 00:33:25.644
He knew what his assignment
was from day one.

00:33:26.084 --> 00:33:27.214
He knew what plan A was.

00:33:27.234 --> 00:33:33.054
As a matter of fact, even Jesus as an
earthly man, Jesse, tried to get plan B.

00:33:33.834 --> 00:33:36.794
When he was in the garden, he said,
look, he said, if it'd be possible,

00:33:36.994 --> 00:33:38.424
let this cut past before me.

00:33:38.424 --> 00:33:41.004
He was like, look, I know we
talked about this up there.

00:33:41.074 --> 00:33:42.304
I was with it when I left.

00:33:43.074 --> 00:33:46.254
I'm going down there, you know,
down the sprawls, you know,

00:33:46.264 --> 00:33:48.034
they, they gonna come back to us.

00:33:48.204 --> 00:33:48.784
That's what we're gonna do.

00:33:48.784 --> 00:33:51.694
But when he got down there, right
before he was supposed to do

00:33:51.694 --> 00:33:54.469
this, He said, can we talk pops?

00:33:54.869 --> 00:33:58.559
Look, um, I've been with
this thing for a long time.

00:33:58.989 --> 00:34:02.019
Uh, it sounded good when we started.

00:34:02.419 --> 00:34:03.419
Now I'm down here.

00:34:03.439 --> 00:34:04.559
It's about to happen tomorrow.

00:34:04.879 --> 00:34:06.119
Is there anything else we can do?

00:34:06.139 --> 00:34:07.629
We have no plan B.

00:34:08.189 --> 00:34:09.139
There is no plan B.

00:34:09.199 --> 00:34:11.429
It's the only plan that works.

00:34:11.929 --> 00:34:18.579
And I think if we begin to really
look at that as a model, we

00:34:18.579 --> 00:34:19.539
have to understand what it is.

00:34:19.539 --> 00:34:21.709
Now, why did that model work for Jesus?

00:34:21.749 --> 00:34:23.669
Because he knew exactly what
it was from the beginning.

00:34:23.809 --> 00:34:24.859
He had one assignment.

00:34:25.224 --> 00:34:25.794
From the beginning.

00:34:26.654 --> 00:34:30.434
And I think that's where we, that's
where we are challenged because we

00:34:30.434 --> 00:34:32.094
don't know what that one assignment is.

00:34:33.044 --> 00:34:33.994
We have to find it.

00:34:34.034 --> 00:34:37.324
And oftentimes it's guided
by someone else's agenda.

00:34:38.169 --> 00:34:40.839
Our assignment usually is
shaped into somebody else's

00:34:40.839 --> 00:34:42.209
big picture or somebody else.

00:34:42.849 --> 00:34:43.239
Grayson: Yeah.

00:34:43.654 --> 00:34:44.274
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:34:44.464 --> 00:34:45.274
And not ours.

00:34:45.404 --> 00:34:48.284
So we get caught up in that,
that tradition makes the

00:34:48.284 --> 00:34:49.284
word of God of none effect,

00:34:50.414 --> 00:34:54.004
So for me now, where I am and
building self and no excuses.

00:34:54.634 --> 00:34:58.064
I think I want people to be, um, I
want to be real instead of relevant.

00:34:58.634 --> 00:35:01.734
I think everybody, I think there's
a messaging today, Jesse, that

00:35:01.784 --> 00:35:02.584
people want to be relevant.

00:35:03.394 --> 00:35:04.984
They want to have a meaning today.

00:35:05.254 --> 00:35:06.524
No, you need to be real.

00:35:06.884 --> 00:35:10.994
Relevance goes with the culture,
you know, and I think because you

00:35:10.994 --> 00:35:14.564
want to be relevant, you become
fluid and you change with the wind.

00:35:15.444 --> 00:35:16.814
And the Bible talks about it in James.

00:35:17.064 --> 00:35:19.764
It says we're tossed to
and fro by anyone adopting.

00:35:19.944 --> 00:35:20.934
You want to be relevant.

00:35:21.204 --> 00:35:22.994
You tend to assimilate to.

00:35:23.409 --> 00:35:26.399
The culture, if you want to be
relevant, I want it, but that's

00:35:26.399 --> 00:35:27.309
not what I supposed to be relevant.

00:35:27.309 --> 00:35:28.029
It was supposed to be real.

00:35:28.554 --> 00:35:28.914
Grayson: Mm.

00:35:29.159 --> 00:35:31.649
Jesse: There's a, again, it's
the, it's the influence of man.

00:35:31.659 --> 00:35:34.979
It's the influence of tradition
that wants it to be relevant.

00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:38.889
Why we, we're supposed to not be of
the world, be in it, but not of it,

00:35:39.059 --> 00:35:41.319
but we become of it instead of in it.

00:35:42.039 --> 00:35:42.979
We start looking like.

00:35:43.344 --> 00:35:44.614
We start looking like it, right?

00:35:44.794 --> 00:35:47.794
So it becomes, so what,
what's the result of that?

00:35:48.004 --> 00:35:50.964
It's a watered down version
of who we're supposed to be.

00:35:51.914 --> 00:35:52.244
Grayson: Mm

00:35:52.524 --> 00:35:57.364
Jesse: Our light now has it now
light now has a, um, has a color

00:35:57.364 --> 00:35:59.284
bulb instead of a true light bulb.

00:35:59.454 --> 00:36:01.844
You know, it's, it's,
it's still giving light.

00:36:01.844 --> 00:36:03.054
It's just not giving the same light.

00:36:03.404 --> 00:36:04.014
You know what I mean?

00:36:04.174 --> 00:36:05.504
It's given a completely different light.

00:36:05.914 --> 00:36:07.074
So for me, I'm.

00:36:07.554 --> 00:36:12.699
I'm adamant about, challenging people to
do that, challenging people to put their

00:36:12.699 --> 00:36:16.852
passion first, When we talk about the
gospel, the gospel should do four things.

00:36:17.192 --> 00:36:21.272
It should challenge, it should
confront, it should convert.

00:36:21.817 --> 00:36:23.027
And it should show compassion.

00:36:23.237 --> 00:36:24.197
That's what the gospel should do.

00:36:25.347 --> 00:36:28.817
But when we live in this era that we're
living in, where you have things like

00:36:28.817 --> 00:36:32.817
diversity, equity, and inclusion, and
you have everybody loving themselves.

00:36:33.117 --> 00:36:34.227
Well, here's the reality.

00:36:34.527 --> 00:36:38.197
There is no challenge because if you
challenge or you confront, now you

00:36:38.197 --> 00:36:40.307
are either phobic or you're canceled.

00:36:40.947 --> 00:36:44.147
So we can't even share the gospel because
that's what the gospel is supposed to do.

00:36:44.837 --> 00:36:47.497
So what we end up doing
is debating and arguing.

00:36:48.397 --> 00:36:51.067
And I don't believe Jesus ever
debated or argued with anybody.

00:36:52.217 --> 00:36:54.077
I think we just need to stay
focused on where we are.

00:36:54.077 --> 00:37:00.157
So for me, When I'm sharing the messaging
of Build Self With No Excuses, it's

00:37:00.157 --> 00:37:02.087
about building yourself as God sees you.

00:37:02.887 --> 00:37:07.697
Build yourself as God has ordained
or put out there for you to be.

00:37:07.867 --> 00:37:12.407
How can we build ourselves to be the
best version of ourselves in God's eyes?

00:37:13.362 --> 00:37:16.312
You know, when it comes down to
it, we have to be able to deal

00:37:16.312 --> 00:37:17.732
with the issues of the day.

00:37:18.452 --> 00:37:21.952
But I don't think people want to deal
with them because they're not equipped

00:37:21.952 --> 00:37:23.492
enough to understand their Bible.

00:37:23.512 --> 00:37:24.592
They don't believe it enough.

00:37:26.212 --> 00:37:29.762
And so we've got to get to a place
where we are encouraging people

00:37:29.762 --> 00:37:33.552
to stand for God in the right way.

00:37:33.857 --> 00:37:35.087
You don't have to argue with people.

00:37:35.967 --> 00:37:37.287
You just live something before them.

00:37:37.457 --> 00:37:41.217
You know, when I use sports
analogies a lot, Jesse, and one

00:37:41.217 --> 00:37:44.197
of the greatest college basketball
coaches was a guy named John Wooden.

00:37:45.597 --> 00:37:47.717
John Wooden, they called
him the Wizard of Westwood.

00:37:48.057 --> 00:37:50.707
He was the head coach at University
of California, Los Angeles,

00:37:51.117 --> 00:37:52.737
or as most people know, UCLA.

00:37:53.617 --> 00:37:57.657
And he went through
winning 10 national titles.

00:37:57.767 --> 00:37:58.867
And he had some great players.

00:37:58.877 --> 00:37:59.767
He had Walton, he had Jabbar.

00:38:00.287 --> 00:38:02.567
I mean, you go through
it, he had the great ones.

00:38:03.752 --> 00:38:09.032
But one of the things that, um, made
him so significant as a coach is

00:38:09.032 --> 00:38:10.672
that he never scouted his opponent.

00:38:11.922 --> 00:38:12.512
Not one time.

00:38:13.362 --> 00:38:19.002
Now in sports, usually we scout
the other team so we can have a

00:38:19.002 --> 00:38:21.032
strategic advantage or be prepared.

00:38:21.932 --> 00:38:22.292
Grayson: right?

00:38:22.532 --> 00:38:23.802
Jesse: philosophy was
a little bit different.

00:38:25.042 --> 00:38:31.672
He said, I believe that if I'm so good at
what I do, it doesn't matter what you do.

00:38:34.292 --> 00:38:36.642
If I'm so good at what I do,
I don't care what you do.

00:38:37.377 --> 00:38:40.567
But I think we've gotten to a place
where we're more concerned about

00:38:40.567 --> 00:38:45.177
what the other people do, instead
of getting real good at what we do.

00:38:46.197 --> 00:38:51.077
I hear so many people in spirit, in
spiritual language, say the devil's busy.

00:38:51.297 --> 00:38:52.027
I hear it all the time.

00:38:52.457 --> 00:38:53.757
Man, the devil's busy, devil is devil.

00:38:54.117 --> 00:38:54.847
Well, hold on a minute.

00:38:54.867 --> 00:38:56.057
Is God not busy too?

00:38:57.527 --> 00:38:58.847
Why are we focused on the devil?

00:38:58.857 --> 00:39:00.187
This is where our mind goes.

00:39:00.187 --> 00:39:04.347
We're so fixated on the problem,
instead of knowing we have a solution.

00:39:04.537 --> 00:39:06.517
Why don't we focus on
the solution some more?

00:39:07.757 --> 00:39:12.267
And this again, this man's tradition,
we've been taught that fear is what

00:39:12.267 --> 00:39:15.607
we have to face and get, but he says
he didn't give it a spirit of fear,

00:39:15.607 --> 00:39:17.787
but a power and love and a sound mind.

00:39:17.947 --> 00:39:19.527
We're focused on the wrong stuff.

00:39:20.737 --> 00:39:23.967
So when it really comes down to
where we are, how do we really

00:39:23.967 --> 00:39:25.817
get proficient at the God stuff?

00:39:27.192 --> 00:39:31.465
When people are looking at
becoming, counterfeit, experts,

00:39:31.832 --> 00:39:35.742
when they're being trained on
how to really see a counterfeit,

00:39:36.225 --> 00:39:37.485
they don't study counterfeits.

00:39:37.818 --> 00:39:40.038
They study the original paper.

00:39:41.273 --> 00:39:41.623
Grayson: Right,

00:39:41.798 --> 00:39:45.568
Jesse: get so good at knowing what
the original looks like, they can spot

00:39:45.568 --> 00:39:46.838
a counterfeit a hundred miles away.

00:39:47.608 --> 00:39:47.888
Grayson: right.

00:39:48.938 --> 00:39:54.241
So the analogy is that when
we get closer to Jesus.

00:39:54.750 --> 00:39:57.670
we will easily see what's not Jesus.

00:39:58.165 --> 00:39:58.695
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:39:58.865 --> 00:39:59.525
Absolutely.

00:39:59.775 --> 00:40:00.275
Absolutely.

00:40:00.625 --> 00:40:04.085
And the bad part about it, Jesse,
is that unfortunately we've aligned

00:40:04.085 --> 00:40:06.845
ourselves with what's not Jesus.

00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:07.870
Grayson: Right.

00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:10.410
Jesse: And we've committed to it
to where when we realize it's not

00:40:10.410 --> 00:40:11.960
Jesus, it's hard for us to walk away.

00:40:13.810 --> 00:40:17.660
So when we hear things about what
we've aligned with, that when you

00:40:17.670 --> 00:40:20.600
really are presented with something
that says, no, that ain't Jesus,

00:40:20.820 --> 00:40:22.400
it's hard for people to not do it.

00:40:22.740 --> 00:40:23.110
Why?

00:40:23.210 --> 00:40:24.460
Because everybody else is doing it.

00:40:25.010 --> 00:40:25.420
Grayson: Right.

00:40:25.690 --> 00:40:27.465
Jesse: And they don't Absolutely.

00:40:27.465 --> 00:40:29.285
Man's tradition makes the
Word of God into effect.

00:40:29.285 --> 00:40:31.231
Tradition says you have
to be in the church.

00:40:31.231 --> 00:40:33.392
It gives us all these
things that we battle with.

00:40:33.392 --> 00:40:35.338
And I'm not telling
people, don't go to church.

00:40:35.338 --> 00:40:39.455
What I'm saying to you is, is
that, is where you're going

00:40:39.465 --> 00:40:41.595
really representing Christ?

00:40:43.145 --> 00:40:45.125
And that doesn't mean they
don't believe in the gospel.

00:40:45.125 --> 00:40:46.015
That's not what I'm saying.

00:40:46.645 --> 00:40:51.175
I'm saying to you, is it really
representing Christ when you

00:40:51.175 --> 00:40:53.125
look at it as for what it is?

00:40:54.655 --> 00:40:58.715
Most of what our deliveries
today are, are entertainment.

00:41:00.505 --> 00:41:01.715
How can I get you in?

00:41:01.715 --> 00:41:03.205
Well, here's the reality, Jesse.

00:41:03.415 --> 00:41:05.145
The gospel is supposed to attract.

00:41:05.515 --> 00:41:06.595
The gospel's not enough.

00:41:07.455 --> 00:41:09.645
We have to put on plays and concerts.

00:41:09.645 --> 00:41:10.295
Don't get me wrong.

00:41:10.545 --> 00:41:14.485
I'm not opposed to any of those
things as methodology, but when

00:41:14.485 --> 00:41:17.365
it's the way that you attract me,
here's what you have to remember.

00:41:17.565 --> 00:41:20.365
If I attract you that way, I got
to keep doing that to keep you.

00:41:21.110 --> 00:41:21.630
Grayson: Right.

00:41:22.080 --> 00:41:23.200
It becomes an idol.

00:41:23.765 --> 00:41:24.445
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:41:25.230 --> 00:41:28.560
Worshipping that as opposed to worship
the true and living God, right?

00:41:29.270 --> 00:41:33.740
that's why, and that's why messaging like
this isn't going to go on many pulpits.

00:41:35.570 --> 00:41:39.140
You know, when I, when I go, when
I actually get invited to a church,

00:41:39.970 --> 00:41:41.100
they don't want me there really.

00:41:42.390 --> 00:41:43.850
And I'm, I'm, I'm honest about that.

00:41:43.850 --> 00:41:46.960
Cause I tell folk anywhere
I go to speak, my girlfriend

00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:48.540
does not like me to say this.

00:41:49.145 --> 00:41:52.795
But I do say this almost every
time I go speak, that I'm here for

00:41:52.795 --> 00:41:56.545
one reason and one reason only,
and that's not to be ass backed.

00:42:01.235 --> 00:42:01.655
Truth!

00:42:02.285 --> 00:42:04.355
And I mean, and I mean that sincerely.

00:42:04.355 --> 00:42:10.905
Now, I'm usually ass backed, but my goal
isn't to say something fluffy and fun.

00:42:11.675 --> 00:42:13.845
Now, my goal isn't to rebuke
the whole room either.

00:42:15.015 --> 00:42:17.015
My goal, Jesse, is to get you to think.

00:42:17.355 --> 00:42:20.695
It's the one thing that we've
literally not done lately.

00:42:21.820 --> 00:42:24.780
Because we have experienced and
engaged in stuff that if you really

00:42:24.790 --> 00:42:26.370
thought about it, made no sense.

00:42:26.760 --> 00:42:27.750
So why did I do that?

00:42:29.420 --> 00:42:34.260
But because man's tradition, the
influence of the populace, the

00:42:34.270 --> 00:42:39.140
influence of the masses, is what gets
you to be subjective to how you think.

00:42:41.150 --> 00:42:41.610
You know what I'm saying?

00:42:41.610 --> 00:42:43.080
That, for me, I can't do this.

00:42:43.230 --> 00:42:49.515
And the biggest, the biggest,
um, uh, example of that, In most

00:42:49.515 --> 00:42:51.295
recent years was this COVID thing.

00:42:52.980 --> 00:42:53.660
Grayson: Oh man.

00:42:53.975 --> 00:42:57.935
Jesse: You, you're not gonna, I wasn't
buying none of that bulljigging at all.

00:42:58.925 --> 00:43:00.585
I don't care what they said.

00:43:00.595 --> 00:43:04.425
Now, again, I never knocked
anybody that bought into it.

00:43:04.885 --> 00:43:09.715
I never knocked anybody who had to,
to do what they need to do to survive,

00:43:09.715 --> 00:43:12.935
because there were people that had
to make choices with their life.

00:43:13.495 --> 00:43:15.755
You lose your job if you don't
do this, or you lose your

00:43:15.755 --> 00:43:16.805
livelihood if you don't do this.

00:43:16.805 --> 00:43:17.525
You're the only breadwinner.

00:43:17.575 --> 00:43:18.955
Look, you gotta do what you gotta do.

00:43:19.365 --> 00:43:20.085
But for me?

00:43:20.935 --> 00:43:21.965
It didn't make sense.

00:43:23.425 --> 00:43:23.975
That's all.

00:43:24.025 --> 00:43:29.575
Now, if I'm gonna, if I'm going to
be subject to a conspiracy, Jesse,

00:43:31.165 --> 00:43:34.575
Jesus coming from heaven, dying on the
cross and raising on the third day,

00:43:34.715 --> 00:43:35.785
I'm gonna go with that conspiracy.

00:43:37.775 --> 00:43:41.225
If I'm gonna be a conspiracy theorist,
I'm gonna go with that conspiracy.

00:43:41.465 --> 00:43:43.445
Then the other one's y'all
the manufacturer, right?

00:43:43.965 --> 00:43:47.385
When it comes down to it, because
none of it made sense to me, right?

00:43:48.018 --> 00:43:48.518
Grayson: Me too.

00:43:49.428 --> 00:43:53.502
Jesse: Especially when it came down to
how the people of God treated now, don't

00:43:53.502 --> 00:43:59.182
get me wrong, here's what did make sense
to me, Jesse, that pastors, for a large

00:43:59.212 --> 00:44:04.592
part, were reluctant to speak about it
because the risk of losing their 501c3

00:44:04.592 --> 00:44:06.222
designation was a real, was a real thing.

00:44:06.692 --> 00:44:07.112
Grayson: Mm.

00:44:08.092 --> 00:44:10.102
Jesse: Even our churches
are governmentally run.

00:44:10.832 --> 00:44:12.322
You're a 501c3.

00:44:12.392 --> 00:44:13.542
Who said you have to be?

00:44:14.292 --> 00:44:15.142
You don't have to be.

00:44:15.712 --> 00:44:16.252
You don't.

00:44:17.192 --> 00:44:17.712
Grayson: I'm with you.

00:44:18.162 --> 00:44:24.112
Jesse: But because, but because the model
works and the donations are tax free,

00:44:24.732 --> 00:44:29.952
you can actually operate a business with
very few restrictions except X, Y, and Z.

00:44:30.662 --> 00:44:31.212
Grayson: Mm hmm.

00:44:31.602 --> 00:44:36.802
Jesse: Because to me, if you are like
Paul, Paul had a career, Paul was a tent

00:44:36.802 --> 00:44:42.362
maker, Paul had his own money, even now,
even though people sold into him, Paul

00:44:42.362 --> 00:44:44.302
would have done ministry just the same.

00:44:44.726 --> 00:44:45.206
Grayson: Right.

00:44:45.452 --> 00:44:48.192
Jesse: We have the wrong model for it.

00:44:49.762 --> 00:44:53.362
Everybody can just ordain themselves
an apostle or bishop when they

00:44:53.362 --> 00:44:55.332
feel like it and start a church.

00:44:57.382 --> 00:44:58.552
I'm not knocking any of them.

00:44:58.552 --> 00:44:59.722
I'm not saying they're not anointed.

00:44:59.722 --> 00:45:00.742
That's not the point.

00:45:00.752 --> 00:45:05.032
The point is to me, not only the
point is, is that we really have no

00:45:05.042 --> 00:45:08.392
protocol to follow except the Bible.

00:45:08.392 --> 00:45:10.452
And we're not doing that
the way that we should.

00:45:11.492 --> 00:45:11.992
Grayson: Mm hmm.

00:45:12.412 --> 00:45:15.642
Jesse: So we can't get the
full essence of the gospel.

00:45:16.442 --> 00:45:18.412
So we become, we become sect driven.

00:45:18.642 --> 00:45:19.992
I want to be about deliverance.

00:45:20.042 --> 00:45:21.302
I want to be about spirituality.

00:45:21.412 --> 00:45:25.492
I want to be, and we find a group that
kind of fits what's comfortable for us.

00:45:26.292 --> 00:45:29.454
I told, I told a group the other
day, Jesse, I said, You can't tell

00:45:29.454 --> 00:45:30.884
me your passion is to be an usher.

00:45:30.984 --> 00:45:31.524
You can't do that.

00:45:31.554 --> 00:45:32.744
You can't tell me passion.

00:45:33.964 --> 00:45:34.784
You can't tell me that.

00:45:35.074 --> 00:45:36.634
But we find, here's what we do.

00:45:36.764 --> 00:45:39.924
We find somewhere in church that
we can do ministry comfortably.

00:45:40.599 --> 00:45:41.119
Grayson: Mm.

00:45:41.624 --> 00:45:43.674
Jesse: We find an area that I
can do this without anything.

00:45:43.974 --> 00:45:47.884
Well, ministry should be the challenge you
because the gospel should challenge you.

00:45:48.959 --> 00:45:53.089
Grayson: ministry should be allowing
the Holy Spirit to, live through you

00:45:53.089 --> 00:45:57.745
instead of you trying to just fit
into what people say you should do.

00:45:58.150 --> 00:45:58.400
Jesse: correct.

00:45:58.420 --> 00:46:02.500
Well, here's what's funny to me, Jesse, is
that when you join a church and they give

00:46:02.500 --> 00:46:06.930
you a spiritual gifts assessment, it's
ironic to me always that my spiritual gift

00:46:06.930 --> 00:46:08.540
fits what the church needs at that moment.

00:46:11.060 --> 00:46:11.630
You know what I'm saying?

00:46:11.965 --> 00:46:12.475
Grayson: Yeah.

00:46:12.985 --> 00:46:15.795
Jesse: And again, again, I'm not,
this isn't me knocking church.

00:46:16.115 --> 00:46:20.715
This is me truly having a step back
and understanding of stuff I can see.

00:46:21.255 --> 00:46:21.715
Grayson: Mm

00:46:21.975 --> 00:46:23.275
Jesse: church shouldn't be predictable.

00:46:23.925 --> 00:46:26.205
And it is, for the most part, nowadays.

00:46:26.575 --> 00:46:27.535
It shouldn't be predictable.

00:46:28.055 --> 00:46:33.185
But I can go to different cities
and go into a different church that

00:46:33.185 --> 00:46:37.235
falls under a certain denomination
or a certain group and there's a

00:46:37.235 --> 00:46:38.845
certain order of service I can expect.

00:46:39.965 --> 00:46:40.335
Right?

00:46:40.445 --> 00:46:40.455
Grayson: hmm.

00:46:40.785 --> 00:46:41.825
Like McDonald's.

00:46:42.005 --> 00:46:42.595
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:46:43.720 --> 00:46:49.967
So when you have large organizations
now that are actually business fine

00:46:49.977 --> 00:46:56.127
church, I can go to one church that
has those three initials in one state,

00:46:56.437 --> 00:46:59.367
and I can go to another church that has
those three initials in another state.

00:46:59.677 --> 00:47:01.747
And why is the music almost the same?

00:47:02.277 --> 00:47:04.127
And why is the way you
do it almost the same?

00:47:04.387 --> 00:47:07.647
Why does it, don't tell me God is in that.

00:47:08.197 --> 00:47:09.147
We're all different.

00:47:09.347 --> 00:47:10.657
There's no way it should look the same.

00:47:11.352 --> 00:47:11.832
But it does.

00:47:12.422 --> 00:47:12.662
Why?

00:47:12.662 --> 00:47:15.832
Because people are more
apt to be involved.

00:47:15.862 --> 00:47:19.762
If it's familiar, they're more and
like, they're more likely to be

00:47:19.762 --> 00:47:22.072
involved if it's comfortable, right?

00:47:22.332 --> 00:47:29.642
So Jesse, if you grew up, uh, in a,
in a, in a Pentecostal environment, if

00:47:29.642 --> 00:47:33.402
ain't nobody falling out during church,
if ain't nobody running around the

00:47:33.402 --> 00:47:37.462
building, if ain't nobody casting out
demons, you say it ain't church, right?

00:47:38.302 --> 00:47:38.472
Grayson: Right.

00:47:38.607 --> 00:47:39.097
Jesse: You know what I'm saying?

00:47:39.157 --> 00:47:40.387
Because that's what church is.

00:47:40.387 --> 00:47:44.077
And if that, those elements aren't there,
it's like, well, this ain't church.

00:47:44.587 --> 00:47:47.537
Or if you're a different way, if
none of those things exist and

00:47:47.537 --> 00:47:50.437
somebody starts doing it, it's like,
whoa, that ain't church at all.

00:47:50.437 --> 00:47:50.887
Why, why?

00:47:51.957 --> 00:47:54.537
That's kind of where we are
because we've given church labels.

00:47:55.407 --> 00:47:57.937
Because we talk about what's not
church, we don't say what's not God.

00:47:57.947 --> 00:48:01.257
We don't say what's not, we say what's
not church, because we label it.

00:48:02.317 --> 00:48:08.837
And so I think for me now, um, as I,
as I Find my true place in my passion,

00:48:08.997 --> 00:48:13.367
which is my heart has always been
for people, is to truly realize that

00:48:13.787 --> 00:48:19.087
those four things I said confront,
challenge, confront, convict, and, uh,

00:48:19.137 --> 00:48:26.767
challenge, confront, convert, and have
compassion are all the things that I

00:48:26.767 --> 00:48:29.597
want to do, you know, so there's so
many things that are facing us today.

00:48:29.817 --> 00:48:35.127
I don't think many people here know how to
deal with somebody who may be transgender.

00:48:35.557 --> 00:48:38.187
Or maybe in a different gay
or homosexual lifestyle.

00:48:38.537 --> 00:48:39.817
They know how to treat
him with the gospel.

00:48:39.817 --> 00:48:41.307
They know how to tell him it's not right.

00:48:41.797 --> 00:48:43.087
But how do you really minister to him?

00:48:43.087 --> 00:48:43.957
How do you share the light?

00:48:43.967 --> 00:48:44.737
How do you show that?

00:48:44.987 --> 00:48:47.687
And I believe that's not something
that we're taught from pulpits.

00:48:48.737 --> 00:48:53.217
I believe the part of us being able
to disciple is to know how, again, to

00:48:53.217 --> 00:48:54.717
equip the saints to work in ministry.

00:48:54.857 --> 00:48:55.727
Here's what's going on.

00:48:55.897 --> 00:48:56.757
How would you deal with this?

00:48:57.987 --> 00:48:58.877
How would you deal with this?

00:48:58.957 --> 00:48:59.897
How do you answer this?

00:49:00.452 --> 00:49:01.302
That's not what we get.

00:49:01.322 --> 00:49:05.502
We get rah rah sessions and motivational
messages and we go out here and

00:49:05.502 --> 00:49:09.382
we fight and we lose the battle of
being a light because our light's

00:49:09.382 --> 00:49:10.602
off when it comes to other people.

00:49:11.262 --> 00:49:12.082
We don't know how to deal with them.

00:49:12.692 --> 00:49:13.272
Grayson: Mm.

00:49:13.342 --> 00:49:18.612
Jesse: I think that for me, I believe that
that's part of my, my passionate pursuit.

00:49:19.812 --> 00:49:25.472
And I think in a world of, that we live
in today, Jesse, we're supposed to be

00:49:25.472 --> 00:49:30.082
creating leaders, yet the only thing we
measured by is how many followers we have.

00:49:32.132 --> 00:49:35.192
Grayson: Well, everything that you've
said is it seems to me like you

00:49:35.192 --> 00:49:41.055
are into discipleship or a lot of
different levels, because Jesus said,

00:49:41.175 --> 00:49:44.995
make disciples, you know, and that's
what we're supposed to be doing.

00:49:45.405 --> 00:49:46.785
And we can't do it with it.

00:49:46.845 --> 00:49:51.355
Like you said, you know, just, Fluffy
sermons or, or topical sermons.

00:49:51.355 --> 00:49:52.965
You know, it's about relationship.

00:49:54.420 --> 00:49:55.090
And, uh,

00:49:55.445 --> 00:49:58.625
Jesse: person that desires relationship
and understands relationship

00:49:58.695 --> 00:49:59.935
in order to have relationship,

00:50:00.080 --> 00:50:00.740
Grayson: Mm

00:50:00.805 --> 00:50:03.825
Jesse: I think that when you
have a desire to do that and it's

00:50:03.825 --> 00:50:06.785
different from the world, it's
really, it's really challenging.

00:50:06.825 --> 00:50:10.295
I mean, it's for people who really
want to serve God, they find themselves

00:50:10.295 --> 00:50:15.235
alone a lot because mainstream
messaging doesn't fit, right?

00:50:15.425 --> 00:50:16.645
I can't do that.

00:50:16.705 --> 00:50:21.045
So it's, I'm not going to be
as exciting or inviting as

00:50:21.055 --> 00:50:22.875
someone who is entertaining.

00:50:23.630 --> 00:50:24.770
You know, that's just the way it is.

00:50:24.780 --> 00:50:29.860
So I, that's, that's been the, that's
been the biggest battle with moving

00:50:29.860 --> 00:50:33.840
forward in the things that you do is
if you look at what's there, you feel

00:50:33.840 --> 00:50:35.280
like you're losing ground, right.

00:50:35.540 --> 00:50:37.270
Or you feel like you have
to change what you do.

00:50:37.650 --> 00:50:42.040
You know, you have to become
what they are, and I think that

00:50:42.500 --> 00:50:43.430
I'm never going to do that.

00:50:43.460 --> 00:50:47.740
So I think that, um, your passionate
pursuit of where you are and what

00:50:47.740 --> 00:50:51.760
you want in life and really know
how much God has done for you.

00:50:51.870 --> 00:50:52.210
Yeah.

00:50:52.210 --> 00:50:55.940
You talk about your podcast and
the messaging that you want to

00:50:55.940 --> 00:50:58.970
leave with people is, you know,
how God has changed your life.

00:50:59.020 --> 00:51:03.400
And I think that for me, Jesse,
there was some ideologies that.

00:51:03.750 --> 00:51:06.320
I believe were elements of the
church that I just didn't agree with.

00:51:07.270 --> 00:51:12.800
I think for me, having the boldness enough
to stand in a space that I'm going to

00:51:12.810 --> 00:51:17.330
speak my truth, you know, and it doesn't,
it doesn't matter to me how you get it.

00:51:17.560 --> 00:51:20.040
I was okay with speaking my
truth when it came to COVID.

00:51:20.250 --> 00:51:22.610
I was okay to speak my truth
when it came to politics.

00:51:22.840 --> 00:51:25.540
There's no politics in the Bible,
so why am I even entertaining it?

00:51:26.420 --> 00:51:26.890
Grayson: mm hmm,

00:51:27.220 --> 00:51:30.430
Jesse: And there's so many things we feel
like we have to take sides on, right?

00:51:30.780 --> 00:51:33.430
When we talk about social injustice
and we talk about race, I'm like,

00:51:33.430 --> 00:51:34.450
why are we still talking about it?

00:51:34.930 --> 00:51:37.210
I mean, I don't, I don't, you're
not going to get me down, pulled

00:51:37.210 --> 00:51:39.150
down that rabbit hole, because
there's no, there's no reason.

00:51:39.160 --> 00:51:43.430
Because if the Bible is my foundation,
then God has no respect to a person.

00:51:43.710 --> 00:51:46.390
I don't care what society's done,
God has no respect to a person.

00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:51.280
Uh, so that, that for me is for
a lot of people is a different

00:51:51.280 --> 00:51:52.390
message and I'm okay with that.

00:51:53.140 --> 00:51:56.210
But there are more people that
don't subscribe to that than do,

00:51:56.420 --> 00:51:59.700
yet their voices are sequestered
and squandered because they don't

00:51:59.700 --> 00:52:01.090
really feel like they have a voice.

00:52:01.490 --> 00:52:04.050
And I think when you truly
disciple people, that's the case.

00:52:04.270 --> 00:52:07.820
If you look at the Sermon on the
Mount, Jesus only talked to the 12.

00:52:07.860 --> 00:52:09.290
It was the crowd that came and listened.

00:52:10.210 --> 00:52:11.500
He took the 12 of them away.

00:52:12.190 --> 00:52:15.000
You know, I want to talk to you 12
and you go do what you need to do,

00:52:15.450 --> 00:52:17.400
but everybody else came to hear that.

00:52:18.020 --> 00:52:19.380
And Jesus spoke in parables.

00:52:19.380 --> 00:52:22.090
He said, because the things of the kingdom
are too complex for you to understand.

00:52:22.750 --> 00:52:26.910
The accountability to really be a
disciple of Christ is way over the heads

00:52:26.910 --> 00:52:28.970
of most people when it comes down to it.

00:52:29.210 --> 00:52:30.270
Even the elements of it.

00:52:30.270 --> 00:52:31.280
I mean, Jesse, come on now.

00:52:31.440 --> 00:52:35.890
What human being is ready to forgive
seven times seven, you know what I mean?

00:52:36.180 --> 00:52:37.810
But that's the way it's supposed to be.

00:52:37.830 --> 00:52:38.120
Right?

00:52:38.290 --> 00:52:41.610
So the things that a kingdom are
hard as when it comes down to it.

00:52:42.700 --> 00:52:44.970
And ultimately, that's
where we have to be.

00:52:45.010 --> 00:52:47.430
We have to decide if that's
what we're going to follow.

00:52:47.460 --> 00:52:51.130
If we're going to be kingdom people,
then we've got to do things that

00:52:51.130 --> 00:52:52.380
don't look like everybody else.

00:52:53.130 --> 00:52:53.660
Grayson: mm hmm,

00:52:53.860 --> 00:52:56.610
Jesse: And I think that's the biggest
challenge because we've lived in a

00:52:56.610 --> 00:53:03.135
world that, um, acknowledgement is And
scrutiny are all a part of how we do.

00:53:03.145 --> 00:53:06.615
We live in a comparison world and
we're so worried about being compared

00:53:06.615 --> 00:53:09.465
to other people or what it's going
to look like to somebody else that we

00:53:09.465 --> 00:53:10.595
can't do what we're supposed to do.

00:53:11.025 --> 00:53:14.925
And I just want to encourage people that
there is a life with Christ, that you

00:53:14.925 --> 00:53:16.675
can be the person that you want to be.

00:53:17.075 --> 00:53:21.265
Uh, you don't have to line up to social
norms and, and be a part of that.

00:53:21.535 --> 00:53:26.285
You need to remove the emotion of most of
your decision making and really become.

00:53:26.580 --> 00:53:28.510
What you need to become for other people.

00:53:28.790 --> 00:53:30.390
And I think that's where, you know, I am.

00:53:30.390 --> 00:53:32.090
So I'm relegated to that.

00:53:32.270 --> 00:53:33.300
I'm okay with that.

00:53:33.340 --> 00:53:34.350
And I'm going to keep doing that.

00:53:35.180 --> 00:53:35.860
Grayson: mm hmm.

00:53:35.860 --> 00:53:42.609
Well, you know, Jesus's says, I
only say what I hear the Father say.

00:53:42.609 --> 00:53:44.649
I only do what I see the Father do.

00:53:45.049 --> 00:53:47.319
to me, that's where we
should be as disciples.

00:53:47.329 --> 00:53:52.419
We should be so closely aligned with,
with Him, abiding in Him, that all of

00:53:52.419 --> 00:53:57.029
these other distractions, you know, like
all these things we just talked about.

00:53:57.367 --> 00:54:01.367
are irrelevant, really, because
that's, we're not, we're only here

00:54:01.367 --> 00:54:03.037
to please him and not, people.

00:54:03.507 --> 00:54:04.027
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:54:04.267 --> 00:54:08.187
And I think, and I think that's
again, Mark seven and 13, the

00:54:08.187 --> 00:54:11.407
tradition of man says, please
man, first, not God, that's what

00:54:11.457 --> 00:54:11.677
Grayson: hmm.

00:54:12.157 --> 00:54:12.447
Jesse: says.

00:54:12.457 --> 00:54:14.437
Get, get in good graces with man.

00:54:14.947 --> 00:54:15.397
Grayson: Mm

00:54:15.787 --> 00:54:17.767
Jesse: That's, that's what we believe.

00:54:17.767 --> 00:54:19.057
And that's what we tend to do.

00:54:19.627 --> 00:54:23.067
The affirmation, the validation
from men is more important than

00:54:23.067 --> 00:54:24.637
affirmation and validation from God.

00:54:24.747 --> 00:54:25.087
Right.

00:54:25.497 --> 00:54:25.957
And I think.

00:54:26.337 --> 00:54:30.557
I think that's where people come to a
complete challenge and where they are,

00:54:30.557 --> 00:54:34.717
but I think that, you know, Jesse,
if you continue to put out the, the

00:54:34.907 --> 00:54:38.927
information that you're putting out
and, and have people on your show that

00:54:38.937 --> 00:54:43.987
really believe in that way, uh, if
we'll begin to work together and get

00:54:43.987 --> 00:54:45.757
the right messaging to the right places.

00:54:46.247 --> 00:54:49.927
Uh, I think that we, we definitely will
make the impactful difference that we need

00:54:49.937 --> 00:54:52.227
to make, but we have to be okay with that.

00:54:52.947 --> 00:54:57.687
And we have to be okay with what we know
we believe, but we have to be studious

00:54:57.687 --> 00:55:01.507
enough and intentional enough to, to study
to show that self approval in the God.

00:55:01.997 --> 00:55:04.437
A workman need not be ashamed,
rightly divine, the word of truth.

00:55:04.617 --> 00:55:05.287
That's what we have to do.

00:55:06.087 --> 00:55:09.410
Grayson: Well, you know, since you,
said that, I think we ought to shift

00:55:09.420 --> 00:55:14.410
gears a little bit here because you
are doing what you're talking about.

00:55:14.460 --> 00:55:16.820
you are so busy with a
lot of different things.

00:55:16.820 --> 00:55:20.990
I would like for you to Take some time
to tell about your coaching and your

00:55:21.000 --> 00:55:24.250
books and all the different things
that you're involved in, because even

00:55:24.250 --> 00:55:29.040
though it may not be church, you're
building disciples in every area of

00:55:29.050 --> 00:55:31.230
your life, at least from what I see.

00:55:31.230 --> 00:55:33.720
And I'd like to, I'd
like to hear about that.

00:55:34.020 --> 00:55:34.220
Jesse: Absolutely.

00:55:34.250 --> 00:55:34.500
Yes.

00:55:34.550 --> 00:55:40.260
I think that what, what got on my side
of my heart years ago was men and the,

00:55:40.260 --> 00:55:42.450
uh, the displacement of men in society.

00:55:43.060 --> 00:55:46.910
Uh, men have been emasculated,
men have been reduced.

00:55:47.380 --> 00:55:51.380
The feminist movement truly was never
about women, it was always about

00:55:51.380 --> 00:55:54.830
destroying the nuclear family, and you
can't do that unless you destroy the man.

00:55:55.440 --> 00:55:59.670
So I think that my whole purpose
is, is to make men aware of who they

00:55:59.670 --> 00:56:05.730
really are, um, equip them and empower
them to reestablish themselves as who

00:56:05.730 --> 00:56:10.890
they are, and move them to a closer
relationship with what will sustain them.

00:56:11.200 --> 00:56:12.190
When it comes down to it.

00:56:12.200 --> 00:56:15.930
So, um, I work with men
healing, the hurt men hide.

00:56:15.980 --> 00:56:16.650
I work with them.

00:56:17.020 --> 00:56:18.480
Um, that's a piece of it.

00:56:18.720 --> 00:56:22.090
I have a clothing line called
manicure present your best self.

00:56:22.370 --> 00:56:25.750
So it's all about positive motivational
where the guys can literally

00:56:25.830 --> 00:56:27.920
signify a man of destiny messaging.

00:56:28.410 --> 00:56:30.340
So it's just a reminder
when it comes to it.

00:56:30.340 --> 00:56:34.270
I think that any takeaway that you can
have from an experience is important.

00:56:34.840 --> 00:56:37.360
Um, that is truly my heart.

00:56:37.680 --> 00:56:39.590
My heart is just to
see people differently.

00:56:39.590 --> 00:56:42.040
So I've done coaching
at the executive level.

00:56:42.050 --> 00:56:45.460
I've done coaching it obviously in
the sports realm, but my heart now

00:56:45.460 --> 00:56:49.500
is really coaching people who are
working through finding who they are.

00:56:49.990 --> 00:56:52.920
Um, getting them to
challenge their old mindsets.

00:56:53.550 --> 00:56:57.700
Um, my podcast is called GM,
which is my initials talking BS.

00:56:58.415 --> 00:57:00.855
And talking BS is, uh, belief systems.

00:57:01.075 --> 00:57:02.445
It's breaking structures.

00:57:02.605 --> 00:57:03.825
It's building synergy.

00:57:04.255 --> 00:57:06.675
And anything that you can put a
B and an S to that's positive,

00:57:06.785 --> 00:57:07.615
that's why I want to talk.

00:57:08.015 --> 00:57:09.185
So it's GM talking BS.

00:57:09.825 --> 00:57:10.865
And people will see it.

00:57:10.995 --> 00:57:14.355
Talking BS, well they, they're
gonna, it is what it is.

00:57:14.745 --> 00:57:15.855
And it, but it isn't.

00:57:16.185 --> 00:57:17.125
But I think that's me.

00:57:17.125 --> 00:57:18.725
So it's about me really talking BS.

00:57:19.385 --> 00:57:21.025
And talking about what your BS is.

00:57:21.385 --> 00:57:23.555
And you can use the vernacular
because that's what it is.

00:57:23.555 --> 00:57:27.005
It's a really bull, you know what,
but it's your belief systems.

00:57:27.610 --> 00:57:30.690
It's breaking structures, it's
building synergy, it's being

00:57:30.690 --> 00:57:34.850
soulful, you know, it's your bank
statements, it's your stewardship,

00:57:34.850 --> 00:57:36.510
it's everything when you're talking BS.

00:57:36.850 --> 00:57:38.680
And that's, that's, that
for me is where it is.

00:57:38.690 --> 00:57:43.420
So I think, um, my whole purpose in
messaging has become refined to that.

00:57:43.830 --> 00:57:45.270
To GM talking BS.

00:57:45.870 --> 00:57:49.180
And I want to, I want
to be, uh, evangelistic.

00:57:49.570 --> 00:57:54.470
So to speak in that messaging and just be
able to go and empathetically challenge

00:57:54.470 --> 00:57:58.340
people when it comes to it So I do it on
a personal level one on one with coaching.

00:57:58.820 --> 00:58:02.320
I've been fortunate enough to do it
in corporations And be able to share

00:58:02.340 --> 00:58:06.890
in there in a unique, uh, in a unique
way, but I'm not afraid to do it.

00:58:06.890 --> 00:58:09.830
I think that, um, corporate
America doesn't bother me.

00:58:09.830 --> 00:58:10.710
It doesn't fear me.

00:58:10.990 --> 00:58:12.240
I'm not going to hold my tongue.

00:58:12.240 --> 00:58:14.450
So I said, I'm, I'm here
to not be asked back.

00:58:14.670 --> 00:58:18.600
I'm going to say probably what
you all don't agree with that is

00:58:19.580 --> 00:58:21.480
politically correct in your workplace.

00:58:21.500 --> 00:58:24.160
Well, I don't work here, so
I be politically correct.

00:58:24.700 --> 00:58:26.520
Um, that's just, that's
just how I feel about it.

00:58:26.530 --> 00:58:28.900
But I believe that any opportunity I get.

00:58:29.385 --> 00:58:34.805
To, um, talk to, challenge,
change, have a discussion with.

00:58:35.415 --> 00:58:38.855
I am passionate about seeing people
be the best version of themselves,

00:58:38.865 --> 00:58:41.445
but especially men, especially men.

00:58:41.555 --> 00:58:44.215
and I think that we bought into
some narratives emotionally

00:58:44.665 --> 00:58:45.795
that don't serve us.

00:58:46.435 --> 00:58:51.971
And those need to be re re evaluated,
adjusted, and shifted so that we can

00:58:51.971 --> 00:58:53.381
be the best version of ourselves.

00:58:54.036 --> 00:58:58.956
Grayson: what kind of narratives that
we've bought into that we need to discard?

00:58:59.427 --> 00:59:02.147
Jesse: I think that
men not being, leaders.

00:59:03.072 --> 00:59:08.262
I think men being providers and
what that entails, I think provision

00:59:08.702 --> 00:59:10.352
is not necessarily about money.

00:59:10.352 --> 00:59:11.592
It's about a structure.

00:59:12.272 --> 00:59:14.692
It's about a place where
everybody can grow.

00:59:15.092 --> 00:59:18.832
I think, again, there's, there's
words and, and phrase and ideologies

00:59:18.832 --> 00:59:20.922
that have been used that limit men.

00:59:20.952 --> 00:59:22.541
I've always said that labels limit.

00:59:23.092 --> 00:59:25.822
When you're talking about being
a provider, are you providing

00:59:25.822 --> 00:59:28.482
a healthy place for people
to grow, your spouse to grow?

00:59:28.892 --> 00:59:31.252
Not necessarily about
who makes the most money.

00:59:31.882 --> 00:59:36.802
If you did, you reduced the provision that
he's providing you all the way around,

00:59:37.172 --> 00:59:39.362
then you're missing what provision is.

00:59:39.902 --> 00:59:43.782
But because we reduced it to just
money and um, what you can get

00:59:43.782 --> 00:59:47.742
from me, then you're missing what
really the value of the man is.

00:59:48.102 --> 00:59:53.142
When it comes down to it, deal with,
economic issues, people believe that

00:59:53.142 --> 00:59:57.852
they're not supposed to have, it's
historically been, obvious that there

00:59:57.852 --> 01:00:01.532
have been, groups of people that may
not have been as fortunate as others.

01:00:02.992 --> 01:00:06.782
If we believe in the gospel, that
shouldn't matter, but a lot of,

01:00:07.262 --> 01:00:09.042
but a lot of times we buy into it.

01:00:09.042 --> 01:00:11.352
And again, fair is a four
letter word that begins with F.

01:00:12.072 --> 01:00:13.962
It's never going to be fair
when it comes down to it.

01:00:13.962 --> 01:00:17.152
And even when you look at the
parable of the sower, Jesse.

01:00:18.562 --> 01:00:22.552
The parable says at the end that,
and some fell on good ground, right?

01:00:22.552 --> 01:00:23.852
Some of the seed fell on good ground.

01:00:24.332 --> 01:00:28.092
But what I noticed about that part
of that, uh, parable is the fact that

01:00:28.992 --> 01:00:32.492
the seed that fell on good ground,
it says some produce 30, some produce

01:00:32.502 --> 01:00:33.812
60, and some produce a hundred.

01:00:34.872 --> 01:00:37.892
So Jesse, even when everything
is quote unquote equal.

01:00:39.167 --> 01:00:41.057
Some people are still
going to only produce 30.

01:00:41.547 --> 01:00:44.087
Some people are still only produce
60 and some people don't produce on.

01:00:44.447 --> 01:00:45.917
It's never going to be equal anyway.

01:00:46.567 --> 01:00:50.027
So I think a lot of the messaging
that we want to share to reduce us.

01:00:50.027 --> 01:00:51.347
And again, make excuses.

01:00:51.347 --> 01:00:52.237
That's why I'm about bill.

01:00:52.237 --> 01:00:53.677
So no excuses.

01:00:54.017 --> 01:00:55.417
They exist today, right?

01:00:55.617 --> 01:00:57.937
I don't believe there's anything in
personal color can't do in the world.

01:00:58.637 --> 01:01:01.417
But yet there's a belief
system that they can't.

01:01:02.227 --> 01:01:05.997
The excuses that we make, whether they
be politically, socially, economically,

01:01:06.247 --> 01:01:09.297
seem to be greater than what's in you.

01:01:09.507 --> 01:01:12.507
And the Bible says, greater is he that's
in you, that's he that's in the world.

01:01:13.027 --> 01:01:17.146
One of my favorite, one of my favorite
verses of scripture is Ephesians 3 and 20.

01:01:17.527 --> 01:01:20.557
None to him that is able to do
exceedingly and abundantly above

01:01:20.557 --> 01:01:24.236
all who can ask of thing according
to the power that worketh in him.

01:01:24.497 --> 01:01:29.877
And you right that God gave you a
Deuteronomy talks about giving you the

01:01:29.877 --> 01:01:33.437
ability to obtain wealth and wealth
doesn't necessarily means money.

01:01:33.437 --> 01:01:37.367
It means wealth of information, wealth
of knowledge, wealth of experience.

01:01:37.547 --> 01:01:42.427
You know, I think we reduce that messaging
to just money, but it's not just money.

01:01:43.287 --> 01:01:45.917
It's being as being
wealthy all the way around.

01:01:45.927 --> 01:01:48.747
So I think those
narratives, those mantras.

01:01:49.057 --> 01:01:54.167
Um, those belief systems are where
we have to really shift and we have

01:01:54.167 --> 01:01:55.687
to call people on where they are.

01:01:56.257 --> 01:01:59.927
You know, there's certain thing in the
church that just doesn't serve us well.

01:02:00.457 --> 01:02:06.267
Um, there's certain, there's certain
egos in the church that literally

01:02:06.587 --> 01:02:09.587
take the fact that people don't know
their word and they use the word

01:02:09.587 --> 01:02:11.257
manipulatively to get what they want.

01:02:11.887 --> 01:02:14.797
So I think we have to, the
Bible talks about a high time

01:02:14.837 --> 01:02:15.817
that we wake up out of sleep.

01:02:16.167 --> 01:02:17.137
We got to see what's happening.

01:02:18.588 --> 01:02:22.063
Grayson: you mentioned  the Parable
of the Solar and I think, the whole

01:02:22.063 --> 01:02:27.673
process of discipleship is to, to
help people become that good ground

01:02:27.723 --> 01:02:31.343
Because it's, it is not the seed,
the seed's the same for everybody.

01:02:31.343 --> 01:02:33.233
It's the ground that makes the difference.

01:02:33.233 --> 01:02:35.783
So it's up to us to become good soil

01:02:36.683 --> 01:02:38.273
Jesse: and everybody's not
gonna produce a hundred.

01:02:38.483 --> 01:02:41.183
Some are gonna produce early,
some produce produce 60.

01:02:41.393 --> 01:02:45.173
The problem is we try to make the thirties
produce 60 and they get frustrated.

01:02:45.603 --> 01:02:46.113
Grayson: Mmm.

01:02:46.470 --> 01:02:46.800
Jesse: A hundred.

01:02:46.805 --> 01:02:47.550
They get frustrated.

01:02:48.360 --> 01:02:49.710
What's for you is for you?

01:02:49.830 --> 01:02:51.870
If 60 is your best, gimme your best.

01:02:52.480 --> 01:02:54.730
But what we want is your
best to be what we want.

01:02:55.530 --> 01:02:56.040
Grayson: Mm.

01:02:56.260 --> 01:02:58.840
Jesse: we're, we're ignoring what
it is that you're supposed to be

01:02:58.840 --> 01:03:01.450
doing or you're capable of doing
at this point in time in your life.

01:03:02.260 --> 01:03:03.340
Let people be where they are.

01:03:03.670 --> 01:03:05.305
We, we've said it before,
bloom, where you're planet.

01:03:06.685 --> 01:03:09.295
where you have, what, what can
you yield from where you are?

01:03:09.295 --> 01:03:12.915
Because there may be some more of
your ground that needs to be tilled.

01:03:12.955 --> 01:03:14.895
There may be some more of your
ground that needs to be watered

01:03:14.895 --> 01:03:16.215
before you can produce more.

01:03:16.850 --> 01:03:17.380
Grayson: Mm hmm.

01:03:18.875 --> 01:03:19.395
Jesse: You know what I mean?

01:03:19.435 --> 01:03:23.085
But most of our evaluation is based
on what someone else needs from us.

01:03:23.615 --> 01:03:26.585
Not what we need from
ourselves or for ourselves.

01:03:27.720 --> 01:03:28.130
Grayson: Yeah.

01:03:29.330 --> 01:03:36.020
Well, tell people where they can, get
more of you,  websites, books, podcast,

01:03:36.595 --> 01:03:38.885
Jesse: Yeah, everything is on my website.

01:03:38.885 --> 01:03:40.885
GM talking BS dot com.

01:03:43.270 --> 01:03:44.500
Grayson: gmtalkingbs.

01:03:44.550 --> 01:03:44.900
com

01:03:45.275 --> 01:03:46.055
Jesse: Everything is there.

01:03:46.055 --> 01:03:48.825
My pod, my daily podcast,
the link is right there.

01:03:49.315 --> 01:03:53.415
Um, consultations, uh, is,
uh, scheduling is right there.

01:03:53.735 --> 01:03:55.675
Um, my books to order them.

01:03:55.905 --> 01:03:56.945
Everything is right there.

01:03:57.345 --> 01:03:58.655
Uh, all the things that we're doing.

01:03:59.105 --> 01:04:00.645
Uh, now it's all up there.

01:04:00.645 --> 01:04:04.125
So everything can be gotten
at GM talking BS dot com.

01:04:06.580 --> 01:04:08.410
Grayson: Well, thank you for that.

01:04:08.420 --> 01:04:14.160
We're, we are about out of time, if you
have one piece of advice that you could

01:04:14.160 --> 01:04:20.920
pass on to a young man or a young woman
out there that could change their lives.

01:04:21.770 --> 01:04:22.710
What would that be?

01:04:24.935 --> 01:04:26.685
Jesse: I think I'm going
to give you two answers.

01:04:27.198 --> 01:04:31.438
because I want to make sure we stay
true to having God as the center of

01:04:31.438 --> 01:04:33.658
our lives and Jesus being the focus.

01:04:33.658 --> 01:04:37.348
But when I talk to people about
their lives, And these both

01:04:37.348 --> 01:04:38.628
things are spiritual as well.

01:04:39.828 --> 01:04:43.018
if someone wanted to change their
life right now, and they wanted

01:04:43.018 --> 01:04:45.618
to have an immediate impact,
they could do it in this fashion.

01:04:45.908 --> 01:04:49.898
Number one is have no emotional
attachment to any outcome.

01:04:50.724 --> 01:04:52.964
And number two is no time
frame for things to happen.

01:04:53.771 --> 01:04:55.331
Romans 8 and 28 is true.

01:04:55.776 --> 01:04:58.676
That all things work together for the
good, for them that love God and those

01:04:58.686 --> 01:05:00.706
that are called according to his purpose.

01:05:02.186 --> 01:05:04.836
Then, there's no reason for you to be
emotionally attached to any outcome.

01:05:05.256 --> 01:05:06.526
It's all working together for your good.

01:05:06.806 --> 01:05:10.616
As a matter of fact, I would contend
that when you are living that

01:05:10.616 --> 01:05:11.986
way, there are no wrong decisions.

01:05:13.171 --> 01:05:16.331
I think we live in a world, Jesse,
where outcomes are what we are

01:05:17.121 --> 01:05:20.141
looking for, and we tend to try to
manipulate and control the outcome.

01:05:20.951 --> 01:05:24.541
Well, Romans 8 and 28 said that all
things work together for your good anyway,

01:05:25.171 --> 01:05:26.761
so have no emotional attachment to it.

01:05:27.121 --> 01:05:30.466
When you get an emotional attachment
to something, now you become a person.

01:05:31.096 --> 01:05:32.376
The one who's driving the train.

01:05:33.286 --> 01:05:36.666
Well, the second part of that is
no timeframe for things to happen.

01:05:37.056 --> 01:05:38.376
Jesse, let me ask you something.

01:05:38.566 --> 01:05:40.426
When has God ever worked
on your timeframe?

01:05:42.996 --> 01:05:43.486
Grayson: Never.

01:05:44.566 --> 01:05:49.136
Jesse: So when we take those things off
the table and we change those things, we

01:05:49.136 --> 01:05:50.876
get to walk in a more spiritual place.

01:05:52.736 --> 01:05:57.766
And I think that right there is what
you actually can do to shift where

01:05:57.766 --> 01:06:02.126
you are right now, anybody that if
you learn to not be emotional about

01:06:02.126 --> 01:06:07.186
outcomes, and trust that God is leading
you and take time frames off the table.

01:06:07.606 --> 01:06:08.816
You allow him to do his work.

01:06:08.966 --> 01:06:12.846
You allow him to work with you, grow
you, change you so that you can be the

01:06:12.846 --> 01:06:14.376
good brown you talked about, Jesse.

01:06:15.303 --> 01:06:19.303
So if I take decision making off
the table and stop worrying about

01:06:19.303 --> 01:06:22.063
outcomes now, I'm leaving the outcome
to God That's a spiritual thing.

01:06:22.263 --> 01:06:24.733
Here's what I have to do is a
spiritual thing I have to do if I

01:06:24.733 --> 01:06:29.938
remove the time frames Now, I'm not
playing God, I'm allowing God to work.

01:06:30.328 --> 01:06:33.578
So there's a natural thing I have
to do, like 1 Corinthians 15, 46,

01:06:33.578 --> 01:06:35.328
says first natural, then spiritual.

01:06:36.148 --> 01:06:38.318
And that first description is
talking about exegetically the

01:06:38.318 --> 01:06:39.688
first Adam and the second Adam.

01:06:40.108 --> 01:06:42.088
But there's a rhema, there's
a present day truth to that.

01:06:42.988 --> 01:06:46.158
And I think that's where we have to
get to, understanding that, and that's

01:06:46.158 --> 01:06:50.008
why I believe that if somebody's able
to do that, I'm not saying it's easy,

01:06:50.318 --> 01:06:51.798
nothing about following God is easy.

01:06:51.968 --> 01:06:54.448
But if you're able to do that,
then you can literally change

01:06:54.448 --> 01:06:57.518
your life and have and begin to
have a life that you want to have,

01:06:58.738 --> 01:06:59.118
Grayson: Yeah.

01:07:00.488 --> 01:07:04.308
Well, anything else you want to add?

01:07:05.128 --> 01:07:07.638
Jesse: I just want to say thank
you for allowing me to be a

01:07:07.638 --> 01:07:08.758
part of what you're doing.

01:07:09.388 --> 01:07:10.798
I wish you all the success.

01:07:11.273 --> 01:07:14.453
And you see your heart is about Christ.

01:07:14.463 --> 01:07:15.243
I can tell that.

01:07:15.683 --> 01:07:18.193
And, um, don't worry about it.

01:07:18.193 --> 01:07:19.293
Focus on the outcomes.

01:07:19.443 --> 01:07:20.403
Just keep doing what you do.

01:07:21.143 --> 01:07:21.963
Don't worry about anything.

01:07:21.963 --> 01:07:23.863
Just keep doing what it is that you do.

01:07:24.433 --> 01:07:28.653
And, um, I just appreciate an atmosphere
and an opportunity to be able to

01:07:28.653 --> 01:07:30.113
share what God has in my heart.

01:07:30.383 --> 01:07:33.323
And I hope that whoever watches this,
whether it's one or a million, that

01:07:33.323 --> 01:07:36.823
you get something from it and it can
impact you and get you to change.

01:07:38.608 --> 01:07:40.218
Grayson: Thank you so much for being here.

01:07:40.218 --> 01:07:41.548
This has been a real blessing.

01:07:41.558 --> 01:07:43.738
Would you, would you
pray for our listeners?

01:07:43.863 --> 01:07:44.193
Jesse: Absolutely.

01:07:44.343 --> 01:07:44.843
Absolutely.

01:07:45.173 --> 01:07:48.593
Father God, we thank you for this
opportunity to be in your presence.

01:07:48.973 --> 01:07:51.993
We thank you for the fruit that
this is going to yield, Father God.

01:07:52.363 --> 01:07:55.093
Father God, continue to touch the
hand of Jesse Dukes, Father God,

01:07:55.403 --> 01:07:57.023
lift him up, raise him, Father God.

01:07:57.023 --> 01:07:59.833
You know your work with him is not
done yet because he's still here.

01:08:00.438 --> 01:08:03.308
Everybody watching this program right
now, Father God, I pray that they

01:08:03.668 --> 01:08:05.268
deepen their relationship with you.

01:08:05.538 --> 01:08:08.488
They, Matthew 6 and 33, and they
seek ye first the kingdom of

01:08:08.528 --> 01:08:12.028
God and his righteousness and
everything will be added unto them.

01:08:12.578 --> 01:08:15.598
Make that not just a declaration,
but a belief, Father God.

01:08:16.198 --> 01:08:20.288
So we pray, healing, love, understanding
to everyone that watches this.

01:08:20.708 --> 01:08:23.648
Father God, prosper them and
give them what they needed.

01:08:23.788 --> 01:08:27.328
Have them trust and rely on you
for everything in their lives.

01:08:27.578 --> 01:08:30.608
And we'll always give you the praise
and honor and glory in Jesus name.

01:08:30.648 --> 01:08:31.008
Amen.

01:08:32.688 --> 01:08:33.388
Grayson: Amen.

01:08:37.788 --> 01:08:39.988
Cailin: We hope you've been
blessed by today's story.

01:08:40.408 --> 01:08:44.598
if you've heard something that you think
could help someone you know, please share

01:08:44.598 --> 01:08:46.428
it using the link in the show notes.

01:08:47.258 --> 01:08:51.608
Also, if you will give Faith and Purpose a
positive review on your podcast platform,

01:08:52.058 --> 01:08:53.698
you could help more people find it.

01:08:54.308 --> 01:08:58.373
You will probably never know how
that small effort can make a big

01:08:58.373 --> 01:09:01.923
difference in someone's life,
but our Heavenly Father knows.

01:09:02.423 --> 01:09:07.223
Speaking of sharing, if you know a Jesus
follower with a story to tell, please send

01:09:07.223 --> 01:09:09.153
them a link to Faith and Purpose Podcast.

01:09:10.123 --> 01:09:12.283
It may encourage them to tell their story.

01:09:12.683 --> 01:09:14.283
That person may even be you.

01:09:14.753 --> 01:09:17.883
Our only criteria is
that Jesus be glorified.

01:09:18.653 --> 01:09:22.163
Most Christians don't share their
faith because they mistakenly think

01:09:22.173 --> 01:09:26.543
their story is not interesting enough,
or that it's self centered to talk

01:09:26.553 --> 01:09:31.593
about themselves, or that they are not
competent to explain the gospel correctly.

01:09:32.033 --> 01:09:33.293
But none of that is relevant.

01:09:33.683 --> 01:09:37.123
If Jesus has changed your
life, you have a story to tell.

01:09:38.068 --> 01:09:42.838
No one has a story like yours, and you
may be the only one who can reach someone

01:09:42.838 --> 01:09:44.618
else through telling your experience.

01:09:45.188 --> 01:09:50.608
A story is just that, a true account
of your own experience, and no one

01:09:50.618 --> 01:09:52.558
can disagree with your experience.

01:09:53.513 --> 01:09:57.363
It's not about theology, and it's not
about how interesting or special you are.

01:09:57.703 --> 01:09:59.363
It's all about Jesus.

01:10:00.143 --> 01:10:04.853
So when you're ready to tell how Jesus
has impacted your life, you can let Jesse

01:10:04.853 --> 01:10:07.973
know at his ministry website, jesseduke.

01:10:07.993 --> 01:10:08.253
net.

01:10:08.883 --> 01:10:12.063
There you can download guidelines
that will make it easy to

01:10:12.063 --> 01:10:13.523
prepare to tell your story.

01:10:14.143 --> 01:10:16.583
Thank you for listening today and Shalom.