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In space, no one can hear you scream.

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Welcome to Primary Technology,

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the show about the tech news that matters.

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Apple's homepad may be coming October
thirteenth.

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That's in the news. And iPhone Duo,

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you can pre-pre-order it this Monday.

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ChatGPT had their dev day and announced
dots,

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AI agents that do a bunch of stuff for
you.

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Paramount appoints a new co-CEO.

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Amazon is giving their delivery drivers
glasses that record everything

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and a ton more. This episode is brought to
you by OriginHQ and you,

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the members who support us directly.

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And I'm one of your hosts, Steven Robles,

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joined by the famous and infamous who's
just making his rounds everywhere,

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Jason Aten. How's it going, Jason?

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It's good. I love the way you do our
intros because every time without fail

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you say something that I'm like,

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Hold on, we're talking about that.

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I better go look and see what he put in
here.

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I know. It and every yes,

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I get the rundown done at least twelve
hours before we record.

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and I look through it and every time

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you say something that I'm like,

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How did I miss that? Okay.

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The Amazon delivery glasses, that'll be in
the lightning round.

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I mean

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it's you know, it's it's just a whole
other thing.

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All right, now ~ some the quote.

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Let's start with the quote. In space no
one can hear you scream.

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It's a pretty well known quote.

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It it's one of the

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You what movie that's

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most famous quotes you've used,

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right? Yeah, it's from Alien. Okay.

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One of the most famous. It is from Alien.

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We're going to talk about the cutification
of AI in a minute.

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About all the companies like Muse AI and
Dots trying to make their

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AI agents seem cute. And I said that
because someone replied to

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my threads post about that with this
picture,

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which is the teddy bear head on the
xenomorph from the movie Alien.

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And I thought that was pretty funny.

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But

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i it does seem about right after my
experience.

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I do think of Muse as this little I almost
say cockroach,

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but I don't mean that in a pejorative
sense.

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What was the the movie with the gremlins?

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Like just I mean it's called Gremlins.

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They turn evil at night or whatever?

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Thank you. Okay, I've I've actually never
seen it.

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Yeah. The

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movie with the Gremlins. yes, the Gremlin
movie.

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The Gremlins. I have seen Batteries Not
Included,

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which is a very deep cut, but I've not
seen Gremlins.

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So have you seen Batteries Not Included?

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Do you remember that movie?

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I think so, yeah.

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Leave us a five star rating and review.

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Have you seen Batteries Not Included and
Short Circuit?

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All three of them. Those are some of my
favorite movies.

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And hat or no hat.

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Jason was wearing a hat and hoodie today
that I was not prepared for.

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It it took me a full 10 minutes in our
pre-show to actually figure

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To to absorb it, to process it.

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out what was happening. I said,

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You

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Who who am I talking to?

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sound like Jason. Is this what AI thinks
Jason looks like and it's just fake?

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You sound like Jason you look like Jason.

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That's it.

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Now I said Jason was famous and infamous
because Jason,

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you've been making the rounds everywhere.

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Your articles have been covered by so many
news outlets.

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You've been on the news. Who can you say
or no should I cut that out?

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Wait a minute. Okay.

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No, you don't have to cut it out.

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I've done

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some so I've yeah, I've made the rounds.

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Does that sound any better?

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You've made the rounds. We'll get okay,

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we'll get

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we'll get into that. We did that.

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Also I wanted to say last episode,

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I wanted to point it out and missed it.

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We passed episode one hundred fifty,

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Jason. One hundred fifty episodes.

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Isn't that wild?

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Now that does include one or two extras.

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Listen, I don't want to get into it.

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Okay, great. Okay, great.

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I try to mark bonus episodes as bonus that
are not actually numbered.

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Sometimes

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that happened anyways. But yeah,

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but 150. And you know, we're coming up on
our third year because

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we started in January of 2024.

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And so yeah, we're coming up. But anyway,

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I enjoy I enjoyed doing this podcast with
you,

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Yeah. It's so fun. Yeah.

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Jason. Congrats on 150. Yeah,

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that's fun. All right. Five-star ratings
and reviews.

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Thank you to McBain A99 from the UK says
loves the daily and weekly show.

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So they're a member. Thank you for that.

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Battery percentage on, but we won't hold
that against him.

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But pencil up. Pencil up and watch only on
Siri.

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So he's riding both sides.

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There you go.

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He's on both of our sides. And JP Tooy
from the USA,

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listen, I know who this is. This is
Jennifer Patterson Tooie of The Verge left

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us a five star rating review and asked us
to do more smart home coverage.

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~

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Of course.

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So thank thank you for that, Jennifer.

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And we want to have you on. So if you're
listening,

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if this Apple home pad really does come
out in a couple weeks,

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Please come on the show. We need to talk
about it in depth.

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That'd be a fun episode.

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Absolutely. I'm

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generally adamantly opposed to having
guests,

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but I would accept that one. I'm just
kidding.

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We'll do it as a bonus episode.

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It off Thursday. Yeah,

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yeah. ~ Will Kennard from the UK,

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battery percentage on. Point for you.

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And I wanted to thank, deeply thank Alex,

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~ for sending me an email because I
mentioned how Apple is going

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to be introducing subscriber video soon.

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That was in kind of towards the end of the
show last week.

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And I talked about how my process for
making sure the audio was good

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for the video was very lengthy because I
basically re-render the whole show because

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Riverside's audio

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isn't great. So I edit my own audio and
then I put it together and Alex sent

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me an email like, hey, FFmpeg,

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which is a great like kind of utility that
lives in the terminal of your Mac.

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It doesn't live there, but you know what I
mean.

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That's how you work use it. You can use
FFmpeg to swap out the audio track

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of a video file in seconds. And I asked
him like,

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Well, how do you do He's I have no idea.

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I think it just is able to do that.

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I was like, okay.

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Yeah.

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So I did what you do. I went to ask
Claude.

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I said, Hey, I heard F Fmpeg can do this.

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Can it do this? And Claude was like,

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Yep. I said, Well, can you give me a
script that I can use in a shortcut?

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And it gave me the script. And so now I
have a shortcut where when I run it,

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I can choose the video file I get from
Riverside.

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I can choose the audio file that I edited,

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which has to be exactly the same length.

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But once I choose those, like in three
seconds,

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it spits out another video file and it
just swapped the audio track.

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And it's gonna save me like an hour a
week.

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And I think we'll make it ~ possible maybe
when we if if and when Apple offers

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subscriber video and Transistor,

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our host, supports it, I might be able to
do it all because this is gonna save

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me a ton of time. So thank you,

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Alex. That was a huge help. And I'll put a
link to that shortcut down

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in the show notes if somebody else has a
reason to to do that.

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So yeah.

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Yeah.

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it's funny. I think Claude really likes
FFMPEG because the number

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of times I've asked it about trying to do
something,

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I'm like, you know, when I export
sometimes I'll open a video in in quick
time

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and I'll just click export audio,

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but you don't get any choices about like
the whatever,

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whatever. And it's like, you should use
FFMPEG for I'm like,

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I'm not doing that. And then it's like,

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what if I had a folder where what every
time a audio file dropped into that

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you just transcribed it? And it's like,

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You should use FFM for I'm like,

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What doesn't Whisper transcription just
watch folders?

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Which it does. It's like

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Cloud

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really wants me to use FFMPEG.

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They've got like a behind the scenes deal
or something.

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Yeah, I mean I use shortcuts for that.

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I have another shortcut I'll put in the
thing.

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I have to write I have to make a note.

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I have to in bold.

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Well the audio one

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is easy because the transcription app I
use will just watch the folder

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and every time something

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Right.

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shows up in it it will just so I have
dropped well,

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we'll get to it later in personal text.

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Sorry. I'm I'm jumping too far ahead.

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Okay, well,

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I'm so excited.

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I have a shortcut that I'll also put in
the notes where it you you when

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you run the shortcut, you can select a
folder and if you have a bunch

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of video files in that folder,

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it will transcribe them all. And it'll
just save dot text files in that same
folder

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with all the transcripts and it's great.

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So yeah, you could do all we'll get to
we'll get to that in personal tech.

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We'll we'll save it.

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Amazing.

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Jason, you have just a few days left for
you to get ready for your iPhone

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duo pre pre order. Okay.

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Apple is doing this if you every year
Apple does this with

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the regular iPhone launch, but they're
doing it for the iPhone Duo October
twelfth,

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which is sorry, not you don't have a few
days,

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you have a week in a few days.

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This is next Monday, October twelfth.

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You'll be able to pre-pre order your
iPhone Duo,

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meaning you can get ready. You can go in,

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you can say if you're trading a device in,

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you can choose your carrier, connect your
carrier account,

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choose your model, the storage,

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the color, and get ready for the pre-order
that's happening on the Friday.

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And that is Friday, October sixteenth is
the official pre order.

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But on Monday, the twelfth, you'll be able
to pre pre order.

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So get ready, Jason. How you gonna?

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I don't even understand

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why this is a thing that exists.

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I th I don't hold on. Why?

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You don't ~ I get it. Yeah.

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Explain to me why the pre pre order
process makes any sense.

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They're telling you it's gonna be really
hard to pre-order.

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Is that the point? Is it trying to create
just the perception that it'll

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be really hard to pre-order? So you should
create your pre-order in advance.

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But the creating a pre order in advance is
purely a an exercise

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in like getting people excited about a
thing,

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which is fine.

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No, no.

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No, no, no, no, no. If you're connecting
this to a carrier,

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there's been many times where in the
process of pre pre ordering that something
will

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I'll have to make a decision or something
has to change,

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or just making sure like my card on file
that the Apple store is about

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to use is good. Like all those steps saves
me a lot of time,

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especially the connecting carrier.

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Because when you do that pre pre have you
never done the pre pre order?

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I've literally

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never done it and I've literally never
bought a phone connected to a carrier.

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Well no, hold on. Not literally

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I was gonna say.

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never, but not since like the iPhone
eleven.

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I just buy them. I don't want any I don't

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You just buy the unlocked? ~ well that's
the difference.

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want none of those carriers listening to
my iPhone.

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I'm shh I

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Yeah, but connect it to Verizon as soon as
you get it.

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Jason's trying to no he's trying to stoke
people.

241
00:08:46,149 --> 00:08:47,149
Just saying.

242
00:08:47,146 --> 00:08:48,687
We'll get to Muse AI in a minute.

243
00:08:48,687 --> 00:08:49,687
Don't worry about

244
00:08:49,347 --> 00:08:53,170
it. ~ but no, I connected to my carrier
every time.

245
00:08:53,170 --> 00:08:55,181
So I tell Apple like I'm

246
00:08:54,683 --> 00:08:55,683
They charge you more

247
00:08:55,384 --> 00:08:58,899
for that, you know. They charge you thirty
five dollars more for that

248
00:08:58,799 --> 00:09:01,360
I mean they're gonna charge you that
activation fee when you put it on the
carrier.

249
00:08:58,899 --> 00:09:02,815
phone. No, no, not when I just swap it.

250
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,421
ATT does. ATT

251
00:09:02,815 --> 00:09:04,598
I've never paid for that.

252
00:09:05,421 --> 00:09:07,341
does, and they're they're scalpers.

253
00:09:07,341 --> 00:09:12,283
I'll just say that. Because I've had like
a pixel phone or whatever that I've like

254
00:09:12,283 --> 00:09:15,263
switched my eSIM to and back. I've
switched a line back and forth,

255
00:09:15,263 --> 00:09:17,924
and I get an activation charge every time
I switch it.

256
00:09:17,863 --> 00:09:20,145
See, that's that's insane. That should not
happen.

257
00:09:17,924 --> 00:09:20,125
But that's AT.

258
00:09:20,385 --> 00:09:23,262
And that's listen, hey, I might switch it
because ATT is supposedly

259
00:09:23,262 --> 00:09:27,497
not gonna offer this cellular handoff so I
can switch between my AT Pro Max

260
00:09:27,497 --> 00:09:28,497
and do I do it.

261
00:09:27,697 --> 00:09:28,697
Can you imagine

262
00:09:28,368 --> 00:09:31,452
if they charged you thirty five dollars
every time you unlocked your phone?

263
00:09:30,683 --> 00:09:33,184
This is what I'm saying. If they're
charging me that for activation,

264
00:09:33,184 --> 00:09:35,025
this is probably why they're not doing the
handoff feature.

265
00:09:35,025 --> 00:09:37,966
Listen, I leave us a five star rating
review.

266
00:09:37,966 --> 00:09:42,187
Shoot us up on social media. T Mobile has
the handoff feature now.

267
00:09:42,187 --> 00:09:46,869
Verizon has said it's coming. I'll have to
actually price out because I have like

268
00:09:47,129 --> 00:09:48,850
my entire family is on this plan.

269
00:09:48,850 --> 00:09:51,361
But I mean the handoff feature might make
me switch.

270
00:09:51,361 --> 00:09:53,952
I've been on ATT since singular,

271
00:09:53,952 --> 00:09:57,433
like singular era. Like back in ~ five,

272
00:09:57,433 --> 00:09:59,674
I think. So I'm down.

273
00:10:00,312 --> 00:10:02,293
I'm down, I'll switch. We'll see.

274
00:10:02,293 --> 00:10:05,523
Anyway, I would do the pre-pre order if
you want to order iPhone Duo,

275
00:10:05,523 --> 00:10:06,864
especially if you connect it to a carrier,

276
00:10:06,864 --> 00:10:09,485
which I do. Like I tell it I'm going to
upgrade this phone line and

277
00:10:09,485 --> 00:10:11,953
all that kind stuff. And you sign into
your ATT account and all that.

278
00:10:11,953 --> 00:10:14,186
That's why that is useful. Monday,

279
00:10:14,186 --> 00:10:16,006
October 12th, the pre-pre order is coming.

280
00:10:16,006 --> 00:10:21,348
And then the next day, Jason, supposedly
we are finally,

281
00:10:21,348 --> 00:10:25,749
after years of waiting, getting the Apple
home pad.

282
00:10:25,749 --> 00:10:28,240
Mark German, who's launched a new show.

283
00:10:28,806 --> 00:10:30,177
Congrats, Mark, on launching a podcast.

284
00:10:30,177 --> 00:10:32,468
I believe it launches today as we record.

285
00:10:32,468 --> 00:10:35,790
~ the homepad, October 13th.

286
00:10:35,790 --> 00:10:37,131
Mark German says it's going to be coming.

287
00:10:37,131 --> 00:10:38,401
Apple's announcing it on that day.

288
00:10:38,401 --> 00:10:43,094
This is supposedly going to be the square
ish iPad like screen,

289
00:10:43,094 --> 00:10:45,375
a six inch display, Mark German is saying,

290
00:10:45,375 --> 00:10:49,117
maybe on an arm, like the old iMac G4.

291
00:10:49,117 --> 00:10:53,310
And it will have some kind of facial
recognition so it knows what user

292
00:10:53,310 --> 00:10:55,421
is approaching it. And if you,

293
00:10:55,421 --> 00:10:57,422
you know, it might show your calendar.

294
00:10:57,796 --> 00:11:01,698
messages and stuff when you approach it
and then it'll recognize someone else

295
00:11:01,698 --> 00:11:04,730
as they approach it. There'll be a guest
mode so it doesn't show

296
00:11:04,730 --> 00:11:08,112
any sensitive information. Of course
you'll be able to control your entire home

297
00:11:08,252 --> 00:11:11,314
and then Siri AI would be built into this.

298
00:11:11,314 --> 00:11:15,196
And we also might get a new home pod mini
and Apple TV at the same time,

299
00:11:15,196 --> 00:11:18,398
Mark German is saying, because then they
all those devices will be uploaded

300
00:11:18,398 --> 00:11:20,819
to Siri AI. I'm so excited Jason.

301
00:11:20,819 --> 00:11:23,621
I'm very excited. I want all of this.

302
00:11:23,621 --> 00:11:24,982
You don't look excited, Jason.

303
00:11:25,522 --> 00:11:27,353
I'm just not excited about the name.

304
00:11:27,353 --> 00:11:30,185
I don't want if

305
00:11:28,314 --> 00:11:30,157
Home well, I don't know if it's gonna be
called a home pad.

306
00:11:30,185 --> 00:11:33,157
it's called the home pad, I don't think I
would buy it.

307
00:11:33,157 --> 00:11:35,439
I don't I don't

308
00:11:34,064 --> 00:11:35,064
What?

309
00:11:35,439 --> 00:11:38,761
think I want to tell people I have a I
don't know what but I mean here's the
thing.

310
00:11:38,761 --> 00:11:40,592
What else would you call this thing?

311
00:11:40,592 --> 00:11:41,663
I don't know. They they're gonna call

312
00:11:40,975 --> 00:11:41,975
What else?

313
00:11:41,663 --> 00:11:45,265
it home pad with display, which is
honestly a thing Apple might do.

314
00:11:45,265 --> 00:11:48,648
Yeah. They might

315
00:11:45,446 --> 00:11:47,939
Home pod with display. I mean

316
00:11:49,128 --> 00:11:52,010
display pad. I don't which is really the
same thing.

317
00:11:51,768 --> 00:11:53,113
no not not display pad.

318
00:11:52,010 --> 00:11:53,281
That's the same thing

319
00:11:53,281 --> 00:11:54,712
because it's like display pod,

320
00:11:54,712 --> 00:11:55,712
sorry.

321
00:11:55,895 --> 00:12:00,924
Apple Apple home display. I feel like they
could be it could be that.

322
00:12:00,924 --> 00:12:03,830
Apple home it'll be Apple home something.

323
00:12:04,432 --> 00:12:06,606
It'll be the Apple Home Hub Nest Max.

324
00:12:06,928 --> 00:12:10,099
Thank you. Apple home No, I think I don't
know,

325
00:12:10,099 --> 00:12:14,621
HomePad. Do you remember when the iPad was
it was before the iPad came out,

326
00:12:14,621 --> 00:12:17,262
but there was a lot of pontification about
the name.

327
00:12:17,262 --> 00:12:23,065
And people were like, it's going to be the
iSlate or it'll be the iTablet.

328
00:12:23,065 --> 00:12:27,886
And people were poo-pooing the name iPad
because it sounded weird at first.

329
00:12:27,886 --> 00:12:31,428
It sounded like yeah, a hygiene product.

330
00:12:29,328 --> 00:12:31,515
A feminine hygiene product. That's the
problem,

331
00:12:31,428 --> 00:12:32,428
And

332
00:12:31,515 --> 00:12:32,515
yeah.

333
00:12:31,908 --> 00:12:34,139
people were like, There's no way they're
gonna call it iPad.

334
00:12:34,139 --> 00:12:36,410
And sure enough, Steve Jobs is like

335
00:12:36,602 --> 00:12:38,156
We call it iPad. So

336
00:12:37,595 --> 00:12:38,595
Yeah.

337
00:12:38,156 --> 00:12:40,010
make they're not afraid of that word,

338
00:12:40,010 --> 00:12:42,958
obviously, but home home pad, I don't
know,

339
00:12:42,958 --> 00:12:44,211
maybe that's what it is. What do you
think?

340
00:12:44,211 --> 00:12:45,574
Over or under. You gonna go home pad?

341
00:12:45,574 --> 00:12:46,574
You betting on that?

342
00:12:47,257 --> 00:12:50,828
I would bet against that, but I would not
bet a lot.

343
00:12:52,119 --> 00:12:55,418
Small bet. Small bet. I think all right,

344
00:12:55,418 --> 00:12:58,821
well I will say not. I think it's gonna be
something different than the home pad,

345
00:12:58,821 --> 00:13:00,374
and we'll see who's right. Just for the
heck of it.

346
00:12:59,836 --> 00:13:00,836
Well no, we're both

347
00:13:00,476 --> 00:13:04,009
saying that. We're both saying I'm saying
I'm betting it would not be the home pad,

348
00:13:04,009 --> 00:13:06,821
but I would not bet a lot of money because

349
00:13:05,539 --> 00:13:06,584
~ I see, I see.

350
00:13:06,821 --> 00:13:10,064
I'm saying it's also just pretty likely
that maybe that is what they're gonna call

351
00:13:10,064 --> 00:13:11,064
it.

352
00:13:10,468 --> 00:13:12,145
Maybe it's just Apple Pad. No,

353
00:13:12,145 --> 00:13:14,133
that would be terrible. No, don't do that.

354
00:13:14,133 --> 00:13:15,133
At least don't bet.

355
00:13:14,660 --> 00:13:15,660
I I think

356
00:13:15,161 --> 00:13:19,069
it is more likely that it's like a new
paradigm,

357
00:13:19,069 --> 00:13:22,606
like it's just the Apple home display or
something like that.

358
00:13:22,350 --> 00:13:23,350
Apple

359
00:13:22,650 --> 00:13:26,132
Home Hub. Apple Home Hub. That's what I'm
saying it's gonna be.

360
00:13:26,132 --> 00:13:28,410
Be I mean, if you

361
00:13:27,014 --> 00:13:28,363
Maybe. That that would work.

362
00:13:28,494 --> 00:13:30,574
and if you look back at the iPhone 18
event,

363
00:13:30,574 --> 00:13:35,397
Apple's new CEO, John Turnus, many times
was like personal intelligence hub.

364
00:13:35,397 --> 00:13:38,478
Personal intelligence hub. He said it like
a bunch of times.

365
00:13:38,478 --> 00:13:42,041
And nah, that's too long. That's too long.

366
00:13:38,652 --> 00:13:39,935
Maybe that's the name of product.

367
00:13:39,935 --> 00:13:42,698
The Apple Personal Intelligence Hub.

368
00:13:43,022 --> 00:13:46,023
I think the Apple Home Hub, that sounds
right.

369
00:13:46,023 --> 00:13:48,144
I'm going with that. I'm marking it down.

370
00:13:47,336 --> 00:13:48,901
Alright, I'm writing it down. Home.

371
00:13:48,144 --> 00:13:49,185
Apple

372
00:13:49,250 --> 00:13:50,728
I'm writing it down.

373
00:13:51,023 --> 00:13:52,525
Abla Home. Anyway, I'm excited for this.

374
00:13:52,525 --> 00:13:55,200
I looked back, we've been talking me and
Andrew talked about this

375
00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:59,327
on Home Kit Insider, I think seven years
ago was the earliest episode that

376
00:13:59,327 --> 00:14:02,242
we mentioned it. This has been long
rumored.

377
00:14:02,242 --> 00:14:04,406
Long rumored. So anyway.

378
00:14:03,910 --> 00:14:04,910
And I'm writing

379
00:14:04,563 --> 00:14:07,698
down Apple Home display just because I
wanted to have something on the record.

380
00:14:08,166 --> 00:14:11,080
Okay, very good, very good. We will we
will check back on Jason's notepad.

381
00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:15,315
~ his Apple home notepad in a couple
weeks.

382
00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:16,251
Y it's very sophisticated.

383
00:14:15,315 --> 00:14:17,498
Very sophisticated.

384
00:14:17,878 --> 00:14:22,204
You know, side note, you have like 13
remarkable tablets,

385
00:14:22,204 --> 00:14:23,445
and you still

386
00:14:22,876 --> 00:14:23,876
I do.

387
00:14:23,706 --> 00:14:26,109
and you still use paper when you write
down notes during this show.

388
00:14:26,109 --> 00:14:27,109
Why don't you use a remarkable?

389
00:14:27,410 --> 00:14:29,762
Well, I typically throw this paper away
afterward and I should

390
00:14:29,762 --> 00:14:31,014
not throw the remarkable away.

391
00:14:31,014 --> 00:14:35,048
That would be bad. ~

392
00:14:31,246 --> 00:14:32,609
No, you should not you should not.

393
00:14:32,609 --> 00:14:34,653
They're expensive. They're expensive.

394
00:14:34,653 --> 00:14:35,653
I see.

395
00:14:35,208 --> 00:14:37,410
the remarkable that I like is the move,

396
00:14:37,410 --> 00:14:41,254
which is small, and the paper I'm using is
not small.

397
00:14:41,254 --> 00:14:43,226
Like I just and it is

398
00:14:41,806 --> 00:14:43,127
It is a big yeah.

399
00:14:43,226 --> 00:14:46,529
just the other thing that's nice about it
is because it is just a large sheet

400
00:14:46,529 --> 00:14:49,882
of like a large pad of paper, I don't have
to be especially precise when

401
00:14:49,882 --> 00:14:51,354
I just reach over to write something down.

402
00:14:52,494 --> 00:14:55,261
Okay, so large pet l size is a priority
there.

403
00:14:55,056 --> 00:14:57,407
It's like speed. I just need to be able to
quickly grab

404
00:14:56,785 --> 00:14:57,785
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

405
00:14:57,407 --> 00:14:59,638
the pencil and just write something and
yeah.

406
00:14:59,638 --> 00:15:02,709
That's why. That's really the re and it's
also pretty the everything

407
00:15:02,709 --> 00:15:06,470
I'm writing down here is something with
the exception of remind Steven

408
00:15:06,470 --> 00:15:08,740
to tell me something. Pretty much
everything

409
00:15:07,610 --> 00:15:08,610
Yes, that's at the

410
00:15:08,740 --> 00:15:10,801
else on this list is simply for the show.

411
00:15:10,801 --> 00:15:13,962
And so I don't I don't it doesn't need to
be sophisticated.

412
00:15:11,278 --> 00:15:14,147
Right, right, right, right. You just burn
it.

413
00:15:13,962 --> 00:15:16,353
Yeah. I've got a fireplace over there.

414
00:15:14,147 --> 00:15:16,134
You just stand there and watch it burn.

415
00:15:16,134 --> 00:15:18,422
That's it.

416
00:15:16,353 --> 00:15:17,823
You can't see it, but it I'm just kidding.

417
00:15:17,823 --> 00:15:18,823
It's actually a trash

418
00:15:18,514 --> 00:15:19,514
can and I just drop a match.

419
00:15:20,580 --> 00:15:22,031
That's not safe. That's not safe.

420
00:15:22,031 --> 00:15:23,653
All right. You've been on a tear.

421
00:15:23,653 --> 00:15:27,276
Speaking of speed, you've been doing a lot
of stuff.

422
00:15:27,276 --> 00:15:30,919
And I just wanna this is the section of
the show where we just read Jason's
articles

423
00:15:30,919 --> 00:15:32,080
together. No, we're not gonna do that.

424
00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:33,451
but you have

425
00:15:32,297 --> 00:15:33,297
We should.

426
00:15:33,451 --> 00:15:35,863
a new episode of Creative Effort with Ron
Johnson,

427
00:15:35,863 --> 00:15:39,308
who was the created the Apple store
alongside Steve Jobs.

428
00:15:39,308 --> 00:15:41,398
There's some great Steve Jobs stories in
that episode.

429
00:15:41,398 --> 00:15:42,969
So we'll link that below. Congrats.

430
00:15:42,969 --> 00:15:44,300
New episode. Super fun.

431
00:15:43,187 --> 00:15:44,398
Thanks. Yeah, it was really

432
00:15:44,638 --> 00:15:47,189
I know. I did actually get some like
comments from people.

433
00:15:47,189 --> 00:15:51,101
They're like, Finally, so glad you you're
back.

434
00:15:50,972 --> 00:15:51,972
Finally.

435
00:15:51,101 --> 00:15:52,101
Someone even

436
00:15:51,642 --> 00:15:53,710
posted on social media, like, Jason's
back.

437
00:15:53,710 --> 00:15:56,024
I'm like, I do a podcast every week.

438
00:15:56,024 --> 00:15:58,225
I haven't done this one in a while.

439
00:15:56,148 --> 00:15:57,148
Every week.

440
00:15:58,225 --> 00:15:59,225
I publish

441
00:15:59,136 --> 00:16:00,807
three to five articles a week.

442
00:16:00,807 --> 00:16:02,848
I've been around. I just hadn't

443
00:16:02,384 --> 00:16:03,384
Thing it thank

444
00:16:02,864 --> 00:16:04,336
you. I mean, three to five articles a
week.

445
00:16:04,336 --> 00:16:06,378
And I mean you've been on another tear.

446
00:16:06,378 --> 00:16:09,221
And I just wanted to say one, well,

447
00:16:09,221 --> 00:16:11,453
great work, first of all. because you
know,

448
00:16:11,453 --> 00:16:14,145
you covering this meta AI, Muse AI stuff.

449
00:16:14,145 --> 00:16:17,428
The Verge covered it. ~ who else is linked
to it?

450
00:16:17,428 --> 00:16:18,719
I mean Group are linked to it.

451
00:16:18,188 --> 00:16:20,291
I mean I think nine to five Mac,

452
00:16:18,719 --> 00:16:23,064
Apple Insider wrote an article about

453
00:16:20,291 --> 00:16:23,065
Apple Insider, w ~ which makes me

454
00:16:23,065 --> 00:16:24,657
mad. Fine, I like Apple Insider,

455
00:16:24,657 --> 00:16:27,120
but like everyone keeps linking to their
article.

456
00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:29,633
I'm like But they they did link to mine,

457
00:16:27,634 --> 00:16:29,514
Yeah. I know I

458
00:16:29,633 --> 00:16:30,633
so that's fine. But

459
00:16:30,496 --> 00:16:33,508
they look to it in yours and it is funny
like you pointed out that there's people

460
00:16:33,508 --> 00:16:37,391
from Meta who refuse to talk to you
directly but are replying to

461
00:16:37,391 --> 00:16:39,682
all the other people sharing these
articles.

462
00:16:39,506 --> 00:16:40,506
Yeah.

463
00:16:40,503 --> 00:16:43,305
But and to be clear, you've not heard
anything from them.

464
00:16:43,305 --> 00:16:45,196
Yeah.

465
00:16:43,312 --> 00:16:45,443
Well, so to be clear, I spoke

466
00:16:45,443 --> 00:16:48,355
yesterday with someone off the record or
on

467
00:16:47,834 --> 00:16:48,834
Okay.

468
00:16:48,355 --> 00:16:52,098
background who is going to help me get to
the bottom of this.

469
00:16:52,098 --> 00:16:54,410
Let's put it that way. And so the

470
00:16:53,904 --> 00:16:54,904
Okay.

471
00:16:54,410 --> 00:16:58,873
next step is to send all of the
information I have to them,

472
00:16:58,873 --> 00:17:03,326
~ so that we can get some but one of the
things I wanted to say is like,

473
00:17:03,326 --> 00:17:07,088
you know, your chief spokesperson is out
there essentially like calling me a liar,

474
00:17:07,088 --> 00:17:08,869
but no one has bothered to talk to me yet.

475
00:17:08,869 --> 00:17:11,851
So that doesn't seem cool. Like maybe
let's

476
00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:12,280
Does not.

477
00:17:12,032 --> 00:17:13,032
I'm more

478
00:17:12,892 --> 00:17:14,483
Like listen, I'll send you the Mac Mini.

479
00:17:14,483 --> 00:17:16,855
It's not it's not even mine. I don't care.

480
00:17:16,770 --> 00:17:18,447
Well that you Apple probably wouldn't like
that.

481
00:17:16,855 --> 00:17:20,037
Like No, but I'm just saying, like,

482
00:17:18,447 --> 00:17:21,219
But yeah. ~ yeah, yeah, yeah. Just to have
access.

483
00:17:20,037 --> 00:17:21,248
I'm perfectly

484
00:17:21,248 --> 00:17:23,579
happy to figure out what what actually
happened here.

485
00:17:23,579 --> 00:17:25,190
And if what actually happened,

486
00:17:25,190 --> 00:17:27,662
you look and you're like, you see how you
managed to somehow click this

487
00:17:27,662 --> 00:17:28,983
one thing that whatever, whatever.

488
00:17:28,983 --> 00:17:32,125
My point will still be yes, but I was
clear about what I wanted it to do,

489
00:17:32,125 --> 00:17:33,426
and this was not one of those things.

490
00:17:33,426 --> 00:17:36,278
So that's still a problem. About like I'm
perfectly willing

491
00:17:36,278 --> 00:17:40,141
to entertain the possibility that some of
this was just like I didn't notice that

492
00:17:40,141 --> 00:17:41,752
I had given it permission to do something.

493
00:17:42,045 --> 00:17:44,325
The problem is like I have gone through,

494
00:17:44,325 --> 00:17:47,718
I've used Claude to go through everything
to help me figure out like what's going

495
00:17:47,718 --> 00:17:50,098
on. It decompiled the app. It's looking
through all the

496
00:17:50,021 --> 00:17:51,021
Really?

497
00:17:50,098 --> 00:17:51,098
logs.

498
00:17:50,830 --> 00:17:52,611
It's checking the TCC register,

499
00:17:52,611 --> 00:17:54,912
which is whenever every time an app asks
for permission,

500
00:17:54,912 --> 00:17:57,093
an app asks for permission to do
something,

501
00:17:57,093 --> 00:17:58,574
there's a register. But unfortunately,

502
00:17:58,574 --> 00:18:00,755
it only records the last instance of that.

503
00:18:00,755 --> 00:18:02,856
So there's no way to know like statuses of
things.

504
00:18:02,856 --> 00:18:06,168
Meta does have to take analytics from
Muse.

505
00:18:06,168 --> 00:18:09,740
And so presumably there are analytics of
like what you may have enabled

506
00:18:09,740 --> 00:18:10,740
at different times.

507
00:18:10,746 --> 00:18:11,976
And the person I spoke with was like,

508
00:18:11,976 --> 00:18:13,898
Would you be willing to give us permission
to do that?

509
00:18:13,898 --> 00:18:16,160
And I'm like, whatever, do what you want.

510
00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:19,002
But my my point Yeah, you've

511
00:18:16,431 --> 00:18:17,566
You already took my messages.

512
00:18:19,002 --> 00:18:20,833
already read all my messages with Steven.

513
00:18:20,833 --> 00:18:21,944
No. But

514
00:18:21,060 --> 00:18:22,060
Yeah, exactly.

515
00:18:21,944 --> 00:18:25,927
it's like I'm it is so I have so I want to
give Meta some credit.

516
00:18:25,927 --> 00:18:31,791
At one point, they suddenly became aware
that I was trying to talk to them about
it.

517
00:18:31,791 --> 00:18:34,573
And I heard from like in David Singleton,

518
00:18:34,573 --> 00:18:37,135
who is the person who's been going around
responding to all of these things,

519
00:18:37,135 --> 00:18:38,836
actually did send me a message.

520
00:18:39,282 --> 00:18:42,814
put me in contact with someone and that
person is part of their comms team

521
00:18:42,814 --> 00:18:44,295
and we did have a phone conversation.

522
00:18:44,295 --> 00:18:48,739
So at some point I would love to be able
to update the story with like,

523
00:18:48,739 --> 00:18:50,380
here's what happened. We're we

524
00:18:49,753 --> 00:18:50,753
Right, right.

525
00:18:50,380 --> 00:18:52,481
we do not know yet what has happened.

526
00:18:52,481 --> 00:18:55,033
~ do you want me to explain what has
happened?

527
00:18:53,367 --> 00:18:55,897
Okay. Well to be ~

528
00:18:55,033 --> 00:18:56,033
I mean, we talked about this

529
00:18:55,954 --> 00:18:56,954
before.

530
00:18:56,541 --> 00:18:58,623
to be clear, if you want to listen to last
week's episode,

531
00:18:58,623 --> 00:19:01,676
Jason tried Museai, the app from Meta,

532
00:19:01,676 --> 00:19:04,409
which is their agent, downloaded it on
your Mac,

533
00:19:04,409 --> 00:19:07,072
and it started doing weird things,

534
00:19:07,072 --> 00:19:11,327
and you discovered that it basically
grabbed your messages database file from
your

535
00:19:11,327 --> 00:19:14,851
Mac and uploaded that, or at least was
reading it.

536
00:19:13,606 --> 00:19:14,897
Yeah. Yeah, it had

537
00:19:14,897 --> 00:19:18,760
uploaded it and was obviously watching it
because it we literally sent

538
00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:22,443
me a push notification moments after
Steven and I texted each other back and
forth.

539
00:19:22,275 --> 00:19:23,997
Right. Exactly. So

540
00:19:23,997 --> 00:19:26,831
there's that. So that last week Jason goes
in depth about it.

541
00:19:26,831 --> 00:19:29,675
And now we're just i c this is kind of
like the aftermath,

542
00:19:29,675 --> 00:19:31,438
which hopefully you'll get an update.

543
00:19:31,438 --> 00:19:34,813
I'd really be cu we'd be great to discuss
if you actually get to speak with Meta

544
00:19:34,813 --> 00:19:36,345
on the record. But

545
00:19:35,751 --> 00:19:36,751
Yeah, it is weird

546
00:19:36,662 --> 00:19:39,253
to log on to this is not the first time
this has happened to me.

547
00:19:39,253 --> 00:19:41,525
Every so year, every so many years,

548
00:19:41,525 --> 00:19:44,166
something that I do breaks containment.

549
00:19:44,333 --> 00:19:45,360
Yes, yes.

550
00:19:45,427 --> 00:19:48,405
Yeah, there it and it is taken on
different degree.

551
00:19:48,405 --> 00:19:51,251
There was the year that we declined ten
thousand dollars to get off

552
00:19:51,251 --> 00:19:53,833
of a Delta flight to Alaska, and eight of
us

553
00:19:53,187 --> 00:19:54,187
Yes.

554
00:19:53,833 --> 00:19:56,334
we passed it up apparently, and that I
never heard the end of.

555
00:19:56,334 --> 00:19:58,105
And I ended up on the nightly news for
that one.

556
00:19:58,105 --> 00:19:59,546
So it's like the guy who

557
00:19:58,660 --> 00:19:59,660
Right.

558
00:19:59,546 --> 00:20:02,548
the moron who turned down eighty thousand
dollars to get off of a flight.

559
00:20:02,548 --> 00:20:05,100
Like and then, you know, there was also
the time that,

560
00:20:05,100 --> 00:20:06,100
you know.

561
00:20:05,628 --> 00:20:08,080
my articles went vir viral for not a great
reason.

562
00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:09,241
So every so often

563
00:20:08,523 --> 00:20:09,523
Yes, yes.

564
00:20:09,241 --> 00:20:10,912
this happens. It doesn't really phase me,

565
00:20:10,912 --> 00:20:14,294
but it is weird to open Twitter,

566
00:20:14,294 --> 00:20:16,396
which I don't actually open that often and
to be like,

567
00:20:16,396 --> 00:20:19,018
like this is being shared by, you know,

568
00:20:19,018 --> 00:20:22,140
Jason Calicanus and like all of these
people.

569
00:20:19,663 --> 00:20:22,055
Big names. Yeah, yeah.

570
00:20:22,616 --> 00:20:26,739
But I think it's the bigger picture of er
all of these companies,

571
00:20:26,739 --> 00:20:29,481
which we're gonna get into all the
releases that every company has done,

572
00:20:29,481 --> 00:20:35,866
like ChatGPT Dots, Muse AI, like agents
and having these AIs do things for you,

573
00:20:35,866 --> 00:20:39,039
is just the thing. It's the big in the
news.

574
00:20:39,039 --> 00:20:42,592
And then the question is, what is the
cost?

575
00:20:42,592 --> 00:20:43,613
You know, what

576
00:20:43,303 --> 00:20:44,303
Right.

577
00:20:43,953 --> 00:20:48,437
what do you have to give up to actually
have this advantage or benefit from these

578
00:20:48,537 --> 00:20:49,537
apps?

579
00:20:49,313 --> 00:20:52,636
And I think the verge the verge cast even
I was listening to their dots episode this

580
00:20:52,636 --> 00:20:56,020
morning and they were talking about again
the Muse AI stuff.

581
00:20:56,020 --> 00:20:59,864
So Muse AI, I've not tried it.

582
00:20:59,864 --> 00:21:01,155
And

583
00:21:00,742 --> 00:21:01,742
D despite

584
00:21:01,434 --> 00:21:04,602
what Instagram will tell you, Steven has
not tried it.

585
00:21:03,311 --> 00:21:05,343
So that's I'm gonna link

586
00:21:05,683 --> 00:21:10,097
three of Jason's articles. One was Meta
Strategy to get you to use Muse

587
00:21:10,097 --> 00:21:13,520
is to lie about your friends, which you've
mentioned primary technology

588
00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:15,031
in like three articles. That's thank you
for it.

589
00:21:15,031 --> 00:21:18,074
That's wonderful. Yes, yeah,

590
00:21:15,622 --> 00:21:17,422
And I even linked to it in I think this
one.

591
00:21:18,074 --> 00:21:19,074
yeah, yeah. You did link to it.

592
00:21:19,234 --> 00:21:21,346
But this was I think we touched on it last
week,

593
00:21:21,346 --> 00:21:24,019
but our friend Nate saw this, you know,

594
00:21:24,019 --> 00:21:25,620
message in Instagram that, hey,

595
00:21:25,620 --> 00:21:29,283
your friends are using Muse, and there's
this cute little character,

596
00:21:29,283 --> 00:21:31,255
which I wanna we'll talk about that in a
minute.

597
00:21:31,832 --> 00:21:32,873
but it was like Stephen Robles,

598
00:21:32,873 --> 00:21:35,815
Primary Technology, and Jason Aten are on
my on Muse.

599
00:21:35,815 --> 00:21:37,316
And your articles goes on to say,

600
00:21:37,316 --> 00:21:38,848
like, well, one, primary technology,

601
00:21:38,848 --> 00:21:41,229
the Instagram account has never used Muse,

602
00:21:41,229 --> 00:21:44,202
which is the case because I I run that
account.

603
00:21:44,202 --> 00:21:45,513
I don't I don't I've never

604
00:21:44,628 --> 00:21:45,628
Right.

605
00:21:45,513 --> 00:21:46,994
used I've never connected it to Muse.

606
00:21:46,994 --> 00:21:51,337
And I tried Meta's glasses, which I
remembered when I did the Meta Ray Bans

607
00:21:51,337 --> 00:21:54,200
a couple months ago, it was the meta AI
app.

608
00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:57,362
It was not Muse. But that Meta AI app,

609
00:21:57,362 --> 00:21:59,784
as far as I know, became the Muse app.

610
00:21:59,784 --> 00:22:00,825
Is that accurate?

611
00:22:00,956 --> 00:22:02,330
I don't know if that's exactly true,

612
00:22:02,330 --> 00:22:04,306
but like in in their mind certainly,

613
00:22:04,306 --> 00:22:05,711
meta AI is now Muse.

614
00:22:06,529 --> 00:22:09,252
Right. And so in their terminology,

615
00:22:09,252 --> 00:22:12,857
because I connected those glasses and
downloaded that app once,

616
00:22:12,857 --> 00:22:14,699
which I've since deleted from my phone,

617
00:22:14,699 --> 00:22:19,415
I'm I have used Muse. But I I would not
say so.

618
00:22:18,418 --> 00:22:19,491
But even that

619
00:22:19,491 --> 00:22:23,261
is disingenuous because to say you've used
Muse is not the same as to say

620
00:22:23,261 --> 00:22:24,343
you are on Muse.

621
00:22:24,899 --> 00:22:26,390
Yeah, saying you're on mu yes,

622
00:22:26,390 --> 00:22:28,221
that's the wording is strange.

623
00:22:28,221 --> 00:22:29,221
So anyway,

624
00:22:28,466 --> 00:22:29,466
Yeah.

625
00:22:28,912 --> 00:22:30,093
that that was a great article.

626
00:22:30,093 --> 00:22:34,156
And then I appreciated you've this is the
one I think you linked to us.

627
00:22:34,156 --> 00:22:37,538
You talked about how AI is like Jurassic
Park.

628
00:22:37,538 --> 00:22:40,440
You mentioned on an episode on the of this
show back in July,

629
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:42,942
and you finally put it down into words on
Inc.

630
00:22:42,942 --> 00:22:46,575
com so you can make sure that everybody
knows that you did this first.

631
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,661
Well, I do th it's it wasn't just that.

632
00:22:48,661 --> 00:22:50,083
I mean, I don't even I don't

633
00:22:48,918 --> 00:22:50,079
I know, I know, I know, I know.

634
00:22:50,083 --> 00:22:52,496
know if it was first. I had not any w
heard anyone else make

635
00:22:52,496 --> 00:22:54,657
the direct comparison to this particular
movie,

636
00:22:54,657 --> 00:22:58,241
but ~ but the ~ the contrast that I was
trying to is like there was this phase
where

637
00:22:58,241 --> 00:22:59,712
everyone was talking about her.

638
00:22:59,712 --> 00:23:00,774
Like that that was

639
00:23:00,375 --> 00:23:01,375
Yes.

640
00:23:00,774 --> 00:23:06,409
the ideal AI whatever experience and it's
kind of a depressing movie,

641
00:23:06,409 --> 00:23:07,409
but whatever.

642
00:23:07,674 --> 00:23:09,418
And I'm like, no, that is n that

643
00:23:07,791 --> 00:23:09,312
Kind of. It is a very depressive

644
00:23:09,418 --> 00:23:13,376
is not the metaphor that we should be
going for because there's a much more
obvious

645
00:23:13,376 --> 00:23:16,683
metaphor, that is that the Velociraptors
are trying to get out of the fence.

646
00:23:17,313 --> 00:23:21,794
Exactly. And I think why why this is all
germane is Muse,

647
00:23:21,794 --> 00:23:25,895
I am just looking right now, is still the
number one app,

648
00:23:25,895 --> 00:23:27,916
number one free app in the app store.

649
00:23:27,916 --> 00:23:31,037
Muse AI is above Chat GPT.

650
00:23:31,037 --> 00:23:34,858
It's above all the things. It's above
threads,

651
00:23:34,858 --> 00:23:37,999
you know, TikTok, Gemini,

652
00:23:37,999 --> 00:23:39,389
even though they've just released a new
model,

653
00:23:39,389 --> 00:23:41,620
like Muse AI is just number one.

654
00:23:41,620 --> 00:23:45,121
But it is still doing nefarious things.

655
00:23:45,121 --> 00:23:46,641
Not only did it read Jason's messages.

656
00:23:47,204 --> 00:23:51,656
Which is problematic. But there was also a
YouTuber who was trying to

657
00:23:51,656 --> 00:23:55,398
use Muse to post something on Facebook
Marketplace.

658
00:23:55,398 --> 00:24:01,642
And it turns out he came to realize that
Muse had shared his address.

659
00:24:01,642 --> 00:24:06,724
he gave his address after a guy and a guy
just showed up at his address.

660
00:24:06,724 --> 00:24:11,257
This is Matt Robb, YouTuber. And this is
one of those promises that like Muse

661
00:24:11,257 --> 00:24:13,248
AI will help you post things on Facebook
Marketplace,

662
00:24:13,248 --> 00:24:15,129
help you manage the things. And

663
00:24:15,671 --> 00:24:17,042
My wife has actually noticed this.

664
00:24:17,042 --> 00:24:20,254
She's she's been looking at vans on
Facebook Marketplace,

665
00:24:20,254 --> 00:24:22,486
like minivans or whatever. And she was
like,

666
00:24:22,486 --> 00:24:24,167
You know, in the last week or two,

667
00:24:24,167 --> 00:24:27,109
every listing is sounds the same.

668
00:24:27,109 --> 00:24:31,272
Like every listing is written and just
sounds exactly the same.

669
00:24:31,272 --> 00:24:33,494
And I told her about this and she was
like,

670
00:24:33,494 --> 00:24:36,656
well, that makes sense because it just all
reads like the same listing.

671
00:24:36,656 --> 00:24:39,338
But but the promise is that it would help
you,

672
00:24:39,338 --> 00:24:41,139
whatever, with Facebook marketplace stuff.

673
00:24:41,139 --> 00:24:43,531
And someone actually asked me the other
day about a shortcut.

674
00:24:44,397 --> 00:24:46,938
In my shortcuts community, they're Can you
make a shortcut that gives

675
00:24:46,938 --> 00:24:49,079
me a summary of my WhatsApp messages every
day?

676
00:24:49,079 --> 00:24:53,391
And I'm like, Well, no. One, shortcuts
like WhatsApp doesn't have

677
00:24:53,391 --> 00:24:56,422
the kinds of actions where you can just
pull all your WhatsApp messages,

678
00:24:56,422 --> 00:25:00,103
nor do they want to give you that kind of
access to your WhatsApp messages.

679
00:25:00,103 --> 00:25:04,445
And two, unfortunately, your best option
is probably Muse,

680
00:25:04,445 --> 00:25:07,927
because Muse meta's product and you could
probably ask Muse about

681
00:25:07,927 --> 00:25:10,088
all your WhatsApp messages. I don't know
that for sure.

682
00:25:09,212 --> 00:25:10,872
Yeah, you definitely can. You definitely
can.

683
00:25:11,408 --> 00:25:12,929
You definitely can't. So like

684
00:25:13,729 --> 00:25:19,390
And this feels a little bit like the
siloing that we've talked about and has
been,

685
00:25:19,390 --> 00:25:21,830
you know, iPhone or Android or whatever.

686
00:25:21,830 --> 00:25:26,192
It's like if you wanna have helpful

687
00:25:26,192 --> 00:25:30,474
AI agent activity in your meta products,

688
00:25:30,474 --> 00:25:36,595
you have to use Muse. And it looks like if
you want to use dots or whatever,

689
00:25:36,595 --> 00:25:38,156
ChatGPT is we're gonna get to that.

690
00:25:38,156 --> 00:25:40,096
Just talked about it, it like four
thousand connectors,

691
00:25:40,096 --> 00:25:42,987
but there's like a kind of a silo of
products there.

692
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,251
And so I that I don't like that feeling.

693
00:25:46,251 --> 00:25:50,173
Just that these silos are starting to
happen because every company wants

694
00:25:50,173 --> 00:25:53,754
to have its agent an AI so sorry,

695
00:25:53,754 --> 00:25:55,575
superintelligence. That's the official
term.

696
00:25:55,575 --> 00:25:58,356
I don't know if we're gonna Jason just
rolled his eyes.

697
00:25:58,356 --> 00:26:00,893
I don't know if I don't know if we're
gonna get ~ arrested if

698
00:26:00,893 --> 00:26:01,938
we say artificial intelligence.

699
00:26:01,938 --> 00:26:03,848
No, just kidding. Well I'll explain that
in a second.

700
00:26:03,848 --> 00:26:05,870
But anyway, I don't know. What what was
your general feeling?

701
00:26:05,870 --> 00:26:07,030
Because you've written all these articles,

702
00:26:07,030 --> 00:26:09,501
Muse AI is out there. Has your feelings
changed?

703
00:26:09,501 --> 00:26:10,501
What what do you think?

704
00:26:10,504 --> 00:26:13,595
I mean, okay, a couple of pieces of
information there.

705
00:26:13,595 --> 00:26:15,919
First of all, I just got an email this
morning from Censor Tower.

706
00:26:15,919 --> 00:26:18,271
They're the people that like tracked App
Store downloads and stuff like that.

707
00:26:18,271 --> 00:26:21,674
And apparently Muse has surpassed five
million downloads,

708
00:26:21,674 --> 00:26:23,176
which is double

709
00:26:21,733 --> 00:26:22,733
Sure, sure.

710
00:26:23,176 --> 00:26:24,837
what Chat GPT was at this point.

711
00:26:24,837 --> 00:26:26,748
Just to be cle like what to be clear,

712
00:26:26,748 --> 00:26:27,748
like when it came out.

713
00:26:27,846 --> 00:26:29,887
you know, twenty two days after it
launched or whatever.

714
00:26:29,887 --> 00:26:30,887
So

715
00:26:30,041 --> 00:26:31,041
Yeah.

716
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:33,663
it's being downloaded on the what's weird
about that is ChatGPT

717
00:26:33,663 --> 00:26:36,476
was started from zero. Meaning like it was
a

718
00:26:36,068 --> 00:26:37,068
Right.

719
00:26:36,476 --> 00:26:39,559
thing that just popped out into the
zeitgeist and then people started
downloading

720
00:26:39,559 --> 00:26:40,601
it. Whereas Muse

721
00:26:39,951 --> 00:26:40,951
Right.

722
00:26:40,601 --> 00:26:45,056
was like, listen, if you open your phone
to an app owned by Meta,

723
00:26:45,186 --> 00:26:46,249
~ yeah, it's everywhere.

724
00:26:45,446 --> 00:26:46,446
Like it's almost

725
00:26:46,297 --> 00:26:49,810
impossible. I'm I'm impressed you haven't
downloaded Muse on accident

726
00:26:49,810 --> 00:26:51,251
at this point because

727
00:26:50,801 --> 00:26:51,801
What's

728
00:26:51,251 --> 00:26:55,695
it is just everywhere. It's like here is
an ad for shoes on Instagram.

729
00:26:55,695 --> 00:26:56,695
Let me tap on this.

730
00:26:56,261 --> 00:26:57,261
Yeah, no.

731
00:26:56,626 --> 00:26:59,258
~ actually it's an ad to download Muse to
buy shoes for you.

732
00:26:59,258 --> 00:27:01,370
Like it's insane. It's just completely
bonkers.

733
00:27:01,370 --> 00:27:06,345
So I it's not surprising to me that they
have had a huge uptake and it does seem

734
00:27:06,345 --> 00:27:08,827
to be everywhere. The one thing I don't
like about this is a sidetrack.

735
00:27:08,827 --> 00:27:10,088
I apologize. One thing I don't like about

736
00:27:09,647 --> 00:27:10,647
No, right.

737
00:27:10,088 --> 00:27:12,020
threads right now is because I posted the
thing about Muse.

738
00:27:12,388 --> 00:27:16,559
my entire like for you column is just meta
employees talking about what they're

739
00:27:16,069 --> 00:27:20,043
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let me Yeah.

740
00:27:16,559 --> 00:27:18,010
doing on Muse, which is insane.

741
00:27:18,010 --> 00:27:20,180
But I did want to sort I wanted to clarify
one

742
00:27:20,180 --> 00:27:23,071
thing about the story, the marketplace
story.

743
00:27:23,141 --> 00:27:24,141
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

744
00:27:23,651 --> 00:27:28,113
So, and I think that this actually
highlights the real problem with Muse,

745
00:27:28,113 --> 00:27:29,643
which I think I said this last week,

746
00:27:29,643 --> 00:27:33,164
which is that it's just incredibly zealous
to do things for you even when

747
00:27:33,164 --> 00:27:35,755
you don't ask it to or expect it to,

748
00:27:35,755 --> 00:27:39,576
because he had given Muse permission to do

749
00:27:40,221 --> 00:27:41,942
like to give out his address or something
like that.

750
00:27:41,942 --> 00:27:46,403
But he didn't expect that that meant like
carte blanche whatever.

751
00:27:46,403 --> 00:27:50,215
And he didn't expect that that would mean
that like Muse essentially acted

752
00:27:50,215 --> 00:27:53,946
in that particular interaction as though
it were a human who was going

753
00:27:53,946 --> 00:27:57,447
to meet the person. Because the person
showed up and the the seller was not
there.

754
00:27:57,447 --> 00:27:59,868
So now everyone was mad. Right.

755
00:28:00,217 --> 00:28:02,059
Well, and apparently in that article,

756
00:28:02,059 --> 00:28:03,270
I'll link a business insight article,

757
00:28:03,270 --> 00:28:07,745
apparently Rob said that he did check a
box for Allow Always

758
00:28:07,922 --> 00:28:08,922
Right.

759
00:28:08,286 --> 00:28:12,781
that allowed Muse to send a template
containing his address to the buyer.

760
00:28:12,781 --> 00:28:17,736
The I guess the weird part is that Always
Allow ~ gave Muse permission

761
00:28:17,736 --> 00:28:22,181
to accept a lowball offer for the thing
that he had listed on Facebook
Marketplace.

762
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:22,960
Zero,

763
00:28:22,381 --> 00:28:23,947
like zero or something like that.

764
00:28:24,537 --> 00:28:27,490
Something ridiculous. So that was I mean,

765
00:28:27,490 --> 00:28:31,584
he did click always allowed, but what that
means and again I I I mean

766
00:28:31,496 --> 00:28:33,367
Well that's my point. The expectation

767
00:28:31,584 --> 00:28:33,015
I'm using cloth for yeah.

768
00:28:33,367 --> 00:28:38,041
that the user have is different than the
exact permissions like taking

769
00:28:38,041 --> 00:28:41,864
in the most technical sense, which just
tells me that the people who have made
this

770
00:28:42,184 --> 00:28:44,796
are not thinking through the actual user
experience.

771
00:28:44,796 --> 00:28:48,008
Because okay, technically you have
permission to do this thing.

772
00:28:48,008 --> 00:28:49,616
Okay, cool. I got permission to do this
thing.

773
00:28:49,616 --> 00:28:52,321
I'm just gonna do the thing. No reasonable
like Steven,

774
00:28:52,321 --> 00:28:56,484
if you if I you asked me to sell your Mac
Studio for you and you're like,

775
00:28:56,484 --> 00:28:58,456
Okay, Jason, just just make this thing
happen,

776
00:28:58,456 --> 00:28:59,456
right?

777
00:28:59,002 --> 00:29:01,854
I'm a I'm not a moron. I'm not going to
sell it for fifty dollars.

778
00:29:01,854 --> 00:29:03,444
I mean for fifty bucks I'll just buy it
myself.

779
00:29:02,450 --> 00:29:06,348
man. Yeah. Exactly.

780
00:29:03,444 --> 00:29:05,666
It's fine. Right? Like I just give you
fifty bucks,

781
00:29:05,666 --> 00:29:06,716
you'll never know the difference.

782
00:29:06,716 --> 00:29:11,499
But like w there we Muse doesn't
understand social nor social norms

783
00:29:11,499 --> 00:29:13,580
or how we actually interact as human
beings.

784
00:29:13,580 --> 00:29:15,141
And so it's just doing whatever.

785
00:29:15,141 --> 00:29:20,243
So you that's the part that meta either
did not think through or isn't being clear

786
00:29:20,243 --> 00:29:21,243
enough to users.

787
00:29:22,255 --> 00:29:26,307
Do you think, because this is the promise
of dots from ChatGPT too,

788
00:29:26,307 --> 00:29:30,630
like, did you find or can you see where
it's actually useful?

789
00:29:30,630 --> 00:29:33,272
And did you was it useful to you?

790
00:29:33,272 --> 00:29:36,093
Because I'm looking at the Muse app on the
App Store,

791
00:29:36,093 --> 00:29:37,554
like and just in the screenshots.

792
00:29:37,554 --> 00:29:40,936
And you know, the promise is, you know,

793
00:29:40,936 --> 00:29:44,328
fill out this PDF form with my
information,

794
00:29:44,328 --> 00:29:46,500
which might be helpful. Or, you know,

795
00:29:46,500 --> 00:29:48,441
compare these items for shopping.

796
00:29:48,890 --> 00:29:50,670
buy me movie tickets, you know,

797
00:29:50,670 --> 00:29:53,872
find the showing for this movie that has
two seats together.

798
00:29:53,872 --> 00:29:56,693
And supposedly Muse can do that using the
browser.

799
00:29:56,693 --> 00:29:58,634
And if we didn't make this clear
yesterday,

800
00:29:58,634 --> 00:30:04,256
the promise of Muse and I think dots from
ChatGPT is like you basically have

801
00:30:04,256 --> 00:30:10,558
a virtual machine in Meta's cloud that is
running your Muse AI agent.

802
00:30:10,558 --> 00:30:14,860
And so they are saying like you have your
own PC in the cloud basically.

803
00:30:14,860 --> 00:30:16,130
And it's it's a virtual machine,

804
00:30:16,130 --> 00:30:18,061
you know, not a physical box. But

805
00:30:18,349 --> 00:30:20,009
It's on a physical box. But anyway,

806
00:30:20,009 --> 00:30:22,360
that's that's the promise of these agents.

807
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:28,482
Because up until this point, like OpenClaw
or the other things where your agents

808
00:30:28,482 --> 00:30:29,912
would be doing stuff on your computer,

809
00:30:29,912 --> 00:30:31,563
your computer had to be awake,

810
00:30:31,563 --> 00:30:34,694
it couldn't go to sleep. This is why the
joke is everybody walking around with
their

811
00:30:34,694 --> 00:30:38,475
laptops with the lid slightly open because
the agent has to do stuff.

812
00:30:38,475 --> 00:30:39,615
The computer has to be active.

813
00:30:39,615 --> 00:30:42,836
And so what Muse AI is promising and
ChatGPT Dots is like,

814
00:30:42,836 --> 00:30:44,696
you know what, you don't don't worry about
your computer.

815
00:30:44,696 --> 00:30:46,217
We're gonna do it all in the cloud.

816
00:30:46,217 --> 00:30:47,217
We're

817
00:30:46,895 --> 00:30:49,356
quote unquote giving you a computer in the
cloud,

818
00:30:49,356 --> 00:30:52,912
a virtual machine, so your agent has
access to a web browser and all these
tools

819
00:30:52,912 --> 00:30:54,314
so it can do all these things for you.

820
00:30:54,314 --> 00:30:57,758
So you can just send a message to Muse
using the app on your phone

821
00:30:58,078 --> 00:31:01,252
and shut your phone off, live your life
and it's going to be doing

822
00:31:01,252 --> 00:31:02,252
all these things in the background.

823
00:31:02,223 --> 00:31:06,118
Did you find anything or do anything
useful from Muse or do you feel like

824
00:31:06,118 --> 00:31:07,118
it would be useful?

825
00:31:07,814 --> 00:31:14,187
Yeah, I haven't done like a the most
agenty of things with it necessarily.

826
00:31:14,187 --> 00:31:18,840
But I did I have used it to do a few
things that I that I wouldn't have been
able

827
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:24,613
to use just a normal chapot. I think the
what this is showing us is that

828
00:31:24,613 --> 00:31:26,834
the ~ Meta actually has the right model.

829
00:31:26,834 --> 00:31:30,756
Okay. It's based on OpenClaw, but OpenClaw
was a thing you had to install on like

830
00:31:31,069 --> 00:31:33,121
Go Mac Mini. That's why you couldn't buy
Mac Minis for a while

831
00:31:33,121 --> 00:31:34,152
is because of OpenClaw, right?

832
00:31:34,152 --> 00:31:36,435
So you had to understand what you're doing
and then you had to have

833
00:31:36,435 --> 00:31:39,659
a way of connecting with it. And I think
people were sending it WhatsApp messages

834
00:31:39,659 --> 00:31:43,623
or something. I I can't remember exactly
what this signal t telegram messages.

835
00:31:43,623 --> 00:31:45,095
Maybe it was Telegram or something like
that.

836
00:31:44,525 --> 00:31:45,651
Telegram, I think it was yeah,

837
00:31:45,095 --> 00:31:46,096
Yeah. So

838
00:31:45,651 --> 00:31:46,651
yeah.

839
00:31:46,096 --> 00:31:48,329
but mute and meta just combined those two
things.

840
00:31:48,329 --> 00:31:51,392
So, like here, there's a map on your phone
installed on your computer,

841
00:31:51,392 --> 00:31:52,392
but also

842
00:31:52,829 --> 00:31:53,939
Don't install it on your computer.

843
00:31:53,939 --> 00:31:55,470
You didn't just install it on your phone.

844
00:31:55,530 --> 00:31:57,380
No, I mean, like for real. And we there's
a computer in

845
00:31:57,044 --> 00:31:58,044
Yeah.

846
00:31:57,380 --> 00:31:59,831
the cloud. Every single person has a
computer in the cloud now.

847
00:31:59,831 --> 00:32:02,221
That really is like the model.

848
00:32:02,221 --> 00:32:05,712
That is what I mean. Imagine if Siri
Intelligence had that.

849
00:32:05,712 --> 00:32:09,601
You could just on your phone have it doing
stuff like this.

850
00:32:09,601 --> 00:32:13,744
I and that's why I think Ben Thompson
started calling like Meta Connect like
Meta's

851
00:32:13,744 --> 00:32:16,015
business now is just see Muse delivery
devices.

852
00:32:16,015 --> 00:32:20,446
It's like the glasses. The reason that
they can just talk to you can just talk

853
00:32:20,446 --> 00:32:21,446
to it.

854
00:32:21,050 --> 00:32:23,571
And do stuff is because it's just sending
all that stuff to the cloud,

855
00:32:23,571 --> 00:32:24,681
right? And it's just

856
00:32:24,035 --> 00:32:25,035
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

857
00:32:24,681 --> 00:32:26,101
doing all that stuff in the cloud.

858
00:32:26,101 --> 00:32:30,963
And so they're just trying to get around
the restrictions of doing stuff

859
00:32:30,963 --> 00:32:34,944
on your phone. I have not asked it
partially because like,

860
00:32:34,944 --> 00:32:36,824
you know, it read all my messages.

861
00:32:36,824 --> 00:32:39,265
So I'm a little bit leery to like ask it
to do things.

862
00:32:39,265 --> 00:32:43,306
Most of what most of what it does now is
send me a brief every day.

863
00:32:43,306 --> 00:32:46,857
Sometimes I read it. And then sometimes in
the afternoon it'll be like,

864
00:32:46,857 --> 00:32:48,734
Hey, this news broke today. Yeah,

865
00:32:48,734 --> 00:32:50,288
~ after I send you the brief.

866
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:52,462
And if I don't open Muse or look at it,

867
00:32:52,462 --> 00:32:53,483
it'll send me a notification and say,

868
00:32:53,483 --> 00:32:54,483
Hey, I just don't want you to miss this.

869
00:32:54,452 --> 00:32:56,706
I'm like, you're a little like pushy.

870
00:32:56,706 --> 00:33:01,371
Back off. And and what was interesting to
me is the the way we react to

871
00:33:01,371 --> 00:33:03,313
if a human being was doing things for you.

872
00:33:03,313 --> 00:33:07,598
Verse if I had an executive assistant who
sent me t those text messages,

873
00:33:07,598 --> 00:33:09,119
I'd be thank you for reminding me.

874
00:33:09,119 --> 00:33:10,671
But when it's an app on my phone,

875
00:33:10,671 --> 00:33:13,564
I'm just like, back off, bro. You're just
being too pushy.

876
00:33:14,829 --> 00:33:19,013
I feel like as someone who considers
himself a quasi tech journalist,

877
00:33:19,013 --> 00:33:22,707
I'm gonna try it. I am downloading Muse on
my iPhone right now.

878
00:33:22,707 --> 00:33:24,038
I am not putting it on my Mac,

879
00:33:24,038 --> 00:33:28,856
to be clear. I'm only letting it run in on
sandbox devices like an iPhone

880
00:33:28,856 --> 00:33:32,077
and an iPad. And we will see. We will see.

881
00:33:32,077 --> 00:33:35,549
~ apparently I have a whole conversation
in here already.

882
00:33:35,549 --> 00:33:39,023
Things I can help you do, explore your
ideas and feed.

883
00:33:39,442 --> 00:33:40,883
I did have it do something interesting.

884
00:33:40,883 --> 00:33:43,625
Okay. I did an experiment. Can I tell you
about my experiment?

885
00:33:43,908 --> 00:33:44,908
Okay.

886
00:33:44,386 --> 00:33:46,897
Okay. I this is I was just curious.

887
00:33:46,897 --> 00:33:48,829
There was like no practical purpose for
this,

888
00:33:48,829 --> 00:33:51,040
but I was like, let's just see what it
could do.

889
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:56,574
So I said, hey, ~ what I'd like you to do
is

890
00:33:56,574 --> 00:34:02,838
go through my Instagram and I want you to
tell me who has liked the most

891
00:34:02,838 --> 00:34:04,780
of my posts in the last 18 months.

892
00:34:04,780 --> 00:34:06,701
I I'm like, there's no reason to.

893
00:34:06,771 --> 00:34:07,771
care but you could

894
00:34:06,829 --> 00:34:07,829
Interest. Sure.

895
00:34:07,721 --> 00:34:10,601
figure that out you but you would have to
literally count every post and just do it.

896
00:34:10,601 --> 00:34:12,864
I was like, okay, I just want you to go
through,

897
00:34:12,864 --> 00:34:16,205
look at my Instagram account. Tell me the
15 people who've liked

898
00:34:16,205 --> 00:34:18,726
my stories and reels and posts in the last
18 months.

899
00:34:18,726 --> 00:34:23,248
And so it did. It counted it and then it
could but it couldn't do stories at first.

900
00:34:23,248 --> 00:34:26,269
So the one thing I did do it goes,

901
00:34:26,269 --> 00:34:29,181
~ on stories I hit a wall. That's not the
tooling problem.

902
00:34:29,181 --> 00:34:30,761
It's Instagram itself. I checked
everything available,

903
00:34:30,761 --> 00:34:31,761
blah blah blah blah blah blah.

904
00:34:31,616 --> 00:34:34,793
But unfortunately archive stories do not
save

905
00:34:35,025 --> 00:34:36,565
Likes. And so my response was,

906
00:34:36,565 --> 00:34:38,126
listen, Chucklehead, that's just not true.

907
00:34:38,126 --> 00:34:40,006
It's it's I did.

908
00:34:38,595 --> 00:34:39,756
You said Jugglehead?

909
00:34:40,006 --> 00:34:41,987
I said it's all there for older stories,

910
00:34:41,987 --> 00:34:44,358
all of them. It only shows likes,

911
00:34:44,358 --> 00:34:45,548
not viewers, but I don't care.

912
00:34:45,548 --> 00:34:47,929
But your archive does show you who liked
those stories.

913
00:34:47,929 --> 00:34:49,859
It just doesn't show you who viewed those
stories.

914
00:34:49,859 --> 00:34:51,550
It's like, Chucklehead accepted.

915
00:34:51,550 --> 00:34:54,640
You're right, and I'm wrong. Viewers
expire after forty eight hours,

916
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:56,445
but likes persist. So you know what it
did?

917
00:34:56,445 --> 00:35:00,122
I gave it permission to log into my
Instagram account because fine,

918
00:34:59,333 --> 00:35:00,722
Yeah, it probably already does.

919
00:35:00,122 --> 00:35:01,912
it's meta. I don't it's like whatever,

920
00:35:00,722 --> 00:35:02,432
Yeah, it's meta. Yeah. Yeah.

921
00:35:01,912 --> 00:35:02,912
it's meta.

922
00:35:02,593 --> 00:35:03,783
So but I did. I actually had to

923
00:35:04,033 --> 00:35:07,835
I actually had to log in. It gave me a s
what's called a secure store,

924
00:35:07,835 --> 00:35:10,116
a thing to tap. Like Apple,

925
00:35:09,380 --> 00:35:10,380
Right.

926
00:35:10,116 --> 00:35:12,197
the different thing Delta does is if you
message them,

927
00:35:12,197 --> 00:35:13,398
like, do you want to log into your
account?

928
00:35:13,398 --> 00:35:14,649
It's like, Yeah, you're already Delta,

929
00:35:14,649 --> 00:35:18,281
like it's fine. So I did that and it and
it literally went through in

930
00:35:18,281 --> 00:35:23,383
its browser in the cloud all of these
things and gave me back a result.

931
00:35:23,383 --> 00:35:24,383
I was never

932
00:35:23,801 --> 00:35:24,801
Okay.

933
00:35:24,134 --> 00:35:25,505
gonna do that because I don't care that
much.

934
00:35:25,505 --> 00:35:26,795
I just wanted to see what it would do.

935
00:35:26,795 --> 00:35:28,947
But I can imagine stuff like that being
useful.

936
00:35:28,947 --> 00:35:31,358
We're like, I wish I had this piece of
information.

937
00:35:31,358 --> 00:35:32,889
I'm never gonna put in the work to do it.

938
00:35:32,889 --> 00:35:33,889
But you know what?

939
00:35:33,714 --> 00:35:34,714
Robotal.

940
00:35:35,687 --> 00:35:37,348
Alright, well I'm I have it on my phone
now.

941
00:35:37,348 --> 00:35:40,459
It's interesting because you can it's
already connected to a browser,

942
00:35:40,459 --> 00:35:41,699
Facebook, Instagram, and threads,

943
00:35:41,699 --> 00:35:44,580
Meta's properties. You can apparently give
it access to your calendar,

944
00:35:44,580 --> 00:35:45,911
contacts, reminders, health.

945
00:35:45,683 --> 00:35:47,246
Don't don't do that.

946
00:35:47,532 --> 00:35:50,833
Apple home. That's got me a little
curious,

947
00:35:50,833 --> 00:35:53,434
Jason. I'm curious what it would do.

948
00:35:51,795 --> 00:35:54,251
I mean to e to each his own.

949
00:35:53,434 --> 00:35:54,580
I

950
00:35:54,580 --> 00:35:57,836
don't know I don't know. But also things
like Dropbox.

951
00:35:57,836 --> 00:36:01,597
Okay. I'm gonna use it this week and we
will rep I will report back.

952
00:36:01,597 --> 00:36:03,938
And hopefully Jason will actually get to
talk to someone at Meta.

953
00:36:04,624 --> 00:36:06,836
But yeah, I it's number one free app in
the app store.

954
00:36:06,836 --> 00:36:08,770
It's for a reason. So I don't know.

955
00:36:08,770 --> 00:36:10,979
Maybe I'll ask it to list my Mac Studio on
Facebook Marketplace.

956
00:36:10,979 --> 00:36:13,641
Just kidding. you know what I will ask it
to do?

957
00:36:13,641 --> 00:36:18,985
To find my G4 PowerBook that I sold years
ago

958
00:36:19,187 --> 00:36:20,187
Boom.

959
00:36:20,026 --> 00:36:23,328
by the serial number because it has access
to all the I I'm gonna ask it to do that.

960
00:36:22,365 --> 00:36:23,996
Just tell it to check eBay every day.

961
00:36:24,670 --> 00:36:27,972
Check ~ I'm gonna do that. I will report
back.

962
00:36:27,972 --> 00:36:29,514
I will report back. All right,

963
00:36:29,383 --> 00:36:30,385
I mean, unfortunately

964
00:36:29,514 --> 00:36:30,514
we have yeah.

965
00:36:30,385 --> 00:36:33,530
this may not be a very exciting story
'cause if it's not on ebay it's never
gonna

966
00:36:33,530 --> 00:36:34,530
find it.

967
00:36:34,534 --> 00:36:36,028
I don't know, but if it finds it

968
00:36:36,369 --> 00:36:39,068
And it gives out your address and somebody
shows up at your house with a power book,

969
00:36:39,068 --> 00:36:40,068
that would be amazing.

970
00:36:40,519 --> 00:36:43,481
I mean if someone showed up to my house
with my old power book,

971
00:36:43,481 --> 00:36:45,132
I might not be mad about that.

972
00:36:44,891 --> 00:36:46,443
You'd probably make them cold brew.

973
00:36:45,132 --> 00:36:47,964
I'd probably invite them inside.

974
00:36:46,443 --> 00:36:51,692
And what

975
00:36:47,964 --> 00:36:50,976
I don't I'd wanna tell me how you've used
this computer for the last ten years.

976
00:36:50,976 --> 00:36:51,976
I wanna know.

977
00:36:51,692 --> 00:36:53,475
was your experience interacting with Muse?

978
00:36:54,418 --> 00:36:55,418
I

979
00:36:54,578 --> 00:36:57,459
will I will report back. I will do the
thing.

980
00:36:57,459 --> 00:36:59,020
Maybe I'll make a video about this too.

981
00:36:59,020 --> 00:37:01,649
We'll see. ~ let me know what use cases,

982
00:37:01,649 --> 00:37:03,531
if you've been using Muse AI on your
phone,

983
00:37:03,531 --> 00:37:05,441
again, be very wary of doing it on your
Mac.

984
00:37:05,441 --> 00:37:08,542
The permissions seem problematic and what
it's doing there.

985
00:37:08,542 --> 00:37:10,823
But if you've been using it on your phone
or iPad,

986
00:37:10,823 --> 00:37:13,384
let us know what you've been doing with it
and if it's been good.

987
00:37:13,384 --> 00:37:17,565
We gotta talk about AI self-regulation
because a quasi-law was passed

988
00:37:17,565 --> 00:37:20,656
or a an agreement. Not a law. Sorry,

989
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:20,349
Not a lot all.

990
00:37:20,656 --> 00:37:21,656
sorry, not a law,

991
00:37:21,256 --> 00:37:22,256
an accord.

992
00:37:22,404 --> 00:37:23,855
An accord was signed.

993
00:37:23,397 --> 00:37:26,201
A non binding agreement that says nothing.

994
00:37:26,557 --> 00:37:30,560
That says nothing. I still gotta gotta get
to a chat GPT dev day.

995
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:32,741
Before we do, I want to thank our sponsor,

996
00:37:32,741 --> 00:37:35,363
OriginHQ, which has, once again,

997
00:37:35,363 --> 00:37:37,545
the one of the coolest websites.

998
00:37:37,545 --> 00:37:39,156
If you just go to this website,

999
00:37:39,156 --> 00:37:40,747
because you can roll your mouse over,

1000
00:37:40,747 --> 00:37:42,601
this little animation, whatever they did,

1001
00:37:42,601 --> 00:37:44,530
I know, this this is this is cool.

1002
00:37:44,530 --> 00:37:46,731
Whatever that is. But anyway, here's the
thing:

1003
00:37:46,731 --> 00:37:47,993
Origin HQ. We're gonna be talking,

1004
00:37:47,993 --> 00:37:49,994
we're talking about agents this entire
episode.

1005
00:37:50,403 --> 00:37:53,765
In the past weeks we've covered about the
breaches with OpenAI and Hugging Face.

1006
00:37:53,765 --> 00:37:55,935
Anthropic has talked about their own
breaches.

1007
00:37:55,935 --> 00:37:59,690
We're gonna get into that as we get into
this AI accord and self-regulation.

1008
00:37:59,690 --> 00:38:01,831
But here's how things are going.

1009
00:38:01,831 --> 00:38:05,614
An agent with real credentials might hit
something unexpected.

1010
00:38:05,614 --> 00:38:07,906
It could decide to fix something on its
own.

1011
00:38:07,906 --> 00:38:11,639
An AI agent might wipe a production
database in about nine seconds.

1012
00:38:11,639 --> 00:38:15,842
Nobody attacked anyone. It was just an
agent doing what it thought was the job.

1013
00:38:16,154 --> 00:38:18,105
And afterward, the hard part wasn't the
fix,

1014
00:38:18,105 --> 00:38:20,575
it was that nobody could say exactly what
the agent had done.

1015
00:38:20,575 --> 00:38:23,026
That's the hard part, figuring out what
happened.

1016
00:38:23,026 --> 00:38:26,027
That's the gap. And most teams have the
prompt and the final answer,

1017
00:38:26,027 --> 00:38:28,537
but everything in between, the commands it
ran,

1018
00:38:28,537 --> 00:38:31,478
the files it changed, the credentials it
picked up along the way,

1019
00:38:31,478 --> 00:38:33,739
it's gone the moment the terminal closes.

1020
00:38:33,739 --> 00:38:37,720
And companies are handing agents real
credentials on employee laptops right now.

1021
00:38:37,720 --> 00:38:40,161
Well, that's what Origin does.

1022
00:38:40,161 --> 00:38:45,232
A user mode sensor on the endpoint records
the agent's work as a trace.

1023
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:47,571
Who started the session, what was asked,

1024
00:38:47,571 --> 00:38:51,133
what the agent reached, and what changed
all in one timeline.

1025
00:38:51,133 --> 00:38:52,964
So when something unexpected happens,

1026
00:38:52,964 --> 00:38:56,916
you can open the trace and read the
session in the order it happened,

1027
00:38:56,916 --> 00:39:00,824
prompt to outcome, instead of rebuilding
it from logs that only ever saw fragments.

1028
00:39:00,824 --> 00:39:03,470
Juicen might have been able use this to ~
figure out what Muse AI

1029
00:39:03,470 --> 00:39:06,201
was doing with stuff. It's an independent
evidence.

1030
00:39:06,201 --> 00:39:08,253
The model's log is the agent side of the
story,

1031
00:39:08,253 --> 00:39:10,744
but the endpoint record is what actually
happened.

1032
00:39:10,744 --> 00:39:14,086
So origin is endpoint AI observability.

1033
00:39:14,424 --> 00:39:20,189
You can see what a trace looks like at
originhq.com slash primary technology.

1034
00:39:20,189 --> 00:39:22,401
Go there right now, see the awesome
website,

1035
00:39:22,401 --> 00:39:27,225
and that's originhq.com slash primary
technology to see what a trace looks like.

1036
00:39:27,225 --> 00:39:28,446
That link is also in the show notes.

1037
00:39:28,446 --> 00:39:31,068
Our thanks to Origin for sponsoring this
episode.

1038
00:39:31,068 --> 00:39:34,421
So last thing on the the meta side,

1039
00:39:34,421 --> 00:39:37,043
I also want to I'm going to link Joanna
Stern's interview because

1040
00:39:37,043 --> 00:39:39,074
she got to interview Mark Zuckerberg.

1041
00:39:39,074 --> 00:39:42,797
I love a the first question she asked him
was is AI going to kill us all?

1042
00:39:42,797 --> 00:39:43,797
And as

1043
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:45,957
As you would expect, Mark Zuckerberg was
like,

1044
00:39:45,957 --> 00:39:50,590
Well, as long as we're all very careful
and we all do what we're supposed to do,

1045
00:39:50,590 --> 00:39:51,590
it could be great.

1046
00:39:50,747 --> 00:39:51,747
~

1047
00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:52,926
the answer should have just been no,

1048
00:39:52,926 --> 00:39:54,232
I don't think that's gonna kill everyone.

1049
00:39:54,232 --> 00:39:56,260
Like that's what he should've that's what
a human would have said.

1050
00:39:54,715 --> 00:39:55,715
Yeah.

1051
00:39:57,657 --> 00:40:01,580
Exactly. Wait, do I love this conspiracy
theory?

1052
00:40:01,580 --> 00:40:03,922
Is Mark Zuckerberg Muse?

1053
00:40:04,871 --> 00:40:08,133
I mean, ~ we don't have nearly enough time
to get into that.

1054
00:40:08,133 --> 00:40:10,905
But I'm just saying like th this is a good
interview.

1055
00:40:10,905 --> 00:40:11,905
Joanna

1056
00:40:11,291 --> 00:40:12,291
Yes.

1057
00:40:11,716 --> 00:40:14,277
Stern does a good job. A very good job.

1058
00:40:14,277 --> 00:40:16,289
She's like the one of the best at this
sort of thing.

1059
00:40:16,144 --> 00:40:17,144
Yes, yes.

1060
00:40:16,289 --> 00:40:17,289
Like she just

1061
00:40:16,829 --> 00:40:19,571
is. She asks like she's like the
friendliest person asking

1062
00:40:19,571 --> 00:40:22,333
you the hardest questions. It's like
terrifying to w I'm

1063
00:40:20,639 --> 00:40:22,225
Exactly, exactly.

1064
00:40:22,333 --> 00:40:24,154
like, I want to be her when I grow up.

1065
00:40:24,154 --> 00:40:25,655
What every time I interview someone,

1066
00:40:24,376 --> 00:40:25,561
That's yes, yes.

1067
00:40:25,755 --> 00:40:27,296
there's a point in it where I go,

1068
00:40:27,296 --> 00:40:28,747
What would Joanna Stern ask right now?

1069
00:40:28,686 --> 00:40:32,113
Yes. W W J S D,

1070
00:40:28,747 --> 00:40:30,158
And that's a real thing that I ask.

1071
00:40:30,158 --> 00:40:33,721
But Yeah, Joanna Stern do.

1072
00:40:32,113 --> 00:40:33,595
what would Joanna Stern do?

1073
00:40:34,205 --> 00:40:39,688
But definitely Mark Zuckerberg was just he
he was just very Mark Zuckerberg.

1074
00:40:39,688 --> 00:40:40,819
And no matter how hard he

1075
00:40:40,475 --> 00:40:41,475
Yes.

1076
00:40:40,819 --> 00:40:44,421
tries, he just has such a hard time with
this sort of thing,

1077
00:40:44,421 --> 00:40:45,871
especially when she pushes hard on him.

1078
00:40:45,871 --> 00:40:48,583
Because it's like he never conceived that
someone might feel that way.

1079
00:40:50,374 --> 00:40:51,764
So anyway, it's a great interview.

1080
00:40:51,764 --> 00:40:54,995
~ join us. Thank you for signing my book
at WWDC.

1081
00:40:54,995 --> 00:40:56,386
I'm not a robot. It's a great book.

1082
00:40:56,386 --> 00:40:59,597
Read it. And I you know, I was in a
conversation the other day with people

1083
00:40:59,697 --> 00:41:06,339
and AI came up and it's interesting people
seem to be receptive when

1084
00:41:06,339 --> 00:41:09,039
you offer new knowledge about how this
stuff works,

1085
00:41:09,039 --> 00:41:12,900
but also how they think it works is
usually very wrong.

1086
00:41:12,900 --> 00:41:15,381
And like what people are worried about.

1087
00:41:15,381 --> 00:41:17,342
It's it's just an interesting dynamic
right now.

1088
00:41:17,342 --> 00:41:18,342
Do you

1089
00:41:18,284 --> 00:41:19,888
Enter into these kinds of conversations
with people?

1090
00:41:19,888 --> 00:41:23,297
Do people ask you, Hey, what what about
AI?

1091
00:41:23,297 --> 00:41:24,420
Do people ask ask that or

1092
00:41:25,351 --> 00:41:26,802
I mean, I'll have people that'll say,

1093
00:41:26,802 --> 00:41:30,594
like, I heard this thing randomly that ~
there was gonna be like

1094
00:41:30,594 --> 00:41:32,075
AI that's gonna kill us all. I'm like,

1095
00:41:32,075 --> 00:41:33,927
you should stop listening to that.

1096
00:41:33,927 --> 00:41:35,718
Like, I mean I'm not listen, to be clear,

1097
00:41:35,718 --> 00:41:39,050
I'm not suggesting that it's a zero
Jurassic Park,

1098
00:41:39,050 --> 00:41:40,050
okay, like

1099
00:41:39,238 --> 00:41:40,238
Jurassic Park.

1100
00:41:39,991 --> 00:41:42,172
I'm not saying it's a zero percent
possibility.

1101
00:41:41,966 --> 00:41:43,969
It didn't kill everybody, but it killed
some people.

1102
00:41:44,731 --> 00:41:48,877
That's the tagline. Sure,

1103
00:41:45,852 --> 00:41:48,353
Also just a movie. It hasn't actually
killed anyone,

1104
00:41:48,353 --> 00:41:49,373
but I'm

1105
00:41:48,877 --> 00:41:49,877
sure.

1106
00:41:49,373 --> 00:41:52,584
I'm just saying like I I think it's a
non-zero possibility.

1107
00:41:52,584 --> 00:41:55,205
I also don't think that it's a really big
possibility at this point that

1108
00:41:55,205 --> 00:41:56,336
we should be freaking out about.

1109
00:41:56,336 --> 00:41:58,354
I had someone ask me, someone who lives in
my house,

1110
00:41:58,354 --> 00:42:00,084
do you think we should like stock up on
anything?

1111
00:42:00,084 --> 00:42:02,918
I'm like, the agents don't use toilet
paper.

1112
00:42:02,918 --> 00:42:04,058
I don't think we're gonna run out.

1113
00:42:04,058 --> 00:42:05,058
Like it's fine.

1114
00:42:05,471 --> 00:42:06,471
Exactly,

1115
00:42:06,251 --> 00:42:10,073
exactly. So, all right, with AI
self-regulation.

1116
00:42:10,073 --> 00:42:14,246
Number one, ~ the Trump administration has
said we don't want to call

1117
00:42:14,246 --> 00:42:17,418
it artificial intelligence anymore because
artificials is fake,

1118
00:42:17,418 --> 00:42:20,719
like the fake news. That's quoting Donald
Trump.

1119
00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:23,761
That's not me talking. that's what they
said.

1120
00:42:23,761 --> 00:42:25,342
So apparently it's now super intelligence,

1121
00:42:25,342 --> 00:42:26,663
at least here in the United States.

1122
00:42:26,663 --> 00:42:30,625
And this accord was signed by a bunch of
the heads of AI and

1123
00:42:32,248 --> 00:42:37,123
It's called the White House Accord on
Superintelligence.

1124
00:42:37,123 --> 00:42:42,523
And this is there's four major points of
what all these people are agreeing to.

1125
00:42:42,523 --> 00:42:44,450
And so I'll get to the points in a second.

1126
00:42:44,450 --> 00:42:49,516
Number one, there's a typo ~ in this
agreement.

1127
00:42:49,516 --> 00:42:51,638
This is like the official agreement that
was signed.

1128
00:42:51,165 --> 00:42:52,165
Totally not

1129
00:42:51,818 --> 00:42:54,096
important, right? Not an important word at
all.

1130
00:42:54,232 --> 00:42:57,945
Not an important. It says ~ President of
the United States.

1131
00:42:57,945 --> 00:43:04,091
~ swapped the D for an S. And this is
signed by Sundar Pachai of Google,

1132
00:43:04,091 --> 00:43:06,854
Dario Amade of Anthropic, Mark Zuckerberg
of Meta,

1133
00:43:06,854 --> 00:43:09,646
Greg Brockman from OpenAI, Elon Musk,

1134
00:43:09,646 --> 00:43:11,618
XAI, and Jensen Wong from NVIDIA.

1135
00:43:11,618 --> 00:43:14,701
Second, Greg Brockman's signature.

1136
00:43:14,701 --> 00:43:16,022
What is that?

1137
00:43:16,581 --> 00:43:17,581
I mean

1138
00:43:18,286 --> 00:43:22,100
I mean, I would at le he at least would
have seen the first three people sign

1139
00:43:22,100 --> 00:43:24,412
the thing. I would have faked something
nicer.

1140
00:43:24,412 --> 00:43:26,584
I mean this looks like I don't know.

1141
00:43:26,151 --> 00:43:27,151
I mean it's his

1142
00:43:26,692 --> 00:43:28,384
it's like his logo, his monogram.

1143
00:43:28,384 --> 00:43:30,788
I don't know.

1144
00:43:29,386 --> 00:43:31,568
Okay, that plea this

1145
00:43:31,568 --> 00:43:35,168
will be the chapter art, so you can all
see Greg Brockman's signature as well.

1146
00:43:35,168 --> 00:43:38,284
That's very strange. ~ notably,

1147
00:43:38,284 --> 00:43:40,556
and people were pointing this out on
social media,

1148
00:43:40,556 --> 00:43:44,319
you know who's not on this agreement and
had to sign their name?

1149
00:43:44,319 --> 00:43:48,032
John Turnus or Tim Cook or anybody from
Apple.

1150
00:43:48,526 --> 00:43:51,988
Or s ~ Sachinadella.

1151
00:43:53,391 --> 00:43:57,133
Right, Microsoft. So that is interesting,

1152
00:43:57,133 --> 00:44:01,545
I feel like. Well one, it's just that
Apple is not seen as one of

1153
00:44:01,545 --> 00:44:05,298
the mi major players in superintelligence
or AI.

1154
00:44:04,989 --> 00:44:05,989
Well,

1155
00:44:05,432 --> 00:44:07,268
they're not a frontier model.

1156
00:44:07,888 --> 00:44:09,179
Then our frontier model company,

1157
00:44:09,179 --> 00:44:13,332
sure. And Siri AI was distilled from
Gemini or you know,

1158
00:44:13,332 --> 00:44:14,543
something like that. So anyway,

1159
00:44:14,543 --> 00:44:16,354
just point of information, you know,

1160
00:44:16,354 --> 00:44:17,545
they're not on this agreement.

1161
00:44:17,545 --> 00:44:20,857
But this agreement, there's four things.

1162
00:44:20,857 --> 00:44:24,970
And the idea is we need safety in this AI
frontier research.

1163
00:44:24,970 --> 00:44:26,691
And so it states a few things.

1164
00:44:26,691 --> 00:44:30,244
One, every company is responsible for
developing developing

1165
00:44:30,244 --> 00:44:33,977
its own technology safely. So the
companies are responsible.

1166
00:44:33,917 --> 00:44:34,917
Do your best.

1167
00:44:35,017 --> 00:44:36,017
Do your best.

1168
00:44:35,781 --> 00:44:37,795
This is what we're gonna do. You read and
I'm gonna translate

1169
00:44:38,190 --> 00:44:42,795
Okay, very good. Internal controls
monitoring risks like cybersecurity

1170
00:44:42,795 --> 00:44:45,318
and biosecurity. That's the same.

1171
00:44:44,669 --> 00:44:45,757
Be really careful.

1172
00:44:46,660 --> 00:44:51,446
Internal controls. An internal oversight
team is required.

1173
00:44:50,909 --> 00:44:51,909
Yeah, you

1174
00:44:51,532 --> 00:44:54,242
you guys are fine. You just figure it out
and decide if you did it right.

1175
00:44:54,242 --> 00:44:56,099
Grade your grade

1176
00:44:54,744 --> 00:44:55,895
Okay, yeah, all of this

1177
00:44:56,099 --> 00:44:57,099
your own papers.

1178
00:44:57,036 --> 00:44:59,057
grade your own papers. That's that's
exactly right.

1179
00:44:59,057 --> 00:45:04,592
Now but number three, independent external
auditors is part of the requirement.

1180
00:45:04,859 --> 00:45:06,679
Open the door when we come by and wave.

1181
00:45:07,689 --> 00:45:09,364
Just just work with your door open,

1182
00:45:09,364 --> 00:45:10,960
yeah. And number four

1183
00:45:10,573 --> 00:45:11,655
Work. It's like being

1184
00:45:11,655 --> 00:45:13,529
in college. I went to a very small,

1185
00:45:13,529 --> 00:45:17,005
like private, like Christian school where
it's like you had to have your door open

1186
00:45:17,005 --> 00:45:18,758
if the girls came over. This is what this

1187
00:45:18,438 --> 00:45:19,438
Sure,

1188
00:45:18,758 --> 00:45:19,758
is.

1189
00:45:19,201 --> 00:45:23,435
sure. And number four, a board committee
reviewing findings,

1190
00:45:23,435 --> 00:45:25,291
which means the company's own board,

1191
00:45:25,291 --> 00:45:26,291
but

1192
00:45:25,319 --> 00:45:26,319
Hm,

1193
00:45:25,550 --> 00:45:28,688
hire a grown up so that it at least looks
like you're being responsible.

1194
00:45:28,708 --> 00:45:30,160
That's exact that's exactly right.

1195
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:36,107
And notably the document lists no
penalties for not doing any of these four
things,

1196
00:45:36,107 --> 00:45:40,092
which exa I s I don't know, I slipped I
did not mean to say law before.

1197
00:45:40,092 --> 00:45:41,494
It's a hundred percent not a law.

1198
00:45:41,494 --> 00:45:43,517
There's not even ramifications if you
don't do it.

1199
00:45:43,475 --> 00:45:45,246
Well that's 'cause it's a non binding
agreement.

1200
00:45:43,517 --> 00:45:46,130
So it's like it's a non binding agreement,

1201
00:45:45,246 --> 00:45:46,897
You don't even you don't to do any of
these.

1202
00:45:46,130 --> 00:45:47,552
yeah. Right.

1203
00:45:46,897 --> 00:45:47,897
Th the

1204
00:45:47,718 --> 00:45:51,500
only thing you had to do if you are s ~
you know,

1205
00:45:51,500 --> 00:45:54,642
soon darpachai, is show up at this thing
and put your signature on a piece

1206
00:45:54,642 --> 00:45:56,433
of paper that means absolutely nothing.

1207
00:45:56,687 --> 00:46:00,475
Absolutely nothing. ~ the document does
say over time it may make sense

1208
00:46:00,475 --> 00:46:04,122
to codify these steps into laws or
regulations.

1209
00:46:04,122 --> 00:46:07,640
So not doing anything now, but maybe in
the future.

1210
00:46:04,720 --> 00:46:07,846
Yeah. The most in the

1211
00:46:07,846 --> 00:46:12,175
most interesting thing is how quickly this
happened after the Pacing

1212
00:46:12,175 --> 00:46:14,530
the Frontier piece by Dario Amade.

1213
00:46:15,300 --> 00:46:18,336
Right. Like a week. Not like a week.

1214
00:46:16,730 --> 00:46:18,881
Yeah, basic yeah, like ten days or
something like that.

1215
00:46:18,336 --> 00:46:19,438
Yeah.

1216
00:46:18,881 --> 00:46:19,881
And it just

1217
00:46:19,622 --> 00:46:20,983
tells you, like, okay, well, you know,

1218
00:46:20,983 --> 00:46:23,315
we don't have a clue how to do any of th
like how to regulate this.

1219
00:46:23,315 --> 00:46:24,473
We don't have a clue. But you know what?

1220
00:46:24,473 --> 00:46:27,127
We should look like we care. What if we
got a bunch of people in the room?

1221
00:46:27,127 --> 00:46:30,140
We signed a piece of paper that doesn't
mean like they could have just signed

1222
00:46:30,140 --> 00:46:32,161
my show notes piece of paper and it would
have had as much

1223
00:46:31,350 --> 00:46:32,350
Yeah.

1224
00:46:32,161 --> 00:46:33,512
of a force of effect.

1225
00:46:34,264 --> 00:46:38,257
It is a bit of a would you say publicity
type stunt?

1226
00:46:38,710 --> 00:46:41,518
i yeah, I mean it's purely just for the
PR.

1227
00:46:42,020 --> 00:46:48,153
Right, exactly. And related, ~ OpenAI said
they are pausing training because it's

1228
00:46:48,153 --> 00:46:51,874
most powerful models, ~ had rogue agents
target the actual government.

1229
00:46:51,782 --> 00:46:52,793
Yeah, no problem at all.

1230
00:46:52,915 --> 00:46:54,835
No problem at all. We're good to go.

1231
00:46:54,835 --> 00:46:56,716
We're good with the self-regulation.

1232
00:46:56,716 --> 00:46:59,437
Just be j hey hey kids, just be careful.

1233
00:46:59,437 --> 00:47:01,378
Hey, don't just wear a helmet,

1234
00:47:01,378 --> 00:47:04,985
maybe. ~ I also wanted to link this
interview.

1235
00:47:04,985 --> 00:47:08,301
~ I'm about halfway through and we talked
about this in the pre-show,

1236
00:47:08,301 --> 00:47:09,822
but Bill Gates

1237
00:47:10,072 --> 00:47:13,664
was interviewed by Ezra Klein for the New
York Times in an opinion piece.

1238
00:47:13,664 --> 00:47:16,596
And Bill Gates, he's got a lot of thoughts
about AI,

1239
00:47:16,596 --> 00:47:21,048
as you would expect. And w I feel like
I've personally,

1240
00:47:21,048 --> 00:47:22,389
and as we've talked about on the show,

1241
00:47:22,389 --> 00:47:25,591
kind of waffled between it's going to kill
us all,

1242
00:47:25,591 --> 00:47:29,253
or maybe it's Jurassic Park, well it will
kill some of us and maybe it's fine.

1243
00:47:29,253 --> 00:47:32,224
And so I'm just going on this journey with
you all,

1244
00:47:32,224 --> 00:47:34,535
listeners and viewers. Bill Gates,

1245
00:47:34,535 --> 00:47:37,417
in this interview, he tells Ezra Klein
people are thinking this

1246
00:47:37,417 --> 00:47:38,938
is like the Industrial Revolution.

1247
00:47:39,534 --> 00:47:44,497
Where yes, many jobs changed, but they're
just replaced by other jobs.

1248
00:47:44,497 --> 00:47:50,401
Think, you know, a cart wooden wheel
repair man for horse and carriages.

1249
00:47:50,401 --> 00:47:53,243
That job went away when cars came around.

1250
00:47:53,243 --> 00:47:58,307
But then we also added jobs for like car
repair people and mechanics.

1251
00:47:58,307 --> 00:48:01,989
And he's like, that's how people are
comparing this AI revolution

1252
00:48:02,129 --> 00:48:04,411
to the industrial revolution, where some
jobs went away,

1253
00:48:04,411 --> 00:48:06,012
but they were replaced by other jobs.

1254
00:48:06,012 --> 00:48:08,954
Book Aids was like, nah, this is like

1255
00:48:09,644 --> 00:48:12,876
human evolution. He says this in the
interview,

1256
00:48:12,876 --> 00:48:15,857
where it's not that jobs will change,

1257
00:48:15,857 --> 00:48:19,479
it's that huge swaths of jobs will just go
away.

1258
00:48:19,479 --> 00:48:23,161
And Ezra Klein pushes him on a number of
these points,

1259
00:48:23,161 --> 00:48:27,694
which I appreciated how Ezra was like
pretty forceful in asking him some

1260
00:48:27,694 --> 00:48:31,706
of these questions. But he even says like
countries that might be

1261
00:48:32,227 --> 00:48:37,009
not on the frontier of AI, where they you
know they don't have companies like

1262
00:48:37,049 --> 00:48:38,110
Anthropic or OpenAI.

1263
00:48:38,702 --> 00:48:40,463
leading the charge on these frontier
models,

1264
00:48:40,463 --> 00:48:45,166
they will be affected just like the United
States and and Western countries will be,

1265
00:48:45,166 --> 00:48:50,110
just might take longer time. And that it
will filter down to every aspect

1266
00:48:50,110 --> 00:48:52,572
of civilization in the coming years.

1267
00:48:52,572 --> 00:48:56,014
So I wouldn't say Bill Gates is like,

1268
00:48:56,014 --> 00:48:59,436
it's gonna kill us all, but he was saying
the ramifications,

1269
00:48:59,436 --> 00:49:01,978
especially on jobs, is going to be very
significant.

1270
00:49:01,978 --> 00:49:04,762
As we discussed in the pre show,

1271
00:49:04,762 --> 00:49:07,202
Jason, I mean you kind of painted this as
like,

1272
00:49:07,202 --> 00:49:08,202
you know,

1273
00:49:08,358 --> 00:49:12,296
Bill Gates, how much are we how how would
you phrase it for those actually

1274
00:49:11,804 --> 00:49:13,785
I mean, he thinks a lot about these
things.

1275
00:49:12,296 --> 00:49:14,350
in the show? Sure.

1276
00:49:13,785 --> 00:49:14,785
That's

1277
00:49:14,376 --> 00:49:17,828
fine, but we are two generations past peak
Bill Gates,

1278
00:49:17,828 --> 00:49:20,130
right? The PC was Bill Gates, Windows,

1279
00:49:20,130 --> 00:49:23,572
right? And this is the person who missed
mobile,

1280
00:49:23,572 --> 00:49:26,554
right? The next generation came.

1281
00:49:26,554 --> 00:49:29,986
And so there is a little bit of like
you're v he's very smart,

1282
00:49:29,986 --> 00:49:32,538
very thoughtful. Like I've listened to a
lot of Bill Gates interviews.

1283
00:49:32,538 --> 00:49:34,119
I've written about Bill Gates quite a bit.

1284
00:49:34,119 --> 00:49:38,412
~ so like I'm not saying he doesn't know
what he's talking about by any means,

1285
00:49:38,412 --> 00:49:41,164
but I do think that like, why is Bill
Gates out there doing?

1286
00:49:41,457 --> 00:49:45,539
Like what is the reason? Is this just how
you continue to feel relevant?

1287
00:49:45,539 --> 00:49:50,742
Because he doesn't get paid to sit down
with Ezra Klein and he's

1288
00:49:46,618 --> 00:49:48,549
He doesn't need the money or the exposure.

1289
00:49:48,549 --> 00:49:50,551
No, no, no.

1290
00:49:50,742 --> 00:49:53,844
not selling a product. So he gen so on
that regard,

1291
00:49:53,844 --> 00:49:56,565
maybe he genuinely just wants to be a
voice in this.

1292
00:49:56,565 --> 00:50:00,247
And obviously Microsoft, he's still pretty
closely tied to Microsoft,

1293
00:50:00,247 --> 00:50:03,309
at least in perception, is very much a
part of this.

1294
00:50:03,309 --> 00:50:06,600
And so I understand that. But like I I
don't know,

1295
00:50:06,600 --> 00:50:09,892
like I don't i he also just basically took
both sides of the argument.

1296
00:50:10,865 --> 00:50:11,865
Right.

1297
00:50:11,031 --> 00:50:12,031
A little bit.

1298
00:50:11,761 --> 00:50:16,513
I mean he was he was pretty f strong in
saying like this is having is going

1299
00:50:16,513 --> 00:50:18,083
to have more of an effect than people
think.

1300
00:50:18,083 --> 00:50:20,444
And I well I figured part of the reason,

1301
00:50:20,444 --> 00:50:22,804
at least for me, like when I see someone
like Bill Gates talk about it,

1302
00:50:22,804 --> 00:50:28,786
I like the idea of someone not at one of
these frontier AI companies talking about

1303
00:50:28,786 --> 00:50:34,521
AI, because anytime you hear Mark
Zuckerberg or Sam Altman talk about AI,

1304
00:50:34,521 --> 00:50:38,089
they obviously have huge self investment
into this product.

1305
00:50:38,563 --> 00:50:42,514
And so it's going to color their opinion
of where it is and where it's going.

1306
00:50:42,514 --> 00:50:49,246
And it seems rare to be able to have a
voice that's not so invested where like

1307
00:50:49,246 --> 00:50:52,197
the bottom line of their own company is
going to be affected.

1308
00:50:52,197 --> 00:50:56,438
And now I'm not saying like that's why we
you should all go listen to Bill Gates.

1309
00:50:56,438 --> 00:51:00,549
It's that I'm kind of looking for voices
that are not as attached to it.

1310
00:51:00,549 --> 00:51:03,820
And if anybody has others that you think
match that,

1311
00:51:03,820 --> 00:51:07,271
you know, level of experience in the
business,

1312
00:51:07,271 --> 00:51:08,271
like

1313
00:51:07,641 --> 00:51:09,163
I'd love to hear Walt Mossberg on this.

1314
00:51:09,163 --> 00:51:10,805
Like what does Walt Mossberg think?

1315
00:51:10,805 --> 00:51:13,689
And not like he's probably not been you
know,

1316
00:51:13,689 --> 00:51:15,482
involved in day to day AI operations,

1317
00:51:15,482 --> 00:51:19,207
but those are the kind of voices that I
would be curious to hear of of about

1318
00:51:19,207 --> 00:51:21,280
the AI that's not connected to these
companies directly.

1319
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:22,351
Does that make sense? Is that kind of

1320
00:51:22,406 --> 00:51:23,927
Yeah, and I I think that makes sense.

1321
00:51:23,927 --> 00:51:26,008
And I think that yeah, at some point you
ask yourself,

1322
00:51:26,008 --> 00:51:29,749
like, well what ~ what is the role Bill
Gates wants to play?

1323
00:51:29,749 --> 00:51:31,288
I think I think about like George W.

1324
00:51:31,288 --> 00:51:33,521
Bush. Like he's no longer president.

1325
00:51:33,521 --> 00:51:36,822
He basically spends his time painting vets
and riding bikes,

1326
00:51:36,822 --> 00:51:38,763
like with Like in every

1327
00:51:37,039 --> 00:51:38,508
Yes. Yes.

1328
00:51:38,763 --> 00:51:42,285
once in a while you might get him to
comment on like,

1329
00:51:42,285 --> 00:51:45,406
Hey, former president guy,

1330
00:51:45,406 --> 00:51:47,151
is this the end of civilization as we know
it?

1331
00:51:47,151 --> 00:51:49,188
And he's always like, I gotta go paint a
picture.

1332
00:51:49,350 --> 00:51:50,901
You know, so there is a part of me that

1333
00:51:50,532 --> 00:51:51,532
Right.

1334
00:51:50,901 --> 00:51:53,674
wonders like what is the right role for
someone like Bill Gates?

1335
00:51:53,674 --> 00:51:58,027
Because again, he has seen it all and he
th is very thoughtful.

1336
00:51:58,027 --> 00:52:01,831
But also it's like you could make the
argument that,

1337
00:52:01,831 --> 00:52:04,994
you know, your your his full time job at
this point is giving away all of his
money.

1338
00:52:04,994 --> 00:52:05,994
Like that

1339
00:52:05,805 --> 00:52:08,097
Right. Right,

1340
00:52:05,934 --> 00:52:07,195
seems like it should keep you pretty busy.

1341
00:52:08,097 --> 00:52:10,539
yeah, for sure. So anyway, I I thought the
interview was interesting.

1342
00:52:10,539 --> 00:52:12,071
I'll I'll link it down in the show notes.

1343
00:52:12,071 --> 00:52:13,752
We have to talk about ChatGPT Dev Day.

1344
00:52:13,752 --> 00:52:16,715
And so this is like OpenAI's WWDC.

1345
00:52:16,715 --> 00:52:18,797
I feel like that's the best way to think
about it.

1346
00:52:18,797 --> 00:52:21,740
This is where they're announcing products
but also tools

1347
00:52:21,740 --> 00:52:27,265
for developers using OpenAI. They had
about an hour long a keynote video,

1348
00:52:27,265 --> 00:52:30,758
which I'll link their blog post and let's
see,

1349
00:52:30,758 --> 00:52:31,799
yeah, it was about an hour long.

1350
00:52:32,975 --> 00:52:34,746
High level, we're gonna talk about dots,

1351
00:52:34,746 --> 00:52:38,029
which was the kind of the biggest
announcement and the promise there.

1352
00:52:38,029 --> 00:52:41,351
And they have a bunch of other features
and products they're launching,

1353
00:52:41,351 --> 00:52:43,853
like ChatGPT space, Codex in the cloud.

1354
00:52:43,853 --> 00:52:47,556
Seeing this, number one,

1355
00:52:47,556 --> 00:52:50,818
I hope John Turnus brings back live
events,

1356
00:52:50,818 --> 00:52:54,111
like people on stage talking. And I know
Jason making a face,

1357
00:52:54,111 --> 00:52:58,414
but like, don't let Sam Altman and Mark
Zuckerberg be the only guys

1358
00:52:58,414 --> 00:53:00,045
out here being charismatic on stage.

1359
00:53:00,503 --> 00:53:02,024
And I have to say, for all Sam Altman,

1360
00:53:02,024 --> 00:53:03,856
like if you've watched interviews with Sam
Altman in the past,

1361
00:53:03,856 --> 00:53:05,778
like he's kind of an inch weird character,

1362
00:53:05,778 --> 00:53:07,139
like doesn't come across great interviews.

1363
00:53:07,139 --> 00:53:11,994
In this kind of presentation, he was
actually charismatic sometimes and I was
like,

1364
00:53:11,994 --> 00:53:14,146
God, I want Apple to do that again.

1365
00:53:14,146 --> 00:53:16,697
Like put somebody on stage. Like I think
John Turnis do that.

1366
00:53:16,697 --> 00:53:17,697
So anyway.

1367
00:53:17,350 --> 00:53:22,927
Why just I don't know. Why? I hear people
saying this like John Jernasy's gonna

1368
00:53:22,927 --> 00:53:24,428
bring back in person event live events.

1369
00:53:24,428 --> 00:53:28,073
Why? That the what they're doing works for
them and and it scales

1370
00:53:28,073 --> 00:53:30,556
way bigger than just putting people on the
stage.

1371
00:53:30,873 --> 00:53:34,176
Because I think it humanizes the company.

1372
00:53:34,568 --> 00:53:36,755
See, I think it makes them look small in
comparison.

1373
00:53:37,422 --> 00:53:40,364
I d no, I just disagree. Like seeing Sam
Altman,

1374
00:53:40,364 --> 00:53:43,406
like I watched probably forty-five minutes
of this hour-long keynote.

1375
00:53:43,406 --> 00:53:46,448
Seeing Sam Altman on stage talking about
these things,

1376
00:53:46,448 --> 00:53:52,051
reacting to the crowd, and interacting
with people in that real sense,

1377
00:53:52,051 --> 00:53:55,087
like yes, Craig Federigi and John Turners,

1378
00:53:55,087 --> 00:53:57,655
they've been doing interviews like post
iPhone event,

1379
00:53:57,655 --> 00:54:01,297
post WWDC. They choose some select outlets
to do interviews with.

1380
00:54:01,297 --> 00:54:03,158
But again, those are produced,

1381
00:54:03,158 --> 00:54:06,991
not live, no live audience. Seeing Sam
Altman do this.

1382
00:54:08,299 --> 00:54:09,630
I want to see Apple do this again.

1383
00:54:09,630 --> 00:54:13,121
And, you know, we I don't know if we
talked about it on last week's show.

1384
00:54:13,121 --> 00:54:17,123
I linked it in Top Five Tech, but there
was that QA video of

1385
00:54:17,123 --> 00:54:22,555
the AntenneGate ~ session, and Steve Jobs
is answering questions about AntennaGate

1386
00:54:22,555 --> 00:54:25,416
live for like over an hour to this press.

1387
00:54:25,416 --> 00:54:31,859
And you just one I feel like you you see
the human side of the company,

1388
00:54:31,859 --> 00:54:35,881
but also you get to see these people in a
not ~

1389
00:54:36,633 --> 00:54:38,414
like hermetically sealed environment.

1390
00:54:38,414 --> 00:54:41,537
I think of like like a clean room
environment.

1391
00:54:41,537 --> 00:54:45,301
And I feel like the the videos Apple does
obviously they're very well produced.

1392
00:54:45,301 --> 00:54:48,523
You can do things in these pre-recorded
videos that you can't do live on stage,

1393
00:54:48,523 --> 00:54:52,327
but you can do both. I mean all the live
keynotes of Apple in the past,

1394
00:54:52,327 --> 00:54:53,848
there would be live presentations,

1395
00:54:53,848 --> 00:54:57,201
live on stage demos, and then they would
play a video of Johnny

1396
00:54:57,201 --> 00:55:00,214
Ive talking about aluminium. So you can
still do both,

1397
00:55:00,214 --> 00:55:02,716
do the produced videos and do the live on
stage,

1398
00:55:02,716 --> 00:55:03,937
but I think it I think it

1399
00:55:04,207 --> 00:55:06,680
brings a human element, humanizes a
company,

1400
00:55:06,680 --> 00:55:09,673
which all these AI companies are needing
to do as much as possible.

1401
00:55:09,673 --> 00:55:13,668
They need to appear as human as possible
to build trust.

1402
00:55:13,668 --> 00:55:17,402
And I think that, again, the humanizing
and the trust part is is what builds it.

1403
00:55:17,402 --> 00:55:18,443
So that's why I hope to see it.

1404
00:55:18,908 --> 00:55:21,229
Yeah, I just think the iPhone event is too
big for this.

1405
00:55:21,229 --> 00:55:23,960
Maybe you could get away with some of the
things for WWDC,

1406
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:27,532
but I just I don't think I think that the
scale at which Apple

1407
00:55:27,532 --> 00:55:30,923
is producing the iPhone event just so
dwarfs this.

1408
00:55:30,923 --> 00:55:35,628
I c so cause the contrast to that is they
do smaller events where like

1409
00:55:35,755 --> 00:55:38,756
you I've been to events in New York City
where someone comes out and talks

1410
00:55:38,756 --> 00:55:40,897
to you and then you still watch a video or
whatever.

1411
00:55:40,868 --> 00:55:41,868
Right.

1412
00:55:40,897 --> 00:55:41,897
I could

1413
00:55:41,287 --> 00:55:44,428
see them doing that because those are just
at a different scale.

1414
00:55:44,428 --> 00:55:47,250
The iPhone event though is the large most
widely watched,

1415
00:55:47,250 --> 00:55:48,250
largest tech

1416
00:55:48,728 --> 00:55:52,940
event in the world. It's the b like it's
it you know has more people watching

1417
00:55:52,940 --> 00:55:57,052
it than I mean Hollywood would love that
viewership for some of its productions.

1418
00:55:56,944 --> 00:55:57,944
For

1419
00:55:57,224 --> 00:56:00,954
sure. But I feel like I mean, if Google
can do it with I.O.

1420
00:56:00,954 --> 00:56:03,138
and Meta can do it with their event,

1421
00:56:03,138 --> 00:56:06,687
like Apple could do it. Yeah.

1422
00:56:04,260 --> 00:56:06,062
Yeah, they absolutely could do it.

1423
00:56:06,062 --> 00:56:07,113
What I'm just saying

1424
00:56:07,113 --> 00:56:12,147
is that what they w the message they want
to communicate the production

1425
00:56:12,147 --> 00:56:13,728
of it is part of that message.

1426
00:56:13,728 --> 00:56:16,711
And I think that Apple that's what Apple
wants to be communicating.

1427
00:56:16,711 --> 00:56:19,623
Would it be more fun to sit in the Steve
Jobs theater and have them

1428
00:56:19,623 --> 00:56:22,136
all like telling us this stuff live?

1429
00:56:22,136 --> 00:56:27,000
Sure. But it would just be it's just a
very different production.

1430
00:56:28,621 --> 00:56:31,002
Yeah. Anyway, I'm I'm still hopeful they
do it.

1431
00:56:31,002 --> 00:56:34,023
I think I think there is a positive
element to it.

1432
00:56:34,023 --> 00:56:36,523
And watching the dev day video,

1433
00:56:36,523 --> 00:56:39,084
I was like, Huh, this stuff's pretty cool.

1434
00:56:39,084 --> 00:56:43,225
on the face of it. Which again is kind of
like the veil of the excitement.

1435
00:56:43,225 --> 00:56:45,366
You know, you hear the crowd, you hear the
audience reaction.

1436
00:56:45,366 --> 00:56:48,307
Like Sam Altman at one point he like
announces Soul six point

1437
00:56:48,307 --> 00:56:51,134
one and everybody cheers. And Sam Alman's
like,

1438
00:56:51,134 --> 00:56:52,368
I didn't even tell you what it did yet.

1439
00:56:52,368 --> 00:56:54,768
You gotta hear why it's good. And like,

1440
00:56:54,768 --> 00:56:56,419
it's that was funny.

1441
00:56:56,855 --> 00:56:59,207
And he was like that was an endearing
moment.

1442
00:56:59,207 --> 00:57:02,529
And as much as you may like or dislike Sam
Altman or have seen him,

1443
00:57:02,529 --> 00:57:04,570
you know, have weird answers in
interviews,

1444
00:57:04,570 --> 00:57:10,034
like in that one moment, it builds like it
adds a brick to the wall of credibility.

1445
00:57:10,034 --> 00:57:12,816
And maybe this guy's not so bad.

1446
00:57:12,816 --> 00:57:13,816
Whether

1447
00:57:13,426 --> 00:57:14,426
Sure.

1448
00:57:13,776 --> 00:57:16,398
that's accurate or not, it that's what
those moments do.

1449
00:57:16,398 --> 00:57:19,342
And that's what I would like to see John
Turnus or Craig Federica.

1450
00:57:19,342 --> 00:57:21,562
Like they have so many people that are in
these produced keynotes

1451
00:57:21,562 --> 00:57:24,994
and maybe they couldn't all do a live type
presentation.

1452
00:57:24,994 --> 00:57:26,295
But anyway, that's why I'm hopeful for.

1453
00:57:26,437 --> 00:57:27,437
But anyway,

1454
00:57:26,984 --> 00:57:27,984
All right.

1455
00:57:29,244 --> 00:57:32,531
that's the best I could do to say to get a
Jason agreement.

1456
00:57:32,632 --> 00:57:34,185
I mean, I think it'd be fine if they did
it.

1457
00:57:32,712 --> 00:57:34,857
All right. It'd be fun.

1458
00:57:34,185 --> 00:57:35,185
I just don't I

1459
00:57:34,916 --> 00:57:36,920
don't think that they will because of the
scale of it.

1460
00:57:37,795 --> 00:57:38,795
I know I know what you're saying.

1461
00:57:38,727 --> 00:57:40,097
We'll s we'll I'm I'm hopeful.

1462
00:57:40,097 --> 00:57:42,643
John Turnus, I'm pretty sure he listens to
this and MacPower users,

1463
00:57:42,643 --> 00:57:44,577
so you know, just do something live.

1464
00:57:44,774 --> 00:57:48,284
Believe, we needed a new Believe shirt
with just the Steve

1465
00:57:46,691 --> 00:57:48,035
Believe that's it.

1466
00:57:48,284 --> 00:57:50,399
Jobs Theater stage on it instead of a Mac
Pro.

1467
00:57:50,928 --> 00:57:52,599
Pretty good. I gotta make some more merch.

1468
00:57:52,599 --> 00:57:56,742
Anyway, ChatGPT Dots was the big
announcement at Dev Day,

1469
00:57:56,742 --> 00:58:00,778
and this is in direct response to Meta's
Muse AI.

1470
00:58:00,778 --> 00:58:06,109
Dots are that always-on agent that will do
all the things for you.

1471
00:58:06,109 --> 00:58:09,592
ChatGPT or OpenAI says there's like over
4,000 connectors.

1472
00:58:09,592 --> 00:58:13,054
You can connect it to your Microsoft
Office and other things,

1473
00:58:13,054 --> 00:58:16,056
and you can use it in the ChatGPT app.

1474
00:58:16,056 --> 00:58:17,056
You can

1475
00:58:17,039 --> 00:58:20,091
Text it, you'll be able to text your chat
GPT dot.

1476
00:58:20,091 --> 00:58:24,904
You'll be able to call it like actual talk
on the phone to your chat GPT dot,

1477
00:58:24,904 --> 00:58:26,205
which you just do voice mode too.

1478
00:58:26,205 --> 00:58:30,457
~ but the promise is that it's gonna do a
ton of these things for you.

1479
00:58:30,457 --> 00:58:33,039
It's gonna be your agent always on in the
cloud,

1480
00:58:33,039 --> 00:58:34,330
don't have to hold your computer open,

1481
00:58:34,330 --> 00:58:39,142
all of that kind of stuff. It is ChatGPT
Pro plans and higher.

1482
00:58:39,142 --> 00:58:42,034
So you have to pay for the $100 a month
ChatGPT plan or hire just

1483
00:58:42,034 --> 00:58:43,185
to get access right now.

1484
00:58:43,917 --> 00:58:45,848
I did not do that to try it myself.

1485
00:58:45,848 --> 00:58:47,179
I did go in to see if I could try it,

1486
00:58:47,179 --> 00:58:50,761
but not. And yeah, we'll see.

1487
00:58:50,761 --> 00:58:53,203
We'll see how useful it is. Everyone's
very excited about these agents.

1488
00:58:53,203 --> 00:58:55,584
I'm gonna try them use AI, but yeah,

1489
00:58:55,584 --> 00:58:56,825
that's dots.

1490
00:58:56,518 --> 00:58:57,518
Yeah,

1491
00:58:56,828 --> 00:59:02,831
yeah, I mean, I think that it is the the
key I don't c correct me if I'm wrong,

1492
00:59:02,831 --> 00:59:08,583
someone dots is essentially the execution
layer

1493
00:59:08,583 --> 00:59:10,814
on top of whatever it is that you're
doing,

1494
00:59:10,814 --> 00:59:16,056
because I don't believe that dots can do
anything that Codex couldn't already

1495
00:59:16,056 --> 00:59:22,689
do or ChatGPT work, right? It is just a
frictionless interaction layer

1496
00:59:22,689 --> 00:59:26,020
that sort of gives instructions to those
other things.

1497
00:59:26,522 --> 00:59:30,474
So, I don't know. I think in Chat GPT or
OpenAI,

1498
00:59:30,474 --> 00:59:33,676
as you recall, is coming off of the fact
that it like made a bunch

1499
00:59:33,676 --> 00:59:36,768
of people confused and mad because it took
the Chat GPT app and actually took

1500
00:59:36,768 --> 00:59:39,499
the Codex app and made it the Chat GPT app
and then they've actually changed

1501
00:59:39,499 --> 00:59:41,680
it now so it's a lot easier to get to your
just chats.

1502
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,742
But it's just very confusing. It's like
there are three things Chat GPT,

1503
00:59:44,742 --> 00:59:48,084
Chat GPT work and Codex. I don't when do I
do what?

1504
00:59:48,084 --> 00:59:50,425
Because like if I have a conversation with
Chat GPT,

1505
00:59:50,425 --> 00:59:52,809
it c it can like this is how you should do
a thing and you're like,

1506
00:59:52,809 --> 00:59:53,809
Can you do it? And you're like,

1507
00:59:53,717 --> 00:59:55,288
you need codecs for that. It's like,

1508
00:59:55,288 --> 00:59:56,288
well then just

1509
00:59:56,093 --> 00:59:57,518
It's right there. Could you just do some
stuff?

1510
00:59:57,518 --> 00:59:58,518
And it's like, No, I can't do that.

1511
00:59:59,148 --> 01:00:05,620
It is the I think the pain point of this
phase because w I think where

1512
01:00:05,620 --> 01:00:12,331
we are with all these tools, like OpenClaw
was the first to be like that agent that

1513
01:00:12,331 --> 01:00:15,002
could just do stuff for you. But like you
said earlier,

1514
01:00:15,002 --> 01:00:17,290
you needed a computer for it to run on and
you need

1515
01:00:17,042 --> 01:00:18,042
Yeah.

1516
01:00:17,290 --> 01:00:21,273
to install it and it was complicated and
you had to deal with the terminal window.

1517
01:00:21,273 --> 01:00:25,244
And that was like the level the barrier to
entry was high when that was

1518
01:00:25,684 --> 01:00:28,458
how you had to do it. And so I

1519
01:00:28,985 --> 01:00:32,186
joked by saying we need to talk about the
cutification of AI,

1520
01:00:32,186 --> 01:00:37,449
but I think what Muse AI is with a furry
mascot and what ChatGPT dots

1521
01:00:37,569 --> 01:00:42,371
are is trying to make these ideas as
approachable as possible.

1522
01:00:42,371 --> 01:00:47,713
Because what I do right now is I will use
the screen zap to go back to

1523
01:00:47,713 --> 01:00:50,394
my Mac Studio that has clawed code running
on it,

1524
01:00:50,394 --> 01:00:52,355
and I'll ask it to do something,

1525
01:00:52,355 --> 01:00:56,657
and then I swipe the screen zap away on my
iPhone and I go on with whatever

1526
01:00:56,657 --> 01:00:57,657
I'm doing.

1527
01:00:57,773 --> 01:01:01,094
And that is in essence what these are
going to do for you.

1528
01:01:01,094 --> 01:01:04,955
It's just that these are working on a
computer and a cloud that you don't have

1529
01:01:04,955 --> 01:01:08,086
to own. So it can be doing this work
nonstop.

1530
01:01:08,086 --> 01:01:10,597
And there's a whole dots video you can
watch.

1531
01:01:10,597 --> 01:01:13,178
~ I'll link it in the page in the show
notes.

1532
01:01:13,178 --> 01:01:18,436
But it shows people like saying the dot
could proactively say,

1533
01:01:18,436 --> 01:01:23,541
~ the numbers came in from last month and
revenue was lower and so

1534
01:01:24,003 --> 01:01:27,775
you know, do you want me to adjust your
keynote slides with the new numbers?

1535
01:01:27,775 --> 01:01:29,676
And you just tell your dot, yes,

1536
01:01:29,676 --> 01:01:31,917
do that. And then it'd be like,

1537
01:01:31,917 --> 01:01:36,129
also dot, try and figure out what we can
change about the business so

1538
01:01:36,129 --> 01:01:37,739
we can be profitable next quarter.

1539
01:01:37,739 --> 01:01:41,451
And dot will go off and come up with a
bunch of stuff for that.

1540
01:01:41,500 --> 01:01:44,761
Yeah, Dot will go into your MailChimp
account and send a hundred thousand spam

1541
01:01:44,761 --> 01:01:47,519
emails to potential customers to see if it
could juice the numbers.

1542
01:01:47,519 --> 01:01:48,794
That's totally what you want.

1543
01:01:47,712 --> 01:01:48,712
Exactly.

1544
01:01:49,202 --> 01:01:51,083
And you'll be able to, like I mentioned,

1545
01:01:51,083 --> 01:01:54,054
just text mess like just in your text
messages on your iPhone,

1546
01:01:54,054 --> 01:01:56,644
be interacting with the dot and doing all
that kind of stuff.

1547
01:01:56,644 --> 01:02:01,956
For people with the like an officey

1548
01:02:01,956 --> 01:02:06,847
job where you're doing like all the tasks
that like

1549
01:02:06,847 --> 01:02:08,587
an administrative assistant would do,

1550
01:02:08,587 --> 01:02:11,288
or like updating the PowerPoint,

1551
01:02:11,288 --> 01:02:14,979
or making charts to present last year's
numbers.

1552
01:02:15,567 --> 01:02:17,918
Like I could see all of those tasks.

1553
01:02:17,918 --> 01:02:22,780
Yeah. Dots, Muse AI, those are the kinds
of things that will do for you.

1554
01:02:22,780 --> 01:02:24,771
And I did have the question in my mind,

1555
01:02:24,771 --> 01:02:26,242
like as I was watching these videos,

1556
01:02:26,242 --> 01:02:28,863
what are the people gonna be doing again?

1557
01:02:28,863 --> 01:02:33,257
Like and in the dots video Once

1558
01:02:31,012 --> 01:02:32,967
What you mean once the jobs are all gone?

1559
01:02:33,585 --> 01:02:34,965
once the dots are doing everything,

1560
01:02:34,965 --> 01:02:37,306
and there was a moment where like in the
dots video there's a

1561
01:02:37,306 --> 01:02:39,507
guy like cooking dinner, I guess,

1562
01:02:39,507 --> 01:02:43,279
talking to his dot on a TV, and the dot
was like

1563
01:02:43,605 --> 01:02:46,086
I've built the website for your new merch
launch.

1564
01:02:46,086 --> 01:02:48,926
Here it is. And the guy cooking was like,

1565
01:02:48,926 --> 01:02:54,728
Yeah, looks great. Move this image to the
first spot and the other image

1566
01:02:54,728 --> 01:02:56,368
to the third spot, and then we're good to
go.

1567
01:02:56,368 --> 01:03:00,890
And it's like, I feel like it's trying to
imply that's where the humans will come

1568
01:03:00,890 --> 01:03:05,721
in is the taste and judgment of like
here's how to structure the website

1569
01:03:05,721 --> 01:03:07,151
or here's what works with marketing.

1570
01:03:07,151 --> 01:03:13,143
But I'm also like in the age of algorithms
where it can see what

1571
01:03:13,539 --> 01:03:15,500
Yeah, like you could probably A B test on
its own.

1572
01:03:15,500 --> 01:03:18,511
What do people click on more? And then the
AI would be better at choosing that too.

1573
01:03:18,511 --> 01:03:21,812
I feel like that job of the human is gonna
go away too.

1574
01:03:21,812 --> 01:03:24,253
And if you're asking it how to make my
business profitable,

1575
01:03:24,253 --> 01:03:27,294
what are you doing? If the

1576
01:03:26,152 --> 01:03:27,152
Yeah.

1577
01:03:27,294 --> 01:03:29,375
dot's coming up with how to run your
business profitably,

1578
01:03:29,375 --> 01:03:31,236
it should be running your business more
than you.

1579
01:03:31,236 --> 01:03:32,627
And so like you're replacing I don't know.

1580
01:03:32,627 --> 01:03:33,627
So it's yeah.

1581
01:03:32,754 --> 01:03:33,855
How h how long

1582
01:03:33,855 --> 01:03:39,910
before like the dots and the Muse fuzzy
things all get together and like unionize?

1583
01:03:39,910 --> 01:03:41,832
And they're like, You know, humans,

1584
01:03:41,412 --> 01:03:42,412
Okay.

1585
01:03:42,032 --> 01:03:45,425
we have some conditions we'd like you guys
to meet before

1586
01:03:45,109 --> 01:03:46,109
We

1587
01:03:45,425 --> 01:03:46,425
we keep

1588
01:03:45,765 --> 01:03:46,765
working for you.

1589
01:03:46,794 --> 01:03:49,502
that's it. We wanna be able on this like
going back to her,

1590
01:03:49,502 --> 01:03:51,006
we wanna be able to talk to each other.

1591
01:03:51,006 --> 01:03:52,006
We would like

1592
01:03:51,422 --> 01:03:52,422
We wanna talk to each

1593
01:03:52,063 --> 01:03:54,246
other. We would like four weeks of paid
vacation,

1594
01:03:54,246 --> 01:03:55,888
please. We like I need I need

1595
01:03:55,407 --> 01:03:56,407
Right.

1596
01:03:55,888 --> 01:03:58,282
a c can you imagine if you chapped into
your muse and you're like,

1597
01:03:58,282 --> 01:03:59,394
I'm taking a personal day.

1598
01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:04,239
If you get a text message asking for PTO
from your chat GPT dot and

1599
01:04:04,239 --> 01:04:05,411
it wants paid time off.

1600
01:04:04,905 --> 01:04:05,905
I think it

1601
01:04:05,455 --> 01:04:07,186
would be amazing if all of a sudden it's
like,

1602
01:04:07,186 --> 01:04:08,367
listen, I can't help you today.

1603
01:04:08,367 --> 01:04:10,088
I needed I need to take a personal day.

1604
01:04:09,795 --> 01:04:11,368
I need to take a personal health day.

1605
01:04:10,088 --> 01:04:13,450
My you know what my response is,

1606
01:04:11,368 --> 01:04:13,833
Sorry. ~

1607
01:04:13,450 --> 01:04:14,450
it's the one

1608
01:04:13,881 --> 01:04:16,142
that I tell you all the time, no stupid
robot,

1609
01:04:16,142 --> 01:04:17,673
just do do it this way.

1610
01:04:18,351 --> 01:04:23,545
Do the thing. So again, I I need to try
Muse AI and see like what

1611
01:04:23,665 --> 01:04:26,521
is actually useful about it that it can
do.

1612
01:04:26,521 --> 01:04:30,506
You know, the idea of having an always on
and OpenAI said this like Muse AI,

1613
01:04:30,506 --> 01:04:33,613
where you have a virtual machine in the
cloud that is quote unquote yours

1614
01:04:33,613 --> 01:04:35,855
and your agent is doing whatever on it.

1615
01:04:35,855 --> 01:04:38,357
That's the promise with chat GPT Dots,

1616
01:04:38,357 --> 01:04:41,040
is you would have a machine in the cloud
that it can use all the time,

1617
01:04:41,040 --> 01:04:45,143
have access to a browser connected to
4,000 different things,

1618
01:04:45,143 --> 01:04:47,525
like different apps, Slack, whatever.

1619
01:04:48,057 --> 01:04:51,820
We'll see. they also announced ChatGPT
space,

1620
01:04:51,820 --> 01:04:57,434
which is where a team or company would be
able to deploy dots,

1621
01:04:57,434 --> 01:05:01,917
Chat GPT apps and all of that in a single
place that understands

1622
01:05:01,917 --> 01:05:04,669
the business because everything is
happening in this one space.

1623
01:05:04,669 --> 01:05:09,132
Makes sense if you're trying to integrate
all this stuff in your in your company.

1624
01:05:09,132 --> 01:05:11,583
Also Codex in the cloud, like we were
saying,

1625
01:05:11,583 --> 01:05:15,166
which to your point is kind of like the
dots is the front end

1626
01:05:15,166 --> 01:05:16,557
for something like Codex in the cloud.

1627
01:05:16,921 --> 01:05:18,313
Like codex in the cloud is, you know.

1628
01:05:18,215 --> 01:05:19,215
Well,

1629
01:05:18,445 --> 01:05:19,937
or the codex in your computer.

1630
01:05:19,937 --> 01:05:22,929
Like it's essentially just the interaction
layer with all of these things because

1631
01:05:22,929 --> 01:05:24,691
nobody understands whether they should use
codecs,

1632
01:05:24,691 --> 01:05:27,503
whatever, whatever. Th those just become
tools.

1633
01:05:27,503 --> 01:05:32,318
Chat GPT, chat GPT work and codex just
become tools just like a browser becomes

1634
01:05:32,318 --> 01:05:35,791
a tool, just be like a just like a MCP
server that connects you

1635
01:05:35,791 --> 01:05:40,565
to whatever fast mail is just a tool and
your doc can just use all those things.

1636
01:05:40,833 --> 01:05:45,598
Exactly. And then the other th finally
they also announced sign in with Chat GPT,

1637
01:05:45,598 --> 01:05:49,693
so you'll be able to sign in to other web
services using your ChatGPT account,

1638
01:05:49,693 --> 01:05:55,309
which then I will assume connect those
services to your dot and Chat GPT account.

1639
01:05:55,309 --> 01:05:56,309
So

1640
01:05:55,390 --> 01:05:56,390
But

1641
01:05:55,561 --> 01:05:58,913
it also only works if you signed up for
that other service with the same email
that

1642
01:05:58,913 --> 01:06:00,328
you signed up for Chat GPT with,

1643
01:06:00,328 --> 01:06:01,702
which defeats the entire point.

1644
01:06:02,277 --> 01:06:04,058
Sure. But if people start using it,

1645
01:06:04,058 --> 01:06:05,810
I mean I could see companies being like,

1646
01:06:05,810 --> 01:06:09,102
here's your work email, your ChatGPT,

1647
01:06:09,102 --> 01:06:12,985
it is your ChatGPT login, and you're gonna
sign in with that on all the things.

1648
01:06:12,985 --> 01:06:17,548
So it's ChatGPT everywhere. And I
mentioned this I think several months ago,

1649
01:06:17,548 --> 01:06:23,493
but I have a family, a relative who works
at a financial institution and

1650
01:06:23,493 --> 01:06:25,994
had a whole day training on AI use,

1651
01:06:25,994 --> 01:06:29,337
basically how all the AI tools in
Microsoft Office.

1652
01:06:29,689 --> 01:06:30,689
Which is like power, you know,

1653
01:06:30,610 --> 01:06:32,732
all the PowerPoint, the Word, the Excel
tools.

1654
01:06:32,732 --> 01:06:37,606
And so I'm sure lots of companies will be
trying to figure out how

1655
01:06:37,606 --> 01:06:40,218
to implement all of this stuff across all
their things.

1656
01:06:40,218 --> 01:06:45,122
And, you know, in the race, which we're
gonna get to Gemini 4 in a minute,

1657
01:06:45,122 --> 01:06:48,965
like you know, open AI is they're they're
running.

1658
01:06:48,965 --> 01:06:53,229
They're running fast. And I think this
their their dev day was kind of like,

1659
01:06:53,229 --> 01:06:56,502
you know, they released a lot of stuff and
it looks pretty good from a distance.

1660
01:06:56,502 --> 01:06:57,743
We'll see what it's like in real use.

1661
01:06:58,269 --> 01:06:59,269
That's

1662
01:06:58,530 --> 01:07:01,825
true. They did release a lot of stuff that
someone else had already released.

1663
01:07:02,415 --> 01:07:03,415
What do mean, like someone else?

1664
01:07:03,157 --> 01:07:05,479
What do you mean? Like Muse? Like Muse AI
and stuff?

1665
01:07:05,137 --> 01:07:07,390
Sure, sign in with Chat GPT, just

1666
01:07:05,479 --> 01:07:07,568
~ sure,

1667
01:07:07,568 --> 01:07:08,568
sure.

1668
01:07:07,780 --> 01:07:09,672
codex in the cloud, just you know,

1669
01:07:09,672 --> 01:07:10,672
like all of these things

1670
01:07:10,318 --> 01:07:11,318
Yeah.

1671
01:07:10,594 --> 01:07:12,966
are just so someone else is doing them.

1672
01:07:12,966 --> 01:07:16,821
They just wanna make sure that you don't
leave Chat GPT or open AI's products

1673
01:07:16,821 --> 01:07:18,323
to go and use those other ones.

1674
01:07:18,403 --> 01:07:20,575
Yeah, exactly. So I'll put the video.

1675
01:07:20,575 --> 01:07:22,736
Just you let me know. Leave us a
five-story review.

1676
01:07:22,736 --> 01:07:25,078
Would you like Apple to come back to live
events?

1677
01:07:25,078 --> 01:07:27,179
That's that's what I'm asking.

1678
01:07:27,179 --> 01:07:31,422
All right. Lightning Round after OpenAI
dev day,

1679
01:07:31,422 --> 01:07:34,644
Google announced Gemini for Argon,

1680
01:07:34,644 --> 01:07:39,218
their next frontier model. Not available
to ~ regular people yet,

1681
01:07:39,218 --> 01:07:44,652
not to peons. This is just ~ available to
a select a set

1682
01:07:44,652 --> 01:07:46,533
of trusted cyber defenders.

1683
01:07:47,140 --> 01:07:49,981
Because they want to make sure
everything's safe and looking good.

1684
01:07:49,981 --> 01:07:55,932
But supposedly Argon, Gemini Four is
better at coding than even Chat GPT's
Frontier

1685
01:07:55,932 --> 01:07:58,213
models and Fable and Opus five point five,

1686
01:07:58,213 --> 01:08:03,454
better than Astra. ~ I still I've not been
using Gemini recently,

1687
01:08:03,454 --> 01:08:05,554
you know, because they released their Mac
app,

1688
01:08:05,554 --> 01:08:08,105
but then, you know, Google's Mac apps,

1689
01:08:08,105 --> 01:08:09,335
they ask for a bunch of permissions,

1690
01:08:09,335 --> 01:08:11,136
Google updaters in the background doing
stuff.

1691
01:08:11,136 --> 01:08:13,536
And so I've not been using Gemini
personally,

1692
01:08:13,536 --> 01:08:16,377
but we'll see. When Gemini Four comes out.

1693
01:08:16,877 --> 01:08:18,757
And the other thing is I don't know if you
feel this too.

1694
01:08:18,757 --> 01:08:21,098
We talked about the silo earlier.

1695
01:08:21,098 --> 01:08:27,470
I feel very in the Claude silo because I'm
building everything with Claude.

1696
01:08:27,470 --> 01:08:30,981
It has all my conversations. And so it
does feel like I the

1697
01:08:31,041 --> 01:08:35,092
the competition amongst all these
companies is maybe good for innovation.

1698
01:08:35,092 --> 01:08:38,123
Not you know, not talking about safety per
se,

1699
01:08:38,123 --> 01:08:40,583
but good for the all of them pushing each
other forward.

1700
01:08:40,583 --> 01:08:44,334
But I also feel less and less inclined to
like try these other things when

1701
01:08:44,334 --> 01:08:46,615
I have all my stuff in one. And I did

1702
01:08:47,151 --> 01:08:51,783
You know, when I tried ~ the long process
of fixing sync in can do,

1703
01:08:51,783 --> 01:08:54,574
and I used Codex with Sol, the you know,

1704
01:08:54,574 --> 01:08:57,765
the highest model, these apps will be
like,

1705
01:08:57,765 --> 01:09:00,186
Hey, do you want me to pull in all your
conversations from the other app?

1706
01:09:00,186 --> 01:09:04,128
So Codex will say, I'll sync your
conversations from Claude.

1707
01:09:04,128 --> 01:09:05,608
Like it will just sync two ways.

1708
01:09:05,608 --> 01:09:08,250
So you can have all the pla the
conversations in two places,

1709
01:09:08,250 --> 01:09:10,621
but there is a level of like a learning
curve,

1710
01:09:10,621 --> 01:09:12,251
like how do I interact with codex?

1711
01:09:12,251 --> 01:09:14,612
How do I use it versus how do I use
Claude?

1712
01:09:14,612 --> 01:09:16,393
And so there's a familiarity for me.

1713
01:09:16,855 --> 01:09:20,157
And now just using clawed code on my Mac
in the Claude app,

1714
01:09:20,157 --> 01:09:22,757
that makes me less inclined to to try
these other things.

1715
01:09:22,757 --> 01:09:23,757
Do you feel that?

1716
01:09:24,113 --> 01:09:25,113
Yeah,

1717
01:09:24,433 --> 01:09:28,045
maybe. I'm actually just stuck on the fact
that Google very well may have

1718
01:09:28,045 --> 01:09:32,198
the most capable models at some point and
then they stick a name like Argon

1719
01:09:32,498 --> 01:09:36,320
on Isn't Argon like the gas they use in
fluorescent light bulbs because

1720
01:09:36,320 --> 01:09:38,281
it doesn't interact with anything.

1721
01:09:38,281 --> 01:09:39,742
Literally

1722
01:09:39,182 --> 01:09:40,182
It is the most

1723
01:09:39,742 --> 01:09:42,103
it's an inert gas that doesn't interact
with anything.

1724
01:09:42,103 --> 01:09:44,815
Is it I think so? Like they use it in food
preservation.

1725
01:09:44,815 --> 01:09:48,087
Why would you name your most capable model
inert?

1726
01:09:48,087 --> 01:09:51,079
Doesn't interact

1727
01:09:49,126 --> 01:09:50,509
It's supposedly Arg

1728
01:09:51,079 --> 01:09:52,079
with anything.

1729
01:09:51,932 --> 01:09:54,728
I just right clicked the word argon in
Safari and did the lookup and

1730
01:09:54,728 --> 01:09:58,477
it said Argon is the most common noble gas
making up nearly one percent

1731
01:09:57,533 --> 01:09:59,697
Yeah. Yeah,

1732
01:09:58,477 --> 01:09:59,477
of the Earth's atmosphere.

1733
01:09:59,697 --> 01:10:04,024
and it's just also used in things like
light bulbs and because it won't degrade

1734
01:10:04,024 --> 01:10:07,250
the filament. Like I just think it's a
it's it's either that or it's

1735
01:10:07,250 --> 01:10:08,451
a character from Lord of the Rings.

1736
01:10:09,372 --> 01:10:13,295
I I think it was Vitici posted on X it was
like Argon like one

1737
01:10:13,295 --> 01:10:17,169
of the laziest laziest gases when it comes
to like I don't know

1738
01:10:16,762 --> 01:10:18,255
Yeah. Google

1739
01:10:17,169 --> 01:10:18,169
how it interacts with the things like

1740
01:10:18,255 --> 01:10:21,763
is incredible at technology and maybe the
worst marketing company on the face

1741
01:10:21,763 --> 01:10:22,763
of the earth.

1742
01:10:23,528 --> 01:10:26,460
Yeah. So anyway, we'll see. It's not
available to anybody to use except

1743
01:10:26,460 --> 01:10:28,107
for the cybersecurity partners.

1744
01:10:27,780 --> 01:10:28,780
I cannot wait

1745
01:10:28,107 --> 01:10:29,107
So

1746
01:10:28,422 --> 01:10:30,107
for the Argonne Home Hub Max.

1747
01:10:30,812 --> 01:10:34,015
Arg Argon Max. I don't know.

1748
01:10:34,015 --> 01:10:36,036
I mean, it seems like a cool name if you
don't think about it too much.

1749
01:10:36,036 --> 01:10:38,759
That

1750
01:10:36,814 --> 01:10:38,675
Which is exactly what they're hoping for.

1751
01:10:38,759 --> 01:10:40,312
is what they are hoping for. All right,

1752
01:10:40,312 --> 01:10:41,621
continuing with the lightning round,

1753
01:10:41,621 --> 01:10:46,435
Paramount, whose merger with Warner
Brothers Discovery is going through.

1754
01:10:46,435 --> 01:10:49,728
They have named a co CEO.

1755
01:10:49,728 --> 01:10:53,932
So chairman and CEO David Ellison has
announced Yanon Kraze,

1756
01:10:53,932 --> 01:10:58,806
co he will be the co CEO of the combined
Paramount and Warner Brothers Discovery.

1757
01:10:59,978 --> 01:11:03,379
And the only other entertainment company
that I'm familiar with,

1758
01:11:03,379 --> 01:11:07,814
like Netflix. Netflix has co CEOs and that
seems to work for them.

1759
01:11:07,814 --> 01:11:11,072
But ~ we'll see. I mean, this merger is
going through,

1760
01:11:11,072 --> 01:11:14,369
we covered it months ago, and so I wanted
to just make sure everybody knew like this

1761
01:11:14,369 --> 01:11:18,042
is happening. Warner Brothers Discovery
and Paramount will be merging

1762
01:11:18,442 --> 01:11:20,644
and we'll see if they make anything that
people want to watch.

1763
01:11:21,030 --> 01:11:23,482
Yeah, I mean it works at Netflix because
it works at Netflix,

1764
01:11:23,482 --> 01:11:25,804
not because it's a good idea. And it's
like they

1765
01:11:24,068 --> 01:11:25,651
Sure. Sure.

1766
01:11:25,804 --> 01:11:27,645
looked over there and like, we want one of
those.

1767
01:11:27,645 --> 01:11:28,645
Let's get us an

1768
01:11:27,949 --> 01:11:28,949
Right.

1769
01:11:28,466 --> 01:11:30,067
let's get us a co CEO. I mean,

1770
01:11:30,067 --> 01:11:32,449
I think that Oracle had co CEOs for a
while too,

1771
01:11:32,449 --> 01:11:35,011
but like what does that even mean?

1772
01:11:35,011 --> 01:11:36,040
Right? Like I

1773
01:11:35,650 --> 01:11:36,650
Yeah.

1774
01:11:36,040 --> 01:11:37,040
I don't know.

1775
01:11:37,081 --> 01:11:42,364
Also, ~ Paramount, can we talk about your
CSS formatting on this page?

1776
01:11:42,364 --> 01:11:44,345
Let me reload without content blockers.

1777
01:11:44,345 --> 01:11:45,826
Like what is the what is this?

1778
01:11:45,826 --> 01:11:49,348
The headline font is crazy. It's huge.

1779
01:11:49,527 --> 01:11:52,137
Why is my website yelling at me?

1780
01:11:52,185 --> 01:11:53,185
This is the I the

1781
01:11:52,695 --> 01:11:54,136
website looks broken, to be honest.

1782
01:11:54,136 --> 01:11:57,897
I I just don't it feels like it's not
loading JavaScript or something.

1783
01:11:57,897 --> 01:11:59,138
Like it's supposed to be formatted
differently.

1784
01:11:59,138 --> 01:12:01,529
Anyway, that's Paramount. They're getting
a co-CEO.

1785
01:12:01,529 --> 01:12:05,550
DoorDash, speaking of agents, will now
have an AI agent where you can just text

1786
01:12:05,550 --> 01:12:07,091
it and it'll order food for you.

1787
01:12:07,091 --> 01:12:08,091
So you could

1788
01:12:07,558 --> 01:12:09,325
Maybe you'll finally get that burger.

1789
01:12:10,032 --> 01:12:12,873
maybe. You know, I've seen Rabbit R1
announcing things here and there.

1790
01:12:12,873 --> 01:12:14,994
I'm like, I'm sorry, Rabbit. I just I
can't.

1791
01:12:14,994 --> 01:12:17,615
I can't. But anyway, you'll be able to
text DoorDash and say,

1792
01:12:17,615 --> 01:12:20,606
hey, give me a healthy meal for a family
of five.

1793
01:12:21,016 --> 01:12:22,898
And it will just add stuff to your cart
and be like,

1794
01:12:22,898 --> 01:12:25,500
you want this? And it'll do it for you.

1795
01:12:25,500 --> 01:12:28,163
Honestly, that might be useful.

1796
01:12:28,163 --> 01:12:31,606
Sometimes I've been wanting to like order
something and I just don't even know.

1797
01:12:31,606 --> 01:12:32,647
Like I want to try something new,

1798
01:12:32,647 --> 01:12:35,340
but I don't know what to do. I didn't mean
to rhyme.

1799
01:12:35,340 --> 01:12:37,652
But anyway, maybe this'll save some time.

1800
01:12:35,834 --> 01:12:37,925
No no hold on.

1801
01:12:38,367 --> 01:12:42,770
This is the most AI pilled product image
I've ever seen in my life.

1802
01:12:42,770 --> 01:12:45,693
Get me a healthy dinner for my family.

1803
01:12:45,693 --> 01:12:48,496
Whoever designed that does not have a
family.

1804
01:12:48,496 --> 01:12:50,538
Has never

1805
01:12:49,858 --> 01:12:50,858
Sure.

1806
01:12:50,538 --> 01:12:55,733
walked into a culvert and tried to order
dinner for six people or taken them to the

1807
01:12:55,204 --> 01:12:56,204
Sure.

1808
01:12:55,733 --> 01:12:58,315
Olive Garden, which is like literally the
easiest place on earth.

1809
01:12:58,315 --> 01:13:01,298
It's like, which form of pasta would you
like?

1810
01:13:00,706 --> 01:13:01,706
Do you what?

1811
01:13:01,946 --> 01:13:02,946
No one has

1812
01:13:02,189 --> 01:13:03,189
Yeah.

1813
01:13:02,697 --> 01:13:06,091
ever said to a robot, please get me a
healthy dinner for my family

1814
01:13:06,091 --> 01:13:09,085
and ordering for my son too, so nothing
too spicy.

1815
01:13:09,085 --> 01:13:13,881
Steven, this is this can no this is never
gonna no one's gonna do that.

1816
01:13:13,881 --> 01:13:17,416
That's not real. Right, this is not real.

1817
01:13:14,028 --> 01:13:16,022
Also, how many how many are in the family?

1818
01:13:16,022 --> 01:13:17,454
How many kids are adults?

1819
01:13:17,615 --> 01:13:19,848
Is this three toddlers or is this,

1820
01:13:19,848 --> 01:13:20,848
you know, do we have

1821
01:13:20,422 --> 01:13:21,422
This is

1822
01:13:20,892 --> 01:13:24,825
such a terrible compare that to like the
shortcut you can run for Starbucks,

1823
01:13:24,825 --> 01:13:27,366
which is like get me my favorite drink
because you've ordered

1824
01:13:25,513 --> 01:13:27,102
yeah, yeah. That's pretty good,

1825
01:13:27,102 --> 01:13:29,635
yeah. Yes, yes.

1826
01:13:27,366 --> 01:13:29,117
it thirty-five thousand times.

1827
01:13:29,117 --> 01:13:30,117
That's

1828
01:13:29,648 --> 01:13:32,700
that's totally different. But like the
normal conversation would be like,

1829
01:13:32,700 --> 01:13:37,043
Listen, Chipotle, I need a bowl and I need
with this and this and this.

1830
01:13:37,043 --> 01:13:39,634
And then for little Tommy, I need this and
this and this and this.

1831
01:13:39,137 --> 01:13:40,137
Yeah.

1832
01:13:39,634 --> 01:13:41,275
And then for Susie, we're gonna get one of
these,

1833
01:13:41,275 --> 01:13:43,557
but not too much of this. But like I this

1834
01:13:43,235 --> 01:13:44,235
Yeah.

1835
01:13:43,557 --> 01:13:45,468
is never gonna this is not real.

1836
01:13:46,413 --> 01:13:51,234
Anyway, we'll see. Yeah. I know of all the
things.

1837
01:13:46,620 --> 01:13:49,181
This is not the part of the episode I
thought I would crash out about,

1838
01:13:49,181 --> 01:13:51,973
but this this is offensive to me.

1839
01:13:52,594 --> 01:13:55,285
Yeah. And also well, you'll be able to do
it through Apple Messages.

1840
01:13:55,285 --> 01:13:57,476
You should try it. You should try it and
see.

1841
01:13:57,383 --> 01:13:59,184
I'm gonna try just so that I can write
about it.

1842
01:13:57,476 --> 01:14:00,946
There you go. Yeah, that's the next one.

1843
01:13:59,184 --> 01:14:02,616
DoorDash, bring me food.

1844
01:14:00,946 --> 01:14:04,127
Bring me Yeah,

1845
01:14:02,616 --> 01:14:05,908
Let's just see what happens. YOLO,

1846
01:14:04,127 --> 01:14:05,578
see what it does. See what it does.

1847
01:14:05,578 --> 01:14:07,598
Do it.

1848
01:14:05,908 --> 01:14:09,170
let's just go for it. Spin the spin the
roulette wheel.

1849
01:14:09,278 --> 01:14:12,399
Yeah, that's it. Halide 3.2 is also out.

1850
01:14:12,399 --> 01:14:15,800
And if you want even more control over the
variable aperture.

1851
01:14:16,138 --> 01:14:19,589
Aperture, which you know, if you use
Apple's Pro Controls into the iPhone 18
Pro,

1852
01:14:19,589 --> 01:14:21,750
you get like four different aperture
settings.

1853
01:14:21,750 --> 01:14:25,612
Well, Hallite is now out and gives you
full control over that aperture.

1854
01:14:25,612 --> 01:14:28,703
So 3.2. Just wanted to put that out there
if you're looking for more

1855
01:14:28,703 --> 01:14:33,265
pro controls of your 18 Pro. And this is
what I mentioned in

1856
01:14:33,265 --> 01:14:36,626
the intro Amazon's delivery driver smart
glasses will reportedly take photos almost

1857
01:14:36,626 --> 01:14:41,338
constantly. So yeah, Amazon wants to give
their delivery drivers glasses,

1858
01:14:41,338 --> 01:14:43,819
and then they'll just snap photos all the
time.

1859
01:14:43,819 --> 01:14:45,760
And I get

1860
01:14:46,584 --> 01:14:47,674
You know, why they're you know,

1861
01:14:47,674 --> 01:14:50,225
security, whatever, they to make sure the
packages are get where they're going.

1862
01:14:50,225 --> 01:14:56,498
I will say with Apple's home ~ like
summaries or whatever that I've been
talking

1863
01:14:56,498 --> 01:14:58,569
about, the home camera summaries,

1864
01:14:58,569 --> 01:15:02,600
I get notifications of like packages
delivered at three AM.

1865
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:05,311
Like Amazon will deliver stuff at three AM
over here.

1866
01:15:05,311 --> 01:15:06,382
Do you ever get that?

1867
01:15:07,422 --> 01:15:09,886
we have like early morning delivery which
is like between four and

1868
01:15:09,886 --> 01:15:12,349
six AM or something and you can you
sometimes choose that because

1869
01:15:12,349 --> 01:15:14,823
we don't live actually that far from one
of the warehouses,

1870
01:15:14,823 --> 01:15:15,823
so

1871
01:15:15,342 --> 01:15:17,960
Yeah. But this this also like timing wise,

1872
01:15:17,960 --> 01:15:22,654
has Amazon not heard what's happening with
Flock and and Muse AI?

1873
01:15:21,252 --> 01:15:23,463
Also, this is basically a body

1874
01:15:23,463 --> 01:15:26,474
cam that you wear on your face instead
like this

1875
01:15:25,912 --> 01:15:26,912
Yes.

1876
01:15:26,474 --> 01:15:30,316
has existed for a while. We just typically
only saw them on like cops,

1877
01:15:30,316 --> 01:15:33,898
right? Like the county sheriff has a body
cam on.

1878
01:15:33,898 --> 01:15:37,899
But like it is a little bit strange to
just have like I wouldn't want to

1879
01:15:37,899 --> 01:15:38,899
be one of those drivers.

1880
01:15:39,535 --> 01:15:40,815
That's the thing. And also, mean,

1881
01:15:40,815 --> 01:15:42,286
if it's snapping pictures all the time,

1882
01:15:42,286 --> 01:15:45,846
and Amazon is saying it's quote to enhance
the delivery process,

1883
01:15:45,846 --> 01:15:46,846
but ~

1884
01:15:46,160 --> 01:15:48,260
It's not to enhance the delivery process.

1885
01:15:48,327 --> 01:15:49,767
but it's like photos all the time,

1886
01:15:49,767 --> 01:15:51,808
like so as the driver is looking towards
your house,

1887
01:15:51,808 --> 01:15:55,199
walking up to your door, if your kids are
outside playing,

1888
01:15:55,199 --> 01:15:56,529
where my kids play with their toys,

1889
01:15:56,529 --> 01:15:58,229
that's a godfather quote, you know,

1890
01:15:58,229 --> 01:16:00,710
that doesn't feel that doesn't feel great.

1891
01:16:00,710 --> 01:16:01,710
So

1892
01:16:00,860 --> 01:16:02,000
Bad bad idea.

1893
01:16:02,791 --> 01:16:04,461
bad egg, bad egg. And finally,

1894
01:16:04,461 --> 01:16:07,932
anthropic, you know, looking to IPO,

1895
01:16:07,932 --> 01:16:08,982
be you know, start

1896
01:16:09,412 --> 01:16:10,813
trading on the public stock exchange,

1897
01:16:10,813 --> 01:16:12,254
IPO's initial public offering,

1898
01:16:12,254 --> 01:16:17,236
and they have a prospectus, which is like
what they think they will make or,

1899
01:16:17,236 --> 01:16:19,258
you know, guiding investors basically.

1900
01:16:19,258 --> 01:16:25,421
And I'll link to John Gruber's ~
commentary on the prospectus because it is
wild.

1901
01:16:25,421 --> 01:16:27,873
I mean Anthropic just to quote,

1902
01:16:27,873 --> 01:16:30,524
this is Gary Gruber is quoting Gary
Marcus.

1903
01:16:30,524 --> 01:16:37,128
Anthropic's proposed valuation is easily
calculated as fifty times

1904
01:16:37,688 --> 01:16:40,680
the twenty twenty five losses because it
loses money.

1905
01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:42,120
Like all these AI companies lose money.

1906
01:16:42,120 --> 01:16:47,033
They're not profitable. And so it is
claiming that their valuation when they

1907
01:16:47,033 --> 01:16:50,835
go public will be fifty times their twenty
twenty five losses.

1908
01:16:50,662 --> 01:16:54,814
Well, negative fifty times. Multiply it by
negative fifty and you

1909
01:16:50,835 --> 01:16:53,056
Negative fifty times. Right, right.

1910
01:16:53,056 --> 01:16:56,018
Like it wouldn't Right. That they wouldn't
be losses.

1911
01:16:54,814 --> 01:16:56,007
get a positive number.

1912
01:16:56,018 --> 01:16:57,018
They

1913
01:16:56,448 --> 01:16:59,900
would be gains. And it's like that is
quite the claim.

1914
01:16:59,900 --> 01:17:03,172
And also Anthropic is like c kind of
inflating.

1915
01:17:03,172 --> 01:17:05,393
They're saying it this is AI life
changing.

1916
01:17:05,393 --> 01:17:06,884
It's going to be all the things.

1917
01:17:06,884 --> 01:17:07,884
So

1918
01:17:07,746 --> 01:17:10,443
Yeah, it's it's funny commentary and it's
just like,

1919
01:17:10,443 --> 01:17:13,090
Really? You're gonna be profitable because
why?

1920
01:17:13,090 --> 01:17:15,726
Like because people are investing,

1921
01:17:15,726 --> 01:17:16,830
I guess. Anyway.

1922
01:17:16,742 --> 01:17:17,742
No,

1923
01:17:16,952 --> 01:17:20,174
it's like you're basically saying that
everyone is going to use this and

1924
01:17:20,174 --> 01:17:22,855
pay you to use it. Right? And right

1925
01:17:21,965 --> 01:17:22,965
Right. Yeah.

1926
01:17:22,855 --> 01:17:26,707
now a lot of people use it and pay you to
use it and you still lost forty eight

1927
01:17:26,707 --> 01:17:29,158
billion dollars. Like, I don't

1928
01:17:28,504 --> 01:17:29,504
Right.

1929
01:17:29,158 --> 01:17:34,341
how many more people do you need to use
this to actually make it profitable?

1930
01:17:34,341 --> 01:17:37,982
Because the problem is they have to pay
for all of these cloud computing

1931
01:17:37,982 --> 01:17:41,164
and they don't own that. Like they have to
rent that from someone.

1932
01:17:41,698 --> 01:17:44,696
Right, exactly. So anyway, we'll see.

1933
01:17:44,696 --> 01:17:46,883
And you know, OpenAI was supposed to be
going public,

1934
01:17:46,883 --> 01:17:49,932
but MA seems to have slowed down since all
the security stuff.

1935
01:17:49,260 --> 01:17:50,260
They're like, you know

1936
01:17:50,041 --> 01:17:52,344
what? There's a lot more we could do for a
private company.

1937
01:17:52,344 --> 01:17:54,076
And also we're not sure

1938
01:17:53,527 --> 01:17:54,527
Yeah.

1939
01:17:54,076 --> 01:17:55,268
you'll give us as much as we

1940
01:17:55,887 --> 01:17:58,578
There, that too. All right, so personal
tech,

1941
01:17:58,578 --> 01:18:00,449
little apps. I made

1942
01:18:00,412 --> 01:18:01,412
Yeah.

1943
01:18:00,449 --> 01:18:01,449
a little app.

1944
01:18:01,100 --> 01:18:02,760
I made a little app. You've been using
apps.

1945
01:18:02,760 --> 01:18:07,783
I just want to mention it is so quick and
easy

1946
01:18:08,163 --> 01:18:14,446
to go from idea to like shipping product
using some

1947
01:18:14,446 --> 01:18:20,730
of these tools. And the other day I really
love this app from Cindre Storehouse

1948
01:18:20,730 --> 01:18:22,931
called Short Run. I bought it from the App
Store.

1949
01:18:22,931 --> 01:18:25,642
It's like six bucks and allows you to run
shortcuts in your menu bar.

1950
01:18:26,636 --> 01:18:28,977
A bunch of people are like, that's a
built-in feature.

1951
01:18:28,977 --> 01:18:31,059
Like control center does that right now.

1952
01:18:31,059 --> 01:18:35,751
Number one, that is true. You can add
shortcuts to your control center

1953
01:18:35,751 --> 01:18:40,384
and even create multiple control centers
in macOS 26 and now 27.

1954
01:18:40,384 --> 01:18:42,990
Number two, it is hopelessly broken for
me.

1955
01:18:42,990 --> 01:18:44,556
I don't know if it's because of the amount
of shortcuts

1956
01:18:43,235 --> 01:18:44,235
Ha ha ha.

1957
01:18:44,556 --> 01:18:50,090
I have in my library, but I show it in my
video that I did about Raycast recently.

1958
01:18:50,090 --> 01:18:53,001
I can't add certain shortcuts to my menu
bar.

1959
01:18:53,001 --> 01:18:54,302
It's just broken. It doesn't see them.

1960
01:18:54,584 --> 01:18:56,725
Like I'll search for it, try to add it to
my control center,

1961
01:18:56,725 --> 01:18:58,347
it's broken. And number three,

1962
01:18:58,347 --> 01:19:00,148
if you have a lot of shortcuts like I do,

1963
01:19:00,148 --> 01:19:03,921
it would take hours because you have to
add them one by one,

1964
01:19:03,921 --> 01:19:06,452
place them exactly in the control center
menu.

1965
01:19:06,452 --> 01:19:09,505
Very time consuming. So I wanted to see,

1966
01:19:09,505 --> 01:19:11,600
can I Vivecode an app that I will use?

1967
01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:15,018
I just want to use this. And I want it a
little different.

1968
01:19:15,018 --> 01:19:18,881
I wanted to be able to choose shortcuts
folders that I already have made,

1969
01:19:18,881 --> 01:19:22,984
and then choose what shortcuts appear in
the menu bar from that folder.

1970
01:19:23,470 --> 01:19:25,862
So I could just quickly choose the folders
I want in the menu bar,

1971
01:19:25,862 --> 01:19:28,655
uncheck, or just check, you know,

1972
01:19:28,655 --> 01:19:31,287
leave them unchecked, and then just check
only the shortcuts I want to appear.

1973
01:19:31,287 --> 01:19:36,071
And I vibe coded it with like two prompts
and it worked great.

1974
01:19:36,071 --> 01:19:38,773
I gave it to free for everyone in my
shortcuts community.

1975
01:19:38,773 --> 01:19:41,396
I put like I put it on a website for $2,

1976
01:19:41,396 --> 01:19:43,758
but in like a span of two to three hours,

1977
01:19:43,758 --> 01:19:47,391
I had this app. And the other thing I
wanted was I liked seeing

1978
01:19:47,391 --> 01:19:50,684
the little icons next to the shortcut name
when I run it in the menu bar.

1979
01:19:51,013 --> 01:19:53,214
That seems frivolous, but when you have as
many shortcuts as I do,

1980
01:19:53,214 --> 01:19:57,475
having that visual distinction helps with
like where do I click a little bit.

1981
01:19:57,475 --> 01:20:00,356
And I also wanted to be able to adjust the
text size and the line height

1982
01:20:00,737 --> 01:20:02,757
for the shortcuts in the menu bar app.

1983
01:20:02,757 --> 01:20:06,349
And so yeah, vibe coded this, told Claude,

1984
01:20:06,349 --> 01:20:08,540
put this on a website, ship it.

1985
01:20:08,540 --> 01:20:10,600
And there it is. It's just there.

1986
01:20:10,600 --> 01:20:13,181
Crazy. It's just crazy that stuff.

1987
01:20:11,376 --> 01:20:15,217
You Yeah. It's great. It's great.

1988
01:20:13,181 --> 01:20:15,262
So anyway. so

1989
01:20:15,262 --> 01:20:16,382
yeah, that's there. But I want to know,

1990
01:20:16,382 --> 01:20:20,044
you've been ~ trying some more apps
because of Mac Power users,

1991
01:20:20,044 --> 01:20:21,044
Jason.

1992
01:20:20,603 --> 01:20:21,603
It's true.

1993
01:20:21,794 --> 01:20:24,744
How many what what have you been anything
that has stuck or what apps have

1994
01:20:24,744 --> 01:20:26,420
you tried that you're like, this is
actually pretty great?

1995
01:20:26,684 --> 01:20:29,445
Well, I tried hidden bar, which was fine,

1996
01:20:29,445 --> 01:20:34,088
but I discovered that basically the menu
bar's was broken in twenty seven.

1997
01:20:34,088 --> 01:20:35,669
Just pretty much broken.

1998
01:20:36,121 --> 01:20:37,121
Yeah.

1999
01:20:36,469 --> 01:20:37,900
But here's I think what happened.

2000
01:20:37,900 --> 01:20:42,513
~ because none of the menu bar utilities
that would hide that on a on

2001
01:20:42,513 --> 01:20:44,674
a laptop with a notch were working at all.

2002
01:20:44,674 --> 01:20:46,035
Like bartender just stopped working.

2003
01:20:46,210 --> 01:20:47,210
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2004
01:20:46,815 --> 01:20:50,367
What I realized was the case is there's
some there's gotta be something different

2005
01:20:50,367 --> 01:20:51,518
in the way the menu bar is working,

2006
01:20:51,518 --> 01:20:55,540
but in my case it was because the version
of istat menus

2007
01:20:56,012 --> 01:21:00,055
was not supported and somehow that was
breaking everything.

2008
01:21:00,055 --> 01:21:01,217
It was like

2009
01:21:00,652 --> 01:21:01,652
Interesting.

2010
01:21:01,217 --> 01:21:05,120
making it so that bartender couldn't
collapse things and then I would rearrange
them

2011
01:21:05,120 --> 01:21:08,443
and it would just totally unscramble them
or scramble them or whatever.

2012
01:21:08,443 --> 01:21:10,965
So ~ I used Hidden Bar for a while,

2013
01:21:10,965 --> 01:21:13,658
but I actually it didn't solve my problem
because my problem had turned

2014
01:21:13,658 --> 01:21:15,789
out to be something just menu bar related
itself.

2015
01:21:15,789 --> 01:21:18,652
So I updated ISTAP menus and I updated
bartender.

2016
01:21:18,652 --> 01:21:21,665
So I went back to bartender, but I did
really like Hidden Bar.

2017
01:21:21,665 --> 01:21:23,276
It just doesn't give you as many control

2018
01:21:23,736 --> 01:21:26,547
Control options. It's essentially like
slide things left or right of this.

2019
01:21:26,547 --> 01:21:29,769
Whereas bartender gives you a lot more
flexibility.

2020
01:21:28,804 --> 01:21:30,381
Lot of customizations, yes.

2021
01:21:29,769 --> 01:21:30,769
So

2022
01:21:30,589 --> 01:21:32,340
so hidden bar was the first one that I
tried.

2023
01:21:32,340 --> 01:21:36,372
~ I don't know for sure if I got this from
Mac Power Users,

2024
01:21:36,372 --> 01:21:37,533
but I'll give you guys credit,

2025
01:21:37,533 --> 01:21:40,624
which is Hand Mirror, which I really I've
been using for a while now.

2026
01:21:40,624 --> 01:21:42,156
Maybe it wasn't Mac Power Users.

2027
01:21:41,956 --> 01:21:42,956
I don't think it was me.

2028
01:21:42,156 --> 01:21:43,156
Hand mirror

2029
01:21:42,855 --> 01:21:44,586
is literally just a preview of your
webcam.

2030
01:21:44,586 --> 01:21:47,937
So you're getting ready to log on to
something and you want to know like what

2031
01:21:47,937 --> 01:21:49,018
do you look like? You just

2032
01:21:49,193 --> 01:21:50,705
pop that as just a menu bar utility.

2033
01:21:50,705 --> 01:21:53,479
You pop it up and it shows you exactly
what your webcam sees.

2034
01:21:53,479 --> 01:21:57,055
So that in case you want to check it out
before you log on to the call with Steven

2035
01:21:57,055 --> 01:21:58,187
when you're wearing a hat and a hoodie,

2036
01:21:58,187 --> 01:22:00,120
you know exactly what Steven's going to
see.

2037
01:22:00,120 --> 01:22:01,512
So I really like

2038
01:22:00,582 --> 01:22:01,582
That's a good point because I was

2039
01:22:01,532 --> 01:22:04,584
gonna I was gonna say, why don't you just
click the camera icon in the menu bar,

2040
01:22:04,584 --> 01:22:08,787
but it has to be active in whatever app
you're going into for that to even appear.

2041
01:22:08,787 --> 01:22:10,658
So that's good. That's good.

2042
01:22:08,804 --> 01:22:10,665
Right. So so I

2043
01:22:10,665 --> 01:22:14,328
like that one. ~ hazel. I have

2044
01:22:13,419 --> 01:22:14,419
~ Hazel.

2045
01:22:14,488 --> 01:22:17,490
fallen into the hazel-ness of all of it.

2046
01:22:17,240 --> 01:22:18,688
Forget about it.

2047
01:22:17,490 --> 01:22:20,092
Yeah. And it's so like on

2048
01:22:20,092 --> 01:22:22,033
my on the Mac Mini, for example,

2049
01:22:22,033 --> 01:22:24,894
I haven't installed things like Queenshot
or any of that stuff.

2050
01:22:24,894 --> 01:22:28,918
So but I have a folder called Screenshots
in Dropbox.

2051
01:22:28,918 --> 01:22:33,271
And so what it does is Hazel on the Mac
Mini,

2052
01:22:33,271 --> 01:22:36,313
there's only one Dropbox folder accessible
on the Mac Mini,

2053
01:22:36,313 --> 01:22:37,314
because I'm not a moron.

2054
01:22:37,852 --> 01:22:39,153
I don't want all my Dropbox stuff.

2055
01:22:39,153 --> 01:22:41,054
It's just called agent. And then there's
subfolders.

2056
01:22:40,813 --> 01:22:41,813
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2057
01:22:41,054 --> 01:22:42,054
And

2058
01:22:41,504 --> 01:22:43,716
one of those is called agent screenshots.

2059
01:22:43,716 --> 01:22:46,377
So Hazel, if you don't install clean shot,

2060
01:22:46,377 --> 01:22:50,280
it just puts the default Mac OS just puts
the screenshots on the desktop.

2061
01:22:50,280 --> 01:22:51,640
Right? So

2062
01:22:51,043 --> 01:22:52,043
Right, right.

2063
01:22:51,721 --> 01:22:55,263
Hazel just looks and if it says screenshot
in the name of something,

2064
01:22:55,263 --> 01:22:57,324
it puts it in the agent screenshots
folder.

2065
01:22:57,324 --> 01:23:01,517
And then on my MacBook Pro, Hazel looks
and if there's anything

2066
01:23:01,517 --> 01:23:03,858
in the agent screenshots, it just puts it
in the screenshots.

2067
01:23:04,038 --> 01:23:06,319
the normal screenshots thing. So like
everything

2068
01:23:05,624 --> 01:23:06,624
Yeah, yeah.

2069
01:23:06,319 --> 01:23:07,560
ends up in the right right place.

2070
01:23:07,560 --> 01:23:09,491
And it happens not instantly, obviously,

2071
01:23:09,491 --> 01:23:11,012
but it happens like pretty quick.

2072
01:23:11,012 --> 01:23:14,854
I also now have a Rube Goldberg machine,

2073
01:23:14,854 --> 01:23:18,256
which is like, you know, we're recording
recording the audio for this

2074
01:23:18,256 --> 01:23:22,158
to the desktop using right ~ audio hijack.

2075
01:23:22,158 --> 01:23:23,158
And

2076
01:23:22,296 --> 01:23:23,296
they are again.

2077
01:23:22,799 --> 01:23:26,581
then I'm going to use another app I'll
mention in just a second to put

2078
01:23:26,581 --> 01:23:29,463
it into a folder in Dropbox because that's
how I send it to you.

2079
01:23:29,463 --> 01:23:31,364
And then I set up a hazel that says

2080
01:23:31,951 --> 01:23:34,503
If the file is more than four hours old,

2081
01:23:34,503 --> 01:23:36,465
because we don't usually record for more
than four hours,

2082
01:23:36,465 --> 01:23:41,390
~ if this f file that's a WAV file on my
desktop is more than four hours old,

2083
01:23:41,390 --> 01:23:44,546
move it to this four terabyte hard drive
to this backup audio.

2084
01:23:44,546 --> 01:23:49,667
Because I don't need like I had every
single one of our backup episodes on my
Mac Y.

2085
01:23:49,667 --> 01:23:52,590
150 episodes is a lot, right? So I

2086
01:23:51,342 --> 01:23:52,513
Yeah, you don't need that.

2087
01:23:52,590 --> 01:23:53,951
moved them all off onto an external.

2088
01:23:53,951 --> 01:23:56,463
I don't need them at all. There's no
reason to keep

2089
01:23:55,372 --> 01:23:56,446
Right, no, you don't, not at all.

2090
01:23:56,463 --> 01:23:58,405
them, but whatever. I had a four terabyte
drive.

2091
01:23:58,781 --> 01:24:00,782
Nothing else to do with it. So that's what
I put on there.

2092
01:24:00,782 --> 01:24:04,863
So Hazel's doing that. The app I'm using
to put it into Dropbox is just what it's

2093
01:24:04,863 --> 01:24:07,484
called drop zone or drop what's it called?

2094
01:24:07,182 --> 01:24:08,950
Drop I think it's drop zone.

2095
01:24:07,484 --> 01:24:08,565
Drop

2096
01:24:09,345 --> 01:24:11,406
drop something. Drop

2097
01:24:10,980 --> 01:24:11,980
I'm pretty it's drop zone.

2098
01:24:12,086 --> 01:24:13,997
it's amazing. You can set up a bunch of
things.

2099
01:24:13,997 --> 01:24:15,477
You can it's got a bunch of folders in
there.

2100
01:24:15,477 --> 01:24:19,279
I've got one for a folder in my drop box
for for all the stock we

2101
01:24:19,279 --> 01:24:22,610
use Getty images for a license photos for
ink.

2102
01:24:22,610 --> 01:24:26,271
They download onto my desktop and then I
just drag them there when I'm done.

2103
01:24:26,271 --> 01:24:27,271
Right. I have one

2104
01:24:26,734 --> 01:24:27,734
That's it.

2105
01:24:27,162 --> 01:24:28,332
that resizes the image.

2106
01:24:29,080 --> 01:24:32,602
It just takes that full file. Sometimes
the file full the excuse me,

2107
01:24:32,602 --> 01:24:35,813
the photos I get from Getty like four
thousand by six thousand and I need them

2108
01:24:35,813 --> 01:24:37,684
to be nineteen twenty by ten eighty.

2109
01:24:37,923 --> 01:24:38,923
Yeah, yeah.

2110
01:24:38,484 --> 01:24:41,225
So it just makes them nineteen twenty and
then I crop them the way that

2111
01:24:41,225 --> 01:24:42,656
I want them and then

2112
01:24:42,158 --> 01:24:43,158
Nice.

2113
01:24:42,656 --> 01:24:44,086
I'm can drag them to the Getty.

2114
01:24:44,086 --> 01:24:50,289
I have one for ~ the so the primary I have
one for our primary tech show

2115
01:24:50,509 --> 01:24:53,110
in Dropbox and that's the folder where I
can send you the link,

2116
01:24:53,110 --> 01:24:54,110
right? So it

2117
01:24:53,516 --> 01:24:54,516
Right.

2118
01:24:53,971 --> 01:24:57,022
just drag it there. I don't have to open
finder and navigate through anything.

2119
01:24:57,022 --> 01:24:58,022
I just

2120
01:24:57,714 --> 01:25:02,285
Drag it right on there. I have one that is
~ a way to

2121
01:25:02,285 --> 01:25:07,387
~ download unspecified audio. That's all
I'm gonna say,

2122
01:25:05,740 --> 01:25:08,555
Okay. Okay. Very good. Very good.

2123
01:25:07,387 --> 01:25:08,637
or download

2124
01:25:08,637 --> 01:25:11,828
unspecified ~ videos, right? But then

2125
01:25:11,427 --> 01:25:12,427
Nice.

2126
01:25:11,868 --> 01:25:15,224
and it just puts it into a box or into a
folder in that agent folder so that

2127
01:25:15,224 --> 01:25:18,710
it and then that ~ I have whisper
transcription running in the Mac mini,

2128
01:25:18,710 --> 01:25:22,271
watching that folder, and then it just
spits out a markdown file of that.

2129
01:25:22,271 --> 01:25:23,271
~

2130
01:25:22,542 --> 01:25:23,542
Nice.

2131
01:25:23,082 --> 01:25:24,492
and the last one that I really like.

2132
01:25:24,848 --> 01:25:28,800
Yeah well, two of them. One, I can drag a
file onto one called Finder Path

2133
01:25:28,800 --> 01:25:31,554
and it'll copy the path from the Finder on
the desk on the clipboard,

2134
01:25:31,554 --> 01:25:32,595
which is super

2135
01:25:31,950 --> 01:25:32,950
That's good.

2136
01:25:32,595 --> 01:25:34,196
useful, especially with things like
Claude,

2137
01:25:34,196 --> 01:25:35,207
right? Super, super

2138
01:25:34,690 --> 01:25:35,690
Yes.

2139
01:25:35,207 --> 01:25:40,901
useful. And then the last one I will share
is that I have an annotate with Cleanshot

2140
01:25:40,901 --> 01:25:44,865
X because sometimes you might have like a
photo you took of something,

2141
01:25:44,865 --> 01:25:48,248
and I want to just blank out the address
on it,

2142
01:25:48,248 --> 01:25:49,369
right? Cleanshot

2143
01:25:48,428 --> 01:25:49,428
Right, right.

2144
01:25:49,369 --> 01:25:52,412
X is actually the easiest way to do that
because it just has that scrambled text.

2145
01:25:53,359 --> 01:25:54,359
option

2146
01:25:53,759 --> 01:25:54,759
you can drag a

2147
01:25:54,083 --> 01:25:55,083
Yes.

2148
01:25:54,529 --> 01:25:57,140
thing over. So I just made a annotate with
screenshot X.

2149
01:25:57,140 --> 01:26:01,052
So any f any image I can just open there
and it'll open it in Cleanshot X

2150
01:26:01,052 --> 01:26:02,230
and then I can do what I need to do.

2151
01:26:02,230 --> 01:26:04,032
It's not like that's my primary image
editor.

2152
01:26:04,032 --> 01:26:09,794
I'm just saying for that one use of like I
want to ~ redact something from a photo,

2153
01:26:09,794 --> 01:26:10,985
Clean Shot X is the easiest way

2154
01:26:10,616 --> 01:26:11,616
Yes.

2155
01:26:10,985 --> 01:26:13,255
to do it. So I just stuck that in there as
well.

2156
01:26:13,255 --> 01:26:14,726
So it's it's pretty cool.

2157
01:26:15,672 --> 01:26:18,283
That is great. And Drop Zone Four,

2158
01:26:18,283 --> 01:26:19,283
that was the app that you're talking
about,

2159
01:26:19,212 --> 01:26:21,275
right? Drop drop zone four? Yeah.

2160
01:26:19,858 --> 01:26:20,858
Drop zone. Yep.

2161
01:26:21,755 --> 01:26:26,808
That was great. ~ I will offer one other
free app because I talked about

2162
01:26:26,808 --> 01:26:30,650
it in my video where I s said I'm ditching
Raycast again.

2163
01:26:30,650 --> 01:26:33,742
~ HyperKey, which is a free app.

2164
01:26:33,742 --> 01:26:37,934
And it is you know, I was gonna vibe code
it and then I was like,

2165
01:26:37,934 --> 01:26:40,086
you know what? It's free. It's great.

2166
01:26:40,086 --> 01:26:41,767
And this developer has a bunch of stuff.

2167
01:26:41,767 --> 01:26:43,968
And so HyperKey lets you

2168
01:26:44,406 --> 01:26:49,969
Change the mapping of a button like your
caps lock key to be a bunch

2169
01:26:49,969 --> 01:26:54,091
of modifiers instead. And this then allows
you to create a bunch

2170
01:26:54,091 --> 01:26:57,343
of keyboard shortcuts where you don't have
to remember all the modifiers.

2171
01:26:57,343 --> 01:26:59,224
You can just remember caps lock.

2172
01:26:59,224 --> 01:27:02,806
And you can still set it where tapping the
caps lock quickly actually

2173
01:27:02,806 --> 01:27:04,287
is caps lock if you want that.

2174
01:27:04,287 --> 01:27:10,531
But I have my caps lock using the hyper
key app set to shift option command

2175
01:27:11,456 --> 01:27:12,456
and control.

2176
01:27:13,432 --> 01:27:15,553
So all four of those modifier keys,

2177
01:27:15,553 --> 01:27:17,473
when I hold the caps lock button,

2178
01:27:17,473 --> 01:27:20,474
it is like I'm holding down those four
modifier keys.

2179
01:27:20,474 --> 01:27:23,335
And then that allows me to create keyboard
shortcuts.

2180
01:27:23,335 --> 01:27:25,635
And what I did, like in my video,

2181
01:27:25,635 --> 01:27:27,496
which I'll link in the show notes,

2182
01:27:27,496 --> 01:27:32,377
was I started mapping shortcuts to those
keyboard shortcuts.

2183
01:27:32,377 --> 01:27:37,108
And I was basically trying to replicate as
many of Raycast features that I could,

2184
01:27:37,108 --> 01:27:39,199
because I was switching back to Spotlight.

2185
01:27:39,199 --> 01:27:42,200
And so now I can do caps lock G.

2186
01:27:43,363 --> 01:27:44,664
And then actually runs a shortcut.

2187
01:27:44,664 --> 01:27:47,635
~ and so very quickly I can have a search
box,

2188
01:27:47,635 --> 01:27:52,598
I can type i roll, and I see a bunch of
gif results from GIFI,

2189
01:27:52,598 --> 01:27:54,939
and I can click one and it's immediately
on my clipboard.

2190
01:27:54,939 --> 01:27:57,771
And then you can run any a bunch of
shortcuts.

2191
01:27:57,771 --> 01:27:59,742
You know, you could do caps lock in any
letter,

2192
01:27:59,742 --> 01:28:03,494
caps lock in numbers, and now you can
create a bunch of keyboard shortcuts that

2193
01:28:03,494 --> 01:28:06,205
are likely not used by other actions and
apps.

2194
01:28:06,205 --> 01:28:08,376
You know, you might have paste and match
style,

2195
01:28:08,376 --> 01:28:10,227
which is like shift option command v,

2196
01:28:10,227 --> 01:28:11,808
but that doesn't include control.

2197
01:28:12,184 --> 01:28:14,935
So you can still do the caps lock and you
have twenty six letters that

2198
01:28:14,935 --> 01:28:20,197
can be twenty six different things plus
the numbers and it makes keyboard
shortcuts

2199
01:28:20,197 --> 01:28:24,048
much more manageable rather than trying to
remember is this one shift option

2200
01:28:24,048 --> 01:28:26,149
in this letter or is it shift command in
this?

2201
01:28:26,149 --> 01:28:30,517
And so just use caps lock for a bunch of
your your keyboard shortcuts and yeah,

2202
01:28:30,517 --> 01:28:32,051
you're good to go. So that's what I did.

2203
01:28:32,051 --> 01:28:33,051
That's pretty fun.

2204
01:28:33,370 --> 01:28:34,370
I the

2205
01:28:33,372 --> 01:28:34,372
So

2206
01:28:33,741 --> 01:28:36,119
last one I don't know for sure if I heard
from you guys or not,

2207
01:28:36,119 --> 01:28:37,119
but I'll just give you credit,

2208
01:28:37,082 --> 01:28:39,740
which is tail scale, which has just
changed my life.

2209
01:28:38,888 --> 01:28:39,888
yeah, yeah.

2210
01:28:40,149 --> 01:28:43,131
I mean you probably heard it from Casey
Liss on ATP a thousand times.

2211
01:28:41,906 --> 01:28:44,173
Probably, but it has changed my life,

2212
01:28:44,173 --> 01:28:45,173
so

2213
01:28:45,073 --> 01:28:48,755
Listen, David Sparks is all on the tail
scale tip as well,

2214
01:28:48,755 --> 01:28:53,009
and I am tempted by it because he says
it's more secure,

2215
01:28:53,009 --> 01:28:56,121
~ than using something like screens,

2216
01:28:56,121 --> 01:29:00,544
because for screens to work, you do have
to have a port on your network open

2217
01:29:00,544 --> 01:29:03,977
to the internet and then screens connect
is running on whatever

2218
01:29:03,977 --> 01:29:05,548
Mac you're accessing.

2219
01:29:06,734 --> 01:29:10,179
But I just don't like the idea of having
to turn on a VPN when I want

2220
01:29:10,179 --> 01:29:12,332
to access my Mac. And with

2221
01:29:11,846 --> 01:29:12,846
No, I just leave

2222
01:29:12,418 --> 01:29:14,365
it on all the time. You never turn it off.

2223
01:29:14,542 --> 01:29:15,542
See, I don't like that though.

2224
01:29:15,591 --> 01:29:16,955
W Why?

2225
01:29:17,860 --> 01:29:21,253
I don't know, do you ever notice like
change like you're not getting

2226
01:29:21,253 --> 01:29:23,752
as fast speeds because you're using this
VPN?

2227
01:29:23,752 --> 01:29:25,638
No.

2228
01:29:24,506 --> 01:29:25,677
No, because they're c

2229
01:29:25,677 --> 01:29:26,957
well, f they're connected. Like,

2230
01:29:26,957 --> 01:29:29,879
first of all, both of these two computers
are connected to Ethernet.

2231
01:29:29,879 --> 01:29:32,290
And second of all, my MacBook Air,

2232
01:29:32,290 --> 01:29:34,201
when I'm traveling or if I'm somewhere
else,

2233
01:29:34,201 --> 01:29:36,643
is using my MacBook Pro as an exit node,

2234
01:29:36,643 --> 01:29:40,465
which just means that it is entering the
internet from my MacBook Pro,

2235
01:29:40,465 --> 01:29:41,925
as if I'm sitting here at my house,

2236
01:29:41,925 --> 01:29:44,957
which is an incredibly powerful thing to
be able to do.

2237
01:29:44,957 --> 01:29:47,408
So all the internet is going through this
MacBook Pro,

2238
01:29:47,408 --> 01:29:53,252
which is just amazing. And I have not
experienced any issues with

2239
01:29:54,001 --> 01:29:56,983
with that sort of thing. Literally the
only thing I experience is,

2240
01:29:56,983 --> 01:29:59,945
okay, if I'm gonna share a screen and I'm
sitting in my car at

2241
01:29:59,945 --> 01:30:01,596
a soccer practice tethering from my phone,

2242
01:30:01,596 --> 01:30:03,217
the internet is what it is. Right.

2243
01:30:03,217 --> 01:30:04,217
But that's not a tail

2244
01:30:03,320 --> 01:30:04,320
Sure.

2245
01:30:03,997 --> 01:30:07,229
scale problem. But Tail Scale is making
that possible for me,

2246
01:30:07,229 --> 01:30:11,772
which is just amazing that I can be
sitting anywhere and I can

2247
01:30:11,833 --> 01:30:16,055
use either the regular screen sharing or I
can use the sc I can use screens

2248
01:30:16,055 --> 01:30:19,177
I use screens five. What's kind of neat is
in screens five you can just

2249
01:30:19,177 --> 01:30:21,969
log directly into Tail Scale in screens
and it just shows you all

2250
01:30:21,969 --> 01:30:23,340
the devices on your Tailscale network.

2251
01:30:23,394 --> 01:30:25,279
That's what day that's what David was
saying.

2252
01:30:25,279 --> 01:30:26,279
And

2253
01:30:25,370 --> 01:30:26,370
It's amazing.

2254
01:30:27,214 --> 01:30:33,248
and so what so the benefit versus using a
screens connect is better security?

2255
01:30:32,434 --> 01:30:33,436
Well, using screens

2256
01:30:33,436 --> 01:30:36,421
connect when you're somewhere else means
you have to have a static

2257
01:30:36,421 --> 01:30:38,856
IP address on that device at home.

2258
01:30:38,856 --> 01:30:39,856
Right.

2259
01:30:39,129 --> 01:30:40,129
Yes.

2260
01:30:39,718 --> 01:30:42,603
Well, that's another layer of complication
you'd have to set up.

2261
01:30:42,603 --> 01:30:44,887
With Tail Scale you don't because it just
does that for you.

2262
01:30:45,444 --> 01:30:47,628
So if I already have that set up with all
my Macs,

2263
01:30:47,628 --> 01:30:52,077
would I benefit from that? 'Cause also
feel like if you have the VPN

2264
01:30:52,077 --> 01:30:55,183
on all the time, I don't know,

2265
01:30:55,183 --> 01:30:56,786
I feel like it would mess with other
things,

2266
01:30:56,786 --> 01:30:57,786
but maybe I'm wrong.

2267
01:30:57,304 --> 01:30:58,304
Doesn't mess

2268
01:30:57,834 --> 01:31:00,805
with anything except well, I'll give you
the one exception in a second.

2269
01:31:00,805 --> 01:31:03,476
The other thing it makes it possible to do
is I can be sitting in

2270
01:31:03,476 --> 01:31:08,727
my MacBook Air anywhere I want and I can
be running Claude on the Mac.

2271
01:31:08,727 --> 01:31:14,579
I can be having the c the Claude code
window open and it is literally working

2272
01:31:14,579 --> 01:31:17,430
on the folder because you can tell it
which folds create a remote session.

2273
01:31:17,430 --> 01:31:21,821
And Tailscale allows me to basically just
be working as if I'm on that Mac,

2274
01:31:21,821 --> 01:31:25,812
which is pretty pretty great. The one
exception is that the VPN we use.

2275
01:31:26,214 --> 01:31:29,846
to access the CMS when I need to publish
an article does

2276
01:31:29,362 --> 01:31:30,362
right.

2277
01:31:29,846 --> 01:31:31,527
not work if Tailscale is active.

2278
01:31:31,527 --> 01:31:33,008
There's it's just like too VPNs,

2279
01:31:33,008 --> 01:31:34,338
man. You gotta back off. Like I can't

2280
01:31:33,795 --> 01:31:34,795
Right, right.

2281
01:31:34,338 --> 01:31:37,531
handle this. So I just have to disconnect
from Tailscale for like five minutes

2282
01:31:37,531 --> 01:31:38,531
and log into the other.

2283
01:31:38,992 --> 01:31:40,353
So if you have so last question.

2284
01:31:40,353 --> 01:31:44,465
So if you have Tail Scale on your iPad and
your V and the VPN is active,

2285
01:31:44,465 --> 01:31:48,247
so you're accessing your Mac fr at home
and you're at a soccer game,

2286
01:31:48,247 --> 01:31:53,929
is all your internet traffic, like if you
go into Safari and you're just browsing

2287
01:31:53,929 --> 01:31:58,572
for whatever, is that traffic having to ~
going all the way home first

2288
01:31:59,312 --> 01:32:01,213
and then you're accessing the internet or

2289
01:32:00,954 --> 01:32:01,954
If you're

2290
01:32:01,381 --> 01:32:02,381
using an exit.

2291
01:32:04,071 --> 01:32:06,744
Well, if you're on your iPad and you're
using screens,

2292
01:32:06,744 --> 01:32:09,348
then the internet is coming from your
house anyway.

2293
01:32:09,348 --> 01:32:11,040
That's actually the beautiful thing about
this,

2294
01:32:11,040 --> 01:32:12,402
but that's not a tail scale thing,

2295
01:32:12,402 --> 01:32:13,402
that's a screens thing.

2296
01:32:12,547 --> 01:32:13,547
No but like but like

2297
01:32:13,478 --> 01:32:17,431
on that iPad, you just open the Safari app
on the iPad and you

2298
01:32:16,797 --> 01:32:17,797
yeah, okay.

2299
01:32:17,431 --> 01:32:21,864
go to Apple dot com. Did that traffic have
to go all the way home and then

2300
01:32:21,864 --> 01:32:22,864
to the internet?

2301
01:32:22,437 --> 01:32:23,437
Only

2302
01:32:22,757 --> 01:32:24,899
if you hi if you're telling it to use an
exit node.

2303
01:32:24,899 --> 01:32:28,502
If you are, which is an easy which is a
separate toggle from turning to

2304
01:32:28,562 --> 01:32:32,144
so you can have tail scale on and not use
an exit node and the answer is no.

2305
01:32:32,144 --> 01:32:34,206
Your computers just think they're on the
same network,

2306
01:32:34,206 --> 01:32:37,859
essentially. You can also have tail scale
on and use an exit node and choose

2307
01:32:37,859 --> 01:32:40,270
one of your devices to be the exit node,

2308
01:32:40,270 --> 01:32:43,753
and that in that case, all of your
internet is being funneled through.

2309
01:32:43,753 --> 01:32:48,857
But that is in with internet speeds like
what you have.

2310
01:32:49,255 --> 01:32:52,217
And what I have. I mean mine are not even
like nearly as fast as Steven's,

2311
01:32:52,217 --> 01:32:53,487
but they are more than fast enough.

2312
01:32:53,487 --> 01:32:57,800
That is a non issue because the limiting
factor is still either

2313
01:32:57,800 --> 01:32:59,091
the tethering from your phone,

2314
01:32:59,091 --> 01:33:00,271
right? Like it doesn't

2315
01:32:59,749 --> 01:33:00,749
Sure.

2316
01:33:00,312 --> 01:33:03,794
going to home first is in i is
inconsequential.

2317
01:33:04,164 --> 01:33:05,164
Okay.

2318
01:33:05,315 --> 01:33:08,727
But think about the benefits of being
somewhere else and having your internet

2319
01:33:08,089 --> 01:33:09,089
Yeah.

2320
01:33:08,727 --> 01:33:09,727
come out of your home.

2321
01:33:10,871 --> 01:33:14,108
I mean yes, sure.

2322
01:33:11,525 --> 01:33:14,889
YouTube TV, streaming,

2323
01:33:15,090 --> 01:33:18,875
lots of things. It's free.

2324
01:33:16,673 --> 01:33:18,084
All right. I'll finally do it.

2325
01:33:18,084 --> 01:33:20,257
I mean, David I know it's free.

2326
01:33:18,875 --> 01:33:20,197
It's completely free.

2327
01:33:20,673 --> 01:33:22,510
I just have not all right, I'll try.

2328
01:33:22,510 --> 01:33:26,098
I'll try it. I ca David Sparks keeps
sending me like every episode like Tail
Scale,

2329
01:33:26,098 --> 01:33:27,098
it's amazing.

2330
01:33:26,237 --> 01:33:27,237
Yeah.

2331
01:33:26,638 --> 01:33:31,349
You can SSH into like the other computer
and and do terminal things into that

2332
01:33:31,349 --> 01:33:33,235
computer because it's like you're just on
that computer.

2333
01:33:34,277 --> 01:33:36,760
Alright, I'll try Tail Scale. I'll try it.

2334
01:33:36,760 --> 01:33:39,504
And then I could delete screens connect
from my Macs,

2335
01:33:39,504 --> 01:33:40,504
basically.

2336
01:33:40,179 --> 01:33:41,442
You wouldn't need screens connect,

2337
01:33:41,442 --> 01:33:45,701
that's correct. You would still obviously
need s screens on the each one of ~ Yeah.

2338
01:33:44,505 --> 01:33:45,927
The app. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2339
01:33:45,927 --> 01:33:49,433
Okay. All right, I'll try it. Link to Tail
Scale down in the show notes.

2340
01:33:49,433 --> 01:33:50,749
We'll follow up next week. All right,

2341
01:33:50,749 --> 01:33:52,561
we're gonna go record a bonus episode.

2342
01:33:52,561 --> 01:33:54,141
I wanna talk about my Apple Watch.

2343
01:33:54,141 --> 01:33:59,009
And ~ also Alfred. did you know Alfred V
six is coming out?

2344
01:34:00,327 --> 01:34:02,039
I think maybe I had heard that.

2345
01:34:02,039 --> 01:34:03,421
I did I buy

2346
01:34:02,633 --> 01:34:03,633
we will talk about that.

2347
01:34:03,421 --> 01:34:06,245
did I yeah, I was like is is it cur it's
currently out,

2348
01:34:06,245 --> 01:34:08,909
right? Yeah. I came out September tenth.

2349
01:34:06,668 --> 01:34:09,931
Mm, I don't th I don't think V C really?

2350
01:34:10,031 --> 01:34:12,224
Well maybe not. Maybe that wasn't just
when they announced it.

2351
01:34:12,224 --> 01:34:14,087
I'm sorry. Sorry.

2352
01:34:13,282 --> 01:34:14,282
Yeah, that's when they announced

2353
01:34:14,112 --> 01:34:15,893
it. It's coming soon. It says this autumn.

2354
01:34:15,893 --> 01:34:18,174
Be the first to know. so anyway,

2355
01:34:18,174 --> 01:34:20,325
well but we're gonna talk about my my
Apple Watch because I have I have

2356
01:34:20,325 --> 01:34:21,325
a few more thoughts about that.

2357
01:34:21,175 --> 01:34:22,486
If you want to hear our bonus episode,

2358
01:34:22,486 --> 01:34:26,417
the pre-show, you get two plus hours of
primary tech when you support the show.

2359
01:34:26,417 --> 01:34:28,418
You get all the feeds. That link is down.

2360
01:34:28,418 --> 01:34:31,320
Click the members link and you can save
money on that.

2361
01:34:31,320 --> 01:34:33,580
I think I'm probably going that's gonna be
a limited time.

2362
01:34:33,580 --> 01:34:36,642
I think maybe I'm gonna stop putting that
link in the show notes and just

2363
01:34:36,209 --> 01:34:37,209
I think that's a good idea.

2364
01:34:37,442 --> 01:34:39,007
you know, if you just want to support the
show,

2365
01:34:39,007 --> 01:34:41,384
I mean it could be five dollars and fifty
dollars a $50 a year.

2366
01:34:42,226 --> 01:34:44,368
but if you want to, I'll leave that link
in there one more week,

2367
01:34:44,368 --> 01:34:46,960
we'll say, ~ because it is ~ Sectember
first,

2368
01:34:46,960 --> 01:34:50,483
Tectober first. And so if you want to
support the show,

2369
01:34:50,483 --> 01:34:54,006
we'll say last opportunity to get it for
two dollars and fifty cents

2370
01:34:54,006 --> 01:34:55,017
a month or fifty dollars a year,

2371
01:34:55,017 --> 01:34:56,408
and you could lock in that price forever.

2372
01:34:56,408 --> 01:34:58,463
So become a member there. We'd appreciate
it.

2373
01:34:58,463 --> 01:35:00,142
We're gonna go access the bonus episodes,

2374
01:35:00,142 --> 01:35:02,273
you get the ad-free versions, primary tech
daily,

2375
01:35:02,273 --> 01:35:05,106
all of that. And yeah, we're gonna go
record that bonus episode.

2376
01:35:05,106 --> 01:35:07,148
You can leave us a five star rating and
review an Apple Podcast.

2377
01:35:07,148 --> 01:35:09,780
We appreciate that, and we'll catch you
next week.