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Intro:
The following program is brought to you by the Tennessee
Broadband Association.

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Lead Tennessee Radio, conversations with the leaders moving our
state forward.

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We look at the issues shaping Tennessee's future: rural
development, public policy, broadband,

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healthcare, and other topics impacting our communities.

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Andy Johns:
Thank you for listening to this episode of Lead Tennessee Radio.

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I'm your guest host, Andy Johns, pinch hitting for Carrie and
Trevor.

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And joined on this episode by Scott Goodale, who is the vice
president of fiber network design and implementation at JSI.

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Scott, thanks so much for joining me.

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Scott Goodale:
Thank you for having me.

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Andy Johns:
We are here at the Tennessee Broadband Association, Kentucky
Rural Broadband Association Joint Conference here in Franklin,

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Tennessee. And Scott is one of the great speakers on the agenda
who is kind of leading us through ideas

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and concepts this week.

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Scott, your topic is on "The Art of Mastering Project
Management." And I know that's something everybody can stand to

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benefit a little bit from managing their projects a little bit
better.

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Tell us a little bit about what the session is about.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. Thank you.

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The biggest component of our session was how do we be more
efficient, and in all approaches, how do we add value?

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The clients or the ISPs are receiving an immense amount of
money.

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They've also saved up their money over the years.

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And now is the opportunity for them to build out, increase their
subscribers, use it as matching funds or any other

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funding source they have to continue to expand broadband and hit
the, I guess, the keywords of

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"broadband for everyone."

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Andy Johns:
One of the things that surprised me that I've never heard a
project management person say before is, is you're encouraging

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folks to kind of, at times a little bit get away from Gantt
charts.

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I thought project management folks loved Gantt charts!

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And I know we may have folks who are driving right now, so we're
going to try to keep it lively and, you know, not too far into

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it. We don't want to put anybody to sleep.

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But you know getting away from Gantt charts is not something
I've heard many project managers say that they're in favor of.

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Tell me a little bit more.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. So Gantt charts are great for the very beginning.

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It lists out what tasks you have.

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It gets into ownership, but at the same time you get wrapped up
in them, and an individual can get twisted

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around. We're behind on one line item and ahead on another, and
it's going to come into conflict.

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So we've kind of tossed those out.

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We understand that they do provide value, but in our projects,
because of the pace we're moving and the resources that

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we're allocating, we don't have somebody dedicated.

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And a lot of our ISPs don't either, just to updating a Gantt
chart and keeping it current.

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So we've moved on to more of a goals and milestones based
approach, where we all know our job.

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We all have our areas of expertise, and we understand what tasks
need to be completed to move the the ball forward.

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So we've set up a little more strategic and definitive approach
of we have 7 to

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10 milestones depending on what the scope of the project is.

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And that allows us to know what yard line we're on.

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If we want to use a football analogy, every first down, that's
where we're at.

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Additionally, we don't get twisted around a serial approach.

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We are more of a parallel approach.

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We're going to attack from all angles.

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Andy Johns:
All right, unpack that for us a little bit, a serial approach.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. So in a lot of cases, people say, "Okay, let's get a
preliminary design, and then we're going to go get our permit

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applications. And then we'll wait till the permits are submitted
before we move into detailed design, before we go into

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contracts." And it's more of you put one foot in front of the
other, and you have to complete a task before you start the next

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task. Under our approach, we kind of divide and conquer.

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And so therefore while designs going on, we're filing for
permits, we're starting to plan and get contracts in place,

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notifying bidders of potential projects that are coming up so
that we are already two steps ahead.

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And you'll hear me say that a lot.

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The old Bart Simpson quote was always thinking two steps ahead.

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He was always frustrated by Homer, who was as not smart as he
was.

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Andy Johns:
That's a kind way to put it. Sure.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. He always was two steps ahead of Bart, and that's what I
tell my team.

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You need to be two steps ahead and know what's coming.

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We are the experts, or your engineering firm is the experts, and
therefore, they should be able to forecast what's going to be the

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next roadblock stepping stone or stage gate.

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Andy Johns:
And that's the thing that's come up a lot talking to vendors and
ISPs here at the conference this week is,

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you know, most cases, this is a once in a generation, once in a
lifetime, time period right now where folks can

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can build and expand broadband networks to connect folks here in
Tennessee.

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Most ISPs are going to get a shot at this once.

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Folks like yourself have done it enough times, helped other
folks with it where, like you said, you're helping, see those

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roadblocks that are that are coming up.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. And a lot of these things are fiscal responsibility, as
well as efficiency.

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As you pointed out, once in a generation, now, this funding
source has finite durations.

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As we know, there's Enhanced ACAM that's going to expire at the
end of 2028.

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We've still got ARPA or CPF that's October of 2026.

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So they have these funds that are being released that have a
terminal.

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This is the last date you can write a check, right.

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And so having an efficient approach to project management so
that you can complete it on time or ahead of the

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deadlines is very important to all of our clients.

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Andy Johns:
The three main elements, and you talked about it earlier, but
with any project management, you're basically looking at cost,

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scope and time.

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And all of those are very connected, especially when you've got
as much going on as broadband providers are here in Tennessee.

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Right now when you're talking to folks, what are you hearing?

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Which one of those is stressing folks out the most?

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And how do they interplay when you're looking at cost, scope and
time?

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. And that's a great question because good, fast, cheap has
always been the

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three-legged stool that you have there.

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We use scope, schedule and budget as a comparison there, the
critical constraints.

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Current day and age, it's not the cheap that has people driven.

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It's the time and the quality.

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So we have to meet specifications because this money that we're
putting in has to create an asset that lasts for a generation.

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Secondly, fast, we have a limited duration of getting it
constructed so that we get reimbursement.

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And then the cheap portion is, of course, we're looking for all
fiscal responsibility.

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We want to make sure the clients, either it's matching or
they're 100% grant funds, go as far as possible, serve as many

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clients, or serve as many subscribers as possible.

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So that's probably though on the latter side of where things
are.

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The awarding agencies, whether it be the state or the federal
government or even general funds, understand that with inflation

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and with constraints for material, we ran into some roadblocks
with that in the last two years, starting to come

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back into some normal ranges.

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But the material delivery lead times are still going to be a
concern as we finish out this year and go

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into next year ahead of BEAD.

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Andy Johns:
Yeah, and we talked about that a little bit on some of the other
episodes, some of the other speakers have brought that up is

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that, you know, by the time, you know, just looking at what one
of the speakers yesterday said, I forget if it was the Tennessee

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Broadband Office or the Kentucky Broadband Office.

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They've got 40 ISPs pre-approved to do these projects, and you
start multiplying that out.

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Maybe only half of them get approved final or whatever it's
going to be, we don't know.

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But that's just one state.

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So you're looking at that many projects going on here.

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And then next door in Kentucky and Georgia, all the other states
are going to be doing that.

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There's going to be real scarcity when it comes to labor,
possibly with supply chain.

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Hopefully that's a little better than it was a couple of years
ago.

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But there are so many factors that go into completing a project
on time, and so many of them are out of your control and out of

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the ISP's control.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. And out of our control is –

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Andy Johns:
Maybe that's not the way that you would phrase it, but –

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Scott Goodale:
No, no, that's I mean, we have certain levels of influence.

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What we have to do is try to predict the future.

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Andy Johns:
No big deal, just predicting the future.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. The ISPs, as you pointed out, most of them will get one
opportunity at this, and it's a huge opportunity for

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them. Some of these ISPs have been owned by the same three
generations for, you know,

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60-80 years.

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Andy Johns:
Right.

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Scott Goodale:
They started with copper, and now they've moved on to fiber.

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One thing we are seeing, though, is they are willing to accept
help.

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They may not have the internal workforce to do it, and they
realize we've got to reach out.

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And that's what companies like JSI are here for.

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We can give you some expertise.

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We can give guidance.

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And it's an a la carte.

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If you just need help with project management, we have tools
that will help.

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If you need help with design or inspection, contract
administration is another one that people really stumble over

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because of the legal aspects of it.

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So, as you were saying, these individuals, the awardees are
opening up to

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an outside agency or firm to really let them be guided.

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And that's all we're asking.

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Andy Johns:
Yeah. And you know, when you've got this much going on right now
asking for help, there's certainly nothing, nothing wrong with

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that.

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Scott Goodale:
No, sir.

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Andy Johns:
Kind of, and you've mentioned it a couple of times, but getting
into accountability, because that's a big part of it.

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Both you guys being accountable to the ISPs, to your clients.

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But then, you know, we talked yesterday about some of the
requirements with the BABA, you know, Build America, Buy

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American. There's a lot built into the BEAD process specifically
to promote that accountability.

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So you guys are working not only to be accountable to your
members or to your clients, but they are

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working to be accountable to their end customers and the
taxpayers.

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There's a lot of accountability built in, but I'm sure it's
something that everybody still has to work towards and make an

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intentional effort there.

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Scott Goodale:
Absolutely. And accountability is something that I really
emphasize on my team.

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We emphasize when we kick off the meetings or kick off the
projects.

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Both accountability between the engineering firm and the awardee
and reciprocated.

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But as you pointed out, there is BABA requirements.

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There's labor law requirements.

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There's taxpayer obligations.

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So all the reporting that goes in with it, it's a frequent word
you'll hear on our conversations, especially

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during the initial setup of we're going to be holding the client
accountable to allow us and communicate to us

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to get them where they need to be.

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Another thing you'll hear me say is help them get out of their
own way.

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Because they have always done things at a pace –

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Andy Johns:
In a nice way.

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Scott Goodale:
In a nice way. And sometimes it's just as blunt as that is.

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Let us help you get out of your way because you've been doing
things this way for two generations.

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You've asked us for our help because we need to speed that
process up.

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And that's really where we are respectfully candid with them,
that the approaches

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of the last two generations when it comes to telecom build out
won't get you where you need to be in the timeline you're working

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with.

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Andy Johns:
Interesting. Okay. So you're seeing it.

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I mean, we're accelerated to that point.

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That's an interesting, interesting thought nobody had brought up
so far is that what's gotten you here won't necessarily take you

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to the next spot, just based on on the accelerated timeline for
these.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. And if you have a small project, if you're a, you know, a
350 subscriber ISP.

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And you get a $2 million loan that you need, or a grant, that
you need to spend over five years.

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Yeah, you're going to be able to pull that off.

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Andy Johns:
Yeah. Piece of cake.

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah, but we're looking at projects where Enhanced ACAM or even
some ReConnect projects are

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400-500 miles that they have to have built out by the end of
2028 and get environmental permitting and get clearance and

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everything. So those are the ones that really catch you off
guard, because there are so many hurdles you have to clear

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before you can even start putting duct in the ground.

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Andy Johns:
Definitely. Well, as we're wrapping up here, last question I
normally ask folks, what advice do you have for folks that are

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looking to either improve the way?

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Obviously working with JSI, I imagine would be one of one of the
pieces of advice.

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But aside from that, what's some advice or a takeaway that you
would have for folks that are looking to get better with their

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project management? Or for some folks, like you said, kind of
taking a big step into the size and scale of some of these

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projects, something they've never, never done before.

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What advice do you have for those folks?

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Scott Goodale:
Yeah. So of course, reaching out to JSI, and one thing I want to
throw out with JSI is we're a full service, but we're

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also here to help. We want to assist the ISPs, the awardees, get
more fiber out to the masses.

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If you only need help with contracts, we can help with just
that.

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Or you just need help in guiding you through the environmental
clearance process.

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Those are services that we offer like an a la carte select what
you need, and use our expertise to get where they need to go.

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The other things are, like we mentioned or talked about a little
previously was, you know, Harvard Business Review

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has some great little, you know, less than 25-50 page books that
you can pick up some good tips

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on how to improve the efficiency of your team.

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One thing that we talk about is effective meetings.

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You know how to deal with difficult people.

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Internal training really will help speed up that growth process.

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It is a little bit costly.

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You know, you still have to take somebody's time away from doing
their daily work, but, you know, devoting some time and resources

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to building your team is immeasurable.

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Andy Johns:
And that's so important and interesting that you touched on it,
because there's been several sessions where that internal

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communication and internal training, making sure your team is
ready.

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It seems like that's something that's been brought up a lot.

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I know this, I said last question was last question, but you
brought up a really good point there that that's been brought up

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a lot. I feel like more so than in the past at this conference,
that getting your team ready.

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You know, not just the technical training, but also the
understanding of of what's what's going on, what's at stake and

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how they can be more efficient and more on board.

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It seems to be a big piece that everybody's talking about this
week to make folks more effective.

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Scott Goodale:
Absolutely. And it's not just about when you're spending your own
money, but as we went back to the BEAD or ReConnect or any of

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the grant funds, there is a regulatory obligation that comes
with that and making sure your team is aware, knowledgeable and

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understands what is at stake is very important.

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And that's part of that.

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You know, let's get our team ready before they have to be ready.

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And so small little training classes, go out there, look on RUS,
look on USDA or NTIA.

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They have little seminars, webinars that you can attend.

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I think JSI has webinars as well that might be like 20 or 30
minutes just to give you the background of what the

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obligations are, what your regulatory compliance requirements
are.

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Even down to what is prevailing wages mean?

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What is Davis-Bacon mean?

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And what do you have to do to be compliant?

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So great little 20 minute sessions like that will make huge
differences in the knowledge base of your team.

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Andy Johns:
Perfect. Thank you for bringing that up.

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Scott Goodale:
Thank you sir.

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Andy Johns:
He is Scott Goodale, vice president of fiber network design and
implementation at JSI.

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Scott, thanks so much for joining us.

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Scott Goodale:
Thank you very much for having me.

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Andy Johns:
And thank you for listening.

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I'm your host, your guest host, Andy Johns with Pioneer Utility
Resources.

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And thank you for listening to this episode of Lead Tennessee
Radio.