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Life can be complicated.

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The full expectation and preparation for one version of future events becomes a complete
180 in the blink of an eye.

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On Wednesday, my right calf was kind of sore.

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I mean, it wasn't like, it's painful.

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my gosh, what's going It was just kind of sore.

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So I called my doctor and they called back and said to, you know, it's probably nothing,
but you should get that checked out.

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When I was in the emergency room, the nurse, she says, I'm telling my colleagues that I've
got a patient with three blood clots in them and he doesn't look anything like a patient

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with three blood clots on him.

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To which I said, well, what does a person with three blood clots look like?

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And she says, they're usually dead.

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How do you anticipate the gravity of a sudden, dire circumstance while on the road to
recovery from a previously life-altering event?

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How do you prepare or attempt to expect the unexpected?

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Every six minutes, somebody in America dies of a blood clot.

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We're here to change that statistic.

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Welcome to Taking a Breath, a stop the clot podcast.

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A podcast dedicated to bringing awareness of the dangers of blood clots from the clotting
disorders community to the world.

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With the help of many notable blood clot survivors, we are here to give you the knowledge
and the skills that you need to prevent this silent killer.

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My name is Leslie Legge.

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I am the president of the National Blood Clot Alliance and I am a blood clot survivor.

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And my name is Todd Robertson.

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I am the patient engagement liaison for the National Blood Clot Alliance and I am a
seven-time blood clot survivor.

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And we're here to stop the clot.

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As blood clot survivors, we know the fear associated with a close call, that dreaded
diagnosis that provides a bitter mix of clarity and finality.

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Our guest today is somebody who unfortunately knows this feeling all too well.

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From active early screenings for his hereditary predisposition for cancer to rolling with
the uncertainty of his developed DVT and PE from cancer treatment complications, it takes

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a level of resiliency

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only experienced by a few.

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Please join me in welcoming today my friend, Dr.

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Michael Philbin.

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So we have hereditary prostate cancer in our family.

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So I was diagnosed when I was 52.

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Sorry.

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I started screening in my forties because my dad died of metastatic prostate cancer when
he was 57.

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I was 12 at the time.

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So both my brother and I were doing screenings well up before that.

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So my brother was, he's 14 years older than me.

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So he was already getting it, you know, you know, getting things checked out and whatnot.

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So he was, I don't know, 53, 54.

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Dad's had it, now my brother's had it.

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So I started taking vitamin E with selenium and lycopene and all that stuff.

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Was that a waste of money for 11 years, probably?

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Did it slow it down?

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Maybe, I don't know.

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So my PSA, when I was like 45, it actually went up enough that for a normal man, it
probably would have been, no big deal, don't worry about it.

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But because of my family history, my dad dying of metastatic disease, my brother having
it.

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Did the first biopsy, which of course I was nervous for.

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And then it came back negative.

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And then six months later, it tripled or quadrupled.

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And I thought, this is it.

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They didn't find it the last time.

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like, God, I'm only 45, 46.

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I thought I had until 50 till I had to worry about this.

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And then that came back negative.

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Nothing there.

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And then the PSA came back down.

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And over the next seven years, it kind of rose slowly, not a big deal.

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The urologist I had at the time, his thing was like, yeah, your PSA has been kind of
steady, but you're 52, your dad's age, your brother's age, maybe we should do another

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biopsy.

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So I talk with my wife and family and my doctor, so we do another biopsy.

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So I was really nervous for the first two and I go into this biopsy thinking, there's no
big deal.

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It's just sort of to check and make sure things are fine.

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Nothing's going to happen.

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Because the PSA hadn't grown up that much.

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So technically,

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PSA screening did not catch my cancer.

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So based on the amount of my PSA change, wouldn't have warranted it.

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But my family history and the age of my brother and father getting it is what warranted
the check.

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And then it turns out I did have prostate cancer.

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So that's what warranted the surgery.

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So I got caught when I was 52, I had a prostatectomy and they told me that getting a blood
clot in your calves and potentially in your lungs was one of the complications of the

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surgery and that I should walk around for at least five minutes every hour.

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If I had any pain in my leg, give them a call.

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So surgery was on Saturday.

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On Wednesday, my right calf was kind of sore.

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It's almost like if you ever done work where you're standing on a ladder and you're on
your chip toes for a little too long, your calves get kind of sore from that.

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So it was just like that.

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It was just a soreness.

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wasn't like, like pain, pain.

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And then by Friday, it was still sore and I was taking six ibuprofen a day.

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So I thought, well, I it's sore.

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It doesn't hurt.

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So I called my doctor and they called back and said to

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You know, it's probably nothing, but you should get that checked out.

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Either come into our urgent care or go to your local ER.

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So I went to the local hospital.

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Of course, they realized I was a week after the prostatectomy.

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I was tachycardic, like on a like 115, 120 beats per minute.

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So they did a echo on the legs and they saw a blood clot in my left leg.

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Bear in mind, the sore were in my right leg.

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They did not see a blood clot in my right leg.

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They saw one in...

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And they also did a CTA and found that I had a small clot in each lung, their
sub-segmental tomylarian bull eye.

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I knew a little bit about the calf pain because once I pulled a muscle in my calf, went to
the local emergency room and they sort of said, well, we don't think it's a blood clot.

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So I was aware that if you had pain in your leg, like felt like a pulled muscle, that that
could potentially be a blood clot.

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So just from that little pulled muscle thing I had.

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some awareness to it and that it was really the other one.

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was, the journalist David something or other in the first Gulf war.

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was sitting on a tank for like four days, got off.

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DVT let loose and he had a massive PE and died on the spot.

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So that was like the first time, like in the general media that I was aware of it.

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The next time was, one of the women I work with her, fiance was diagnosed with colon
cancer, but they got it.

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It looks like he's going to be okay.

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They can do some treatment two days later.

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He's dead.

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It's like, what happened?

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we had a blood clot.

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So there was a time where now I've like, know somebody that's had a blood clot and you
know, it will, the DVT emboli or whatever, thrombo embolized went to the lungs and he died

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from it.

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So that was sort of a, you know, one was in the general media.

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Another was actually someone I know is Beyonce.

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So I had some awareness to it.

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And like I said, that my cancer center, had,

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made me well aware that it was something to be on the lookout for.

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When I was in the emergency room, the nurse, she says, I'm telling my colleagues that I've
got a patient with three blood clots in them and he doesn't look anything like a patient

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with three blood clots on him.

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To which I said, well, what does a person with three blood clots look like?

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And she says, they're usually dead.

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So I said, and I figured, well, I guess I must be doing okay.

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I knew blood clots weren't a good thing, but I figured I feel okay.

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I'm in the hospital, they're taking care of me.

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So while I was in the hospital, it was fine.

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It was a couple of weeks after my doctors, my general practitioners, doctor's office
called and said the doctor had liked to come in, like me to come in to see me.

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So I went in and I said, I heard you had these P E's after your surgery.

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said, I said, yeah, it was no big deal.

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They were small ones.

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He's like, well, if the good thing they were, we wouldn't be talking right now.

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And that was sort of the aha.

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I'm going to.

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okay.

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And mine were below the knee, so those are supposed to be not as dangerous, you know,
because the higher up they go, the bigger the vein, the bigger the clot and whatnot.

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And I think because I just had, within the week of the abdominal surgery, I think they
were taking a lot more seriously.

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And the ER doctor said, if we were in Europe, we'd release you because it's below your
knee.

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They wouldn't even treat it.

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They'd say, go home.

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It's only in recent years where they do an echo on it that they can actually see them now,
because I think the older technology

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the veins were too low below the knee, wouldn't even see that per se.

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My GP told me if you stuck a hundred people in a room, I would have been the last one
anyone would have picked to get it.

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Have a blood clot after the surgery.

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The clotting risks associated with surgery can be terrifying.

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Knowing that these complications stem from oftentimes life-saving procedures just makes
these subdued clotting events that much more nefarious.

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However, when it comes to being informed, the best you can do to prepare is communicate,
inquire, and recognize the risk factors beforehand.

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Here to discuss the clotting risk for people with hereditary predispositions to cancer and
how to communicate risk effectively.

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From Memorial Sloan Kettering, this is Dr.

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Avi Leder.

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That individual that has prostate cancer, if I were to meet him beforehand, just for
discussion about the risk of blood clotting, I would actually tell them that prostate

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cancer is associated with a relatively low risk of blood clots.

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The fact that you are at low risk does not mean that you're not going to have a clot.

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the fact that you're at high risk is not mean that you're going to have a clot, but it is
about probabilities in life.

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Right?

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So that's mainly for us.

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think for us as a group of doctors, physicians,

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Ideally, we would be able to select the higher risk group for more intensive education and
prevention and the lower risk group in which you save them some of those worrying

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situations.

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But I would tell that patient that if they were going to surgery, they should ask the
surgeon about a prevention of black clots because hospitalization and surgery

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Even if your cancer is a low risk blood clot cancer, the surgery in itself, you just pull
someone off Fifth Avenue here and put them in hospital for five or six days and they have

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surgery and they were healthy, their risk increases.

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So the surgery is a big thing.

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I say this every time, but I feel like we need to clone you because of your willingness to
just talk about your whole health experience.

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We just don't have many men that are so open about things, so it's great to have your
willingness to do so.

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So here's a question for you because you're so very matter of fact about everything when
we chat.

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And I was like that too when I was diagnosed.

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And then when I started to like do my research on what had happened and when all of the
statistics look like it massively raised my anxiety.

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What was your experience like when you started to kind of delve into learning about blood
clots?

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Cause it's one thing when you're in the hospital and you're, you've got great care at MSK
and hey, you should be aware of the following things, but

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Did it do a number on you at all after the fact?

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Yeah, it more after.

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Yeah.

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And actually it was a central New Jersey hospital that I was at for that.

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So all my blood clot related stuff wasn't done at the cancer center.

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It was done locally.

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But MSK had told you to be on the lookout.

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Okay.

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That's where I have the surgery.

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there, you know, when I call, they said either come in to see us or go or whatever.

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so tell us about the after.

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Yeah.

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So after, so like, like I said, when I saw my general practitioner, you know, at first I
was like, they're small blood clots, like no big deal.

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And then he sort of said, well, if they weren't, you know, then it's a lot more serious.

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So that was the first aha moment that, you know, that you start learning a little bit more
about it and stuff.

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So I ended up, so I was seeing a local hematologist, the same doctor I had in the
hospital.

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continued to see them, afterwards.

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So.

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The P E's actually cleared like within a month or two, because it was maybe it was
actually five weeks after surgery, right before I was supposed to go to work.

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And one morning I just felt really weird.

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I called my wife up to come get me, went to the emergency room to get check docs.

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just felt, and they looked, everything was, they didn't see anything in the fact, the CTA
shows the blood clots have now cleared or whatever.

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So I don't know if it was just a, what they call the phasovagal response or something.

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You know, it's almost like if you think you're not feeling right, you can almost get
yourself into like, I don't know if shock's the right word, but you think something wrong

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and there isn't, it just sort of, so those actually cleared pretty quickly.

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And I saw the hematologist fairly regularly and they do the echo on the leg.

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And again, like I said, that the cloth that was seen was in the left leg, despite the pain
in the right leg.

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and the clot was sort of still there.

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So I was on Xarelto for a while.

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mainly, and then it seemed like the clot was stable.

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So after, know if was like six or nine months or a year or something, went off for like a
month.

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They checked my D dimer and then that was still a little elevated.

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And the whole time my hematologist would say, well, it's risk versus reward.

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You know, we keep you on it because the reward outweighs the risk.

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You know, so each time we went through, was a shared decision making thing very much.

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so then I went back on for a while.

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And so was, I was on totally for like two years and then finally was off because the, the
DVT and the, the cap seemed fine and everything like that.

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Did you have any concern about coming off of it?

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yeah.

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Cause I mean, when you, when you're on the, anticoagulant, at least it's like, you know,
90, 90, whatever, 5 % of people aren't going to have a recurrence applied.

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So it's not a hundred percent, but at least you realize while you're on it, you're,
you're, have.

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very good protection.

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Yeah.

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Cause so I wasn't that worried about recurrence of my prostate cancer because if I had a
prostate cancer recurrence, you know, more than likely, yeah, I'd have to go through

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radiation or, but in terms of it killing you probably would take a while versus you get
another blood clot and you could drop dead.

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So the, the blood clots were, were almost kind of a, and that I wasn't expecting.

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Like when I was told I had prostate cancer, I'm like, well, I this day was going.

212
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Cause a lot of people say they hear they have cancer and they don't hear what the doctor
says.

213
00:15:51,348 --> 00:15:56,938
I remember every word he told me, because I knew that that more than likely was going to
happen.

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it wasn't, but the blood, having getting the blood clots, that was unexpected that I
didn't, expect would happen nor potentially realize the potential lethality of.

215
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You know, have it having a blood clot.

216
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think the conference we were at, I believe they had said 20 % of cancer patients get a
blood clot at some point.

217
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in time.

218
00:16:19,122 --> 00:16:28,986
Yeah, it's the second leading cause of mortality for cancer patients behind the cancer
itself, which is mind boggling when you think about it.

219
00:16:28,986 --> 00:16:31,347
Especially pancreatic, guess, is especially high.

220
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Yeah, there are certain that are higher risk.

221
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Yeah, I was in the same camp.

222
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Like once I started actually doing my research and I'm a researcher by training.

223
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So I was like, my God, these numbers.

224
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And then, you know, I realized how very lucky I was and how very lucky I was that I got
treated relatively quickly.

225
00:16:48,942 --> 00:17:01,626
also, so one of the things I also wanted to touch on, you've had time to kind of reflect
upon all of this and like you got treated at, for your cancer at MSK, which is a world

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renowned institution.

227
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You live in a metropolitan area or close to it, so you can get access to healthcare.

228
00:17:08,287 --> 00:17:15,910
You've been a real proponent of your own health, which I think is just so critically
important for people, especially if there's a family history.

229
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So you have this platform now.

230
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What do you say to people and men in particular about getting real about your own
healthcare?

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If you know there's a family history of something, you know, how do you deal with it?

232
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Like recommendations to Joe Q public about your health, your own healthcare journey.

233
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Cause you really took control of yours.

234
00:17:41,222 --> 00:17:42,422
Yeah.

235
00:17:42,422 --> 00:17:47,896
Well, my other brother who didn't have, who hasn't had prostate cancer, he started, has a
saying.

236
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how would you like your pain now or later?

237
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And later is usually worse.

238
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So it's easy to put your head in the sand.

239
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And I've done it.

240
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Everybody's done it.

241
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I don't want to worry about that later.

242
00:18:02,218 --> 00:18:09,754
But ultimately catching something earlier is going to be more treatable, less painful or
whatever.

243
00:18:09,754 --> 00:18:17,272
I think if it's something at some point when you finally realize, you know, I need to get
this looked at, know, because if you don't, it's

244
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you know, it's going to be worse later on as you do things.

245
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So if, at least if you think of the, I want less pain now or more pain later, you know?

246
00:18:24,778 --> 00:18:27,591
But the prostate it's, it's so interesting.

247
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You know, that is something that men should be aware of.

248
00:18:30,193 --> 00:18:33,816
And you know, you are out there, you know, advocating for awareness.

249
00:18:33,816 --> 00:18:44,584
So, you know, you've kind of, don't know if you're the reluctant advocate now or you're
being dragged into it by a national blood clot Alliance, Memorial Slung Kettering, but you

250
00:18:44,584 --> 00:18:45,100
know,

251
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Where do you see this going?

252
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You've got, like I said, you've got a platform.

253
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People want to hear a story.

254
00:18:49,751 --> 00:18:56,853
You have the ability to help influence people think about their health journey in a really
good way.

255
00:18:56,853 --> 00:18:59,294
Like, how do you see this developing for you?

256
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From the blood clot standpoint or?

257
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All of it.

258
00:19:02,535 --> 00:19:09,277
I mean, from hereditary cancer, I also volunteered force facing hereditary cancer
empowered.

259
00:19:09,277 --> 00:19:14,538
So I'm already doing a lot of stuff with them in terms of the hereditary cancer and the
things.

260
00:19:14,542 --> 00:19:21,268
So I think it's something like 10 % of cancers are hereditary and usually hereditary is
early onset.

261
00:19:21,268 --> 00:19:25,892
The average is like 66 for prostate cancer and early onset is before 55.

262
00:19:25,892 --> 00:19:32,849
Much like women would breast or ovarian, know, C-carp cancer in the thirties or ovarian in
the forties and whatnot versus at older ages.

263
00:19:32,849 --> 00:19:36,742
So I definitely, you know, work in that camp.

264
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And the problem is like on the prostate cancer, and there's a lot of this.

265
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it's over treated.

266
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We don't need to screen anybody, which if you're at average risk or normal risk for a
disease, that may be quite true.

267
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You're at average risk.

268
00:19:52,043 --> 00:19:56,757
Maybe we don't need to screen, but if you're a high risk individual for whatever the
disease is.

269
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you know, my case, the blood clot was more a complication of surgery.

270
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There are people that have clotting disorders that put down that risk for that.

271
00:20:04,493 --> 00:20:10,388
So certainly, you know, if, if, if you're in a family where there's a hereditary history
of

272
00:20:10,476 --> 00:20:19,610
of DBTs or PEs and whatnot, that's probably something that, you know, to be aware of, you
know, whether it's, you find out, you have this disorder or not?

273
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Cause that is one thing the hematologist said when they checked me and said, yeah, we did
all the tests on your blood and you don't have any pre, you don't have a predisposition to

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blood clots.

275
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At that point, I wasn't necessarily aware of, okay, what are all these different disorders
and so forth.

276
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Once you have one of those clotting disorders, you know, most people are going to know it
a lot.

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00:20:38,894 --> 00:20:39,894
You know, more readily.

278
00:20:39,894 --> 00:20:42,444
So once she said I did, I wasn't predisposed to it.

279
00:20:42,444 --> 00:20:49,534
really didn't give that end any more thought, but, certainly fear of recurrence of the
blood clots occurring.

280
00:20:49,534 --> 00:20:55,414
anytime I'd have like some soreness or pain in my calf or my thigh, you know, it's like,
this it again?

281
00:20:55,414 --> 00:20:58,594
Is that said again, emergency room, am I overreacting?

282
00:20:58,594 --> 00:21:04,728
Am I, so needless to say, you know, a few cases I made the point of my hematologist.

283
00:21:04,834 --> 00:21:12,790
you know, a couple of days later, then you should you be waiting days by thought, well, I
don't think it's urgent, you know, cause anytime anything happens, you think, do I need to

284
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go to my, local doctor in a couple of days?

285
00:21:15,692 --> 00:21:17,613
Should I go to an urgent care center?

286
00:21:17,613 --> 00:21:21,026
Do I need to go to an emergency room or somebody you're with?

287
00:21:21,126 --> 00:21:29,222
So you always kind of run through what's the appropriate thing, you know, or do you take
two aspirin and call your doctor and, know, the famous take two aspirin and call your

288
00:21:29,222 --> 00:21:30,273
doctor in the morning.

289
00:21:30,273 --> 00:21:32,404
So you always sort of look at.

290
00:21:32,490 --> 00:21:37,793
where do things appear to be and what's the right step to take and so forth.

291
00:21:38,334 --> 00:21:49,022
So yeah, there's a few times where I'd end up, and probably more than a few times, like
after an airline flight, my heart rate was up.

292
00:21:49,102 --> 00:21:50,626
Yeah, I had PEs before.

293
00:21:50,626 --> 00:21:54,770
So it's like, okay, well, we just want to rule it out because you've had it before.

294
00:21:54,770 --> 00:22:00,514
You were just on a long flight, even though I wasn't presenting with any leg pain or
whatever.

295
00:22:00,514 --> 00:22:05,715
The elevated heart rate was enough that, you know, they did a quick CTA to go, no, there's
no P E's in there.

296
00:22:05,715 --> 00:22:07,156
You're, okay.

297
00:22:07,156 --> 00:22:13,375
So it's certainly, I think once you've had a blood clot and everyone I run into any of
the, you've had a blood clot already.

298
00:22:13,375 --> 00:22:14,228
That puts you at higher risk.

299
00:22:14,228 --> 00:22:15,478
You could get another one.

300
00:22:15,478 --> 00:22:26,021
So any medical professional I've been to is at least been aware that because I've had one,
their radar goes up and immediately that, you've had a word clock before and they're

301
00:22:26,021 --> 00:22:28,682
taking it seriously as to do we need to rule it out?

302
00:22:28,682 --> 00:22:30,462
Is it something that's going on?

303
00:22:30,510 --> 00:22:31,730
or whatever.

304
00:22:32,750 --> 00:22:39,170
and then I think I told you, or I talked about, it was like, I think a highly weeks after
the surgery or whatever.

305
00:22:39,170 --> 00:22:46,330
And I was at home and I felt a twinge in my thigh three seconds later, a twinge in my
lung.

306
00:22:46,550 --> 00:22:52,870
And all of a I started like blacking out and I thought, you know, cause it's like, well
the blood clot let loose.

307
00:22:52,870 --> 00:22:53,990
just went to my lung.

308
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:59,100
And, again, was that more of a vasovagal thing where you like talked yourself into

309
00:22:59,158 --> 00:23:02,009
And I was starting to go out and I thought I was dying at that point.

310
00:23:02,009 --> 00:23:03,370
It was really, it was kind of scary.

311
00:23:03,370 --> 00:23:06,101
And then it went away and I was fine.

312
00:23:06,101 --> 00:23:11,333
It's like, you hold your breath too long, you get a little lightheaded and then you, so,
and then I was fine.

313
00:23:11,333 --> 00:23:14,724
was thinking, my God, what was that?

314
00:23:17,066 --> 00:23:19,047
I mean, I actually called my hematologist office.

315
00:23:19,047 --> 00:23:20,917
It was kind of late and I forget what they said.

316
00:23:20,917 --> 00:23:23,128
And ultimately, yeah.

317
00:23:23,128 --> 00:23:25,489
Cause again, do I go to an ER right now?

318
00:23:25,489 --> 00:23:27,000
And it just seemed it come into.

319
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,873
came and went and I just kept an eye and it was kind of okay.

320
00:23:29,873 --> 00:23:38,871
So, you know, I did evaluate sure I've been going to an emergency right then and there,
but because it kind of came and went, it didn't seem to be, I forget if we had the white,

321
00:23:38,871 --> 00:23:40,343
the Apple watchers and now it's good.

322
00:23:40,343 --> 00:23:41,864
look at the Apple watch.

323
00:23:41,864 --> 00:23:45,407
So every time I go on Mary hat and my heart rates always elevated.

324
00:23:46,128 --> 00:23:47,890
Hey, hey, I love.

325
00:23:48,142 --> 00:23:48,842
All right.

326
00:23:48,842 --> 00:23:50,082
My heart rate's 104.

327
00:23:50,082 --> 00:23:51,512
I'm sitting on the train.

328
00:23:51,512 --> 00:23:53,302
Is anything going on here?

329
00:23:53,302 --> 00:23:56,122
And then I do my thing and I come back and then my heart rate back down.

330
00:23:56,122 --> 00:24:04,202
So I'm at least used to, if I go into Manhattan, you're usually, you know, it's hustle,
buffle, what fought for, you know, crime.

331
00:24:04,202 --> 00:24:07,542
So I don't know if your adrenaline's up a little bit.

332
00:24:07,662 --> 00:24:08,302
certainly yeah.

333
00:24:08,302 --> 00:24:14,892
Any heart rate being up, that's of course more of the pulmonary embolism than a DBT.

334
00:24:14,892 --> 00:24:17,974
You know, so you're aware of these things to know to be on the lookout.

335
00:24:17,974 --> 00:24:29,652
So, it can always be a little, like, like I said, I had a bigger fear of a blood clot
recurrence and dying from that than a prostate cancer recurrence.

336
00:24:30,013 --> 00:24:41,691
That's why, know, your voice is so important to, know, to us in the thrombosis world,
because you've experienced it and you can talk about it talk about it, but until you

337
00:24:41,691 --> 00:24:43,414
actually experience it, it's a different.

338
00:24:43,414 --> 00:24:44,735
It's a different story altogether.

339
00:24:44,735 --> 00:24:56,004
So, you know, I think it's important that because VTE, these blood clots, you know, I
often refer to them as sometimes they're the bride and sometimes they're the bridesmaid,

340
00:24:56,014 --> 00:24:56,469
i.e.

341
00:24:56,469 --> 00:25:05,772
they attach themselves to other things like cancer, you know, using your voice to say,
hey, I had prostate cancer, but I also had this.

342
00:25:05,772 --> 00:25:13,638
And you guys should also just be aware of this in the event that, you know, you have
surgery or what have you, just to make people aware because that will save lives.

343
00:25:14,188 --> 00:25:20,934
And also, you know, if you feel a twinge and you were smart, you know, like go to the
doctor, go to the emergency room.

344
00:25:20,934 --> 00:25:25,151
I'm like, I'm glad I eventually went because my outcome could have been a lot worse.

345
00:25:25,151 --> 00:25:29,092
And I was the person who was trying to talk myself out of there was something wrong.

346
00:25:29,092 --> 00:25:31,328
And there was something wrong.

347
00:25:31,328 --> 00:25:38,105
I didn't know what it was, but I think, you know, always err on the side of caution and
rule it out.

348
00:25:38,105 --> 00:25:41,778
Just like you were saying, do you want your pain now or do you want your pain later?

349
00:25:41,778 --> 00:25:43,176
And later's work.

350
00:25:43,192 --> 00:25:44,494
But later is always worse.

351
00:25:44,494 --> 00:25:46,628
Usually it is always worse.

352
00:25:46,628 --> 00:25:47,648
So,

353
00:26:17,442 --> 00:26:20,124
Michael, just want to say thank you so much for joining us here today.

354
00:26:20,124 --> 00:26:24,588
Your story is amazing and then we're so happy that you're okay.

355
00:26:24,588 --> 00:26:27,881
And also thank you for helping us to raise blood clot awareness.

356
00:26:27,881 --> 00:26:38,519
It's so important to have people like you doing so and in particular to have men who are
willing to share their stories because your story will share, will save lives.

357
00:26:38,562 --> 00:26:39,321
Thank you.

358
00:26:39,321 --> 00:26:46,336
It is my pleasure and usually, you know, everyone wants to hear about my prostate cancer
stuff and the blood clots like a

359
00:26:46,488 --> 00:26:48,399
yeah, I some blood clots, but it worked out okay.

360
00:26:48,399 --> 00:26:53,210
So it's kind of interesting to actually now have a platform to actually discuss that part
of things.

361
00:26:53,210 --> 00:27:00,242
Cause not everybody's necessarily aware, especially if you have 20 % of cancer patients
having blood clots at some point.

362
00:27:00,763 --> 00:27:10,055
I don't know the percentages of how many become fatal P E's necessarily, but at least, I
guess the lucky thing, if you know you're in a high risk group, you can look out for it.

363
00:27:10,055 --> 00:27:11,666
So it's, tougher if.

364
00:27:12,354 --> 00:27:14,318
you get a blood clot for no reason at all.

365
00:27:14,318 --> 00:27:15,701
You don't, you don't understand.

366
00:27:15,701 --> 00:27:21,724
So at least if you know you're in a high risk group, can try to be aware or monitor or
whatever you need to do.

367
00:27:21,724 --> 00:27:23,277
Awesome.

368
00:27:23,277 --> 00:27:24,298
Thank you.

369
00:27:27,084 --> 00:27:32,855
We want to thank Michael once again for sharing his experience and vulnerability here
today.

370
00:27:32,874 --> 00:27:35,426
A special thank you to the exquisite Dr.

371
00:27:35,426 --> 00:27:40,318
Avi Leder from Memorial Sloan Kettering for his impeccable expertise.

372
00:27:40,498 --> 00:27:45,659
Thank you for joining us here today on another episode of Taking a Breath.

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00:27:45,659 --> 00:27:52,961
For more information on risk prevention and community, please visit stoptheclock.org.

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00:27:52,961 --> 00:27:56,290
We know the patient because we are the patient.

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00:27:56,290 --> 00:28:01,192
Together, with listeners like you, can collectively stop the clock.

376
00:28:13,036 --> 00:28:15,970
Another Everything Podcast production.

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00:28:17,333 --> 00:28:22,021
Visit everythingpodcast.com, a division of Patterson Media.

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00:28:22,021 --> 00:28:24,644
Subscribe wherever you get your podcast.