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Before we get into today's conversation,
I wanna let you know about something

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that's grown into an extremely powerful
part of what we do at Silver Core,

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00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:26,340
our members only community, the Silver
Core Club Club members not only get

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access to exclusive discounts and
early access to year and events,

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they also get access to the outpost.

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Our private podcast is where I go
deeper, I share lessons learned, I

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answer member questions, and bring
in guests to explore topics we don't

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always cover in the public show.

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It's real, it's personal, and
it's built to add value to your

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journey outdoors and in life.

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Here's a review from Silver
Court Club member Ray.

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Each episode of the Silver Court Outpost
feels like opening a small mystery box

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filled with insights, practical wisdom,
and a unique perspective on life.

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All framed through the
lens of the outdoors.

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One of the most impactful elements
of the outpost is how each episode

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ends with a call to action.

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These weekly challenges invite
you to step outside your routine,

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try something new, and shift your
perspective in a meaningful way.

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They've helped me change how I
approach my time in nature and how

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I reflect on my personal growth.

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Having access to Travis's mentorship
through the outpost is invaluable.

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His insight, knowledge, and wisdom
come through in every episode, and his

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ability to connect outdoor experiences
to larger life lessons is very powerful.

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If you're looking for a podcast
that's quick, thoughtful, and

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transformative, he should definitely
give the Silverado Post to listen.

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Thanks Ray.

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Members can find their personal private
link in the Silver Core Club dashboard.

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If you're not already a member,
you can learn more@silvercore.ca.

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Now, without further ado, let's head
into this conversation with Ron Speller.

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I'm joined today by someone who
spent a lifetime paying attention to

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animals and to l landscapes, and to
the quiet lessons you only hear when

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you're still enough to notice 'em.

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He's walked wild ground over
six continents with a rifle in

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hand, and a story in his mind.

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For over 45 years, he's written thousands
of articles, hosted shows, tested

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gear, and taught generations of hunter.

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But none of that explains
the person behind it.

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And that's who I'm looking forward
to hearing from today, where

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it started, what's changed, and
maybe if we're lucky, a few of the

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moments it still catch his breath.

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Welcome to the Silver
Core Podcast, Ron Smer.

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Oh, Travis, that was a
remarkable introduction.

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I'm almost starting to
like myself after that.

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I love it.

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Well, I mean, you've got a
larger than life personality

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and persona and it precedes you.

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And you know, I'll be honest,
you're an inspiration.

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I'm sure you've heard this by from many
people before, but I'll say it again.

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You're an inspiration to me in the way
that you can story tell so eloquently

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the ethical storytelling and hunting.

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Um, your constant pursuit
of knowledge is inspiring.

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The fact that you're never resting on
your laurels, you're always looking

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at ways that you can improve and,
you know, maybe learn something else.

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And the amount of integrity and clarity
that you bring into everything you do.

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Massively inspiring.

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So thank you for all of that.

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Well, thank you for, for, uh,
recognizing that I try to do that.

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Of course, uh, how well I succeed is up
to folks who are listening to me, but that

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kind of is my intent, you know, after all
these years of being in this game that

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I think I, I have something that I have
learned, the information I've accumulated

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and experiences that I've had that I think
can help inform, maybe inspire others.

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And I certainly want to
pass that on because.

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Anyone who has the, the passion I have
always had for outdoors, for nature,

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for wildlife, for the pursuit thereof.

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And I, I would just like to help 'em out.

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Help 'em out.

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Anything I can do to help folks out.

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That's kind of what's
driving me these days.

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Where did you first learn
that you had this passion?

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For, and this talent for
storytelling and being able to

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relate your passion to others.

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Yeah.

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That actually came from a high
school English teacher, ah, good

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old Dwayne Sra, uh, rest his soul.

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He was a great guy and he
was a hunter and a shooter.

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And he lived just across the street
from where I lived when I was in,

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uh, grade school up into high school.

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And he had the reputation for
being a real hard teacher.

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He had just made him toe
the line, which was great.

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Uh, most of us students really
appreciated it because he saw in us

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some potential and that he had insisted
that we live up to our potential.

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So it was really quite effective.

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So when I started writing papers for his
classes, he would write in the margins.

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You've got away with words.

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Um huh You ought to consider being
a writer and stuff like that.

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Of course, he would catch me in class
with a. Field of Stream or sports of Field

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Magazine put my textbook in the front of
it to disguise it so he knew what I was

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up to, and he, he just knew that I was
taken with this stuff and he one day said.

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He pulled me aside and said, you know,
you ought to think about a career as

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an outdoor writer and I, a career as an
outdoor writer from a small town farm kid.

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Well, what's that?

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You know?

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Right.

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But of course, I recognize names like
Jack O'Connor and Elmer Keith and

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all the old school guys, and he said,
yeah, those people are being paid to

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write those stories you're reading
all the time in those magazines.

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So maybe you could do that given your your
gift here for communicating and writing.

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So that's what planted the seed for me.

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Now the rest of it was
just innate in nature.

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Uh, my appreciation for it, I don't
know how anyone comes up with this.

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I always say it's an istic urge left
over from caveman days or something,

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but I just think it's part of the human
condition to, uh, ex to experience nature

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in a personal way and to be moved by it.

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I don't know if you have
ever read Aldo Leopold?

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He is a Yeah.

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Some yes.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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His, um, sand County
Almanac book That's right.

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Really captured me in high school.

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I read that and it was
like he was speaking to me.

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He and I had the same philosophies, the
same spirit about this interconnection

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between ourselves and nature.

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He talked about the thrill of goose
music and what it did to your soul.

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Mm-hmm.

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All of those wilderness experiences
that I'm sure you're aware of too.

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And most hunters have that at their core.

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I think that's what pulls us into it.

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Hunting isn't.

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I wanna go kill a big animal, an
animal and and thump my chest so

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much as I want to be an integral
part of this whole natural

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experience the way all wildlife is.

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We are essentially wildlife ourselves.

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We are subject to the same laws of
nature as every sheep and deer and

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chickadee, and, and mouse out there.

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And we cannot live without them.

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They cannot live without us.

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We're all part of that same cycle of life.

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So I think that's what hunting and
fishing are about, is trying to connect

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closer and closer to that whole program.

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Did you realize that when you first
started out or is that something that

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you kind of realized later in life?

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You know, I think it was sort of inherent
or innate in me and my education and

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readings of people like loophole.

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Uh, that just cemented it for me.

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It confirmed it, it helped me articulate
it myself, but I had this incredible

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urge deep inside me that I just had
to get out, you know, in high school.

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Yeah, I stopped doing all sports because,
well, the boys and my friends were

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out in the football field practicing.

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I was hunting pheasants.

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Mm-hmm.

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And to me that was way more important.

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You know, I'm, I remember
this, um, same ilk.

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Uh, I didn't get into hunting
until a little later on.

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I was fishing, uh, family had a
commercial fly fishing lodge in mm-hmm.

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Uh, central British Columbia area here.

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And I say commercial fly fishing lodge.

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It was purchased as a lodge.

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It was flying or hiking access only.

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Uh, and had a commercial license
that we held on it, but we

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never ran it commercially.

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We let scout groups use
it, and that was about it.

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So I would spend a fair bit of time
out fishing and as a youngster I would.

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I guess I'm gonna do air brackets.

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I would hunt grouse because I
had no idea what I was doing.

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I had no idea about hunting licenses.

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I had no idea about seasons
or any of this other stuff.

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I'm glad I figured it
out later on in life.

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But, um, uh, but I knew I just,
I loved being out in the woods

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and that connection to nature.

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And it isn't if I was successful
getting a fish, although they're,

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when you're younger, there's always
like, Hey, who's got the biggest fish?

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And who's got, who's got the most?

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And, uh, but I, that only lasts so long.

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Once, once you get a big one or
once you get a big haul or whatever,

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it might be like, well, that isn't
the thing that keeps me out here.

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That was maybe something that originally,
uh, appeared to be aspirational

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based on what we see on social
media, what we see written about.

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But it's that deepening of our connection
with our natural environment that, uh, I'm

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constantly learning when I'm out there.

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That really, really drives me.

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Yeah.

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Uh, that's exactly it.

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And I think so many people
listening to this will understand

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that a few probably won't.

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I know people who just, you know, you
could show them the, uh, the world's

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biggest Moose or, uh, watch that
Peregrine Falcon stoop down and hit a

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shorebird or something, and they go,
eh, let's go to town and have a beer.

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Yeah.

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They just don't, they just
don't have it within them.

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But, um, that's okay.

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We've got room for everybody, but you
can't drag me out of the country and

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show me into the city is not gonna work.

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Yeah.

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Well, I'm, I'm too close
to the city right now.

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I'm actively looking out, out outwards,
but, um, that, that's another story.

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Um, so you've spent most of
your life chasing wild things.

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Yeah, pretty much.

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What is it that you've truly been chasing?

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If you're to sit down and look back and.

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Yeah, great question, Travis.

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Great question.

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What I've been chasing is essentially
myself, my own identity, which is

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so wrapped up in all of this stuff,
but I've also been chasing beauty,

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for lack of a better term, and
that encompasses everything within

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nature that is so perfect in its in
its blood and gore as well as its.

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Blossoming.

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Mm-hmm.

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Everything from wild flowers
to wildlife to a storm.

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If you read, uh, Muir, uh, writing
about the glories of being up

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in a tree in a big wind storm

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mm-hmm.

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Yosemite and how he was rejoicing at
the pelting of the rain and the howling

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of the wind, and celebrating what
most of us would hide from, didn't get

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away from the discomfort, but he felt
that even deeper than I probably do,

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because he was out in that nasty stuff.

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Just thinking this is all a part of this
incredible glory then, and that probably

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extends beyond ourselves, beyond our own
nature here on earth and into the cosmos.

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I think it's that the vibration
of the cosmos, if you look into

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string theory and all the latest
scientific things about what.

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Adams truly are, and what keeps things
going, and it's all vibrations of energy.

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Mm-hmm.

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And we are parts of that,
manifestations of that sort of thing.

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It's a, it's the, the
great cosmic mystery.

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It's, it's discovering God and,
and the, the goodness of it.

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Um, and it's, as you said
earlier, it's a constant search.

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00:12:01,905 --> 00:12:04,695
You don't just get there and
say, okay, figured it out.

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Now there's new things
revealed all the time.

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A couple, three years ago or so here on
the ranch, my wife and I bought a small

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ranch property closer to the grandkids
so that we can show, give them the

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opportunity of getting out of the city
and having freedom roam around like I did

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on the farms and stuff when I was a kid.

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So, of course, I'm interested
in this environment that we're.

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Sort of husbanding and trying
to improve some of the old farm

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ground and the overgrazed pastures.

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We're trying to improve those, but
I would go out and look for things.

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What is growing out here?

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What is a native plant
versus an introduced invasive

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species in a weed and such?

230
00:12:42,225 --> 00:12:47,175
And one march with cabin fever raging,
I just had to get out and find something

231
00:12:47,594 --> 00:12:51,015
showing me that spring was coming,
we're getting renewed life and all the

232
00:12:51,015 --> 00:12:54,915
wonderful things we want about spring,
uh, waiting for ice out so I could go

233
00:12:54,915 --> 00:12:56,265
fishing and all that sort of thing.

234
00:12:56,964 --> 00:13:01,074
Uh, and I went up in the hills to look
for the earliest wildflower I could find.

235
00:13:01,074 --> 00:13:04,885
I knew that the, some of these glacier
lilies or fawn lilies were pretty

236
00:13:04,885 --> 00:13:08,814
early and would come out in the snow,
but I'm up where there's just nothing.

237
00:13:08,814 --> 00:13:12,385
It looked pretty desolate, and I
spotted a little white thing on

238
00:13:12,385 --> 00:13:15,175
the ground and I got down close
and looked, and I found a tiniest

239
00:13:15,175 --> 00:13:17,724
wildflower I have ever seen in my life.

240
00:13:17,844 --> 00:13:20,724
And that was commonly called a Turkey pea.

241
00:13:20,724 --> 00:13:24,805
It has a bit of a little rootlet
bulb that apparently turkeys and

242
00:13:24,805 --> 00:13:30,474
other birds will dig up and eat,
or, or something is the, uh, genus.

243
00:13:30,474 --> 00:13:34,165
But it was just an obscure,
wholly obscure little plant.

244
00:13:34,645 --> 00:13:39,895
And I am speaking of a series of blossoms
in a ray seam that probably no more

245
00:13:39,895 --> 00:13:44,515
than an eighth to a quarter of an inch
in size and the entire plant might be

246
00:13:44,515 --> 00:13:47,605
lucky to hit two inches and it blooms.

247
00:13:48,165 --> 00:13:51,885
When there's nothing else going on
and then dies within a couple of

248
00:13:51,885 --> 00:13:53,625
weeks, does its thing, you know?

249
00:13:53,685 --> 00:13:53,805
Mm-hmm.

250
00:13:54,045 --> 00:13:56,954
It's fire pressure and then it just
stores the energy in that little bulb

251
00:13:56,954 --> 00:14:00,555
until the next go around and you,
you look at a little thing like that,

252
00:14:00,765 --> 00:14:05,295
inconsequential little nothing but
to that plant and whatever insects.

253
00:14:05,895 --> 00:14:08,175
Need that plant to feed on.

254
00:14:08,175 --> 00:14:11,714
It's all part of that whole
system, that circle of life.

255
00:14:11,775 --> 00:14:11,985
Mm-hmm.

256
00:14:12,225 --> 00:14:12,344
And

257
00:14:12,645 --> 00:14:17,564
discover something like that to me
is that is as exciting as discovering

258
00:14:17,564 --> 00:14:22,574
that giant ram on the mountain side
with the big dramatic horns curling up.

259
00:14:23,115 --> 00:14:26,925
They're equally fascinating and
interesting just in different dimensions.

260
00:14:27,675 --> 00:14:32,025
You know, it's kind of interesting how
you talk about the vibration of things.

261
00:14:32,025 --> 00:14:38,175
A friend of mine, he's heavy into, uh,
radios and he rebuilds antique Collins,

262
00:14:38,265 --> 00:14:41,084
uh, HF radios and he's like, look at this.

263
00:14:41,084 --> 00:14:44,625
I take this one crystal out and
it oscillates at a circle FA

264
00:14:44,625 --> 00:14:47,834
certain frequency, and I put this
other crystal inside it and now

265
00:14:47,834 --> 00:14:49,365
I can transmit on this frequency.

266
00:14:49,365 --> 00:14:50,385
Over here he says, Trav.

267
00:14:50,820 --> 00:14:52,710
You know, everything
in life is vibrations.

268
00:14:52,710 --> 00:14:54,150
We see things on a wavelength.

269
00:14:54,150 --> 00:14:55,680
We listen on a wavelength.

270
00:14:55,740 --> 00:14:57,660
Everything happening on
some sort of a wavelength.

271
00:14:58,020 --> 00:15:00,600
I'm willing to bet there's some
wavelengths out there that we don't

272
00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:04,800
even really understand that are
affecting us, and people talk about it.

273
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:06,240
John Sinani, he's a futurist.

274
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:10,350
He's been on the podcast and he talks
about operating at a higher frequency.

275
00:15:10,410 --> 00:15:16,710
Um, Sean Taylor, x jtf two friend of
mine, who's, uh, uh, heavily believes

276
00:15:16,710 --> 00:15:21,810
in the, the energy and frequency that we
kind of give off, and he would use that

277
00:15:21,810 --> 00:15:24,330
as a tier one Special Forces operator.

278
00:15:24,510 --> 00:15:28,110
He says, that's gonna sound crazy, but I'd
feel the energy in the room next to me.

279
00:15:28,410 --> 00:15:34,350
And then, uh, Nikki Vandel, she's, um,
was on the TV show alone where they,

280
00:15:34,350 --> 00:15:36,330
uh, have to survive in the Arctic.

281
00:15:36,330 --> 00:15:40,380
And I was chatting with her and
she says, you know, when I go out

282
00:15:40,380 --> 00:15:45,870
into the woods, I will say, hello,
forest, it's me, Nikki, I'm here.

283
00:15:45,930 --> 00:15:47,415
She says, it sounds so corny.

284
00:15:47,815 --> 00:15:48,615
She says, but.

285
00:15:49,365 --> 00:15:53,655
It changes the frequency and all of a
sudden those little brown birds that

286
00:15:53,655 --> 00:15:58,335
would chirp at ya and the squirrels that
chirp at ya, they start, you start to

287
00:15:58,335 --> 00:16:02,175
get on the same wavelength or frequency
that these things are operating on, and

288
00:16:02,175 --> 00:16:06,135
you'll connect with nature and see the
critters that you otherwise wouldn't.

289
00:16:07,530 --> 00:16:09,479
Do you have any thoughts on that?

290
00:16:10,170 --> 00:16:11,790
No, you're absolutely right.

291
00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:16,650
My wife is, has this extraordinary
ability to feel the vibrations

292
00:16:16,650 --> 00:16:18,000
in the room and read the room.

293
00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:21,239
And she will sometimes say
to me, you're so clueless.

294
00:16:21,239 --> 00:16:25,140
Didn't, you know, things go over there
was, you know, feeling blue because her

295
00:16:25,140 --> 00:16:27,810
boyfriend just left her, whatever it is.

296
00:16:27,870 --> 00:16:33,959
And I'm going, duh, I don't know, but put
me out in the woods and it's reversed.

297
00:16:34,890 --> 00:16:36,239
Mm. I'm seeing and sensing things.

298
00:16:36,239 --> 00:16:38,430
And I said, what did you think
of that pheasant over there?

299
00:16:38,490 --> 00:16:39,449
Where, what pheasant?

300
00:16:39,449 --> 00:16:40,199
She didn't see it.

301
00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:44,939
We just drove by this beautiful, gorgeous
pheasant all puffed out, showing off to

302
00:16:44,939 --> 00:16:47,729
his girlfriends and she doesn't notice it.

303
00:16:48,449 --> 00:16:52,290
So we're, we're each tuned into
the vibrations and the frequencies

304
00:16:52,290 --> 00:16:53,910
that are different frequencies.

305
00:16:55,530 --> 00:16:55,984
You know, I've.

306
00:16:56,625 --> 00:17:00,555
In preparing for this, I was looking at
a bunch of your different podcasts and

307
00:17:00,555 --> 00:17:04,755
past interviews, and I see a lot of the
same sort of things coming up and the

308
00:17:04,755 --> 00:17:06,765
same themes, and it got me thinking.

309
00:17:07,845 --> 00:17:11,745
What's something about you
that people don't tend to ask

310
00:17:11,835 --> 00:17:13,275
that they should be asking?

311
00:17:15,135 --> 00:17:16,079
Oh gosh, Travis.

312
00:17:16,335 --> 00:17:17,115
I don't know.

313
00:17:17,115 --> 00:17:20,415
You know, people are
welcome to ask anything.

314
00:17:20,655 --> 00:17:25,515
Um, but I, I, I'm not so full of
myself that I think I can tell

315
00:17:25,515 --> 00:17:27,285
people what they should ask about me.

316
00:17:28,395 --> 00:17:34,065
I, I'm a pretty typical middle of
the road American, I would guess.

317
00:17:34,245 --> 00:17:37,575
Country boy probably
puts me in a category.

318
00:17:37,905 --> 00:17:41,325
Um, I don't like categorizing
anyone because we all have the,

319
00:17:41,625 --> 00:17:45,225
the ability and the right to
become what we want to become.

320
00:17:45,705 --> 00:17:45,885
Mm-hmm.

321
00:17:46,125 --> 00:17:49,305
But I, I am pretty heavily into, um.

322
00:17:49,365 --> 00:17:52,545
A hunt on a shoot straight,
which is our motto.

323
00:17:53,055 --> 00:17:55,965
Um, I think that kind of sums up,
even though it's grammatically

324
00:17:55,965 --> 00:17:59,655
incorrect for an English teacher
to do that, most people get it.

325
00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:00,675
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

326
00:18:01,125 --> 00:18:04,125
And it's, it's the integrity
of whatever it is in life that

327
00:18:04,125 --> 00:18:05,625
you're heavily involved in.

328
00:18:05,865 --> 00:18:10,965
I think you need to do it with integrity
and honesty and try to do it right

329
00:18:11,445 --> 00:18:16,305
while understanding that none of us is
perfect and we probably can't get it

330
00:18:16,305 --> 00:18:23,085
right, but get it right, not just for
yourself so that you can win, but get

331
00:18:23,085 --> 00:18:26,775
it right for the entire enterprise.

332
00:18:27,300 --> 00:18:32,459
And everyone else who may be affected
by or influenced by your actions.

333
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:37,620
So in the realm of hunting,
I, I want to do it right to

334
00:18:37,620 --> 00:18:39,360
honor the tradition of hunting.

335
00:18:39,629 --> 00:18:42,840
We all know that there are plenty
of what we used to call slob

336
00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:44,639
hunters and probably still should.

337
00:18:45,030 --> 00:18:49,139
You know, people who don't quite get it
yet, they're not tuned in and not hearing

338
00:18:49,139 --> 00:18:50,730
the vibrations and all the rest of it.

339
00:18:51,179 --> 00:18:54,179
Um, but you get that
in all aspects of life.

340
00:18:54,179 --> 00:18:57,899
You know, it's the same basic thing,
but I think it's critically important

341
00:18:57,899 --> 00:19:00,990
for hunters to try to strive.

342
00:19:01,575 --> 00:19:06,495
For a higher level of interaction,
uh, and respect for the

343
00:19:06,495 --> 00:19:08,175
wildlife as well as ourselves.

344
00:19:08,175 --> 00:19:09,945
And then the hunting traditions.

345
00:19:10,095 --> 00:19:13,815
If we want to maintain this deep into
the future, I think we have to do that.

346
00:19:14,235 --> 00:19:18,915
Uh, it used to be when we were fewer
and the wildlife were more, we could

347
00:19:18,915 --> 00:19:22,605
get away with some fairly bullish
behavior and over harvest and whatnot.

348
00:19:22,605 --> 00:19:26,475
All it's just like St. Louis and
Clark coming across the continent with

349
00:19:26,475 --> 00:19:28,935
their voyage of discovery in 1805.

350
00:19:29,565 --> 00:19:32,685
They were able to shoot a bison, eat
what they wanted, and then walk away.

351
00:19:33,525 --> 00:19:34,875
Mm. 'cause there were plenty of bison.

352
00:19:35,235 --> 00:19:36,735
Mm. 30, 40 million of them.

353
00:19:36,795 --> 00:19:40,215
And they knew when they walked away from
that, they had taken what they needed for

354
00:19:40,215 --> 00:19:43,875
their nourishment, and then the wolves
and the coyotes and everything else

355
00:19:43,875 --> 00:19:45,645
would clean it up and be thankful for it.

356
00:19:45,735 --> 00:19:49,575
And the whole system worked,
be because it wasn't abused.

357
00:19:49,580 --> 00:19:49,810
Mm-hmm.

358
00:19:50,190 --> 00:19:52,210
Now that we have thousands and.

359
00:19:52,879 --> 00:19:57,590
Probably millions of miles of paved
highways and channelized rivers and

360
00:19:57,590 --> 00:20:03,830
drained swamps and wetlands and cities
spreading across the landscape, and we're

361
00:20:04,370 --> 00:20:08,689
digging up minerals from the soils to
make the world into our image so we're

362
00:20:08,689 --> 00:20:10,340
more comfortable, et cetera, et cetera.

363
00:20:10,850 --> 00:20:14,300
That makes it harder and harder
on the surviving wildlife and wild

364
00:20:14,300 --> 00:20:18,830
places, and I think too many hunters
always go with the, oh gosh, what's

365
00:20:18,830 --> 00:20:20,240
happening with the deer population?

366
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:23,719
We need to kill more cougars so
we can get more deer when the real

367
00:20:23,719 --> 00:20:28,370
issue is what are we doing to shrink
the habitat available for the deer

368
00:20:28,370 --> 00:20:30,439
population or the elk or anything else?

369
00:20:31,639 --> 00:20:32,899
A real crux situation.

370
00:20:32,899 --> 00:20:39,530
But then that that involves some
reflection and we have to say, wait

371
00:20:39,530 --> 00:20:41,479
a minute, what is my role in this?

372
00:20:41,750 --> 00:20:42,949
Maybe I am at fault.

373
00:20:42,949 --> 00:20:45,110
We've met the enemy and he is us.

374
00:20:45,110 --> 00:20:45,110
Mm-hmm.

375
00:20:45,117 --> 00:20:45,294
That's.

376
00:20:46,770 --> 00:20:49,110
So I, I think we do need to do it.

377
00:20:49,530 --> 00:20:53,220
Each of us needs to consider that
because what is the impact we are having?

378
00:20:53,580 --> 00:20:58,199
If I wanna enjoy pheasant hunting, I
have to, can do what I can to contribute

379
00:20:58,199 --> 00:21:02,909
to maintaining enough open lands with
suitable habitat for pheasants, that

380
00:21:02,909 --> 00:21:04,860
we can maintain populations of those.

381
00:21:05,730 --> 00:21:07,645
And that just goes for everything.

382
00:21:07,645 --> 00:21:08,044
Mm-hmm.

383
00:21:08,304 --> 00:21:08,524
And

384
00:21:10,350 --> 00:21:14,580
to me it's, it's fairly simple, but it's
also, I think, extremely frustrating

385
00:21:14,580 --> 00:21:19,860
because I constantly see an increase
in developments, human development and

386
00:21:19,860 --> 00:21:22,290
such, and people become complacent.

387
00:21:22,470 --> 00:21:24,449
It goes back to an old
pop song in the sixties.

388
00:21:24,449 --> 00:21:26,250
You don't know what
you got till it's gone.

389
00:21:26,370 --> 00:21:26,699
Right?

390
00:21:27,179 --> 00:21:27,360
Yeah.

391
00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:32,070
And each generation is born into
a world that is what it is at that

392
00:21:32,070 --> 00:21:33,600
time, and they base it from there.

393
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:34,800
That's their foundation.

394
00:21:35,399 --> 00:21:37,590
So when I was a kid, you
know, the foundation was.

395
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:44,550
Probably one farmstead on every
square mile of ground in Eastern

396
00:21:44,550 --> 00:21:45,960
South Dakota where I grew up.

397
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:48,540
And I just assumed that's the
way the world was everywhere,

398
00:21:48,540 --> 00:21:49,440
pretty much, you know?

399
00:21:50,070 --> 00:21:53,580
And it gave us a lot of room to roam
around and find rabbits and pheasants

400
00:21:53,580 --> 00:21:58,230
and, and dive into the creek and saint it
fer meadows and mud puppies and whatever,

401
00:21:58,590 --> 00:22:00,690
and then start to discover nature.

402
00:22:00,870 --> 00:22:03,930
But now I can go back to those
places and, and there are fewer

403
00:22:03,930 --> 00:22:09,060
farms there, but the ground has been
turned into a monoculture, right?

404
00:22:09,060 --> 00:22:12,240
They've got huge equipment to crop
these fields that you no longer have,

405
00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:17,129
the little side weed patches and brush
piles and things that provided that.

406
00:22:17,475 --> 00:22:19,155
Wildlife that we enjoyed back then.

407
00:22:19,155 --> 00:22:23,685
So now it becomes like ohoh, what's
happened to all the wildlife?

408
00:22:25,185 --> 00:22:29,535
I think there's a, uh, a disconnect
that'll happen from people in their

409
00:22:29,535 --> 00:22:32,895
natural environment, particularly
if they're growing up in an urban

410
00:22:32,895 --> 00:22:36,465
environment and they're just not
exposed to it in the same way.

411
00:22:36,795 --> 00:22:41,264
Now your writing exposes people to
a different aspect, and you started

412
00:22:41,264 --> 00:22:44,655
that, if I'm not mistaken, and I don't
wanna put words in your mouth, but I

413
00:22:44,655 --> 00:22:47,865
think you put five articles out and
they were all five were picked up

414
00:22:47,865 --> 00:22:50,355
right when you first started, and you
just kind of hit the ground running.

415
00:22:51,675 --> 00:22:58,455
And, uh, but now, now people aren't
going into the long form content, uh,

416
00:22:58,455 --> 00:23:00,165
reading it in the way that they used to.

417
00:23:00,165 --> 00:23:03,045
They're not picking up field
and stream and, uh, reading

418
00:23:03,045 --> 00:23:03,825
it in the way they used to.

419
00:23:03,825 --> 00:23:07,125
They're getting all of their information
and tiny little bites through social

420
00:23:07,125 --> 00:23:13,155
media and as long as it can, can kick that
dopamine on and, and, um, attack their

421
00:23:13,155 --> 00:23:15,045
attention for a fraction of a second.

422
00:23:15,870 --> 00:23:20,070
How, how are you finding that transition?

423
00:23:20,070 --> 00:23:24,180
Because you're into this digital
world now and, and how do you help

424
00:23:24,180 --> 00:23:28,920
people connect with their natural
environment and make, make it meaningful?

425
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:34,380
The fact that they, they really should be
considering how we all are interplaying

426
00:23:34,380 --> 00:23:36,660
within the wild creatures and animals.

427
00:23:36,780 --> 00:23:36,990
Yeah.

428
00:23:37,050 --> 00:23:39,510
Great points, great points, Travis.

429
00:23:40,110 --> 00:23:43,350
And you know, I'm not so sure I'm all
that successful at it, but what I have

430
00:23:43,350 --> 00:23:48,330
discovered in doing what I do now, which
is the YouTube channels and a podcast and

431
00:23:48,330 --> 00:23:51,960
some blogs on our website, I'd be write
a few articles for the magazines anymore.

432
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,240
But as you noted, there's
just nobody's reading them at

433
00:23:54,780 --> 00:23:56,220
the rates that they used to.

434
00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:00,600
So how do you reach these people with
anything other than a 32nd soundbite?

435
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,770
Well, that's part of the challenge,
and what I try to do with my

436
00:24:04,770 --> 00:24:07,620
soundbites is make them meaty enough.

437
00:24:08,670 --> 00:24:12,780
I found that I pretty
much have to cater to the.

438
00:24:13,020 --> 00:24:18,600
Uh, interest in cartridges and ballistics
and all the tools that just such a

439
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:20,639
part of being human is, is tool use.

440
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:24,840
Mm. We're enamored of the latest and
greatest tools and high technology.

441
00:24:24,990 --> 00:24:27,540
Look what we're doing right
now, talking to one another a

442
00:24:27,540 --> 00:24:29,040
thousand miles apart and Yep.

443
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:30,540
Like in the same room.

444
00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:31,920
Yes.

445
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,270
I think what we have to do is figure
out how we can use these new medium,

446
00:24:36,930 --> 00:24:39,930
uh, these new media to reach people.

447
00:24:40,230 --> 00:24:44,280
And then as you said, with the shorter
attention spans we've got these days.

448
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,139
How do you get the message across?

449
00:24:46,470 --> 00:24:49,710
I think by tweaking it a little bit.

450
00:24:50,115 --> 00:24:51,045
We can do that.

451
00:24:51,045 --> 00:24:55,305
So what I try to do is if I can
slip a little bit of a conservation

452
00:24:55,305 --> 00:24:59,655
message in with the fun stuff about
the bullets and favorite rifles and

453
00:24:59,655 --> 00:25:01,065
cartridge and scopes and such, Hmm.

454
00:25:01,755 --> 00:25:01,935
Just

455
00:25:02,115 --> 00:25:06,885
try and at least each one of my
broadcasts to have a one or two points

456
00:25:06,885 --> 00:25:11,535
about some conservation issue, whether
it's wildlife in Africa or in the us.

457
00:25:11,865 --> 00:25:17,505
Um, overpopulation issues, overuse,
whatever it is, just to get people to

458
00:25:17,505 --> 00:25:22,095
say, okay, I learned all about the,
uh, six millimeter creed more cartridge

459
00:25:22,095 --> 00:25:24,615
and how fast it goes and how flat
it shoots and all that great stuff.

460
00:25:24,645 --> 00:25:29,805
And oh man, I better get thinking about
all the highway deaths of mule deer

461
00:25:30,045 --> 00:25:31,785
that are reducing those populations.

462
00:25:31,785 --> 00:25:35,325
They can't bounce back because there's
so much traffic now and they're

463
00:25:35,325 --> 00:25:38,505
migrating and they have to cross
these highways and they're taking

464
00:25:38,505 --> 00:25:39,645
out more deer that way than the.

465
00:25:40,305 --> 00:25:42,135
Cougars and the wolves ever took out.

466
00:25:42,315 --> 00:25:42,975
Right.

467
00:25:43,095 --> 00:25:45,645
Maybe I should start thinking about
that stuff, or I won't be able

468
00:25:45,645 --> 00:25:47,445
to use my six millimeter creed.

469
00:25:47,445 --> 00:25:50,265
More on that glorious
hunt I was hoping to take.

470
00:25:50,595 --> 00:25:51,285
No kidding.

471
00:25:51,885 --> 00:25:57,165
Uh, have you noticed a shift in the,
uh, the types of people that are

472
00:25:57,165 --> 00:26:01,035
becoming interested in, in hunting
and learning about their environment?

473
00:26:01,875 --> 00:26:03,290
Yeah, I have it.

474
00:26:03,295 --> 00:26:07,185
It is always a younger crowd kind of
coming up, not as money as they used to,

475
00:26:07,185 --> 00:26:11,565
because hunters are no longer heroes like
they were back in the mid 20th century.

476
00:26:12,105 --> 00:26:12,195
Mm.

477
00:26:12,615 --> 00:26:15,525
But still, there are
enough family connections.

478
00:26:15,525 --> 00:26:16,665
My grandpa hunted.

479
00:26:16,665 --> 00:26:17,745
I, I hear this a lot.

480
00:26:18,285 --> 00:26:22,785
In fact, we just had an elk camp, an elk
bootcamp last week, and several folks

481
00:26:22,785 --> 00:26:27,375
there were in their, Hmm, thirties to
forties hunting for the first time.

482
00:26:27,375 --> 00:26:27,850
They had first.

483
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:31,215
Purchased a rifle and
gotten interested in it.

484
00:26:31,665 --> 00:26:33,314
So they're starting to come around.

485
00:26:33,314 --> 00:26:36,645
Even though, as you said earlier,
there's urban, suburban environments

486
00:26:36,645 --> 00:26:40,364
and growing up that way, you don't
get exposed to grandpa walking out

487
00:26:40,364 --> 00:26:43,034
the back door and coming back with
a brace of pheasants or rabbits.

488
00:26:43,814 --> 00:26:46,455
Mm. So you have to find out about
it somewhere along the line.

489
00:26:46,455 --> 00:26:50,445
And I suspect that they're picking
up a few shorts on the, uh, social

490
00:26:50,445 --> 00:26:53,864
media where they see someone hunt and
it looks exciting to them, and then

491
00:26:53,864 --> 00:27:00,135
they start digging into it and they
will discover websites or YouTube

492
00:27:00,135 --> 00:27:03,705
channels similar to mine, where we're
discussing those sorts of things.

493
00:27:04,215 --> 00:27:06,135
And then they'll start to get interested.

494
00:27:06,135 --> 00:27:11,054
And when they start seeing more and more
footage of wildlife, or especially if

495
00:27:11,054 --> 00:27:15,584
they get out, literally get out into
nature and have a close encounter with

496
00:27:15,584 --> 00:27:20,054
something that really rings a bell for
'em, then they're all excited about it.

497
00:27:20,415 --> 00:27:23,804
And just down that camp we had
here in the mountains, several

498
00:27:23,804 --> 00:27:28,125
people were from the flat land back
East Ohio, that kind of country.

499
00:27:28,544 --> 00:27:32,235
And they thought they knew what country
was like, but they get here and the

500
00:27:32,235 --> 00:27:34,004
mountains are going up this angle.

501
00:27:34,725 --> 00:27:34,995
Yeah.

502
00:27:34,995 --> 00:27:38,655
And they're looking across a big
canyon at something four or 500

503
00:27:38,655 --> 00:27:42,885
yards away and just the whole place
feels like another planet almost.

504
00:27:42,885 --> 00:27:44,145
It's so vast.

505
00:27:44,235 --> 00:27:44,415
Mm-hmm.

506
00:27:45,375 --> 00:27:48,764
And that just exposes them to,
oh my gosh, I've been living

507
00:27:48,764 --> 00:27:50,415
in a cocoon all these years.

508
00:27:50,595 --> 00:27:53,895
They're like butterflies finally
emerging from the chrysalis.

509
00:27:54,465 --> 00:27:58,665
And it just inspiring to, to
listen to them and see the joy

510
00:27:58,665 --> 00:27:59,955
on their faces when they just.

511
00:28:00,870 --> 00:28:05,459
It seems crazy, but it's just that
simple discovery of how big the world is.

512
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:05,909
Mm-hmm.

513
00:28:05,909 --> 00:28:06,854
And they can be a part of it.

514
00:28:07,949 --> 00:28:11,250
You know, I, I think that you
kinda nailed it on the head there.

515
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:16,229
'cause I, I look at when COVID
hit and the, uh, concept of

516
00:28:16,229 --> 00:28:18,479
self-reliance, really kind of Yeah.

517
00:28:18,719 --> 00:28:22,169
Stuck home with people, people like,
I'm gonna start making sourdough bread,

518
00:28:22,169 --> 00:28:25,679
I'm gonna start gardening, I'm gonna
start hunting because that's easy.

519
00:28:25,679 --> 00:28:27,360
I hear, I can get all my food hunting.

520
00:28:27,629 --> 00:28:27,780
Right.

521
00:28:27,989 --> 00:28:28,050
Yeah.

522
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:36,600
Um, and, uh, that was a, a bit of a, I saw
a big boost in the, uh, in the firearms

523
00:28:36,629 --> 00:28:38,459
and hunting industry and interests there.

524
00:28:39,090 --> 00:28:44,760
But more and more I'm looking at how
people are associating with their natural

525
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:48,479
world and vehicles to that are, uh, food.

526
00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:50,580
Like, where's your food coming from?

527
00:28:50,580 --> 00:28:53,729
And they're learning more about, uh,
like we had Malcolm Wood on, he did a

528
00:28:53,729 --> 00:28:59,219
documentary on microplastics and how that
he kind of brought that term to light.

529
00:29:00,135 --> 00:29:04,275
Uh, we've, we've talked about,
like you say, uh, mono crops and

530
00:29:04,275 --> 00:29:07,485
monocultures and, and the impact
that has on our environment.

531
00:29:07,485 --> 00:29:10,785
And I think people can start relating
how they connect with their food.

532
00:29:11,295 --> 00:29:16,005
I think that, uh, people you brought
up, oh, grandpa going out, coming back

533
00:29:16,005 --> 00:29:21,975
with a, a, a brace, that connection
to their history I think is a big

534
00:29:21,975 --> 00:29:23,535
part that people are looking for.

535
00:29:24,015 --> 00:29:27,405
But more than anything, I think they're
looking for a connection because in

536
00:29:27,405 --> 00:29:31,605
this ever connected world where you
and I can talk thousands of miles

537
00:29:31,605 --> 00:29:37,215
apart and, um, we're right, right
here as if we're in the same room.

538
00:29:37,860 --> 00:29:43,500
W there's also a massive degree of
disconnection that, that we have.

539
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,110
Social media isn't a social aspect.

540
00:29:46,110 --> 00:29:51,630
People aren't going out to the local,
um, pubs or local social gatherings

541
00:29:51,630 --> 00:29:52,860
in the way that they used to.

542
00:29:52,890 --> 00:29:57,030
Kids nowadays are being raised and they
have anxiety to go in public because all

543
00:29:57,030 --> 00:29:59,490
of this stuff, they don't even want, they
have anxiety to pick up the phone and

544
00:29:59,490 --> 00:30:03,720
talk because everything's a, a text and
get back, and it's especially formulated.

545
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,740
So I think what most people
are really looking for is a way

546
00:30:07,740 --> 00:30:12,150
to connect to themselves, to
other people and, and to nature.

547
00:30:12,150 --> 00:30:19,440
And I, I think you writing and your
way of storytelling is intriguing

548
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:24,510
for people because they feel that
connection to history and, and to others.

549
00:30:25,605 --> 00:30:26,055
Well, good.

550
00:30:26,055 --> 00:30:27,165
I'm glad to hear that.

551
00:30:27,225 --> 00:30:32,205
Um, I sometimes think when I read
some really good storytellers, I just

552
00:30:32,205 --> 00:30:37,365
think I'm pretty much a piker if some
folks are enjoying it and it helps

553
00:30:37,365 --> 00:30:40,245
inspire them to get out and discover
the things you just talked about.

554
00:30:40,245 --> 00:30:42,195
'cause I think you,
you hit it right there.

555
00:30:42,555 --> 00:30:46,935
They're just as they're afraid to have
real social interactions with people,

556
00:30:46,935 --> 00:30:48,195
they would rather do it on the phone.

557
00:30:48,195 --> 00:30:52,665
I think they're doing the gaming and
watching videos on the phone and think

558
00:30:52,665 --> 00:30:56,265
like, I'm out there hunting an elk because
they're watching someone else see an elk.

559
00:30:56,325 --> 00:30:56,535
Mm-hmm.

560
00:30:57,105 --> 00:31:00,615
When they really get there and
they feel the vibrations up

561
00:31:00,615 --> 00:31:03,045
close and it's the real world.

562
00:31:03,045 --> 00:31:07,995
It's com not completely different, but
it, it brings it all home and they, they

563
00:31:07,995 --> 00:31:11,865
understand I have to become involved in.

564
00:31:12,795 --> 00:31:14,325
Getting these things for myself.

565
00:31:14,325 --> 00:31:15,855
Ke self-sufficiency.

566
00:31:16,155 --> 00:31:16,335
Mm-hmm.

567
00:31:16,935 --> 00:31:20,685
We are big on that because I obviously
out on the ranch here, we, we can grow.

568
00:31:20,685 --> 00:31:24,285
We've got an orchard, we've got a
garden, we cut our own firewood.

569
00:31:24,465 --> 00:31:28,755
We're completely off the grid, so we're
connected, but we're also old people.

570
00:31:28,755 --> 00:31:30,135
You know, we kind of grew up that way.

571
00:31:31,180 --> 00:31:35,295
And I can remember as a kid when
the telephone came into the house.

572
00:31:36,285 --> 00:31:36,316
Oh yeah,

573
00:31:36,735 --> 00:31:37,005
yeah.

574
00:31:37,005 --> 00:31:39,555
At first, I must have been probably
seven years old or something.

575
00:31:39,915 --> 00:31:40,365
And bingo.

576
00:31:40,365 --> 00:31:41,715
This telephone thing up here.

577
00:31:41,775 --> 00:31:42,285
Wow.

578
00:31:43,245 --> 00:31:45,135
Can't imagine a kid
today listening to this.

579
00:31:45,135 --> 00:31:45,885
Going, what?

580
00:31:46,125 --> 00:31:47,565
Yeah, the telephone.

581
00:31:47,565 --> 00:31:51,135
I remember we used to have to
rent our telephone and Exactly

582
00:31:51,195 --> 00:31:52,400
rent it from the phone company.

583
00:31:52,660 --> 00:31:55,485
And if you're lucky, you had a
really long cord on it and you can

584
00:31:55,485 --> 00:31:58,125
kind of sneak into the other room
to have a private conversation.

585
00:31:58,125 --> 00:32:00,795
But if not, you're having your
private conversation in front of.

586
00:32:01,169 --> 00:32:02,820
Everybody who's walking
through the kitchen.

587
00:32:03,419 --> 00:32:03,629
Yeah.

588
00:32:03,659 --> 00:32:07,350
Not only that, when I was a kid, your
private conversation wasn't worrying about

589
00:32:07,350 --> 00:32:11,219
just your family, it was worried about
everyone else who was on that same line.

590
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:11,850
That's right.

591
00:32:13,169 --> 00:32:13,229
Yeah.

592
00:32:13,229 --> 00:32:16,439
The lines where you would have
certain number of rings was yours and

593
00:32:16,439 --> 00:32:19,649
then one shorter ring would be the
neighbor or somebody else on the line.

594
00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:23,070
Everybody would know those rings
and say, oh, let's listen to what's

595
00:32:23,070 --> 00:32:24,659
going on with Ron and his girlfriend.

596
00:32:25,979 --> 00:32:26,610
That's funny.

597
00:32:27,090 --> 00:32:34,739
So if younger you was looking at you
now, what would surprise him The most?

598
00:32:35,459 --> 00:32:36,989
That I still alive.

599
00:32:39,300 --> 00:32:41,280
I should have been dead
several times over.

600
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:41,489
Amen.

601
00:32:42,750 --> 00:32:44,340
I have been blessed.

602
00:32:44,340 --> 00:32:47,280
I mean, God has just really been
looking out for me 'cause I did

603
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:50,939
some of the dumbest things, you
know, guns going off where they

604
00:32:50,939 --> 00:32:52,260
shouldn't have even been loaded.

605
00:32:52,590 --> 00:32:54,989
Uhhuh and, uh, driving.

606
00:32:55,110 --> 00:32:56,939
Oh, in snowstorms.

607
00:32:57,750 --> 00:33:02,490
Where you shouldn't have even been on the
road and going across rivers where you got

608
00:33:02,490 --> 00:33:06,990
sucked over the falls and churned around
a few times before you managed to pop up.

609
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,000
Yeah, I thought I wasn't
gonna get out of that one.

610
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:10,230
Tell me about that one.

611
00:33:10,890 --> 00:33:11,910
That would've surprised me.

612
00:33:11,970 --> 00:33:16,440
I tell you one thing though, that
I'm really grateful for when I was in

613
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,510
college dreaming about all this stuff.

614
00:33:18,510 --> 00:33:20,370
You know, what do you want to be
when you grow up kind of a thing.

615
00:33:20,490 --> 00:33:21,540
And planning for it.

616
00:33:21,540 --> 00:33:24,390
I just, I planned like, I think
I'm gonna try that outdoor writing

617
00:33:24,390 --> 00:33:25,980
thing that my English teacher said.

618
00:33:26,310 --> 00:33:28,980
I think I can maybe make
that work, so I'll try that.

619
00:33:28,980 --> 00:33:31,650
But if that doesn't work,
what am I going to do?

620
00:33:31,650 --> 00:33:34,290
So I picked up a teaching
certificate so I could go into

621
00:33:34,290 --> 00:33:35,670
the school systems and teach.

622
00:33:36,094 --> 00:33:39,604
And that way I would at least
get the fishing season off.

623
00:33:40,060 --> 00:33:40,419
Mm-hmm.

624
00:33:40,500 --> 00:33:40,899
30 months

625
00:33:40,899 --> 00:33:41,501
off in the summer.

626
00:33:41,794 --> 00:33:44,044
Not ideal, but it's better than nothing.

627
00:33:44,225 --> 00:33:44,495
Yep.

628
00:33:45,034 --> 00:33:47,314
Um, so that's what I was planning to do.

629
00:33:48,155 --> 00:33:51,514
And while I was doing that, I was
discovering all sorts of other

630
00:33:51,514 --> 00:33:55,354
things about, and I thought,
I wanna live close to nature.

631
00:33:55,594 --> 00:34:00,425
Ideally I would like to have a 10,000
acre ranch with a river running through

632
00:34:00,425 --> 00:34:04,324
it, butting up against the mountains
in Montana or someplace like that.

633
00:34:04,655 --> 00:34:07,685
And then all that national
forest land beyond.

634
00:34:07,685 --> 00:34:14,165
So I've got pretty much the whole world,
uh, to roam and hunt and fish and not

635
00:34:14,165 --> 00:34:18,154
have to ask permission or pay somebody a
trespass fee and all this kind of stuff.

636
00:34:18,185 --> 00:34:20,855
So obviously it was this
big pie in the sky dream.

637
00:34:21,335 --> 00:34:25,324
But now if I'd have been then
looking at now, I would've said.

638
00:34:26,115 --> 00:34:27,165
My golly old man.

639
00:34:27,165 --> 00:34:28,485
You came pretty close.

640
00:34:29,025 --> 00:34:29,264
Yeah,

641
00:34:29,685 --> 00:34:33,135
because I, I got through
my writing in this career.

642
00:34:33,135 --> 00:34:38,925
I got to visit those places pretty
regularly and hunt in Alaska

643
00:34:38,925 --> 00:34:43,665
and Asia and Australia and New
Zealand and Argentina and all over.

644
00:34:44,235 --> 00:34:47,145
And it's as if I had this giant property.

645
00:34:47,355 --> 00:34:51,525
But now here I am on this small property,
you know, it's not exactly my 10,000

646
00:34:51,525 --> 00:34:57,225
acres, but I've got land and it, it's
mine on which to hunt, run my dogs,

647
00:34:57,525 --> 00:35:01,485
uh, improve the habitat, grow the
gardens, whatever I want to do with it.

648
00:35:01,755 --> 00:35:06,945
So I really feel blessed and
fulfilled at the same time and feel

649
00:35:06,945 --> 00:35:11,775
a responsibility to leave it better
than I found it, improve the land.

650
00:35:11,895 --> 00:35:14,625
And I think that's what a lot
of hunters are doing these days.

651
00:35:14,625 --> 00:35:18,015
You know, you, the big deal with whitetail
hunters especially is to get a piece

652
00:35:18,015 --> 00:35:20,475
of property and manage it for deer.

653
00:35:20,870 --> 00:35:21,259
Right.

654
00:35:21,470 --> 00:35:22,880
Hers or pheasants or something.

655
00:35:22,910 --> 00:35:23,120
Right.

656
00:35:23,390 --> 00:35:27,890
Managing for wildlife, that was unheard
of 50 years ago when I was a kid.

657
00:35:27,890 --> 00:35:31,190
It was all out, how can this
land put money in my pocket?

658
00:35:32,180 --> 00:35:36,110
Mm. That's prior to that, my,
like my grandfather probably,

659
00:35:36,110 --> 00:35:37,820
or the, at least his father.

660
00:35:37,820 --> 00:35:42,350
Before him, it would've been, how
can I use the land just to survive?

661
00:35:42,890 --> 00:35:42,950
Mm.

662
00:35:43,310 --> 00:35:45,200
Folks were essentially
living off the land.

663
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:45,920
They were farmers.

664
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:47,000
What are they farming for?

665
00:35:47,330 --> 00:35:48,590
So they can feed themselves.

666
00:35:48,860 --> 00:35:49,100
Sure.

667
00:35:49,100 --> 00:35:52,520
And then if there's a little leftover,
they can sell that and get a washing

668
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:53,900
machine from, or something like that.

669
00:35:54,975 --> 00:35:58,665
But they were, they had the
chickens, they had the cow for milk.

670
00:35:58,875 --> 00:35:59,325
They great.

671
00:35:59,325 --> 00:36:01,485
Raised a pig for bacon on down the line.

672
00:36:01,485 --> 00:36:04,605
It's just good old fashioned
homesteading sort of things.

673
00:36:05,085 --> 00:36:07,665
But you know, what it's turned into
now, of course, is that you can

674
00:36:07,665 --> 00:36:11,505
specialize with all the big equipment
and you can produce enough food for 40

675
00:36:11,505 --> 00:36:13,335
people, a hundred people, 200 people.

676
00:36:13,335 --> 00:36:17,835
I don't know what farmers claim these
days, but one farmer feeds incredible

677
00:36:17,835 --> 00:36:20,685
number of people and that's what
enables, of course, cities to be there

678
00:36:20,685 --> 00:36:23,895
and people to live in those cities
and have no connection to the land.

679
00:36:24,855 --> 00:36:27,945
Mm. Going into a store and purchasing
the food product ready to eat.

680
00:36:28,035 --> 00:36:28,275
Mm-hmm.

681
00:36:29,085 --> 00:36:33,375
So, I, I, I just think that,
as you said earlier, folks are

682
00:36:33,375 --> 00:36:37,635
discovering there's something missing
within them when they do this.

683
00:36:38,145 --> 00:36:42,795
Um, I don't mind spending a week
or two on a, a vacation in a town

684
00:36:42,795 --> 00:36:44,505
where everything is done for me.

685
00:36:44,565 --> 00:36:47,085
And it's just like, this is kinda easy.

686
00:36:47,385 --> 00:36:47,475
Sure.

687
00:36:47,475 --> 00:36:48,255
Everything's right there.

688
00:36:48,255 --> 00:36:50,835
All they have to do is
pay for it and heat it up.

689
00:36:51,375 --> 00:36:55,395
Uh, but after a bit of that,
it's like, I wanna make my own.

690
00:36:55,395 --> 00:36:55,725
I don't know.

691
00:36:55,725 --> 00:36:57,825
I wanna get my fingernails in the dirt.

692
00:36:58,365 --> 00:37:02,475
And, uh, I was just pulling
carrots yesterday, I of the garden.

693
00:37:02,715 --> 00:37:04,935
There's just something
so satisfying about it.

694
00:37:06,165 --> 00:37:06,645
Yeah.

695
00:37:06,705 --> 00:37:11,235
You know, nothing worthwhile in my
life has ever come easy, and I've

696
00:37:11,235 --> 00:37:12,945
heard others say the same thing.

697
00:37:12,945 --> 00:37:15,615
And when things do come too easy.

698
00:37:16,140 --> 00:37:17,940
I don't find they're that worthwhile.

699
00:37:17,940 --> 00:37:20,190
And I look back at all the
things that really matter.

700
00:37:20,190 --> 00:37:22,980
And you know, we've heard
people talk about type one fun.

701
00:37:22,980 --> 00:37:24,629
Hey K, we're on a rollercoaster.

702
00:37:24,629 --> 00:37:25,170
Lots of fun.

703
00:37:25,170 --> 00:37:28,680
You look back and you say, it
wasn't a memorable time in my life.

704
00:37:29,129 --> 00:37:31,080
Uh, some people talk about type two fun.

705
00:37:31,140 --> 00:37:35,069
Uh, during the time it's got a
pack on my back, all this meat,

706
00:37:35,069 --> 00:37:36,480
it's pouring rain, it's freezing.

707
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:37,859
I can't get a fire going.

708
00:37:38,460 --> 00:37:41,460
But you look back on that and
that sticks in your memory.

709
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:44,879
And that's, then of course, I had one
friend tell me about type three fun.

710
00:37:44,879 --> 00:37:45,810
I said, I've never heard of that.

711
00:37:45,810 --> 00:37:46,410
What is that?

712
00:37:46,410 --> 00:37:48,149
And he said, well, that's when you go out.

713
00:37:48,149 --> 00:37:49,230
And it's just terrible.

714
00:37:49,230 --> 00:37:50,250
It's like your situation.

715
00:37:50,250 --> 00:37:52,109
You talk about I can't get the fire going.

716
00:37:52,740 --> 00:37:55,440
And then you think about it later
years and it's still just as bad.

717
00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:56,850
It's Oh, okay.

718
00:37:56,850 --> 00:37:57,420
Fair enough.

719
00:37:58,529 --> 00:37:59,190
Full circle.

720
00:37:59,940 --> 00:38:00,149
Right.

721
00:38:00,450 --> 00:38:01,259
Fair enough.

722
00:38:02,460 --> 00:38:04,140
I would add this though, Travis.

723
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:10,259
Uh, there have been many things given to
me that I didn't have to work for and, but

724
00:38:10,259 --> 00:38:12,390
it's all pretty much the beauty of nature.

725
00:38:13,154 --> 00:38:17,115
The, the feeling that you get at
certain times, it's just so intense.

726
00:38:17,115 --> 00:38:19,275
You get almost, almost cry.

727
00:38:19,424 --> 00:38:19,515
Mm-hmm.

728
00:38:19,755 --> 00:38:23,355
When you see this incredible
scenery, a mountain and a a, a

729
00:38:23,355 --> 00:38:25,365
rainbow, you get the picture.

730
00:38:25,634 --> 00:38:25,815
Yeah.

731
00:38:25,815 --> 00:38:32,505
There's just certain scenes in places
in life, even wood smoke in the woods.

732
00:38:32,505 --> 00:38:37,335
When you smell it at a certain time,
it just moves you internally so

733
00:38:37,335 --> 00:38:40,185
much you can't quite figure out why.

734
00:38:40,605 --> 00:38:45,134
Um, you does it remind you of home
and, and grandmother back in a

735
00:38:45,134 --> 00:38:48,585
day once when you were a kid and
you really didn't even register.

736
00:38:48,585 --> 00:38:55,154
But that, that scent of wood smoke
means home, hearth, family safety, all

737
00:38:55,154 --> 00:38:58,755
of the things that stirs within you
that you don't necessarily articulate.

738
00:38:59,205 --> 00:39:00,345
And that's like that.

739
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:01,740
With nature.

740
00:39:01,830 --> 00:39:01,920
Mm-hmm.

741
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:02,580
You're out

742
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:08,100
doing your best hunting to see
the, the legal buck that you can

743
00:39:08,100 --> 00:39:11,400
take with your tag or, or a big
one that you've been looking for.

744
00:39:11,460 --> 00:39:15,060
And then you happen to see
something completely different.

745
00:39:15,570 --> 00:39:18,990
Uh, I remember one time I was mule
deer hunting and at the crack of

746
00:39:18,990 --> 00:39:24,240
dawn with the red sky up on the ridge
above me here came a line of elk.

747
00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:28,290
There must have been 40, 50 of
them all in single file Wow.

748
00:39:28,380 --> 00:39:32,940
Silhouette against that red sky and
just going about their business.

749
00:39:33,300 --> 00:39:38,280
And it was the, the, the daily walk to
back to bed or whatever they were doing.

750
00:39:38,340 --> 00:39:42,300
And it was just the magic of that
moment is what I remember about that.

751
00:39:42,390 --> 00:39:45,690
I don't even remember if I shot
a deer on that hunt or even

752
00:39:45,690 --> 00:39:47,340
saw one, but I remember that.

753
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:47,910
Yeah.

754
00:39:48,030 --> 00:39:48,960
And that'll stick with you

755
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:50,760
and he'll stick with you
for the rest of your life.

756
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:51,330
Yeah.

757
00:39:51,750 --> 00:39:52,710
And that was free.

758
00:39:53,010 --> 00:39:53,790
That was a given.

759
00:39:53,790 --> 00:39:56,010
That was just all I
had to do was be there.

760
00:39:56,820 --> 00:40:00,780
Well, that's some of the benefits
of the lifestyle that you've chosen.

761
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,870
Those are some of the benefits of
you putting yourself out there.

762
00:40:03,870 --> 00:40:09,960
Taking that step and being bold and
seeing how far you can take your passion.

763
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:11,670
What are some of the costs?

764
00:40:13,860 --> 00:40:18,990
You know, my particular lifestyle is.

765
00:40:19,245 --> 00:40:23,865
It has a pretty heavy cost for
relationships sometimes, and I

766
00:40:23,865 --> 00:40:25,275
have many friends in the same boat.

767
00:40:25,275 --> 00:40:30,404
When we were really active rider,
outdoor rider, gun rider type,

768
00:40:31,275 --> 00:40:33,255
uh, it involves being away a lot.

769
00:40:33,285 --> 00:40:37,035
You've gotta go on a doll, sheep hunt to
Alaska, you're gonna be gone for a week

770
00:40:37,035 --> 00:40:42,255
or two and the family's at home and, you
know, truck drivers, anyone who does a lot

771
00:40:42,255 --> 00:40:46,395
of work away from home, you've gotta have,
you gotta work at it pretty hard to keep

772
00:40:46,395 --> 00:40:49,154
things going so things can fall apart.

773
00:40:49,545 --> 00:40:56,205
And then there's a little bit of a an
ego, potential ego issue if you start

774
00:40:56,205 --> 00:41:00,255
to think you're somebody important
because there's your story and picture

775
00:41:00,255 --> 00:41:01,755
on a magazine cover or something.

776
00:41:02,234 --> 00:41:04,515
Uh, and, and you could
start to act like a jerk.

777
00:41:04,515 --> 00:41:07,515
And I certainly went through a
more than a short phase of that.

778
00:41:08,085 --> 00:41:09,405
Thinking you're really somebody important.

779
00:41:09,405 --> 00:41:12,375
But when you, you get a little older
and you come to the realization that

780
00:41:12,375 --> 00:41:14,355
you're really no better than anyone else.

781
00:41:14,355 --> 00:41:15,705
You just try your best.

782
00:41:15,705 --> 00:41:19,545
They try their best and you give
everyone the benefit of the doubt.

783
00:41:19,965 --> 00:41:23,325
You turn the other cheek and
you just try to do your best and

784
00:41:23,325 --> 00:41:24,915
help others to do their best.

785
00:41:24,915 --> 00:41:29,115
So now you're working as a team,
or at least as you know, not

786
00:41:29,115 --> 00:41:33,015
antagonistic, you know, it's not a
contest on who did the best, who shot

787
00:41:33,015 --> 00:41:34,515
the biggest and all the rest of it.

788
00:41:35,145 --> 00:41:38,085
Um, once you realize that, it
just becomes a lot more pleasant.

789
00:41:38,325 --> 00:41:38,595
Mm-hmm.

790
00:41:39,255 --> 00:41:42,405
And, and then success is
measured in many ways.

791
00:41:42,405 --> 00:41:46,425
Of course, I can look in the wall and
say, boy, am I ever a great sheep hunter?

792
00:41:46,425 --> 00:41:48,435
Look at the size of that doll
ram up there on the wall.

793
00:41:48,435 --> 00:41:51,615
Every time I look at that baby, I
remember the glacier, we hiked up

794
00:41:51,615 --> 00:41:53,865
and I remember sleeping on the ice.

795
00:41:53,865 --> 00:41:58,905
And I remember, uh, waiting across that
river and all the rest of the adventure.

796
00:41:58,905 --> 00:42:00,345
But, hey, wait a minute.

797
00:42:00,765 --> 00:42:01,725
I had a guide.

798
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:05,310
And I had a packer and they
helped me and they were an

799
00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:07,140
integral part of the operation.

800
00:42:07,500 --> 00:42:11,250
The only real difference was I had
the rifle, they didn't, but otherwise

801
00:42:11,250 --> 00:42:13,770
it's as much their ram as it is mine.

802
00:42:13,830 --> 00:42:14,010
Mm-hmm.

803
00:42:14,250 --> 00:42:14,310
So

804
00:42:14,670 --> 00:42:19,410
that's sort of a humbling, eh, not
really humbling, but just appreciation

805
00:42:19,410 --> 00:42:25,170
for what others have done for you
rather than, well, look what I did.

806
00:42:25,950 --> 00:42:26,340
Yeah.

807
00:42:26,820 --> 00:42:33,000
You know, I was in, um, uh, Nuremberg
and we were, uh, what is it, AWA

808
00:42:33,030 --> 00:42:34,471
over there at the, uh mm-hmm.

809
00:42:34,785 --> 00:42:36,000
At the AWA show.

810
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:40,890
And, um, friend says, uh, Trav,
uh, I want to hook you up with

811
00:42:40,890 --> 00:42:41,790
a friend of mine over there.

812
00:42:41,790 --> 00:42:45,240
He's head of, uh, hunter training
and firearms education for the

813
00:42:45,240 --> 00:42:47,005
Bavarian region and mm-hmm.

814
00:42:47,190 --> 00:42:47,490
Excellent.

815
00:42:47,550 --> 00:42:50,790
Had a good chat with him
and, um, excellent fellow.

816
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:56,850
I. Anyways, learning a little bit about
their culture and, and what it's like.

817
00:42:56,879 --> 00:43:00,390
'cause he's very heavy into the
traditional hunting culture.

818
00:43:00,390 --> 00:43:03,240
And, and I, I talk to my
friend, he's like, yeah, we'll

819
00:43:03,240 --> 00:43:04,350
get you out over in Germany.

820
00:43:04,379 --> 00:43:05,549
We'll do some hunting over there.

821
00:43:05,549 --> 00:43:08,040
He is like, my first hunt,
holy crow, what was that?

822
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:09,000
Ever expensive?

823
00:43:09,029 --> 00:43:10,589
I'm like, okay, well
like, what do you mean?

824
00:43:10,740 --> 00:43:13,710
He says, well, you gotta get all
the traditional attire right.

825
00:43:13,710 --> 00:43:15,210
You gotta wear the, the right gear.

826
00:43:15,240 --> 00:43:16,470
Okay, sure, fair enough.

827
00:43:16,470 --> 00:43:17,040
I get ya.

828
00:43:17,399 --> 00:43:22,710
He says, but when you get your, um, first
buck when you're over there with them,

829
00:43:23,339 --> 00:43:27,629
now you gotta pay for everything, drinks
for everybody, celebrate for every,

830
00:43:27,629 --> 00:43:32,250
it's unlike in North America where the
hunter has looked at, Hey, look at this

831
00:43:32,250 --> 00:43:34,200
great hunter in what he came home with.

832
00:43:34,439 --> 00:43:37,560
When the hunter goes out and they're
successful, they now have to turn around

833
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:41,009
and thank all of the people who brought
them there, the people who helped set

834
00:43:41,009 --> 00:43:44,549
up camp, everybody else who was out
hunting, who had eyes and ears out

835
00:43:44,549 --> 00:43:46,080
and passing intel back and I thought.

836
00:43:46,544 --> 00:43:48,225
Isn't that interesting?

837
00:43:48,779 --> 00:43:54,225
I, I really like that idea behind
celebrating the community and

838
00:43:54,225 --> 00:43:57,075
everybody who made it happen,
because we're not all gonna be the

839
00:43:57,075 --> 00:44:00,495
one with the rifle in our hand, but
we all play a very integral role.

840
00:44:00,944 --> 00:44:02,745
Yeah, that's, that's interesting.

841
00:44:02,745 --> 00:44:06,584
It's part of the, the village tradition.

842
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:07,100
The tribe.

843
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:07,620
Mm-hmm.

844
00:44:07,839 --> 00:44:08,060
The

845
00:44:08,060 --> 00:44:11,415
tribal experience of hunting
when everyone worked for a common

846
00:44:11,415 --> 00:44:13,935
goal with his extended family.

847
00:44:14,595 --> 00:44:17,984
Uh, I think we kind of got away from
that in the States with the pioneers.

848
00:44:18,584 --> 00:44:22,665
Obviously the Native Americans were
doing it, uh, but they had fairly small

849
00:44:22,665 --> 00:44:25,665
tribes, but they all sort of had to
work together and I'm sure there were

850
00:44:25,665 --> 00:44:29,745
better hunters in the group and others
were better at, at setting up camp.

851
00:44:29,745 --> 00:44:33,044
And the women were obviously doing the
cooking and a lot of the grunt work and

852
00:44:33,044 --> 00:44:38,625
such, but everyone had his role to play
and we've kind of gotten away from that.

853
00:44:38,625 --> 00:44:40,605
Once we went off and got our.

854
00:44:41,220 --> 00:44:46,830
160 acres and plowed the ground,
put up the Saudi or the log

855
00:44:46,830 --> 00:44:48,779
cabin and raised our families.

856
00:44:48,779 --> 00:44:50,549
We were sort of individual.

857
00:44:50,549 --> 00:44:53,100
That's always been a big part
of America's individualism.

858
00:44:53,105 --> 00:44:53,464
Mm-hmm.

859
00:44:53,544 --> 00:44:54,029
And that

860
00:44:54,089 --> 00:44:59,310
freedom, which I think is a great
thing, but we really are not isolated.

861
00:44:59,310 --> 00:45:02,580
So the, the sod buster who was out
doing that with his family, he was

862
00:45:02,580 --> 00:45:06,899
probably using a plow made out of iron
or steel that was built by somebody else.

863
00:45:07,740 --> 00:45:10,709
Mm. Mine out of the ground in another
country, you don't realize that, you

864
00:45:10,709 --> 00:45:12,330
know, you think, oh, aren't I sufficient?

865
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:13,169
Well, wait a minute.

866
00:45:13,740 --> 00:45:14,640
Who made the plow?

867
00:45:15,254 --> 00:45:15,544
Yeah,

868
00:45:16,125 --> 00:45:17,105
that's fair point.

869
00:45:17,759 --> 00:45:18,029
Yeah.

870
00:45:18,060 --> 00:45:20,069
And you gotta think
about all those things.

871
00:45:20,069 --> 00:45:23,819
So yeah, it's, it's kind of the tradition,
I think, in America as opposed to Europe

872
00:45:23,819 --> 00:45:27,299
as you were discussing, where we're,
we're still a little bit fresh with that.

873
00:45:27,299 --> 00:45:28,259
Do it yourself.

874
00:45:28,815 --> 00:45:30,855
Attitude and that that way of life.

875
00:45:31,125 --> 00:45:35,205
But obviously now we've gotten
pretty, pretty well away from it

876
00:45:35,505 --> 00:45:38,595
other than the back to the land
movement, the self-sufficiency

877
00:45:38,595 --> 00:45:42,705
movement, which I think is pretty
exciting, I think is a good move.

878
00:45:42,705 --> 00:45:47,175
I think most people should consider, how
much can I do to become self-sufficient?

879
00:45:47,925 --> 00:45:51,405
Uh, we're living in an area, in a
community where we have a lot of

880
00:45:51,405 --> 00:45:56,415
like-minded folks, most of whom
are at least indulging in some

881
00:45:57,015 --> 00:45:58,725
production of their own food sources.

882
00:45:58,815 --> 00:46:01,935
A lot of hunters around here,
obviously, but then we have cattlemen

883
00:46:01,935 --> 00:46:05,745
and some people raise goats and
some people specialize in honeybees.

884
00:46:05,955 --> 00:46:08,625
Some of 'em are doing
sweet corn and orchards.

885
00:46:08,715 --> 00:46:12,105
And when you get to know folks
and you go realize, well, I don't

886
00:46:12,105 --> 00:46:13,725
have to grow everything myself.

887
00:46:13,905 --> 00:46:18,705
You're better at growing cherries
than I would be, so why don't I get

888
00:46:18,705 --> 00:46:22,965
my cherries from you and you can get
your squash from me, or whatever.

889
00:46:22,965 --> 00:46:24,105
We have to trade.

890
00:46:24,110 --> 00:46:24,300
Mm-hmm.

891
00:46:25,530 --> 00:46:30,360
That's a, a useful old fashioned
lifestyle that I think can be

892
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:32,370
done even in suburban areas.

893
00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:35,610
And you get to know folks who
have, they may have a connection to

894
00:46:35,610 --> 00:46:38,520
somebody in the country, but they
also may have it in their backyard.

895
00:46:38,550 --> 00:46:38,700
Mm-hmm.

896
00:46:39,330 --> 00:46:44,070
Have suburban backyards in which you can
grow enough vegetables to probably feed

897
00:46:44,070 --> 00:46:48,420
a family of two for a year or close to
it if you really know what you're doing.

898
00:46:48,540 --> 00:46:48,810
Yeah.

899
00:46:49,290 --> 00:46:52,830
There was a book back in, when I was in
college, five Acres and Independence.

900
00:46:53,220 --> 00:46:57,540
Someone had written about, we live on five
acres and we provide everything we need.

901
00:46:57,540 --> 00:46:57,600
Wow.

902
00:46:58,110 --> 00:47:01,380
Obviously not, not the steel tools,
but the food, they were growing.

903
00:47:01,380 --> 00:47:06,210
They were making honey and maple syrup
and they had rabbits and chickens and

904
00:47:06,210 --> 00:47:10,590
eggs and uh, I think a milk goat or
something like that, but they laid

905
00:47:10,590 --> 00:47:14,880
it all out in this book on how two
people could produce enough to live on.

906
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:16,110
Completely.

907
00:47:16,350 --> 00:47:16,710
Huh.

908
00:47:17,010 --> 00:47:17,490
Acres

909
00:47:17,580 --> 00:47:18,780
might have to give that book a read.

910
00:47:18,780 --> 00:47:19,950
That sounds very intriguing.

911
00:47:20,385 --> 00:47:21,915
Five acres and independence.

912
00:47:21,915 --> 00:47:26,025
Can't remember the authors, but it was
pretty fascinating to me back in the day.

913
00:47:26,475 --> 00:47:29,805
You know, we talk about
independence and individuality.

914
00:47:29,865 --> 00:47:33,345
Uh, my wife and I were in
Sweden and we did a driven hunt.

915
00:47:33,345 --> 00:47:35,235
That was the first time I've
ever done a driven hunt.

916
00:47:35,235 --> 00:47:36,135
That was pretty neat.

917
00:47:36,135 --> 00:47:43,095
We're in historic solar on, and, uh,
it's a, uh, it's a bit of a throwback

918
00:47:43,095 --> 00:47:45,555
for, uh, Sweden, the whole community.

919
00:47:45,555 --> 00:47:50,685
And, uh, the men, the women, they're
all out there hunting and it's a little

920
00:47:50,685 --> 00:47:54,045
different than in North America would
being such a male dominated activity.

921
00:47:54,525 --> 00:47:58,845
But the hive mindedness is, I guess
the best way that I can put it,

922
00:47:58,845 --> 00:48:02,325
the way that they all, they're,
they're a very social culture.

923
00:48:02,715 --> 00:48:07,215
And, um, red Deer goes down and
everyone's working together and get

924
00:48:07,215 --> 00:48:11,265
it on the sled and get it, drag the
thing on out and get it up in one of

925
00:48:11,265 --> 00:48:14,985
the farms hanging up and everyone's
out there working on the different

926
00:48:14,985 --> 00:48:16,790
animals and butchering 'em up and.

927
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,880
It's, uh, it's a very
social sort of event.

928
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:24,510
Very, um, very natural.

929
00:48:24,510 --> 00:48:29,310
And over in North America, I
find there's, uh, this level of

930
00:48:29,310 --> 00:48:35,190
individuality that tends to kind of,
uh, tear, tear our community apart.

931
00:48:35,370 --> 00:48:37,200
Firearms, community hunting community.

932
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:39,060
Well, I'm not a bow hunter.

933
00:48:39,060 --> 00:48:39,810
Forget them.

934
00:48:39,870 --> 00:48:41,880
Well, you know, I'm just
a pistol shooter, right?

935
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:44,940
Forget those, uh, shotguns
or whatever it might be.

936
00:48:44,940 --> 00:48:50,730
And there's this sort of, um, uh, less
cohesive nature that I've, that I've seen.

937
00:48:50,730 --> 00:48:53,190
And I don't know if, I
don't know why that is.

938
00:48:53,220 --> 00:48:53,910
I don't know.

939
00:48:53,910 --> 00:48:58,920
I, I, I have a feeling in Canada,
I see it a lot because in Canada

940
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:00,030
I'm gonna do my air quotes.

941
00:49:00,030 --> 00:49:05,910
Guns are special because you've gone
and done a, um, uh, a two day course and

942
00:49:05,910 --> 00:49:09,030
you've been criminal record checked and
vetted, and not everyone can have it.

943
00:49:09,030 --> 00:49:11,011
And they got all these
rules that apply to you and.

944
00:49:11,460 --> 00:49:16,440
So when you have all of these extra
rules, I see these sub communities go out

945
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:21,480
and they start trying to have some sort
of control over what they're doing and

946
00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:24,180
they create their own rules and mm-hmm.

947
00:49:24,240 --> 00:49:27,630
And I, and I don't know if this is a
level of social engineering that's been

948
00:49:27,630 --> 00:49:32,400
brilliantly put upon to try and divide
things that are looked at as negative

949
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:35,340
guns, hunting the rest by, um, by society.

950
00:49:35,340 --> 00:49:41,970
But I, I can see, um, I can see
work like what you're doing and,

951
00:49:41,970 --> 00:49:46,950
and others in the storytelling and
the connectedness of helping break

952
00:49:46,950 --> 00:49:48,150
down the chinks in that armor.

953
00:49:48,210 --> 00:49:52,080
Like when I look over into the states,
and of course grass is always greener,

954
00:49:52,470 --> 00:49:58,290
but when I look on over, uh, there seems
to be a lot more camaraderie between, uh,

955
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,870
different factions and less divisiveness.

956
00:50:01,260 --> 00:50:01,590
Um.

957
00:50:02,924 --> 00:50:03,705
I'll just throw that out there.

958
00:50:03,705 --> 00:50:03,765
Yeah.

959
00:50:03,890 --> 00:50:08,895
I didn't, I don't know enough about, uh,
your Canadian gun and hunting cultures

960
00:50:09,464 --> 00:50:14,625
to make that assessment, but I do know
that we have a similar issue here with

961
00:50:14,625 --> 00:50:16,450
the, I only shoot a bow, you know?

962
00:50:16,450 --> 00:50:16,569
Right.

963
00:50:16,589 --> 00:50:18,015
I'm a better father than you are.

964
00:50:18,314 --> 00:50:22,274
It's not, some people really
jump on it and they wear it as a

965
00:50:22,274 --> 00:50:26,805
badge of honor, which is sort of
silly, but it, it is part of it.

966
00:50:26,805 --> 00:50:31,785
But what I do notice is there seems to
be a built in negativity, and maybe it's

967
00:50:31,785 --> 00:50:37,004
social media, but I noticed it before
social media came in to a degree, but

968
00:50:37,004 --> 00:50:41,145
it wasn't as blatant and noticeable
because people had to do it face to face.

969
00:50:41,234 --> 00:50:41,535
Right.

970
00:50:41,535 --> 00:50:45,105
If you were out in the raffle range and
you were shooting a, say an auto loader,

971
00:50:45,105 --> 00:50:48,705
and the next guy was shooting an old black
powder muzzle loader, he could climb on

972
00:50:48,705 --> 00:50:53,234
his moral high horse and give you a bit
of a ribbing about how he was the superior

973
00:50:53,234 --> 00:50:56,609
hunter and shooter because you're using
this newfangled high tech stuff, Uhhuh.

974
00:50:57,345 --> 00:50:59,445
That always goes on to a degree.

975
00:50:59,745 --> 00:51:04,215
But what I've noticed on social
media is that people really

976
00:51:04,275 --> 00:51:05,955
go to the hate side of it.

977
00:51:06,075 --> 00:51:06,375
Hmm.

978
00:51:06,375 --> 00:51:06,615
And I

979
00:51:06,615 --> 00:51:11,805
think that's, that's a product of seeing
the hatred on all the political issues.

980
00:51:12,105 --> 00:51:17,625
Nobody can make a comment and say, I have
observed that X, Y, and Z, so maybe we

981
00:51:17,625 --> 00:51:20,415
should consider Z, Y, and X next time.

982
00:51:20,535 --> 00:51:23,085
Mm. It's you worthless blankety blank.

983
00:51:23,085 --> 00:51:25,785
So-and-sos who like the
YZ Xs are full of it.

984
00:51:26,085 --> 00:51:27,435
We're gonna kill you all.

985
00:51:27,585 --> 00:51:27,855
Yeah.

986
00:51:27,855 --> 00:51:29,055
Worthless, blah, blah, blah.

987
00:51:29,325 --> 00:51:30,045
Oh my gosh.

988
00:51:30,045 --> 00:51:31,815
You think, what is
wrong with these people?

989
00:51:32,265 --> 00:51:35,715
But I think part of it is, of course,
they just need to vent whatever

990
00:51:35,865 --> 00:51:37,935
undisclosed anger is within them.

991
00:51:38,055 --> 00:51:40,125
Here's a place where you can spit it out.

992
00:51:40,185 --> 00:51:40,425
Mm. Just

993
00:51:40,935 --> 00:51:45,135
get your anger out there and be as nasty
as you want because you're incognito.

994
00:51:45,855 --> 00:51:47,115
Mm. We see you do it.

995
00:51:47,115 --> 00:51:49,395
Or, or come after you after
you've done it sort of thing.

996
00:51:49,635 --> 00:51:51,135
That spills over into this.

997
00:51:51,135 --> 00:51:54,255
Some of the things I cover,
uh, just the other day we did.

998
00:51:54,465 --> 00:52:00,345
A review, Tate on my channel did a
review of a rifle, I think it was a ra.

999
00:52:00,370 --> 00:52:00,790
Mm-hmm.

1000
00:52:00,890 --> 00:52:01,110
And

1001
00:52:01,310 --> 00:52:04,305
somebody had to write in and
say, why didn't you do a, um,

1002
00:52:04,575 --> 00:52:06,135
a show of Tika in that review?

1003
00:52:06,195 --> 00:52:07,275
That was disgusting that day.

1004
00:52:07,965 --> 00:52:11,355
Well, how can you do a review
of a ra if you use the Tika?

1005
00:52:12,405 --> 00:52:14,655
You wanna see the Tika review go there?

1006
00:52:14,685 --> 00:52:15,045
Yeah.

1007
00:52:15,555 --> 00:52:18,405
But they've just gotta complain
about something and bitch about it.

1008
00:52:18,405 --> 00:52:19,515
It's just crazy.

1009
00:52:19,815 --> 00:52:22,725
And then the worst one is when they
say, oh, that new cartridge they came

1010
00:52:22,725 --> 00:52:24,285
out with, what a piece of junk that is.

1011
00:52:24,285 --> 00:52:25,215
Nobody needs that.

1012
00:52:25,365 --> 00:52:28,725
Why my grandpa's old whatever
is more than good enough.

1013
00:52:28,995 --> 00:52:31,485
You know, they're just gonna, they're
just trying to take your money.

1014
00:52:31,875 --> 00:52:36,135
And I always have to remind these
guys, of course, the ammo and firearms

1015
00:52:36,135 --> 00:52:38,205
manufacturers are doing it to make money.

1016
00:52:38,205 --> 00:52:39,975
That's what's called a business.

1017
00:52:39,975 --> 00:52:40,070
That's right.

1018
00:52:40,425 --> 00:52:40,635
That's right.

1019
00:52:40,785 --> 00:52:43,125
And they're making the
tools that you need.

1020
00:52:43,125 --> 00:52:45,015
Do you really want them
to go outta business?

1021
00:52:45,015 --> 00:52:45,555
That's right.

1022
00:52:46,065 --> 00:52:47,625
Well, whose side are you on here?

1023
00:52:47,685 --> 00:52:47,895
Yeah.

1024
00:52:47,895 --> 00:52:47,985
You

1025
00:52:47,985 --> 00:52:49,515
sound like an anti gunner to me.

1026
00:52:50,235 --> 00:52:50,805
Totally.

1027
00:52:50,805 --> 00:52:52,125
And, and people don't see that.

1028
00:52:52,125 --> 00:52:52,545
I don't.

1029
00:52:53,025 --> 00:52:53,475
Yeah.

1030
00:52:53,565 --> 00:52:58,305
It's, um, being in the business and
having been here for, um, I guess

1031
00:52:58,305 --> 00:53:00,615
1994, I started, uh, training.

1032
00:53:00,615 --> 00:53:06,705
I was in high school at the time, and, um,
I decided I'll try and make a go of this.

1033
00:53:06,705 --> 00:53:09,495
I applied with the local police
department in my early twenties and,

1034
00:53:09,495 --> 00:53:12,615
uh, the Vancouver police, they said,
Hey, you did awesome on the physical.

1035
00:53:12,945 --> 00:53:17,415
You came top on the, um, on the
written, on the, uh, intellect side.

1036
00:53:17,415 --> 00:53:21,135
I don't know what that means,
but, um, but you're young.

1037
00:53:21,135 --> 00:53:22,215
You need life experience.

1038
00:53:22,215 --> 00:53:25,275
I'm like, okay, well I'll do this
thing I've been doing on the side and

1039
00:53:25,275 --> 00:53:28,455
I'll make it into a business and when
that fails because all businesses

1040
00:53:28,455 --> 00:53:31,905
have a high likelihood of failure,
then, then I'll, I'll come on back.

1041
00:53:31,935 --> 00:53:34,545
Well, it never failed and they
ended up becoming a customer and

1042
00:53:34,545 --> 00:53:37,815
I'm doing gun plumbing for them
and for other police agencies.

1043
00:53:38,565 --> 00:53:40,335
And it kind of, uh, built out from there.

1044
00:53:40,335 --> 00:53:47,234
But I, and so my view has always kind
of been in this industry, so maybe it's

1045
00:53:47,234 --> 00:53:52,875
a little myopic, but I, I see a lot
of, I want to tear down your building

1046
00:53:53,145 --> 00:53:54,915
to make my building look bigger.

1047
00:53:55,185 --> 00:53:56,595
And maybe that's like it everywhere.

1048
00:53:56,775 --> 00:54:00,315
But for me, being in the industry,
I sure see it a lot in the hunting

1049
00:54:00,315 --> 00:54:02,115
and firearms kind of community.

1050
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:03,210
Yeah.

1051
00:54:03,540 --> 00:54:03,750
Yeah.

1052
00:54:03,750 --> 00:54:04,259
It's crazy.

1053
00:54:04,259 --> 00:54:07,680
It's just human nature building,
you know, trying to build yourself

1054
00:54:07,710 --> 00:54:09,600
up by tearing someone else down.

1055
00:54:09,600 --> 00:54:09,660
Hmm.

1056
00:54:10,620 --> 00:54:13,350
One needs to recognize it
and fight against it, but it

1057
00:54:13,350 --> 00:54:15,149
really does hurt our industry.

1058
00:54:15,270 --> 00:54:16,049
What's the point?

1059
00:54:16,319 --> 00:54:21,330
But I am amazed at the number of
manufacturers who are buddies with others

1060
00:54:21,390 --> 00:54:24,029
in the industry, say, you are building.

1061
00:54:24,325 --> 00:54:25,375
You're making bullets.

1062
00:54:25,464 --> 00:54:25,705
Hmm.

1063
00:54:25,765 --> 00:54:25,884
And

1064
00:54:25,884 --> 00:54:30,415
I'll, I'll get these bullet people who
are visiting with their competition

1065
00:54:30,714 --> 00:54:34,584
and comparing notes and getting along
just fine and they respect one another.

1066
00:54:34,584 --> 00:54:38,305
And I think that's because they've
been around long enough to realize

1067
00:54:38,305 --> 00:54:41,095
that the competition helps everyone.

1068
00:54:41,185 --> 00:54:41,515
Mm-hmm.

1069
00:54:41,875 --> 00:54:45,145
You see that your competition's
selling more bullets because

1070
00:54:45,145 --> 00:54:48,115
they have a new designer or a new
material that you didn't think of.

1071
00:54:48,354 --> 00:54:51,564
Now you get your brain going, wait a
minute, I can't rest on my laurels.

1072
00:54:51,564 --> 00:54:52,944
I need to come up with something better.

1073
00:54:53,064 --> 00:54:53,245
Right.

1074
00:54:53,245 --> 00:54:57,174
And that's what pushes, uh, the,
the product development throughout.

1075
00:54:57,535 --> 00:54:59,964
I've really seen it in optics,

1076
00:55:00,595 --> 00:55:01,075
scopes,

1077
00:55:01,075 --> 00:55:06,115
and binoculars in the last 25, 30 years
is, for a long time it was, there are

1078
00:55:06,174 --> 00:55:09,805
two or three top line European makers of.

1079
00:55:10,095 --> 00:55:11,115
Binoculars and scopes.

1080
00:55:11,115 --> 00:55:12,495
They really have it figured out.

1081
00:55:12,495 --> 00:55:16,935
They've just got the optical science
down to an art, and the others really

1082
00:55:16,935 --> 00:55:18,615
didn't know some of these secrets.

1083
00:55:18,645 --> 00:55:18,885
Hmm.

1084
00:55:18,885 --> 00:55:22,125
One of the first secrets that
came out in the 1930s was zes.

1085
00:55:22,455 --> 00:55:26,655
They found, accidentally found out that
a coating of magnesium sulfite on the

1086
00:55:26,655 --> 00:55:31,905
surface of a lens would cut the light
reflection or the light loss in half.

1087
00:55:32,205 --> 00:55:33,015
Big deal.

1088
00:55:33,015 --> 00:55:33,075
Huh?

1089
00:55:33,345 --> 00:55:36,795
So they start making binoculars
using this, and people would look

1090
00:55:36,795 --> 00:55:38,745
through 'em and go, holy mackerel.

1091
00:55:38,745 --> 00:55:41,475
This is the most incredibly
sharpened, contrasted,

1092
00:55:41,475 --> 00:55:43,185
binocular image I've ever seen.

1093
00:55:43,395 --> 00:55:46,005
So they own the, they own that field.

1094
00:55:46,065 --> 00:55:46,185
Hmm.

1095
00:55:46,185 --> 00:55:46,665
Until others

1096
00:55:46,965 --> 00:55:48,135
finally figured it out.

1097
00:55:48,645 --> 00:55:52,635
Well, these days everybody's figured
out all the secrets, as much as I can

1098
00:55:52,635 --> 00:55:54,525
tell, and they all know how to make it.

1099
00:55:54,525 --> 00:55:58,515
Now it's just a matter of finding the
cheapest way of getting it done, whether

1100
00:55:58,515 --> 00:56:04,035
that's offshore with cheaper labor, or
finding a source where you can save a

1101
00:56:04,035 --> 00:56:06,135
nickel on your materials here and there.

1102
00:56:06,745 --> 00:56:08,365
Or maybe skip the middleman.

1103
00:56:08,365 --> 00:56:10,225
Like some of 'em are doing it sell direct.

1104
00:56:10,465 --> 00:56:14,575
But the upshot is we're now
looking at optical quality

1105
00:56:14,575 --> 00:56:16,345
in our binoculars and scopes.

1106
00:56:16,765 --> 00:56:19,645
The, that are half the price
they were 10 years ago.

1107
00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:20,970
Yeah, yeah.

1108
00:56:21,210 --> 00:56:22,009
'
cause of the competition.

1109
00:56:22,279 --> 00:56:22,569
Yeah.

1110
00:56:23,390 --> 00:56:24,265
And, and the benefits

1111
00:56:24,654 --> 00:56:25,345
everybody.

1112
00:56:25,975 --> 00:56:26,305
Yeah.

1113
00:56:26,305 --> 00:56:28,375
Well it benefits the end user for sure.

1114
00:56:28,404 --> 00:56:32,665
I, it's gotta be tough on the optics
companies if they're uh, uh, always

1115
00:56:32,665 --> 00:56:34,825
looking for the cheaper outsourcing.

1116
00:56:35,185 --> 00:56:35,395
Like,

1117
00:56:35,395 --> 00:56:38,875
yeah, you can go too, too far
down, I think to the bottom.

1118
00:56:39,055 --> 00:56:42,865
But I think what's also
interesting is that how many

1119
00:56:42,865 --> 00:56:44,125
of them are still in business?

1120
00:56:44,424 --> 00:56:45,685
They pop up and they.

1121
00:56:46,305 --> 00:56:47,475
Shine for a while.

1122
00:56:47,480 --> 00:56:51,945
They, they start to get accolades for
making an incredible instrument and

1123
00:56:51,945 --> 00:56:53,685
then they hang on for quite a while.

1124
00:56:53,925 --> 00:56:59,985
Um, I see way more optic companies staying
in business now than were 30 years ago.

1125
00:57:00,885 --> 00:57:01,185
Yeah.

1126
00:57:01,185 --> 00:57:02,535
With, with the Optic.

1127
00:57:02,625 --> 00:57:07,575
So I've got some friends at Armament
Technology and they do SAI optics

1128
00:57:07,575 --> 00:57:13,215
and tangent Theta and like super
high-end, uh, crystal clear optics.

1129
00:57:13,215 --> 00:57:14,565
They're, they're really cool.

1130
00:57:15,075 --> 00:57:21,225
And what I'm noticing in, at least from my
outside perspective looking in is that not

1131
00:57:21,225 --> 00:57:24,315
only is it a process of trying to make it.

1132
00:57:24,645 --> 00:57:28,935
The best out there and the most
robust and, uh, sing and all dancing

1133
00:57:28,935 --> 00:57:33,165
and like, they'll innovate toolless
re zero, so you don't have to, uh,

1134
00:57:33,465 --> 00:57:34,875
like cool little things like that.

1135
00:57:34,875 --> 00:57:37,785
But it's the storytelling
that I'm starting to see

1136
00:57:37,785 --> 00:57:39,285
really kind of bleeding in.

1137
00:57:39,705 --> 00:57:43,635
I, I think people are
becoming less interested.

1138
00:57:43,635 --> 00:57:45,165
I, I guess there's gonna
be different groups.

1139
00:57:45,165 --> 00:57:48,105
There's gonna be those who are always
looking for the cheapest one, the best

1140
00:57:48,105 --> 00:57:49,395
they can get for the cheapest price.

1141
00:57:49,755 --> 00:57:54,105
But then there's gonna be those who want
to know the individuals behind the brand.

1142
00:57:54,405 --> 00:57:59,715
And if they have money that they can spend
and they got their choice, maybe I'll buy

1143
00:57:59,745 --> 00:58:04,065
made in Canada, or maybe I'll buy Made in
America over top of, uh, getting something

1144
00:58:04,065 --> 00:58:05,985
that's gonna be made, made in China.

1145
00:58:06,660 --> 00:58:11,940
And the, the level of storytelling that
I see, uh, in marketing essentially

1146
00:58:11,970 --> 00:58:15,660
is, uh, really seems to be the thing
that's amped up over the years.

1147
00:58:15,720 --> 00:58:17,069
And I've seen it in the gun culture too.

1148
00:58:17,069 --> 00:58:21,330
Like when, uh, uh, Magpole started making
training videos because they're like,

1149
00:58:21,330 --> 00:58:26,670
well, we can't advertise our guns, but
we can put out a training video and if

1150
00:58:26,670 --> 00:58:31,140
you have this mag pull device on your gun
and you follow our training, look at how

1151
00:58:31,140 --> 00:58:32,790
much of a better shooter you're gonna be.

1152
00:58:33,029 --> 00:58:37,680
So, um, uh, that, that's one area
that I've seen really kind of propel.

1153
00:58:37,680 --> 00:58:40,410
And that's probably an area that
you've had a fair bit of experience in.

1154
00:58:41,175 --> 00:58:41,535
Yeah.

1155
00:58:41,535 --> 00:58:44,895
And that might be answering your
earlier question about storytelling

1156
00:58:45,255 --> 00:58:49,935
in social media and in YouTube instead
of people reading the magazines

1157
00:58:49,935 --> 00:58:53,145
or heavens forbid, a book, can you
believe that people ever did that?

1158
00:58:54,255 --> 00:58:54,705
That's right.

1159
00:58:55,275 --> 00:58:55,575
Yeah.

1160
00:58:55,905 --> 00:58:59,925
They're telling their stories in
this new media and that is the,

1161
00:58:59,955 --> 00:59:01,875
the short film or the long film.

1162
00:59:01,875 --> 00:59:03,795
But you get to see the personality.

1163
00:59:03,795 --> 00:59:05,655
You get to hear the voice, and it helps.

1164
00:59:06,165 --> 00:59:09,195
It's a lot more challenging to
get that through in writing.

1165
00:59:09,225 --> 00:59:09,315
Mm-hmm.

1166
00:59:09,915 --> 00:59:14,295
If you've read good literature and
you remember some characters that

1167
00:59:14,295 --> 00:59:17,535
just struck you, they stick with
you, you, you know, this person.

1168
00:59:17,535 --> 00:59:18,285
Mm-hmm.

1169
00:59:18,285 --> 00:59:19,425
How do you make that happen?

1170
00:59:19,425 --> 00:59:23,265
It's an imaginary person and
you wrote words that made people

1171
00:59:23,265 --> 00:59:25,365
feel that they know this person.

1172
00:59:25,725 --> 00:59:33,915
But then you look at something like
Lonesome Dove, Gus, um, Gus Mo it Gus call

1173
00:59:35,085 --> 00:59:37,575
on Lonesome Dove, the character in that.

1174
00:59:38,940 --> 00:59:39,870
I call it a movie.

1175
00:59:39,870 --> 00:59:40,890
It was on television.

1176
00:59:40,890 --> 00:59:40,950
Yeah.

1177
00:59:41,075 --> 00:59:41,195
Yeah.

1178
00:59:41,880 --> 00:59:45,990
And stuff, but the, the Best Western
ever made because of that character.

1179
00:59:46,020 --> 00:59:46,350
Mm.

1180
00:59:46,620 --> 00:59:50,250
Robert Duval's character
in that just grabs you.

1181
00:59:50,610 --> 00:59:55,260
And I try to imagine writing, well,
heck, I don't have to imagine.

1182
00:59:55,260 --> 00:59:56,010
I read the book.

1183
00:59:56,160 --> 00:59:58,020
Mm. And it's just as good in the book.

1184
00:59:58,470 --> 01:00:00,420
You love this guy, you
love this character.

1185
01:00:00,420 --> 01:00:06,420
In the book, I guess Val's Art
as an actor was portraying that

1186
01:00:06,750 --> 01:00:09,450
e with equal effect in the movie.

1187
01:00:10,260 --> 01:00:14,640
And just what you mentioned now, if
you've got a manufacturer who puts

1188
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:18,840
out YouTubes on his website, or maybe
he's putting him on a YouTube channel

1189
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:22,140
or something like that, they've gotta
be careful how they tiptoe through

1190
01:00:22,140 --> 01:00:24,090
the minefield of This is a bad gun.

1191
01:00:24,150 --> 01:00:24,450
Mm-hmm.

1192
01:00:25,050 --> 01:00:28,980
Mention this word and that word and
all the thought police out there.

1193
01:00:29,010 --> 01:00:29,070
Yeah.

1194
01:00:29,760 --> 01:00:30,120
Yes.

1195
01:00:30,120 --> 01:00:32,190
How do you get your message across?

1196
01:00:32,190 --> 01:00:35,220
And storytelling is probably
the, the right answer.

1197
01:00:35,595 --> 01:00:36,705
I think you nailed it,

1198
01:00:36,915 --> 01:00:37,185
huh?

1199
01:00:37,665 --> 01:00:40,815
Well, that's, do you
find a lot of hurdles?

1200
01:00:40,845 --> 01:00:44,595
Like, I don't think, I don't think
TikTok will let images of guns and

1201
01:00:44,595 --> 01:00:49,904
stuff, uh, easily, uh, Instagram
meta that they, they clamp down

1202
01:00:49,904 --> 01:00:51,555
pretty hard, but not like TikTok.

1203
01:00:51,555 --> 01:00:55,214
And then YouTube is sort of a little
bit broader of what you can talk about.

1204
01:00:55,569 --> 01:00:57,855
Do you, do you talk, see hurdles there?

1205
01:00:58,245 --> 01:00:58,725
Oh yeah.

1206
01:00:58,875 --> 01:01:00,075
There're hurdles all the time.

1207
01:01:00,345 --> 01:01:05,415
You're always tiptoeing you through
the minefield and walking on eggshells

1208
01:01:05,415 --> 01:01:09,315
because you don't know exactly
what thing you might say that gets

1209
01:01:09,315 --> 01:01:11,595
YouTube to say You're canceled.

1210
01:01:11,955 --> 01:01:12,195
Your

1211
01:01:12,465 --> 01:01:13,904
channel is gone forever.

1212
01:01:13,965 --> 01:01:14,925
It's so arbitrary.

1213
01:01:14,925 --> 01:01:16,515
They can do it if they want.

1214
01:01:16,815 --> 01:01:18,285
And you ask them what are your rules?

1215
01:01:18,285 --> 01:01:20,835
And then you try your best to follow
those rules and then the next time

1216
01:01:20,835 --> 01:01:23,895
they're, they ding you and say,
well, we're gonna pull this one

1217
01:01:23,895 --> 01:01:25,665
off because you violated the rules.

1218
01:01:25,665 --> 01:01:26,384
You go, what rules?

1219
01:01:26,384 --> 01:01:27,195
So they changed them.

1220
01:01:27,195 --> 01:01:27,585
Mm-hmm.

1221
01:01:28,365 --> 01:01:32,654
So the rules are constantly changing,
but also individuals who check that

1222
01:01:32,654 --> 01:01:38,235
video, I think it's all done with ai,
computer bot stuff, but you can ask for

1223
01:01:38,235 --> 01:01:40,245
a real person review saying, mm-hmm.

1224
01:01:40,485 --> 01:01:41,205
I don't think they got this.

1225
01:01:41,205 --> 01:01:41,625
Right.

1226
01:01:41,865 --> 01:01:43,215
That usually works.

1227
01:01:43,455 --> 01:01:43,815
Yeah.

1228
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:48,540
You know, some guys won't even say
the word rifle or bullet or shoot,

1229
01:01:48,540 --> 01:01:49,950
and they've got code words like pew.

1230
01:01:49,950 --> 01:01:51,089
Pew Sure.

1231
01:01:51,089 --> 01:01:54,720
And bang stick and freedom pills
and all sorts of silly things.

1232
01:01:55,379 --> 01:01:56,654
I hate that because it's slow.

1233
01:01:56,654 --> 01:01:58,095
I know there's language, but

1234
01:01:58,440 --> 01:01:59,339
it's, yeah.

1235
01:01:59,339 --> 01:01:59,850
Like why?

1236
01:01:59,850 --> 01:02:01,770
Why do you have to hide what it
is that you're talking about?

1237
01:02:01,770 --> 01:02:02,940
It's not nefarious.

1238
01:02:03,420 --> 01:02:03,779
Yeah.

1239
01:02:03,870 --> 01:02:05,819
But that's, that's the way it is.

1240
01:02:05,819 --> 01:02:09,629
So you've gotta be careful, and I'm
glad we're having this conversation

1241
01:02:09,629 --> 01:02:12,450
because I hadn't really thought
of the power of storytelling to

1242
01:02:12,450 --> 01:02:13,710
get around some of this stuff.

1243
01:02:14,009 --> 01:02:18,540
I don't necessarily have to mention
specifically all the items and what

1244
01:02:18,540 --> 01:02:20,970
they do if I have a riveting story.

1245
01:02:21,029 --> 01:02:21,150
Mm-hmm.

1246
01:02:21,390 --> 01:02:24,180
That inspires people to
investigate on their own.

1247
01:02:24,180 --> 01:02:28,319
Because everybody knows once you have the
name of a product, you can come close to

1248
01:02:28,319 --> 01:02:32,279
approximating the correct spelling of it
on a search and you're going to find it.

1249
01:02:32,285 --> 01:02:32,455
Yes.

1250
01:02:33,420 --> 01:02:37,049
So I gotta remember that
and put it to effect here.

1251
01:02:37,110 --> 01:02:41,130
Well, it's, it's a direction that I
took with my company a few years ago

1252
01:02:41,250 --> 01:02:45,540
and I was, um, silver Core Firearms
training for the longest time.

1253
01:02:45,540 --> 01:02:48,630
It was started as Silver Core Gun
Works and doing gunsmithing for

1254
01:02:48,630 --> 01:02:50,160
every Joe Blow who came through.

1255
01:02:50,160 --> 01:02:54,569
And I mean, anyone who's gonna
bring their gun to a kid to work on

1256
01:02:54,660 --> 01:02:56,460
is not gonna be paying top dollar.

1257
01:02:56,520 --> 01:03:00,000
And, uh, every gun that I worked on was
gonna be different, different issues.

1258
01:03:00,000 --> 01:03:05,790
And I learned, okay, start picking up
armored car companies, police agencies,

1259
01:03:05,790 --> 01:03:07,230
they're all on the same platform.

1260
01:03:07,230 --> 01:03:09,900
I can tool all the same
and they pay their bills.

1261
01:03:11,370 --> 01:03:15,630
So then it was silver Court firearms
training, silver court training.

1262
01:03:15,660 --> 01:03:18,390
'cause the word firearms was
getting blocked all over the place.

1263
01:03:18,395 --> 01:03:23,910
And, and recently I thought, you know
what I mean, I, I know the gun stuff.

1264
01:03:23,910 --> 01:03:25,410
I was raised around the gun stuff.

1265
01:03:25,470 --> 01:03:29,910
Um, I know some, not all,
I mean in, in my area.

1266
01:03:31,125 --> 01:03:33,315
But there's so many other
things that I'm interested in.

1267
01:03:33,315 --> 01:03:37,695
And I rebranded to Silver Core
Outdoors because firearms are a natural

1268
01:03:37,695 --> 01:03:39,705
portion of some outdoor activities.

1269
01:03:39,705 --> 01:03:44,475
And I found greater success in being
able to tell the story of connecting

1270
01:03:44,475 --> 01:03:47,505
with people, connecting with their
environment, connecting with their food.

1271
01:03:47,505 --> 01:03:51,885
And I reached far more people
who I ever would than if I

1272
01:03:51,885 --> 01:03:53,235
just looked at the gun side.

1273
01:03:53,235 --> 01:03:55,185
Now, uh.

1274
01:03:55,845 --> 01:03:59,745
I, I can't deny that if you put
the word gun in a post, it's gonna

1275
01:03:59,745 --> 01:04:02,955
have a very vocal crew of people.

1276
01:04:03,075 --> 01:04:05,895
But it's, it's the echo
chamber, so to speak.

1277
01:04:05,895 --> 01:04:09,525
It's the people who would
already be looking at your stuff.

1278
01:04:09,615 --> 01:04:09,885
Mm-hmm.

1279
01:04:10,125 --> 01:04:14,745
Um, if you want to try and win hearts and
minds and show people that there are other

1280
01:04:14,745 --> 01:04:19,395
ways out there, and you know, guns can be
really scary in the wrong person's hands.

1281
01:04:19,575 --> 01:04:25,125
Guns can be a, a dangerous thing if used
improperly, but so can cars soak, can

1282
01:04:25,125 --> 01:04:27,345
household cleaning chemicals, right.

1283
01:04:27,735 --> 01:04:32,175
Um, let's, let's look at the
story and the lifestyle behind

1284
01:04:32,175 --> 01:04:34,365
how you can connect to nature.

1285
01:04:34,365 --> 01:04:36,855
And, you know, there just so
happens to be a gun in the

1286
01:04:36,855 --> 01:04:38,115
background in some of these things.

1287
01:04:38,475 --> 01:04:40,245
I found some success doing that.

1288
01:04:40,605 --> 01:04:42,105
Yeah, I can imagine.

1289
01:04:42,225 --> 01:04:45,555
Um, I think it's a lot more,
it's a lot harder work, more

1290
01:04:45,555 --> 01:04:47,835
challenging to do it, but yeah.

1291
01:04:47,865 --> 01:04:48,825
Great storytelling.

1292
01:04:48,825 --> 01:04:52,634
I've, uh, for the several years now
I've been sort of bemoaning the fact

1293
01:04:52,634 --> 01:04:55,185
that we don't have hunters as heroes.

1294
01:04:55,785 --> 01:04:59,384
Um, who's that author
writing about a game warden?

1295
01:04:59,384 --> 01:05:02,955
His protagonist is this game
warden in Wyoming, I think.

1296
01:05:03,464 --> 01:05:04,065
Uh, okay.

1297
01:05:04,065 --> 01:05:06,075
Box c CJ Box.

1298
01:05:06,075 --> 01:05:06,855
Does that sound right?

1299
01:05:06,975 --> 01:05:07,185
Okay.

1300
01:05:07,185 --> 01:05:08,504
The last name is Box.

1301
01:05:08,504 --> 01:05:11,625
He's got a series of paperback
little novels that are, you

1302
01:05:11,625 --> 01:05:15,645
know, fairly good, pretty, pretty
riveting, uh, for some folks.

1303
01:05:15,645 --> 01:05:17,085
He's real popular anyway.

1304
01:05:17,265 --> 01:05:17,325
Yeah.

1305
01:05:17,325 --> 01:05:20,294
But that's the first one I've
seen in a long, long time.

1306
01:05:20,535 --> 01:05:24,375
Who made sort of the gun
user hunter the hero?

1307
01:05:25,395 --> 01:05:27,075
Mm. He, I assume he had to sort of.

1308
01:05:28,155 --> 01:05:31,490
Ca couch it or cover it with Game warden.

1309
01:05:31,495 --> 01:05:34,995
So he's an official, officially
government approved gun owner.

1310
01:05:35,055 --> 01:05:35,595
Right.

1311
01:05:36,855 --> 01:05:40,215
But still, at least the guns
end up many times being part

1312
01:05:40,215 --> 01:05:41,745
of the hero, saving the day.

1313
01:05:41,775 --> 01:05:42,134
Mm.

1314
01:05:42,495 --> 01:05:43,665
In novels like that.

1315
01:05:44,055 --> 01:05:48,165
But now I think back when I was a kid,
when a heroes were, we were seeing

1316
01:05:48,165 --> 01:05:52,275
them on TV with some Disney movies
about Daniel Boone and all the old

1317
01:05:52,275 --> 01:05:55,005
Pioneer Heroes and the Cowboy Westerns.

1318
01:05:55,005 --> 01:05:58,485
That was a big deal in the
1950s into the seventies.

1319
01:05:59,025 --> 01:06:02,955
So people like Davey Crockett and
Daniel Boone and the Lewis and Clark

1320
01:06:02,955 --> 01:06:06,735
Expedition and all these things that
were not that far in our background,

1321
01:06:07,125 --> 01:06:09,225
which made America, which made us great.

1322
01:06:09,855 --> 01:06:14,025
A kid with a love for the outdoors
and exploration and discovery and

1323
01:06:14,025 --> 01:06:16,935
adventure, would hear about those people.

1324
01:06:16,965 --> 01:06:18,495
And we heard about 'em in school.

1325
01:06:18,495 --> 01:06:21,555
They were on pop culture
in those days, these days.

1326
01:06:21,555 --> 01:06:23,025
What does pop culture give you?

1327
01:06:23,295 --> 01:06:23,835
Mm-hmm.

1328
01:06:24,404 --> 01:06:31,065
Urbanites playing makeup space games and,
and who can dance better than the next guy

1329
01:06:31,065 --> 01:06:33,075
on the street corner and things like that.

1330
01:06:33,075 --> 01:06:36,555
And, you know, more power to you
that takes a lot of talent, but

1331
01:06:36,795 --> 01:06:40,904
it doesn't have that connection to
the real world that we were getting

1332
01:06:40,904 --> 01:06:42,795
with our heroes back in the day.

1333
01:06:43,395 --> 01:06:47,895
Even a, a hero as fake as John
Wayne or some of the Yeah.

1334
01:06:47,990 --> 01:06:51,315
Cowboys on, you know, that's like,
obviously this guy's just a Hollywood

1335
01:06:51,315 --> 01:06:55,154
star and he's pretending to be somebody
who was probably never really did exist.

1336
01:06:55,395 --> 01:06:55,575
Mm. But

1337
01:06:55,575 --> 01:07:00,165
there were people, there's a, there's
a gram, a grim seed of truth in

1338
01:07:00,165 --> 01:07:02,475
that there were people like that.

1339
01:07:02,985 --> 01:07:07,815
Uh, they weren't the white hat
perfect Western cowboy saves the day

1340
01:07:07,815 --> 01:07:11,384
sort of person, but they were were
real people living out there who did

1341
01:07:11,384 --> 01:07:13,215
the right thing at the right time.

1342
01:07:13,545 --> 01:07:16,634
And they used often
firearms to accomplish it.

1343
01:07:16,640 --> 01:07:16,799
Right.

1344
01:07:17,569 --> 01:07:22,430
Because firearms were a tool just
like an ax or a plow or your horse or

1345
01:07:22,430 --> 01:07:24,560
whatever you, whatever else you needed.

1346
01:07:24,560 --> 01:07:28,520
In those days, the technology was
what it was, and you used that

1347
01:07:28,520 --> 01:07:30,110
technology and did the right thing.

1348
01:07:30,920 --> 01:07:33,680
Of course, people could say, oh,
what, what about all the people they

1349
01:07:33,680 --> 01:07:38,240
killed and the bad guys shooting and,
and then the treatment of the Native

1350
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:39,740
Americans are taking away their land.

1351
01:07:40,009 --> 01:07:42,110
You can always go to the dark
side on all of this stuff.

1352
01:07:42,110 --> 01:07:47,480
Sure, it's human nature, but the idea
that some good guy with a gun can

1353
01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:50,150
save the day, I think is still valid.

1354
01:07:50,150 --> 01:07:52,640
We just don't see it in pop culture.

1355
01:07:53,240 --> 01:07:53,720
You don't?

1356
01:07:53,720 --> 01:07:56,930
Well, it's shifted, uh, like I think
you nailed it there when you talk

1357
01:07:56,930 --> 01:08:01,819
about good guy, it was the, the white
hat individual who, and it just so

1358
01:08:01,819 --> 01:08:07,580
happened to be that the situation was
such that a firearm necessitated the,

1359
01:08:07,790 --> 01:08:09,770
uh, prevailing of good over evil.

1360
01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:14,450
And over the years it changed
from a moral, ethical.

1361
01:08:15,060 --> 01:08:16,740
Um, high ground.

1362
01:08:17,160 --> 01:08:17,580
Yeah.

1363
01:08:17,670 --> 01:08:23,460
Based on the zeitgeist, based on
the culture to, um, to Rambo, uh,

1364
01:08:23,490 --> 01:08:27,510
who's, and it's more about, well,
the person with the biggest gun and

1365
01:08:27,510 --> 01:08:31,319
the biggest muscles, and there's this
whole fascination in Hollywood with

1366
01:08:31,319 --> 01:08:35,399
the just go out and shoot 'em up and,
you know, it ends justify the means.

1367
01:08:35,399 --> 01:08:39,990
But the, the human ethical
part of the whole story, um,

1368
01:08:40,050 --> 01:08:41,580
seems to have been minimized.

1369
01:08:41,580 --> 01:08:42,120
And I,

1370
01:08:42,240 --> 01:08:46,140
yeah, and they, they also
celebrated the actual evil guy.

1371
01:08:46,350 --> 01:08:46,560
Right.

1372
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:51,240
Many of the movies would have
the bad guy in the end getting

1373
01:08:51,240 --> 01:08:53,760
his riches and his rewards.

1374
01:08:54,510 --> 01:08:55,620
And the good guys didn't.

1375
01:08:55,625 --> 01:08:55,710
Mm-hmm.

1376
01:08:56,005 --> 01:08:59,580
And you, you look at those and
think this is not helping anyone.

1377
01:08:59,580 --> 01:09:04,889
I mean, I get the artistry in the
story, but what a downer of a story.

1378
01:09:05,160 --> 01:09:09,420
And then I think back to something as
simplistic as the Rifle Man TV series.

1379
01:09:09,510 --> 01:09:09,599
Mm-hmm.

1380
01:09:10,170 --> 01:09:11,969
Back in the sixties, love that show.

1381
01:09:11,974 --> 01:09:12,085
Mm-hmm.

1382
01:09:12,215 --> 01:09:12,564
Still

1383
01:09:12,585 --> 01:09:12,804
do.

1384
01:09:13,139 --> 01:09:17,580
But like most of the shows in the sixties,
there was a moral lesson in there.

1385
01:09:17,609 --> 01:09:17,790
Mm-hmm.

1386
01:09:18,029 --> 01:09:18,179
Pretty,

1387
01:09:18,179 --> 01:09:24,090
you know, pretty, uh, softly delivered,
but it would be paw showing the son

1388
01:09:24,090 --> 01:09:29,399
that you, you can't just go around,
uh, bullying everyone in the streets.

1389
01:09:29,399 --> 01:09:30,779
You're probably not gonna work.

1390
01:09:30,779 --> 01:09:30,870
Right.

1391
01:09:31,854 --> 01:09:35,665
I have this rifle that can settle the
score with these crew of bad guys.

1392
01:09:35,694 --> 01:09:35,844
Yep.

1393
01:09:36,384 --> 01:09:36,564
Yeah.

1394
01:09:36,984 --> 01:09:38,304
But, okay, great.

1395
01:09:38,304 --> 01:09:41,575
So you've got your white hat hero
and he's usually, well, he was

1396
01:09:41,575 --> 01:09:44,964
always depicted as doing the right
thing in all aspects of life.

1397
01:09:45,234 --> 01:09:47,274
He took responsibility for himself.

1398
01:09:47,604 --> 01:09:51,174
He didn't stick his nose into other
people's business generally until it

1399
01:09:51,174 --> 01:09:54,924
was required, you know, push him to the
edge and now he's gonna do something.

1400
01:09:54,924 --> 01:09:58,405
But I think the story that came
through is that each of us, within

1401
01:09:58,405 --> 01:10:03,384
the community has to do our part
to make that community successful.

1402
01:10:03,594 --> 01:10:04,945
To make life worth living.

1403
01:10:05,184 --> 01:10:05,424
Mm. Help

1404
01:10:05,424 --> 01:10:11,065
one other out, mind your own business,
work hard, do your part, and it'll

1405
01:10:11,065 --> 01:10:15,655
all mesh pretty nicely, but as soon
as you get the, the greedy guy who

1406
01:10:15,655 --> 01:10:19,075
wants to come into town to make easy
money, whether it's robbing the bank or

1407
01:10:19,075 --> 01:10:23,065
cheating at cards in the bar and all the
rest, all the stories that they told.

1408
01:10:23,065 --> 01:10:23,155
Sure.

1409
01:10:23,155 --> 01:10:23,424
Sure.

1410
01:10:23,865 --> 01:10:27,315
Yeah, the moral was always
the right, do the right thing,

1411
01:10:27,315 --> 01:10:28,545
and it works out in the end,

1412
01:10:28,575 --> 01:10:29,235
right?

1413
01:10:29,385 --> 01:10:32,474
We're away from that and now we're
to the, the guy who's the strongest,

1414
01:10:32,474 --> 01:10:37,304
the toughest, the meanest and cheats
the most is going to win heck of

1415
01:10:37,304 --> 01:10:38,894
a message to send to our kids.

1416
01:10:38,940 --> 01:10:39,230
Yeah.

1417
01:10:40,245 --> 01:10:41,054
Yeah, it is.

1418
01:10:41,745 --> 01:10:48,974
Well, looking at the different
legacies that these characters have

1419
01:10:48,974 --> 01:10:53,115
left over the years and how that's
changed, if I were to look at you

1420
01:10:53,115 --> 01:10:55,965
and say, what would your legacy be?

1421
01:10:56,655 --> 01:10:57,075
What would that

1422
01:10:57,075 --> 01:10:57,344
be?

1423
01:10:58,035 --> 01:10:58,245
Hmm.

1424
01:10:59,325 --> 01:11:03,375
You know, I used to never think about
it, but I hear a lot about it from my.

1425
01:11:03,825 --> 01:11:06,345
Viewers and listeners and fans these days.

1426
01:11:06,735 --> 01:11:11,025
And I'm beginning to appreciate it
because to them, I'm Grandpa Ron

1427
01:11:11,025 --> 01:11:15,645
or Uncle Ron, somebody who's been
fortunate to have done the things

1428
01:11:15,645 --> 01:11:17,595
that they dream of someday doing.

1429
01:11:17,595 --> 01:11:22,215
So they, they look up to
me, uh, because of that.

1430
01:11:22,545 --> 01:11:27,345
And then IF feel that it's my
obligation to provide them with the,

1431
01:11:27,405 --> 01:11:31,695
the best information education, if
you can call it that, that I can.

1432
01:11:32,175 --> 01:11:39,525
And ultimately I would like my
legacy to be that I helped prolong

1433
01:11:39,525 --> 01:11:42,870
our tradition of outdoor mm-hmm.

1434
01:11:43,730 --> 01:11:46,635
Of, of, I don't wanna say
hunting specifically, but

1435
01:11:46,635 --> 01:11:47,865
that's definitely a part of it.

1436
01:11:47,865 --> 01:11:48,555
A huge part of it.

1437
01:11:48,555 --> 01:11:51,645
But our outdoor lifestyle.

1438
01:11:52,394 --> 01:11:55,335
Let's go with outdoor life, you
know, the outdoor life adventure,

1439
01:11:55,665 --> 01:11:59,684
the canoeing and the camping, and the
exploring and the fishing and, and

1440
01:11:59,684 --> 01:12:05,805
finding mushrooms and, uh, just living
off the land and staying connected

1441
01:12:06,225 --> 01:12:08,535
to nature as we were designed to do.

1442
01:12:08,535 --> 01:12:13,635
I mean, you think about how long man
lived that close to nature, the stone

1443
01:12:13,635 --> 01:12:17,775
age cultures, of which we might have two
or three left on the planet that haven't

1444
01:12:17,775 --> 01:12:23,745
been influenced by modern things, but what
it was like to be that close to nature,

1445
01:12:23,745 --> 01:12:27,465
to understand that you could eat this
plant in this season, but not this plant.

1446
01:12:28,095 --> 01:12:32,175
And you could, how you would get
this meat to keep you and your

1447
01:12:32,175 --> 01:12:36,015
family alive without destroying
the environment that supported you.

1448
01:12:37,065 --> 01:12:44,535
I, if my legacy can do that and the
same time maintain or restore, uh,

1449
01:12:44,535 --> 01:12:48,644
a bit of, um, let's say glory, but.

1450
01:12:49,800 --> 01:12:51,690
A proper place for hunters.

1451
01:12:51,690 --> 01:12:54,480
In other words, we're not the
bad guys, we're not the anti

1452
01:12:54,540 --> 01:12:56,850
hunter's ideal of an evil.

1453
01:12:56,970 --> 01:12:58,050
Kill all the animals.

1454
01:12:58,050 --> 01:13:01,860
You don't care about 'em thing, which
is ridiculous, but it's out there.

1455
01:13:02,070 --> 01:13:02,190
Mm-hmm.

1456
01:13:02,910 --> 01:13:06,840
I would like for more and more people
to understand that hunters can be

1457
01:13:07,950 --> 01:13:09,960
an influence for good in nature.

1458
01:13:10,980 --> 01:13:15,390
Uh, we, many of us have been obviously
what we've done since the start of

1459
01:13:15,390 --> 01:13:20,010
the conservation movement, uh, ending
market hunting, establishing wildlife

1460
01:13:20,010 --> 01:13:24,090
lands and refuges and Nashville forests
and grasslands in place, protecting

1461
01:13:24,090 --> 01:13:29,400
the wild so that the wildlife could
then thrive with good management and

1462
01:13:29,400 --> 01:13:31,110
understanding all of those programs.

1463
01:13:31,110 --> 01:13:34,770
I think we've done a great job of that,
or at least our two generations ago did.

1464
01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:37,710
I think we're falling on our
faces a little bit here in

1465
01:13:37,710 --> 01:13:38,970
the last generation or two.

1466
01:13:39,060 --> 01:13:39,480
Hmm.

1467
01:13:39,915 --> 01:13:43,065
Or three where we was
riding on the coattails.

1468
01:13:43,185 --> 01:13:46,245
Like I, I grew up in an era
where the Canada geese were

1469
01:13:46,245 --> 01:13:47,985
starting to come back until, wow.

1470
01:13:47,985 --> 01:13:48,525
Now look at 'em.

1471
01:13:48,525 --> 01:13:49,845
They're all practically a nuisance.

1472
01:13:50,205 --> 01:13:50,325
Mm-hmm.

1473
01:13:50,895 --> 01:13:53,115
Whitetailed deer were never
around when I was a kid.

1474
01:13:53,115 --> 01:13:55,905
They started coming back and now look
at how many whitetailed deer there are.

1475
01:13:56,055 --> 01:14:00,285
We brought elk back, pronghorn
back on and on It goes until

1476
01:14:00,855 --> 01:14:01,845
we just took it for granted.

1477
01:14:02,205 --> 01:14:03,945
Isn't this something we
get to go out and hunt?

1478
01:14:03,975 --> 01:14:08,325
We get, I, I used to be able to get eight
deer tags in one season in South Dakota.

1479
01:14:08,355 --> 01:14:08,835
Wow.

1480
01:14:09,135 --> 01:14:10,095
It was in my twenties.

1481
01:14:10,665 --> 01:14:10,905
Yeah.

1482
01:14:11,115 --> 01:14:11,685
Wow.

1483
01:14:12,345 --> 01:14:15,615
So you start to take it for granted and
now you, you look at what's happening

1484
01:14:15,615 --> 01:14:19,155
now and you, I like to tell folks we've
gotta do what your great-grandpa did

1485
01:14:19,155 --> 01:14:22,305
and your grandpa did, which is get
on the ground and, and build the wood

1486
01:14:22,305 --> 01:14:27,705
duck nesting boxes and, and lobby to
save this wetland from being drained

1487
01:14:27,705 --> 01:14:29,655
and put into another shopping center.

1488
01:14:30,195 --> 01:14:33,285
Because when's the last time you hunted
in a shopping center parking lot?

1489
01:14:34,035 --> 01:14:34,605
Yeah.

1490
01:14:35,325 --> 01:14:37,815
And then it's really funny, I'll say
that to some young kids that live

1491
01:14:37,815 --> 01:14:40,605
in the cities and it's just like
they get this look on their face.

1492
01:14:40,605 --> 01:14:42,075
Like, oh gosh, you're right.

1493
01:14:42,075 --> 01:14:44,745
I never thought of that because
I've been around long enough

1494
01:14:44,745 --> 01:14:46,394
to say I used to hunt there.

1495
01:14:46,485 --> 01:14:46,665
Yeah.

1496
01:14:46,665 --> 01:14:47,985
Where that center is.

1497
01:14:48,405 --> 01:14:48,705
Yeah.

1498
01:14:49,394 --> 01:14:50,625
And how long can that continue?

1499
01:14:50,775 --> 01:14:55,065
So if my legacy is waking people up to
that reality so that they continue to

1500
01:14:55,065 --> 01:14:58,934
do the good conservation work that was
started a hundred years ago by real

1501
01:14:58,934 --> 01:15:01,724
conservation hunters, that would be cool.

1502
01:15:02,894 --> 01:15:04,005
I really like that.

1503
01:15:04,065 --> 01:15:09,884
And you know, I think there's this idea
within people that the conservation work

1504
01:15:09,884 --> 01:15:12,525
is hard or it's somebody else's job.

1505
01:15:12,974 --> 01:15:18,224
And I think maybe what they overlook
is the opportunity for themselves.

1506
01:15:18,255 --> 01:15:22,125
'cause you know, society is often,
what's in it for me if I do this well?

1507
01:15:23,715 --> 01:15:26,955
L lots in it for you, for
your kids, for your grandkids.

1508
01:15:27,255 --> 01:15:28,365
Oh, that's too far in the future.

1509
01:15:28,365 --> 01:15:30,945
I just look right now like
what's in it for me right now.

1510
01:15:31,394 --> 01:15:34,755
I mean, we've got a local group, pit
water fellers, and they're building duck

1511
01:15:34,755 --> 01:15:37,005
boxes and they love bringing people out.

1512
01:15:37,005 --> 01:15:38,865
And you can go up and you can volunteer.

1513
01:15:38,865 --> 01:15:40,005
And what do you learn?

1514
01:15:40,035 --> 01:15:41,925
Wow, I learned new places I can hunt.

1515
01:15:41,985 --> 01:15:46,065
I learn other people in the community who
are like-minded and I'm picking up tips

1516
01:15:46,065 --> 01:15:49,905
and tricks and maybe I'm gonna be more
successful on my, on my next season out.

1517
01:15:50,265 --> 01:15:53,415
I mean, if it's something that
you're interested in, one of the

1518
01:15:53,415 --> 01:15:56,684
biggest things I've heard people
say is like, how do I get into this?

1519
01:15:56,684 --> 01:15:57,675
It's so expensive.

1520
01:15:57,675 --> 01:15:58,815
And how do I find a mentor?

1521
01:15:59,175 --> 01:16:04,875
Well, through the conservation groups is
one way that you put out and infinitely

1522
01:16:04,875 --> 01:16:06,675
get back for generations to come.

1523
01:16:06,675 --> 01:16:10,665
So right now you get back connections
and people might not tell you their

1524
01:16:10,665 --> 01:16:13,035
secret honey hole, but they'll
get you pointed in the right

1525
01:16:13,035 --> 01:16:14,505
direction to kind of get you going.

1526
01:16:14,880 --> 01:16:15,330
Yeah.

1527
01:16:15,390 --> 01:16:16,410
Excellent point.

1528
01:16:16,410 --> 01:16:16,740
Yeah.

1529
01:16:16,740 --> 01:16:19,710
The conservation group like that,
you don't think of it as, no, I have

1530
01:16:19,710 --> 01:16:23,070
to go out in the hot sun and, and
uh, pull weeds or whatever they're

1531
01:16:23,070 --> 01:16:24,960
doing and I guess I could sacrifice.

1532
01:16:25,230 --> 01:16:30,240
No, you get to be a part of that community
that is improving wildlife areas for

1533
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:32,040
everyone's benefit, including yours.

1534
01:16:32,220 --> 01:16:35,580
And you're gonna meet folks who say,
yeah, come on, join the club, take you

1535
01:16:35,580 --> 01:16:37,560
under the wing, be a mentor to you.

1536
01:16:37,740 --> 01:16:39,390
Or you know how it works.

1537
01:16:39,390 --> 01:16:41,340
You get to be friends with
somebody and you go, well, shoot,

1538
01:16:41,340 --> 01:16:43,080
I want to take this guy hunting.

1539
01:16:43,200 --> 01:16:43,380
Yeah.

1540
01:16:43,440 --> 01:16:43,500
I

1541
01:16:43,500 --> 01:16:44,550
enjoy him so much.

1542
01:16:44,850 --> 01:16:47,640
So suddenly you do have a place to
hunt because you've made a new friend

1543
01:16:47,640 --> 01:16:50,820
who's taken you and then you return
the favor with something that you're

1544
01:16:50,820 --> 01:16:52,110
doing in your neck of the woods.

1545
01:16:52,470 --> 01:16:52,620
Yeah.

1546
01:16:52,620 --> 01:16:56,580
I've got a, an old friend that I
bumped into a few years ago and

1547
01:16:56,700 --> 01:17:00,210
we just connected and now he comes
out to the ranch to pheasants.

1548
01:17:00,210 --> 01:17:03,270
He shot his first pheasant in
something like, what did he say?

1549
01:17:03,270 --> 01:17:06,325
It was about 20 or 30 years since
he'd gotten a pheasant really.

1550
01:17:07,140 --> 01:17:07,470
Yeah.

1551
01:17:07,470 --> 01:17:10,980
And he hunted with Covey and me
on the ranch, and I was tickled

1552
01:17:10,980 --> 01:17:12,570
to have him shoot my pheasants.

1553
01:17:12,750 --> 01:17:12,990
Totally.

1554
01:17:12,990 --> 01:17:14,580
You know, it took him quite a while.

1555
01:17:14,580 --> 01:17:17,220
'cause his balance isn't as good
as it used to be, and a few issues.

1556
01:17:17,220 --> 01:17:19,620
And when you get into your
seventies, sure these things happen.

1557
01:17:20,160 --> 01:17:23,910
But he made this beautiful shot
on a, a big rooster that Covey

1558
01:17:23,910 --> 01:17:26,520
pointed and went across his
front and he killed that rooster.

1559
01:17:26,520 --> 01:17:30,210
And he was just about crying
because it felt so good.

1560
01:17:30,210 --> 01:17:30,900
No kidding.

1561
01:17:31,530 --> 01:17:34,770
His puppy made the retrieve,
which made it even more special.

1562
01:17:35,250 --> 01:17:38,580
And so I get as much joy out of
that as, as shooting a aluminum

1563
01:17:38,580 --> 01:17:40,560
pheasants in three seconds of myself.

1564
01:17:40,620 --> 01:17:40,920
Mm-hmm.

1565
01:17:41,520 --> 01:17:43,500
You know, the whole
thing just comes around.

1566
01:17:43,920 --> 01:17:46,950
So, yeah, it's, it's a great way to do it.

1567
01:17:46,950 --> 01:17:50,490
Join Ducks Unlimited or Pheasants
Forever, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.

1568
01:17:50,490 --> 01:17:54,630
All these user groups who are
conservationists, who are striving

1569
01:17:54,630 --> 01:17:58,590
for the kind of work that needs to
be done to keep us all in the field,

1570
01:17:58,740 --> 01:18:01,230
enjoying open spaces and wildlife.

1571
01:18:01,800 --> 01:18:04,080
That alone is a great legacy for anyone.

1572
01:18:04,514 --> 01:18:05,085
I love that.

1573
01:18:05,085 --> 01:18:08,264
Ron, is there anything that we should
talk about that we haven't talked about?

1574
01:18:09,075 --> 01:18:10,755
Where are you gonna take
me moose hunting next?

1575
01:18:11,235 --> 01:18:12,315
Come on up.

1576
01:18:12,644 --> 01:18:15,465
Yeah, I think what we're
talking last was, uh, I was on

1577
01:18:15,465 --> 01:18:18,075
the moose hunt there and yeah,

1578
01:18:18,179 --> 01:18:20,144
no, no, this, this has just been great.

1579
01:18:20,144 --> 01:18:21,615
I'm happy to visit with you.

1580
01:18:21,615 --> 01:18:24,195
I love your insights and
your passion for this.

1581
01:18:24,675 --> 01:18:28,485
Um, I didn't really know where
this was going to go, uh, but I

1582
01:18:28,485 --> 01:18:31,995
figured, hey, you talked to another
conservationist hunter and it's probably

1583
01:18:31,995 --> 01:18:33,495
gonna be some pretty good stuff.

1584
01:18:33,554 --> 01:18:37,724
Well, I really enjoy this conversation
Ron, and thank you so much for

1585
01:18:37,724 --> 01:18:39,105
being on the Silver Corp podcast.

1586
01:18:39,375 --> 01:18:40,094
My pleasure.

1587
01:18:40,094 --> 01:18:43,065
I'll be, uh, more than tickled
if you invite me back someday.

1588
01:18:43,695 --> 01:18:44,565
I can guarantee it.

1589
01:18:44,775 --> 01:18:45,639
Thanks so much, Travis.