WEBVTT 00:00:03.150 --> 00:00:06.030 Matt Abrahams: This Tech Tools miniseries is brought to you by Prezi, the 00:00:06.030 --> 00:00:10.080 presentation tool that makes your ideas easy to follow, hard to forget, and 00:00:10.080 --> 00:00:12.665 faster than ever to create with Prezi AI. 00:00:13.440 --> 00:00:16.950 The best investment is in the tools of one's own trade. 00:00:17.400 --> 00:00:20.205 At Think Fast Talk Smart, we are taking this quote by Benjamin 00:00:20.205 --> 00:00:24.210 Franklin, the famous US inventor and founding father, very seriously. 00:00:24.690 --> 00:00:29.070 As you know, our show strives to share tips and techniques to help you hone and 00:00:29.070 --> 00:00:31.200 improve your communication and careers. 00:00:31.860 --> 00:00:36.090 These practices and approaches can be augmented with tools and technology. 00:00:36.420 --> 00:00:37.410 I'm Matt Abrahams. 00:00:37.470 --> 00:00:40.890 I teach strategic communication at Stanford Graduate School of Business. 00:00:41.160 --> 00:00:46.290 Welcome to this Tech Tools miniseries of Think Fast Talk Smart, the podcast. 00:00:46.890 --> 00:00:51.060 In this multi-part miniseries, we'll introduce you to tools we use at Think 00:00:51.060 --> 00:00:55.769 Fast Talk Smart to help us be better at our spoken and written communication. 00:00:56.394 --> 00:00:59.665 And you'll learn best practices from the founders who created them. 00:01:00.175 --> 00:01:03.745 Taken together, we hope these communication tools will help you find 00:01:03.745 --> 00:01:06.505 new ways to think fast and talk smart. 00:01:07.255 --> 00:01:10.854 I am super excited today to speak with Yuhki Yamashita, who is 00:01:10.914 --> 00:01:12.804 Figma's Chief Product Officer. 00:01:12.925 --> 00:01:14.155 Yuhki, welcome. 00:01:14.245 --> 00:01:15.100 Thanks for joining me. 00:01:15.810 --> 00:01:16.679 Yuhki Yamashita: Thank you for having me. 00:01:16.860 --> 00:01:20.220 Matt Abrahams: Some of our listeners might not know what Figma is. 00:01:20.580 --> 00:01:24.210 Can you share what your product is using the elevator pitch 00:01:24.210 --> 00:01:26.280 structure I teach my students? 00:01:26.400 --> 00:01:31.080 What if you could, so that, for example, and that's not all. 00:01:31.080 --> 00:01:32.039 Do you wanna give that a try? 00:01:32.429 --> 00:01:36.419 Yuhki Yamashita: So what if you could visualize any idea you have in your 00:01:36.419 --> 00:01:40.949 head and immediately collaborate on it in real time with others so that 00:01:40.949 --> 00:01:44.339 you and your team, if you have one, can make digital experiences like 00:01:44.339 --> 00:01:46.259 apps and websites together end to end? 00:01:46.530 --> 00:01:50.639 For example, you can brainstorm an idea on digital whiteboard, bring 00:01:50.639 --> 00:01:54.810 it into a design infinite canvas, present that vision in a deck, and 00:01:54.810 --> 00:01:56.770 actually get it built end to end. 00:01:57.429 --> 00:01:58.130 And that's not all. 00:01:58.130 --> 00:02:02.160 People have found other creative ways to use Figma, like sharing a visual 00:02:02.160 --> 00:02:06.929 resume or planning a trip or wedding, or even arranging an apartment floor plan. 00:02:07.350 --> 00:02:09.750 Matt Abrahams: That was a great use of that structure. 00:02:09.750 --> 00:02:11.280 You get an A plus. 00:02:11.370 --> 00:02:14.415 I'm curious, Yuhki, what led you to join Figma? 00:02:14.725 --> 00:02:16.645 Yuhki Yamashita: There is the practical reason and kind 00:02:16.645 --> 00:02:18.145 of the philosophical reason. 00:02:18.145 --> 00:02:21.985 So the practical reason was I was working at Uber before my 00:02:21.985 --> 00:02:24.865 time at Figma, uh, happened to be on a team that experimentally 00:02:24.865 --> 00:02:26.335 brought Figma into the company. 00:02:26.335 --> 00:02:29.485 And this is a time when we were trying to de-silo all the product 00:02:29.485 --> 00:02:32.595 work that's going on and get the rest of the company knowing what's 00:02:32.595 --> 00:02:34.245 happening inside of the product world. 00:02:34.515 --> 00:02:35.835 So it was a perfect fit for that. 00:02:35.835 --> 00:02:39.945 So I got to see firsthand how it spread virally, got everyone involved, but 00:02:39.945 --> 00:02:43.875 maybe even more importantly, it embodied a philosophy that I always had around 00:02:43.875 --> 00:02:47.820 design, which is that design shouldn't be just designer's consideration. 00:02:48.090 --> 00:02:51.780 I was a product manager for most of my career, and oftentimes had to dig 00:02:51.780 --> 00:02:56.340 through Dropbox files to find that right PNG, and then if I wanted to edit 00:02:56.340 --> 00:03:00.420 it, I needed to gain access to some other application or just, you know, 00:03:00.420 --> 00:03:02.130 go to Photoshop and make some edits. 00:03:02.370 --> 00:03:05.980 Figma took the point of view that I had, which is that over time, these 00:03:06.140 --> 00:03:09.865 boundaries between functions that should be blurred or are artificial. 00:03:10.255 --> 00:03:13.045 Design is something that everyone should be participating in. 00:03:13.045 --> 00:03:17.545 I saw Figma champion that world view early on, and I was really excited by it. 00:03:17.905 --> 00:03:18.385 Matt Abrahams: Great. 00:03:18.385 --> 00:03:23.365 So it was a practical experience that lined up with your philosophical 00:03:23.365 --> 00:03:25.675 approach that, that led you to to join. 00:03:26.075 --> 00:03:30.595 You and Figma have thought a lot about visualizing and communicating ideas. 00:03:30.920 --> 00:03:35.720 What are some of the best practices you've identified for visualization 00:03:35.720 --> 00:03:37.429 and communicating effectively? 00:03:37.790 --> 00:03:41.510 Yuhki Yamashita: I think the first thing that comes to mind is the 00:03:41.510 --> 00:03:45.859 idea that people usually have only a couple takeaways that they can 00:03:46.459 --> 00:03:48.920 bring home or bring to other people. 00:03:49.339 --> 00:03:51.980 For example, if it's a pitch deck, there's that one slide that people 00:03:51.980 --> 00:03:55.850 remember, or that one framework to describe what your product is about 00:03:55.850 --> 00:03:57.709 or maybe what problem you're solving. 00:03:58.160 --> 00:04:03.035 And so I spend a disproportionate amount of time trying to distill that 00:04:03.035 --> 00:04:07.174 discussion or the thesis into something visual that people can remember. 00:04:07.325 --> 00:04:12.365 And sometimes I describe it almost as a meme, you know, like people 00:04:12.365 --> 00:04:16.445 have such short attention spans, they're often multitasking when 00:04:16.445 --> 00:04:17.825 they're consuming information. 00:04:18.185 --> 00:04:20.675 So there's just this one meme that they can take away. 00:04:20.675 --> 00:04:23.745 And maybe that's a really well articulated insight. 00:04:23.925 --> 00:04:26.895 Maybe it's a very provocative problem. 00:04:27.135 --> 00:04:30.585 Maybe it's a visual that you want to keep using over and over again, 00:04:30.855 --> 00:04:34.155 but those are the things that I think about most when I think about 00:04:34.155 --> 00:04:35.805 storytelling and visual storytelling. 00:04:36.195 --> 00:04:38.145 Matt Abrahams: It almost sounds like there's an emotional 00:04:38.145 --> 00:04:39.585 connection to the image. 00:04:39.975 --> 00:04:44.085 Is that something you think a lot about as you think about leveraging images 00:04:44.085 --> 00:04:45.640 to help people focus and remember? 00:04:46.260 --> 00:04:49.979 Yuhki Yamashita: I think so, because oftentimes, for example, I remember 00:04:49.979 --> 00:04:54.030 maybe when I was back at Uber, I was responsible for the rider app, and 00:04:54.060 --> 00:04:55.560 the rider app had a lot of issues. 00:04:55.560 --> 00:04:58.919 When you're getting into a car, there's all things that can go wrong, and it's 00:04:58.919 --> 00:05:02.789 very easy for people to just bring up the thousand different issues that 00:05:02.789 --> 00:05:04.799 they want my team to fix, for example. 00:05:05.130 --> 00:05:08.280 But if you can distill it down to actually there are four stages to a 00:05:08.280 --> 00:05:11.640 pickup, you need to do this and then that, then all of a sudden you've 00:05:11.789 --> 00:05:14.175 given everyone a vocabulary, right? 00:05:14.475 --> 00:05:17.985 And then that is the very same visual framework that people might use in 00:05:17.985 --> 00:05:21.555 their own teams to slot in, oh, here are my problems and goals, and all of 00:05:21.555 --> 00:05:26.505 a sudden you've kind of discretized this ambiguous space into something. 00:05:26.835 --> 00:05:29.835 It's really just language and it just happens to be that like we, 00:05:29.865 --> 00:05:33.285 we've given it something visual or given it words that are memorable. 00:05:33.525 --> 00:05:35.625 Often people call it a framework, but you know, that's 00:05:35.625 --> 00:05:36.885 really essentially what it is. 00:05:37.305 --> 00:05:40.275 Matt Abrahams: I'm a huge fan of frameworks when it comes to communication. 00:05:40.275 --> 00:05:43.245 I think it really helps, in fact, you leverage the pitch framework 00:05:43.245 --> 00:05:49.065 that I like to teach, but I like this idea of distilling processes down 00:05:49.215 --> 00:05:53.745 into their core components, and then thinking about what's the best way to 00:05:53.745 --> 00:05:55.935 visually represent this information. 00:05:56.115 --> 00:06:00.580 In essence, what you said is it gives you a different vocabulary beyond just words. 00:06:00.760 --> 00:06:03.490 It, it gives you a visual vocabulary and I like that a lot. 00:06:03.850 --> 00:06:07.810 Before we end, I'd like to ask you the same two questions that I'm asking 00:06:07.810 --> 00:06:09.790 everyone who's part of this miniseries. 00:06:09.910 --> 00:06:13.450 Who is a communicator that you admire and why? 00:06:13.810 --> 00:06:17.050 Yuhki Yamashita: One communicator who comes to mind is actually my 00:06:17.050 --> 00:06:18.975 first professor of computer science. 00:06:19.355 --> 00:06:21.035 His name is David Millen. 00:06:21.340 --> 00:06:24.910 He runs his introductory to computer science course that's also 00:06:24.910 --> 00:06:27.910 available online for anyone to take. 00:06:28.150 --> 00:06:30.735 And I admire him for two reasons. 00:06:30.735 --> 00:06:37.245 One is he never says, um, it's always just so fluid, even while navigating 00:06:37.605 --> 00:06:41.745 some of the most complex topics, and it comes from a lot of practice, 00:06:41.745 --> 00:06:43.185 but it's just really impressive. 00:06:43.695 --> 00:06:48.285 And the second is really able to make the most complicated things relatable. 00:06:48.765 --> 00:06:54.435 And he's actually managed to make computer science theatrical, almost. 00:06:54.795 --> 00:06:58.530 It's, it's really fun to watch and inspiring, especially from the 00:06:58.530 --> 00:07:02.400 perspective of a student who based on that may or may not pick up the skill. 00:07:03.405 --> 00:07:05.205 Matt Abrahams: One, I love that you picked a professor. 00:07:05.235 --> 00:07:07.965 I think our profession can use all the help we can get. 00:07:08.025 --> 00:07:11.175 I appreciate that anybody can now go check out that course. 00:07:11.805 --> 00:07:14.565 When you said that one thing that stood out to you is that he made 00:07:14.565 --> 00:07:18.135 things relatable and engaging, were there particular techniques he used? 00:07:18.135 --> 00:07:20.475 You said theatrical but what does that mean? 00:07:20.475 --> 00:07:21.345 I'm just curious. 00:07:21.525 --> 00:07:23.865 I'm always interested in how does somebody take something which is 00:07:23.865 --> 00:07:27.795 rather complex like coding and make it engaging and accessible. 00:07:28.035 --> 00:07:31.695 Yuhki Yamashita: For example, he was teaching the idea of binary search. 00:07:32.085 --> 00:07:35.145 He would pick up a dictionary and say, hey, let's talk about 00:07:35.145 --> 00:07:36.435 linear versus binary search. 00:07:36.435 --> 00:07:40.335 Linear search means that you're going, and maybe it was his phone directory and 00:07:40.575 --> 00:07:42.825 I could tell you, hey, go find John Smith. 00:07:43.205 --> 00:07:46.265 But start from the beginning and just flip through every page. 00:07:46.265 --> 00:07:47.225 That's linear search. 00:07:47.495 --> 00:07:50.585 Conversely, I could tell you to do a binary search and he took a directory, 00:07:50.855 --> 00:07:55.835 he ripped it in half, looked at the name, discarded half, kept ripping in half, and 00:07:55.835 --> 00:07:57.425 he could get to John Smith much faster. 00:07:57.425 --> 00:08:01.385 And that's such a visual and evocative way to understand what 00:08:01.385 --> 00:08:02.490 binary search is really about. 00:08:02.520 --> 00:08:02.810 Matt Abrahams: Yeah. 00:08:02.830 --> 00:08:05.165 So he showed you, used an analogy. 00:08:05.165 --> 00:08:05.745 I love that. 00:08:05.835 --> 00:08:06.705 That's great. 00:08:06.705 --> 00:08:09.365 He must've been very strong to be ripping phone books in half. 00:08:09.815 --> 00:08:11.105 Alright, question number two. 00:08:11.550 --> 00:08:16.170 Beyond your tool, what is one communication hack tool or 00:08:16.170 --> 00:08:20.005 shortcut that you use to help yourself be more effective? 00:08:20.715 --> 00:08:24.135 Yuhki Yamashita: I think it's gonna come back to the idea of forming a meme. 00:08:24.195 --> 00:08:27.855 It sounds like a very trivializing thing to do, but I've just kind of 00:08:27.855 --> 00:08:32.775 realized that even as leaders in a company, you find that people start 00:08:32.775 --> 00:08:36.794 repeating things, phrases that they've heard that they picked up, that make 00:08:36.794 --> 00:08:41.985 them maybe sound smart or is a little bit counterintuitive or evocative, and 00:08:41.985 --> 00:08:43.370 therefore you want to spread it more. 00:08:44.010 --> 00:08:48.330 I mentioned spending a disproportionate amount of time honing in on what is a 00:08:48.330 --> 00:08:52.650 way to express this insight that makes people want to repeat it, or what is a 00:08:52.650 --> 00:08:56.610 way to visualize it so that they would want to reuse it over and over again. 00:08:56.790 --> 00:09:01.230 I really spend eighty percent of the time kinda coming it down to like, what is that 00:09:01.230 --> 00:09:03.660 one thing that's gonna spread virally? 00:09:04.205 --> 00:09:06.065 Matt Abrahams: I think that's actually really cool. 00:09:06.275 --> 00:09:11.015 To me, memeifying something, based on what you've said, is really about 00:09:11.015 --> 00:09:14.765 finding what is most relevant and what is most likely to be reused. 00:09:15.185 --> 00:09:18.845 And if you use those two ideas, relevance and reuse as a guide, 00:09:19.175 --> 00:09:20.645 it can really help you focus. 00:09:20.715 --> 00:09:22.555 Yuhki, this has been really insightful. 00:09:22.575 --> 00:09:26.415 I really appreciate not just you sharing what your tool does, which 00:09:26.415 --> 00:09:30.615 is very helpful for collaboration and visualization, but also your approach 00:09:30.645 --> 00:09:34.095 and the way you think about these challenges and how people can be more 00:09:34.095 --> 00:09:35.835 creative and make better decision making. 00:09:35.835 --> 00:09:36.825 Thanks for joining us. 00:09:36.830 --> 00:09:37.590 Yuhki Yamashita: Thank you for having me. 00:09:39.760 --> 00:09:41.415 Matt Abrahams: Thank you for joining us for one of our 00:09:41.415 --> 00:09:45.495 Communication tools episodes of Think Fast Talk Smart, the podcast. 00:09:45.885 --> 00:09:49.355 Please be sure to listen to all of the episodes in this miniseries. 00:09:49.650 --> 00:09:52.980 We appreciate Prezi's sponsorship of these episodes. 00:09:53.400 --> 00:09:58.680 This episode was produced by Katherine Reed, Ryan Campos, and me, Matt Abrahams. 00:09:58.950 --> 00:10:00.510 Our music is from Floyd Wonder. 00:10:00.570 --> 00:10:02.970 With special thanks to Podium Podcast Company. 00:10:03.360 --> 00:10:06.689 Please find us on YouTube and wherever you get your podcasts. 00:10:06.960 --> 00:10:08.970 Be sure to subscribe and rate us. 00:10:09.180 --> 00:10:12.360 Follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok, and Instagram. 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:16.980 And check out fastersmarter.io for deep dive videos, English language 00:10:16.980 --> 00:10:19.230 learning content, and our newsletter. 00:10:19.740 --> 00:10:23.219 Please consider our premium offering for extended Deep Thinks episodes, 00:10:23.339 --> 00:10:28.790 Ask Matt Anythings, and much more at fastersmarter.io/premium.