1 00:00:00,142 --> 00:00:04,702 Welcome to Say More, the powerhouse podcast dedicated to elevating the voices 2 00:00:04,702 --> 00:00:09,042 and journeys of women striving for the C -suite and those who've already conquered 3 00:00:09,042 --> 00:00:09,532 it. 4 00:00:09,532 --> 00:00:14,102 Brace yourself for candid conversations, illuminating interviews and unfiltered 5 00:00:14,102 --> 00:00:18,962 insights as we delve into the triumphs, hurdles and invaluable lessons learned 6 00:00:18,962 --> 00:00:20,686 along the path to success. 7 00:00:20,686 --> 00:00:25,306 Join us on this empowering journey where inspiration meets empowerment and wisdom 8 00:00:25,306 --> 00:00:26,466 reign supreme. 9 00:00:26,466 --> 00:00:30,946 Get ready to ignite your ambition, harness your potential and thrive alongside your 10 00:00:30,946 --> 00:00:33,350 sisters on Say More. 11 00:00:49,582 --> 00:00:56,842 for joining another episode of Say More, the powerhouse podcast where it's women 12 00:00:56,842 --> 00:01:01,452 talking to other women about their journey, whether you're in college, 13 00:01:01,452 --> 00:01:06,022 whether you're in high school, whether you're part of the C -suite already, there 14 00:01:06,022 --> 00:01:11,470 is a conversation to be had about that journey and even about where you are now. 15 00:01:11,470 --> 00:01:16,210 opportunities for us to help one another to talk about their hurdles, talk about 16 00:01:16,210 --> 00:01:19,570 the challenges, and certainly talk about those successes. 17 00:01:19,570 --> 00:01:26,350 And today I have an amazing guest who will share some insight about her own journey. 18 00:01:26,350 --> 00:01:31,030 But I know that, you know, as listeners will all relate to it as well, find some 19 00:01:31,030 --> 00:01:34,320 pieces and be able to take that nugget and share with others. 20 00:01:34,320 --> 00:01:40,206 If you have not shared this podcast with anyone yet, please make sure you do with. 21 00:01:40,206 --> 00:01:44,246 all of your friends, your sisters, your neighbors, your colleagues, and that they 22 00:01:44,246 --> 00:01:50,526 get a chance to say more about how we elevate other women. 23 00:01:50,526 --> 00:01:51,226 How do we do that? 24 00:01:51,226 --> 00:01:52,006 How do we inspire? 25 00:01:52,006 --> 00:01:53,326 How do we empower? 26 00:01:53,326 --> 00:01:56,566 So today's guest, Heather Archidias. 27 00:01:56,566 --> 00:02:00,906 And it's a great conversation that we're going to have. 28 00:02:00,906 --> 00:02:05,966 And it's about, you know, really the journey and your journey today to the C 29 00:02:05,966 --> 00:02:08,782 -suite and what inspired you. 30 00:02:08,782 --> 00:02:14,202 to pursue this leadership role and how you just navigated your career path to get you 31 00:02:14,202 --> 00:02:16,144 to the point where you are today. 32 00:02:19,022 --> 00:02:21,122 First of all, thank you for everything you're doing. 33 00:02:21,122 --> 00:02:24,932 I love, you know, just helping women help other women. 34 00:02:24,932 --> 00:02:27,151 I think everybody wants to help, right? 35 00:02:27,151 --> 00:02:29,172 Like as women, we're naturally, we want to help. 36 00:02:29,172 --> 00:02:31,622 And sometimes it's just, we don't know how. 37 00:02:31,622 --> 00:02:35,282 So I love this form that you've created and thank you for having me. 38 00:02:35,282 --> 00:02:39,922 I mean, I think, you know, when I think about my career path, it has not been 39 00:02:39,922 --> 00:02:42,302 linear and it has not been clean. 40 00:02:42,302 --> 00:02:43,322 It's been messy. 41 00:02:43,322 --> 00:02:45,022 It's been full of some successes. 42 00:02:45,022 --> 00:02:47,122 It's been full of failures. 43 00:02:47,122 --> 00:02:47,918 Like it's. 44 00:02:47,918 --> 00:02:53,658 You know, it's just a mismatch, I think, of like hard work and not being scared to 45 00:02:53,658 --> 00:02:59,118 take some risks and then also like luck, being at the right place at the right time 46 00:02:59,118 --> 00:03:03,778 and also just having some great mentors that help guide me along, right? 47 00:03:03,778 --> 00:03:08,398 And having women that I could look up to and aspire to be. 48 00:03:08,578 --> 00:03:15,018 It's just been a really interesting journey that I never would have predicted 49 00:03:15,018 --> 00:03:17,582 when I first started out. 50 00:03:17,582 --> 00:03:18,886 a long time. 51 00:03:20,846 --> 00:03:24,746 I love that, I love that with, you know, say more. 52 00:03:24,746 --> 00:03:30,126 It's about, you know, the authentic, genuine feelings and thoughts and comments 53 00:03:30,126 --> 00:03:31,126 that we can share. 54 00:03:31,126 --> 00:03:35,166 And I love that what you pointed out for our listeners, that it's not, it's not 55 00:03:35,166 --> 00:03:36,626 been a straight line. 56 00:03:36,626 --> 00:03:37,686 It's been some curves. 57 00:03:37,686 --> 00:03:39,946 It's been some, you know, some have been rocky. 58 00:03:39,946 --> 00:03:41,546 Some has been, you know, smooth. 59 00:03:41,546 --> 00:03:46,626 So I think it's great that our listeners hear that because oftentimes, you know, we 60 00:03:46,626 --> 00:03:50,414 can beat ourselves up because, hey, it doesn't look like, 61 00:03:50,414 --> 00:03:54,194 what I read about or what I saw on social media. 62 00:03:54,194 --> 00:03:57,274 So I must not be doing this thing right. 63 00:03:57,274 --> 00:04:03,293 And that's so unfair, one, if we do it to ourselves, but when others impose that 64 00:04:03,293 --> 00:04:07,104 same view on other people and other women. 65 00:04:07,104 --> 00:04:09,914 So it really is to talk about that today. 66 00:04:09,914 --> 00:04:14,734 And so when I think about the prominent leadership position that you hold and you 67 00:04:14,734 --> 00:04:15,950 can share that. 68 00:04:15,950 --> 00:04:19,590 What challenges have you faced throughout your career journey? 69 00:04:19,590 --> 00:04:24,850 I mean, because you have been in a number of key roles and just how did you overcome 70 00:04:24,850 --> 00:04:26,170 some of those challenges? 71 00:04:26,170 --> 00:04:29,470 And like, what advice would you give to our listeners? 72 00:04:29,470 --> 00:04:34,530 I would say, first and foremost is just being an advocate for yourself. 73 00:04:34,530 --> 00:04:38,330 I spent almost 20 years in journalism before I moved over to the healthcare 74 00:04:38,330 --> 00:04:38,770 space. 75 00:04:38,770 --> 00:04:42,830 And I think most of that is kind of mid management. 76 00:04:43,662 --> 00:04:49,122 working in an industry that also very mission driven like healthcare, but also 77 00:04:49,122 --> 00:04:53,822 in an industry, right, that was rapidly changing, you know, the industry not maybe 78 00:04:53,822 --> 00:04:59,762 changing as fast as it needed to, to stay, you know, profitable and relevant. 79 00:04:59,762 --> 00:05:06,922 But I think the things that really held me back there were just, you know, not having 80 00:05:06,922 --> 00:05:11,502 a lot of the thing that I like about the business world is right, it is very, 81 00:05:11,502 --> 00:05:14,502 objective, goal -oriented. 82 00:05:14,682 --> 00:05:16,782 You set tasks, you do it. 83 00:05:16,782 --> 00:05:22,962 You have people along the way who really reward and appreciate your results. 84 00:05:23,262 --> 00:05:29,282 I think journalism is, it's like an industry of storytellers, but I think the 85 00:05:29,282 --> 00:05:35,782 thing that was really hard for me there was just no one necessarily thinking about 86 00:05:35,782 --> 00:05:36,542 careers. 87 00:05:36,542 --> 00:05:41,262 We were so focused on the stories that I really just 88 00:05:41,262 --> 00:05:48,642 didn't have a wealth of people saying, hey, like maybe when you voice your 89 00:05:48,642 --> 00:05:52,862 displeasure with, you know, a direction that we're going in a meeting that you, 90 00:05:52,862 --> 00:05:58,662 instead of criticizing someone else's idea that you pitch a better idea or hey, like 91 00:05:58,662 --> 00:06:03,602 maybe you do, you know, collaborate some of that dirty laundry behind the scenes 92 00:06:03,602 --> 00:06:06,862 and make sure that you're understanding other people's viewpoints before you just 93 00:06:06,862 --> 00:06:09,292 say something and maybe catch people off guard. 94 00:06:09,292 --> 00:06:10,318 It was just... 95 00:06:10,318 --> 00:06:15,298 feedback that I could have used earlier in my career to be a more collaborative 96 00:06:15,298 --> 00:06:21,518 teammate, to be a stronger advocate for my group of writers that I was managing. 97 00:06:21,518 --> 00:06:26,437 I just think looking back at Young Heather, I'm a little bit embarrassed. 98 00:06:26,437 --> 00:06:30,578 Like, no wonder I kind of got stuck in mid -management. 99 00:06:30,578 --> 00:06:40,046 I think the thing that was it for me is just I was about to turn 40 and 100 00:06:40,046 --> 00:06:43,046 going through another round of layoffs. 101 00:06:43,386 --> 00:06:45,866 And that's just a horrible place to be, right? 102 00:06:45,866 --> 00:06:49,466 When there's just not enough money to pay everybody and you got to pick who gets to 103 00:06:49,466 --> 00:06:50,726 keep their job and who isn't. 104 00:06:50,726 --> 00:06:53,256 And just like the enormous weight of that. 105 00:06:53,256 --> 00:06:58,166 And they were offering a round of buyouts and they're like, like, so enough people, 106 00:06:58,166 --> 00:06:59,616 volunteers took the buyouts. 107 00:06:59,616 --> 00:07:02,246 We wouldn't have to do any layoffs. 108 00:07:02,246 --> 00:07:08,436 And I can remember, right, just thinking much. 109 00:07:08,622 --> 00:07:13,962 my job is who I am, like a journalist is who I am, like this is what I went to 110 00:07:13,962 --> 00:07:15,122 college for. 111 00:07:15,122 --> 00:07:19,982 But then also just thinking like, is this really what I wanna do? 112 00:07:20,722 --> 00:07:23,162 Is this really where I wanna be, right? 113 00:07:23,162 --> 00:07:27,122 Like just working, I had gotten so many promotions without any corresponding pain 114 00:07:27,122 --> 00:07:28,102 creams. 115 00:07:28,122 --> 00:07:31,312 Heather today would never take a promotion without a pain cream. 116 00:07:31,312 --> 00:07:32,822 Just like, who was it? 117 00:07:32,822 --> 00:07:36,430 I was just thinking like, I just, it was just a whole, 118 00:07:36,430 --> 00:07:42,210 other mindset and I think, you know, I took the leap, like I took a job for half 119 00:07:42,210 --> 00:07:48,350 the pay, you know, hoping that my skills translated and just kept taking those sort 120 00:07:48,350 --> 00:07:49,950 of expanded steps. 121 00:07:49,950 --> 00:07:56,890 But I think, you know, my, I guess my overall advice through that journey is 122 00:07:56,890 --> 00:07:59,750 like, I wish I would have been a learner. 123 00:07:59,750 --> 00:08:04,350 I wish I would have been more focused on my own career a little bit sooner than I 124 00:08:04,350 --> 00:08:05,454 was and just. 125 00:08:05,454 --> 00:08:08,894 setting those sort of career plans and five -year goals. 126 00:08:08,894 --> 00:08:12,714 I was just like in it for the love of what I was doing that day. 127 00:08:12,714 --> 00:08:16,694 So just like I wish I would have thought a little more long -term earlier. 128 00:08:16,694 --> 00:08:20,004 I wish I would have left journalism a little earlier quite quickly. 129 00:08:20,004 --> 00:08:25,694 I wish, you know, that I would have, you know, not been so scared to pivot and 130 00:08:25,694 --> 00:08:26,384 change course. 131 00:08:26,384 --> 00:08:29,784 And I would say like the last 10 years I've grown and learned so much. 132 00:08:29,784 --> 00:08:34,477 I've had the privilege of having so many, so many mentors. 133 00:08:34,477 --> 00:08:41,557 One in particular, just this really strong woman who has since retired, but just so 134 00:08:41,557 --> 00:08:46,837 great at like holding a room, helping people be accountable, helping people 135 00:08:46,837 --> 00:08:52,367 succeed, but also helping us accomplish what we needed and tactfully, right? 136 00:08:52,367 --> 00:08:59,417 And not the rash and sassy, you know, that I can a little bit cringe when I think 137 00:08:59,417 --> 00:09:00,437 about. 138 00:09:01,217 --> 00:09:03,886 I love that because, 139 00:09:03,886 --> 00:09:10,026 just you sharing it because again, I think our listeners will appreciate that even 140 00:09:10,026 --> 00:09:13,786 though and certainly layoffs can be devastating. 141 00:09:13,786 --> 00:09:20,066 Even thinking about a career change can be totally devastating, but how you chose 142 00:09:20,066 --> 00:09:25,866 that and saw that as an opportunity to pivot and to really reflect on what it is 143 00:09:25,866 --> 00:09:29,406 that you want to do and what would you change about that? 144 00:09:29,406 --> 00:09:32,622 So again, it's not a failure. 145 00:09:32,622 --> 00:09:35,902 if you don't feel, I mean, move forward and learn from it. 146 00:09:35,902 --> 00:09:39,082 And I think it's okay that we have these moments. 147 00:09:39,082 --> 00:09:45,622 I think oftentimes, you know, as women, we can see things as periods versus a comma, 148 00:09:45,622 --> 00:09:47,832 you know, okay, it's the next thing. 149 00:09:47,832 --> 00:09:53,642 So I think it's so powerful that you shared lessons learned, but you also share 150 00:09:53,642 --> 00:09:57,326 the power of what you have learned. 151 00:09:57,326 --> 00:09:59,726 And what you know now is just the no goal. 152 00:09:59,726 --> 00:10:03,546 You know, why take, you know, a whole number of promotions without the 153 00:10:03,546 --> 00:10:05,966 compensation piece to go along with it. 154 00:10:05,966 --> 00:10:11,546 And I need, and I'm certain that you have that same commitment for our listeners, 155 00:10:11,546 --> 00:10:15,006 regardless of where you are in your stage, but certainly those that are just starting 156 00:10:15,006 --> 00:10:20,586 out to hear this, to understand this and to have people in your corner that you can 157 00:10:20,586 --> 00:10:22,222 have these conversations with. 158 00:10:22,222 --> 00:10:26,882 Certainly say more will be a go -to for you, but it's important to have people in 159 00:10:26,882 --> 00:10:29,312 your corner that you can have those conversations with. 160 00:10:29,312 --> 00:10:34,442 Thinking about the journey that you had, the move from one career to the next. 161 00:10:34,442 --> 00:10:40,662 In your experience, how do you think gender diversity has impacted any decision 162 00:10:40,662 --> 00:10:45,202 -making and innovation within, I guess even the organizations that you've been a 163 00:10:45,202 --> 00:10:49,342 part of, what did you think about the career that you had or even the current 164 00:10:49,342 --> 00:10:50,342 one now? 165 00:10:53,262 --> 00:10:56,242 Yeah, I think in the crew that I had, right, it's interesting. 166 00:10:56,242 --> 00:11:00,602 I recently had lunch with one of my former coworkers from my newspaper days and we 167 00:11:00,602 --> 00:11:08,002 just, you know, there's a journalism is still to this day, very male dominated, 168 00:11:08,002 --> 00:11:08,232 right? 169 00:11:08,232 --> 00:11:16,372 And so there's like, it is very man -centric for lack of a better word. 170 00:11:16,372 --> 00:11:22,362 And I think, you know, sometimes, and again, I'm approaching 50, so things are 171 00:11:22,362 --> 00:11:23,022 certainly, 172 00:11:23,022 --> 00:11:25,352 better right now than they used to be. 173 00:11:25,352 --> 00:11:31,422 But I think that there's just, you know, there were just those roles I think that 174 00:11:31,422 --> 00:11:32,272 women could play. 175 00:11:32,272 --> 00:11:39,261 Like we were talking about women as, you know, what leader they support, right? 176 00:11:39,261 --> 00:11:41,482 Versus being leaders in their own right. 177 00:11:41,482 --> 00:11:45,462 And I think that there were certainly some of us who felt, you know, that way is 178 00:11:45,462 --> 00:11:52,118 like, well, that, you know, that person's job is just to make so and so look good. 179 00:11:52,142 --> 00:11:54,542 versus that person's job. 180 00:11:54,542 --> 00:12:00,762 And just having to center your career, I think, A Random Man, I think we've 181 00:12:00,762 --> 00:12:02,502 certainly come a long way from that. 182 00:12:02,502 --> 00:12:04,782 Healthcare, I'm so grateful, right? 183 00:12:04,782 --> 00:12:08,521 It's largely female dominated, right? 184 00:12:08,521 --> 00:12:13,212 In a lot of places, like on my team, we were just talking the other day about how, 185 00:12:13,212 --> 00:12:14,126 so there's, 186 00:12:14,126 --> 00:12:18,606 There's now 80 people or so on my team, about eight of them are men. 187 00:12:18,606 --> 00:12:25,126 Otherwise it is a very, a very female dominated team, like most of healthcare. 188 00:12:25,226 --> 00:12:30,166 So it's kind of an awkward place to be healthcare and be a woman, but I think 189 00:12:30,166 --> 00:12:36,726 still there are still issues around, you know, I see some of my friends who have 190 00:12:36,726 --> 00:12:40,366 gone on from journalism and now they're in different careers across. 191 00:12:40,366 --> 00:12:43,946 across different industries and just, you know, there's still, we've come a long 192 00:12:43,946 --> 00:12:46,126 way, but there's still ways to go, right? 193 00:12:46,126 --> 00:12:51,886 In terms of just equal opportunity and pay inequities, like those are all things that 194 00:12:51,886 --> 00:12:55,026 we need to keep our eye on. 195 00:12:55,026 --> 00:13:01,606 I just, you know, one of the things here is that's so great is, you know, I know 196 00:13:01,606 --> 00:13:08,558 you, our CEO is so wonderful, but then a couple of years ago, our parent company, 197 00:13:08,558 --> 00:13:12,618 a young woman in our 40s was named CEO of our entire company. 198 00:13:12,618 --> 00:13:14,568 And that was just so inspiring, right? 199 00:13:14,568 --> 00:13:20,118 Because if you can't see yourself in a role, if you don't have anybody to aspire 200 00:13:20,118 --> 00:13:24,158 to or look up to, like, and I just remember how affirming and wonderful that 201 00:13:24,158 --> 00:13:29,778 was when that news came about who our new, you know, corporate CEO would be, like, 202 00:13:29,778 --> 00:13:34,898 how meaningful that was, not just to me, but to everyone really across the company. 203 00:13:34,898 --> 00:13:36,078 Because I think, 204 00:13:36,078 --> 00:13:40,238 That's the thing is like healthcare largely, you know, with women, but now 205 00:13:40,238 --> 00:13:45,238 also at the very top a woman and that's a really cool thing for us. 206 00:13:45,438 --> 00:13:47,668 I think it's great what you said. 207 00:13:47,668 --> 00:13:51,978 I mean, the excitement that we can have for others, there is certainly enough 208 00:13:51,978 --> 00:13:57,778 opportunity for all to have and play a role in that, but really to be sharing the 209 00:13:57,778 --> 00:14:00,078 excitement for the success being seeing my others. 210 00:14:00,078 --> 00:14:05,582 And I think this is probably a great segue for thinking about what initiatives. 211 00:14:05,582 --> 00:14:10,762 because of your own journey, have you had the opportunity to implement or witness 212 00:14:10,762 --> 00:14:16,562 that foster diversity and inclusion over the course of your career that really 213 00:14:16,562 --> 00:14:16,902 stood out? 214 00:14:16,902 --> 00:14:24,442 Yeah, I would say, you know, at Sunshine Health, diversity is just such a crucial 215 00:14:24,442 --> 00:14:26,412 piece of our success, right? 216 00:14:26,412 --> 00:14:32,362 It's just that diversity of our workforce, the inclusion of just making sure everyone 217 00:14:32,362 --> 00:14:34,158 has a seat at the table. 218 00:14:34,158 --> 00:14:38,638 Like you can't have true innovation if you don't have it, if you don't have all 219 00:14:38,638 --> 00:14:43,638 different people of backgrounds and beliefs to come and help fuel that, help 220 00:14:43,638 --> 00:14:49,918 bring their life experience and all of the wisdom that comes with that into your 221 00:14:49,918 --> 00:14:51,118 engagement approaches. 222 00:14:51,118 --> 00:14:53,018 That's just so crucial. 223 00:14:53,018 --> 00:14:57,878 So I think I'm really lucky that I get to be in a space where that's so highly 224 00:14:57,878 --> 00:14:58,718 valued. 225 00:14:58,718 --> 00:15:01,526 But I think for me, like it, 226 00:15:01,806 --> 00:15:08,006 The place where I feel like I still try to help others, right, that can still be a 227 00:15:08,006 --> 00:15:12,246 struggle is just that whole, and I've even talked to my own son about this, right? 228 00:15:12,246 --> 00:15:15,786 He is 25 now and he's early in his career. 229 00:15:15,786 --> 00:15:19,846 And I think there's just such a balance between, you know, that whole notion of 230 00:15:19,846 --> 00:15:22,296 can you bring your real self to work, right? 231 00:15:22,296 --> 00:15:26,526 Do you get to be authentically you at work? 232 00:15:26,526 --> 00:15:28,870 And I think I just... 233 00:15:29,006 --> 00:15:33,356 I'll be happy when we don't have to have this conversation anymore, right? 234 00:15:33,356 --> 00:15:36,926 I think that that just establishing trust, right? 235 00:15:36,926 --> 00:15:41,646 And with your team, being honest, being honest about your mistakes, being honest 236 00:15:41,646 --> 00:15:46,126 about, you know, other people, like feedback for others, like that's just such 237 00:15:46,126 --> 00:15:47,746 a crucial part. 238 00:15:47,746 --> 00:15:52,926 And I think, you know, it's just, we're getting close, right? 239 00:15:52,926 --> 00:15:58,990 But there's still just a lot of work to be done around just helping people. 240 00:15:58,990 --> 00:16:04,090 feel comfortable, to be their real selves at work, to raise their hand, even if it's 241 00:16:04,090 --> 00:16:11,670 maybe out of the scope of their expertise, but they have a lived experience that can 242 00:16:11,670 --> 00:16:18,750 inform a strategy, like just being willing to make that leap and raise their hand and 243 00:16:18,750 --> 00:16:23,790 volunteer for the extra assignment that seems a little out of their comfort zone. 244 00:16:23,790 --> 00:16:27,686 I feel like for me, I spend a lot of time just... 245 00:16:27,918 --> 00:16:32,618 trying to share a little bit of courage with people because I think early in my 246 00:16:32,618 --> 00:16:37,238 career I had so much fear and I led from a place where it's like, okay, well, I'm not 247 00:16:37,238 --> 00:16:41,778 gonna, you know, I'm not gonna take that risk and I just, you know, like, I just 248 00:16:41,778 --> 00:16:43,978 wanna encourage people to take all the risks. 249 00:16:43,978 --> 00:16:48,098 Like, failures are really just opportunities to like grow and learn or 250 00:16:48,098 --> 00:16:49,798 maybe just do something different. 251 00:16:49,798 --> 00:16:51,688 Like, not every table's for you. 252 00:16:51,688 --> 00:16:55,150 And I feel like I'm at that age where it's like, I don't need to be. 253 00:16:55,150 --> 00:16:59,950 at every table, like you spend the early part of your career just trying to like 254 00:16:59,950 --> 00:17:01,810 fight and earn your seat at the table. 255 00:17:01,810 --> 00:17:05,050 And now like, I feel like I've turned the corner and was like, every table is not 256 00:17:05,050 --> 00:17:05,570 for me. 257 00:17:05,570 --> 00:17:07,170 Like, and that's okay. 258 00:17:09,134 --> 00:17:12,954 love that and for a lot of listeners I know this is going to be the crystal ball 259 00:17:12,954 --> 00:17:16,874 that they're kind of looking into what would be the other side of this because 260 00:17:16,874 --> 00:17:20,654 again while you're going through it and while you're feeling it and trying to find 261 00:17:20,654 --> 00:17:26,154 every table possible that you can sit at that there is the other side and flip side 262 00:17:26,154 --> 00:17:30,914 that you discover is that every table was not a table that you needed to reach or in 263 00:17:30,914 --> 00:17:35,974 some instances I think you know you've talked about some of the experiences and 264 00:17:35,974 --> 00:17:37,452 you've talked about 265 00:17:37,486 --> 00:17:40,286 even highlighting the success of others. 266 00:17:40,286 --> 00:17:45,546 But I think we have to be, and I love that Seymour allows for this, that we can be 267 00:17:45,546 --> 00:17:49,766 transparent in our conversations, that it's not just a gender piece that we're 268 00:17:49,766 --> 00:17:54,286 talking about, because some of the challenges that I know that you've heard 269 00:17:54,286 --> 00:18:00,286 and that I've certainly heard throughout my career has involved other women with 270 00:18:00,286 --> 00:18:03,342 other women relative to... 271 00:18:03,342 --> 00:18:05,542 difficulties that they face. 272 00:18:05,542 --> 00:18:10,822 And so I don't want to, and I know that there, we oftentimes think that maybe, you 273 00:18:10,822 --> 00:18:12,662 know, maybe it's just a man versus woman. 274 00:18:12,662 --> 00:18:14,782 No, it can happen in all different places. 275 00:18:14,782 --> 00:18:18,612 And so there are opportunities for us all to learn and be reflective. 276 00:18:18,612 --> 00:18:23,682 And I guess again, when I, you know, you've talked about where you, you know, 277 00:18:23,682 --> 00:18:28,022 this whole idea of overcoming challenges and then thinking about gender diversity, 278 00:18:28,022 --> 00:18:29,006 you know, 279 00:18:29,006 --> 00:18:33,966 Leadership often comes with its share of setbacks and failures, right? 280 00:18:33,966 --> 00:18:39,506 Can you share a significant professional setback that you encounter and how you 281 00:18:39,506 --> 00:18:43,750 manage to bounce back from it because resilience is such a key thing? 282 00:18:45,518 --> 00:18:50,338 Yeah, I mean, I think for me, right, it was when I decided to leave journalism and 283 00:18:50,338 --> 00:18:55,518 take a job for half the pay and, you know, kind of really sort of go back to that 284 00:18:55,518 --> 00:18:57,858 ground level of an individual contributor. 285 00:18:57,858 --> 00:18:59,478 And what does that look like? 286 00:18:59,478 --> 00:19:02,738 And like, it felt like a failure at the time. 287 00:19:02,738 --> 00:19:04,738 It was so scary. 288 00:19:04,738 --> 00:19:10,968 And I can just remember being like, my gosh, like, what am I doing? 289 00:19:10,968 --> 00:19:11,938 Like, is this good? 290 00:19:11,938 --> 00:19:13,338 Is this going to be my life? 291 00:19:13,338 --> 00:19:14,734 But it was such a 292 00:19:14,734 --> 00:19:17,374 It turned out to be exactly what I needed, right? 293 00:19:17,374 --> 00:19:19,774 Cause I had to get it. 294 00:19:19,774 --> 00:19:24,414 It just really right away put me back into that growth mindset of like, I need to 295 00:19:24,414 --> 00:19:25,574 learn these things. 296 00:19:25,574 --> 00:19:27,274 I need to figure this out. 297 00:19:27,274 --> 00:19:31,374 I need to be working in the corner over here to make my skills better. 298 00:19:31,374 --> 00:19:35,314 Like, you know, in journal, like this is going to sound so minute, but it's just 299 00:19:35,314 --> 00:19:36,934 kind of a good example. 300 00:19:36,934 --> 00:19:41,594 It's like, you know, PowerPoint is the language of corporate America, but, and 301 00:19:41,594 --> 00:19:43,406 students are learning it in school now. 302 00:19:43,406 --> 00:19:44,506 I didn't, right? 303 00:19:44,506 --> 00:19:48,346 Like I'm of a certain age where we didn't learn PowerPoint in school and it 304 00:19:48,346 --> 00:19:52,666 definitely wasn't a skill set that you needed in journalism, but it literally, so 305 00:19:52,666 --> 00:19:57,666 I can remember just at night, just trying to figure that out and trying to figure 306 00:19:57,666 --> 00:20:02,506 out how to make things act like Microsoft Word, which it really doesn't, right? 307 00:20:02,506 --> 00:20:05,726 It took me a long time, but it's just things like that, right? 308 00:20:05,726 --> 00:20:11,286 It really helped at that really low level put me into a growth mindset that has 309 00:20:11,286 --> 00:20:12,654 really helped my career. 310 00:20:12,654 --> 00:20:17,154 throughout the last decade of just not being afraid to ask questions, not being 311 00:20:17,154 --> 00:20:19,394 afraid to go acquire the skills. 312 00:20:19,394 --> 00:20:25,174 I think a lot of times people are just afraid to say they don't know something or 313 00:20:25,174 --> 00:20:27,054 ask someone to teach them something. 314 00:20:27,054 --> 00:20:34,214 And I have been so incredibly blessed by just having people and coworkers that I 315 00:20:34,214 --> 00:20:38,234 could go to and say, can you please just, can I put time on your calendar for you to 316 00:20:38,234 --> 00:20:38,944 walk me through this? 317 00:20:38,944 --> 00:20:42,062 I would love to just get a better understanding of how this all works. 318 00:20:42,062 --> 00:20:43,802 People want to help you. 319 00:20:43,802 --> 00:20:48,812 I think sometimes young women come to me and they're like, I want to mentor. 320 00:20:48,812 --> 00:20:49,812 How does that work? 321 00:20:49,812 --> 00:20:53,482 And I'm like, it can work so many different ways. 322 00:20:53,482 --> 00:20:56,042 And I'm not going to tell you what the answer for you is. 323 00:20:56,042 --> 00:20:59,922 But what it looked like for me was just having small requests. 324 00:20:59,922 --> 00:21:01,642 Can you help me understand this? 325 00:21:01,642 --> 00:21:03,542 Can you help me understand that? 326 00:21:03,542 --> 00:21:05,602 Can you walk me through this project? 327 00:21:05,602 --> 00:21:07,952 Can you share your project plan on that? 328 00:21:07,952 --> 00:21:10,318 I'd love to see how that came together. 329 00:21:10,318 --> 00:21:13,458 behind the scenes because that's awesome what you did. 330 00:21:13,658 --> 00:21:16,898 Because I think sometimes, like I have never have approached someone and been 331 00:21:16,898 --> 00:21:18,728 like, hey, can you please be my mentor? 332 00:21:18,728 --> 00:21:21,528 I think that can be intimidating for people, right? 333 00:21:21,528 --> 00:21:22,688 Because they know what that means. 334 00:21:22,688 --> 00:21:25,598 Does that mean you want to meet with me once a week for an hour? 335 00:21:25,598 --> 00:21:26,938 I don't have an hour. 336 00:21:26,938 --> 00:21:31,598 But if you put 15 minutes on my calendar and say, yeah, I would love to understand 337 00:21:31,598 --> 00:21:36,398 this, like I'm nine times out of 10 going to accept that if it fits into my 338 00:21:36,398 --> 00:21:37,218 schedule. 339 00:21:37,218 --> 00:21:39,566 So I think for me, it's just, 340 00:21:39,566 --> 00:21:45,526 you know, keeping, you know, keeping that sort of growth mindset, even if it's just 341 00:21:45,526 --> 00:21:46,786 a little bit of time a week. 342 00:21:46,786 --> 00:21:48,466 I mean, we all have a full play. 343 00:21:48,466 --> 00:21:52,966 It's so hard to think about your career and balance your work deliverables and try 344 00:21:52,966 --> 00:21:54,626 to manage your family. 345 00:21:54,626 --> 00:21:56,306 It's a lot to be a woman, right? 346 00:21:56,306 --> 00:22:01,346 Like we, I think one of the things that I still see, you know, in a lot of my 347 00:22:01,346 --> 00:22:07,176 friends and coworkers is just this idea that women still have to do it all, right? 348 00:22:07,176 --> 00:22:09,518 In a way that men just don't have to. 349 00:22:09,518 --> 00:22:11,578 feel that same burden. 350 00:22:12,078 --> 00:22:14,588 And I think that's it. 351 00:22:14,588 --> 00:22:16,618 You don't have to boil the ocean. 352 00:22:16,618 --> 00:22:21,758 Just take one little tiny step, at least once a month or once a week, whatever you 353 00:22:21,758 --> 00:22:25,878 can carve out to build your career or build your brand. 354 00:22:26,118 --> 00:22:27,478 And then you're moving. 355 00:22:27,478 --> 00:22:29,358 You're keeping that momentum. 356 00:22:29,958 --> 00:22:34,338 You don't have to run if you just keep taking those little steps and they 357 00:22:34,338 --> 00:22:35,462 eventually add up. 358 00:22:36,686 --> 00:22:42,206 Quick question for you when I think about this and so asking questions, you're 359 00:22:42,206 --> 00:22:42,386 right. 360 00:22:42,386 --> 00:22:48,186 It's powerful That's how you learn but then there are situations, you know And 361 00:22:48,186 --> 00:22:51,986 I'm certain that listeners are probably saying this to themselves that this sounds 362 00:22:51,986 --> 00:22:56,066 like a perfect environment and a perfect climate that you can feel comfortable in 363 00:22:56,066 --> 00:23:02,326 asking questions I hear often across the nation from women regardless of kind of 364 00:23:02,326 --> 00:23:06,414 where they are in their stage of career journey where they say I 365 00:23:06,414 --> 00:23:11,194 you know what, if I ask a question, it's going to come across as if I don't know 366 00:23:11,194 --> 00:23:15,954 and I'm not qualified to be in the role that I'm in, that people are going to 367 00:23:15,954 --> 00:23:18,534 question me because I had that question. 368 00:23:18,534 --> 00:23:20,894 So what's been your experience with that? 369 00:23:20,894 --> 00:23:26,114 Because I do, I love how you describe that and how you decided to, you know, take 370 00:23:26,114 --> 00:23:29,414 that next step and be a person of inquiry. 371 00:23:29,414 --> 00:23:34,434 But what, what advice would you give in those instances where, you know what you 372 00:23:34,434 --> 00:23:35,758 ask the question? 373 00:23:35,758 --> 00:23:40,838 and you're already perhaps the only woman or whatever else on the leadership team, 374 00:23:40,838 --> 00:23:44,198 what kind of conversation would you offer for that? 375 00:23:47,150 --> 00:23:50,270 Honestly, I would say maybe you're not the right place. 376 00:23:50,270 --> 00:23:52,040 I think, you know, I spent a lot of time. 377 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:54,990 We need to hear that. 378 00:23:55,130 --> 00:23:55,869 Yeah. 379 00:23:56,290 --> 00:23:58,120 Because that's a hard thing, right? 380 00:23:58,120 --> 00:24:01,110 Like I spent a lot of time in the wrong place. 381 00:24:01,110 --> 00:24:05,390 And I think, you know, obviously it's the benefit of age, right? 382 00:24:05,390 --> 00:24:10,510 When you accumulate all these experiences, you can look back at your younger self and 383 00:24:10,510 --> 00:24:11,982 be like, hmm. 384 00:24:11,982 --> 00:24:15,282 Like I don't want to rock the boat, but like maybe you should rock the boat 385 00:24:15,282 --> 00:24:20,522 because if they don't appreciate every, like people are not, like here's what I 386 00:24:20,522 --> 00:24:26,442 always try to tell people, like especially on my own team or my friends or whoever, 387 00:24:26,442 --> 00:24:29,432 like this job in healthcare, it might not be for you. 388 00:24:29,432 --> 00:24:30,702 It's not for everybody. 389 00:24:30,702 --> 00:24:32,762 It is constantly changing. 390 00:24:32,762 --> 00:24:36,842 It's a lot of busy, like priorities change from one day to the next. 391 00:24:36,842 --> 00:24:38,574 We have to be reactive. 392 00:24:38,574 --> 00:24:43,354 You know, and I think not everybody loves to be in kind of that fast paced and 393 00:24:43,354 --> 00:24:45,094 sometimes chaotic environment. 394 00:24:45,094 --> 00:24:48,334 And it's not your fault and it's not the company's fault. 395 00:24:48,334 --> 00:24:50,924 Like that might just not be the right place for you. 396 00:24:50,924 --> 00:24:52,394 And that's not failure. 397 00:24:52,394 --> 00:24:58,154 That's a step to you finding your true purpose and where you're supposed to be. 398 00:24:58,154 --> 00:25:02,934 So like, I don't, I just, I think that, 399 00:25:03,662 --> 00:25:09,422 If you feel like, my advice is if you feel like you're spending too much time trying 400 00:25:09,422 --> 00:25:13,902 to fit into an organization and trying to make sure that you don't rock the boat, 401 00:25:13,902 --> 00:25:15,842 it's probably not your boat. 402 00:25:15,842 --> 00:25:21,082 And also if you want to come to our boat, send team jobs, then you just go down to 403 00:25:21,082 --> 00:25:22,002 Florida. 404 00:25:22,362 --> 00:25:25,130 We're always looking for great talent. 405 00:25:27,726 --> 00:25:34,106 I love how you answered that authentically because, you know, oftentimes we look for 406 00:25:34,106 --> 00:25:38,066 the most politically correct response to it. 407 00:25:38,066 --> 00:25:44,386 But really, as you mentioned, it's about, and it's okay to think about appropriate 408 00:25:44,386 --> 00:25:44,986 fit. 409 00:25:44,986 --> 00:25:48,146 Sometimes, you know, people feel like, well, if I don't, if I'm not here, then 410 00:25:48,146 --> 00:25:53,966 I'm not any, you are, when you get to the right spot, I promise you will flourish. 411 00:25:53,966 --> 00:25:57,358 So it's about, you know, reflecting in on that. 412 00:25:57,358 --> 00:26:03,978 and realizing that honestly to stay longer in that space doesn't help anyone because 413 00:26:03,978 --> 00:26:07,578 you're not growing and they're not benefiting from what you know because 414 00:26:07,578 --> 00:26:09,558 you're afraid to ask the questions. 415 00:26:09,558 --> 00:26:11,418 So thank you, thank you for that. 416 00:26:11,418 --> 00:26:14,898 And then, you know, Heather, when I think about, again, just some of what you've 417 00:26:14,898 --> 00:26:20,638 talked about, how have you looked at ways to pay it forward and support the 418 00:26:20,638 --> 00:26:22,702 development of aspiring female leaders? 419 00:26:22,702 --> 00:26:26,721 within your organization or even outside of it, you know, because you know, being 420 00:26:26,721 --> 00:26:31,222 in a role like you're in, you can't help but have people that ask specific things 421 00:26:31,222 --> 00:26:34,694 about, you know, could you answer this or could you help me with this? 422 00:26:36,462 --> 00:26:41,062 Yeah, I think for me, right, it is just helping empower other women to be their 423 00:26:41,062 --> 00:26:42,242 own best advocate. 424 00:26:42,242 --> 00:26:48,142 I think, you know, we all come from, we all are shaped by our own experiences. 425 00:26:48,142 --> 00:26:52,541 And I think because I had, you know, I spent such a long time in a place where I 426 00:26:52,541 --> 00:26:58,282 didn't feel valued or, and also like I was not advocating for myself, that I always 427 00:26:58,282 --> 00:27:03,962 make time to just give feedback to people about how they do things or just how to be 428 00:27:03,962 --> 00:27:06,158 a better advocate for themselves. 429 00:27:06,158 --> 00:27:10,098 I think, you know, for the most part, like, I think people are really grateful 430 00:27:10,098 --> 00:27:14,378 for feedback, I think, because I felt like I was feedback starved earlier in my 431 00:27:14,378 --> 00:27:15,278 career. 432 00:27:16,838 --> 00:27:23,358 I will tell you this, like, one of my team members would constantly say, like, why do 433 00:27:23,358 --> 00:27:26,898 I feel like every time we go to Happy Hour, it's a performance evaluation? 434 00:27:26,898 --> 00:27:29,638 Like, it's not a performance evaluation. 435 00:27:29,638 --> 00:27:32,308 I just really want to help you, right? 436 00:27:32,308 --> 00:27:36,078 Like, sometimes people get in their own way and they don't know, like, 437 00:27:36,078 --> 00:27:39,338 I look back at young Heather and all the ways I got in my own way. 438 00:27:39,338 --> 00:27:44,017 Like if someone would have just taken time to give me that direct candid feedback, 439 00:27:44,017 --> 00:27:49,338 then I would have been so much better, so much earlier. 440 00:27:49,338 --> 00:27:54,628 And I think that that's like, I just try to give, not just to women, to everyone, 441 00:27:54,628 --> 00:27:59,622 but really, especially for women, it's just because we are. 442 00:27:59,630 --> 00:28:03,250 you know, our tendency is not to be a great advocate for ourselves. 443 00:28:03,250 --> 00:28:07,650 Our tendency is not necessarily like to be a strong advocate for our teams, right? 444 00:28:07,650 --> 00:28:11,030 But not necessarily a strong advocate for ourselves. 445 00:28:11,030 --> 00:28:15,930 And so I really, you know, just try to also help people understand that people 446 00:28:15,930 --> 00:28:18,770 treat us the way that we allow them to treat us. 447 00:28:18,770 --> 00:28:18,910 Right. 448 00:28:18,910 --> 00:28:23,130 And again, like every table is not for us and it doesn't mean anything about us. 449 00:28:23,130 --> 00:28:25,010 It's not a reflection of us. 450 00:28:25,010 --> 00:28:27,790 Like it doesn't even necessarily have to be a reflection of that. 451 00:28:27,790 --> 00:28:31,580 it's just not a good fit and that's just, we're in the business. 452 00:28:31,580 --> 00:28:35,990 I tell this to everybody, we're in the business of ourselves. 453 00:28:36,110 --> 00:28:40,970 So first and foremost, I'm the business of Heather and what's best for me and my 454 00:28:40,970 --> 00:28:44,710 children and how that works, how that happens. 455 00:28:44,710 --> 00:28:51,690 And so I think nobody ever, women shouldn't be apologetic for making choices 456 00:28:51,690 --> 00:28:56,650 and decisions that are in their own best interest, but I feel like sometimes we do. 457 00:28:56,974 --> 00:29:00,684 It's, you know, another thing I always do is like, please stop apologizing. 458 00:29:00,684 --> 00:29:04,474 Like you don't, you don't, I even work on apologizing. 459 00:29:04,474 --> 00:29:08,224 Like I'll stop an email when I'm like, I'm so sorry to whatever, whatever. 460 00:29:08,224 --> 00:29:09,604 Like I still do that. 461 00:29:09,604 --> 00:29:09,994 Right. 462 00:29:09,994 --> 00:29:15,974 And I, you know, I, in all intents, like, I feel like, I made it, but like, I still 463 00:29:15,974 --> 00:29:16,334 do. 464 00:29:16,334 --> 00:29:18,844 It's just showing green and who we are sometimes. 465 00:29:18,844 --> 00:29:21,394 And I just really like try to guard against that myself. 466 00:29:21,394 --> 00:29:24,254 So I try to flag that kind of stuff for other people. 467 00:29:24,254 --> 00:29:25,030 It's. 468 00:29:25,134 --> 00:29:27,204 It's a continual journey, right? 469 00:29:27,204 --> 00:29:29,404 It's a continual and you know what? 470 00:29:29,404 --> 00:29:33,194 You're such a great conversationalist because you've actually brought up another 471 00:29:33,194 --> 00:29:38,174 conversation in my mind where as you said, you know, it's kind of ingrained. 472 00:29:38,174 --> 00:29:44,174 It's you know, it's like the manners piece if you will of apologizing if there is a 473 00:29:44,174 --> 00:29:46,246 delay and so. 474 00:29:46,862 --> 00:29:51,582 Here's the dilemma for some and I'm certain that listeners are thinking, okay, 475 00:29:51,582 --> 00:29:57,602 what about when you recognize that and you stop doing that, but the people around 476 00:29:57,602 --> 00:30:02,342 you, depending upon who they are and what their experiences have been, they then 477 00:30:02,342 --> 00:30:06,582 take that and that is used against like, well, you know, she's not apologetic. 478 00:30:06,582 --> 00:30:08,642 She is just, you know, too strong. 479 00:30:08,642 --> 00:30:14,242 She's just, you know, not, not caring and she's not acknowledging her own. 480 00:30:14,242 --> 00:30:14,886 So. 481 00:30:14,894 --> 00:30:16,044 Talk about that. 482 00:30:16,044 --> 00:30:21,294 Again, a lot of what you've said already, it depends on are you in the right spot, 483 00:30:21,294 --> 00:30:23,714 an environment, right fit. 484 00:30:23,714 --> 00:30:29,394 But that, what I've just shared, and as you were shaking your head, you can relate 485 00:30:29,394 --> 00:30:36,914 to as well of how that's then perceived, whereas if someone else, another gender, 486 00:30:36,914 --> 00:30:41,114 may have done that, it would not be brought up. 487 00:30:41,114 --> 00:30:43,886 So how have you had worked with, 488 00:30:43,886 --> 00:30:46,014 through that in your own head. 489 00:30:47,950 --> 00:30:51,170 And even through the mentoring conversations that you've had with lit, 490 00:30:51,170 --> 00:30:53,032 you know, aspiring leaders. 491 00:30:54,702 --> 00:30:55,942 Yeah, it's hard, right? 492 00:30:55,942 --> 00:30:57,202 It's hard to be a woman. 493 00:30:57,202 --> 00:31:02,702 And I think just acknowledging that it's hard with each other and having that 494 00:31:02,702 --> 00:31:09,342 female network of support, right, wherever it is, is essential because there are 495 00:31:09,342 --> 00:31:14,022 times, right, I think one way that I deal with it is just by being a good team 496 00:31:14,022 --> 00:31:17,782 member to others and expecting other people to be good team members to us, 497 00:31:17,782 --> 00:31:18,962 right? 498 00:31:18,962 --> 00:31:22,262 I think that's kind of the foundation of just mutual respect. 499 00:31:22,262 --> 00:31:23,214 So, 500 00:31:23,214 --> 00:31:27,874 I'm not apologizing, but when I got to it, here you go. 501 00:31:27,874 --> 00:31:30,014 That's kind of what we get. 502 00:31:30,014 --> 00:31:34,474 The other side of the fence, that's what it looks like and no one questions that. 503 00:31:34,474 --> 00:31:39,674 And I think also there are times where I feel like... 504 00:31:41,550 --> 00:31:45,050 that there is a trust, right, in our workplace. 505 00:31:45,050 --> 00:31:49,850 And we are really so lucky to have just such a great leadership team and such a 506 00:31:49,850 --> 00:31:52,530 great, you know, just team members at every level. 507 00:31:52,530 --> 00:31:56,470 And I do think that there is a baseline trust that when something kind of what I 508 00:31:56,470 --> 00:32:00,210 would say goes sideways and someone's feelings get hurt, that we can raise our 509 00:32:00,210 --> 00:32:03,510 hand and be like, hey, like, help me understand why you did that. 510 00:32:03,510 --> 00:32:06,270 Like, just approaching those things from a place of learning. 511 00:32:06,270 --> 00:32:08,622 And I've had people stop with me because like, 512 00:32:08,622 --> 00:32:11,982 Like I think that my leadership style is very direct. 513 00:32:11,982 --> 00:32:17,822 I think I get to be, I think, you know, people who are new to my team get very 514 00:32:17,822 --> 00:32:22,562 surprised by how direct and maybe not abrupt, right, but just concise. 515 00:32:22,562 --> 00:32:24,162 I am overly concise. 516 00:32:24,162 --> 00:32:28,702 I think sometimes people have this idea of like someone who's like a marketing 517 00:32:28,702 --> 00:32:32,402 executive and they're always flower and they're flowery and they're always, you 518 00:32:32,402 --> 00:32:36,142 know, just so, so nice and so, so polished. 519 00:32:36,142 --> 00:32:37,766 And I really am just. 520 00:32:37,774 --> 00:32:40,244 You know, I'm just cut from a little bit different cloth. 521 00:32:40,244 --> 00:32:45,074 Like I get to the point, I get out of the point, but I also take time to express my 522 00:32:45,074 --> 00:32:51,774 genuine concern and appreciation for the team and for the work and for the effort. 523 00:32:51,774 --> 00:32:57,994 And so I think it's a little bit of once you establish that trust, right, you can 524 00:32:57,994 --> 00:33:01,174 raise your hand when something doesn't feel good or people can come to me if 525 00:33:01,174 --> 00:33:03,344 something doesn't feel good or they don't understand. 526 00:33:03,344 --> 00:33:05,884 Like I always try to take time. 527 00:33:05,934 --> 00:33:08,574 for big things to explain the why, right? 528 00:33:08,574 --> 00:33:11,954 I think that's something that I'm always continually working on too is like, I have 529 00:33:11,954 --> 00:33:16,734 all these journeys going on in my head and it's important that I remember to take 530 00:33:16,734 --> 00:33:21,914 people along with me so that like my behavior like makes sense because 531 00:33:21,914 --> 00:33:25,934 sometimes I realize I could be like, like I'm thinking about eight different things 532 00:33:25,934 --> 00:33:31,654 and sometimes I just try to remember to just take time to explain the why so then 533 00:33:31,654 --> 00:33:33,678 maybe my actions like. 534 00:33:33,678 --> 00:33:37,898 Apologies for getting these results to you two weeks later, but I was the blah blah 535 00:33:37,898 --> 00:33:43,618 blah like sometimes I will say Hey, like here's this bucket of stuff, you know, we 536 00:33:43,618 --> 00:33:49,398 prioritize it after we did project walk like, you know Let me know if you have any 537 00:33:49,398 --> 00:33:54,638 questions like so it's it's a little bit the why and not the apology so people like 538 00:33:54,638 --> 00:33:59,058 know that I'm not just Like I don't want people to feel disrespected but at the 539 00:33:59,058 --> 00:34:03,302 same time like I also like want to hold a respect for myself 540 00:34:04,174 --> 00:34:05,354 I love that. 541 00:34:05,354 --> 00:34:10,534 And I love that how you've one taken the approach that you are recognizing that the 542 00:34:10,534 --> 00:34:13,474 Y could assist them in helping them to better understand. 543 00:34:13,474 --> 00:34:17,254 But at the same time, you're not shortchanging yourself and where you're, 544 00:34:17,254 --> 00:34:22,294 you know, that it needs to move to, and that apologies should not be the hallmark 545 00:34:22,294 --> 00:34:27,914 for every female leader as you're, you know, trying to operate in your day to day 546 00:34:27,914 --> 00:34:28,694 business. 547 00:34:28,694 --> 00:34:28,944 Right. 548 00:34:28,944 --> 00:34:34,232 So, can you, I mean, even as the words are coming out of my mouth, 549 00:34:34,382 --> 00:34:35,452 You can. 550 00:34:36,909 --> 00:34:40,029 Even as the words are coming out of my mouth, though, like it's like you can't 551 00:34:40,029 --> 00:34:43,359 over explain the why because men are over explaining the why. 552 00:34:43,359 --> 00:34:47,999 You don't want to justify my decision by the blah, blah. 553 00:34:47,999 --> 00:34:49,329 Like it's it's so hard. 554 00:34:49,329 --> 00:34:50,829 It's hard to be a woman. 555 00:34:50,829 --> 00:34:52,179 It's fair. 556 00:34:52,179 --> 00:34:55,089 And that's why, again, you know, say more. 557 00:34:55,089 --> 00:34:58,669 The whole notion behind even kicking this off was, you know, you talk about 558 00:34:58,669 --> 00:35:00,819 experiences and you never waste an experience. 559 00:35:00,819 --> 00:35:05,309 But I thought this is the place where these conversations have got to come to 560 00:35:05,309 --> 00:35:06,094 the forefront. 561 00:35:06,094 --> 00:35:09,914 because they are, we're all kind of challenging and being battling with the 562 00:35:09,914 --> 00:35:11,784 same kinds of things that are happening. 563 00:35:11,784 --> 00:35:14,334 So I appreciate again, your honesty. 564 00:35:14,334 --> 00:35:20,574 And I think it's a great segue to, it's hard being a leader, but then also how do 565 00:35:20,574 --> 00:35:25,634 you prioritize self care and just to maintain a healthy, I say work -life 566 00:35:25,634 --> 00:35:31,174 balance, work -life integration, whatever the buzzword is for today, but how do you 567 00:35:31,174 --> 00:35:32,006 do that? 568 00:35:36,334 --> 00:35:38,094 I'm still working on that. 569 00:35:38,094 --> 00:35:40,734 I think for me, I knew that. 570 00:35:40,734 --> 00:35:45,474 So listeners, if you're just listening to it and can't see it, she is still there, 571 00:35:45,474 --> 00:35:46,884 but it's like what we all do. 572 00:35:46,884 --> 00:35:51,094 It's that long pause of, okay, how are we doing this thing? 573 00:35:51,094 --> 00:35:53,013 So Heather, your answer. 574 00:35:55,662 --> 00:35:58,322 Yeah, I think, you know, I'm still working on that. 575 00:35:58,322 --> 00:36:05,722 It's, it is how I now have, I think about how I practice self care is just giving 576 00:36:05,722 --> 00:36:09,782 myself grace, grace to know that the scales never going to be perfectly 577 00:36:09,782 --> 00:36:10,262 balanced. 578 00:36:10,262 --> 00:36:11,922 Sometimes I'm winning at life. 579 00:36:11,922 --> 00:36:13,202 I'm running. 580 00:36:13,202 --> 00:36:18,182 I'm, you know, going on hiking trips with my family and sometimes I'm winning at 581 00:36:18,182 --> 00:36:21,462 work and I'm getting all these great things done. 582 00:36:21,462 --> 00:36:24,878 And I'm really proud of the work and the progress. 583 00:36:24,878 --> 00:36:29,497 But those two things often can't happen at the same time and it's okay. 584 00:36:29,578 --> 00:36:33,508 Like I don't, you know, sometimes like I have a long day. 585 00:36:33,508 --> 00:36:34,758 My kids are both grown now. 586 00:36:34,758 --> 00:36:35,598 They're wonderful. 587 00:36:35,598 --> 00:36:38,098 They're, they're 25 and 20. 588 00:36:38,368 --> 00:36:41,678 and just, you know, sometimes I'll have a really long day. 589 00:36:41,678 --> 00:36:44,878 And what I really wanted to do is call them and catch up with them at the end of 590 00:36:44,878 --> 00:36:45,468 the day. 591 00:36:45,468 --> 00:36:46,888 But I'm just so tired. 592 00:36:46,888 --> 00:36:48,168 I've been talking all day. 593 00:36:48,168 --> 00:36:49,578 I'm just emotionally exhausted. 594 00:36:49,578 --> 00:36:51,078 I don't create that connection. 595 00:36:51,078 --> 00:36:53,098 Sometimes that's the feedback that they give it. 596 00:36:53,098 --> 00:36:54,606 Mom, like, Hey, like. 597 00:36:54,606 --> 00:36:57,366 maybe just call and check us in on us more. 598 00:36:57,366 --> 00:36:59,385 Or, okay, like, you know. 599 00:36:59,986 --> 00:37:06,426 So like, I definitely value and prioritize our quality family time together. 600 00:37:06,426 --> 00:37:08,366 But sometimes like the workday wins. 601 00:37:08,366 --> 00:37:12,846 And then I'm like, like, I don't, you know, it's just, I just try to give myself 602 00:37:12,846 --> 00:37:13,586 grace, right? 603 00:37:13,586 --> 00:37:18,846 I try to know that I'm, I just need to make sure I'm putting some wins in both 604 00:37:18,846 --> 00:37:19,766 sides. 605 00:37:19,766 --> 00:37:22,118 And it's not always going to be a perfect. 606 00:37:23,790 --> 00:37:24,950 Not a perfect balance. 607 00:37:24,950 --> 00:37:29,960 So I think again, that's the honest piece of this because a lot of people will say, 608 00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:30,960 well, I have it. 609 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:32,750 And I'm like, well, I'm not sure how you have it. 610 00:37:32,750 --> 00:37:39,590 I mean, I've not had it for years being in key leadership roles, but I understand the 611 00:37:39,590 --> 00:37:40,500 importance of it. 612 00:37:40,500 --> 00:37:44,490 And as you said, I think grace and allowing and extending that grace to 613 00:37:44,490 --> 00:37:46,530 yourself certainly gets you there sooner. 614 00:37:46,530 --> 00:37:50,830 So here's one that I know and I'm thinking about as I'm thinking about this question 615 00:37:50,830 --> 00:37:52,334 that I'm gonna ask you. 616 00:37:52,334 --> 00:37:54,634 I hear this quite a bit too. 617 00:37:54,634 --> 00:37:59,594 So can you share your insights on fostering a culture of support and 618 00:37:59,594 --> 00:38:02,074 collaboration among women in the workplace? 619 00:38:02,074 --> 00:38:06,794 And I'll say, I'll add this caveat because you always hear it, particularly 620 00:38:06,794 --> 00:38:12,284 environments where competition or crab mentality may be prevalent. 621 00:38:15,470 --> 00:38:16,650 How does that work? 622 00:38:16,650 --> 00:38:21,990 I would say that it's really important, right? 623 00:38:21,990 --> 00:38:27,210 I read this somewhere and I'm sorry that whoever owns this particular phrase and 624 00:38:27,210 --> 00:38:33,470 piece of work that I can't properly cite it, but I think it's really important to 625 00:38:33,470 --> 00:38:37,010 have your board of directors, right? 626 00:38:37,010 --> 00:38:44,130 So that you have that female group of women who you can rely on, who support 627 00:38:44,130 --> 00:38:45,486 you, right? 628 00:38:45,486 --> 00:38:51,246 and that you are helping foster and include other people and just like ever 629 00:38:51,246 --> 00:38:58,546 growing the group so that it is a community of women who can surface like, 630 00:38:58,546 --> 00:39:02,906 you know, like I think everybody is like, I don't want to ask a stupid question, but 631 00:39:02,906 --> 00:39:07,226 it's just creating those spaces where people, especially women can just bring 632 00:39:07,226 --> 00:39:11,786 like their concerns, their fears and have that space to discuss it. 633 00:39:11,786 --> 00:39:13,550 And then also like, 634 00:39:13,550 --> 00:39:15,060 just understand each other. 635 00:39:15,060 --> 00:39:20,030 I think sometimes when I've seen women not get along with each other, it's because 636 00:39:20,030 --> 00:39:22,130 it's just a misunderstanding. 637 00:39:22,130 --> 00:39:25,570 Like somebody hasn't taken time to listen to what the other person's been 638 00:39:25,570 --> 00:39:30,270 accomplished and another person is inadvertently doing things that's harming 639 00:39:30,270 --> 00:39:32,690 like a particular project owned by another woman. 640 00:39:32,690 --> 00:39:35,390 And it's not, it's not purposeful, right? 641 00:39:35,390 --> 00:39:38,120 It's just taking that extra time. 642 00:39:38,120 --> 00:39:42,766 And I would just say if you feel like you're getting crossways with someone, 643 00:39:42,766 --> 00:39:48,306 to just, again, just invite them out for lunch or invite them out for a drink or 644 00:39:48,306 --> 00:39:52,226 just even put a couple minutes on their schedule to say, hey, help me understand 645 00:39:52,226 --> 00:39:53,216 what you're trying to do here. 646 00:39:53,216 --> 00:39:56,306 Because a lot of times we're all trying to get to the same place and maybe we're 647 00:39:56,306 --> 00:40:01,386 taking different paths and those paths can sometimes get cross ways because it's 648 00:40:01,386 --> 00:40:05,746 competing resources, scarce resources type mentality. 649 00:40:05,746 --> 00:40:10,426 But just taking time to try to understand the women around you and their goals and 650 00:40:10,426 --> 00:40:12,102 what they're trying to do. 651 00:40:12,242 --> 00:40:15,822 I think eliminates most of that. 652 00:40:15,822 --> 00:40:21,602 Like I truly feel like that is just a miscommunication among the tribe. 653 00:40:22,762 --> 00:40:30,662 I so appreciate that and listeners, let's, you know, we can all lock into a situation 654 00:40:30,662 --> 00:40:35,462 that we've been exposed to and we may have put the title on a crab mentality, but to 655 00:40:35,462 --> 00:40:37,462 be very honest, we're all in it together. 656 00:40:37,462 --> 00:40:39,310 So how can one... 657 00:40:39,310 --> 00:40:44,030 you know, one or more, take that, I call it that bigger step and say, let's have a 658 00:40:44,030 --> 00:40:48,330 conversation just like Heather described, you know, don't let it lie there and 659 00:40:48,330 --> 00:40:51,350 fester, but really look at ways to communicate. 660 00:40:51,350 --> 00:40:56,470 And I think, you know, that as we look at where we're going as women and looking 661 00:40:56,470 --> 00:41:00,730 ahead, even for yourself, Heather, what do you envision for the future of women and 662 00:41:00,730 --> 00:41:02,850 leadership roles in your sector? 663 00:41:02,850 --> 00:41:07,610 And what do you think, what steps do you think organizations can take to really 664 00:41:07,610 --> 00:41:09,070 further promote? 665 00:41:09,070 --> 00:41:13,062 gender equality and empower women to excel in the C -suite. 666 00:41:15,342 --> 00:41:21,082 I mean, I think organizations as a whole, right, just to need to make sure that 667 00:41:21,082 --> 00:41:27,262 their internal promotions are clearly and fairly done. 668 00:41:27,262 --> 00:41:29,952 That's one of the things I really think we do well at. 669 00:41:29,952 --> 00:41:36,002 We have such a great internal fill rate for our director and above with just 670 00:41:36,002 --> 00:41:39,682 grooming people for those leadership roles at Sunshine. 671 00:41:39,682 --> 00:41:42,638 I just had a meeting the other day with 672 00:41:42,638 --> 00:41:45,758 some new team members that are coming into our department. 673 00:41:45,758 --> 00:41:49,698 And I was, it was just so incredible to hear about their career journeys. 674 00:41:49,698 --> 00:41:51,818 Like most of them had been here longer than me. 675 00:41:51,818 --> 00:41:52,998 I've been here eight years now. 676 00:41:52,998 --> 00:41:55,578 That's really long in my estimation, right? 677 00:41:55,578 --> 00:41:59,618 But these were folks who had been here 10 years or 12 years. 678 00:41:59,618 --> 00:42:05,538 And just, just an incredible, like, you know, to hear about how people have 679 00:42:05,538 --> 00:42:09,108 navigated, navigated their individual careers. 680 00:42:09,108 --> 00:42:11,438 I think if companies can just foster a 681 00:42:11,438 --> 00:42:16,418 place where employees can see themselves learning and growing and also not being 682 00:42:16,418 --> 00:42:19,318 afraid to raise their hand and be like, hey, like, I think I'm ready for a new 683 00:42:19,318 --> 00:42:23,458 challenge or hey, help me take the next steps. 684 00:42:23,458 --> 00:42:30,278 I think that is like the key thing to helping women, you know, achieve success 685 00:42:30,278 --> 00:42:33,058 at whatever level they want to achieve success at, right? 686 00:42:33,058 --> 00:42:37,338 And that's also recognizing that, you know, not everybody, you know, just wants 687 00:42:37,338 --> 00:42:39,918 to have a continual progression. 688 00:42:39,918 --> 00:42:43,958 you know, up the corporate ladder. 689 00:42:43,958 --> 00:42:49,458 You know, I think everybody's goals are different and I think the more that we can 690 00:42:49,458 --> 00:42:55,278 create an environment where everyone feels valued and supportive and, you know, hats 691 00:42:55,278 --> 00:42:59,838 can see the future for themselves, I think the better. 692 00:42:59,838 --> 00:43:05,378 But also there needs to be those systemic issues, like those systemic processes 693 00:43:05,378 --> 00:43:06,926 where you're looking at. 694 00:43:06,926 --> 00:43:12,106 pay inequities from a large scale and fixing things that maybe are broken, 695 00:43:12,106 --> 00:43:12,286 right? 696 00:43:12,286 --> 00:43:17,846 Like that's a very key piece of the puzzle too that companies need to make sure that 697 00:43:17,846 --> 00:43:19,386 they're doing. 698 00:43:19,826 --> 00:43:26,946 I love how as much as you've evolved into the leader that you are, that you have 699 00:43:26,946 --> 00:43:31,986 chosen an organization that is doing and has that same commitment level. 700 00:43:31,986 --> 00:43:36,622 And I think our listeners will hear that when those things match, 701 00:43:36,622 --> 00:43:41,042 There is great success that can be had from everybody. 702 00:43:41,042 --> 00:43:43,112 The organization wins as well as the leader. 703 00:43:43,112 --> 00:43:44,862 So thank you for pointing that out. 704 00:43:44,862 --> 00:43:52,202 And as we move to our last question, we've talked about it before, but when 705 00:43:52,202 --> 00:43:55,722 reflecting on your journey and if you could go back and think that you would 706 00:43:55,722 --> 00:44:01,122 tell your 20 year old self, but is there anything else that you haven't told us 707 00:44:01,122 --> 00:44:05,302 that you think about that, you know what, 20 year old self, this is the guidance 708 00:44:05,302 --> 00:44:06,886 that I'd give you. 709 00:44:06,894 --> 00:44:07,942 today. 710 00:44:11,886 --> 00:44:18,166 I would say right is just being genuine with yourself and with others. 711 00:44:18,166 --> 00:44:23,966 I think, you know, we've just being your own advocate as much as we advocate for 712 00:44:23,966 --> 00:44:26,666 our families and advocate for our teams. 713 00:44:26,666 --> 00:44:29,766 I mean, we've all had that place where you're like, you're in a group meeting and 714 00:44:29,766 --> 00:44:33,496 you say an idea and then it's sort of the conversation goes on. 715 00:44:33,496 --> 00:44:37,806 But then three minutes later, a man says it and it's like the best idea ever. 716 00:44:37,806 --> 00:44:40,386 I think sometimes right. 717 00:44:40,558 --> 00:44:49,398 It's just about like in a very genuine kind way be like, like make a joke out of 718 00:44:49,398 --> 00:44:49,668 it. 719 00:44:49,668 --> 00:44:53,398 Like I think sometimes when you feel like things aren't going well, even if it 720 00:44:53,398 --> 00:44:59,898 doesn't change things, I think there's just a way to, to, to flag some of those 721 00:44:59,898 --> 00:45:01,508 things so that you feel great. 722 00:45:01,508 --> 00:45:04,618 Like it's not always, it doesn't always go my way. 723 00:45:04,618 --> 00:45:04,808 Right. 724 00:45:04,808 --> 00:45:06,734 Like I, and when it doesn't, 725 00:45:06,734 --> 00:45:09,734 I mean, the first one to be like, ooh, that was a bad idea for me. 726 00:45:09,734 --> 00:45:12,934 That didn't turn out how I was going to think it was going to be. 727 00:45:12,934 --> 00:45:20,034 But I think it all really just comes back to following your gut, following your 728 00:45:20,034 --> 00:45:27,014 instinct, being true to who you are, and not being afraid to take risks. 729 00:45:27,014 --> 00:45:30,834 I just wish I would have taken more risks earlier. 730 00:45:31,374 --> 00:45:35,150 So many of the things that I've learned, I've learned through failure. 731 00:45:35,150 --> 00:45:37,510 Like that's just a key ingredient of life. 732 00:45:37,510 --> 00:45:45,150 Like I spent a lot of time stuck in places because I was afraid of the unknown. 733 00:45:45,150 --> 00:45:50,630 And I would just be like, take a leap, ask for help, right? 734 00:45:50,910 --> 00:45:53,310 Like people wanna help you. 735 00:45:53,670 --> 00:45:55,830 I love that. 736 00:45:55,830 --> 00:46:02,230 And listeners, thank you for being a part of today's conversation and thank you for 737 00:46:02,230 --> 00:46:03,918 marking this as a favorite. 738 00:46:03,918 --> 00:46:09,838 Thank you for subscribing and thank you for supporting other women as we all 739 00:46:09,838 --> 00:46:12,758 continue down the path of our own journeys. 740 00:46:12,758 --> 00:46:14,238 We're in it together. 741 00:46:14,238 --> 00:46:17,098 Say more for you, for all of us. 742 00:46:17,098 --> 00:46:19,018 Thank you for tuning in.