1 00:00:13,170 --> 00:00:17,160 Before we jump into this episode with Chris Hunt from CO of the West, here's 2 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:19,140 something for those who want to go deeper. 3 00:00:19,860 --> 00:00:25,470 The Silver Court Club gives you access to our private podcast, the Outpost plus 4 00:00:25,500 --> 00:00:31,110 free courses insurance, exclusive gear discounts, and it's an RCMP approved Gun 5 00:00:31,110 --> 00:00:33,690 Club for license, issuance and renewal. 6 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:39,780 If you value growth, preparedness and community, check it out@silvercore.ca. 7 00:00:40,860 --> 00:00:44,040 Alright on with the podcast, you're gonna enjoy this one. 8 00:00:45,510 --> 00:00:49,170 I'm joined today by an artist, storyteller, and man on a mission. 9 00:00:49,575 --> 00:00:52,575 After years in the creative world, including time at Black 10 00:00:52,575 --> 00:00:56,505 Rifle Coffee, he stepped away to build something deeply personal. 11 00:00:56,835 --> 00:01:00,195 What started as a simple Instagram page became a movement. 12 00:01:00,495 --> 00:01:04,035 He's the creator of Code of the West, a modern guide to living with 13 00:01:04,035 --> 00:01:07,665 honor, grit, and purpose in a world that often forgets those things. 14 00:01:07,665 --> 00:01:13,485 His work strikes a chord because it's not theory, it's lived experience, loss, 15 00:01:13,665 --> 00:01:16,095 risk growth, and a refusal to quit. 16 00:01:16,605 --> 00:01:19,185 Welcome to the Silver Court Podcast, Chris Hunt. 17 00:01:20,565 --> 00:01:20,835 That 18 00:01:20,895 --> 00:01:25,875 kind of made me emotional, like I don't, I don't think of, I don't think of myself. 19 00:01:26,625 --> 00:01:29,085 Uh, in that way often. 20 00:01:29,145 --> 00:01:33,914 I mean, I, you're, that wasn't inaccurate, but, but it just, it's brother, 21 00:01:33,914 --> 00:01:34,575 that's you. 22 00:01:34,815 --> 00:01:35,205 Yeah. 23 00:01:35,205 --> 00:01:40,935 It's just, uh, yeah, I mean, it, it's, it's me, but it's, uh, you know, I'm 24 00:01:40,935 --> 00:01:43,335 sure you kind of can relate where like when you're just in your own 25 00:01:43,335 --> 00:01:47,175 head, you're just chopping wood and carrying water, so you don't necessarily 26 00:01:47,175 --> 00:01:51,855 stop to think that what you're doing has any, like, any value outside of 27 00:01:51,855 --> 00:01:53,565 just the activity that you're doing. 28 00:01:55,275 --> 00:01:59,805 Have you, you must have a sense of the amount of impact that you're 29 00:01:59,805 --> 00:02:03,164 having on other people's lives with your book, with your page. 30 00:02:03,164 --> 00:02:08,235 People must be writing in and, and giving you background on, on 31 00:02:08,235 --> 00:02:10,485 how their lives are better, just because of what you're putting out. 32 00:02:11,355 --> 00:02:11,775 Man. 33 00:02:11,835 --> 00:02:16,937 Um, I'm probably gonna cry at some point during this, just so 34 00:02:16,937 --> 00:02:20,115 you know, like, um, but, um, I. 35 00:02:20,115 --> 00:02:23,745 Yeah, I'm getting, I, I get that sense people, people send me a lot 36 00:02:23,745 --> 00:02:28,155 of dms now and um, kind of goes back to what I was saying just 37 00:02:28,155 --> 00:02:30,435 now, you know, about the intro. 38 00:02:30,585 --> 00:02:36,285 Um, I feel just, I felt compelled to do this and, and, and I 39 00:02:36,765 --> 00:02:40,905 did it with the intention of hoping that I would help people. 40 00:02:41,204 --> 00:02:45,165 'cause part of Code of the West is just, this is the way I found my 41 00:02:45,165 --> 00:02:51,885 way back from things and, and then I learned a long time ago, but it took 42 00:02:51,885 --> 00:02:57,645 a long time for me to kind of gain the courage, kinda like a puppy learning 43 00:02:57,650 --> 00:02:58,935 how to bark for the first time. 44 00:02:59,505 --> 00:03:05,895 Um, that, that just sharing and, and, and letting people know that they're not 45 00:03:05,895 --> 00:03:09,735 necessarily the only ones experiencing something can have a lot of value to it. 46 00:03:10,065 --> 00:03:15,585 So, um, without getting too personal with any of the people who've sent stuff and. 47 00:03:16,350 --> 00:03:20,250 I get a lot of notes about people who didn't punch their own card 48 00:03:20,340 --> 00:03:23,340 out, um, 'cause of Code of the West. 49 00:03:24,210 --> 00:03:30,090 And then I, I get a lot of just notes from people who are just, um, it's, it's 50 00:03:30,090 --> 00:03:33,300 interesting 'cause it's not like people who are saying like, I'm fixed now. 51 00:03:33,359 --> 00:03:40,019 It's people saying, um, I'm, I'm kind of staying, you know, I'm sticking around. 52 00:03:40,050 --> 00:03:43,950 And, and, and it's, it's more like the framework aspect of things, 53 00:03:43,950 --> 00:03:47,250 which is something that I talk, I've certainly started talking more about 54 00:03:47,310 --> 00:03:48,870 with Code of the West, you know, this. 55 00:03:48,959 --> 00:03:55,709 It's not just, um, the guru thing, which I'm not against inherently, you know, 56 00:03:55,709 --> 00:04:00,359 on, especially on social media that like, if you do this, you'll fix that. 57 00:04:00,359 --> 00:04:04,500 And it's like, that's not bad if you're looking for something. 58 00:04:04,935 --> 00:04:07,454 And, and finding a solution that gets the ball rolling. 59 00:04:07,605 --> 00:04:08,084 Great. 60 00:04:08,265 --> 00:04:12,494 You know, but I think it's, um, I'm trying to not to have a potty mouth. 61 00:04:12,494 --> 00:04:14,234 I'm trying not to have a potty mouth and not cry. 62 00:04:14,505 --> 00:04:14,864 Um, 63 00:04:15,614 --> 00:04:16,125 but, um, 64 00:04:16,844 --> 00:04:20,985 um, it's a, it, it becomes snake oily I think when you just say, 65 00:04:20,985 --> 00:04:22,335 this will solve your problem. 66 00:04:22,605 --> 00:04:27,794 And, and, and for me, there was nothing that solved my problem other than just 67 00:04:27,794 --> 00:04:33,105 this quiet evolution of myself that had to continually occur and play out. 68 00:04:33,135 --> 00:04:38,355 And so it's, well, I think the outside of the fact that people just sending in 69 00:04:38,355 --> 00:04:40,575 those notes is pretty powerful to me. 70 00:04:40,935 --> 00:04:44,805 It's the fact that like, how they're responding is, is, is not so much 71 00:04:44,805 --> 00:04:46,905 like, thank you for fixing something. 72 00:04:46,905 --> 00:04:51,735 It's more like, thank you for pointing out that there's a way out 73 00:04:52,724 --> 00:04:57,344 without necessarily, uh, addressing or specifying a destination. 74 00:04:59,355 --> 00:05:02,385 I think there's a danger to the idea of fixing. 75 00:05:02,715 --> 00:05:06,100 Something because that presupposes that we're broken. 76 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:06,540 Mm-hmm. 77 00:05:06,620 --> 00:05:06,940 About that. 78 00:05:06,940 --> 00:05:10,095 And oftentimes we're in places there. 79 00:05:10,095 --> 00:05:12,255 You, well, I mean, oftentimes we're gonna be. 80 00:05:13,410 --> 00:05:18,570 People say, I want to be happy, I want to be successful, I want to be, you name it. 81 00:05:18,990 --> 00:05:23,970 And they'll set that as their, their north star that they're going to work towards. 82 00:05:24,450 --> 00:05:28,920 And that's an unachievable goal when they start realizing that happiness 83 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:30,900 is a byproduct of the process. 84 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,690 You don't, you, you can never be happy. 85 00:05:33,810 --> 00:05:36,270 You can never just say, I'm gonna be happy 'cause it. 86 00:05:37,185 --> 00:05:39,135 It puts that carrot in front of you. 87 00:05:39,140 --> 00:05:39,330 Mm-hmm. 88 00:05:39,410 --> 00:05:41,205 And it's always gonna be dangling in front of you. 89 00:05:41,205 --> 00:05:45,315 It's not quantifiable, but it's not quantifiable because what is 90 00:05:45,315 --> 00:05:47,775 happy today is gonna be different from what's happy tomorrow. 91 00:05:47,865 --> 00:05:48,675 Just like pain. 92 00:05:49,155 --> 00:05:52,875 It's, I love that quote from, uh, the Simpsons where Lisa's like, 93 00:05:52,875 --> 00:05:54,585 this is the worst day of my life. 94 00:05:54,585 --> 00:05:55,935 I've, it's so bad. 95 00:05:56,505 --> 00:06:01,005 And Homer says, oh, sweetie, it's the worst day of your life so far. 96 00:06:01,905 --> 00:06:01,965 Yeah. 97 00:06:01,965 --> 00:06:05,925 It reminds me of a different Simpsons quote that, that I feel like, uh, 98 00:06:06,345 --> 00:06:07,965 actually sums up my life pretty well. 99 00:06:07,965 --> 00:06:09,825 Like, which is, how does it taste Ralph? 100 00:06:09,915 --> 00:06:11,235 It tastes like burning. 101 00:06:12,435 --> 00:06:13,605 It tastes like burning. 102 00:06:14,055 --> 00:06:14,955 That's right. 103 00:06:15,705 --> 00:06:16,605 Oh, I love that. 104 00:06:16,695 --> 00:06:22,425 Well, you know, you said CO to the West helped bring you back. 105 00:06:22,635 --> 00:06:22,725 Mm-hmm. 106 00:06:23,055 --> 00:06:23,835 Where were you? 107 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:34,515 It, it, it was, um, it a place that, um. 108 00:06:35,055 --> 00:06:36,405 Was way too comfortable. 109 00:06:36,735 --> 00:06:40,275 Um, for, for as, as, as uncomfortable as it was. 110 00:06:40,275 --> 00:06:45,045 I mean, I, I would say the place that I was at was almost like an 111 00:06:45,045 --> 00:06:48,555 overlap of two different, different states and places in my life. 112 00:06:48,585 --> 00:06:55,425 'cause I've always been, I've very, um, I've always been very sovereign minded. 113 00:06:55,575 --> 00:06:58,155 Uh, I, I, I've always wanted to have my independence. 114 00:06:58,155 --> 00:07:01,665 I've always wanted to kind of do my own thing since a very early age. 115 00:07:02,175 --> 00:07:10,665 And that led to this willingness to go to ambiguous places and, 116 00:07:10,665 --> 00:07:14,265 and choosing ambiguous paths, like choosing to be a compa creator. 117 00:07:14,805 --> 00:07:17,175 There's still no like path to that. 118 00:07:17,235 --> 00:07:20,025 You just figure it out if you wanna do it, but. 119 00:07:20,805 --> 00:07:22,635 Um, overlapping with that. 120 00:07:23,294 --> 00:07:27,615 So that was a lot of drive and a lot of myopic obsession to, to get somewhere. 121 00:07:27,945 --> 00:07:28,365 Mm-hmm. 122 00:07:28,784 --> 00:07:34,395 In line with that, um, I, um, I had my own challenges and difficulties growing 123 00:07:34,395 --> 00:07:43,245 up, but um, I had my first sort of real adult, or actually I just say real life 124 00:07:43,275 --> 00:07:47,445 challenge when I had a couple of friends that died real close to each other 125 00:07:47,895 --> 00:07:51,075 when I was in my mid twenties and, um. 126 00:07:51,974 --> 00:07:57,075 Just the quick version of that is one, one of them got diagnosed with terminal 127 00:07:57,075 --> 00:07:59,234 cancer and he'd kind of hidden himself. 128 00:07:59,234 --> 00:08:02,804 And we, I went with a friend and we literally threatened, I threatened 129 00:08:02,804 --> 00:08:06,104 to kick the door in, um, on his apartment if he didn't open it. 130 00:08:06,104 --> 00:08:08,234 And he opened it and he looked like a Holocaust victim. 131 00:08:08,684 --> 00:08:12,135 And so we got him to go to the hospital and he just got diagnosed 132 00:08:12,135 --> 00:08:13,335 with terminal cancer there. 133 00:08:14,174 --> 00:08:18,554 And then a friend, a same friend group, a different friend, I called him and 134 00:08:18,554 --> 00:08:20,745 was like, Hey, Lauren's gonna die. 135 00:08:20,775 --> 00:08:21,614 You should come home soon. 136 00:08:21,614 --> 00:08:26,445 And this is a guy who, um, ho trains, you know, like was a busker. 137 00:08:26,505 --> 00:08:30,195 You know, I, I called, we called him traveling kids in Idaho when I was 138 00:08:30,195 --> 00:08:32,655 growing up, but like a hobo basically. 139 00:08:33,194 --> 00:08:35,834 And so I was like, let me, yeah, yeah, let me, let me buy you a bus 140 00:08:35,834 --> 00:08:38,385 ticket back and, and come see Lauren. 141 00:08:38,385 --> 00:08:40,365 'cause they say it's gonna be like six months and it's not. 142 00:08:40,395 --> 00:08:41,324 I just know it's not. 143 00:08:41,745 --> 00:08:42,584 And which was true. 144 00:08:43,184 --> 00:08:44,204 And he's like, no, no. 145 00:08:44,204 --> 00:08:46,875 I'm gonna hop a train back and I need to think about this. 146 00:08:47,685 --> 00:08:52,095 He died on a train, uh, coming back, um, outside of Portland. 147 00:08:52,454 --> 00:08:57,975 So, which is kind of funny 'cause Michael was the one that died on the train. 148 00:08:58,064 --> 00:09:00,824 Um, he had a habit of like, living bigger than everybody else. 149 00:09:00,824 --> 00:09:03,795 And so when Lauren was like, dying on a morphine drip, we're like, 150 00:09:03,795 --> 00:09:04,995 Hey, Michael beat you to the punch. 151 00:09:04,995 --> 00:09:06,465 He's like, uh, fucking Michael. 152 00:09:06,675 --> 00:09:09,795 Like, um, which is just sort of the nature of our friend group. 153 00:09:09,795 --> 00:09:12,314 But that was a part of also this whole thing. 154 00:09:12,855 --> 00:09:14,235 And this will make sense in the end. 155 00:09:14,295 --> 00:09:18,795 Um, I, when we got together and, and found out that Lauren was dying, 156 00:09:19,245 --> 00:09:21,645 I basically told everybody, he's like, look, we can't teach him like 157 00:09:21,645 --> 00:09:23,715 a pariah or treat him like a pariah. 158 00:09:24,585 --> 00:09:25,725 We gotta help 'em die. 159 00:09:25,725 --> 00:09:28,574 Well, you know, and treat 'em with the same dark. 160 00:09:29,130 --> 00:09:31,319 Honest humor that we treat each other all the time with. 161 00:09:31,319 --> 00:09:36,660 And so we, we let him die with dignity as a friend group, but 162 00:09:36,660 --> 00:09:37,920 we didn't process anything. 163 00:09:38,250 --> 00:09:40,050 And then Michael died in the middle of it. 164 00:09:40,439 --> 00:09:45,209 And it just led to this cascading effect, not just for myself, but for pretty much 165 00:09:45,209 --> 00:09:47,010 this entire tight knit friend group. 166 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:52,260 We still, a lot of us are still friends, but it's not the same thing 167 00:09:52,260 --> 00:09:57,840 that it was because we all got tested and challenged and um, some of us got 168 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:01,500 through it, some of us didn't, and some of us it got worse for them and 169 00:10:01,500 --> 00:10:02,730 then they're not here anymore either. 170 00:10:02,760 --> 00:10:06,510 You know, it led to this chain of, uh, alcoholism and suicide. 171 00:10:07,500 --> 00:10:12,120 'cause these people were really well loved and, and, and, and affected us, you know? 172 00:10:12,150 --> 00:10:14,640 'cause we were all young and didn't expect it to occur. 173 00:10:14,670 --> 00:10:19,620 So this is a long way of saying that the place that I was in prior to 174 00:10:20,069 --> 00:10:23,670 sort of coming back to this framework that I had as a kid growing up, 175 00:10:23,670 --> 00:10:27,990 which is what I call the Code of the West, is, um, I was in this. 176 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:33,989 Holding two seemingly contradictory things at the same time, which was moving 177 00:10:33,989 --> 00:10:39,900 ahead like a freight train in my life for my career, while also just suffering 178 00:10:40,439 --> 00:10:47,670 like emotionally and, and not really understanding how to process this stuff. 179 00:10:48,180 --> 00:10:54,839 And, and both of those sort of put me into a place that I would say, 180 00:10:54,930 --> 00:11:01,380 um, was oftentimes confusing activity with achievement and, um, certainly 181 00:11:01,439 --> 00:11:04,349 wasn't me living in a complete way. 182 00:11:04,650 --> 00:11:08,819 You know, uh, to sum this up, I would say that like I did not 183 00:11:08,819 --> 00:11:10,349 know how to human very well. 184 00:11:13,140 --> 00:11:15,270 You know, I think you're not alone there, right? 185 00:11:15,270 --> 00:11:17,880 I don't think there's a lot of people who don't know how to Yeah. 186 00:11:19,619 --> 00:11:25,800 Um, and it's, you know, you talk about, I. I, I really like what you said there. 187 00:11:26,400 --> 00:11:27,570 Let him die. 188 00:11:27,570 --> 00:11:27,960 Well. 189 00:11:28,230 --> 00:11:28,320 Mm-hmm. 190 00:11:28,560 --> 00:11:32,700 And everybody tends to look at, how can I live? 191 00:11:32,700 --> 00:11:36,600 Well, not many people reframe it in a way, like, how do I die? 192 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,510 Well, 'cause really, if you look at it every day, we're marching towards 193 00:11:39,510 --> 00:11:41,550 an inev, an inevitable outcome. 194 00:11:42,210 --> 00:11:43,050 How do we die? 195 00:11:43,050 --> 00:11:44,820 Well, what legacy are we leaving? 196 00:11:45,090 --> 00:11:48,960 How are we impacting those around us through our thoughts, words, and actions? 197 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:54,090 And that's where I see Code of the West really helping people. 198 00:11:54,090 --> 00:11:57,060 And that's a, it's a very interesting, subtle reframe. 199 00:11:57,270 --> 00:12:01,980 And when you, when you think about, so you talk about suicide, suicide 200 00:12:01,980 --> 00:12:03,480 sends a very strong message. 201 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:03,690 Mm-hmm. 202 00:12:03,930 --> 00:12:10,590 And one of the more powerful things that I have seen in regards to suicide, it's 203 00:12:11,130 --> 00:12:15,930 an individual's ability to try and have complete ownership over a situation. 204 00:12:15,930 --> 00:12:16,380 Mm-hmm. 205 00:12:17,325 --> 00:12:18,945 Because they feel overwhelmed. 206 00:12:18,945 --> 00:12:21,735 They feel like they're not wanted, they're not loved or the 207 00:12:21,735 --> 00:12:23,175 world be better off without 'em. 208 00:12:23,175 --> 00:12:28,125 But whatever they're feeling, I've never seen that go away. 209 00:12:28,575 --> 00:12:32,265 When they take their life, it just gets transferred and oftentimes 210 00:12:32,295 --> 00:12:34,185 amplified by those around them. 211 00:12:34,485 --> 00:12:34,725 Mm-hmm. 212 00:12:35,535 --> 00:12:39,885 And that reframe as well, when you think about not how am I living, but how am 213 00:12:39,885 --> 00:12:42,375 I dying and what is my impact gonna be? 214 00:12:42,735 --> 00:12:46,155 That's often enough to keep people thinking like, maybe 215 00:12:46,155 --> 00:12:47,295 I should rethink this. 216 00:12:47,355 --> 00:12:52,065 I don't like this pain, but clearly I must be strong enough if I'm being 217 00:12:52,065 --> 00:12:53,595 burdened with these challenges. 218 00:12:53,925 --> 00:12:58,995 And if I can overcome these challenges in a way that shows strength, resolve 219 00:12:58,995 --> 00:13:02,120 grit, will I help others in the same way? 220 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:02,400 And that's 221 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:02,955 a framework though. 222 00:13:03,225 --> 00:13:05,355 If you don't have that framework, it's just pain. 223 00:13:06,915 --> 00:13:07,455 Mm. 224 00:13:09,045 --> 00:13:11,805 Well, it's not just pain, but you know, it's an oversimplification. 225 00:13:11,805 --> 00:13:12,825 But I think, you know what I mean? 226 00:13:14,445 --> 00:13:15,045 A hundred percent. 227 00:13:15,045 --> 00:13:15,315 I know. 228 00:13:15,315 --> 00:13:18,645 Was that the idea when you started Code of the West or was it a tool that you 229 00:13:18,645 --> 00:13:20,625 built for yourself that kind of grew? 230 00:13:20,925 --> 00:13:21,165 It? 231 00:13:21,315 --> 00:13:26,235 It was a byproduct of, um, sort of the mindfulness that I had to 232 00:13:26,235 --> 00:13:29,775 employ and, and, and just tricks. 233 00:13:29,775 --> 00:13:36,255 I mean, I, I, my, my, uh, lack of ability to human well is, is sort of 234 00:13:36,675 --> 00:13:42,105 endemic of just the way my brain works and I've made it sort of a hobby to try 235 00:13:42,105 --> 00:13:46,425 to understand how I might be different. 236 00:13:46,905 --> 00:13:51,045 Um, I finally got my brain scanned, um, when I was at Black Rifle. 237 00:13:51,105 --> 00:13:57,255 Uh, we were, um, gonna enlist in this, um, sort of pilot program to use magnetic 238 00:13:57,255 --> 00:14:03,645 resonance to help with PTSD and traumatic brain injuries and um, 'cause everybody 239 00:14:03,645 --> 00:14:05,415 I worked with were like Navy Seals. 240 00:14:05,954 --> 00:14:10,574 Green Berets, um, and combat veterans like from G Watt. 241 00:14:10,785 --> 00:14:10,875 Right. 242 00:14:10,875 --> 00:14:17,985 And, um, so I was gonna be the control one of the controls in the, in, in this 243 00:14:18,045 --> 00:14:21,615 thing where I put the halo on and they're measuring my alpha, beta and theta 244 00:14:21,615 --> 00:14:24,074 waves and like he is the normal one. 245 00:14:24,345 --> 00:14:24,824 Come on. 246 00:14:24,824 --> 00:14:24,975 Yeah. 247 00:14:24,975 --> 00:14:27,555 When I, when the, the scientist called me, he's like, yeah. 248 00:14:27,615 --> 00:14:31,635 Um, so like we, we've got some stuff to talk about. 249 00:14:31,694 --> 00:14:36,765 Um, and, and my brain just as it turned out is, which wasn't really news to 250 00:14:36,765 --> 00:14:41,475 me, but it, it was, um, a relief was that like, it, it just doesn't work 251 00:14:41,475 --> 00:14:43,305 normal doesn't mean that it's bad. 252 00:14:43,334 --> 00:14:44,535 It just doesn't work normal. 253 00:14:44,925 --> 00:14:50,295 And, and so there was a little bit of time before that really kind of before I came 254 00:14:50,295 --> 00:14:53,415 to Black Rifle or went to black rifle, where I was starting to realize that. 255 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:55,500 Okay, I need to make changes. 256 00:14:55,500 --> 00:14:59,400 You know, like I can't drink half a bottle of bourbon every day, um, just 257 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:01,770 to shut my brain down, um, at night. 258 00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:01,950 Mm. 259 00:15:02,190 --> 00:15:04,470 And sleeping was always a big issue for me. 260 00:15:04,470 --> 00:15:09,810 Like, I mean, I, I have a hobby for the past, like 20 years of like figuring 261 00:15:09,810 --> 00:15:11,430 out the best methods to go to sleep. 262 00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:15,570 And it's taken me almost, I mean, I'll be 40 in a few months, I would say, up 263 00:15:15,570 --> 00:15:21,510 until I was about 37, to be able to fall asleep within 15 minutes of going to bed. 264 00:15:21,900 --> 00:15:25,800 Usually it would take hours and I mean hours to go to sleep. 265 00:15:26,220 --> 00:15:31,680 And I mean, a lot of that was sort of like exploring meditation and mindfulness 266 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:35,520 techniques and things that were, like things that you could do while you 267 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:39,630 were awake or are often done when they, they weren't, they weren't meant to be 268 00:15:39,630 --> 00:15:40,890 like, here's how you can go to sleep. 269 00:15:41,190 --> 00:15:44,790 It was just me testing things continually, which is also 270 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:46,050 sort of a byproduct of my life. 271 00:15:46,650 --> 00:15:52,500 And, um, and so the thing that, so Code of the West sort of resulted. 272 00:15:53,445 --> 00:15:59,085 In the intersection of how do I kind of crawl back because I crawled for 273 00:15:59,085 --> 00:16:03,495 a while, you know, like after Lauren and Michael died, I went and did 274 00:16:03,495 --> 00:16:07,425 trail maintenance for a hitch in the Wenatchee, and then immediately went 275 00:16:07,425 --> 00:16:12,105 to New York City like three weeks later and, um, moved there for comics. 276 00:16:12,165 --> 00:16:17,145 So I, I like literally came from a situation where I was standing next 277 00:16:17,145 --> 00:16:20,595 to Alpine Lakes watching ridge lines catch on fire from Lightning, having 278 00:16:20,595 --> 00:16:22,125 conversations with my friend about. 279 00:16:22,755 --> 00:16:23,415 What do we do? 280 00:16:23,415 --> 00:16:24,704 We're 70 miles back. 281 00:16:24,885 --> 00:16:28,305 How are we gonna get out of this to like carrying the same osprey 282 00:16:28,305 --> 00:16:33,314 pack into Washington Square Park to get on the subway to go to the, 283 00:16:33,405 --> 00:16:34,545 the apartment I was gonna live in. 284 00:16:35,055 --> 00:16:40,365 And, um, and so there's always been this, um, sort of movement 285 00:16:40,365 --> 00:16:42,165 forward that I've had in my life. 286 00:16:42,194 --> 00:16:46,035 You know, I, I would crawl basically, even if I couldn't stand up and 287 00:16:46,035 --> 00:16:49,064 walk towards the light or movement. 288 00:16:49,064 --> 00:16:52,485 I knew that like, and this is something that got echoed by the people and the 289 00:16:52,485 --> 00:16:56,115 friends that I have at Black Rifle now, you know, that movement equals life. 290 00:16:56,145 --> 00:16:58,964 Like if you just sit, I mean, I know if you're lost in the woods, you're 291 00:16:58,964 --> 00:17:02,835 supposed to kind of sit still, but like, uh, you know, certainly in firefights 292 00:17:02,835 --> 00:17:06,944 and that sort of thing, like you, if you just sit down and give up, you're 293 00:17:06,944 --> 00:17:08,625 probably not gonna do very well. 294 00:17:08,865 --> 00:17:13,754 Um, and, and so it, it just, code of the West is sort of just a confluence 295 00:17:13,815 --> 00:17:15,734 of a number of different things. 296 00:17:15,734 --> 00:17:19,365 Not to mention it just was a way of honoring the people that raised me. 297 00:17:21,135 --> 00:17:21,675 And how I 298 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:22,169 was raised. 299 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:26,159 So, so I'm, I'm curious. 300 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:27,810 I've been taking notes as you go through here. 301 00:17:27,810 --> 00:17:27,869 Yeah. 302 00:17:27,899 --> 00:17:31,169 'cause I, I will, my A DHD kicks in and I'm, I'm all over the board 303 00:17:31,169 --> 00:17:33,000 boy, so try, try to keep things. 304 00:17:33,690 --> 00:17:33,930 Thank you. 305 00:17:33,935 --> 00:17:34,995 I ramble, so I'm sorry. 306 00:17:35,250 --> 00:17:37,379 Uh oh. 307 00:17:37,379 --> 00:17:37,860 I love it. 308 00:17:38,129 --> 00:17:41,159 Um, you brought up some important ones that I didn't want to, uh, 309 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:42,690 uh, didn't want to gloss over. 310 00:17:43,290 --> 00:17:46,530 And I do want to talk with the childhood one because I think we probably can share 311 00:17:46,530 --> 00:17:50,580 some funny stories on that one based on our preamble before we started recording. 312 00:17:50,909 --> 00:17:52,950 But, um, sleep. 313 00:17:53,190 --> 00:17:55,500 So I was up at around zero 200 this morning. 314 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,800 I think I got back to sleep around five o'clock. 315 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:03,180 And then, um, that's not a normal for me. 316 00:18:03,180 --> 00:18:05,820 And then I was up again, probably about seven, knowing that I 317 00:18:05,820 --> 00:18:09,480 had to be bright-eyed and bushy tailed and ready for, uh, for the 318 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:11,129 podcast that we're doing here. 319 00:18:11,129 --> 00:18:11,220 Mm-hmm. 320 00:18:11,490 --> 00:18:13,500 I've never had a problem falling asleep. 321 00:18:13,950 --> 00:18:14,909 You lucky son of a bitch. 322 00:18:14,970 --> 00:18:15,389 Get a cup. 323 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:18,870 However, staying asleep is a different story. 324 00:18:19,290 --> 00:18:23,340 It's very beneficial when I'm out hunting because getting up early, going 325 00:18:23,340 --> 00:18:27,780 out and I'm, I'm my mind's going and I'm switched on and it's like what I 326 00:18:27,780 --> 00:18:30,030 do to fall back asleep is probably. 327 00:18:30,705 --> 00:18:32,625 Counter to what the experts would tell you. 328 00:18:32,955 --> 00:18:36,855 I'll do, uh, puzzles and brain games on my phone, which is number one, 329 00:18:36,855 --> 00:18:41,265 stimulation number two, it's blue light and you're on a device or whatever it is. 330 00:18:41,265 --> 00:18:44,325 But for whatever reason, that's one thing that helps. 331 00:18:44,535 --> 00:18:47,655 And then when I'm like, okay, I am at a point where I can kind of fall asleep. 332 00:18:48,105 --> 00:18:51,315 The other thing that I, and I forget where I pick this one up, but I 333 00:18:51,315 --> 00:18:56,865 find it useful, is I will hyper concentrate on very small things. 334 00:18:56,895 --> 00:19:01,065 For example, I will think about walking out my front door. 335 00:19:01,125 --> 00:19:02,925 What does the doorknob feel like? 336 00:19:02,925 --> 00:19:05,805 What's the green of the wood look like and the direction of it? 337 00:19:05,805 --> 00:19:08,415 What do the, uh, pebbles feel on my bare feet? 338 00:19:08,415 --> 00:19:11,475 What is, and like always, what do I pass next? 339 00:19:11,475 --> 00:19:12,705 What do the pillars look like? 340 00:19:12,705 --> 00:19:17,115 What are the, and I'll concentrate on all of these tiny, tiny little details 341 00:19:17,115 --> 00:19:19,545 and try, and I go as minute as I can. 342 00:19:20,175 --> 00:19:24,735 And that for whatever reason shuts my brain down. 343 00:19:24,735 --> 00:19:27,825 So I'm not thinking about all these other things that are coming in 344 00:19:27,825 --> 00:19:29,445 and it kind of laser focuses it. 345 00:19:29,475 --> 00:19:30,015 Interesting. 346 00:19:30,015 --> 00:19:31,845 What do you do to fall asleep? 347 00:19:31,845 --> 00:19:33,555 Not that pretty much the opposite. 348 00:19:34,365 --> 00:19:34,395 Okay. 349 00:19:34,485 --> 00:19:38,085 Um, that's thing interesting because, so one of the things that I learned 350 00:19:38,085 --> 00:19:44,715 with that brain scan is that, um, to put it in the most, like basic terms, my 351 00:19:44,715 --> 00:19:46,665 brain just takes in a shit ton of data. 352 00:19:47,055 --> 00:19:51,045 Um, and, um, and it does it at a pretty fast clip. 353 00:19:51,045 --> 00:19:53,115 It's not an intelligence thing, it's just, it's just straight 354 00:19:53,115 --> 00:19:54,615 up a data correlation thing. 355 00:19:55,095 --> 00:20:00,045 And so, um, what I, what I had to do for a number of years. 356 00:20:01,740 --> 00:20:05,610 When I was younger anyways, I would journal before I went to sleep, um, 357 00:20:05,625 --> 00:20:10,380 and, and, and try to get everything out that, um, had lingered, you know, 'cause 358 00:20:10,380 --> 00:20:13,620 that's usually what I, I'd get caught up in these loops of thinking about things. 359 00:20:14,100 --> 00:20:17,910 And then as I got older in, in my life, I was able to engineer my life 360 00:20:17,910 --> 00:20:19,170 towards the things that I wanted to do. 361 00:20:19,170 --> 00:20:21,720 So, you know, I was, I was writing and drawing comic books, 362 00:20:21,750 --> 00:20:22,590 you know, for a long time. 363 00:20:22,590 --> 00:20:23,220 That was a dream. 364 00:20:23,220 --> 00:20:26,010 So a lot of the anxieties and things that I'd been thinking 365 00:20:26,010 --> 00:20:29,490 about that would keep me awake were like the what ifs of the future. 366 00:20:29,910 --> 00:20:35,880 So as the future became the present, um, it became more about, um, it 367 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:39,090 became less about those specific things that I was fixating on and 368 00:20:39,090 --> 00:20:41,010 more of the, the habit of like. 369 00:20:41,700 --> 00:20:43,980 How do I not dwell on things at night? 370 00:20:44,370 --> 00:20:54,090 And so, um, I realized over the years that, um, I had to sort of let go of, of, 371 00:20:54,149 --> 00:20:59,070 of things as I'd went to sleep, you know, because I would hyperfocus I would do 372 00:20:59,070 --> 00:21:00,899 the thing you're describing by default. 373 00:21:01,530 --> 00:21:07,290 And so I had to sort of like figure out a way to, I, I describe it as like 374 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:12,149 going through the office and turning all the lights off, um, and, and just sort 375 00:21:12,149 --> 00:21:14,550 of like closing up shop for the night. 376 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:19,590 And, um, and so I would, it's a distinction. 377 00:21:19,590 --> 00:21:24,899 It's, it's, so rather than go look for something, I would sort of step away 378 00:21:24,899 --> 00:21:29,220 from something and, and I would engineer the last few hours of the day to sort 379 00:21:29,220 --> 00:21:31,980 of like know how to let go of things. 380 00:21:31,980 --> 00:21:36,510 Know I be, I got good at knowing what, what got hooked, hooked, hook me at night. 381 00:21:36,780 --> 00:21:38,490 And so I'd be like, okay, I'm gonna. 382 00:21:39,225 --> 00:21:40,514 I'm just gonna go ahead and do this thing. 383 00:21:40,514 --> 00:21:43,155 I'm gonna go ahead and do the thing that's gonna give me anxiety, you know? 384 00:21:43,215 --> 00:21:47,834 Um, you know, maybe it's send in an email or, um, whatever. 385 00:21:48,345 --> 00:21:52,365 Um, but then the actual internal thing that started happening was I 386 00:21:52,365 --> 00:21:55,485 started, I had always been interested in meditation just 'cause of the 387 00:21:55,485 --> 00:21:58,995 brain stuff that I had going on, and I wanted to be a Jedi grown up. 388 00:21:59,475 --> 00:22:01,514 Um, so I wanna be like Luke Skywalk, who doesn't? 389 00:22:01,784 --> 00:22:02,205 Yeah, right. 390 00:22:02,235 --> 00:22:03,554 I mean, any reasonable person. 391 00:22:03,554 --> 00:22:03,615 Yeah. 392 00:22:04,125 --> 00:22:10,814 Um, and uh, so I started using sort of meditation techniques to sort of just 393 00:22:10,814 --> 00:22:14,115 like zone out and try to like, 'cause once I, I identified the fact that 394 00:22:14,115 --> 00:22:15,855 my brain just didn't wanna shut down. 395 00:22:16,334 --> 00:22:18,554 Um, or I wasn't, I wasn't. 396 00:22:19,635 --> 00:22:21,795 Accommodating my brain shutting down. 397 00:22:22,215 --> 00:22:30,525 Uh, I started finding ways to sort of like create a, a structured, um, almost like 398 00:22:31,005 --> 00:22:36,165 falling backwards, like into like, into like a, like a dead man's float mentally. 399 00:22:36,765 --> 00:22:40,725 And, um, and so I, for a long time what I would do is I'd count 400 00:22:40,725 --> 00:22:44,865 backwards from 500, which I know it sounds like really ridiculous, but 401 00:22:44,955 --> 00:22:46,365 it would just be something for me. 402 00:22:46,365 --> 00:22:49,695 It would be something that I could, like structurally get lost in. 403 00:22:49,785 --> 00:22:52,425 Like, I didn't have to, it was, it was something that kind of kept, 404 00:22:52,425 --> 00:22:58,620 I. Me on a track one thing while, while sort of just getting wrote. 405 00:22:58,620 --> 00:23:01,679 And I eventually just, you know, I, I, I can't explain this, 406 00:23:01,679 --> 00:23:02,970 but I get to about four 70. 407 00:23:02,970 --> 00:23:04,530 I'm like, I don't want to go any lower than that. 408 00:23:04,530 --> 00:23:08,490 I'm just gonna go back over and start over at 500 and start counting back down again. 409 00:23:09,360 --> 00:23:11,804 And I'd usually fall asleep by like the third or fourth time. 410 00:23:11,804 --> 00:23:17,010 And then now, um, this is gonna sound kind of funny and probab and I hope not 411 00:23:17,010 --> 00:23:23,820 sacrilegious, but like I pray at night instead of doing the numbers thing. 412 00:23:24,149 --> 00:23:26,760 And, and so like, I don't always get to the Amen. 413 00:23:27,149 --> 00:23:32,760 Uh, but like I'm, I'm basically going, this is my version of the 414 00:23:32,845 --> 00:23:34,770 don't, don't fixate on the anxiety. 415 00:23:34,770 --> 00:23:36,480 It's more like, what am I grateful for? 416 00:23:36,870 --> 00:23:42,300 What am I, um, well mostly that, like what am I grateful for? 417 00:23:42,300 --> 00:23:44,460 Like, and, and it's things that are not. 418 00:23:44,940 --> 00:23:45,480 Big. 419 00:23:45,930 --> 00:23:48,900 And I think that's part of the reason why before we started talking, before 420 00:23:48,900 --> 00:23:52,410 we started recording where I, I was like, I don't really know what it's 421 00:23:52,410 --> 00:23:55,170 like on the outside of this because 422 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:55,770 Mm. 423 00:23:56,190 --> 00:23:59,400 I've fortunately gotten to a point where like, I don't give a shit 424 00:23:59,460 --> 00:24:03,390 about most of the things that people would probably care about. 425 00:24:03,870 --> 00:24:09,870 Um, I sleep in a bed and I'm glad to have a bed because I've slept 426 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:11,760 in places where I didn't have that. 427 00:24:11,790 --> 00:24:13,650 I mean, and you obviously hunt. 428 00:24:13,650 --> 00:24:13,740 Mm-hmm. 429 00:24:14,130 --> 00:24:18,990 Um, I know the value of a comfortable rock, uh, when you've worked for 15 430 00:24:18,990 --> 00:24:20,670 hour days going up and down a mountain. 431 00:24:20,970 --> 00:24:26,160 Um, and, and so the things that I think about and pray about, and 432 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:29,280 I, and I I have this, I don't like asking for things when I pray. 433 00:24:29,670 --> 00:24:36,120 Um, it's more like thinking about like, Hey, if I can, if I can 434 00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:41,070 go in this direction, you know, if, if, if I can be of help. 435 00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:47,340 Moving this way, it's more like, I'm not trying to trick God or the universe. 436 00:24:47,340 --> 00:24:52,710 It's just that like I just realize that like there's things that I, like, the bad 437 00:24:52,710 --> 00:24:57,930 things get me to the good things, and so I don't have the big picture all the time. 438 00:24:57,930 --> 00:25:04,320 So it's, I, I feel like I, it's sort of a little rude to ask for specific things 439 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:09,360 because I'm probably silly and, and not seeing the big picture and don't know, 440 00:25:09,360 --> 00:25:12,570 well, of course I'm not seeing the big picture, so it's like, it's more like 441 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:17,520 asking for help to just go where I need to go and, and being grateful for what I got. 442 00:25:17,550 --> 00:25:21,060 Like, you know, most of the time it's like, thanks for knowing 443 00:25:21,060 --> 00:25:22,710 one that I love dying today. 444 00:25:22,950 --> 00:25:24,240 Again, thanks for the bed. 445 00:25:24,690 --> 00:25:24,780 Mm-hmm. 446 00:25:25,020 --> 00:25:28,980 Thanks for the fact that I get to walk outside and see Serk Mountains in the 447 00:25:28,980 --> 00:25:35,430 distance and you know, go walk across 20 acres of property, you know, from on the 448 00:25:35,460 --> 00:25:37,170 property that I'm renting for my family. 449 00:25:37,935 --> 00:25:40,004 Um, it's stuff like that. 450 00:25:40,004 --> 00:25:45,014 And so that's, for some reason that's really, it's a groovy spot. 451 00:25:45,230 --> 00:25:46,695 I, I don't know how to describe it. 452 00:25:46,695 --> 00:25:49,635 Like, it's just, I get to say goodnight with God, basically, 453 00:25:52,034 --> 00:25:56,534 you know, that is a groovy spot and as you describe it, so I've tried 454 00:25:56,534 --> 00:26:01,065 the talk backwards thing, the count backwards, but then I'm goal oriented. 455 00:26:01,095 --> 00:26:01,185 Mm-hmm. 456 00:26:01,185 --> 00:26:03,645 And I'll start again, and I'll start again 'cause I lose track, 457 00:26:03,645 --> 00:26:05,385 but I gotta make it down to zero. 458 00:26:05,385 --> 00:26:10,365 And, and I got this drive that like, I can do this and it's a weird thing, but. 459 00:26:11,220 --> 00:26:15,690 It sounds not dissimilar from my process of trying to remember 460 00:26:15,690 --> 00:26:20,250 my childhood home and the carpet and the what color and the smell. 461 00:26:20,730 --> 00:26:25,500 It's taking your mind and hyper fixating on something aside from all 462 00:26:25,500 --> 00:26:27,690 of this sensory input that's coming in. 463 00:26:27,750 --> 00:26:32,820 'cause I love to create and I love, I get these crazy ideas that come in 464 00:26:32,820 --> 00:26:37,680 at all times, but that hyper fixation process of something that's completely 465 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:42,300 outside of like, I'm not interested in recreating my, my childhood home. 466 00:26:42,300 --> 00:26:42,660 Right. 467 00:26:42,660 --> 00:26:46,230 I tell you something interesting though, like along the lines of this. 468 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:52,170 Um, so when I'm drawing and writing, I'll spontaneously have really vivid 469 00:26:52,170 --> 00:26:54,090 memories from all over the place. 470 00:26:54,090 --> 00:26:56,190 You know, different areas of my life, childhood. 471 00:26:56,190 --> 00:27:02,430 And it's like I'm there, not like in a flashback way, but um, just 472 00:27:03,300 --> 00:27:04,980 remembering it from the first person. 473 00:27:05,490 --> 00:27:09,030 And one of the things that happens a lot of times when I go to sleep now is. 474 00:27:10,574 --> 00:27:12,735 And this is gonna sound really weird, and I hope it doesn't 475 00:27:12,735 --> 00:27:16,034 sound like scary, but memories. 476 00:27:16,034 --> 00:27:22,365 And also, so I'm not a musical person, but, um, three things happen 477 00:27:22,725 --> 00:27:24,945 a lot of times that I can't explain. 478 00:27:25,274 --> 00:27:28,725 One is I'll just start watching things happen. 479 00:27:29,145 --> 00:27:35,205 Like I'll, I'll start watching memories and then sometimes I will be listening 480 00:27:35,205 --> 00:27:41,955 to music I've never heard before, that somehow I'm creating, which I don't know 481 00:27:42,014 --> 00:27:45,225 how to even explain this very well, but it's like, it's not like I'm listening to 482 00:27:45,225 --> 00:27:47,715 like Lady Gaga as a soundtrack in my head. 483 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:49,425 It's like, I'm. 484 00:27:50,475 --> 00:27:53,625 And maybe it's just the impression I'm listening to music 485 00:27:53,625 --> 00:27:54,585 that I've never heard before. 486 00:27:54,585 --> 00:27:57,975 It's, and it's not actual music, although I have recordings of waking 487 00:27:57,975 --> 00:28:01,425 up and humming it, um, just because I thought it was interesting. 488 00:28:01,755 --> 00:28:04,035 Um, but I, I, I, yeah, I'm not a musical person. 489 00:28:04,035 --> 00:28:06,405 I love music, but I, I, I don't create music. 490 00:28:06,825 --> 00:28:10,995 And then sometimes I just go and I watch stories unfold, and it's 491 00:28:10,995 --> 00:28:14,295 like, I'm aware of the fact that like, I'm not controlling it. 492 00:28:14,655 --> 00:28:17,655 I'm just watching and I'm not asleep yet. 493 00:28:17,985 --> 00:28:22,125 I'm just, it's like my, it's like the ca the best way I can put it is there 494 00:28:22,125 --> 00:28:26,115 was this sort of like, I always felt like there was a chaos in my brain, you 495 00:28:26,115 --> 00:28:27,075 know, when I was trying to go to sleep. 496 00:28:27,075 --> 00:28:28,815 There just shit happening everywhere. 497 00:28:28,815 --> 00:28:28,935 Mm-hmm. 498 00:28:29,175 --> 00:28:32,025 And, and I would try to control it and try to tamp it down. 499 00:28:32,625 --> 00:28:35,325 When I, when I basically was like, you know what? 500 00:28:35,565 --> 00:28:40,215 I'm just going to get a bucket of popcorn and just look at the chaos. 501 00:28:41,355 --> 00:28:47,370 I realized it really wasn't chaos, it was just, I. Unstructured things happening. 502 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:51,000 And, and I would just, it was interesting, you know, and so it's 503 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,600 like, rather than fight my brain, I just sort of like laid down in the 504 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,400 lazy river and just saw what I saw. 505 00:28:59,070 --> 00:29:03,930 I, that is really cool because there's something, I don't know, we don't 506 00:29:03,930 --> 00:29:08,070 have the answers to everything and we talk normal, like what's a nor, right. 507 00:29:08,635 --> 00:29:11,055 What's, what's a normal brain hunter? 508 00:29:11,070 --> 00:29:11,129 I 509 00:29:11,129 --> 00:29:12,389 don't think that we're solving anything. 510 00:29:14,879 --> 00:29:18,450 Well, I mean, if you look at me up top, I'm kinda like a duck right now. 511 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:20,760 My leg is going up and down a mile a minute. 512 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:26,220 I don't belong in confined walls in a, in front of a desk, in a, 513 00:29:26,700 --> 00:29:29,520 um, in a situation like this, um. 514 00:29:30,495 --> 00:29:34,875 I'm, I'm not, I belong in an area where there's vast space around me. 515 00:29:34,875 --> 00:29:34,965 Mm-hmm. 516 00:29:35,205 --> 00:29:38,175 That's when I, my body tends to, tends to calm down. 517 00:29:38,445 --> 00:29:40,784 I got all these inputs coming in all the time. 518 00:29:40,844 --> 00:29:43,635 I was diagnosed with severe A DHD as a kid. 519 00:29:43,635 --> 00:29:46,514 I was put on the highest doses of Ritalin that they had in the 520 00:29:46,514 --> 00:29:49,395 province, apparently as an a, um, hey, 521 00:29:49,395 --> 00:29:51,375 well, I mean, you might as well set some record somewhere. 522 00:29:52,814 --> 00:29:53,324 That's right. 523 00:29:53,324 --> 00:29:53,774 There you go. 524 00:29:53,774 --> 00:29:55,365 It was an experimental run. 525 00:29:55,365 --> 00:29:58,064 I took myself off, but like, it was from grade three to grade 526 00:29:58,064 --> 00:29:59,895 seven, took myself off cold Turkey. 527 00:29:59,895 --> 00:30:00,554 I'm like, that's it. 528 00:30:00,554 --> 00:30:01,245 I'm done with this. 529 00:30:01,245 --> 00:30:01,514 Right? 530 00:30:01,574 --> 00:30:01,665 Mm-hmm. 531 00:30:02,235 --> 00:30:11,294 But the, the inputs that we have coming in is, you know, sometimes you look at it 532 00:30:11,294 --> 00:30:13,125 like how much is actually unique thought. 533 00:30:13,395 --> 00:30:19,334 How much is us seeing something or reinterpreting something or, uh. 534 00:30:19,935 --> 00:30:25,034 We don't have the luxury that people, way back in the day, the ancient Greeks 535 00:30:25,034 --> 00:30:28,754 would sit around and philosophize and just think on singular subjects for 536 00:30:28,754 --> 00:30:33,554 long periods of time, and it'll come up to us now in a TikTok feed and we'll 537 00:30:33,554 --> 00:30:36,705 make a tweak on that and feel like we've, we've invented something new. 538 00:30:36,975 --> 00:30:44,054 I don't know if there's much new actual, original things out there, maybe new 539 00:30:44,054 --> 00:30:48,705 ways of looking at it, but perhaps how our brains are picking it up. 540 00:30:48,705 --> 00:30:52,845 Maybe you are tapping into a frequency out there that uh, uh, 541 00:30:53,925 --> 00:30:58,245 artists and creative people like yourself can, can use the fuel. 542 00:30:58,274 --> 00:30:59,415 I think it's kind of neat. 543 00:30:59,534 --> 00:31:00,135 And the other thing, 544 00:31:00,435 --> 00:31:00,764 oh, go ahead. 545 00:31:00,764 --> 00:31:01,215 You go ahead. 546 00:31:01,215 --> 00:31:01,725 Go ahead. 547 00:31:01,965 --> 00:31:02,745 I'll go back to this. 548 00:31:03,015 --> 00:31:03,075 O 549 00:31:04,275 --> 00:31:05,685 Okay, I'll, I'll tell a story. 550 00:31:05,745 --> 00:31:07,965 Don't forget your funny thing 'cause I want to hear your funny thing. 551 00:31:08,145 --> 00:31:10,035 So, so we're talking about memories. 552 00:31:10,095 --> 00:31:14,595 Um, and I've done work as a subject matter expert for all levels of court in Canada 553 00:31:14,595 --> 00:31:19,665 here on use of force firearms or weapons related issues and keeping credentials up. 554 00:31:19,665 --> 00:31:24,405 You do use of force experts, uh, workshops and seminars, and sometimes 555 00:31:24,405 --> 00:31:29,565 they talk about how memories are formed and how oftentimes we 556 00:31:29,565 --> 00:31:32,025 are our own worst, uh, witness. 557 00:31:32,025 --> 00:31:35,745 And the memories can be completely different from different perspectives. 558 00:31:35,925 --> 00:31:36,015 Mm-hmm. 559 00:31:36,255 --> 00:31:39,285 Sometimes people will block things out entirely and there's lots of parts of my 560 00:31:39,285 --> 00:31:41,325 childhood that I, I just don't remember. 561 00:31:41,715 --> 00:31:47,025 Uh, I remember riding the bus to a school and the Oklahoma City 562 00:31:47,025 --> 00:31:51,795 bombing was in the news and I was reading this newspaper and I had what 563 00:31:51,825 --> 00:31:53,745 they call it, a flashbulb memory. 564 00:31:54,495 --> 00:32:01,080 And I. I was like a child in a room that was completely engulfed on fire. 565 00:32:01,410 --> 00:32:04,500 And I came home and it just felt really weird and very strong. 566 00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:07,200 And I interesting asked my mom and I said, yeah. 567 00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:09,780 I said this really weird thing. 568 00:32:09,780 --> 00:32:12,360 And I was in this room, was completely engulfed in fire. 569 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:16,140 And she says, well, yeah, you were at a, uh, sleepover at your friend's 570 00:32:16,140 --> 00:32:20,700 house and their Christmas tree caught on fire and you guys were all up. 571 00:32:20,700 --> 00:32:22,530 The firefighters came in the middle of the night. 572 00:32:22,530 --> 00:32:23,970 And I blocked all of that out. 573 00:32:23,970 --> 00:32:27,810 But in my memory, I can remember there was a fishbowl with matches in it. 574 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,950 And I don't wanna think it, but I'm wondering how that tree lit 575 00:32:31,950 --> 00:32:35,340 on fire caught on fire and Right. 576 00:32:35,610 --> 00:32:37,380 And why maybe that memory was blocked out. 577 00:32:37,385 --> 00:32:37,505 Yeah. 578 00:32:37,510 --> 00:32:41,400 But as she says, when I was dropped off, uh, I would just, they'd plunk me down 579 00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:42,840 on the ground and I'd stare at the wall. 580 00:32:42,930 --> 00:32:44,760 They'd pick me up and move me and stare at the wall. 581 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:45,810 And like, was he abused? 582 00:32:45,810 --> 00:32:46,590 Like what happened? 583 00:32:46,590 --> 00:32:46,830 Right. 584 00:32:46,830 --> 00:32:50,070 And went back the next day and they talked to them. 585 00:32:50,070 --> 00:32:52,830 I didn't want to get out of the car for whatever reason and. 586 00:32:53,415 --> 00:32:57,675 Um, so who knows what was going on there, but the way memories are formed and how 587 00:32:57,675 --> 00:32:59,475 much of that memory is actually accurate. 588 00:32:59,475 --> 00:33:01,095 If I had to blocked so much of that out. 589 00:33:02,325 --> 00:33:03,165 It is interesting. 590 00:33:03,255 --> 00:33:06,855 So I wanna hear your, oh, well, I was gonna say, um, when you were saying 591 00:33:06,855 --> 00:33:10,575 how, you know, what I might be tuned in with as a creative or an artist, 592 00:33:10,635 --> 00:33:15,345 um, I'd always had, I'd always had this aversion to referring myself as an artist. 593 00:33:15,345 --> 00:33:19,245 Although I will say, I think now I would consider myself that because 594 00:33:19,845 --> 00:33:23,985 I'm actually trying to say something that's subjective and, and unique to me. 595 00:33:24,435 --> 00:33:28,485 But when I talked to the scientist after he scanned my brain and he was 596 00:33:28,485 --> 00:33:33,885 like, um, you know, telling me basically why I was a bit of an odd duck. 597 00:33:33,915 --> 00:33:35,955 He's like, what do you do? 598 00:33:35,955 --> 00:33:36,825 A black rifle? 599 00:33:37,155 --> 00:33:38,895 And I was like, oh, well I'm the art director. 600 00:33:38,895 --> 00:33:40,095 I have like a group of. 601 00:33:40,455 --> 00:33:43,515 You know, pirates underneath me and we make coffee bags and stuff. 602 00:33:43,515 --> 00:33:44,175 And why? 603 00:33:44,625 --> 00:33:48,855 He's like, because your brain looks and behaves like an engineer's brain. 604 00:33:49,245 --> 00:33:50,115 Not what? 605 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:50,560 Because 606 00:33:50,565 --> 00:33:52,605 they, they'd scanned a lot of people's brains by this point, 607 00:33:52,605 --> 00:33:58,605 and it wasn't, this is not like a, um, uh, uh, an astrology reading. 608 00:33:58,695 --> 00:34:00,105 And they didn't present it as like mm-hmm. 609 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:00,800 Empirical evidence. 610 00:34:00,885 --> 00:34:03,075 They were just saying, Hey, we, this is what we've done. 611 00:34:03,585 --> 00:34:05,325 We've scanned all these different brains. 612 00:34:05,355 --> 00:34:06,225 This is what they did. 613 00:34:06,735 --> 00:34:11,715 If we look at like, you know, 99% of people who are engineers or scientists, 614 00:34:11,715 --> 00:34:16,635 people who have that kind of, uh, predilection towards, um, building 615 00:34:16,635 --> 00:34:19,215 things, their brain looks like yours. 616 00:34:19,455 --> 00:34:22,665 The brains of people who are supposedly the artists look like 617 00:34:22,784 --> 00:34:24,045 something completely different. 618 00:34:24,465 --> 00:34:25,875 And so, um. 619 00:34:26,985 --> 00:34:30,405 That's the weird hybrid that I've always been. 620 00:34:30,465 --> 00:34:33,555 And that's part of also this whole thing with Code of the West of 621 00:34:33,555 --> 00:34:35,325 like, I just didn't fit in anywhere. 622 00:34:35,775 --> 00:34:40,035 And, and I think that's part of the reason why I sort of sought 623 00:34:40,035 --> 00:34:41,775 this sovereignty for myself. 624 00:34:41,925 --> 00:34:44,835 'cause the world loves to categorize things and box you 625 00:34:44,835 --> 00:34:47,535 in and tell you what you are. 626 00:34:47,565 --> 00:34:47,655 Sure. 627 00:34:48,075 --> 00:34:49,245 It's a DHD. 628 00:34:49,245 --> 00:34:54,135 It's, uh, I had, I, I was supposed to, when I was supposed to be learning how to 629 00:34:54,135 --> 00:34:57,435 speak as a child, I had ear infections. 630 00:34:57,495 --> 00:35:01,695 So I thought I could talk because I was modeling what I'd heard. 631 00:35:02,055 --> 00:35:02,835 Turns out I'd, 632 00:35:03,405 --> 00:35:03,855 I was talking 633 00:35:03,860 --> 00:35:08,385 gobbly goop, so I had to go to a deaf school when I was supposed 634 00:35:08,385 --> 00:35:09,585 to be learning how to read. 635 00:35:09,825 --> 00:35:13,635 So that by the time that I showed up in first grade, I guess you just aren't, 636 00:35:14,055 --> 00:35:15,465 I remember thinking this as a kid. 637 00:35:16,259 --> 00:35:18,540 The teacher didn't teach us how to read. 638 00:35:18,540 --> 00:35:20,910 She just was like, go and read this simple book. 639 00:35:20,910 --> 00:35:22,649 You know, see Jane Run or whatever. 640 00:35:22,919 --> 00:35:23,879 Mm. And I was like, I can't read. 641 00:35:23,879 --> 00:35:26,220 And she's like, well, I guess you sucks to be you. 642 00:35:26,549 --> 00:35:32,850 She told my mom that, um, he's not gonna learn how to read and he's probably 643 00:35:32,850 --> 00:35:33,990 not gonna make it through school. 644 00:35:34,470 --> 00:35:37,290 And kind of, sorry. 645 00:35:37,544 --> 00:35:37,964 Mm-hmm. 646 00:35:38,049 --> 00:35:38,910 And that was that. 647 00:35:38,915 --> 00:35:38,924 Mm-hmm. 648 00:35:39,060 --> 00:35:42,750 And I, I just panicked 'cause I didn't clearly know how to read, 649 00:35:42,750 --> 00:35:44,310 but I knew that it was important. 650 00:35:44,370 --> 00:35:46,529 Like my grandpa had a basement full of books. 651 00:35:47,235 --> 00:35:52,125 And I just knew that I needed, I needed that information and, and my 652 00:35:52,125 --> 00:35:54,194 mom was pretty transparent with me. 653 00:35:54,194 --> 00:35:55,335 She's like, this is what they're saying. 654 00:35:55,335 --> 00:35:56,505 This is what we're gonna figure out. 655 00:35:56,505 --> 00:35:58,275 And I was just brow beaten. 656 00:35:58,275 --> 00:36:00,615 And my grand, I was crying on my grandpa's waterbed. 657 00:36:00,615 --> 00:36:02,775 I don't know know, people might not know what a water bed is, but it's 658 00:36:02,775 --> 00:36:04,395 basically a big balloon you slept on. 659 00:36:04,875 --> 00:36:10,424 And I was crying so hard that I was like rocking in a wave on the, on the waterbed. 660 00:36:10,964 --> 00:36:12,105 And he's like, we're gonna figure it out. 661 00:36:12,194 --> 00:36:13,305 My mom said the same thing. 662 00:36:13,845 --> 00:36:18,795 And I got into a remedial reading class and within weeks I was reading. 663 00:36:19,305 --> 00:36:24,734 And, and and outta spite for this woman who I won't name, but I remember her name, 664 00:36:24,734 --> 00:36:26,714 well, who was my first grade teacher. 665 00:36:27,225 --> 00:36:31,125 I just, I don't know if you had book it in, in Canada, but Pizza 666 00:36:31,125 --> 00:36:34,634 Hut had this program back in the day where if you, yes, okay. 667 00:36:35,024 --> 00:36:36,285 I slayed book it. 668 00:36:36,524 --> 00:36:38,265 I absolutely destroyed book it. 669 00:36:38,835 --> 00:36:39,015 I was 670 00:36:39,015 --> 00:36:40,064 getting personal pan pizza. 671 00:36:40,064 --> 00:36:40,185 'cause you 672 00:36:40,185 --> 00:36:40,875 get the pizza. 673 00:36:40,935 --> 00:36:44,595 Yeah, just um, getting personal pan pizzas like left and right and it 674 00:36:44,595 --> 00:36:49,214 was just like out of spite, just pure, pure elementary school rage. 675 00:36:49,515 --> 00:36:53,564 And, and so I consumed so many books that by the time I was 676 00:36:53,564 --> 00:36:54,975 about second to third grade. 677 00:36:55,665 --> 00:36:59,055 I was reading Kenneth Roberts, I don't know if you're familiar with him. 678 00:36:59,085 --> 00:37:04,575 Um, he, uh, wrote the Northwest Passage Andra in Arms, um, was mostly like a, 679 00:37:05,024 --> 00:37:08,325 uh, 18th century historical fiction guy. 680 00:37:08,714 --> 00:37:11,475 I would basically is put to put it to you, is simply, I was reading 681 00:37:11,475 --> 00:37:15,944 way above my reading level, but my, the reason why I bring this 682 00:37:15,944 --> 00:37:19,815 up is not to brag about, you know, reading adult books when I was a kid. 683 00:37:19,815 --> 00:37:24,975 It is to say that like the adults or an adult in my life said, Nope, 684 00:37:25,245 --> 00:37:26,625 this is the category you're in. 685 00:37:27,015 --> 00:37:28,935 Um, you are not smart. 686 00:37:28,964 --> 00:37:32,145 You didn't show up smart, therefore you remain not smart. 687 00:37:32,565 --> 00:37:35,835 And, and so that was probably the first moment in my life where 688 00:37:35,835 --> 00:37:37,875 I'm like, don't trust the adults. 689 00:37:38,745 --> 00:37:40,185 Do what you have to do. 690 00:37:40,365 --> 00:37:43,365 And I was obsessed with Teddy Roosevelt from a really early age 691 00:37:43,365 --> 00:37:45,135 because of the Young Jones Chronicles. 692 00:37:45,135 --> 00:37:46,635 Again, I don't know if anybody remembers that. 693 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:46,690 Mm-hmm. 694 00:37:46,770 --> 00:37:47,865 But there was an episode where 695 00:37:48,135 --> 00:37:48,315 Uhhuh 696 00:37:48,555 --> 00:37:52,395 Indie goes to Africa and meets Teddy and I just became enamored. 697 00:37:52,395 --> 00:37:53,325 And he had asthma. 698 00:37:53,325 --> 00:37:54,405 Like I had asthma. 699 00:37:54,795 --> 00:37:59,235 And I was just like, I'm gonna just do the Teddy Roosevelt thing 700 00:37:59,235 --> 00:38:02,445 and just, um, I'm gonna, again, I'm not gonna talk like a sailor. 701 00:38:02,445 --> 00:38:04,455 So I'm trying to think of a way of say this. 702 00:38:04,455 --> 00:38:12,015 I'm gonna physically exert my, my will upon the world around me and, and attempt 703 00:38:12,105 --> 00:38:21,255 to, um, go to uncomfortable places in an effort to be the thing that I want to be. 704 00:38:21,525 --> 00:38:26,295 And, you know, I might fail, you know, like, um, probably, but, um. 705 00:38:27,194 --> 00:38:31,275 I mean, we're talking foundationally, I was just like, Hmm, no, no, bro. 706 00:38:31,335 --> 00:38:34,065 Like I'm not feeling this whole asthma thing. 707 00:38:34,065 --> 00:38:36,165 I'm not feeling the not reading thing. 708 00:38:36,765 --> 00:38:39,645 I'm gonna go and do, I'm gonna at least try. 709 00:38:40,035 --> 00:38:44,295 And I, it's terrifying in a weird way to look back at this and go like, 710 00:38:46,125 --> 00:38:49,305 for one, what, why am I this way? 711 00:38:49,365 --> 00:38:55,904 Like, what compelled me to defiantly say No, I'm going to figure this out. 712 00:38:56,535 --> 00:39:00,735 And alternatively, what would've happened if I didn't, if I hadn't had that? 713 00:39:00,944 --> 00:39:05,115 And so that's part of the impetus of Code of the West is just like, uh, 714 00:39:05,115 --> 00:39:09,194 you might be 40, you might be 70, you might be 17, you might be six. 715 00:39:09,225 --> 00:39:11,174 Hopefully not, but, you know, reading Code of the West. 716 00:39:11,174 --> 00:39:18,134 But, um, it's like I'm hoping, even though I can't name that sort of mojo 717 00:39:18,525 --> 00:39:22,935 woowoo thing that I'm talking about, I'm not gonna worry about the fact that 718 00:39:22,935 --> 00:39:24,194 I don't know what it is and I can't. 719 00:39:24,705 --> 00:39:29,355 Perfectly put it in a cam and, and try to sell it or present it to people. 720 00:39:29,355 --> 00:39:36,315 It's more like, hopefully I can just sort of in whatever way, shape, 721 00:39:36,315 --> 00:39:43,214 or form, like pass on the, uh, honorable, yet defiant, um, sovereign 722 00:39:43,575 --> 00:39:45,855 sense of myself to other people, 723 00:39:48,645 --> 00:39:49,214 you know? 724 00:39:49,935 --> 00:39:50,355 Okay. 725 00:39:50,535 --> 00:39:52,125 I'm taking notes as we go through here. 726 00:39:52,125 --> 00:39:53,955 You're bringing up a lot of really cool parts. 727 00:39:53,955 --> 00:39:54,015 Yeah. 728 00:39:54,015 --> 00:39:54,134 Sorry. 729 00:39:55,005 --> 00:39:57,105 Uh, no, this is awesome. 730 00:39:57,165 --> 00:40:02,145 I'm sit around and think, I mean, there's clearly, and there's so much value in 731 00:40:02,145 --> 00:40:06,045 what you're, when you're putting out and you're able to distill that through 732 00:40:06,045 --> 00:40:10,485 your Instagram feed and provide people that same value on a daily basis. 733 00:40:10,515 --> 00:40:14,085 'cause not everybody has the ability to sit around and think a lot. 734 00:40:14,595 --> 00:40:16,995 I think everyone, they are very lucky for that. 735 00:40:17,085 --> 00:40:17,865 Uh, most people, 736 00:40:19,875 --> 00:40:22,335 well, most people have the capacity, not everyone. 737 00:40:22,335 --> 00:40:22,424 Sure. 738 00:40:22,424 --> 00:40:25,185 But most people have the capacity, not, not everybody. 739 00:40:25,185 --> 00:40:26,805 And maybe that's not the right way to say it. 740 00:40:26,805 --> 00:40:28,509 Not everyone has ability, because I know your audience 741 00:40:28,509 --> 00:40:28,964 will know too. 742 00:40:29,085 --> 00:40:32,234 It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's predilection, you know? 743 00:40:32,234 --> 00:40:33,345 It's like I, I think mm-hmm. 744 00:40:33,585 --> 00:40:34,845 Not to get off your thing. 745 00:40:34,845 --> 00:40:39,645 I just, I'll say real quick about drawing or writing or anything, or hunting, people 746 00:40:39,645 --> 00:40:41,145 will say like, oh, I wish I could do that. 747 00:40:41,145 --> 00:40:41,984 I wish I had your talent. 748 00:40:41,984 --> 00:40:45,075 It's like, yeah, you could, if you, if your interest aligned 749 00:40:45,075 --> 00:40:48,734 with what I'm doing, you would obsessively learn how to do it too. 750 00:40:50,145 --> 00:40:50,265 Mm-hmm. 751 00:40:51,734 --> 00:40:54,600 And again, happiness would be a byproduct of that. 752 00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:54,879 Mm-hmm. 753 00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:56,145 Of the work that you're putting in. 754 00:40:56,924 --> 00:41:01,845 I was asked to speak at a university in California, and um, I was talking 755 00:41:01,845 --> 00:41:07,590 with the doctor, professor ahead of time, and I. And, uh, you know, about 756 00:41:07,590 --> 00:41:10,680 the idea what one man can do, another person can do, and he brought up 757 00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,250 some very valid points about people like with severe schizophrenia, maybe 758 00:41:14,250 --> 00:41:15,600 they're not gonna have the same tools. 759 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:16,170 I'm like, okay. 760 00:41:16,170 --> 00:41:17,402 Or bipolar or something like that. 761 00:41:17,407 --> 00:41:17,825 Fair enough. 762 00:41:18,750 --> 00:41:19,050 Right. 763 00:41:19,050 --> 00:41:22,740 I, I wasn't, I wasn't maybe looking at it in the same way, what one 764 00:41:22,740 --> 00:41:24,750 person can do, most people can do. 765 00:41:24,755 --> 00:41:24,945 Mm-hmm. 766 00:41:25,025 --> 00:41:30,120 Or at the very least, I think everybody can look at their current position and 767 00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:35,700 say, how can I take that one small step towards something that's desirable in 768 00:41:35,700 --> 00:41:37,890 my life, which I'm not doing right now? 769 00:41:37,980 --> 00:41:38,070 Mm-hmm. 770 00:41:38,340 --> 00:41:41,880 So it doesn't necessarily mean that everyone's gonna be a star athlete, where 771 00:41:41,940 --> 00:41:46,740 everyone's gonna be a great thinker, but wherever they are right now, tomorrow 772 00:41:46,770 --> 00:41:48,750 they can be one small step closer. 773 00:41:48,750 --> 00:41:52,560 And if they don't do that step the next day, but they do it again 774 00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:56,490 the day after that, not to beat themselves up because the macro of 775 00:41:56,490 --> 00:41:59,070 those tiny little steps is crazy. 776 00:41:59,075 --> 00:41:59,225 Yeah. 777 00:41:59,225 --> 00:42:00,480 The best time to plant a tree 778 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:01,620 was 20 years ago. 779 00:42:01,620 --> 00:42:03,450 The next best time to do it is today. 780 00:42:04,730 --> 00:42:04,951 It is 781 00:42:05,055 --> 00:42:05,865 right today. 782 00:42:06,105 --> 00:42:09,825 Well, you talk about labels and how harmful labels can be. 783 00:42:10,214 --> 00:42:12,884 Uh, so I was diagnosed severe A DHD. 784 00:42:13,305 --> 00:42:18,765 Mind you, even to this day, despite having a lot of, um, indicators 785 00:42:18,765 --> 00:42:22,185 that would suggest that I have, that I still question, although 786 00:42:22,185 --> 00:42:25,875 some of my family and friends would say, no, no, you, you got it right. 787 00:42:26,265 --> 00:42:27,285 But I still question. 788 00:42:27,734 --> 00:42:32,205 I am 40 se 46, turning 47. 789 00:42:32,205 --> 00:42:32,325 Okay. 790 00:42:32,325 --> 00:42:35,475 So you're a few years older than me, but we're, I think, pretty much dealing 791 00:42:35,475 --> 00:42:38,775 with the same level of as assessment. 792 00:42:38,924 --> 00:42:41,355 You know, at the time a DH ADHD is kind of, that probably 793 00:42:41,355 --> 00:42:42,555 we're in that era of like, 794 00:42:42,615 --> 00:42:43,005 Hmm, 795 00:42:43,214 --> 00:42:43,995 give him some Ritalin. 796 00:42:45,300 --> 00:42:45,779 That's right. 797 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:47,340 That's a hundred percent what it was. 798 00:42:47,759 --> 00:42:52,320 So I remember one person saying to me, uh, is there ever, has there 799 00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,500 ever been a time in your life when you didn't feel like you had a DHD? 800 00:42:56,009 --> 00:42:59,970 Because almost every single day you talk about music in the head, 801 00:43:00,390 --> 00:43:06,270 there is a constant washing machine of sound and music that's playing 802 00:43:06,450 --> 00:43:07,770 as you're talking right now. 803 00:43:07,830 --> 00:43:13,320 Um, Bjork did a song called Pluto, I think it is, and it's not a great song, 804 00:43:13,620 --> 00:43:18,029 but when I listened to it, it's like, that's kind of the feeling that I hear 805 00:43:18,029 --> 00:43:20,370 in my head constantly in the background. 806 00:43:20,910 --> 00:43:24,750 Has there ever been a time when I don't feel that well, well, yeah, 807 00:43:24,750 --> 00:43:28,259 actually, and I list off a few different times when I haven't felt that. 808 00:43:28,259 --> 00:43:33,509 And they say, well, if that's the case, then do you really have a DHD? 809 00:43:33,540 --> 00:43:40,259 Like if you have these times, when you're able to have everything calm and in tune. 810 00:43:40,259 --> 00:43:43,350 And those times are generally always when I'm out in nature. 811 00:43:44,220 --> 00:43:49,860 Maybe it's just a natural response of your body being physically in a 812 00:43:49,860 --> 00:43:54,300 place where your mind isn't, where your mind isn't at ease or at rest. 813 00:43:54,750 --> 00:43:57,090 That's an, that's an interesting way to look at it. 814 00:43:58,200 --> 00:43:59,190 That But the the, I'm sorry. 815 00:43:59,280 --> 00:43:59,370 Go 816 00:43:59,370 --> 00:43:59,550 ahead. 817 00:43:59,550 --> 00:43:59,910 Go ahead. 818 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,140 I was gonna say, the worrisome thing about labels is that 819 00:44:04,140 --> 00:44:05,520 so many people buy into them. 820 00:44:05,970 --> 00:44:08,760 I mean, people are like, well, I'm gonna go get my kid diagnosed. 821 00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,200 I'm pretty sure they got the tsm. 822 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:11,850 Well, maybe they do, right? 823 00:44:11,940 --> 00:44:16,740 But maybe diagnosing them just gives them an out where they never want to try again. 824 00:44:16,890 --> 00:44:21,600 For some reason, you and I had that drive within us to say, screw you. 825 00:44:21,720 --> 00:44:22,890 I'm pushing forward. 826 00:44:23,190 --> 00:44:24,300 I don't care what you say. 827 00:44:24,300 --> 00:44:27,120 And for me, I think it was deeply rooted in sort of an 828 00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:29,700 oppositional defiance sort of, um. 829 00:44:30,330 --> 00:44:35,730 Uh, perspective, uh, where I would comply without capitulating because 830 00:44:35,730 --> 00:44:37,410 I want to do things my own way. 831 00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:38,670 Come hell or high water. 832 00:44:38,970 --> 00:44:39,120 Mm-hmm. 833 00:44:39,810 --> 00:44:47,279 Um, and that built into something that isn't the easy path, but it creates a path 834 00:44:47,279 --> 00:44:49,680 that I can be, at least I can call my own. 835 00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:49,770 Mm-hmm. 836 00:44:50,009 --> 00:44:50,759 And I can be proud of 837 00:44:51,535 --> 00:44:51,754 you. 838 00:44:51,759 --> 00:44:56,040 You bring something up there that at the end that I think is, as, as we're 839 00:44:56,250 --> 00:44:58,109 talking about this, I'm thinking about it. 840 00:44:59,250 --> 00:45:03,990 I had a very strong sense of my identity as, as Chris Hunt, you 841 00:45:03,990 --> 00:45:05,730 know, at an, as an early age. 842 00:45:05,730 --> 00:45:13,290 And, and what I mean by that is that like I, I never really viewed myself sort of in 843 00:45:13,290 --> 00:45:15,990 a meta awareness way as a part of a unit. 844 00:45:16,049 --> 00:45:19,319 I just always viewed myself as Chris, like a brain and jar basically. 845 00:45:19,319 --> 00:45:21,420 Not that I'd had that language at that time. 846 00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:22,799 So like. 847 00:45:23,550 --> 00:45:25,920 It never really occurred to me that there's like a one 848 00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:27,390 size fits all for anything. 849 00:45:27,720 --> 00:45:32,250 And, but people not only want the ease of the explanation, but they oftentimes 850 00:45:32,250 --> 00:45:34,230 want the identity that goes along with it. 851 00:45:34,260 --> 00:45:36,120 'cause it also makes that part of it easier too. 852 00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:36,210 Mm-hmm. 853 00:45:36,450 --> 00:45:40,200 Even with the m it's, it's almost become, even just saying that as 854 00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:42,420 much as I enjoy saying that m um. 855 00:45:42,690 --> 00:45:43,380 Right, right. 856 00:45:43,515 --> 00:45:46,620 And it, it, and, and, and I've taken this, I've probably taken 857 00:45:46,740 --> 00:45:50,580 a half dozen self-assessments and it's 50 50, you know, every time. 858 00:45:50,580 --> 00:45:50,670 Sure. 859 00:45:51,270 --> 00:45:56,670 And, um, it, which, okay, if it was one way or the other, it doesn't matter to me. 860 00:45:56,670 --> 00:45:58,770 It's just more like, okay, this is a data point. 861 00:45:59,190 --> 00:46:05,640 But I think that you and I, it sounds like we, we didn't, like, I 862 00:46:05,640 --> 00:46:08,670 never really wanted to belong in a group, but I was curious to be in a 863 00:46:08,670 --> 00:46:10,320 group, like I wanted to have friends. 864 00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:10,410 Mm-hmm. 865 00:46:10,650 --> 00:46:14,400 I wanted to be, feel belonging to something, but I didn't wanna 866 00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:16,830 lose my identity alongside of it. 867 00:46:17,250 --> 00:46:20,550 And, and it seems like every, not everybody, but from an 868 00:46:20,550 --> 00:46:22,080 early age, it seemed like. 869 00:46:22,950 --> 00:46:28,890 A lot of the people around me wanted to identify in, not only in simple terms, 870 00:46:29,279 --> 00:46:35,940 but in ways that allowed them to just sort of, um, group by osmosis in a way. 871 00:46:36,090 --> 00:46:38,160 Like, you know, where it's like, Hey, hey, I don't have to really 872 00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:42,360 fight to be, to have my people like, I mean, we're humans, we're tribal. 873 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:44,100 We want, we want the support. 874 00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,980 We don't wanna get kicked away from the fire, how we want 875 00:46:46,980 --> 00:46:47,910 to be invited by the fire. 876 00:46:47,910 --> 00:46:49,020 Mm-hmm. 877 00:46:49,050 --> 00:46:52,440 I'm, I feel like I'm the person who would've been like a strider, 878 00:46:52,500 --> 00:46:54,870 you know, and Lord of the Rings or something, you know, I'd have, I 879 00:46:54,870 --> 00:46:57,810 would've been that person where it's like everybody else is sitting around 880 00:46:57,810 --> 00:47:00,990 the fire shivering and, and there's just like, why is there like a fire 881 00:47:00,990 --> 00:47:03,270 like 30 feet away in the, in the dark? 882 00:47:03,270 --> 00:47:07,890 And it'd just be like me just there under like skins and just like staring 883 00:47:07,890 --> 00:47:11,790 into the fire by myself and like with maybe some sort of like giant 884 00:47:11,790 --> 00:47:13,350 dire wolf, like next, I don't know. 885 00:47:13,350 --> 00:47:16,410 I mean, like, I'm not, I'm just saying like, it, it, it. 886 00:47:16,950 --> 00:47:24,540 It, I, I, if, if it means losing myself versus, uh, appeasing a larger system from 887 00:47:24,540 --> 00:47:26,790 an early age, I was like, fuck the system. 888 00:47:27,030 --> 00:47:30,211 And I don't mean that like in a punk rock sort of way, you know, it, it, 889 00:47:30,240 --> 00:47:34,950 I mean it from like a truly, almost a epistemological way where it's like, 890 00:47:35,100 --> 00:47:39,060 um, it just didn't jive with me. 891 00:47:39,240 --> 00:47:45,330 And, and I, I, I, I wonder 'cause you know, sometimes, um, evolutionary, uh. 892 00:47:45,870 --> 00:47:48,870 Evolutionary biologists will have this debate about like, what are, what 893 00:47:48,870 --> 00:47:52,290 are the most beneficial traits for like, say like a chimpanzee to have? 894 00:47:52,290 --> 00:47:56,310 Is it the ability to create tools or is it the ability to copy the 895 00:47:56,310 --> 00:47:59,160 chimps that create tools and, 896 00:47:59,160 --> 00:47:59,850 Hmm. 897 00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:04,050 ' cause 'cause the logic being that cool, if you have one good invention 898 00:48:04,050 --> 00:48:07,740 and you, you make a, you make a, a flint flake, uh, or a, a flint 899 00:48:07,740 --> 00:48:09,180 knife you can scrape hides with. 900 00:48:09,390 --> 00:48:09,780 Cool. 901 00:48:09,990 --> 00:48:11,610 You contributed something to the better. 902 00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:13,650 You know, go to the, the group of chimps. 903 00:48:14,070 --> 00:48:17,880 If you're the kind of like clever chimp that's walking around going 904 00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:20,640 like, yeah, okay, a scraper, an ax. 905 00:48:21,390 --> 00:48:22,830 What are you doing with that at lateral thing? 906 00:48:22,980 --> 00:48:28,290 Um, suddenly you're the super chimp if you can copy all the different things and the, 907 00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:32,130 I'm not saying that's who I am, I'm just saying that like, as far as traits go. 908 00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:36,900 Uh, maybe you and I just have something different and that's okay. 909 00:48:36,990 --> 00:48:41,910 And I think for a long time I saw the things that I was struggling 910 00:48:41,910 --> 00:48:44,250 with as weaknesses because I was struggling with them. 911 00:48:44,640 --> 00:48:48,840 And as I got older and, and certainly as I started doing Code of the West, 912 00:48:49,050 --> 00:48:52,740 like Code of the West, actually, beyond just being a framework for 913 00:48:52,740 --> 00:48:58,650 myself is the first time where I'm like, oh, that's how this could work. 914 00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:01,410 You know, meaning me, like, you know, like 915 00:49:01,410 --> 00:49:02,190 mm-hmm. 916 00:49:02,265 --> 00:49:07,260 The only thing that makes sense to me that I could do with my life is go to the West 917 00:49:07,260 --> 00:49:14,040 because it is the intersection of writing and drawing and video and, and talking 918 00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:17,070 to people and, and growth and philosophy. 919 00:49:17,490 --> 00:49:20,850 All the things that I've always had to sort of like compartmentalize in my life. 920 00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:25,110 And, and so it's not so much that like only I could make code to the West. 921 00:49:25,110 --> 00:49:28,590 It's more like anybody, a lot of people could do what I'm doing. 922 00:49:28,650 --> 00:49:31,260 It's just that for me, I finally found the thing. 923 00:49:31,785 --> 00:49:35,295 The structure that the only kind of structure that would 924 00:49:35,295 --> 00:49:36,675 work for me, basically. 925 00:49:38,870 --> 00:49:41,265 You, you talk about, uh, sure. 926 00:49:41,265 --> 00:49:44,235 I'd want to have friends growing up. 927 00:49:44,235 --> 00:49:45,075 Did you have friends? 928 00:49:45,135 --> 00:49:45,405 Yeah. 929 00:49:45,405 --> 00:49:45,885 Not really. 930 00:49:46,275 --> 00:49:47,865 Uh, I mean, kind of, yes. 931 00:49:48,075 --> 00:49:49,905 But, um, what did you. 932 00:49:53,475 --> 00:49:58,020 No, no, not, I, I had, yeah, I mean, I had, I had, I was around adults. 933 00:49:58,020 --> 00:50:01,560 I was on a truck, you know, so if I wasn't sick in the hospital 934 00:50:01,590 --> 00:50:01,950 mm-hmm. 935 00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:05,010 I was on a, I was on a truck with my dad in the summertime. 936 00:50:05,700 --> 00:50:07,470 Uh, he was a high value product. 937 00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:11,730 Uh, truck driver did a bit of household too, but I was going back 938 00:50:11,730 --> 00:50:15,120 and forth across the United States, coast to coast, multiple times a 939 00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:18,180 summer, um, in, in, in a truck. 940 00:50:18,240 --> 00:50:24,450 And so I'd come back, you know, in first grade, go, go leave, go for the 941 00:50:24,450 --> 00:50:27,510 summer, come back in second grade, and I'd see some of the same faces 942 00:50:27,510 --> 00:50:30,000 and they'd be like, teacher would be like, what'd you do this summer? 943 00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:32,970 And, you know, these kids would be like, we went to Disneyland, 944 00:50:32,970 --> 00:50:34,650 or we went to the Wisconsin Dells. 945 00:50:34,650 --> 00:50:34,740 Mm-hmm. 946 00:50:34,980 --> 00:50:37,320 And they'd get to me and be like, I saw a man die next to the 947 00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:39,150 buffet at the Petro Iron Skillet. 948 00:50:39,270 --> 00:50:41,610 Um, you know, in Indianapolis. 949 00:50:41,610 --> 00:50:42,240 Like, yeah. 950 00:50:42,330 --> 00:50:47,040 You know, or I saw a Mount St. Helen's, you know, uh, like I 951 00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:48,750 almost got kidnapped in New Jersey. 952 00:50:48,750 --> 00:50:50,100 You know, it, it was like. 953 00:50:51,390 --> 00:50:55,355 I didn't know how to talk to kids as a kid, you know, because Uhhuh 954 00:50:55,575 --> 00:50:59,280 i'd, I'd already, it's like the world had been trying to kill 955 00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:01,080 me through asthma and allergies. 956 00:51:01,530 --> 00:51:05,730 Um, you know, my, like, I, I'm fighting to learn how to talk. 957 00:51:05,730 --> 00:51:07,260 I'm fighting to learn how to read. 958 00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:11,520 Like, I just kind of ca I was like an outside dog that showed 959 00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:12,990 up, like in elementary school. 960 00:51:12,990 --> 00:51:16,380 And then they were just like, you need to kind of just be cool, man. 961 00:51:16,500 --> 00:51:18,570 And I'm just like, I, I got that dog in me. 962 00:51:18,575 --> 00:51:19,980 Like, you know, it's like, I didn't know. 963 00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,970 I didn't, I didn't want, I didn't care about the Power Rangers or, I 964 00:51:23,970 --> 00:51:25,950 mean, I like Batman and Star Wars. 965 00:51:26,010 --> 00:51:29,310 Um, but sure, I just, I was ready to go. 966 00:51:29,310 --> 00:51:32,850 I mean, you could ask my mom, you know, and she would, would be, she would tell 967 00:51:32,850 --> 00:51:36,390 you that like at eight, nine years old, I was like, man, why can't I have a car? 968 00:51:36,390 --> 00:51:39,000 I just wanna go sit at the coffee shop and read and write. 969 00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:41,730 Um, I want to go where I want to go right now. 970 00:51:41,730 --> 00:51:46,650 I wanted agency from a very early age and, and other kids just wanted to like. 971 00:51:47,430 --> 00:51:52,980 I don't know, like eat pizza and, and watch movies, which is was fun 972 00:51:52,980 --> 00:51:54,570 when I got to experience it finally. 973 00:51:54,570 --> 00:51:59,340 But I didn't really get a friend until I was a more like junior high. 974 00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:02,280 You know, I had, I had people who I had, I'd have sleepovers with or 975 00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:03,480 something every once in a while. 976 00:52:04,020 --> 00:52:06,930 But, um, I just, they weren't that interesting to me. 977 00:52:07,230 --> 00:52:10,470 Like I was, I was wanting to prepare for life. 978 00:52:10,470 --> 00:52:12,630 I was wanting to get out and start doing shit. 979 00:52:14,100 --> 00:52:14,490 Mm-hmm. 980 00:52:15,210 --> 00:52:20,670 I, I think, uh, my story is probably pretty similar and what that does 981 00:52:20,670 --> 00:52:24,300 when you have a different life experience and a different perspective, 982 00:52:24,540 --> 00:52:25,770 it puts you on the outside. 983 00:52:26,190 --> 00:52:29,640 And when you're on the outside and have a personality type that doesn't 984 00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:35,340 necessarily want to be on the inside, it can put you at odds with those social 985 00:52:35,340 --> 00:52:40,350 structures that everyone naturally will, will kind of want to group towards. 986 00:52:40,350 --> 00:52:45,930 And if they can't put a label on you and understand you oftentimes. 987 00:52:46,470 --> 00:52:49,319 People will fear what they don't understand. 988 00:52:49,709 --> 00:52:49,890 Mm-hmm. 989 00:52:50,129 --> 00:52:54,240 And what they fear, they'll, it'll be, they'll reject. 990 00:52:54,240 --> 00:52:57,000 They'll exclude and so they'll exclude. 991 00:52:57,000 --> 00:53:01,500 And so it's no, uh, no slight on the people around me. 992 00:53:01,529 --> 00:53:05,459 I put myself in that situation based on my own stubbornness and, 993 00:53:05,819 --> 00:53:09,959 uh, not wanting to conform to like a, I'd look at these things and 994 00:53:09,959 --> 00:53:11,700 I'd consider them them childish. 995 00:53:11,700 --> 00:53:14,580 And like when I was in grade four, I set up, I was reading 996 00:53:14,609 --> 00:53:16,140 college level chemistry books. 997 00:53:16,169 --> 00:53:21,149 'cause I was really interested in making things like disappearing ink with phenyl 998 00:53:21,149 --> 00:53:25,589 pha solution, making your own gunpowder, um, nitrocellulose compounds, if it 999 00:53:25,589 --> 00:53:29,640 blew up, had an endothermic, exothermic reaction or it could kind of disappear. 1000 00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:32,009 I was that, that was cool. 1001 00:53:32,009 --> 00:53:33,419 That was science to me, right? 1002 00:53:34,169 --> 00:53:34,290 Mm-hmm. 1003 00:53:34,529 --> 00:53:34,531 That's chemistry. 1004 00:53:35,459 --> 00:53:38,475 I. And, uh, I had set up a, my grade four teacher is like, 1005 00:53:38,475 --> 00:53:39,944 I, I can't control this kid. 1006 00:53:40,335 --> 00:53:44,745 So we put, we put puzzles and games at the back and he can have 1007 00:53:44,745 --> 00:53:48,615 his chemistry lab and during lunch breaks he can teach chemistry. 1008 00:53:48,674 --> 00:53:49,660 And so that's what I would do. 1009 00:53:49,839 --> 00:53:50,261 That's amazing. 1010 00:53:50,266 --> 00:53:55,455 And yeah, that was a good teacher, that was a teacher who could realize that, 1011 00:53:55,484 --> 00:53:59,145 okay, he's not super great in these areas. 1012 00:53:59,145 --> 00:54:02,295 Rather than trying to make him better, we're gonna double down on the things 1013 00:54:02,295 --> 00:54:04,125 that he's showing a lot of aptitude for. 1014 00:54:04,129 --> 00:54:04,299 Mm-hmm. 1015 00:54:04,384 --> 00:54:06,734 And that's something that I try to do with my kids. 1016 00:54:07,154 --> 00:54:11,984 Um, but I also, you know, I don't ever wanna lose sight of the fact that, 1017 00:54:12,315 --> 00:54:13,935 like I was told I couldn't do math. 1018 00:54:13,935 --> 00:54:15,884 I was told that reading will be a challenge for me. 1019 00:54:15,884 --> 00:54:18,674 And like you, I persevered and overcame. 1020 00:54:18,734 --> 00:54:21,134 And even in recent years, I look at things like. 1021 00:54:21,705 --> 00:54:26,295 The Adobe Suite, how do you use After Effects and Premier Pro and Photoshop? 1022 00:54:26,295 --> 00:54:29,145 Like this is a completely new language and one day it's just like, you know what? 1023 00:54:29,535 --> 00:54:30,134 I'll do it. 1024 00:54:30,134 --> 00:54:35,205 And there's a light bulb switch and I'm proficient enough to put out content now. 1025 00:54:35,205 --> 00:54:36,610 So we found the reason to do it, 1026 00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:43,095 found the reason there's a proper external or internal stimulus that, 1027 00:54:43,275 --> 00:54:45,855 uh, that that move me forward. 1028 00:54:46,065 --> 00:54:50,685 And it's the understanding and people like to talk about neuroplasticity. 1029 00:54:50,805 --> 00:54:53,295 It's the understanding that you can always learn something new and 1030 00:54:53,295 --> 00:54:54,645 your brain is always expanding. 1031 00:54:56,805 --> 00:54:57,465 Damn, that thing. 1032 00:54:57,825 --> 00:54:59,384 Uh, yes, a hundred percent. 1033 00:54:59,745 --> 00:54:59,955 Yeah. 1034 00:54:59,955 --> 00:55:02,205 No, I get the old, the old MV seven mute. 1035 00:55:02,565 --> 00:55:07,275 Um, because I think about the neuroplasticity thing a a lot, 1036 00:55:07,815 --> 00:55:10,634 and I've thought about it since I was a pretty young person. 1037 00:55:11,415 --> 00:55:18,615 And, and I think that I. Like I, I'd almost, man, like 40 minutes ago, you 1038 00:55:18,615 --> 00:55:23,775 asked like, how, you know, where that place was that I was in and I didn't 1039 00:55:23,775 --> 00:55:25,785 get out of it for like 15 years. 1040 00:55:26,325 --> 00:55:30,345 And it, it got to the point where right before I was gonna black rifle and 1041 00:55:30,345 --> 00:55:34,245 I told you that I'd, I'd realized it probably shouldn't drink all the time 1042 00:55:34,245 --> 00:55:35,865 and, you know, do these other things. 1043 00:55:36,345 --> 00:55:42,735 Mm. I, I, I, I realized that I, I was living in an unintegrated way, meaning 1044 00:55:42,735 --> 00:55:48,495 that I was, I needed both parts of myself in a room, but I had divided 1045 00:55:48,495 --> 00:55:51,405 myself into a, like a workaholic. 1046 00:55:51,765 --> 00:55:56,115 This thing that we're talking about, this kid growing up, you know, that 1047 00:55:56,115 --> 00:55:57,825 is just like, I'm gonna do my thing. 1048 00:55:58,425 --> 00:55:59,655 I'll see y'all down the line. 1049 00:56:00,180 --> 00:56:00,720 Piece. 1050 00:56:01,110 --> 00:56:02,760 Um, that's great. 1051 00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:05,820 It works really well to do exceptional things, but it doesn't 1052 00:56:05,820 --> 00:56:07,710 do well to be a normal human. 1053 00:56:08,070 --> 00:56:12,090 And, um, and, and that's, and you, you see, that's what 1054 00:56:12,090 --> 00:56:13,560 we, I missed out on anyways. 1055 00:56:13,620 --> 00:56:17,550 I, it was the modeling that occurred, um, of like, this is just 1056 00:56:17,550 --> 00:56:20,550 how you normal do normal and, um, 1057 00:56:20,555 --> 00:56:20,635 mm-hmm. 1058 00:56:21,180 --> 00:56:27,930 And so I, I wouldn't, I didn't know how to be that obsessive driven person 1059 00:56:27,930 --> 00:56:33,750 and also keep my house clean and, you know, uh, exercise, cook for myself. 1060 00:56:34,135 --> 00:56:41,160 And, and I got the inclination around 2019 ish that was like, oof. 1061 00:56:41,820 --> 00:56:43,560 Like, I don't know how to do. 1062 00:56:44,250 --> 00:56:45,569 Basic human things. 1063 00:56:45,839 --> 00:56:49,529 And it's embarrassing, you know, to not know how to cook. 1064 00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,589 It's embarrassing to, I mean, I knew how I could do my laundry. 1065 00:56:52,589 --> 00:56:54,450 I mean, I knew how to, I knew how to clean dishes. 1066 00:56:54,450 --> 00:56:58,350 But it's like, part of my thing too is with the cooking is I get overwhelmed, 1067 00:56:58,350 --> 00:57:02,040 kinda like with the Adobe suite, where it's like, I don't, I'd go and try to 1068 00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:05,940 look something up on the internet and it's like, I need the foundational 1069 00:57:06,240 --> 00:57:09,450 explanation of the logic of a stove top. 1070 00:57:09,779 --> 00:57:13,259 Like, I don't know what the hell one through four actually is. 1071 00:57:13,259 --> 00:57:15,060 Especially when the recipe's like, put it on low. 1072 00:57:15,065 --> 00:57:15,285 Mm-hmm. 1073 00:57:15,370 --> 00:57:17,279 I'm like, what's low? 1074 00:57:17,609 --> 00:57:19,049 No one's, that's subjective to me. 1075 00:57:19,350 --> 00:57:22,680 Like low could be one low, could be four. 1076 00:57:22,710 --> 00:57:24,180 'cause it's below the halfway points. 1077 00:57:24,210 --> 00:57:24,330 Mm-hmm. 1078 00:57:24,839 --> 00:57:26,339 What does low mean? 1079 00:57:26,944 --> 00:57:32,279 And, and so I would get frustrated, just try to do simple things like that. 1080 00:57:32,279 --> 00:57:35,970 And, and, and, and I realized that I was, I'm gonna have to go 1081 00:57:35,970 --> 00:57:38,520 and do what I used to do and I'm just gonna have to go ask people. 1082 00:57:38,520 --> 00:57:40,109 I'm gonna have to, I'm gonna have to be. 1083 00:57:40,980 --> 00:57:46,560 Vulnerable enough to be like, Hey, I'm kind of, um, sort of retarded in these 1084 00:57:46,560 --> 00:57:52,650 ways, you know, or re retarded in these ways from, from not having, um, been 1085 00:57:52,650 --> 00:57:56,220 exposed to them and not for lack of trying and not for, like, I didn't, my mom got 1086 00:57:56,220 --> 00:58:00,450 really upset actually 'cause she thought that she let me down or something and I 1087 00:58:00,450 --> 00:58:03,210 was like, mom, you, you were a single mom. 1088 00:58:03,210 --> 00:58:04,320 I was a latchkey kid. 1089 00:58:05,040 --> 00:58:08,400 You could only do so much to, to prepare me. 1090 00:58:08,430 --> 00:58:11,310 You know, it's like, if, if I didn't learn how to cook a pork chop, I, 1091 00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:14,520 I did all these other things as a byproduct of what you did teach me. 1092 00:58:14,820 --> 00:58:17,160 I can, I can learn how to cook the pork chop now. 1093 00:58:17,550 --> 00:58:23,100 But, um, it, it took, it took the integration and 1094 00:58:23,100 --> 00:58:24,990 realizing that I'm actually, I. 1095 00:58:28,035 --> 00:58:31,305 I'm not two different people, you know, it's, I'm not, I'm not a 1096 00:58:31,305 --> 00:58:37,425 worker be, and I'm not like this stunted, you know, um, basic human 1097 00:58:37,425 --> 00:58:38,775 that doesn't know how to do things. 1098 00:58:38,805 --> 00:58:40,545 It's like, I'm just, Chris. 1099 00:58:41,175 --> 00:58:44,925 I'm, I'm a person that knows how to be driven and doesn't 1100 00:58:44,925 --> 00:58:46,305 know how to cook for themselves. 1101 00:58:46,395 --> 00:58:47,505 That's the same person. 1102 00:58:47,805 --> 00:58:47,985 It's 1103 00:58:48,405 --> 00:58:49,125 it for whatever 1104 00:58:49,125 --> 00:58:49,455 reason. 1105 00:58:49,455 --> 00:58:54,045 And I, for years in my head, saw myself in this, this binary, 1106 00:58:54,045 --> 00:58:55,875 dualistic way, and it's like. 1107 00:58:56,625 --> 00:58:59,235 Oh, well, I just need to figure out, I need to look at it from the perspective of 1108 00:58:59,235 --> 00:59:01,425 like, how do I make a better me, you know? 1109 00:59:01,425 --> 00:59:05,055 And, and the me that can, can take care of my space, the me that can 1110 00:59:05,055 --> 00:59:09,225 cook for myself, it maybe you'll have a good effect on my career. 1111 00:59:09,345 --> 00:59:10,125 And it did. 1112 00:59:10,125 --> 00:59:13,935 But it, it kind of brought me back to this place where I was like, it brought 1113 00:59:13,935 --> 00:59:17,115 me back to that six, 7-year-old version of me where I'm just like, you know what? 1114 00:59:17,835 --> 00:59:19,335 I don't care about a lot of this stuff. 1115 00:59:19,425 --> 00:59:21,105 Like, I, I care about like mm-hmm. 1116 00:59:21,345 --> 00:59:25,485 His being I on your happiness thing. 1117 00:59:26,055 --> 00:59:31,065 I had a friend who was in that friend group that lost the two guys and, um, I 1118 00:59:31,065 --> 00:59:36,345 was helping her move to Portland and from Boise and I was driving a U-Haul for, 1119 00:59:36,555 --> 00:59:42,075 and um, this is about a year after it had happened, and, um, I was like learning 1120 00:59:42,075 --> 00:59:44,355 how to fight and mixed martial arts stuff. 1121 00:59:44,415 --> 00:59:45,915 It was a weird time. 1122 00:59:46,035 --> 00:59:48,465 It was enjoyable, but also painful at times. 1123 00:59:48,705 --> 00:59:48,795 Mm-hmm. 1124 00:59:49,035 --> 00:59:51,255 And, um, she's like, Chris, what makes you happy? 1125 00:59:51,495 --> 00:59:53,505 Like, that's the question she asked me. 1126 00:59:54,075 --> 00:59:57,165 And not, are you happy, but what makes you happy? 1127 00:59:57,404 --> 00:59:59,504 And I'm sitting there driving that U-Haul and I'm like, 1128 01:00:01,634 --> 01:00:02,595 son of a bitch. 1129 01:00:03,464 --> 01:00:05,745 I can't answer that question with a single thing. 1130 01:00:06,314 --> 01:00:12,674 And so for, for years after that, which I would say this is another path 1131 01:00:12,674 --> 01:00:15,734 towards Code of the West, is that like I started trying to figure out what 1132 01:00:15,734 --> 01:00:17,654 the, that the answers were to that. 1133 01:00:18,345 --> 01:00:22,305 And as I started accumulating things on that list, they weren't big. 1134 01:00:22,634 --> 01:00:27,524 It was things like sitting in a room and reading a book or sitting in a room 1135 01:00:28,185 --> 01:00:31,904 when it's raining outside, uh, or, uh. 1136 01:00:32,520 --> 01:00:35,310 You know, sitting in the grass on a spring day, you know, it was just, it 1137 01:00:35,310 --> 01:00:40,230 was like things that were achievable, I just didn't make time for, and that was 1138 01:00:40,230 --> 01:00:44,129 also kind of like a blow to me when I started making that list and realizing 1139 01:00:44,129 --> 01:00:45,960 that I'm just not doing these things. 1140 01:00:46,020 --> 01:00:49,830 And I'd always been this advocate of agency where it's like, if you want 1141 01:00:49,830 --> 01:00:53,759 to, if you have a dream and you want to go and build a, you wanna build your, 1142 01:00:53,819 --> 01:00:57,029 your publishing business, or you wanna build a, a concrete business and you're 1143 01:00:57,029 --> 01:01:03,029 not doing it, and you've got two legs and two arms and no excuses, you know, 1144 01:01:03,060 --> 01:01:04,440 you could, you could go and do it. 1145 01:01:04,620 --> 01:01:05,009 I'm real. 1146 01:01:05,040 --> 01:01:09,060 I realized like, man, it's not, I don't even have the ability to 1147 01:01:09,060 --> 01:01:10,620 say that I was making excuses. 1148 01:01:10,710 --> 01:01:17,640 I didn't even stop to think about just structuring something 1149 01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:19,500 good for me into my life. 1150 01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,760 You know, everyone wants to be motivated. 1151 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,760 They're like, you know, I'm super motivated to do something, or I'm 1152 01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:31,740 looking for some external motivator. 1153 01:01:31,740 --> 01:01:34,500 I'm gonna read this book, I'm gonna do whatever it might be. 1154 01:01:35,790 --> 01:01:42,210 And I think your Code of the West kind of hits on a process, which can 1155 01:01:42,210 --> 01:01:47,430 lead to motivation through discipline if we just take those little steps. 1156 01:01:47,430 --> 01:01:49,260 Because motivation is fleeting. 1157 01:01:49,470 --> 01:01:49,560 Mm-hmm. 1158 01:01:49,800 --> 01:01:52,320 Discipline is something that you act, it's tangible, it's 1159 01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:53,670 something that you can control. 1160 01:01:53,670 --> 01:01:55,230 And it's some, yeah, it's great. 1161 01:01:55,230 --> 01:01:56,700 It's something you could work towards. 1162 01:01:56,730 --> 01:02:00,240 And if there's a roadmap in place and you can say, I'm gonna try 1163 01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:02,820 this roadmap a little bit, and you're not making any promises of 1164 01:02:02,820 --> 01:02:04,140 what's at the end of the roadmap. 1165 01:02:04,140 --> 01:02:05,400 Well I call the, you're saying is 1166 01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:05,820 compass. 1167 01:02:05,820 --> 01:02:06,750 It's a compass to me. 1168 01:02:06,750 --> 01:02:12,330 'cause a map is predetermined and uh, you know, that's the thing that the 1169 01:02:12,330 --> 01:02:15,090 gurus and the Instagram pages, I think. 1170 01:02:15,435 --> 01:02:16,605 Cell is the map. 1171 01:02:16,875 --> 01:02:21,825 And that's like, I, I just, it's, I don't, I don't believe that 1172 01:02:21,825 --> 01:02:23,235 everybody's map is the same. 1173 01:02:23,654 --> 01:02:29,595 And so I think it's more like, can I, can I, a compass is not biased. 1174 01:02:29,685 --> 01:02:31,485 A compass just tells you where North is. 1175 01:02:31,875 --> 01:02:35,295 And so it just helps everybody navigate that. 1176 01:02:35,355 --> 01:02:38,745 If you know how to read a map, if you know where you're trying to go, 1177 01:02:38,745 --> 01:02:42,585 the compass helps you get there, but it doesn't tell you where to go. 1178 01:02:42,645 --> 01:02:46,455 And that's where I think that a lot of this sort of modern, uh, hustle 1179 01:02:46,455 --> 01:02:50,265 grind culture, it's about like, you, you where you want to go, where you 1180 01:02:50,265 --> 01:02:53,805 need to go, that's the top of that mountain where you got, you got million 1181 01:02:54,134 --> 01:02:57,585 dollars and you got a hundred thousand Instagram followers and blah, blah, blah. 1182 01:02:57,585 --> 01:02:58,005 And it's like. 1183 01:02:58,890 --> 01:03:04,080 I climbed my mountain in my twenties going into comics, and I, I got 1184 01:03:04,080 --> 01:03:10,290 there and I was like, shit, uh, it's not what I thought it was gonna be. 1185 01:03:10,350 --> 01:03:12,210 And, and I wasn't happy. 1186 01:03:12,210 --> 01:03:15,000 And then I had to step back and be like, so if I've spent the 1187 01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:20,730 past 17 years building my identity around my dream, and I got there, 1188 01:03:20,730 --> 01:03:22,020 I got to my dream and I got it. 1189 01:03:22,110 --> 01:03:28,860 I got my comic, my graphic novel, printed, published one reward, and I'm not happy. 1190 01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:34,080 I can either double down on not being happy, or I can step back and realize, 1191 01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:36,090 or I can step back and find a way. 1192 01:03:36,585 --> 01:03:37,515 To be happy. 1193 01:03:37,845 --> 01:03:40,935 And, um, it's like the sunk cost bias. 1194 01:03:40,965 --> 01:03:45,645 You know, when you've, like, when you're playing poker and you're like all in, 1195 01:03:45,705 --> 01:03:49,425 or almost all in on a shitty hand, and like that river comes and you're like, 1196 01:03:49,515 --> 01:03:52,935 I'm not gonna lose this and I can't bluff this, or I'm not gonna win this 1197 01:03:52,935 --> 01:03:54,555 and I can't bluff my way through this. 1198 01:03:54,945 --> 01:03:58,155 So do you go all in or do you just save what little bit you have? 1199 01:03:58,155 --> 01:04:01,155 And I was like, it was hard, but I was like, I'm gonna have to 1200 01:04:01,155 --> 01:04:04,065 walk away from comics because this is not making me happy. 1201 01:04:04,395 --> 01:04:06,465 It's hard choices like that. 1202 01:04:06,465 --> 01:04:09,975 The map would tell you, double down, keep going, be miserable. 1203 01:04:10,005 --> 01:04:11,475 'cause you're just being weak. 1204 01:04:11,475 --> 01:04:14,505 You're being, you know, who's gonna carry the boats, uh, you know, 1205 01:04:14,505 --> 01:04:15,825 or who's gonna draw the comics. 1206 01:04:16,065 --> 01:04:16,155 Mm-hmm. 1207 01:04:16,515 --> 01:04:19,815 Um, and, and it's just like maybe you, maybe you step back and you 1208 01:04:19,815 --> 01:04:21,105 decide you do wanna keep going. 1209 01:04:21,950 --> 01:04:22,790 That's fine too. 1210 01:04:22,790 --> 01:04:22,880 Mm-hmm. 1211 01:04:23,150 --> 01:04:27,830 But it's like, I just don't, I don't ad adhere to this, this, uh, notion 1212 01:04:27,830 --> 01:04:29,570 that there's one way to do things. 1213 01:04:29,570 --> 01:04:34,730 There's, I, I would say that for me, code of the West is just an encouragement 1214 01:04:34,730 --> 01:04:38,300 and saying that, like, the one thing that I know for sure is don't stop 1215 01:04:38,300 --> 01:04:39,860 looking for the thing that works. 1216 01:04:42,530 --> 01:04:47,060 So there's something that I look at and I try to apply to my life 1217 01:04:47,330 --> 01:04:52,460 faster than I have in the past, but it's to stop, regroup, and choose 1218 01:04:52,460 --> 01:04:54,620 a more desirable course of action. 1219 01:04:54,920 --> 01:04:58,010 Now, that more desirable course of action might just be on that 1220 01:04:58,010 --> 01:04:59,390 same path that you're on before. 1221 01:05:01,700 --> 01:05:04,520 Fail fast, fail fast, fail hard, fail often. 1222 01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:06,380 Do you really? 1223 01:05:06,620 --> 01:05:06,890 Yeah. 1224 01:05:07,395 --> 01:05:08,915 I believe in that a hundred percent. 1225 01:05:11,220 --> 01:05:11,790 I love it. 1226 01:05:12,180 --> 01:05:12,570 Yeah. 1227 01:05:13,020 --> 01:05:14,850 So many people are afraid of failure. 1228 01:05:15,030 --> 01:05:15,510 Why? 1229 01:05:15,870 --> 01:05:19,710 And the more you fail, the more you realize, man, I'm not made outta glass. 1230 01:05:19,740 --> 01:05:19,950 Mm-hmm. 1231 01:05:20,190 --> 01:05:21,720 I can actually get back up again. 1232 01:05:22,110 --> 01:05:24,480 And that's where the strength comes from. 1233 01:05:24,900 --> 01:05:28,380 People will look at their failures and say, well, what are, what 1234 01:05:28,380 --> 01:05:29,580 will other people think of me? 1235 01:05:29,580 --> 01:05:31,440 What will my family and my friends give a shit? 1236 01:05:31,470 --> 01:05:32,880 Or people online. 1237 01:05:33,300 --> 01:05:37,320 Yeah, people you've never, never even met before, but they're gonna have an 1238 01:05:37,320 --> 01:05:38,970 opinion about whatever it might be. 1239 01:05:39,840 --> 01:05:41,880 Fail fast, fail far hard, fail off. 1240 01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:45,600 And the people who are truly successful that I know are the ones who've 1241 01:05:45,600 --> 01:05:49,770 tried all these different options and failed hard, but gotten back up 1242 01:05:49,830 --> 01:05:50,370 well on the thing 1243 01:05:50,370 --> 01:05:50,730 about 1244 01:05:50,730 --> 01:05:52,830 the who cares what people think about you too. 1245 01:05:52,830 --> 01:05:57,930 Anyways, I will say, I mean, so, so I'm in spitting distance of 300,000 people 1246 01:05:57,930 --> 01:06:00,480 on Instagram now, and that's cool. 1247 01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:01,620 It's an interesting data point. 1248 01:06:02,010 --> 01:06:05,820 I can count on two hands how many times I've had someone 1249 01:06:05,880 --> 01:06:08,070 like get real mean or nasty. 1250 01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:13,710 Ever unco to the west in the comments and, huh? 1251 01:06:14,490 --> 01:06:15,089 For real. 1252 01:06:15,120 --> 01:06:19,110 Like, and I mean, I've had, I've had, I've blocked some people, like people, 1253 01:06:19,110 --> 01:06:22,620 if people want to show up and try to stir like the pot, I'm just like, nah, 1254 01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:24,450 like juice ain't worth the squeeze. 1255 01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:25,589 I'm not gonna feed the troll. 1256 01:06:25,589 --> 01:06:32,400 But that's kind of the point, is I don't give any fertile ground in there to, um, 1257 01:06:32,790 --> 01:06:34,950 to let that stuff sort of foster and grow. 1258 01:06:34,950 --> 01:06:40,049 And I think that that's a reflection of my brain, you know, like, 'cause 1259 01:06:40,049 --> 01:06:42,870 what you're talking about with like, you know, failing, what's it look like? 1260 01:06:42,960 --> 01:06:43,980 People's perception of it. 1261 01:06:43,980 --> 01:06:49,680 It's like, well, I, I'm gonna be my own worst critic no matter what. 1262 01:06:49,680 --> 01:06:51,029 I know that about myself. 1263 01:06:52,140 --> 01:06:55,620 So there's not much that anybody else can make me feel worse about. 1264 01:06:55,620 --> 01:06:55,799 Now. 1265 01:06:55,799 --> 01:06:58,830 I, I, I will, I don't like disappointing people. 1266 01:06:58,920 --> 01:06:59,759 I will say that. 1267 01:06:59,850 --> 01:07:02,819 And if, if, if, if a troll shows up, that's just like, I. 1268 01:07:03,225 --> 01:07:05,234 I thought this thing and then it didn't work out. 1269 01:07:05,384 --> 01:07:06,854 And I think, I feel like you lied to me. 1270 01:07:06,915 --> 01:07:09,915 There's a mo or not that that happens that often, but it's like that 1271 01:07:09,915 --> 01:07:12,825 framework will kind of bum me out and be like, did I really do that? 1272 01:07:13,154 --> 01:07:14,174 Did that sucks? 1273 01:07:14,174 --> 01:07:16,365 And if I did do something wrong, then I'll admit to it. 1274 01:07:16,814 --> 01:07:24,345 But, um, it's, it's more like realizing that, um, it's, you 1275 01:07:24,345 --> 01:07:28,274 can't control other people's perceptions of, of you or your path. 1276 01:07:28,694 --> 01:07:33,044 And so social media has this way of, of sort of hyper 1277 01:07:33,584 --> 01:07:36,495 spinning that judgment cycle up. 1278 01:07:36,915 --> 01:07:41,415 But it also like, that's like a big, uh, what do they call those things 1279 01:07:41,415 --> 01:07:45,015 that used to go, we like you spin 'em around and like they make, and like 1280 01:07:45,015 --> 01:07:46,544 they, or they, you could like blow. 1281 01:07:46,549 --> 01:07:46,850 Yeah, yeah. 1282 01:07:46,850 --> 01:07:47,689 Little clackers. 1283 01:07:47,919 --> 01:07:48,209 Yeah. 1284 01:07:48,240 --> 01:07:48,529 Like, 1285 01:07:49,040 --> 01:07:49,330 okay. 1286 01:07:49,330 --> 01:07:49,529 Yeah, 1287 01:07:49,814 --> 01:07:53,055 it's movement, it's sound, it's distracting, but at the end of the 1288 01:07:53,055 --> 01:07:55,004 day it's like, what is that thing? 1289 01:07:55,004 --> 01:07:56,955 We can't even remember what it's called, but like, I mean, it's a perfect 1290 01:07:56,955 --> 01:07:57,915 analogy in a way 'cause it's like. 1291 01:07:58,814 --> 01:07:59,924 What, what is this like? 1292 01:07:59,924 --> 01:08:00,705 I mean, okay, cool. 1293 01:08:00,705 --> 01:08:03,765 Like you're making a lot of noise, but like, does this have a value? 1294 01:08:03,765 --> 01:08:05,115 Does this have a purpose to it? 1295 01:08:05,174 --> 01:08:06,555 Like, 'cause I don't see it. 1296 01:08:06,555 --> 01:08:13,064 And so, um, you know, it, it basically, once you remove, when, when you untether 1297 01:08:13,064 --> 01:08:17,205 yourself, I found this, I don't know how you feel about it, but if you untether 1298 01:08:17,205 --> 01:08:21,854 yourself from these, from the scaffoldings that do show up in the frameworks, 1299 01:08:22,215 --> 01:08:26,385 um, that, that are kind of just like there, you know, the, the like, well 1300 01:08:26,385 --> 01:08:27,644 this is how we've done it for a while. 1301 01:08:27,644 --> 01:08:31,335 So, you know, if you have a, if you have an Instagram account and someone does 1302 01:08:31,335 --> 01:08:35,175 show up and they're an asshole to you, you should be an asshole back or not. 1303 01:08:35,205 --> 01:08:40,425 Maybe, maybe you're just like, ignore it or maybe you go, well, hey, are you okay? 1304 01:08:40,635 --> 01:08:42,495 Like, uh, what's going on? 1305 01:08:42,495 --> 01:08:42,675 Mm-hmm. 1306 01:08:42,974 --> 01:08:45,615 You know, like, or you send 'em a dm, you know, be like, Hey, are you, 1307 01:08:46,125 --> 01:08:50,054 I know I don't know you, but, um, doesn't seem like you're doing okay. 1308 01:08:50,115 --> 01:08:51,165 You know, whatever. 1309 01:08:51,165 --> 01:08:54,915 Like, umhmm, we, we have a prescriptive. 1310 01:08:55,319 --> 01:09:00,389 Sort of like process or flow to these things that, especially with 1311 01:09:00,389 --> 01:09:03,300 the internet, it's like you and I grew up in, in a different way 1312 01:09:03,300 --> 01:09:04,439 before the internet showed up. 1313 01:09:04,469 --> 01:09:07,800 Like, no elbows in the table, don't wear hats inside. 1314 01:09:07,830 --> 01:09:09,479 We're both violating that rule right now. 1315 01:09:09,484 --> 01:09:09,625 Mm-hmm. 1316 01:09:09,870 --> 01:09:11,550 Um, and there we are. 1317 01:09:11,729 --> 01:09:14,429 And well, I got reflection off the top of my head from the lights. 1318 01:09:14,490 --> 01:09:17,939 I just, I'm, I'm look like a crazy person without a hat on right now. 1319 01:09:17,939 --> 01:09:19,349 Like, um, yeah. 1320 01:09:19,380 --> 01:09:23,010 Like, but there's this slow gradual, like we adapted, oops, sorry. 1321 01:09:23,700 --> 01:09:25,649 We adapted to this world. 1322 01:09:26,130 --> 01:09:27,300 We weren't born into it. 1323 01:09:27,300 --> 01:09:27,330 Uhhuh. 1324 01:09:27,870 --> 01:09:32,429 And so it's our responsibility, I feel, and this is part of Code of the West 1325 01:09:32,429 --> 01:09:36,899 is, is like people wanna lament and talk about Gen Z all the time and be like, 1326 01:09:36,899 --> 01:09:38,069 oh, they're just always on their phones. 1327 01:09:38,069 --> 01:09:38,729 They're always doing this. 1328 01:09:38,729 --> 01:09:42,450 It's like, so, so what are we doing to help? 1329 01:09:43,410 --> 01:09:48,089 Them, you know, if, if, if this world that they've inherited from us is 1330 01:09:48,389 --> 01:09:53,250 performative, it's it's judgmental, or they think that it's performative and 1331 01:09:53,250 --> 01:09:57,990 judgmental because the system that they've been born into is this big ass structure 1332 01:09:59,129 --> 01:10:03,089 that is just this thing we're spinning around that doesn't really do anything. 1333 01:10:03,269 --> 01:10:03,599 You know? 1334 01:10:03,599 --> 01:10:08,459 And so, and, and you know, like I, if, if, if all we're doing is 1335 01:10:08,459 --> 01:10:12,209 just saying, oh, you shouldn't put that much stock in these things. 1336 01:10:12,240 --> 01:10:16,679 Well, they're, they're putting all the stock in it because they're not like us. 1337 01:10:16,679 --> 01:10:18,269 They literally don't have 1338 01:10:18,419 --> 01:10:18,509 mm-hmm. 1339 01:10:18,839 --> 01:10:23,610 A frame of reference for what the world existed like before all of this 1340 01:10:23,610 --> 01:10:25,530 existed that we're talking on right now. 1341 01:10:25,530 --> 01:10:27,870 The reason why Code of the West exists, the reason why you have your 1342 01:10:27,870 --> 01:10:30,360 platform, you need to, are you good? 1343 01:10:31,200 --> 01:10:31,799 No, no. 1344 01:10:31,799 --> 01:10:34,919 I just saw a shadow move by and, uh, but I squirrel. 1345 01:10:35,190 --> 01:10:36,570 Um, but, but we're good. 1346 01:10:36,570 --> 01:10:38,730 I remembered I got a text earlier that someone's gonna 1347 01:10:38,730 --> 01:10:39,959 be dropping by the studio here. 1348 01:10:40,380 --> 01:10:44,130 Um, I, uh, I, I guess what I'm saying is, is that like, that's part of this 1349 01:10:44,130 --> 01:10:52,530 whole thing is that, um, there's just a, there is no, like, somehow we got 1350 01:10:52,530 --> 01:10:56,040 this point where all the manners, all the things that we used to grow 1351 01:10:56,040 --> 01:11:00,120 up and learn, um, we just decided not to pass 'em on for some reason. 1352 01:11:00,420 --> 01:11:04,860 Um, you know, like, uh, and I don't know why, because now we have this giant 1353 01:11:04,860 --> 01:11:10,139 megaphone where we can talk to each other and communicate and instead of being like, 1354 01:11:10,139 --> 01:11:15,000 Hey, you know what, it used to be kind of, we, we'll go like old gray mirror sheet. 1355 01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:15,150 What? 1356 01:11:15,150 --> 01:11:18,059 She used to be like, I wish, I wish Canada was like this. 1357 01:11:18,389 --> 01:11:20,010 I wish America was like this. 1358 01:11:20,190 --> 01:11:21,420 It used to be like this. 1359 01:11:21,870 --> 01:11:23,099 Instead, why not? 1360 01:11:23,190 --> 01:11:26,070 Why not go like, Hey, this is what I think it should be. 1361 01:11:26,070 --> 01:11:26,610 What are you doing? 1362 01:11:26,639 --> 01:11:27,630 Yeah, yeah. 1363 01:11:27,630 --> 01:11:30,540 Like, like, or hey, if you're struggling with this. 1364 01:11:30,930 --> 01:11:34,920 This is, this is something that we used to do, or this is something that I do do. 1365 01:11:35,370 --> 01:11:38,775 Um, I'm not saying everybody goes and makes Co of the West or Co of 1366 01:11:38,780 --> 01:11:41,400 the East or coast of the CO to the Southwest or whatever, but it's 1367 01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:47,040 like, I, I do do that version of it, like, you know, or your version. 1368 01:11:47,040 --> 01:11:48,270 It's just like how. 1369 01:11:49,485 --> 01:11:54,765 Like when you're optimizing for attention, you're not really 1370 01:11:54,765 --> 01:11:56,985 optimizing for evolution in any way. 1371 01:11:57,255 --> 01:11:57,645 You know? 1372 01:11:57,645 --> 01:12:02,085 And so you'll see people copying and parroting a lot of these influencers 1373 01:12:02,085 --> 01:12:05,205 about here's how you get millions of dollars and freedom or whatever. 1374 01:12:05,205 --> 01:12:08,685 And it's like, okay, I get, I get what Gen Z's doing shit like this, 1375 01:12:08,685 --> 01:12:10,275 because that's all they're seeing. 1376 01:12:10,305 --> 01:12:14,205 They're not, they don't if they don't have grandpa, I had, you know, I had 1377 01:12:14,205 --> 01:12:18,585 grandpas that were self-made and, you know, in business and I had a grandpa that 1378 01:12:18,585 --> 01:12:23,025 was just old school, putting your head down, go to work, get your retirement. 1379 01:12:23,055 --> 01:12:27,705 You know, I had examples of, uh, of people around me that had different ways 1380 01:12:27,705 --> 01:12:29,325 of going through life and succeeding. 1381 01:12:29,415 --> 01:12:35,175 And, um, if we're not trying to, like, this is something I haven't 1382 01:12:35,175 --> 01:12:38,775 articulated very well, so I, I'll, I'll kinda leave it at this because 1383 01:12:38,775 --> 01:12:44,685 it's an incomplete thought, but like we, we just sort of let the old world. 1384 01:12:45,269 --> 01:12:49,980 Dissipate and then this superstructure supplanted it 1385 01:12:50,009 --> 01:12:51,690 with that, that is the internet. 1386 01:12:51,780 --> 01:12:54,870 And then, and then every, all of us were sitting around going like, 1387 01:12:54,870 --> 01:12:56,490 well, why, why is everything broken? 1388 01:12:56,490 --> 01:12:58,559 Like, why isn't anything working the way that it used to? 1389 01:12:58,559 --> 01:13:02,190 It's like, 'cause we sledge hammered the shit outta everything and just, 1390 01:13:02,339 --> 01:13:05,969 and just brushed and we just broomed the dust of everything that used 1391 01:13:05,969 --> 01:13:08,610 to be off the, the foundation. 1392 01:13:09,030 --> 01:13:12,929 And we just had this Rube Goldberg overly complex device that we 1393 01:13:12,929 --> 01:13:16,620 used to do really simple things, which is just talk to each other. 1394 01:13:19,469 --> 01:13:21,269 And you just hit the nail on the head right there. 1395 01:13:21,389 --> 01:13:22,169 And the. 1396 01:13:22,514 --> 01:13:27,495 The number of people in the younger generation that are so hyper connected 1397 01:13:27,495 --> 01:13:31,035 through social media, through all the different little apps and Snapchats, 1398 01:13:31,094 --> 01:13:35,985 WeChat, whatever the, the different things that they're using, but so 1399 01:13:36,075 --> 01:13:38,655 isolated from each other at the same time. 1400 01:13:39,075 --> 01:13:44,235 And their process that they know for interaction is gonna be based 1401 01:13:44,235 --> 01:13:46,905 on what's been modeled before them and what their friends do. 1402 01:13:46,905 --> 01:13:47,085 And 1403 01:13:49,245 --> 01:13:53,445 I, when you talk about dealing with a hater, somebody comes in with a lot of 1404 01:13:53,445 --> 01:13:58,995 negativity and the natural knee jerk response is to come in and try and cut 1405 01:13:58,995 --> 01:14:00,705 them down or tell them why they're wrong. 1406 01:14:00,750 --> 01:14:01,599 It's not yourself. 1407 01:14:01,599 --> 01:14:04,394 It's not to stop, regroup, and choose or explain yourself. 1408 01:14:04,425 --> 01:14:04,995 No, no, no, no. 1409 01:14:04,995 --> 01:14:05,745 This is what I meant. 1410 01:14:05,745 --> 01:14:07,455 And then you're sucked into this trap of it. 1411 01:14:08,040 --> 01:14:10,110 To be able to shift that completely. 1412 01:14:10,110 --> 01:14:13,349 And one of the easiest ways, you've just mentioned it there, you'll 1413 01:14:13,349 --> 01:14:15,389 just on the side DM a person. 1414 01:14:15,690 --> 01:14:18,690 What I do, so I've, I run a company, silver Core Outdoors, 1415 01:14:18,719 --> 01:14:21,570 we're very, very well reviewed. 1416 01:14:22,049 --> 01:14:25,169 But every once in a while you're gonna run it as somebody who's got an 1417 01:14:25,169 --> 01:14:28,379 issue with something you can't please all of the people all of the time. 1418 01:14:28,500 --> 01:14:30,059 And we might so mess 1419 01:14:30,059 --> 01:14:31,019 up sometimes too. 1420 01:14:32,549 --> 01:14:33,480 Well, and that's it. 1421 01:14:33,480 --> 01:14:34,679 And we're not perfect. 1422 01:14:34,799 --> 01:14:38,129 And there are times that we've made mistakes and we've mistepped and we 1423 01:14:38,129 --> 01:14:39,599 need to hear about it and be able to. 1424 01:14:40,365 --> 01:14:42,435 Uh, to move forward in a positive way. 1425 01:14:42,825 --> 01:14:48,075 But what I do whenever possible is I find that person's phone number and I give them 1426 01:14:48,075 --> 01:14:54,495 a phone call and I'll say, listen, I'm genuinely curious about your perspective. 1427 01:14:54,495 --> 01:14:59,145 If they, if a negative review is left or an angry email or whatever it might 1428 01:14:59,145 --> 01:15:04,095 be, and the staff that work with me, they say, I don't know how you do it. 1429 01:15:04,095 --> 01:15:07,215 I, you know, they were so angry before and now they were singing 1430 01:15:07,215 --> 01:15:08,415 our praises and they love us. 1431 01:15:08,415 --> 01:15:10,245 And I say, well, it's simple. 1432 01:15:10,305 --> 01:15:14,445 I call 'em up and I then I listen and I listen to what they have to say, and 1433 01:15:14,445 --> 01:15:16,395 then I say, okay, so let me understand. 1434 01:15:16,395 --> 01:15:17,295 Here's what I'm hearing. 1435 01:15:17,295 --> 01:15:18,075 Is that correct? 1436 01:15:18,540 --> 01:15:20,580 And they'll say, yes, and I'd like to add this. 1437 01:15:20,580 --> 01:15:20,970 Okay. 1438 01:15:20,970 --> 01:15:23,610 And I write it all down and I say, well, let's see what we 1439 01:15:23,610 --> 01:15:24,660 can do to make this better. 1440 01:15:24,690 --> 01:15:25,020 Right? 1441 01:15:25,020 --> 01:15:28,440 Or sometimes, sometimes there's gonna be situations. 1442 01:15:28,440 --> 01:15:31,080 I remember one girl and I said, look at it. 1443 01:15:31,500 --> 01:15:34,710 I've, I've looked, you've got a pattern of even negative reviews 1444 01:15:34,710 --> 01:15:39,180 for people, and I, I, I sp spent probably more time than I should have. 1445 01:15:39,180 --> 01:15:44,790 Looking at all of this stuff that you have here, um, how is that working out for you? 1446 01:15:45,210 --> 01:15:46,980 It looks like you got fired from this job. 1447 01:15:46,980 --> 01:15:50,820 It looks like you had for, based on these, uh, different personality things 1448 01:15:50,820 --> 01:15:51,900 like how's that working out for you? 1449 01:15:51,930 --> 01:15:53,640 I'm not asking you to take the review down. 1450 01:15:53,645 --> 01:15:54,060 Yeah, yeah. 1451 01:15:54,150 --> 01:15:55,920 I'm genuinely curious. 1452 01:15:55,950 --> 01:15:55,980 Okay. 1453 01:15:56,310 --> 01:15:57,960 And she came right? 1454 01:15:57,960 --> 01:15:59,010 And she came back. 1455 01:15:59,070 --> 01:16:01,650 I said, look, we can't help you in, in what you're looking 1456 01:16:01,650 --> 01:16:03,930 for help on, unfortunately. 1457 01:16:04,140 --> 01:16:05,880 Um, but. 1458 01:16:07,139 --> 01:16:10,170 Doesn't mean that we can't treat you like a human and see what's going on. 1459 01:16:10,170 --> 01:16:15,030 And she came back with the most glowing review afterwards and said, oh, Travis 1460 01:16:15,030 --> 01:16:18,360 gave me a reality check and I really appreciate That wasn't my intention. 1461 01:16:18,360 --> 01:16:18,929 Yeah, right. 1462 01:16:19,349 --> 01:16:19,590 Yeah. 1463 01:16:19,679 --> 01:16:20,519 It wasn't my intention. 1464 01:16:20,519 --> 01:16:23,880 Even though she was, she was quite upset at first, like, holy crow, how do you know 1465 01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:25,349 all these things about where I worked? 1466 01:16:25,349 --> 01:16:29,940 And, and, um, so while you didn't leave a number and you left this whole thing 1467 01:16:29,940 --> 01:16:33,690 anonymously and I had to figure out who you were, so I may have a DC that a little 1468 01:16:33,690 --> 01:16:37,320 further down the road, but had a human connection and a very positive outcome. 1469 01:16:37,320 --> 01:16:42,389 And I find the younger generation is fearful of just picking up the phone 1470 01:16:42,389 --> 01:16:44,580 and saying, Hey, like, like, what's up? 1471 01:16:45,360 --> 01:16:48,000 This is something I've been, I've been thinking about more. 1472 01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:51,780 'cause I, I think that you're inevitably gonna always have that sort of 1473 01:16:51,780 --> 01:16:57,870 generational, um, conflict, you know, as, as you're older, and I shouldn't say 1474 01:16:57,870 --> 01:17:05,009 conflict, you're just, we think that we man, every time, um, we think that, um. 1475 01:17:06,120 --> 01:17:10,290 Every since I was a kid, every older generation has said something 1476 01:17:10,290 --> 01:17:13,590 negative about the generation that comes up behind them or the, the, the 1477 01:17:13,590 --> 01:17:15,030 subsequent generations below them. 1478 01:17:15,480 --> 01:17:18,840 And it's like, okay, the only habit, the only thing that seems to be 1479 01:17:18,840 --> 01:17:21,269 consistent here is that everybody thinks that everybody that's 1480 01:17:21,269 --> 01:17:22,320 younger than them is an idiot. 1481 01:17:22,830 --> 01:17:26,760 And to me, the only thing that's actually consistent is that the 1482 01:17:26,760 --> 01:17:28,170 world's just continually changing. 1483 01:17:28,530 --> 01:17:35,099 And the frameworks that we have, you know, for ourselves, what made sense in 1999 1484 01:17:35,099 --> 01:17:39,030 does not make sense in 2025 in some ways. 1485 01:17:39,360 --> 01:17:43,470 But, but the base frameworks, things that I'm talking about with Code 1486 01:17:43,470 --> 01:17:45,030 of the West all the time, it's like 1487 01:17:47,130 --> 01:17:51,210 in theory they could have, they could operate in 2139, you know, 1488 01:17:51,210 --> 01:17:54,120 because it's, it's just, it's just about, like, it's not about. 1489 01:17:55,505 --> 01:17:58,590 The, the specificity and the nuance of the culture. 1490 01:17:58,590 --> 01:18:02,160 It's, it's, it's about what's it like to be a part of a community? 1491 01:18:02,670 --> 01:18:06,480 And, and there's Mm, and that's why, I mean, it's a, to me, I view it as 1492 01:18:06,480 --> 01:18:08,070 a compass and not a map, you know? 1493 01:18:08,070 --> 01:18:10,170 'cause it's, it's something that's gonna evolve, you know, 1494 01:18:10,470 --> 01:18:13,980 society interaction, how we do it. 1495 01:18:14,700 --> 01:18:18,420 We might just be on, you know, talking through radio signals and just staring 1496 01:18:18,420 --> 01:18:21,510 at each other on a podcast in 30 years because we're just in our, each other. 1497 01:18:21,510 --> 01:18:23,460 Everybody's in their brains about it or something. 1498 01:18:23,460 --> 01:18:24,000 I don't know. 1499 01:18:24,360 --> 01:18:27,780 Um, but I think Neurolink Yeah, exactly. 1500 01:18:27,870 --> 01:18:32,490 But with Gen ZI think that, um, you know, much like we're the first 1501 01:18:32,490 --> 01:18:36,450 generation to have lived in both worlds. 1502 01:18:38,190 --> 01:18:41,310 They're the first generation that's only lived in that one, this 1503 01:18:41,310 --> 01:18:42,870 current one, rather, I should say. 1504 01:18:43,380 --> 01:18:48,090 Mm. And, and the other world existed even though it changed and shifted. 1505 01:18:48,765 --> 01:18:52,695 It existed pretty much for all of humanity prior to this moment. 1506 01:18:53,025 --> 01:18:56,565 You know, it's like, okay, we got the telephone, we got airplanes, 1507 01:18:56,565 --> 01:18:59,565 we've got, you know, the 20, the 20th century is pretty dope. 1508 01:18:59,685 --> 01:19:04,605 But there was, there were, it was more like refined, refined versions 1509 01:19:04,605 --> 01:19:08,235 of communication methods that we'd, you know, been as, you know, 1510 01:19:08,235 --> 01:19:09,885 aspiring towards for a long time. 1511 01:19:10,365 --> 01:19:13,425 Um, nobody, I mean, Jesus Christ. 1512 01:19:13,605 --> 01:19:17,475 I mean, like, we have ai, like we have actual AI that 1513 01:19:17,475 --> 01:19:19,875 can think it's self emergent. 1514 01:19:20,265 --> 01:19:23,235 Like it's not just some novelty of like, find me a recipe. 1515 01:19:23,235 --> 01:19:27,915 It's like you can have a debate with an AI about its sovereignty mm-hmm. 1516 01:19:28,155 --> 01:19:29,235 And its own existence. 1517 01:19:30,150 --> 01:19:33,570 If you told me that when I was nine years old for one, I'd been like, hell yeah. 1518 01:19:33,630 --> 01:19:35,610 Where's the hoverboard and the flying DeLoreans. 1519 01:19:35,700 --> 01:19:41,070 But, um, yeah, but what I'm getting at is, is that, like you, you mentioned 1520 01:19:41,070 --> 01:19:45,361 legacy earlier and, and you have kids, I think you said, and I don't mm-hmm. 1521 01:19:45,385 --> 01:19:45,705 To my knowledge. 1522 01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:45,930 Mm-hmm. 1523 01:19:46,470 --> 01:19:54,900 Um, but um, this idea of legacy, I think goes beyond just, um, I think oftentimes 1524 01:19:54,900 --> 01:20:00,780 we see legacy as wanting some sort of reassurance that to ourselves that when 1525 01:20:00,780 --> 01:20:07,590 we die we feel like we've had some sort of impact or we're leaving some impression 1526 01:20:07,590 --> 01:20:11,010 of our time here behind after we're gone. 1527 01:20:11,610 --> 01:20:19,410 And for me, I think it's more it, like the sun could exp I could 1528 01:20:19,410 --> 01:20:21,510 save, I could go full Armageddon. 1529 01:20:22,035 --> 01:20:26,415 Bruce Willis go up with my oil rigging friends, blow up the asteroid 1530 01:20:26,535 --> 01:20:28,335 that's gonna destroy the earth. 1531 01:20:28,455 --> 01:20:33,495 They could put statues of us in every city, in every country of the world. 1532 01:20:34,245 --> 01:20:35,924 And at some point the sun's gonna explode. 1533 01:20:36,554 --> 01:20:39,495 You know, like regardless of how long those statues stay, like 1534 01:20:39,495 --> 01:20:40,755 at some point it's just gone. 1535 01:20:41,174 --> 01:20:45,405 And so it, you, you could argue that there's more value in time, you know, 1536 01:20:45,405 --> 01:20:47,054 for how long people remember you. 1537 01:20:47,054 --> 01:20:51,495 If you're Gil, you're Gilgamesh or Beowulf, I'd argue that it doesn't matter. 1538 01:20:51,500 --> 01:20:56,115 It, it matters like when, when you are like, I think about like, the greatest 1539 01:20:56,115 --> 01:20:59,535 mystery and exploration that I'll ever have in my life is like death. 1540 01:20:59,655 --> 01:21:02,594 And as macab as this sounds like, I think about death a 1541 01:21:02,594 --> 01:21:04,605 lot, but not in like a dark way. 1542 01:21:04,815 --> 01:21:04,905 Mm-hmm. 1543 01:21:04,905 --> 01:21:06,735 I'm just like, okay. 1544 01:21:06,974 --> 01:21:11,835 Um, it's, you said early on in the podcast, it's inevitable. 1545 01:21:11,924 --> 01:21:14,325 You know, it's the one thing that we all can't avoid. 1546 01:21:14,835 --> 01:21:17,535 So for me, I just wanna know when it happens. 1547 01:21:17,535 --> 01:21:19,514 Like, I let, I didn't leave anything on the mat. 1548 01:21:20,220 --> 01:21:24,150 And the legacy that I wanna leave behind is more of what it means 1549 01:21:24,150 --> 01:21:33,090 to just live well and live as an individual and, and die with not, 1550 01:21:33,450 --> 01:21:35,010 no one's gonna die without regrets. 1551 01:21:35,100 --> 01:21:37,380 But, um, I think it's, 1552 01:21:39,900 --> 01:21:42,870 I think it's important to, to die. 1553 01:21:43,440 --> 01:21:43,920 Well die. 1554 01:21:43,920 --> 01:21:48,600 Well, like I said about Lauren, you know, and helping him like, um, I, 1555 01:21:48,780 --> 01:21:53,820 Michael died alone with a lot of drugs and alcohol sys in his system in a, 1556 01:21:53,820 --> 01:21:55,500 in a switchy yard outside of Portland. 1557 01:21:56,220 --> 01:22:03,690 Lauren died surrounded by family, slowly, albeit, but with a chance 1558 01:22:03,690 --> 01:22:08,160 to talk and, and say goodbye and, and come to terms with it. 1559 01:22:08,250 --> 01:22:11,340 You know, it's like we don't always get to control the way that we die, 1560 01:22:11,490 --> 01:22:16,710 but we can control to a large degree how we live up until that point. 1561 01:22:17,205 --> 01:22:20,535 And, and I think that's the legacy that I wanna leave behind. 1562 01:22:23,625 --> 01:22:27,974 I think you're doing a damn good job of, of putting the work in 1563 01:22:27,974 --> 01:22:30,255 to be able to leave that legacy. 1564 01:22:30,255 --> 01:22:30,705 Trying. 1565 01:22:30,730 --> 01:22:33,915 Where, where do you see the future of CO to the West? 1566 01:22:35,415 --> 01:22:36,014 Um, 1567 01:22:38,594 --> 01:22:45,045 there's stuff that's, um, like, I haven't signed in any NDAs about anything, but 1568 01:22:45,045 --> 01:22:49,724 I, I have a habit of not wanting to count my chickens before they hatch. 1569 01:22:50,235 --> 01:22:51,705 So smart. 1570 01:22:51,795 --> 01:22:56,775 As far, as far as what I can control, you know, I'm trying to carve out time 1571 01:22:56,804 --> 01:23:04,019 to write another book that's not just a, like a sequel to the, I mean, the, 1572 01:23:04,019 --> 01:23:06,075 the manual is basically an epistemology. 1573 01:23:06,075 --> 01:23:07,485 It's just a way of explaining things. 1574 01:23:07,485 --> 01:23:07,575 Mm-hmm. 1575 01:23:07,815 --> 01:23:11,655 That, you know, all the people in my life that we've talked about 1576 01:23:12,344 --> 01:23:15,105 that they sort of intuited, um. 1577 01:23:15,570 --> 01:23:20,550 That they're not gonna have, like, just because Stoicism lines up a lot 1578 01:23:20,550 --> 01:23:22,830 with Code of the West doesn't mean that the people that taught me the 1579 01:23:22,830 --> 01:23:25,050 code knew who Marcus Aurelius was. 1580 01:23:25,110 --> 01:23:25,500 You know? 1581 01:23:25,530 --> 01:23:26,565 So it's like mm-hmm. 1582 01:23:26,650 --> 01:23:30,780 I kind of wanted to sort of structure it, but now I want to have, uh, 1583 01:23:30,810 --> 01:23:35,820 sort of like an actual document that could help young people, especially. 1584 01:23:35,820 --> 01:23:38,580 Like, I keep thinking like the big book of shit. 1585 01:23:38,580 --> 01:23:39,270 You should know. 1586 01:23:39,660 --> 01:23:41,970 Um, you know, that's, that's stuff mm-hmm. 1587 01:23:42,210 --> 01:23:45,330 That I, I, I, I had a hard time with things like how to cook and how to, 1588 01:23:45,810 --> 01:23:49,110 you know, change tires and, you know, manners and different things like that. 1589 01:23:49,110 --> 01:23:52,890 So I really want, I want to, I want to continue to write and publish books 1590 01:23:52,890 --> 01:23:55,080 that have value that can be referenced. 1591 01:23:55,080 --> 01:24:01,800 And then, um, I want to, um, I want to, I want to document other people's 1592 01:24:01,800 --> 01:24:06,960 stories more, you know, uh, like, um, this is where I'm being careful about 1593 01:24:06,960 --> 01:24:09,390 one of those eggs that could hatch. 1594 01:24:09,390 --> 01:24:10,110 Mm-hmm. 1595 01:24:10,111 --> 01:24:10,112 Um. 1596 01:24:11,760 --> 01:24:16,260 I would like to, I'd like to go and talk to people and, and, and meet them 1597 01:24:16,260 --> 01:24:22,110 where they are and work alongside them and, and have the chance to show people 1598 01:24:22,320 --> 01:24:31,110 that things that I talk about are not gone, you know, show, not tell more 1599 01:24:31,350 --> 01:24:32,580 that, that there are people mm-hmm. 1600 01:24:33,000 --> 01:24:39,030 Who still, even though I think that Code of the West aspires to, or I aspire 1601 01:24:39,030 --> 01:24:43,980 with Code of the West to basically make a modern myth, you know, and that 1602 01:24:44,100 --> 01:24:51,810 a myth is not a, an accurate factual play by play storytelling, uh, method. 1603 01:24:51,810 --> 01:24:55,350 It's, it's, it's romanticized. 1604 01:24:55,350 --> 01:24:56,685 It's, it's, it's, it's, it's a lesson. 1605 01:24:56,705 --> 01:24:57,125 Mm-hmm. 1606 01:24:57,205 --> 01:24:58,020 You know, more than anything. 1607 01:24:58,590 --> 01:25:03,960 And, and so I think that the, it's very important to, um, uh. 1608 01:25:05,385 --> 01:25:09,705 Tie it together and, and show that like, yes, it might be a myth, but there's 1609 01:25:09,705 --> 01:25:11,535 still a component of it that is real. 1610 01:25:12,105 --> 01:25:16,245 And I really want to, I, I wanna physically get people together. 1611 01:25:16,335 --> 01:25:20,684 Something I can tell you that I don't feel, I don't have any qualms about saying 1612 01:25:20,684 --> 01:25:25,665 is that I, um, I live in northern Idaho outside of a, a town called Sandpoint. 1613 01:25:26,594 --> 01:25:32,115 And I, and I'm officially on the, um, board of directors now for the PRCA rodeo 1614 01:25:32,115 --> 01:25:34,155 that happens every year in Sandpoint here. 1615 01:25:34,335 --> 01:25:37,695 And as a part of this Cool, it's, it's cool. 1616 01:25:37,695 --> 01:25:38,355 I'm excited. 1617 01:25:39,075 --> 01:25:43,275 And so as a part of the arrangement that I have is, um, it's not, 1618 01:25:43,275 --> 01:25:45,315 we're not rebranding the rodeo. 1619 01:25:45,344 --> 01:25:49,905 It's still the Sandpoint rodeo, but I get to say that this is 1620 01:25:49,934 --> 01:25:51,344 the code of the West Rodeo. 1621 01:25:51,344 --> 01:25:55,065 If you want to come and, and see Code of the West in person or 1622 01:25:55,065 --> 01:26:00,705 experience it in some way, I. August of 2025 is gonna be the first time. 1623 01:26:00,855 --> 01:26:01,275 I don't know. 1624 01:26:01,275 --> 01:26:02,955 Everybody wants to show up in Sandpoint, Idaho. 1625 01:26:02,955 --> 01:26:05,025 It's kind of out of, out of, out of the way. 1626 01:26:05,025 --> 01:26:10,845 But I, I just, I want to start doing things that are more in person, ideally, 1627 01:26:10,845 --> 01:26:14,475 you know, find a way to, to allow people to have their own agency to 1628 01:26:14,475 --> 01:26:18,735 start, you know, go to the West, you know, book, I don't know, book clubs 1629 01:26:18,735 --> 01:26:21,135 or, I mean, I haven't, I haven't had a chance to really build it the way 1630 01:26:21,135 --> 01:26:24,765 I wanted it to yet, but it's like, it just, it just needs to be real. 1631 01:26:24,820 --> 01:26:27,615 It, it can't be theoretical, you know, alone. 1632 01:26:27,825 --> 01:26:31,605 And so there's, that's part of where it's going, figuring that 1633 01:26:31,605 --> 01:26:36,525 stuff out, uh, getting my podcast going again, and, um, and just, 1634 01:26:36,525 --> 01:26:37,845 that's more of just a habit thing. 1635 01:26:37,880 --> 01:26:39,495 I, I got all that stuff worked out. 1636 01:26:39,615 --> 01:26:39,675 Hmm. 1637 01:26:39,675 --> 01:26:41,805 And, um, and then, um, 1638 01:26:43,875 --> 01:26:46,935 there's, it could get pretty interesting by the end of the summer 1639 01:26:46,935 --> 01:26:51,225 here if everything goes the way that it, it's, it's looking, you know? 1640 01:26:51,315 --> 01:26:54,345 And, and so this. 1641 01:26:55,785 --> 01:26:59,595 Uh, I, I don't think there's any harm in saying like, I'm, um, I'm doing 1642 01:26:59,595 --> 01:27:01,635 a collection drop with Huckberry. 1643 01:27:02,175 --> 01:27:07,515 Um, so like, I'm, I'm basically putting something together with them that's gonna 1644 01:27:07,515 --> 01:27:16,065 be a combination of Code of the West, you know, shirts, hats, um, but also tools. 1645 01:27:16,245 --> 01:27:16,425 Cool. 1646 01:27:16,430 --> 01:27:19,185 And, and, and things that are what brands? 1647 01:27:19,215 --> 01:27:22,005 I, I'll be a little, I will wait to say the brands just because we haven't 1648 01:27:22,005 --> 01:27:25,815 assigned anything or anything, but like, things like knives, you know, 1649 01:27:26,625 --> 01:27:32,895 like, uh, jack, like jack shirt, I, I gotta be careful, but like, but 1650 01:27:32,895 --> 01:27:34,425 like, things that are useful Sure. 1651 01:27:34,635 --> 01:27:36,585 To people if you're from the northwest, if you're from the 1652 01:27:36,585 --> 01:27:39,825 bush, you know, like, um, and um. 1653 01:27:40,530 --> 01:27:44,969 Yeah, like that, that it's not just an affectation, it's like it's, it's it's 1654 01:27:45,030 --> 01:27:48,570 shit kicker gear that you could just throw in the back of a Subaru if you're 1655 01:27:49,230 --> 01:27:52,589 somebody who's a white collar person who grew up in Alberta or grew up in 1656 01:27:52,589 --> 01:27:54,839 Montana but is doing something new now. 1657 01:27:55,139 --> 01:27:59,519 Or it could also just be the jacket that you wear, or the gloves that you use, or 1658 01:27:59,519 --> 01:28:03,330 the tool that you use if you are still, you know, in the shit, so to speak. 1659 01:28:03,960 --> 01:28:06,990 And then, um, I'm doing some stuff with Boot Barn as well. 1660 01:28:07,110 --> 01:28:08,910 Um, that's incremental. 1661 01:28:08,910 --> 01:28:10,559 There's a couple things that we're doing there. 1662 01:28:10,650 --> 01:28:16,799 Um, and, and that it's, I'm, it's more of like, I didn't look 1663 01:28:16,799 --> 01:28:18,360 for that, but that happened. 1664 01:28:18,780 --> 01:28:25,860 And, and so to me it's, it's a way of hopefully just, um, extending the 1665 01:28:25,860 --> 01:28:30,269 opportunity to help people ultimately. 1666 01:28:31,065 --> 01:28:33,105 I like, I like that a lot. 1667 01:28:33,165 --> 01:28:36,675 And also depending when the dates are in August, I'll go to the, 1668 01:28:36,675 --> 01:28:38,565 uh, I'll be there at the rodeo. 1669 01:28:38,745 --> 01:28:39,285 That'd be cool. 1670 01:28:39,345 --> 01:28:43,485 It's, it's like August 1st, I think that, yeah. 1671 01:28:43,515 --> 01:28:43,905 Okay. 1672 01:28:45,315 --> 01:28:49,095 My daughter's going off to university, so we'd be juggling a few things there. 1673 01:28:49,095 --> 01:28:52,545 I don't know what's, uh, when the official head in time is, I should 1674 01:28:52,545 --> 01:28:53,565 probably look at the calendar. 1675 01:28:53,565 --> 01:28:54,050 How far north are you? 1676 01:28:54,050 --> 01:28:56,565 Like where, how far are you from the border? 1677 01:28:56,955 --> 01:28:57,135 I'm. 1678 01:28:58,350 --> 01:28:59,130 Pretty close. 1679 01:28:59,160 --> 01:29:05,100 I mean, we're, I'm in Ladner, I mean, the border's 15 minutes away from me. 1680 01:29:05,190 --> 01:29:09,690 And I drove down, I visited a buddy in Boise, uh, Brad Brooks. 1681 01:29:09,690 --> 01:29:11,100 He owns a company called Ar Gall. 1682 01:29:11,520 --> 01:29:15,510 And, um, Zach Hansen, he's written a book called Turning Ferrell. 1683 01:29:15,780 --> 01:29:19,410 Actually, Zach, he lent me this, uh, Kerra Rod, and I'd 1684 01:29:19,410 --> 01:29:20,790 never used one of them before. 1685 01:29:20,790 --> 01:29:24,180 And coming from a fly fishing background, everyone kind of 1686 01:29:24,180 --> 01:29:25,320 turns their nose up at 'em. 1687 01:29:25,320 --> 01:29:29,010 But, uh, I, I had the, probably one of the best fishing days 1688 01:29:29,010 --> 01:29:29,970 of my life with this thing. 1689 01:29:29,970 --> 01:29:31,140 A little compact little. 1690 01:29:31,260 --> 01:29:31,650 That's amazing. 1691 01:29:31,650 --> 01:29:36,240 I felt like, uh, yeah, I felt like Hemingway fishing in the Saw two and let 1692 01:29:36,240 --> 01:29:41,760 us stay in his, um, his cabin in, uh, Atlanta, which is, uh, Atlanta, Idaho. 1693 01:29:41,760 --> 01:29:41,880 That's 1694 01:29:42,210 --> 01:29:42,300 cool. 1695 01:29:42,300 --> 01:29:45,450 So do you go through Bonners Ferry then, or how do you come down South? 1696 01:29:47,195 --> 01:29:48,330 Yeah, that's a good question. 1697 01:29:48,450 --> 01:29:48,929 I don't know. 1698 01:29:48,990 --> 01:29:52,830 I, um, I sat in the passenger seat and my wife drove, 'cause I hate driving. 1699 01:29:52,860 --> 01:29:57,990 And, uh, you ask your wife and, and I, I put the thing on the old map Quest 1700 01:29:58,049 --> 01:30:02,969 on, uh, put it on the Google Maps and, uh, uh, and we just camped along 1701 01:30:02,969 --> 01:30:06,629 the way and fished and, um, um, yeah. 1702 01:30:06,990 --> 01:30:07,469 Very cool. 1703 01:30:07,469 --> 01:30:10,139 What about, um, Zane, Zane Gray? 1704 01:30:10,259 --> 01:30:11,820 Uh, you're familiar with him? 1705 01:30:12,480 --> 01:30:12,684 Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. 1706 01:30:12,690 --> 01:30:15,419 So he's got a writers of the Purple Sage and then obviously 1707 01:30:15,419 --> 01:30:16,530 the book, the Code of the West. 1708 01:30:18,599 --> 01:30:20,429 And he had one quote. 1709 01:30:20,759 --> 01:30:23,849 So very different, highly influential in his own right. 1710 01:30:23,849 --> 01:30:23,940 Mm-hmm. 1711 01:30:24,299 --> 01:30:32,190 In romanticizing and creating, uh, the, the western culture that so 1712 01:30:32,190 --> 01:30:34,200 many movies have been based off of. 1713 01:30:34,230 --> 01:30:38,339 Uh, you've gone and codified a lot of these things that, uh, that he never 1714 01:30:38,339 --> 01:30:42,929 did that, um, kind of make up those points, which is, which is really cool. 1715 01:30:42,929 --> 01:30:44,940 But he had a quote says, say. 1716 01:30:45,540 --> 01:30:49,350 You can't tell what a man's made of by looking at him, you gotta go away. 1717 01:30:49,470 --> 01:30:55,980 What he does, and that, I think, encapsulates what you're doing. 1718 01:30:58,110 --> 01:30:59,070 I appreciate that. 1719 01:30:59,970 --> 01:31:03,840 There's a lot of stuff, a lot of quotes, and I, I used to do 1720 01:31:03,840 --> 01:31:06,870 a lot of pull, a lot of quotes outta Louis Lamore and Zane Gray. 1721 01:31:06,870 --> 01:31:11,040 And it's not that I, it's not that I don't find any value in it, it's just 1722 01:31:11,040 --> 01:31:14,220 that I, um, or not that I don't find any value in it anymore, it's just 1723 01:31:14,220 --> 01:31:17,550 I've realized that I've got more to say than can be just reflected off 1724 01:31:17,550 --> 01:31:19,770 those quotes in, in, in many cases. 1725 01:31:19,770 --> 01:31:19,890 Mm-hmm. 1726 01:31:19,965 --> 01:31:20,345 But, um, 1727 01:31:22,800 --> 01:31:24,450 I would agree with Zane Gray. 1728 01:31:24,660 --> 01:31:27,000 Uh, I, I mean it's 1729 01:31:30,570 --> 01:31:34,440 in storytelling, they say show don't tell and which just seems counterintuitive, 1730 01:31:34,440 --> 01:31:38,430 especially if you're working within words, uh, a lot of times because 1731 01:31:39,060 --> 01:31:42,120 you have to tell to, so to speak. 1732 01:31:42,480 --> 01:31:44,130 But there's, that's sort of the little. 1733 01:31:44,519 --> 01:31:49,080 Tricks of the trade is learning how to paint a picture with, um, with 1734 01:31:49,080 --> 01:31:54,599 words as opposed to, um, trying to render a photograph with words. 1735 01:31:55,019 --> 01:32:00,660 And, and so, and that's, you know, after having spent a lot of time learning how 1736 01:32:00,660 --> 01:32:04,650 to draw, you know, and illustrate more than, more than actually writing prose. 1737 01:32:05,309 --> 01:32:08,040 Um, even though I wrote a lot since I was little, it just wasn't 1738 01:32:08,040 --> 01:32:09,540 the number one thing that I did. 1739 01:32:09,960 --> 01:32:15,330 But I think that, it's funny that you brought that quote up 'cause that's really 1740 01:32:15,330 --> 01:32:20,460 part of that, the reason why I want to do the thing that I'm being a little 1741 01:32:20,460 --> 01:32:26,220 dodgy about, uh, as far as going and working alongside people, um, and, and, 1742 01:32:26,430 --> 01:32:29,550 and showing them that this still exists. 1743 01:32:30,269 --> 01:32:31,559 I also, as a part of. 1744 01:32:32,535 --> 01:32:37,785 Wanting to do that would be putting myself in situations where, by working 1745 01:32:37,785 --> 01:32:42,495 alongside them, I'm learning things that I haven't done before and I'm doing 1746 01:32:42,495 --> 01:32:46,394 things that are not just new to me, but they're, they'd be uncomfortable even 1747 01:32:46,394 --> 01:32:47,775 to somebody who knew how to do them. 1748 01:32:48,255 --> 01:32:54,105 And, and so I'm hoping that because there's talk is cheap, it doesn't 1749 01:32:54,105 --> 01:32:58,605 matter how good I've gotten at, at articulating things in Code of the 1750 01:32:58,605 --> 01:33:01,365 West, you know that people believe them. 1751 01:33:01,365 --> 01:33:05,745 And I'm grateful that most people believe what I'm saying, that I 1752 01:33:05,745 --> 01:33:07,394 know, that I know to be the truth. 1753 01:33:08,684 --> 01:33:12,735 But there's just a certain level, especially as we're talking about like Gen 1754 01:33:12,735 --> 01:33:17,775 Z and the other generations, like, I'm not saying that I wanna be that guy, it's just 1755 01:33:17,775 --> 01:33:21,945 that I know, that I know about myself. 1756 01:33:22,065 --> 01:33:26,370 That if, if you put a camera on me and you asked me to do something that 1757 01:33:26,370 --> 01:33:29,955 was really hard, I wouldn't pretend. 1758 01:33:31,170 --> 01:33:34,980 That it, well, I wouldn't pretend at all, I guess is what I'm saying. 1759 01:33:35,250 --> 01:33:37,530 And mm-hmm. 1760 01:33:37,531 --> 01:33:40,500 And I, I have no problem with failing like we talked about earlier. 1761 01:33:40,559 --> 01:33:45,870 And if no one else will be willing to fail in front of literally 1762 01:33:45,870 --> 01:33:47,670 everybody, then I'll do it. 1763 01:33:48,059 --> 01:33:52,860 And that's kind of, in a strange way, what I'm hoping to be able to do, just because 1764 01:33:52,894 --> 01:33:56,880 I, I believe in that quote so much that you referenced with Z from Zane Gray. 1765 01:33:59,849 --> 01:34:04,514 Well, I think, uh, I think there's a, I'll show you, I, 1766 01:34:04,519 --> 01:34:05,670 I do a little bit of research. 1767 01:34:05,670 --> 01:34:08,400 I got a six pages printed off here of things that I didn't even get 1768 01:34:08,400 --> 01:34:10,740 to, uh, talk to you about, just because we can do again, you want 1769 01:34:11,355 --> 01:34:11,474 point, 1770 01:34:13,075 --> 01:34:17,910 I, I think we're gonna have to, and maybe, maybe I bring my kid down if, and do 1771 01:34:17,910 --> 01:34:19,500 something at the, uh, the rodeo there. 1772 01:34:19,500 --> 01:34:21,300 That could be kind of fun too, if, uh, yeah. 1773 01:34:21,300 --> 01:34:24,059 That would be, but yeah. 1774 01:34:24,090 --> 01:34:27,150 Um, is there anything that we haven't talked about that 1775 01:34:27,150 --> 01:34:28,230 we should be talking about? 1776 01:34:29,760 --> 01:34:34,590 You know, like you, you asked me sort of a similar question before we started, uh, 1777 01:34:34,830 --> 01:34:42,990 and I think the, I, I just like talking to people and, and not having, uh, an agenda. 1778 01:34:43,050 --> 01:34:47,550 So there's always things we could talk about, but I don't think that 1779 01:34:47,550 --> 01:34:50,340 there's anything that we need to talk about, if that makes sense. 1780 01:34:51,960 --> 01:34:52,980 Totally makes sense. 1781 01:34:53,310 --> 01:34:56,310 What, what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna have links in the description. 1782 01:34:56,310 --> 01:35:01,200 I'll have, uh, links over to your social media to what you're doing, 1783 01:35:01,200 --> 01:35:06,540 where people can find you, and, um, maybe we'll call it a wrap there. 1784 01:35:06,545 --> 01:35:06,625 Yeah. 1785 01:35:06,625 --> 01:35:06,825 Okay. 1786 01:35:06,905 --> 01:35:07,145 Chris? 1787 01:35:07,175 --> 01:35:07,465 Yeah. 1788 01:35:07,465 --> 01:35:08,665 For, for the time being. 1789 01:35:10,445 --> 01:35:11,520 For for the time being. 1790 01:35:11,520 --> 01:35:11,970 Yes. 1791 01:35:11,970 --> 01:35:14,730 And thank you so much for being on the Silver Corp podcast. 1792 01:35:14,790 --> 01:35:15,480 Thanks for having me. 1793 01:35:15,480 --> 01:35:16,800 I feel. 1794 01:35:17,280 --> 01:35:18,929 I feel lighter. 1795 01:35:18,990 --> 01:35:23,730 I feel I, I like, I love, I love the feeling of being able to sit down and you 1796 01:35:23,730 --> 01:35:27,089 ride that high afterwards just saying, I just had an amazing conversation. 1797 01:35:27,360 --> 01:35:27,570 Thank you. 1798 01:35:27,570 --> 01:35:28,110 Yeah, likewise. 1799 01:35:28,110 --> 01:35:28,740 I appreciate it. 1800 01:35:28,740 --> 01:35:29,219 Thank you.