1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:03,023 (bright music) 2 00:00:05,520 --> 00:00:07,110 - This is Lab Medicine Rounds, 3 00:00:07,110 --> 00:00:09,030 a curated podcast for physicians, 4 00:00:09,030 --> 00:00:11,400 laboratory professionals, and students. 5 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:14,160 I'm your host, Justin Kreuter, the Bow Tie Bandit of Blood, 6 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:17,700 a transfusion medicine pathologist at Mayo Clinic. 7 00:00:17,700 --> 00:00:20,280 Today we're rounding with Jennifer Storlie, 8 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,550 operations manager of inpatient laboratory services 9 00:00:23,550 --> 00:00:25,860 at Mayo Clinic here in Rochester, Minnesota, 10 00:00:25,860 --> 00:00:27,030 to talk about a topic 11 00:00:27,030 --> 00:00:29,070 that's currently on the front of mind 12 00:00:29,070 --> 00:00:32,010 for many healthcare organizations. 13 00:00:32,010 --> 00:00:35,070 We'll be talking about workforce stability 14 00:00:35,070 --> 00:00:37,710 and strategies for retention. 15 00:00:37,710 --> 00:00:39,690 Thanks for joining us today, Jennifer. 16 00:00:39,690 --> 00:00:41,590 - Yeah, thank you for having me today. 17 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:46,650 - So let's kinda start off with, why is workforce stability 18 00:00:46,650 --> 00:00:50,433 such an important topic for healthcare right now? 19 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:55,110 - Well I think, any level of turnover 20 00:00:55,110 --> 00:00:58,290 creates an opportunity for an open position. 21 00:00:58,290 --> 00:01:00,989 And dependent upon your staffing levels, 22 00:01:00,989 --> 00:01:03,630 you may be able to absorb that open position 23 00:01:03,630 --> 00:01:05,913 for the time being until that can be filled. 24 00:01:06,851 --> 00:01:09,630 But eventually for many, if you have too many open positions 25 00:01:09,630 --> 00:01:12,003 that can cause this imbalance in the work unit. 26 00:01:13,171 --> 00:01:14,790 So, now you've created a hardship, 27 00:01:14,790 --> 00:01:16,950 and just to be able to provide 28 00:01:16,950 --> 00:01:21,810 that quality of healthcare for patients becomes jeopardized. 29 00:01:21,810 --> 00:01:24,240 So, then if we look at turnover rates 30 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:26,250 and not having the staffing levels needed 31 00:01:26,250 --> 00:01:27,720 to run a work unit, 32 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,843 there's also such a large cost associated with it. 33 00:01:31,770 --> 00:01:36,090 And so, beyond the cost, then you're asking staff 34 00:01:36,090 --> 00:01:39,510 to pick up additional hours, over-time. 35 00:01:39,510 --> 00:01:42,420 There may be reduced opportunity for PTO. 36 00:01:42,420 --> 00:01:44,910 Now you're creating burnout. 37 00:01:44,910 --> 00:01:47,610 You've got unsatisfied staff 38 00:01:47,610 --> 00:01:51,330 because of the workload that they're having to maintain. 39 00:01:51,330 --> 00:01:56,297 And it just becomes this continuous need that we have. 40 00:01:56,297 --> 00:01:58,290 And when you have a continuous turnover 41 00:01:58,290 --> 00:02:00,540 or needs for hiring of new staff, 42 00:02:00,540 --> 00:02:03,570 there's also this great need for training. 43 00:02:03,570 --> 00:02:05,913 Bringing in new staff, so now you're training. 44 00:02:09,457 --> 00:02:11,619 And when we're training staff, 45 00:02:11,619 --> 00:02:13,163 we know that we have lower productivity. 46 00:02:14,779 --> 00:02:17,820 And losing staff that have that experience level, 47 00:02:17,820 --> 00:02:19,470 it's just, it's unfortunate. 48 00:02:19,470 --> 00:02:22,110 They've got a certain skill level that when it's lost, 49 00:02:22,110 --> 00:02:25,533 it takes a while to be able to get that from a new hire. 50 00:02:28,139 --> 00:02:31,620 So, then we're growing those new hires to gain the skills 51 00:02:31,620 --> 00:02:33,303 and the knowledge that's needed. 52 00:02:35,619 --> 00:02:37,500 And I think we're constantly adjusting 53 00:02:37,500 --> 00:02:40,293 to that inefficiency as well with the productivity. 54 00:02:41,131 --> 00:02:44,340 And sometimes, they'll say, I'm in phlebotomy, 55 00:02:44,340 --> 00:02:47,709 so it'll be like, well turnaround times 56 00:02:47,709 --> 00:02:48,720 for testing what's going on. 57 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:49,680 And it's like, well, 58 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:51,900 collections were taking a little bit longer. 59 00:02:51,900 --> 00:02:54,240 We've got newer staff in certain units, 60 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,390 so there might be additional errors 61 00:02:57,390 --> 00:02:59,760 or just asking a lot of questions. 62 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:01,170 You're usually taking two people 63 00:03:01,170 --> 00:03:03,720 off the floor to train that one person. 64 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:05,460 So there's just a lot with it. 65 00:03:05,460 --> 00:03:07,470 If we had that stability, we wouldn't have to 66 00:03:07,470 --> 00:03:10,170 continuously be looking at hiring. 67 00:03:10,170 --> 00:03:12,990 And I think hiring is not all bad when you're bringing 68 00:03:12,990 --> 00:03:15,960 on somebody new to a work unit unit. 69 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:17,640 But when you have an influx of it, 70 00:03:17,640 --> 00:03:19,260 when you have that large turnover, 71 00:03:19,260 --> 00:03:21,668 then it can cause some other issues. 72 00:03:21,668 --> 00:03:22,501 - Wow. 73 00:03:22,501 --> 00:03:24,840 I think you shot me right through the heart 74 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:28,920 when you were talking about the delays in lab draw 75 00:03:28,920 --> 00:03:31,211 as a transfusion medicine doc. 76 00:03:31,211 --> 00:03:35,190 There are certain patients that I absolutely am looking for 77 00:03:35,190 --> 00:03:38,696 kind of a post transfusion platelet count 78 00:03:38,696 --> 00:03:42,210 within one hour of transfusion. 79 00:03:42,210 --> 00:03:45,389 But I think as you were kind of talking about though, 80 00:03:45,389 --> 00:03:47,059 why is this important? 81 00:03:47,059 --> 00:03:49,349 I had this vision of dominoes 82 00:03:49,349 --> 00:03:53,040 as you were talking about how this kind of starts 83 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:57,480 as one thing really cascades into 84 00:03:57,480 --> 00:04:01,890 so many other domains that we know are important. 85 00:04:01,890 --> 00:04:06,210 Like, what is the wellbeing of our workforce? 86 00:04:06,210 --> 00:04:09,420 And I can only imagine what it's like trying to 87 00:04:09,420 --> 00:04:13,410 train a new employee and welcome them into your culture 88 00:04:13,410 --> 00:04:17,523 if the work unit is really strapped with work. 89 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:20,200 - Yeah, I mean, so we talk about 90 00:04:21,259 --> 00:04:23,829 positive onboarding experiences for staff 91 00:04:23,829 --> 00:04:26,000 and we really wanna give that to those new hires. 92 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,320 But you're right, when you're just struggling to 93 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:30,690 collect the next order or get to the next patient 94 00:04:30,690 --> 00:04:32,850 to meet the needs of what you're expected, 95 00:04:32,850 --> 00:04:34,960 that can be a challenge. 96 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:37,170 So we're always trying to balance 97 00:04:37,170 --> 00:04:39,720 which need is greater at the moment, 98 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,420 and it's just a continuous balance. 99 00:04:42,420 --> 00:04:44,130 It definitely is. 100 00:04:44,130 --> 00:04:46,677 - Let's dive into that a little bit. 101 00:04:46,677 --> 00:04:50,076 So what are, let's kind of get our hands around 102 00:04:50,076 --> 00:04:53,370 what are a couple of those current kind of challenges? 103 00:04:53,370 --> 00:04:56,528 Maybe a few with hiring and then a few 104 00:04:56,528 --> 00:04:59,643 with retaining some of these quality employees. 105 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:02,913 - Well, we're talking about healthcare. 106 00:05:04,128 --> 00:05:06,630 So we've got a skill level that's oftentimes needed. 107 00:05:06,630 --> 00:05:09,029 So it's not just the skill level, 108 00:05:09,029 --> 00:05:10,140 but then we've also got education. 109 00:05:10,140 --> 00:05:12,300 You're not just hiring anybody off of the street, 110 00:05:12,300 --> 00:05:15,660 for the most part, to fill healthcare positions. 111 00:05:15,660 --> 00:05:18,813 So that can be a challenge when you're out there recruiting. 112 00:05:20,697 --> 00:05:23,947 And to be honest, it's a very competitive market right now. 113 00:05:25,077 --> 00:05:26,160 I think that we can all agree 114 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:28,473 that as we've gone about our day-to-day lives, 115 00:05:29,379 --> 00:05:31,650 we see it in restaurants and retail shops and businesses. 116 00:05:31,650 --> 00:05:33,870 They're all struggling to have enough employees 117 00:05:33,870 --> 00:05:37,260 to be able to just run the day-to-day business, 118 00:05:37,260 --> 00:05:39,033 just to keep operations going. 119 00:05:40,498 --> 00:05:42,898 So we need to look into how do we fit into that? 120 00:05:44,100 --> 00:05:45,510 Are we competitive? 121 00:05:45,510 --> 00:05:48,330 Do we have the right pay and benefits? 122 00:05:48,330 --> 00:05:52,050 And are we meeting the needs and expectations 123 00:05:52,050 --> 00:05:54,963 of what potential new hires are looking for? 124 00:05:56,098 --> 00:05:58,560 And I feel like we're seeing a shift as well 125 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:01,920 where employees are saying, what can the company do for me 126 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:04,560 versus what can I do for the company? 127 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:05,880 So there's a little bit of different 128 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:07,380 of a shift in the culture too 129 00:06:07,380 --> 00:06:10,290 of what people are asking for in a job and a career. 130 00:06:10,290 --> 00:06:13,620 And perhaps what might have been a good benefit 131 00:06:13,620 --> 00:06:16,710 a couple years ago might not be so relevant today. 132 00:06:16,710 --> 00:06:18,780 And I think it's just constantly adjusting 133 00:06:18,780 --> 00:06:21,123 to what is it that people are looking for. 134 00:06:24,630 --> 00:06:27,380 I think we're looking for, we're healthcare, 135 00:06:27,380 --> 00:06:30,270 so we want people who are helpful 136 00:06:30,270 --> 00:06:34,440 and to fit into our rich ties that we speak of. 137 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:38,400 But a lot of companies are wanting good quality 138 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:40,500 candidates to come in through their doors. 139 00:06:41,397 --> 00:06:43,317 So there's that competition 140 00:06:43,317 --> 00:06:46,830 that we're continuously needing to vile for. 141 00:06:46,830 --> 00:06:51,540 And I think being present in social media 142 00:06:51,540 --> 00:06:55,056 in the appropriate context, what does that look like? 143 00:06:55,056 --> 00:06:57,090 So that we're connecting with the right audience 144 00:06:58,035 --> 00:07:00,180 and that we're creating pathways for job opportunities 145 00:07:00,180 --> 00:07:03,903 that are attainable is gonna be really important as well. 146 00:07:04,917 --> 00:07:06,420 And as we reach out, 147 00:07:06,420 --> 00:07:09,120 making sure that we're intentional with recruiting. 148 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:11,550 Are we recruiting a diverse workforce 149 00:07:11,550 --> 00:07:14,790 or are we missing an opportunity there as well? 150 00:07:14,790 --> 00:07:18,627 So as we look at even our current staff 151 00:07:18,627 --> 00:07:21,480 and our new hires, I think it's really important 152 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:25,140 that we understand, is there a level of engagement? 153 00:07:25,140 --> 00:07:27,150 Do employees feel empowered? 154 00:07:27,150 --> 00:07:28,920 Do they feel like they've found 155 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:32,913 that good career fit that's meeting their expectations? 156 00:07:34,050 --> 00:07:38,526 I think there was a mindset when you work for Mayo, 157 00:07:38,526 --> 00:07:40,380 and it's like, now it's like, 158 00:07:40,380 --> 00:07:42,390 but I still wanna be happy in my job. 159 00:07:42,390 --> 00:07:43,650 I want it to be a good fit. 160 00:07:43,650 --> 00:07:46,890 I want it to fulfill my day. 161 00:07:46,890 --> 00:07:48,960 So I think there's a lot more of looking at that 162 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:51,993 and not just that you work for a certain company. 163 00:07:52,830 --> 00:07:55,560 - I'm curious, I apologize to interrupt you. 164 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:56,393 - [Jennifer] Yeah. 165 00:07:56,393 --> 00:08:01,100 - There, I'm curious about, as you were talking about 166 00:08:03,300 --> 00:08:08,300 what a company perk, what a perk of the job was in the past 167 00:08:08,490 --> 00:08:10,920 may not be relevant now. 168 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:14,590 And I'm kind of curious about, what are your thoughts 169 00:08:15,568 --> 00:08:18,060 about how do you kind of keep your fingers 170 00:08:18,060 --> 00:08:21,390 on the pulse of what really are 171 00:08:21,390 --> 00:08:26,390 the current needs and interests of the workforce? 172 00:08:27,780 --> 00:08:29,973 What's the way to, 173 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:35,283 I guess to be a constantly evolving organization? 174 00:08:36,300 --> 00:08:39,390 - Well, I think that you really need to be able to listen 175 00:08:39,390 --> 00:08:41,520 to what your employees are saying. 176 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:43,860 Pick up on those key indicators when they talk. 177 00:08:43,860 --> 00:08:46,680 We do have the benefit of having a Sirota survey 178 00:08:46,680 --> 00:08:48,750 where we do get feedback, 179 00:08:48,750 --> 00:08:51,240 but also just including your employees 180 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:52,500 on those day-to-day decisions 181 00:08:52,500 --> 00:08:55,200 so that you can hear what they're having to say. 182 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:56,850 They're the ones out there doing the work. 183 00:08:56,850 --> 00:09:00,270 How important is it to bring back to the work unit 184 00:09:00,270 --> 00:09:02,790 and share with their managers so that you can constantly 185 00:09:02,790 --> 00:09:05,073 even evolve what's needed in the team? 186 00:09:05,940 --> 00:09:08,520 Making sure you're keeping that communication open. 187 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:10,680 And then are we truly being flexible? 188 00:09:10,680 --> 00:09:12,090 We talk about this flexibility 189 00:09:12,090 --> 00:09:14,460 and then having this work-life balance, 190 00:09:14,460 --> 00:09:15,900 but what does that look like? 191 00:09:15,900 --> 00:09:18,090 And in healthcare, we can't just send the patients home 192 00:09:18,090 --> 00:09:19,620 because it's a holiday or a weekend 193 00:09:19,620 --> 00:09:21,450 or we just don't have staffing today. 194 00:09:21,450 --> 00:09:23,700 We're not like a restaurant where we can tweak our hours 195 00:09:23,700 --> 00:09:25,650 and we're not gonna open at this time. 196 00:09:25,650 --> 00:09:28,170 So we have to have staffing around the clock. 197 00:09:28,170 --> 00:09:30,063 And how do we meet those needs? 198 00:09:31,110 --> 00:09:32,550 It's really important to listen 199 00:09:32,550 --> 00:09:36,749 to what people need as they have daycare struggle issues 200 00:09:36,749 --> 00:09:38,100 and they're going to school. 201 00:09:38,100 --> 00:09:40,860 And so there's all these family dynamics 202 00:09:40,860 --> 00:09:43,590 and personal dynamics that we're just, you really, 203 00:09:43,590 --> 00:09:45,480 it's really important that you're just listening 204 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:48,603 to your employees and making sure that the best, 205 00:09:49,470 --> 00:09:52,320 that the way you can to best meet the needs of the patient 206 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,170 matches what the best needs of the employees are. 207 00:09:55,170 --> 00:09:56,850 And I think that's what you just constantly. 208 00:09:56,850 --> 00:09:58,659 You can't be like, well this is set in stone, 209 00:09:58,659 --> 00:10:00,570 this is gonna be 2023's plan. 210 00:10:00,570 --> 00:10:02,610 It's continuous involving. 211 00:10:02,610 --> 00:10:05,130 - And I imagine that is this, 212 00:10:05,130 --> 00:10:07,320 I'm kind of curious for how does this look like 213 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,450 so our audience can kind of get a little bit more 214 00:10:11,358 --> 00:10:12,570 of what your experience has been. 215 00:10:12,570 --> 00:10:15,270 Is this something that, this constant listening 216 00:10:15,270 --> 00:10:17,710 to employees, is this something that is 217 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:20,340 a regular topic of discussion 218 00:10:20,340 --> 00:10:23,490 with management meetings about 219 00:10:23,490 --> 00:10:26,220 what we are hearing from our employees? 220 00:10:26,220 --> 00:10:29,488 Or is this something that's more informal 221 00:10:29,488 --> 00:10:32,909 that you're meeting with some of the 222 00:10:32,909 --> 00:10:35,309 leadership for your group, 223 00:10:35,309 --> 00:10:38,280 reflecting on what you are hearing 224 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,293 from employees in meetings? 225 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:43,320 What does that look like? 226 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,173 - I think it's a combination because really, 227 00:10:48,420 --> 00:10:51,510 you're gonna know if something's not going well 228 00:10:51,510 --> 00:10:54,630 because there's gonna be that communication. 229 00:10:54,630 --> 00:10:57,589 You're just gonna hear that chatter in the work unit. 230 00:10:57,589 --> 00:10:59,460 But I think a lot of work units have adapted 231 00:10:59,460 --> 00:11:01,620 to also having huddles. 232 00:11:01,620 --> 00:11:04,620 And so those are great opportunities to just 233 00:11:04,620 --> 00:11:07,890 quick spend a few minutes connecting with the team. 234 00:11:07,890 --> 00:11:09,990 What are some quality issues, safety issues? 235 00:11:09,990 --> 00:11:11,460 What's not going well in the work unit? 236 00:11:11,460 --> 00:11:13,380 What is going well in the work unit? 237 00:11:13,380 --> 00:11:14,940 And when you're having those huddles, 238 00:11:14,940 --> 00:11:16,890 it also allows you an opportunity then 239 00:11:16,890 --> 00:11:20,040 to really connect individually with those staff 240 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:22,230 and be able to hear what those concerns are. 241 00:11:22,230 --> 00:11:23,063 It's also like, 242 00:11:23,063 --> 00:11:25,020 I've always found it really beneficial too 243 00:11:26,179 --> 00:11:27,420 to just throw out an email and say 244 00:11:27,420 --> 00:11:29,979 you know what, I'm struggling with this. 245 00:11:29,979 --> 00:11:31,980 Or I see a lot of communication through Teams chat 246 00:11:31,980 --> 00:11:33,090 that looks kind of negative. 247 00:11:33,090 --> 00:11:34,680 What could we do different? 248 00:11:34,680 --> 00:11:36,696 What are some suggestions? 249 00:11:36,696 --> 00:11:38,190 And then getting a team wrapped around that 250 00:11:38,190 --> 00:11:41,160 so that you don't continue to hear those issues, 251 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:43,740 but that you grow and you enhance that process. 252 00:11:43,740 --> 00:11:45,990 And I think when you bring in staff 253 00:11:45,990 --> 00:11:49,320 and you allow them the power to be part of that, 254 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:51,900 it shows that you're valuing what they do every day. 255 00:11:51,900 --> 00:11:53,730 It shows that you're valuing their opinion 256 00:11:53,730 --> 00:11:56,130 and their thoughts and that you're willing to create 257 00:11:56,130 --> 00:11:57,750 a work unit that is successful 258 00:11:57,750 --> 00:11:59,460 for them to come to every day. 259 00:11:59,460 --> 00:12:02,160 Even if it is a little bit short with staffing. 260 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:04,140 I think they're gonna be a little bit more open 261 00:12:04,140 --> 00:12:06,150 to putting in that extra effort 262 00:12:06,150 --> 00:12:09,150 if you can start to meet some of their needs as well. 263 00:12:09,150 --> 00:12:11,010 - Wow, this really resonates with me 264 00:12:11,010 --> 00:12:15,090 and I'm curious about as doing these huddles 265 00:12:15,090 --> 00:12:17,490 and why this resonates with me 266 00:12:17,490 --> 00:12:21,990 is I love this kind of engagement with the work unit. 267 00:12:21,990 --> 00:12:26,118 Is that oftentimes people may make suggestions 268 00:12:26,118 --> 00:12:28,020 that are great and brilliant 269 00:12:28,020 --> 00:12:32,640 but are gonna take a little bit of time to work on. 270 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:37,640 Maybe it's not even fully in our control of our work unit. 271 00:12:37,890 --> 00:12:40,350 And we can explore that. 272 00:12:40,350 --> 00:12:45,350 How do you handle and manage that in a positive way 273 00:12:45,540 --> 00:12:48,180 when employees are making these great suggestions, 274 00:12:48,180 --> 00:12:51,168 but like you said, you just can't on a dime 275 00:12:51,168 --> 00:12:54,090 change the work hours in many cases? 276 00:12:54,090 --> 00:12:56,880 - Yeah, so there's some things where I think 277 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:59,160 we're not able to be as flexible with. 278 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:01,050 We know we need to have X amount of staff 279 00:13:01,050 --> 00:13:03,900 on the overnight to care for the patients. 280 00:13:03,900 --> 00:13:04,800 We can't really change that 281 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:08,501 because that's the business need of the hospital. 282 00:13:08,501 --> 00:13:10,050 But things that we can do is 283 00:13:10,050 --> 00:13:11,501 when an enhancement comes forward. 284 00:13:11,501 --> 00:13:14,520 And you're right, sometimes things do take a little bit 285 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:16,680 of time, sometimes they take longer than what you 286 00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:18,030 would like to imagine. 287 00:13:18,030 --> 00:13:22,950 But for instance, a staff member brought forward the concern 288 00:13:22,950 --> 00:13:26,490 about line draws not being able to be identified 289 00:13:26,490 --> 00:13:27,870 on the patient list. 290 00:13:27,870 --> 00:13:30,360 So I'll put through an epic change request, 291 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,640 and then it's getting that employee involved. 292 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:34,800 So I had that person be involved on the meetings. 293 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:35,633 Sharing forward. 294 00:13:35,633 --> 00:13:37,740 What would you like to see this workload look like? 295 00:13:37,740 --> 00:13:39,060 And then sharing it with the team, 296 00:13:39,060 --> 00:13:40,950 hey, this suggestion was brought forward. 297 00:13:40,950 --> 00:13:42,930 I'm sure others have experienced 298 00:13:42,930 --> 00:13:45,003 that this would be a benefit. 299 00:13:46,541 --> 00:13:49,800 - So you're really getting them integrated 300 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:51,960 with the solution. 301 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,150 So that person, that's what I'm hearing right, 302 00:13:54,150 --> 00:13:56,312 is they're really in the thick of it. 303 00:13:56,312 --> 00:13:57,145 - [Jennifer] Definitely. 304 00:13:57,145 --> 00:14:00,960 - So they understand why something is taking some time 305 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:03,210 and maybe even building some leadership skills 306 00:14:03,210 --> 00:14:04,890 in the process. 307 00:14:04,890 --> 00:14:06,840 - It's a great opportunity for that. 308 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:08,610 There's no reason why they can't be part 309 00:14:08,610 --> 00:14:11,100 of an epic change request meeting. 310 00:14:11,100 --> 00:14:14,070 Have them sit in with, we use Soft for our collections, 311 00:14:14,070 --> 00:14:15,390 have them sit in on those teams. 312 00:14:15,390 --> 00:14:17,061 So that they can understand 313 00:14:17,061 --> 00:14:19,560 what is the length in between the meetings? 314 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:21,090 How long does it take to get something? 315 00:14:21,090 --> 00:14:23,910 But they also start to understand the process of it. 316 00:14:23,910 --> 00:14:25,680 And that way, they don't feel 317 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:27,300 like things are just happening to them 318 00:14:27,300 --> 00:14:28,500 but they can actually be part 319 00:14:28,500 --> 00:14:31,020 of that process and that change agent. 320 00:14:31,020 --> 00:14:32,400 And I think that's really big, 321 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:34,590 and you don't have to have too many people involved 322 00:14:34,590 --> 00:14:37,440 where the communication starts to share and spread. 323 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,930 So you have one or two people involved 324 00:14:39,930 --> 00:14:42,570 and they're sharing it with their close coworkers, 325 00:14:42,570 --> 00:14:44,700 it's shared in meetings and education events 326 00:14:44,700 --> 00:14:45,533 through huddles. 327 00:14:45,533 --> 00:14:47,460 And now everybody's aware of what's going on. 328 00:14:47,460 --> 00:14:50,100 What's the process, why is it taking a long time? 329 00:14:50,100 --> 00:14:53,760 So I think think there are really those quick just do its, 330 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:55,950 and anytime you can implement a just do it, 331 00:14:55,950 --> 00:14:57,183 that's fantastic. 332 00:14:58,890 --> 00:15:01,230 But sometimes for those longer projects, 333 00:15:01,230 --> 00:15:03,989 I think just getting the staff involved, 334 00:15:03,989 --> 00:15:05,817 allowing them to be part of the communication. 335 00:15:05,817 --> 00:15:07,110 I'll forward an email to them and say, 336 00:15:07,110 --> 00:15:08,730 hey what do you think about this? 337 00:15:08,730 --> 00:15:10,500 Just making sure they're engaged 338 00:15:10,500 --> 00:15:12,270 so that they know, oh, she didn't forget about this. 339 00:15:12,270 --> 00:15:13,620 This isn't on the back burner. 340 00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:16,140 This is just what this process looks like 341 00:15:16,140 --> 00:15:18,180 is really important. 342 00:15:18,180 --> 00:15:20,670 And I think you're right, you grow those management skills 343 00:15:20,670 --> 00:15:23,640 and you allow them to be part of the process. 344 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:25,770 And they're no longer just an employee that comes in, 345 00:15:25,770 --> 00:15:27,900 clocks in, does their job, and leaves. 346 00:15:27,900 --> 00:15:30,450 They're now an employee who's helping 347 00:15:30,450 --> 00:15:33,330 to make the work unit a better place. 348 00:15:33,330 --> 00:15:35,190 - So I wanna, I think you've probably, 349 00:15:35,190 --> 00:15:37,470 we've started to dip into some kind of these 350 00:15:37,470 --> 00:15:40,350 top recruitment strategies to kinda increase 351 00:15:40,350 --> 00:15:42,120 the stability of our workforce. 352 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:44,280 But I want to kind of call some attention 353 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:45,330 and highlight to that. 354 00:15:45,330 --> 00:15:47,280 So I was wondering if you could kind of 355 00:15:48,300 --> 00:15:50,211 elaborate a little bit 356 00:15:50,211 --> 00:15:52,830 on some of your kind of top recruitment strategies. 357 00:15:52,830 --> 00:15:55,680 - Yeah, there is such a growth that I've seen 358 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:59,760 and experienced this past year with recruitment efforts, 359 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:03,990 and it seems like no suggestion or path 360 00:16:03,990 --> 00:16:06,090 really is off the table for discussion 361 00:16:06,090 --> 00:16:09,390 as long as it does have the potential to reach people. 362 00:16:09,390 --> 00:16:13,320 So there's a lot of effort going into many strategies, 363 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:15,180 and I'm sure there's even more happening 364 00:16:15,180 --> 00:16:17,480 across the organization. 365 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:20,670 But some of the recruitment initiatives that are in place 366 00:16:20,670 --> 00:16:23,851 that I'm particularly close with working 367 00:16:23,851 --> 00:16:25,771 is we're doing advertising 368 00:16:25,771 --> 00:16:29,100 through local newspapers, billboards. 369 00:16:29,100 --> 00:16:32,823 There was one of the billboards by the fairgrounds, 370 00:16:33,660 --> 00:16:35,940 when we had this for phlebotomy, there was a picture 371 00:16:35,940 --> 00:16:37,260 of a couple of my old employees that made sure, 372 00:16:37,260 --> 00:16:39,030 hey, look you're on a billboard. 373 00:16:39,030 --> 00:16:40,470 Let's get some excitement around this 374 00:16:40,470 --> 00:16:43,410 so that they would make sure to share it with people. 375 00:16:43,410 --> 00:16:44,910 And then social media, 376 00:16:44,910 --> 00:16:46,770 making sure that we're utilizing those tools. 377 00:16:46,770 --> 00:16:49,680 'Cause I think that's really important right now. 378 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:52,410 We're also using Indeed hiring events. 379 00:16:52,410 --> 00:16:54,430 I have an all day Indeed event tomorrow 380 00:16:55,379 --> 00:16:57,990 that I'll be sitting at doing for interviews. 381 00:16:57,990 --> 00:17:00,480 We're also doing handshake campaigns, 382 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:02,190 advertising through high schools, 383 00:17:02,190 --> 00:17:04,379 making sure that we're connecting 384 00:17:04,379 --> 00:17:05,430 with those career counselors so that they know 385 00:17:05,430 --> 00:17:09,240 what kind of job opportunities are out there for students. 386 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:12,510 Whether it is a degree needed or if it's just a training, 387 00:17:12,510 --> 00:17:15,690 that students have the different opportunities 388 00:17:15,690 --> 00:17:17,100 and are aware of that. 389 00:17:17,100 --> 00:17:19,620 We're also working with recruiting agencies 390 00:17:19,620 --> 00:17:23,550 such as Velocity and Recruit Talent Inc. 391 00:17:23,550 --> 00:17:27,120 All with the goal so that we can share what our needs are 392 00:17:27,120 --> 00:17:29,673 and have this support network around us. 393 00:17:30,780 --> 00:17:32,760 Other opportunities that have been really great, 394 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:35,283 as we know that Mayo's a larger institution, 395 00:17:36,758 --> 00:17:37,860 so we're sharing staff. 396 00:17:37,860 --> 00:17:40,170 We go to different departments, we get different jobs, 397 00:17:40,170 --> 00:17:41,670 but one of the things that you can do 398 00:17:41,670 --> 00:17:43,590 since you have that skillset set is keep them 399 00:17:43,590 --> 00:17:46,110 on as a supplemental or job two employee. 400 00:17:46,110 --> 00:17:47,550 So that when they're able to, 401 00:17:47,550 --> 00:17:51,270 if they're looking into picking up additional hours, 402 00:17:51,270 --> 00:17:53,070 they can come back into your work unit 403 00:17:53,070 --> 00:17:56,250 and maintain that skill and help fill in some of those gaps. 404 00:17:56,250 --> 00:17:58,053 So that's been really great too. 405 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,760 - Well, and so you're doing several, 406 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:03,850 and maybe that's and understatement 407 00:18:03,850 --> 00:18:06,059 to say several different strategies. 408 00:18:06,059 --> 00:18:07,019 - Yes. 409 00:18:07,019 --> 00:18:10,110 - How do you assess that? 410 00:18:10,110 --> 00:18:12,190 Because I imagine that that's kind of 411 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:16,530 a valuable information to know. 412 00:18:16,530 --> 00:18:20,313 Which of these strategies are more effective? 413 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:24,813 And maybe even it gets more specific than that, 414 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:27,780 more effective in recruiting some of the 415 00:18:27,780 --> 00:18:32,400 top employees that you see engaged in the work unit. 416 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,000 So how do you assess 417 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,157 what do you wanna continue going forward? 418 00:18:37,157 --> 00:18:39,810 What's not really a good investment 419 00:18:39,810 --> 00:18:42,120 of your time and resources? 420 00:18:42,120 --> 00:18:45,390 - Yeah, so we're fortunate enough to have HR recruiters 421 00:18:45,390 --> 00:18:46,590 that partner with us 422 00:18:46,590 --> 00:18:49,440 and they kind of help us manage some of that data. 423 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,300 So if we do an initiative 424 00:18:51,300 --> 00:18:54,420 and we don't have any activity out of it, 425 00:18:54,420 --> 00:18:57,240 it's probably one that we might put to the side. 426 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:59,190 And the thing about a lot of these initiatives 427 00:18:59,190 --> 00:19:01,710 is they might, they're gonna work differently 428 00:19:01,710 --> 00:19:02,970 for different areas. 429 00:19:02,970 --> 00:19:05,940 So maybe some collections for phlebotomy 430 00:19:05,940 --> 00:19:08,880 is gonna have one path that's gonna work better 431 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:11,460 and testing labs are gonna have a different outcome. 432 00:19:11,460 --> 00:19:13,470 So I think you also need to know who is it 433 00:19:13,470 --> 00:19:16,110 that you're recruiting for and separate that. 434 00:19:16,110 --> 00:19:19,500 So we may not be as successful in one area, 435 00:19:19,500 --> 00:19:23,259 but a testing lab might be very successful in that. 436 00:19:23,259 --> 00:19:24,960 So it is watching to see 437 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:26,700 how many candidates are we getting out of there? 438 00:19:26,700 --> 00:19:30,000 How much activity, how much interest? 439 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:32,250 And then continuing to work, 440 00:19:32,250 --> 00:19:34,773 because you're right, it really is a lot. 441 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:38,520 I am by no means a subject matter expert, 442 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:42,240 but this last year, there has just been so many different 443 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:44,550 recruiting opportunities I've been part of. 444 00:19:44,550 --> 00:19:47,340 And in the past, I've always been part of recruiting, 445 00:19:47,340 --> 00:19:49,950 but I did it more to connect with people 446 00:19:49,950 --> 00:19:53,430 and just share my love for what I do for my job. 447 00:19:53,430 --> 00:19:55,110 So it was a way for me to connect, 448 00:19:55,110 --> 00:19:57,930 share what I do, say, here's another career path. 449 00:19:57,930 --> 00:19:59,550 But now it's really going out there 450 00:19:59,550 --> 00:20:01,200 and it's being that driving force 451 00:20:02,229 --> 00:20:05,040 and it's really being specific about what we need. 452 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:06,960 What are we looking for? 453 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:08,040 And like you said, 454 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:10,590 just making sure we're using it the correct way. 455 00:20:10,590 --> 00:20:11,423 - Wow. 456 00:20:11,423 --> 00:20:14,430 I bet this conversation for listeners 457 00:20:14,430 --> 00:20:17,370 has really sparked some ideas 'cause there's, 458 00:20:17,370 --> 00:20:21,570 like you're saying, there's a lot of context specificity 459 00:20:21,570 --> 00:20:25,110 for what works, what might be getting done. 460 00:20:25,110 --> 00:20:28,410 And so can you speak to some potential 461 00:20:28,410 --> 00:20:30,379 educational opportunities 462 00:20:30,379 --> 00:20:34,380 where listeners can learn more about this? 463 00:20:34,380 --> 00:20:35,340 - Sure. 464 00:20:35,340 --> 00:20:37,320 There's a number of career opportunities 465 00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:38,570 that are being discussed, 466 00:20:39,438 --> 00:20:41,490 not only with how do we bring in top talent, 467 00:20:41,490 --> 00:20:43,530 but how do we grow our current staff 468 00:20:43,530 --> 00:20:46,140 and some educational pathways that'll continue to 469 00:20:46,140 --> 00:20:48,330 feed the needs of the organization. 470 00:20:48,330 --> 00:20:50,097 'Cause we need to do both. 471 00:20:50,097 --> 00:20:53,400 But one way is bringing in people 472 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:54,810 that have maybe the soft skill, 473 00:20:54,810 --> 00:20:57,780 and then doing some onsite specific training 474 00:20:57,780 --> 00:21:00,990 and creating those pathways where they can grow 475 00:21:00,990 --> 00:21:02,490 from one career field to the next. 476 00:21:02,490 --> 00:21:04,500 So for example, phlebotomy, 477 00:21:04,500 --> 00:21:07,749 we have two programs that we teach, 478 00:21:07,749 --> 00:21:10,290 that we teach you the skill. 479 00:21:10,290 --> 00:21:12,210 And one is through the Mayo School of Health Science 480 00:21:12,210 --> 00:21:14,710 and the other is the Phlebotomy Assistant program, 481 00:21:15,577 --> 00:21:19,050 which they both offer specific training pathways 482 00:21:19,050 --> 00:21:21,150 to learn that phlebotomy skillset. 483 00:21:21,150 --> 00:21:23,070 But it's just really utilizing it 484 00:21:23,070 --> 00:21:24,630 for which one is right for you. 485 00:21:24,630 --> 00:21:28,640 And then being able to look at how do we balance the needs? 486 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:30,870 So as our needs for phlebotomists grow, 487 00:21:30,870 --> 00:21:32,190 we're able to adjust the number 488 00:21:32,190 --> 00:21:34,020 of cohorts that we offer in a year 489 00:21:34,020 --> 00:21:36,783 or the number of students that we offer in a class. 490 00:21:38,130 --> 00:21:40,890 And both programs have been successful this past year 491 00:21:40,890 --> 00:21:42,453 with meeting those needs. 492 00:21:43,290 --> 00:21:47,040 The Phlebotomy Assistant program is also offering training 493 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,820 on all three shifts since that is a specific need. 494 00:21:50,820 --> 00:21:53,310 So that started for 2023. 495 00:21:53,310 --> 00:21:56,080 It's just to how do we grow to meet the needs 496 00:21:57,039 --> 00:21:57,990 of hires coming in? 497 00:21:57,990 --> 00:22:00,300 Maybe a day shift training program doesn't work. 498 00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:02,250 So now we're offering the evening and overnight, 499 00:22:02,250 --> 00:22:05,130 and hopefully we'll be able to fill those hires 500 00:22:05,130 --> 00:22:06,963 into those positions as well. 501 00:22:08,910 --> 00:22:10,500 So development and education, 502 00:22:10,500 --> 00:22:13,360 I think it's only going to continue to grow and enhance 503 00:22:14,811 --> 00:22:15,990 as we better understand the need 504 00:22:15,990 --> 00:22:18,090 collaboratively in the healthcare field. 505 00:22:18,090 --> 00:22:18,923 - Wow. 506 00:22:18,923 --> 00:22:20,550 And I think that's another topic 507 00:22:20,550 --> 00:22:22,650 we'll have to invite you back for. 508 00:22:22,650 --> 00:22:23,970 I'm the medical director 509 00:22:23,970 --> 00:22:26,700 for a medical laboratory science program, 510 00:22:26,700 --> 00:22:28,590 and yeah there's a huge need, 511 00:22:28,590 --> 00:22:33,459 and how to expand that is a complex question. 512 00:22:33,459 --> 00:22:35,730 (laughing) 513 00:22:35,730 --> 00:22:37,740 So thank you so much. 514 00:22:37,740 --> 00:22:40,620 We've been rounding with Jennifer Storlie today. 515 00:22:40,620 --> 00:22:45,480 Thanks for taking the time to talk about workforce stability 516 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:47,340 and really kind of elaborate 517 00:22:47,340 --> 00:22:52,200 on some of those strategies for retention for our workforce. 518 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,360 - Yeah, thank you for having me. 519 00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:56,790 - If you'd like to hear more about this topic, 520 00:22:56,790 --> 00:22:58,530 Jennifer will be presenting 521 00:22:58,530 --> 00:23:02,310 at the 2023 Phlebotomy Conference in April. 522 00:23:02,310 --> 00:23:07,310 So please visit mayocliniclabs.com/phlebotomy2023 523 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,020 for more information. 524 00:23:10,020 --> 00:23:12,360 And all of our listeners, thank you for joining us today. 525 00:23:12,360 --> 00:23:14,370 We invite you to share your thoughts 526 00:23:14,370 --> 00:23:16,320 and suggestions via email. 527 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,120 Please direct any suggestions 528 00:23:18,120 --> 00:23:23,120 to mcleducation@mayo.edu and reference this podcast. 529 00:23:23,580 --> 00:23:26,280 If you've enjoyed Lab Medicine Rounds podcast, 530 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:27,480 please subscribe. 531 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,460 And until our next rounds together, 532 00:23:29,460 --> 00:23:32,160 we encourage you to continue to connect lab medicine 533 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:36,189 and the clinical practice through insightful conversations. 534 00:23:36,189 --> 00:23:38,772 (bright music)