WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:44.739 --> 00:00:46.029 Duke: All right, Corey, what are we talking about today? 00:00:46.409 --> 00:00:46.829 CJ: All right, duke. 00:00:46.829 --> 00:00:51.769 Today we're gonna talk about, , our favorite things and this one is, is kind 00:00:51.769 --> 00:00:54.559 of a little bit all over the place, but it's all over the place in a good way. 00:00:54.559 --> 00:00:54.859 I think. 00:00:55.555 --> 00:00:56.515 Duke: all over the place. 00:00:56.635 --> 00:00:56.965 Ha. 00:00:57.445 --> 00:00:58.285 Oh, all over the place. 00:00:58.285 --> 00:01:00.085 And that is like a few of our favorite of things, and we're gonna like 00:01:00.085 --> 00:01:01.195 different things in the I get you again. 00:01:01.690 --> 00:01:01.930 CJ: Yeah. 00:01:01.930 --> 00:01:02.200 Yeah. 00:01:02.290 --> 00:01:02.830 I mean, right. 00:01:02.830 --> 00:01:05.500 So, you know, it is not like, okay, we're going to get into like 00:01:05.500 --> 00:01:08.050 the incident management lane and we're gonna stay there, or we're 00:01:08.050 --> 00:01:11.620 gonna talk about, you know, this particular job type or anything. 00:01:11.620 --> 00:01:14.410 We're just gonna talk about some of the things that we like in ServiceNow. 00:01:15.116 --> 00:01:15.896 I'll kick us off. 00:01:16.106 --> 00:01:19.616 All right, so one of my favorite things is, , script rest APIs. 00:01:20.106 --> 00:01:21.726 , first of all, the platform is amazing, right? 00:01:21.731 --> 00:01:25.851 If you've worked on ServiceNow for anything longer than a month or if 00:01:25.851 --> 00:01:28.341 you've built anything in it, ever, right? 00:01:28.341 --> 00:01:31.191 Like, you know, how amazing and how powerful the platform is. 00:01:31.641 --> 00:01:36.651 , What enables it to be super powerful is the fact that you can access the 00:01:36.651 --> 00:01:42.381 platform from any other device that supports REST APIs and having a scripted 00:01:42.381 --> 00:01:44.901 rest a P I is just like a game changer. 00:01:44.931 --> 00:01:46.191 For me, it's the ability. 00:01:46.283 --> 00:01:50.123 to send data to the ServiceNow instance, run a script against it directly 00:01:50.123 --> 00:01:53.453 in the a p i, and then manipulate it on the backend and the table 00:01:53.458 --> 00:01:57.893 structure or whatever I want to do, literally whatever I wanna do, right? 00:01:57.898 --> 00:02:01.414 Like I can have that spawn an event that sends a report to somebody, I, 00:02:01.653 --> 00:02:03.633 I can have that kickoff a workflow. 00:02:03.783 --> 00:02:06.273 I can have it, you know it, I can have it do anything. 00:02:06.873 --> 00:02:07.623 Updated record. 00:02:08.313 --> 00:02:09.093 Updated record. 00:02:09.098 --> 00:02:10.833 That's so blase, right? 00:02:10.983 --> 00:02:14.793 Like, I can have, I can have it kick off other integrations, right? 00:02:14.793 --> 00:02:20.599 Like it, it's basically giving you, , the ability to have something external to 00:02:20.599 --> 00:02:25.729 the system, . Ask the ServiceNow instance to do whatever it is you want it to do. 00:02:25.729 --> 00:02:25.999 Right. 00:02:25.999 --> 00:02:28.639 , and one of the reasons I find this so powerful and so interesting, 00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:31.599 right, is because I do a lot of stuff with home automation, ? And in home 00:02:31.599 --> 00:02:34.179 automation you often have triggers. 00:02:34.179 --> 00:02:34.239 I. 00:02:34.534 --> 00:02:38.344 That you want to enable or kick off a flow to do something, right? 00:02:38.344 --> 00:02:41.054 We have that same thing in service now with, , with business flows and so on 00:02:41.054 --> 00:02:45.214 and so forth, , like if I close my door, I close the kitchen door, after 10:00 00:02:45.214 --> 00:02:49.654 PM I might wanna send an email letting me know house is locked down, right? 00:02:50.329 --> 00:02:53.269 That's something you can do with a scripted rest, a p i, right? 00:02:53.269 --> 00:02:57.169 Like you close the kitchen door, that's gonna send a a, a rest, rest post 00:02:57.169 --> 00:02:59.209 message over to ServiceNow instance. 00:02:59.214 --> 00:03:01.939 You're gonna kick off that scripted rest a p i and boom, now you 00:03:01.939 --> 00:03:03.559 got a notification locked down. 00:03:03.829 --> 00:03:04.279 Perfect. 00:03:04.279 --> 00:03:04.819 Love that. 00:03:05.059 --> 00:03:05.269 Right? 00:03:05.269 --> 00:03:09.019 That's just a minor, example of, of one of the reasons why I love this thing, 00:03:09.019 --> 00:03:10.759 but I just love the flexibility of it. 00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:14.583 It just really to me amps up the power of a already powerful platform. 00:03:14.738 --> 00:03:16.748 Duke: What's the coolest thing you've done for a client with that? 00:03:16.984 --> 00:03:18.994 CJ: The coolest thing I ever did with it, was the integration 00:03:18.994 --> 00:03:20.374 between a Microsoft product. 00:03:20.374 --> 00:03:24.689 It was , a product that they were using to track all of their work in, and I can't 00:03:24.929 --> 00:03:26.729 work items and so on, on for so forth. 00:03:26.729 --> 00:03:26.909 Right? 00:03:26.909 --> 00:03:28.259 And I can't remember the actual name of it. 00:03:28.259 --> 00:03:29.999 It's gonna pop to me at the end of the episode. 00:03:29.999 --> 00:03:34.309 But anyway, the way that the rest a p i with that product was set up is 00:03:34.314 --> 00:03:38.179 that, It was a lot of sending of post messages and they wanted to really 00:03:38.479 --> 00:03:42.949 like kick off things in ServiceNow that would then send things back to them. 00:03:43.326 --> 00:03:46.346 Sometimes with a client, you get into a situation where there's multiple, 00:03:46.346 --> 00:03:48.026 work management products, right? 00:03:48.296 --> 00:03:51.566 And you've got one that is driving the others. 00:03:51.926 --> 00:03:53.096 That was the case here. 00:03:53.256 --> 00:03:56.761 , so this Microsoft product was the product that was driving all of the 00:03:56.761 --> 00:04:00.161 work, , through the enterprise and though they had ServiceNow and need light 00:04:00.161 --> 00:04:01.781 ServiceNow, and they utilize ServiceNow. 00:04:02.466 --> 00:04:03.546 For some things, right? 00:04:03.546 --> 00:04:06.376 They wanted to have, , maintained that Microsoft, , system 00:04:06.376 --> 00:04:07.516 as the source of, , truth. 00:04:07.786 --> 00:04:09.676 And so what would happen is we'd send. 00:04:10.716 --> 00:04:14.866 A post message, , from that system to ServiceNow, we pick it up in a 00:04:14.866 --> 00:04:17.866 scripted rest, a p i, and then we have to massage it because the way the 00:04:17.866 --> 00:04:19.726 data came over was pretty horrible. 00:04:20.116 --> 00:04:24.776 And so we had to parse through it, we've gotta, manipulate it a little bit. 00:04:24.776 --> 00:04:27.966 We've gotta enrich it, ? Because some of the information wasn't 00:04:27.966 --> 00:04:29.526 sent, but can be inferred. 00:04:30.061 --> 00:04:31.531 Based on the process, right? 00:04:31.531 --> 00:04:34.111 Like they send two, three different attributes, but 00:04:34.111 --> 00:04:35.311 they didn't send the fourth. 00:04:35.671 --> 00:04:36.061 Right? 00:04:36.061 --> 00:04:40.291 But we can look up, but based on those three attributes and us knowing it, right? 00:04:40.291 --> 00:04:43.411 Like we can create a lookup table and now we can look, send those three 00:04:43.411 --> 00:04:46.711 attributes, pull back the fourth, and then send that into the process, right? 00:04:46.771 --> 00:04:49.916 and the reason this was really cool is that , it was really hard to do this 00:04:49.916 --> 00:04:52.656 in something like a scripted clue or a business rule, , just because of 00:04:52.656 --> 00:04:55.006 the number , of moving parts in it. 00:04:55.276 --> 00:04:59.716 And it was a lot cleaner to put in a scripted rest a p I and have the scripted 00:04:59.866 --> 00:05:03.946 rest a p I then spit out the cleaning data that can then be utilized throughout the 00:05:03.996 --> 00:05:05.376 , rest of the platform, which would then. 00:05:05.776 --> 00:05:08.716 It was used to send data back to where it came from. 00:05:09.681 --> 00:05:09.761 Duke: Hmm. 00:05:10.096 --> 00:05:11.956 CJ: So it was just like this virtuous loop. 00:05:12.106 --> 00:05:14.546 Anyway, it's probably my favorite because it was the first thing that I 00:05:14.546 --> 00:05:17.856 worked on, , with a scripted rest, a p i that really showcased the power to. 00:05:18.566 --> 00:05:19.976 Duke: I still gotta really go deep on that. 00:05:19.976 --> 00:05:23.046 I think I've used it once, but wasn't one of those things where you got enough 00:05:23.046 --> 00:05:26.396 death for it to stay, in your head is kinda like, wow, that was super powerful. 00:05:26.951 --> 00:05:30.441 Alright, , my favorite thing is Flow designer and it took me a long 00:05:30.441 --> 00:05:34.341 time to get there and I have had on again, off again with Flow Designer. 00:05:34.866 --> 00:05:39.336 But it's back on and it's still one of my favorite things. 00:05:39.336 --> 00:05:44.526 And I think the last time, like it's always given me good vibes in terms 00:05:44.526 --> 00:05:46.206 of like, wow, this is really powerful. 00:05:46.266 --> 00:05:51.276 But I think the last time it really rang a bell for me was 00:05:51.546 --> 00:05:53.676 in my last, , coaching cohort. 00:05:53.883 --> 00:05:55.923 It was the second session we ever talked to each other. 00:05:56.193 --> 00:05:58.773 And we had already gone over data structure and we'd always kind of 00:05:58.773 --> 00:06:00.183 built out the tables that we wanted. 00:06:00.393 --> 00:06:04.143 And then I said, let's do this piece of logic. 00:06:04.423 --> 00:06:04.573 Okay. 00:06:04.578 --> 00:06:06.043 Essentially it's my Soaping app, right? 00:06:06.043 --> 00:06:09.573 You have, just real simply, we have recipes that have ingredients, right? 00:06:09.938 --> 00:06:10.268 CJ: Yep. 00:06:10.553 --> 00:06:13.493 Duke: So there's a recipe table and an ingredient table and a 00:06:13.493 --> 00:06:17.063 table where you store the linkage between recipes and ingredient. 00:06:17.613 --> 00:06:20.223 Because an ingredient could be on multiple recipes and a recipe can 00:06:20.223 --> 00:06:21.573 have multiple ingredients, right? 00:06:21.633 --> 00:06:26.678 So, But when I do a batch, I wanted it to air quotes, actualize the ingredient. 00:06:26.858 --> 00:06:29.321 So I wanted to have a batch ingredient table, you 00:06:29.326 --> 00:06:30.311 feel you with me so far? 00:06:30.761 --> 00:06:35.136 And so basically it would say, okay, I'm doing this recipe, so make a 00:06:35.141 --> 00:06:40.566 similar record, but we'll call it a batch ingredient and make one for every 00:06:41.196 --> 00:06:42.876 ingredient that I need for the recipe. 00:06:42.906 --> 00:06:44.826 So now I have these batch ingredients, which is like the 00:06:44.826 --> 00:06:46.446 literal use of the ingredient. 00:06:46.896 --> 00:06:48.756 Not the theoretical use of the ingredient. 00:06:49.536 --> 00:06:51.516 And so it's like, how do you get it to do that? 00:06:51.516 --> 00:06:53.526 I mean, just thinking about the code, it's like, okay, glide record 00:06:53.526 --> 00:06:57.773 here and then like another glide record and insert multiple and even 00:06:57.773 --> 00:07:00.898 I was starting to gag a bit at the JavaScript I'd have to pull out. 00:07:00.908 --> 00:07:04.938 , but here we are, , a team of ServiceNow beginners and me, and they 00:07:04.938 --> 00:07:06.708 basically built it in flow designer. 00:07:06.708 --> 00:07:07.868 And they didn't use any code. 00:07:08.078 --> 00:07:08.618 CJ: Nice. 00:07:09.023 --> 00:07:11.483 Duke: You could wizard it out if you could just think about it and just 00:07:11.483 --> 00:07:13.133 like do it in little simple steps 00:07:13.561 --> 00:07:18.016 CJ: You know what that brings to my mind, constraints breed innovation, right? 00:07:18.631 --> 00:07:19.981 Duke: Yeah, no, absolutely right. 00:07:20.101 --> 00:07:22.951 It, yes, that's exactly what it is. 00:07:23.011 --> 00:07:23.551 it's true. 00:07:23.551 --> 00:07:25.571 There are some high powered devs out there. 00:07:25.571 --> 00:07:28.671 They could probably have written a script to do that , in a shorter amount 00:07:28.671 --> 00:07:32.781 of time than we did in Flow Designer, but like, how many of them are there 00:07:33.196 --> 00:07:33.586 CJ: Right. 00:07:34.021 --> 00:07:36.001 Duke: how many beginners are there in ServiceNow? 00:07:36.001 --> 00:07:36.091 Right. 00:07:36.376 --> 00:07:37.276 CJ: Absolutely. 00:07:37.651 --> 00:07:39.511 Duke: It's, it's a scale thing. 00:07:39.521 --> 00:07:44.621 A lot more people can do a lot more stuff and that stuff is just easier to read. 00:07:44.621 --> 00:07:48.551 Anybody could pop up that flow and say, okay, that's what the flow does. 00:07:49.911 --> 00:07:54.331 Then we got it to do something way more complicated, as you're adding the 00:07:54.331 --> 00:07:59.401 ingredients to the batch check to see if we actually have enough of it left, and 00:07:59.401 --> 00:08:04.638 then set a flag , if we're deficient in that ingredient on the batch and that, was 00:08:04.638 --> 00:08:08.478 still in the flow designer, but that took us all of like one line of JavaScript. 00:08:09.738 --> 00:08:13.428 CJ: Which, you know, is, there's a lot of ways to get that one line right? 00:08:13.428 --> 00:08:14.388 Like Google's your friend. 00:08:15.528 --> 00:08:16.188 Duke: exactly. 00:08:16.193 --> 00:08:19.433 It wasn't even a complicated line of JavaScript, but just thinking like for 00:08:19.433 --> 00:08:25.228 one line of JavaScript and this Wizard e component based workflow builder, I got 00:08:25.233 --> 00:08:27.243 a simple supply chain management solution 00:08:28.168 --> 00:08:28.458 CJ: Yeah, 00:08:28.563 --> 00:08:30.633 Duke: and we did it in like hours, you know. 00:08:31.643 --> 00:08:35.123 So it wasn't like this big, huge, hard, difficult thing. 00:08:35.763 --> 00:08:38.283 And , you stack that up against solutions where it's like, man, I've 00:08:38.283 --> 00:08:43.923 spent days on scripts trying to get like assessments to do what I want 'em to do. 00:08:44.698 --> 00:08:44.758 CJ: Yeah. 00:08:44.898 --> 00:08:45.313 Duke: know what I mean? 00:08:45.853 --> 00:08:46.153 CJ: Yep. 00:08:46.183 --> 00:08:46.813 Absolutely. 00:08:46.813 --> 00:08:47.443 I know what you mean. 00:08:47.443 --> 00:08:50.173 Like beating your head up against something that you're, yeah. 00:08:50.953 --> 00:08:55.403 Duke: And I think about all the solutions I've ever had, and the reason. 00:08:55.559 --> 00:08:59.879 I couldn't just get somebody to mock it up was because it needed JavaScript. 00:08:59.879 --> 00:09:04.379 And not only JavaScript, but familiarity with ServiceNow objects in JavaScript, 00:09:04.529 --> 00:09:04.889 right? 00:09:04.889 --> 00:09:08.309 So like glide record and glide aggregate and glide system and all that stuff, 00:09:08.669 --> 00:09:11.459 which you couldn't ask a low-code dev to really, you know what I mean? 00:09:12.449 --> 00:09:13.919 CJ: Yeah, no, absolutely. 00:09:14.039 --> 00:09:14.249 Right. 00:09:14.249 --> 00:09:18.899 Like those are all things that you know are outside of the typical common lexicon 00:09:18.899 --> 00:09:20.369 when you're just starting in ServiceNow. 00:09:21.059 --> 00:09:21.389 Right. 00:09:21.389 --> 00:09:24.599 And Flow Designer just gives you that stuff to pick off the shelf. 00:09:24.804 --> 00:09:28.279 Duke: And the deeper I go, the more I love it, subflows love it. 00:09:28.526 --> 00:09:30.741 and , now that you can actually take , the flow and convert 00:09:30.741 --> 00:09:33.051 it to Subflow is super sweet. 00:09:33.711 --> 00:09:37.761 , yeah, the more components that they add to it, just the more interesting it gets. 00:09:38.064 --> 00:09:38.934 And so I just. 00:09:39.169 --> 00:09:40.099 I love flow design. 00:09:40.099 --> 00:09:42.709 It's like the, you know how it's like the first tool you reach for? 00:09:43.291 --> 00:09:43.581 CJ: Yeah. 00:09:43.946 --> 00:09:44.666 Duke: what it's like for me. 00:09:44.666 --> 00:09:46.196 Just, oh, we need something to do this. 00:09:46.196 --> 00:09:46.376 Yeah. 00:09:46.376 --> 00:09:47.996 Let me just, uh, yeah, I got a couple ideas. 00:09:47.996 --> 00:09:50.546 Lemme just mock pick up a flow designer and Bingo. 00:09:50.551 --> 00:09:50.906 Bingo. 00:09:50.906 --> 00:09:51.506 There it is. 00:09:52.256 --> 00:09:52.676 CJ: Yeah, right. 00:09:52.676 --> 00:09:55.586 Like we all got that one screwdriver that we keep around the house, right? 00:09:55.586 --> 00:09:58.466 That's got the interchangeable bits and it never fails you. 00:09:58.466 --> 00:09:58.826 Right. 00:09:59.216 --> 00:10:00.296 Duke: Oh man, here it is. 00:10:00.296 --> 00:10:00.746 Okay, here it is. 00:10:00.806 --> 00:10:03.886 So I got , this customer, , and they have this really. 00:10:05.386 --> 00:10:08.596 If you hear them explain it, it's really simple, but it's just because 00:10:08.596 --> 00:10:14.896 the assessment and surveys module and ServiceNow is just, uh, that way, um, 00:10:15.016 --> 00:10:19.786 you like getting it to do anything. 00:10:19.786 --> 00:10:24.196 Then that one supremely narrow use case is ServiceNow. 00:10:24.196 --> 00:10:27.646 Imagine when they built it is just like you might as well be pulling 00:10:27.646 --> 00:10:31.216 your teeth out with a, with a wrench or with a, what would you 00:10:31.321 --> 00:10:34.441 CJ: Yeah, man, I, I still write my own survey module. 00:10:34.441 --> 00:10:36.571 I don't, I don't, I don't use, yeah. 00:10:36.616 --> 00:10:41.106 Duke: So at any rate, , what they wanted was just a lot more 00:10:41.256 --> 00:10:45.606 notifications along the way because they wanted , their surveys to be open 00:10:45.611 --> 00:10:48.006 for a long time, a long, long time. 00:10:48.783 --> 00:10:52.513 you gotta think like they're a P M O and they want every project that they 00:10:52.513 --> 00:10:55.603 finish, they want the stakeholders of that project to do a survey on. 00:10:55.603 --> 00:10:57.283 And it's kind of like a mandatory thing. 00:10:57.493 --> 00:11:00.433 And so they're basically like three months later they'll be going back to bug 00:11:00.433 --> 00:11:01.873 these people, Hey, fill out the survey. 00:11:01.873 --> 00:11:05.256 'cause it goes towards our, personal assessments and what our personal reviews. 00:11:05.729 --> 00:11:06.239 so. 00:11:06.788 --> 00:11:07.658 I'm just like, oh God. 00:11:07.658 --> 00:11:09.068 Like how do I make it do that? 00:11:10.088 --> 00:11:14.558 Like, am I putting in a scheduled job that fires an event and I'm making a new event 00:11:14.558 --> 00:11:18.728 and then I'm having a mail script, do all kinds of blah, blah, blah, blah, right? 00:11:19.493 --> 00:11:20.454 CJ: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:11:20.459 --> 00:11:20.663 Right. 00:11:21.098 --> 00:11:22.178 Duke: or what else am I doing? 00:11:22.178 --> 00:11:25.928 Am I cracking open the legacy flow so I can look at the, the 00:11:25.928 --> 00:11:28.178 default assessment workflow? 00:11:28.178 --> 00:11:30.668 Am I like gonna have to have multiple assessment workflows? 00:11:30.668 --> 00:11:31.688 Like how do I even. 00:11:33.038 --> 00:11:36.278 At that point, you're even looking at how assessments launch themselves with 00:11:36.278 --> 00:11:37.958 that stupid business rule they have, 00:11:38.543 --> 00:11:38.833 CJ: Yeah. 00:11:39.008 --> 00:11:41.528 Duke: and it makes a separate business rule for whatever assessment you 00:11:41.533 --> 00:11:43.028 have, but they're all named the same. 00:11:43.033 --> 00:11:44.558 I'm just like this, 00:11:45.758 --> 00:11:46.958 CJ: Oh, I'm gonna stop you there. 00:11:46.958 --> 00:11:50.438 Like, you obviously know way more about this process than I do. 00:11:53.198 --> 00:11:55.988 Duke: but I'll bet you, you're, you're as happy about the prospect of 00:11:55.988 --> 00:11:58.478 working on it as I am working on it. 00:12:01.013 --> 00:12:01.823 Anyways. 00:12:02.039 --> 00:12:07.059 to make a, an extremely long short, I spent like an afternoon literally just 00:12:07.059 --> 00:12:10.389 working out in my head, how can I possibly get this to work with all the scripts and 00:12:10.389 --> 00:12:13.419 all the different ways of doing it, and how much am I gonna break this to get it? 00:12:13.839 --> 00:12:14.739 And I'm just like, you know what? 00:12:14.744 --> 00:12:15.399 Screw that. 00:12:15.479 --> 00:12:18.479 , I'm just gonna make a flow that as soon as assessment's created, I'm gonna 00:12:18.479 --> 00:12:20.949 manage all the , notifications to fire. 00:12:20.949 --> 00:12:24.536 I'll do that from a workflow, and it was stupid easy. 00:12:25.976 --> 00:12:28.706 And so now it's almost to the point I'm not quite there, but I'm at 00:12:28.706 --> 00:12:33.099 the tipping point where I can say, look like I, I'm not even, I'm not 00:12:33.099 --> 00:12:34.449 even starting with business rules. 00:12:34.449 --> 00:12:36.029 I'm gonna start with script with, uh, flow design. 00:12:36.593 --> 00:12:39.303 CJ: Yeah, , you and I both have , a shared client, ? That built their 00:12:39.303 --> 00:12:41.063 instance, , flow Designer first, right? 00:12:41.063 --> 00:12:43.763 And they had some constraints that they were working around to do that. 00:12:43.768 --> 00:12:46.713 But again, it goes back to, constraints breed, , innovation. 00:12:46.713 --> 00:12:49.593 And so the, some of the things that they're using Flow Designer to do, 00:12:49.759 --> 00:12:52.729 our literally amazing and things that I would've never considered. 00:12:53.494 --> 00:12:55.119 So , it's getting there, right? 00:12:55.449 --> 00:12:57.939 And so my next one, right? 00:12:57.939 --> 00:13:01.149 One of the favorite things that I'm seeing is the momentum of the product 00:13:01.449 --> 00:13:03.309 towards low code and ease of use. 00:13:03.729 --> 00:13:08.929 There is just , this large, unstoppable force of at ServiceNow 00:13:08.929 --> 00:13:13.999 that is just pushing the product into corners where it's never existed 00:13:13.999 --> 00:13:19.589 before in terms of approachability of folks, , of diverse skill sets. 00:13:20.009 --> 00:13:22.589 . So a as you were just saying, dude, like a lot of the folks 00:13:22.779 --> 00:13:23.979 that you're mentoring, right? 00:13:23.984 --> 00:13:28.454 They don't necessarily have years and years of service now experience, right? 00:13:28.454 --> 00:13:31.604 But they built the SOAP app for you in the matter of a couple hours. 00:13:31.854 --> 00:13:33.834 . You couldn't have done that 10 years ago, man. 00:13:35.394 --> 00:13:35.784 Duke: No. 00:13:35.844 --> 00:13:36.174 No, for 00:13:36.334 --> 00:13:38.794 CJ: It, the, the pro like part, the product was great. 00:13:38.914 --> 00:13:40.324 , it wasn't there yet though. 00:13:40.324 --> 00:13:44.621 It wasn't non-technical jump in build app, it wasn't there. 00:13:44.626 --> 00:13:46.271 Technical jump in, build an app. 00:13:46.271 --> 00:13:46.691 Sure. 00:13:46.691 --> 00:13:48.941 Probably in a week, not in a couple hours. 00:13:49.041 --> 00:13:50.181 , I just love to see it. 00:13:50.491 --> 00:13:52.981 , there's so much of this that makes my life easier. 00:13:53.556 --> 00:13:56.616 Because even though , I'm really proficient with code at this point and 00:13:56.616 --> 00:13:57.936 I'm really proficient with ServiceNow. 00:13:58.716 --> 00:14:02.796 Anything that allows me to scale my skillset and get through, , client 00:14:02.796 --> 00:14:07.099 requirements faster is a win for me and the client . And so I know a lot of folks 00:14:07.099 --> 00:14:09.979 out there are thinking, oh my God, you know, they're moving towards low code, 00:14:09.979 --> 00:14:11.179 they're moving towards ease of use. 00:14:11.329 --> 00:14:15.409 They're not gonna need us senior level folks, bss, they, they will 00:14:15.709 --> 00:14:17.329 always need senior level folks, right? 00:14:17.329 --> 00:14:20.579 In this ecosystem, ? Because the things that you know, are things 00:14:20.579 --> 00:14:24.359 that other people don't yet know and take a long time to learn, right? 00:14:24.389 --> 00:14:27.299 And so when you get into a situation with a client and they're like, 00:14:27.299 --> 00:14:31.229 Hey, I need to do this one thing, and , you jump into flow design and. 00:14:32.624 --> 00:14:35.264 Well, flow designer can't yet do that one thing, right? 00:14:35.264 --> 00:14:37.964 , or you know, you want to do it in a low-code way and it turns out 00:14:37.964 --> 00:14:40.994 well, you can't actually do that thing with condition builder. 00:14:41.264 --> 00:14:42.164 Now what do you do? 00:14:42.734 --> 00:14:42.914 Right? 00:14:43.034 --> 00:14:46.244 Or you've seen this before and because you've seen it before, 00:14:46.244 --> 00:14:48.734 you know exactly where you need to go do it to tweak it, right? 00:14:48.734 --> 00:14:52.414 Like there's always gonna be the market , for a skillset in this, ecosystem. 00:14:52.744 --> 00:14:56.239 But, We should all be embraced and the fact that all of this stuff is now 00:14:56.244 --> 00:15:00.829 easier for all of us to do, and that's really appreciated from my perspective. 00:15:01.219 --> 00:15:02.134 , Duke: I totally get you. 00:15:02.134 --> 00:15:04.114 It's like the stuff that's coming out with Vancouver with the new, 00:15:04.384 --> 00:15:04.714 CJ: Yeah. 00:15:04.844 --> 00:15:08.169 Duke: The easier to describe conditions so you don't have to write scripts for it. 00:15:08.174 --> 00:15:12.309 Like are, is the user logged in, like it's just menu driven now 00:15:12.879 --> 00:15:14.379 CJ: Right, right. 00:15:14.663 --> 00:15:17.903 Duke: Or are the impersonating and Holy cow, dude, I just had an aha moment. 00:15:18.653 --> 00:15:19.553 CJ: Oh, oh. 00:15:19.943 --> 00:15:21.983 Duke: Okay, so this is all coming from the screenshot that we got 00:15:21.983 --> 00:15:24.923 from Vancouver and blah, blah, blah, safe harbor and all that stuff. 00:15:25.206 --> 00:15:28.236 but there's that thing that they're adding to acls where basically like you 00:15:28.241 --> 00:15:30.576 can add those new types of conditions 00:15:31.501 --> 00:15:31.851 CJ: Right. 00:15:31.926 --> 00:15:34.776 Duke: one of the ones I saw on that list was, is impersonating, 00:15:35.401 --> 00:15:35.691 CJ: Yeah. 00:15:36.396 --> 00:15:37.476 Duke: which is awesome 00:15:37.926 --> 00:15:41.541 because have you ever been in a position where it's like, Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:15:41.541 --> 00:15:43.881 I know I, I need to impersonate this person, but I'm not going 00:15:43.881 --> 00:15:46.221 for the a c l experience. 00:15:46.221 --> 00:15:46.611 Right. 00:15:47.571 --> 00:15:47.661 CJ: Right. 00:15:47.961 --> 00:15:48.411 Duke: You know what I mean? 00:15:48.416 --> 00:15:50.691 Just let me do what I wanna do as this person, but you 00:15:50.691 --> 00:15:52.011 can't do it as that person because 00:15:52.071 --> 00:15:53.091 CJ: Oh my God, I didn't even think 00:15:53.156 --> 00:15:53.271 Duke: like, 00:15:57.261 --> 00:15:58.041 CJ: changer. 00:15:58.041 --> 00:16:00.426 Duke: it could be, I remember a couple times where it's happened, 00:16:00.426 --> 00:16:01.416 it's just like, I get it. 00:16:01.416 --> 00:16:01.716 I know. 00:16:01.746 --> 00:16:04.416 I know why you're trying to stop me, but I promise you, I'm 00:16:04.416 --> 00:16:06.006 not here for the a c L stuff. 00:16:06.011 --> 00:16:07.656 I'm here for something completely different. 00:16:08.166 --> 00:16:08.616 CJ: Right. 00:16:08.856 --> 00:16:14.226 I'm here and I need to be in this context, but I need to have powers in this context. 00:16:14.226 --> 00:16:20.166 Duke: just let me see the record, please just let me see the record. 00:16:20.676 --> 00:16:21.126 CJ: Right. 00:16:22.716 --> 00:16:24.456 And you know, and, and, yeah. 00:16:24.456 --> 00:16:25.326 Oh man, that's game changer. 00:16:25.326 --> 00:16:25.806 That's awesome. 00:16:26.006 --> 00:16:26.686 I didn't even think of that. 00:16:27.359 --> 00:16:28.559 So that goes back to my point, right? 00:16:28.559 --> 00:16:31.519 There'll always be a market for expertise , in this ecosystem, right? 00:16:31.519 --> 00:16:35.319 Because , folks like us have seen this before and know that this can be an 00:16:35.324 --> 00:16:37.689 issue and know how to now to go fix it. 00:16:37.749 --> 00:16:39.729 And it's easier now to also fix 00:16:40.038 --> 00:16:42.888 Duke: If only for the reason that it makes life easier for me. 00:16:43.973 --> 00:16:44.323 CJ: right? 00:16:44.403 --> 00:16:46.923 Duke: You know, 'cause I didn't, like, I didn't grow up building 00:16:46.923 --> 00:16:48.243 solutions with JavaScript. 00:16:48.243 --> 00:16:50.823 Like, I didn't come at it from I'm a hardcore developer, a full stack 00:16:50.828 --> 00:16:52.953 developer, welcome to ServiceNow. 00:16:53.283 --> 00:16:56.613 I came at it from, hey, totally average guy 00:16:58.488 --> 00:16:59.028 CJ: Yeah. 00:16:59.088 --> 00:16:59.598 Yeah. 00:16:59.603 --> 00:16:59.848 Right. 00:16:59.883 --> 00:17:01.713 Duke: mediocre man, here's ServiceNow. 00:17:01.718 --> 00:17:02.733 You're in charge of it now. 00:17:03.063 --> 00:17:03.933 I'm like, oh, okay. 00:17:04.473 --> 00:17:04.863 You know? 00:17:04.863 --> 00:17:07.193 And over 15 years it got good, but , as they make that stuff 00:17:07.198 --> 00:17:08.663 more and more easy, oh dude. 00:17:09.383 --> 00:17:12.133 Pray the Lord that they hear this for the, , UI builder. 00:17:13.093 --> 00:17:14.803 Can we please just make that easier? 00:17:15.993 --> 00:17:16.453 CJ: There, there, 00:17:16.453 --> 00:17:18.193 Duke: please make that easier, please? 00:17:18.823 --> 00:17:20.893 CJ: there's some stuff in Vancouver about that too. 00:17:20.893 --> 00:17:21.103 Right? 00:17:21.103 --> 00:17:25.753 And I'm not qualified enough in UI builder to talk about how easy or how much easier 00:17:25.753 --> 00:17:27.523 it'll actually make the process go. 00:17:27.528 --> 00:17:28.758 , because it's been hard. 00:17:28.968 --> 00:17:33.638 Um, but you know, I, I do think that they hear us and I do think that, , The 00:17:33.638 --> 00:17:36.913 gods of ServiceNow , are moving , their hammer in that direction, right? 00:17:36.913 --> 00:17:39.653 To get that working, , for more of us average folks. 00:17:39.653 --> 00:17:41.193 And I agree with you, , I'm not a coder dude. 00:17:41.193 --> 00:17:44.438 At least I wasn't right until ServiceNow, because I grew up in the days of Doss. 00:17:44.438 --> 00:17:47.668 But like the first time I wrote JavaScript, It was the first time 00:17:47.668 --> 00:17:49.698 I, , logged into a ServiceNow instance. 00:17:49.698 --> 00:17:53.248 It's one of those things you, I built the muscle and, , as a side note, 00:17:53.253 --> 00:17:56.308 right, if you listen to this and you don't know how to cope, it's possible. 00:17:56.338 --> 00:17:57.178 I didn't know. 00:17:57.418 --> 00:17:59.398 I now know it is possible. 00:17:59.803 --> 00:18:02.073 Duke: I go a lot of that in my, coaching cohort, like a lot of 00:18:02.073 --> 00:18:04.233 people are too approaching it that they don't have a technical 00:18:04.238 --> 00:18:08.073 background or that kind of technical background, and I'm just like, look. 00:18:08.568 --> 00:18:09.528 You're gonna learn how to code. 00:18:09.528 --> 00:18:10.788 And it's not the end of the world. 00:18:10.788 --> 00:18:12.588 It's not as big a scary thing as you think. 00:18:12.588 --> 00:18:14.868 'cause it's, again, I think you, I think you said it in one of our 00:18:14.868 --> 00:18:17.688 episodes, like, look, we're not training you to be a JavaScript developer. 00:18:19.278 --> 00:18:19.758 You know what I mean? 00:18:19.763 --> 00:18:22.488 We're training you to know enough JavaScript is to work in ServiceNow. 00:18:22.488 --> 00:18:25.598 And there's a big, huge difference between the two of those. 00:18:25.658 --> 00:18:26.828 Anyway, we're going way off topic 00:18:26.873 --> 00:18:27.143 CJ: No. 00:18:27.173 --> 00:18:29.458 Yeah, no, but, but here, I gotta rant for this, right? 00:18:29.458 --> 00:18:32.158 Because I think a lot of people forget this, right? 00:18:32.158 --> 00:18:33.738 , or sometimes , they never knew, right? 00:18:33.738 --> 00:18:35.808 But in this market, in our ecosystem. 00:18:36.408 --> 00:18:40.038 Co companies aren't hiring you like in in clients, right? 00:18:40.038 --> 00:18:41.748 Like the ServiceNow customers. 00:18:41.748 --> 00:18:45.678 They're not hiring you to be like amazing JavaScript developers, right? 00:18:45.678 --> 00:18:49.028 They're not hiring you to do wizardry, ? In the platform. 00:18:49.178 --> 00:18:53.588 They're hiring you to solve problems with technology. 00:18:53.938 --> 00:18:55.348 That's what they're hiring you. 00:18:55.708 --> 00:19:02.038 They don't care if you do that with the Condition Builder or JavaScript or 00:19:02.038 --> 00:19:05.608 Doss Script of 640 K of conventional. 00:19:05.668 --> 00:19:06.478 They don't care. 00:19:07.618 --> 00:19:08.068 They don't care. 00:19:08.068 --> 00:19:11.368 They got an outcome that they're looking to achieve, and you are 00:19:11.368 --> 00:19:13.498 there to facilitate that, right? 00:19:13.498 --> 00:19:17.826 You're there to get them to that outcome and so, When you start thinking 00:19:17.826 --> 00:19:21.576 about, oh man, coding, I'm got, I gotta be able to be a full stack dev. 00:19:21.906 --> 00:19:26.166 You don't, you need to know enough JavaScript to get you to be able to solve 00:19:26.171 --> 00:19:28.146 problems on the ServiceNow platform. 00:19:28.536 --> 00:19:29.496 That's what you need. 00:19:29.796 --> 00:19:30.996 You don't need anything else. 00:19:31.439 --> 00:19:32.219 Sorry, ran off. 00:19:32.249 --> 00:19:32.549 That's 00:19:32.744 --> 00:19:33.284 Duke: that's okay. 00:19:33.284 --> 00:19:33.854 That's a good one. 00:19:34.234 --> 00:19:35.104 alright, let's see. 00:19:35.164 --> 00:19:36.514 Um, whose turn is it? 00:19:37.339 --> 00:19:38.029 CJ: uh, is yours? 00:19:38.584 --> 00:19:39.094 Or, yep. 00:19:39.124 --> 00:19:39.964 'cause I, uh, 'cause 00:19:39.964 --> 00:19:40.924 Duke: got two of these now. 00:19:43.834 --> 00:19:44.554 CJ: so, right. 00:19:44.554 --> 00:19:47.464 So I, so well, let's, let's, let's meta this one out a little bit, right. 00:19:47.704 --> 00:19:50.734 Took us 20 minutes to figure out what we're gonna talk about today. 00:19:50.884 --> 00:19:52.504 And now 20 minutes in. 00:19:52.624 --> 00:19:54.274 We've talked about two of those things. 00:19:54.919 --> 00:19:56.029 Duke: Two of the six things. 00:19:56.569 --> 00:19:58.159 , okay, well, I, let's just roll with it. 00:19:58.159 --> 00:19:58.729 I'll tell you another 00:19:58.864 --> 00:19:59.254 CJ: Go for 00:19:59.419 --> 00:20:02.953 Duke: I mean, it goes off of your rant though too, is that, there are 00:20:02.953 --> 00:20:06.853 different things when I'm putting 'em together, explore and S N U tills, 00:20:07.258 --> 00:20:07.828 CJ: Yeah. 00:20:08.008 --> 00:20:08.668 Oh yeah. 00:20:09.488 --> 00:20:12.848 Duke: And I know they were built for serious developers, but it makes life 00:20:12.848 --> 00:20:17.711 so much easier for even beginning level, devs and ss n u util specifically. 00:20:18.041 --> 00:20:21.641 Like I know that thing does a ton of stuff, but I use it every 00:20:21.641 --> 00:20:23.141 single day in background scripts. 00:20:23.504 --> 00:20:25.934 It just makes background scripts so much better. 00:20:25.984 --> 00:20:29.624 . Color coded and, , it does that whole type of head thing on the object. 00:20:29.624 --> 00:20:30.674 So it's like glide record. 00:20:31.034 --> 00:20:32.084 Ah, and it's like aqui. 00:20:35.509 --> 00:20:37.109 CJ: It like clip without the clippy. 00:20:37.114 --> 00:20:38.009 Did you mean tag? 00:20:39.404 --> 00:20:41.444 Duke: But even variables that you described, right? 00:20:41.714 --> 00:20:43.844 Like and then, then becoming that type of head thing. 00:20:43.844 --> 00:20:46.274 I know there's a proper name for what these kind of tools are. 00:20:46.424 --> 00:20:46.934 I don't care. 00:20:46.934 --> 00:20:48.914 Like ss n u till is red hot that way. 00:20:49.496 --> 00:20:49.856 CJ: Yeah. 00:20:49.946 --> 00:20:51.506 I'm, I'm with you a hundred percent on these, right? 00:20:51.506 --> 00:20:55.046 , I think anything that makes the, development experience easier right? 00:20:55.046 --> 00:21:00.581 And allows you to scale, , your time better, ? It is akay in my book, and so I, 00:21:00.586 --> 00:21:02.171 I totally agree with you on both of these. 00:21:02.171 --> 00:21:03.371 So they're both awesome. 00:21:03.671 --> 00:21:05.696 And it goes back, to , my previous ran, right? 00:21:05.746 --> 00:21:07.996 This stuff going low code and ease of use. 00:21:08.266 --> 00:21:12.946 We've already in the ecosystem have been building those things, right? 00:21:12.946 --> 00:21:15.436 Like in ServiceNow, it's just getting a hit and starting to build it themselves. 00:21:16.029 --> 00:21:20.469 All right, so, um, my next one is , data certification right? 00:21:20.469 --> 00:21:20.889 Is an. 00:21:22.719 --> 00:21:25.059 Unsung hero of a ServiceNow instance. 00:21:25.389 --> 00:21:26.559 It is Really? 00:21:27.669 --> 00:21:27.999 Yeah, man. 00:21:28.089 --> 00:21:34.009 Like it's, so I built the whole app using this thing, , that allowed, I. 00:21:34.374 --> 00:21:39.094 Organizational wide, , certification of distribution lists, right? 00:21:39.099 --> 00:21:42.369 The idea behind it was there's a ton of distribution lists here. 00:21:42.699 --> 00:21:44.889 Nobody knows who owned, who owns them. 00:21:45.099 --> 00:21:48.374 People often transition between departments, , or 00:21:48.374 --> 00:21:49.694 out of the, , organization. 00:21:49.699 --> 00:21:54.114 Somebody needs to, , do the care and feeding of the membership, , of these 00:21:54.114 --> 00:21:56.724 groups, and nobody's willing to do that. 00:21:56.964 --> 00:21:58.584 So how about everybody do it? 00:21:59.404 --> 00:22:04.144 . And so using data certification, I hacked it a little bit and had it running 00:22:04.144 --> 00:22:09.034 against, , group objects and ownership and, but boom, bad bing bad, boom. 00:22:09.034 --> 00:22:11.644 Now you've got data certification objects going out to the owner 00:22:11.934 --> 00:22:14.994 of every distribution list that you have in your C M D B. 00:22:15.264 --> 00:22:17.374 Another thing about it that was just so cool. 00:22:17.554 --> 00:22:17.884 Cool. 00:22:17.884 --> 00:22:20.194 So cool is that , we had this concept where you could then 00:22:20.194 --> 00:22:23.284 nominate a new owner based on the people in, , the membership list. 00:22:23.284 --> 00:22:24.604 Anyway, I'm going on the tangent. 00:22:24.724 --> 00:22:28.289 My point is, is that data certification built was the , backbone of that app. 00:22:28.289 --> 00:22:28.619 Right. 00:22:28.624 --> 00:22:29.269 And it allowed. 00:22:30.454 --> 00:22:36.664 This ability to run on a schedule, to run ad hoc, to be a good front end 00:22:36.904 --> 00:22:40.354 for the user experience so that folks can just go into the portal, click a 00:22:40.359 --> 00:22:43.954 few buttons, you know, that stuff goes back to data certification and gens 00:22:43.954 --> 00:22:47.349 it up and then it, either re accepts or rejects it, that sort of thing. 00:22:47.379 --> 00:22:47.529 Right? 00:22:47.529 --> 00:22:51.999 It's just such an amazing thing that I think is underutilized because it's 00:22:52.089 --> 00:22:53.949 often only looked at through this. 00:22:53.984 --> 00:22:57.974 The lens of the C M D B and not what other processes that you 00:22:57.974 --> 00:23:00.104 might need to certify, right? 00:23:00.104 --> 00:23:05.299 What do you need to understand, , whether or not it's been done or needs to be 00:23:05.304 --> 00:23:09.619 done and who owns it and, , attributes that might need to change on a fly. 00:23:09.619 --> 00:23:10.999 You know, all of these sorts of things, right? 00:23:11.049 --> 00:23:13.359 , there's a whole list of things that I can think of, right? 00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:14.019 That they, 00:23:14.044 --> 00:23:14.884 Duke: fundamental thing, right? 00:23:14.884 --> 00:23:16.294 Like data goes stale. 00:23:16.839 --> 00:23:17.229 CJ: yes. 00:23:17.709 --> 00:23:18.219 Yes. 00:23:18.949 --> 00:23:21.869 Duke: and it's like, how would you normally make sure 00:23:21.874 --> 00:23:23.399 that this data is not stale? 00:23:23.399 --> 00:23:28.859 And so why not put a workflow around the upbeat band certification of the data? 00:23:29.369 --> 00:23:30.029 CJ: Yes. 00:23:30.959 --> 00:23:36.299 Duke: it's kind of one of those things that you have to sit back and just marvel 00:23:36.299 --> 00:23:39.209 at the simple, elegant beauty of it. 00:23:39.493 --> 00:23:42.758 What I mean, , and plus they did need a certain specific 00:23:42.758 --> 00:23:44.048 in interface for that, right? 00:23:44.048 --> 00:23:47.678 Because it was kind like, Hey, are all these a hundred records? 00:23:47.678 --> 00:23:48.128 Correct. 00:23:48.128 --> 00:23:50.098 And of course, you don't want to be pulling each one of those 00:23:50.098 --> 00:23:51.808 things up on a form like a pleb, 00:23:52.648 --> 00:23:53.098 CJ: Right. 00:23:53.188 --> 00:23:55.853 Duke: it gives you the interface to say like, change five or six of 00:23:55.853 --> 00:23:57.383 'em at a time this way, that way. 00:23:58.013 --> 00:23:58.313 CJ: yeah. 00:23:58.313 --> 00:24:01.313 And it also gives you the interface two of grouping them together. 00:24:01.343 --> 00:24:04.338 'cause you'd also don't want to go in and have to say these six. 00:24:04.463 --> 00:24:07.913 , servers go to Mike and these 20 go to Jen, right? 00:24:07.913 --> 00:24:09.653 Like, you don't want to have to be able to do that. 00:24:09.653 --> 00:24:12.743 So you go in and you can set condition builders, boom. 00:24:12.743 --> 00:24:16.083 And now Mike gets everything that's a VMware server, and Jen gets 00:24:16.083 --> 00:24:17.943 everything that's in Azure, right? 00:24:17.943 --> 00:24:18.663 Things like that. 00:24:18.668 --> 00:24:21.878 And if you do it correctly, this thing. 00:24:22.348 --> 00:24:27.988 Practically runs itself after you set it up and you get the be, you 00:24:27.988 --> 00:24:29.518 just reap the rewards of that. 00:24:29.788 --> 00:24:35.728 You can get a report that says, yeah, everything is solid, and you can stand 00:24:35.728 --> 00:24:39.448 behind that because you know why you can stand behind that because other 00:24:39.448 --> 00:24:41.468 people have validated that is solid. 00:24:42.148 --> 00:24:44.368 The subject matter experts like. 00:24:44.873 --> 00:24:48.713 You don't understand like how, like most people don't understand like how important 00:24:48.713 --> 00:24:52.203 this is, , for business when they're doing things like asset management, 00:24:52.503 --> 00:24:54.423 especially things like asset management. 00:24:54.573 --> 00:24:55.593 What do we have? 00:24:55.743 --> 00:24:56.043 I dunno. 00:24:56.733 --> 00:24:57.063 Right? 00:24:57.063 --> 00:24:58.353 Somebody needs to figure it out. 00:24:59.703 --> 00:25:02.913 Duke: I mean, doesn't everybody on the process world say like trust but verify? 00:25:03.123 --> 00:25:03.453 Okay. 00:25:03.453 --> 00:25:05.103 So tell me again how you're gonna verify. 00:25:05.823 --> 00:25:09.086 CJ: Right, and now that we've validated it, we've gone through this asset 00:25:09.086 --> 00:25:13.276 management process, we've got all of our assets logged into, , ServiceNow, 00:25:13.276 --> 00:25:17.176 we've got correspondence, c MDBs form right now, how do we make sure that we 00:25:17.176 --> 00:25:21.916 don't have to redo this work again in six months or a year or a year and a half? 00:25:22.156 --> 00:25:24.196 Data certification takes care of that for you. 00:25:24.346 --> 00:25:26.356 This stuff is expensive, right? 00:25:26.356 --> 00:25:28.846 In man hours, like certifying data. 00:25:29.671 --> 00:25:29.971 Duke: Yep, 00:25:30.781 --> 00:25:33.211 CJ: So, yeah, this one's an unsung hero in my book. 00:25:33.211 --> 00:25:33.601 I love it. 00:25:33.978 --> 00:25:37.458 Duke: I, I remember that app you built with it and I haven't had a good 00:25:37.458 --> 00:25:41.638 opportunity to really leverage it, but ever since I saw what you did there, 00:25:41.908 --> 00:25:45.268 I was like, it always something, it's a checkbox in my head when somebody's 00:25:45.268 --> 00:25:46.948 describing an app to me, I'm like, Hmm. 00:25:47.098 --> 00:25:49.228 Is there anything in here that sounds like I'm gonna have to 00:25:49.378 --> 00:25:50.728 babysit the data a little bit 00:25:51.103 --> 00:25:51.453 CJ: Right. 00:25:51.958 --> 00:25:54.298 Duke: if so, let me get data certification underneath it. 00:25:54.593 --> 00:25:55.283 CJ: Exactly. 00:25:55.313 --> 00:25:56.663 It's like, let's go ahead and get you in here. 00:25:56.663 --> 00:25:57.443 Let's do something with it. 00:25:58.478 --> 00:25:58.868 Duke: Yeah. 00:25:59.091 --> 00:25:59.571 Um, 00:25:59.626 --> 00:26:00.026 CJ: got, duke? 00:26:00.268 --> 00:26:00.538 Duke: Okay. 00:26:00.538 --> 00:26:01.708 A lot of things at once. 00:26:01.708 --> 00:26:04.978 Reporting in pa, I know it's a big thing. 00:26:05.134 --> 00:26:05.284 I. 00:26:05.284 --> 00:26:09.174 love it and I, I don't love it in terms of fulfilling the insight minds of 00:26:09.174 --> 00:26:12.324 people like, oh look, could you gimme a report with incidents by priority? 00:26:12.354 --> 00:26:14.784 And since that didn't illuminate the many, he is like, well, gimme 00:26:14.784 --> 00:26:16.494 one by incident by category. 00:26:17.544 --> 00:26:20.184 Um, I love the mindful. 00:26:20.423 --> 00:26:24.563 Thinking of the outcomes that the process is trying to achieve and then 00:26:24.563 --> 00:26:26.483 measuring for the support of the outcomes. 00:26:26.753 --> 00:26:30.386 And I, and I especially love building dashboards for 00:26:30.386 --> 00:26:32.426 different roles in the process. 00:26:32.456 --> 00:26:32.756 Like it's 00:26:32.761 --> 00:26:35.846 not like everybody in the process has to have the same dashboard 00:26:35.846 --> 00:26:36.866 where you have one dashboard. 00:26:36.866 --> 00:26:38.606 It's like, that's such a stupid idea, right? 00:26:38.606 --> 00:26:41.516 Like, well, these four things are for you and these four things are for you. 00:26:41.516 --> 00:26:45.116 We just put them together and mix it up because, yeah. 00:26:45.116 --> 00:26:45.476 Anyway. 00:26:45.986 --> 00:26:46.496 CJ: Yeah. 00:26:46.556 --> 00:26:46.796 No. 00:26:46.801 --> 00:26:46.996 Right. 00:26:48.086 --> 00:26:51.146 Duke: I love, I think the unsung hero of the platform 00:26:51.146 --> 00:26:53.376 is, , like the number reports, 00:26:53.628 --> 00:26:55.693 do this query and show me the number. 00:26:56.113 --> 00:26:56.563 CJ: Yeah. 00:26:56.593 --> 00:27:00.923 Duke: there's 42 of them and , if you just think about an operator 00:27:00.923 --> 00:27:02.423 report, I call 'em operator reports. 00:27:02.423 --> 00:27:04.953 It's the reports that go in front of people who are required 00:27:04.953 --> 00:27:06.333 to do the day-to-day activity. 00:27:06.918 --> 00:27:07.428 CJ: Yeah. 00:27:07.788 --> 00:27:10.758 Duke: And all they care about is, dude, just show me like what the 00:27:10.758 --> 00:27:12.888 next most important one to do is. 00:27:13.408 --> 00:27:13.758 CJ: Right. 00:27:14.124 --> 00:27:16.484 Duke: And that could be boiled down to a dashboard with three 00:27:16.484 --> 00:27:19.064 or four numbers on it, you know, how to make it super complicated. 00:27:19.508 --> 00:27:19.898 Let the 00:27:19.898 --> 00:27:23.858 analysts go deep on the, line graphs and the paretos and the pie 00:27:23.858 --> 00:27:25.898 charts and the, and the whatevers. 00:27:25.928 --> 00:27:27.548 Let the analysts go deep on that. 00:27:27.608 --> 00:27:31.178 But for the operators, it's just like, get the most important work in front of them. 00:27:31.539 --> 00:27:35.619 CJ: I still think that you talk about reporting in probably the 00:27:35.619 --> 00:27:39.429 best way in this ecosystem because you see it from the perspective of 00:27:39.434 --> 00:27:41.469 the people who are doing the work. 00:27:41.679 --> 00:27:45.399 People who need to analyze the results of the people who are doing the work and the 00:27:45.399 --> 00:27:47.199 people who need the plan, the next thing. 00:27:47.469 --> 00:27:47.799 Right? 00:27:48.759 --> 00:27:52.229 And, reporting is the thing that allows you to know that you're achieving the 00:27:52.229 --> 00:27:56.249 outcomes that you're trying to achieve and where to adjust if you're not, 00:27:57.794 --> 00:27:58.334 Duke: That's right. 00:27:58.334 --> 00:28:02.379 I mean, I always beg my coaching cohorts to , think about the outcomes 00:28:02.379 --> 00:28:06.069 first, or just imagine that you're paying for this thing in pushups 00:28:06.614 --> 00:28:06.964 CJ: right. 00:28:07.419 --> 00:28:08.499 Duke: or your own money. 00:28:10.479 --> 00:28:12.309 Why are you gonna spend this money for it? 00:28:12.309 --> 00:28:17.139 Like it would won't blink an eye like, is it six 600 or like a hundred thousand 00:28:17.139 --> 00:28:18.909 dollars implementation of whatever. 00:28:19.329 --> 00:28:21.039 But what if you had to pay for that? 00:28:21.879 --> 00:28:25.929 Like I don't, I don't have six fees just lying around and so I had 00:28:25.929 --> 00:28:29.169 better be damn sure that's gonna improve something for my life. 00:28:29.199 --> 00:28:30.339 Okay, so you get it implemented. 00:28:30.339 --> 00:28:30.549 Okay. 00:28:30.549 --> 00:28:34.133 Did it improve my life by like a hundred thousand dollars factor? 00:28:34.133 --> 00:28:34.913 How do I know? 00:28:35.633 --> 00:28:35.993 CJ: Right. 00:28:36.683 --> 00:28:39.473 Duke: Well, you don't, because most people put, do reporting error 00:28:39.478 --> 00:28:41.543 quotes on their scopes of work. 00:28:41.793 --> 00:28:44.853 But I love, I love the capability that sits underneath. 00:28:45.163 --> 00:28:49.633 I love just thinking about reports, like what report indicates performance and 00:28:49.633 --> 00:28:51.536 then putting PA on top of that, right? 00:28:51.536 --> 00:28:56.246 So if I know my outcomes, I can get PA to measure the outcomes and like every 00:28:56.246 --> 00:28:57.896 single day I can see, am I getting. 00:28:58.451 --> 00:28:59.711 Closer to what I need. 00:28:59.711 --> 00:29:01.391 Am I getting farther away from what I need? 00:29:01.811 --> 00:29:04.571 And I guess the last thing I'll throw in here too, is that it 00:29:04.571 --> 00:29:08.081 allows me to make smart decisions about managerial energy, right? 00:29:08.086 --> 00:29:12.521 Like it's not like we could just say, make all the outcomes we're pursuing go up. 00:29:13.601 --> 00:29:16.721 And in fact, that would be a stupid way of operating, right? 00:29:17.111 --> 00:29:17.501 CJ: Yep. 00:29:17.721 --> 00:29:19.881 , Duke: if you're in the incident domain, and. 00:29:20.371 --> 00:29:25.458 , everybody's super ultra responsive to the tickets, Ultra responsive to the tickets. 00:29:25.878 --> 00:29:29.663 Do you want to force it to improve when it's already up 00:29:29.663 --> 00:29:31.163 above everybody's expectation? 00:29:31.163 --> 00:29:33.803 Meanwhile, you're some other metric is down. 00:29:34.279 --> 00:29:37.669 why would you, like, you only have a, you can only have a time enough to 00:29:37.669 --> 00:29:43.509 drive one or two elements, and so it's like, PA allows you to get to a point 00:29:43.509 --> 00:29:45.549 where you don't care about a metric. 00:29:46.299 --> 00:29:49.239 We solved that whole response time thing. 00:29:49.599 --> 00:29:50.529 We've solved that. 00:29:50.769 --> 00:29:53.589 Now we're onto the next big managerial dragon to slay. 00:29:54.108 --> 00:29:54.628 CJ: Exactly. 00:29:54.668 --> 00:29:57.008 , allows for the efficient allocation of resources. 00:29:57.058 --> 00:30:00.508 . And that is something because we all have finite resources. 00:30:00.728 --> 00:30:04.598 , this reminds me of a quote by a, a guy named Red, uh, red aar. 00:30:04.628 --> 00:30:05.648 He was a firefighter. 00:30:05.958 --> 00:30:09.078 And the quote is, if you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do 00:30:09.078 --> 00:30:11.448 the job, wait until you hire an amateur. 00:30:12.333 --> 00:30:12.663 Right. 00:30:16.009 --> 00:30:19.419 and so the reason that popped in my head based on what you're talking about, right? 00:30:19.419 --> 00:30:23.524 Is, is because all of these things are things , that professionals bring to 00:30:23.524 --> 00:30:28.224 the table, and every company, no matter how big they are, has finite resources 00:30:28.229 --> 00:30:30.954 devoted to specific tasks, right? 00:30:31.164 --> 00:30:35.244 if you want to actually get the job done in a. 00:30:35.724 --> 00:30:39.314 reasonably, , respectable man manner you need to have a professional, 00:30:39.374 --> 00:30:40.754 this is how professionals think. 00:30:41.414 --> 00:30:43.299 So anyway, that's kind of the tangent. 00:30:43.299 --> 00:30:47.896 I, I probably took it just because I really liked the quote, but, do 00:30:47.986 --> 00:30:50.506 we are at like 40 minutes to record? 00:30:50.536 --> 00:30:52.786 Uh, do you, do we have time for anything else? 00:30:53.721 --> 00:30:54.801 Duke: We have time for one more. 00:30:55.251 --> 00:30:55.491 CJ: I got. 00:30:55.641 --> 00:30:57.651 All right, so here, , I'll jump this one in here. 00:30:58.041 --> 00:31:01.161 Virtual agent is one of my favorite things. 00:31:01.371 --> 00:31:05.391 , What I love about virtual agent is, , aside from all of the exciting 00:31:05.391 --> 00:31:10.586 possibilities now with, , gen ai, , I love that virtual agent allows folks to 00:31:10.586 --> 00:31:15.086 interact with the system in a different way, in a more approachable way, in a 00:31:15.086 --> 00:31:20.371 way that a lot of people are getting more familiar with, because they're often 00:31:20.371 --> 00:31:24.961 interacting with other services that they consume in the same way, right? 00:31:25.261 --> 00:31:29.101 , The ability on the backend of virtual agent to structure these 00:31:29.101 --> 00:31:34.291 conversations and to utilize different, , integrations and resources. 00:31:34.481 --> 00:31:37.516 One of the things that I did that I thought was, , really cool was. 00:31:38.651 --> 00:31:42.691 , I was able to, there, the client had a, external knowledge base and what 00:31:42.691 --> 00:31:47.731 they wanted to do was to have the virtual agent search both their internal 00:31:47.731 --> 00:31:51.731 knowledge base on the ServiceNow platform, but then go out and, search 00:31:51.731 --> 00:31:53.381 their external knowledge base as well. 00:31:53.381 --> 00:31:56.441 I think it was like write something or other Right Answer, write check. 00:31:56.441 --> 00:31:56.831 I dunno. 00:31:57.131 --> 00:31:58.891 And, , and it had a rest, a p i, right? 00:31:58.891 --> 00:32:01.291 And so, boom, by the b by the boom. 00:32:01.561 --> 00:32:04.321 , in the conversation designer, we pull a rest, a p i, we loop 00:32:04.321 --> 00:32:06.011 through those, returns, right? 00:32:06.011 --> 00:32:07.121 We get a little bit of a snippet. 00:32:07.121 --> 00:32:11.021 And now you've got in the chat window, you've got a return , on your search 00:32:11.021 --> 00:32:14.931 that has searched both, your on site and offsite knowledge basis, right? 00:32:15.011 --> 00:32:18.761 , and folks can page through that and select the one that they want, and, Incident 00:32:18.761 --> 00:32:20.831 deflection is my point here, right? 00:32:20.831 --> 00:32:24.641 You have a robot and the robot basically allows you to deflect an 00:32:24.641 --> 00:32:28.721 incident and it again, dovetails into more efficient use of resources. 00:32:29.301 --> 00:32:30.361 , and it's just really cool. 00:32:30.361 --> 00:32:30.962 I like playing with it. 00:32:32.604 --> 00:32:36.494 Duke: Oh man, I have a feeling that there's gonna be some, , greater than the 00:32:36.494 --> 00:32:41.204 sum of their parts collaboration between generative AI and virtual agent, right? 00:32:41.789 --> 00:32:42.179 CJ: Dude. 00:32:42.644 --> 00:32:44.759 Duke: Because virtual agent, , you had to structure it. 00:32:44.789 --> 00:32:47.459 You had to say, here is the best next step. 00:32:48.929 --> 00:32:53.119 But , now with gen ai, , if the language models are built correctly, 00:32:53.119 --> 00:32:57.359 maybe the virtual agent could be a little bit more, figure it out itself. 00:32:57.359 --> 00:32:57.809 What to do. 00:32:58.644 --> 00:33:01.764 CJ: That's what I'm hoping that the partnership in this direction goes. 00:33:01.769 --> 00:33:01.944 Right. 00:33:01.944 --> 00:33:07.284 Like the ability to have a bit more , open-ended conversations where, the 00:33:07.289 --> 00:33:09.174 coding that you do is more guiding. 00:33:09.604 --> 00:33:13.514 . , the AI to help the user get to the point where they want to be, but, not 00:33:13.514 --> 00:33:19.294 having to, structure each, step in the process, , very deliberately, right? 00:33:19.294 --> 00:33:21.124 , I think there will be a lot of value there. 00:33:21.454 --> 00:33:24.604 And the thing that I've always wanted, and we're so close, , is to be able 00:33:24.604 --> 00:33:26.584 to log into a virtual agent, right? 00:33:26.584 --> 00:33:29.614 And it's like, and I think you could, you can do some of this 'cause I have right? 00:33:29.884 --> 00:33:34.414 Say, oh, hey Corey, I see that you are in office building number seven. 00:33:34.924 --> 00:33:36.154 What can I help you with? 00:33:36.304 --> 00:33:37.234 Like I can't print. 00:33:37.264 --> 00:33:38.554 Oh, let's take a look. 00:33:38.614 --> 00:33:40.564 Looks like you're close to printer number three. 00:33:40.564 --> 00:33:42.274 Is that the printer that you're talking about? 00:33:42.514 --> 00:33:43.114 Yes it is. 00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:43.714 Okay, great. 00:33:43.714 --> 00:33:44.434 One second. 00:33:46.024 --> 00:33:47.914 It looks like that service is offline. 00:33:47.914 --> 00:33:49.504 Here, let me restart it for you. 00:33:50.854 --> 00:33:53.628 Try again, right? 00:33:53.698 --> 00:33:55.318 That's what I want. 00:33:55.318 --> 00:33:59.998 That is where the solution that I wanna deploy to clients and allow 00:33:59.998 --> 00:34:02.638 them to like just relu revolutionize. 00:34:03.733 --> 00:34:09.713 Revolution change, transform the way , that they do internal IT 00:34:09.713 --> 00:34:11.753 support and other process support. 00:34:12.136 --> 00:34:14.776 So that's why I think virtual agent is cool and that's why I think 00:34:14.776 --> 00:34:18.156 it's pretty much has limitless, potential, especially now with gen ai. 00:34:20.466 --> 00:34:22.146 Duke: Alright, those were a few of our favorite things. 00:34:22.146 --> 00:34:25.356 Why don't you, wherever you see this put in the comment section, what some 00:34:25.361 --> 00:34:28.386 of your favorite things are and why, and maybe we can bring you onto an episode. 00:34:29.406 --> 00:34:33.516 CJ: Yeah, and uh, and like it smashed that subscribe button or something like that. 00:34:35.454 --> 00:34:35.664 Duke: All right. 00:34:35.664 --> 00:34:36.294 We'll see you on the next one. 00:34:36.294 --> 00:34:36.564 Folks. 00:34:36.789 --> 00:34:37.929 CJ: and still no outro, 00:34:38.574 --> 00:34:40.464 Duke: Still no outro 90th episode. 00:34:40.674 --> 00:34:41.124 No outro. 00:34:41.859 --> 00:34:42.509 CJ: no outro.