I'm never going to make that quieter.
What's up? Welcome to better by Bitcoin episode. What is this?
007.
007. James Bond episode.
Today we have a few new faces. We're gonna be doing an episode
today on it's gonna sound like this is like a Bible study. It's
on the parable of the talents. My name is Anton Syme. I'm a
filmmaker, director of photography. I did the movies.
No safe spaces. What is a woman? Am I racist? I am in no way a
theologian. So I'm going to introduce this topic, although
doing theology is way out of my depth, but we're going to bring
it all together, bring it back to Bitcoin. So I guess we can
start out by just letting everybody else introduce
themselves. JD, you want to go first?
Sure. So I am JD. My goal and just kind of thing in life is
like the Bitcoin ad guy. I love telling stories, love doing
advertising, and I just really want to help move Bitcoin into
the mainstream ad space with just storytelling. What about
you, Bondur?
My name is Bondur. I have had, let's see, a career in finance.
Music, film, teaching, and engineering most recently. And
I've basically seen firsthand how fiat destroys all of these
industries from the inside out. And I'm here for Bitcoin. So
been a Christian for a long time, too. But yeah. Who's next?
We got Jordan and Brandon. Jordan.
Jordan. Yeah. So I'm the executive director of TGFB
Media. We exist to help Christians understand and use
Bitcoin for the glory of God and the good of people everywhere.
I have served as a missionary, a pastor, living overseas in
Uruguay. And yeah, I help Christians try to think about
Bitcoin in ways that aren't intuitively obvious to them.
And Brandon.
Yes, thank you. I'm Brandon Gentile. I am a former college
hockey player, professional hockey player turned business
guy for 10 years. Really a real estate guy, real estate
investor. And just the last handful of years, really became
a Bitcoin specifically, Bitcoin specific author, educator,
podcaster, and helped Bitcoin trading cards as well with their
back end and marketing and everything as well. So that team
there and that is really my last 15, 20 years.
I love it. Fun fact, if anybody didn't know it. Well, I don't
know. I don't know if I was supposed to out it. But when
there's Satoshi for Bitcoin trading cards, somebody here
might have been in that costume. But anyway, that was a fun
adventure. Yeah, Anthony, you want to kick us off with your
thoughts on this?
All right, sure. So Parable of Talents, what is it? It's a
story in the Bible. And it is Jesus speaking to the disciples
telling a parable. And you hear this get brought up. You hear
well, okay, let me backtrack a little bit. You hear people
sometimes in the progressive camp, especially on social
media, sometimes just say that Jesus was a socialist. And
another interesting thing about the Parable of Talents within
the Parable of Talents, and I'll tell the story of what it is
real quick. But he says the line, to each according to his
ability, which you may hear that line and think, wait, that's
not calling. Yeah. To to each according to his ability. From
each according to his ability to each according to his need is
what Karl Marx said. So Karl Marx, the, the author of the
Communist Manifesto, basically bastardized scripture. So it
gets really confusing for people. But in this parable,
Jesus tells a story of a master, basically a, you could call him
like a capitalist or like a business owner, a guy with
money. And he has three servants. And in the story, he
gives to one servant five talents, which I didn't do the
math on this. I have at one point, didn't you guys know what
a talent is and like a weight of silver by chance? Anybody
know? I feel like it's looking over now. Yeah, it's only like
an hour's worth of wages. Croc, help us Croc. Some somebody
looked it up on time. So he gives one guy five talents,
which is silver, essentially. He gives him a bunch of silver
coins. He gives another guy two talents, and he gives another
guy one talent. He goes on a journey. And he says steward
over this, basically, take this, invest it, make me some
money. And when I come back, you know, show me what you've done.
There's a guy who had nine to 12 years wages. And if it was a
gold talent, it was 15 to 20 years wages. Okay, I think
these are silver. So it's a ton of money, actually.
Yeah, one biblical talent is about 75 pounds.
Wow. Wow. Of gold. Yeah. Yeah. What's the dollar value of 75
pounds? 600,000 us. Okay, a lot of money. So he's essentially
given these guys this upstart capital and said, Hey, I'm going
to give you this money, just go out, start businesses, and let's
expand my empire. And so the guy that he gave five to, you know,
that guy went out and successfully ran businesses and
was able to make enough profit that he made double the amount
of money back. So he was originally given five talents,
he made 10. The guy that was given to made four, so he
doubled it, the guy that was given one, did nothing but
basically bury it in the ground and was like, this, this greedy
capitalist boss of mine. You know, I'm not gonna, I'm not
gonna work for him. I'm not gonna risk his money. Basically,
the guy didn't trust himself, but is calling the guy who gave
the money greedy. And so when the master comes back, you know,
everybody comes together, and he looks over the businesses. And
he's like, wow, the guy that I gave the most to, you know, was
able to give me a return of the exact same amount, the guy that
I gave the second most to same thing. The third guy calls him
greedy to his face. And then the master like throws out the guy
who had the least. So it's a story of meritocracy. And it's a
story that is honoring of business of building something
of making a profit. So basically, Jesus was very much
not a socialist, he was, he was a capitalist. What I find so
interesting about this story, aside from that is now, we have
Bitcoin, which is something that sort of exists outside of
capitalism. And I think there's a lot of implications for
everybody. But for Christians specifically, it's another
really interesting thing about Bitcoin. It's the only money
that doesn't have Caesar's face on it, it doesn't have, it's not,
you know, no country owns it. And so there's interesting
applications for that for, for Christians as well. Because, you
know, in the Bible, there's another story where somebody
tries to trick Jesus basically brings him this coin, and says,
should we pay taxes? And he's like, whose face is on the coin?
It's Caesars, it's it's Caesars money. So you know, feel free to
give it to him. God is the one who provides all of your your
income anyway. So if you trust God, you should, you know, not
be concerned about paying taxes and stuff. But Bitcoin doesn't
have anybody's face on it. So after saying all that, what are
you guys thoughts on this?
In the biblical context of like Bitcoin, rather, or like the
like, well, I guess what's the stir the pot a little bit. So
actually, let me stir the pot. Jordan, knowing your history as
like a missionary, how do you think this, you know, the story
of the talents kind of resonates in the Bitcoin era with like
people in Venezuela, or people just in Latin America, like the
greater south? When it comes to? Do you think they actually can
get back to believing that you can get ahead? Because they've
been pushed out so hard?
Yeah, I mean, I don't think they have a problem thinking about
getting ahead. I don't think I think that this story is really
important. Because the the thing that you I mean, you hit on the
fact that you know, God isn't a socialist and God doesn't. Again,
he were quite true generosity is is volitional generosity. It
doesn't it just doesn't mean a government telling you you have
to do this. And you know, saying like, we have control over all
these things, we're going to force you to do we're gonna
force you to be generous, like that, that's not generosity. And
so what you what you see here is in this in this story, it's
really, really interesting. And the reason I think it's
important is because we don't have any framework for what the
scriptures and what God thinks about money, what God thinks
about generosity, we are like, so far, it's kind of like the
phrase here, like late stage capitalism, you know, it's all
fraught phrase in and of itself. But like, you have this thing
where everyone just like, Oh, yeah, yeah, late stage
capitalism. Sure. Yeah. You know, and it's just like, we act like
we understand what these things mean, even though we really have
done the first clue. And so I think that this passage can be
one that's helpful to start to, you know, start to form and like
layout and kind of articulate a biblical understanding of, you
know, of economics more broadly, in addition to, you know, just
investing, there's lots of things here. So like, just the
idea of like God, God giving people not the exact same
amount, like that offensive to a whole lot of people like God,
God doesn't just give everybody the same amount. So we're not
God is not a radical egalitarian in this sense. You know, it's,
it should do we have a problem with the fact that Elon Musk,
you know, is a is, you know, a quadrillionaire and the rest of
us aren't what knows. That's, that's okay. That's fine. You
know, and again, we obviously there's, we could get into
details. And obviously, there's exceptions to this. There's
different, there's list different ways of making money
that are that are more or less listed in your moral than
others. But I still think this is a it's a helpful thing to
think about. You know, just the fact that you have some sort of
framework, because most of us were just kind of grasping,
we'll just, you know, this is what I've heard, this is what I
see, and just try to normalize, you know, try to normalize
things. And so I just think it's, it's one of the things
where you need to, I think we're in a moment where, again, people
don't know what things are, and we don't have a framework by
which to determine what we do know. So we don't have like a
big $5 word is like epistemological framework.
epistemology is just how do you know what you know. And so I
think that we're in a moment where people are really
struggling to try to figure out how do we really know anything.
And so you have people on the on the left who are saying, well,
this is what I feel, you know, and so I'm going to, I'm going
to trust my feelings. This is what I, you know, my body, I
feel out of place my body. And so I, you know, this is how I
know, I know what I should do, because, you know, I feel this
way. And so I think that's, that's one source of
epistemological truth. And then I think there's a whole bunch of
other ones that we, you know, there's that other groups use.
And so I think that, again, just having this verse in this
passage, and I think Christians need to start thinking about how
to help the people around them, whether they're Christians or
not think through and acknowledge, you know, and
understand the difficulties that they're enduring and kind of why
why those are.
Brandon, do you have any thoughts on like, you know,
because I'm curious, kind of double clicking from your
perspective, because I know you have the athlete perspective.
And I'm very curious if there's an angle to like, the number of
NFL stars and the number of NHL stars are just athletes who go
professional, but then they lose everything, right? Like, why do
you think that is? And do you think it's like, is it a lack of
God? Like, is it a lack of understanding of something like
this? Or it's like, hey, you kind of have to like, because
the word is stewardship, right? It's like, they're not, do they
not learn how to be good stewards? Like, I don't know.
I'm just curious.
Yeah, no, this is something I think about a lot, just in terms
of how does a society collapse, I guess, like, what comes first?
And I probably talked about this with you, J.D., I probably
talked about with you, Jordan, I just like what comes first? Is
it, is it God that leaves society first? Or, you know, the
people remove themselves from God, from truth, and then the
money goes? Or is it the money that goes first, and then it
becomes people just unravel, and then like, God goes, you know,
right after that, or just morality? It's like, what comes
first? You always come back to like, okay, yeah, people leave
God, people leave truth first, and then it's very easy for the
money to become corrupted. And someone, I think Anton was
saying earlier, a quick aside is that, like, Bitcoin, the
monetary layer, I think, because I was, I was just talking over
Christmas about this with a couple of family members, and
they were getting very confused in thinking that the money was
intricately linked to the economic system you have. So
like, it's very timely, I guess, talking about Karl Marx, right?
Where in this parable about people like interlinked, like
thinking of capitalism and inflation, or like, natural,
like, inflation is a natural law, like that, like, that's
just part of life. Like, that's how money works. And it's
couldn't be further from the truth, where money is the
foundation, it's the bedrock, you know, pulling on another,
you know, thinking about another verse in the Bible, but being
you build your house on rock, or, you know, instead of sand,
right? So monetary bedrock is there, that's what undergirds
the financial system. And then you build your system on top
that whatever you choose, I mean, it could be socialism could
be capitalism, it could be whatever it is. But when you
corrupt that bedrock, or you're building on sand, which would be
fiat, then you can put anything as we see, you can put
capitalism, the best thing we found to run a human economic
structure, and it's still going to collapse over time, this
where is where Jordan, you made me think of this, where the like
late stage fiat, because that it's not capitalism is failing,
it's the monetary bedrock, that's on sand, it's late stage
fiat, because now everything's just falling and collapsing and
floating in on itself. So and then bring it back to just the
parable itself, I think, again, it's such a great parable,
because it's, it's showing as well, like you can, you can't,
it's okay to, you know, Christians, I think have a hard
time just being okay with wealth at times, right. And it's okay
to go multiply your wealth, we need to go multiply our wealth
to go then really combat evil, all over the place and combat
darkness and disinfect darkness. And a lot of times you have to
have wealth in order to do that. And then the other half time
you don't, you know, you can be Mother Teresa, you could be
extremely poor or in poverty or, or whatever it might be and
doing good works. But another way, a big way to combat that
is to have wealth and then, you know, go and do good deeds with
that wealth. So I think it's just a it's a great parable to
talk about, because there's so many, you can just take so many
ways with it.
I, when I was younger, I used to think that, you know, I look at
these, like, tribes that existed, you know, like the
K'un, I think they're called the San and the Kalahari. And they
were like these egalitarian tribes. And I would look at
them, they didn't have anything, they didn't have buildings,
they, they just were hunter gatherer tribes. And I would
think, those people are basically the best people in the
world. I, essentially, I thought that they didn't have
sin that, that their society just functioned perfectly. And
it turns out that's not true at all. And that in throughout
history, basically, all tribes have had warfare against each
other, they have all the same struggles that we have, they
just don't have the technology to build things. So what do you
guys think about the idea of like cultivating, and gardening
and building? And, and then like, how, how will a world in
which Bitcoin is gaining more and more value? How will it
change the way that we cultivate the world and our role in that?
I'm curious, I'm really curious, your, your take on this
Pandora, because you, you actually both of you guys have
lived in LA longer than I have, but like, I'm very curious if
cities will ever be built like Los Angeles again. And it's
actually interesting, because like half of Los Angeles just
burned down. But being raised, way, way, way less than half,
but yeah, I know. Yeah. 1%. I wish you were. Come on, man.
But, but that's nothing burned down. I mean, Malibu, the
Palisades, Altadena was amazing.
I know, it's wild. But the, the question is, like, you know, is
it going to be rebuilt? On a big, like, we're still in
Fiat land, right? But do you think there's a chance that some
of the thinking that goes back into the reconstruction is like
a Bitcoin bedrock, kind of like what Brandon was talking about?
Like, can the foundation be Bitcoin? And then it's like, is
the stewardship of this space going to be different? Or do you
think it's just going to be, it's actually going to get
worse? Like people are going to put like an 80 story high rise
with the 70,000 sardine cans, and just try and go with it?
Yeah, it'll be 80,000 story, sardine high rise, of course,
because, because Bitcoin is gonna take a long time to, to
make its way through the culture. And that's just, that's
just the way it is. That's how the growth is going to happen.
Because it's all bottom up, not top down. You can't just say,
great, everyone use Bitcoin in the, even in El Salvador, where
they've tried to do that. The people in El Salvador, like some
of them are like, yeah, this is great. But the vast majority are
like, no, no, thanks. Just give me what I'm used to. Um, but to
bring it back to the Parable of Talents. Because there is an
interesting thing. There's an interesting dynamic here. The
fundamental like assumption in a Parable of Talents situation is
that they had monetary metals as their money, right? Which are
inherently inflationary as you mine more monetary metals. So
that's why like, there's this assumption in the parable that
says, yo, we are, you know, if you just, if you just bury it,
that's going to be worse than if you put it in the, the, with the
bankers, because there's an inflationary dynamic at play
that says like, it's actually like you're actually losing
money by just burying it, because there is inflation,
right? Now, you put it in the bankers, you get the interest.
And so you're actually, quote, unquote, keeping pace with that
inflation. Now, the inflation is, of course, super small,
because they don't have extreme mining situations like they do
now. Um, but I think that's, that's a part of the parable.
Now, to bring it back to your question, how does Bitcoin
actually change this, this in particular, because we're no
longer going to be in that inflationary world, it's going
to be 0% inflation, like hard stop, when you buried in the
ground, like that is actually probably going to be a wise
choice. In some capacities, it's going to be more wise than
putting it at the banker where it can like, get hacked and
stolen and, you know, hyper, we have complicated, etc. Right. So
the understanding of the parable of the talents is going to
change in the future. I mean, the root truth of their like the
root truth that we've been trying to get across, you know,
be responsible stewards doesn't change. But the culture around
how it views this parable is going to change, it's going to
be interesting. In fact, I'd love to hear Jordan's immediate
thoughts on that. But yeah, I'd like I've thought about this a
couple times. I'm like, I don't, it's just it's very weird. Like
there's going to be weird things that happen. And how do we
prepare for that? Like, because we're entering a brand new world
here. We've never seen anything like this, apart from very small
situations where the trade was cut off. And so the monetary
inflation was literally zero and all that. Yeah, it's gonna be a
strange time. Jordan.
Yeah, I think still, again, while granting this is new, in
some ways, I think this the temptations of all these things
that are described in this passage are still going to be
true. So like one of the things you look at, I mean, you can see
this some of this attitude just in the way that, you know, at
least with the conversations I have with Christians today,
right? Like, I'll say, hey, you should talk about, you know, you
should invest some money in Bitcoin. You know, like, if you
got some long term savings, like, you know, put some into
Bitcoin. And you have this, you know, people like, oh, it's too
volatile, you know, they have like this, it's this, this fear
of the bitcoins volatility. And so there's really at root is
like a fear of risk. And so you see, the interesting about this
passage is, you have the two people who assumed risk are the
ones who are commended, because it was skillful risk. You know,
it wasn't just rash, do whatever, you know, has no
correspondence with reality. It was it was skillful, calculated,
wise risk. And then, and then you have the guy who, again, is
the kind of took the safe bet, which for a lot of people,
especially when they think about Bitcoin, they think about
investments more broadly, like they think they're being
faithful by, but you know, by not assuming risk. And in the
case of this one, the master, you know, master in this in this
passage rebukes the guy, because again, because of the
justification for the risk or the lack of risk taking. So he
says his his excuses, right there in verse 24, I knew you to
be a hard man, reaping where you didn't sow and gathering where
you where you scatter no seed. So you guys are saying like,
you're you get something for nothing. Like, I knew you to be
a hard man who gets something for nothing, you know, and so I
was I was afraid and I buried it in the ground. And so you see
this, I mean, the elsewhere, you can see this same kind of thing.
This is this is a sinful fear that precludes you prevent you
from from taking risks that would demonstrate a faith in in
your master, in our case, you know, the bigger picture, like a
faith in God. And so I think that this is a really important
thing, if you're going to apply this to Bitcoin, you know, there
there is a there is a real time for for the assumption of
necessary risk. And I think that we're in a moment when like
buying Bitcoin, obviously, there's a risk associated with
that anything could happen, we actually could see solar flares
that, you know, burn up every computer and whatever and render
all that uses is certainly possible. But there's also other
risk of just the government continuing to steal from you by
creating money out of there. Those are far more, you know,
far more reels are happening in real time. So I think that's
that's one thing. I also think the way that you the master's
response is telling. So whereas the, you know, the man who
buried his talents, he attributed to fear, he said, I
was afraid to do this. And so I buried it, because I was afraid
of you, it's kind of a little shot at the master. But the
master respond, wicked and wicked and slothful servant. So
he just basically the master who's supposed to be like the
the actual perspective here of what's going on, he attributes
the burying in the burying of the of the talents of the you
know, the silver, the gold, whatever, in the ground to to
wickedness and slothfulness, laziness, this guy didn't want
to work hard to, you know, to do something hard. And so the
easiest thing was just to bury it in the ground. And then you
can just, you can kind of blame is, you know, blame the master.
It's very similar to what we see. And I think this is this
is deliberate. There's a lot of parallels between this passage
and the passage in Genesis three, you know, you have, you
know, Adam and Eve, they blame God, basically, you know, Adam
says, the woman you gave me, you know, the serpent is here, you
know, they blame everybody but themselves. And so I think
there's, there's a lot of parallels there. And so I do
think I do think that, again, one of the things that we need
to do is just call Christians to be brave and call Christians on
their, you know, on their wicked, their tendency towards
wicked, and faithless risk avoidance. And so yeah, I think
in terms of how it's going to affect, again, you're still
going to have, you're going to have people who are willing to,
you know, assume risk, and you're going to have people who
are going to be afraid of doing that. And, you know, and again,
there's still going to be opportunities to seek yield, you
know, in the, in the case of, you know, bankers that, you
know, are described here, you're still going to have places that
are awful, you offer you yield on your Bitcoin, you're still
going to have places that are going to offer you more yield
and be more risky. And, you know, again, I think there's
there's a time and a place potentially for some of those
things. But I do think it's going to be Bitcoin just due to
the nature of it, at least in the next, you know, the next 10
years or so, you know, you don't, you won't have to pursue
the same kind of insane risk that you're kind of forced into
in a situation where the currency is so far debased. So
there's a lot of different ways we could go. But yeah.
Do you think Brandon, I got a random like hot take too, but I
know the the adage is if you want to control the people who
give them bread and circus, do you think we're going to see a
world when we get further down like the Bitcoin path where,
like sports becomes less important? Or is it going to
become more important? Like, I'm very curious, actually your
take as an athlete? Do you think Bitcoin makes it more
valuable to have a skill like, you know, being a pro hockey
player or a pro basketball player or whatever it is? Or is
it actually going to like, change it? And how do you think
that's going to happen?
It's definitely going to change. I think about this a fair amount
too. There's a lot of me that, you know, one of the reasons I
left, whatever it was 12 years ago, was because it was people
didn't want to be around. Again, this is the fiat endgame
like late stage fiat, like we were talking about earlier. So
this is, you know, you kind of devolve into celebrity, you
know, athletics is just people that are, you think as a kid,
right? You think like, Oh, this is these are great people. Like
these are, in essence, like the best of the best, like these,
these guys get after if anyone's listened to any of David Goggin
stuff over time, not necessarily Christian thing here, but any of
his stuff over time, you know, he talked about making getting
into the SEAL teams, and in the Navy, and then being like, All
right, guys, let's get after it. And everyone's like, What do you
mean, man? Like, we were, we're good. Like, we made it, you
know, he's like, what, like, what do you mean? Like, where's
the next finish line? Like, let's get after it. Like, let's
get even better. And most people are just kind of like, yeah,
like, we're good. That's a lot like athletics. That's, I'm
sure a lot like Hollywood or whatever it is, like people get
this certain echelon and people just you start people just keep
falling off over time to like their levels of comfort of, of,
you know, there's only a very few amount of select few people
that I think really just constantly are getting after it.
And it's a very small percent, maybe a couple percent of the
population. That's about it. And, and quite honestly, I think
it's a lot of the Bitcoiners are in that group of people who are
just, they're, they're highly regarded people, right? And they
there was maybe something a little bit off with them. And
there's
there's never, there's always another finish line. But I think
it's like that segment of society that really takes life
to that level. I mean, you look at like, again, I talked about
the American Revolution a lot. And it was only a couple percent
of people that, that fought and gave the other 97% freedom, you
know, you think about it, it's like most people were British
loyalists, you know, Tories or whatever they were calling them.
And they were ratting on the Patriot American patriots, and
saying, Hey, they're in there. And, and most people weren't,
you know, they were, they were just like, fine to just like,
well, the the king said, he's only going to tax us 2%, or 5%,
you know, whatever it was, and they were just fine to just be
served for the state still. And, hey, we're at least over here.
But there was a couple percent of people who were like, No,
we're, you know, it's kind of like the crypto reserve, right?
What happened this past week, this got a not, you know,
crypto reserve got announced. And what do you see a bunch of
weapons being like, yeah, like, no, no, no, no, like, this, this
is not how this goes. That's one of the bets. I mean, I was
told my wife, that's one of the bets I have on Bitcoin. You
know, the technology of it is superior, all these different
aspects. But like, part of the bet to me is like, these people
in Bitcoin are highly regarded, man, like they are, they're not
going to go down, they will die on that hill. Those are the
people I want to put my money with. And those are the that's,
you know, generally how I am as a human being. So like, I align
with that. And, and, you know, I don't call it martyrdom, or,
you know, whatever you want to call it, it's like, that's, I'm
not going to put any of us in that class. But I think there's
a lot of people in Bitcoin, that will take it to that level,
quite honestly, and, and seeing that this is this economic
system that undergirds all this, the, you know, like all these
parables, you kind of look through all these things, and
what was the common theme of a lot of people who were doing
said thing, or they wouldn't compromise on those values, or
they wouldn't compromise on their, their truth, or, you
know, or morality, or natural law, whatever it was, people
are willing to put their life on the line and to uphold those
things. So I think that, you know, I didn't answer most of
your sports questions, but I think that, you know, I think
I answered most of your sports question. But in saying that, I
hope it should be somewhat obvious that like, I, I'm not
pushing any of my kids to be in sports, like, do they play
sports? Yeah, they do. I don't care what level they're at, like
to me, athletics, and my wife was an athlete as well played at
Michigan State was an athlete as well. And it was just like, we
kind of looked back, we're like, there's like a bunch of losers
that you're kind of around. All throughout. I'm not saying just
at Michigan State, right. But like all throughout, there's
people that I didn't want to be involved with, they weren't
trying to get after it, they weren't the best versions of
themselves. And it's just you kind of look at it, you're like,
well, why? Like, what do we do this for? So anyway, I hope it
becomes a less, I hope it becomes less of a, like the all
the sports gambling, all the things that have happened, I
hope Bitcoin helps correct a lot of these things, right? Like,
all these things have sprung up because of late stage VR, where
people are out the risk curve gambling on things because they
feel like they have to, or maybe because they literally have to,
they have to buy lotto tickets all the time. And I hope that
changes. And we've now bastardized and destroyed much
of the sports. And I think humans always want to compete. I
hope we I hope we do. I'm trying to like, square the circle
somehow of like, is that I think it's a tricky topic. Like I
hope, I hope sports becomes more prevalent in the sense that
people feel the need to do that instead of go to war. Like I
almost hope the Olympics become a bigger thing. But like the
money involved is not as as great if that makes sense. So
you're I don't know how you work those two things, where like
there's more people involved, there's even more talent in the
future in the sports world. But there's actually less money
involved. Because you see, again, sports, you have the
athletes that you're watching the NFL football game, and you
can't even watch half the time. I mean, like, again, I'm from
Michigan. So like the Detroit Lions is here, we're an
unbelievable team, and Super Bowl favorites, like the entire
year or whatever half the year, well, their team got decimated
by injuries. And and you have this world where like, got the
rules are such that you have to protect certain guys and do
certain things. So guys are getting injured. And, and so
like, you can't even watch the game half the time. And there's
so much money riding on one guy or certain guys because of this,
because of the fiat system we're in that people are out the risk
curve trying to, to make their their payment on their mortgage
that month. So they're doing things that otherwise they maybe
they wouldn't do. So anyway, it's a long rambling way of
just trying to say, I hope that there's sports becomes better in
the sense in the sense of like, just people doing that instead
of going to war. You think of like Navy SEALs or spec ops
guys, hopefully those guys are playing sports someday. And we
don't need them fighting wars as much, right. So it's just it's
this weird dynamic, and I hope the money becomes less of an
aspect of it. But people actually do it more, because,
hey, I'm well off, or we can do these things that can just
become the best version, use my talents, or whatever they are to
the best of my abilities, my artistic or athletic abilities.
I like that in the in the parable, it doesn't tell you how
long that the master has been away. But it does speak to time
preference a little bit, because it says he was away for a really
long time. And if you think about it, the guys that had five
and two, you have no idea what they invested in, did they buy
a vineyard? Because at some point, they were out the money.
If the master were to come back, he'd been like, where's my
money? And I'd be like, I spent, you know, half of it buying this
thing, like the business isn't operating yet. And there have
been a couple athletes like Okung, Russell Okung, who've
taken their salary in Bitcoin. The interesting thing about
that, is let's say you take your your pay in Bitcoin, then you
hit a bear market. What do you do? If you balled out of
control, and you've bought like McLaren's and houses and who
knows what boats, those payments could come due, and
you might actually be down. And for all for people investing in
Bitcoin, it's like, yeah, it's a little different than the
parable of the talents, because you kind of are burying it by
hodling, you're kind of burying it. But you're experiencing a
deflation, essentially, which is making the amount of value in
dollar terms go up over the long term, by holding on to it, which
is inherently risky. Yeah, there's one thing, it's kind of
a weird thing to say about a Bible verse, but I kind of wish
that it was a little different. I wish that within these guys,
there was a shit corner. And there was like one guy who made
really bad investments. Because there are there are people who
would do that, like, we're taking a risk by investing in
Bitcoin. But it's a very, very calculated risk that we've
studied, we feel a conviction about. And there's there are a
lot of people out there right now, who are working hard to
just gamble on coins that are complete scams. And in this
parable, the master is essentially a, it is, it's
symbolizing God, essentially, who is ultimately wise knows who
he's choosing knows who has the ability and who's going to make
the wise investment. So in this parable, he's not going to
choose somebody like that. But in reality, you have a lot of
things that you can, that you have the opportunity to invest
or gamble in. And so you've got to take a risk, but you you
better do your due diligence.
One thing that's interesting about the last thing you just
said, and I think Christians and people in general, like it's the
whole, why do bad things happen to good people thing. But it
goes to, you know, the unfortunate truth of like, not
all people are God's people. Jordan, give me a minute for
you for that one. But I think that's the truth. Awesome. Thank
you, camera for freezing. But the other piece is best, best
time always. But I think the thing that's the most unique
about this is the guy who got the one was the least
trustworthy of the bunch. And so it kind of goes to the master,
having the foresight to give people according to their
ability, but then also give somebody something more than
they were capable of. And then he's kind of upset that he kind
of lived in the expectation he had is like, I'm going to give
you more than you can handle. And you just proved to me that I
was wrong. And it actually in the verse, you know, where he
goes, and this is actually the second thing that the master
said, I'll pull it back up again, if people want to read
it, but it was probably the most like, thing that hit me the
hardest is where it says, you knew that I reap where I have
not sown and gather where I scattered no seed. And like, in
that phrase, as a question, is more of like, you think that
around it, my take on it, and Jordan, you can correct me if
I'm wrong on this, but it's like, you were afraid, because
you thought that, like, I'm blanking, I'm like, how did in a
second, the one all everywhere, but at the end of the day, he's
like, you, you, you were afraid, and you thought that by burying
it in the ground, like, that would be more valuable than you
trying to try, like attempting something as kind of a kind of
the way I take it is like, the way I take it is like, what you
did by doing nothing, was even worse than the next line, which
is like giving to the bankers, like doing nothing was below the
expectation I had for you, like the expectation I had for you is
to do something. That's
so actually, I think it's worse than that, actually. And I think
it I think this plays itself out. The master asks, like, you
knew that I reaped where I did not. So you knew that that was
in your head, right? So why didn't you just do anything?
Because it's my money, and I would have reaped where I did
not. So, right. It's like you're, you knew that you confess
to this, and yet you act contrary to your own knowledge
to your own confession.
And the guy is so arrogant that he's basically saying, yeah,
you're the master, you have all this money, I'm actually better
than you, I'm actually smarter than you. And yet, he didn't
even trust in himself to take a risk and to invest. So deep down
he knew that he wasn't actually capable of investing. And yet he
tries to pin it on the guy who originally made the capital and
say, No, no, no, no, I'm better than you. But deep down, he
knows that he's not capable.
And I think what Steven said to another aspect of it is, like,
the master is clearly accusing him of like, either lying or
being self deceived. He's like, you're attributing fault to me,
when reality like you are the problem. It's not me, that's the
problem. It's you, that's the problem. And so I think that
yeah, I think again, to see, I think it's instructive to look
at the the other two examples, because in the case of both of
the other two examples, the master renders to each one
according to their works, right? So it's in this is the pattern
that we see all throughout scripture. It's not just sowing
and reaping, it's sowing and exponential reaping. So like you
you know, you so like you take a piece of fruit, and you take a
seed and you plant the seed in the ground, you don't just get
one piece of fruit, you get a tree that produces 100 pieces of
fruit. And so you do have like this, this multiplicative, you
know, multiplicative, you know, expectation that God has for,
for, you know, when he when he basically entrusts stuff to us.
I think it's also interesting, because like, if you're, if
you're watching this, you're like, wait, what are talents?
Like, is that is that like our abilities? It actually like our
word talents today, where we think about like the things that
we can do, or the abilities that we have actually comes from this
passage, like this, this passage had such an impact that like
these, you know, talents back then was just an amount of gold.
But because of you know, it you could people applied it more
broadly to like all that God has given us, it actually became
known as as talents. So you know, if you have a you know,
talent as a basketball player, you know, what a videographer or
whatever it is, it comes from from this passage.
That's actually interesting, too, because I didn't even
realize that, you know, thinking through it, but the like the
whole thing about the talents, but as he had to made to but
talent, as we talked about the top of this was like was a year's
worth of wages. And so it's the talent is what you're going to
put into a year's worth of effort. And so like, if you're
you know, when people say their talents, like you're a talented
football player, if I tell you, you're a talented hockey player,
immediately, what's conjures up in my mind is years of effort.
And so that's actually interesting. I didn't even
think about that, because like the the talented, like the
charge of that word, this is one of the things that I really
loved about CS Lewis of like coming back and like, we need
to take charge of these words as Christians. It's like, it's so
unfortunate that we've kind of seeded so much ground on the
battle of the battlefield of words, because it's it's so easy
for people to be confused now, because we've sacrificed words
like marriage and covenant and all these things. And so that's
really, really, you know, that is actually one of the things we
talked yesterday in on the show about like, you know, like
cathedrals and kind of like, what are some of the things
when I come back, I actually think the the old robber baron
like way of, and I can't remember, it was Carnegie or was
right, I think it was Rockefeller, but it was like,
don't, don't insult somebody who buys ink by the barrel type
thing. It was like the old, it might have been Hearst,
actually. But he was basically talking about, you know, don't
go to don't go to war with somebody who can basically print
whatever story he wants the world to know, and gaslight
people into believing a certain thing. And I think what's gonna
be really, really interesting is as we get to a Bitcoin world,
and this is one of my favorite things about if you've read the
white paper, and you kind of do any deep diving on Adam back,
like one of the things Adam had was, like, basically, you have
to pay to email somebody that was like one of the things if I
remember correctly, and it's like, if you think about that
based in a Bitcoin world where it's finite, it's like, you're
gonna make a real big deduction of like, do I actually need or
want to send this email? And it's gonna be really interesting
to like, you know, think about everything in a context of, you
know, I'm not just gonna send junk mail, like junk mail will
actually go away. And like, lives will be better for it
because you have less stuff for your brain to sift through.
Yeah, there's an opportunity cost, like safety and just had a
tweet about this this morning and about how just like the what
the one of the downstream effects of the SPR over time
will be that it'll it'll basically teach the United
States, you know, about the the idea of an opportunity cost.
Can I can I mention one other thing, because I think this is
really instructive, too. So like in this passage, okay, so in
this passage, you have three amounts of money that are given
out. All right. But what's the ultimate? What's the ultimate
stand in for this, like the ultimate thing that God has
given us is our own lives. And so like, so at the end, so like
at the end of, you know, when when the master returns, he
gives to each one in accordance with what they've done. So like
the first guy is super faithful, you know, and so he says, here's
here's five more, you know, well done, my good and faithful
servant, I will set you over much enter into the joy of your
master, something similar to the second guy. And so like
fruitfulness in, you know, with little brings fruitfulness in,
in, you know, in rulership over much. And so it's interesting,
right? It's actually pretty fitting. Like, if you like if
you are a good steward of your life, and what does that look
like to mean to be a good steward of your life? At the end
of the day, it's to give it's to entrust your life to Christ.
Like it's to put it in his hands and carry out his will. And so
what you know, it would make sense that you would be given
eternal life. You know, if you steward your life and give it to
the person who you know, is the best the best steward of it, if
you entrust it to his care, then you know, the the reaping that
you get is infinite lifetimes, effectively, you know, that's
that's, you know, that's how you could, you know, it's kind of
eternal life isn't just this random thing, like it's actually
it corresponds with, you've lived life faithfully. And so
I'm going to give you a whole bunch more of them more than you
could possibly, you know, imagine.
I love the double meaning of this pair is one of my favorite
parables in the Bible. I love that it both applies to creating
something, taking risks and making a profit and in the sense
of actually making money. And it also applies to evangelism using
the life that God has given you to basically bring light into
the world to essentially to tell other people about Jesus, what
God has done to to bless your life, so that their life gets
blessed. And there is a multiplicative effect that
happens that's not just generating profit, it's actually
like generating souls that are saved, people that get the
blessing of God by you, essentially showing the blessing
that has been given to you. And, and it's both, it's both applies
to business and moneymaking and to evangelism. And yeah, it's
just beautiful. And this short little story, you get both of
those things.
Random, one more thing, and sorry to jump back in, but
actually curious. Brandon, I think your superpowers
relationships, like you're just a frickin relationship machine,
like everybody loves you. But I'm very curious, the the
parables with or rather the corollaries with with the
investments here with relationships, because I
actually think a lot of like myself personally, like I think
I struggle with relationships sometimes. And, you know, I
don't think I have a good sense sometimes, on like the proper
way to grow or foster duties. And I'd actually really love to
hear your take on the application of this to, you
know, it's like, to relationships, or it's like,
hey, like, I, I'm investing in these things. And I'm growing
these things and like perspective on like, why I think
they're important, how you grow them, how you move them. But
then also like how it comes back to this of like, you know, God
has given me the ability to talk to a lot of people minister to
a lot of people spread a message to a lot of people. And I, you
know, how do you see that kind of playing out here of like,
because I'm sure more people are reaching out to you and you to
Jordan, you know, every day, like, how do you think this kind
of correlates to like relationships? And how does that
change in like a Bitcoin world, like the relationship to become
more valuable, they become less?
I think it's, I think relationships are everything. And
I'll say this, I appreciate the kind words, I always think that
about you, quite, quite honestly. And I look at you guys.
And I think that I don't think that about myself. So I
appreciate the kind words, but it's not easy. I mean, number
one, we're men, right? So like, relationships are, you know,
like, I think I think good friendship is like, hey, I can
talk to one of you guys like today, and I can talk to you
like a year from now. And they're like, we picked up right
where we left off, right. And that's the kind of people you
want to be around. I find that a lot in Bitcoin. I mean, I will
say this is kind of the segues beautifully from the story I was
telling earlier of being in athletics. I didn't, I just
didn't get along with a lot of people in athletics. And they
just weren't my people. And so like Bitcoiners, again, I would
be the 10th time 100 time we've hung out or first time and then
like a year from now, we'll just pick right up, you know, right
where we left off. And I think that's true, probably for the
guys that are on here as well in that Bitcoin community. And a
lot of the Christian community as well. I'm sure that's, that's
true as well, right? Like we can just kind of just like we have
these core values. And so in saying all that, the community
is the number one thing in a survival situation. So it's not
gold, or it's not Bitcoin, it's not water, you know, it's like,
because whatever you're deficient at, like Jordan said
earlier, like, if there's a solar flare, or whatever
happens, it's going to be a mad chaos, right? It's Mad Max at
that point. So it's like, who are the people that I'm around?
And who am I going to surround myself with? Because that's the
only thing that's gonna matter, because these people are going
to be helping me with what I'm deficient at. And even though a
lot of us are, you know, again, Bitcoiners tend to, whether they
are just weaponized autists are highly regarded, they think they
are he-man, or they think they're some lone wolf, and like,
I'm just gonna do everything myself, which I know is me at
times, you aren't, you know, so like, that's, that's that
humbling process. And the humility that the humility test
in a way that Bitcoin is where you have to unlearn a lot of
your life in a way and then like relearn it. And I think that's
what Bitcoin does so well is just reframing. Because we're
all doing it, right? We all everyone who's in Bitcoin had to
go in like people think that Bitcoiners are like, you guys
are idiots. Like, how come like, let the free market decide?
It's like, well, number one, we are the free market. Like I am
the free market, Jordan, you know, Anton, we're all the free
market, and we are free to then educate people on the scams that
are going around all around the world. And that's the free
market doing free market things. And it's our duty to go do those
things, which comes back to the parable, which to me is don't
put your head in the sand. Don't take the blue pill. And it's
using your talents, because I'm glad you said that Jordans, I
forgot, I always think of this parable. And Anton, you were
saying it's one of your favorites. I always think of
this parable as just strictly talents. I almost never think of
it. And on the money side, I always am thinking of the
talents of what have I been given? And how can I do things?
Because at times, I'm like, why am I doing this? You know, like,
why? Why am I, you know, spouting my mouth off all the
time or writing things or doing whatever, you know, helping
different companies with stuff or helping Bitcoin trading cards
going to conferences? Like, why? Why am I doing? I could just
have a great life and just go away with my kids and my wife
and have a great life. Because it's just a deeper meaning is
deeper calling that I think God implanted here in me. And I
would I would say probably you to knowing you guys, that it's
like, we could all just go do something else. But we're called
to do this because of the talents we've been given. And
and to not put our head in the sand, because we could do that
we could just go shoot up heroin and go sit under a bridge to
like, every day, we have a choice to go do that. Or you'll
go do this or go do that. And we all get up and choose every
single day like, hey, it's not going to be easy. Most of the
world's not going to be with us. Like we said earlier, the 97%
are not going to be honest, and a lot of them probably never
will be. And we were going to have to drag a lot of them
kicking and screaming to the finish line, as they did in the
American Revolution. And George Washington going across the
Delaware River with icebergs floating by like it's, it's not
gonna be fun. It's not gonna be pretty. But some of us are
called to use those talents in order to further society and
further truth.
Bond or I'm very curious. Yeah. And you opened up but like this,
this is seems like exactly like you've what you've been talking
about, to me, ever since we first met.
Exactly 100% agree with everything you said, Brandon,
well stated. And let me affirm how real the community thing is.
And anytime you can attest to this, for years, I basically
just posted on Facebook as private messages, just
screaming at all of my friends, but never actually engaging with
the wider Bitcoin community. And since engaging with the wider
Bitcoin community, it's like, whoa, these people, it's like,
it's like, part of that was like, I wanted to, like, it was
like, Bitcoin is a totally decentralized thing. I wanted to
build, I didn't, I didn't. It's not like I wanted to do it
alone. Like I was engaging people like Anton. But I wanted
to build as like, yo, we don't I don't even, I don't even need to
be a satellite for the larger community. I can like literally
be my own node with my own network, my own private Bitcoin
network. And like, you can do that you can build that it's
like, totally doable. It just is so hard. And it takes so long
because you have so much less people in your community. The
amount of people that you get when you open up to the broader
community is just bonkers. I mean, JD, JD and I started or
restarted the Bitcoin meetup here.
And just say like, Bondor basically started this new one.
I'm gonna give you 100% of the credit like is the heart and
soul of Nelda Bitcoin. So
but the point is, once we open that up, it you know, starts
it's just me and JD because we met at the conference. Right?
First conference I've ever been at the bar. Yeah, at the bar.
And since then, a year ago, a little over a year ago, it's
like grown to the last meeting was 21 people. And like, that is
like real people in the real community around our area. Like
there's a coffee shop that's close to us that I went to this
week, I think on Tuesday. And like we should we like I roll in
there at whatever 9am. And one of the Bitcoiners who's at the
community, like at our meetup is there, orange pilling another
person. Like, this is LA, like LA proper was like, hell yeah,
this is what I'm talking about. Right?
Nobody ever shows up to anything in LA, the fact that showed up
in real life or something.
And these guys are showing up every guys and girls. And
actually, we have a we almost have like we had a couple weeks
ago where we have more women that all the women in Bitcoin
are in LA, by the way, just FYI, we've found them. But like,
they're just they're just scoping out and prepping for $5
rent attacks. You know, they're just I do. Okay, so I jokingly
say like 15 $15. Exactly. I especially in LA probably 35.
But like, no, I do think that they we joke, but I do think
that that is one easy way kind of bond or what you're saying is
it's easy to withdraw passively because you're thinking, what's
the about the worst thing that could happen, I could get $5
wrenched, I could get, you know, whatever, like the worst things
that can happen that to, you know, use them as a
justification to just not rock the boat or whatever. And yet,
like, yeah, and yet, like so much of even just I mean, again,
we've talked about from a different perspective, but even
as a Christian, like one of the verses that I just, I'm like, I
don't know how I didn't see this before. But like, one of the
things about the kingdom of God is like, it's, it's actually
like on the offensive. And so you know, one of the things that
Jesus says is that the gates of hell won't stand against it. And
in for whatever reason, you think about that, you're like,
Oh, you know, you're like, hell is this big, intimidating thing.
It's like, no, hell is this gated place. And we're like,
charging towards it. And the gates are, they're not going to
be able to stand there forever, we're gonna run over the gates,
like, we're gonna we're gonna break down the gates. And it's
not even gonna be. Yeah, exactly. So like, yeah, the
walls are gonna fall. And so like, again, now, again, there's
gonna be people who are gonna die. In the meantime, there's
gonna be things that are gonna be hard, whatever. But just like
the place for just fear and cowardice and hiding and being
silent, like, there's just no room, like, there's no room for
it. And like, and so if that is your attitude, like that's
demonstrating the same type of cowardice that, you know, the
master rebukes in this guy here. So the move is to attack.
Absolutely. Yes. Yes. Join, join, join the cosmically
regarded ones. And, you know,
yeah, no, I, this is such a great, great thing. I just want
to add one quick thing is that it's, you know, God, God created
the devil, like he was an he's an angel, you know, so it's like,
he has dominion over him. And that's like, we all forget that
I forget that, you know, it's like, like, like you said, fear,
that's what made me think of it. Fear is Satan, you know, and
it's like the what if it's the fear, it's these things that
just consume you. And that's what Satan wants. And God has
control over him. And and he's and what have you just mentioned
that kind of something alluded to something that a minute ago
was when we think of it, too. So I think that's so important to
remember that it's he always, you know, against gates, like
God, we will conquer that we will conquer Satan, we that will
be conquered. And we just have to remember that that he, he's
below God. It's not like, Oh, God and Satan are up here
fighting each other on equal playing field. Like, that's not
an equal playing field. And that's, that's what we all have
to remember. Brandon, you said something about? Yeah, real
quick. So Brandon, you said something about that the way to
survive in a catastrophe is basically through community.
Above all else, it's not like having water stored or having
guns and ammo or having silver coins to use. Man, we saw that
so much with the fires that just happened in LA. Altadena, I was
in the process of moving to a house that burned down. So I was
my neighbor, my entire neighborhood is completely gone.
It's the Yeah, it's, it's ash now. But I had always thought,
you know, I've been looking at Altadena for years, I live
basically adjacent to it. And they don't have community. They
say they have community, but they really don't. Nobody knows
each other's names. And I am a part of all these Facebook
groups for people that live in Altadena. And a lot of them are
like, yeah, there was this guy that lived on my street. He
drove a red car, he always wore this certain baseball cap. I
never got his name. Does anybody know who I'm talking about? I
wanted to check on him. Is he okay? Nobody knew each other's
names. And a lot of people have GoFundMes. A lot of people
didn't get almost any money on their GoFundMes. And then a few
people that had really done the work to create a community for
themselves, which, if you've ever been a part of a community,
it takes a little bit of sacrifice. It's a little bit of
a risk to go out there in the real world and make friends. And
you also have to be generous yourself. And it's so worth it.
Because when you need that community, if you put in the
work, it's there. If you didn't, it's not there.
Yeah, I said one thing. So like one of the dangers of money and
over reliance on a monetary economy is that money enables
artificial community. Like money basically enables you to buy
people to help you, like to buy people's attention to care about
you. And so like you can, again, that can work for a period of
time, but there'll come a point where that'll end, you know. And
so like, this is one of the things where I never forget. One
of my wife's best friends, one of my best friends, she was
married. And I don't, I can't remember if they had kids at
that point. But we just were talking about having kids. And
we just said, you know, like, we're planning on having, you
know, good, good number of kids. Because like, when we get old,
somebody's gonna have to take care of us. And, you know, if we
have, even if we just have like one or two kids, then that's,
that's a lot. Like, taking care of two parents is a lot for one
or two kids. So if you have four or five, six kids, whatever,
then it's easier to spread the load. And if you don't have any
kids, and obviously, there's people who are unable to have
kids. And so like, that's a whole different situation. So
you know, again, they work it out differently. So this is some
condemnation. But like, but what we said was, like, there's
people who are just planning, oh, I'm not gonna have any kids.
Like, that's kind of their game plan. Now, it's I'm not gonna
have any kids, because I want to work, I want to make money, I
want to do whatever. At the end of your life, you're going to
spend the vast majority, if you don't have kids to care for,
you're going to spend the vast majority of your money, paying
other people to try to care about you are trying to pay
people to convince them to care about you. And in an inflationary
world that gets even like, it's more expensive than you're ever
prepared for. So I think I think that this is, you know, Bitcoin
will kind of help help people. I don't know, it's restored
people's priorities in a lot of ways, just by being a more sane,
you know, I don't know, it's, it's more connected to like,
it's more like everything else in the world scarce, you know,
that you can't, you have to make yes or no decisions, you can't,
you can't fudge on it in that way. And so, again, I'm
optimistic that it'll be helpful over time, and that people have
a healthier view of the world as a result of its ascendance.
You gave me an interesting thought. And I'm actually
curious, all your takes on this, do you think Bitcoin is going to
make the world bigger? And what I mean by that is, are people
going to think more about the opportunity cost of going
somewhere? And like, is travel actually going to become less?
Like less of a thing, because Bitcoin is the rising tide,
everything is going to get better everywhere. So you're not
going to be discontent where you are, because I need to go to
America to make money, or I need to arbitrage, you know,
making this thing somewhere else, because I can make it
somewhere else cheaper, like, like, is the world going to get
bigger again?
Definitely, there's going to be especially right away, there are
going to be some of these smaller countries that
essentially go on a Bitcoin standard, and they are going to
welcome you if you want to go there and spend Bitcoin, it's
there's going to be a lot for you to do. And it's going to be
open to you. And it will also have an effect where it will
somewhat preserve cultures, like, in in the in the middle of
the 1900s, you had basically, like the Soviet Union, you had
these giant blocks of like, essentially empires, I was
looking at the Japanese Empire in 1942. It was massive, it was
like one third of the size of Russia now. And we're going away
from that to where you're going to have sovereign individuals,
and you're going to have a little sovereign enclaves, kind
of like what, theoretically, we're seeing in El Salvador now.
Yeah, I think it'll, I think it'll become, I think what
you're alluding to JD is that will people in essence, live in
their citadels? Will they kind of just live there more? And
you're gonna have people that might move around like
Anton was saying, like in the near future type of thing. But
you know, 50 years from now, 100 years from now, are we
traveling as much? Does the world become bigger in that
sense? Like where we're just not traveling as much like I am
content because I have six kids and I have my whole family here.
We've got our wealth, we've got what we need, I don't need to go
travel. Because again, the symptom of the society, and
we're all about the same age. You saw the last 20 years, a lot
of people leaving. I mean, again, in the Midwest, you have
people what leaving because of job opportunities, money, and
they want to go travel, I want, you know, travel became so easy.
It's like, I want to go do things my parents have wealth,
like I'm gonna go travel and do stuff. I'm living in LA, living
in whatever Chicago, I'm living in New York City. And it was
like, cool, it was trendy to leave your family. And now what
do we see? We see senior centers everywhere, you know, assisted
living because no one has the money to pay for their parents,
or there are no kids really, because they're gone. And
they're too busy making money that they can't even take care
of the parents. So you're in this world where I do believe I
hope I mean, to me, like the senior housing stuff is very
sad. Like it's, I have a very different take on on that. And
it's, it's, it's not the typical take, I'm sure a lot of you
guys, a lot of big players would probably have a similar take.
But it's society is like, Oh, look at this is great. Like,
look at these facilities taken. It's like, where are the
people's family? You know, like, where are the people that love
them? Like, what is going on? And it's, it's a symptom, again,
of late stage fiat has been mentioned many times. But I do
hope that that kind of turns around. And we build these
compounds or citadels or these communities that are
decentralized, built on community, and they are local,
because that's, as we know, just governing wise, like we talked
in the beginning, governance is way easier locally, you know,
getting back to this, this standard of taking care of just
the people right around us. That's the easiest way,
obviously, humans have found to govern and work things. So I do
think it might take 50 years, 100 years, but it I think we're
going to get to a more of the world is bigger, where I'm not,
I don't have to feel like I have to travel all over, because
everyone else is doing it. I think it just naturally starts
to kind of heal again.
Yeah, I think at the same time, though, like, just given the
dynamics of how much Bitcoin is out there, and how much Bitcoin,
like how expensive Bitcoin is, like, it's gonna be harder and
harder for your average person to be able to, you know, make a
meaningful amount of Bitcoin. So I think I think that probably
the bigger the bigger challenge is gonna be well, I don't know
about bigger, I don't know how to even evaluate the size of the
challenge. Basically, I would say, like, in some ways, this,
the parable of the talents is going to be relevant to people
who are Bitcoiners at this point, because, like, you're
going to have, I mean, if things continue to, you know, to go
along the same kind of lines that they've been going, like,
if you have any kind of significant amount of Bitcoin,
like, you're going to have a staggering amount of money. And
you're going to be trying to figure out, you know, again,
like, what do I do with this? How do I store this in effective
ways? And, yeah, and like, and again, just I think thinking
about that, the sooner you start thinking about that, like, what
are the things that are important to me? Yeah, I just
think that's, that's something you ought to be doing. Because
again, like, I have people in my in my feed who are totally
rational people, you know, again, who are who are older,
who've been in, you know, live, live the world, and they're
basically saying, I'm upping my price, you know, like the odds
of Bitcoin going to a million dollars by the end of this year
just got a whole lot bigger. And so I just think like, this can
move so fast, like the speed that this thing can move, and
then the position it would put anybody who's got a meaningful
amount of Bitcoin in. Yeah, I just think it could get it could
get bonkers really quick. And yeah, and I think if that's
happening at the same time as you have so many cultures around
the world who are, you know, the currencies are failing, and
things are getting harder and harder, I think you can see.
Yeah, just it could it could get a lot worse before before it
gets be better on a large scale.
Somebody was putting a TA, you know, a TA bro was putting
something down, but the 14th is apparently when we're supposed
to get to our next, like, next all time high, not saying that
the peak, but like, when we're supposed to break the previous
one is the 14th. So seven days from now, like, I don't know, I
just have a hunch will be like 140 a week from now. And I
think this Bitcoin reserve thing took everybody by surprise, who
expected that in the afternoon yesterday?
Well, not even not even well, actually, nobody expect I did
not expect it until today, because they're having the
meeting today. And I was like, Okay, so maybe we hear
something the end of the day today, or maybe we hear
something on Monday. And candidly, I think the people,
you know, and if you're watching this, you know, like, I know, a
significant amount of Bitcoin is any, like any portion and like,
you don't have to have like bitcoins, or you don't have like
a whole have a whole corner, like a significant amount of
Bitcoin is gonna be any Bitcoin. And at certain points in time,
and I think the thing that's really interesting that I, you
know, haven't really thought about, but I think it was David
Bailey, who actually posted this. But there is not enough
Bitcoin now for every millionaire in the United States
to own one. And so the the thing to think about right now is the
people who are going to have the most regret when it comes to
Bitcoin ownership are not the poor, it's the rich.
Well, most specifically, it's it's the boomers who have houses
that they need to all sell now because they need to pay for
their retirement because they don't have kids.
It's gonna be really interesting to actually to see this transfer
of wealth and actually see like, the countries I'm actually the
most excited for when it comes to being on a Bitcoin standard
Bitcoin in general, like Italy. You know, like I we have family
in Italy and America. Well, America, too. But But I think we
have the quintillion effect. So I think, you know, we're probably
better off than most. And if you're not familiar with that,
especially we are the money printer, and we're the closest
there's we benefit the most. Sorry, everybody else that we're
showing over we are those cock bucks. We also get screwed the
most because the money printer destroys the culture, which is
why we have such destroyed culture. Speaking of Italy,
again, is some of these things can be preserved. And I think
the other thing is, though, not only they're gonna be preserved
is it's actually going to potentially, you know, if this
can come, I hope we get to a million by Christmas, like I
posted earlier this week, we're gonna get to a million by
Christmas. I don't know if we are, but I really, really want
us to because I do believe the issue we have is, you know, the
money printers screwed things up so much. And these people you
can't be, you know, in Italy, like the employment rate for
people under the age of like 35 is like 20 20%, something like
that. It's nuts. And it's like, you know, we have a family
member here. And she's been telling us she's like, my
generation has no hope. And so they have no dreams and no
desire, and they don't do anything. And so it's like,
when we can re instantiate hopes and dreams and balance to some
of these things by pouring kerosene, like I think Bitcoin
is economic kerosene in a good way, it's going to wipe
everything away, and it's going to supercharge everything all at
the same time. I think it's going to be really, really
interesting to see what happens. I think the global South is
going to is going to come roaring back in the neck. Like
I think the 20 the 2030s and the 2040s are going to be like
Latam, Africa, you know, Southeast Asia and India, like
it's going to be wild seeing those those cultures develop on
a Bitcoin standard.
I think that yeah, I just think we're good. I was just gonna
say I liked the answer so far. I've just been all of the above.
Yeah, I just think it's like, it's kind of like, yeah, it's
kind of it's like the, you look at the mountain from the front
of it, you're like, Oh, look, it's just straight up. And then
you look at it from the side. And it's like, actually, it's
up and down and up and down, but it gradually goes up. Because
like, I just look at, I mean, you look at there's so many
things that the attention economy, you know, or like, just
the things like OnlyFans, like, there's this chick, I can't
remember her name, Lily something like she's going to
like nursing homes. Yeah, she's like going to nursing homes
down, like having sex with like old men in the nursing homes and
like filming it and then getting like getting making money off
of this. So like, I'm just thinking like, that's, that's
one, that's an American person who is, you know, relative
comfort. And obviously, like, wealth brings extravagance and
all this kind of stuff. But I just think like, yeah, sure,
sure. You're right. So but like, you've got, you've got, but
you've got, you've got this, what is it gonna do? If people
realize how worthless their dollars are? Like, what are
that? What? What lengths are they going to be willing to go
to, to make Bitcoin? Like that? I don't know. I could just see
this getting really, really bad again. Like, you look in that
you look at the Roman Empire, like, how bad did it get? They
literally threw Christians in a in a ring with lions, you know,
it'd like to, I mean, this is just the cultural degradation
that happened. So like, I don't know, like, I'm hopeful over the
long term. But just in the if you told me in the next 10 to 15
years that we had, you know, actual Hunger Games, like TV
shows where it was all actually happening, like, I could totally
believe it. Like, it wouldn't surprise me.
I disagree. 100%
I hope so. I hope so. Again, we've been following the path of
Rome for, you know, pretty, pretty closely. So I'm just
sure you and I are our kindred spirits here at Bondor is the
hard disagree. There's none of that's gonna happen. Like, the
one of the and Jay, you and I have talked about this. We
bought, we definitely bought heads on this. I think it's, I
think it's a healthy budding heads.
It's great. Every, every meetup, people are like, positivity.
Talk to that guy. You want negativity? Go over there.
I really don't see that. Because we have Bitcoin that no one
control. No one can control. This is completely unlike any
other historical paradigm. On top of that, it takes a
monumental amount of effort just to understand what you have. And
that that applies for both both camps, right? The people who
want to destroy the world versus the people who want to rebuild
the world better. I'm not the build back. So how does this
play out practically? Well, practically, um, anybody who's
denominated in Bitcoin has a firewall against inflation,
which means that their entire lives, like the world can be
crumbling around them because of crazy hyperinflation, etc. But
they're, they're still fine. Like they're 100% able to still
buy groceries, they're 100% able to like their families insulated
from the insanity at a monetary level, right? Now, of course,
there's societal issues or whatever. But like, think about
think about what a firewall is. It's it's literally a wall of
fire that is that you cannot cross this, you cannot cross
this, this chasm. And everybody who's protected by a firewall,
you guys, you guys are good. Anybody can get the firewall
themselves, right? So there's it's the I shared this article
again, it's it's a old Satoshi Nakamoto Institute article,
Nakamoto Institute article. But it's the Bitcoin's shroud of
allure and subtlety, where you are. You're basically the game
theory says, you're better off just adopting Bitcoin, then you
are fighting it or trying to attack people or doing any of
this stuff, because you like you can have the firewall, like, why
would you just like, try and fight the firewall, when you can
just have it? Right? We just trade your trade your wealth
Bitcoin, you're good to go. You don't have to suffer inflation
anymore. So that's just the inflation piece of the puzzle.
There's all sorts of other pieces of the puzzle, like with
the time preferences. And with the just the way that it stops
the absurd erosion of culture, like it really does. Like this
is not like we're talking about something, you know, Jordan, and
you know, I tend to agree, like the there's nothing new under
the sun. But like, and of course, this isn't anything new.
Like this is things like this have happened in history, but
it's always been small. This is this is the whole, this is the
whole world. And it's all happening at once. Sure. The the
the end, like the end dynamic of like, Bitcoin going to a million
this year, I really just don't see it. Like, yeah, if it does
do that, well, that's not necessarily going to be a
function of Bitcoin's value increasing, because it's going
to take way longer than a year for people to even understand
that the value has increased, right? So what, if Bitcoin goes
to a million in a year, what that says is, the US dollar has
just hyper inflated, and there's no other, like, the amount of
Bitcoin ecosystem stuff, all of that has only built up, or, or
what it will say, or what it will say, it'll, because again,
the reality is, like, there's information asymmetry. So you
had the world radically changed in 1913, with the creation of
the Federal Reserve, a small group of people, very small
group of people made a decision that they benefited from
tremendously to the detriment of everybody else. And so like, I
could totally see because again, if you have the governmental
officials who are controlling the money printers in all these
countries, who basically see the writing on the wall, none of
their people do or very small, very few of their people do, but
they go, wait, right now, the jig, the game is up, we can
print money right now to buy Bitcoin, and then they all start
or like four or five of them start doing that. Like you could
you could see, I mean, it could get crazy really quickly. And so
again, I don't think it requires tons of people, it only requires
a very small group of people who are the ones who most know that
this whole system is a Ponzi scheme, like fiat currencies or
Ponzi schemes. So yeah, I just think and again, I'm not
talking I'm not talking in terms of people, I just think the
reality is, even in the United States, the number of people who
are going to be able to accumulate through through their
savings or selling things that they have to accumulate a good
amount of Bitcoin is going to be still relatively small. And and
as it sets in that, again, it's in some ways, it's going to be a
path to nowhere to try to accumulate a large amount of
Bitcoin. Like what lengths are people going to be willing to go
to in their extreme, you know, like hopelessness or something
or like the stream like jadedness to try to accumulate
more? Is it going to be, you know, are we going to see, you
know, more extreme examples in this lily girl, you're going to
see again, things like, I don't even want to put things out
there. But I just think like, yeah, I think we're just not
prepared for because again, will that be the smart thing to do?
Well, no, on a long enough time horizon, of course not. But
people are not smart. Like people are not good. They make
stupid decisions, short sighted decisions all the time. And I
don't think that Bitcoin is going to, it's going to change
it at a societal level over time. But there's still going to
be hundreds of 1000s of individual people who are we're
going to be able to point to as saying those are ridiculous
decisions that have affected a lot of people in poor ways.
For me, that that really comes down to just the market
dynamics, the bubble dynamics, and you know, hysterical popular
delusions of the madness of crowds kind of like mentality.
But you know, what's the end result of that? Well, the end
result of that is everyone sells all their homes, buys Bitcoin,
and then nobody has, there's no more buyers anymore, the market
crashes. And it's just, it's no different than any of the
bubbles we've already seen. Time and time again in Bitcoin, just
it's like, you know, all the all the leverage for all the things
and just people will go crazy at the market top. Yeah, market
tops, they go crazy. And then it's just, yeah, it crashes. And
everyone's like, Wait a second, what was I thinking? And yeah,
they like,
I guess what I'm saying is, though, is like, again, I think
the housing market, like the housing market market needs to
crash, like it's unhealthy that it's at a level. But like, if
that's caused by Bitcoin, people are going to be like, this is
the worst thing ever. Bitcoin is the worst thing ever. And again,
it's because because of how many people are going to be adversely
affected by it, even though it was doomed to fail anyhow. And
even if Bitcoin didn't exist, it was going to crash. Anyhow, I
think you're still going to have people and especially you know,
you have the media and whatever, there's incentive for people to
tell the media to default Bitcoin and to do all these
things. Again, it doesn't mean it's actually true.
But this is why you got to move out of Florida and move to Los
Angeles where the real estate is far more solid.
Welcome to you.
This gives us lots to talk about on future episodes. I love the
idea of talking about what people will be willing to do
when there's crazy scarcity in Bitcoin. But we should probably
wrap it up. So I just want to thank Brandon underscore
Gentile. Jam Bush writes, Jordan, thanks for coming on
today. Bond or JD. And yeah, that's it better by Bitcoin.
Check us out on YouTube because we just created a YouTube
channel. It's better by BY Bitcoin. And we'll see you on
the next one.
Thanks, boys.