[00:00:03] Antony Whitaker: Hello and welcome to today's episode of the Grow My Salon Business Podcast. I'm your host, Antony Whitaker. And as always, it's great to have you here with us today. Thank you for the compliments regarding the podcast. I really do appreciate it. And if you're one of those people who haven't yet left us a review for the podcast, I would love it if you took five minutes and did it
[00:00:23] Antony Whitaker: because ratings and reviews are extremely helpful. They do matter in the rankings of the show and it certainly helps other people to find the podcast. And I also love to hear what's been helpful. All you need to do to leave a review is go to the Apple podcast app and search, grow my salon business, scroll to the bottom of the page and leave a review.
[00:00:45] Antony Whitaker: And you would make us very happy. So with all that said on with today's show. Now, my guest today is a great hairdresser. He's also a very accomplished educator, a great entertainer, extremely funny. He's a great friend of mine and he has a stutter. And the most wonderful thing about it is that he couldn't care less.
[00:01:06] Antony Whitaker: So in today's podcast, we will discuss happiness, stuttering, and overcoming the challenges that life throws at you. 
[00:01:14] Antony Whitaker: So without further ado, welcome to the podcast. My good friend, Oscar Bond.
[00:01:19] Oscar Bond: And I'm very glad to be here, Antony. It'll be a joy speaking to you.
[00:01:23] Antony Whitaker: Yeah, it will be. It's been a long time coming this. Um, so today we're going to talk about an area of expertise that I actually have never focused on the podcast before.
[00:01:33] Antony Whitaker: And, but it's something we all want and that is happiness. So Um, and in general, we talk about mental health more than ever these days, but we never really talk about happiness and you are the absolute king of happiness. Despite what life throws at you, you're always happy. You're always funny. And as a result, you're liked wherever you go.
[00:01:56] Antony Whitaker: And in this industry, I think that being happy and being fun to be around and being light will definitely take you a long way. So. Let me ask you this question. I've known you now for over 40 years, which is a very long time, and I've actually never seen you in a bad mood. I've never seen you angry. I've never even really seen you a bit sullen.
[00:02:19] Antony Whitaker: You know, you're just one of these people that are few and far between, but you're always in a good mood. You're always happy. You always make me laugh. And what's more, you make me stutter too, which is what might turn into a little bit of a problem. So I want to ask you this question. Is being happy Just a gift that you were born with, or is it something that you consciously work at?
[00:02:43] Oscar Bond: I think a little bit of both. Number one, uh, I was dealt a really good hand when it comes to family. You know, I come from a really good family, never any drama. I did lose a sister in a car accident, but other than that, it was a Brady bunch upbringing and, uh, I think I told you last week, like if anything bad happens, if I went home to my mom and said, mom, I've got a bad kidney.
[00:03:03] Oscar Bond: She'd be like, Oh, you want a cup of tea? Like you're just taught really early on that you're not like, there's always someone much worse off. And I think my parents always saw the good side of things. It wasn't until I started working. I realized how important being a good mood is and I think it happened when we were assistants.
[00:03:20] Oscar Bond: I don't know who, who I was assisting, but they weren't very good with clients. And they kind of said to me, you better be happy because I'm effing grumpy. And that's how it kind of all started. And I realized I'm just never really in, in a bad mood. I get down for a day, but never days, you know, so I don't know.
[00:03:41] Oscar Bond: I kind of married someone brilliant, but is everything that I'm not so miserable, unhappy, angry. No, it's no, she's, she's absolutely brilliant. But, uh, maybe that's the reason why she got attracted to me as well, because I do kind of, I'm always happy.
[00:03:57] Antony Whitaker: Okay. So,
[00:03:58] Oscar Bond: angry every now and again, I get angry at myself versus others.
[00:04:02] Oscar Bond: A lot more.
[00:04:03] Antony Whitaker: okay.
[00:04:04] Oscar Bond: when you, when you like what you said, like you forgot to press, uh, the, uh, the record button, stuff like that drives me nuts. And it happens more and more and more. And I haven't started once.
[00:04:15] Antony Whitaker: well, yeah, we're early days so far. Um, I mean, like I said, we've known each other for a very long time. I've stayed at your house. I spend a lot of time with you, but I've never, ever seen an unhappy, you know, version of Oscar. Um, what is it that makes you happy?
[00:04:36] Oscar Bond: That's impossible to answer. I tell you what, what makes me happier is when things kind of just go, like when you wake up in the morning and the kids are the same kids they were the night before. Wendy is the same as she was the night before? Like, things are normal, but. Every day stuff hits you and I've kind of learned that it just, it's not going to kill you.
[00:04:55] Oscar Bond: There's never a spaceship about to blow you up. So it's kind of, I don't know what it is. It's, it's not that I don't care about things. I do care about things, but I don't let things really bother me. You know, like, uh, bad things. And I think, and I think also when you put what you chuck out there comes back.
[00:05:14] Oscar Bond: So if you chuck out kind of happiness, I do have one key I'm good at remembering people. You know, like I'm not very bright. I didn't do very, very, very, very well at, at, at high school. But I had, if I meet someone I haven't seen in 30 years, I'll remember something about them. And I didn't know I was very good with people as a kid at all.
[00:05:36] Oscar Bond: You know, just, uh, I wasn't destined to be, but I think that's how you go into hairdressing when you're not destined to be much, you know, like you're, you're looking to find something. And, uh, I think those early trainings at BDAL soon really gave me everything I needed of, of what I wasn't. I was already a happy kid.
[00:05:53] Oscar Bond: So it's hard becoming happy. That's the key. And I think everyone's aware of mental illness, but you got to realize like everyone has it. I've got it. You've got it. It's just different degrees. So maybe, maybe I've been pretty good on the old mental health side. Physically needs a bit of work. You know, like I'm not, I'm not the, I'm not the fittest person out there.
[00:06:13] Oscar Bond: I'm not the best looking person out there, I'm not the tallest, so I think the one thing I've got going for me is a good old happy smile. I don't really know, like it's uh, I think you want to, I was really lucky early on because I see kids go, go, go through it now where you want to be everything you're not.
[00:06:30] Oscar Bond: You know, you want to be taller. You want to be better looking. You want to be this. You want to, you don't want to stutter. Then one day you just kind of like, this is it. it. And I think sometimes there was a time, I can't remember, uh, who it was, but it was someone important, whether it was the owner of a Vade or someone else.
[00:06:52] Oscar Bond: But they said, if you just, people like you don't try and be anybody else. And I was like, the kind of gay, it might have been like, uh, Ricky Israel or something, you know, like you're, you're trying to perform to be somebody else. And then one day just, and I was lucky because I think that's what turned the corner.
[00:07:10] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. It's interesting. And I mean, some people might think I'm insensitive, you know, uh, talking about the stuttering thing. Uh, but, but, but, but I can, because I used to have a bit of a stutter, um, as well. Um, and, but even more so because we have a very long history and, uh, we both laugh about it. But. I think that your approach to dealing with your stutter, that it actually underpins in many ways who you are.
[00:07:40] Antony Whitaker: It's almost become your sort of secret weapon to sort of breaking down barriers and disarming people because you're a teacher. You get on an airplane every week and you're in a different part of America, you know, two or three days a week doing seminars in front of audiences and you stand on stage and you talk for a living.
[00:08:01] Antony Whitaker: And you just get up there and you just stutter as if you stutter, you stutter, you couldn't care less about it. And I always think that's really interesting because a lot of people that would have any sort of speech impediment would, um, they do the opposite. Yeah, they, they avoid talking. So, um, has it ever bothered you like when you were a kid growing up that it did having a stutter ever hold you back in any way?
[00:08:28] Oscar Bond: There's times you wish you didn't stutter. You know, there's, it's never the easy times. I don't stutter out of, um, and I don't think you do either. It's not out of fear or it's out of maybe excitement or your brain's running too fast. I always thought people would make fun of me. Nobody ever did. uh, brothers my nickname was donkey because he always calls me donkey. So, and also it's not really a big deal. Like, uh, the, the, the, the hardest time was first of all, like when you become a teacher and you talk to people, but that really wasn't that bad. I had you next to me and others and you started like, but that, but that, but that was kind of the, uh, A difficult time was the first time you're on stage with a microphone.
[00:09:14] Oscar Bond: Because you, when you start it, it gets louder. And I'll never forget, people were like, shockwaves. They'd ask me, uh, uh, where do you live? And I was living in Washington, D. C. And I was going, wha, wha, I, So all of a sudden, and it was kind of a light bulb because all of a sudden I was like, Oh my God, I'm like crushing here.
[00:09:32] Oscar Bond: And after show some of the, after the show, someone goes, when you were thinking it was really inspirational, they had no idea I was like already cut my throat. Like I couldn't get a word out. So what people's perception is, and you said something really, really important in that last thing, which is true. I think if you stutter, or you have an impediment of any kind, you disarm people.
[00:09:50] Oscar Bond: So I walk into new groups three times a day, every weekend. And somehow, maybe it's just because I'm not an intimidating figure. I think that goes down to your looks, your attire, uh, I'm not dangerous. So I think what you said about having a stutter, disarming people, that's really true. I never thought about it, but no one's ever given me a hard time.
[00:10:15] Oscar Bond: One lady, one time made fun of me. That was bad
[00:10:19] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. . Yeah.
[00:10:21] Oscar Bond: I can't say that story. That's, that's a private story, but yeah, it was really bad.
[00:10:26] Antony Whitaker: It, it, it's a little bit like, um, blushing. Um, I used to blush really badly. I'd go bright red and it, it really used to inhibit my ability to communicate. 'cause I didn't wanna, I didn't want the attention to be on me. And I remember talking about it once. I can't remember. Who was with, I think it was in some sort of group setting where we were talking about something like this wasn't therapy, but it was it was maybe some sort of teacher training thing or something and I just remember, you know, talking  about the fact that blushing was, you know, I felt really bad when I was in front of an audience and I could just feel myself going bright red and I still do that today and there might be, you know, a couple of thousand people in the room, but it doesn't bother me.
[00:11:14] Antony Whitaker: I just get on with it and you just do it. And the bit that disarmed it or the bit that that changed how I felt about it was when we were talking about it in this group setting and I said, I just want to want the ground to open up and swallow me when when I blush. And this girl said. She said, Oh, I don't know.
[00:11:32] Antony Whitaker: I actually find that quite endearing you brought, when you, when you blush, it makes you more human. And, and from that moment on, it was like, Oh, okay. Do you know what I mean? So if I blush, I blush, if I stutter, I stutter, I, I obviously. I stutter more with you because it's like a trigger you start and it sets me off.
[00:11:55] Antony Whitaker: Do you know what I mean? So, um, So so so that's a bit of a problem. But uh, and that and that is why we've probably taken This is over 250 podcast episodes before i've actually got you on here, So anyway 
[00:12:12] Oscar Bond: So  you said, like that, that girl that said, I think it's kind of endearing or I think it's kind of cute. Those are the pieces in life. They give you huge amounts of confidence. You know, I think it was one time I was stuttering doing one of the classes at, at night, if it else soon, I said something about, I was in a car and someone goes, how many cars are you in?
[00:12:32] Oscar Bond: And the girl says, I think it's kind of cute. I've never stopped talking. Like, if I look back, it's not big breakthroughs. It's tiny things where someone goes, I think it's kind of endearing where you just snap right out of it. So I try and tell people that have, and we have a stutter, uh, there's all kinds of speech impediments.
[00:12:48] Oscar Bond: The hard one for me is a stammer where there's no noise. That's harder than, that's harder than being like, uh, but you just get through. I mean, it's. So I think it's, I think there's no way there's not self help books, but one day someone just triggers you. I do have a great family. I've had great people around me.
[00:13:07] Oscar Bond: So even if someone does make fun, I probably made fun of them a lot more. Like it's not, it used to hurt me as a kid maybe, but ever since a teenager, it didn't bother me.
[00:13:17] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Um, I hadn't got this written down, but it just occurred to me to, to, to think about this in this context in that, um, anyone you talk to who knows you, I was talking to someone this morning, Eric, who said to me, Oh, Oscar's the funniest guy in the world. And you're on your best behavior at the moment, without a doubt.
[00:13:37] Antony Whitaker: Okay. Um, but, um, A lot of people would say that about you that you're very, very funny. Whenever I'm with you, you make me, you know, laugh my head off just constantly, you know, you find humor and everything. So I'm trying to make a connection between Oscar the comedian and Oscar the stutterer. Did, um, the stuttering, um, Is there, is there a connection?
[00:14:02] Antony Whitaker: Do you know what I mean? Was you, you, you, you, you know how when people get, say they get bullied at school, so they learn to be funny as a survival mechanism. Did, did you learn to be funny and make fun of yourself so that people would like you instead of give you a hard time?
[00:14:16] Oscar Bond: Yeah, I think I had enough people making fun of me when it came to my brothers and that's not, that's not bullying or bad or anything. I mean, my older brother's lost his hair and my other one's a bit chunky. So it all comes back around. No, it's, uh, but I think as a defense of when you started, you would make fun of it.
[00:14:34] Oscar Bond: So people don't laugh at you. They laugh with you. I think that, never really thought about it, but I've never, I've never stuttered. So I'm being like, ah, one time. Not good. It was in Japan, man. Not good. You speak funny. One of those things, like, oof. Yeah. Not allowed back for a number of years, but there you go.
[00:14:51] Oscar Bond: No, it's, uh, it really, I don't know. I mean, it's, if I meet someone that stutters, you really don't have a bad stutter until we talk. But if I meet someone that's worse than me, I don't know. I can't even talk to them like I was, I'd rather just turn away and be like, Hey, you'll do great. You know, like, uh, otherwise it's just that it's like a mechanism where clickers, but, but that, but those things kind of roll off me a lot more than other things.
[00:15:20] Oscar Bond: Like the things that are painful to me is I don't know when you're not liked. There's not many people that don't like me and the people I don't like, I know why they don't like me. But there was a, there was a craving through a big chunk of my career where you had to be liked, you know? And that's not really important at all.
[00:15:37] Oscar Bond: You keep your own path. I learned that kind of late. I learned that through Wendy. She's really good like that. Both.
[00:15:44] Antony Whitaker: it's like. You, what you do for a living. I mean, I mean, I, you know, we've both been teachers for a long time standing in front of audiences, et cetera. I don't do that post COVID nearly as much as I used to before COVID. Now I do a lot more stuff that's online, um, obviously, but I think there's something about what you do and I haven't seen you in action for a while on a stage, but if you've got arrival of hairdressers.
[00:16:10] Antony Whitaker: And you come along for the first time and people don't know you. There's always a degree of people sort of sat there sizing you up. Do you know what I mean? Like people, it's, it's a little bit like if you're self-conscious about dancing,
[00:16:24] Oscar Bond: Mm hmm.
[00:16:25] Antony Whitaker: it's like get over it because No one's actually watching you.
[00:16:29] Antony Whitaker: They're actually more concerned with themselves. And I'm thinking in a hairdressing environment, if you're there on stage and you've got a class full of new people in front of you who never met you before, they're sort of like, and you get up there and you start stuttering. I think it probably just takes all the ego out of the room.
[00:16:50] Oscar Bond: Yeah. It's not, it's not a good way to,
[00:16:52] Antony Whitaker: mean?
[00:16:52] Oscar Bond: it's not a good way to start a class, man. It's stuttering. Cause then I'll go, then it's like, has he been on the bloody Mary's? Like, like what's he been doing? Cause something like that. So, it's, it's something that you break through straight away. And I think, uh, when Claiborne told me something one time, he says the best educators are the best storytellers.
[00:17:12] Oscar Bond: So over a long career, you got a shit ton of stories, uh, you know, you can, they're, they're out there at the yin yang. So I think you, it's really difficult when I have people in a room where they're one year out of school and they're 63 years old, the same age as me, you know, they're kind of over their career.
[00:17:29] Oscar Bond: They feel like they're not part of it. So I think you just connect with everyone. It's, and I don't have a difficult time doing it. I take care of everyone in the class. I've never just taken care of the. The cute ones, the, no, it's everyone. And I found in my experience, the people that you take care of, take care of you later on in life.
[00:17:45] Oscar Bond: So
[00:17:46] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we haven't worked together for a long time, but I know when we used to that you had this ability to, and it was a mixture of humor and just genuine empathy to break down any barriers, to break down any of the ego in the room, and often when you've got a room full of hairdressers, there's a healthy amount of ego there.
[00:18:06] Antony Whitaker: Um, but anyway, um, so, so, so, so let, let's leave that alone for a moment. Um, because all these things are sort of interlinked in some ways. And I know you said that you were more than happy to talk about anything. And a lot of people will know that of your journey in that, you know, you started with me at Sassoon's in London, literally in the same week in 1980 or whenever it was.
[00:18:27] Antony Whitaker: Um, you know, we literally started at the same time, which was a fantastic, you know, time to work with, uh, or work in. And we worked together in the schools and academies. And then you moved to the United States. Uh, so you've been living in America for a long time. Um, And then you had a salon for a number of years.
[00:18:45] Antony Whitaker: Did you, it was only the one salon you had, wasn't it?
[00:18:47] Oscar Bond: Only one slot. And prior to that, I came out because I fell in love and I like the US and the US was good to me. I had no idea there was going to be the big key for me was I wasn't very good in the hair salon. I'm slow. I don't do color. So I got back into doing some night classes and that led to more classes.
[00:19:06] Oscar Bond: And that's how it all kind of started. And the big break was getting picked up by a Vader. Really, they're the ones that gave me a lot more reach, so. But there was no plans involved. You're very, I've always admired you for your kind of planning, the way you write your books and everything. Uh,
[00:19:22] Oscar Bond: It's, uh, yeah, I don't overthink things, but I wish I was a better planner. I've got a really good planner in Wendy, but you've always been good like that, man. I've always admired you for it.
[00:19:31] Antony Whitaker: Well, thanks man, I appreciate that. But, uh, what I was gonna talk about was your school, because a lot of people won't know, uh, that you opened the school. It was a fantastic school too, uh, uh, in New Jersey. And, uh, it was big and I saw it, and it, it looked like it was gonna be a huge success. Uh, and due to reasons beyond your control, you know, I know there was a fire in the school, et cetera, and, you know, one thing led to another.
[00:19:55] Antony Whitaker: And it ended up, um, bankrupting you. And I know you said that we can talk about that. Um, because again, that goes, it's sort of linked. With the whole, um, I'm happy thing. Do you know what I mean? Because if, if ever there was a reason to not be happy, you know, uh, I would have thought, you know, going bankrupt would be high on that list.
[00:20:18] Antony Whitaker: I mean, you know, you've got a wife, you've got, had two young kids at the time, you know, you had a house and you had the school with a business partner and all that sort of stuff. Uh, and I remember seeing you around that time and it still didn't seem to phase you. It was just like, you just roll with the punches.
[00:20:31] Antony Whitaker: You just get up every day and. And get, get on with it. So can you talk to us about how you dealt with that? Because at any time there will be people listening to this that are having a tough time in business, tough time in their life, relationships, what, whatever it is. And not everyone is able to sort of sail through things.
[00:20:52] Antony Whitaker: So, you know, how did you deal with that period of your life?
[00:20:56] Oscar Bond: Uh, it's a really good question because it all started off so good. You know, we sold our salon to Sam Brocato for a decent amount of money. We had like, oh, $400,000 in working capital. Everything's hunky dory. And then one day you get a phone call saying, uh, your buildings had a fire. And we bought the building.
[00:21:16] Oscar Bond: So just after that, it was every day you are dealing with. What's presented, you got people coming at you for money. You, there was asbestos involved. So all of a sudden there's remediation. You learn a lot about debt. So in one night, everything turned really, really sour. I was more worried about marriage and the kids than I was about money.
[00:21:37] Oscar Bond: I think Wendy was a lot more worried about money than, than other things. So you just got through it, but we kept getting, you kept paying, we just kept putting good money after like good money after good money, we were kind of throwing it away and in hindsight, I learned a lot that when something bad happens, you stop.
[00:21:55] Oscar Bond: You don't put another penny into it. That was the big lesson I learned from it. And also, uh, you get through it. We had a, we had a business partner that was a really good friend of mine. I would never do that again. Uh, my attorney once said the only partner you want in life, you either want to marry them or dance with them but never do business.
[00:22:10] Oscar Bond: That was kinda because there's a sooner or later there's a philosophical difference, whether it's equity, whether it's whatever. So we had a lot left on our plate. We both needed jobs really quick. Uh, I had at least Hattori Hanzo was kind of gunning for me. So that, that's where I went. Wendy went with a distributor to be of, of a color line.
[00:22:34] Oscar Bond: And I would have worked in a gas station. Like one, one night you got tons of money next night. You got nothing. So it was just day by day. I had really good people around me. One of them was Eric Fisher. I've got you. There's, I had excellent people around me. Uh, But then sometimes, you know, the people you really rely on, they're not around.
[00:22:54] Oscar Bond: So it was really hard, but you just get through it every single day. Had a really bad experience, uh, prior to COVID where Wendy's brother took his own life and it wasn't expected. And that is really shocking to me. That makes me feel like I should have done more because we went through a bankruptcy. So the idea is if you are listening to this now and you're having a bad time or you're really down so far You've been a hundred percent successful at living So that's what you kind of go to every single day and then I can almost guarantee you it does get better It will get better.
[00:23:27] Oscar Bond: So there was a there was a lot learned in that I don't know what to go through it again. And, and hindsight, hindsight is everything, like what we should have done, what I should have done all that. But on the day of when it's presented, you do the best thing for, you go with the best advice you have, whether it's.
[00:23:45] Oscar Bond: your attorney, but I realized there was a lot in debt, like, and we've got through it. Now we, we own a place in, in the Poconos. Uh, so you do get through it. It was just a horrible few year, like not a few weeks or a few months, a horrible few years, but then it's behind you. So, I really admire Wendy because she took the brunt of all the financial stuff and we begged, borrowed money.
[00:24:08] Oscar Bond: We kept putting good money after bad money. The bank kept giving us money. You can do it. You can do it. And in reality, looking back on that day one, we should have been like the keys are yours. So you learn a lot, but that's half of life. And now I kind of appreciate everything. I love my job. Uh, I don't think it's any fun being in your sixties, but my mom said when you hit 70, you feel really young.
[00:24:30] Oscar Bond: So I've only got seven more years of that. Uh, just the, the, the alternatives to life to get an older aren't that great. The alternatives to not get through a bankrupt aren't that great. So I think you just deal with it. I was lucky because my mom and dad. They have a good mentality like that. And we have good people around us.
[00:24:46] Oscar Bond: A couple, a couple of really good clients that became good friends. Eric was a really big help to me. You just need some people around you that can say, you can do it. No, one's going to come flying in with a million dollars. Be like, there you go. So you've got to kind of get out of your own hole that you dug, but, uh, we got through it and it's, it wasn't a good experience, but very appreciative of everything now,
[00:25:05] Antony Whitaker: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, there's a lot of people that have been very successful in business that have also been bankrupt. Um,
[00:25:12] Antony Whitaker: they all say that it's, you know, that it's, they were better off for it at some level that they learned a lot about themselves, et cetera. 
[00:25:20] Oscar Bond: learn a lot of what you should have done, but, but at the same time, um, I didn't know. So. You think of bankruptcy, it's a really bad word, but it's there for a reason. So there's people that go bankrupt, which I don't agree with because they could pay their bills, but there's others we would never have got out of the debt ever.
[00:25:38] Oscar Bond: So you go bankrupt to give you a fresh start. And I've never had to go through a recovery of drugs, alcohol, anything like that. But that was a recovery. Like you start back down, like your credit goes from here. credit rating is really important. And we were up there in the seven hundreds.
[00:25:53] Oscar Bond: And then one night you're at the bottoms, like three 18. I think we were like, Uh, but you just start and you just, I was on a debit card for a few months. I still travel. I didn't have any credit cards. So I had to get prepaid credit cards to use to check in hotels. It was just miserable, but, but I did have some really good, good people around me and family and everything.
[00:26:12] Oscar Bond: And you do work through it. I think, I think, sorry,
[00:26:17] Antony Whitaker: No, no. I was going to say, what, what, what did you learn about yourself?
[00:26:22] Oscar Bond: nothing kills you. You know, all the, I mean, so many of the words, like the moment we knew we were going to go through a bankruptcy and we lived in a really nice house, we left that house. And we rented another house. We could have stayed in that house for another five years and not paid mortgage, but you've got these things hanging over you just want to deal with them.
[00:26:39] Oscar Bond: So at the moment we were like, definitely going to go through the bankruptcy. And it was horrible experience, uh, because it was big, if it's small, like if you can't pay, pay for your car. Signed off, but if it's big, they went, they went through not family treasures, but Wendy's great aunt silverware, like everything you're allowed your wedding ring and one other ring.
[00:27:00] Oscar Bond: Other than that, everything's taken kind of bad, but, but you go through it and then you hear about, uh, the worst thing for us was it was later on in life. Like I, was 50, like 49, 50. That's 500 years old. Actually, uh, no, it's. That if it happens earlier in life, you've got more of a recovery time.
[00:27:20] Oscar Bond: And a really good friend of mine, I had John Paul, who's very, very successful. He went through a bankruptcy early in life in his thirties, and he said it's going to take like six, seven years. And that's exactly what it did. It was a hard struggle. And we'll never have those, what we had before. But life is, it's good.
[00:27:35] Oscar Bond: I've got two, uh, great kids, a great wife, a dog that's patting outside Audrey over there. So, so things can't, can't be being, you just get through things like it's. There's loads of people that wouldn't have got through it and you kind of think like the alternative wasn't good. It really wasn't.
[00:27:52] Antony Whitaker: You, you, um, we both mentioned Eric a couple of times. Um, and you mentioned him as being someone who was like, you know, having good people around you and, and you have a huge network of people because of the fact that you travel every week and you're standing in front of audiences every week.
[00:28:10] Antony Whitaker: You go to every state in America, uh, and you're very well known. Um, and, um, And so you get to see some incredible businesses and meet some incredible business owners. So what do you see that really sets successful people apart? When, you know, you, you meet people that have got a great salon business, what is it about them that sets them apart from everyone else, so to speak?
[00:28:41] Oscar Bond: I think anyone, especially scholars, school owners that are very successful, are very driven. Very driven. Like laser focus. It's not like they wake up in the morning. No, they get up early. They read books. They do the best they can. The people I admire, especially someone like Eric, it's because he's got, um, Family of four kids.
[00:28:59] Oscar Bond: He deals with all the same crap that we all deal with and has a fantastic business where people love him. So he's, he hasn't had to really, he's had to work on his business, but he has people, there's van council in, in, in Atlanta, the same thing, people never quit. So when you just have people that work for you, so he's got four salons.
[00:29:19] Oscar Bond: I just see them as deep down. They have good, good, good, good, good, good You know, whether it's faith, family, good business practices, and they kind of like, Eric, like you, has always been the same person. You know, it's not like, Oh, Anthony, you've got, um, you're wearing a bra.
[00:29:36] Oscar Bond: Lovely. Like, uh, no, it doesn't. He's always been. Good luck to you man, two thumbs up. It's kind of, um, you know, he's been a normal person, deals with normal stuff. And even people that you, that you think are super, super successful, they deal with crap all day long. So it's, it's just life. It doesn't matter where you are, you're going to deal with that.
[00:29:57] Oscar Bond: So it's how you kind of deal with all the crisis in your life. I've always been blessed with good health, good kids, good family, good friends, and it's not all luck because you do get to choose who is around you.
[00:30:09] Antony Whitaker: Yeah, yeah, no, you, you just mentioned another one, uh, with, um, Van Council and, um, you know, I've had Van on the podcast. Another one is David Wagner, um, uh, and, and Eric, they've all got these incredible employee-based businesses. With an incredible culture and they're big businesses. Um, you know, jute, uh, in particular, uh, and van council, big businesses, and they seem to be as successful today as what they've ever been in an environment, which has become very much about independence and very much about, you know, salon suites and all that.
[00:30:52] Antony Whitaker: And so I look at businesses like theirs as flying the flag for, you know, If you're going to do a commission based salon, do it like this, because this is a real business because they've got phenomenal businesses on. I'll put links in the show notes of today's episode for people to go back and listen to those podcasts.
[00:31:10] Antony Whitaker: Because. You know, they're really inspiring business owners and stuff. So I'm always looking at them, whether it's those guys, whether it's people in America, people in Australia, people in Europe, the UK, whatever, I'm always looking at what is it that sets these uber successful salon owners apart and their salons themselves apart, because it's inspiring in that when you go into a business like that, I fully recognize.
[00:31:38] Antony Whitaker: That the salon suite thing and the independent thing that there's a place for it. But at the same time, I think that that there's also a cause or a case to really push what building a great commission-based salons about because it's so exciting to create that sort of culture for when you walk in there.
[00:32:02] Antony Whitaker: As a young 17, 18, 19-year-old, and this is going to be your career. The whole thing, the whole team, the culture, the environment, the music, the decor, all that sort of stuff is what sets it apart from just being in a. a room by yourself as a salon suite. So, um, talk to us about your observations on that.
[00:32:23] Oscar Bond: Uh, it very much happened from West Coast to East where commission salon starts up. Wind down and independent started to wind up. And that was a, that was a few years ago and bear in mind, I've been to every state twice, so I've got kind of a good, good, a good bearing of it to have a very successful salon, like a van Michael or an Eric Fisher or a jute.
[00:32:45] Oscar Bond: Um, you need really good leadership. And that's lacking. There aren't enough vans, erics, um, people around. It's also, they're having a really hard time as well. They're having a hard time getting staff. Years ago, they were the ones. So, give me a minute, I'm gonna read you something from Mario Tricosi's Salons and Schools.
[00:33:05] Oscar Bond: It's a big chain of salons, they're very, very wealthy. Hold on, it's in my bag.
[00:33:10] Oscar Bond: This thing here, Tricosi Salon and Spas, they're a really big, big network. And this was, uh, the Midwest show. There's a booth, like a big booth, and it costs a lot of money to get a booth. And their booth is to hire staff. It's the first time I've ever seen a show where they're trying to hire people walking around the show.
[00:33:29] Oscar Bond: Uh, this is what it says, maybe you get a little picture of that or something, but I will read it out to you. This is someone, they're trying to get staff.
[00:33:35] Antony Whitaker: read it, read it out. Cause, um, a lot, some people will watch this on YouTube, but the majority of people just listen to it. So,
[00:33:42] Oscar Bond: Okay. It says what, um, what we offer accelerated training and mentorship program get on the floor in six weeks or less. Number one, up to 50 percent service commission, additional commission on retail and tenure, marketing support to help build your business, company pay, continue education from top industry talent.
[00:34:00] Oscar Bond: That's me. Uh, comprehensive health insurance, medical Rx, Rx which is um, uh, prescriptions, dental vision, life and disability, free mental health, wellbeing benefits, 401k with a generous company match. 401k is where you can put money prior to tax and your company matches it. It's free money. Like it's a great thing.
[00:34:22] Oscar Bond: Uh, time off benefit. Yeah.
[00:34:24] Antony Whitaker: pension fund. Yeah.
[00:34:24] Oscar Bond: Yeah, yeah, kind of, uh, time off benefits, including paid leave and employee discounts up to 90 percent off services. And that's just to get someone to be an employee. So van offers 500 bucks to become a, to become an assistant. If you're there six, six months, he'll give you another thousand dollars.
[00:34:42] Oscar Bond: You finish your call. So it's hard getting people. I do think the pendulum swung so far towards. Independence. I mean, it's a great idea, man. Imagine if we were finishing school, we can get our own little space with our own name on it. And we get our own business card and our own logo. But guess what we don't have?
[00:35:00] Oscar Bond: Any business. So I go to loads of them and they go in when they have a client. It doesn't, it's cheap. It's 300 bucks a week or something. So I get that for a haircut. So. But I do think that what you miss out on is the camaraderie of when you and I work together and I'll come in every day and you'd say, you look like, that's what I kind of miss with people.
[00:35:24] Oscar Bond: And that's the energy of Eric, Eric, Van, jute. They don't have paid cultures. It's an organic culture that everyone becomes part of. They're all birds of a feather. There's no odd ones out. But it's getting harder and harder, but I think people are craving it. They're sick and tired of not having any clients.
[00:35:41] Oscar Bond: Like social media has really hurt the big commission-based salons. Like it's, it's hard, it's hard to run an operation when you don't know what your people are doing. Eric's frustrated. I know Van's frustrated. So they're having a hard time, but they're surviving. Whereas the others have a hard time, don't survive, but it's not easy.
[00:36:01] Oscar Bond: I go to schools and just, I don't want to talk bad about the kids, but They're, they're not driven by excellence. They think they are, you know, they, but they're not because there's not enough leadership above them to tell them what excellence is. So I think as part of being older in these classes, I kind of show them what we were shown, which was do the best you can with whatever you have.
[00:36:25] Oscar Bond: No, that's kind of been the, the message for a long time.
[00:36:30] Antony Whitaker: standout word with everything you just talked about was leadership.
[00:36:34] Oscar Bond: you have a salon now? Would you want to, would you want to open another hair salon? Personally, in New York, I wouldn't. Maybe, maybe somewhere else.
[00:36:43] Antony Whitaker: I'll tell you what I miss. I miss what I described. I mean, I had great salons when I had them and I loved building a brand. I loved creating something that was bigger than me. I loved creating that culture and giving people a career path and you'd walk in the door and it was like going into a great restaurant or going into a great club.
[00:37:02] Antony Whitaker: It was like, Oh, this is fantastic. You know, I loved being at work. And, uh, uh, I, I think I can pretty confidently say most of the people that I worked with at that time also loved working there. And so I, I, I would love to have that sort of salon again. I recognize totally the challenges today with, uh, recruiting and, and keeping people because it's a different world and a lot of that is because of the technology and stuff that's available today.
[00:37:30] Antony Whitaker: And, and, and that's made it so much easier, you know, through social media, through iPhone, through. You know, all the digital marketing and being able to take payments and book appointments on a phone and all that sort of stuff. It's a different world to, to the world that, uh, you and I started here dressing in, but there was one, one other thing I wanted to touch on with you because.
[00:37:51] Antony Whitaker: You are a hair cutter. Your skill is that you are a great haircutter and you're on the road, you know, two days a week doing classes in front of an audience, teaching them to cut hair. And yet all over the world for the last, pretty much the last 20 years is that. The, the, the era that you started in and I started in was all about cutting hair and the era that we live in now is predominantly everywhere.
[00:38:21] Antony Whitaker: It's more about. And so I wanted to ask you, what, what do you, what do you see? As far as that goes, I mean, what am I, what am I really asking here? Um, you know, you talk about the pendulum swinging back. I mean, and everything we've been in this industry long enough to know that everything changes.
[00:38:40] Antony Whitaker: Eventually, nothing stays the same forever. Um, and I will often get people say to me, you know, people. Not necessarily my age, a little bit younger, maybe in their forties. And they'll say, Antony, where can I get a decent haircut? Because they'll know that I'm in the industry. And they will say that so many salons you go into now, they just don't know how to do a nice little haircut.
[00:39:03] Antony Whitaker: So what do you see as someone who travels around teaching people to cut hair? You know, every single week, do you, do you see that sort of, uh, you know, lack of expertise, lack of willingness, lack of. Like, you know, lack, full stop.
[00:39:18] Oscar Bond: I think it kind of started with When we were younger, like the only way, what, what we strive to do when we were assistants, what we dreamt of was one day getting published in a magazine, your own name. We used to watch people like Mitch Barry. Oh my gosh, I wish I could do that. So a whole bunch of my drive was to try and get publicity.
[00:39:39] Oscar Bond: But what that also did was, because there were strong trends, every year, like it or not, you had to learn 2, 3, 4 haircuts. There was a long one, a middle length, and a short one. There hasn't been a short haircut in the last 15, 20 years.
[00:39:51] Oscar Bond: try it, try it, and think of one. So, kids can go through the whole of school, and they might do little old ladies hair, but they don't do anything short and creative. They don't really get the chance. So they all know hair which is this long, with an iron work, and some color. They don't know anything else.
[00:40:07] Oscar Bond: And color has been predominant, so they all want to be color specialists. If you leave school, and you're a color specialist, it just means you can't cut hair. Like, you're not a specialist at anything when you leave school. So, until fashion dictates short hair, people don't really care about it. I mean, they want to learn in classes, but do they go out afterwards and find a short hair model and practice?
[00:40:27] Oscar Bond: They all know it's coming. They all know that they can't do short hair. So, it does give people of an older generation a bit of an advantage because they've got those things already set up. They've done years of, yeah. Well, where was? Kids leaving school since, certainly since COVID or prior. I don't think they've ever done a short haircut. All they do is short haircuts or I'm a barber that, that, that, that does pixies, barbers do men's haircuts. They don't do pixies, so the whole thing, when it comes to short hair, when it comes to short hair, just is people want it, people crave for it, but until a big celebrity where everyone wants that look like right now, it's still about here.
[00:41:04] Oscar Bond: Like it looks like a shaggy Bob. It's always something like a shaggy Bob until someone, until you've got people going, I want that, but it hasn't happened in years when it does, it's I struggle sometimes because it is all about hair color. So if I owned a salon again, um, I think it would all be about hair color.
[00:41:21] Oscar Bond: Maybe you put the price of the haircut into it. Like that's how less important it is, but to certain people, it's really important. So I go out there and I teach about the fact that I do hair cutting. I've had a great career just cutting hair. I don't know if you could do that these days. You need color, unless you're going to get paid a lot for a haircut.
[00:41:38] Oscar Bond: And I get paid really well for a haircut. Um, and I still enjoy doing it. I must admit my eyes aren't as good as they were. Believe me, shocking. No, but, but also it kind of keeps you on your game where you're showing someone doing a Bob and you've got 20 people watching you, you can't be like, Oh yeah. Yeah.
[00:41:57] Oscar Bond: Lick them, stick them. No, you got to like, like, so that's what keeps you up, on your toes. And I enjoy what I do. The most thing I enjoy most is just meeting and new people. I'll go to some tiny towns, meet some of the nicest people. And, and, and I still enjoy it. Yeah. That's, that's the best part of it is sometimes people think so much more of you, you're like, what,
[00:42:19] Antony Whitaker: yeah. That's it. See, now that's, that's actually taken us full circle back to where we started. That's your thing, isn't it? You love meeting new people. Not everyone does. Um, and as a, to be a successful hairdresser, you need to, you need to be interested in people like not just we, we both know people who are really good at cutting hair, but their shortfall is that they don't actually like people that much.
[00:42:43] Antony Whitaker: So you've got to combine those, those different elements, don't you? Yeah.
[00:42:48] Oscar Bond: Yeah. And if you look at the people mentioned like your Erics and your Vans, people love them. Like, I mean, they're, they're, so I think I know some really poor hairdressers that are really great people and are really slammed. I know some people that are great hairdressers, not very busy.
[00:43:06] Oscar Bond: So I don't, I think it's a combination of a lot of different kind of cocktails make the perfect one. I'm certainly not perfect. I need, I need a colorist. I need, uh, I need an assistant. Uh, so it's, I'm not that I'm, I was and never will be the best stylist, but I do enjoy teaching classes. I do enjoy talking.
[00:43:25] Oscar Bond: Which is kind of weird because neither of us are very good talkers as kids, you know, but no one's ever, so if anyone does have any kind of ailments like that, no one's ever, Your worst fears never happen. Like, like a whole bunch of people going, ah, you speak really funny. Ah, no, it doesn't happen. Doesn't happen at all.
[00:43:42] Oscar Bond: Uh, maybe it did. I didn't hear it. I don't know, but it doesn't really happen. So I think all the fears you have fear is the one thing that stops you.
[00:43:50] Antony Whitaker: Yeah.
[00:43:50] Antony Whitaker: Um, now I know you said you're not real big on social media and I can vouch for that. You're not real big, but you sort of are on there. So, so whereabouts can people connect with you on Instagram or any other social
[00:44:01] Oscar Bond: my, my, um, handle would be Oscar Bond oh oh seven and it's not the one with, um. Underscores cause that got hacked. The person that does nothing on social media that follows no one got hacked. And it was kind of an invasion. So I couldn't imagine if my life was on there. Uh, but now what I do know is every single person that I've connected with, I know.
[00:44:23] Oscar Bond: So I've only got a couple thousand, but I know all of them. Whereas before I had like eight, 11, 12, 000, didn't know any of them, just lots of lots, lots of people saying, yeah, many nice-looking girls. So I was like, maybe I should find out who these people are. So I do like the idea. And I think having a group of smaller numbers is a lot more attractive than a group of big numbers.
[00:44:42] Oscar Bond: Maybe it's a bit elitist, but if I did own a salon, I'd have a Facebook page for the salon, but I'd have a closed one for clients. I think people would like to be into things, you know? So I know with Hansa, with that mentoring, if we have closed groups, people crave to get in there because they can't.
[00:45:00] Antony Whitaker: Okay. Yeah, that's interesting.
[00:45:02] Oscar Bond: So I, I look at, I, I look at numbers totally the opposite way. Like I would much rather be part of the like a group or the. Then part of something like the codec group
[00:45:12] Antony Whitaker: Right. Okay. So it's OSCARBONN007, no underscores.
[00:45:17] Oscar Bond: right below. It's the same picture with underscores. Yeah, that's not me.
[00:45:21] Antony Whitaker: All right. Okay. Well, if anyone wants to, uh, connect with you, I'll put those links on our website and in the show notes for today's podcast.
[00:45:29] Oscar Bond: Well, also if, if, if anyone knows me, I don't know if they know this about you, but you produce some books, man, that every single person should have. It's I know they're, I know they're related to hairdressing and building a business, but you could put it into any walk of life. 
[00:45:44] Oscar Bond: You've got to realize that having, having a book, like a legacy of a book, you should feel very proud.
[00:45:51] Antony Whitaker: Mm.
[00:45:51] Oscar Bond: should feel very proud, man. And so should your kids. So should Belinda. Everything's good, man.
[00:45:55] Antony Whitaker: Thank
[00:45:56] Oscar Bond: I really admire you, Ella, and I'm lucky that you're in my life. So I don't have many people, but I'm lucky.
[00:46:01] Antony Whitaker: Cheers, mate. Any, any final words before we wrap up?
[00:46:06] Oscar Bond: No. What'd you call a man with a rubber toe?
[00:46:10] Antony Whitaker: Oh, God. What? All right, that'll do. All
[00:46:16] Oscar Bond: kind of fantastic. Could be one.
[00:46:18] Antony Whitaker: Roberto.
[00:46:19] Oscar Bond: Roberto. Yeah, Roberto. I can't ever meet Roberto again after that. But I would do this video anytime, man. I thoroughly enjoyed it.
[00:46:27] Antony Whitaker: Okay. All right. Well, if you listen to this podcast with Oscar and have enjoyed it, do me a favor, share it to people that you know would also enjoy it. And don't forget to subscribe and leave us a rating and review on the Apple podcast app. Uh, so to wrap up, Oscar Bond, thank you for being on this week's episode of the Grow My Salon Business Podcast.
[00:46:45] Antony Whitaker: You've been very well behaved. I certainly weren't
[00:46:48] Oscar Bond: Thank you. And I didn't stutter very much either. You didn't stutter very much either. There we go.
[00:46:53] Antony Whitaker: I know you've been very professional, very well behaved.
[00:46:56] Oscar Bond: Thank you.
[00:46:57] Antony Whitaker: uh, cheers, mate. We'll do it again sometime. 
[00:47:00] Oscar Bond: Appreciate you man. No worries