Speaker 1 (00:00):
Real estate team versus independent brokerage or even independent team Orage, which is the right direction for you? How do you know and what does a brokerage or a teamer require that a team doesn't for answers? Check out this conversation with Brad Nicks, who's turned two real estate teams into brokerages, including Path and post a 30 person brokerage that operates as a team. Learn the maker doer follower framework and how it affects your model decision. Learn the years long evolution of their onboarding and training to create strategic guides, not just commodity agents. Get tips to figure out the right sequence, structure, and platform for your training content and learn why five star reviews are the ultimate measure of success. Check out Brad Nicks right now on real estate team os. 

Speaker 2 (00:47):
No matter where your business is today or where you want to take it, you'll get there faster and more profitably with an operating system. Welcome to Team Os, your guide to starting, growing and optimizing real estate team. Here's your host, Ethan Butte. 

Speaker 1 (01:01):
Brad, thank you so much for being a longtime listener of the show. I'm excited to have you participate and contribute as a guest. Welcome to Real Estate Team os. 

Speaker 3 (01:09):
Yeah, thanks for having me, Ethan. Excited about it. 

Speaker 1 (01:11):
Are you a viewer or listener or both? 

Speaker 3 (01:14):
Both. It just depends on where I'm at in the world. I have a morning routine. I walk my dogs every single morning. Most of the time I'm listening. Every once in a while I may pull up YouTube and take a look at. 

Speaker 1 (01:24):
Yeah, cool. Yeah, I'm a listener as well to other podcasts. Oddly, I tend not to listen to my own. I guess 

Speaker 3 (01:30):
I get it. Yeah. 

Speaker 1 (01:32):
Cool. Well, you probably know this one's coming. It's where we always started is what is a must have characteristic of a high performing team. 

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Yeah. I love listening to all the answers you get from this. For me, I think it comes down to mindset and specifically I'm looking for a growth mindset. I'm trying to make sure I have one and everyone that I work with has that growth mindset as opposed to a fixed mindset because as you know Ethan, this industry is always changing. The tech is changing, the market is changing, the rates are changing, consumer expectations are changing, so that growth mindset I really think makes a big difference. 

Speaker 1 (02:08):
Cool. What are a couple, just a practical takeaway for folks. I think most people would appreciate growth mindedness, but how do you identify it as you're engaging with someone either to bring onto the team or perhaps someone, I don't know if they're in a weak moment or a weak spell or something where they're kind of closing off and getting a little bit more fixed. How do I identify that? Can you coach people out of it or do you feel like that this is an enduring characteristic of someone? 

Speaker 3 (02:36):
I am an optimist, so I think everyone can change for the better. Right. 

Speaker 1 (02:40):
Okay, good. 

Speaker 3 (02:40):
I do think it's a skill. You can learn a mindset, you can change and adapt over time. I find myself sometimes falling away from that and you try to catch yourself out of it. So yeah, it is something I think you can change if you work at it. It's not easy to change if you're default fixed, but I think it comes with realizing that change is inevitable, right? We can't control it and actually that act of letting go of like, all right, I don't need to be in control, is more freeing than I think people realize and I try. If someone's stuck in that spot, I try to just unlock that moment where they feel trapped and say, look, it's not going to matter. We're going to get through this together and let's find a different way to look at it and talk about it. 

Speaker 1 (03:26):
I appreciate that optimism. One of the things I've observed in myself as I ebb and flow between them from time to time, I'm a little bit defensive by nature and that comes with a little bit of change, a version I want to be right. I know all these things. So for me it's like at some level, a growth mindedness is a mindfulness practice for me. I will catch myself reacting to something in a way that I know is not constructive and get back on track. 

Speaker 3 (03:50):
So I'm similar to that. Ethan. I try honestly to have strong opinions but loosely held. Right. So I have that. I'm default. Right. No, I know. I believe what I'm saying and thinking, but I'm open to being wrong. You may have to prove it a little more than you wanted to 

Speaker 1 (04:07):
Characterize your real estate journey a little bit. I mean specifically when did brokerage occur to you? And I think if I got the arc right, you went to maybe the banking side of it or something for some period, wrap that up in whatever way do you think would be helpful for the context of some of the ground that we're going to cover here? 

Speaker 3 (04:27):
Yeah. I've been licensed since 1997, so it's been a long time in the industry. I was originally with a family team. Aunt and uncle got me into the business, a traditional story. It wasn't a career goal, but I ended up here and they were kind of a team Before teams existed, they were just husband and wife team. It was the common thing. We ended up taking that little team and turning it into a brokerage. So that was the first independent brokerage I had started back in oh five before the crash. Went through that and then that down cycle actually sold that brokerage. It was a general brokerage at the time, sold it to Century 21, and then I had a non-compete and that's when I ended up in the banking stuff that you saw in my resume. Got it. I did a little startup in local talent and finance and stuff during the non-compete going on, and then in that same period of time I got back into real estate through a connection with Becky Babcock and we took what she had established as a team under her name and turned it into path and post the brand it is today as a branded team. 

Speaker 3 (05:32):
We were at the ERA franchise at that time. We were actually the top team in the country for ERA for three years before we then took that independent team back to being a brokerage. 

Speaker 1 (05:42):
So we're going to get into indie brokerage versus team versus team or independent team bridge maybe because I'm sure you've considered them all at different points. So I'd love to help people make not necessarily your exact same decision, but a decision that makes sense for them based on your own perspective and experience. But before we do characterize path and post however you'd like, let folks know where you are, agent count, culture, structure, whatever you want to share. 

Speaker 3 (06:11):
Yeah. We're in north Atlanta. We've got 30 humans here at the, I like to say six of 'em are staff if you count myself, and then the rest are agents and we'll do 300 plus transactions a year here in North Atlanta. We run it like a team brokerage is how I position it. Everyone who works here is on the team. 

Speaker 1 (06:33):
Cool. So I guess that just tees us straight into indie brokerage versus maybe indie team bridge versus a team in another brokerage. What was going on when you connected with Becky, you were with ERA, obviously very performant. What was that decision about? What were maybe to the degree you recall, pros and cons that were on the table at the time? Or was it just an inevitable direction? 

Speaker 3 (07:00):
A little bit of both. I mean there were pros and cons to rebranding the Becky Babcock team to path and post. It was an intentional act. We co-own the company to get it out of one person's name. We needed something that was bigger than both of us so that we could both invest our time and energy and grow it beyond. And honestly, we wanted to build something that our agents could feel like it was theirs. So our goal of building everything we've done is like start at the client and work backwards. So how does path and post feel to a consumer, buyer or seller? And then how would our agent who is in between us and that consumer explain and feel about it as well? So we were very intentional day one about the brand itself, wanted the agent to be able to say, this is my team and it be true and not just marketing. So every agent, the team is we are all staff supporting the client experience behind the agent. 

Speaker 1 (07:59):
We're definitely dwell in that concept. I think a bit deeper, but I want to stay a little bit with why not the path and post team brokered by ERA or fill in the blank. Anyone talk about that piece? I know there are a lot of folks that watch and listen that wonder about that. We've certainly had independent brokerages, independent teamer is on, some people are scared of the brokerage part of it. Some people move in that direction anyway for speed and flexibility. How were you looking at that? 

Speaker 3 (08:29):
Yeah, I mean we were definitely a team under another national brokerage, national franchise, and it was great. It worked fine. I have nothing but good things to say about the broker. I was with an ERA as a brand. It just came a point to where we started bumping up on little edges of franchise guidelines or even the consumer expectation of calling the office thinking it was our office and it wasn't. It was the broker's. So from the consumer experience backwards, we said, look, we could probably do this on our own. I had experience doing that on our own. So on the other hand, it was a little bit inevitable. Yeah, we were just going to outgrow this at some point to be where we are. I mean there are real expense decisions to make. You are taking on certain overhead of people and software that a broker is carrying, but for us it was speed and agility and independent decision-making that really drove us to pulling the trigger to make the move. 

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Do you have any sense of who is this for? Who isn't this for? If someone's like, gosh, maybe I should go that direction, what are some characteristics or maybe some obstacles or roadblocks that they're bumping into that this move might alleviate and maybe characterize too, I know I'm asking multiple questions here, but characterize a little bit to that additional responsibility that comes with being an independent. 

Speaker 3 (09:51):
I think it takes a person who's just a natural maker. I view the world in the lens of the diffusion of innovation curve except through the lens of there's certain types of people, there are makers, there are doers, there are followers, and then there are the complainers at the back. And I think you have to be a maker. If you want to go independent brokerage, you have to be willing to make processes and systems and structures that are done for you. When you're with a franchise, you have to take on that desire. And so if you're a default doer, and I think most team leaders are default doers, they're just really good at everything they do, but you have to go to that next level to be a maker. Can I make things that don't exist today and build them ourself? And I love doing that. That's just who I am. And I think that's the key characteristic that I would describe is make sure you're a maker and you love making stuff, constantly going to be doing it. 

Speaker 1 (10:53):
The most common team leader is just a really successful kind of hardcore salesperson, and when they want to get things on the rails and really create some economies of scale and really push for growth, but smart growth, they obviously need that right hand, like an operations mind. Do you see the maker a little bit like an ops minded, process minded system minded person? Is that a little bit kin? 

Speaker 3 (11:23):
Yeah, I think that's right. I think that's right. Most team leaders are just great at sales. They're doing the actual business and the hardest thing a team leader I've seen face with is getting out of production. It's the goal, but it's the hardest thing to do because you're just so good at doing the thing you're doing. Either you've got to become that maker or you have to hire that maker to build this so that the foundation is there to grow on top of. 

Speaker 1 (11:49):
Were you functionally that for Becky, or is she also kind of geared the same way? 

Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah, I mean she's definitely was a doer with a lot of maker tendencies. 

Speaker 3 (12:02):
She was like, she just needed help making it. So I was like, I know how to make a brokerage. I've done it before, so let's put some things in place, turn this team model into a brokerage model. And I learned a lot from my first brokerage. It was a general brokerage, I say very different from a team brokerage. It was very much the same model every other franchise runs. And I said, I will not do that again. So I learned what I didn't like and what I didn't love. And so when we built path and post, I knew from the start what we were doing. I had a clear vision and a clear goal, and I think that helps a ton. 

Speaker 1 (12:39):
Yeah, break down that team rich piece a little bit. I don't think, I mean a lot of people are familiar with the term, I don't think just in having conversations, everyone has the same view of what it is, but you're essentially running a team bridge, which is a brokerage and it's being run as a team. I think you've already kind of characterized a little bit about why, but feel free to go into that too. But when you're explaining your model to someone else that is a peer functionally, maybe a more traditional team leader, how do you describe the difference between an independent brokerage and a team and then maybe layer in why that made sense for you all? And I think that'll set us up for a client experience conversation is my guess, I'm guessing. 

Speaker 3 (13:21):
Sure, yeah, for sure. You have to decide there are some things that you're going to be taking on financing, accounting, those kinds of details. How are you going to pay your agents and what's the process you're going to do to make sure that they're paid in a timely manner and put that structure in place. And if you start with that, take care of the money first and make sure they're paid right, and then you work out from there, we, speaking of money, are we going to accept earnest money and if so, we're going to be the holder of earnest money. What does that mean from a trust account setup and the audit and responsibility standpoint? And we just looked at it from a very system oriented process of like, we've got to now the broker was making the payments, now we've got to take on the payment piece, and they were holding the earnest money and do we want to hold the earnest money or not? 

Speaker 3 (14:06):
So we did. We chose early on that we want to hold the earnest money because we think that's a better experience for our clients, and it was everything from day one for that client experience you're talking about. So we started very foundational. What is it we'll be taking on that we're not doing today and make sure that we are willing to do it and had a plan to do it well? I think a lot of people just like the idea of owning something independently but don't really, what does that mean? What different type of work does that mean for me that I'm not doing today that I will have to be responsible for tomorrow? And that's just a couple of examples. Happy to go into others. 

Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, please. 

Speaker 3 (14:49):
Okay. The structure of it, early on we were getting, Becky was not in production, I was not in production. We've never been in production. So the structure of it, can it support the structure? We believe really strongly that owner operators shouldn't be in competition with the agent, and we wanted that to be true from day one when we built this. So that structure alone needed to have a certain amount of transactions and size underneath it to support that before we even thought about taking it out independent, otherwise we'd just stayed a team at ERA because we didn't want that feel of cherry picking going on and those tough decisions of who gets the next lead and all that. I love the transaction level. I love the client experience, which we'll talk about, but I don't even represent my own brother and father. I send that business to that to the agents. 

Speaker 3 (15:47):
So it is that firm of a belief system that we really, when we got down to it, it was just a core values decision. So we built the brand on three core values from day one. It's like what will always be true that Becky and I have together, and it came down to respect Unity and the Golden Rule. Plus for us, we call it our rug. It's a silly acronym, but it is true. You can ask anyone on our team, RUG is real. It's from the interview. It's the only reason we'd ever hire someone because we believe we're aligned in values. It's also the only reason we ever fire someone. We're no longer aligned in one of those or multiple of those values. And so we hire and fire based on values and have made every decision running the brokerage through that lens from day one 

Speaker 1 (16:32):
Golden Rule. It seems like one of those things that shouldn't have to be stated, but somehow when we get into a business context and we start moving quickly, 

Speaker 1 (16:41):
It's one of those things that requires that level of intentionality. I really appreciate having that one in the mix. It's like for anyone that's not familiar, the golden rule is a natural outcome of almost every single major world religion and philosophical system. As people organized around any of a variety of thoughts ask themselves how are we supposed to live? All of them arrived at some version of the Golden Rule. And so it's like if we're going to operate as a social species, it seems to make sense and again, it's easy to lose sight of. So I love that you have it explicitly stated. So let's go in a little bit to client experience. And one thing I observed hosting more than 270 episodes of the Customer Experience podcast is that I'll call it agent experience in this case, but in that case it was employee experience. 

Speaker 1 (17:30):
Your client experience will never be better than your agent experience. They're two sides of the same coin. I think anyone who's really paying attention to what you've been saying so far can kind of hear the level of intentionality of what's best for the client, what's best for the agent as you're kind of making some of these decisions, even as big as the business model itself and whether or not to take on brokerage responsibilities and then obviously the how of that once you decide to make that commitment. But I'd love for you to start high level on when did client experience and or agent experience occur to you as I guess the North Star to make all the other decisions against? 

Speaker 3 (18:12):
Yeah, it was honestly before I started Path and Post, you had mentioned that banking startup going through that process of starting a company from scratch with a friend and growing a brand around that. I mean, we were written up in Fast Company, we're in brand textbooks and stuff about the process. I learned a lot about how to build things the right way and it changed the way I view companies really. They are an experienced delivery machine in my mind more than anything else, more than a money extraction machine that everybody else looks at them through. I love delivering amazing experiences to people, be the agent, staff and client a lot. So early on before I even partnered with Becky, we met and said, look, what are we doing together? What are we trying to build? And so that was early foundation. How will we know if we've been successful is the best way. 

Speaker 3 (19:12):
I think to frame that, and we came up with the phrase, we want to enrich life transitions and each word was very specifically chosen, enriches that add value, make it feel better life, not real estate. We didn't want to do real estate. We want the consumer's life to be better. And then we picked transition purposely juxtaposed to the word transaction, which I think is abused in this industry. It's all counting numbers and look, numbers matter in this industry. Oftentimes business is just math. I believe that, but if that's all you focus on and you build your company around it, then that's how it's going to feel to the consumer. So we want to enrich that life transition of every customer we come in contact with, and if we build it right with that foundation of our vision, then we will have succeeded long-term. 

Speaker 1 (20:05):
One thing I'll observe is that when we get so focused on, I mean there is a transactional nature to some parts of the experience, and if we get over-focused on it, then that comes to supplant the goal that you have, which is to enrich life transitions. So more language that I've seen you use that I like is that your agents are professional strategic guides, and when I saw that on one of your web pages, s and g strategic and guide were capitalized, that obviously means something. I wanted to hear you out on what it means to be a professional strategic guide and then what does that training process look like? 

Speaker 3 (20:47):
Sure. Look, yeah, I think the number one problem with our industry as a whole is consumers think all agents are the same and they pay the same amount for a great one as they do a terrible one. And I think that model in and of itself makes the industry feel broken to so many people for the same reasons. It's like, well, I just paid that had a terrible experience. Agents are not worth it. So we had to say, we need to build something that's better than the average experience that's going on out there. And so the be builder than the average, we specifically said, we don't want to be an agent at all. I don't want to be an average agent. So we're like, all right, if we're not going to be agents and we're not going to be the word realtor, what are we then? So we really pick those two words. We want to be strategic, which I think the average agent is not strategic and we want to be a trusted guide that can really personalize the experience and be that person to lean on. And that's why we picked those two words from the beginning is I believe every consumer deserves a strategic guide through the real estate process if they want their life transition enriched anyway. 

Speaker 1 (21:59):
How do you vet the potential for professional strategic guide and then in terms of onboarding, training, whatever you all are doing for a sustained, whether it's weekly or monthly types of trainings and get togethers, how are you training and reinforcing the professional strategic guide and maybe how are you vetting it out on the front end as well? 

Speaker 3 (22:19):
Yeah, I, I'll say I'm not always great at it. Sometimes I get it wrong, but I'm always trying to get better that the interview process is important and what we're really looking for is that values alignment and I'm looking specifically for a growth mindset who shares our same core values or really close because I believe the skill part of real estate can be taught if you have the right mindset and the right values, I can teach you how to win with the skills. And we've gotten pretty good at that at the interview and hiring, but once we get 'em on, the onboarding experience is something we have worked for years on Ethan, I've rebuilt it multiple times. In fact, I recently just rebuilt it this year, is we've documented everything we do, we call it the pathway. It's a five step thing. You connect, you discover, plan, guide, and at the end you reflect and in each one of those steps, there is so much that goes on inside and micro steps that we have over, I think last count was about 500 individual training pieces of content that we are taking our new hires through over their first 90 days basically and trying to, we built it online so they can go self-paced a little bit, they can pull themselves through the content. 

Speaker 3 (23:44):
It's written word, it's podcasts, it's videos and loom recordings that we've shot. It's all custom created by us. It's not some third party system we bought from a coach and imported. We are really taking them through the pathway to teach them what it is to enrich a life, transition the pathway, and at that same time we're meeting every week, you ask what's the cadence of the company? There's a Zoom on Monday, there's an in-person workshop every Tuesday. There's another Zoom on Wednesday and that's every week and then once a month we're all hands in person for a couple hours and that's coming up this Thursday. We'll be doing that. So variety of ways to engage online coaching and group settings, and we've just found that that's the best way to get them in, see what other professionals are doing already on our team, what a strategic guide looks like and showing them. And we've found the best way to measure that long term is five star reviews. 

Speaker 3 (24:52):
We don't count closings at our company. We don't count volume of transactions in our company. I'm sure all those things matter, but that's the transaction piece. We're after that life transition piece. And so did they love it? Did they give us a five star review and we celebrate those crazy. We're reading 'em out loud, we're digging into the case study in front of everyone. So what went right here? How did they go online and rave about this? Because people don't do that all the time, especially about a real estate experience. And I'm really proud we've gotten over 1,505 star reviews on Google and Zillow over the years because I think we have discovered a way to build strategic guides that people enjoy working with. 

Speaker 1 (25:35):
I love the five star review is the outcome because that is the proof of efficacy that what is being talked out is being created and delivered for people. So much so that in an unsolicited manner or lightly solicited, would you go do this? We all get asked so much for feedback that 

Speaker 3 (25:54):
Yeah, everybody ignores it. 

Speaker 1 (25:55):
Yeah, totally. By the way, if no matter where you're watching or listening, please click the five stars on this podcast. I've never asked for reviews. There 

Speaker 3 (26:05):
You go. 

Speaker 1 (26:07):
I was just kind of doing some recon on how we're doing overall and I could definitely use some five star reviews if you like, what we're doing here, but the idea that you've taken control of the whole thing with one end goal in mind and constantly iterated on it, I think is probably the key to this success. I would also add that, and I'm going to sound a little bit soft here, but when you look to take care of the experience, the transactions and the revenue ultimately take care of themselves. Now you do need to pay mine to make sure that it makes sense from a perspective and that everyone can earn what they need and want to earn. But when you take care of first things first, the money kind of takes care of itself and it's a little bit of an act of faith, but obviously you are both kind of deeply convicted about, and if you're based on the gold rule, you're not going to go wrong. 

Speaker 1 (27:00):
But in any case, talk a little bit about where did this start? I heard 500 pieces of content consumed approximately over 90 days. It didn't start out that way. So give just advice to someone who doesn't have this type of training super well organized or maybe hasn't they set it up two and a half or three or four years ago and haven't revisited it because it's fine. What platforms are you using? How much time do you devote? Once a quarter we're going to look at it, maybe replace some pieces or is it an annual overhaul? Any details you have I know would be helpful for people. 

Speaker 3 (27:39):
Well, it started as a WordPress plugin as a knowledge base on a website I built years ago 

Speaker 1 (27:45):
Just answering questions like, here are the top 85 questions we answered over the past QQA 

Speaker 3 (27:50):
Type things. Yes, every time an agent would ask us a question, we would say, all right, how are we answering this? Is this something we can repeat? Okay, document it. And then we'd put it in that knowledge base. We outgrew that for the functionality. We went to train for years, we were on the train platform and this year we just migrated over to guru get. guru.com is the platform we're on now. It's got some AI powered stuff that we like. So it's been the same base knowledge that's just evolved as the team has grown, as our processes get fine tuned and platforms change, you have some different workflows on how to consume the content. So we feel pretty dialed in right now on where it is. Feel very confident in the pathway being the best way to experience real estate. I would say the one thing that I would tell someone is I realized I needed to do this when I was in front of a room. I can't remember the exact room, but I remember the exact feeling. It's like, oh, I just rocked that presentation. I just crushed that training. You know how you feel as a leader. You're like, oh yeah, I went and I covered all the details and I walked out and I turned around. I'm like, there's six people on my team that weren't here today and they didn't get to experience it. And that's when I realized how am I going to recreate this? That's the best I'll ever do. I just crushed that presentation. 

Speaker 3 (29:13):
I'll never be that good again and then we'll get the lesser version of me. So then that's when I realized it kept happening over and over again. Not everyone can attend every meeting for various reasons. Life happens and how am I going to get this information to the person who wasn't here and then how am I even if all attended, how am I going to get this information to the next person I hire? 

Speaker 1 (29:34):
Right? 

Speaker 3 (29:35):
And when you realize that and you're like, oh my God, I'm just going to be spinning my wheels forever if I don't start building kind of process. And that's when you realize I've got to do this. And honestly I wish I'd have sped it up faster and got to where I am today the first two years instead of decades later. But that is probably the most valuable thing you can do if you're going to go build something independently is build the process. It's not, I love to sell hamburgers. I have a process to produce hamburgers that are amazing forever and it's that thing that I fell in love with is the making of the process. And I think someone on the team or the ownership level needs to love making that process 

Speaker 1 (30:23):
Go another layer deeper on it. Because what I hear partly is I'm teaching all this stuff, it's got good energy, me delivering it kind of is an important part of it. I heard you say earlier, it's audio, it's video, it's written word worded. So it's a combination of media but also it's not like, Hey, welcome to Path and Post. Go log in over here and choke down these 500 pieces of content. Not everything you record necessarily goes in or it maybe doesn't go in full, it goes in some kind of a thoughtful sequence. Talk a little bit about that step a little bit of what stays in, what gets discarded over time. How do you think about sequencing of these elements? So it's not just this repository of all this stuff I ever 

Speaker 3 (31:11):
Said, yeah, you got to dump all the stuff in the thing, you need to organize it. And that's like how do you want this to organize? And I've learned over time, you have two audiences constantly going through this content. The audience I think most team leaders built for is their current team. I need to document this for my team. They need to be able to reference this. And it becomes a Wikipedia type of experience where it's search and find the answer. And I did that day one through that WordPress knowledge base. It was like searching find a wiki. But I've learned that if you build it from the lens of the new hire and organize it that way, it's a way better experience for everyone on the team, not just the new hire because it's thoughtful, it's organized. It's like where do I start day one, week one, week two and methodically absorb this content over a period of time and however much content it has, we are up to 90 days worth of learning now used to, we call it RAMP Camp, we used to have Ramp Camp was one week at one point we're going to cram all this information into your head in one week 

Speaker 3 (32:16):
And now it's 90 days. So we just learn through trial and error that it is better to space it out. But if you build it with how should a new hire get onboarded and some of it is like sign up for this tool, but this is the day you do that and sign up for this tool and this is day three, you're ready for this tool now. And some of it is meet with the coach to do it. Some of it's go do it on your own depending on the tool, but we've thought through each step very methodically what is the best onboarding experience and then it'll always be searchable for your existing team. They can still use it like a wiki and they don't care what order is in anyway. They're just going to Google or search their answer inside your knowledge base and find it. So I think if you start from the new hire and build it out from there, it works best. 

Speaker 1 (33:04):
Cool. Also, we chatted a little bit about the AI features in Guru. I would love for you to kind of share that with folks that haven't moved to a platform that supports it. And I'll just give a quick parallel. It's also a cross promotion. So warning to everyone, I'm about to promote something. So obviously realestate team os.com, we have all these written up. There is a kind of terrible search function on the episodes page itself can search by keywords in the guest name, but it's not as good as obviously even your first wiki Brad. It's not even that great, but I then found a platform where I could take these massive documents I make for every episode. So it's the full transcript, it's my writeup, it's my own personal notes, and now there's an AI overlay. So anyone can go to realestate team os.com/bot and you can use that to give me five episodes where the folks talk about recruiting because looking for some recruiting tips and it'll give you the five episodes and maybe a couple bullet points on 'em and you can go watch and listen to the ones that you want. Or you could say, look at all the episodes that give me five of the most common or most effective or most important recruiting tips and it will give you that. And so I assume that your entire body of knowledge now years and years deep 

Speaker 1 (34:18):
Is kind of now available to be remixed and I think that's a whole new layer for agent training and agent engagement. So it's not this, did I ask the question the right way so it can match me up with the right question and answer. It's like this remix layer. What was your first experience with interacting via an AI interface with your own body of knowledge and maybe what feedback have you gotten from agents in this kind of zone? 

Speaker 3 (34:44):
Super valuable. The AI layer on top of my content is unlocking so many new experiences because we've all played with ai, we've all gone to chat GPT and put it in, you get the Internet's answers back, but now you can go inside our guru knowledge base, ask the question, and you get only our curated answers back, not blended in with any other brokerage or the general internet and that I want AI bot trained on my knowledge that only gives the right answer that I wrote is super powerful and we're just now beginning to unlock some great agent experiences around it. So we have a custom stipulation library that we've built over time and very specific use cases like 16 steps that help win in a seller's market as an example. They're written down in detail. So now you can go and ask the AI special stip bot inside our guru to write your special stip for you and it will do it pretty darn good, like 95% the way I would've done it, right? 

Speaker 3 (35:56):
Because coming right off of our training and it's like, oh, I need a special stick for the seller to replace the water heater. And sometimes agents would just put a period and that'd be the stipulation and that's not enough. It's like, well, what if they don't and how much does it cost and by when and who's responsible for doing it? And so the bot is goes and fills in all those answers for them and then spits back out the actual step that they can copy and paste. Now we're still saying, and I would advise anybody, don't fully trust it a hundred percent, but it's going to be way better than your first draft. So I view kind of all the AI stuff as the 10 80 10 rule 10% of the time putting the right question in, crafting your prompt, the prompt engineering ai, I'll do 80% of the work and then you've spent 10% on the backend curating it, making sure it fits your context and everything like that. And we are getting amazing feedback on that already for the agents who have started trusting it more. They're just letting it write the steps. 

Speaker 1 (36:58):
Yeah, I love it. And it's much more timely and relevant, the interpretation layer of like, this is how this answer was written to this question 18 months ago or 18 days ago or whatever it was. It's just so much more dynamic and time-saving for the agent. And again, the caution on the 10 80 10 is really strong. So you mentioned a coach earlier. Are you and Becky coaching on the staff side in service of all of this? What does a staff look like and what are some of the key positions there? 

Speaker 3 (37:38):
So I would not say that we're coaching, we're leading the whole team. We do have a success manager that's more at the coach level. I think some teams call it team leaders. It's just our terminology. We started success coach early on instead of that team leader role. So that's a key role on our team right now. We are also, 

Speaker 1 (37:59):
Is that a full-time role or is that a producing agent 

Speaker 3 (38:02):
Full-time out of production in management only 

Speaker 3 (38:07):
And we do have, she's a success manager. We're in the process of hiring success coach under her who will be the hybrid role that you're talking about in production and in management, helping new agents learn in the field, mentor type work. And then we also have a client care manager who is sitting at the top of the funnel, pseudo ISA type person that's managing 40,000 leads in a pond in follow up boss. And then we have the back office who's doing listing management, commission payment accounting stuff at the backend operations manager and that's our lean mean team getting it all done. 

Speaker 1 (38:51):
What do you think, high level question, what do you think about the future of the real estate team model in particular, and maybe we include independent teamer there if we want to, but you've seen essentially the rise of the team. I mean its roots are obviously 30 years deep, but the real come ups been the past 12 ish, 15 ish years. Where do you think we are? Where do you think it's going? 

Speaker 3 (39:17):
Yeah, I've lived that ride. I've rode that wave. I think it's going to go through a period of change and I'm not really sure what the outcome is. It's really hard to sell a team. I'll say it that way. So the exit strategy of a team needs to be thought through, if you're owning it this way, how am I going to get out of it? From the exit strategy standpoint, there's not a lot of people showing up to buy a team. There's not a marketplace for team purchases and stuff, so what is the earnout model of identifying someone who can come in and learn the way and earn out over time? You need to think about that as a team leader is like how, or I'm just going to keep running it forever and retire it, close it when I'm done. How are you going to end this thing before you even begin it? 

Speaker 3 (40:04):
I think you need to think through that. I do imagine the whole industry is going to go through some consolidation, some will earn out, some will try to sell out, some will just close shop, some will just fail honestly through some tough market times. So I don't know what it means long-term for the team after that round of consolidation goes. I imagine that's going to happen at the brokerage level too. The MLS level, all the techs, there'll be a consolidation phase I feel like over the next two to five years, and I honestly don't know how it ends for teams, so I'm just be point blank, but I'm okay with that. I going to try have a growth mindset and assume the best is going to happen. 

Speaker 1 (40:45):
Yeah. Well I think just to the spirit of what you're saying, I do think an independent team reach is probably in a better position 

Speaker 2 (40:55):
Than 

Speaker 1 (40:55):
A real estate team being brokered by another business. I mean there is something, especially when you've taken care to do the type of branding that you have, Becky's name isn't on it. The obvious benefit to that you already stated, which is every agent can own it, and frankly, I don't know if you heard the episode with Lisa Stafford in New Jersey, but she rebranded the Lisa Stafford team into NJ Property Experts for the exact same reason. Now, it was never about me anyway. It just happened to wind up with my name on it, but now I want something that everyone can own and then it's something that goes beyond you and not just in name, just even in function and spirit. 

Speaker 3 (41:38):
Yeah. Can it live beyond you is the question do you want it to while you're building it? By default, it ends up being some team leader's name almost always, right? And can you make it bigger than yourself and what is that going to be at the end of it? We think about that a lot, honestly. It's like I want this to be bigger than me. I love it. I don't want to stop doing it anytime soon, but it needs to be bigger than me. Ultimately, it should not rely only on me to succeed. And that's why I put so much effort and these foundational things that we can build on top of. 

Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, I mean the systems and the processes do have value again, because it's like you're creating a plug and play type of environment. Not that it's that mechanical, but it's got the pieces where you can create the type of experience you want to in a repeatable manner, such that path and post develops local value that is independent of the revenue that you're generating this day, this week, this quarter, this year, whatever. So I think you are moving that direction. I also would add that literally every industry goes through consolidation and it's not just like a seasonal thing. It is truly inevitable. 

Speaker 3 (42:49):
It is inevitable, I believe, and I don't know what that means for every team out there, but we're prepared. I believe we've got a great foundation and we're going to be successful no matter what happens to us moving forward. And I just want to circle back. You had mentioned the money and the golden rule a couple times, and I just want to come back to that. I love how you said it. Money is the result, not the reason that we're doing this. We really try to find people who want that to be true in their life too. Sure, everybody needs a certain income to make their standard of living true, but that should be the result of something you actually are really good at and passionate about and want to get better at all the time. And so we are trying to find those people and that connects back to the golden rule. 

Speaker 3 (43:36):
We actually had a plus at the end of it because to your point, everyone knows the golden rule, but the plus is the one that we are trying to identify is can you do unto others just because it's the right thing with no expectation of getting anything back, forget the second part of the golden roll. Just do it right because right feels good and we try to get that into the plus one experience every time you're working with a customer, what can I do that they're not expecting me to do and what value can I deliver to them that they didn't even know I could bring to the table? And if you do that, then you've become a professional strategic guide who will get five star reviews. 

Speaker 1 (44:18):
I think a lot of people when they think about the surprise and delight category of experience, think that it's because the stories that get held up in books and social media, et cetera, is ran down the street and spent $600 on this thing and came back to the point of sale, the restaurant, the retail shop, whatever, and blew their mind. It really is as simple as what you just said, which is thinking in advance about what this person might need or want, even if they have not explicitly stated it, because I am the professional strategic guide, I'm looking out for their best interests. I'm thinking two steps ahead on their behalf. I'm not responding to their questions. I'm anticipating their needs and wants and surprising and delighting them simply through that level of intention and thought. 

Speaker 3 (45:05):
Yeah, it's actually really simple for a real estate agent to do that because we have so much information behind the industry walls that consumers don't know about. Anything in the MLS behind an MLS login, like a seller's property disclosure or a custom plaid or some HOA documents, all of that, we have access to that. The consumer, that stuff's not on Zillow, so as soon as they inquire about 1, 2, 3 Main Street, just go get the stuff that they don't have access to and give it to 'em without him even asking like, Hey, I saw your favorite of this home. Here's the property disclosure for 1, 2, 3 Main Street. In fact, I read it and analyzed it and saw that water heat's 13 years old. Have you ever replaced a water heater? You're having real conversations of real value that they didn't even know existed when they favorited that home on Zillow, it is that simple. We call it the value formula. Find an item of value, send it to them without them asking for it, and then call 'em and talk to 'em about it. Like the whole call your leads problem that team leaders have. That's the solution. That's the answer. Just teach the value formula. Then they have some reason to call and it's a great experience for the agent and the client. 

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Yeah, that's it. I mean, the agent side of that too is I don't know why or what to say. It's like, I sent you this thing. Did you get it? That's the open. 

Speaker 3 (46:24):
Let's just start with that. Not are you looking to buy today? Like no, is now a good time to talk? No, I see this item of value. Did you see it? 

Speaker 2 (46:34):
Yeah. 

Speaker 3 (46:34):
It's just simple to solve, but it's hard if you don't have the right mindset of agent to accept that. 

Speaker 1 (46:42):
Yeah. Brad, this has been awesome. I'm so glad we connected. Again, thank you so much for spending time in these episodes, and thank you for spending time making one. Before I let you go, I would love to know your very favorite team to root for besides Path and Post or the best team you've ever been a member of. 

Speaker 3 (47:00):
That's easy. I'm a Braves fan season ticket holder in the chop house. It's been a rough season, but we've had some great runs as a franchise, huge baseball fan, huge Braves fan, and I can answer the other one too. My brother is the CEO of a local brewery path and Post I run and he runs Reformation Brewery, so I love being a little bit a part of that team as a partner over there too. That's been awesome. 

Speaker 1 (47:28):
Awesome. That's linked up down below for folks watching and listening. Brad, what is one of your most, you don't strike me as a frivolous person, so I'm kind of hoping you go this direction, but what is one of your most frivolous purchases or what's a cheapskate habit you hold onto even though you probably don't need to? 

Speaker 3 (47:45):
My wife would probably say, I have too many bags and I'm not like a fancy bag guy. Just I have a bag for every special use case, like gear bags, travel bags, game bags, you name it. I have a custom bag that I've hand selected just for that thing that's probably frills. I don't think I need all that many bags in my life, but most of 'em are around my passion for games. We are board gamers. We buy a lot of games and I like to take 'em and share them with other people, so I need bags. 

Speaker 1 (48:18):
Cool. Is there a bag of bags or a closet of bags, or are these on shelves like in the basement 

Speaker 3 (48:24):
There's a closet of bags? Yes. There's the basement under the stairs, closet, just full of bags, suitcases and bags that you put in. Suitcases and hiking packs and yeah, day packs, you name it. Yeah, 

Speaker 1 (48:38):
And you can pull out the right one without really looking, 

Speaker 3 (48:41):
Oh, I know exactly what I need for the occasion. For sure. 

Speaker 1 (48:44):
That's surprise me. That's just who I'm and no one else could. When you are investing time in resting, relaxing, and recharging, what are you doing or when you're investing time in learning, growing and developing, what are you 

Speaker 3 (48:55):
Doing? Well, I'm playing board games to relax and have fun with my friends or family travel, I would say. I work to travel. I love to experience new places and new things with my family, and I do read a lot. I do listen to a lot of content, so I'm either reading, watching, or listening to real estate content all the time on a curated list, whether it's your show or others that I'm following, so I do believe you are what you eat, and so I try to eat the right things in life, but in the content I consume, I do think makes me better every day. 

Speaker 1 (49:33):
Awesome. It's an absolute privilege to be part of a thoughtful diet. I appreciate that. What's the best place for someone to connect with you if they want to learn more, follow up on anything that we've covered here? 

Speaker 3 (49:42):
Yeah, just reach out to path post.com. Everything's there eight letters, P-A-T-H-P-O-S t.com. You can connect to us from there. My info's on there, everybody who works there, I even use this when I'm interviewing. Just go to that website, explore the agents, call any of 'em, ask what it's like to work here before you come on. So yeah, call anybody at my team and ask about it. 

Speaker 1 (50:05):
Cool. I love the recruiting tip there at the end. I appreciate all the time that you spent with me. I wish you continued success and this was fun. Thanks, Brad. 

Speaker 3 (50:12):
Thanks you, Ethan. Appreciate it. 

Speaker 2 (50:14):
Thanks for checking out this episode of Team Os. For email exclusive insights every week, sign up@realestateteamos.com.