1 00:00:00,992 --> 00:00:03,855 Thank you for joining me today on Let's Get Digital. 2 00:00:03,855 --> 00:00:06,557 I am Carrie Charles, your host. 3 00:00:06,578 --> 00:00:11,122 And today I have a very special guest. 4 00:00:11,122 --> 00:00:24,575 And I'm really excited about this guest because Jeff Mucci, the founder and CEO of Arden Media, is also our media partner for the podcast and has been now for like five years. 5 00:00:24,575 --> 00:00:25,236 So. 6 00:00:25,236 --> 00:00:30,162 We have an amazing partnership with Arden, as well as his publications. 7 00:00:30,162 --> 00:00:33,646 And so I wanted him to come on the show for a number of reasons. 8 00:00:33,646 --> 00:00:35,909 He has an exciting announcement. 9 00:00:35,909 --> 00:00:37,250 So stay tuned. 10 00:00:37,250 --> 00:00:38,982 Jeff, thanks for coming on. 11 00:00:38,982 --> 00:00:40,574 I'm so glad you're here, finally. 12 00:00:40,574 --> 00:00:42,616 uh 13 00:00:42,824 --> 00:00:47,239 Yeah, so I want to know first about just about you. 14 00:00:47,239 --> 00:00:51,965 How did you, the man behind RCR Wireless News and soon to be more. 15 00:00:51,965 --> 00:00:54,438 So how did you get in the industry? 16 00:00:54,438 --> 00:00:56,499 Tell me about your path. 17 00:00:57,102 --> 00:00:59,762 Let me start by just talking about RCR wireless. 18 00:00:59,762 --> 00:01:07,662 I had been in telecom most of my career through deregulation and C-Lex, DSL companies, broadband wireless, et cetera. 19 00:01:07,882 --> 00:01:19,982 But in 2009, I was looking around to buy a company and RCR was a print publication, had been around since 1982, was the proverbial Bible of the industry. 20 00:01:19,982 --> 00:01:26,462 And the previous owners closed it, I think it was in February or March of 2009. 21 00:01:26,662 --> 00:01:32,805 And they closed it the day before CTIA when the editors were actually getting ready to go to CTIA and cover the show. 22 00:01:32,805 --> 00:01:44,019 ah And you may remember 2009 was a tough economic downturn year and I'd been looking around to buy a business and an analyst friend of mine said, hey, did you see that RCR 23 00:01:44,019 --> 00:01:44,810 closed? 24 00:01:44,810 --> 00:01:55,094 Well, I called the owners, flew to Detroit that I think that week and bought the assets, hired the editorial team back and uh I created Arden Media. 25 00:01:55,486 --> 00:01:58,130 to buy those assets of RCR Wireless News. 26 00:01:58,130 --> 00:02:03,657 So uh Arden Media is a research-driven news information and event company. 27 00:02:03,798 --> 00:02:07,294 And so I've been a publisher now for the past 16 years. 28 00:02:07,370 --> 00:02:11,184 Wow, tell me more about RCR Wireless News. 29 00:02:11,365 --> 00:02:13,403 A little bit about, I mean just everything. 30 00:02:13,403 --> 00:02:23,368 I want to know, you've talked about the history, tell me about the platform and everything, the sponsors, what type of information you cover, what type of verticals you 31 00:02:23,368 --> 00:02:24,219 cover. 32 00:02:24,750 --> 00:02:31,150 Well, I think that's really going to lead into the conversation about our announcement. 33 00:02:31,850 --> 00:02:42,950 know, RCR Wireless News was created in 1982 when the very first trial and commercial launch of cellular technology started. 34 00:02:43,090 --> 00:02:47,230 So RCR Wireless News stands for Radio Communications Report. 35 00:02:47,230 --> 00:02:48,670 It was a newsletter. 36 00:02:48,790 --> 00:02:53,790 I had heard rumors that it was actually faxed to people back in the day. 37 00:02:54,318 --> 00:02:58,843 uh So it was a way for readers to learn about the industry. 38 00:02:58,843 --> 00:03:07,422 And you got to remember you had the incumbent Bell companies that were assigned a license and then you had entrepreneurs who were assigned licenses. 39 00:03:07,422 --> 00:03:10,235 And this was back in the days of 1G. 40 00:03:10,235 --> 00:03:16,201 So RCR Wireless News has been covering wireless since the inception of cellular technology. 41 00:03:16,201 --> 00:03:17,702 uh 42 00:03:19,884 --> 00:03:25,979 You fast forward to the last year and uh the industry has changed. 43 00:03:25,979 --> 00:03:30,713 uh The media industry has changed and the technology has changed. 44 00:03:30,713 --> 00:03:37,188 If you look back at 2024, carrier CapEx and wireless declined. 45 00:03:37,188 --> 00:03:43,022 You saw a number of companies, the major vendors to the carriers saw their share prices decline. 46 00:03:43,022 --> 00:03:45,524 You saw their sales decline, et cetera. 47 00:03:45,610 --> 00:03:50,232 And so that signal very clearly that a change was adrift. 48 00:03:50,232 --> 00:03:58,966 And at the same time, you're starting to see the hyperscalers and others announce hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars being invested in data centers. 49 00:03:58,966 --> 00:04:03,298 So we knew that we needed to evolve beyond wireless. 50 00:04:03,298 --> 00:04:09,301 And we also needed to evolve beyond traditional uh news coverage. 51 00:04:09,301 --> 00:04:12,982 So I'm going to talk about that in a minute, but RCR Wireless News has been. 52 00:04:13,102 --> 00:04:16,902 You know, stood for editorial excellence for over 40 years. 53 00:04:17,002 --> 00:04:20,982 It's, it's a amazing group of people. 54 00:04:22,102 --> 00:04:25,862 Season writers, conference producers. 55 00:04:25,862 --> 00:04:29,122 You know, we truly are a global news information event company. 56 00:04:29,122 --> 00:04:31,082 have a team in London now. 57 00:04:31,082 --> 00:04:32,302 We have an office in London. 58 00:04:32,302 --> 00:04:35,462 We have people across the U S and Latin America. 59 00:04:35,462 --> 00:04:37,262 Our customers include. 60 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:50,107 You know, the major chip vendors like Qualcomm and NVIDIA and Supermicro and Intel, Nokia, Ericsson, uh all the major test and measurement clients are clients, including the key 61 00:04:50,107 --> 00:04:54,559 size VIAVs, the Anritsus, the Expos, Aspirants. 62 00:04:54,960 --> 00:05:00,153 you know, we cover today uh all network technologies, including wireless. 63 00:05:00,153 --> 00:05:01,183 We cover fiber. 64 00:05:01,183 --> 00:05:04,685 uh We cover enterprise wireless and private networks. 65 00:05:04,685 --> 00:05:06,406 uh 66 00:05:06,434 --> 00:05:13,217 We cover the carriers, particular attention to all the global carriers and how they're changing their business plans. 67 00:05:13,377 --> 00:05:20,600 And now we debuted a new newsletter called AI Infrastructure that goes out daily, six days a week. 68 00:05:20,681 --> 00:05:23,162 And we'll talk a little bit more about that as well. 69 00:05:23,162 --> 00:05:30,205 So ah the industry has changed and the technology has changed and we have evolved as well. 70 00:05:30,205 --> 00:05:32,704 So that's a little bit about RCR Wireless News. 71 00:05:32,704 --> 00:05:38,291 All right, so it's time to pull back the curtain and make the announcement. 72 00:05:38,291 --> 00:05:40,683 When you told me, let's back up just a little bit before we do this. 73 00:05:40,683 --> 00:05:46,539 So I remember we talk a lot, Jeff, and I remember the first time that I met you. 74 00:05:47,484 --> 00:05:52,950 I believe it was at the Verizon event, VZ Tough. 75 00:05:52,950 --> 00:05:53,926 the VC tough. 76 00:05:53,926 --> 00:05:55,310 Yeah, in Austin, you're right. 77 00:05:55,310 --> 00:05:55,991 remember that? 78 00:05:55,991 --> 00:05:57,821 That was, what a great event. 79 00:05:57,821 --> 00:05:59,922 That was a wonderful event every year. 80 00:05:59,922 --> 00:06:01,203 Really miss it. 81 00:06:01,203 --> 00:06:10,900 And I remember that we met each other and you said, know, hey, I love your brand, like what you're doing. 82 00:06:10,900 --> 00:06:12,818 How about we do something together? 83 00:06:12,818 --> 00:06:14,749 And with our Sierra Wireless News. 84 00:06:14,749 --> 00:06:23,033 And I was so excited and I was just mind blown because I had so much respect for you, the publication. 85 00:06:23,133 --> 00:06:24,924 And I said, okay. 86 00:06:24,924 --> 00:06:32,960 What what do we do and you said how about a podcast and I got so nervous because I'd never done that before ever 87 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,760 And I didn't even I didn't know anything about it. 88 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:39,800 I'd been on the radio once and I just said absolutely. 89 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:45,360 think 50 54 times and I was embarrassed and I thought how am I going to do this podcast? 90 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:47,780 And, you know, fast forward. 91 00:06:47,780 --> 00:06:49,360 Gosh, how many years has it been? 92 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:50,340 Five or six years. 93 00:06:50,340 --> 00:06:54,400 And Jeff, you I just owe so much to you. 94 00:06:54,400 --> 00:07:01,600 And I've grown so much through this podcast and also been able to really help the industry and make a difference. 95 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:03,058 And I just want to say thank you. 96 00:07:03,058 --> 00:07:04,002 Thank you. 97 00:07:04,002 --> 00:07:04,743 Well, thank you. 98 00:07:04,743 --> 00:07:07,194 It's been a pleasure having you part of our team, so to speak. 99 00:07:07,194 --> 00:07:10,847 And uh you've gone through an evolution on your own. 100 00:07:10,847 --> 00:07:13,289 Remember it was 5G Talk, I think was the initial show. 101 00:07:13,289 --> 00:07:17,973 And then last year we talked about uh the technology is changing, right? 102 00:07:17,973 --> 00:07:23,457 And 5G was big for the past five years and you came up with Let's Get Digital. 103 00:07:23,457 --> 00:07:25,539 And I'd love to hear kind of your take. 104 00:07:25,539 --> 00:07:27,731 Why did you pick Let's Get Digital? 105 00:07:27,731 --> 00:07:29,992 Because I think it'll segue into what I'm doing. 106 00:07:30,056 --> 00:07:39,899 It's really funny because uh I uh was thinking about a new name for the show and I thought, gosh, digital infrastructure, has to really make sense there. 107 00:07:39,899 --> 00:07:43,521 with my personality, I'm not a super serious person. 108 00:07:43,521 --> 00:07:47,632 And I thought, what can I play on? 109 00:07:47,632 --> 00:07:49,282 What could be really cool? 110 00:07:49,282 --> 00:07:53,776 And when I was younger, I sang Olivia Newton-John in a talent show. 111 00:07:53,776 --> 00:07:55,845 I believe it was in junior high. 112 00:07:55,845 --> 00:07:59,686 And I got dressed up and put on the leg warmers and did the whole thing. 113 00:08:00,056 --> 00:08:06,289 I sang Let's Get Physical and I thought, what if I do Let's Get Digital, is that going to be super weird? 114 00:08:06,289 --> 00:08:09,571 And I asked a few people and they said, oh no, let's do it. 115 00:08:09,571 --> 00:08:10,231 You should do it. 116 00:08:10,231 --> 00:08:11,352 Just go for it. 117 00:08:11,352 --> 00:08:16,794 So um anyway, that's how it got started and I'm happy. 118 00:08:16,794 --> 00:08:24,618 I'm happy about the title and I cannot wait for you to announce your new project and your new platform. 119 00:08:24,618 --> 00:08:25,919 So please, let's go. 120 00:08:25,919 --> 00:08:27,460 What is next? 121 00:08:27,630 --> 00:08:39,870 Well, we looked at, again, the technology wireless and how, you know, 5G is broadband and to support 5G, the carriers have been pulling fiber and building fiber networks all across 122 00:08:39,870 --> 00:08:40,870 the country. 123 00:08:41,010 --> 00:08:47,090 But if you're writing about fiber and you're a wireless company, you're not quite 100 % aligned. 124 00:08:47,090 --> 00:08:55,424 And while we had written about Telco Cloud and Telco Edge, and we've done events for years on Telco Cloud and Telco Edge, again, 125 00:08:55,424 --> 00:08:56,655 Wireless is wireless. 126 00:08:56,655 --> 00:08:59,356 So we knew we needed to morph into something else. 127 00:08:59,356 --> 00:09:01,667 And uh the challenge was, how do we do that? 128 00:09:01,667 --> 00:09:04,889 And our answer was RCR Tech. 129 00:09:04,889 --> 00:09:09,882 about uh eight weeks ago, we launched a website called RCR Tech. 130 00:09:09,882 --> 00:09:14,064 We've communicated to our clients the same message I'm telling you. 131 00:09:14,064 --> 00:09:15,495 The technology has changed. 132 00:09:15,495 --> 00:09:17,266 The industry has changed. 133 00:09:17,266 --> 00:09:18,647 We need to evolve as well. 134 00:09:18,647 --> 00:09:24,590 And so we've evolved RCR Wireless to RCR Tech as our kind of umbrella brand. 135 00:09:24,830 --> 00:09:26,131 parent brand, if you will. 136 00:09:26,131 --> 00:09:39,057 uh And it really provides us a broader platform to cover everything that's going on today, uh not only enterprise networks or carrier networks, but also the AI infrastructure world. 137 00:09:39,057 --> 00:09:49,322 And we break down AI infrastructure, yes, the physical data centers, but the network connectivity between them, the GPU chips, the memory chips, the cooling and power that go 138 00:09:49,322 --> 00:09:50,232 behind it. 139 00:09:50,232 --> 00:09:58,688 So we've got a whole ecosystem that we're writing reports about and doing events upon, but ah the big unveil is really RCR Tech. 140 00:09:58,808 --> 00:10:06,934 And it's a broad platform for us to continue what we've been doing for 40 years, which is research-driven news information and events. 141 00:10:06,934 --> 00:10:11,357 And it's all about creating content that builds communities. 142 00:10:11,357 --> 00:10:17,870 And then, you know, the way we make money is we run marketing campaigns to turn those community members into 143 00:10:17,870 --> 00:10:20,590 revenue opportunities for our clients. 144 00:10:20,990 --> 00:10:29,090 But at the end of the day, we're based in research-driven journalism and analysis, and that's core to everything we do. 145 00:10:29,370 --> 00:10:38,010 So I'll pause for a minute and answer any specific questions, but I do want to talk a little bit about RCR Tech and some of the things that we're doing there and how we're 146 00:10:38,010 --> 00:10:39,750 shaping the editorial coverage. 147 00:10:39,912 --> 00:10:43,167 Yes, so do you have an event coming up? 148 00:10:43,167 --> 00:10:47,082 Like is there a flagship event, something that we can look forward to there? 149 00:10:47,374 --> 00:10:49,794 Well, in December, we have a virtual event. 150 00:10:49,794 --> 00:10:52,594 It's called AI Infrastructure Forum. 151 00:10:52,694 --> 00:10:56,034 It's one of eight events that we're doing this year. 152 00:10:56,154 --> 00:11:01,854 This month, by the way, we have an NTN event that happened yesterday, and we've got a 60 event coming up. 153 00:11:01,854 --> 00:11:06,074 So we've got some exciting events that perform exceptionally well. 154 00:11:06,674 --> 00:11:14,954 And oftentimes we're getting 2,000 registrations for these events, and sometimes 600 to 800 people will actually attend throughout the day. 155 00:11:14,954 --> 00:11:16,454 So our virtual events 156 00:11:16,468 --> 00:11:19,099 are extraordinary in terms of their engagement. 157 00:11:19,099 --> 00:11:22,020 But in December, we have AI infrastructure forum. 158 00:11:22,121 --> 00:11:30,114 And uh we are planning an invitation only dinner type event in December. 159 00:11:30,114 --> 00:11:32,995 We're looking at Northern Virginia or Texas. 160 00:11:32,995 --> 00:11:34,186 We're kind of looking. 161 00:11:34,186 --> 00:11:37,647 Virginia has always been the hotbed of data centers. 162 00:11:37,647 --> 00:11:41,389 And we'll talk about the history of telecom in a minute. 163 00:11:41,389 --> 00:11:44,130 But you look at what's going on in Texas. 164 00:11:44,706 --> 00:11:46,757 Texas is pretty interesting as well. 165 00:11:46,757 --> 00:12:00,389 So uh we want to have the first of what I think will be several invitation only exclusive type events where we'll get uh analysts and key leaders in the sector to do roundtable 166 00:12:00,389 --> 00:12:01,079 discussions. 167 00:12:01,079 --> 00:12:06,914 We'll have our chief analyst, Sean Kinney, help facilitate and guide us through those discussions. 168 00:12:06,914 --> 00:12:11,258 But it's really meant to bring thought leaders together in a room. 169 00:12:11,258 --> 00:12:13,890 And that's what we're planning for December. 170 00:12:13,890 --> 00:12:15,941 So stay tuned for invitations. 171 00:12:15,941 --> 00:12:18,773 I know you're gonna be there and help us with that. 172 00:12:18,993 --> 00:12:28,144 And then we hope to replicate that around the country as we move our virtual events to more physical events again, ah because we believe there's real value in that ah eye to 173 00:12:28,144 --> 00:12:32,985 eye, face to face contact and the networking that goes along with uh events. 174 00:12:33,268 --> 00:12:40,683 So you said you were gonna talk a little bit more about RCR tech and maybe get into the AI aspect, so let's go. 175 00:12:40,683 --> 00:12:46,137 So, you know, go to rcrtech.com right now and uh look at it. 176 00:12:46,137 --> 00:12:53,361 It's not your typical news uh website that has a it is a set up as a newsletter website. 177 00:12:53,361 --> 00:12:58,875 So we debuted the AI infrastructure newsletter, I guess, about 12 weeks ago. 178 00:12:58,875 --> 00:13:00,286 Kelly has been writing it daily. 179 00:13:00,286 --> 00:13:03,718 And you'll notice at the very top of one of the newsletters, it's Kelly. 180 00:13:04,238 --> 00:13:08,698 giving you an overview of the key trends of the day, the key insights of the day. 181 00:13:08,698 --> 00:13:15,078 so it's our goal is to provide in five minutes or less what our readers need to know about AI infrastructure. 182 00:13:15,138 --> 00:13:17,178 So it's Kelly's voice at the top. 183 00:13:17,178 --> 00:13:19,458 mean, keep in mind, we've got very seasoned journalists. 184 00:13:19,458 --> 00:13:23,738 Kelly's been writing for RCR for nearly 20 years, right? 185 00:13:23,738 --> 00:13:28,878 And so she has context to the news release of the day. 186 00:13:28,878 --> 00:13:31,778 So it's not rewriting press releases. 187 00:13:31,778 --> 00:13:33,410 It's her talking about 188 00:13:33,410 --> 00:13:40,374 the trends of the day, the trends of the week, original content, and then we'll have some of our own original news insight stories. 189 00:13:40,374 --> 00:13:47,238 And then we curate uh links to research or the original sources of press releases or other sources. 190 00:13:47,238 --> 00:13:55,522 So it's meant to be a give our readers what they need to know in five minutes or less, original and curated content from a seasoned journalist. 191 00:13:55,702 --> 00:14:00,125 So check out that newsletter and you'll see the same thing now on RCR Wireless. 192 00:14:00,185 --> 00:14:02,636 That newsletter is shaped the same way. 193 00:14:02,664 --> 00:14:10,907 I've gotten extraordinarily good feedback from people saying, you know, it's really nice to hear from Kelly or Kat talk about what's going on for the day. 194 00:14:10,907 --> 00:14:17,400 Our editor in London, James Blackman, again, has been covering telecom for 20 plus years. 195 00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:19,881 His expertise is around enterprise. 196 00:14:19,881 --> 00:14:26,164 So uh the carriers have been talking about enterprise and how they have to serve the enterprise better. 197 00:14:26,164 --> 00:14:28,655 And that's where their growth and margin is going to come from. 198 00:14:28,655 --> 00:14:31,586 So what James does is he writes about 199 00:14:31,866 --> 00:14:35,688 He has a newsletter, a weekly newsletter called the Enterprise Edition. 200 00:14:35,789 --> 00:14:46,516 So he writes not only about the carriers serving the enterprise and the revenue growth for carriers in the enterprise sector, but he also writes about private wireless networks. 201 00:14:46,536 --> 00:14:50,679 So enterprises are building their own private networks. 202 00:14:50,679 --> 00:14:57,243 so James covers those globally for mining, for ports, for manufacturing, et cetera, a lot of use cases in there. 203 00:14:57,243 --> 00:15:01,566 And he'll also be layering in AI infrastructure use cases from 204 00:15:01,602 --> 00:15:04,185 various enterprise vertical markets. 205 00:15:04,185 --> 00:15:08,749 uh you can look from this broader platform, RCR Tech. 206 00:15:08,990 --> 00:15:17,798 It provides us to move into new verticals, launch newsletters with seasoned journalists, and really provide the readers what they need to know in five minutes or less, original 207 00:15:17,798 --> 00:15:21,074 content, curated content from seasoned journalists. 208 00:15:21,074 --> 00:15:24,480 And wait, to subscribe, tell us again, how do we subscribe? 209 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:25,281 to RCR Tech. 210 00:15:25,281 --> 00:15:27,364 There's a big red button there that says subscribe. 211 00:15:27,364 --> 00:15:31,918 Put your email in and you'll have the flexibility to opt out anytime you want. 212 00:15:31,918 --> 00:15:39,304 uh I do encourage you to check our events section on RCR Tech. 213 00:15:39,304 --> 00:15:40,946 You'll see our upcoming events. 214 00:15:40,946 --> 00:15:42,828 You'll see our past events. 215 00:15:42,828 --> 00:15:46,210 In our past events, there'll be links to all the different sessions. 216 00:15:46,271 --> 00:15:50,764 You'll also see on RCR Tech something called RCR Trends. 217 00:15:50,874 --> 00:15:56,619 And that is where our editors identify on a monthly or quarterly basis, key trends. 218 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:05,119 And they'll write a narrative about what the key trend is, some insights, some key uh &A activity or whatever the product announcements have been. 219 00:16:05,119 --> 00:16:10,654 And then they'll bundle in other articles that we've written or others have written about that particular trend. 220 00:16:10,750 --> 00:16:12,941 And it's rcrtech.com. 221 00:16:13,763 --> 00:16:14,523 There we go. 222 00:16:14,523 --> 00:16:15,124 All right. 223 00:16:15,124 --> 00:16:16,324 Very clear. 224 00:16:16,645 --> 00:16:25,533 So Jeff, I know that you've been around for a long time and in the industry. 225 00:16:26,754 --> 00:16:28,075 But you look so good. 226 00:16:28,075 --> 00:16:29,716 You look so young. 227 00:16:34,021 --> 00:16:36,623 Well, that's a whole other podcast we'll have to do. 228 00:16:36,623 --> 00:16:37,765 oh 229 00:16:37,765 --> 00:16:39,398 been covering telecom for years. 230 00:16:39,398 --> 00:16:40,372 Why don't we start there? 231 00:16:40,372 --> 00:16:41,033 There we go. 232 00:16:41,033 --> 00:16:42,564 You've been covering telecom. 233 00:16:42,564 --> 00:16:43,835 That's a better way to put it. 234 00:16:43,835 --> 00:16:46,516 You have been covering telecom for years. 235 00:16:47,717 --> 00:16:52,700 Where we were, you talked a little bit about that, where we are now, where are we going? 236 00:16:52,821 --> 00:16:56,942 And what do you see in our future down the road? 237 00:16:56,942 --> 00:17:00,422 Well, I'm no expert and there people a whole lot smarter than me. 238 00:17:02,002 --> 00:17:06,842 I guess I do want to go back to, started out my career in commercial real estate, right? 239 00:17:06,842 --> 00:17:17,862 And then in 1990, 1991, the SNL crisis in the banks, the real estate market imploded and a friend of mine from college who out of college had gone to work for Sprint and a group of 240 00:17:17,862 --> 00:17:26,668 investors had bought a, he included, had bought a business called Shared Tenant Services and they provided in-building communication services to 241 00:17:26,668 --> 00:17:31,081 roughly 100 million square feet of class A office building across the country. 242 00:17:31,181 --> 00:17:36,135 And they needed someone who could liaison with the real estate owners and the real estate leasing agents. 243 00:17:36,135 --> 00:17:39,102 And here I am kind of looking for something to do. 244 00:17:39,102 --> 00:17:42,109 And so they hired me and that was my entree into telecom. 245 00:17:42,170 --> 00:17:48,476 And then deregulation occurred and ended up starting a CLEC and I started a DSL company. 246 00:17:48,476 --> 00:17:49,625 It was backed by Morgan Stanley. 247 00:17:49,625 --> 00:17:52,978 And then I was part of the founding team of Clearwire that Goldman Sachs backed. 248 00:17:52,978 --> 00:17:53,902 And so 249 00:17:53,902 --> 00:17:55,642 you know, right place at the right time. 250 00:17:55,642 --> 00:18:01,941 lot of just a lot of technology changes in the mid 90s because of regulatory change. 251 00:18:01,941 --> 00:18:10,502 And then the early 2000s, you know, I was part of the team at ClearWire that launched the first broadband wireless network in the country in Jacksonville, Florida. 252 00:18:10,562 --> 00:18:16,582 And so, and by the way, we had an analyst write a white paper about defining broadband wireless. 253 00:18:16,662 --> 00:18:23,442 And here what I'm going to say at that time, 2003, broadband wireless was 256K. 254 00:18:24,928 --> 00:18:30,931 So you think about today, you go to speed test and on your mobile phone, you're getting 200 megabits per second down. 255 00:18:30,931 --> 00:18:32,642 It's incredible. 256 00:18:32,702 --> 00:18:44,849 So, and I think this is really the theme of, uh you know, the processing and the signaling and the MIMO technology that allows for, you know, more bandwidth on a device and the 257 00:18:44,849 --> 00:18:46,610 compute power on the device. 258 00:18:46,610 --> 00:18:54,794 But uh long story short, I think what, you know, the more time goes on, the more time repeats itself, right? 259 00:18:54,934 --> 00:18:56,685 It just keeps building on it, right? 260 00:18:56,685 --> 00:18:59,026 And you need faster chips and you need more bandwidth. 261 00:18:59,026 --> 00:19:06,279 And um so I remember going to New York to moderate a CEO panel. 262 00:19:06,279 --> 00:19:12,241 uh And I'd been out of telecom for about 10 years, right? 263 00:19:12,241 --> 00:19:23,278 I had restructured some companies for investors and I'd bought RCR and I'd go up there and it was the same people I knew from 10 years before, like the Hunter newbies and 264 00:19:23,278 --> 00:19:31,398 You know, I remember Alec, oh gosh, was like they were partying like they were in 1999. 265 00:19:32,078 --> 00:19:44,678 know, the data centers, the interconnectivity and you know, what started as May East and May West with industrial internet, now we had to have interconnects for all the carriers. 266 00:19:44,698 --> 00:19:50,118 And then you had, you know, Google and the cable companies that needed to get content and video closer to their. 267 00:19:50,118 --> 00:19:52,366 So again, data centers grew up. 268 00:19:52,366 --> 00:19:57,126 But to me it was like, wait a minute, we did that 10 years ago when I was building fiber networks and that sort of thing. 269 00:19:57,126 --> 00:20:09,486 And then you look where we are today, it's AI, you're looking at a 1000X, 100,000X increase in data and the need to process that data. 270 00:20:10,046 --> 00:20:19,910 And so to me that the trillions of dollars that are being spent into data centers, at the end of the day, when you peel the onion back, it's... 271 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,471 It's a bigger data center. 272 00:20:21,471 --> 00:20:23,602 It's a bigger telecom hotel. 273 00:20:23,602 --> 00:20:30,836 It's uh being populated with racks of servers and lots of fiber. 274 00:20:30,936 --> 00:20:37,750 And the use case really determines, you know, is that rack going to have more storage? 275 00:20:37,750 --> 00:20:38,791 Is it going have more network? 276 00:20:38,791 --> 00:20:40,841 Is it going to have more memory? 277 00:20:40,942 --> 00:20:46,895 That's kind of akin to 10 years ago when you heard the term bare uh metal servers, right? 278 00:20:46,895 --> 00:20:48,888 And I remember going to trade shows and 279 00:20:48,888 --> 00:20:54,803 you would see these servers that would have varying degrees of storage or networking or compute. 280 00:20:54,803 --> 00:20:57,355 And depending on the application, where was the data? 281 00:20:57,355 --> 00:21:05,531 If the data's on the edge, you might need more compute because you got to process data to make decisions at the edge. 282 00:21:05,853 --> 00:21:10,036 lot of the same today with uh the large language models being built. 283 00:21:10,036 --> 00:21:15,821 And now you have inferencing with enterprise and others starting to train their models and deploy them. 284 00:21:15,981 --> 00:21:16,950 But it's all 285 00:21:16,950 --> 00:21:21,531 you know, you got to have real time decision making in an automated system. 286 00:21:21,651 --> 00:21:24,432 And but we're operating at a scale that's unprecedented. 287 00:21:24,432 --> 00:21:27,733 ah So it's pretty exciting. 288 00:21:27,733 --> 00:21:38,046 It's we don't know the outcome yet, but we all we know that there's a awful lot of capital being deployed, which is not too different from 1999 when, you know, I raised a couple 289 00:21:38,046 --> 00:21:41,057 hundred million dollars to build a regional DSL company. 290 00:21:41,057 --> 00:21:45,764 And we deployed over 100 million in capital and 400 central offices in 12 months. 291 00:21:45,986 --> 00:21:55,554 That's a drop in the bucket compared to, you know, what Meta and the other guys are doing today where they're deploying, you know, a hundred billion dollars, right? 292 00:21:55,554 --> 00:22:02,459 But at the end of the day, it's buildings, it's servers, it's connectivity, it's chips. 293 00:22:02,539 --> 00:22:06,743 It's just done on a whole entirely different scale, which is exciting for all of us. 294 00:22:06,743 --> 00:22:09,765 It's exciting for us to cover AI infrastructure, right? 295 00:22:09,765 --> 00:22:16,150 uh And so I think we're just like we were 40 years ago at the inception of RCR wireless. 296 00:22:16,226 --> 00:22:22,170 We're here with RCR Tech at the inception of something that people just don't know, right? 297 00:22:22,170 --> 00:22:33,398 When 1G was launched ah in 1982, I don't think people really fathomed that 5G would offer the speeds that we have today and change our lives with. 298 00:22:33,398 --> 00:22:40,323 The internet wouldn't exist without, you know, processing power and AI, we just don't know where it's going to end up. 299 00:22:40,323 --> 00:22:45,176 But I know for us that are building and operating in the market, it's a new staffing. 300 00:22:45,176 --> 00:22:47,146 We'll talk about staffing and labor. 301 00:22:47,147 --> 00:22:56,410 It is just, it's invigorating frankly, but I think a big difference, and this is a really important point, when you had deregulation in the 90s and you had a lot of capital going 302 00:22:56,410 --> 00:23:02,192 in to build broadband networks, my company and many others, you didn't have revenue. 303 00:23:02,192 --> 00:23:09,504 So all you did was ramp up expenses, deploy capital, and then the Bell companies could forward price their models in a way that we couldn't. 304 00:23:09,710 --> 00:23:11,530 So all of us, we all went out of business, right? 305 00:23:11,530 --> 00:23:20,630 A lot of capital and you've talked to Dan Caruso and others, Zayo made it and know, the level threes and the et cetera's, but what's different about this time is the hyperscalers 306 00:23:20,630 --> 00:23:21,970 have cashflow. 307 00:23:22,170 --> 00:23:25,510 And in many cases, they're funding this growth out of cashflow. 308 00:23:25,510 --> 00:23:29,670 That did not exist during the telecom boom and bust, the dot com bust. 309 00:23:29,670 --> 00:23:32,090 So it's a materially different time. 310 00:23:32,550 --> 00:23:36,170 And I think that's a real key differentiator in terms of what's going on today. 311 00:23:36,192 --> 00:23:37,352 Hmm. 312 00:23:38,592 --> 00:23:39,952 Such good points. 313 00:23:40,332 --> 00:23:42,432 I'm thinking about your comment. 314 00:23:42,432 --> 00:23:43,692 I mean, it's so exciting, right? 315 00:23:43,692 --> 00:23:46,092 Everything that's happening, we're in the middle of it. 316 00:23:46,092 --> 00:23:49,332 There's all this growth possibility, AI. 317 00:23:49,332 --> 00:23:53,072 But then we're a little nervous too, right? 318 00:23:53,072 --> 00:23:55,912 How is this going to affect our jobs? 319 00:23:56,092 --> 00:23:59,572 I guess it's about jobs. 320 00:23:59,572 --> 00:24:02,072 I'm constantly reading. 321 00:24:02,246 --> 00:24:11,871 Every single morning I read, first thing in morning, and I'm just reading and reading about how AI is going to affect the job market and specific jobs. 322 00:24:11,871 --> 00:24:23,045 I was reading the other day, obviously we all know this, a CEO of Anthropic said that half of all entry level white collar jobs could be wiped out by AI within five years. 323 00:24:23,106 --> 00:24:26,027 And I'm looking at entry level jobs. 324 00:24:26,047 --> 00:24:32,290 We have uh kids that are just graduated from college and looking for jobs and they can't find jobs. 325 00:24:32,290 --> 00:24:32,871 in. 326 00:24:32,871 --> 00:24:42,157 So I think that's the piece of this excitement that is the challenge is the psychological safety of people. 327 00:24:42,157 --> 00:24:43,918 What is going to happen to me? 328 00:24:43,918 --> 00:24:46,620 So do you have thoughts on that? 329 00:24:46,620 --> 00:24:53,324 how is this going to affect our workforce and maybe specifically our telecom workforce and data center? 330 00:24:53,804 --> 00:25:02,560 Well, I think uh the first point I make is if you're not leaning into AI, you need to be and you need to look at everything you do day in and day out. 331 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:07,604 And it's not only applies to you and me as business owners, but everyone. 332 00:25:07,604 --> 00:25:15,770 They need to look at how, can they break their work product into steps and then try a use case. 333 00:25:15,918 --> 00:25:20,258 of using AI to accelerate that, to increase their productivity. 334 00:25:20,558 --> 00:25:25,198 So I think across the board in every function, you need to be doing that. 335 00:25:25,198 --> 00:25:26,418 I think that's point number one. 336 00:25:26,418 --> 00:25:28,938 If you don't, you're gonna be left behind. 337 00:25:28,938 --> 00:25:39,938 I think one of the things that's not talked about is, you know, my kids have just graduated from college and they've grown up with using AI and I really don't, it's like 338 00:25:39,938 --> 00:25:44,058 using phones in the classroom and all the uproar about that. 339 00:25:44,058 --> 00:25:46,372 But, you know, I think, I don't know how to, 340 00:25:46,525 --> 00:25:52,209 measure how kids are using AI to write papers and that sort of thing. 341 00:25:52,209 --> 00:26:03,336 the kids of today, while it has probably, it's been said that this job market for recent grads is probably one of the most difficult one in 10, maybe even 20 years, they do have 342 00:26:03,336 --> 00:26:04,057 innate skills. 343 00:26:04,057 --> 00:26:09,731 They are AI native because they have been using GEN.AI as a daily routine. 344 00:26:09,731 --> 00:26:11,202 And I don't think they've... 345 00:26:11,650 --> 00:26:14,553 They fully have unlocked the potential that they have. 346 00:26:14,553 --> 00:26:17,476 So I think the world is not going to come to an for these folks. 347 00:26:17,476 --> 00:26:28,839 uh while they may fall behind a couple of years getting ramped up, I think you're going to find that that AI native skill set uh is going to allow them to move ahead very quickly. 348 00:26:28,839 --> 00:26:35,334 I think the bigger challenge is the older generations, ah will they lean into it? 349 00:26:35,354 --> 00:26:41,445 And fortunately, I think if you do a search today on Google, it returns their version of AI. 350 00:26:41,445 --> 00:26:45,231 So I think we're being pulled along with it, whether we like it or not. 351 00:26:46,334 --> 00:26:48,557 But I think in terms of 352 00:26:49,612 --> 00:26:52,383 labor markets uh in telecom. 353 00:26:52,383 --> 00:27:02,418 The CEO of BT earlier this year announced uh that they're gonna lay off, I think, 50-some-odd thousand people and they're gonna continue reducing their workforce because of 354 00:27:02,418 --> 00:27:04,889 AI and other automation opportunities. 355 00:27:04,949 --> 00:27:09,851 So there is gonna be displacement, uh but there also is gonna be opportunity. 356 00:27:09,851 --> 00:27:19,536 It's kinda like when AT &T, I think eight or nine years ago, announced their domain 2.0 and they were leaning into being a software-driven network company 357 00:27:19,536 --> 00:27:22,438 versus a hardware network driven company. 358 00:27:22,438 --> 00:27:27,401 they, uh gosh, I'm drawing a blank on CEO's name now, but no longer there. 359 00:27:27,401 --> 00:27:32,114 But he was saying, you need to learn software, you're not gonna have a job here. 360 00:27:32,114 --> 00:27:33,565 He was that direct, right? 361 00:27:33,565 --> 00:27:37,408 So I think what we have here is people need to know AI, they need to lean into it. 362 00:27:37,408 --> 00:27:45,124 uh There will be new opportunities that we don't yet know for new graduates and folks that have experience, but you gotta lean into it. 363 00:27:45,124 --> 00:27:46,474 You gotta be ready to embrace it. 364 00:27:46,474 --> 00:27:49,488 uh But it's gonna have a material impact on software. 365 00:27:49,488 --> 00:27:50,488 jobs. 366 00:27:50,609 --> 00:27:54,711 It used to be if you had a computer science degree, it was you punched your own ticket, right? 367 00:27:54,711 --> 00:27:56,432 You're going to make a lot of money. 368 00:27:56,432 --> 00:28:08,910 But today, I talked with a fellow publisher this week who is eliminating uh coding positions because AI is doing the entry level coding that they used to hire people to do. 369 00:28:08,910 --> 00:28:14,563 know, software development is being directly impacted by AI. 370 00:28:14,563 --> 00:28:17,976 um It's a brave new world out there. 371 00:28:17,976 --> 00:28:19,136 But you know, 372 00:28:19,214 --> 00:28:21,895 uh You can't use AI to build a data center. 373 00:28:21,895 --> 00:28:24,087 You can't use AI to build racks. 374 00:28:24,087 --> 00:28:26,798 can't lay fiber with AI. 375 00:28:26,798 --> 00:28:30,040 uh Now you can't automate processes. 376 00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:42,406 uh I think AI ops, you look at telecom and you look at how they monitor their networks and manage their networks, I think AI will have a big impact. 377 00:28:42,447 --> 00:28:49,260 We're going to be writing about dark AI ops or dark ops, like dark factories that operate without people. 378 00:28:49,474 --> 00:28:51,395 You're going to need fewer people in customer service. 379 00:28:51,395 --> 00:28:54,100 You're going to need fewer people in network operations. 380 00:28:54,100 --> 00:28:56,872 So it's going to shape and change the industry. 381 00:28:57,330 --> 00:28:58,180 It sure is. 382 00:28:58,180 --> 00:29:04,223 And what I'm telling people now is upskill, upskill, reskill, upskill, reskill. 383 00:29:04,223 --> 00:29:07,045 And you may just need to do that yourself. 384 00:29:07,045 --> 00:29:09,585 I took an AI course recently. 385 00:29:09,966 --> 00:29:12,013 It was an all-day course. 386 00:29:12,013 --> 00:29:13,788 Actually, it was two days long. 387 00:29:13,788 --> 00:29:15,589 And I needed to learn it. 388 00:29:15,589 --> 00:29:24,032 So I would say that that's crucial that we all, no matter what age, we need to learn AI. 389 00:29:24,032 --> 00:29:24,963 We need to upskill. 390 00:29:24,963 --> 00:29:27,734 We need to get into that world because there's going to be more jobs created. 391 00:29:27,813 --> 00:29:31,394 with AI and in those types of skill sets. 392 00:29:31,394 --> 00:29:35,514 So there'll be more opportunity and you want to be able to take advantage of it. 393 00:29:36,174 --> 00:29:38,594 I couldn't agree more with everything you said. 394 00:29:38,594 --> 00:29:44,414 The installation, repair, maintenance jobs, those are very low risk of being replaced with AI. 395 00:29:44,454 --> 00:29:47,474 Construction, skilled trades, again, very low risk. 396 00:29:47,474 --> 00:29:52,454 Kids coming out of high school and college and they pay well too. 397 00:29:53,094 --> 00:29:54,874 It's tough to find. 398 00:29:54,947 --> 00:30:05,054 the return to vocation, you when I was in high school back in the day, you know, we had auto shop and you had vocational skills being taught and that really was taken out of the 399 00:30:05,054 --> 00:30:05,775 high school. 400 00:30:05,775 --> 00:30:07,576 You're seeing a return to that. 401 00:30:07,636 --> 00:30:11,859 And I think there's been a lot written this year about the value of a college degree. 402 00:30:11,859 --> 00:30:12,920 It's not what it used to be. 403 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:22,316 And the sooner that folks get into trades that will not be replaced by AI, six figure jobs, you get certified, start your own business. 404 00:30:22,434 --> 00:30:25,679 I don't care what it is, HVAC, electrical, construction. 405 00:30:25,679 --> 00:30:35,312 uh There's a world of opportunity out there and I think it's kind of nice to go back to folks learn to use their hands and do something real, right? 406 00:30:35,312 --> 00:30:39,218 uh We're gonna need those assets and that infrastructure in this country. 407 00:30:39,218 --> 00:30:40,250 So, so true. 408 00:30:40,250 --> 00:30:41,632 Okay, Jeff, one more time. 409 00:30:41,632 --> 00:30:44,455 How do we find out more about RCR Tech? 410 00:30:44,834 --> 00:30:48,620 Well, go to rcrtech.com, hit the subscribe button. 411 00:30:48,620 --> 00:30:51,644 While you're there, check on the upcoming events. 412 00:30:52,006 --> 00:30:54,989 Sign up for one of our upcoming events, AI Infrastructure. 413 00:30:55,042 --> 00:30:56,423 Forum is going to be in December. 414 00:30:56,423 --> 00:31:03,066 If you have an interest in attending AI Infrastructure uh Forum, register for the event. 415 00:31:03,066 --> 00:31:10,029 if you want to come to our private exclusive event, you can certainly contact me at jmoochee at ardentmedia.com. 416 00:31:10,029 --> 00:31:19,776 If you're interested in sponsoring one of our events, sponsoring one of our newsletters, uh please reach out to me or uh Fiona Smart at fsmart.com. 417 00:31:19,776 --> 00:31:32,672 at ArdMedia.com and join the Qualcomm's and the Vidya's, the Intel's, the Supermicro's and Dell's and all of our other great customers who have been receiving tremendous ROI by 418 00:31:32,672 --> 00:31:36,874 investing in programs with uh what is now RCR Tech. 419 00:31:37,312 --> 00:31:38,392 Jeff, thank you. 420 00:31:38,392 --> 00:31:39,983 Thank you for being my friend. 421 00:31:39,983 --> 00:31:47,678 Thank you for the opportunity with RCR Wireless and now RCR Tech to partner with the podcast. 422 00:31:47,678 --> 00:31:48,969 And I appreciate you. 423 00:31:48,969 --> 00:31:50,289 And thank you for coming on the show. 424 00:31:50,289 --> 00:31:52,080 I'm super excited about the new brand. 425 00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:53,616 I know it's going to be a huge hit. 426 00:31:53,616 --> 00:31:55,962 I cannot wait for the events. 427 00:31:57,003 --> 00:31:58,644 Yes, take care.