Arvid Kahl: Hey, Arvid here. Today, I'm talking to Aprilynne
Alter, a YouTube expert who really knows what she's doing.
The day after we had this chat, Aprilynne posted a video to
YouTube that at this point has gotten almost 100,000 views. I
don't think I need to say more about her expertise, you will
see. But besides that, we talked about many issues that come up
in the lives of digital creators, balancing quality and
quantity, all those mental health pressures we go through
and how to set up your homework environment for optimal
productivity. This will be a masterclass in not just video.
Big shout out to our sponsor: acquire.com at this point, more
about that later. And now, here's Aprilynne Alter.
Thanks for being on the show, Aprilynne. You're in this unique
position of being close enough to remember what it's like to be
a YouTube beginner. And it's something that I consider myself
to be still, yet you're also experienced enough to teach
beginners how to do it, which is really cool. You're just about
to monetize a YouTube channel for the second time around. And
what I wonder is, what's the most surprising thing that
you've learned in the second round of getting to a
monetization?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, that's a great question. The most
surprising thing to me so far, I think, was that I actually took
back my editing, which is strange because I have been
outsourcing my editing for a while. I started outsourcing my
editing for my old channel. And I continue to do that into this
new channel. But recently, in the last like two months, I took
my editing back towards myself. And I never thought that that
would be something that I would do. For so long, I was in the
camp of, yeah, as soon as you can afford it, outsource your
editing because then like it frees up your time to do other
things that you probably like more. Because I did not enjoy
the editing process. But I realized that as soon as I
started to edit myself again, I was able to level up my YouTube
skills so much and just like became an overall be a better
creator. And my content became a lot higher quality, not because
I can edit better than my editor. I am not a professional
editor, whatsoever. And it's like this takes me so long to
do. But it's because when I have like full ownership of the
entire process again, I'm able to, I guess, like fully create
the vision. And so the cool thing about having a new channel
is that I get to experiment so much more with the different
types of content and then the different styles of content and
formats that I want to try out. And it's a lot easier, I think,
for me to like iterate and pivot and try new things when I have
ownership of the entire thing versus I'm trying to like
communicate with an editor like, oh, hey, let's actually try this
style. Let's actually try this thing or that thing. So yeah, I
think like, I surprised myself taking back my editing. And I
was surprised by how well it went. And now I probably won't
outsource again for a long, long, long time.
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, exactly!
Arvid Kahl: It's so interesting because I've been doing all my
Arvid Kahl: As enjoyable as it is to be able to experiment for
editing myself. And I've always been thinking, when can I give
myself, it just takes a lot of time, right? It's a lot of time.
it away?
But then again, what I'm hearing is that time is well spent
because it's time to allow you to experiment more and to do
things. I have two questions as a follow up here. Like,
obviously, spending time doing your own editing allows you to
be more creative, but does it also help you just become better
at talking to the camera? Do you see like, is that a kind of self
reflection in there where you can train yourself to be better
at presenting to have more energy or to convey things
better? Is that something you've been experiencing?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, I get that question sometimes. For me,
no. Because I guess like, what I'm editing, I edit for so much
more than just I guess like my talking head footage. I think
when I film, that's really when I try to focus on my like tonal
inflections or making sure that I'm energetic enough or I'm
saying the sentence in the right way. When I edit, it's less so
about that and more so about okay, like how can I use what I
have? Because like my content isn't particularly like whoosh
like all, you know, it's like I'm not giving away a castle.
I'm not, you know, like doing all of this stuff, right? I'm
teaching people about YouTube. This is not like groundbreaking,
like hyper emotional stuff. But the cool thing about editing is
that I get to like, just like take the base footage, which is
me talking to the camera, hopefully with some degree of
tonal inflections and other stuff like that, but mostly,
like, augment that with visuals and B roll and music and sound
design in just like really take it from meh to something that
I'm very proud of. So I think like, that's kind of a skill
that I'm honing with editing process.
Arvid Kahl: Interesting. Do you experiment a lot with tone
between your videos? Because I've been noticing in your work,
that all of the videos you do are slightly different than
style. You do a lot of experimentation right now, I
guess, trying to figure out what works, which is awesome. Because
that's such a indie hacker mix between an indie hacker and a
creator just experimenting all the time. Do you experiment a
lot with that?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, I mean, again, that's the cool part
about having a new channel is that I can experiment. And so
yeah, with every new video, I think a lot about like, what do
I want the final product to look like and to feel like? And I've
been experimenting a lot with, like, what that is taking
inspiration from some of my favorite creators, like, how can
I take elements of that into my own content? Especially I think
in a more saturated niche, like the YouTube tips niche, where
there are a lot of people there. You have to think about, okay,
like what's going to set my content apart. And for a lot of
people, it's like their own style and the format. And so
I've been experimenting a lot and like this new one that's
coming out is actually different from what I've released so far.
And I'm very excited for it. And yeah, it's also a degree of what
do I enjoy creating, right? Because like, that's, like, what
you're really looking for is, what works and what do you enjoy
and that you can continue to do consistently while loving the
process. So that's what I'm doing.
Arvid Kahl: That is awesome. That must be fun. YouTube must
be pretty present in your life right now. Right?
Aprilynne Alter: Oh, yeah, that's like the only thing that
I think about all day and night.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, for sure, right? You can't sleep, got a
YouTube. That's interesting because it is different now than
it used to be like a couple of months or years in the past. You
did pivot, right? From your first channel to the second
channel. Can you maybe tell me more about that pivot? How that
came to be?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, okay. So my first channel, I started
YouTube in July of 2021, I believe. And I had no video or
editing experience whatsoever. But I had listened to a podcast
featuring Ali Abdaal and he's a well known fantastic, very
lucrative YouTuber. And that was like my first time really
hearing that people could be on YouTube. And like, not in a Mr.
Beast fashion. I'm like, oh, there's like someone who was an
educational YouTuber and making a lot of money from doing this,
like, this is actually something that is possible. And at that
point, I was like, trying to do a lot of different things. So I
made a YouTube channel. At that point, I didn't really know what
my niche was. I just kind of like took Twitter threads, X
threads, but it was Twitter at the time and turned them into
YouTube videos. And then late 2021 happened. And then all of a
sudden on Twitter, everyone was talking about these things
called NFTs. And some people loved them. And some people
hated them. But no one can really tell me exactly what they
were. So I'm not wanting to be left out of conversations. And I
believe that the best way to learn is by doing so I made an
experimental NFT collection on my own just to like, see what
the hype is about. Like, surely it's not like, you know, we've
all heard of NFT millionaires during that time. And I'm like,
surely it's not that as easy as just like NFT's and then oops,
you're a millionaire, right? There's got to be something else
here. So I created an NFT collection and made a lot of
mistakes in the process. Like I didn't know what gas fees were,
that was like a whole thing. And I made a thread on Twitter, kind
of like recounting my experience and a lot of people really
resonated with that thread. So I turn that thread into a YouTube
video. And that video blew up. That was my first viral video.
That video got my channel monetized and I had this large
flood of people coming into my channel, who again, like they
had heard about NFT's, they'd heard about NFT millionaires and
they're just like, well, you know and they were mostly other
creators and entrepreneurs thinking, is this something for
me? How do I fit into this? I think there's always this fear
of like a new trend taking off like, will I be left behind?
Will this type of thing be reserved for the people who are
super hyper technical and know all of this stuff? Because it
was like a very complex topic and not very accessible to
people. So that's kind of what my content became. I leaned into
that because they say you niche down to blow up. And even though
I wasn't particularly passionate about the crypto space or NFT's
myself, I thought, hey, like, let me ride this wave as far as
I can and serve the people who are here already. So I made more
content focused on the creation process of NFT's and making the
industry more accessible to people who otherwise would not
be able to like understand what's going on. And that did
super super well. And my channel was making upwards of $100 per
day just from AdSense alone. And then you have sponsorships on
top of that. Things are going really, really well. But because
I was creating in a niche that I was not genuinely passionate
about, I burned out really, really, really hard. Like
biggest period of burnout I've ever felt in my life, the
strongest period of burnout I've ever felt in my life, to the
point where, you know, I was sleepy all the time. Everything
felt so hard and so heavy, like I could not get up off the
couch. And I was like, oh, like something needs to change, like,
this is not good. I deserve better in my life than to be in
this period of burnout. So had like a little existential crisis
and decided what I wanted to do with my entire life. Fast
forward through lots of bits and pieces and ultimately realized
that I really love YouTube. And if there was like, if I could be
anything, if I could do anything, I would want to be a
YouTuber. I would want to be teaching people things on
YouTube. I just love the process of creating a YouTube video. And
so then again, like another period of existential crisis and
self reflection about like, what do I want to make a YouTube
channel about? I kind of like landed on well, the one thing
that I know for sure, is that I love talking about YouTube. And
I love teaching people about YouTube. And I get questions all
the time about how to grow on YouTube. And it's something that
I'm very passionate about. And then I know that there's a lot
of misinformation about it online. So, you know, just
because I was burned so badly from being in a niche that I
didn't care about, I wanted to make sure that going into my
next channel would be something that I absolutely loved. So here
we are. I made a new channel in April 14, I believe, is when I
started this brand new channel. And yeah, that's the TLDR of
that channel pivot.
Arvid Kahl: That's awesome. I love the fact that you went from
something that you were not passionate about, like in terms
of the whole NFT space, which is something that I kind of feel
the same. I love the technology. I love the social implications
of what may happen. But I'm just not that into it in the sense
that I want to contribute and want to be part of all these
communities. I also launched a failed NFT collection, which was
fun and I got to talk about it. I got to talk about like failing
at understanding why this works. And all that stuff, which is
nice for me. It's a learning for me that I got to share through
my means, which is podcasting and writing, right? And now, I
guess, video as well. But it's interesting to try these things
out and then use them. What I really like about the journey
that you're currently on is that instead of saying, I built this
amazing channel on YouTube, follow me and do what I do. You
started a new one and you want to, like just really walk the
walk. You want to get into monetization to show people that
it can be done repeatedly. And that is wonderful because that
just teaches people that or it shows them that you're not just
talking about what they should do. You're actually showing
them. It's really cool. I think that's for a teacher, that is a
spectacular way of approaching this.
Aprilynne Alter: Thank you. I really appreciate that.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, I appreciate that too because I get to learn
from you. Right? The benefits of you actually walking the walk
here is that I get to see how much experimentation is needed
to, you know, figure things out. Also how the, you know, the
amount of subscribers versus the amount of hours watched and that
kind of stuff all plays into, you know, into how you create
and what you create. So what I would like to know in terms of
monetization because that's the thing that a lot of people want
to understand about YouTube. Getting monetized on YouTube, is
that enough for a creator to you know, build a life on YouTube?
Aprilynne Alter: Monetizing your channel won't in the beginning.
No, that is not enough. The way that monetization works on
YouTube for those curious, is that once you reach a certain
threshold of monetization, which right now to enter the YouTube
Partner Program and to benefit from AdSense, so from ads shown
on your YouTube videos, you have to reach 1000 subscribers and
4000 watch hours. So at that point, you're a YouTube partner.
And now you take a portion, that's around 55% of the ad
revenue from ads played on your videos. And usually, this is
measured by something called a CPM or cost per mil, that's like
the cost per 1000 views that advertisers pay to advertise on
your videos or RPM, just revenue per mil. And for most like that
the average number is around $5. So that's like you receive $5
for every 1000 views on your channel. Some niches have a
higher CPMs, some niches have a lower CPM. But that's kind of
like the overall average. And as you can imagine, if you're a
newer channel and maybe you're getting 1000 views per video,
which is great at a certain stage, that's only roughly $5
that you're making per video that you put out. You think
about all the time and energy that goes into making the video.
It's like, okay, that's not a living, whatsoever. So I think
like you have to determine for yourself like what a livable
wage is. But also, the majority of creators who are full time on
YouTube, the majority of their income comes from sources
outside of just YouTube AdSense, whether that be affiliate
marketing or sponsorships or products or you know, digital
offerings or something else. So, yeah, I think like, there's this
common misconception that, oh, you just get monetized on
YouTube and then the AdSense pays for everything in life. And
while AdSense can be significant, if you play your
cards correctly, the cool part about YouTube is your
distribution, right? It's like, hey, all of a sudden, like, once
your platform becomes big enough, you have free
distribution of anything that you want to. And it's
particularly powerful distribution because your
audience cares about you as a creator. And so if you were to
go and create your own product, like yes, you can have
sponsorship slots where you share someone else's product.
But if you create your own, now all of a sudden, you don't have
to worry about a marketing budget, like your new YouTube
channel is your marketing budget and it converts people a lot
better than traditional marketing does as well. So yeah,
that's kind of like the overall of rundown of YouTube
monetization.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, that makes sense to me, like distribution
is a big deal. Like the fact that you can talk to people who
already like you. Like, that makes marketing so much easier.
And I love that, which is, it makes me wonder, like, do you
even still need to chase virality on YouTube if your
audience is already where you are? Like, do you still make
Aprilynne Alter: I think it depends on what stage you're at.
There are ups and downs of virality of speaking that you
get a lot of use and a lot more people can discover you downs in
that, it might not be the right people who are discovering you.
I think it's still important to make videos that have the
potential of like, of discoverability. Because most
videos to go viral? Or do you just make videos for your
people want their audiences to grow. And so like if you just
focus on making content that only suits your current
audience, without thinking about how can this be discovered or
applicable to other people, then your audience isn't going to
audience?
grow very much. Now, it's like if you're at a stage where you
don't really care about your audience growing at all, that's
completely fine. But if you do want to continue to grow and I
think like there's like a mixture. You don't have to be
trying to make like a viral bangers every time. But I do
think that it's worth a lot of intentional thought about like
the topic and the packaging of the video to as I said, like,
make it more discoverable by new people who don't already know
who you are.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, let's maybe dive into that kind of strategy
angle there a little bit like how does it work for you? What
is your strategy, your content creation strategy, both in terms
of pacing and the topics but also what the exact content of
the video is supposed to be?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, okay. So I start, like most people on
YouTube, they think of an idea. Then they script their video and
they film their video, then they upload their videos. And then
they think like, oh yeah, I need a title on a thumbnail and they
slap one together and publish. That is overall a more self
centered way to approach YouTube because you're thinking like
you. You're not thinking like your audience. Your audience
doesn't see the beautiful video, all your audience sees is the
title and thumbnail. And so when I go about my YouTube process, I
always start with idea first, with the topic, the like three
T's that are the most important to think about our topic, title
and thumbnail. I start with topic because it doesn't really
matter how good of a video you make or how beautiful your title
and thumbnail are. If it's a topic that no one's interested
in, no one's going to click on it. And if they don't click,
then they don't watch. So I think about topic first. And
when I think about topics, I think about, okay, like, what
are people first, like, what do I want to teach? And what are
people interested in? And how can I like merge them together?
Because sometimes you want to teach something. But it's not
something that people are interested in after coffee yet.
I will give you a YouTube related example. Right? So maybe
I want to teach people about music and sound design and about
like how you can use that to elevate the quality of your
videos. If I just made a video title like how to choose the
right music for your YouTube videos. It might do well. I feel
like that's like more like search related topic. So if
people are directly searching for that thing, I might show up.
But if it just like appears on someone's homepage, unless
they're specifically thinking about that, they might not click
on it because it's like, it's just seems kind of boring to
them. Versus if I say something like this one thing will 5x your
views or something like this, there's one element will elevate
the quality of your videos. It won't be phrased like that. But
then it's like, okay, you capture something that people
are interested about, which is getting more views or growing on
YouTube. And you're hooking them from there. And then you're
delivering on that promise, but by talking about the thing that
you want to teach. And so that's like the whole concept of
packaging is what's the topic? And then what's the title on
thumbnail. How do you make a title thumbnail combo so good,
that if people see it and they don't click on it, for whatever
reason, they'll think later in the day of like, man, I wonder
what was in that video. Like you want it to be that intriguing.
So then they click on it. And then when it comes to after I
have my title and thumbnail and topic, that's when I'll start
scripting the video itself. And I have like a whole process
around like research and then outline and then scripting and
then after a script. Starting now, in my most recent video,
I've experimented with a new process where instead of going
straight into filming after a script, I go through my entire
script and annotate it with exactly what is going to happen
on screen during each of those times, whether that be B roll or
a visual or an animation or talking how to footage. And that
like takes a lot of I guess like the mental effort of the editing
process but front loads it. It also helps me with like the
filming process and making the filming process a lot easier
because I know what I need to be filming and then after have all
of my footage, then I'll hop into my editor and video itself.
And after all of that, export, publish and a video is out.
Arvid Kahl: I love that you pre edit your video before you film
it. That's kind of cool like that conceptually. I mean, I
guess that's how most like high budget movie productions work,
right? Everything is already in the script very, very clearly
laid out. But for a single creator, it tends to be less
organized. I love that you organize it that way that you
have everything figured out in the beginning. That's really
cool.
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, it's something new that I tried with
this video and I've loved how it turns out in terms of like, I
feel like I'm able to create a more dynamic video because of
that and because the editing processes was already something
that's like, ah, it's so much effort. If I can, like
frontload, at least like the mental part of it, then all you
have to focus on in the editing process itself is the execution
of something that I've already thought about, which is great.
Arvid Kahl: I love that you call it more dynamic because in a
way, it's more constrained, but allows you to just feel more
free in knowing what exactly is happening around you. Right? You
can kind of play with it in a way. That's cool. Because I do
wonder, is it potentially harming your creativity in the
editing process to have everything laid out even before
you film?
Aprilynne Alter: No, because like one, I can always change
something if I need to. But two, it's still like the same thing,
right? It's still like the same creative process that I'm
thinking about. But it's just at a different time. Right? Since I
was like, if I would be doing this either way, either after
filming or before. And I'd rather do it before because
like, in this case, like I thought about a lot more types
of B roll that I wanted to include that I thought would
look really, really cool. And part of like, the rough part
about editing is if you start to edit and you're like, ah, I
really wish I had footage of this, but I don't. So I'm going
to do something else. Right? Versus if I say that before the
filming process starts, I can record as much extra footage as
I want to. And I could decide for myself if I want to use it
or not an editing process, but at least it's there.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, that makes perfect sense. It is very clear.
I love the way of phrasing it. You're still the same creative
person, you're just at a different point. You stil apply
this creativity, that's cool. Let's get back to title and
thumbnail for a bit. Because as a YouTube user, not just as
somebody who is like throwing this mostly unedited podcast on
YouTube. But also, as somebody who just watches a lot of
YouTube from all different kinds of people, title and thumbnail
is all I have to make a judgment about the video. And that's kind
of what you explained, right? You have your home feed that
kind of stuff that gets shown to you. And then you have the
things you search for, which apparently are two very
different things to optimize for. That's interesting. But
let's dive into title and thumbnail b. Before we get to
that hopefully. You never know. As somebody who wants to build a
very authentic brand like being myself in front of people, I
struggle so hard with catchy titles and thumbnails, like it
always feels like it's not me to be louder than I am. And to
promise more than I think it actually is about. How can I
avoid feeling that way? Because I know I need to compete with
all these other very showy, very flashy things on YouTube. Like,
how do I deal with that as a creator who wants to stay
authentically, myself?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, I think like it comes down to, it's not
about you being loud. It's about your audience. Like it's about
your audience wanting to click on the video. It's about like,
getting the audience to watch the video in the first place.
And so it's like, again, like they don't see your video and
most likely, they don't know you. And if you don't package it
in the right way, if you package it in a way that would only be
interesting to people who already know who you are or
already subscribed to you, then you're doing the audience a
disservice, like any new audience a disservice. Because
then they'll see your video, it'll come up for them. But
because it's packaged in that way, they're not going to be
interested in and they're not going to click and so that video
could be something that was really like that might change
their lives or might like change the way in which they think or
maybe exactly what they need, but they're never going to see
it because of the way in which you packaged it, which is only
really interesting or relevant for people who already know who
you are. So yeah, I don't know if that helps at all.
Arvid Kahl: Oh, absolutely. What I hear you say let me just
mirror this back to you, is that if the video is really really
good and helpful to an audience that may not know about it, it's
not communicable outside of the title and thumbnail, so these
need to communicate. This is good for you. They can't know
what the video is about. They have to be lured in and then see
the video and then figure out oh, yeah, this is actually for
me.
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah. So I recently had a conversation with
a friend about a similar topic of like, I was thinking about a
title and thumbnail. I was like, oh, like I could do this but
like, it seems to clickbaity, right? And I want to avoid the
idea of clickbait whilst also, you know, having a packaging
that is attractive enough to be clicked on. And what he said,
which was interesting to me and that helped me was that if you
have a problem with packaging your video in a way that is
intriguing or interesting enough to be clicked on, what it really
is most likely is you not being confident enough with the
quality of your own video. Because if your video is good
enough, it won't really matter why they clicked on it in the
first place. After they watch it, they're gonna be like, dang,
that was a good video and I want to tell other people about it
because it was so good. Because like, if you think about the
YouTube videos that you've watched in the last month, do
you remember the title and thumbnail of those videos? I
never remember what the thumbnail is in the first was. I
might remember the title if I like, think about it really,
really hard. But for the most part, no. I just think about
like, what the video is. And so yeah, like, if your video was
good enough, it won't really matter why they came. They're
going to be grateful that they came. So maybe the answer is
like, I guess the question for you is do you believe that your
videos are worth watching? And that if people watch it, they'll
believe that it was worth their time?
Arvid Kahl: Well, ask my imposter syndrome about that
part. But yeah, I get it. Like, obviously, it does remind me of
books like book covers, right? I don't know if you saw this like
a month ago or so like Pieter Levels was sharing this picture
of all the self help productivity books and they're
all just white books with like, font. And that's all, right?
Like there was 20 books on the page, they all looked alike,
doesn't really matter. They're still hyper successful books
that are sold all over the place because the content of the book
is what gets people to change their lives. And then they tell
their friends to get the book.
Aprilynne Alter: Exactly!
Arvid Kahl: The difference here, apparently, between books and
YouTube is YouTube is immediately measurable. Like you
see if people clicked on your video, if they shared it, if
they invited their friends for other means then YouTube if you
see if it's external or came through Twitter or newsletters
or whatever, right? You get immediate data. And that's what
I sometimes struggle with because if it doesn't perform
immediately, a new video that I put out, it feels like I did
something wrong, even though it may just be that my audience
just wasn't awake just yet or had something else to do. How do
you deal with this in your own work? Like how do you deal with
the, I guess, the curse and the blessing that is immediately
available analytics in videos like this?
Aprilynne Alter: Gosh, it's so hard. The number of hours that
have disappeared for me from just like refreshing YouTube
studio after a new video was live and I'm like please a 1 out
of 10, please a 1 out of 10. For those who are not creators, a 1
out of 10 is a good thing for YouTubers. YouTube will rank
your video out of your last 10 videos in terms of its
performance. So a 10 out of 10 is oh it's like the the worst
performing video out of your latest 10 versus a 1 on 10 is
your best performing video out of your most recent 10. Yeah,
it's tough for me to get stuff done during the first day that I
upload a new video because I'll just be like so wired like, are
they gonna like it? Please like it. I work so hard on this
video. I really hope that they enjoy it. And I think like I've
come to try to like separate the result of a video into like
three categories in my head. One category is the views, right? So
like, okay, like how many views did this video get? That's like
bucket A. Bucket B is how much did my audience or like any
people enjoy this content? What are my comments like? Are my
comments saying like, man, this is the best video that I've seen
in a long time. Or, wow, this helped me so so so much right?
Or are the video or the comments more generic? Right? It' like
okay, like, how much did they find the content useful? And how
much did they enjoy it? And then the third bucket is what did I
learn from this process? Or how do I feel about it? So for a
number of videos, like they might not perform the best, but
I learned something new and it's like thinking about YouTube
skills in general is like collecting more like items or
buffs video game that is YouTube. So okay, like maybe you
didn't defeat the dragon yet, but like in this run, you were
able to pick up some new items and buffs that can help you in
the next time you try to defeat the dragon or make a viral
video, right? And it's like, okay, like, I pick up these new
skills and now we have them forever. In my most recent
video, I was playing around with some B rollers or supplementary
footage and I discovered this new angle that I really, really,
really loved. And it's going to be my first time using that
angle in this new video. And I'm like, whoa, I can now use that
for all of my future videos. And even if this video isn't a
complete banger, you're gonna like I've collected this item
that I can now use forever. And that's so cool. And that's a big
win. So those are like the three buckets. So like, whenever I get
too deep into thinking about that bucket, one of the results,
I try really hard to focus on okay, like, were there any other
ones on the other buckets? And if yes, were good. The last
thing I'll say too, is that the best cure that I found for a
video not doing as well as I wanted to is working on the next
one, right? Like I try to go into every single video thinking
this will be the one or like, this is my next hit. Because
one, I want to genuinely believe that like if I don't believe
that, why am I making the video in the first place? Like if I
don't believe that it's useful or like good enough for a lot of
people to watch and love, why am I making it in the first place?
And two like, you just like have that prolonged hope. And so as
soon as the video goes out, it's like, cool. Now, let's work on
the next one. And this one is going to be my best one yet. And
I kind of like takes the focus away from thinking about what's
already happened to what's going to happen.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, that 1 out of 10 thing on YouTube, it can can
give you brain damage. That's how I feel sometimes when I look
at this. It's like I'm looking at this number that won't
change, like over the next couple hours. It's just not
gonna happen. And what do I want out of this? Why do I want it to
be higher? Like every video is different too, right? You can't
expect to be better every single week than everything you've ever
done before. That's not how progress works. It's like a back
and forth. I really liked the idea of separating this into
buckets and taking the like analytical results in a
different bucket then the results for you as a creator,
the learnings, the internal learnings and I love the dragon,
a World of Warcraft raiding metaphor there because that's
how I feel about like my whole creator journey. I started like
with item level 200. And now I'm an average item level 457 or
something. It just keeps increases over time.
Arvid Kahl: You don't really see the massive difference as you go
Aprilynne Alter: It does.
through it. But over time, looking back at two years ago, I
was listening to my 20th podcast episode for some, I misclicked
somewhere yesterday, let's just say that. I just randomly
clicked on my website and I clicked on the audio version of
a episode 25 or something. And I was listening to the audio and
it was horrible. I recorded that with my old what is it called?
This weird, high gain microphone that picked up everything around
me. And it was really, really bad, not edited at all super
bad. And it was like still people listened to this. And the
same people that listened to that back then, they listen to
my stuff right now, which is much better produced. It's much
better thought out and all of that stuff, they still around
like they didn't hate it back then. Why should I think it was
bad, right? It's like you see the increase of quality over
time. And you see your own journey, which is really cool.
Aprilynne Alter: It depends on what my goal is. I think I'm
able, so I recently started this like on my new channel, this 90
day challenge to get my new channel monetized. And I had
like I went in with a couple of different strategies to try out.
In the beginning, my goal was to upload three videos per week.
Now to me that was insane. I don't know what I was thinking.
I obviously only able to upload one video per week max. And but
that week, I succeed. I make three videos in one week. And
the difference is, is that the quality of each of those videos
in that one week was the same if not better as a year or two ago
when I would make one video per week. Right? And so I was like
okay, like, does that mean that it takes less time to make a
video then? Well, after that I started thinking more
strategically. I was like, well, for this moment in time for my
journey, it's less so about quantity, but more so about
quality. And so then I switch my strategies instead of focusing
Which I wonder like, how much time do you spend per video?
on the quantity of three videos per week. I'm like, hey, let's
just make the best video I've ever made. Now, I take a lot
Because did you spend less time on that before? Did you spend
more time on each of my videos more like an entire week for a
more time on that before? What is that trajectory for somebody
single video, which is a similar time as what I did before, but
the quality of this video is so much better than ever before.
who's getting better at YouTube? Do you spend more time or less?
So, yes. I'm able to get more quality bang for my time buck
now. It's just up to me in terms of how I want to divvy that up.
Arvid Kahl: That makes sense. Do you have like a number of hours
that you spent on like an average over your last like 5 or
10 videos?
Aprilynne Alter: When I made three videos in one week, each
of those videos on average took me two days, but like two full
days, I'll say like 16 hours for a video. Now, it's more like
eight hours per day for seven days. So 56, right? Hours for a
single video. Yeah, but like that's kind of, but like, I'm
doing this full time. So there's nothing else I'm doing with my
time besides YouTube. So all of my effort can go into it.
Arvid Kahl: Okay
Aprilynne Alter: And that's what I'm doing.
Arvid Kahl: Okay, I don't want to like dive too deep into the
specifics. But I'm a process person. When I write, I have one
day for writing, one for editing. And then I turn it into
my other kinds of contents. I'll record a podcast, record the
video then I distribute. So that's my weekend structure. Do
you have like a similar structure for how you produce
videos like a step by step order of things?
Aprilynne Alter: I used to. So back when I had a more
consistent schedule, I will give you the schedule that I had for
my three videos per week. So on Monday, I would upload a video
in the morning and then I would ideate script and film another
video. On Tuesday, I would edit that video. On Wednesday, I
would upload the video and spend the day researching for like
more content for the future. Thursday, I would idea a script
to film my next video. Friday, I would edit that. Saturday, I
would upload that and idea a script and film. And on Sunday,
I would edit and then on Monday it would start over again.
Arvid Kahl: Oh, that sounds like a great work life balance,
Aprilynne Alter: Honestly, it wasn't bad. But the edit days
were the worst for me. The idea of scripted film, I was like,
cool. I'm vibing this is great. The research days were amazing
because I love to do research. I just got to like, get snacks and
go in front of my computer and just like spend the day
researching and that was great. The editing was awful. I said
eight hour days before my editing day is where, gosh, 14
hour a days, 16 hour a days in order to try to get it all done.
It was too much. So now what I've done is kind of like taken
as I saw that same process, right of like idea script, film,
edit, upload and like research as well. But now I've like
expanded each of those to the point where I feel like it's
enough, I suppose. And I think like the debate of like, should
I focus more on quantity or on quality is one that a lot of
people talk about? And it's a question that I get a lot of
time. Like many times the answer that I'll have to say for this
is just because I don't want people looking at my own
process. I mean, like, oh, I should do that. And she's
focusing so much on quality, so I should too. My take on this is
focus on quantity, so on consistency. Usually that's one
video per week, at least until it's no longer a question of
will I make another video? Until it's like it's not even a
thought in your head. It's of course, I'm going to make
another video that's just what I do. Right? So as long as it's
like, will I make another video? Oh, this is really really hard.
Like as long as there's that potential there of if you were
to take longer in a video might never get done. Focus on
quantity, focus on consistency. Then, once it no longer becomes
a question which is like that's just a staple of your life. Then
you can focus more on quality. So that's where I'm at in my
journey so I can focus more on quality. And at this point, like
how I do that is because I've done the quantity thing for so
long, I know what like the baseline is. And I know where I
thought like, oh, if I just had another day to do this, it would
be so much better. Right? And so then I'm able to use my time and
right?
like, add time where it needs to be now and I process because I
know where to allocate time for the biggest result or the
biggest impact.
Arvid Kahl: That sounds like a very thought through approach,
like, but I started with all random trying things out. But
this seems to be like you crystallize the high impact
things and integrate it into a structure. How do you prevent,
like burnout? Like you talked about burnout on YouTube
channels before. Like, what active steps do you take right
now to not burn out on this one?
Aprilynne Alter: If I ever so I feel like I have like a
hypersensitive sensitivity to burnout now. And like if I feel
even like the inkling of it potentially coming, I'm like,
oh, warning, something's gonna happen. Let's chill out for a
second. So usually, I have to think about, like, why I'm
feeling that burnout. And at this point for me, it's usually
something external because I've done enough work. And I'm far
enough along my own journey that I am confident that what I am
doing now in terms of like, the content itself and the process
itself, is something that I genuinely love, like I genuinely
enjoy. It's taken a lot of work to get to this point, but
something that I believe to be true. So when I like feel any,
like, ounce of burnout coming in, I'm like, why is this
happening? And it depends. Typically, it's because either
like, I'm making a video that I don't actually want to be making
or I'm pushing myself too fast when I should be slowing down or
other things are going on in my life. Like, we're in a heatwave
and there's no air conditioning, you know or like, ah, like or
I'm sick or something else that's or like, I haven't gone
outside enough. So I don't have enough fresh air. Right? And
there's usually something else going on. I'm like, that's the
reason why. But I think like, it's a lot easier for me to
identify that because I know that my core thing is something
that I love and I'm lucky enough to like found that for myself.
But, yeah.
Arvid Kahl: Okay, that makes absolute sense. And thinking
about it as something external, something that is not coming
from within you in the sense of that it's like a deep desire,
but some kind of external pressure or external constraint
that makes, that's my experience as well with these things. And
often it's something externalized like, it's an
expectation that we projected onto something else as well.
Right? That's also weird. How has your move to San Francisco
affected your mental health, let's just say that, or your
productivity? Like your state of doing things on YouTube? Because
move is a pretty big thing. And moving to the valley is probably
equally big and making big changes. Has that had an effect
on you?
Aprilynne Alter: It's had an enormous effect. But probably
for a different reason than you would think so, prior to this.
Like I mean, I've been living with my partner, Rocks, for
almost two years now. And for the majority of his time, we
were both working from home in the same place. And it was
great. But I feel like neither one of us were as productive as
we could have been. Because, you know, oftentimes, it wasn't like
a one bedroom apartment. And so we're not even like distanced
from each other in different rooms. We're normally in the
same room in two different corners. And it's just like it
was so hard to have long, productive hours
Arvid Kahl: Right
Aprilynne Alter: Because I think we picked up on each other's
energies a lot. So it's like, even if I was like in the zone,
if he was having a rough day, I would pick up on his energy and
like want to go and console him or want to like go and see
what's going on and vice versa. So when we moved to San
Francisco, he now like works at like a different physical
office. So he leaves early in the day
Arvid Kahl: Perfect!
Aprilynne Alter: And he doesn't come back until really late at
night and also going to San Francisco, I didn't really have
any friends here at all. I had one friend that I was looking
forward to seeing here. The week that I moved here she moved to
Romania. I was like man, of course. So I didn't really have
any friends here at all. And there is like a moment and I
guess like the main shift that happened was the default was
stillness. So the default, if I were to do nothing in this
apartment, it would just be stall. Rocks wouldn't be here. I
wouldn't really have friends like trying to hit me up or you
know, go out and do an activity. I would just be alone and still.
And also, I have these, like gigantic windows in this
apartment, which just like have a gorgeous city view. So I can
just like stand there and like, look out into the city, which I
love because I love that San Francisco is a city of builders.
And there's this energy of like a lot of people are here working
towards their dream. And I think like that default of being still
has allowed me to work so much more and like be a lot more
productive. Because I can always add in distraction if I want to.
I can always fill the space with videos or calling friends and
family or going out if I need to. But it's just like, I've
been able to be so focused. And I tend to work really well if
I'm alone. I know some people like to work when they're like
around people. Even in school, I never went to a library to study
because there are people around. I like went to like my room and
shut all the doors, right? So this has been a dream for me.
I've just been able to get super, super deep into spending
my time exactly how I want to spend my time. And it's been
wonderful.
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, the ability to just be still in yourself and
reflect on the things you want to do. I think that's the source
of energy and the generative core of most creators, many
creators. I don't know. And you know, people have different
personalities. And like you said, some people need their
solipsistic kind of enclosed space. I'm the same way like
this is my room and nobody goes into my room. I have a biometric
lock on the door. Nobody gets into this room. That's how my
studio is.
Aprilynne Alter: What about your dog?
Arvid Kahl: The dog, she can knock and then I will let her
in. But we should have a little doggie door in here. But no, the
puppy is an exception because she's my co founder at this
point. So she
Aprilynne Alter: That makes sense
Arvid Kahl: Has access privileges to my room. But yeah,
I need the space as well. Like my creative source is finding a
silent place, thinking and then I can follow like you said with
distractions as well. I think it's important to have that
place to go to and probably that is something over the last
couple of years, that was significantly lacking in most
people's home office, forced home office lives, right?
Particularly if you have kids or pets or just loud neighbors, you
live in a busy space, not having a place to go back to retreat
to, to relax, that probably was a big issue. It's nice that you
have that. I'm really happy for you to be able to have this
place and also for Rocks to have his thing and do his work from
another place and not have this kind of energy bounce that you
were describing. That's really important. So having, maybe
that's something to talk about. What does a creator space look
like? How how do you set up your space to be creative in,
starting with not having another person sitting there streaming
for hours a day? Right?
Aprilynne Alter: Yeah, for sure. I mean, I think it's very
dependent on the creator in general. I can speak to what
helps me out. One thing that really helps me, which might
seem counterintuitive, but I think like if you're a creator
you would understand. Having some sort of structure in my day
helps a lot with being able to be more creative. And so like
the very first like I have a morning routine, where when I
get up after I brush my teeth, I will go to like a specific like
corner that I have over there, where I have my journal and a
pen and it was right next to a window so I will open the
window, get that natural light, look out into the city and just
spend some time journaling. It doesn't have to be that much
like one page if need be. Usually, it's longer. But no
matter, I start my day unless I have a very early call. I start
my day with that and I just think like it helps so much just
like to get me ready for that day to look out, to get inspired
by the city view and to just like reflect and think about
like where I'm at in the current moment and like what I want my
day to look like. After that's done, then I can like start my
day. And I like having like a separate like desk that I use
for just like work, I guess. If I want to like watch TV or
something or like, watch YouTube, at this point, I just
consume YouTube for entertainment. I don't really
like watch TV anymore. It's like, we have an open floor
plan. So it's like this the L is the couch and then the TV is
here. And then on the other side of the couch is the desk and the
slight corner. And I guess like all this to say that for me, I
really love like the separation of spaces. It's like, okay, I
have a specific space for journaling. I don't do any work
there. I don't do anything else in that space other than
journal. I have this space. I have the space for work. I don't
do anything else in the space besides work. I have that space.
I don't do anything else in that space besides chill, right? And
just like having those separation for me, has been
really, really great. And then also like, even in that, there's
like another little kitchen table and like the bar kitchen
area, where I can go and sit if I want like a change in scenery
or like, you know, if I want to go and like write someplace
else. So I think like the optionality and like where I
want to, like sit and do work if needed. And the separation of
spaces and access to natural light, have been pretty big for
me in terms of being able to like, more easily access a flow
state.
Arvid Kahl: That is something that I've witnessed both in
myself and a lot of other creators. Like when you told me
the story about you having your little journaling spot where all
that happens, there is journaling. I had this
conversation a couple of weeks ago with somebody else. They
have their journaling spot, that one seat in the house like a
nice cushion space where they can relax into. They have their
little coffee table beside it, and they they spent like 30
minutes or whatever journaling and then they leave the space
and nobody else is allowed to sit there. It's there spot,
right? And that's for that purpose alone. I think that's
something that if you're building a home office or if you
want to work from home, you have to really consciously make these
spaces for yourself to be creative. And I've talked to
writers that have a desk that is just for writing by hand. And
then there's the computer that's for writing, you know, on the
keyboard or whatever. Like taking these different
activities and giving them individual spots and spaces that
compartmentalizes the activities into spaces where if you go
there, you're prepared to do that work. That is something
that I find myself too, like the space I'm sitting in right now
is my recording computer, like I literally bought a little Mac
Mini that is connected to all this stuff here that is just for
recording. I don't edit here. I don't do anything else here. If
I sit on this chair here, I record, which brings me into a
mind space where I'm more inquisitive, right? Where I'm
talking to people and I get to ask them cool questions that
brings me an energy and then I move over there, which is
invisible right now because it's obviously not in the recording
space. And that's where all the kind of analytical deep work
happens, the editing even the writing and that happens there
for me. So it's really cool to see you taking that step as
well. And having all these little spaces. That's
interesting. What's that conscious? Like did you
consciously set up the space like this? Or did it just you
map the activities onto the space?
Aprilynne Alter: Most of these happen by happenstance. So when
we moved into this apartment, we are subletting and so this is
like a fully furnished apartment during this time. But where this
current desk was, was where my journaling nook is now. And I
didn't like that in terms of like having like a filming
background. Like I moved things around. But then that area was
bare. And I was like, we got to put something there. How about
like a little like desk over there that we can put like the
coffee maker on and maybe I can journal? And I think like, as
that started to be built out, I started to realize like, oh,
this is actually a huge deal. Like, I'm able to keep with a
journaling habit that I know is really important to me, but I
haven't been able to keep with for a while because there's a
designated spot for it. And I'm able to get more work done in
this space because it's separate, like big, like, from
my chill space. I originally started to like watch my
entertainment on the couch because I don't have an office
chair. This chair is just like a normal like, kitchen chair. And
so instead of like sitting here to relax, I just like moved over
to the couch and was like, oh, this is actually a big deal too.
So in the future, with every new space that we set up, that's
what I'm going to look for. It's like okay, how can I
compartmentalize spaces for specific activities?
Arvid Kahl: That's like creator of Feng Shui, right?
Aprilynne Alter: Pretty much, yeah
Arvid Kahl: Yeah, you have to find the right spots for the
right energies in your space. That is really cool. And since
we're talking about finding, let's bring this to a close.
Where can people go to find you?
Aprilynne Alter: What a segue! Incredible! I'm on YouTube,
youtube.com/@aprilynnealter. I'm on Twitter as well
@AprilynneAlter. And yeah, that's for the most part where
you can find me if you want to follow along the journey or
learn more about YouTube.
Arvid Kahl: I highly recommend it. I'm a big fan of your work.
I follow you everywhere I can find you because your insights
are spectacular. And I'm really, really grateful that you shared
your early morning instead of going into your journaling note
today with me in this conversation. Thanks for giving
me a little insight into the world with a physical and mental
world of a creator who is very, very interested in sharing and
teaching people, which I really admire. You're so good at
teaching people and you're teaching people how to teach,
which is even better. Telling people how to get a grow on
YouTube is effectively teaching them how to teach, which is
really, really cool. So thank you so much for being on the
show today. Thank you for spending your morning with me.
That was wonderful. Thank you.
Aprilynne Alter: Thanks so much for having me.
Arvid Kahl: Always a pleasure. Thanks.
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