WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:03.290 --> 00:00:06.080 voiceover: A key component of the modern world economy, the chemical 00:00:06.080 --> 00:00:09.620 industry delivers products and innovations to enhance everyday life. 00:00:10.151 --> 00:00:14.130 It is also an industry in transformation where chemical executives and 00:00:14.130 --> 00:00:17.761 workers are delivering growth and industry changing advancements while 00:00:17.761 --> 00:00:21.510 responding to pressures from investors, regulators, and public opinion. 00:00:22.051 --> 00:00:24.991 Discover how leading companies are approaching these challenges 00:00:25.001 --> 00:00:26.611 here on the chemical show. 00:00:27.071 --> 00:00:30.410 Join Victoria Meyer, president of Progressio Global and 00:00:30.421 --> 00:00:31.830 host of the chemical show. 00:00:32.101 --> 00:00:36.311 As she speaks with executives across the industry and learns how they are leading 00:00:36.311 --> 00:00:41.900 their companies to grow, transform, and push industry boundaries on all frontiers. 00:00:42.231 --> 00:00:44.500 Here's your host, Victoria Meyer. 00:00:46.875 --> 00:00:48.465 VictoriaM: Hi, this is Victoria Meyer. 00:00:48.655 --> 00:00:52.680 Welcome back to The Chemical Show where Chemicals Means Business. 00:00:52.950 --> 00:00:57.230 Last week, I talked about the Six Trends Driving the Chemical Industry Today. 00:00:57.870 --> 00:01:00.190 Some of you told me I was missing a big trend. 00:01:00.260 --> 00:01:05.150 In fact, Chat GPT and yes, I went out to ask Chat GPT what it 00:01:05.150 --> 00:01:07.980 thought about the biggest trends in the chemical industry today. 00:01:08.540 --> 00:01:11.925 Well, Chat GPT told me I was missing four trends. 00:01:12.675 --> 00:01:13.045 Four. 00:01:13.075 --> 00:01:13.545 That's a lot. 00:01:14.025 --> 00:01:19.455 I'm actually going to bundle that into a single yet very complex trend. 00:01:20.085 --> 00:01:21.015 Sustainability. 00:01:21.735 --> 00:01:26.035 Sustainability means different things to different people in different companies. 00:01:26.315 --> 00:01:30.625 And I'm just going to frame this in the context of the chemical industry today. 00:01:31.325 --> 00:01:36.875 Sustainability across the industry covers a wide range of topics. 00:01:37.425 --> 00:01:39.905 We've got clean air and clean water. 00:01:40.105 --> 00:01:43.975 And what I think of as kind of the roots and the core of environmental 00:01:43.995 --> 00:01:47.215 sustainability and responsibility that across the industry 00:01:47.215 --> 00:01:49.585 we've been focused on forever. 00:01:49.840 --> 00:01:51.040 Right, really and truly. 00:01:51.290 --> 00:01:52.300 Decarbonization. 00:01:53.615 --> 00:01:59.035 Reducing water usage, both industrial, what we're using in manufacturing, in 00:01:59.035 --> 00:02:03.605 the production of the wide variety of chemicals, um, and other products that 00:02:03.605 --> 00:02:08.675 we're producing, as well as the final usage, um, at the consumer level, right? 00:02:08.675 --> 00:02:10.895 So a lot of focus on reducing water usage. 00:02:11.975 --> 00:02:15.895 Circularity and circular solutions, often plastics, right? 00:02:15.895 --> 00:02:19.945 So that's the most common place we talk about is plastics, but also carbon. 00:02:20.105 --> 00:02:23.895 And if you listen to my interview a couple of weeks ago with, um, Kevin 00:02:23.895 --> 00:02:28.385 Norfleet from Celanese, we talked about carbon circularity in the form 00:02:28.385 --> 00:02:32.175 of carbon capture and utilization and, and the repurposing carbon there. 00:02:32.505 --> 00:02:36.185 Um, also textiles is a really big area. 00:02:36.185 --> 00:02:42.195 There's a number of, um, startups and other textile focus firms focused in 00:02:42.195 --> 00:02:47.445 that area because textile recircularity and textile circularity is critical. 00:02:47.445 --> 00:02:50.245 In fact, one of the companies I'm doing a lot of work with right now, 00:02:50.295 --> 00:02:53.745 Carbios, has developed a solution for this, but they and others are 00:02:53.745 --> 00:02:55.905 trying to solve this challenge. 00:02:56.255 --> 00:02:59.265 Um, green hydrogen and green methanol. 00:02:59.940 --> 00:03:01.620 We've talked about that on The Chemical Show. 00:03:02.020 --> 00:03:05.990 Green electricity, whether it be solar, wind, or water. 00:03:06.300 --> 00:03:11.040 And if I think about solar and wind, both of which require an abundance 00:03:11.330 --> 00:03:15.490 of chemicals and other minerals and materials to be successful. 00:03:16.530 --> 00:03:17.930 Electric vehicles, right? 00:03:18.210 --> 00:03:20.340 We can't talk about electrification without talking 00:03:20.340 --> 00:03:22.100 about EVs, electric vehicles. 00:03:23.080 --> 00:03:25.680 Biotechnology and bio based chemicals, right? 00:03:25.680 --> 00:03:30.440 So we've talked about that a lot on the Chemical Show and, and highlighted 00:03:30.440 --> 00:03:35.940 some innovative participants across the industry, people ranging from 00:03:35.940 --> 00:03:42.130 Lanzatech to Integrity Biochem to Solugen and others, right? 00:03:42.310 --> 00:03:44.770 And then sustainable supply chains, right? 00:03:44.770 --> 00:03:45.060 So. 00:03:45.390 --> 00:03:48.480 A lot of times that's in the context of scope three emissions. 00:03:49.060 --> 00:03:52.790 Sometimes sustainability is in the context of business sustainability 00:03:52.790 --> 00:03:53.920 and business continuity. 00:03:54.170 --> 00:03:57.360 But what we're seeing there is around shorter supply chains, 00:03:57.370 --> 00:03:59.040 alternative fuels and more. 00:03:59.320 --> 00:04:04.845 So there is no doubt that the chemical industry and it's partners 00:04:05.245 --> 00:04:11.175 are investing billions and perhaps trillions in sustainable solutions. 00:04:11.915 --> 00:04:16.315 And yet the question remains, who's going to pay for it? 00:04:17.215 --> 00:04:19.395 How quickly can it scale? 00:04:19.745 --> 00:04:22.165 And when is it going to be profitable? 00:04:22.415 --> 00:04:26.805 So that brings me maybe to the whole framework of today's conversation. 00:04:27.055 --> 00:04:30.865 Number one, sustainability is absolutely a key trend driving the 00:04:30.865 --> 00:04:38.275 industry today, but Can Sustainability and Profitability Coexist? 00:04:39.185 --> 00:04:40.475 And that's a big question. 00:04:40.825 --> 00:04:44.915 So when we, when we think about this and when I look at it, there are a 00:04:44.915 --> 00:04:49.915 number of companies that are rolling back their sustainability goals, right? 00:04:49.915 --> 00:04:53.715 So one of the latest ones I've heard is Coca Cola, but I actually went out, 00:04:53.735 --> 00:04:57.615 I did a Google search really quick just to say, okay, what companies have 00:04:57.615 --> 00:04:59.255 rolled back their sustainability goals? 00:04:59.450 --> 00:05:05.400 And these are the headlines "More than 40 Fashion Suppliers Have 00:05:05.410 --> 00:05:07.650 Rolled Back Climate Commitments. 00:05:07.950 --> 00:05:08.880 What's Going On?" 00:05:09.020 --> 00:05:12.230 So that was something that was published just four days ago. 00:05:13.470 --> 00:05:17.430 Um, another article, "How Companies are Starting to Back Away from Green Targets." 00:05:17.580 --> 00:05:18.100 Here we go. 00:05:18.470 --> 00:05:23.570 "Swiss giant Nestle has Rolled Back Recycling Targets and the Difference 00:05:23.570 --> 00:05:29.260 Amounts to the Weight of 30 Eiffel Towers.' Um, "Shell weakens it's 2030 00:05:29.260 --> 00:05:31.840 Carbons Emissions Reduction Target." 00:05:31.860 --> 00:05:35.090 So that is just on the first page. 00:05:35.350 --> 00:05:38.190 You, if we were reading it on a newspaper, we'd call it above the fold. 00:05:38.690 --> 00:05:39.990 It's before you have to scroll. 00:05:41.290 --> 00:05:43.720 So there's a lot of concern here, right? 00:05:43.720 --> 00:05:46.370 So this, this is just a snapshot of the headlines. 00:05:47.010 --> 00:05:50.030 People are very invested and concerned about this. 00:05:50.560 --> 00:05:55.750 And yet at the same time, companies are doubling down. 00:05:55.750 --> 00:06:02.260 So just this week we heard from Evonik, um, that it's new innovation strategy 00:06:02.260 --> 00:06:04.810 will focus on bio based solutions. 00:06:05.135 --> 00:06:10.485 The energy transition and the circular economy, and that Evonik expects these 00:06:10.485 --> 00:06:12.985 three growth areas to generate 1. 00:06:13.025 --> 00:06:16.095 5 billion by 2032, right? 00:06:16.095 --> 00:06:22.415 So the company is investing heavily in its R& D efforts in 00:06:22.495 --> 00:06:27.595 other efforts towards what I would categorize as Sustainable Innovation. 00:06:27.955 --> 00:06:28.995 So clearly. 00:06:29.510 --> 00:06:30.420 It's of interest. 00:06:30.420 --> 00:06:33.320 Again, I've, I've already mentioned, I've talked to a number of companies 00:06:33.450 --> 00:06:36.760 on The Chemical Show that are really committed and focused. 00:06:36.760 --> 00:06:42.220 And in fact, their entirety of their business model is really around bio 00:06:42.220 --> 00:06:43.940 based and sustainable solutions. 00:06:44.295 --> 00:06:46.735 So, so what gives, right? 00:06:47.315 --> 00:06:52.345 Can Sustainability and Profitability coexist? 00:06:53.935 --> 00:06:54.405 Maybe. 00:06:55.075 --> 00:06:58.955 And I think the reality is it's not going to be fast, right? 00:06:58.955 --> 00:07:00.595 So there are no fast solutions. 00:07:00.595 --> 00:07:03.595 When we talk about the innovators, these innovative solutions 00:07:03.595 --> 00:07:05.725 don't roll out very quickly. 00:07:06.170 --> 00:07:07.570 Getting to scale. 00:07:07.810 --> 00:07:12.200 To the scale that the chemical industry is in is not a fast pace. 00:07:12.230 --> 00:07:15.960 It took us decades, hundreds of years, depending on which 00:07:15.960 --> 00:07:16.880 products you're looking at. 00:07:16.880 --> 00:07:17.100 Right. 00:07:17.100 --> 00:07:19.090 So there's a lot of things going on here. 00:07:19.340 --> 00:07:21.940 Um, what I would like to articulate that was maybe some of the 00:07:21.950 --> 00:07:24.520 challenges that are going on today. 00:07:24.520 --> 00:07:28.200 So, you know, that headline that said, Oh, Companies are 00:07:28.200 --> 00:07:29.540 rolling back what's going on. 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:31.800 Well, let's talk about what's going on. 00:07:31.860 --> 00:07:36.580 And I've talked to companies across the value chain in different parts 00:07:36.580 --> 00:07:40.400 of the chemical industry, um, to get some of this feedback about some of 00:07:40.400 --> 00:07:43.330 the challenges that they see, some of the challenges that you see. 00:07:43.720 --> 00:07:46.920 So number one is Affordability. 00:07:46.960 --> 00:07:48.420 It gets back to the profitability. 00:07:48.420 --> 00:07:49.460 Who's going to pay for it? 00:07:50.210 --> 00:07:55.750 Corporate purchasing's willingness to pay more for circular or 00:07:55.750 --> 00:08:00.200 sustainable products is not there. 00:08:00.270 --> 00:08:00.600 Right. 00:08:00.830 --> 00:08:06.000 So there seems to be conflicting objectives between a quest to 00:08:06.060 --> 00:08:07.880 continually lowering costs. 00:08:07.880 --> 00:08:08.240 Right. 00:08:08.550 --> 00:08:12.220 Um, which often happens when you're talking with procurement 00:08:12.320 --> 00:08:14.000 across all industries, right? 00:08:14.240 --> 00:08:19.380 They are tasked with reducing costs, with getting the best price, and 00:08:19.390 --> 00:08:23.050 their willingness - and I'm hearing this a lot really across product 00:08:23.050 --> 00:08:27.670 lines - is their willingness to pay more for those products doesn't exist. 00:08:27.710 --> 00:08:32.180 So even products that we know that are readily available in a recycled format. 00:08:32.210 --> 00:08:34.340 So let's take a recycled PET. 00:08:35.490 --> 00:08:37.310 Despite having corporate objectives. 00:08:37.310 --> 00:08:41.760 So if we take the plastic bottlers, um, whether it be Coca Cola or Pepsi, 00:08:41.760 --> 00:08:45.220 whether it be other companies that are using a lot of plastics and a lot of 00:08:45.220 --> 00:08:50.770 PET and packaging, their willingness to pay more for recycle to help meet their 00:08:50.850 --> 00:08:55.520 sustainability targets and what their customers are asking for is not there. 00:08:55.780 --> 00:08:56.130 Right? 00:08:56.310 --> 00:08:59.590 So misalignment of objectives, that'd be one thing. 00:08:59.970 --> 00:09:06.770 Another challenge is really around the individual consumers willingness to number 00:09:06.770 --> 00:09:15.280 one, pay more for products that are green, sustainable, sourced responsibly, more 00:09:15.280 --> 00:09:17.260 sustainable supply chains, et cetera. 00:09:17.260 --> 00:09:17.600 Right? 00:09:18.010 --> 00:09:19.100 Are we willing to pay more? 00:09:21.135 --> 00:09:22.535 Oftentimes, not really. 00:09:23.185 --> 00:09:27.520 Consumer's willingness to have less. 00:09:27.920 --> 00:09:31.360 Whether it be clothing or other stuff. 00:09:31.370 --> 00:09:37.560 So that consumerism has absolutely driven demand across the chemical 00:09:37.560 --> 00:09:39.190 industry and other industries. 00:09:39.610 --> 00:09:46.650 And yet at the same time, it also nets out to a problem that we've got more stuff 00:09:46.690 --> 00:09:51.130 and more stuff that eventually has to be disposed of and disposed of responsibly. 00:09:51.420 --> 00:09:52.820 So, you know, there we go. 00:09:52.900 --> 00:09:54.580 Part three related to the consumers. 00:09:54.920 --> 00:10:00.635 The consumer's willingness to change their behaviors around recycling, right? 00:10:00.795 --> 00:10:06.595 So talk to anyone involved in the recycling industry, go look at the 00:10:06.595 --> 00:10:12.895 recycling numbers for plastics, cans, bottles, um, and glass. 00:10:13.495 --> 00:10:19.765 It's, it varies, it varies by region, by state when you look across the US, by 00:10:19.765 --> 00:10:23.605 country, but really it's remarkably low. 00:10:23.915 --> 00:10:27.915 A remarkably low number, even for those that have and have 00:10:27.935 --> 00:10:29.195 curbside recycling programs. 00:10:29.195 --> 00:10:33.345 So one of the things we hear a lot about oftentimes is the 00:10:33.425 --> 00:10:37.545 inaccessibility of recycling systems, and that is absolutely true. 00:10:38.405 --> 00:10:42.775 But I know, and I'm guessing you know, people that even though they 00:10:42.775 --> 00:10:48.635 have easy and readily available recycling programs, curbside recycling 00:10:48.635 --> 00:10:50.735 programs, don't take advantage of it. 00:10:50.975 --> 00:10:51.255 Right. 00:10:51.515 --> 00:10:55.455 So there needs to be behavioral change and there's a lot of different 00:10:55.455 --> 00:11:00.405 suggestions out there in the industry and across the industry and beyond 00:11:00.695 --> 00:11:02.635 that offer up suggestions to that. 00:11:02.635 --> 00:11:05.045 But individuals. 00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:06.230 You and I. 00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:11.030 Our friends and family and people across the world. 00:11:11.540 --> 00:11:16.180 Our willingness to change behaviors is critical in order to solve 00:11:16.190 --> 00:11:20.300 some of the sustainability and profitability and circularity. 00:11:20.900 --> 00:11:21.710 And on and on. 00:11:22.080 --> 00:11:22.360 Right. 00:11:22.370 --> 00:11:25.130 So that's, that's the second challenge overarching. 00:11:25.590 --> 00:11:28.830 The third challenge is Regulations and Regulatory Approvals, right? 00:11:28.900 --> 00:11:38.140 So anyone that is trying to introduce new products, new technologies has faced this. 00:11:38.330 --> 00:11:41.810 It is, there are hurdles, there are massive hurdles. 00:11:42.090 --> 00:11:43.310 The pace is slow. 00:11:43.790 --> 00:11:48.760 This is not just in the US, this is globally, um, so the plastics industry 00:11:48.760 --> 00:11:52.690 as they are trying to get advanced recycling in place are facing hurdles. 00:11:53.120 --> 00:11:58.440 The biotech and the bio based and green chemical innovators as they 00:11:58.470 --> 00:12:04.410 try to bring new products to market are facing slow regulatory approvals 00:12:04.440 --> 00:12:05.900 and hurdles to try to get that. 00:12:05.900 --> 00:12:11.655 So again, we have a misalignment of objectives and actions, right? 00:12:11.695 --> 00:12:14.685 So we've got objectives and I think we've got objectives globally. 00:12:14.685 --> 00:12:16.805 We've got objectives at a national level. 00:12:17.005 --> 00:12:21.355 We've got objectives at a corporate level, um, to achieve certain sustainability 00:12:21.355 --> 00:12:24.815 goals profitably, we hope, right? 00:12:24.815 --> 00:12:27.165 So that's one of the other premises that we're, we're 00:12:27.165 --> 00:12:28.625 working on in today's episode. 00:12:29.025 --> 00:12:33.695 But the hurdles that are in place, um, act counter to those objectives. 00:12:34.305 --> 00:12:36.655 You know, the fourth thing is around investors, investors, 00:12:36.655 --> 00:12:37.635 willingness and patience. 00:12:38.015 --> 00:12:44.785 So investing in and supporting businesses through the time it takes to scale 00:12:45.165 --> 00:12:47.095 through the profitability needs, right? 00:12:47.115 --> 00:12:52.490 One of the things we see is getting a new technology to scale takes a long time. 00:12:52.510 --> 00:12:54.470 I'm going to use LanzaTech as an example. 00:12:54.820 --> 00:12:58.360 And you guys know I had Jennifer Holmgren on, uh, early in the 00:12:58.360 --> 00:12:59.740 early days of The Chemical Show. 00:12:59.740 --> 00:13:03.130 I need to bring Jennifer back on and get an update from her. 00:13:04.360 --> 00:13:09.788 LanzaTech has been at this for 20 years before they're realizing profitability. 00:13:09.788 --> 00:13:11.495 Um, Trillium. 00:13:12.765 --> 00:13:15.115 Uh, was on The Chemical Show last year. 00:13:15.165 --> 00:13:17.175 Advantium was on The Chemical Show. 00:13:17.505 --> 00:13:22.075 These guys have been at it for years, seven to 10 years easily. 00:13:22.415 --> 00:13:27.815 Solugen, which was on recently and I had Gaurab, the CEO of Solugen on recently. 00:13:28.205 --> 00:13:30.145 They've been at this for years. 00:13:30.235 --> 00:13:35.485 It's almost a decade to get to scale much less profitability, right? 00:13:35.505 --> 00:13:39.285 So what that requires is patient investors, right? 00:13:39.565 --> 00:13:44.575 A long term view in terms of how to get there, a willingness to experiment, 00:13:44.665 --> 00:13:49.515 adapt, scale, and grow on things that may or may not be successful. 00:13:49.615 --> 00:13:52.135 And sometimes it, it takes a long time for these sustainable 00:13:52.135 --> 00:13:53.905 solutions to become successful. 00:13:54.265 --> 00:13:57.405 Um, and yet there needs to be a certain amount of willingness and patience. 00:13:57.805 --> 00:14:01.655 You know, the other piece that ties into investors is, you know, if we 00:14:01.655 --> 00:14:03.465 look back over the past several years. 00:14:03.635 --> 00:14:05.935 ESG investing was all the rage. 00:14:06.345 --> 00:14:10.405 And there's been a lot of pushback on it recently and people say, Oh, that's, 00:14:10.415 --> 00:14:11.915 you know, appropriate or inappropriate. 00:14:12.595 --> 00:14:14.085 I'm not saying it, whether it is or not. 00:14:14.155 --> 00:14:14.425 Right. 00:14:14.425 --> 00:14:18.865 So I think investing guidelines, you do what makes sense for you. 00:14:18.955 --> 00:14:22.025 I think we also, you know, companies are held to certain standards and 00:14:22.025 --> 00:14:22.965 there are certain regulations. 00:14:23.125 --> 00:14:23.435 Right. 00:14:23.675 --> 00:14:28.444 So I'm not debating any of that, but there was an interesting article, uh, 00:14:28.444 --> 00:14:33.084 just this week in Harvard Business Review in their online magazine. 00:14:33.104 --> 00:14:36.254 And it's titled, "It's Time to Unbundle ESG." 00:14:36.924 --> 00:14:40.284 And part of this is, and why were they together anyway? 00:14:40.284 --> 00:14:42.724 So environmental, social, and governance, right? 00:14:42.754 --> 00:14:46.854 And especially when these things move at a different pace and they've been 00:14:46.854 --> 00:14:50.774 called different things through the years there's an opportunity to unbundle and 00:14:50.774 --> 00:14:56.244 maybe it will be unbundled once again, the E environmental, I tie that back 00:14:56.244 --> 00:14:58.574 over to sustainability is likely to stay. 00:14:58.824 --> 00:14:59.604 It will stay. 00:14:59.824 --> 00:15:01.024 We're on this path. 00:15:01.034 --> 00:15:03.254 I think we're committed to this path, right? 00:15:03.514 --> 00:15:05.754 And then the fifth challenge. 00:15:05.914 --> 00:15:10.464 And when we talk about sustainability and whether sustainability and profitability 00:15:10.494 --> 00:15:17.849 can coexist is a collective openness and a willingness to recognize that Number one, 00:15:17.869 --> 00:15:19.309 we don't have all the solutions today. 00:15:19.549 --> 00:15:21.009 There are alternate solutions. 00:15:21.479 --> 00:15:24.009 We don't necessarily have the right metrics, right? 00:15:24.039 --> 00:15:27.319 And so we need to define those metrics more broadly. 00:15:27.689 --> 00:15:33.719 And in, in doing so, recognizing that one size does not fit all one target. 00:15:33.974 --> 00:15:36.584 Does not fit all there's a number of variables. 00:15:36.594 --> 00:15:39.744 So, you know, if you go back to where I started early in today's episode 00:15:40.114 --> 00:15:44.864 about all the things that fall under the sustainability umbrella, whether 00:15:44.864 --> 00:15:51.324 it be circularity or water reduction or cleaner air, green hydrogen, they are. 00:15:51.634 --> 00:15:56.214 All take us to a sustainable future in a different way, right? 00:15:56.474 --> 00:16:00.734 And so with, it requires different targets and different goals and different 00:16:00.744 --> 00:16:06.924 objectives, and ultimately we need to get to that place and lack of openness 00:16:07.024 --> 00:16:11.863 around what sustainability may be and where those definitions are and how 00:16:11.864 --> 00:16:17.849 to draw those hurdles is one of the challenges that, that faces Sustainability 00:16:17.859 --> 00:16:20.309 and sustainable solutions today, right? 00:16:20.339 --> 00:16:21.649 So coming back. 00:16:21.699 --> 00:16:24.799 Can profitability and Sustainability coexist? 00:16:25.819 --> 00:16:30.599 Yes, I'm going to say yes, but it's not immediate. 00:16:31.479 --> 00:16:35.499 Some of these hurdles and challenges that I've identified need to be 00:16:35.559 --> 00:16:41.539 overcome, but I go back to also where I started, which is, the trends. 00:16:41.874 --> 00:16:45.754 Sustainability is absolutely one of the key trends for the chemical 00:16:45.754 --> 00:16:52.024 industry, really for all process industries this decade and beyond. 00:16:52.264 --> 00:16:54.554 So that's it for today. 00:16:54.654 --> 00:16:56.284 I'd love to hear your point of view on this. 00:16:56.864 --> 00:16:57.784 What do you think? 00:16:58.224 --> 00:17:00.824 Can sustainability and profitability coexist? 00:17:01.204 --> 00:17:02.924 Do they coexist today? 00:17:04.174 --> 00:17:08.284 How will they coexist in the future and what do we need to do to make that happen? 00:17:08.314 --> 00:17:10.674 So head on over to my LinkedIn page. 00:17:10.694 --> 00:17:12.664 I'm going to have a post out there. 00:17:12.684 --> 00:17:16.064 I'd love to hear from you and just see what you have to say. 00:17:16.464 --> 00:17:19.054 So thank you for listening to today's chemical show. 00:17:19.094 --> 00:17:21.744 Keep listening, keep following, keep sharing, and we will 00:17:21.744 --> 00:17:23.724 talk with you again soon. 00:17:28.756 --> 00:17:30.536 voiceover: We've come to the end of today's podcast. 00:17:30.946 --> 00:17:33.496 We hope you enjoyed your time with us and want to learn more. 00:17:33.905 --> 00:17:36.165 Simply visit thechemicalshow. 00:17:36.175 --> 00:17:38.925 com for additional information and helpful resources. 00:17:39.525 --> 00:17:43.635 Join us again next time here on The Chemical Show with Victoria Meyer.