WEBVTT

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Okay,

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welcome back to the thirty fourth

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episode of Tesla to Mars.

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Today we have a very special guest.

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He's called Cern Basher,

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and this is the first of

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many episodes to come

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because we're going to do a

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robot taxi countdown until

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the robot taxi starts

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rolling out in Austin, Texas.

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For today,

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we're going to start off with a

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video from Elon Musk.

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about the transatlantic

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trade union and then we'll

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dive straight into the

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episode and florian will be

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the host today of our

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session I I hope that um I

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hope that the united states

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and europe can establish a very close

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partnership.

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We obviously are there's an

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alliance already,

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but I'm hopeful that there

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can be a very close

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relationship with America and Europe.

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And I'm hopeful, for example,

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with the tariffs that that

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at the end of the day,

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I hope it is agreed that

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both Europe and the United

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States should move ideally, in my view,

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to a zero tariff situation,

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effectively creating a free

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trade zone between Europe

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and North America.

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And that would be my,

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that's what I hope occurs.

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I hope that... All right.

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Florian and Damian,

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can you tell us what we saw just now?

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Yeah, sure.

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In the video,

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he also talked that he

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suggested that to Trump.

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But one of the areas we are

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very passionate about in this podcast is,

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let's say, the Age of Abundance,

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which is Tesla's new mission.

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We always had Tesla's

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mission to accelerate the

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world to sustainable energy,

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and now it's working

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towards a sustainable abundance for all.

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which is, I think,

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more in line with the whole

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mosque economy that that

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has been created.

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So not only Tesla,

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the boric company and all

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the companies within within

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within that realm.

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And

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I think this transatlantic alliance,

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sort of new alliance

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between the US and Europe.

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First of all,

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I personally like that idea a lot,

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so I'm all in favor.

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But I think it's a big

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stepping stone towards sort

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of the golden era,

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age of abundance and

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revival of the West that we

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are seeing here.

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and today with uh with a

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guest from from overseas we

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thought well let's already

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take a step into that

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direction and uh and uh

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work towards um yeah

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working working more

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closely with uh with with

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people across across the

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world yeah so we're

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establishing our own

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transatlantic bridge over

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here so thanks cern for

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giving us the possibility to to do so

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um for today thank you for

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coming on um the last time

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we tried wasn't that

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successful due to

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technological difficulties

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from our end not your end

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for today I want to give

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the floor to florian and

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florian will be the

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asking the questions because

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we've looked at a lot of

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your content we've

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assembled some questions

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which we think are the best

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questions we could have

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asked in limited time and

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it will circle around a

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couple topics so the first

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topic will be robotaxi

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fleet operations and investment strategy

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The second topic will be a

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little bit more about

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Robotaxi unit economics and

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the business models.

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The third topic,

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Tesla's competitive

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position and future growth.

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And the fourth and final

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topic in our eyes is the

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most fun topic to discuss.

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And that's the Robotaxi revenue strategy,

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community governance.

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And Damian also already mentioned it,

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the age of abundance.

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So...

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Florian, the floor is yours.

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Maybe before we go there and

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just touch a little bit

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upon the point where we started, sir.

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And so we're trying to

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create a bridge from the US to Europe.

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We have a lot of European

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followers and a lot of

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engagement with European followers.

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Can you more or less paint

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us a picture from your

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point of view of like

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what's happening with the terrorists?

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Because here in the

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Netherlands and in Europe,

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it's fairly much driven by

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the mainstream media.

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So I think it would be good

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to get some input from

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somebody directly with a, I would say,

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crisp view on the

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a lot of things that are

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happening in the world.

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Sure.

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Yeah, I can attempt to do that.

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Let me also first add that

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we also have a

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trans-Pacific partnership

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going here today as well.

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I'm a New Zealand citizen.

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I grew up in Canada.

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I've lived in the US now for thirty years,

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so I'm a citizen of three countries.

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So let's extend this

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trans-Atlantic partnership

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to the Pacific as well.

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Great.

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All in.

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Yeah.

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New Zealand is a nation

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that's left out of discussion.

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So I'm forcibly including

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him here in this discussion today.

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You know,

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sometimes it's easier actually to

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see things clearly from

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outside the nation that you're in.

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So I'm curious about your

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guys' perspective on this

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whole tariff situation.

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But my perspective is that, you know,

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this is something that

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Trump has been thinking

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about now for forty years.

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Right now,

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people might question his

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ability to think deeply about this stuff,

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but make no mistake about it.

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He's been talking about

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trade imbalances now for forty years.

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He was on the Larry King show, you know,

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basically four years ago,

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Oprah Winfrey as well.

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Yeah, right.

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So, you know,

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this is an issue to the

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extent that tariffs and more importantly,

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probably non tariff trade

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barriers of all different kinds.

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And there's a.

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four-page list of the

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different types of

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non-tariff trade barriers

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that nations can throw at each other.

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And by the way, the U.S.

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is guilty of this as well.

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It's not like we don't throw

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up non-tariff trade

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barriers to all kinds of nations.

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We have a system of trade in

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the world right now that's far from free.

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Every country has carved out

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all kinds of protections

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for different types of groups.

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And so this, I suppose,

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is Trump's attempt at

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trying to address that.

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Will his strategy of making

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the world deal with this all at once,

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will that work out?

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Or is this too big of a lift?

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And I think that remains to be seen.

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I think most of us believe

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that Trump is a dealmaker.

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He's made deals before.

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He's renegotiated the US

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free trade agreement with

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Canada and Mexico in his first term.

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And his eyes made that better.

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And so how far is he willing

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to go with this, I think,

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is the question.

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And I don't have the answer on that.

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Time will tell.

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For me, it's, I think, also...

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the terrorists are sort of

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one of the levers that Trump is pulling.

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I also think that Elon is

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very closely involved into

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the thinking in this thing.

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Otherwise,

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you would not have Elon talk about

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this on this italian event

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and elon was already like

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meeting world leaders over

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the last four years right

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so he he he was a little

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bit um uh pre pre-rolling

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himself into this

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disposition already and in

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in our podcast we we we

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also followed initiatives

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around those very closely

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And, um,

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we talked about those being a sort

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of flywheel of, of five pillars.

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We'll touch to the flywheel

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later on because we have it

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structured in the, in the comments.

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Um, and it's, it's a very good topic,

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so it's not to steal it, but, uh,

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I would love to give the

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stage to Florian to start

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diving into the topics and

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then those will be amongst

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one of the talking points.

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Okay.

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Cool.

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Well, thank you, Kees.

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I think we're still in the

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introduction round.

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We would have loved to

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introduce you and invite

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you to our office where we normally sit,

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but due to technical reasons,

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we are not able to do that.

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But I thought that was kind

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of a good way to actually

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build the bridge already

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that we're trying to create.

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Um, I was actually born in Venezuela,

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so I'm South American by heart, uh,

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and by, by head and by my parents, I'm,

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uh, I'm Dutch.

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So, uh,

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I also would like to call me more

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of a global citizen than, uh,

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than a European.

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Um, and, uh,

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I think you guys touched upon

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something that, uh,

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Elon is talking about.

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Trump is talking about

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terrorists or for four years, I think.

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It all started also with Reagan.

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He also started this

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conversation to get in that

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time in the eighties to get

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from this progressive

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sixties and seventies to the eighties.

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And I think we are in the

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kind of similar kind of

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culture shift where we go

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from being woke to more right.

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So I think there are a lot

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of similar things happening

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in this world.

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Well,

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I just want to also explain a little

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bit about our background

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between CERN and iSELF.

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We approach each other on X,

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and it also shows the power of X.

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I think you sent out a

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valuation of Tesla in a

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beautiful report and I reacted to that.

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Thank you for this.

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And I used it for an

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inspiration in my

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management team to explain

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what the valuation could be.

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And you talked about a Tesla

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being worth a seventy two K

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if Robotaxi arrives.

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So we started this

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discussion about

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depreciation and our current model,

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et cetera.

00:10:48.493 --> 00:10:50.114
and um now we are here two

00:10:50.134 --> 00:10:51.254
years later and we're

00:10:51.274 --> 00:10:52.434
having big discussions with

00:10:52.455 --> 00:10:53.975
our funders about residual

00:10:53.995 --> 00:10:56.716
values and in sixty days

00:10:56.897 --> 00:10:58.197
there's another paradigm

00:10:58.437 --> 00:11:00.479
starting where uh tesla

00:11:00.519 --> 00:11:02.600
starting with their um with

00:11:02.620 --> 00:11:03.639
their robot taxi and

00:11:04.280 --> 00:11:05.480
residual values could could

00:11:05.500 --> 00:11:08.482
be turned around completely so um

00:11:10.138 --> 00:11:11.219
um we also discussed in that

00:11:11.239 --> 00:11:12.220
time that I went on a

00:11:12.279 --> 00:11:13.581
podcast with herbert and

00:11:13.600 --> 00:11:14.741
you watched that podcast

00:11:15.462 --> 00:11:16.563
and you said uh what an

00:11:16.604 --> 00:11:17.945
amazing story I would like

00:11:17.965 --> 00:11:19.626
to learn more about it and

00:11:19.706 --> 00:11:21.369
by the way I love that

00:11:21.389 --> 00:11:22.208
you're building a robot

00:11:22.250 --> 00:11:24.772
taxi fleet and by the way I

00:11:24.851 --> 00:11:25.472
already bought

00:11:28.197 --> 00:11:30.318
so I I replied yeah I also

00:11:30.359 --> 00:11:31.820
buy fifty or cyber trucks

00:11:31.879 --> 00:11:33.461
in private so we are doing

00:11:33.500 --> 00:11:35.662
the same thing that shows

00:11:35.682 --> 00:11:36.722
the power of x you know

00:11:36.743 --> 00:11:38.004
it's like there are totally

00:11:38.104 --> 00:11:39.605
different people around the

00:11:39.625 --> 00:11:40.566
world doing exactly the

00:11:40.605 --> 00:11:41.986
same thing and they're

00:11:42.006 --> 00:11:44.307
thinking the same so um it

00:11:44.327 --> 00:11:45.408
was a pleasure to meet you

00:11:45.428 --> 00:11:47.470
cern in that time and um I

00:11:47.490 --> 00:11:48.331
think the last two years

00:11:48.370 --> 00:11:49.591
we've been back and forth a

00:11:49.631 --> 00:11:51.974
lot trying to understand

00:11:52.413 --> 00:11:53.554
what this is actually doing

00:11:53.934 --> 00:11:54.836
and that this is actually

00:11:54.855 --> 00:11:56.157
building a robot taxi fleet

00:11:58.397 --> 00:11:59.878
And we also discussed of

00:11:59.918 --> 00:12:01.658
maybe becoming partners in the U.S.

00:12:01.878 --> 00:12:03.139
So we could bring our

00:12:03.198 --> 00:12:04.839
knowledge of Mr. Green to the U.S.

00:12:05.538 --> 00:12:08.500
and start together a Robotaxi fleet.

00:12:08.539 --> 00:12:11.740
So I think the core

00:12:11.780 --> 00:12:13.282
questions that we want to

00:12:13.322 --> 00:12:16.241
address here is around the

00:12:16.322 --> 00:12:17.423
Robotaxi business model.

00:12:18.648 --> 00:12:20.409
um and uh this is going to

00:12:20.429 --> 00:12:23.253
be our first episode in uh

00:12:23.273 --> 00:12:24.994
what we will call our

00:12:25.073 --> 00:12:26.836
countdown to robo taxi uh

00:12:27.937 --> 00:12:29.298
episode so we will we will

00:12:29.317 --> 00:12:31.059
do like ten episodes until

00:12:31.139 --> 00:12:33.282
june uh all talk about robo

00:12:33.302 --> 00:12:34.783
taxi so we will be happy to

00:12:34.822 --> 00:12:37.785
have you more and not only today but um

00:12:39.206 --> 00:12:40.408
We'd love to invite you for

00:12:40.847 --> 00:12:41.869
more episodes about this.

00:12:43.870 --> 00:12:45.951
If we don't manage to get

00:12:45.971 --> 00:12:47.491
all the questions answered today,

00:12:47.672 --> 00:12:49.433
we will have some other editions.

00:12:50.522 --> 00:12:51.663
You're actually the first

00:12:51.802 --> 00:12:54.725
one that actually has already a fleet,

00:12:54.885 --> 00:12:56.727
and now we're waiting for

00:12:56.748 --> 00:12:57.948
the moment that it can wake

00:12:58.028 --> 00:13:00.770
up and become a robot taxi fleet, right?

00:13:00.831 --> 00:13:02.852
So how is it right now for

00:13:02.893 --> 00:13:04.695
you to have sort of five

00:13:04.735 --> 00:13:07.157
thousand Teslas under your belt,

00:13:07.236 --> 00:13:09.259
but still waiting for that capability?

00:13:10.220 --> 00:13:11.681
I can imagine that sometimes

00:13:11.701 --> 00:13:12.662
you wake up in the middle

00:13:12.701 --> 00:13:13.543
of the night and think,

00:13:14.484 --> 00:13:15.605
when is it going to happen?

00:13:18.038 --> 00:13:19.359
Yeah, well, uh,

00:13:19.379 --> 00:13:20.299
we already building this

00:13:20.360 --> 00:13:22.100
fleet for ten years as of

00:13:22.181 --> 00:13:23.081
two thousand thirteen.

00:13:24.023 --> 00:13:26.904
So, um, I think patience is the core,

00:13:27.885 --> 00:13:30.047
core habit here or the core value.

00:13:30.327 --> 00:13:32.028
And, uh, I mean,

00:13:32.568 --> 00:13:35.711
patience will eventually pay out big time,

00:13:36.472 --> 00:13:38.734
um, when this future will happen.

00:13:38.833 --> 00:13:40.836
And I think we only need like.

00:13:41.563 --> 00:13:41.903
What is it?

00:13:41.943 --> 00:13:42.985
Forty five, sixty days,

00:13:43.024 --> 00:13:44.105
because we will see this

00:13:44.144 --> 00:13:45.706
future actually going to happen.

00:13:45.765 --> 00:13:48.668
So I'm happy.

00:13:48.768 --> 00:13:50.729
It's five.

00:13:51.489 --> 00:13:52.528
Is it one hundred percent of

00:13:52.548 --> 00:13:55.091
your fleet that is capable of FSD?

00:13:58.004 --> 00:14:00.966
Yeah, well, according to my theory,

00:14:01.206 --> 00:14:02.586
I think it's capable.

00:14:02.907 --> 00:14:05.048
According to Kay's theory, it's not.

00:14:06.309 --> 00:14:07.009
We're still having this

00:14:07.049 --> 00:14:08.630
discussion about whether

00:14:09.991 --> 00:14:11.452
V-III is also capable of

00:14:11.493 --> 00:14:13.094
becoming a robot taxi, yes or no.

00:14:14.375 --> 00:14:16.216
What's your picture on that, Cern?

00:14:16.235 --> 00:14:17.537
Do you think V-III is

00:14:17.576 --> 00:14:18.898
capable of becoming a robot taxi?

00:14:18.937 --> 00:14:22.421
Yeah, Hardware III versus Hardware IV.

00:14:22.461 --> 00:14:22.581
Yeah.

00:14:23.379 --> 00:14:25.041
yeah I think it's uh highly

00:14:25.100 --> 00:14:26.522
likely that something will

00:14:26.542 --> 00:14:27.383
need to be done there with

00:14:27.423 --> 00:14:29.504
the hardware but you know

00:14:29.543 --> 00:14:30.504
what the economics of

00:14:30.543 --> 00:14:32.686
robotaxi make it a slam

00:14:32.745 --> 00:14:35.547
dunk opportunity you would

00:14:35.586 --> 00:14:37.248
spend several thousand

00:14:37.288 --> 00:14:38.668
dollars upgrading the

00:14:38.708 --> 00:14:40.049
hardware perhaps even the

00:14:40.090 --> 00:14:41.010
cameras if you need to

00:14:41.750 --> 00:14:43.251
because the the revenue

00:14:43.331 --> 00:14:45.754
upside is enormous so

00:14:46.134 --> 00:14:47.835
whether it's capable on day one

00:14:48.606 --> 00:14:49.788
or not remains to be seen

00:14:50.008 --> 00:14:51.548
but it will be capable in

00:14:51.610 --> 00:14:52.850
fairly short order I think

00:14:52.890 --> 00:14:53.471
that would be pretty

00:14:53.510 --> 00:14:54.552
important for tesla to take

00:14:54.572 --> 00:14:56.854
care of and then florian

00:14:56.874 --> 00:14:58.195
just to comment on on what

00:14:58.215 --> 00:15:00.176
you've built I I see you

00:15:00.216 --> 00:15:01.456
right now as having

00:15:01.618 --> 00:15:02.697
essentially you know five

00:15:02.739 --> 00:15:03.798
thousand caterpillars

00:15:04.580 --> 00:15:05.461
waiting for the day they

00:15:05.480 --> 00:15:07.422
turn into butterflies and

00:15:07.442 --> 00:15:08.682
I'm not sure if the logo on

00:15:08.722 --> 00:15:10.284
the mr green on your shirt

00:15:10.325 --> 00:15:11.625
there is a butterfly but it

00:15:11.645 --> 00:15:13.147
looks like a lot from here

00:15:13.187 --> 00:15:14.307
like a butterfly taking flight

00:15:16.052 --> 00:15:17.253
Let's rebrand it that way.

00:15:17.873 --> 00:15:18.432
And CERN,

00:15:18.653 --> 00:15:21.355
if you would assign a probability

00:15:21.434 --> 00:15:24.895
to the fleet of Florian

00:15:24.916 --> 00:15:28.418
becoming a robot taxi fleet at this point,

00:15:28.498 --> 00:15:30.278
what would be your probability?

00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:32.019
Oh,

00:15:32.039 --> 00:15:34.341
I think Tesla has signaled a very clear

00:15:34.380 --> 00:15:36.621
intention about having

00:15:37.423 --> 00:15:40.043
non-Tesla owned vehicles in the fleet.

00:15:40.104 --> 00:15:40.884
They've certainly talked

00:15:40.903 --> 00:15:42.125
about individuals being

00:15:42.164 --> 00:15:44.105
able to put their vehicle in the fleet.

00:15:45.610 --> 00:15:46.091
And to me,

00:15:46.111 --> 00:15:48.092
then it makes extreme sense to

00:15:48.134 --> 00:15:51.996
have a enterprise doing the same thing.

00:15:53.398 --> 00:15:55.679
The nice thing about Mr. Green,

00:15:55.700 --> 00:15:56.159
for example,

00:15:56.179 --> 00:15:57.280
let's say they're rolling out

00:15:57.922 --> 00:15:59.423
a robo taxi network service

00:15:59.442 --> 00:16:00.023
across Europe.

00:16:00.803 --> 00:16:02.264
So you would sort of start

00:16:02.304 --> 00:16:03.927
maybe city by city or a few

00:16:03.966 --> 00:16:04.726
cities at once.

00:16:05.628 --> 00:16:06.249
When you start,

00:16:06.288 --> 00:16:07.168
you want to make sure that

00:16:07.188 --> 00:16:08.711
you've got enough vehicles

00:16:09.211 --> 00:16:11.072
in that market so that you

00:16:11.092 --> 00:16:12.433
can offer a proper service.

00:16:13.688 --> 00:16:16.090
And I think fleet operators like Mr. Green,

00:16:16.149 --> 00:16:16.450
I think,

00:16:16.809 --> 00:16:17.951
would be a great partner for

00:16:18.010 --> 00:16:19.951
Tesla in helping them roll

00:16:19.991 --> 00:16:22.533
it out across the continent.

00:16:23.253 --> 00:16:24.332
Same thing here in the US.

00:16:24.413 --> 00:16:28.934
And so that's really attractive, I think,

00:16:28.975 --> 00:16:30.196
for Tesla, because that's, you know,

00:16:30.216 --> 00:16:31.155
five thousand vehicles they

00:16:31.176 --> 00:16:33.376
don't have to make.

00:16:33.456 --> 00:16:35.057
At least initially, obviously, over time,

00:16:35.077 --> 00:16:35.638
they're going to make

00:16:35.717 --> 00:16:36.458
millions of vehicles,

00:16:36.538 --> 00:16:38.599
but the larger the fleet

00:16:39.120 --> 00:16:40.620
and the quicker you get to that size,

00:16:40.659 --> 00:16:41.421
the better off it's going

00:16:41.441 --> 00:16:42.100
to be for everybody.

00:16:43.125 --> 00:16:43.645
Yeah,

00:16:43.785 --> 00:16:45.787
it looks like that Tesla abandoned

00:16:46.126 --> 00:16:47.386
that idea a little bit of

00:16:48.908 --> 00:16:50.327
operating them themselves

00:16:50.488 --> 00:16:51.908
and more sort of open

00:16:51.969 --> 00:16:53.009
sourcing that whole fleet

00:16:53.048 --> 00:16:56.009
management idea to entrepreneurs.

00:16:56.029 --> 00:16:58.150
Yeah, and for me,

00:16:58.331 --> 00:16:59.270
that's a pretty obvious

00:16:59.311 --> 00:17:01.552
decision because the

00:17:01.572 --> 00:17:04.472
Robotaxi model is so profitable.

00:17:05.753 --> 00:17:07.034
If Tesla doesn't share it,

00:17:07.054 --> 00:17:07.814
they actually open

00:17:07.834 --> 00:17:08.954
themselves up to all kinds

00:17:08.974 --> 00:17:09.775
of political attack.

00:17:11.945 --> 00:17:12.185
Right.

00:17:12.346 --> 00:17:13.547
So in the U S you know,

00:17:13.626 --> 00:17:14.448
Trump is not going to

00:17:14.488 --> 00:17:15.428
remain in power forever.

00:17:16.608 --> 00:17:18.329
It's quite likely at some point, the,

00:17:18.349 --> 00:17:20.291
you know, the Democrats have,

00:17:20.571 --> 00:17:21.192
have a president.

00:17:21.251 --> 00:17:21.393
Right.

00:17:21.413 --> 00:17:22.413
And so you want to make sure

00:17:22.432 --> 00:17:23.153
that you've got enough

00:17:23.233 --> 00:17:25.154
constituents benefiting

00:17:25.214 --> 00:17:27.076
from this new powerful business model.

00:17:28.217 --> 00:17:29.218
It's very clear to me when I

00:17:29.238 --> 00:17:30.999
run the numbers, the Tesla only models,

00:17:31.078 --> 00:17:32.319
the most profitable by far,

00:17:32.839 --> 00:17:33.480
because they don't have to

00:17:33.500 --> 00:17:34.701
share the revenue with anybody.

00:17:36.022 --> 00:17:37.304
But from a, just a, you know,

00:17:37.364 --> 00:17:39.365
political monopolistic standpoint,

00:17:40.422 --> 00:17:41.604
Sharing that wealth around I

00:17:41.624 --> 00:17:43.047
think is going to be very important.

00:17:44.188 --> 00:17:44.709
And of course,

00:17:45.230 --> 00:17:47.614
with humanoid robots coming down the pipe,

00:17:47.634 --> 00:17:48.695
that's even more important

00:17:48.736 --> 00:17:49.376
than that scenario.

00:17:50.384 --> 00:17:52.046
yeah I think if you look

00:17:52.165 --> 00:17:53.426
look at the war chest now

00:17:53.446 --> 00:17:54.567
of Tesla as well they have

00:17:54.627 --> 00:17:56.288
like thirty billion plus on

00:17:56.328 --> 00:17:57.169
the on the balance sheet

00:17:57.209 --> 00:17:57.970
right so they have some

00:17:58.029 --> 00:17:59.550
capital to deploy there and

00:17:59.590 --> 00:18:00.672
I think it's it's better

00:18:00.971 --> 00:18:01.811
there's been a lot of

00:18:01.852 --> 00:18:03.733
discussion around it uh of

00:18:03.753 --> 00:18:04.913
how to use that capital

00:18:04.953 --> 00:18:06.295
maybe buy some stock Etc

00:18:06.315 --> 00:18:07.256
but I think most sense

00:18:07.296 --> 00:18:08.896
makes to put it where it

00:18:08.936 --> 00:18:09.998
makes the most money which

00:18:10.038 --> 00:18:10.958
is with robot taxi

00:18:11.097 --> 00:18:12.219
essentially are you looking

00:18:12.259 --> 00:18:13.500
at it from the same point of view sir

00:18:15.336 --> 00:18:15.616
Yeah,

00:18:16.257 --> 00:18:19.279
the capital expense of Robotaxi isn't

00:18:19.359 --> 00:18:20.320
so terrible because the

00:18:20.361 --> 00:18:21.121
vehicles are going to pay

00:18:21.141 --> 00:18:24.443
for themselves in about six months.

00:18:25.065 --> 00:18:26.766
So that's not too big of a deal.

00:18:27.586 --> 00:18:28.708
When I look at my models,

00:18:29.367 --> 00:18:30.388
Tesla is going to have an

00:18:30.409 --> 00:18:31.569
abundance of cash flow

00:18:31.630 --> 00:18:33.230
pretty quickly after

00:18:33.271 --> 00:18:34.251
Robotaxi is rolled out.

00:18:37.241 --> 00:18:38.482
I'm not in the camp that

00:18:38.522 --> 00:18:39.202
says that Tesla should

00:18:39.222 --> 00:18:40.503
start buying back stock today.

00:18:41.104 --> 00:18:41.324
I mean,

00:18:41.344 --> 00:18:42.744
certainly it would be nice for the

00:18:42.765 --> 00:18:43.265
stock price,

00:18:43.305 --> 00:18:44.425
but I think Tesla needs to

00:18:44.445 --> 00:18:45.346
make sure that they've got

00:18:45.405 --> 00:18:46.287
the financial resources

00:18:46.366 --> 00:18:48.688
necessary to invest in

00:18:49.127 --> 00:18:50.028
particularly compute.

00:18:50.989 --> 00:18:51.568
I think they're going to be

00:18:51.588 --> 00:18:52.630
spending a lot of money on

00:18:52.670 --> 00:18:56.951
that for the foreseeable future.

00:18:56.971 --> 00:18:57.632
We have an interesting

00:18:57.652 --> 00:18:58.853
question about that as well,

00:18:59.292 --> 00:19:00.413
the compute later on.

00:19:00.907 --> 00:19:02.169
And it also makes sense to

00:19:02.329 --> 00:19:04.050
open up this as a sort of

00:19:04.090 --> 00:19:05.633
business opportunity for

00:19:05.732 --> 00:19:08.056
people that are excited about this thing.

00:19:08.536 --> 00:19:10.238
If you look at the last two decades,

00:19:10.758 --> 00:19:11.679
the companies that have

00:19:11.719 --> 00:19:13.280
been winning Alibaba,

00:19:14.582 --> 00:19:16.324
let's say fun companies, Apple,

00:19:18.266 --> 00:19:20.326
Google, Amazon,

00:19:20.846 --> 00:19:22.407
and they all sort of open

00:19:22.468 --> 00:19:23.808
up a sort of ecosystem for

00:19:23.888 --> 00:19:25.210
entrepreneurs where they

00:19:25.509 --> 00:19:26.931
can work with AWS,

00:19:26.971 --> 00:19:28.451
but also the Amazon store,

00:19:28.932 --> 00:19:30.153
Google with SEO,

00:19:31.153 --> 00:19:33.535
Alibaba with buying and selling goods.

00:19:36.797 --> 00:19:40.078
I've been an Amazon seller

00:19:40.098 --> 00:19:41.098
for a couple of years,

00:19:41.619 --> 00:19:42.740
and I always thought about

00:19:42.779 --> 00:19:44.781
Jeff Bezos waking up every morning like,

00:19:44.821 --> 00:19:45.041
wow,

00:19:45.061 --> 00:19:46.663
how amazing is it that one million

00:19:46.742 --> 00:19:48.023
entrepreneurs wake up every

00:19:48.064 --> 00:19:51.005
day working as hard as they

00:19:51.045 --> 00:19:54.007
possibly can to actually

00:19:54.047 --> 00:19:55.228
grow your own business?

00:19:56.189 --> 00:19:57.489
So in Tesla's case,

00:19:57.528 --> 00:19:58.509
that's a really good point.

00:19:58.589 --> 00:19:59.431
In Tesla's case,

00:19:59.471 --> 00:20:00.951
the Robotaxi network is a

00:20:01.011 --> 00:20:03.113
platform for other services.

00:20:03.791 --> 00:20:05.472
everybody's focused on you

00:20:05.492 --> 00:20:07.434
know ride hailing and

00:20:07.454 --> 00:20:08.796
that's the first use case

00:20:08.976 --> 00:20:10.596
but it extends way beyond

00:20:10.636 --> 00:20:12.518
that to you know package

00:20:12.558 --> 00:20:14.380
delivery and all kinds of

00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:15.580
other services that can be

00:20:15.621 --> 00:20:16.821
delivered on a robo taxi

00:20:16.862 --> 00:20:19.344
network um this idea of

00:20:19.384 --> 00:20:20.624
having like a mobile office

00:20:20.663 --> 00:20:23.646
for example tesla again is

00:20:23.686 --> 00:20:24.707
like you said they're going

00:20:24.727 --> 00:20:25.768
to want to partner partner

00:20:25.788 --> 00:20:26.709
with entrepreneurs that

00:20:26.729 --> 00:20:27.829
have different ideas about

00:20:27.869 --> 00:20:29.891
how to you know put robo

00:20:29.931 --> 00:20:30.892
taxis in the world and

00:20:30.951 --> 00:20:31.972
offer additional services

00:20:33.068 --> 00:20:33.950
And we're still in the early

00:20:34.009 --> 00:20:34.851
innings of that.

00:20:34.951 --> 00:20:36.813
Like there's so many stuff

00:20:36.873 --> 00:20:39.796
that's still to be thought of.

00:20:39.855 --> 00:20:40.316
Like you,

00:20:40.375 --> 00:20:42.198
you can think of some services right now,

00:20:42.617 --> 00:20:44.200
but I think once it gets up

00:20:44.259 --> 00:20:47.563
and rolling up and running, then the,

00:20:47.603 --> 00:20:48.824
the creativity will flow.

00:20:49.785 --> 00:20:51.166
You could have a bar on wheels.

00:20:51.926 --> 00:20:52.126
Yeah.

00:20:52.627 --> 00:20:52.807
Right.

00:20:52.827 --> 00:20:53.548
You don't need to go to a

00:20:53.568 --> 00:20:55.049
bar anymore vehicle and

00:20:55.089 --> 00:20:55.810
drink if you want to.

00:20:55.851 --> 00:20:56.771
And it could be a, you know,

00:20:57.417 --> 00:20:58.337
unique experience wine

00:20:58.377 --> 00:20:59.439
tasting experience or

00:20:59.459 --> 00:21:00.778
something right that's the

00:21:00.838 --> 00:21:02.500
same that robert scobel

00:21:02.519 --> 00:21:05.621
said to us as service that

00:21:05.780 --> 00:21:07.102
I'm personally hoping for

00:21:07.142 --> 00:21:08.863
is that uh I can rent out

00:21:08.883 --> 00:21:10.403
my dog so my parents can

00:21:10.442 --> 00:21:11.763
just the dogs just walks in

00:21:11.784 --> 00:21:13.423
the cyber cap you know has

00:21:13.483 --> 00:21:14.525
a big can of food there

00:21:14.565 --> 00:21:15.505
where he walks in and he

00:21:15.525 --> 00:21:16.526
gets delivered to my

00:21:16.586 --> 00:21:18.006
parents that they can walk

00:21:18.026 --> 00:21:21.448
him out yeah many crazy

00:21:21.468 --> 00:21:22.407
things will occur and

00:21:24.577 --> 00:21:25.439
And a lot of people talk

00:21:25.459 --> 00:21:27.098
about sort of dojo as sort

00:21:27.118 --> 00:21:28.700
of AWS of Tesla.

00:21:28.759 --> 00:21:34.181
But this cyber cap and this

00:21:34.201 --> 00:21:36.922
whole robot taxi thing will

00:21:37.061 --> 00:21:38.021
open up so many

00:21:38.061 --> 00:21:39.021
opportunities for

00:21:39.102 --> 00:21:40.482
entrepreneurs all over the world.

00:21:40.843 --> 00:21:43.343
And I think that's to become a dead scale.

00:21:43.363 --> 00:21:44.584
It's only possible when you

00:21:44.624 --> 00:21:46.124
have thousands or millions

00:21:46.203 --> 00:21:49.085
of entrepreneurs waking up every day

00:21:49.890 --> 00:21:51.730
and using your your products

00:21:51.789 --> 00:21:53.371
and services to help their

00:21:54.230 --> 00:21:55.671
customers and grow together

00:21:56.830 --> 00:21:57.652
that's right and I think

00:21:57.692 --> 00:21:59.172
the cyber cab is the the

00:21:59.211 --> 00:22:00.592
vehicle that solves the

00:22:00.672 --> 00:22:01.672
transportation issue in

00:22:01.712 --> 00:22:02.573
terms of moving humans

00:22:02.613 --> 00:22:04.893
around but the robo van is

00:22:04.932 --> 00:22:06.073
the one that truly opens up

00:22:06.252 --> 00:22:07.334
business opportunities on

00:22:07.374 --> 00:22:09.913
this on this platform right

00:22:10.013 --> 00:22:10.834
you could have you know

00:22:10.874 --> 00:22:11.835
wedding parties use the

00:22:11.875 --> 00:22:12.815
robo van you could have

00:22:12.875 --> 00:22:13.894
kids use that instead of a

00:22:13.954 --> 00:22:14.875
school bus you could have

00:22:14.934 --> 00:22:16.756
pop-up stores pop-up

00:22:16.816 --> 00:22:18.256
restaurants pop-up bars

00:22:20.047 --> 00:22:21.387
Food trucks, all that stuff.

00:22:21.768 --> 00:22:25.529
Yeah, with a larger vehicle.

00:22:26.171 --> 00:22:27.290
Are you more excited about

00:22:27.352 --> 00:22:30.594
that van or the cab?

00:22:30.653 --> 00:22:32.515
Or is it a sort of equal big

00:22:32.555 --> 00:22:34.536
opportunity in your eyes?

00:22:35.176 --> 00:22:35.356
Yeah,

00:22:35.436 --> 00:22:37.417
I'm excited about the entire platform

00:22:37.438 --> 00:22:38.659
and what that provides.

00:22:39.578 --> 00:22:40.500
I actually think that one

00:22:40.539 --> 00:22:42.240
day the transport of humans

00:22:42.260 --> 00:22:43.541
could actually be almost free.

00:22:44.883 --> 00:22:46.344
That Tesla and its partners

00:22:46.384 --> 00:22:47.243
will make their money on

00:22:47.263 --> 00:22:48.065
these other services.

00:22:49.809 --> 00:22:50.789
But initially, obviously,

00:22:50.829 --> 00:22:52.250
the ride share part is significant.

00:22:52.270 --> 00:22:53.951
The revenue stream from that will be huge.

00:22:55.771 --> 00:22:57.352
But I think like a lot of things,

00:22:57.751 --> 00:23:00.732
like when Amazon opened up,

00:23:00.752 --> 00:23:01.693
you couldn't have imagined

00:23:01.713 --> 00:23:02.834
what Amazon could become.

00:23:03.993 --> 00:23:04.914
And I think it's the same

00:23:04.954 --> 00:23:06.555
thing with this platform.

00:23:07.095 --> 00:23:08.655
We can see now some ideas.

00:23:08.675 --> 00:23:09.355
We're talking about some

00:23:09.415 --> 00:23:11.176
ideas that what it could offer,

00:23:11.196 --> 00:23:12.517
but there's probably a

00:23:12.557 --> 00:23:13.376
thousand things that we're

00:23:13.396 --> 00:23:14.577
not thinking of.

00:23:15.357 --> 00:23:15.478
Yeah.

00:23:16.003 --> 00:23:16.544
Yeah.

00:23:16.564 --> 00:23:17.846
I also remember that story

00:23:17.885 --> 00:23:19.227
with Jeff Bezos with,

00:23:19.346 --> 00:23:21.048
when he bought a warehouse

00:23:21.067 --> 00:23:22.288
that was way too big for

00:23:22.308 --> 00:23:23.529
the capabilities or the

00:23:23.569 --> 00:23:25.571
things that Amazon had at the,

00:23:25.751 --> 00:23:26.613
at a certain point,

00:23:26.633 --> 00:23:28.513
they just had one hundred,

00:23:28.815 --> 00:23:30.195
one percent of one hundred

00:23:31.176 --> 00:23:32.357
of the space being used for

00:23:32.438 --> 00:23:33.939
Amazon there themselves.

00:23:35.420 --> 00:23:38.182
So they, so they approached Toys R Us to,

00:23:38.282 --> 00:23:39.083
to, to get in.

00:23:39.262 --> 00:23:42.405
And from there on that, that whole yeah,

00:23:43.290 --> 00:23:44.873
fly view of third party

00:23:44.913 --> 00:23:46.974
sellers came across.

00:23:48.776 --> 00:23:50.317
But that was also not like a

00:23:50.357 --> 00:23:53.260
very well thought out business move.

00:23:54.080 --> 00:23:56.284
It was just happened to become that way.

00:23:58.496 --> 00:23:59.056
And for me,

00:23:59.355 --> 00:24:01.037
we talked a lot about sort of

00:24:01.116 --> 00:24:02.317
technology adoption.

00:24:02.416 --> 00:24:04.817
So with software, for example,

00:24:04.877 --> 00:24:05.657
with WhatsApp,

00:24:06.097 --> 00:24:08.518
the adoption was like two

00:24:08.557 --> 00:24:10.239
years before getting to one

00:24:10.278 --> 00:24:11.219
billion users.

00:24:11.739 --> 00:24:12.999
But this business has a sort

00:24:13.019 --> 00:24:14.799
of big physical aspect in

00:24:14.880 --> 00:24:18.660
it since it still has to be manufactured.

00:24:19.760 --> 00:24:20.280
Do you think

00:24:22.520 --> 00:24:23.701
Do you think to get to sort

00:24:23.740 --> 00:24:25.481
of enormous skills,

00:24:25.662 --> 00:24:27.442
Tesla will expand on their

00:24:27.542 --> 00:24:29.343
own capabilities to manufacture?

00:24:29.982 --> 00:24:32.284
But do you think there will

00:24:32.304 --> 00:24:33.684
be cybercaps from different

00:24:33.704 --> 00:24:36.326
brands at a certain point?

00:24:36.766 --> 00:24:37.046
Yeah,

00:24:37.066 --> 00:24:38.145
I think if you would have asked me a

00:24:38.205 --> 00:24:38.645
year ago,

00:24:38.705 --> 00:24:39.747
I think I would have said I'm

00:24:39.787 --> 00:24:40.586
hopeful that other

00:24:40.626 --> 00:24:41.886
manufacturers will partner

00:24:41.906 --> 00:24:44.587
with Tesla in some way and

00:24:44.627 --> 00:24:45.669
provide different vehicles

00:24:45.749 --> 00:24:46.749
and be a part of this.

00:24:47.328 --> 00:24:48.710
If you ask me the same question today,

00:24:48.769 --> 00:24:50.049
I'm less hopeful on that.

00:24:51.174 --> 00:24:52.635
which I suppose, financially speaking,

00:24:52.675 --> 00:24:53.777
may be better for Tesla,

00:24:54.557 --> 00:24:56.460
but I think it spells the

00:24:56.500 --> 00:24:58.101
likely death of many automakers,

00:24:58.842 --> 00:24:59.461
unfortunately.

00:25:01.163 --> 00:25:02.304
Now, maybe it's not too late,

00:25:03.025 --> 00:25:05.207
but it's going to take a while, I think,

00:25:05.247 --> 00:25:07.648
for other automakers to

00:25:07.808 --> 00:25:09.309
engineer FSD into their vehicles.

00:25:09.349 --> 00:25:10.191
It's not just, you know,

00:25:10.211 --> 00:25:10.932
you don't slap on the

00:25:10.971 --> 00:25:12.472
cameras and put the hardware in the car.

00:25:13.354 --> 00:25:14.394
For most of them,

00:25:14.494 --> 00:25:15.596
it will be too late already.

00:25:16.755 --> 00:25:17.295
Yeah,

00:25:17.394 --> 00:25:18.955
and this is something we also talk

00:25:18.976 --> 00:25:22.457
about a lot is we have this

00:25:22.477 --> 00:25:24.377
thesis that Tesla is

00:25:25.098 --> 00:25:26.118
currently eating one

00:25:26.159 --> 00:25:27.019
hundred percent of the

00:25:27.058 --> 00:25:28.579
profits of the EV market

00:25:29.140 --> 00:25:30.280
because nobody is making

00:25:30.340 --> 00:25:31.381
EVs at a profit yet.

00:25:31.401 --> 00:25:31.540
Right.

00:25:32.862 --> 00:25:34.102
Let alone being on the verge

00:25:34.142 --> 00:25:35.563
of launching cybercaps.

00:25:35.603 --> 00:25:36.462
And I think this is

00:25:37.463 --> 00:25:38.344
something very much

00:25:38.784 --> 00:25:40.444
appreciated in the market

00:25:40.464 --> 00:25:41.545
that actually nobody is

00:25:41.605 --> 00:25:42.806
making money on EVs.

00:25:44.248 --> 00:25:45.929
The capabilities of EVs are

00:25:45.969 --> 00:25:46.929
much better than ICE

00:25:46.949 --> 00:25:49.108
vehicles already at this point.

00:25:50.549 --> 00:25:51.990
And everybody's selling at a loss.

00:25:52.029 --> 00:25:54.211
So Tesla is competing

00:25:54.270 --> 00:25:55.590
against companies that are

00:25:55.790 --> 00:25:57.070
loss making at this moment.

00:25:57.111 --> 00:26:01.772
So how long is that bubble still?

00:26:05.773 --> 00:26:07.054
The analogy for me is that

00:26:07.074 --> 00:26:09.595
you've got farmers tilling

00:26:09.615 --> 00:26:10.394
the field by hand.

00:26:11.525 --> 00:26:13.205
And you've got a company that's invented,

00:26:13.266 --> 00:26:13.526
you know,

00:26:13.566 --> 00:26:15.046
horses that till the field and

00:26:15.066 --> 00:26:15.506
it's better.

00:26:16.165 --> 00:26:17.346
But the game is not even that.

00:26:17.426 --> 00:26:18.946
Now you've got a company making tractors.

00:26:19.487 --> 00:26:20.928
So the original farmers are

00:26:20.968 --> 00:26:22.067
trying to catch up to the

00:26:22.188 --> 00:26:22.948
guys with horses.

00:26:24.048 --> 00:26:25.229
But their game is actually

00:26:25.249 --> 00:26:26.308
in tractors and no one's

00:26:26.410 --> 00:26:27.430
really recognizing that yet.

00:26:27.450 --> 00:26:30.570
It's a good way to paint the

00:26:30.611 --> 00:26:31.111
picture indeed.

00:26:31.131 --> 00:26:33.491
Tesla's so far ahead, right?

00:26:34.491 --> 00:26:35.731
If they can pop out a cyber

00:26:35.771 --> 00:26:37.053
cab every five seconds out

00:26:37.073 --> 00:26:38.952
of their factory, I mean,

00:26:38.972 --> 00:26:40.273
the other automakers are

00:26:40.374 --> 00:26:41.153
just dead in the water.

00:26:41.782 --> 00:26:44.567
There's lightning fast, by the way.

00:26:44.606 --> 00:26:46.048
And millions of tractors

00:26:46.190 --> 00:26:47.932
entering the road very soon.

00:26:47.951 --> 00:26:49.634
Yeah.

00:26:49.714 --> 00:26:50.435
Let's see.

00:26:50.476 --> 00:26:51.938
Before we hijack the whole

00:26:51.978 --> 00:26:53.800
meeting with all kinds of sidesteps,

00:26:54.080 --> 00:26:55.503
and there are millions with Tesla,

00:26:55.864 --> 00:26:56.285
Florian.

00:26:57.967 --> 00:26:58.707
Yeah, thank you, Kenny.

00:27:00.228 --> 00:27:02.750
I was hoping to ask you some

00:27:02.789 --> 00:27:03.970
questions as well, Cern,

00:27:04.009 --> 00:27:06.291
about actually what we've

00:27:06.311 --> 00:27:07.392
been talking about in the

00:27:07.412 --> 00:27:08.133
last ten minutes.

00:27:08.173 --> 00:27:11.075
But I think the core of the

00:27:11.115 --> 00:27:12.174
questions are like,

00:27:13.415 --> 00:27:14.415
if you are an entrepreneur,

00:27:14.696 --> 00:27:16.597
if you are seeing this happening,

00:27:17.337 --> 00:27:18.318
what are the possibilities

00:27:18.358 --> 00:27:19.358
for you as an entrepreneur?

00:27:19.479 --> 00:27:22.701
So what I would like to ask you is,

00:27:24.162 --> 00:27:26.222
what's the difference in roy

00:27:26.462 --> 00:27:28.242
between buying a used tesla

00:27:29.104 --> 00:27:33.305
versus um versus a cybercap

00:27:33.644 --> 00:27:35.746
for example so if you're an

00:27:35.806 --> 00:27:36.925
entrepreneur right now you

00:27:36.945 --> 00:27:39.126
will you are um you're

00:27:39.166 --> 00:27:40.367
seeing what elon is doing

00:27:40.428 --> 00:27:41.288
you're you have the

00:27:41.327 --> 00:27:42.367
ambition to become a

00:27:42.548 --> 00:27:44.388
shepherd what would you

00:27:44.449 --> 00:27:45.648
advise him would you advise

00:27:45.669 --> 00:27:47.750
him to buy a secondhand

00:27:47.789 --> 00:27:49.750
tesla or would you say no

00:27:50.250 --> 00:27:53.352
please wait and um and buy a cybercap

00:27:55.105 --> 00:27:56.047
Yeah, that's a good question.

00:27:56.067 --> 00:27:58.828
I have theorized that the

00:27:58.888 --> 00:28:00.430
value of a secondhand Tesla

00:28:00.450 --> 00:28:02.771
goes up dramatically once

00:28:02.811 --> 00:28:04.012
the Robotaxi network is in

00:28:04.053 --> 00:28:05.173
operation because you're

00:28:05.253 --> 00:28:07.096
turning a depreciating

00:28:07.135 --> 00:28:08.876
machine now into a money-making machine.

00:28:09.397 --> 00:28:10.598
You've fundamentally changed

00:28:10.659 --> 00:28:11.558
what that vehicle is.

00:28:12.819 --> 00:28:14.821
So there is an opportunity, I think,

00:28:15.001 --> 00:28:17.884
to purchase Tesla vehicles

00:28:18.125 --> 00:28:20.846
secondhand that are FSD capable

00:28:22.333 --> 00:28:24.736
um with purchased fsd again

00:28:24.776 --> 00:28:25.876
tesla has said that they'll

00:28:25.916 --> 00:28:27.758
make whole those those

00:28:28.318 --> 00:28:29.299
those folks right if you've

00:28:29.319 --> 00:28:30.681
got purchased fsd in your

00:28:30.701 --> 00:28:34.144
car um that they'll you

00:28:34.163 --> 00:28:35.005
know they'll make it

00:28:35.305 --> 00:28:36.967
robotaxi ready now whether

00:28:37.007 --> 00:28:38.387
it's ai five chip remains

00:28:38.407 --> 00:28:39.249
to be seen maybe it might

00:28:39.269 --> 00:28:39.990
be something else but

00:28:40.009 --> 00:28:41.431
either way it'll be able to

00:28:41.451 --> 00:28:43.834
be a money-making machine

00:28:43.874 --> 00:28:45.414
so that seems like a pretty

00:28:45.454 --> 00:28:46.236
reasonable way to go

00:28:48.084 --> 00:28:49.223
And the nice thing about the

00:28:49.263 --> 00:28:50.665
existing Tesla vehicles is

00:28:50.685 --> 00:28:52.287
you can carry more than two passengers.

00:28:53.768 --> 00:28:53.928
Now,

00:28:54.167 --> 00:28:55.548
maybe there are some other issues that

00:28:55.588 --> 00:28:57.171
we haven't thought of yet in terms of,

00:28:57.351 --> 00:28:57.510
you know,

00:28:57.530 --> 00:28:58.551
what happens if somebody leaves

00:28:58.571 --> 00:29:00.133
the door open and stuff like that, right?

00:29:00.153 --> 00:29:01.013
Whereas the cyber cab,

00:29:01.614 --> 00:29:02.654
that happens automatically.

00:29:05.978 --> 00:29:08.019
If Tesla does make good on

00:29:08.038 --> 00:29:09.359
their promise to sell cyber

00:29:09.380 --> 00:29:12.323
cabs to people, sure,

00:29:12.383 --> 00:29:14.884
they can make the car for, what,

00:29:14.924 --> 00:29:15.845
twenty thousand dollars,

00:29:15.884 --> 00:29:16.685
twenty five thousand?

00:29:17.599 --> 00:29:19.079
What are they going to sell it to you for?

00:29:20.101 --> 00:29:20.740
I don't think they're going

00:29:20.760 --> 00:29:21.461
to sell it to you for

00:29:21.480 --> 00:29:22.540
twenty five thousand dollars.

00:29:22.881 --> 00:29:24.122
Why would you sell a money

00:29:24.162 --> 00:29:25.402
making machine so cheaply?

00:29:27.083 --> 00:29:29.803
So I think the lower risk

00:29:29.843 --> 00:29:31.284
opportunity probably is to

00:29:31.403 --> 00:29:32.963
pick up some used Teslas

00:29:32.983 --> 00:29:34.325
that are robo taxi ready.

00:29:35.724 --> 00:29:37.125
Because it's unclear to me

00:29:37.184 --> 00:29:38.246
what the cyber cab will

00:29:38.286 --> 00:29:39.145
actually be sold for.

00:29:42.567 --> 00:29:43.528
I believe there are some

00:29:43.627 --> 00:29:44.948
orders already placed for

00:29:45.169 --> 00:29:47.128
cybercaps by the bigger fleet owners,

00:29:47.769 --> 00:29:49.590
which is not made out in the open yet,

00:29:49.651 --> 00:29:50.911
but I think they're already

00:29:50.990 --> 00:29:52.491
opening up for orders.

00:29:54.432 --> 00:29:55.333
If that would be the case,

00:29:55.373 --> 00:29:58.855
it would also go to Mr. Green, right?

00:29:59.095 --> 00:30:04.557
Cern, would you think that the use case of,

00:30:04.676 --> 00:30:05.278
let's say,

00:30:05.337 --> 00:30:06.817
the existing fleet and the

00:30:06.877 --> 00:30:08.078
cybercap is different?

00:30:08.891 --> 00:30:10.632
So even talked about the

00:30:10.692 --> 00:30:13.755
Airbnb model for sort of

00:30:13.934 --> 00:30:15.736
mix between Airbnb and Uber.

00:30:16.517 --> 00:30:17.758
It seems that the cyber cap

00:30:17.798 --> 00:30:19.459
is sort of the more on the

00:30:19.578 --> 00:30:22.161
Uber side and the ride

00:30:22.181 --> 00:30:22.981
hailing seems to be a

00:30:23.021 --> 00:30:24.722
little bit more on the Airbnb side.

00:30:24.762 --> 00:30:25.083
Do you,

00:30:25.303 --> 00:30:26.784
do you think there's a difference there?

00:30:28.526 --> 00:30:29.527
Yes, there is.

00:30:29.547 --> 00:30:29.866
I mean,

00:30:30.007 --> 00:30:33.509
I think that ultimately I think

00:30:33.549 --> 00:30:34.789
we'll have very specific

00:30:34.829 --> 00:30:36.612
vehicles for very specific use cases.

00:30:38.253 --> 00:30:38.574
Right.

00:30:38.594 --> 00:30:39.094
So for example,

00:30:39.114 --> 00:30:39.855
just to expand the

00:30:39.954 --> 00:30:41.195
conversation to the cyber truck,

00:30:41.736 --> 00:30:42.455
every now and then it's

00:30:42.556 --> 00:30:43.557
really handy to have a

00:30:43.596 --> 00:30:45.257
truck to haul stuff around.

00:30:45.857 --> 00:30:46.557
Yeah.

00:30:46.678 --> 00:30:46.798
Right.

00:30:46.897 --> 00:30:47.979
My mom just recently got a

00:30:48.019 --> 00:30:49.019
new big screen TV.

00:30:49.640 --> 00:30:50.660
Couldn't fit that in my car.

00:30:51.820 --> 00:30:52.820
It wouldn't fit in the Model Y,

00:30:52.861 --> 00:30:53.761
but it fit beautifully in

00:30:53.781 --> 00:30:54.382
the cyber truck.

00:30:54.422 --> 00:30:55.982
So there's all kinds of use

00:30:56.002 --> 00:30:56.782
cases where you want

00:30:56.823 --> 00:30:58.324
different form factors for vehicles.

00:30:58.864 --> 00:31:00.305
In terms of moving people around,

00:31:00.345 --> 00:31:02.145
the cyber cab's perfect for, let's say,

00:31:02.205 --> 00:31:03.866
ninety percent of the needs

00:31:03.886 --> 00:31:04.527
that people have.

00:31:05.757 --> 00:31:06.678
But you do need other

00:31:06.698 --> 00:31:08.038
vehicles in the fleet to

00:31:08.077 --> 00:31:09.179
provide that optionality

00:31:09.219 --> 00:31:11.160
for larger group sizes or

00:31:11.259 --> 00:31:12.421
to carry certain things.

00:31:13.740 --> 00:31:14.922
And so that's going to be important.

00:31:16.383 --> 00:31:17.544
I also think that, by the way,

00:31:17.604 --> 00:31:19.464
that the amount of revenue

00:31:19.484 --> 00:31:21.486
you get for carrying three

00:31:21.506 --> 00:31:22.346
or four people should be

00:31:22.385 --> 00:31:23.247
more than what you would

00:31:23.267 --> 00:31:24.366
get if you carry just two people.

00:31:24.386 --> 00:31:26.127
Definitely.

00:31:26.469 --> 00:31:28.869
There comes the Model Y. Yeah.

00:31:29.644 --> 00:31:31.005
so if I understand you

00:31:31.045 --> 00:31:32.945
correctly a certain um if

00:31:32.965 --> 00:31:33.826
an entrepreneur wants to

00:31:33.865 --> 00:31:35.185
start becoming a shepherd

00:31:35.246 --> 00:31:36.307
it doesn't really matter if

00:31:36.346 --> 00:31:37.787
he starts with a used tesla

00:31:38.846 --> 00:31:40.127
um because the residual

00:31:40.147 --> 00:31:41.167
value of that car will

00:31:41.248 --> 00:31:42.827
eventually increase to a

00:31:42.928 --> 00:31:45.588
certain amount which is

00:31:45.628 --> 00:31:46.828
good enough for him to take

00:31:46.848 --> 00:31:50.450
that risk um but there he

00:31:50.470 --> 00:31:52.851
could also wait and see

00:31:52.951 --> 00:31:54.131
what this is going to offer

00:31:54.171 --> 00:31:55.971
with the cyber cap but if I

00:31:56.010 --> 00:31:57.031
listen to you correctly you

00:31:57.051 --> 00:31:58.291
don't think that tesla will

00:32:00.973 --> 00:32:01.734
They have been telling that

00:32:01.775 --> 00:32:03.655
they would like to offer

00:32:03.675 --> 00:32:07.698
them for like thirty K. So

00:32:07.938 --> 00:32:09.659
are you saying that you

00:32:09.679 --> 00:32:10.398
don't think that they're

00:32:10.419 --> 00:32:11.318
going to offer it for thirty K?

00:32:13.079 --> 00:32:14.980
Well, just think about this, though,

00:32:15.141 --> 00:32:16.201
if you offer a vehicle for

00:32:16.241 --> 00:32:20.084
thirty K and that vehicle can make.

00:32:20.124 --> 00:32:20.624
That's to say,

00:32:20.683 --> 00:32:23.384
ninety thousand dollars a year.

00:32:23.404 --> 00:32:24.526
You've undersold the vehicle now,

00:32:24.546 --> 00:32:24.826
of course,

00:32:24.846 --> 00:32:26.086
Tesla can make some of this up

00:32:26.185 --> 00:32:27.166
by taking some of the

00:32:27.186 --> 00:32:28.567
revenue from Robotaxi,

00:32:28.607 --> 00:32:29.208
which they will do.

00:32:30.430 --> 00:32:32.231
So there's two things at play, right?

00:32:32.251 --> 00:32:33.271
There's the value of the car

00:32:33.291 --> 00:32:35.734
and what the car is worth, right,

00:32:36.174 --> 00:32:37.195
as a money-making machine.

00:32:37.215 --> 00:32:37.736
And then, of course,

00:32:37.756 --> 00:32:38.717
there's Tesla's take rate

00:32:38.777 --> 00:32:41.499
on the revenue from the operation of it.

00:32:41.538 --> 00:32:42.881
So in theory,

00:32:42.941 --> 00:32:44.862
I guess they could sell the car cheaply,

00:32:45.742 --> 00:32:46.304
but then they're going to

00:32:46.324 --> 00:32:47.443
have a much higher take

00:32:47.505 --> 00:32:52.348
rate on the Robotaxi revenue, right?

00:32:52.388 --> 00:32:53.470
And it's the same issue with

00:32:53.690 --> 00:32:54.651
the cost of the FSD.

00:32:56.008 --> 00:32:56.969
know on one hand you could

00:32:57.009 --> 00:32:58.348
say fsd should be worth a

00:32:58.409 --> 00:32:59.509
lot because of what it can

00:32:59.549 --> 00:33:00.569
do it turns something into

00:33:00.589 --> 00:33:02.451
a money making machine on

00:33:02.471 --> 00:33:03.571
the other hand you could

00:33:03.652 --> 00:33:04.612
argue that well they should

00:33:05.032 --> 00:33:06.973
sell fsd really cheaply for

00:33:07.054 --> 00:33:08.913
individual use but when you

00:33:08.974 --> 00:33:10.174
put your vehicle in the

00:33:10.194 --> 00:33:12.036
robo taxi network they

00:33:12.056 --> 00:33:13.096
should get a higher

00:33:13.737 --> 00:33:14.916
percentage of the revenue

00:33:14.957 --> 00:33:16.417
because you're using fsd

00:33:16.438 --> 00:33:17.159
that they've developed

00:33:17.199 --> 00:33:18.719
which is very valuable and

00:33:18.739 --> 00:33:19.880
you're making money off of that

00:33:21.148 --> 00:33:21.970
So I guess they've got

00:33:22.009 --> 00:33:23.631
different levers to pull, Florian,

00:33:23.851 --> 00:33:24.791
in terms of how they do it.

00:33:24.872 --> 00:33:26.073
So I suppose they could sell

00:33:26.093 --> 00:33:27.673
the cyber cab cheaply if they wanted to.

00:33:29.295 --> 00:33:30.035
Yeah, indeed.

00:33:31.175 --> 00:33:33.037
So that's also my follow up

00:33:33.076 --> 00:33:33.837
question is like,

00:33:34.999 --> 00:33:36.059
does it really matter if

00:33:36.099 --> 00:33:37.941
you buy a used car or a new

00:33:37.980 --> 00:33:40.403
car if you are going to

00:33:40.442 --> 00:33:41.723
build like a fleet of cars

00:33:41.763 --> 00:33:42.804
which you will put on the

00:33:42.844 --> 00:33:44.164
robo taxi fleet on the on

00:33:44.204 --> 00:33:45.185
the robo taxi network?

00:33:46.467 --> 00:33:48.468
Yeah, I think if you are building a fleet,

00:33:48.508 --> 00:33:50.650
you probably want to sort of

00:33:51.576 --> 00:33:52.776
have a term structure, I guess,

00:33:52.855 --> 00:33:53.497
of vehicles, right?

00:33:53.517 --> 00:33:54.477
You want some older ones,

00:33:54.497 --> 00:33:55.297
you want some newer ones,

00:33:55.317 --> 00:33:56.637
and you kind of want to turn them over,

00:33:57.438 --> 00:33:57.657
right?

00:33:57.698 --> 00:33:58.458
And so you've kind of got

00:33:58.478 --> 00:34:00.259
this fleet that's, you know,

00:34:00.318 --> 00:34:02.539
not all one year, right?

00:34:02.579 --> 00:34:03.619
Let's say you want vehicles

00:34:03.660 --> 00:34:04.259
that maybe have been

00:34:04.299 --> 00:34:05.421
produced over the last, you know,

00:34:05.461 --> 00:34:08.222
five or six years, right?

00:34:08.262 --> 00:34:09.202
And then the ones that are

00:34:09.242 --> 00:34:10.302
older wear out and you

00:34:10.322 --> 00:34:12.143
replace those with a newer

00:34:12.163 --> 00:34:13.003
batch of vehicles.

00:34:13.864 --> 00:34:14.963
But I do think that there

00:34:15.003 --> 00:34:16.304
may be a nice opportunity

00:34:16.724 --> 00:34:19.726
with used Teslas that have purchased FSD.

00:34:20.697 --> 00:34:21.356
Because right now,

00:34:21.416 --> 00:34:24.579
when you buy those in the used car market,

00:34:25.159 --> 00:34:26.340
there is not much of a premium,

00:34:26.481 --> 00:34:27.181
if anything,

00:34:28.101 --> 00:34:29.463
for having FSD that's part of

00:34:29.483 --> 00:34:29.842
the vehicle.

00:34:31.092 --> 00:34:32.014
The market doesn't

00:34:32.173 --> 00:34:34.155
appreciate this or price this in.

00:34:35.074 --> 00:34:36.275
And you see that from an

00:34:36.376 --> 00:34:37.717
analyst point of view as well.

00:34:38.157 --> 00:34:40.257
Nobody really prices in the

00:34:40.297 --> 00:34:41.679
robot actually revenues from it.

00:34:42.139 --> 00:34:44.019
But are you saying that if

00:34:44.039 --> 00:34:46.402
you have a used Tesla, you bought FSD,

00:34:46.442 --> 00:34:48.262
that the money you paid for

00:34:48.422 --> 00:34:51.523
FSD is not something

00:34:51.965 --> 00:34:53.686
current sellers getting back?

00:34:54.326 --> 00:34:56.206
Correct.

00:34:56.246 --> 00:34:56.567
Okay.

00:34:57.067 --> 00:34:59.568
That's already an interesting one.

00:34:59.708 --> 00:34:59.789
Yeah.

00:35:01.503 --> 00:35:03.344
And particularly if Tesla

00:35:03.643 --> 00:35:04.643
makes good on their promise

00:35:04.684 --> 00:35:05.903
to upgrade those vehicles

00:35:06.123 --> 00:35:06.925
to whatever hardware is

00:35:06.985 --> 00:35:08.704
necessary to make them robotaxi ready.

00:35:09.746 --> 00:35:10.726
And I think they will do

00:35:10.746 --> 00:35:13.045
that because if you look at

00:35:13.086 --> 00:35:14.487
the revenue upside,

00:35:16.327 --> 00:35:19.327
just a simple hardware adjustment,

00:35:20.188 --> 00:35:21.608
even though it might prove

00:35:21.648 --> 00:35:22.548
difficult because of the

00:35:22.588 --> 00:35:24.489
form factor issues and stuff like that,

00:35:25.170 --> 00:35:25.969
it will make sense.

00:35:26.409 --> 00:35:27.931
It will justify the investment.

00:35:28.797 --> 00:35:29.378
Oh, I think so.

00:35:29.398 --> 00:35:30.478
And even if Tesla didn't,

00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:31.599
I think the individual

00:35:31.699 --> 00:35:33.061
owner would justify their

00:35:33.081 --> 00:35:33.981
investment of a couple of

00:35:34.081 --> 00:35:35.342
three thousand dollars themselves.

00:35:35.362 --> 00:35:35.483
Yeah.

00:35:35.523 --> 00:35:35.784
Yeah.

00:35:39.152 --> 00:35:39.414
Cern,

00:35:39.454 --> 00:35:41.614
like an underlying question that I

00:35:41.655 --> 00:35:43.456
have comes from the following.

00:35:43.516 --> 00:35:45.557
So Damien and I have been

00:35:45.597 --> 00:35:47.619
buying Amazon businesses as

00:35:47.659 --> 00:35:48.960
well over the last couple of years.

00:35:49.699 --> 00:35:51.041
And I still vividly remember

00:35:51.081 --> 00:35:53.503
a couple of guys coming on

00:35:53.523 --> 00:35:55.443
the call and I said, well, you did great.

00:35:55.463 --> 00:35:57.164
You build a company with

00:35:57.224 --> 00:35:59.567
like twenty million of revenue and three,

00:35:59.586 --> 00:36:00.867
four million of EBITDA.

00:36:00.887 --> 00:36:02.369
It's awesome what you've built.

00:36:03.409 --> 00:36:04.911
They were like, yeah, well,

00:36:05.050 --> 00:36:06.090
we put a half a million

00:36:06.110 --> 00:36:07.172
bucks in this company.

00:36:07.211 --> 00:36:08.632
We could better have bought

00:36:08.652 --> 00:36:09.672
some Amazon stock,

00:36:10.592 --> 00:36:11.673
didn't have to do anything,

00:36:11.793 --> 00:36:13.335
and our returns would have been better.

00:36:15.195 --> 00:36:16.416
And I think we're dealing here with,

00:36:16.755 --> 00:36:18.597
let's say, the same type of arbitrage.

00:36:18.617 --> 00:36:20.538
So we have a bit of an idea

00:36:20.577 --> 00:36:22.259
of where Tesla is going and

00:36:22.338 --> 00:36:23.780
also what underlying

00:36:23.820 --> 00:36:26.840
business opportunities are.

00:36:27.521 --> 00:36:28.722
How do you look at that

00:36:29.422 --> 00:36:30.523
information arbitrage?

00:36:31.641 --> 00:36:32.942
If we would do, let's say,

00:36:33.101 --> 00:36:35.702
more efforts for a robot taxi fleet,

00:36:36.003 --> 00:36:37.563
there should also be a higher return.

00:36:37.824 --> 00:36:38.804
How do you look at that in

00:36:38.844 --> 00:36:40.864
comparison to the Tesla stock currently?

00:36:42.206 --> 00:36:43.025
Yeah, that's a good question.

00:36:43.065 --> 00:36:43.786
I think there's a lot of

00:36:43.847 --> 00:36:45.547
depth to that to really dig into.

00:36:45.586 --> 00:36:47.467
But just at a surface level,

00:36:48.429 --> 00:36:51.829
if you are looking for income, right,

00:36:51.989 --> 00:36:52.990
then building a business

00:36:53.030 --> 00:36:53.990
and generating income

00:36:54.030 --> 00:36:55.251
stream makes a lot of sense.

00:36:56.356 --> 00:36:58.038
If you're looking for maximum growth,

00:36:58.177 --> 00:36:59.159
then being a passive

00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:00.539
investor in a company like Tesla,

00:37:00.559 --> 00:37:03.081
which doesn't pay dividends at this point,

00:37:03.802 --> 00:37:04.902
is the easier way to go.

00:37:06.043 --> 00:37:06.543
And frankly,

00:37:06.583 --> 00:37:07.824
also probably less risky and

00:37:07.864 --> 00:37:08.885
more diversified as well,

00:37:08.905 --> 00:37:10.045
even though it's a single company.

00:37:12.086 --> 00:37:17.190
Now, ideally, you do both, right?

00:37:17.449 --> 00:37:18.630
Yes, both are good ideas.

00:37:18.731 --> 00:37:20.911
You can make money on both ideas.

00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:24.300
I think also once the market

00:37:24.601 --> 00:37:27.342
starts recognizing this as

00:37:27.882 --> 00:37:28.942
a valid business,

00:37:29.242 --> 00:37:30.523
as a business opportunity,

00:37:31.443 --> 00:37:33.402
then you enter a whole new

00:37:33.443 --> 00:37:35.003
world where capital is

00:37:35.023 --> 00:37:36.903
slowly becoming available.

00:37:37.664 --> 00:37:39.463
And this opportunity is now

00:37:39.503 --> 00:37:40.704
being opened for more and

00:37:40.724 --> 00:37:42.184
more entrepreneurs entering

00:37:42.324 --> 00:37:43.385
a certain market.

00:37:43.425 --> 00:37:44.704
Because, you know,

00:37:46.164 --> 00:37:47.925
who else like money making machines?

00:37:47.965 --> 00:37:49.706
Well, obviously banks, right?

00:37:52.434 --> 00:37:54.034
Or let's say new economy things,

00:37:54.275 --> 00:37:55.556
new economy initiatives

00:37:56.056 --> 00:37:57.657
that are decentralized

00:37:57.697 --> 00:37:59.760
finance like or initiatives

00:37:59.780 --> 00:38:02.362
that are in the crypto space.

00:38:03.043 --> 00:38:04.202
So I think once the

00:38:04.224 --> 00:38:05.324
opportunity is there and

00:38:05.585 --> 00:38:10.349
recognized and our

00:38:10.389 --> 00:38:11.268
assumptions on that

00:38:11.309 --> 00:38:12.309
opportunity is that it's

00:38:12.349 --> 00:38:14.072
going to be a very big opportunity.

00:38:15.043 --> 00:38:16.184
Not only a lot of money will

00:38:16.204 --> 00:38:17.445
flow to the capital markets,

00:38:17.485 --> 00:38:18.744
but also a ton of money

00:38:18.764 --> 00:38:21.226
will flow to the markets to

00:38:21.326 --> 00:38:22.846
utilize this opportunity

00:38:22.885 --> 00:38:24.467
for the people that want to jump on it.

00:38:25.487 --> 00:38:26.586
The other thing too, guys,

00:38:26.626 --> 00:38:28.907
is that RoboTaxi, in my mind,

00:38:28.927 --> 00:38:32.768
is a Trojan horse for humanoid robots.

00:38:32.809 --> 00:38:33.048
Yeah.

00:38:33.889 --> 00:38:36.289
If you have a business around RoboTaxi,

00:38:36.750 --> 00:38:37.750
you're now giving yourself

00:38:37.869 --> 00:38:39.771
optionality to be a player

00:38:39.791 --> 00:38:41.411
in the humanoid bot opportunity,

00:38:41.431 --> 00:38:43.572
which is an order of magnitude bigger.

00:38:44.351 --> 00:38:46.434
So it's a testing ground essentially for,

00:38:46.454 --> 00:38:48.815
uh, for the, for the optimist, uh,

00:38:48.856 --> 00:38:49.255
future.

00:38:50.476 --> 00:38:50.737
Yeah.

00:38:51.456 --> 00:38:53.079
Crazy to realize, you know,

00:38:53.199 --> 00:38:54.699
there are days that are not

00:38:54.760 --> 00:38:56.822
waking up to this, but end of the year,

00:38:56.842 --> 00:38:58.402
there will be four or five

00:38:58.422 --> 00:39:02.286
thousand working in Tesla factories, uh,

00:39:02.365 --> 00:39:02.846
already.

00:39:03.487 --> 00:39:05.007
So, you know,

00:39:05.047 --> 00:39:07.130
being caught by the tractor is already,

00:39:07.289 --> 00:39:10.612
uh, it's already a big one, but, uh, uh,

00:39:10.672 --> 00:39:11.032
the, the,

00:39:11.072 --> 00:39:12.393
the Lamborghini tractor is

00:39:12.434 --> 00:39:13.293
already on his way.

00:39:13.333 --> 00:39:14.175
Right.

00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:15.179
Yeah,

00:39:15.300 --> 00:39:16.360
that's why we have to extend the

00:39:16.400 --> 00:39:18.221
analogy to the next, the next thing,

00:39:18.260 --> 00:39:18.460
right?

00:39:18.601 --> 00:39:19.260
Yeah.

00:39:19.300 --> 00:39:19.521
Yeah.

00:39:19.541 --> 00:39:21.561
Maybe, uh,

00:39:22.041 --> 00:39:24.483
maybe because I liked it remark a lot, uh,

00:39:24.503 --> 00:39:25.623
about the Trojan horse that

00:39:25.643 --> 00:39:27.443
you just made about building this, uh,

00:39:28.083 --> 00:39:31.385
this setting up this shepherd business,

00:39:31.485 --> 00:39:32.646
that it's actually a Trojan

00:39:32.706 --> 00:39:34.387
horse who set up this humanoid.

00:39:34.827 --> 00:39:36.266
Can you elaborate a little

00:39:36.306 --> 00:39:40.369
bit how these two businesses can, uh,

00:39:40.389 --> 00:39:41.768
can affect each other and, uh,

00:39:41.789 --> 00:39:42.548
and leverage each other?

00:39:43.530 --> 00:39:43.849
Sure.

00:39:44.329 --> 00:39:44.590
Yeah.

00:39:45.034 --> 00:39:45.373
Florian,

00:39:45.434 --> 00:39:47.135
I've heard you talk about the

00:39:48.715 --> 00:39:50.175
cyber cab and other Tesla

00:39:50.195 --> 00:39:53.336
vehicles are robots on wheels.

00:39:53.416 --> 00:39:54.956
And robots with wheels that

00:39:54.996 --> 00:39:56.637
can move stuff are great,

00:39:58.097 --> 00:39:59.838
but they're limited in what they can do.

00:40:00.018 --> 00:40:00.938
They can move stuff around

00:40:00.978 --> 00:40:02.099
and that's hugely important

00:40:02.280 --> 00:40:03.159
in our society.

00:40:03.199 --> 00:40:05.300
Moving stuff is a big business globally,

00:40:05.340 --> 00:40:05.561
right?

00:40:06.201 --> 00:40:08.902
People, goods, et cetera, huge business.

00:40:09.302 --> 00:40:09.961
Look at Amazon,

00:40:10.322 --> 00:40:11.382
look at the shipping companies,

00:40:11.603 --> 00:40:12.182
huge business.

00:40:13.447 --> 00:40:14.467
But even bigger than that is

00:40:14.507 --> 00:40:15.409
everything else that we do.

00:40:17.090 --> 00:40:19.231
And so with humanoid robots,

00:40:19.452 --> 00:40:20.773
we have an AI-powered

00:40:20.873 --> 00:40:22.594
machine that for the first

00:40:22.635 --> 00:40:25.336
time in human history will

00:40:25.356 --> 00:40:26.918
be able to out-compete us

00:40:26.978 --> 00:40:29.061
at some point with respect

00:40:29.081 --> 00:40:30.041
to the work that we are

00:40:30.061 --> 00:40:31.101
able to do as humans.

00:40:32.023 --> 00:40:33.463
The humanoid robot can work

00:40:33.503 --> 00:40:34.826
seven thousand hours a year.

00:40:35.706 --> 00:40:36.547
I don't know about you guys,

00:40:36.567 --> 00:40:37.648
but I can't come close to that.

00:40:38.496 --> 00:40:40.335
right want to nope and

00:40:40.396 --> 00:40:42.157
especially not doing manual

00:40:42.197 --> 00:40:43.496
labor in the same time like

00:40:43.956 --> 00:40:46.117
exactly stop dexterity

00:40:46.217 --> 00:40:47.697
creating but also

00:40:47.737 --> 00:40:50.338
assembling right and

00:40:50.358 --> 00:40:51.179
they're only going to get

00:40:51.219 --> 00:40:53.340
better over time whereas

00:40:53.380 --> 00:40:55.539
humans get to a point and

00:40:55.559 --> 00:40:57.320
then you kind of plateau

00:40:57.360 --> 00:41:00.260
and then level off so

00:41:00.280 --> 00:41:01.702
anyway the examples go on

00:41:01.742 --> 00:41:03.021
but the humanoid robot will

00:41:03.061 --> 00:41:04.422
be able to do eventually

00:41:05.103 --> 00:41:06.663
anything that a human can do

00:41:07.809 --> 00:41:09.110
from a labor perspective and

00:41:09.130 --> 00:41:09.911
maybe even more,

00:41:10.271 --> 00:41:13.954
but just from a labor perspective,

00:41:13.974 --> 00:41:15.235
the human race has never

00:41:15.295 --> 00:41:17.317
had a machine that can

00:41:17.416 --> 00:41:18.637
outcompete us in that way.

00:41:19.358 --> 00:41:20.259
We've had specialized

00:41:20.278 --> 00:41:21.119
machines that can do

00:41:21.159 --> 00:41:21.960
certain things better,

00:41:22.380 --> 00:41:23.440
but we've never had a

00:41:23.501 --> 00:41:24.601
general purpose machine

00:41:24.621 --> 00:41:26.184
that can do anything that a human can do.

00:41:26.523 --> 00:41:28.385
And without a human coming

00:41:29.246 --> 00:41:30.467
to operate that machine.

00:41:30.487 --> 00:41:30.847
That's right.

00:41:32.019 --> 00:41:34.041
And so having a Robotaxi fleet,

00:41:34.081 --> 00:41:35.981
having robots on wheels is

00:41:36.021 --> 00:41:36.960
going to be important in

00:41:37.021 --> 00:41:38.681
moving these humanoid robots around.

00:41:38.822 --> 00:41:39.822
So if you are a fleet

00:41:39.882 --> 00:41:42.063
operator for the robots on wheels,

00:41:42.862 --> 00:41:44.083
that will serve you well in

00:41:44.123 --> 00:41:45.222
terms of positioning the

00:41:45.282 --> 00:41:46.103
other robots where they

00:41:46.123 --> 00:41:48.364
need to be to provide other

00:41:48.384 --> 00:41:49.423
services on top of that

00:41:49.463 --> 00:41:50.744
Robotaxi network of just

00:41:50.824 --> 00:41:52.085
moving stuff from point A

00:41:52.105 --> 00:41:54.065
to point B. So for example,

00:41:54.125 --> 00:41:55.045
package delivery,

00:41:55.545 --> 00:41:56.545
how do you get the package

00:41:56.565 --> 00:41:58.045
from the vehicle to your doorstep?

00:41:59.306 --> 00:41:59.706
Exactly.

00:42:00.489 --> 00:42:01.550
So you use, use,

00:42:01.690 --> 00:42:03.572
it's a very hard problem that, that,

00:42:03.711 --> 00:42:05.333
that many companies are

00:42:05.753 --> 00:42:07.134
working very hard on like,

00:42:07.235 --> 00:42:08.456
like Uber and Amazon on

00:42:08.476 --> 00:42:09.836
sort of the last mile delivery.

00:42:09.856 --> 00:42:12.139
That's sort of the Holy grail and, uh,

00:42:12.539 --> 00:42:14.000
where, where everybody's looking for,

00:42:14.019 --> 00:42:15.420
but the humanoid would easily, uh,

00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:15.862
solve that, that issue.

00:42:15.882 --> 00:42:16.762
Well, it's the last, the last, the last,

00:42:16.802 --> 00:42:17.603
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:17.623 --> 00:42:18.643
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:18.664 --> 00:42:19.405
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:19.425 --> 00:42:20.264
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:20.284 --> 00:42:21.045
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:21.065 --> 00:42:21.827
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:21.847 --> 00:42:22.547
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:22.567 --> 00:42:23.268
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:23.288 --> 00:42:23.987
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:24.007 --> 00:42:24.728
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:24.748 --> 00:42:25.510
the last, the last, the last, the last,

00:42:25.530 --> 00:42:25.909
the last, the last,

00:42:26.436 --> 00:42:27.277
And maybe the robot will

00:42:27.318 --> 00:42:28.199
just throw it on the

00:42:28.219 --> 00:42:29.460
doorstep and that'll be great.

00:42:29.480 --> 00:42:30.199
It'll look like Michael

00:42:30.239 --> 00:42:31.501
Jordan when it throws your package.

00:42:32.161 --> 00:42:32.963
With a catapult.

00:42:36.746 --> 00:42:37.847
Go ahead.

00:42:38.166 --> 00:42:39.208
No, go ahead.

00:42:39.307 --> 00:42:39.668
It's fine.

00:42:40.108 --> 00:42:43.831
I'm actually kind of

00:42:43.891 --> 00:42:46.054
intrigued by your Trojan

00:42:46.094 --> 00:42:48.576
horse kind of analogy because

00:42:49.784 --> 00:42:51.304
uh of course you're right

00:42:51.324 --> 00:42:53.306
that um when you have a

00:42:53.686 --> 00:42:56.047
logistic company with robo

00:42:56.248 --> 00:42:58.030
caps you're able to deliver

00:42:58.070 --> 00:42:59.351
those humanoids to the

00:42:59.371 --> 00:43:00.351
place where you want to go

00:43:00.391 --> 00:43:02.972
but um case and I have been

00:43:03.012 --> 00:43:03.914
working on something the

00:43:03.954 --> 00:43:05.255
last few months which is

00:43:05.375 --> 00:43:08.777
also um getting more and

00:43:08.836 --> 00:43:12.980
more uh out in the open is that um

00:43:14.445 --> 00:43:17.585
that the physical AI is

00:43:17.646 --> 00:43:21.547
built upon data from real world data.

00:43:22.809 --> 00:43:26.210
So the cars which are

00:43:26.250 --> 00:43:27.891
driving around already are

00:43:27.990 --> 00:43:29.351
already accumulating a lot

00:43:29.371 --> 00:43:31.492
of data in order to build

00:43:32.373 --> 00:43:33.652
the foundation model to

00:43:33.713 --> 00:43:36.295
create a self-driving car.

00:43:37.375 --> 00:43:38.795
But that self-driving car,

00:43:38.876 --> 00:43:41.336
the brains of that car can

00:43:41.657 --> 00:43:42.876
be copy pasted to the

00:43:42.896 --> 00:43:43.998
brains of the humanoid.

00:43:45.010 --> 00:43:46.652
With with the only exception

00:43:46.733 --> 00:43:47.934
is that the cars are not

00:43:47.974 --> 00:43:49.076
allowed to drive there

00:43:49.115 --> 00:43:53.061
where humans are actually walking but

00:43:54.813 --> 00:43:55.313
Maybe, Kees,

00:43:55.333 --> 00:43:56.233
you can explain a little bit

00:43:56.273 --> 00:43:57.496
about what we're doing with

00:43:57.976 --> 00:44:01.059
the data and how we see it

00:44:01.119 --> 00:44:02.940
as a business model also for Shepard's.

00:44:04.922 --> 00:44:06.423
Because there are a lot of

00:44:06.443 --> 00:44:07.786
people already working on this.

00:44:07.885 --> 00:44:08.346
It's like,

00:44:09.086 --> 00:44:10.809
how can we accumulate this real

00:44:10.829 --> 00:44:13.570
world data in order to

00:44:15.172 --> 00:44:16.373
deploy the humanoids?

00:44:16.534 --> 00:44:17.054
And as of

00:44:18.302 --> 00:44:19.061
At this moment,

00:44:19.382 --> 00:44:20.583
we only know that Tesla is

00:44:20.603 --> 00:44:22.782
accumulating the data for themselves,

00:44:23.523 --> 00:44:24.583
but maybe we can,

00:44:24.844 --> 00:44:26.644
and also Tesla can use that

00:44:26.664 --> 00:44:28.965
data to bring it to third

00:44:29.005 --> 00:44:33.126
party operators working in

00:44:33.166 --> 00:44:33.827
this new world.

00:44:33.887 --> 00:44:35.487
So maybe Kees,

00:44:35.507 --> 00:44:36.367
you can explain a little bit

00:44:36.387 --> 00:44:37.447
about what I'm trying to say.

00:44:38.347 --> 00:44:38.648
Yeah,

00:44:38.947 --> 00:44:41.548
so we've been tapping into the fleet

00:44:41.608 --> 00:44:44.809
API for quite some time now.

00:44:46.570 --> 00:44:47.590
And of course,

00:44:47.610 --> 00:44:49.090
you're gathering immense

00:44:49.150 --> 00:44:51.170
amounts of video data from

00:44:51.231 --> 00:44:52.451
multiple camera angles.

00:44:53.391 --> 00:44:55.811
You could be able to store

00:44:55.831 --> 00:44:58.092
that data and sell it to

00:44:58.132 --> 00:45:00.132
third parties that might

00:45:00.972 --> 00:45:02.612
map out whole cities.

00:45:03.806 --> 00:45:07.248
or charging data or voice control data.

00:45:07.530 --> 00:45:09.612
There's a lot of valuable

00:45:09.632 --> 00:45:11.172
information that we can map

00:45:11.313 --> 00:45:11.893
out the world.

00:45:13.275 --> 00:45:18.079
And I think right now it's

00:45:18.119 --> 00:45:19.440
very difficult to pinpoint

00:45:19.501 --> 00:45:21.402
a specific value to that.

00:45:22.503 --> 00:45:24.545
And I'm not sure if anybody

00:45:24.605 --> 00:45:26.146
really takes this into

00:45:26.166 --> 00:45:29.170
account into their Tesla valuations.

00:45:29.969 --> 00:45:31.391
um so very curious how you

00:45:31.931 --> 00:45:33.333
look towards that and

00:45:34.054 --> 00:45:35.114
because like we are

00:45:35.173 --> 00:45:37.996
interested in um you laid

00:45:38.036 --> 00:45:39.237
out that three-step model

00:45:39.338 --> 00:45:40.699
like tesla can operate

00:45:40.739 --> 00:45:41.840
themselves you have a fleet

00:45:41.900 --> 00:45:42.559
operator and you have

00:45:42.619 --> 00:45:45.242
individual owners our

00:45:45.302 --> 00:45:47.003
vision is more we are the

00:45:47.043 --> 00:45:48.545
fleet operator running our

00:45:48.585 --> 00:45:50.327
own fleet but also in the

00:45:50.367 --> 00:45:52.547
meanwhile enabling private

00:45:52.708 --> 00:45:55.630
owners and small fleet operators

00:45:56.532 --> 00:45:57.753
where we gather or

00:45:57.793 --> 00:45:59.434
accumulate all that data

00:45:59.554 --> 00:46:04.695
and we will be able to utilize that data.

00:46:04.896 --> 00:46:07.197
Just a quick comment on that, by the way.

00:46:07.456 --> 00:46:08.876
As an individual vehicle owner,

00:46:09.617 --> 00:46:10.898
let's say I contribute my

00:46:10.938 --> 00:46:12.958
vehicle to the fleet for

00:46:12.998 --> 00:46:15.719
four hours today.

00:46:15.759 --> 00:46:17.340
Do I get paid based on the

00:46:17.400 --> 00:46:22.101
activity of my individual vehicle?

00:46:22.161 --> 00:46:23.742
That's an open question because

00:46:24.898 --> 00:46:26.077
My individual vehicle might

00:46:26.117 --> 00:46:27.438
not be optimized to produce

00:46:27.478 --> 00:46:28.159
the most revenue.

00:46:29.438 --> 00:46:29.898
Tesla,

00:46:29.998 --> 00:46:31.760
as the fleet operator or as the

00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:32.639
network operator,

00:46:33.380 --> 00:46:34.199
might want to actually

00:46:34.239 --> 00:46:35.641
position my vehicle in a

00:46:35.701 --> 00:46:36.860
certain place in case

00:46:36.940 --> 00:46:37.740
someone needs a ride.

00:46:38.701 --> 00:46:39.742
So my vehicle actually may

00:46:39.782 --> 00:46:40.822
not see a lot of action.

00:46:40.942 --> 00:46:42.601
So should I not get paid

00:46:42.641 --> 00:46:43.661
just because it's sitting

00:46:43.681 --> 00:46:45.623
there when other people's

00:46:45.643 --> 00:46:47.322
vehicles may have had more rides?

00:46:47.443 --> 00:46:49.824
So there's the structure of

00:46:49.864 --> 00:46:51.244
the network and how that's going to work,

00:46:51.304 --> 00:46:53.425
I think, that remains to be seen.

00:46:55.820 --> 00:47:00.543
um I'm sorry I I went on

00:47:00.583 --> 00:47:01.264
such a tangent I've

00:47:01.284 --> 00:47:03.206
forgotten your question yeah so

00:47:04.266 --> 00:47:07.588
um maybe I can hop in and uh

00:47:07.628 --> 00:47:08.509
we can talk about it

00:47:08.548 --> 00:47:11.590
further is that um what we

00:47:11.670 --> 00:47:12.972
what we are uh we're

00:47:13.012 --> 00:47:14.333
working with some companies

00:47:14.373 --> 00:47:15.213
what their names again

00:47:15.253 --> 00:47:17.815
their case um well there's

00:47:18.054 --> 00:47:19.376
multiple companies so you

00:47:19.416 --> 00:47:21.137
like uh you have a lot of

00:47:21.318 --> 00:47:22.679
fleet api companies out

00:47:22.719 --> 00:47:24.619
there uh of course one of

00:47:24.659 --> 00:47:26.101
those is standard fleet the

00:47:26.141 --> 00:47:27.621
first third party uh

00:47:28.077 --> 00:47:29.518
a partner of Tesla and that,

00:47:30.018 --> 00:47:31.338
but you can extend it

00:47:31.378 --> 00:47:33.900
further because Resla, for instance,

00:47:34.639 --> 00:47:38.222
and we might too, we're using a fleet.

00:47:38.402 --> 00:47:40.181
So they're doing the back

00:47:40.262 --> 00:47:42.202
end day to day operations, combining,

00:47:42.682 --> 00:47:44.384
enabling people to run their business.

00:47:45.063 --> 00:47:46.045
But more the consumer

00:47:46.105 --> 00:47:47.784
oriented stuff is companies

00:47:47.824 --> 00:47:49.706
like Ziva Global or

00:47:50.507 --> 00:47:53.971
matter ai that sell usb

00:47:53.990 --> 00:47:56.474
drives to store that video

00:47:56.514 --> 00:47:57.775
data instead of just the

00:47:57.815 --> 00:47:58.695
flash drive that's in the

00:47:58.735 --> 00:48:00.257
tesla vehicle and there's

00:48:00.277 --> 00:48:03.902
tons of companies out there

00:48:04.143 --> 00:48:05.184
so yeah and and also natix

00:48:05.204 --> 00:48:07.606
for example um they're all

00:48:07.626 --> 00:48:09.989
uh trying to get a position

00:48:11.391 --> 00:48:12.050
In the car.

00:48:12.391 --> 00:48:14.552
So what they do is they they

00:48:14.572 --> 00:48:16.913
put the USB on the on the

00:48:16.952 --> 00:48:18.333
car and they collect the

00:48:18.353 --> 00:48:21.355
data and that data you can sell again.

00:48:21.554 --> 00:48:23.614
So we've been talking about them.

00:48:23.635 --> 00:48:25.155
What what's the value of the

00:48:25.195 --> 00:48:27.436
data and to whom are you

00:48:27.456 --> 00:48:28.456
going to sell that data?

00:48:28.617 --> 00:48:30.818
So at this moment, they only sell it to,

00:48:30.858 --> 00:48:32.998
for example, insurance companies.

00:48:33.199 --> 00:48:33.298
Yeah.

00:48:34.041 --> 00:48:36.844
And they say that they are

00:48:36.864 --> 00:48:39.226
ready to see whether an

00:48:39.306 --> 00:48:40.568
accident happened and how

00:48:40.628 --> 00:48:41.628
it happened and who was

00:48:41.708 --> 00:48:43.291
actually involved in the accident.

00:48:43.811 --> 00:48:44.952
Just as we are seeing right

00:48:44.992 --> 00:48:47.195
now with the crazy Nazi

00:48:47.215 --> 00:48:49.436
people spraying and scratching the cars.

00:48:50.117 --> 00:48:50.978
There's actually valuable

00:48:51.018 --> 00:48:53.039
data because you know who it is, you know,

00:48:53.240 --> 00:48:55.262
and you can actually go after it.

00:48:55.862 --> 00:48:56.724
So that's the same with an

00:48:56.784 --> 00:48:58.144
accident and with insurance.

00:48:58.876 --> 00:49:01.217
So they told us that that

00:49:01.257 --> 00:49:03.938
data is worth around fifty

00:49:03.958 --> 00:49:07.400
to one hundred euros per month per car.

00:49:07.460 --> 00:49:07.541
Wow.

00:49:09.382 --> 00:49:12.483
So that's and that's just one use case.

00:49:12.983 --> 00:49:13.923
Yeah.

00:49:13.963 --> 00:49:17.784
So I think they were talking

00:49:17.824 --> 00:49:19.666
about the data being a

00:49:19.706 --> 00:49:22.286
value of about between two

00:49:22.387 --> 00:49:23.768
and four dollars per mile.

00:49:25.173 --> 00:49:27.416
so um I don't know how many

00:49:27.476 --> 00:49:28.436
miles this already

00:49:28.476 --> 00:49:29.737
collected but I think it's

00:49:29.797 --> 00:49:31.978
in in the billions with a

00:49:32.018 --> 00:49:33.639
value of two dollars per

00:49:33.699 --> 00:49:36.802
mile how is this actually

00:49:37.083 --> 00:49:38.083
put on the balance sheet of

00:49:38.123 --> 00:49:39.304
tesla is is it already on

00:49:39.324 --> 00:49:40.264
the balance sheet of tesla

00:49:40.865 --> 00:49:42.987
for example and um and how

00:49:43.106 --> 00:49:44.268
is this going to play out

00:49:44.327 --> 00:49:45.929
for third-party players and

00:49:45.969 --> 00:49:47.130
how is this thinking about

00:49:47.170 --> 00:49:48.952
this kind of business models

00:49:49.827 --> 00:49:50.047
Yeah.

00:49:50.327 --> 00:49:51.007
So actually, again,

00:49:51.027 --> 00:49:52.009
there's a lot of depth to this.

00:49:52.068 --> 00:49:53.610
So think about the different

00:49:53.650 --> 00:49:54.791
potential customers, right?

00:49:54.831 --> 00:49:58.514
You've got municipalities, governments,

00:49:58.594 --> 00:49:59.215
local governments,

00:49:59.275 --> 00:50:01.018
cities that could benefit

00:50:01.057 --> 00:50:01.978
from a lot of the data

00:50:02.018 --> 00:50:02.938
coming from the vehicles,

00:50:02.958 --> 00:50:04.320
whether it's real-time

00:50:04.380 --> 00:50:08.885
pothole detection and alert, right?

00:50:09.125 --> 00:50:09.925
There's a pothole here.

00:50:09.945 --> 00:50:10.766
Go fix it.

00:50:11.416 --> 00:50:12.737
Or even just issues with the

00:50:12.777 --> 00:50:13.336
infrastructure,

00:50:13.356 --> 00:50:14.657
like the traffic light's not working,

00:50:14.757 --> 00:50:15.657
or the signpost,

00:50:15.838 --> 00:50:17.898
someone hit it and it's

00:50:17.938 --> 00:50:18.697
fallen on the road,

00:50:18.777 --> 00:50:19.858
or a tree has fallen over.

00:50:20.579 --> 00:50:21.639
All that kind of stuff would

00:50:21.659 --> 00:50:22.998
be tremendously valuable to

00:50:23.039 --> 00:50:23.898
municipalities.

00:50:24.579 --> 00:50:25.699
I would imagine in that case,

00:50:25.739 --> 00:50:26.639
Tesla might just provide

00:50:26.679 --> 00:50:27.780
that for free and say, hey,

00:50:28.380 --> 00:50:31.481
we're being a good company here.

00:50:31.501 --> 00:50:32.740
We're helping you out.

00:50:32.920 --> 00:50:33.661
Good Samaritan.

00:50:34.300 --> 00:50:34.920
Good Samaritan.

00:50:34.940 --> 00:50:35.800
We're helping make the

00:50:35.820 --> 00:50:37.061
roadways safer for everybody.

00:50:37.681 --> 00:50:38.342
That kind of stuff.

00:50:38.641 --> 00:50:39.282
That would be great.

00:50:40.306 --> 00:50:41.527
And then at the other extreme,

00:50:42.188 --> 00:50:43.570
who is going to pay a ton

00:50:43.590 --> 00:50:44.951
of money for this information?

00:50:45.472 --> 00:50:46.331
Well, that's Wall Street.

00:50:47.773 --> 00:50:48.815
So if you're a hedge fund

00:50:49.295 --> 00:50:50.235
and you want to keep track

00:50:50.275 --> 00:50:51.217
of certain things,

00:50:51.277 --> 00:50:52.757
like how many cars are in a

00:50:52.838 --> 00:50:54.619
parking lot in front of a certain store,

00:50:55.260 --> 00:50:56.981
or how many Amazon trucks

00:50:57.021 --> 00:50:57.702
do you see on the road,

00:50:57.963 --> 00:50:59.925
whatever data they want to track,

00:51:01.005 --> 00:51:01.965
this would be one way to

00:51:02.005 --> 00:51:03.047
facilitate that in a

00:51:03.126 --> 00:51:04.829
certain area if they cared about that.

00:51:05.784 --> 00:51:07.025
Now they're already using

00:51:07.125 --> 00:51:08.344
satellite imagery.

00:51:08.405 --> 00:51:09.706
There's companies that

00:51:09.726 --> 00:51:10.985
provide that every single

00:51:11.025 --> 00:51:13.266
day to Wall Street in terms

00:51:13.385 --> 00:51:15.206
of where ships are and how

00:51:15.226 --> 00:51:16.367
many cars in a parking lot

00:51:16.427 --> 00:51:17.126
and stuff like that.

00:51:18.027 --> 00:51:20.748
So those are the two extremes, I think,

00:51:20.788 --> 00:51:23.027
in terms of maybe getting

00:51:23.068 --> 00:51:24.068
data for free and then

00:51:24.088 --> 00:51:24.989
being willing to pay a ton

00:51:25.009 --> 00:51:25.568
of money for it.

00:51:26.389 --> 00:51:27.148
And then there's a bunch of

00:51:27.188 --> 00:51:28.068
companies kind of in the

00:51:28.088 --> 00:51:30.088
middle that probably would

00:51:30.128 --> 00:51:31.590
pay for portions of the

00:51:31.630 --> 00:51:32.750
data that's relevant to them.

00:51:33.947 --> 00:51:35.809
And certainly insurance companies, uh,

00:51:35.849 --> 00:51:36.809
would be a big customer.

00:51:38.168 --> 00:51:39.969
Um, so yeah, I think that's,

00:51:40.269 --> 00:51:41.251
that's an interesting one.

00:51:41.311 --> 00:51:42.451
The other one is advertising.

00:51:43.971 --> 00:51:45.431
You can advertise on the

00:51:45.512 --> 00:51:46.411
outside of the vehicle.

00:51:47.893 --> 00:51:49.032
You could advertise on the

00:51:49.092 --> 00:51:49.994
inside of the vehicle.

00:51:51.514 --> 00:51:52.614
And then it kind of related

00:51:52.653 --> 00:51:53.934
to it is you can create,

00:51:53.994 --> 00:51:55.735
because the vehicle is, you know,

00:51:55.775 --> 00:51:57.416
GROK powered,

00:51:58.777 --> 00:51:59.856
the vehicle could be your guide.

00:52:00.751 --> 00:52:02.572
And you could have this guided experience.

00:52:02.592 --> 00:52:04.213
So if I travel to Amsterdam,

00:52:04.273 --> 00:52:05.353
I could get in a cyber cab

00:52:05.393 --> 00:52:06.134
and it could take me around

00:52:06.173 --> 00:52:06.894
the city and tell me

00:52:06.934 --> 00:52:08.295
everything about what I'm seeing.

00:52:09.356 --> 00:52:10.295
Yeah.

00:52:10.376 --> 00:52:10.577
Right.

00:52:10.617 --> 00:52:11.817
And then I could say, you know,

00:52:11.836 --> 00:52:12.478
take me to the best

00:52:12.538 --> 00:52:13.597
restaurant in this area

00:52:13.617 --> 00:52:14.318
that serves this kind of

00:52:14.358 --> 00:52:15.760
food and it would take me there.

00:52:16.219 --> 00:52:20.081
And by the way, the restaurants would pay.

00:52:20.181 --> 00:52:20.742
Yeah,

00:52:21.063 --> 00:52:23.844
I liked I liked the direction where

00:52:23.864 --> 00:52:24.625
it's going from.

00:52:25.309 --> 00:52:27.974
I think if you look at what Elon is doing,

00:52:29.137 --> 00:52:33.985
Elon never works in the day-to-day,

00:52:34.045 --> 00:52:34.264
right?

00:52:34.304 --> 00:52:35.487
So he's always ten years

00:52:35.547 --> 00:52:38.853
ahead and works on where he wants to go.

00:52:40.172 --> 00:52:42.954
Um, yeah, I, I really liked what you,

00:52:43.074 --> 00:52:44.775
what you posted about, uh, the,

00:52:44.856 --> 00:52:46.077
the functions that each of

00:52:46.177 --> 00:52:47.438
Elan company had put

00:52:47.478 --> 00:52:49.599
together in one slide and

00:52:49.639 --> 00:52:52.201
the X and XAI from my point of view,

00:52:52.300 --> 00:52:52.902
one of the first

00:52:52.942 --> 00:52:54.163
consolidations that we're

00:52:54.202 --> 00:52:56.403
going to see within the, the, the,

00:52:56.443 --> 00:52:57.364
the Elan empire.

00:52:58.226 --> 00:52:59.206
And, uh,

00:52:59.226 --> 00:53:01.208
with X they're working on the everything.

00:53:02.173 --> 00:53:03.755
store everything app right

00:53:03.795 --> 00:53:05.077
so all the goods and

00:53:05.117 --> 00:53:06.498
services that you use in

00:53:06.518 --> 00:53:07.500
your daily life can be

00:53:07.539 --> 00:53:11.324
powered by uh by x xai is

00:53:11.385 --> 00:53:13.168
exploring is trying to

00:53:14.048 --> 00:53:16.351
understand the secrets of the universe so

00:53:17.364 --> 00:53:17.884
Therefore,

00:53:17.943 --> 00:53:19.405
it really needs the real world

00:53:19.445 --> 00:53:21.369
data that Optimus and the

00:53:21.528 --> 00:53:23.371
cybercaps are providing.

00:53:23.931 --> 00:53:25.894
And right now we have a fleet of globally,

00:53:25.954 --> 00:53:27.597
let's say, of ten million.

00:53:28.518 --> 00:53:29.500
But ten years from now,

00:53:29.519 --> 00:53:30.541
there will be a fleet of

00:53:30.601 --> 00:53:31.862
probably one hundred fifty

00:53:31.902 --> 00:53:33.865
to two hundred fifty million cars.

00:53:34.706 --> 00:53:39.211
I'm very excited about Kees

00:53:39.251 --> 00:53:40.474
and Florian already working

00:53:40.534 --> 00:53:43.436
on the API store because I

00:53:43.476 --> 00:53:45.340
think that API and the app

00:53:45.360 --> 00:53:46.922
store are sort of early

00:53:47.061 --> 00:53:49.905
innings where Tesla is developing because

00:53:50.746 --> 00:53:53.369
especially when the fleet is that large,

00:53:53.409 --> 00:53:54.630
to two hundred million,

00:53:54.710 --> 00:53:55.990
two hundred fifty million ish.

00:53:56.512 --> 00:53:59.474
That also has never happened in the world.

00:53:59.514 --> 00:54:01.336
The same counts for Optimus.

00:54:01.376 --> 00:54:01.597
Like,

00:54:02.057 --> 00:54:04.739
is it already crowded in the restaurant?

00:54:05.121 --> 00:54:06.561
So that information is going

00:54:06.601 --> 00:54:08.083
to become so real time.

00:54:09.322 --> 00:54:12.425
Um, and, and especially if you see like,

00:54:12.485 --> 00:54:12.704
okay,

00:54:12.724 --> 00:54:15.307
I want to drive around in only that

00:54:15.327 --> 00:54:16.849
feature would be already fun.

00:54:16.869 --> 00:54:18.811
Like drive around the Sydney, bam.

00:54:19.331 --> 00:54:23.454
And, and some, uh, FSD, uh, car will,

00:54:23.494 --> 00:54:24.735
will accept that offer.

00:54:25.137 --> 00:54:26.097
You pay like one,

00:54:26.257 --> 00:54:27.858
one dollar and then off you go.

00:54:27.898 --> 00:54:28.659
So you can think about

00:54:28.699 --> 00:54:30.862
millions of things there.

00:54:31.422 --> 00:54:34.045
Um, said that is from my point of view,

00:54:34.085 --> 00:54:35.286
something inevitable.

00:54:36.257 --> 00:54:37.797
And we cannot,

00:54:38.978 --> 00:54:41.039
Ilan also talked about using

00:54:41.079 --> 00:54:44.300
the cars as the total

00:54:44.320 --> 00:54:46.041
compute of all the cars together.

00:54:46.621 --> 00:54:48.061
It's also something valuable

00:54:48.081 --> 00:54:49.021
that is going to happen

00:54:49.061 --> 00:54:50.021
because in the end,

00:54:50.181 --> 00:54:51.983
even if you drive ten hours a day,

00:54:52.023 --> 00:54:52.922
there's still fourteen

00:54:52.963 --> 00:54:54.362
hours of compute left and

00:54:54.382 --> 00:54:55.264
you have that battery

00:54:55.284 --> 00:54:57.963
already in place that can power that.

00:54:58.925 --> 00:54:59.905
But those are things.

00:55:00.731 --> 00:55:02.012
that we cannot envision how

00:55:02.052 --> 00:55:03.112
it's going to look like,

00:55:03.132 --> 00:55:03.972
but it's going to be

00:55:04.092 --> 00:55:05.733
inevitable that this stuff

00:55:05.753 --> 00:55:06.733
is all going to happen.

00:55:07.974 --> 00:55:09.554
Think about how useful it

00:55:09.594 --> 00:55:10.775
would be for police forces.

00:55:10.795 --> 00:55:12.177
They're looking for a certain vehicle.

00:55:12.777 --> 00:55:14.398
Now with the whole Robotaxi fleet,

00:55:14.438 --> 00:55:15.458
you can basically look at

00:55:15.478 --> 00:55:16.318
every license plate of

00:55:16.358 --> 00:55:17.219
every car on the road

00:55:17.338 --> 00:55:20.380
instantly and tell the

00:55:20.400 --> 00:55:21.920
police exactly where that vehicle is.

00:55:22.461 --> 00:55:23.802
So there's all kinds of

00:55:23.822 --> 00:55:24.922
applications for that data.

00:55:25.706 --> 00:55:26.086
And, of course,

00:55:26.106 --> 00:55:27.307
it's the perfect thing for

00:55:27.467 --> 00:55:29.329
AI to parse through and

00:55:29.389 --> 00:55:30.552
find out what's relevant

00:55:30.592 --> 00:55:35.536
with all the data that's coming in.

00:55:35.757 --> 00:55:38.079
It's something that Kees and

00:55:38.179 --> 00:55:40.862
I looked at when we visited the GIGA

00:55:41.809 --> 00:55:43.030
factory in Berlin, the opening,

00:55:43.070 --> 00:55:44.592
we got the opportunity to

00:55:44.672 --> 00:55:46.173
walk around and see everything,

00:55:46.293 --> 00:55:48.376
all the lineup.

00:55:48.836 --> 00:55:49.458
And at the end,

00:55:49.637 --> 00:55:53.322
we saw this chip and with eight cameras.

00:55:53.422 --> 00:55:54.342
And I said to Kees,

00:55:54.503 --> 00:55:55.465
I think this is the most

00:55:55.505 --> 00:55:57.206
important part of the whole factory.

00:55:58.771 --> 00:56:02.052
So we touched upon the

00:56:02.092 --> 00:56:03.173
cameras actually getting

00:56:03.233 --> 00:56:04.313
all the data in there,

00:56:04.974 --> 00:56:08.856
but we also have a compute in the car.

00:56:09.456 --> 00:56:11.697
So I think you touched upon this as well,

00:56:12.038 --> 00:56:13.737
Cern, about the inference compute,

00:56:13.777 --> 00:56:15.059
which is available in the car.

00:56:15.778 --> 00:56:17.760
Can you elaborate and maybe

00:56:17.940 --> 00:56:18.981
talk a little bit about

00:56:19.181 --> 00:56:20.300
what you think the value is

00:56:20.340 --> 00:56:21.961
going to be of that compute in the car?

00:56:23.413 --> 00:56:24.572
yeah I built a model for

00:56:24.612 --> 00:56:26.333
this florian uh probably a

00:56:26.353 --> 00:56:27.693
year and a half ago now and

00:56:27.833 --> 00:56:28.815
it was really just a stab

00:56:28.855 --> 00:56:30.114
in the dark and it still is

00:56:31.315 --> 00:56:33.956
but there's no doubt that

00:56:34.195 --> 00:56:35.376
if you have a powerful

00:56:35.657 --> 00:56:36.936
computer in the vehicle

00:56:37.356 --> 00:56:40.137
that that is very useful for ai inference

00:56:44.139 --> 00:56:45.601
You shared some slides with me,

00:56:45.621 --> 00:56:46.862
and I would love to show it.

00:56:47.541 --> 00:56:48.762
In which document is that?

00:56:48.842 --> 00:56:50.943
I don't think I sent that to you.

00:56:51.043 --> 00:56:52.103
I'm happy to send it to you,

00:56:52.123 --> 00:56:53.384
but it's kind of an old

00:56:53.423 --> 00:56:54.264
model at this point.

00:56:55.625 --> 00:56:56.905
I actually worked with James

00:56:56.945 --> 00:56:58.507
Delma a little bit on that,

00:56:59.347 --> 00:57:01.068
and he and I basically

00:57:01.168 --> 00:57:02.188
concluded that at this point,

00:57:02.407 --> 00:57:03.188
we don't know what the

00:57:03.228 --> 00:57:04.128
pricing would look like.

00:57:04.949 --> 00:57:06.690
But certainly at scale,

00:57:07.610 --> 00:57:08.831
it's a very valuable thing.

00:57:10.358 --> 00:57:10.518
Yeah,

00:57:10.539 --> 00:57:12.280
I think we also discussed a little

00:57:12.300 --> 00:57:15.983
bit about it, Cern, is that with AI,

00:57:16.123 --> 00:57:16.882
you need compute.

00:57:17.804 --> 00:57:18.503
And with compute,

00:57:18.525 --> 00:57:19.405
you need a lot of energy.

00:57:20.365 --> 00:57:23.188
So with the cars already

00:57:23.228 --> 00:57:24.608
having a compute in there

00:57:24.809 --> 00:57:26.670
and also their batteries already in there,

00:57:26.690 --> 00:57:29.132
it's like a distributed

00:57:29.612 --> 00:57:32.554
force of AI already in place.

00:57:33.353 --> 00:57:34.855
So if you add all the

00:57:34.875 --> 00:57:36.315
gigawatt hours in battery

00:57:36.376 --> 00:57:37.717
already in place of the six,

00:57:37.757 --> 00:57:38.998
seven million cars already

00:57:39.077 --> 00:57:39.798
roaming the world,

00:57:40.628 --> 00:57:43.190
together with the compute power in there,

00:57:43.329 --> 00:57:45.050
there's already kind of a

00:57:45.190 --> 00:57:49.713
use case only for having

00:57:49.773 --> 00:57:52.313
some models running on that

00:57:52.353 --> 00:57:53.153
computer in the car.

00:57:54.094 --> 00:57:56.275
So we definitely need an

00:57:56.355 --> 00:57:57.536
expert like James Dahmer to

00:57:57.576 --> 00:57:58.416
really explain this,

00:57:58.476 --> 00:58:01.137
but I think we are already

00:58:01.817 --> 00:58:03.398
kind of grasping the idea

00:58:03.438 --> 00:58:05.099
of how this could play out.

00:58:06.458 --> 00:58:08.119
Sorry, Kenny.

00:58:09.206 --> 00:58:10.847
I think they're already doing right.

00:58:11.027 --> 00:58:15.911
I read something about it.

00:58:15.931 --> 00:58:17.271
What are they doing?

00:58:17.291 --> 00:58:17.512
Well,

00:58:17.592 --> 00:58:19.753
I think they're already partly using

00:58:19.994 --> 00:58:21.114
using a part of the fleet

00:58:21.135 --> 00:58:22.635
to run some of the models.

00:58:22.695 --> 00:58:23.936
I think even mentioned it or

00:58:23.976 --> 00:58:24.956
someone mentioned it in the

00:58:24.996 --> 00:58:25.838
last couple of weeks.

00:58:27.137 --> 00:58:29.559
Well, let's say that supercluster,

00:58:29.599 --> 00:58:29.980
what they have,

00:58:30.019 --> 00:58:31.061
they what have they paid

00:58:31.101 --> 00:58:32.382
with XAI for that whole

00:58:32.422 --> 00:58:34.103
superclusters like twenty billion,

00:58:34.123 --> 00:58:35.684
something in that realm.

00:58:36.313 --> 00:58:37.614
or that is the fundraise

00:58:37.635 --> 00:58:39.974
that XAI has been doing to build compute.

00:58:40.956 --> 00:58:41.255
Well,

00:58:41.835 --> 00:58:43.657
let's say the computer within a Tesla

00:58:43.677 --> 00:58:46.958
costs two and a half thousand dollars.

00:58:47.677 --> 00:58:49.059
Then you can divide that

00:58:49.099 --> 00:58:50.599
twenty billion to the two

00:58:50.619 --> 00:58:51.920
and a half thousand and see

00:58:51.940 --> 00:58:53.041
how many cars you need to

00:58:53.081 --> 00:58:55.280
come to the same compute as

00:58:55.340 --> 00:59:01.043
that super cluster, as a rough estimation,

00:59:01.063 --> 00:59:01.784
because those are

00:59:01.824 --> 00:59:03.123
specialized computers and I

00:59:03.143 --> 00:59:04.005
understand all that.

00:59:04.706 --> 00:59:05.967
But the amount of compute

00:59:05.987 --> 00:59:08.789
will start exceeding that

00:59:09.170 --> 00:59:11.492
very rapidly when cars are

00:59:11.512 --> 00:59:14.755
coming off the line every five seconds.

00:59:14.835 --> 00:59:15.916
And it's a combination, too,

00:59:15.956 --> 00:59:17.577
of the car is going to need

00:59:17.617 --> 00:59:19.920
that compute itself, perhaps.

00:59:20.579 --> 00:59:22.021
But certainly when it's idle,

00:59:23.163 --> 00:59:25.083
you can use that compute, right,

00:59:25.123 --> 00:59:26.144
for other things,

00:59:26.244 --> 00:59:28.226
less maybe time sensitive type work.

00:59:29.565 --> 00:59:30.585
um it remains to be seen

00:59:30.847 --> 00:59:31.947
it's certainly a nice asset

00:59:31.987 --> 00:59:32.606
and the other thing that

00:59:32.626 --> 00:59:34.188
we're not mentioning is the

00:59:34.228 --> 00:59:36.068
same ship is in the

00:59:36.088 --> 00:59:37.128
humanoid robot it's an

00:59:37.168 --> 00:59:39.809
optimus as well right now

00:59:39.829 --> 00:59:40.670
maybe there's one chip

00:59:40.710 --> 00:59:41.690
instead of two in there but

00:59:41.731 --> 00:59:42.871
still it doesn't take many

00:59:42.931 --> 00:59:44.030
optimists to get you know

00:59:44.130 --> 00:59:44.972
equal to the fleet of the

00:59:44.992 --> 00:59:46.851
vehicle so they're going to

00:59:46.891 --> 00:59:49.233
have a massive mobile

00:59:49.313 --> 00:59:51.193
distributed inference capability

00:59:51.990 --> 00:59:52.431
Yeah,

00:59:52.490 --> 00:59:55.052
I'm not as technically advanced as

00:59:55.311 --> 00:59:57.532
most of the people are,

00:59:57.572 --> 00:59:59.353
but is it possible to train

00:59:59.393 --> 01:00:00.733
like AI models on that

01:00:00.773 --> 01:00:01.693
computer as well that are

01:00:01.713 --> 01:00:04.014
in the cars and maybe an

01:00:04.034 --> 01:00:04.853
optimist in a while?

01:00:05.414 --> 01:00:06.014
I don't think so.

01:00:06.034 --> 01:00:06.795
I don't think it would be

01:00:06.835 --> 01:00:07.715
optimized for that.

01:00:07.855 --> 01:00:09.715
I think it's more for inference, which.

01:00:10.596 --> 01:00:11.916
Ninety five percent of what

01:00:11.956 --> 01:00:13.336
we need for AI ultimately

01:00:13.356 --> 01:00:15.476
will be inference once you

01:00:15.496 --> 01:00:16.036
build the model.

01:00:16.317 --> 01:00:17.398
So it's good.

01:00:17.458 --> 01:00:18.398
It's going to be in the right place.

01:00:19.532 --> 01:00:23.432
So sort of a napkin

01:00:23.452 --> 01:00:25.193
calculation to have twenty

01:00:25.313 --> 01:00:30.034
billion in compute requires

01:00:30.155 --> 01:00:31.815
roughly eight million cars

01:00:33.355 --> 01:00:34.635
to get on the road.

01:00:34.675 --> 01:00:37.496
So when you're then at the

01:00:37.556 --> 01:00:40.217
point of having twenty

01:00:40.257 --> 01:00:42.117
million cars being built annually,

01:00:43.217 --> 01:00:44.418
then you see how much

01:00:44.478 --> 01:00:47.719
compute also is going to be

01:00:47.798 --> 01:00:48.778
just by selling cars.

01:00:50.298 --> 01:00:50.719
It's crazy.

01:00:52.382 --> 01:00:53.804
I mean, this is going to be amazing.

01:00:53.864 --> 01:00:56.108
And I think we need to do a

01:00:56.170 --> 01:00:57.251
deep dive into this in one

01:00:57.271 --> 01:00:58.313
of our next episodes.

01:00:58.853 --> 01:01:00.556
So we need to invite

01:01:00.577 --> 01:01:01.840
somebody who's going to

01:01:02.260 --> 01:01:03.262
help us explain this.

01:01:04.460 --> 01:01:05.440
I think for this episode,

01:01:05.920 --> 01:01:08.240
we would like to touch on two more items.

01:01:09.561 --> 01:01:10.702
One is the Age of Abundance,

01:01:10.742 --> 01:01:12.682
which I want to discuss in ten minutes.

01:01:14.063 --> 01:01:15.943
But we also wanted to

01:01:15.983 --> 01:01:18.065
discuss the Doge flywheel.

01:01:19.085 --> 01:01:19.704
Maybe, Damien,

01:01:19.744 --> 01:01:21.445
you can answer some

01:01:21.465 --> 01:01:22.385
questions about this and

01:01:22.405 --> 01:01:25.126
how you envision this Doge

01:01:25.246 --> 01:01:27.228
being a flywheel for Tesla as well.

01:01:27.954 --> 01:01:28.534
Yeah, yeah.

01:01:28.635 --> 01:01:32.235
And just flywheel for let's

01:01:32.396 --> 01:01:33.677
let Bridget for that sort

01:01:33.717 --> 01:01:35.378
of age of abundance.

01:01:36.117 --> 01:01:37.318
And obviously there's a lot

01:01:37.358 --> 01:01:41.579
of dirt where let's say we

01:01:41.619 --> 01:01:42.860
as a society as a whole

01:01:42.900 --> 01:01:43.800
need to go through.

01:01:43.880 --> 01:01:46.740
So a lot of secrets are being revealed,

01:01:46.760 --> 01:01:47.382
a lot of things,

01:01:47.402 --> 01:01:48.541
how sort of the system has

01:01:48.581 --> 01:01:52.862
been operating behind the scenes.

01:01:53.824 --> 01:01:54.023
But

01:01:54.943 --> 01:01:55.885
Yeah, for me,

01:01:55.925 --> 01:01:58.246
I think that's a lot of noise

01:01:58.286 --> 01:02:00.188
and not very much signal

01:02:01.570 --> 01:02:02.490
that we're hearing there.

01:02:02.751 --> 01:02:05.432
So we talked about it in our

01:02:05.492 --> 01:02:07.594
podcast that the whole Doge

01:02:07.655 --> 01:02:09.297
operation is a sort of five

01:02:10.317 --> 01:02:12.679
pillar flywheel that Elon

01:02:12.699 --> 01:02:13.480
has created there.

01:02:13.519 --> 01:02:14.820
So the first one is

01:02:15.041 --> 01:02:16.822
obviously cost savings.

01:02:16.862 --> 01:02:18.545
So people keep more money in the pocket.

01:02:20.061 --> 01:02:21.461
And we start seeing the

01:02:21.501 --> 01:02:22.762
savings of those being

01:02:23.362 --> 01:02:27.043
openly being published on their website.

01:02:28.244 --> 01:02:30.864
The second is less regulation.

01:02:32.344 --> 01:02:33.144
What that means for

01:02:33.204 --> 01:02:35.266
companies is so much money

01:02:35.286 --> 01:02:36.485
is now being spent of

01:02:37.726 --> 01:02:40.427
lawyers and administration

01:02:40.487 --> 01:02:43.108
just to keep your business running.

01:02:43.307 --> 01:02:45.467
Depends on what kind of sector you are.

01:02:45.507 --> 01:02:46.427
But let's say you're in the

01:02:46.467 --> 01:02:47.349
banking system.

01:02:47.409 --> 01:02:49.048
Well, you already need like

01:02:49.766 --> 01:02:51.007
fifty two hundred million a

01:02:51.047 --> 01:02:52.708
year to just uh operate

01:02:52.728 --> 01:02:54.550
your your bank and a lot of

01:02:54.590 --> 01:02:56.050
these people will start you

01:02:56.271 --> 01:02:58.413
know need to uh start doing

01:02:58.452 --> 01:02:59.994
something else but if you

01:03:00.034 --> 01:03:01.155
think about it from a sort

01:03:01.195 --> 01:03:02.735
of productivity standpoint

01:03:03.275 --> 01:03:04.396
those people are just

01:03:04.556 --> 01:03:05.777
referees on the field and

01:03:05.818 --> 01:03:07.898
not and not players so I

01:03:07.938 --> 01:03:10.340
think that whole efficiency

01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:13.463
thing is uh is um it's not

01:03:13.543 --> 01:03:15.083
only less rules and

01:03:15.123 --> 01:03:16.644
regulation but also people

01:03:16.844 --> 01:03:17.766
being freeing up and

01:03:17.806 --> 01:03:19.586
starting being more productive

01:03:19.746 --> 01:03:19.887
Yeah.

01:03:20.007 --> 01:03:21.487
Entering more productive roles.

01:03:22.327 --> 01:03:24.369
So even touch on that.

01:03:24.409 --> 01:03:25.550
And that's point number three.

01:03:25.570 --> 01:03:28.090
So people moving from a sort

01:03:28.130 --> 01:03:30.152
of bad operating system to

01:03:30.351 --> 01:03:32.873
a more efficient operating

01:03:32.893 --> 01:03:34.875
system and use the analogy

01:03:34.914 --> 01:03:36.355
of East Berlin versus West

01:03:36.414 --> 01:03:38.155
Berlin at that point.

01:03:39.797 --> 01:03:42.639
So that will go into to add.

01:03:44.141 --> 01:03:46.123
We have seen the cost savings already.

01:03:46.143 --> 01:03:48.083
So point number one is already in place.

01:03:48.164 --> 01:03:50.625
We have seen the efficiency.

01:03:50.644 --> 01:03:52.706
So Doge is also publishing

01:03:54.387 --> 01:03:55.547
the amount of rules and

01:03:55.586 --> 01:03:56.927
words being used in things.

01:03:57.768 --> 01:03:59.268
And we start already seeing

01:03:59.429 --> 01:04:01.190
sort of job numbers that

01:04:01.210 --> 01:04:03.630
are quite positive in the US.

01:04:04.251 --> 01:04:06.612
So that means a lot of new

01:04:07.052 --> 01:04:07.954
initiatives are being

01:04:08.014 --> 01:04:10.956
started and investments are being made.

01:04:11.797 --> 01:04:12.657
The fourth pillar is

01:04:12.757 --> 01:04:14.318
obviously a very important one,

01:04:14.719 --> 01:04:16.219
the lower interest rates,

01:04:16.260 --> 01:04:17.420
because now you keep more

01:04:17.460 --> 01:04:18.501
money in your pocket as a

01:04:18.541 --> 01:04:19.402
government as well,

01:04:19.483 --> 01:04:22.204
so you can have better conditions there.

01:04:22.684 --> 01:04:23.306
Therefore,

01:04:23.405 --> 01:04:26.909
less cost for people in their daily lives,

01:04:26.929 --> 01:04:28.469
because in the end,

01:04:28.550 --> 01:04:29.731
the consumers are paying

01:04:29.771 --> 01:04:30.672
that interest rate.

01:04:31.271 --> 01:04:32.333
be it by mortgages,

01:04:32.393 --> 01:04:33.733
being by goods or services,

01:04:33.753 --> 01:04:35.135
just be more expensive.

01:04:36.175 --> 01:04:38.237
And the fifth pillar is that

01:04:38.717 --> 01:04:39.818
it just becomes more

01:04:39.878 --> 01:04:41.119
attractive to work and

01:04:41.159 --> 01:04:44.182
start your company.

01:04:45.784 --> 01:04:47.766
Because if there's less

01:04:47.806 --> 01:04:49.206
rules or regulations and

01:04:49.226 --> 01:04:50.228
there's more access to

01:04:50.288 --> 01:04:51.889
people and there's more

01:04:52.429 --> 01:04:54.050
money that you keep in your pocket,

01:04:54.911 --> 01:04:55.952
then the incentives are

01:04:55.972 --> 01:04:57.393
aligned to sort of start

01:04:57.413 --> 01:04:58.333
your own business and

01:04:58.853 --> 01:05:00.094
become more entrepreneurial.

01:05:00.215 --> 01:05:02.717
So there's a lot of data

01:05:02.737 --> 01:05:03.878
that shows the less

01:05:04.259 --> 01:05:05.920
bureaucratic a country is,

01:05:06.000 --> 01:05:07.101
the more entrepreneurial

01:05:07.161 --> 01:05:08.181
becomes and the more

01:05:09.182 --> 01:05:10.023
uh the more wealth you

01:05:10.083 --> 01:05:11.664
create as a as a company

01:05:12.224 --> 01:05:14.126
and I think all those five

01:05:15.987 --> 01:05:17.628
uh uh pillars will

01:05:17.949 --> 01:05:19.530
influence tesla very much

01:05:19.550 --> 01:05:21.871
for the good because um

01:05:22.891 --> 01:05:25.134
because those teslas are

01:05:25.414 --> 01:05:27.074
are being used for people

01:05:27.114 --> 01:05:28.235
in their daily lives so

01:05:28.576 --> 01:05:30.518
financing becomes more attractive

01:05:31.717 --> 01:05:32.878
um that that's the thing

01:05:32.918 --> 01:05:33.958
people have more money in

01:05:33.978 --> 01:05:35.338
the pocket so they can buy

01:05:35.998 --> 01:05:37.498
a sort of car in in that

01:05:37.539 --> 01:05:39.800
sort of segment um do it

01:05:39.820 --> 01:05:41.460
yeah maybe that's a bit of

01:05:41.480 --> 01:05:43.780
an optimist view on on how

01:05:43.840 --> 01:05:46.360
things go but um I think we

01:05:46.400 --> 01:05:49.001
already seen the first uh

01:05:49.041 --> 01:05:51.141
the first things in in

01:05:51.282 --> 01:05:52.681
interest rates coming down

01:05:52.882 --> 01:05:54.661
and uh savings that are

01:05:54.681 --> 01:05:55.902
being made that this

01:05:55.922 --> 01:05:57.543
flywheels now already start

01:05:57.682 --> 01:05:58.503
uh start rolling

01:06:00.467 --> 01:06:00.746
Yeah,

01:06:00.766 --> 01:06:02.068
I think that's a really good observation.

01:06:02.108 --> 01:06:02.507
And actually,

01:06:02.588 --> 01:06:05.608
I would even extend it a little further.

01:06:05.628 --> 01:06:06.568
And this takes us right into

01:06:06.608 --> 01:06:10.251
this idea of sustainable abundance.

01:06:10.331 --> 01:06:10.670
Right.

01:06:10.710 --> 01:06:11.690
So again, as I mentioned,

01:06:11.731 --> 01:06:13.032
for the first time in human history,

01:06:13.072 --> 01:06:14.092
we're developing a machine

01:06:14.112 --> 01:06:16.813
that can outcompete us.

01:06:16.913 --> 01:06:18.313
So think about this.

01:06:19.054 --> 01:06:20.233
You've got a nation that has

01:06:20.293 --> 01:06:22.094
that and a nation that doesn't.

01:06:23.436 --> 01:06:24.695
It doesn't take much to

01:06:24.755 --> 01:06:25.695
imagine that the nation

01:06:25.717 --> 01:06:26.577
that doesn't have that

01:06:26.757 --> 01:06:28.036
suddenly is not competitive

01:06:28.376 --> 01:06:29.478
against the nation that does.

01:06:31.474 --> 01:06:33.235
and so for me doge is kind

01:06:33.255 --> 01:06:34.235
of a metaphor for the

01:06:34.275 --> 01:06:35.735
process that every country

01:06:36.436 --> 01:06:38.257
every company and basically

01:06:38.277 --> 01:06:39.436
every family needs to go

01:06:39.456 --> 01:06:41.597
through to make sure that

01:06:41.617 --> 01:06:42.498
they're not wasting that

01:06:42.518 --> 01:06:43.438
they're saving that they're

01:06:43.458 --> 01:06:45.239
efficient etc etc because

01:06:45.900 --> 01:06:47.201
this change that is about

01:06:47.240 --> 01:06:50.041
to come with ai powered

01:06:50.181 --> 01:06:52.782
humanoid robots and cars

01:06:52.802 --> 01:06:56.864
that drive themselves is such a powerful

01:06:59.295 --> 01:07:00.635
competitive force on the

01:07:00.675 --> 01:07:01.996
world that we've never seen before.

01:07:02.056 --> 01:07:03.757
And it's going to hit us so quickly.

01:07:05.217 --> 01:07:06.257
And I don't think really

01:07:06.378 --> 01:07:07.619
hardly anybody appreciates

01:07:07.958 --> 01:07:11.541
how rapid this change is going to come.

01:07:11.561 --> 01:07:14.362
So think about this too,

01:07:14.481 --> 01:07:17.963
in terms of let's just

01:07:18.003 --> 01:07:21.864
imagine a world where all

01:07:21.925 --> 01:07:24.766
labor is done by a humanoid robot.

01:07:24.786 --> 01:07:26.047
Let's assume that eventually

01:07:26.067 --> 01:07:26.927
we get to the point where

01:07:26.967 --> 01:07:28.047
bots are that capable.

01:07:31.402 --> 01:07:35.525
Now think about your family.

01:07:35.565 --> 01:07:37.206
You've got parents,

01:07:38.166 --> 01:07:40.688
one or two that work and

01:07:40.728 --> 01:07:42.170
they provide for the kids.

01:07:42.190 --> 01:07:44.951
Okay.

01:07:45.092 --> 01:07:47.492
And most families provide

01:07:47.572 --> 01:07:48.914
whatever they can for the kids, right?

01:07:48.974 --> 01:07:50.215
Like we're not looking for

01:07:50.235 --> 01:07:51.135
the kids to work.

01:07:51.896 --> 01:07:53.697
Now, hundreds of years ago,

01:07:53.717 --> 01:07:54.317
that was the case.

01:07:54.356 --> 01:07:55.297
Kids used to work.

01:07:56.331 --> 01:07:58.150
But now we don't do that so much anymore,

01:07:58.170 --> 01:07:59.172
at least in the Western world.

01:07:59.592 --> 01:08:02.632
Kenny is being raised as a kid to work.

01:08:03.293 --> 01:08:04.452
There you go.

01:08:04.472 --> 01:08:07.014
There's always a few exceptions.

01:08:07.034 --> 01:08:08.313
But think about the humanoid

01:08:08.353 --> 01:08:11.454
robot world where adults no

01:08:11.494 --> 01:08:13.954
longer need to work to

01:08:13.994 --> 01:08:16.836
provide for the family at the extreme.

01:08:18.136 --> 01:08:18.996
So in that sense,

01:08:19.917 --> 01:08:22.096
we all become kids in that

01:08:22.157 --> 01:08:22.777
sense and that we're

01:08:22.796 --> 01:08:23.997
dependent upon this new

01:08:24.037 --> 01:08:25.858
form of labor to provide things for us.

01:08:28.081 --> 01:08:29.362
Now you could imagine that

01:08:29.381 --> 01:08:30.984
that might end badly if we

01:08:31.003 --> 01:08:31.984
all sit around and eat ice

01:08:32.024 --> 01:08:33.266
cream and lay on the couch

01:08:33.306 --> 01:08:36.090
all day because we don't need to work.

01:08:36.109 --> 01:08:37.030
And I suppose a few people

01:08:37.051 --> 01:08:37.952
will opt to do that.

01:08:39.474 --> 01:08:41.275
But it also frees up humans

01:08:41.315 --> 01:08:42.757
from the toil of labor.

01:08:44.618 --> 01:08:46.180
There's no more need to

01:08:46.340 --> 01:08:48.462
exchange labor for money

01:08:48.943 --> 01:08:51.344
and scarcity becomes a thing of the past.

01:08:51.885 --> 01:08:52.385
And of course,

01:08:52.585 --> 01:08:54.306
there's this human nature

01:08:54.886 --> 01:08:56.328
view that has always lived

01:08:56.588 --> 01:08:58.829
out there that a human is

01:08:59.070 --> 01:09:02.273
lazy by nature and that has

01:09:02.353 --> 01:09:04.614
held back like a universal basic income,

01:09:04.654 --> 01:09:05.176
for instance,

01:09:05.216 --> 01:09:07.797
to pop up whilst experiments,

01:09:08.417 --> 01:09:10.619
however minor they were all

01:09:10.659 --> 01:09:11.301
around the globe,

01:09:11.501 --> 01:09:13.242
prove the exact opposite.

01:09:13.301 --> 01:09:14.302
That's right.

01:09:14.681 --> 01:09:16.323
And we're about to test that theory,

01:09:16.382 --> 01:09:18.264
I think, at scale pretty rapidly.

01:09:19.604 --> 01:09:20.925
Because initially,

01:09:20.944 --> 01:09:22.305
humanoid certainly will be

01:09:22.626 --> 01:09:24.746
a tool for us to be better at our jobs.

01:09:24.765 --> 01:09:25.766
It'll be like an assistant.

01:09:26.546 --> 01:09:27.547
And then it'll start taking

01:09:27.587 --> 01:09:28.868
the jobs that humans don't want.

01:09:29.148 --> 01:09:29.729
That's great.

01:09:30.189 --> 01:09:30.969
And then it's going to start

01:09:31.029 --> 01:09:31.770
taking every job.

01:09:33.449 --> 01:09:34.930
And the change will be like that.

01:09:36.813 --> 01:09:37.533
I don't know when that is.

01:09:37.573 --> 01:09:38.934
It might be ten, fifteen years from now,

01:09:39.014 --> 01:09:41.253
but that point is coming.

01:09:41.293 --> 01:09:41.793
In the early days,

01:09:41.814 --> 01:09:42.954
it's going to look really clumsy.

01:09:42.994 --> 01:09:44.215
These robots today still

01:09:44.234 --> 01:09:46.515
look pretty clumsy.

01:09:46.935 --> 01:09:47.956
Walking like Joe Biden or

01:09:47.975 --> 01:09:52.237
whoever you want to know

01:09:52.256 --> 01:09:52.957
what they're walking like.

01:09:53.757 --> 01:09:54.757
But make no mistake,

01:09:54.797 --> 01:09:56.438
they are the worst they're

01:09:56.478 --> 01:09:57.538
ever going to be right now.

01:09:58.618 --> 01:09:59.259
You just need to think

01:09:59.298 --> 01:10:01.000
forward a little bit and

01:10:01.180 --> 01:10:02.520
it's a profound change on

01:10:02.560 --> 01:10:03.439
the entire world.

01:10:03.479 --> 01:10:05.980
So I think back to your point that

01:10:06.569 --> 01:10:07.229
Doge, I think,

01:10:07.310 --> 01:10:09.211
is just the process that we

01:10:09.270 --> 01:10:11.371
all need to go through.

01:10:11.470 --> 01:10:13.511
And I'm really interested to

01:10:13.551 --> 01:10:15.351
see which country is next

01:10:15.431 --> 01:10:19.632
in line to do a Doge-type effort.

01:10:19.912 --> 01:10:21.712
And the quicker that countries do that,

01:10:21.773 --> 01:10:24.154
the better off they will be.

01:10:24.194 --> 01:10:27.033
Because in this world that's coming,

01:10:27.453 --> 01:10:28.715
it's going to be a force of

01:10:28.795 --> 01:10:30.935
deflation like we've never seen before.

01:10:32.770 --> 01:10:34.192
And so if you're not already

01:10:34.231 --> 01:10:35.113
efficient and lean,

01:10:35.153 --> 01:10:38.395
it's going to be a very painful process.

01:10:38.416 --> 01:10:40.497
Can you explain why that's

01:10:40.518 --> 01:10:42.779
going to be a painful process?

01:10:43.060 --> 01:10:44.481
Because it feels a little

01:10:44.502 --> 01:10:45.442
bit contradictory.

01:10:45.502 --> 01:10:46.863
If there's enough money

01:10:47.463 --> 01:10:49.305
being made by robots,

01:10:49.905 --> 01:10:50.827
why do you care about

01:10:50.846 --> 01:10:52.007
efficiency in the government?

01:10:52.769 --> 01:10:53.430
Well,

01:10:53.569 --> 01:10:55.310
it's the transition that I think is

01:10:55.350 --> 01:10:55.671
risky.

01:10:56.672 --> 01:10:57.094
Exactly.

01:10:57.113 --> 01:10:59.216
And like before we dive into it,

01:10:59.235 --> 01:11:00.957
because a very good question, Florian,

01:11:01.158 --> 01:11:04.360
and I've put it on screen a bit before,

01:11:04.400 --> 01:11:06.363
but there's this article by

01:11:06.403 --> 01:11:09.046
Roboflock and he said

01:11:09.206 --> 01:11:11.027
actually that in order to

01:11:11.167 --> 01:11:13.048
get to that state of abundance,

01:11:13.829 --> 01:11:14.930
we now need to put in

01:11:15.885 --> 01:11:18.967
the most effort and the hard

01:11:19.009 --> 01:11:21.390
work to actually prepare for that.

01:11:21.430 --> 01:11:22.872
And I think, yeah, Cern,

01:11:22.912 --> 01:11:24.555
you're going to enlighten us.

01:11:24.595 --> 01:11:25.935
But this article,

01:11:25.996 --> 01:11:27.837
I can recommend it to everyone.

01:11:28.679 --> 01:11:30.220
It's from Ed Roboflock.

01:11:30.780 --> 01:11:32.823
He is laying it out perfectly here.

01:11:33.003 --> 01:11:34.385
And also he's basing his

01:11:34.425 --> 01:11:37.828
work on Tony Siba and other things.

01:11:39.761 --> 01:11:42.262
I'm in order of, let's say, next in line,

01:11:42.302 --> 01:11:42.564
sir.

01:11:42.583 --> 01:11:44.264
And I'm, I think,

01:11:44.344 --> 01:11:45.965
optimistic because Elon

01:11:46.185 --> 01:11:47.465
always famously wears his

01:11:47.545 --> 01:11:49.086
tech support T-shirt.

01:11:49.945 --> 01:11:52.646
So he builds this this up

01:11:52.686 --> 01:11:54.847
from a technological solution.

01:11:54.927 --> 01:11:59.130
And and I even, you know,

01:11:59.149 --> 01:12:00.310
have been I've been talking

01:12:00.329 --> 01:12:02.951
with with Florian about XAI.

01:12:03.994 --> 01:12:05.336
sort of shadow running the

01:12:05.416 --> 01:12:07.197
operations on X because he

01:12:07.237 --> 01:12:08.658
just wants to have the

01:12:08.698 --> 01:12:10.198
wizard engineers building

01:12:10.238 --> 01:12:13.979
sort of the future of that app.

01:12:14.801 --> 01:12:16.362
And I think same goes for

01:12:16.402 --> 01:12:17.402
government because it's

01:12:17.442 --> 01:12:19.622
such a headache to work

01:12:19.643 --> 01:12:21.564
with the cobalt and all the

01:12:21.604 --> 01:12:22.904
legacy technology.

01:12:24.405 --> 01:12:26.127
I was called that ex-founder

01:12:26.287 --> 01:12:27.768
of Airbnb that is on board.

01:12:29.617 --> 01:12:32.439
You talked briefly about

01:12:32.759 --> 01:12:34.060
sort of having an Apple or

01:12:34.239 --> 01:12:35.780
Airbnb like experience for

01:12:35.900 --> 01:12:37.162
all your stuff for the government.

01:12:38.403 --> 01:12:43.006
And this is also what was

01:12:43.046 --> 01:12:45.268
being touched on one of the

01:12:45.349 --> 01:12:47.449
earlier interviews with Marc Andreessen,

01:12:47.489 --> 01:12:48.430
where he talked about what

01:12:48.451 --> 01:12:49.452
these guys are building in

01:12:49.492 --> 01:12:50.252
the background.

01:12:50.813 --> 01:12:54.154
It's like the truly groundbreaking stuff.

01:12:54.175 --> 01:12:56.356
So now it's a lot of noise

01:12:57.757 --> 01:12:58.878
with some cops and all the

01:12:58.918 --> 01:13:00.380
bills that are being published.

01:13:00.399 --> 01:13:02.442
So that's just a sort of stage one work.

01:13:03.301 --> 01:13:05.063
Same with Twitter, right?

01:13:05.082 --> 01:13:08.264
So let's keep the things in the air,

01:13:08.283 --> 01:13:10.265
make sure it's not loss making anymore.

01:13:10.886 --> 01:13:11.746
And from there on,

01:13:11.805 --> 01:13:14.386
we start the innovation part.

01:13:15.007 --> 01:13:16.868
And since the legacy is so

01:13:16.927 --> 01:13:19.128
painful with systems of fifty years old,

01:13:19.510 --> 01:13:20.470
it will be probably

01:13:20.609 --> 01:13:23.831
overhauled in one big overtake.

01:13:23.871 --> 01:13:25.912
And that sort of template of

01:13:25.931 --> 01:13:27.212
how to operate these kind

01:13:27.233 --> 01:13:28.774
of things will be then

01:13:29.914 --> 01:13:31.015
more easily let's say

01:13:31.095 --> 01:13:32.456
accessible for governments

01:13:32.515 --> 01:13:34.596
around the world let's hope

01:13:34.636 --> 01:13:36.837
so yeah and I think what

01:13:37.097 --> 01:13:38.279
the point that I want to

01:13:38.319 --> 01:13:39.378
try to emphasize here too

01:13:39.458 --> 01:13:42.041
is that you know the system

01:13:42.060 --> 01:13:43.081
that we have in the united

01:13:43.140 --> 01:13:44.862
states is critical for

01:13:44.902 --> 01:13:46.122
developing this technology

01:13:47.262 --> 01:13:48.503
but as this technology

01:13:48.543 --> 01:13:50.003
propagates through society

01:13:51.125 --> 01:13:53.246
the system that I think and

01:13:53.265 --> 01:13:54.706
by and large that we we

01:13:54.725 --> 01:13:55.987
have we see more in europe

01:13:57.204 --> 01:13:57.926
is going to be more

01:13:57.985 --> 01:13:58.966
necessary in terms of that

01:13:59.025 --> 01:14:00.346
mindset in terms of taking

01:14:00.386 --> 01:14:01.627
care of people and and

01:14:01.688 --> 01:14:02.908
dealing with the fallout of

01:14:02.948 --> 01:14:04.069
this as people start to

01:14:04.109 --> 01:14:06.671
lose their jobs to robots

01:14:07.992 --> 01:14:08.993
those people need to be

01:14:09.052 --> 01:14:10.613
taken care of in some way

01:14:10.654 --> 01:14:11.914
that's that's respectful

01:14:11.935 --> 01:14:13.296
that works economically

01:14:13.315 --> 01:14:16.457
yeah right and not allowed

01:14:16.478 --> 01:14:17.918
to become a political force

01:14:17.939 --> 01:14:19.060
that's trying to stop this

01:14:19.100 --> 01:14:20.239
technology because if we

01:14:20.300 --> 01:14:22.622
stop it you know what china is not

01:14:23.873 --> 01:14:25.494
No, I will be late.

01:14:25.515 --> 01:14:26.036
We'll be late.

01:14:26.376 --> 01:14:28.417
And so this is a very key time.

01:14:28.518 --> 01:14:30.038
And, and particularly now with the,

01:14:30.059 --> 01:14:30.979
like in the United States

01:14:31.020 --> 01:14:32.581
with the political environment,

01:14:33.481 --> 01:14:34.682
I've often said that if I

01:14:34.703 --> 01:14:36.545
was an advisor to the democratic party,

01:14:36.984 --> 01:14:38.305
I would get them to embrace

01:14:38.426 --> 01:14:41.929
Elon more than Trump is embracing him.

01:14:41.948 --> 01:14:42.989
They should be fighting over

01:14:43.050 --> 01:14:44.530
guys like him.

01:14:44.650 --> 01:14:45.271
Yeah.

01:14:45.351 --> 01:14:46.493
And that, that that's,

01:14:46.613 --> 01:14:47.514
they're doing the exact

01:14:47.594 --> 01:14:48.373
opposite right now.

01:14:48.474 --> 01:14:50.136
And they're so underestimating.

01:14:50.922 --> 01:14:52.423
what this guy is capable of.

01:14:54.645 --> 01:14:57.306
I think he explained it

01:14:57.346 --> 01:14:58.969
pretty well in the same

01:14:59.009 --> 01:14:59.889
interview that we just

01:14:59.908 --> 01:15:00.810
showed in the beginning

01:15:02.190 --> 01:15:07.113
about setting up a free terrorist zone.

01:15:07.814 --> 01:15:08.755
He also mentioned in that

01:15:08.795 --> 01:15:11.256
same interview is that the

01:15:11.317 --> 01:15:13.917
people who are not in favor

01:15:13.979 --> 01:15:16.000
of this are the current establishment

01:15:16.795 --> 01:15:18.556
And those are the big, big companies.

01:15:19.797 --> 01:15:20.757
The big companies,

01:15:21.759 --> 01:15:22.939
they have their cash flows,

01:15:23.301 --> 01:15:24.060
they have their dividends,

01:15:24.081 --> 01:15:25.462
they have their shareholders, et cetera.

01:15:26.122 --> 01:15:27.184
And the big companies are

01:15:27.243 --> 01:15:28.465
not known for innovation.

01:15:29.565 --> 01:15:31.368
So they know they're going

01:15:31.387 --> 01:15:32.788
to lose against innovation.

01:15:33.909 --> 01:15:35.350
So what do they do in order

01:15:35.390 --> 01:15:37.092
to stop innovation is they

01:15:37.153 --> 01:15:38.713
build a lot of rules.

01:15:39.494 --> 01:15:40.114
Complexity.

01:15:42.636 --> 01:15:44.078
And they thrive on scarcity.

01:15:44.099 --> 01:15:44.399
Yes.

01:15:45.338 --> 01:15:46.939
They thrive on scarcity of goods.

01:15:47.399 --> 01:15:49.981
But the most important thing is, is, uh,

01:15:50.021 --> 01:15:51.443
we should keep innovation at,

01:15:51.762 --> 01:15:53.583
at the low lowest point as

01:15:53.623 --> 01:15:55.505
possible because innovation

01:15:55.524 --> 01:15:56.805
is going to really disrupt us.

01:15:57.846 --> 01:15:59.728
So I think that's the, the,

01:15:59.908 --> 01:16:01.109
the real problem right now

01:16:01.229 --> 01:16:02.609
is that we have to shift

01:16:03.489 --> 01:16:06.872
from the establishment to,

01:16:07.072 --> 01:16:08.052
to new innovation,

01:16:08.073 --> 01:16:09.474
which is already knocking on our door.

01:16:11.694 --> 01:16:12.996
China is already doing this.

01:16:13.515 --> 01:16:14.976
So China is the new world.

01:16:16.296 --> 01:16:19.338
And we, Europe, and together with US,

01:16:19.479 --> 01:16:20.338
are the old world.

01:16:21.079 --> 01:16:23.881
And we are trying to keep it

01:16:25.622 --> 01:16:26.322
in the same place.

01:16:26.341 --> 01:16:27.802
But we are seeing that we

01:16:27.823 --> 01:16:28.783
are getting disrupted.

01:16:28.863 --> 01:16:31.725
So I think we are in an

01:16:31.784 --> 01:16:33.265
amazing transition phase

01:16:33.586 --> 01:16:35.146
where actually a lot of

01:16:35.186 --> 01:16:36.108
things are going to break.

01:16:36.988 --> 01:16:37.929
But there's also a lot of

01:16:37.948 --> 01:16:39.890
things which we can build up again.

01:16:39.930 --> 01:16:42.390
And this is this age of

01:16:42.451 --> 01:16:44.931
abundance that Ilan is talking about.

01:16:47.264 --> 01:16:48.524
Yeah, first.

01:16:50.006 --> 01:16:52.529
So what I'm trying to go to

01:16:52.588 --> 01:16:57.154
is to that article that you

01:16:57.173 --> 01:16:59.555
were showing a case is actually,

01:17:00.877 --> 01:17:02.458
it's a pretty good article.

01:17:02.618 --> 01:17:03.579
And if you pop it up,

01:17:03.720 --> 01:17:05.301
I can walk through a little

01:17:05.320 --> 01:17:08.805
bit through it to see if we can

01:17:09.194 --> 01:17:10.935
touch upon some stuff which

01:17:10.996 --> 01:17:12.015
are written in that article

01:17:12.076 --> 01:17:13.855
but one of the things that

01:17:14.015 --> 01:17:19.057
um so we we learned from

01:17:19.158 --> 01:17:20.637
elon like three weeks ago

01:17:20.677 --> 01:17:21.998
four weeks ago that the new

01:17:22.059 --> 01:17:23.319
mission of tesla is the

01:17:23.338 --> 01:17:25.020
sustainable abundance um

01:17:26.880 --> 01:17:27.680
and this is actually the

01:17:27.739 --> 01:17:29.320
mission for humanity's future

01:17:30.836 --> 01:17:32.176
So we talked about what does

01:17:32.216 --> 01:17:33.037
abundance mean?

01:17:33.438 --> 01:17:33.698
Well,

01:17:33.978 --> 01:17:35.720
abundance means that we don't need to

01:17:35.760 --> 01:17:36.359
work anymore.

01:17:36.399 --> 01:17:37.581
We don't need money anymore.

01:17:38.081 --> 01:17:39.082
We have a lot of abundance.

01:17:39.101 --> 01:17:41.403
So he tells there's already

01:17:41.443 --> 01:17:43.324
some abundance already in our world,

01:17:43.345 --> 01:17:45.006
which is the Internet and water supply.

01:17:46.506 --> 01:17:48.908
But he also says that he got

01:17:48.969 --> 01:17:50.810
some lessons from reading

01:17:50.869 --> 01:17:52.150
the Ian Banks series.

01:17:53.220 --> 01:17:54.820
And Ilan referred to these

01:17:54.900 --> 01:17:57.243
books several times to

01:17:57.302 --> 01:17:59.005
explain to people how he

01:17:59.085 --> 01:18:01.266
sees this future of abundance.

01:18:02.207 --> 01:18:04.809
And this book talks about AI

01:18:04.948 --> 01:18:07.251
and humanity actually

01:18:07.652 --> 01:18:09.592
converging and living in a

01:18:09.672 --> 01:18:11.033
world where there's abundance.

01:18:11.194 --> 01:18:14.457
So it's amazing that we are

01:18:14.476 --> 01:18:16.337
actually going into this place.

01:18:16.618 --> 01:18:18.180
This is the place that he

01:18:18.239 --> 01:18:19.180
wants us to go to.

01:18:22.099 --> 01:18:22.939
So in this world,

01:18:24.099 --> 01:18:25.439
work transforms into an

01:18:25.539 --> 01:18:27.279
optional activity driven by

01:18:27.380 --> 01:18:29.940
personal interest and not

01:18:29.980 --> 01:18:31.520
by economic necessity anymore.

01:18:32.081 --> 01:18:34.001
Money loses its relevance

01:18:34.782 --> 01:18:36.341
and time takes center stage.

01:18:36.662 --> 01:18:39.622
So that's what I wanted to

01:18:39.662 --> 01:18:41.563
talk about is if we are

01:18:41.603 --> 01:18:43.082
entering a world with robot

01:18:43.122 --> 01:18:47.203
taxis and humanoids and those assets,

01:18:47.463 --> 01:18:49.585
real world assets are

01:18:49.664 --> 01:18:51.645
producing real world cash flow

01:18:52.984 --> 01:18:54.886
Who is going to get all that cash flow?

01:18:55.206 --> 01:18:58.269
So if all that cash flow is going to Tesla,

01:18:59.149 --> 01:19:02.393
we will get an issue, people revolting,

01:19:02.573 --> 01:19:02.854
hey,

01:19:03.073 --> 01:19:05.275
I'm losing my job and all the money

01:19:05.296 --> 01:19:06.096
is going to Tesla.

01:19:07.217 --> 01:19:11.021
So what I wanted to ask you, sir, is,

01:19:12.443 --> 01:19:13.963
how does tesla think about

01:19:14.003 --> 01:19:16.064
this issue and how is tesla

01:19:16.104 --> 01:19:17.246
and elon and how's the

01:19:17.286 --> 01:19:19.186
community of tesla thinking

01:19:19.226 --> 01:19:20.927
about who's going to own

01:19:20.967 --> 01:19:22.048
these assets and how are

01:19:22.069 --> 01:19:22.988
they are they going to be

01:19:23.048 --> 01:19:26.070
funded yeah now these are

01:19:26.091 --> 01:19:27.851
important questions and I

01:19:27.912 --> 01:19:29.493
actually had an interaction

01:19:29.972 --> 01:19:31.014
with elon last summer on

01:19:31.033 --> 01:19:34.136
this um where I had a post

01:19:34.315 --> 01:19:35.976
about whether tesla would

01:19:36.037 --> 01:19:37.898
rent out the robots or sell

01:19:37.917 --> 01:19:40.639
them and elon's response was both yep

01:19:42.279 --> 01:19:43.498
And so the fact that he's

01:19:43.519 --> 01:19:44.399
saying that we're going to

01:19:44.439 --> 01:19:46.079
sell them is an important

01:19:46.199 --> 01:19:47.039
answer to this question.

01:19:47.079 --> 01:19:48.501
It's much like the answer to

01:19:49.041 --> 01:19:50.100
the Robotaxi Network in

01:19:50.121 --> 01:19:51.961
terms of selling cybercaps to people.

01:19:52.942 --> 01:19:54.082
He's giving people the

01:19:54.122 --> 01:19:56.342
ability to earn income for themselves,

01:19:57.622 --> 01:19:59.122
both on the cars and with

01:19:59.143 --> 01:19:59.882
humanoid robots.

01:19:59.903 --> 01:20:01.024
And I think that's important.

01:20:01.064 --> 01:20:03.644
I think he recognizes the

01:20:03.783 --> 01:20:05.225
issue that if one company

01:20:05.604 --> 01:20:07.604
controls all these machines,

01:20:09.006 --> 01:20:09.945
that's not going to work.

01:20:10.747 --> 01:20:11.929
You have a rebellion on your hand.

01:20:12.090 --> 01:20:13.850
They're going to storm your

01:20:13.872 --> 01:20:15.033
company with pitchforks and

01:20:15.052 --> 01:20:15.673
take everything.

01:20:16.253 --> 01:20:17.395
And they're already doing it.

01:20:17.595 --> 01:20:18.957
They're already trying to do that.

01:20:19.237 --> 01:20:20.319
Yeah.

01:20:20.378 --> 01:20:20.639
Right.

01:20:21.319 --> 01:20:23.362
And so you have to share the wealth.

01:20:23.481 --> 01:20:24.944
You have to make sure that

01:20:25.043 --> 01:20:26.024
to the extent possible,

01:20:26.064 --> 01:20:27.046
we leave no one behind.

01:20:27.907 --> 01:20:28.927
Now, of course, in reality,

01:20:28.967 --> 01:20:31.251
that's impossible, but you have to try.

01:20:34.011 --> 01:20:37.792
So if we are all assuming

01:20:37.832 --> 01:20:38.913
that this is the case,

01:20:39.113 --> 01:20:41.716
so Tesla needs to share

01:20:42.055 --> 01:20:43.596
their cash flows with the community.

01:20:45.618 --> 01:20:46.639
How is this going to look like?

01:20:46.679 --> 01:20:47.819
Because I've been I've been

01:20:47.878 --> 01:20:50.041
trying to to find a solution for this.

01:20:50.100 --> 01:20:53.722
So how how is a thirty

01:20:53.743 --> 01:20:55.283
thousand dollar cyber cap

01:20:55.304 --> 01:20:58.386
going to be funded then?

01:20:58.445 --> 01:21:00.426
He said, is that going to be funded by

01:21:03.148 --> 01:21:04.869
a single family or how is

01:21:04.890 --> 01:21:06.149
this going to work out?

01:21:07.992 --> 01:21:08.952
What's your idea on that?

01:21:10.453 --> 01:21:11.373
Well, I mean,

01:21:11.434 --> 01:21:14.595
I think initially it's fairly

01:21:14.636 --> 01:21:15.817
clear because, you know,

01:21:15.837 --> 01:21:16.578
the world isn't going to

01:21:16.618 --> 01:21:18.059
change that quickly initially, right?

01:21:18.458 --> 01:21:19.960
It's at the extreme other

01:21:20.079 --> 01:21:21.721
end where you start to question things.

01:21:21.801 --> 01:21:23.523
And Elon's made the comment about,

01:21:23.563 --> 01:21:24.804
you know, what is money at this point,

01:21:24.844 --> 01:21:25.064
right?

01:21:25.543 --> 01:21:26.125
Yeah.

01:21:26.145 --> 01:21:27.706
But early on, I think it's pretty clear.

01:21:27.765 --> 01:21:27.926
It's

01:21:28.393 --> 01:21:30.213
you're buying a money making machine.

01:21:30.253 --> 01:21:32.015
So you pay thirty thousand dollars for it.

01:21:32.095 --> 01:21:33.676
You can finance that through a bank,

01:21:33.777 --> 01:21:35.118
maybe even through Tesla directly,

01:21:36.158 --> 01:21:37.179
most likely through a bank,

01:21:37.220 --> 01:21:39.360
just like you would any other auto loan.

01:21:41.061 --> 01:21:42.082
And then you put that

01:21:42.122 --> 01:21:42.944
vehicle in the fleet and

01:21:42.963 --> 01:21:43.984
you start earning an income.

01:21:45.064 --> 01:21:46.265
And it's highly likely that

01:21:46.305 --> 01:21:48.247
that income on that vehicle

01:21:48.707 --> 01:21:50.069
is more than you paid for

01:21:50.109 --> 01:21:50.949
just in the first year.

01:21:52.791 --> 01:21:54.051
And so that's going to

01:21:54.091 --> 01:21:56.594
attract a lot of people to that business.

01:21:58.274 --> 01:22:00.056
And there's going to be Uber drivers,

01:22:00.077 --> 01:22:00.537
for example,

01:22:00.577 --> 01:22:01.537
that are put out of work that

01:22:01.717 --> 01:22:02.757
probably sell their vehicle

01:22:02.818 --> 01:22:04.038
and buy a cyber cab and

01:22:04.118 --> 01:22:04.939
make some money that way.

01:22:05.841 --> 01:22:07.121
So I think that's pretty clear.

01:22:07.421 --> 01:22:08.823
It's just as this then

01:22:08.863 --> 01:22:10.063
filters through the economy

01:22:10.103 --> 01:22:11.524
and starts taking away more

01:22:12.164 --> 01:22:13.305
drivers' jobs and other

01:22:13.326 --> 01:22:15.006
people's jobs with the humanoid bots,

01:22:15.988 --> 01:22:17.188
how does that transition look?

01:22:18.708 --> 01:22:19.890
And unfortunately,

01:22:19.970 --> 01:22:21.150
I think there's a role for

01:22:21.310 --> 01:22:22.231
nation states in this.

01:22:23.739 --> 01:22:24.140
And of course,

01:22:24.180 --> 01:22:25.261
that's where it gets political.

01:22:25.322 --> 01:22:27.305
And that's where it gets, you know,

01:22:27.324 --> 01:22:28.426
we're going to have two

01:22:28.466 --> 01:22:29.769
camps on this in terms of

01:22:29.809 --> 01:22:30.529
how they think about it,

01:22:31.570 --> 01:22:32.212
at least here in the U.S.

01:22:33.845 --> 01:22:36.306
Will nation states be able to do this?

01:22:36.867 --> 01:22:38.828
Aren't we going towards a more global,

01:22:39.148 --> 01:22:40.328
new form of state?

01:22:40.349 --> 01:22:41.269
Because nation state

01:22:41.309 --> 01:22:42.850
building is already two

01:22:42.869 --> 01:22:43.930
hundred years old and in

01:22:43.970 --> 01:22:46.051
the old paradigm of capitalism.

01:22:46.110 --> 01:22:47.692
You can easily think about

01:22:47.992 --> 01:22:49.332
cities like Abu Dhabi or

01:22:49.393 --> 01:22:51.913
Dubai that wants to say, well,

01:22:51.953 --> 01:22:54.694
we're a cybercap operated

01:22:54.734 --> 01:22:56.076
city from day one.

01:22:57.055 --> 01:22:58.396
They're a little bit more

01:22:59.037 --> 01:23:00.597
totalitarian in their rules.

01:23:02.301 --> 01:23:03.761
The more totalitarian

01:23:03.822 --> 01:23:05.141
countries will probably be

01:23:05.162 --> 01:23:09.484
the first to introduce this.

01:23:09.743 --> 01:23:11.604
And the sooner you do it, the better,

01:23:11.645 --> 01:23:12.426
because it's going to put

01:23:12.445 --> 01:23:13.586
you in a more competitive

01:23:13.666 --> 01:23:15.167
position for a whole bunch

01:23:15.186 --> 01:23:15.747
of other stuff.

01:23:15.827 --> 01:23:17.847
Everything you have to offer

01:23:17.868 --> 01:23:18.747
your city and just the

01:23:18.768 --> 01:23:19.828
quality of living of the

01:23:19.868 --> 01:23:22.390
people goes up with so many

01:23:22.449 --> 01:23:23.610
points at once.

01:23:24.591 --> 01:23:25.771
In the positive scenario and

01:23:25.792 --> 01:23:27.192
the negative scenario,

01:23:27.212 --> 01:23:28.592
it will help more control.

01:23:29.448 --> 01:23:31.109
because you can track where

01:23:31.168 --> 01:23:33.149
cars are at Cedra and you

01:23:33.168 --> 01:23:36.010
basically can control what

01:23:36.029 --> 01:23:37.671
the cars are doing probably

01:23:37.990 --> 01:23:40.712
to a certain extent.

01:23:40.752 --> 01:23:42.972
But yeah,

01:23:43.052 --> 01:23:44.912
we're going to enter many of

01:23:44.953 --> 01:23:46.774
these sort of the first to

01:23:46.894 --> 01:23:48.634
adapt will have a very much

01:23:48.713 --> 01:23:49.975
competitive advantage

01:23:49.994 --> 01:23:53.216
situations in the next ten years.

01:23:55.475 --> 01:23:56.515
was a video of watching last

01:23:56.576 --> 01:23:57.277
night they were talking

01:23:57.296 --> 01:23:58.256
about the advent of the

01:23:58.317 --> 01:23:59.858
automobile and that the uk

01:23:59.898 --> 01:24:01.097
could have set itself up as

01:24:01.198 --> 01:24:02.878
one of the major world

01:24:02.918 --> 01:24:04.600
manufacturers but when

01:24:04.659 --> 01:24:05.560
automobiles were first

01:24:05.621 --> 01:24:07.001
introduced there they had a

01:24:07.082 --> 01:24:08.402
red flag rule someone had

01:24:08.442 --> 01:24:09.863
to walk in front of the car

01:24:10.802 --> 01:24:13.204
waving a red flag because

01:24:13.244 --> 01:24:14.404
cars were so dangerous to

01:24:14.484 --> 01:24:16.405
people yeah and you had to

01:24:16.426 --> 01:24:17.646
have two drivers in the car

01:24:19.064 --> 01:24:20.787
So of course, regulations, you know,

01:24:20.827 --> 01:24:21.787
totally stymied any

01:24:21.806 --> 01:24:22.667
advantage that they

01:24:22.707 --> 01:24:23.828
might've had in the UK in

01:24:23.868 --> 01:24:24.670
terms of being able to

01:24:24.710 --> 01:24:25.831
build these things because

01:24:26.150 --> 01:24:27.091
the demand wasn't there

01:24:27.131 --> 01:24:27.893
because of the rules.

01:24:28.774 --> 01:24:29.833
And I think we run the same

01:24:29.894 --> 01:24:31.034
risk with this technology,

01:24:31.076 --> 01:24:32.676
but we have to recognize

01:24:32.716 --> 01:24:34.939
that this is absolutely

01:24:34.998 --> 01:24:36.539
critical because if we don't do it,

01:24:36.579 --> 01:24:37.220
someone else will.

01:24:43.609 --> 01:24:44.328
If I may ask,

01:24:44.949 --> 01:24:46.250
I can understand that a lot

01:24:46.289 --> 01:24:47.909
of our listeners are not as

01:24:47.970 --> 01:24:49.650
far advanced in this age of

01:24:49.671 --> 01:24:51.990
abundance as Florian and you, Cern.

01:24:53.271 --> 01:24:54.372
Let's say if I'm a regular

01:24:54.391 --> 01:24:55.292
person and maybe an

01:24:55.351 --> 01:24:57.613
entrepreneur or also on, let's say,

01:24:57.653 --> 01:24:59.012
a bigger scale for a country,

01:24:59.573 --> 01:25:01.054
how can I as a person or as

01:25:01.073 --> 01:25:01.814
a country be...

01:25:02.829 --> 01:25:04.310
positioned in the right way

01:25:04.371 --> 01:25:06.551
to make most use of this

01:25:06.792 --> 01:25:09.033
age that is coming upon us?

01:25:09.073 --> 01:25:10.234
What would be your advice if

01:25:10.295 --> 01:25:11.176
I would be asking you that

01:25:11.256 --> 01:25:12.216
if we're sitting in a bar

01:25:12.256 --> 01:25:13.476
or now here in a podcast?

01:25:13.497 --> 01:25:15.257
Yeah,

01:25:15.278 --> 01:25:17.158
I think it's to find a way to be a

01:25:17.260 --> 01:25:18.801
part of this new movement,

01:25:18.860 --> 01:25:20.140
whether it's Robotaxi and

01:25:20.161 --> 01:25:23.082
being a vehicle or a small fleet owner,

01:25:24.264 --> 01:25:25.805
or in the case of humanoid robots,

01:25:25.944 --> 01:25:27.365
positioning yourself to be

01:25:27.867 --> 01:25:29.927
a part of that movement as well, because

01:25:31.577 --> 01:25:32.757
one thing I know for sure I

01:25:32.778 --> 01:25:34.158
would want to try to own a

01:25:34.198 --> 01:25:35.179
few of those machines that

01:25:35.219 --> 01:25:37.579
are changing the world I'd

01:25:37.619 --> 01:25:38.579
rather own the machines

01:25:38.600 --> 01:25:39.740
changing the world than be

01:25:40.060 --> 01:25:41.220
subject to a machine that's

01:25:41.261 --> 01:25:44.203
changing my world right and

01:25:44.222 --> 01:25:45.342
that's just inevitable I'm

01:25:45.422 --> 01:25:46.503
sorry it's just inevitable

01:25:46.543 --> 01:25:47.804
it's coming I don't know

01:25:47.844 --> 01:25:49.465
when it might be longer in

01:25:49.505 --> 01:25:50.604
the dis in the future than

01:25:50.685 --> 01:25:52.305
I think it is it might be

01:25:52.345 --> 01:25:53.365
twenty five years from now

01:25:53.386 --> 01:25:55.247
for all I know but it also

01:25:55.306 --> 01:25:56.887
could be as quick as five years from now

01:25:58.788 --> 01:25:59.788
And so I think you want to

01:25:59.828 --> 01:26:01.390
be prepared for that change.

01:26:01.449 --> 01:26:01.850
It's coming.

01:26:02.890 --> 01:26:03.930
Humanity's seen other

01:26:04.310 --> 01:26:05.511
massive changes before.

01:26:06.310 --> 01:26:07.131
It's just that none of us

01:26:07.150 --> 01:26:07.930
have lived through them.

01:26:07.970 --> 01:26:08.731
We've read about them in

01:26:08.771 --> 01:26:10.712
history books and they seem like nice,

01:26:10.792 --> 01:26:11.832
neat changes where we go

01:26:11.872 --> 01:26:13.953
from riding a horse to driving a car.

01:26:14.872 --> 01:26:15.372
But you know what?

01:26:15.432 --> 01:26:18.274
The history of that was a mess, right?

01:26:18.673 --> 01:26:19.654
They had dirt roads.

01:26:19.675 --> 01:26:20.935
These roads were covered in

01:26:21.015 --> 01:26:22.135
mud and these cars were

01:26:22.194 --> 01:26:23.135
tearing up the roads and

01:26:23.154 --> 01:26:24.735
all the horse owners were complaining and

01:26:25.715 --> 01:26:27.457
And the gasoline was a mess.

01:26:27.476 --> 01:26:28.278
Like there was so many

01:26:28.337 --> 01:26:30.119
issues with that transition.

01:26:30.159 --> 01:26:31.060
Yeah.

01:26:31.140 --> 01:26:32.381
Yeah, I think so.

01:26:32.443 --> 01:26:33.684
And then I'm also curious to

01:26:33.724 --> 01:26:35.405
hear Florian's view on it,

01:26:35.426 --> 01:26:36.606
because he has a bright

01:26:36.646 --> 01:26:37.467
mind and has always

01:26:37.921 --> 01:26:39.002
busy with, let's say,

01:26:39.042 --> 01:26:40.082
ten years down the line.

01:26:40.662 --> 01:26:43.144
But I went a little bit

01:26:43.185 --> 01:26:44.625
deeper on what are the things,

01:26:44.664 --> 01:26:45.826
like with AI as well, right?

01:26:45.865 --> 01:26:46.806
So what are the things in

01:26:46.827 --> 01:26:49.309
the past we had that things would change?

01:26:49.868 --> 01:26:51.550
And the funny thing is you

01:26:51.590 --> 01:26:52.310
wouldn't imagine,

01:26:52.350 --> 01:26:55.311
but when boats went from sailing to,

01:26:56.052 --> 01:26:56.432
let's say,

01:26:56.613 --> 01:26:58.694
automatic boats or boats like steamboats,

01:26:59.829 --> 01:27:00.750
They had hybrids.

01:27:01.069 --> 01:27:01.810
Can you imagine?

01:27:03.030 --> 01:27:04.331
It looks so silly right now,

01:27:04.350 --> 01:27:05.412
but we're doing exactly the

01:27:05.452 --> 01:27:06.192
same with cars.

01:27:06.212 --> 01:27:08.952
So it was for me a moment of epiphany.

01:27:10.012 --> 01:27:10.712
But for me,

01:27:10.752 --> 01:27:12.313
and I'm a guy who always works

01:27:12.353 --> 01:27:14.314
in Excel and the guys make

01:27:14.333 --> 01:27:15.394
fun of me all the time and

01:27:15.474 --> 01:27:16.734
PDFs and everything that

01:27:16.774 --> 01:27:18.215
fits in it is my truth.

01:27:19.595 --> 01:27:20.975
But there's a lot in vision as well,

01:27:21.015 --> 01:27:21.996
and I'm trying to

01:27:22.792 --> 01:27:24.335
get on the train and I think

01:27:24.414 --> 01:27:26.978
I'm more advanced than general people,

01:27:27.038 --> 01:27:29.421
but I try to get people with me and I say,

01:27:29.462 --> 01:27:31.184
like, read these books or do this stuff.

01:27:31.224 --> 01:27:32.565
But I think you have to get

01:27:32.605 --> 01:27:33.707
in the knit of it.

01:27:33.747 --> 01:27:35.149
So I had an AI training last

01:27:35.189 --> 01:27:37.471
week and that just opens your mind.

01:27:37.752 --> 01:27:39.213
There's so much opportunity

01:27:39.253 --> 01:27:40.595
and things that are going on.

01:27:41.356 --> 01:27:41.837
As you say,

01:27:41.877 --> 01:27:43.759
like being just involved in

01:27:43.779 --> 01:27:46.261
this transition would be

01:27:46.301 --> 01:27:47.322
good for everyone.

01:27:47.362 --> 01:27:48.141
Maybe Florian,

01:27:48.181 --> 01:27:49.262
you have an idea and also

01:27:49.302 --> 01:27:50.884
maybe concrete action

01:27:50.923 --> 01:27:52.085
points for listeners to get

01:27:52.125 --> 01:27:53.006
on the bandwagon here.

01:27:53.826 --> 01:27:55.627
Yeah, I do have a few.

01:27:55.787 --> 01:27:58.869
So if you don't buy a Tesla,

01:27:58.909 --> 01:27:59.791
you're buying a horse.

01:28:01.511 --> 01:28:02.012
Definitely.

01:28:02.172 --> 01:28:05.515
That's why I definitely on the on the AI,

01:28:05.534 --> 01:28:06.216
because, you know,

01:28:06.296 --> 01:28:07.457
many people are having a

01:28:07.537 --> 01:28:08.957
jet GPT or a grog.

01:28:10.451 --> 01:28:11.572
Grok, you know,

01:28:12.252 --> 01:28:13.793
membership or how do you call it?

01:28:15.695 --> 01:28:17.778
But there you pay like one hundred bucks,

01:28:17.858 --> 01:28:18.719
two hundred bucks.

01:28:20.560 --> 01:28:23.323
Well, average employee in your company,

01:28:23.403 --> 01:28:23.604
well,

01:28:23.644 --> 01:28:25.604
let's say cost between five thousand

01:28:25.685 --> 01:28:27.087
and ten thousand euros or a

01:28:27.106 --> 01:28:29.029
dollar at any given point.

01:28:29.509 --> 01:28:30.590
So I was having a

01:28:30.649 --> 01:28:32.171
discussions with my I'm

01:28:32.212 --> 01:28:34.194
setting up a new company right now.

01:28:35.002 --> 01:28:36.184
So I said, gents,

01:28:36.543 --> 01:28:37.904
we need to double down if

01:28:37.944 --> 01:28:40.166
we have like five K or ten

01:28:40.225 --> 01:28:42.447
K monthly memberships or

01:28:42.487 --> 01:28:45.207
things or courses or whatever we have.

01:28:45.707 --> 01:28:48.729
So learning from my past.

01:28:48.750 --> 01:28:53.351
So I have a history of online advertising.

01:28:53.412 --> 01:28:54.792
And I remember the days

01:28:55.052 --> 01:28:56.372
starting to advertise when

01:28:56.412 --> 01:28:57.854
Google clicks were just one

01:28:57.934 --> 01:28:59.935
cent and Facebook clicks

01:28:59.954 --> 01:29:00.935
were just one cent.

01:29:00.975 --> 01:29:03.176
And I remember like, oh, well, our

01:29:04.317 --> 01:29:05.478
uh our rate for email

01:29:05.497 --> 01:29:07.018
addresses is now ten cents

01:29:07.037 --> 01:29:08.378
that's way way too much so

01:29:08.418 --> 01:29:09.298
we we were very

01:29:09.338 --> 01:29:10.500
conservative about that

01:29:10.520 --> 01:29:11.699
opportunity what was at

01:29:11.739 --> 01:29:13.621
hand right now so I will

01:29:13.640 --> 01:29:15.421
say if you if you pay ten

01:29:15.462 --> 01:29:16.601
thousand euros in

01:29:16.681 --> 01:29:18.983
subscriptions for ai at

01:29:19.002 --> 01:29:20.382
this moment it's still just

01:29:21.144 --> 01:29:22.963
one basically one high paid

01:29:23.043 --> 01:29:24.444
employee that you that you

01:29:24.484 --> 01:29:27.286
have uh working there and

01:29:27.466 --> 01:29:28.466
will benefit you

01:29:28.686 --> 01:29:29.886
tremendously if you start

01:29:29.966 --> 01:29:31.667
understanding that that world and

01:29:32.507 --> 01:29:34.149
humanoids and robot taxis

01:29:34.229 --> 01:29:35.409
are just one part of that

01:29:35.449 --> 01:29:37.851
whole super intelligence

01:29:37.872 --> 01:29:40.654
that is starting to become

01:29:40.713 --> 01:29:46.396
reality in front of our eyes.

01:29:46.436 --> 01:29:47.738
Yeah, and I would just add too,

01:29:47.837 --> 01:29:49.680
just again from a big picture standpoint,

01:29:49.739 --> 01:29:51.961
you think about parents and

01:29:51.980 --> 01:29:52.981
what they do for their kids.

01:29:54.363 --> 01:29:54.802
What do we do?

01:29:55.222 --> 01:29:55.923
We protect them.

01:29:57.345 --> 01:29:59.746
We provide for them, right?

01:29:59.966 --> 01:30:00.766
We educate them.

01:30:01.331 --> 01:30:04.432
We guide them and we care for them.

01:30:04.493 --> 01:30:06.113
And that's exactly what

01:30:06.172 --> 01:30:07.453
humanoid robots are going

01:30:07.493 --> 01:30:10.655
to do for all of humanity.

01:30:10.756 --> 01:30:12.055
Again, whether you like it or not,

01:30:13.237 --> 01:30:14.557
there's pros and cons to all this,

01:30:15.478 --> 01:30:16.298
but we're developing

01:30:16.319 --> 01:30:18.279
machines that are truly intelligent.

01:30:19.020 --> 01:30:20.461
You look at them today, they're clumsy,

01:30:20.520 --> 01:30:21.600
but they're only going to get better.

01:30:22.261 --> 01:30:24.382
And so we better find a way

01:30:24.403 --> 01:30:26.404
to adapt to this as quickly

01:30:26.423 --> 01:30:27.604
as possible because it's coming.

01:30:30.185 --> 01:30:31.626
there's opportunity in that

01:30:31.645 --> 01:30:32.587
there has to be right.

01:30:32.627 --> 01:30:34.587
Can either there, anytime there's a change,

01:30:34.948 --> 01:30:36.189
there has to be opportunity

01:30:36.229 --> 01:30:38.150
for people somewhere in that change.

01:30:38.190 --> 01:30:38.511
Yeah.

01:30:38.591 --> 01:30:38.791
Yeah.

01:30:38.810 --> 01:30:40.412
Whether you choose to see it or not.

01:30:40.431 --> 01:30:40.893
Yeah.

01:30:41.212 --> 01:30:42.453
A hundred percent.

01:30:42.533 --> 01:30:44.716
I th I think we'll adapt in the end.

01:30:44.796 --> 01:30:45.376
Of course.

01:30:45.515 --> 01:30:47.117
Of course.

01:30:47.157 --> 01:30:48.899
The opportunity it will bring is that we,

01:30:48.979 --> 01:30:49.179
as a,

01:30:50.260 --> 01:30:52.541
as a conscious beings are freed up

01:30:52.900 --> 01:30:54.743
of being a slave to money.

01:30:54.823 --> 01:30:54.962
Yeah.

01:30:56.019 --> 01:30:58.079
And that's something which

01:30:58.140 --> 01:30:59.119
is completely behind.

01:30:59.820 --> 01:31:01.701
It's such a new paradigm

01:31:01.902 --> 01:31:03.021
that we need to get used to it,

01:31:03.082 --> 01:31:06.082
but we will get used to it

01:31:06.122 --> 01:31:07.503
and we will get into a new

01:31:07.543 --> 01:31:08.925
kind of consciousness and

01:31:08.984 --> 01:31:09.864
higher consciousness.

01:31:10.925 --> 01:31:12.706
The implications are super big.

01:31:14.787 --> 01:31:17.167
And we will also be connected to the AI.

01:31:17.268 --> 01:31:21.130
So with Neuralink coming,

01:31:21.250 --> 01:31:22.029
there will be the first

01:31:22.090 --> 01:31:23.131
persons who are actually going to

01:31:24.175 --> 01:31:25.716
going to be as brave to

01:31:25.775 --> 01:31:27.077
actually connect with AI

01:31:27.216 --> 01:31:29.538
and learn languages in a

01:31:29.578 --> 01:31:30.640
few minutes or whatever.

01:31:30.680 --> 01:31:32.761
And there will be people who say, well,

01:31:32.780 --> 01:31:33.742
I'm too scared to do it.

01:31:33.801 --> 01:31:35.783
So the new divide will not

01:31:35.823 --> 01:31:36.944
be between rich and poor,

01:31:36.984 --> 01:31:39.225
but between connected to AI or not.

01:31:40.527 --> 01:31:41.747
There's going to be a

01:31:41.806 --> 01:31:42.847
totally different kind of

01:31:43.167 --> 01:31:44.168
mindset about that.

01:31:45.010 --> 01:31:49.453
So that's maybe the more

01:31:49.653 --> 01:31:50.814
important discussions that

01:31:50.833 --> 01:31:51.373
we need to have.

01:31:56.863 --> 01:31:58.506
I had one more question for you,

01:31:58.546 --> 01:32:00.127
but I don't know if we have time anymore,

01:32:00.506 --> 01:32:00.868
Kees.

01:32:01.868 --> 01:32:02.029
Well,

01:32:02.069 --> 01:32:04.090
I think we still have a little bit of

01:32:04.270 --> 01:32:04.650
time.

01:32:06.573 --> 01:32:09.515
Let's say we extend it with, let's say,

01:32:09.654 --> 01:32:10.695
ten to fifteen minutes.

01:32:11.237 --> 01:32:13.639
After ten minutes,

01:32:13.759 --> 01:32:17.641
I'll give a sign and then we'll stop.

01:32:17.721 --> 01:32:18.662
Kenny, you go ahead.

01:32:18.682 --> 01:32:19.663
You wanted to ask something.

01:32:21.239 --> 01:32:21.359
Yeah,

01:32:21.380 --> 01:32:22.860
I don't want to waste too much of the

01:32:22.900 --> 01:32:23.100
time,

01:32:23.121 --> 01:32:25.021
but I think like I tried to go back

01:32:25.061 --> 01:32:25.802
to history, you know,

01:32:25.823 --> 01:32:27.143
and there have been so many

01:32:27.203 --> 01:32:29.204
times when we've had the same as well.

01:32:29.265 --> 01:32:30.425
I think like machines that

01:32:30.444 --> 01:32:33.087
we saw coming on the landscaping,

01:32:33.106 --> 01:32:34.488
you know, when we had farms,

01:32:34.927 --> 01:32:36.048
everybody thought everybody

01:32:36.069 --> 01:32:36.609
would lose this.

01:32:37.149 --> 01:32:38.989
Yeah, industrial revolution came from it.

01:32:39.029 --> 01:32:40.430
So I think there will be

01:32:40.570 --> 01:32:41.770
always a use for people,

01:32:41.850 --> 01:32:43.032
and I think it will be more

01:32:43.072 --> 01:32:44.172
to the creative part,

01:32:44.953 --> 01:32:46.012
because now a lot of my

01:32:46.092 --> 01:32:47.194
time actually goes in my

01:32:47.253 --> 01:32:48.574
work to doing structured

01:32:48.774 --> 01:32:50.456
things that are ninety percent the same,

01:32:51.136 --> 01:32:52.697
while the ten percent, I think,

01:32:52.737 --> 01:32:56.238
is the most nice stuff to focus on.

01:32:56.297 --> 01:32:58.238
So I hope we will transition

01:32:58.739 --> 01:33:00.701
to focusing more on the ten percent,

01:33:01.261 --> 01:33:02.622
using our creativity and

01:33:02.742 --> 01:33:03.702
using that for a full day.

01:33:04.002 --> 01:33:05.262
Damian, don't make a shit.

01:33:06.869 --> 01:33:07.590
Don't say anything.

01:33:08.610 --> 01:33:10.032
I was saying, Kenny,

01:33:10.051 --> 01:33:11.292
I was focusing a hundred

01:33:11.313 --> 01:33:13.074
percent on all the good stuff,

01:33:13.095 --> 01:33:14.895
but that is also not good for your brain.

01:33:14.916 --> 01:33:16.738
You need some structure as well sometimes.

01:33:16.957 --> 01:33:17.158
Yeah.

01:33:17.177 --> 01:33:17.478
I've seen,

01:33:17.637 --> 01:33:18.779
I've seen it can bring a lot of

01:33:18.819 --> 01:33:19.579
carnage as well.

01:33:19.600 --> 01:33:20.201
Yes.

01:33:20.220 --> 01:33:20.820
But that doesn't,

01:33:21.020 --> 01:33:22.421
that doesn't account for everyone.

01:33:22.842 --> 01:33:23.844
We're seeing people at the

01:33:23.863 --> 01:33:24.604
other side here.

01:33:24.623 --> 01:33:28.646
So if you think about it,

01:33:28.667 --> 01:33:29.387
we're all going to have our

01:33:29.427 --> 01:33:30.328
own personal coaches.

01:33:31.890 --> 01:33:32.390
Yeah.

01:33:32.451 --> 01:33:34.091
Yeah, exactly.

01:33:34.639 --> 01:33:36.060
Yeah, Damian,

01:33:36.159 --> 01:33:38.440
we were sitting one time in

01:33:38.480 --> 01:33:40.801
his garden and he has some

01:33:40.841 --> 01:33:41.841
gym stuff laying around.

01:33:41.881 --> 01:33:42.502
So he was like,

01:33:42.721 --> 01:33:44.443
what happens if Optimus is here?

01:33:44.483 --> 01:33:47.043
He can look at your posture is right.

01:33:47.064 --> 01:33:48.283
You can say, do pushups.

01:33:48.304 --> 01:33:49.824
You need to move.

01:33:50.545 --> 01:33:51.845
Maybe you get some data like, hey,

01:33:51.865 --> 01:33:53.086
your blood pressure is too high.

01:33:53.126 --> 01:33:54.067
Relax a little bit.

01:33:54.266 --> 01:33:55.988
So it can help you advance

01:33:56.087 --> 01:33:57.007
in all kinds of stuff.

01:33:57.028 --> 01:33:58.588
So I can't wait to have it

01:33:58.609 --> 01:33:59.229
around the house.

01:33:59.849 --> 01:34:02.569
I'm building my new company on this idea.

01:34:04.610 --> 01:34:07.012
I'm building a company in health,

01:34:07.033 --> 01:34:10.796
so increasing our health as humans.

01:34:11.277 --> 01:34:12.557
So my idea was Elon is

01:34:12.597 --> 01:34:13.899
taking care of the machines.

01:34:15.239 --> 01:34:17.521
What is my vision on helping humans?

01:34:18.903 --> 01:34:19.844
One of the things that we're

01:34:19.884 --> 01:34:22.225
building are we're just

01:34:22.265 --> 01:34:23.145
collecting a lot of

01:34:23.305 --> 01:34:25.207
equipment that is collecting data.

01:34:25.307 --> 01:34:27.430
So we say we provide the sensors.

01:34:27.930 --> 01:34:29.310
So we have sensors that can

01:34:29.350 --> 01:34:30.912
measure your body composition,

01:34:30.932 --> 01:34:32.213
your heart rate, all that.

01:34:33.192 --> 01:34:34.853
And normally it was just

01:34:34.912 --> 01:34:37.755
impossible to just, um,

01:34:37.795 --> 01:34:39.314
to just make sense of all the data and,

01:34:39.335 --> 01:34:39.655
and, and,

01:34:40.095 --> 01:34:42.216
and come with a sort of congruent advice.

01:34:43.157 --> 01:34:43.417
Uh,

01:34:43.438 --> 01:34:46.038
but my idea is that sensors will have a

01:34:46.099 --> 01:34:47.060
huge value in,

01:34:47.220 --> 01:34:48.140
in the world because it

01:34:48.199 --> 01:34:50.320
feeds the AI with the,

01:34:50.360 --> 01:34:54.182
with the data we're, we're collecting.

01:34:54.243 --> 01:34:54.423
Yeah.

01:34:54.444 --> 01:34:54.524
Yeah.

01:34:54.543 --> 01:34:56.824
I think Optimus too is one giant sensor.

01:34:57.524 --> 01:34:58.645
Um, you know, he'll,

01:34:58.805 --> 01:35:00.306
he'll be able to tell you in real time,

01:35:00.346 --> 01:35:01.386
the quality of the air that

01:35:01.407 --> 01:35:01.807
you're breathing.

01:35:01.828 --> 01:35:02.568
Yeah.

01:35:03.283 --> 01:35:05.305
Just all kinds of stuff like that is huge.

01:35:06.265 --> 01:35:09.847
For now, I have Optimus behind me,

01:35:09.887 --> 01:35:10.547
making me work.

01:35:10.608 --> 01:35:11.729
He's got the hammer in his hand.

01:35:13.409 --> 01:35:14.411
But hopefully in the future,

01:35:14.451 --> 01:35:16.853
I'll be standing behind him.

01:35:16.872 --> 01:35:18.354
You can imagine all those

01:35:18.373 --> 01:35:19.335
fingers having different

01:35:19.375 --> 01:35:20.796
sensors so he can measure

01:35:20.876 --> 01:35:22.197
body temperature, room temperature.

01:35:22.256 --> 01:35:22.756
Yeah, you got it.

01:35:25.302 --> 01:35:26.963
If somebody's got a flu or not,

01:35:28.364 --> 01:35:30.485
those things are very easily detectable,

01:35:30.525 --> 01:35:31.765
but we're just not used to

01:35:31.805 --> 01:35:33.146
having all these sensors around.

01:35:33.506 --> 01:35:33.827
That's right.

01:35:34.627 --> 01:35:35.587
I think for you, Damian,

01:35:35.627 --> 01:35:36.889
it will be very confronting

01:35:36.908 --> 01:35:38.088
because you will see also

01:35:38.128 --> 01:35:38.869
some gaps in your

01:35:38.930 --> 01:35:40.930
personality and other flaws.

01:35:41.570 --> 01:35:42.792
I think you will have a big list,

01:35:42.851 --> 01:35:43.952
but let's not go there

01:35:43.971 --> 01:35:44.653
because then we need

01:35:44.693 --> 01:35:46.172
another day for this podcast.

01:35:47.253 --> 01:35:49.154
Let's go to that million dollar question,

01:35:49.175 --> 01:35:49.574
Florian.

01:35:51.109 --> 01:35:52.930
yeah so uh before I want to

01:35:52.949 --> 01:35:55.231
do that maybe you can find

01:35:55.271 --> 01:35:59.815
the the the advertisement

01:35:59.956 --> 01:36:03.217
which frank made for the

01:36:03.279 --> 01:36:04.579
tesla robo taxi do you know

01:36:04.619 --> 01:36:06.180
which one I'm talking about

01:36:06.201 --> 01:36:09.662
I was saying you mean with

01:36:09.684 --> 01:36:10.804
grok in the car as well

01:36:11.805 --> 01:36:13.806
yeah it's amazing this is a

01:36:13.926 --> 01:36:15.127
girl who's being picked up

01:36:15.148 --> 01:36:16.047
by the robo taxi yeah

01:36:20.682 --> 01:36:21.963
Maybe we can put it on the screen.

01:36:22.003 --> 01:36:23.363
Is it possible, Florian?

01:36:23.423 --> 01:36:24.963
I know how it looks like.

01:36:25.125 --> 01:36:28.045
Sort of final video then?

01:36:28.826 --> 01:36:32.225
No, but let's have Kees be busy with that.

01:36:32.265 --> 01:36:36.427
But I saw something going

01:36:36.488 --> 01:36:38.247
back to the Robotaxi CERN

01:36:39.268 --> 01:36:40.009
in the business model.

01:36:43.761 --> 01:36:45.302
This guy Phil Beisel put out

01:36:45.363 --> 01:36:46.503
an excellent article

01:36:47.985 --> 01:36:48.826
regarding the business

01:36:48.845 --> 01:36:50.587
model and how it's going to

01:36:50.627 --> 01:36:51.488
change everything.

01:36:51.528 --> 01:36:53.310
And he also talked about

01:36:56.032 --> 01:36:57.752
this disruption that the

01:36:57.792 --> 01:36:59.375
cars made to the horses, etc.

01:36:59.435 --> 01:37:00.636
So he made the same analogy.

01:37:01.456 --> 01:37:03.717
And I saw a remark of you

01:37:04.698 --> 01:37:05.680
where you were talking

01:37:05.739 --> 01:37:08.641
about the repositioning of the cars,

01:37:08.841 --> 01:37:09.622
which will be key.

01:37:10.532 --> 01:37:13.976
So for Robotaxi to actually

01:37:14.056 --> 01:37:17.180
become a real disruption,

01:37:18.101 --> 01:37:20.163
it needs to drive enough

01:37:20.244 --> 01:37:22.146
miles in order to get

01:37:22.266 --> 01:37:23.469
enough cars off the road.

01:37:23.628 --> 01:37:25.150
So the utilization is going

01:37:25.171 --> 01:37:27.252
to be like a key driver.

01:37:29.159 --> 01:37:31.060
And a key driver for having

01:37:31.100 --> 01:37:32.280
a high utilization is

01:37:32.320 --> 01:37:33.301
actually repositioning.

01:37:34.243 --> 01:37:37.344
So what I read is that you

01:37:37.363 --> 01:37:38.484
were talking about this

01:37:38.524 --> 01:37:41.006
kind of an AI model trying

01:37:41.046 --> 01:37:43.287
to get this problem out of the way.

01:37:43.347 --> 01:37:44.809
Can you elaborate a little

01:37:44.828 --> 01:37:46.909
bit about that and why you

01:37:46.930 --> 01:37:48.411
think repositioning is such

01:37:48.430 --> 01:37:51.193
a key element in this business model?

01:37:51.212 --> 01:37:51.512
Sure.

01:37:51.792 --> 01:37:52.974
Yeah, that's a good question.

01:37:53.014 --> 01:37:53.833
And Phil and I have talked

01:37:53.854 --> 01:37:55.314
about this as well.

01:37:58.930 --> 01:38:00.771
The customer experience with

01:38:00.811 --> 01:38:02.073
Robotaxi is going to depend

01:38:02.113 --> 01:38:02.953
on having a vehicle

01:38:03.413 --> 01:38:04.474
immediately available or

01:38:04.533 --> 01:38:06.996
close to immediately available, right?

01:38:07.036 --> 01:38:07.916
A lot of times you can

01:38:07.975 --> 01:38:08.837
schedule your departure,

01:38:08.856 --> 01:38:10.238
but many times it's spontaneous.

01:38:10.257 --> 01:38:10.898
You want a vehicle,

01:38:10.917 --> 01:38:11.898
you want to walk outside,

01:38:12.519 --> 01:38:14.520
grab a taxi and go.

01:38:14.579 --> 01:38:15.461
So in that case,

01:38:15.501 --> 01:38:16.640
and in order for that to work,

01:38:17.381 --> 01:38:18.801
you need to reposition the

01:38:18.822 --> 01:38:20.063
vehicles in places where

01:38:20.103 --> 01:38:23.484
people are likely to need them.

01:38:23.545 --> 01:38:24.945
Well, how do you figure that out?

01:38:26.194 --> 01:38:27.735
Well, you need to know where people are.

01:38:28.015 --> 01:38:29.056
You need to know what people

01:38:29.077 --> 01:38:29.797
are going to do.

01:38:30.778 --> 01:38:34.501
So if you are a Robotaxi

01:38:34.900 --> 01:38:36.101
Network subscriber,

01:38:37.002 --> 01:38:38.344
then the network may learn

01:38:38.384 --> 01:38:39.104
some of your habits,

01:38:39.123 --> 01:38:40.024
like when you go to work

01:38:40.064 --> 01:38:42.627
and when you leave work, et cetera.

01:38:43.506 --> 01:38:44.347
Or even that,

01:38:44.608 --> 01:38:45.809
just the vehicles driving

01:38:45.828 --> 01:38:47.029
around can notice that

01:38:47.069 --> 01:38:48.211
there is a congregation of

01:38:48.230 --> 01:38:49.652
people at this sporting event,

01:38:49.811 --> 01:38:50.912
and it's likely at some

01:38:50.932 --> 01:38:52.253
point that those people are

01:38:52.274 --> 01:38:52.953
going to want to go home.

01:38:54.877 --> 01:38:56.099
or a concert or something, right?

01:38:56.698 --> 01:38:58.199
And so you need the

01:38:58.220 --> 01:38:59.701
capabilities of AI to parse

01:38:59.720 --> 01:39:01.240
through all that data about

01:39:01.301 --> 01:39:02.542
what's going on in a city

01:39:03.002 --> 01:39:04.323
to figure out then where to

01:39:04.443 --> 01:39:05.724
optimally place the vehicles.

01:39:06.323 --> 01:39:07.323
It's too complex of a

01:39:07.363 --> 01:39:10.206
problem for a person to figure out.

01:39:10.246 --> 01:39:11.546
Now, obviously, if there's a concert,

01:39:11.567 --> 01:39:12.407
then it's pretty obvious,

01:39:12.487 --> 01:39:13.207
or a football game,

01:39:13.226 --> 01:39:13.887
you know you're gonna need

01:39:13.908 --> 01:39:15.828
to position vehicles next to those venues,

01:39:16.529 --> 01:39:18.069
but it's more nuanced than that.

01:39:20.331 --> 01:39:21.252
I would also say too,

01:39:21.271 --> 01:39:23.752
from a Robotaxi revenue perspective,

01:39:25.314 --> 01:39:27.154
So one of the keys is that

01:39:27.215 --> 01:39:28.875
if you can drive your cost

01:39:28.914 --> 01:39:29.854
of operation down,

01:39:30.975 --> 01:39:32.115
then you can afford to

01:39:32.195 --> 01:39:33.836
actually have a very low

01:39:33.935 --> 01:39:35.237
utilization rate on a per

01:39:35.277 --> 01:39:37.817
vehicle basis and still end

01:39:37.877 --> 01:39:39.097
up with revenue for the

01:39:39.177 --> 01:39:40.398
network that's very high.

01:39:41.417 --> 01:39:41.979
Because again,

01:39:41.998 --> 01:39:43.738
you're providing a service

01:39:43.779 --> 01:39:44.899
to customers that is so

01:39:44.939 --> 01:39:47.340
compelling at an attractive price.

01:39:49.963 --> 01:39:50.765
And that was to my point

01:39:50.805 --> 01:39:51.625
earlier about as an

01:39:51.765 --> 01:39:53.006
individual vehicle owner,

01:39:53.666 --> 01:39:54.565
I don't necessarily want to

01:39:54.605 --> 01:39:56.266
be paid on the use of my vehicle,

01:39:56.306 --> 01:39:57.747
but more of the vehicles in

01:39:57.787 --> 01:39:59.069
the network during the time

01:39:59.088 --> 01:40:00.149
that I put my vehicle in.

01:40:01.310 --> 01:40:02.050
Because if my vehicle is

01:40:02.090 --> 01:40:03.591
sitting for four hours and

01:40:03.610 --> 01:40:05.332
I don't get paid, that's no good to me.

01:40:05.671 --> 01:40:06.131
But still,

01:40:06.152 --> 01:40:09.713
that was very useful for the network.

01:40:09.753 --> 01:40:10.634
That may actually help the

01:40:10.673 --> 01:40:13.796
network optimize its total revenue.

01:40:13.855 --> 01:40:13.975
Yep.

01:40:15.056 --> 01:40:15.358
Florian,

01:40:15.377 --> 01:40:16.979
I'm not sure if I answered your question,

01:40:16.998 --> 01:40:18.158
but touched on a difference.

01:40:18.279 --> 01:40:18.619
Definitely.

01:40:18.699 --> 01:40:19.980
And it also reminded me of

01:40:20.041 --> 01:40:22.202
something I think Alexander

01:40:22.301 --> 01:40:23.582
Mertz also mentioned is

01:40:23.622 --> 01:40:27.104
that also the repositioning

01:40:27.405 --> 01:40:29.686
AI model behind the

01:40:29.726 --> 01:40:31.747
repositioning will also

01:40:32.248 --> 01:40:33.770
help increase the value proposition.

01:40:34.326 --> 01:40:38.628
Because if I just came back

01:40:38.668 --> 01:40:42.032
from a visit to France with the airplane,

01:40:42.131 --> 01:40:45.055
I came to the airport, I ordered an Uber,

01:40:45.675 --> 01:40:46.876
but I had to time the

01:40:46.935 --> 01:40:48.176
moment the Uber was

01:40:48.237 --> 01:40:49.778
actually coming and I was at that place.

01:40:52.380 --> 01:40:54.502
And it's always that I have

01:40:54.542 --> 01:40:56.143
to wait for like five to ten minutes.

01:40:57.224 --> 01:40:58.865
But with an AI repositioning

01:40:58.905 --> 01:40:59.947
model behind it,

01:41:00.207 --> 01:41:01.787
it will probably become

01:41:01.908 --> 01:41:02.969
like less than one minute.

01:41:03.407 --> 01:41:04.307
That's actually the value

01:41:04.328 --> 01:41:06.229
proposition enhancement as well.

01:41:07.211 --> 01:41:08.472
So that was something I

01:41:08.493 --> 01:41:10.015
wanted to add as well.

01:41:10.074 --> 01:41:11.756
But that's what popped up in

01:41:11.796 --> 01:41:13.279
my mind when you answered this question.

01:41:14.220 --> 01:41:14.439
Yeah,

01:41:14.500 --> 01:41:16.202
I would imagine as a Robotaxi Network

01:41:16.221 --> 01:41:17.403
subscriber, for example,

01:41:17.462 --> 01:41:18.725
it'll know where you are at all times.

01:41:18.744 --> 01:41:20.046
And if you're walking through an airport,

01:41:21.028 --> 01:41:21.228
right,

01:41:21.307 --> 01:41:22.328
it knows where you are and it can

01:41:22.869 --> 01:41:23.890
more properly time

01:41:24.551 --> 01:41:25.692
the arrival of the vehicle

01:41:26.051 --> 01:41:26.813
with your arrival,

01:41:27.474 --> 01:41:30.155
that kind of stuff is possible for sure.

01:41:30.256 --> 01:41:30.336
Yeah,

01:41:30.416 --> 01:41:32.238
and it would also make sense that you

01:41:32.257 --> 01:41:33.238
have a lot of premium

01:41:33.278 --> 01:41:34.519
versions where you first

01:41:34.578 --> 01:41:36.081
align always and all that,

01:41:36.581 --> 01:41:38.141
especially in the first, let's say,

01:41:38.222 --> 01:41:40.224
five years of this.

01:41:40.984 --> 01:41:44.328
Same as airlines, skip the line and yeah.

01:41:44.408 --> 01:41:45.529
And certain preferences,

01:41:45.588 --> 01:41:46.368
they might even be able to

01:41:46.448 --> 01:41:47.550
provide certain things in

01:41:47.590 --> 01:41:49.032
the vehicle like drinks and food,

01:41:49.051 --> 01:41:49.572
for example,

01:41:50.091 --> 01:41:50.792
that's in line with your

01:41:50.813 --> 01:41:51.673
preference eventually.

01:41:53.074 --> 01:41:56.615
It'll just hop over to Moet Chandon,

01:41:56.997 --> 01:41:59.257
put a bottle inside, some water.

01:42:00.097 --> 01:42:01.358
That's right.

01:42:01.398 --> 01:42:02.458
What I would like to do is

01:42:02.538 --> 01:42:04.180
also like if you're sitting in the car,

01:42:04.420 --> 01:42:05.439
your time is going to be

01:42:05.479 --> 01:42:06.740
spent very differently, right?

01:42:06.780 --> 01:42:08.121
So now you're still like

01:42:08.822 --> 01:42:10.362
looking at the wheel, at least in Europe,

01:42:10.421 --> 01:42:12.363
you have to still hold it as well.

01:42:12.382 --> 01:42:14.123
I hope you're looking at the road,

01:42:14.203 --> 01:42:14.644
not the wheel.

01:42:15.534 --> 01:42:15.795
Sorry,

01:42:15.854 --> 01:42:17.695
at the road and the wheel sometimes.

01:42:17.775 --> 01:42:18.296
Where is it?

01:42:18.796 --> 01:42:21.337
But I think it will change completely.

01:42:21.396 --> 01:42:23.096
Like I said to my girlfriend as well,

01:42:23.136 --> 01:42:24.238
when we went on vacation,

01:42:24.297 --> 01:42:26.978
we left like early morning, came, I think,

01:42:27.217 --> 01:42:28.958
like in the night at our

01:42:28.979 --> 01:42:29.979
destination in Europe.

01:42:30.618 --> 01:42:31.979
And if there would be a robot taxi,

01:42:32.000 --> 01:42:32.520
I would just say,

01:42:32.539 --> 01:42:34.199
let's hop on the robot taxi

01:42:34.239 --> 01:42:35.541
at like nine in the evening,

01:42:35.661 --> 01:42:36.820
sleep and then next day.

01:42:36.940 --> 01:42:39.221
So it's going to change the dynamics of

01:42:40.079 --> 01:42:42.820
like travel through the roads very much,

01:42:43.261 --> 01:42:43.841
but also what,

01:42:43.921 --> 01:42:45.002
what would you do with your time?

01:42:45.042 --> 01:42:47.002
And like, if it's during the day, I,

01:42:47.083 --> 01:42:48.083
a lot of the times jump in

01:42:48.104 --> 01:42:49.284
my car and then go for a

01:42:49.345 --> 01:42:51.025
business meeting and I'm in

01:42:51.046 --> 01:42:51.886
the car for an hour.

01:42:52.305 --> 01:42:53.306
I would like to do work or

01:42:53.346 --> 01:42:54.846
maybe like discuss with grok.

01:42:54.867 --> 01:42:55.908
Like I have some ideas.

01:42:56.188 --> 01:42:57.628
Uh, can you make a list?

01:42:57.708 --> 01:42:58.989
I need to order some food.

01:42:59.090 --> 01:42:59.710
I don't know, you know,

01:42:59.770 --> 01:43:00.630
so there's going to be a

01:43:00.670 --> 01:43:03.171
lot of opportunity there as well.

01:43:03.292 --> 01:43:05.212
It'll give us a lot of more opportunity.

01:43:05.252 --> 01:43:06.412
I think to spend time with

01:43:06.453 --> 01:43:07.953
friends and family that we

01:43:08.134 --> 01:43:08.875
maybe don't have today

01:43:08.914 --> 01:43:09.715
because either it's,

01:43:10.805 --> 01:43:11.726
You have to drive yourself

01:43:11.766 --> 01:43:12.367
and you don't want to

01:43:12.386 --> 01:43:13.587
because it's tiring or you

01:43:13.627 --> 01:43:14.309
just don't have time.

01:43:15.210 --> 01:43:16.690
If you're able to work in the vehicle,

01:43:16.711 --> 01:43:17.430
then you will have time

01:43:17.470 --> 01:43:19.292
because you're just like we are now.

01:43:19.332 --> 01:43:19.972
We're sitting there.

01:43:20.252 --> 01:43:21.173
Why not be moving at the

01:43:21.194 --> 01:43:22.975
same time and then getting

01:43:23.015 --> 01:43:24.076
to the point that you want

01:43:24.095 --> 01:43:25.617
to be after the meeting's over?

01:43:26.938 --> 01:43:30.421
It's going to restructure

01:43:30.461 --> 01:43:32.002
the whole way that people move around.

01:43:32.823 --> 01:43:34.163
It's going to disrupt airlines.

01:43:34.243 --> 01:43:35.845
It's going to disrupt public transit.

01:43:35.864 --> 01:43:37.206
It's going to disrupt trains,

01:43:37.326 --> 01:43:39.268
not to mention Uber and taxi services.

01:43:42.676 --> 01:43:43.877
It's the biggest transition

01:43:43.936 --> 01:43:45.559
since electricity.

01:43:46.100 --> 01:43:46.881
If you think about the

01:43:46.900 --> 01:43:49.302
transition that people had in electricity,

01:43:49.363 --> 01:43:52.126
how much of a change in

01:43:52.947 --> 01:43:54.929
your daily life that will have suddenly,

01:43:54.988 --> 01:43:55.149
you know,

01:43:55.168 --> 01:43:57.692
you didn't have to go to bed at

01:43:57.752 --> 01:43:58.512
seven p.m.

01:43:58.552 --> 01:44:00.814
because you could stay up.

01:44:02.355 --> 01:44:03.337
and many of these things

01:44:03.356 --> 01:44:04.738
were very revolutionary so

01:44:05.337 --> 01:44:06.738
before electricity it was

01:44:06.818 --> 01:44:08.259
even the case that people

01:44:08.779 --> 01:44:11.480
were um sleeping in two

01:44:11.520 --> 01:44:13.421
parts in the night so one

01:44:13.462 --> 01:44:14.561
they start sleeping very

01:44:14.662 --> 01:44:15.703
early then in the middle of

01:44:15.722 --> 01:44:16.922
the night they woke up to

01:44:17.182 --> 01:44:18.144
just chit chat with the

01:44:18.203 --> 01:44:19.184
neighbors and then go back

01:44:19.224 --> 01:44:20.765
to sleep again until it was

01:44:20.784 --> 01:44:22.565
uh light again so that

01:44:22.605 --> 01:44:23.746
period was just very long

01:44:25.537 --> 01:44:28.099
And you would never say that

01:44:28.158 --> 01:44:29.180
electricity would have

01:44:29.220 --> 01:44:31.041
disrupt such a normal habit,

01:44:31.100 --> 01:44:32.740
but many of our sort of

01:44:32.981 --> 01:44:34.282
normal habits in day-to-day

01:44:34.322 --> 01:44:36.922
life will be completely

01:44:37.064 --> 01:44:38.203
overhauled by all these

01:44:38.243 --> 01:44:39.824
opportunities that these

01:44:39.925 --> 01:44:41.286
technologies are going to bring.

01:44:42.886 --> 01:44:44.527
And Jensen Wong of Nvidia

01:44:44.567 --> 01:44:46.547
says that AI is so foundational,

01:44:46.707 --> 01:44:47.668
it's like electricity.

01:44:47.689 --> 01:44:48.429
Yeah.

01:44:49.224 --> 01:44:50.426
It's going to be infused

01:44:50.485 --> 01:44:51.807
into absolutely everything.

01:44:51.988 --> 01:44:52.548
Everything.

01:44:52.569 --> 01:44:54.971
I think so as well.

01:44:54.992 --> 01:44:58.055
That's a nice bombshell to end on.

01:44:58.497 --> 01:44:59.899
And it's almost one hundred year,

01:44:59.979 --> 01:45:00.640
one hundred fifty

01:45:00.779 --> 01:45:02.002
electricity is not so long

01:45:02.061 --> 01:45:03.944
time ago in this grand scheme of things.

01:45:03.965 --> 01:45:04.444
So that's right.

01:45:04.905 --> 01:45:08.487
The crazy thing before we go that case,

01:45:08.527 --> 01:45:09.547
I know we have to wrap up.

01:45:09.587 --> 01:45:10.887
So there's only one thing I

01:45:10.908 --> 01:45:11.688
would like to mention.

01:45:12.469 --> 01:45:14.689
So like back in the days,

01:45:14.708 --> 01:45:15.649
you have this movie which

01:45:15.689 --> 01:45:17.189
is called The Man Who Made America.

01:45:17.250 --> 01:45:17.890
I think, Damian,

01:45:17.949 --> 01:45:19.711
we've discussed it a couple of times.

01:45:20.331 --> 01:45:21.271
And there's actually I think

01:45:21.311 --> 01:45:22.532
it's Edison or somebody

01:45:22.612 --> 01:45:23.252
else who's going to be

01:45:23.271 --> 01:45:24.613
backed by JP Morgan.

01:45:24.853 --> 01:45:26.273
And they have a certain way

01:45:26.313 --> 01:45:27.913
to drive electricity.

01:45:28.673 --> 01:45:30.454
And everybody backs him, you know,

01:45:30.494 --> 01:45:32.476
because he's the most smart

01:45:32.516 --> 01:45:33.077
guy in the world.

01:45:33.117 --> 01:45:34.177
And then somebody else comes

01:45:34.217 --> 01:45:35.658
along with a different

01:45:35.698 --> 01:45:37.960
solution for electricity,

01:45:38.000 --> 01:45:39.381
which is really going to be it, you know.

01:45:39.480 --> 01:45:41.862
So I hope Elon is the latter

01:45:43.103 --> 01:45:43.802
and not the former.

01:45:44.063 --> 01:45:46.085
But it always trickles in my mind,

01:45:46.104 --> 01:45:47.926
like even if you have the

01:45:47.966 --> 01:45:49.947
most smart guy in the sense,

01:45:50.287 --> 01:45:51.448
also with FSD or whatever,

01:45:51.728 --> 01:45:52.988
it can always be that there is coming...

01:45:53.809 --> 01:45:55.109
different technologies or

01:45:55.130 --> 01:45:56.430
whatever that takes over.

01:45:56.470 --> 01:45:58.212
But I think for now they're leading,

01:45:58.231 --> 01:45:58.932
so that's all good.

01:45:58.993 --> 01:46:00.113
But it always pops to my

01:46:00.134 --> 01:46:02.395
mind when it's funny

01:46:02.435 --> 01:46:03.735
because I'm on the

01:46:03.775 --> 01:46:05.877
Wikipedia page of the

01:46:05.978 --> 01:46:07.418
electricity transition.

01:46:08.399 --> 01:46:11.442
One of the topics

01:46:12.282 --> 01:46:14.484
is that electricity was the

01:46:14.564 --> 01:46:16.086
liberator of the woman

01:46:17.108 --> 01:46:19.470
because of all the machines,

01:46:19.670 --> 01:46:22.634
washing machines, centrifuge, fridge,

01:46:22.753 --> 01:46:23.274
all that.

01:46:25.015 --> 01:46:27.019
It was electrical

01:46:27.078 --> 01:46:29.240
housekeeping was apparently before,

01:46:30.061 --> 01:46:31.623
just after the First World War,

01:46:31.644 --> 01:46:32.444
a very big thing.

01:46:34.529 --> 01:46:39.201
And it was really being seen

01:46:39.261 --> 01:46:40.524
at the time as something

01:46:40.564 --> 01:46:42.248
that liberated women.

01:46:43.737 --> 01:46:45.318
First feminist wave.

01:46:45.618 --> 01:46:46.639
And humanoid robots will

01:46:47.899 --> 01:46:49.121
liberate humanity.

01:46:49.301 --> 01:46:50.462
Humanity, exactly.

01:46:51.523 --> 01:46:52.524
Choose your words carefully,

01:46:52.583 --> 01:46:53.264
not eliminate.

01:46:53.283 --> 01:46:57.546
Right.

01:46:57.568 --> 01:47:00.569
Slight difference.

01:47:00.609 --> 01:47:02.971
Let's end on a positive note there, Cern.

01:47:03.252 --> 01:47:05.273
Let's liberate humanity.

01:47:05.573 --> 01:47:07.454
Let's liberate Cern.

01:47:07.494 --> 01:47:08.836
We've held him hostage for

01:47:08.855 --> 01:47:09.556
quite a while now.

01:47:10.617 --> 01:47:11.898
We found the video, so...

01:47:12.921 --> 01:47:14.581
yeah we're just gonna we're

01:47:14.621 --> 01:47:15.542
gonna close off with this

01:47:15.561 --> 01:47:16.962
video uh thank you so much

01:47:17.181 --> 01:47:18.862
cern for uh being here with

01:47:18.942 --> 01:47:20.842
us and taking the time and

01:47:20.863 --> 01:47:21.943
I hope to invite you as a

01:47:21.983 --> 01:47:23.863
guest um again in the

01:47:23.884 --> 01:47:25.884
coming uh uh ten episodes

01:47:25.904 --> 01:47:27.463
uh where we're going down

01:47:27.503 --> 01:47:29.965
to the robotics future uh

01:47:29.984 --> 01:47:31.085
so for everyone thanks for

01:47:31.104 --> 01:47:32.104
tuning in thanks for

01:47:32.364 --> 01:47:33.185
listening thanks for

01:47:33.225 --> 01:47:34.326
watching thanks for paying

01:47:34.345 --> 01:47:35.886
attention and having the

01:47:35.905 --> 01:47:38.247
patience and let's close

01:47:38.287 --> 01:47:38.947
off with this video

01:47:55.394 --> 01:47:56.694
Blind me to the moon.

01:48:23.648 --> 01:48:24.429
Honey!

01:48:24.469 --> 01:48:25.488
Honey!

01:48:25.689 --> 01:48:27.649
Are we flying it?

01:48:53.122 --> 01:48:54.365
It's time for love.