Welcome back to another episode of Dancing with Depression. I'm your host, Adam Turner. And in today's episode, you're going to hear a voice that might be new to you, but one I first heard around September, 1975. It's a voice that started softly, full of encouragement, support, and love. But as I found my own voice over the years, hers had to get little louder to be heard, often times having to remind me that wisdom, which she had, came from experiences which I hadn't yet had. And if by chance she didn't have a previous experience to draw from, her go-to was, because I said so, and until you start paying the bills, that's all you need to know.
Think you know who it is? Well, if you haven't figured it out yet, today's special guest is my mom, who we'll hear from momentarily.
So how did we get here? Well, when I started opening up about my depression, I found reflection to be an integral part of better understanding why I was feeling the way I was. How time and experiences were bringing old memories and emotions into sharper focus. That was true for me, and as I've learned, it was also true for my mom.
The conversation between my mother and me actually started in the most ordinary way possible. I was at a routine doctor's appointment. My doctor was going through the standard list of questions — my family history of cancer, diabetes, high blood pressure — and then came the one about anxiety or depression or any other mental health diagnosis.
That's when it hit me. I didn't know the answer. So, before I left the parking lot, I called my mom. Thought it was gonna be a quick conversation, just to ask if we had any history of depression or if she'd ever taken medication for it, so I could update the doctor during my next visit.
But that one simple question opened the door to a much deeper discussion about how she viewed her mental health decades ago and how time and reflection have given her a new understanding of what she was going through back then.
So without further ado, let's get into it. A heartfelt, honest conversation between mother and son.
_______________________________________________
Adam Turner (
00:01)
Hi, Mom.
Alan (
00:02)
Hi, Adam.
Adam Turner (
00:04)
⁓ you're so nice now that we're recording. That's so lovely. ⁓ Are you ready for this?
Alan (
00:07)
Thank you.
Yes, Adam.
Adam Turner (
00:17)
Okay, so we were talking the other day and I was asking you a question about specifically depression, mental health and so on. And you started to answer and then kind of went back. Can you share just a little bit about what you were thinking about when I was asking you that?
Alan (
00:28)
Yes.
I don't remember. You were asking me about what again?
Adam Turner (
00:47)
if you had taken any medication specifically for depression.
Alan (
00:50)
⁓
Yeah. Well, I think I told you that I had been on something that the doctor prescribed. And at the time, I didn't think I was depressed. And I told him that. But ⁓ he apparently must have thought I was or something was going on.
And now that I look back on it, I think I was at some point not depressed enough to want to do myself any harm, but there were certain things going on in my life at the time. And I think that's kind of what was causing it, going kind of...
Adam Turner (
01:46)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
01:48)
crazy.
Adam Turner (
01:50)
So, I know you've had a lot of things, different things that it could be, but do you remember specifically what was going on around that time?
Alan (
02:00)
Well,
I'm thinking that some of the things that were going on was your father and I were having some difficult times. ⁓ I thought, I really thought our 13th wedding anniversary was going to be it.
⁓ he, I don't remember exactly some of the things, but he moved out of the house. ⁓ we had some properties that we owned right across the street from where we lived. And he said he needed to.
do that. And I, you know, I didn't really understand at the time. And he went over and he stayed out in one of the empty apartments that was across the street. And you know, he was right across the street. So wasn't like if I needed him, he was, you know, he was within reach. But it still made me feel really bad.
I says, what did I do? I don't know what I did. I know there was things going on and we went for ⁓ marriage counseling.
And we had been to marriage counseling probably about four times at least within our, not all at that time, but kind of throughout.
Adam Turner (
03:54)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
04:00)
One of the times we went to marriage constantly was to a rabbi.
And he was, he was, I thought he was really wonderful. I don't know, I'm not sure what your father thought, but I think he liked him. And we, like I said, we had gone a few different times and each time we went, things seemed to be okay for a while.
And I think what the turning point for me was.
When I got sick, when I got really sick in 2009.
Adam Turner (
04:45)
Sick with what?
Alan (
04:46)
the multiple myeloma.
I knew then that your father was going to be by my side. Sorry.
He would be there for me no matter what. Because I had in the past doubts about that. It seemed to me that he always had more ⁓ room or more for other people. And not me. And I felt kind of left out at times. ⁓
But that's your father. He always likes to help everybody. So anyways, when I got sick, I knew for sure because he was going to be there for me no matter what. And he was. And he still is. Because of some of the dumb things I've done about breaking bones.
Adam Turner (
05:57)
That's the most recent thing.
Alan (
05:59)
It is, but it goes back to when he started when I was sick. ⁓
You know, a lot of people, men and women, would not be able to do what he has done. To be with someone that that's sick. To be ⁓ there for that person. You hear all the time about people leaving because this one or that one got sick and they just couldn't handle it and ⁓ that kind of thing. And that's...
⁓ You know, I thought at times that your father was, I mean, it was like too much. I thought it was too much for a lot of people. Even me, I mean, here I am going through a stem cell ⁓ transplant and I'm in the hospital for over, a little over a month and then I'm home.
and really wasn't doing anything except for sleeping. And he was there the whole time, making sure that I was, you know, I had what I needed, that I was okay, you know, that kind of thing. I remember you coming to the house when I was sick and you taking me outside because I had to get a little bit of exercise.
So you said, let's go walking down the, and this is when we were living over on Green Hollow. And you said, well, let's walk down the driveway. Cause it was a long driveway. And we walked down the driveway and we walked back and, um, you know, I had gotten a little bit fresh air and a little bit of exercise and, then I think I went back to bed. Probably. I don't know. I don't remember that part.
Adam Turner (
08:03)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Alan (
08:06)
But yeah, I did. Oh, OK. So I really had a lot to be thankful for at that point. But before that, it was, I don't know, was crazy. mean, you know, the doctor would ask me, you, you know, I.
Adam Turner (
08:07)
I remember you did. Yep. ⁓
Alan (
08:36)
Do you feel, I said, I feel fine. But I think I was really just, I don't know. I think I kind of was just kidding myself that how can I be, you know, ⁓ having problems? I've, you know, I've got a house to take care of. I got kids to take care of. I've got, I got your husband, my husband.
and I was working, you know, I was working and it's like, how do I have time to even feel like I'm depressed? But I think I was to some point.
Adam Turner (
09:23)
And so in the moment, or as things are going on, and I can totally relate, you're so focused on all of the other things that you have to take care of that it's almost as if you were saying, or you were telling your body, listen, if you think I'm depressed, I'm not accepting it because I got other stuff I gotta do. ⁓ Because that was, you know, a...
Alan (
09:44)
Yeah.
Adam Turner (
09:51)
big deal. It kind of my thought process was I didn't and I'm curious you like I didn't I thought depression was more like a in an extremely traumatic and it's not to say that what you experienced wasn't but it just I don't know. I had to reflect like you're doing now and when you look at it and you've got
the kids, ⁓ you've got the marriage, you've got work, you've got your health, all of that, you get distracted. And I think you're right. I think you kind of trained yourself to say I'm okay.
Alan (
10:40)
Well, I think one of the other things is that because I had so many other things going on in my life that I needed to take care of that I didn't even see that you were having a problem.
Adam Turner (
11:01)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
11:02)
I did
not see that. And that makes me very sad that I wasn't able to see that you needed help. I you didn't say anything, but still, maybe there should have been something that would have...
I saying, well, you know, maybe you should talk to him. you should, but I never, I always thought you were fine. I always thought you were You had plenty of friends. You had things that you were ⁓ involved in outside of school and you seemed to be happy. mean, never.
Adam Turner (
11:44)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
11:49)
ever thought there was a problem.
Adam Turner (
11:54)
And I think that is common, right? ⁓ I didn't really know ⁓ if it wasn't for my coworker and friend, Nicole, like I, I, I mean, I eventually probably would have found out, right? But I, I wasn't, I wouldn't say that while I was there in Connecticut and living there, because I had already moved away and
Alan (
12:02)
Bless you.
Adam Turner (
12:24)
⁓ I, there's no way that you could have known, ⁓ there, there just isn't. So, you, you can take that off of, off of your, your chest, but I, I look at it in, in say very similarly when we look back, we can see things that we've experienced that could attribute to it.
And that's where the interesting connection comes for everybody because you don't anticipate it, you don't know. ⁓ And I think that when you take a look at when you were experiencing what you were experiencing, mental health was not necessarily something that was discussed. It's still on the rise, but it
Alan (
13:17)
Good. ⁓
Adam Turner (
13:23)
Then it was, you know, not as talked about or discussed. So that's another component. You you mentioned, you know, kind of like. As a mother would, you know, I I wish I could have been there for you and so on. I mean, you have been in so many different ways, you don't realize it. ⁓ But my question is.
And I didn't think I was going to ask this, but when I was going and was dealing with and kind of the thick of things and I allude to not calling or when I did, it was kind of short and kind of like an in between ⁓ running an errand type of thing.
did you, how did, how did you feel knowing what I was dealing with or was it happening and you didn't know what I was dealing with? And so it affected you a different way. Cause we could, could, could we agree that we're close and we talk a lot, at least when under normal circumstances type of thing.
Alan (
14:50)
Yeah.
Adam Turner (
14:54)
And when we do, I always walk away smiling and laughing and so on. So it wasn't that I didn't want to talk to you, but what was that like and when did you notice it?
Alan (
15:16)
I remember, I think when it first started happening, when you were ⁓ calling us in between your food stops or ⁓ something like that, I felt kind of slighted. I felt like, what's the matter? He can't call us when he doesn't have to run an errand. And I mentioned this to dad. He can't call us, mean, just, I mean, talk to us. mean,
It's not like it's, he's right here with us that we can go and see him or hear him anytime. And so that when we did get to talk to you, it's like, wow, you know, he, feels like it's, he's got more important things than to talk to his parents. And that never used to be the case. So I, I did, I felt, you know, kind of slighted because what?
What did I do wrong? What? You know, why is he acting like this? And, um... That's... I guess that's, you know, that's how I felt for... But then when I found out that you were having some problems, that you were ha... Okay, and you were trying to deal with those... Okay, well, we'll give you some time. Um... But try to get back to the way you were. That you were...
Adam Turner (
16:41)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
16:42)
You know, you were calling and I'm not saying you have to talk to us for two or three hours at a time, but more than five minutes is nice. ⁓
Adam Turner (
16:52)
We've definitely had some two hour conversations, but they were regarding my mental health. Some things that I was dealing with and I needed to talk to you about.
Alan (
16:57)
Yeah. Yes.
Right. And I can understand that because
I understand that now more. ⁓ that you're still having to go through some things to get, you know, certain things figured out. And that takes some time, but
Adam Turner (
17:08)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
17:23)
It would just be nice to be able to, I mean, like, it was so nice when we got to get together, when we went to Utah, everybody.
Adam Turner (
17:38)
Mm-hmm.
Alan (
17:40)
Everybody had a good time as far as I could tell.
Adam Turner (
17:45)
We had a blast.
Alan (
17:46)
It was like a really nice time. And that's not something that we can do all the time because everybody, this one's there and this one's there. And, you know, so it's not something we could do all the time, but that time we made it count. We made it count. And then of course, when...
Adam Turner (
18:06)
For sure. Yeah.
Alan (
18:11)
When your father and I and you and Bobby were gonna go away, I did something dumb and I broke my shoulder. Well.
Adam Turner (
18:23)
I just gonna say, you know, we can see more of each other if you would just land on your two feet and not... For somebody that doesn't like hospitals, you do like to visit them quite frequently.
Alan (
18:27)
I know, I stop breaking things, huh?
No, no,
But, you know, we talked about being able to do something after my shoulder heals. And I just have to keep myself in one piece. My father's over here laughing. Yeah. So, okay, thank you. I don't know if they have enough in the store.
Adam Turner (
18:54)
As he should. We got extra duct tape. We'll tape you together.
Well, we'll see. I do want one more thing to kind of talk about because you mentioned it, but I really think for people that are going through stuff, they're not necessarily in the mindset of trying to figure out how they're feeling.
cancer and beat it not once, not twice, but if I'm not mistaken three times. Is that correct?
Alan (
19:46)
I think so. It was the same cancer, but you know, yeah, I had to go back for ⁓ chemo and yeah.
Adam Turner (
19:56)
Mm-hmm. And a fairly intense stem cell treatment. Is that what it was?
Alan (
20:04)
Well, I'll tell you the truth on the stem
cell.
The stem cell ⁓ itself, I didn't think it was that bad. What was bad was the recovery. That stunk.
Adam Turner (
20:27)
Mm.
Alan (
20:30)
Cause here I am in bed for like, your father likes to say 20 hours out of the day.
And when I tried to eat something, would, it would come back up. He would, he was so funny. He would get, he would get all these things for me to try to eat and he'd have them on the table. And it was a good size table, you know? So I go and I try something and I go, no, that's not going to work. That's not going to work. That's not going to work.
You know what I was able to do?
Adam Turner (
21:15)
What?
Alan (
21:15)
He got
me some.
⁓ Cran.
What was it? Cranberry? Grape, think it was.
Yeah, it was very great.
Adam Turner (
21:33)
good.
Alan (
21:36)
was able to keep that down! ⁓ all things. Yeah. and the other thing, I'm trying to remember what the other thing was that I kept down. ⁓ it has something with cheese, I think. Do you remember that, No. It had something to do with, I think, cheese, and I don't remember exactly what it was. And was able to keep that down. So that's kind of like what I lived on.
Adam Turner (
21:41)
So you had a liquid diet?
Alan (
22:06)
for a while. huh.
Adam Turner (
22:06)
Hmm. So the recovery, recovery
was, so the recovery was rough.
Alan (
22:13)
The recovery was very rough. had told me, they had told me at the hospital, they had told me at Dana-Farber that it was going to take probably at least a year before I started feeling more like myself. And they weren't kidding. I think it took a little bit more than a year, but it was, it was a long time. And, ⁓ and even now I'm like, I'm tired all the time.
I mean, you know that, you know I'm always taking a nap in the afternoon. And some of that might be from some of the medications I'm on, but still, you know, it was rough for quite a while.
Adam Turner (
22:48)
Mm-hmm.
I'm still partially, I still believe partially that you're trying to get away from dad's bad jokes, but I won't say for certain that that's the reason why. ⁓ Two things, one, I wanna share just with you one of the memories that I had ⁓ because I can't remember what it was, but dad,
Alan (
23:13)
.
Adam Turner (
23:30)
Dad had something where he wasn't able to take you to Dana Farber for, I don't know that it was for chemo. I thought it was for something else, but either way it was an appointment there and you had asked if I could bring you in and I did. well, the beauty of this is even if I don't have it accurate,
Alan (
23:40)
⁓
I don't remember that.
Adam Turner (
23:58)
I knew you wouldn't be able to correct me because I knew you wouldn't remember it, but it's stuck in my head because, ⁓ so we went there and you were familiar with the facility. I had never been there and ⁓ you had me park at a certain spot and we walked in and I remember telling you, I'm like, my goodness, like this is,
a really far walk. Like, why don't they have parking closer for patients that have to come in and whatever? And you said to me that there was a place that you could park closer, but you wanted purposefully to walk through the children's hospital to get to your appointment. And I was like,
Why? And basically in a nutshell, you didn't, I don't know the exact words, but you were basically like, they kind of give me inspiration. If they can deal with what they're dealing with, then I can too. And I thought that that was pretty awesome. ⁓ and so there were things that, you know, I think
you passed on even though you were going through some difficult times. ⁓ And so that was pretty cool.
Alan (
25:41)
don't remember that at all. Are you sure you got the right mother?
Adam Turner (
25:47)
I have a pretty bad memory, but when something that profound happens, I am 100 % certain, yes.
Alan (
26:01)
I don't remember any time
that your father never had, was able to take me up there. Was that, Anna, was that before I was actually had to go into the hospital?
Adam Turner (
26:07)
Yeah, it was like I said, it I don't it what's.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a walk in, walk
out. like I said, I don't think it was an actual treatment. It was something else that they did have to take blood or do something, but ⁓ yeah, I remember it.
Alan (
26:26)
Yeah.
I don't remember that at
all. Huh, and I usually can, yeah, okay. Well, if you say so.
Adam Turner (
26:37)
So the last question I have is.
Well, it's a question and then and then a statement. So the question is, do you have any questions? That you want to ask me that I will be on record of answering.
Alan (
26:56)
⁓
Do I have any questions for you? No, I don't know. I hadn't really thought that far ahead. I mean, I just, guess the question is, that maybe how are you feeling? Are you feeling any better now that you've been able to talk about some of these things?
Adam Turner (
27:03)
Yes.
⁓ yes, I am. and you know, as, as I've mentioned, you know, if six months ago you would ask me, do I think I would have experienced the things I did? No, I wouldn't. I, it's very, it's, it's, it's different. It, I don't know how to describe it, but what I do know and can say with confidence is,
Alan (
27:24)
you
Yeah.
Adam Turner (
27:54)
I feel more like myself today than I have in years. And that is a lot about learning things. It's about perspective and getting an opportunity to
Alan (
28:03)
⁓ that's good.
Adam Turner (
28:21)
talk to other people that are experiencing or have experienced what you've experienced is very therapeutic to me. ⁓ I understand that it's not for everybody, but I think if people were educated a little bit more and given the opportunity, I think that they could get a lot out of it. ⁓ So once again, a mother
Alan (
28:31)
Mm-hmm.
Adam Turner (
28:51)
In less than 30 minutes, with the focus on your story, has reverted back to me several times as not surprised at all. I love you more than I'll ever be able to share. And thank you for
even when you don't understand supporting and having faith that I'll figure it out. ⁓
So I appreciate that.
Alan (
29:30)
I'm glad, I'm hoping that this helped in some way, our talk. And ⁓ I think I just wanna maybe make sure that some of the other people that might be listening to this, I talked about having doubts years ago at my marriage and stuff, but I want people to know
that we did go for marriage constantly. We did have other people that we talked to when we were hitting a rough patch. And because of that, that we, your father and I will be celebrating 55 years of marriage come this February.
Adam Turner (
30:21)
56 years?
Alan (
30:22)
55
years.
Adam Turner (
30:25)
No, 56.
Alan (
30:27)
Explain because the people out there are going to want to know why I'm saying 55 and you're saying 56.
Adam Turner (
30:37)
Because Dad Counts when he asked you and the fact that it took you a year to accept
Alan (
30:43)
It'd take me a year.
Yeah, go ahead.
Adam Turner (
30:46)
It's hard enough if he's celebrating 56 and you're only on 55.
Alan (
30:49)
Yeah.
Well, anyways, that is, ⁓ there's not very many people I don't think nowadays that can say they're gonna celebrate 55 years or 56 years of marriage. So I just wanted to put it out there.
Adam Turner (
31:10)
Awesome. And, and I will say that that is, it was a beautiful thing before I knew how incredibly challenging in a good way that marriage is. You have to put the work in and clearly you guys have, and it's a testament to dad being there when you needed him most and knowing that after that point, he was your rock.
Alan (
31:26)
That's right.
Yep.
Adam Turner (
31:39)
And ⁓ yes, he is. Yes, he is. So thank you so much, Mom. I just can't thank you enough. And I will work on some things. And I hope that you see those differences because you guys mean the world to me. And we'll have some fun when you heal up and we get back together and have some fun.
Alan (
31:40)
and it still is my rock.
Welcome.
Yeah, yeah, right, we
will. Okay, honey. Good talk. I love you too and say hello to Bobby. Can't leave Bobby out. All right. Bye.
Adam Turner (
32:13)
All right, I love you.
I will. Nope.
Bye.
Outro:Wow, that was eye-opening. I remember feeling a little confused when my mom first shared her thoughts about the doctor's diagnosis and how she didn't agree. Don't get it twisted, I know my mom is amazing, but the sarcastic northerner in me wanted to ask her when exactly she became a doctor.
But I think it's helpful to give that moment some context. In the 1980s and 1990s, mental health just wasn't something people talked about openly, especially within families. Organizations like NAMI, the National Alliance on Mental Illness, had only just been founded in 1979. It started as a small grassroots movement — families sitting around kitchen tables, searching for understanding and support.
And remember, this was before social media. There were no viral posts or overnight awareness campaigns. Change happened slowly — one story, one person, one family at a time. I think most would agree that mental health awareness and education have come a long way since then. But there's still work to be done.
I'm curious — can you think of a time or conversation, a situation that when it happened, you saw it one way, but as time passed, you were able to look at it differently, maybe even see it more clearly than you did back then?
That's really what this episode represents for me. I can better understand now why my mom didn't think of herself as depressed at the time. The language, the understanding, and the awareness we have today just didn't exist back then.
This isn't about whether my mom had a formal diagnosis of depression. It's about understanding how we sometimes miss the signs in ourselves, how we normalize the weight we're carrying, and how healing can still begin even long after the hardest chapters have passed.
The truth is, some things are hereditary. Understanding our family history is about awareness. And it's our responsibility to educate ourselves, to be better prepared for what we might be up against as we take care of our loved ones and ourselves.
Like you, it was also my first time hearing that my parents could very well have gotten divorced even after 13 years of marriage. Yet, through counseling, commitment, and a lot of faith, come February 2026 they’ll be celebrating their 55th — and respectfully 56th — wedding anniversary.
I personally believe a lot of that has to do with my dad finally listening to my mom.
I know that was a lot to digest, but if there's one thing I hope you take away from this, it's that asking questions about where we come from can be one of the most powerful steps toward healing where we are.
Before I sign off, I just want to say — thanks, mom. I love you, and thank you for sharing so honestly. From your personal health experiences to reminding us that some of the most beautiful things in life exist because the work was put in. And for continuing to be there for your favorite second-born son.
And to everyone listening, thank you for being here.
If you're struggling, remember help exists, change is possible, and you are absolutely worth it. Until next time, continue to ask questions, keep learning about your mental health, and when it comes to depression — take the lead.