WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.720 Matt: Mark Szymanski, welcome back to the WP minute. 00:00:03.720 --> 00:00:05.590 Mark: Uncle Matt, it's always a pleasure to be here. 00:00:05.880 --> 00:00:06.760 Thank you so much. 00:00:07.460 --> 00:00:08.900 It's been a while, but it has 00:00:08.900 --> 00:00:09.510 Matt: been a while. 00:00:09.690 --> 00:00:14.569 Uh, you know, there's, uh, today's topic we're, we're going to be 00:00:14.569 --> 00:00:20.180 talking hopefully a little bit about, uh, AI and, uh, my exploration 00:00:20.189 --> 00:00:23.630 with coding with AI, like getting a little bit more serious about it. 00:00:23.770 --> 00:00:25.240 I saw you put up a video. 00:00:25.390 --> 00:00:27.489 Uh, I almost trolled you on that video. 00:00:27.489 --> 00:00:28.089 I'll save that. 00:00:28.540 --> 00:00:30.170 Uh, for a later conversation. 00:00:30.610 --> 00:00:33.940 That's how you put out a video using AI to code a plugin. 00:00:33.949 --> 00:00:35.080 So I'm excited to hear more about that. 00:00:35.080 --> 00:00:36.380 And of course I'll link it up in the show notes. 00:00:37.089 --> 00:00:43.000 Um, but, uh, yeah, this time instead of me leading, I'm just as lost as you are. 00:00:43.010 --> 00:00:45.250 So this is going to be an interesting conversation, right? 00:00:45.250 --> 00:00:47.670 Usually I'm here coaching you through something, helping 00:00:47.670 --> 00:00:48.389 you understand something. 00:00:48.640 --> 00:00:51.860 I'm just as lost as you are with AI, uh, maybe even more so. 00:00:52.170 --> 00:00:55.489 And, uh, I'm kind of interested to talk about both of our experiences and maybe 00:00:55.489 --> 00:00:57.010 what we're, what we're up to with it. 00:00:57.099 --> 00:00:57.849 If that's cool with you. 00:00:57.910 --> 00:01:00.400 Mark: That's always great. 00:01:00.449 --> 00:01:01.620 Always great to chat with you, brother. 00:01:01.680 --> 00:01:06.360 Um, yeah, I mean, um, well, I just want to say right off the top, I know we 00:01:06.360 --> 00:01:10.509 were talking in the green room before this, uh, that you, I've only known 00:01:10.509 --> 00:01:14.179 you for, I think, I can't remember what our anniversary is, knowing each 00:01:14.180 --> 00:01:18.500 other, but it's been a year or very, just around a year, and you've gone in 00:01:18.500 --> 00:01:24.385 that time from, completely dis complete disdain for AI to now realizing that 00:01:24.385 --> 00:01:26.365 it's, it's coming, it's, it's here. 00:01:26.785 --> 00:01:28.855 It's gonna continue to get a little more interesting. 00:01:28.855 --> 00:01:30.895 And you've had a chance to look at it a little deeper. 00:01:30.895 --> 00:01:33.745 And now as you're saying off camera, you're basically a 00:01:33.745 --> 00:01:35.755 senior developer, you know, so I 00:01:35.755 --> 00:01:40.375 Matt: feel like a senior developer, but the code output is probably abysmal. 00:01:40.585 --> 00:01:41.185 Um, 00:01:41.425 --> 00:01:42.745 Mark: we definitely need to dig into that. 00:01:42.750 --> 00:01:42.820 Yeah. 00:01:42.865 --> 00:01:43.135 Yeah. 00:01:43.135 --> 00:01:44.065 We definitely need to dig into that. 00:01:44.275 --> 00:01:46.315 Matt: So let, let's talk about, um. 00:01:47.750 --> 00:01:50.620 Sort of giving up the reins to AI and like where my thoughts 00:01:50.620 --> 00:01:51.980 are, you know these days. 00:01:52.530 --> 00:01:58.150 I still think it's just a Really good assistant right now. 00:01:58.870 --> 00:02:04.650 It is Replicating so I've been using it Claude I've been using Claude 00:02:04.719 --> 00:02:08.300 largely over the last I don't know six months I generally it's how I 00:02:08.310 --> 00:02:13.530 shape a lot of my show notes for the podcast episodes that I put out Really, 00:02:13.530 --> 00:02:15.829 that's what I use it for mostly. 00:02:16.160 --> 00:02:20.960 Um, and, uh, it's been fine for that, right? 00:02:20.960 --> 00:02:22.340 It's, it's been okay for that. 00:02:22.750 --> 00:02:25.690 Uh, these are things that are, you know, low value. 00:02:26.000 --> 00:02:28.380 Um, you know, I, I just need concise. 00:02:28.380 --> 00:02:30.310 I need speed and efficiency. 00:02:30.390 --> 00:02:34.725 And that's where, you know, Claude and his recent iteration of, uh, Uh, 00:02:34.755 --> 00:02:36.754 it's, uh, LLM has been really great 3. 00:02:36.755 --> 00:02:40.775 5 or whatever it was as of this recording. 00:02:40.775 --> 00:02:47.915 Um, but anything else that I was trying to have it do on the things that I was 00:02:47.924 --> 00:02:52.885 looking for, like, I don't know, even analyzing data, um, throwing a spreadsheet 00:02:52.885 --> 00:02:55.305 at it and asking it certain questions. 00:02:55.585 --> 00:02:58.585 Um, and I'd say even like six months ago when I started getting into it, at least 00:02:58.585 --> 00:03:02.134 with Claude, asking it to code some stuff for me, it just wasn't really working. 00:03:02.624 --> 00:03:10.215 Um, And fast forward six months, uh, I've made a lot more headway, probably 00:03:10.215 --> 00:03:11.465 because the tools are getting better. 00:03:11.675 --> 00:03:15.124 There is one tool that I started to use, which is like literally 00:03:15.124 --> 00:03:18.194 life changing, uh, which I just discovered over the, over the weekend. 00:03:18.614 --> 00:03:20.064 But all of this is to say is like. 00:03:21.275 --> 00:03:26.265 It still is just doing the things I'm asking it to do, writing 00:03:26.265 --> 00:03:31.205 words is doing good, writing code seemingly is doing great because the 00:03:31.205 --> 00:03:32.455 shit that I'm building is working. 00:03:34.065 --> 00:03:39.995 But it's not really helping me or guiding me if I'm making the right decisions. 00:03:40.405 --> 00:03:43.715 In other words, there still has to be a layer of human 00:03:43.715 --> 00:03:45.025 interaction with this stuff. 00:03:45.615 --> 00:03:50.545 Uh, which I think anyone taking it serious, uh, will know that, uh, and 00:03:50.545 --> 00:03:53.935 certainly if you're doing it for your business, like if you're in marketing and 00:03:54.385 --> 00:03:58.284 I don't know, you're trying to like make blog posts and pages for customers or even 00:03:58.285 --> 00:04:00.155 write code for your WordPress website. 00:04:00.705 --> 00:04:03.355 I think at the end of the day, like you're still going to need to know what the hell 00:04:03.355 --> 00:04:06.275 you're doing and understand the concepts. 00:04:06.595 --> 00:04:09.625 Right now I'm totally lost with what I'm doing. 00:04:09.875 --> 00:04:13.885 I just keep smashing the prompts and it keeps giving me code. 00:04:14.205 --> 00:04:14.924 I try it. 00:04:15.059 --> 00:04:18.209 It works, or it doesn't, and then I ask it to do it again, and then 00:04:18.209 --> 00:04:19.699 I just move on to the next step. 00:04:19.979 --> 00:04:22.109 It's the worst way of doing it. 00:04:22.120 --> 00:04:25.839 It's like, totally, uh, unoptimized. 00:04:25.880 --> 00:04:27.060 I'm burning oil. 00:04:27.280 --> 00:04:31.809 And, like, I am the world's problem with greenhouse gases right now, 00:04:31.809 --> 00:04:37.069 because I am making NVIDIA CPUs just, or NVIDIA GPUs just go nuts with 00:04:37.069 --> 00:04:38.309 the code that I'm trying to write. 00:04:38.309 --> 00:04:40.169 There's no optimization on my side. 00:04:40.599 --> 00:04:41.379 Uh, does that make sense? 00:04:41.379 --> 00:04:44.379 Like, I feel like it's still not there to, like, just completely 00:04:44.379 --> 00:04:46.199 solve the world's problems. 00:04:46.810 --> 00:04:51.130 Mark: That is a really good example of probably where I would say most of the 00:04:51.130 --> 00:04:53.310 world is with these tools right now. 00:04:53.340 --> 00:04:56.279 Um, I want to make some quick disclaimers and maybe just kind of 00:04:56.280 --> 00:04:57.609 continue to set the scene a little bit. 00:04:57.610 --> 00:04:59.530 The first disclaimer that I'm going to make, I think I can speak for 00:04:59.530 --> 00:05:03.739 both of us, when we say that we don't know how this stuff works right now. 00:05:04.079 --> 00:05:05.439 technically at all. 00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:10.159 Um, we can, we can pseudo describe how it works, right? 00:05:10.159 --> 00:05:13.719 It's basically just like they somehow coded something that went across the 00:05:13.719 --> 00:05:18.899 internet, so to speak, all the language data that we have and basically built kind 00:05:18.899 --> 00:05:20.899 of like a little bit of a language model. 00:05:21.179 --> 00:05:24.459 We could think of it as almost like a little working brain, but it doesn't 00:05:24.469 --> 00:05:27.369 really expand too much on things. 00:05:27.399 --> 00:05:29.769 I feel like we're maybe getting there, but it doesn't really expand on things. 00:05:29.779 --> 00:05:30.669 It's really just like. 00:05:30.725 --> 00:05:38.284 Uh, uh, a model of data that it can pull from and accurately kind of like, like 00:05:38.284 --> 00:05:42.524 again, pseudo feel like a person that you're talking to or something like that. 00:05:42.524 --> 00:05:46.934 It's way better than a Google search, uh, in a lot of ways because it has all that 00:05:46.934 --> 00:05:48.344 data and it can express it back to you. 00:05:48.344 --> 00:05:51.895 It's kind of like talking to a person and for people that are completely 00:05:52.844 --> 00:05:56.465 removed from technology, it's very new and very interesting and very cool. 00:05:56.465 --> 00:05:58.794 Once you play with it a little bit, you realize kind of what's going on. 00:05:58.794 --> 00:06:00.684 You realize some of the limitations and all that sort of stuff, 00:06:01.004 --> 00:06:02.155 but that's a big disclaimer. 00:06:02.825 --> 00:06:06.244 The other big disclaimer that I feel like that I can kind of say or set the 00:06:06.244 --> 00:06:13.574 scene here for, uh, in, as of November of 2024, Claude, ChatGBT, Gemini, there's 00:06:13.574 --> 00:06:15.154 a ton of other ones obviously out there. 00:06:15.364 --> 00:06:19.304 None of them are, this is I think the big part in what you're kind of describing 00:06:19.304 --> 00:06:25.135 in the beginning, they're not magic, they're not mind readers, they're not, um, 00:06:25.215 --> 00:06:30.750 independent, like, thinkers in any way, they are literally just Assistance for 00:06:30.750 --> 00:06:35.340 the most part the best way that in the way that I, I feel like in the last like month 00:06:35.340 --> 00:06:40.599 or two, I've really like stepped up my prompt engineering or just my utilization 00:06:40.599 --> 00:06:45.710 of these tools and the mindset change that I had was like This isn't magic. 00:06:45.790 --> 00:06:52.325 This is like my If I was like a, a senior marketing director or a senior 00:06:52.325 --> 00:06:57.015 developer or whatever, this is my junior sitting next to me and I can be like the 00:06:57.015 --> 00:07:00.535 manager or more of the director and they can do some of the work and they're not 00:07:00.535 --> 00:07:01.694 going to be able to do the whole work. 00:07:01.725 --> 00:07:03.435 It's, it's actually kind of funny. 00:07:03.435 --> 00:07:06.934 I've thought about this many times and I'm like, I haven't, I don't have a extensive 00:07:06.944 --> 00:07:09.465 background in corporate environment, but it's almost kind of like that. 00:07:09.475 --> 00:07:11.895 It can just take the place a little bit of. 00:07:12.539 --> 00:07:16.340 The less senior devel I'm not, I'm not saying that we should, like, get 00:07:16.340 --> 00:07:17.420 rid of junior developers and stuff. 00:07:17.710 --> 00:07:20.540 I'm just saying, like, that's the level of capability that this stuff has, 00:07:20.760 --> 00:07:25.030 but like you said, you ha it has to be directed by somebody, kind of, currently. 00:07:25.030 --> 00:07:30.084 It's not really It's not really there yet, at least the way that most people use it. 00:07:30.095 --> 00:07:33.625 And again, the biggest disclaimer of all is this just started, like 00:07:33.694 --> 00:07:35.405 let, like a few years ago, max. 00:07:35.405 --> 00:07:37.475 So we are extremely early to this. 00:07:38.074 --> 00:07:40.775 And, uh, that's why, that's why I'm making some of the content. 00:07:40.775 --> 00:07:41.895 Cause I know this is where it's headed. 00:07:41.905 --> 00:07:43.464 Like, we're just going to keep getting crazier with this. 00:07:43.845 --> 00:07:44.024 Matt: Yeah. 00:07:44.024 --> 00:07:45.624 I was having a conversation with my brother. 00:07:45.924 --> 00:07:50.044 Who's been using chat GPT, uh, for a little while and he uses it 00:07:50.054 --> 00:07:52.345 much more for, uh, coding stuff. 00:07:52.345 --> 00:07:55.025 And I talked to him a couple of weeks ago about this and, you know, 00:07:55.025 --> 00:07:58.304 he was saying like, Hey man, this is, you know, changing the world. 00:07:58.304 --> 00:08:00.734 This is going to be, you know, totally, this is really going to make things 00:08:00.734 --> 00:08:05.375 weird over the next couple of years of how people are, whatever, just doing 00:08:05.394 --> 00:08:08.995 anything on the web, whether it's, you know, your search from search to 00:08:09.015 --> 00:08:11.755 creating content, to writing code, to interacting with those sites. 00:08:12.245 --> 00:08:14.635 Um, and I agree with him. 00:08:15.424 --> 00:08:19.874 But I think at the top of this stuff, uh, I feel like we're in the, um, 00:08:19.905 --> 00:08:25.335 the housing bubble, uh, or like, uh, a couple of years ago during COVID 00:08:25.384 --> 00:08:28.184 when like money was free and everyone was just like getting mortgages. 00:08:28.184 --> 00:08:31.654 It is like 2%, you know, you could do all this stuff and money was just out there. 00:08:31.655 --> 00:08:35.625 I feel like we're in that mode right now with AI where this stuff 00:08:35.625 --> 00:08:38.784 is still too cheap, like 20 bucks a month to do what I'm doing. 00:08:39.375 --> 00:08:41.395 I can't see that sustaining, right? 00:08:41.414 --> 00:08:47.415 And I think what we're looking at is in the near future, a lot of these sites 00:08:47.445 --> 00:08:51.115 either just like constantly ramping up the price like we see with freaking 00:08:51.115 --> 00:08:53.314 streaming services with everything, right? 00:08:53.315 --> 00:08:56.365 Because they're burning cash and power literally. 00:08:56.785 --> 00:09:04.790 Um, and Inevitably, there'll be some like some major corporation needs to win as 00:09:04.790 --> 00:09:09.750 it always does and we're gonna start to see like the Tightening of like what's 00:09:09.750 --> 00:09:16.959 available at what cost so the way I see it is all these guys Claude Chat GPT. 00:09:17.039 --> 00:09:19.570 It was the only two I really use I don't use Gemini or anything 00:09:19.570 --> 00:09:23.750 else really but those two are just gonna be like Alright, we're done. 00:09:23.830 --> 00:09:27.120 Like, the free ride is over, it's either now minimally a hundred 00:09:27.120 --> 00:09:29.820 bucks a month, two hundred bucks a month, like, what's the pressure 00:09:29.820 --> 00:09:31.930 point where people will pay up to? 00:09:32.470 --> 00:09:35.069 Uh, or you're just not gonna get all this new cool shit that you're 00:09:35.069 --> 00:09:36.500 getting now for twenty bucks a month. 00:09:36.890 --> 00:09:40.580 And that's really gonna, that's when things will change, I think dramatically, 00:09:40.580 --> 00:09:42.459 with like, who has access to what. 00:09:42.859 --> 00:09:46.439 Like, what is your best AI, and can you afford to use it? 00:09:46.819 --> 00:09:49.010 Uh, I think is, is where we're headed. 00:09:49.020 --> 00:09:53.555 It's not gonna be, like, this commodity, like, where, like, where Accessing today. 00:09:53.564 --> 00:09:55.474 I mean could be wrong, but that's the way I see it 00:09:55.984 --> 00:10:01.854 Mark: mate could be Um, I wish I knew who it was and if I find the video again, we 00:10:01.854 --> 00:10:05.844 can link it below but there was a video it was just a short like a one or two 00:10:05.874 --> 00:10:09.595 three minute video where this guy was saying that Around the time that open eye 00:10:09.665 --> 00:10:12.365 open ai did they go private or public? 00:10:12.405 --> 00:10:14.535 I can't whatever they did there like They had like a weird 00:10:14.564 --> 00:10:15.505 Matt: non profit 00:10:15.564 --> 00:10:15.765 Mark: at 00:10:15.765 --> 00:10:17.865 Matt: one point sort of like this mullenweg and 00:10:18.185 --> 00:10:19.904 Mark: and automatic stuff like you're just like what? 00:10:20.394 --> 00:10:21.524 Yeah, what yeah what happened there? 00:10:21.535 --> 00:10:26.569 Um, but so Around that time, somebody was, uh, in this video that I saw, like, 00:10:26.569 --> 00:10:28.919 kind of like, it was, I wish I could remember the argument entirely, but 00:10:28.919 --> 00:10:32.709 basically they said that they're not worried about basically what you described 00:10:32.709 --> 00:10:36.769 there, because all, because everybody and their mother, it was so weird how 00:10:36.769 --> 00:10:40.409 this happens, like, we heard the word AI, we saw ChatGPT, and then basically 00:10:40.449 --> 00:10:44.099 overnight, everyone started implementing these things, and it's strange how that 00:10:44.099 --> 00:10:47.349 happens, sometimes it's like you need one person to just be like, oh, I figured it 00:10:47.349 --> 00:10:50.395 out, and then somehow, Even though you couldn't figure it out for many years. 00:10:50.415 --> 00:10:53.535 Now everybody is releasing their thing where they figured it out, I guess 00:10:53.535 --> 00:10:54.905 just reverse engineering or whatever. 00:10:54.905 --> 00:10:58.974 But, um, but because we're seeing that and all these things are cheap, 00:10:59.254 --> 00:11:02.965 they're thinking that everything is just going to continue to be cheap. 00:11:02.975 --> 00:11:06.114 Now, again, certainly at certain points, there's going to be more 00:11:06.114 --> 00:11:08.934 developments and maybe there'll be like more expensive, but then they'll 00:11:08.934 --> 00:11:10.635 come down in a more commoditized thing. 00:11:11.025 --> 00:11:14.525 I just don't think that this version of AI is ever really going to be 00:11:14.525 --> 00:11:17.614 like expensive because it's already cheap and it doesn't do anything. 00:11:18.369 --> 00:11:20.759 Completely groundbreaking. 00:11:20.759 --> 00:11:24.639 Like it's definitely a big shift, but it's not like you can just tell it to 00:11:24.639 --> 00:11:28.849 do something like, you know, we, we think about, um, I don't know if you've 00:11:28.849 --> 00:11:32.029 seen, obviously you've heard of Tesla and the cars and everything like that 00:11:32.029 --> 00:11:35.079 and everything you can do, but those are still like a premium ish product. 00:11:35.389 --> 00:11:37.949 I don't know if you saw the Tesla bots just like that. 00:11:37.969 --> 00:11:41.619 They showed like that level of stuff is. 00:11:42.050 --> 00:11:45.380 I feel like AI, I don't know, 0, whatever they call it, you know, 00:11:45.380 --> 00:11:47.810 whatever they're going to dub that, that's going to be the next thing. 00:11:47.810 --> 00:11:52.939 Once it starts moving into like hardware, I feel like, and physical items that are 00:11:52.939 --> 00:11:58.160 going to like actually enhance your life, like more physically, rather than just the 00:11:58.160 --> 00:12:03.050 stuff that we can do digitally, um, that's when the world's really going to change. 00:12:03.060 --> 00:12:05.830 Like, because everybody's going to see that, like when you see robots 00:12:05.830 --> 00:12:09.130 walking around and things, it's like literally iRobot from that Will 00:12:09.130 --> 00:12:10.250 Smith movie, that's going to be wild. 00:12:10.690 --> 00:12:11.250 But, um, 00:12:11.575 --> 00:12:12.785 Matt: Yeah, it doesn't it. 00:12:13.705 --> 00:12:14.725 Yeah, I agree. 00:12:14.745 --> 00:12:17.475 And I think we're we're missing this layer right now. 00:12:17.955 --> 00:12:22.464 And I want to talk about our experiences like coding in a moment, but we're 00:12:22.474 --> 00:12:24.155 missing this like connected layer. 00:12:24.204 --> 00:12:27.885 So like, what would AI be really great for right now? 00:12:28.155 --> 00:12:30.755 Well, I want it to look at my to do list. 00:12:30.995 --> 00:12:35.275 I want it to prioritize it based on like what I've prioritized in the past. 00:12:35.584 --> 00:12:39.899 I want it to You know, recommend what my next steps are, right. 00:12:39.899 --> 00:12:41.569 To improve my productivity. 00:12:41.989 --> 00:12:42.160 Right. 00:12:42.160 --> 00:12:45.520 Because, you know, getting things done, like, you know, you have this 00:12:45.550 --> 00:12:48.849 to do list, it's like write the blog posts and you're like, okay, 00:12:49.429 --> 00:12:50.920 like, where do I start with this? 00:12:50.920 --> 00:12:55.060 Like, I want smart intelligence to like, look at my list, break it 00:12:55.069 --> 00:12:59.209 down and then start to prompt me and say, here's what you should do next. 00:12:59.229 --> 00:13:03.439 Like these are, but it's not gonna, there's no AI to do that. 00:13:03.439 --> 00:13:04.629 And, and then you're just siloed. 00:13:04.679 --> 00:13:05.009 Let me stop 00:13:05.010 --> 00:13:06.249 Mark: you there for a second though. 00:13:06.249 --> 00:13:06.689 Do you. 00:13:07.180 --> 00:13:08.690 First question, and then there's a follow up. 00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:10.420 Do you think it can't do that right now? 00:13:10.430 --> 00:13:12.230 Do you believe that it can't like from your experience or do you 00:13:12.230 --> 00:13:15.040 believe that you just don't have the tooling or you don't, you don't know? 00:13:15.040 --> 00:13:15.989 I just don't think 00:13:15.990 --> 00:13:18.410 Matt: that I don't think that tooling exists. 00:13:18.729 --> 00:13:21.259 Like I don't want to give up my to do list app. 00:13:21.689 --> 00:13:23.369 I want it to work with it. 00:13:23.370 --> 00:13:25.719 And you know, we've seen some of these things like, I don't know 00:13:25.720 --> 00:13:27.130 if, Folks are just listening. 00:13:27.130 --> 00:13:28.510 I'll try to find it and link it up. 00:13:28.520 --> 00:13:32.099 But I know Claude launched, um, some new experimental thing. 00:13:32.099 --> 00:13:35.180 I don't think it's generally available yet, but it'll control your computer 00:13:35.439 --> 00:13:39.479 to do things like that's getting to the next level where like, yeah, okay. 00:13:39.479 --> 00:13:43.869 So now I can tell Claude, Hey, you know, prune my to do list, open up my 00:13:43.869 --> 00:13:45.109 email, start responding to that stuff. 00:13:45.109 --> 00:13:47.019 But I still think that's so far away. 00:13:47.089 --> 00:13:50.989 And then do you really trust back to that human interaction layer? 00:13:50.989 --> 00:13:53.060 Like, do you trust the code that you're deploying to your server? 00:13:53.060 --> 00:13:54.739 Like you're going to spot check it before you do that. 00:13:55.119 --> 00:14:00.814 Um, And are you going to trust it to manage your, your to do list? 00:14:01.245 --> 00:14:04.995 Uh, you know, I, I don't know, but that, but yeah, I mean, once it gets 00:14:05.025 --> 00:14:09.685 incorporated into that layer, yeah, I mean, I think productivity will, 00:14:09.814 --> 00:14:12.994 we're going to see a few years of like, wow, this is immense productivity. 00:14:13.475 --> 00:14:17.114 Um, but then what are the next few years after that look like where. 00:14:17.545 --> 00:14:20.485 You know, it's starting to do things for you and you're like, holy shit. 00:14:20.485 --> 00:14:25.685 Like, do I get paid the same, uh, you know, because of these efficiencies? 00:14:25.685 --> 00:14:26.355 I, you know, I don't know. 00:14:26.355 --> 00:14:28.774 It's, that's why, you know, again, shout out to my brother. 00:14:28.775 --> 00:14:32.654 I think he's looking at it going, things are going to get weird, but, um, 00:14:33.675 --> 00:14:39.714 let's just talk about our experiences with, with coding and, um, I'll start. 00:14:39.714 --> 00:14:45.865 So I, I have this idea for this web app and it's not even like something 00:14:45.865 --> 00:14:47.085 I'm making generally available. 00:14:47.085 --> 00:14:47.355 Let's say. 00:14:47.740 --> 00:14:52.140 It's more of like a tool for myself, um, but I want it to operate, uh, 00:14:52.209 --> 00:14:55.620 as a web app, um, one, because I want the challenge, but two, like, 00:14:55.969 --> 00:14:57.819 there's other ways that I can extend it and do some other things. 00:14:57.819 --> 00:15:00.140 But anyway, the point is, I was just like, all right, I'm going 00:15:00.140 --> 00:15:01.050 to get more serious about it. 00:15:01.050 --> 00:15:03.585 Let me see if I can figure this stuff out because Clawd 3. 00:15:03.585 --> 00:15:05.509 5 came out and I heard it was great for coding. 00:15:06.269 --> 00:15:09.840 So my first experience is Clawd. 00:15:10.390 --> 00:15:11.300 Here's the idea. 00:15:11.850 --> 00:15:13.070 Here's what I want you to build. 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:16.340 Uh, I had some direction. 00:15:16.810 --> 00:15:22.199 Uh, I asked it a few things cause I do have a sort of a, uh, uh, 00:15:22.290 --> 00:15:23.890 network operating background. 00:15:23.890 --> 00:15:27.610 So I was like, let's compare this to running on an AWS stack 00:15:27.970 --> 00:15:30.159 versus, uh, a CloudFlare stack. 00:15:30.489 --> 00:15:32.600 Uh, I've heard some great things about CloudFlare's efficiencies. 00:15:33.160 --> 00:15:34.450 I just don't know if it's as mature. 00:15:34.800 --> 00:15:37.320 So I asked it to like compare and contrast some of this stuff and 00:15:37.320 --> 00:15:38.280 I ended up going to CloudFlare. 00:15:38.750 --> 00:15:41.510 Path because I just didn't want to use AWS for this. 00:15:41.790 --> 00:15:43.620 I don't even know if that's the right thing So that's problem. 00:15:43.630 --> 00:15:44.180 Number one. 00:15:44.440 --> 00:15:49.410 I'm asking AI to like give me advantages of Both of these technical stacks. 00:15:49.410 --> 00:15:51.750 It said, you know cloudflare is the most efficient. 00:15:52.710 --> 00:15:57.229 Okay, you know, so great So I decided to go with that and then I just started 00:15:57.239 --> 00:16:01.960 dumping the ideas and like just hammering it with Like the questions and what I 00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:08.840 need it to do and the first major lesson that I learned was these interfaces You 00:16:08.840 --> 00:16:10.739 know you go to Whatever it is, claude. 00:16:10.740 --> 00:16:12.649 ai, chat. 00:16:12.649 --> 00:16:14.839 openai, um, com. 00:16:16.079 --> 00:16:22.229 These interfaces, you just dump stuff into it, and it is just like this huge 00:16:22.359 --> 00:16:24.330 pool that you're just throwing stuff into. 00:16:24.620 --> 00:16:28.189 And what I found with Claude was, I just started burning all of the tokens. 00:16:28.199 --> 00:16:32.439 I'm a pro 20 bucks a month user, but I would reach my limit. 00:16:32.879 --> 00:16:37.630 Uh, In like an hour of asking it questions and having it code for me. 00:16:37.910 --> 00:16:41.300 So I found myself talking to it and the answers it was giving me. 00:16:41.300 --> 00:16:42.930 It was like, ah, it's like, it's guiding me. 00:16:42.950 --> 00:16:44.860 It's like saying, here's what you should do next. 00:16:45.020 --> 00:16:46.919 And then it would prompt me and say, well, you know, do you 00:16:46.920 --> 00:16:48.020 want to extend these features? 00:16:48.219 --> 00:16:49.370 Do you want more clarity? 00:16:49.370 --> 00:16:51.899 Like do you want, and I'd be talking to it and like, yeah, man, give me more clarity. 00:16:51.900 --> 00:16:52.779 Cause I don't know what the hell I'm doing. 00:16:53.379 --> 00:16:54.869 So it would give me these answers. 00:16:55.345 --> 00:17:01.135 And extend upon it, it was just so much so fast that I was burning the, 00:17:01.205 --> 00:17:04.495 the, the tokens and then it would just say, Hey, you can't use 3. 00:17:04.495 --> 00:17:09.585 5 until whatever, 2 PM, you know, it'd be like a four, three or four 00:17:09.585 --> 00:17:13.774 hour window and I'd have to like shut my laptop and be like, fuck, I can't 00:17:13.774 --> 00:17:15.435 talk to this thing anymore, right? 00:17:15.545 --> 00:17:20.065 But I could go to three or whatever, whatever it's called and that, but the 00:17:20.065 --> 00:17:22.195 answers were just so vastly different. 00:17:22.845 --> 00:17:24.524 Um, the experience was so different. 00:17:24.964 --> 00:17:29.525 To like ask a code and it didn't know like where it left off 00:17:29.535 --> 00:17:30.855 with my other conversation. 00:17:30.855 --> 00:17:32.235 So that was super frustrating. 00:17:32.585 --> 00:17:36.465 But the first lesson I learned was you still have to be dialed in. 00:17:37.025 --> 00:17:41.295 Otherwise you're just at least with Claude anyway, you're going to burn through those 00:17:41.295 --> 00:17:45.275 tokens, you know, just asking a zillion questions and having it talk to you. 00:17:45.330 --> 00:17:47.420 If that makes sense. 00:17:48.180 --> 00:17:48.390 Mark: Yeah. 00:17:48.390 --> 00:17:51.840 And if you, if you've, if you've tried Claude, I would recommend you take a look 00:17:51.840 --> 00:17:54.700 at it, but what Matt's describing there, what you're describing, yeah, it's, it's 00:17:54.700 --> 00:17:58.050 entirely, um, it's entirely like that. 00:17:58.050 --> 00:18:01.940 So I made, uh, a couple of videos maybe two months ago at this point where I 00:18:01.940 --> 00:18:05.520 was just diving into this concept of literally maybe my first times using 00:18:05.520 --> 00:18:07.690 Claude and trying to code when I did that. 00:18:07.690 --> 00:18:09.780 I had that exact same experience that you had. 00:18:09.810 --> 00:18:10.230 I was like. 00:18:10.760 --> 00:18:11.670 What the fuck? 00:18:11.800 --> 00:18:14.290 Uh, I, I have all these questions still. 00:18:14.290 --> 00:18:16.820 And like, I, I can't do this until tomorrow or whatever. 00:18:17.320 --> 00:18:18.810 I'm not sure if there's a way around that. 00:18:18.810 --> 00:18:20.270 I don't know if you can buy more tokens. 00:18:20.589 --> 00:18:26.170 Um, one piece of one thought there though, is that whatever you're spending 00:18:26.170 --> 00:18:29.519 to get that information, you absolutely would have spent way more money trying 00:18:29.519 --> 00:18:31.000 to get somebody to do it for you. 00:18:31.040 --> 00:18:31.520 Like, sure. 00:18:31.530 --> 00:18:33.980 So, I mean, just to keep that in perspective, but I, but again, it's, 00:18:33.990 --> 00:18:35.780 it's, your point is completely taken. 00:18:35.780 --> 00:18:37.260 Like that's kind of annoying where we're at right now. 00:18:37.539 --> 00:18:38.940 I do think it's probably a bit of. 00:18:39.440 --> 00:18:43.330 Again, where we're at right now, so to speak with again, being extremely 00:18:43.330 --> 00:18:46.390 early, but the fact that you can do it, you know, we could stick on that 00:18:46.390 --> 00:18:47.860 and that's like the, the main piece. 00:18:48.340 --> 00:18:52.210 What I've learned from my second go around with this video that I just, 00:18:52.230 --> 00:18:56.229 uh, posted today, uh, as of recording this, it's like an hour and a half 00:18:56.229 --> 00:18:59.199 long video and, and I did it, and I did it specifically in two ways. 00:18:59.209 --> 00:19:01.589 The first part of it was just kind of me explaining what I was doing 00:19:01.589 --> 00:19:04.079 and the finished product and then the back half hour or whatever. 00:19:04.079 --> 00:19:04.889 As me literally. 00:19:06.185 --> 00:19:07.375 like playing around building it. 00:19:08.175 --> 00:19:11.855 So there's a, there's a bunch of little gold nuggets in there, but a 00:19:11.855 --> 00:19:15.005 couple of the ones that I found was if you're going to do this, you have to 00:19:15.005 --> 00:19:18.885 realize like you have to continuously get better at being a prompt engineer. 00:19:19.125 --> 00:19:22.675 You have to understand that, like, you have to give it all that information. 00:19:23.014 --> 00:19:27.845 You have to ask it to ask you questions, like prompted to ask you questions 00:19:27.865 --> 00:19:29.635 and particularly one at a time too. 00:19:29.635 --> 00:19:31.235 So you can just like kind of have a conversation. 00:19:31.615 --> 00:19:33.325 There's a little bit of stuff in there about like, you know, 00:19:33.325 --> 00:19:34.415 saving tokens and all that. 00:19:35.420 --> 00:19:37.850 The first time I did it, this is a really big one. 00:19:38.050 --> 00:19:41.090 The first time I did it, when it'll give you, let's say you're just 00:19:41.090 --> 00:19:44.780 making a simple WordPress plugin, so it codes a bunch of stuff for you. 00:19:44.790 --> 00:19:48.689 It outputs the files and the nice little art, uh, artifacts feature things. 00:19:48.690 --> 00:19:49.980 So you can kind of see it and everything like that. 00:19:49.980 --> 00:19:52.149 You can download the files, you can save them into your, on your 00:19:52.149 --> 00:19:53.429 computer directories and all that. 00:19:53.960 --> 00:19:58.490 If you ask it to change something or it has to rewrite it, what it, I think 00:19:58.490 --> 00:20:03.440 what it does on purpose is only gives you part of the file back because 00:20:03.460 --> 00:20:04.619 I think that's just less tokens. 00:20:04.620 --> 00:20:05.720 It doesn't want you to rewrite everything. 00:20:05.849 --> 00:20:08.389 I was telling it, no, I don't, I want you to rewrite the whole thing for 00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:09.600 me so I can just copy and paste it. 00:20:09.870 --> 00:20:12.310 Not really a good idea because you're going to burn a shit ton more tokens. 00:20:12.330 --> 00:20:13.020 Yeah, that's what I was doing 00:20:13.020 --> 00:20:13.270 Matt: too. 00:20:13.320 --> 00:20:14.009 I was just ripping through it. 00:20:14.009 --> 00:20:14.010 This 00:20:14.010 --> 00:20:18.040 Mark: is what I mean, like, you have to be the senior developer, 00:20:18.050 --> 00:20:19.449 and it's the junior developer. 00:20:19.450 --> 00:20:21.840 Like, you're still working, you're just guiding it, and 00:20:21.840 --> 00:20:22.809 it's doing a lot of this stuff. 00:20:22.809 --> 00:20:24.690 So that's one, that's one thought in my mind. 00:20:25.050 --> 00:20:27.589 Um, we could talk about, like, you know, is the code good or not? 00:20:27.870 --> 00:20:30.990 I think that if you're doing something relatively ubiquitous, it's going 00:20:30.990 --> 00:20:34.840 to be pretty good because it's not, unless it's hallucinating, which 00:20:34.840 --> 00:20:39.670 I Hopefully you can kind of tell maybe sometimes, but I don't know. 00:20:39.710 --> 00:20:42.000 You definitely probably want to get the shit vetted, let me just say 00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:46.675 that, but The one other piece of it is you mentioned where you're just kind 00:20:46.675 --> 00:20:48.165 of dumping everything into a pool. 00:20:48.205 --> 00:20:51.455 The one cool thing that I've found with Claude is it has a projects feature. 00:20:51.465 --> 00:20:54.485 I don't know what plan it's on or whatever, but that kind of like 00:20:54.965 --> 00:20:56.755 where we're, where we're not at yet. 00:20:56.845 --> 00:21:00.794 And kind of, they're kind of not there is think about like these LLMs of having 00:21:00.794 --> 00:21:03.595 like a big language model that they've scraped the internet and looked through 00:21:03.595 --> 00:21:04.525 all the data and everything like that. 00:21:04.525 --> 00:21:04.735 Okay. 00:21:04.735 --> 00:21:05.795 That's the whole LLM. 00:21:06.145 --> 00:21:09.365 What I want though, and I've tried this and I haven't like put it, I haven't 00:21:09.365 --> 00:21:10.784 made a video or anything too much yet. 00:21:10.995 --> 00:21:16.295 What I want to do is the LLM doesn't know what I want in this project or maybe 00:21:16.295 --> 00:21:18.905 like about me or my business or whatever. 00:21:19.225 --> 00:21:22.564 The secondary piece of this, and people have been doing this on like, if you've 00:21:22.564 --> 00:21:26.415 ever seen somebody do like a personal AI chat bot where they basically 00:21:26.425 --> 00:21:30.721 recreate themselves so people can ask questions and answer like there, you 00:21:30.721 --> 00:21:32.265 need to, what we all should be doing. 00:21:33.325 --> 00:21:35.135 This is a really good piece of content actually that I should write, 00:21:35.555 --> 00:21:39.715 but we all were like building our Facebook pages or our LinkedIn's 00:21:39.725 --> 00:21:41.275 or our websites or our blogs. 00:21:41.275 --> 00:21:45.165 What we need to be doing now is like building our own personal LLM 00:21:45.545 --> 00:21:49.055 where it's like everything about us so at any point like we could 00:21:49.055 --> 00:21:52.515 call in or somebody else could call into that and like get the answer. 00:21:52.805 --> 00:21:58.145 Cause that is like, I feel like maybe 75 area of where we need 00:21:58.145 --> 00:21:59.185 to go with some of this stuff. 00:21:59.515 --> 00:22:02.955 Because then, if you can do that, and you can create that, your own 00:22:02.955 --> 00:22:07.065 little segmented thing there, then now you've added more information to it, 00:22:07.065 --> 00:22:08.084 kinda like how you're doing, right? 00:22:08.084 --> 00:22:10.914 Like you threw all that information in there, and if you could silo that, 00:22:10.924 --> 00:22:12.705 you could always come back to that. 00:22:13.160 --> 00:22:16.250 I know they do it in the chat formats, but the projects thing is a separate thing. 00:22:16.540 --> 00:22:18.379 You could always come back to that and you could always 00:22:18.379 --> 00:22:20.070 continue that that piece of it. 00:22:20.310 --> 00:22:23.510 So a lot of stuff there, but Um, that's been my experience 00:22:23.520 --> 00:22:27.119 a couple little tips that i've found so far in my short journey. 00:22:27.370 --> 00:22:30.840 Matt: Yeah, I started I Purposely started in a project like when I got 00:22:30.840 --> 00:22:32.390 more serious about building this app. 00:22:32.460 --> 00:22:42.760 I started in a cloud project um, and I I I still find it lacking in It, 00:22:43.090 --> 00:22:47.520 especially when you hit, uh, uh, I have to just get better at understanding 00:22:47.520 --> 00:22:48.970 like how the, how this stuff works. 00:22:48.970 --> 00:22:52.210 But if you start a chat, let's say with 3. 00:22:52.210 --> 00:22:55.020 5, uh, sonnet, I believe is what it's called. 00:22:55.659 --> 00:22:55.939 Yeah. 00:22:56.300 --> 00:22:56.519 Yeah. 00:22:56.519 --> 00:22:56.819 Sonnet. 00:22:57.260 --> 00:23:00.469 Um, which is there at this point, they're most advanced, uh, that 00:23:00.540 --> 00:23:02.240 is accessible to average users. 00:23:02.570 --> 00:23:06.670 Um, You start that chat, you start, you know, going down the road of like, 00:23:06.670 --> 00:23:08.340 okay, build me this, this script. 00:23:08.750 --> 00:23:12.870 And, um, I'm building something again, runs on CloudFlare. 00:23:13.260 --> 00:23:18.069 CloudFlare has workers, which is, I don't know, the way that I understand it, the 00:23:18.069 --> 00:23:24.170 way that I've always perceived it as is like a serverless code architecture. 00:23:24.180 --> 00:23:29.379 Basically I can run tiny, tiny, tiny little operating systems that 00:23:29.440 --> 00:23:30.204 will run these, these scripts. 00:23:30.534 --> 00:23:31.574 Uh, these commands. 00:23:32.095 --> 00:23:38.585 So I have to build this big script that does all these API endpoints and routes 00:23:38.595 --> 00:23:39.985 and connections and all this other stuff. 00:23:40.785 --> 00:23:42.925 And if I'm chatting with it, 3. 00:23:42.925 --> 00:23:44.414 5 SONNET, I'm improving it. 00:23:44.444 --> 00:23:45.754 I'm adding API endpoints. 00:23:45.755 --> 00:23:46.355 I'm testing it. 00:23:46.385 --> 00:23:47.654 I'm building it, deploying it. 00:23:48.234 --> 00:23:49.714 And then I run out of tokens. 00:23:51.410 --> 00:23:51.940 And it's okay. 00:23:51.940 --> 00:23:53.600 You can't talk to me until four o'clock. 00:23:54.470 --> 00:23:59.460 I can't like back out to the pro like air quotes back out to the projects 00:23:59.460 --> 00:24:05.595 folder and then pick up on it with like version, uh, you know, LLM 3. 00:24:05.595 --> 00:24:10.680 0 and say, okay, let's reference this file that we've been building over here with 3. 00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:13.130 5 and now like, let's continue building this. 00:24:13.140 --> 00:24:15.290 It just, it has no idea. 00:24:16.090 --> 00:24:19.670 On how to do that, unless I'm just maybe not prompting it well enough. 00:24:19.910 --> 00:24:22.550 I mean, it creates the artifact, you see it, this is getting like really 00:24:22.560 --> 00:24:27.009 inside baseball here, but if you use Claude, folks who are listening, use 00:24:27.009 --> 00:24:28.040 Claude, you know what I'm talking about. 00:24:28.280 --> 00:24:33.229 You have like, the previous files that it's created in the project that you 00:24:33.229 --> 00:24:37.229 can click on at any time and see, even with a name, because it gives it a name, 00:24:37.279 --> 00:24:41.230 or you can actually tell it, give it this name, uh, and you try to reference 00:24:41.230 --> 00:24:42.680 it, it still has no freaking idea. 00:24:43.629 --> 00:24:46.370 Which is one of like that most aggravating things for me unless I 00:24:46.409 --> 00:24:51.000 unless their projects don't work the same as I thought they did Or it just 00:24:51.110 --> 00:24:54.199 simply has no idea because the 3. 00:24:54.199 --> 00:24:59.039 5 stuff was way more advanced like that Let me backtrack if you're asking 3. 00:24:59.040 --> 00:25:01.560 5 to code something for you It is literally like having somebody 00:25:01.569 --> 00:25:05.690 sit alongside of you and talk to you Like, it explains everything. 00:25:06.350 --> 00:25:09.139 It asks you what you want to do next. 00:25:10.130 --> 00:25:13.110 Suggests things that you should be doing, you know, next. 00:25:13.270 --> 00:25:14.510 Uh, for like features. 00:25:14.790 --> 00:25:16.380 You're like, oh shit, I never even thought about that feature. 00:25:16.380 --> 00:25:17.520 And you're like, wow, this is amazing. 00:25:17.999 --> 00:25:22.100 And then as soon as you go to like three, It's like, the baseline one, 00:25:22.120 --> 00:25:23.250 It's just like, here's the code. 00:25:23.329 --> 00:25:24.370 It doesn't say anything else. 00:25:24.640 --> 00:25:26.140 And it's just like, shit man, what the hell happened? 00:25:26.140 --> 00:25:27.580 You were so nice to me in this other chat. 00:25:27.890 --> 00:25:28.690 And now we got nothing. 00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:30.730 Um, it's vastly different. 00:25:31.080 --> 00:25:36.995 And um, So what I started to do it too is like, yes, I started to, as I 00:25:36.995 --> 00:25:42.105 understood the limitations I was running up against, I started, you know, making 00:25:42.105 --> 00:25:46.885 the requests a little bit smaller and then in the, I forget what it's called. 00:25:46.965 --> 00:25:48.695 Uh, let's see if I can pull it up really quick. 00:25:48.894 --> 00:25:49.644 There's instructions. 00:25:49.644 --> 00:25:51.474 I think you can say, I think it's called instructions. 00:25:51.475 --> 00:25:53.614 Yeah. 00:25:56.074 --> 00:25:57.715 Set custom instructions for the project. 00:25:57.715 --> 00:26:01.085 So in the upper right hand corner in the project, it says, 00:26:01.085 --> 00:26:02.275 how should Claude respond? 00:26:03.014 --> 00:26:03.695 I said that. 00:26:05.220 --> 00:26:10.100 I profiled myself, and I said, Before writing a lot of code, please explain 00:26:10.100 --> 00:26:14.689 quickly what you'll be doing before, before I can confirm, or so I can confirm. 00:26:15.130 --> 00:26:17.600 Right, so basically, don't burn those credits. 00:26:18.665 --> 00:26:21.355 Or tokens by writing a shitload of code. 00:26:21.675 --> 00:26:24.715 Tell me what you're going to do first and then I'll approve it. 00:26:24.795 --> 00:26:27.065 And even that didn't work all the time. 00:26:27.385 --> 00:26:30.185 It did when I asked it bigger things and it would like bullet 00:26:30.365 --> 00:26:31.595 point some features it might do. 00:26:31.985 --> 00:26:35.545 Um, you know, uh, it, you know, it would ask me, it was, it 00:26:35.545 --> 00:26:36.624 was like hit or miss with that. 00:26:36.915 --> 00:26:40.145 And I have another one in the instructions that says when writing code, please 00:26:40.145 --> 00:26:41.845 use good inline documentation. 00:26:42.105 --> 00:26:43.735 I'm a beginner level developer. 00:26:43.745 --> 00:26:48.305 It helps me find the areas you need me to update because what was happening was it 00:26:48.305 --> 00:26:50.045 would suggest those changes to the code. 00:26:51.254 --> 00:26:54.915 Like you said instead of like writing out 800 lines of code every single 00:26:54.915 --> 00:26:59.365 time which was a complete list of the file It would say just update these 00:26:59.375 --> 00:27:03.295 sections and I'm like, I don't even know where do I find this section? 00:27:04.255 --> 00:27:05.465 Yeah, where the hell is that at? 00:27:05.615 --> 00:27:09.664 So I'm trying to say like like really document this and help me 00:27:09.664 --> 00:27:14.935 understand where it needs to go later on So again hit or miss with that. 00:27:15.145 --> 00:27:17.145 I wish it was a little bit a little bit better 00:27:18.645 --> 00:27:23.264 Mark: Yeah, I mean again, I've had similar things and it probably it sounds like 00:27:23.264 --> 00:27:28.455 what you're trying to achieve is probably more more robust and more advanced than 00:27:28.455 --> 00:27:32.074 what I was trying to achieve in that video specifically that was like building a I 00:27:32.075 --> 00:27:38.485 think that maybe had Maybe seven files, eight files or something like that. 00:27:39.025 --> 00:27:42.075 Um, so I'm not sure if there's more, if there's more to it, but I mean, if 00:27:42.075 --> 00:27:44.785 you have more functionality, then the files are just getting bigger, it's more 00:27:44.785 --> 00:27:48.755 tokens, it's more decisions, it's more features, it's all that sort of stuff. 00:27:49.265 --> 00:27:53.394 Um, but I mean, I don't know, I'm, I'm bullish on it to this point. 00:27:53.394 --> 00:27:56.249 Cause I think it's pretty incredible what we can do so far. 00:27:56.790 --> 00:27:59.760 But all of the feedback that you're giving, I'm sure, like a lot of other 00:27:59.760 --> 00:28:02.940 people have like had, and like, I don't know, the thing, the thing 00:28:02.940 --> 00:28:06.979 with this is the part that confuses me the most is how you actually 00:28:06.980 --> 00:28:08.410 make something like this better. 00:28:08.920 --> 00:28:13.929 Like, like I, I've, I've, I mean, if we want to go off topic of coding, 00:28:13.930 --> 00:28:16.210 I don't know if you have more on the coding stuff specifically, but just 00:28:16.210 --> 00:28:19.880 like other use cases, I've actually found a ton of ways that I've used 00:28:20.030 --> 00:28:24.490 like Claude specifically and a chat, GPT and Gemini to certain cases, like. 00:28:25.225 --> 00:28:28.004 I have a laundry list of things now just in the past two months that I've used 00:28:28.004 --> 00:28:32.075 this stuff for that has actually made a difference, I would say, in all of my 00:28:32.075 --> 00:28:35.435 workflows and my just thought processes and the way that I work on things. 00:28:35.435 --> 00:28:38.364 Matt: Uh, let me just wrap up on some of this coding stuff. 00:28:39.735 --> 00:28:42.604 So then, so what happened next is like, here's the things I don't know. 00:28:42.615 --> 00:28:49.405 I'm way out of my league on, uh, on what I'm coding, right? 00:28:49.405 --> 00:28:52.525 It's pure JavaScript, you know. 00:28:53.175 --> 00:28:53.965 I mean, I'm actually. 00:28:54.660 --> 00:28:56.240 I can understand some of it now, right? 00:28:56.240 --> 00:28:58.970 Because I've literally been neck deep in it and it's actually 00:28:58.970 --> 00:29:01.320 a great education process. 00:29:01.560 --> 00:29:04.810 Sort of like reminds me of learning WordPress all over again. 00:29:05.549 --> 00:29:10.770 Um, which is cool, but way out of my league in terms of 00:29:10.770 --> 00:29:11.979 like what it's developing. 00:29:12.449 --> 00:29:15.099 So I found, uh, an app called cursor. 00:29:15.449 --> 00:29:16.750 Have you run into this? 00:29:16.790 --> 00:29:16.840 I've 00:29:16.840 --> 00:29:17.220 Mark: heard of it. 00:29:17.240 --> 00:29:17.930 I haven't used it yet 00:29:18.780 --> 00:29:23.480 Matt: because when I was coding, like when I initially started this 00:29:23.480 --> 00:29:26.480 project, I'm like, I got to start like a whole local development. 00:29:28.165 --> 00:29:28.805 Environment. 00:29:29.004 --> 00:29:30.925 I haven't done that in years. 00:29:31.004 --> 00:29:35.675 And when I did it for WordPress, WordPress is so easy. 00:29:35.705 --> 00:29:38.265 Like it's so, uh, you know, I guess it's the good and bad of 00:29:38.265 --> 00:29:39.794 WordPress because it's so archaic. 00:29:39.795 --> 00:29:42.984 It's my SQL, PHP and HTML, right? 00:29:42.984 --> 00:29:44.955 And CSS and of course now JavaScript. 00:29:44.965 --> 00:29:48.754 But the essence of it is like you can get a local environment up pretty damn easy. 00:29:49.505 --> 00:29:51.085 Whereas with like this stuff. 00:29:52.405 --> 00:29:55.865 You know, package installers, NPM install, like you're building all this 00:29:55.865 --> 00:29:57.575 stuff, then you have to deploy it. 00:29:57.575 --> 00:30:00.435 You have to do all of this stuff to get this thing going, and 00:30:00.435 --> 00:30:01.625 then what are you coding in? 00:30:02.085 --> 00:30:08.355 So I've, okay, hey, hey Claude, what's everyone using for coding, right? 00:30:08.355 --> 00:30:09.415 And they're like, oh, VS code. 00:30:09.415 --> 00:30:09.885 It's okay. 00:30:09.885 --> 00:30:14.125 So I started using VS code, and then my mind is blowing up because I'm 00:30:14.125 --> 00:30:17.215 like, fine, man, I don't even know how to say, like, then I just feel 00:30:17.225 --> 00:30:20.075 way out of my league because I'm like, this thing isn't set up right. 00:30:20.995 --> 00:30:22.855 I don't even know if I'm optimized right. 00:30:23.095 --> 00:30:24.205 Am I doing this correctly? 00:30:24.635 --> 00:30:29.315 Um, and then I started hitting that wall of Claude. 00:30:29.515 --> 00:30:32.245 Now over the weekend, I started making a lot of headway. 00:30:32.255 --> 00:30:33.025 Things were working. 00:30:33.255 --> 00:30:37.175 I built my, what's known as the Cloudflare Worker, and it was working. 00:30:37.175 --> 00:30:41.155 And I could send data to these APIs, it would talk to other APIs, and send 00:30:41.155 --> 00:30:42.515 me the information back that I needed. 00:30:42.885 --> 00:30:44.495 I was like, okay, I'm making, making headway. 00:30:44.845 --> 00:30:48.615 And then I was like, okay, now I need to make this a front end because I can't 00:30:48.615 --> 00:30:50.065 just do everything through the terminal. 00:30:50.335 --> 00:30:53.595 I need to be able to manage this in a web browser. 00:30:54.175 --> 00:30:57.295 And that's when the freaking wheels fell off because I was just like, 00:30:57.325 --> 00:31:00.775 Hey Claude, build me a react app that connects up to all these APIs. 00:31:00.775 --> 00:31:01.715 I can do this stuff. 00:31:01.875 --> 00:31:02.715 And it was just. 00:31:03.510 --> 00:31:04.310 It was just a shit storm. 00:31:04.310 --> 00:31:09.500 I mean, I just 48 hours of like trying to just figure out how to deploy this to 00:31:09.550 --> 00:31:12.330 cloudflare is the problem with cloudflare. 00:31:12.370 --> 00:31:14.780 I don't know is a problem with my code probably. 00:31:15.090 --> 00:31:15.410 Right. 00:31:15.420 --> 00:31:16.730 So there's all this stuff happening. 00:31:17.560 --> 00:31:24.980 And, um, I found cursor and I don't even remember how I found it. 00:31:26.320 --> 00:31:30.440 I think I was like, I need to find an alternative to vs code because I just felt 00:31:30.440 --> 00:31:32.790 like, I'm, I just using the wrong tool. 00:31:32.790 --> 00:31:34.430 Like, I just can't do this stuff anymore. 00:31:34.920 --> 00:31:38.139 And then I found Cursor, and Cursor integrates with Cursor. 00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:45.370 Directly with Claude and the magic is it's not your tokens. 00:31:45.470 --> 00:31:49.700 It's their tokens So I can just freaking pound away at this thing and 00:31:49.700 --> 00:31:51.250 just be like, here's the 900 lines. 00:31:51.400 --> 00:31:52.980 Look at it Tell me what's wrong. 00:31:53.300 --> 00:31:54.500 All right, give me the update. 00:31:54.680 --> 00:31:59.580 Here's another 900 lines like give you know, give me another update And that has 00:31:59.880 --> 00:32:03.380 solved it dramatically and basically what it has stopped and what it has allowed 00:32:03.380 --> 00:32:07.410 me to do is in, in cursor, now this is, you know, anyone who's like a proper 00:32:07.410 --> 00:32:12.930 dev is like freaking out flipping tables right now, but I ask it to do something, 00:32:13.950 --> 00:32:18.170 it shows me the code like I was doing in my Claude web browser and instead of 00:32:18.180 --> 00:32:23.920 me copying and pasting it into the file, you just say, apply it and it writes it. 00:32:23.920 --> 00:32:24.324 Hmm. 00:32:24.845 --> 00:32:26.725 Right in the file Right. 00:32:27.115 --> 00:32:29.715 So I'm just like oh, yeah all day man. 00:32:29.715 --> 00:32:31.255 Like I just said yes. 00:32:31.265 --> 00:32:31.585 Yes. 00:32:31.615 --> 00:32:31.915 Yes. 00:32:31.945 --> 00:32:37.315 Yes Like this is all the code I want And I finally got to a point where 00:32:37.525 --> 00:32:40.935 now I'm not using react anymore I'm using another framework called svelte, 00:32:41.505 --> 00:32:44.605 which is like a pure JavaScript play on it supposed to be more efficient. 00:32:44.615 --> 00:32:45.505 Yada Yada, I don't know. 00:32:45.535 --> 00:32:47.975 I'm like watching YouTube videos while I'm coding. 00:32:48.245 --> 00:32:52.667 I am you're not coding I'm coding, man. 00:32:52.667 --> 00:32:53.484 You're 00:32:53.485 --> 00:32:53.925 Mark: prompting. 00:32:53.925 --> 00:32:54.465 I'm coding. 00:32:54.685 --> 00:32:55.685 Matt: This is the way that I see it is. 00:32:55.905 --> 00:32:57.035 I'm the guy with the idea. 00:32:57.545 --> 00:32:58.665 We're working together on this. 00:32:58.675 --> 00:32:59.365 It's a partnership. 00:32:59.855 --> 00:33:02.045 Uh, me, Claude, and, and Cursor. 00:33:02.555 --> 00:33:06.475 And, I finally get to a point where I've, I've launched the app. 00:33:06.925 --> 00:33:10.835 It's, the very basic iterations of it are, are working. 00:33:11.205 --> 00:33:14.095 Um, but Cursor is really the thing that made me. 00:33:14.400 --> 00:33:21.040 You know, turn the, turn the corner, which has allowed me to now I use. 00:33:21.230 --> 00:33:26.830 Um, so instead of like, uh, working with like some of like the real inside, like 00:33:26.840 --> 00:33:31.620 if a big issue comes up, right, like, um, I'm talking about and I'm, I'm asking 00:33:31.620 --> 00:33:33.050 it to like help me style the front end. 00:33:34.260 --> 00:33:37.390 So instead of doing that even in cursor, because you've got this tiny 00:33:37.480 --> 00:33:43.820 little window, literally, um, I'll, I'll start asking chat GPT and Claude 00:33:44.150 --> 00:33:45.480 what their recommendations are. 00:33:45.790 --> 00:33:48.040 So now it's like, I have two different people in front of me. 00:33:48.515 --> 00:33:50.245 You know, big, big question, right? 00:33:50.245 --> 00:33:51.025 Like a big question. 00:33:51.025 --> 00:33:54.655 Like what should I use tailwind or should I use like some other CSS 00:33:54.675 --> 00:33:58.685 framework, whatever, and I'll, I'll ask them both, see what the answers are. 00:33:59.315 --> 00:34:02.475 And then I'll aggregate that and then bring that into a cursor 00:34:02.475 --> 00:34:05.185 and be like, okay, here's where I think I should be going with this. 00:34:05.185 --> 00:34:05.855 What do you think? 00:34:07.540 --> 00:34:12.520 It'll give me the answer and man, I'm a, I'm a single 00:34:12.630 --> 00:34:14.680 person enterprise is what I am. 00:34:15.310 --> 00:34:15.710 Okay. 00:34:16.930 --> 00:34:18.800 I'm going to be launching so many apps, dude. 00:34:20.520 --> 00:34:21.570 It's not even gonna be funny. 00:34:22.030 --> 00:34:22.400 Okay. 00:34:24.150 --> 00:34:25.780 All I have to say is WordPress is in trouble. 00:34:26.400 --> 00:34:27.270 Mark: WordPress is in trouble. 00:34:27.270 --> 00:34:27.530 Yeah. 00:34:28.200 --> 00:34:28.690 Oh my God. 00:34:28.720 --> 00:34:31.450 Um, man, people are gonna be so mad about this. 00:34:31.500 --> 00:34:32.730 Um, No, 00:34:32.850 --> 00:34:34.720 Matt: it does help me really appreciate. 00:34:35.420 --> 00:34:39.510 Like what WordPress has like really like even like I'm looking at 00:34:39.510 --> 00:34:40.830 it now, and I'm like holy shit. 00:34:40.840 --> 00:34:44.955 There's Lot of like legacy stuff here and I can understand why people 00:34:44.955 --> 00:34:49.745 who are on the cutting edge look at WordPress and go That's a joke. 00:34:49.805 --> 00:34:53.665 Like look at that dinosaur over there But at the same time as an end user 00:34:54.865 --> 00:34:56.845 like imagine trying to do like imagine. 00:34:56.995 --> 00:34:59.540 Oh, yeah AI is gonna change all this stuff You can just make your own 00:34:59.550 --> 00:35:01.900 WordPress, and it ain't gonna happen. 00:35:02.260 --> 00:35:06.300 Uh, I mean, not anytime soon, and not to what you can do with WordPress, but 00:35:06.510 --> 00:35:10.550 it does also make me appreciate, like, what we have as, like, this little 00:35:10.560 --> 00:35:12.660 bottled up application that is WordPress. 00:35:13.260 --> 00:35:14.110 Mark: I got a lot of thoughts. 00:35:14.110 --> 00:35:16.640 The first one I have to say, though, is that I didn't realize it. 00:35:16.830 --> 00:35:17.630 It took less than a year. 00:35:17.630 --> 00:35:21.170 It took a week for you to be completely bullish on AI and be 00:35:21.170 --> 00:35:22.510 like literally a senior developer. 00:35:22.520 --> 00:35:23.690 That's amazing. 00:35:23.760 --> 00:35:25.510 I don't know if anybody's ever done that in a week. 00:35:26.080 --> 00:35:27.300 Um, I'm gonna quickly go 00:35:27.310 --> 00:35:28.990 Matt: back to the CEO level in a moment. 00:35:29.460 --> 00:35:29.630 Mark: There you go. 00:35:29.990 --> 00:35:30.720 Once I smart it up. 00:35:30.720 --> 00:35:37.210 Um, yeah, the one random question that I have that I don't know if we can 00:35:37.210 --> 00:35:40.200 really answer, but it would be good to get other people from the community to 00:35:40.200 --> 00:35:43.235 answer this is, We are not developers. 00:35:43.275 --> 00:35:44.555 I wouldn't classify myself. 00:35:44.555 --> 00:35:46.385 I don't think you'd classify yourself as developers, right? 00:35:46.385 --> 00:35:48.625 Like we know code here and there, just from being around. 00:35:48.625 --> 00:35:53.365 We know what stuff does, but we've never sat for eight hours, multiple times per 00:35:53.365 --> 00:35:56.545 week, per day, per year to like actually develop software or anything like that. 00:35:57.255 --> 00:35:58.495 We know enough to be dangerous. 00:35:58.495 --> 00:36:00.405 And now with Claw, we know enough to be really dangerous. 00:36:00.735 --> 00:36:03.475 So I'm wondering. 00:36:04.285 --> 00:36:09.605 If we're that camp, so to speak, like we're that archetype and we're see 00:36:09.605 --> 00:36:12.375 this and we're like, Oh shit, we could like build our own apps and stuff 00:36:12.375 --> 00:36:13.915 like that, or like our own plugins. 00:36:14.045 --> 00:36:16.975 And it's like, we know the dangers kind of, if we're being honest with 00:36:16.975 --> 00:36:18.285 ourselves, but we're trying it. 00:36:18.285 --> 00:36:19.145 Cause it's interesting. 00:36:19.145 --> 00:36:19.755 We're trying to learn. 00:36:21.105 --> 00:36:25.705 I wonder if software developers, the other archetype, if they look at these things 00:36:25.725 --> 00:36:30.045 and they're leveraging, I wonder if like that, that, that, what you just described 00:36:30.045 --> 00:36:33.305 there with like Claude and cursor, I don't know this enough, and I'm sure there's. 00:36:33.660 --> 00:36:36.900 Videos and people doing this stuff, but I don't know if our, our software 00:36:36.900 --> 00:36:40.950 developers, you would think that if, if you put that into a software developer's 00:36:40.950 --> 00:36:45.020 hands, like the co pilot from GitHub or, you know, whatever, or whatever, whatever 00:36:45.020 --> 00:36:46.430 the, well, there's tons of them now. 00:36:46.860 --> 00:36:52.805 If you gave that to somebody like, are they just like flying at like Mock 10 now. 00:36:52.955 --> 00:36:53.165 Yeah. 00:36:53.165 --> 00:36:53.675 I think that's 00:36:53.675 --> 00:36:55.295 Matt: where the biggest wins are, for sure. 00:36:55.325 --> 00:36:55.685 Yeah. 00:36:55.805 --> 00:36:56.375 Mark: You know what I mean? 00:36:56.375 --> 00:37:00.275 So it's like, the thing is, it's not like only we have these tools. 00:37:00.275 --> 00:37:02.825 They have the tools too, so they're not in trouble or anything like that. 00:37:02.825 --> 00:37:04.325 I don't think that by any means. 00:37:04.685 --> 00:37:08.195 Um, and they still know what they're doing, so it's like they can go faster 00:37:08.225 --> 00:37:09.425 and they know what they're doing. 00:37:09.665 --> 00:37:12.485 So it's like if they run into the problems that you're having and I'm having, then 00:37:12.485 --> 00:37:13.895 it's like, oh, I know exactly what to do. 00:37:13.895 --> 00:37:14.556 Boom, boom, boom. 00:37:14.561 --> 00:37:15.815 I know exactly what to tell it to do. 00:37:15.820 --> 00:37:17.645 Da, da da, and, and they're off to the races. 00:37:17.915 --> 00:37:18.065 Yeah. 00:37:18.070 --> 00:37:18.160 Um. 00:37:18.710 --> 00:37:20.660 Matt: I think that's where cursor is supposed to really win. 00:37:20.690 --> 00:37:26.180 I'm using it from a, I'm using it from, uh, like it's chat features. 00:37:26.200 --> 00:37:30.810 I feel like are supposed to be just an assist literally, whereas I'm 00:37:30.810 --> 00:37:32.250 using it to code the whole thing. 00:37:33.050 --> 00:37:36.830 I, they, uh, from all the stuff that I've been watching and listening to people 00:37:36.830 --> 00:37:40.420 talk about how like amazing cursor is, is because it has like this auto complete 00:37:40.420 --> 00:37:45.280 feature, which if you know what you're doing speeds it up like that 10 X level 00:37:45.510 --> 00:37:47.990 where you can start, like if you know the code, you can start writing the code. 00:37:48.370 --> 00:37:51.940 And then it'll start auto completing the code it thinks is gonna come next. 00:37:52.430 --> 00:37:52.820 Mark: Oh wow. 00:37:53.220 --> 00:37:55.150 Matt: So, I don't even know what I'm doing. 00:37:55.180 --> 00:37:57.240 So I'm asking it to write stuff for me. 00:37:57.320 --> 00:37:59.830 And then, that's what I'm, that's how I'm using it. 00:38:00.170 --> 00:38:03.160 Whereas like, man, if you know what you're doing, this thing is, 00:38:03.600 --> 00:38:05.249 you know, puts you on Mach 10. 00:38:05.250 --> 00:38:07.810 And then if you really have a question, then you can ask AI. 00:38:07.810 --> 00:38:10.780 So, yeah, like, it really helps that kind of person for sure. 00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:14.310 Mark: Yeah, I mean, just in general with the coding stuff, I love 00:38:14.310 --> 00:38:15.420 that these tools are available. 00:38:15.420 --> 00:38:17.330 It's awesome that they're available to anybody. 00:38:17.810 --> 00:38:19.580 Um, I'm sure some people are going to be like, well, you 00:38:19.580 --> 00:38:20.790 shouldn't be coding your own stuff. 00:38:20.800 --> 00:38:22.260 It's like, I mean, I don't know if you want to play around 00:38:22.260 --> 00:38:23.300 and you understand the risks. 00:38:23.300 --> 00:38:26.460 Like in that video, I say like, I'll give you guys this code, but 00:38:26.490 --> 00:38:28.320 do not, do not hold me liable. 00:38:28.320 --> 00:38:30.390 Like, this is your own, you know, use it your own risk. 00:38:30.390 --> 00:38:34.300 Like, uh, it's, uh, It's there, but I don't know, you know, it's got an 00:38:34.300 --> 00:38:37.280 encryption class for like the API keys, but like other than that, like I 00:38:37.290 --> 00:38:40.340 have no idea what holes you could poke in this thing or anything like that. 00:38:40.340 --> 00:38:43.840 So I would always just say exercise caution there, but it is pretty 00:38:43.840 --> 00:38:45.240 incredible what we're able to do. 00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:48.130 And seemingly in such a short time from when we went from like pretty 00:38:48.130 --> 00:38:52.050 much everything being like hand coded, so to speak, to now, you know, 00:38:52.050 --> 00:38:56.070 we have, you know, We can get so much further so much faster us and 00:38:56.070 --> 00:38:57.230 people doing this professionally. 00:38:57.230 --> 00:38:58.750 It's, it's pretty, it's pretty insane. 00:39:00.010 --> 00:39:04.250 Matt: So how, what other areas are you using it in outside of content or coding? 00:39:04.790 --> 00:39:05.100 Mark: Yeah. 00:39:05.100 --> 00:39:09.220 So the other area would be like, um, so we're not coders, right? 00:39:09.220 --> 00:39:11.340 Like we said, but we are content creators. 00:39:11.370 --> 00:39:14.790 And I think that like you and I are probably similar, 00:39:14.850 --> 00:39:15.950 we're similar in that realm. 00:39:16.030 --> 00:39:19.700 So it's like, we know ways, and we know the hangups and the limitations. 00:39:20.080 --> 00:39:23.360 That creating content, like of creating content, right? 00:39:23.590 --> 00:39:25.530 We don't really know the software side. 00:39:25.530 --> 00:39:29.150 So if we switch to this content side, it's like, How, how, how, 00:39:29.520 --> 00:39:31.370 how can we possibly speed this up? 00:39:31.370 --> 00:39:32.810 So let me think of a bunch of different ways. 00:39:33.180 --> 00:39:36.620 The first way this is like, again, some of these are like small 00:39:36.620 --> 00:39:38.850 wins because they're not like groundbreaking things, but they're 00:39:38.850 --> 00:39:40.670 really like, actually pretty awesome. 00:39:40.680 --> 00:39:44.840 Like if you stack them all up, first thing is, okay, so we record YouTube videos. 00:39:44.870 --> 00:39:46.070 I'm not going to do it in order. 00:39:46.070 --> 00:39:48.020 Cause I can't remember off the top of my head, but I'll just 00:39:48.020 --> 00:39:49.610 go from thinking about these. 00:39:50.050 --> 00:39:52.190 The first one is like, we record YouTube videos, right? 00:39:52.410 --> 00:39:54.470 And I like to put chapters in all my YouTube videos. 00:39:54.490 --> 00:39:55.880 I was literally doing this. 00:39:56.490 --> 00:39:59.170 Like I would watch the whole video back and put the chapters in. 00:39:59.260 --> 00:40:00.300 I don't have to fucking do that anymore. 00:40:00.690 --> 00:40:02.380 Like I, I upload the video. 00:40:02.710 --> 00:40:05.890 I wait, maybe, sometimes it's right away depending on the length of the video. 00:40:06.110 --> 00:40:08.660 I took that whole hour and a half script. 00:40:09.380 --> 00:40:11.940 In ChatGPT, I tried to do this with ChatGPT but a while 00:40:11.940 --> 00:40:13.100 ago it's, it's not as good. 00:40:13.140 --> 00:40:15.760 Claude is way better with like pasting things in and maybe it's 00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:18.890 just the new model now, like more, it can just understand more. 00:40:19.370 --> 00:40:20.660 So I, I upload the video. 00:40:20.700 --> 00:40:22.230 I go to the bottom, show transcript. 00:40:22.250 --> 00:40:24.490 I copy that whole thing with the timestamps in it. 00:40:24.700 --> 00:40:29.555 I paste that into Claude and I say, Hey, Give me YouTube chapters, one liners for 00:40:29.555 --> 00:40:33.375 it, just like formatted perfectly, and just give me chapters for these videos. 00:40:33.395 --> 00:40:35.865 And then I can even say, hey, get a little more detailed if it doesn't 00:40:35.865 --> 00:40:37.255 give me enough, or how I want it to do. 00:40:37.580 --> 00:40:40.650 And that saves a shit ton of time if you were going to sit 00:40:40.650 --> 00:40:41.780 there and watch all of that. 00:40:41.880 --> 00:40:43.400 And that's just a small win, like I said. 00:40:43.400 --> 00:40:44.030 So there's that. 00:40:44.210 --> 00:40:46.310 You already mentioned things like explaining. 00:40:46.310 --> 00:40:49.220 You could, you could even say, I literally just tried this 00:40:49.230 --> 00:40:50.060 with the last couple of videos. 00:40:50.470 --> 00:40:52.350 Let's stick on that just from the transcript. 00:40:52.350 --> 00:40:54.340 It knows everything your video is about, right? 00:40:54.550 --> 00:40:58.160 And it's an expert at YouTube if you tell it it's an expert at YouTube. 00:40:58.380 --> 00:40:59.970 So you can get the subtitles from that. 00:40:59.980 --> 00:41:00.310 I'm sorry. 00:41:00.310 --> 00:41:02.200 You can get the chapters from that. 00:41:02.510 --> 00:41:06.360 You can tell it, give me 10 really good titles for this video. 00:41:06.800 --> 00:41:09.050 Based on just your knowledge of YouTube. 00:41:09.490 --> 00:41:12.130 So, and then I'm not saying like copy and paste that part. 00:41:12.140 --> 00:41:15.850 Like I just need the ideas cause I'm not creative enough to think of the ideas. 00:41:16.180 --> 00:41:17.250 So like, give me the titles. 00:41:17.980 --> 00:41:19.370 I even experimented with this. 00:41:19.690 --> 00:41:22.410 I said, you already mentioned the description and stuff like that. 00:41:22.410 --> 00:41:23.330 So you could obviously get that. 00:41:23.645 --> 00:41:26.985 But the, I even experimented with, Hey, I know you for Claude. 00:41:27.215 --> 00:41:31.415 I know you can't, I know you can't generate images. 00:41:31.595 --> 00:41:31.965 Okay. 00:41:32.015 --> 00:41:33.215 And we can talk about images. 00:41:33.215 --> 00:41:35.255 Cause that's like kind of another modal of this piece. 00:41:35.255 --> 00:41:36.505 That's good and bad. 00:41:36.515 --> 00:41:37.915 Very hit or miss more than text. 00:41:38.615 --> 00:41:40.215 I know you can't generate images, Claude. 00:41:40.705 --> 00:41:45.175 But can you prompt some, another tool to generate a really good 00:41:45.175 --> 00:41:47.805 thumbnail for this, or at least give me some ideas and stuff like that, 00:41:47.805 --> 00:41:49.035 or what a good thumbnail would be. 00:41:49.235 --> 00:41:49.985 It does it. 00:41:50.005 --> 00:41:50.975 It doesn't do it great. 00:41:50.985 --> 00:41:52.315 Cause then I copied that. 00:41:52.585 --> 00:41:57.455 I took it over to Grok on X cause it, cause I think Grok uses flux, which 00:41:57.455 --> 00:42:00.345 is probably like one of the best image generator generative things now. 00:42:00.695 --> 00:42:05.385 And I put it over there and it didn't give me great stuff, but it gave me something 00:42:05.385 --> 00:42:07.725 that like, you know, maybe would spark a little bit, you know what I mean? 00:42:07.725 --> 00:42:10.705 But like even with text, you can kind of get some ideas for imagery and things. 00:42:11.035 --> 00:42:14.615 So those are just some of the ways like in YouTube that I've sped up and at 00:42:14.615 --> 00:42:19.525 least gave myself way more ideas for things because, you know, Those things 00:42:19.525 --> 00:42:20.675 are hard to come up with on your own. 00:42:20.675 --> 00:42:23.074 I mean, yeah, I mean, 00:42:23.735 --> 00:42:25.755 Matt: as an assistant, it definitely helps. 00:42:26.145 --> 00:42:29.245 Um, it, it still hasn't ever really knocked it out of the park for me 00:42:29.255 --> 00:42:31.535 for, for, uh, titles and stuff. 00:42:31.535 --> 00:42:34.925 I think it's still very baseline, but it does bring in. 00:42:35.575 --> 00:42:39.725 Uh, like a, a different perspective and what I'll do is like ask, like, 00:42:40.015 --> 00:42:45.125 here's my, here's the type of viewer I'm hoping to, uh, uh, to, to watch 00:42:45.125 --> 00:42:46.995 this video, uh, whatever it might be. 00:42:46.995 --> 00:42:50.325 Freelancer, WordPress beginner, whatever it might be, the keyword is. 00:42:50.645 --> 00:42:52.465 And then like, what would appeal to them? 00:42:52.875 --> 00:42:57.045 And I, and I use that as like ideation, you know, and other, like, like other 00:42:57.055 --> 00:43:01.735 words, you know, like what are other words I can use that are, are keywords for this? 00:43:02.125 --> 00:43:05.455 Um, yeah, all of that stuff, uh, you know, works great. 00:43:05.815 --> 00:43:09.245 For the chapters, uh, because I use DS script. 00:43:09.595 --> 00:43:12.945 Um, D Descrip just has chapters, a chapter thing built right in. 00:43:12.945 --> 00:43:15.255 So you just click it and it's still all ai Yeah. 00:43:15.405 --> 00:43:16.365 Chat, GPT driven. 00:43:16.365 --> 00:43:19.905 But, um, you know, I've always found it to be a little bit more accurate because 00:43:19.905 --> 00:43:23.895 it has the whole video file, uh, and it just, whatever, just does a better job. 00:43:23.985 --> 00:43:30.105 Um, but, uh, yeah, often I'll use, uh, I'll use that and I use Whisper AI as a. 00:43:30.725 --> 00:43:32.255 I think it only runs on Mac, though. 00:43:32.485 --> 00:43:35.935 Uh, so Whisper AI, or Whisper Transcription is 00:43:35.935 --> 00:43:37.685 what it's called, uh, on Mac. 00:43:37.715 --> 00:43:45.155 It's a Mac app, and, um, you can just drop in your video or, um, MP3 00:43:45.155 --> 00:43:50.195 file, or any, any file, any media file, and ask it to transcribe it 00:43:50.195 --> 00:43:51.685 and then run the same commands on it. 00:43:51.685 --> 00:43:53.625 It's just like a local app. 00:43:54.015 --> 00:43:55.895 Um, I'll use that from time to time. 00:43:56.245 --> 00:43:58.759 Mark: Yeah, the other thing I try to do, I haven't done it yet, 00:43:59.050 --> 00:44:02.520 As much recently as I take the transcription because it's not great. 00:44:02.540 --> 00:44:04.710 I mean, maybe Descript already does this, but the transcript 00:44:04.710 --> 00:44:05.910 isn't great from YouTube. 00:44:06.370 --> 00:44:09.970 Um, like it's the words, but it's not formatted well. 00:44:10.100 --> 00:44:13.170 So like the idea would be to take that text and put it on your website 00:44:13.510 --> 00:44:15.080 so you could index that text. 00:44:15.430 --> 00:44:18.650 Um, I'm not even sure as we move forward, if that's even going to be completely 00:44:18.650 --> 00:44:22.240 necessary, because it's probably going to just, you know, somehow get. 00:44:22.780 --> 00:44:26.870 You know, SEO juice and ranking and any sort of index ability from like the actual 00:44:26.870 --> 00:44:30.690 words in the YouTube video at this point, but that's just another random thing. 00:44:31.210 --> 00:44:37.040 Um, yeah, there's a, there's a lot of trying to think of anything else 00:44:37.040 --> 00:44:38.150 that I've, that I've tried to do. 00:44:38.170 --> 00:44:39.630 I just literally hate making thumbnails. 00:44:39.660 --> 00:44:41.530 So I'm waiting for a really good thumbnail thing. 00:44:41.530 --> 00:44:45.630 I've explored, explored some GPTs, custom GPTs for that. 00:44:46.170 --> 00:44:49.830 Um, but, uh, Yeah, I don't know. 00:44:49.830 --> 00:44:52.030 This is all kind of like very interesting and slightly kind 00:44:52.030 --> 00:44:53.200 of concerning at the same time. 00:44:53.200 --> 00:44:56.450 Cause like at some point, you know, I mean, I don't know if you've, I don't 00:44:56.450 --> 00:45:01.580 know if you've experimented with 11 labs and any sort of, uh, image or 00:45:01.590 --> 00:45:06.820 not, not image, but like voice, like you can very, very soon we're gonna be 00:45:06.820 --> 00:45:09.420 able to just like make our own stuff. 00:45:09.430 --> 00:45:13.750 Like, let's just generate our own things just from all of the, the voice 00:45:13.750 --> 00:45:17.830 data we have of ourselves, the video data we have of ourselves, and then 00:45:17.850 --> 00:45:20.140 all of the, any LLM stuff that we've. 00:45:20.560 --> 00:45:21.070 Put together. 00:45:21.070 --> 00:45:23.530 So it's going to, it is going to get weird. 00:45:23.590 --> 00:45:27.170 Um, I'm just hoping it doesn't get weird super soon or we 00:45:27.170 --> 00:45:28.370 could at least capitalize on it. 00:45:28.480 --> 00:45:30.760 Um, it's a lot of stuff. 00:45:31.010 --> 00:45:33.290 Matt: So are you still going to build out that, that plugin and 00:45:33.300 --> 00:45:38.900 continue like making plugins for like sites that you're building out? 00:45:38.900 --> 00:45:42.240 Like what's, what's the future for developing plugins for you? 00:45:42.270 --> 00:45:42.370 I 00:45:42.370 --> 00:45:46.860 Mark: mean, so that one specifically was, uh, I was trying to create a. 00:45:47.330 --> 00:45:50.570 automated via the YouTube API, just like automatically know 00:45:50.570 --> 00:45:51.890 when I'm live on my website. 00:45:51.890 --> 00:45:55.430 And I just created like custom it's an, it checks the YouTube API. 00:45:55.430 --> 00:45:57.480 It says, are you live or not? 00:45:57.530 --> 00:46:00.570 It gives a couple pieces of data that it pulls in, like the 00:46:00.570 --> 00:46:03.240 YouTube URL and stuff like that. 00:46:03.240 --> 00:46:05.900 And then it, it can, it integrates specifically with bricks to 00:46:05.900 --> 00:46:08.670 like use all those things with dynamic tags and conditions. 00:46:09.020 --> 00:46:09.740 Works great. 00:46:10.060 --> 00:46:10.590 Perfect. 00:46:11.080 --> 00:46:14.395 And in order to do all of that, I would have either needed to hire a 00:46:14.395 --> 00:46:15.815 developer or find a plugin that did it. 00:46:15.815 --> 00:46:18.625 So I think for very niche things like that, you're definitely 00:46:19.095 --> 00:46:22.025 probably very well off doing that. 00:46:22.485 --> 00:46:27.585 I'm thinking of if you do like an analysis on like the ROI of doing 00:46:27.585 --> 00:46:30.755 something like that, just even personal ROI, like nothing's going to come 00:46:30.755 --> 00:46:32.345 along and like fix that right away. 00:46:32.575 --> 00:46:36.315 I would love to have a larger conversation on like where this is all going. 00:46:36.325 --> 00:46:39.895 Cause I don't like, I love WordPress and I love websites, but I don't think 00:46:39.895 --> 00:46:42.645 we're going to be on websites for the rest of our lives necessarily. 00:46:42.645 --> 00:46:45.895 I think there's going to be some more to that just in like the 00:46:45.895 --> 00:46:49.835 different ways that we operate with things because to go back to. 00:46:50.720 --> 00:46:56.130 If you think about like the Google search era versus now the AI prompting 00:46:56.140 --> 00:46:59.300 era, I don't know about you, but there have been times very recently 00:46:59.300 --> 00:47:01.240 where I have not gone to Google. 00:47:01.260 --> 00:47:06.405 I've gone to like a chat GPT or a Claude because I want I don't want 00:47:06.405 --> 00:47:08.125 to go search for an answer anymore. 00:47:08.145 --> 00:47:11.655 I want the answer to kind of like come to me and I don't mean like 00:47:11.655 --> 00:47:13.015 I'm just going to take the answer. 00:47:14.135 --> 00:47:15.965 It's like it has all that information. 00:47:16.145 --> 00:47:20.505 So we can explain it to you in a way that you're actually asking particularly for. 00:47:20.705 --> 00:47:20.885 I don't know. 00:47:20.975 --> 00:47:21.785 I'm sure you've done this. 00:47:21.795 --> 00:47:23.875 Like you go and you have a very specific problem. 00:47:24.095 --> 00:47:26.825 So then you have to search Google and you have to go through like 10 links 00:47:26.825 --> 00:47:29.005 to find like maybe what the answer is. 00:47:29.315 --> 00:47:32.585 But with now, it's like it does that step for you in a lot of ways. 00:47:32.990 --> 00:47:36.050 And the other big thing that I do, and this is one of the things I 00:47:36.060 --> 00:47:38.420 don't like about cloud just yet, but I'm sure they're going to have it. 00:47:39.170 --> 00:47:44.730 I love chat GPT and Gemini, which is Google's for the conversational, because 00:47:44.730 --> 00:47:47.420 you know, I hate text and this is a lot of reading that we're doing so far. 00:47:47.780 --> 00:47:50.840 So like, I'll like actually have a conversation with it and I'll be like, 00:47:50.840 --> 00:47:53.720 Hey, what do you think about this topic? 00:47:53.910 --> 00:47:56.820 Like I'll do this in preparation for like, You know, any sort of 00:47:56.830 --> 00:48:00.230 podcasting debate, like live topics, like, hey, you know, like, what do 00:48:00.230 --> 00:48:01.830 you think about, like, open source? 00:48:01.830 --> 00:48:03.500 Do you think that's a good thing, a bad thing, or whatever? 00:48:03.500 --> 00:48:07.120 You can kind of, like, get a lot of ideas and a lot of different things that 00:48:07.420 --> 00:48:10.370 you would have had to go read, like, a bunch of different people's opinions. 00:48:11.230 --> 00:48:15.210 But now it, it's aggregated all that and it's just thrown in at you. 00:48:15.210 --> 00:48:16.780 I'm not saying just take it as face value. 00:48:16.780 --> 00:48:19.650 I'm saying like you can almost do like a little mock conversation or 00:48:19.650 --> 00:48:21.260 mock debate, debate with these things. 00:48:21.490 --> 00:48:23.360 And then you can do it from both sides too. 00:48:23.570 --> 00:48:26.510 And then you have all the perspectives and then you can create your own perspective. 00:48:26.510 --> 00:48:29.510 And then you could, you know, go into the content or the, or 00:48:29.510 --> 00:48:30.760 the show or whatever with that. 00:48:30.760 --> 00:48:34.320 I mean, I've literally done that before just because of the ease of that. 00:48:34.380 --> 00:48:36.230 Like it's just, I'm just talking to my phone. 00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:37.760 Like it's, it's so easy. 00:48:38.210 --> 00:48:38.480 Matt: Yeah. 00:48:38.870 --> 00:48:39.150 Yeah. 00:48:39.220 --> 00:48:40.730 Uh, it's, it's certainly. 00:48:41.225 --> 00:48:45.385 Um, you know, some, it's many different ways, you know, to, to use it. 00:48:45.765 --> 00:48:50.025 Um, I was also thinking too, like while I was using cursor, I'd be like, man, if 00:48:50.025 --> 00:48:52.395 I could just talk to this thing, which it probably even has, I don't, I don't 00:48:52.395 --> 00:48:56.325 know if I could just like talk to this and, and explain what I, what I want. 00:48:56.785 --> 00:49:00.345 Uh, but I still have a lot of like uncertainty on, you know, what, 00:49:00.345 --> 00:49:01.605 what the answers are going to be. 00:49:01.865 --> 00:49:05.154 Um, even from a, uh, you know, I don't know. 00:49:05.155 --> 00:49:06.835 I like to see a ton of options. 00:49:06.945 --> 00:49:10.115 I don't mind sifting through it as long as that the options I have are, 00:49:10.115 --> 00:49:15.380 you know, Are are close to you know, giving me the answer, you know, argue 00:49:15.380 --> 00:49:17.140 if google even still does that anymore. 00:49:17.140 --> 00:49:21.390 I don't know Um, but I don't mind like sifting through that through that stuff, 00:49:21.390 --> 00:49:26.930 but I totally get it like just give me the answer I signed up for Uh only 00:49:26.930 --> 00:49:34.240 because Kevin rose, uh from dignation He has he's uh, I guess an advisor or 00:49:34.290 --> 00:49:38.680 his the vc firm that he works for is invested in perplexity And you could 00:49:38.680 --> 00:49:44.465 get a free year Of Perplexity Pro, uh, if you were on his email list. 00:49:44.985 --> 00:49:48.835 Um, I've heard a lot of people talk about it, like, oh, it's like, you 00:49:48.835 --> 00:49:51.835 know, search results and all this stuff, and like, that's supposed to think, be 00:49:51.835 --> 00:49:54.015 the thing that really crushes Google. 00:49:54.965 --> 00:49:57.445 You know, I did it for, for this project that I'm working on. 00:49:58.645 --> 00:50:01.264 I mean, it didn't really give me anything that Claude and 00:50:01.265 --> 00:50:03.645 ChatGPT wasn't already giving me. 00:50:03.905 --> 00:50:06.065 And I mean, it's a cool interface, and I'm sure it's like, if I 00:50:06.065 --> 00:50:10.255 was doing more, it would give me some, you know, better stuff. 00:50:10.295 --> 00:50:14.935 But once again, I'm just like, I, I, I'm, I'm not, I haven't tapped in 00:50:15.055 --> 00:50:17.005 to the full potential of this stuff. 00:50:17.495 --> 00:50:20.435 Uh, cause you know, effectively, I feel like I'm just getting 00:50:20.435 --> 00:50:22.895 started, but that's where that is. 00:50:23.195 --> 00:50:23.905 Uh, 00:50:25.465 --> 00:50:27.005 Mark: We're all just getting started, Matt. 00:50:27.355 --> 00:50:28.685 You know, it's kind of, it's early. 00:50:28.685 --> 00:50:29.565 We're all just getting started 00:50:29.565 --> 00:50:31.855 Matt: and we're all just on the way out all at the same time. 00:50:32.435 --> 00:50:35.475 Mark: You know, I, that is a larger, larger topic. 00:50:35.515 --> 00:50:38.445 Um, and I don't, I'm sure this has already happened though, kind of in 00:50:38.445 --> 00:50:41.705 history and waves, obviously not AI related, but again, like with so many 00:50:41.705 --> 00:50:45.505 other things, I think we're just going to have to continue to, I think that. 00:50:46.445 --> 00:50:50.335 If we're talking about this now, we are perhaps potentially the best position. 00:50:50.335 --> 00:50:53.125 So I'm trying to get more people, you know, like just from this type of content, 00:50:53.125 --> 00:50:56.655 if we can get more people think about this and understanding that it's real, the hope 00:50:56.655 --> 00:51:01.625 would be that we can continue to leverage it for as much as we need to leverage it. 00:51:01.645 --> 00:51:05.475 And then we could continue to evolve and adapt to obviously fill in the 00:51:05.475 --> 00:51:08.795 gaps that like this thing, you know, these types of things are going to do, 00:51:08.795 --> 00:51:13.590 like we could, there's always going to be a reason to, um, continue to 00:51:13.590 --> 00:51:15.520 try to innovate and do other things. 00:51:15.530 --> 00:51:17.690 So, um, I don't know. 00:51:17.730 --> 00:51:19.050 It's going to be interesting though, regardless. 00:51:19.050 --> 00:51:19.180 Yeah. 00:51:19.180 --> 00:51:22.400 We'll see what, uh, we'll see what the future holds with, with all of this. 00:51:23.500 --> 00:51:24.960 Matt: It's the WP minute, the WP minute. 00:51:24.960 --> 00:51:26.260 com slash subscribe. 00:51:26.260 --> 00:51:29.030 Still not powered by, uh, AI yet. 00:51:29.610 --> 00:51:30.130 Yet. 00:51:30.130 --> 00:51:35.860 Yes, maybe someday, uh, hit that, uh, hit that newsletter. 00:51:35.860 --> 00:51:38.780 I've, um, I think I mentioned this to you a couple of weeks ago. 00:51:38.780 --> 00:51:40.470 I switched over to convert kit. 00:51:41.810 --> 00:51:42.380 It's going to be kit. 00:51:42.410 --> 00:51:43.540 Is it, has it already, excuse me? 00:51:43.540 --> 00:51:43.800 Sorry. 00:51:43.800 --> 00:51:44.900 It's just, it's just kit now. 00:51:44.920 --> 00:51:45.210 That's right. 00:51:45.210 --> 00:51:46.440 It's just kit, kit. 00:51:46.660 --> 00:51:47.050 com. 00:51:47.410 --> 00:51:52.850 Um, one, because this is a semi tangent to what we're talking about today, but, 00:51:53.250 --> 00:51:57.450 um, you know, everything that happened with WordPress and, um, just my, I've 00:51:57.450 --> 00:51:59.860 always had this feeling anyway, but like everything, especially with like 00:51:59.870 --> 00:52:04.025 WordPress and understanding, like who, Where you're doing your business like 00:52:04.035 --> 00:52:08.395 who owns that business that you're doing business with Um, and yeah, I 00:52:08.395 --> 00:52:09.575 was running on mailchimp for a while. 00:52:10.105 --> 00:52:10.865 It was fine. 00:52:10.875 --> 00:52:16.565 I never really loved like making the newsletters there uh, but I switched 00:52:16.575 --> 00:52:20.705 to uh kit because I Had nathan on the show many many years ago and 00:52:20.915 --> 00:52:25.075 he'll dm me every once in a while to ask a couple questions And uh, I was 00:52:25.075 --> 00:52:26.115 like, yeah, you know i'll use it. 00:52:26.185 --> 00:52:30.490 We got a new add on for it for gravity forms You Uh, and so far, so good. 00:52:30.830 --> 00:52:32.770 Uh, consolidated two MailChimp accounts. 00:52:32.770 --> 00:52:34.010 It was a little bit of a pain in the neck. 00:52:34.460 --> 00:52:38.090 Uh, because it flagged me for like, where did you get these users from? 00:52:38.090 --> 00:52:40.990 And it's like, well, I merged two, I had two different lists. 00:52:40.990 --> 00:52:42.880 My mat report list and my WP minute list. 00:52:42.880 --> 00:52:44.880 And I was always mailing both. 00:52:44.950 --> 00:52:47.580 So I just consolidated into one and it flagged a bunch of stuff. 00:52:48.020 --> 00:52:50.610 Um, but crafting the templates there. 00:52:51.095 --> 00:52:53.585 Much easier, uh, happier about that. 00:52:53.585 --> 00:52:56.165 So if you do receive the email and you have any feedback, hit 00:52:56.165 --> 00:52:58.095 reply on the next email that I send, let me know what you think. 00:52:58.525 --> 00:53:00.225 Mark, what about you? 00:53:00.255 --> 00:53:01.235 What are you, what are you up to? 00:53:01.235 --> 00:53:01.995 Where can folks find you? 00:53:03.045 --> 00:53:07.545 Mark: Um, just trying to double, triple, quadruple down on content on YouTube. 00:53:07.545 --> 00:53:09.035 You can just go to mjs. 00:53:09.035 --> 00:53:09.575 bio. 00:53:09.575 --> 00:53:10.745 You can sign up for my newsletter. 00:53:10.745 --> 00:53:13.545 All my social links and everything like that are there just trying to provide 00:53:13.545 --> 00:53:14.995 as much value as possible to you guys. 00:53:15.005 --> 00:53:15.965 So appreciate it. 00:53:17.475 --> 00:53:18.095 Matt: Awesome stuff. 00:53:18.275 --> 00:53:19.265 Thanks for watching everybody. 00:53:19.355 --> 00:53:20.175 See you. 00:53:21.035 --> 00:53:23.495 Or you'll hear us in the next episode.