Welcome to Resilience Talk hosted by Paul Spencer of Second Nature Solutions.
Let's dive in.
Brandon Giella: Hello and welcome back to another episode of the
Resilience Talk podcast I have with me as always, Paul Spencer.
Paul, thank you for being here.
Today we are going to be talking about change.
Why is change important and how this relates to faith.
So last episode, we talked about where is your faith.
We talked about this being a confusing, chaotic age that
we find ourselves in, but.
Today a a core component of being faithful and building resilience
is the ability to change.
But before you even have the ability to change, we have to
understand why is change important?
What does it do for us?
So Paul, you have some thoughts on change and what it does for us.
You have examples we've been talking about, um, this week, about how
change is essential to bringing energy into a company and having
this kind of rebirth moment.
So tell us about this.
Tell us your thoughts on change.
Paul Spencer: Yes.
So, um, maybe just going back to the faith part.
So, uh, what we talked about before was the faith and hope of things
that are swirling around us and, uh, we lose control and, uh, sometimes.
We lose a little bit of control and sometimes it's seemingly like desperate,
like everything around me is just falling down and no matter where I.
Grab, right.
I lose a foothold, I lose a handhold, and, and I can't really,
I can't get a grip on anything.
And that was the theme of, of what we talked about before, is in the
end, you're just left with faith.
Right?
And your relationship with God.
Um, and so faith and hope are also essential, at least from my perspective
of where we are and what we're doing.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: And change, like how you let us in change is an essential
part of bringing energy and, and a rebirth to whatever we're up to.
So just kind of going back to what I was just saying, if, if things are falling
apart around me, let's just say it's my business and it's, it's, it's on the
edge of the cliff and the cliff is just falling into the sea and there's nothing.
I can do about it no matter what I try or what I do.
And it's almost left for me to just observe.
Um, and I don't know how many of you have experienced this,
but uh, I've experienced it.
I've seen it happen to others.
Um, and it's just something that you just, you watch, right?
And in the end you still have faith that, um, I can bounce back.
Right.
And some, sometimes for each of us that takes more time or less time.
Um, and we all, we all process those things as, as pretty
much grief in our own way.
Right?
And there's all those stages of grief.
Um, and so maybe for some of us that takes next week and I'm.
I'm ready to go back to work and figure out what I'm gonna do next, um, or do
it in a better way or a different way.
And some of us it may take months, maybe years and maybe never, right?
We never wanna touch that thing again.
Um, but in the end, uh, that there is something to, to be said about
those things around us going away.
Um, because there is a rebirth, right?
There's an opportunity for something to come back.
Um, I think my, my Yaya, uh, which is a Greek, Greek grandmother, right, Yaya, um,
she would mention about that when somebody would pass away, she would always, however
she knew this, she would always point out that, uh, there was a new baby born.
Right.
So, so and so passed away, but so and so just had a baby
Brandon Giella: hmm.
Paul Spencer: she would always re recall, right, that with death comes new, right?
There's a rebirth.
Um, and you can think about this as also with, um, like forest fires, right?
We have this huge devastation of lately, a lot of forest fires.
Um, and those trees are burned and it.
And animals and all kinds of stuff, uh, houses, right?
Um, but what we know is you go back to those areas and there's.
There's plant life, right?
There's animals, there's, it's not like that is gone forever.
It actually doesn't take long for trees and plants and animals
to go right back into that area.
It's a rebirth.
Um, so anyway, there's, this is an extreme way of saying change.
I think today we don't wanna talk about extreme change.
Um, but just going back to the faith and the resiliency, it's just knowing
that when things aren't going well.
It, uh, and we're experiencing something that we're not comfortable
with or that we don't want.
Uh, sometimes, even though in the moment that might not be easy to
see sometimes, uh, into the future, you'll be able to look back and you
say, well, if that wouldn't have happened, I wouldn't be doing this.
Right.
If that wouldn't have happened, I wouldn't have met so and so.
If that wouldn't have happened, we wouldn't have hired e uh, this
person and that person, and we wouldn't even be close to doing
the things that we're doing today.
Brandon Giella: That's right.
That's right.
I have several friends who are experiencing layoffs right now, and
I know having gone through that in my career, there's usually really amazing
opportunities that come in the future by having let that thing go, whether you're.
Forced out, you know, it's not of our own will, but, but by, by having that
freedom, even though it's painful, there's a lot of new opportunities that can come.
So if so, if I'm understanding you right, we need change to do
the things that we want to do.
We need to embrace change wherever we want to go, hit our goals, the
performance of the business, things in our marriage life, that sort of thing.
But you have to let things go.
Something has to die in order to experience that rebirth in the future,
which can be a very scary thing.
So how do you, how do you
Paul Spencer: maybe just qualify that, not so something doesn't necessarily
have to die, but it's, it's when, um, it's, it's just that scenario
when things are kind of outta control for you and you can't get a grip,
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: um, it's okay to let that go right now.
I'm not saying you don't do the best you can and try to do the things
that, uh, make good decisions and all of that, but at some point, um.
It's, it's just wise to let it go.
Um, I think what we wanna talk about today is proactive change,
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: So those are the things, what we've been talking about is things
that are happening to us or around us that we don't have a sphere of control
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: Right?
Um, so there are opportunities that we have where, um, a lot of the family
businesses, um, are very secure.
And feel safe in the fact that, um, we have a lot of tenure in
our, in our business, right?
So if we have a 30-year-old business, sometimes a 50-year-old
business, and, uh, some of our staff.
Have been with us for 20, 30 years.
Um, and that's not a, I'm not saying that's a bad thing, I'm
just saying that feels good.
And it is an accomplishment.
It's a huge accomplishment for, and you end up with family, not just your family,
but because they've been there so long and they've likely helped you build your
business, um, when it was fresh and.
Risky, right?
And, uh, and so they're family members to that business.
They, they're just a big part of that business.
Um, so that's pretty normal and it feels secure and safe, and why wouldn't it?
Um, what I am proposing or rather encouraging is that there are
moments when you can be aware.
That the reasons why we're not able to move here or the reasons why, uh, we're
losing customers here, or the reason why I can't really put my finger on it,
but it just feels Hmm, not sure, um, is because you haven't invoked any change.
Right?
Uh, another customer of my mind says, if you're not growing, you're dying.
Right?
So, uh, and it's not about.
In this case, it's not necessarily that you're not growing, um,
and then you're not advancing.
It's just this, um, it's just this feeling,
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Here's an example.
Uh, there may be opportunities to bring in somebody from the outside.
Ooh.
Dirty word, right?
Oh, no, no, no.
From somebody from the outside who's worked in corporate or worked
in a different industry and is not gonna have our same values.
And is what's that gonna do?
Right?
Well, what it does is the same reason that you.
Work with me and you hire with me, right?
We have similar values.
We have the, uh, we have, uh, uh, interests in both, uh, me serving you
and you having some kind of initiative that you want to achieve, right?
We, we work together and I'm an outsider, but you work with me, right?
So you can bring outsiders in who, um, when you bring somebody
in who's new to the company.
Uh, they want to do something and they're generally excited and
I would say 10 times outta 10, they're excited to join your team.
They've left somewhere, or maybe they were looking right and they weren't working,
and you've hired them in and you've give them a great story about who you
are, what you're doing, um, where you're going, and they wanna join your team.
And so when they show up that first day, they're eager.
And that just by itself brings a lot of energy.
Um, and if you give them enough room to make decisions and to do things maybe
that you wouldn't normally do or maybe that you're a little uncomfortable
with, uh, you'll be surprised.
By, um, how much energy that brings to you and to those around
you and to your, your employees.
Um, but you'll also be surprised how much you learn
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: by, I don't think that's gonna work.
I don't agree with that.
That's not how we do things around there, around here.
Um, but you let it run for a little bit.
You don't have to be risky with it and say you're just gonna do whatever
you want, but give them a month.
Give 'em six weeks and then see what happens.
And you'll be surprised that by the time you're done with that, you'll say,
Hmm, I didn't expect that to happen.
Right.
Oh, I'm surprised.
Oh, that's interesting.
Right.
And those are the phrases that are bringing creativity and energy and some
rebirth into, oh, you mean if we do that?
And then the customer did this?
Yeah.
Oh, I wonder if we were to, right.
And then it just goes from there.
Brandon Giella: I like that you put phrases to.
That experience because that is real.
And there's so many people that would would say like, oh, you gotta
have creativity in your business.
You gotta have this culture that has this kind of, you know,
creativity to it or something.
And um, but it's like, what does that even mean?
But I love that, that phrase, when you hear that, 'cause I've heard that in
my career, that that is creativity.
I think that's fantastic.
So, okay, so an important component of this.
I wanna touch, I wanna make sure we hit on this, this topic.
'cause we were talking about it this week of the idea of play.
And that you have to be willing to play and experiment in a business
in order to bring about that kind of, uh, dynamism if you will.
Um, but that can seem scary.
Uh, what is play?
I don't want you playing with my business, you know?
Please don't do that.
Um, so, but, but then the, the, the other thing that we, we were
talking about was it takes a lot of resilience to be able to.
Take on this idea of play and learning and experimentation.
So talk us through that.
How do I, how do I get from this place that like, uh, play
experimentation, creativity?
That sounds scary to me, but, and, and getting to that place of change,
like walk me through that process.
Paul Spencer: sure.
Yeah.
So, uh, resilience, uh, is.
Also an input into being resilient is not having your
identity tied into the business.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Right?
So in order for me to be willing and accepting and actually happy
and eager to some change in my business is that my business is,
is not a stark reflection of me.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Right?
And so if I'm resilient and I'm able to just say.
I'm willing to let the business shift and change from what, how I
built it or how I have designed it.
Um, doesn't mean I let go of the governance of it.
I can still govern.
I can still manage where it's going.
Um, but if, uh, you are starkly afraid of it getting out of control and you
losing your identity with the business because it moves, um, then you're not
as much resilient as you could be.
Right.
So one of the things that we can talk about is experimenting
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: and playing with it.
So having some play in, uh, what we do and, and how we speak to each other and
how we decide what we're going to do.
So an experiment could be, uh, just going back to the example
we had before is we've got, um.
A lot of tenure in our management staff and maybe even our executive staff.
And, um, it would be fun to experiment with bringing in a new
executive who is, uh, in a different industry than ours and has these.
Whatever qualities.
Right?
Um, and you may say that, uh, why would we do that?
That doesn't, we don't need that.
Or, uh, but the, just the idea of doing it is probably already
making you uncomfortable.
Right.
Brandon Giella: I can hear listeners cringing right now listening to
Paul Spencer: just like, you know, like if you're watching somebody and
you're like, uh, so tomorrow is part of our, um, team building exercise.
Well, actually we're not gonna do it tomorrow.
Uh, it's almost lunchtime.
We're gonna do it right after lunch.
So we're all gonna carpool over there and everybody's looking
at you like, what are we doing?
And we're gonna go skydiving.
all of a sudden people are touching their face and they're, they're, they
got scratches on their shoulders and behind their back and they're like,
we're gonna go, we're gonna go skydiving.
Uh, so that's the feeling you're getting by saying, we're gonna hire a new
executive into your, into your team.
But we don't need that.
Well, but, uh, what would be a, what, what could happen, right?
What would be a benefit?
Of bringing somebody in.
And those are the, those are the ways you start to form your experiment.
Like with Deming, we would say, what's your theory?
So the theory is if we bring in an outside executive who, uh, has these qualities,
they will bring energy into, uh, our initiative of growing into a new vertical.
Right.
Or they will bring energy into our lethargic sales staff or our, uh,
operations team that just can't seem to get out of their own way.
Right.
But you have a theory around that.
And then you design the role, you design who you're gonna talk to, how you're
gonna network, and then you bring him in.
Right.
And the, the.
Thing that you have with the language is really important
because it's an experiment.
And like you said, I've had, I've had an owner tell me that we're not experimenting
with my business, which is also fun.
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: uh, for me it's fun.
Uh, probably not for her.
But anyway, um, the, the, the idea of the experiment.
The language of experiment and theory is just like if we were at school, right?
And we're in the science lab, we don't know what's going to happen,
and we're gonna learn by observing and measuring what's what happens, right?
And so what what it does is it tells us right away by the words
that we're using that we do not know what the outcome will be.
Which also tells us that if it fails or if it's not what
we expected, then that's okay.
And, uh, so what we then, then we say, well, Paul, if it, if we go through this
whole process and we fail, what would be the, that would be a waste of time.
And we would say maybe, uh, but I guarantee you we would learn something.
Right.
And the learning is the rebirth.
The learning is the growth.
The learning is the energy of what do we do next?
What could we tweak?
What could we, uh, let's say we, we have a bad hire and it just goes poorly.
Um, worst case scenario, like just terrible.
For all kinds of different reasons and we could say, we're
never gonna do that again.
Or we could look back and we could say, alright, this experiment,
this is what we expected.
We got something way different.
Why was that?
What did we learn?
Well, we learned that maybe, uh.
The role that we put on paper does not match the person we got in, in reality.
And why is that?
Well, maybe, right?
There's a whole slew of things that we can start to learn and then we can
choose to not do that again or choose to, uh, improve the process and go again.
Right.
But in the end, we're learning and we're constantly learning.
And I know I'm talking about hiring, but this could fit in operations.
It could fit in your, on your shop floor, in your in man, um, manufacturing.
Right.
It could fit in services, fits in sales all the time.
Sales is really good at this.
They're used to experimenting a lot, even though they may not call it that.
Um, so yeah.
Brandon Giella: I, you're touching on some really deep stuff in that.
F failure is like one of these I, I fear is a core human emotion
that is underneath failure.
Uh, and, and motivating us in a lot of different ways.
Like I, you know, I'm an owner of a business, I run a team.
I have objectives.
Uh, I'm afraid of failure.
I don't wanna fail.
The humiliation, the shame, whatever might be a part of that.
I feel like I'm not competent at this.
You know, that sort of thing.
And I'm sure there's a lot of people listening that it's like, yeah, you
should just experiment, try new things.
And if it fails.
No big deal.
It's, you know, we're just, we learned and I'm, I'm thinking, how do you, how
do you, like, how do you relate to fear?
Like I, this, there's something in this conversation that I, I,
I feel like is really central.
That is, how do you develop the kind of self or culture or communication
or whatever it might be to relate well with fear and seeing it as learning
and being resilient enough to handle that instead of going into that
common step of, you know, humiliation or shame or whatever it might be.
And I don't know if that's tracking with where you're going, but that's
what keeps coming to mind to me.
Paul Spencer: Mm-hmm.
Well, it's normal.
I mean, it's completely normal to have some fear of failure, right.
For all the things that you just said.
So, uh, if you're not feeling that, then I'd wonder right where you are.
Right.
I mean, they, they talk, yeah.
Maybe psychopath.
Uh, but I mean, even people who are, like, you've, you hear this a lot
like, um, for like singers like, uh, like celebrity singers, right?
That, that those like 4, 5, 10 minutes before they go on
stage is like this full anxiety.
Like, what am I doing?
Brandon Giella: Yeah, I've heard
Paul Spencer: it's this nervous energy.
Um, so everybody gets it.
No matter how many times you've gone out on stage and you sang that song, right.
Um, so I'd say that's normal.
It's absolutely normal and completely understandable that you would
have fear, uh, when the, with the idea of experimenting or playing
around with, with something.
Right?
Um, but it just, it all goes back down to resilience and the fortitude,
courage that you have, uh, to be able to step out onto the stage.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Right.
Uh, because you do it one or two times, you do it a handful of times.
Um, and that singer knows that they can sing and they know that
they can rock it out, right?
And they know that everybody's gonna love it.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: But for whatever reason that those, those few minutes to go out
there, all those doubts come in, right?
All of that plays and you're like, right, you gotta take a deep breath.
But as soon as you go out there.
You're on and you're good.
Right.
Um, so for somebody who's new at going out on stage or, uh, experimenting for
the first time out of their safe zone, it takes a lot of courage to do it right.
To step out onto the stage and go for it, and it may not go well.
Right.
And I would say that, um.
I'm not gonna put it in the, in the singing category 'cause I
don't even know anything about it.
But, uh, this is what I do know.
This is a proven fact with all of my, um, clients.
Everybody out there listening is, uh, you've all been in the safe,
happy zone with lots of tenure and um, and you've had lots of failures
bringing in those new fresh people.
And you've had, uh, maybe one role or another that is almost a revolving door
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: of, this is my third IT director in four years, right?
Uh, this is, I've, I've tried to hire a number two, three or four different times.
Each one of 'em didn't last 90 days.
And the one that lasted more than 90 days, I knew 60 days
in they weren't gonna make it.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Right.
And so then you say, why do you think that is?
And, but they don't know, right?
Why is it that you can't sing when you get out on stage?
Well, 'cause you don't have enough reps, right?
You don't have enough, you don't have enough, uh, uh, practice at it, right?
Um, singing might be a little bit different.
Than doing an interview process, meaning, uh, maybe there's
a talent aspect to singing.
Um, but in the interview process, it's a process, right?
You put it together and yes, maybe some people are more skilled or
talented at doing the interview itself.
Um, but in the end, you put a process together, you run it, you
realize that didn't work out so well.
You revise it, you go from there.
Um, but those first couple of times.
Uh, if you're doing it on your own without a guide, right, without
somebody who is kind of that singing coach or expert to guide you through,
and you've never done it before, of course it's not gonna go well.
Of course, you're gonna get unexpected results, right?
Uh, but that's okay, right?
Because if you have the mindset again of I'm doing it, let's say you're just doing
it unguided and I've never done it before.
You do the best you can, but then you, you're, you have the mindset, like you
just said, I'm experimenting with it.
I have a theory, and if it doesn't work, I'll go back and I'll refine it.
That's, that's the flow.
Right.
So just going back, just kind of loop it back to what you were,
you were saying, where's the fear?
Well, the fear is, uh, counteracted by the fortitude to do something.
Right.
Having the courage to go for it.
Right.
And then after that, the courage will only get you to outcomes if
you're willing to get some reps.
Maybe even some outside help and some expertise in it, right.
I can't, uh, yeah, so I was just gonna go back to the, the,
the, the music analogy, right?
At some point you can teach yourself how to play guitar and all that, and
I know people do, but even people who, uh, are really good at that as
far as I know, tend to go and learn.
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: Right.
They, they tend to have, uh, some kind of coach or singing coach or Right.
And that's how they get better because there's an expert behind
you, around you to help you improve.
Brandon Giella: that's right.
Even Tiger Woods, Serena Williams, you know, all these amazing people still
had coat, they had swing coaches.
You know, they're still improving their aspects of their techniques,
and they're the best in the world, and they go to coaching every week.
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
And that's actually a great, another great analogy too is uh, tiger Woods.
Uh, at his peak was the best, right?
But he still has a swing coach.
then you would say, well, that guy doesn't, that guy's
never won a tournament.
Right.
The, I'm putting it into the analogy of, of being an owner and working
with outsiders that he, that person's never, uh, uh, ran a $50 million
company that does X, Y, and Z.
Exactly what I do Well, okay.
But, uh, I Why would you wanna hire somebody that did that?
Right.
I wanna, I wanna, I wanna bring in the person who has thought.
About sales or something different or maybe a different industry that's
gonna create some energy, some change into my business and gimme
some insights that's different than what I'm, than what I'm used to.
And so that golf swing coach is an outsider who spends a lot of time thinking
about the techniques and the flow of things and, and all of those things.
And that's all they're focused on.
Brandon Giella: They read research reports on how to do your swing.
I mean, they're during the week, they're, they're working
Paul Spencer: they are the expert in that one thing.
Right.
Does that mean they can go out and, and be like Tiger Woods?
No, but that's why Tiger Woods wants that person.
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
Brandon Giella: So if I'm, if I'm recapping and putting the, the
logic together, an owner could.
It could be experiencing some kind of static, uh, experience where
it's just not really clicking.
Things are not really humming or there's not really any energy
or passion like there should be.
So in order to get where they want to go, there's gotta be some change.
And so there's gotta be things that you have to let go.
Typically in order to experience that change, which can be
scary, this can be a new thing.
Even if you've done it before and it didn't go well, there's still
that fear of moving to this next step, bringing in this change.
And a way to overcome this fear is keep trying.
Hire a coach or a consultant or somebody, some kind of expert to
come help you, but additionally.
Separate yourself a bit from the business.
Take a step back, look at it objectively.
Think of it as a process.
Think of it as a, a way to learn, experiment, even play.
It should be fun to try new things and to bring in this energy and
passion again, so that you can get more performance out of your business,
more, you know, bring in that hire, make this change initiative happen,
bring in this new technology, improve your processes, that sort of thing.
And so that's kind of the process of
Paul Spencer: exactly.
Yeah.
And I would add one more, which is to bring joy into work.
Brandon Giella: Ooh,
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
Brandon Giella: that sounds lovely.
I want that.
That sounds great.
Everybody should have that.
Paul Spencer: yeah.
When you're, when you're doing things that are fresh and fun and exciting.
Right.
It, it brings joy into work.
Brandon Giella: yeah.
Paul Spencer: and this is also proven, uh, so with the different
customers that I have, right?
The clients, uh, they're in various stages of, of all this.
Some are like what we've been describing where they're kind of wrestling with
what does change look like, and, um, and.
Do I bring in another person or not?
And it doesn't have to be people.
Sometimes we wrestle with a poor customer and.
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Paul Spencer: Why we need to cut that customer
Brandon Giella: Hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Paul Spencer: because they're taking way too much overhead, distracting
everybody, but, but we've been right.
Um, so it doesn't always have to be a person, uh, all the way
over to, uh, those companies.
Family businesses that have embraced the change and brought in new, new
people, um, fresh perspectives.
And, uh, and it's not immediate.
This isn't like you snap your fingers and then you're done.
It, it is, it is a process.
And it could take months, even years.
Right.
But what happens is that your business before is.
A shadow of itself, right?
It's you look back and you're like, oh man, I can't believe
we were, we were that way.
Not because it was a bad thing.
It's just almost hard to imagine what it was like, right?
Because now we're doing things in a different way, um, and we've got different
people working on different things.
And as an owner, I've experienced this, you as owners start
to have joy in the work.
You start to see that, oh, I don't have to own every little tiny piece.
I don't have to be involved with all of it.
I can let these people, right?
You design it that way and then now you can work on fun things.
Um, and like that is from a business owner's perspective, being strategic
and dreaming and thinking about what's coming next, that's where you want to be.
Uh, I'm not saying that, that Paul is saying that that's where you wanna be.
I'm saying that's really knowing all of you, that's where you want to be,
and so you can put yourself there.
Brandon Giella: So change equals vision, which equals joy.
You can have joy in your work again, but you need some, you need some
breathing room, which requires change.
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
Yeah.
Joy and Work is working on something that you.
Uh, are empowered to work on, so even a worker.
I'm allowed to work on the processes, make things better, right?
While I'm doing my work, that's fun, right?
And you snowball that out.
We've talked about this before.
You snowball that out by your 30 employees, 200 employees, and
they're all improving processes.
What does that mean for your business as opposed to the
traditional way, which is just do your work and Paul will manage you,
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: will tell you what to do and what not to do.
Right.
How, just think how much drag
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Paul Spencer: that brings to your business, especially over 20, 30 years.
Brandon Giella: mm
Paul Spencer: You could see the difference between those two businesses
and let them run for 20 years.
Where they will be.
Um, and it doesn't necessarily mean that one will have more revenue than the other.
Potentially maybe one will have more profit than the other, but I guarantee you
if you walked into them, you would feel a buzz in one, which is a joyful buzz.
And one is this stale kind of stagnant thing that we're talking about,
which is people are just in their cubes or in their office spaces or
on the floor just doing what they do.
Brandon Giella: Yeah.
Just grinding away.
Grinding away.
And the the funny thing too is when you're doing your work joyfully
with passion, with creativity, it's likely higher quality work.
Same, same workers doing the same process, same task.
But the joyful ones will actually probably do it better, faster,
you know, more energy doing it.
Paul Spencer: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You definitely get more quality for sure.
Brandon Giella: You know, so that's what everybody, that's what everybody
who runs a business wants is joy in their work, and they want the work
to be good, higher quality, better, but you've gotta have some resilience
doing that, which requires some, some faith to inspire that kind of change,
e courage to get through and do it.
So, um, so what a call to action, a call to arms, to take courage and to change,
have hope and faith, and do it well.
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
I think the call to action is, um.
Just the awareness.
I know we've
Brandon Giella: Awareness.
Paul Spencer: of times, right?
Just by listening to this, um, you may not know what the experiment is
or, or what it is that you're actually after from a process perspective or who
knows, whatever your theory might be.
Or you may not even have your theory, but just listening to this and thinking about
it, uh, you will arrive somewhere, right?
And just the awareness of it will give you some, some juice, right, to say.
You know, uh, maybe a couple weeks from now, a month from now, you're ready and
you're gonna, you're gonna think about, I wanna do this, whatever that this is.
Brandon Giella: hmm.
And I would encourage too, listen for that phrase.
Huh.
Interesting.
That to me, that that says a lot to me.
I love that you mentioned that earlier in creativity.
Yeah.
I love that.
That's great.
Well, Paul, thank you.
I know change.
We are going through a momentous.
Age where change is everywhere and it's something to embrace because
it can be a really beautiful thing.
So thanks for bringing that to our attention.
Paul Spencer: Yeah.
Brandon Giella: All right, my man.
Well, we will see you next time.
Thanks, Paul.
Paul Spencer: All right.
Good.
Thank you.
Welcome to Resilience Talk hosted by Paul Spencer of Second Nature Solutions.
Let's dive in.