Introduction: Welcome to the Fiscal Firehouse, a podcast
dedicated to promoting financial literacy to firefighters.
I'm your co-host, John Beatty, executive board member of Local 1309, a lieutenant,
and also a certified financial planner.
With me, I have the other co-host of the fiscal firehouse, Louis Barella, executive
Board member of Local 1309 ambulance driver, and want to be financial expert.
Together, John and I hope to bring clarity to the world of personal finance,
specifically relating to firefighters.
Firefighting is a difficult job making sound.
Financial decisions shouldn't be.
Jon Intro: In today's episode of the fiscal firehouse, John
and Louis have a lighthearted conversation about the lottery.
What are your odds of winning and what you should do if you win?
The old saying that you can't win if you don't play is accurate.
Right?
Later in the episode, John and Louis have a philosophical conversation
about the difference between being rich and being wealthy.
John and Louis will discuss the five different elements of wealth
and how they change based on what phase of life you are in.
Without further ado, let's kick it over to local 1309 studios and the
recording of the physical firehouse.
Jon: welcome back to the Fiscal Firehouse.
I'm your co-host John Beatty.
Sitting across from me on this beautiful wood table in local 1309
studios is definitely the fan favorite.
Louis Barilla.
Louis, what's going on
Louie: What's up jb Good to be here, bud.
I'm happy to have the fall in full swing and get to keep the podcast
going for a new, hopefully calmer season, at least until the holidays.
Jon: Yeah, that's right.
This is this is perfect.
I love this time of year.
Football's in full season.
Oh.
Since the last re since the last recording.
So we weighed our way back to Wisconsin, got to go watch the Badgers play,
and then went, took the kids to, the holy Grail, the, Lambeau Field.
Oh my God.
And, that was a great experience.
But dude, my badgers,
Louie: Oh, rough
Jon: dude, you saw 'em,
Louie: I saw 'em live at the big
Jon: and it was not pretty, not good.
Yeah.
Louie: not good.
Yeah.
And Michigan's not good this year.
they're not a great team, but Bandit Badgers are just
Jon: scoreless in the last two games, and now they gotta go to, Oregon.
So Reed's at that game
Louie: gonna have a good time, I think
Jon: they're gonna be a blowout,
Louie: Ah, brutal.
Jon: it's too much.
But nonetheless, it brought me back to the days of college.
And ironically, the, hotel that we stayed at was right across
from the old fraternity house.
Not quite what I remembered, but I woke up early Sunday morning
and was taking a little saunter.
And, as I looked out there, it brought some back, some fond memories.
There was the, the front yard was just littered in beer cans.
Oh yeah.
Must have been, 3000 beer cans out there.
And it's oh man, I don't want to go back.
But I enjoyed my time, when I was there.
Louie: nice to visit.
Jon: Oh, nice to visit.
But
Louie: we had the same thing.
We went back and went to my old fraternity and it is a.
It is a pit.
I'm pretty sure it's more disgusting now than when I lived in it.
Yeah.
I'm pretty sure, but when you're in college man and you're 19 years
old, I, nothing seems that dirty.
Nothing seems that bad, but it
Jon: you're just living for the weekend.
Yeah.
And, some really good friends that you probably still keep in contact with there.
Louie: there you go.
Jon: yeah.
But it was fun.
I forgot how much I liked Madison.
Like it's a really cool
Louie: a cool town.
Yeah.
Jon: right on the lakes there and the weather was perfect.
It was like high sixties and
Louie: Randall's a great venue.
Jon: It was a, it is
Louie: a great venue.
Jon: Too bad, they suck and it was a terrible experience.
Shut out.
But nonetheless, so we're gonna have a lighthearted episode.
We've had some heavy topics over the last, couple months.
And, we wanted to, have some fun with this episode and talk about the lottery
and probabilities and just have some fun.
But, I do feel it, incumbent that we, talk PSA announcement.
so we're recording this towards the end of October.
and it's open enrollment season.
So just a reminder for everyone out there that, if you're changing your medical
insurance or you wanna, contribute to a flexible spending account to go
ahead and get your information in.
'cause most of those, you gotta have it submitted by, the first
or second week in November.
So make sure and fill that stuff out.
And if you guys have questions about flexible spending accounts
and HSAs and all that other stuff, refer back to, previous episodes.
One of the first ones we recorded.
We pretty, we did a nice deep in depth conversation about all that stuff, so
make sure and get your stuff filled out.
Louie: Yep.
Jon: Yep.
Yep.
Louie: Get it taken care
Jon: getting taken care of.
And, we're gonna opt into the old, west Metro Medical Insurance this go
Louie: Oh yeah.
Switching it up, huh?
Jon: Gonna switch it up.
PPO three coming our way.
Louie: Okay.
All right.
All
Jon: All right.
and another thing I wanted to touch on, and this is based off of our
last episode, which were, we talked about the one big beautiful bill act.
we got a lot of actually questions and some follow up,
from the listeners out there.
So one that we specifically wanted to talk to, that most of the firefighters
are really interested in is this whole concept of the OT deduction.
dude, they're trying to max that thing out as much as possible.
And a very common, I think, misconception out there is, FLSA, so the Fair Labor
Standards Act and how that applies to us specifically as firefighters.
So pretty much most of the firefighters I know are not based on a 40 hour work week.
Yeah.
Right.
They have a def different.
A different FLSA schedule.
So the two that I'm most familiar with are one that is, basically a 27 day period.
It encompasses 216 hours and the other one is a 24 day period,
which encompasses 192 hours.
I think that's really standard.
I know.
That's what We use here at West Metro.
So yeah, you gotta take those 24 blocks and it'll definitely tell you on your
scheduling software what those blocks are.
Or you can reach out to your payroll department.
but you basically gotta work over 192 hours.
In those 24 blocks, that is what's gonna qualify you for overtime or premium pay.
had several people being like, I'm just factoring this off of 40 hours.
So if I'm doing more than 40 hours, then I'm gonna have a ton of overtime that I
can, write off, so to speak, or deduct.
Louie: and doesn't
Jon: man, I wish it was that way.
I know I wish it was that way, but that is definitely not the way.
so then it gets even a little bit more convoluted.
And I had someone that was very astute, reach out and being like, and they
were referencing our contract, right?
West Metro's So we, within that 192 hours, we have a little provision
that says that for 182 hours it is paid as straight, and then you
basically have 10 hours that's built in overtime as part of your base salary.
Man, once again, this is not financial advice.
This is not tax advice, but I don't.
I don't build that in as overtime, like I'm not gonna take that deduction.
I don't think that's in the spirit of how the law was written.
so we'll see as more case studies get played out on how this is gonna formulate.
But I really think it is the purpose of, at least for the West Metro folks,
is you gotta be over that 192 hours.
Because once again, every department does things different.
we used to be penalized if you took sick leave.
within that FLSA period within that
Louie: days.
Oh sure.
Jon: hour days.
So you'd get straight time if you worked, in overtime of 24 hours, but you took sick
time 24 hours within that block of time,
So once again, every department operates a little bit differently and you can't give
just gross generalizations about this.
So everyone out there, especially outside of West Metro, you gotta really
do your due diligence on how your contract is written and how it's applied.
And really, once the software gets updated, the payroll software, it'll be
a lot easier, to identify that stuff.
But for this first go around, it's gonna be a little choppy, but I do
feel quite confident in saying that the 40 hours is not applicable.
You really have to look at your FLSA schedule to see
how overtime is calculated.
Does that make sense?
Louis?
Louie: sense.
I like it.
Thanks for the advice.
I think that, it's gonna be weird the first year when people are
trying to figure out exactly how much they're gonna put in overtime and
what it's gonna look like and how it's gonna be audited by the IRS.
So I would agree with you.
I think you should play conservative and say, this is my non base pay.
This is my premium portion above my, 56 hour work week
that I'm working or whatever.
and then that is what you should deduct, when it comes time to do your taxes.
There'll be a lot more clarification coming out, I'm sure over the next year,
but, I play it real safe this first year.
Jon: Yeah.
I'm always really conservative about that.
I just, I try to follow it to the letter of the law
Louie: You don't want Uncle Sam digging around in those finances,
Jon: and no.
so just a little housekeeping on some of those things.
So yeah, keep the questions coming guys though, if you've got 'em,
we'd be more than happy to, answer 'em to the best of our abilities.
But, we're gonna talk, we're gonna talk about a little bit of lottery stuff here.
Yeah.
There's no shortage of DJ and gamblers on, I don't care what fire
department we're talking about here.
You guys
Louie: all have 'em.
You guys all have that one B crew that just likes to, they'll, they
will be sitting there gambling on Russian, basement table tennis in
the winter and like weird stuff, man.
Jon: Parlays
Louie: to get rich quick though,
Jon: They do want it.
That is everyone's, I think that's the easy way out.
And that's just man, that's what people think about when they think about the
lottery or they think about all these things that, social media bestows upon
us as far as reality versus perception.
And, yeah, it's really easy if you just buy one ticket or you
make one bet and it's, you have a huge windfall off of that.
that is the American way.
They, that's, they want rags to riches and they want it to happen fast.
Louie: want it now and they want it all.
They want it all.
And they want it in cash.
They want to take the cash value
Jon: And then they don't want to pay taxes and they just
want to take that to the max.
that's their society.
And like I said, the fire department is no different.
We have a lot of type A personalities that like to take risks.
They like to do things on their days off.
and, gambling is definitely part of that.
Louie: Oh yeah.
So speaking of that, let's, let's just talk about the lottery.
'cause it's always fun, right?
Pe this is a great table talk around the fire station, kitchen table.
You're having lunch, you're having dinner, and people just want to
know that Powerball starts creeping up, or that mega million start
creeping up and people go Hey, we gotta take that engine over to the,
Jon: yeah, we got a
Louie: we go get groceries, we gotta get some, we gotta get our,
pull our money and try to win this Powerball or hit this jackpot.
but it's fun to think about what you
Jon: do.
Ah,
Louie: John, you're smart with your money.
I want to know if you won.
So the Mega Millions is now at about 340.
Jon: million.
Okay?
Louie: Okay.
if you took the cash value, that's about $160 million.
Jon: 60%?
50% of what the advertised value
Louie: somewhere around there.
So you're looking about 160 million.
I'd say you don't, let's just say half is gonna go away
Jon: It's a taxes, which it will.
Louie: probably, it's probably a fair.
So you're left with about $80 million.
you hit it, you take the cash baby.
'cause why would you not take the cash?
Jon: No, life's short.
Life is short.
Louie: are you doing, John, with $80 million?
You finishing your career here at Old West Metro or what?
Jon: As much as I love the brothers and sisters, of West
Metro and I really do like my job.
But, if I did not need income, I would, I would find something else.
And it's like I said, no disrespect to the organization or what I really enjoy
in the value that I get out from this job.
But man, it's just there's a big world out there and, time is the
most valuable resource we have.
So if I can control that time as much as I can, I would take full advantage of it.
But we do play, Katie and I, we do play, Powerball or Mega Millions.
Man sporadically.
It's really, when it gets up to those, $1 billion, the odds don't change.
But for some reason I feel more inclined to play when it
gets to over a billion dollars.
I think I just get caught up just like everyone else in the excitement.
And, there's actually a lot of studies, it's a lot of
like, um, planning a vacation.
So there's a lot of studies that say that part of the effects of vacation
are what people really enjoy about.
Vacation is the lead up into the vacation.
Thinking about what you're gonna do, dreaming about this and
fantasizing and envisioning what that vacation's gonna look like.
I think that's what the Powerball or Mega Millions is for a lot of people.
It gets them outside of their normal lives.
it gets them thinking about what could be possible if money wasn't an issue.
And it really gives them that kind of freedom to think big.
Yeah.
And not be restricted by like, well that'd be great, but I
can't afford that kind of thing.
So I think there is to a small amount, like that's a small price to pay for
some excitement or some entertainment.
'cause it, at the end of the day, that's what the lottery ends up being.
Yeah.
Is entertainment.
Louie: I totally agree.
I think, and even mathematically, there's something called expected value, right?
So there comes a point where even with the insane odds, the high
amount of the Powerball can, you can make a mathematical case for
being like, I should buy a ticket.
'cause it's fun and
Jon: Oh yeah.
Louie: it.
And I totally get it.
I'm not poo-pooing that.
I would say that.
I would be surprised, John, if your Powerball ticket comes at
the expense of your Roth IRA
Jon: or
Louie: or your 4 57 contributions, and I don't know how true that is for other
people that play things like the Powerball or the Colorado lottery or whatever.
I think that probably a lot of those people feel like, they, they should be
saving more for retirement or saving more.
but they just feel like, Hey, this is what we do.
And I think a lot of studies have been done that show that, poor
people disproportionately play.
The lottery games.
and I think that is that, that's the dark side about it.
And we're, you know, we're keeping this lighter.
We don't have to go into that.
But, man, I do think that it's fun if people wanna play.
And it's fun when crews play when they talk about it.
I've heard some amazing things that people that would do that,
what they would do with Powerball or Mega Millions if they won.
And, I've got good ideas.
I never play, but if I did play and I did win, I
Jon: you've never bought a ticket?
Louie: I shouldn't say never.
I have bought a ticket in the past.
I probably can count on one hand.
The amount of Powerball tickets, that I have.
But I'll tell you what, you guys wouldn't see me again at West Metro.
I wouldn't even, I wouldn't even call.
It wouldn't
Jon: Wouldn't even call in Rich.
You would just be No.
Louie: Yeah, I wouldn't even,
Jon: Louise
Louie: be worth, it wouldn't even be worth my time to call in.
I'd be worth so much money that I would be losing money by calling the chief
and telling him that I'm gonna quit.
yeah.
I, you guys are just never here from me or see from me again and
I'd move somewhere far away and
Jon: I'm trying to, I'm trying to remember if Colorado's a place
that you can stay anonymous.
I don't think it is.
Louie: oh, I don't think so
Jon: think you actually have to disclose it.
And they have to, you know, in public records, I don't know if
they gave you your full name, but it'd be like L and then Barre one.
Louie: Yeah, I don't think you could just have your lawyer go in and
be like, Hey, this is my private client that I'm taking it for.
Which is a shame 'cause it leads to a host of problems,
Jon: we'll, which we'll get into here in a minute.
Yeah.
but that is very accurate as far as, I don't know.
I, you know, to get back to that though, what would I do with 80 million?
and I've actually thought about this, so I truly believe I would end up
starting, I would hope I would start some kind of foundation, some type of
philanthropy where, you know, maybe I keep like 10% of that, so eight or
10 million and then keep the other, you know, 70 million for philanthropy.
'cause I think, I, I do think there is a problem with too much wealth out there
and not having an incentive to work.
I don't think that's a productive life and I don't want my kids to have that
type of windfall where they don't ever have to like, think about working.
I think there is some value in actually having motivation and having a passion
and having to do something and not just have something handed to you.
I don't know.
it's easy to say that now, but then I'd be like, dude, that,
that freaking boat was real nice.
That
Louie: that jet stream, man,
Jon: It was really nice.
Louie: airplane, man.
I don't wanna wait in these lines anymore.
Jon: I would, that is the one, honestly, I am on the Warren Buffet train as far as
if you listen to some of his things about, being one of the richest people in the
world, most wealthy people in the world.
And really his one really nice thing that he would never give up is private travel.
Oh, you, because once you go there, you can't go back into
the Southwest, what am IC 38?
I can't even sit with my kids.
No.
dude, it ain't happening.
Yeah.
So I would definitely take up Warren on some private travel for sure.
but do I need 15 houses?
No.
Do I need all these other
Louie: things?
Just a few.
I just need a few, man.
Jon: just a couple, be seasonal here and there.
What about you?
What have, have you guys ever thought about what the Barillas would do
if you, Took the big winnings home.
Louie: Oh, man.
Caitlyn doesn't really play that game.
She doesn't really care.
She feels ah, that'd be just a curse.
Yeah.
Which we'll talk about in just a minute here.
Yeah.
which, and she's right.
I would be like, oh sweetheart, we'd go, we're gonna have houses in different
places, in different countries.
We're gonna go everywhere.
I think that, I think that you're right though.
I would have to give a lot of it away.
Yeah.
I think giving it a lot of away is the key to, and not to like all your third cousins
that start coming outta the woodwork.
That's not what I'm saying.
But I think to charity that would have to be your mission and your goal.
I think if you kept it, you know, $80 million and this, that's a small, this
is a small jackpot, $80 million that would be using our 4% rule, which if
you guys remember, if you take a pool of money and you, only spend 8%, or
sorry, 4% of it, you have a very low likelihood about living your money.
So using that rule, you would have about.
$3.2
million a year every year for the rest of your life that you could spend.
that's like $266,000 a month that you would be able to live off of.
that is insane.
you have a high income family's salary every, a yearly salary, every month that
you could do whatever you want with.
And I think that you would, you would have fun for a while, but
then you would go off the rails.
So you'd have to have some guard rails.
I think giving it away, having some charitable things that you do
and having some kind of structure.
I don't think I'd work at West Metro.
I think I'd be done with that, but I would try to do something, in a
volunteer aspect that I would get some kind of pleasure and structure from.
I think.
that's what I say too.
I don't know.
I'd probably be on drugs and be living under a bridge in five
years, but I'd be a fun five years.
Jon: it'd be five years worth noting.
You're not kidding about that.
so what are the actual odds?
All right, so I can't remember who, who said this, but basically the theme
behind it was like, the lottery's for people that can't do math.
Yeah.
It's basically attacks on the poor, more or less because disproportionately people
from the lower end of the socioeconomic spectrum do play the lottery in hopes
of getting out of that position.
Right.
Like, that's kind of, that they believe that is their way,
to achieve financial freedom.
because of the, I don't wanna say it's a lack of information, but it truly
is out of sometimes desperation, just feeling well with $2 I have a chance,
and then I can do something with that.
So
Louie: yeah, $2 won't do anything in my Roth IRA, but it'll change my whole
family tree if I hit the Powerball.
Which is true.
But you're not gonna hit the Powerball.
And I think that's the thing is a lot of people like to say, someone has to win.
Someone has to win.
Yeah.
But not you.
Not you.
And that's just how it's gonna be.
John asked what are the actual odds?
The odds of winning the Powerball are one in 292 million.
Yeah.
Which is.
Nuts.
I mean, that is an insane, that is such an insanely hot, low odds that our brains
don't even know how to think of that.
Like that, that 292 million, it's not like, um, your, your odds
are, in a stadium full of people.
And you might be that one out of a hundred thousand people, it's
exponentially higher than that.
or worse odds that odds are exponentially worse than that.
just to give you a couple ideas, to put it in perspective, your odds
of getting struck by lightning in your lifetime are one in 15,300
Jon: And probably even higher here in Colorado.
Louie: in Colorado on the eastern plains, man, you're probably, or
anywhere, even in the mountains.
In the
Jon: Up on the mountains.
Yep.
But,
Louie: it, so what that means is that you are 19,000 times more likely.
Of getting hit by lining than winning the Powerball 19,000 times.
we're firefighters, so we'll like this one, not for firefighters,
but just for the public in general.
Just for everyone out there, your odds of dying in a fire or a smoke
inhalation related incident are one in about 1500, which is a lot
higher than I would've thought.
I would've
Jon: I would've thought.
Louie: because of the smoke.
I guess that makes it a lot higher.
so you're 198,000 times more likely to die in a fire or smoke related incident
than you are of winning the Powerball.
No one thinks that's gonna happen to 'em.
No one thinks they're gonna get hit by lightning.
but you still think if I buy that ticket, man, I'm gonna win, get away.
And you're not.
You're just not.
Jon: Louise here to crush your dreams and saying, you are not gonna win.
Louie: you're not.
Jon: And the Mega millions isn't that much better.
It's basically 2 million less.
So they must have one digit off, I'm guessing, is how they figure that.
'cause Mega Millions is one in about 290 million, so it's gotta
be one digit off, and that's why you have the odds difference.
So very low.
low probability of winning either of those big national lottery.
So people are like, well, hey, okay, that's fine.
I, that's a long shot.
But what if I play the state lottery?
You know, most states have a lottery system and Colorado's
no different Colorado lottery.
It's lottery plus, something like that.
So the odds of winning that are one in about 3.8
million.
So once again, when you talked about the chance of dying in a fire or getting
struck by a lightning are a much higher probability of either one of those
happening than the Colorado lottery.
So even that one is a very low probability of ever.
Having that opportunity to win that.
Yeah.
When you start looking at that, so the, what I love is then okay,
Louie, hey, one is not good enough.
What if I buy five tickets, 10 tickets, 20 tickets?
My chances are gonna be that much better.
how does the math work on that?
Is it, is it really that much better?
Is it that much more likely that you're gonna win if you buy
10 tickets versus one ticket?
Louie: no.
If you ask me to explain the math in a way that anyone could understand,
I could not, I don't even understand it, but I just know it's not that no,
Jon: no, it doesn't go from one to oh, now I got a 10 chance.
'cause every time it's a random chance you do that next drawing.
So your odds are still, equally low at winning, whether you
buy one ticket or five tickets.
So, I mean, that's the one thing I would encourage people when
they're playing to play responsibly.
So, you know, if you, if you do, are a habitual player of the
lottery, if you typically buy five or 10 tickets, just buy one.
Your chances are still so low.
But at least if you need psychologically to move on and
say, I had a chance, there you go.
Then save yourself 20 bucks.
because the mega millions now, is up to $5 per ticket.
Louie: Okay.
I didn't know that.
Jon: So historically, I think they've always been $1 for every play.
but now it's up to five bucks, which is.
Dude, that, like I said, you buy two tickets and that's 10 bucks right
Louie: and it's every week.
Jon: do that, I think it's multiple times.
It's either two or three times.
I think it's three times per week.
Louie: Oh man.
Jon: stuff.
So that stuff would add up in a hurry.
Oh, yeah.
Louie: Especially if that were in a Roth.
IRA I'm not saying you shouldn't play, but I'm just throwing out some other ideas.
Jon: just throwing that out there.
Yeah.
so here's the trivia question for you.
All right.
What state has the best odds of winning the lottery with a guaranteed
jackpot of at least 1 million?
Dollars.
Louie: Okay.
Jon: So I had to put that $1 million caveat in there.
'cause there's a lot of state, I had to do some research on this.
There's a lot of state lotteries that have like small games, pick three or something
like this, where most of the jackpots
Louie: A hundred
Jon: 50
Louie: or 50.
Okay.
Jon: hundred thousand.
But these are ones that, have typically from one to 35 or 40
random numbers, like five digits.
Louie: I didn't look these up.
I'm just gonna guess.
I don't know, you know the answers, but I don't, so I'm just
gonna take a guess which state.
So this includes not only like Powerball, but like the state
Jon: lottery.
The state lottery.
And I, once again, I didn't go so in depth to verify that each
state has their own lottery.
I'm sure there's probably a couple states that don't, and I don't have, and I don't
have disclosures on, don't pick this one.
Louie: So I'm gonna, you know, my gut is telling me it's like a small
state with not a lot of people like a Wyoming or Kansas or something.
But I actually think that.
Maybe there's more payouts in like more populated states, like California
or I don't know, Florida or New York.
so I guess I'll just say Florida.
Florida?
Jon: Okay.
it's Colorado.
Louie: What?
No way.
Colorado.
Jon: at least from the research I could do.
this was, and this took me an, an inordinate amount of time to figure
this out, but the odds at one.
Point or one to 3.8
million are the best odds out of any major state lottery
system that I could identify.
Massachusetts was like one in 7 million.
New York was one in 6 million.
They were higher up.
And once again, they must just have larger numbers.
Yeah.
That identify those odds.
Wow.
I guess you're lucky to live here in the state of Colorado.
Damn.
Louie: Dang.
Okay, hey, let's all play after this.
Let's go get, let's go get our tickets.
Jon: let's make it happen.
but it is interesting and you use, a lot of the natural resources
here in the state and the parks and everything else and Sure.
That's where a lot of that money from the lottery goes is to
Louie: say.
Jon: That's what they
Louie: That's what they say.
That's what they say
Jon: what they, that's what they want you to believe is this park was
furnished by the Colorado lottery.
they wanna make you feel good
Louie: Yeah.
It's a charitable deduction.
Man.
I'm just gonna write this off.
this is totally charitable.
Jon: it should be a charitable deduction.
All right, so follow up.
it's not, no.
So follow up is, okay.
What state or which, yeah, what state has the best odds of winning the Powerball?
this is represented once again, when they, there was a study that they did,
and it was like from 1992 to 2025.
So this year, which state had the best odds of winning the
Powerball as represented by wind?
Per 100,000
Louie: So per capita.
'cause I was gonna say probably California.
Yeah.
Jon: So you gotta take population into that.
Which, which one has got the best chance?
Louie: Oh boy.
Jon: Oh
Louie: I am gonna go with Florida
Jon: Florida, okay.
All right.
little Rhode Island.
Yeah, little Rhode Island.
statistically speaking has had the most wins.
They've had 488 wins.
since this timeframe
Louie: you could have given me 48 more guests and I would
Jon: You would've not gotten little Rhode Island.
yeah.
So consider next time you're on the East Coast.
we do have some east coasters that work here at the fd.
So next time you're back home, maybe, wait to buy your lotto ticket, then.
There you
Louie: There you go.
Jon: that's gonna change your odds.
I dunno.
you gotta put it out into the
Louie: I gotta try.
You gotta try.
Whatever man.
You
Jon: try, you gotta put it out in the universe.
All right, so then the last one is, what is the most un unlikely
state to win the Powerball?
Once again, this is as represented by 100,000 residents.
So which one has the least amount of wins?
Basically is what's, that's staying out of all the states that play in Powerball.
And once again, I don't remember.
Offhand, if it's like 45 states now that, that play into Powerball.
it's a high number.
Louie: I'm gonna go with Massachusetts.
Massachusetts,
Jon: okay.
It's the other m the old Mississippi.
Oh, Mississippi.
once again, I think they just got into Powerball recently,
but they've had two wins.
Okay.
since they've enrolled so Dang.
Louie: Dang.
don't go
Jon: they could use a little luck down there, down in Hurricane Alley, the old
Louie: They're overdue.
They're overdue.
That means go buy your ticket from Mississippi.
'cause it's overdue, man.
that's how betting and gambling
Jon: It has to mean reversion, right?
Mean reversion.
It has to go back.
Like I love those people that literally, like we've, Louis and I have been to
Vegas a few times, not to gamble, but for conferences and other stuff, and I love
to watch those old birds out there that just they just, see, we call 'em Seahawks.
They're just waiting for someone that's been playing there for 20 minutes and
they could tell they didn't win anything.
Then they get up there and then they claim that chair and they hawk.
Louie: it's hot.
It's gonna, it's overdue.
It's gonna hit, it's gonna hit.
Jon: It's gonna hit, man.
I love watching people in their element like that.
'cause it is fascinating.
Yeah.
All right.
So what's the moral of the story with this, you know, Powerball,
mega Millions, whatever lottery.
it's a long shot.
It's an extremely long shot.
Yeah.
We've already talked about the statistical probability of you winning
and it's not likely ever, but if you have to do it because it's a form of
enjoyment and entertainment for you, by all means, but do it responsibly.
and, please don't do that in lieu of contributing to, an investment account.
Louie: There you go.
Jon: that's the 2 cents for that one.
What's the, what's this thing on the curse of the lottery?
yeah, man, one in 200 million chance, and you're telling me I'm gonna be cursed now.
Yeah.
'cause I won.
Louie: So you're lucky enough to actually win.
And then you have this kind of well-known, phenomenon that happens
called the Curse of the Lottery winner.
And, what that is there's.
There's been different studies that have been done at both statewide
levels and national levels that say, something like 70% of lottery winners
go broke after just a few years.
And I think that, I mean, that's stark.
a lot of people might say that, that maybe those numbers are not quite accurate.
Jon: Yeah.
Skewed a little bit,
Louie: little bit.
But there's still high it, it's still a high chance that you're gonna
experience some really bad things that happen to you if you win the lottery.
So going broke is like the very end game.
In the meantime, people will have relationship breakdowns.
They are more likely to experience divorce and estrangement from their families.
they have mental health problems from the stress and the, the.
The trying to figure out how to manage your money responsibly, from
people trying to swindle you, you have exploitation and crime are increased.
and there's a lot of tragic ends.
Like they're more likely to die from drug overdoses for obvious reasons, from
heart attack, from a bunch of different,
Jon: unnatural
Louie: causes, so to speak.
So you have these curses that happen and it's not just with lottery winners.
I think that we'd like to focus on that one 'cause we're like,
oh, I'm not gonna get lucky.
So if someone else gets lucky, then at least I could feel like, ah,
they're not really getting that lucky.
They have all this, bad stuff happening to 'em.
But there's a lot of studies that have been shown that, People who come into
a lot of money in a relatively short amount of time have similar problems.
Yeah.
Maybe not as pronounced, but in some ways even more pronounced.
if you look at pro athletes, I mean, it is, it is crazy how many NFL athletes and
NBA athletes are broke with just within a few short years after exiting the league.
And it's for those similar reasons, like when you throw a bunch of money, at a
young person who doesn't know how to handle it, bad things very often happen.
And so I think that what we would consider a blessing to come into a lot
of money, whether it's a windfall from a rich uncle, a rich unknown uncle, right?
That's everyone's dream as well.
You have this rich unknown uncle that just leaves you a bunch of money.
it.
it is not like you would all of a sudden have the knowledge and
the foresight and the ability to manage it in an effective way.
and it can lead to a lot of headaches and a lot of problems, like real, legitimate
Jon: s Yeah.
And that's, it's funny when you, it's, I mean, that, there's
actually nothing about that.
That's funny.
But it's funny in the sense of you feel like you've been given this gift, you've
been given this big windfall, and all of a sudden your life is gonna be incrementally
better and you're gonna be happier because you now have this, newfound wealth.
Or money.
but it almost always ends up, like you said, in a tragic event.
And I think the one that is the most, you know, that would be really hard
to reconcile is are people hanging out with you because they like you?
Or are they merely, you know, hanging around you because of
the things that come with that?
I think that'd be really tough psychologically to get over no, they
didn't like me before, but now of a sudden I've got all this money.
They're, they're into wanting to hang out.
And I feel like you would always be questioning
Louie: you'd always wonder mm-hmm.
Jon: Like, well, okay, does this.
person like me for who I am or because, they get free things.
I think that'd be really hard.
And the explo, the exploitation from, people surrounding them,
if they had friends beforehand, I think those go through the roof.
And that professional athletes are typically the ones that are
like the poster child for that.
Like they've got an entourage, right?
So you're not just funding, we went out to dinner for myself,
it's no, myself and 28, my homies.
And then they're homies.
Homies.
And pretty soon, you know, you're spending a hundred grand on a dinner once
you're like, dude, what just happened?
And I think that happens time and time again.
So it's legit.
so what would you advise someone if they didn't, if they do win the
Colorado lottery or something like that.
what should be some of the first steps you think they should do?
Louie: I'll say this.
I think that the best thing you can do if you, and we said winning the
lottery, but if you come into a lot of money, whether it's a, a windfall of
Jon: which is more realistic for our folks, right?
Like you do have someone, your parents were wealthy or grandparents
or somehow like, you know, you just came into this and we're not, and it
might not be $15 million, it might be like a million dollars, but that
is a lot of money to, to our members.
And that's gonna, that's gonna happen as this, generational wealth gets
transferred over the next, few years.
So this is for you guys as well.
This is, this goes beyond just the Powerball winnings.
Louie: Yeah, I would say that, a couple things that you can do to prepare to
come into a lot of money like that, or when you do come in, is you need to
surround yourself with really smart people who have your best interest in mind.
And this is gonna be really sad to say, but it's that does not mean your family.
That does not mean your friends or your homies that you grew up
with as much as you want it to.
It does not.
Those people are not necessarily financial experts.
They are not necessarily, have your best interest in mind or want you
to keep all the money that you got.
I would say that what it means is you need like qualified, certified.
Educated financial experts and legal experts in your corner.
you gotta have a legitimate CFP and a legitimate, certified financial planner.
a legitimate accountant and a legitimate lawyer.
Not family.
I think that I, you can't say that enough.
It should not be family.
or close friends like, or friends at all.
This, these should just be people that you find.
Jon: a business relationship.
They work for you.
Their interests have to be aligned with your interests.
So basically they have to put your interest first.
That's the whole concept of a fiduciary standard.
and I can't agree with you more.
You have to surround yourself with experts, and people that are, have the
knowledge and the ability to take that windfall, that lump sum, whatever that
is, and then create a plan for you.
And then be able to help quarterback how you're gonna use that money.
Yeah.
and really walk through those steps.
that has to be first and foremost what happens.
yeah.
I don't know, man.
Honestly, there'd be nothing happier for me than to get some, some
message, you know, a week down the road and be like, dude, you won't
believe this firefighter from Weber.
Justin.
Their freaking, like Louis and John are full of shit.
I won, man.
You gotta play.
You gotta play to win
Louie: That Nigerian prince came through baby.
Jon: Oh my God, dude, I love it.
But yeah, the lottery's all about speculation.
It's not investing.
Yeah.
All right.
So that's fun, just to think about that.
but now we're gonna pivot just a touch and really.
get a little philosophical here.
Okay.
and this is one that I think actually I really liked when
I was doing my coursework.
You know, there's obviously the technical aspects of financial
advising and planning, you know, coming up with investment strategies
and withdrawal strategies and tax optimization, all that stuff.
and honestly, like the software that they've created now, dude
is fantastic at that stuff.
Oh, believe it.
But really where I think the value, whether you have a planner or
advisor or a counselor is really in the thought exercises and the
communication that surrounds money.
And what is money?
Why do you need money?
What's the purpose of money?
And really diving into that more, interpersonal concepts of
money and what it's there for.
But it's the difference between this concept of rich and the difference
between this concept of wealth.
I think a lot of times.
and you can agree or disagree with me, Louis, on this one, but I think a lot
of times, and I've even noticed myself in conversation, getting those terms
intermixed, meaning the same things.
what's your thoughts?
do you differentiate the difference between rich and wealthy, or
do you just think that's just all the, all in the same?
Louie: No, you know what I think that just out of, I don't know, laziness,
I kind of interchange the terms
Jon: or
Louie: I swap them out and use them to refer to whatever, and this is probably
not right, or at least maybe not according to your, formal definitions.
But I think in my head I always assumed if there is a difference, it's that
rich is enough money for like your current lifetime or maybe, for the
next 10 years or something like that.
a lot of money in a relatively short amount of time.
But being wealthy, I've always thought of as enough money that you're
gonna change your family tree, your children and your children's children.
Yeah.
So something like Warren Buffet is wealthy.
He has a lot of income producing assets that continue to contribute to his
wealth, whereas who, you know, some.
A 22-year-old kid in the NFL is rich 'cause he got a contract for 5 million.
Yeah.
In my head that's how I thought about it.
But, happy to hear what your coursework revealed
Jon: to.
No, I think that's a really good, and I think that's above what most people think.
I don't think they can define it in that frame or that context.
So I think you're right on.
So when I think of Rich, or being rich, it's exactly what you said.
It's about what you have right now.
And that typically comes from active income, right?
So working or whatever.
You're making money, and it typically tends to be on the
higher income lifestyle, right?
So you're making a lot of money.
So you really, at that point, if you're being rich, you're really focusing on cash
flow and then funding a certain lifestyle.
I think that's really what goes with this when you think about rich versus
wealthy is rich is what you see.
So it's the stuff on Instagram, it's the people driving the bugattis, it's flying
in a private jet, it's going to these, isolated, Islands on a, on an extravagant
vacation that costs $40,000 a day.
that's what I think when you think about being rich, it's
people making a lot of money.
and then they're living lavishly.
They're showing that money off, right?
Whether that's houses, cars, vacations, all that stuff.
So the risk with being rich is, it can be taken away and
it can be taken away rapidly.
All of a sudden, if you lose that contract, if you're a pro
athlete and you get hurt, you no longer get that guaranteed income.
That money's gone.
and that could go for a lot of other,
Louie: but your expenses are still
Jon: your expenses are still there.
Your lifestyle still remains the same, but now your income is shut off.
So now that goes away.
So that's your biggest risk is if you're relying on active income, so
a job or however you make your money.
and then that goes away without savings or assets.
You're no longer rich anymore, and, but you still have to fund that lifestyle.
Whereas wealth, I think it's more about sustaining financial independence.
So it's assets like Louis talked about that generate
income once you stop working.
So that can be through different investments.
That could be through real estate.
There's a lot of different ways that you can make what they call passive
income, where you're no longer have to working, working for that.
Your money is making money.
That's what wealth is all about.
So your focus should be more on ownership.
In long term financial security.
and there's already the examples of investments, real estates, having
a business that generates income.
and really the key idea there is that wealth is about freedom of time
and stability and not just spending.
So there's a lot of, a.
Researcher, there's books out there that specifically talk more about
that concept of, being rich versus wealthy, the whole rich dad, poor dad,
millionaire next door kind of thing.
Yeah.
and that's really what they talk about when they talk
about, you know, what is wealth.
And a lot of the, the people that end up being millionaires
come from very modest means.
Yeah.
they're firefighters, they're teachers.
They're people that strategically set away money every couple weeks,
whether that was in their investment accounts or a brokerage account.
And then they just let that money work.
You know, they work their 20, they work their 30, 40 year careers, and then
after 40 years of investing, they end up with a lot of money because they
typically kept their lifestyle low.
They never, they never out kicked their coverage.
They never lived beyond their means, and they just kind of slow and
steady kind of the whole turtle race.
and that's how they became wealthy.
Yeah.
That's really the difference.
Louie: And I think that is really cool.
the book that you mentioned, the Millionaire Next Door, that
was a book that was written like probably 30 years ago now.
That was
Jon: in the nineties I think.
Louie: Yeah.
and the interesting thing about it is they took like this data from all
these actual millionaires, like it was hundreds and hundreds of millionaires
all over the country, and they found out, and when they said by a millionaire,
that means someone whose net worth is in excess of a million dollars.
So everything you.
Own minus what you owe.
If the difference after you take that subtraction, if you have a million dollars
in assets, then you're a millionaire.
And what they found to John's point is that millionaires are not flashy.
They're actually very frugal in a lot of ways.
I think they said that the average car, the median car or
something of a millionaire is like a Ford, a Chevy or a Toyota.
it's like a very cheap brand.
It's not a Lexus and it's not a Mercedes and it's not a Tesla.
it's a very,
Jon: do you actually remember what the vehicle was?
They actually cited the number one, and I can't remember what the sample size was.
We're talking, hundreds if not thousands of people that they
ended up doing this survey on.
so it was a pretty good representation of the general population, the
number one vehicle that their folks.
Louie: Toyota Camry.
Is it?
Toyota Camry
Jon: that, ended up being millionaires, was a, Ford F-150 pickup truck.
Okay?
And we're talking like an older truck, but that was the number one thing.
Once again, pretty modest.
So if you think of tradespeople, if you think of, police officers,
firefighters, all these other things, that was the average, vehicle that
these millionaires had was a Ford F-150.
Louie: Yeah.
They, and that, so first of all, firefighters don't be
like, you know what that means?
I need to go get my Ford F 1309 $80,000.
that new, Raptor is built on the F-150 chassis, so I'm gonna go
ahead and get a raptor at $95,000.
That's not what we're saying.
they're used, they are used
Jon: and they average, and I think the average age of the vehicle was
somewhere between 15 to 18 years.
So once again, they e even if they bought it new, they bought
it and they probably paid cash.
They didn't finance it, and then they kept it until literally the wheels fell off.
And that's how they did it.
They didn't have a car payment for 20 years, so that money, they just were
able to stash away and invest it.
And then lo and behold, 20 years down the line, this is what you got.
Louie: Yeah.
and that was true for their whole lifestyle.
Like they, it showed that they also lived in like middle class or maybe upper
middle class neighborhoods, but they didn't live in like the whole McMansion
neighborhoods or, very exclusive.
ritzy neighborhoods.
They lived in like middle class neighborhoods.
At least the majority of them did.
Yeah.
Which was interesting as well.
and then, they didn't pay a lot for their clothes, for their
food, for their entertainment.
They didn't have a lot of really expensive hobbies.
and so that kind of painted a different picture, especially when that came out in
the nineties versus, MTV cribs or whatever that showed rich people what they, what.
So that was like the, oh, this is what a millionaire is really and
this showed, no, it's not, they live on less than they make by a lot.
And I think they called them like paw something,
Jon: something
Louie: like
Jon: prodigious savers of wealth.
Louie: It was something like that.
Yeah.
And so it showed that they saved their money, like something like
30 to 40% of their income were being, was being saved and invested.
Every year.
They tracked their expenses, they could tell you how much they
spent on different categories.
and then it also in this, even today, I think a lot of people would.
I find this hard to believe the overwhelming majority of millionaires
were self-made millionaires.
So it's 80% did or first generation millionaires, like they did
not inherit anything from their parents or their grandparents.
and then they all had, like you said, they had businesses, a lot of 'em had
businesses, but not what you think.
It's not like they had investment firms.
Their businesses were like janitorial services, car wash, laundromats, like
very, blue collar plumbing businesses.
that is how they made their millions.
Yeah.
which is completely fascinating 'cause it just shows like that is a really cool
way that people can actually get rich.
Lottery's.
Not gonna happen.
Powerball's not gonna happen.
inheriting it probably is not gonna happen, but it can happen.
You can become a millionaire.
You can, get wealthy by.
doing the right things, making the right moves, and saving your money and investing
it, for the long term, which is in my opinion, that's like more encouraging
than anything about the lottery or pro athletes or anything like that.
Jon: Yeah.
No, it's, to Louis's point, it's 100% possible for everyone
that's listening to this.
And a million dollars obviously is not what a million dollars was in 1992.
Obviously with inflation, everything else.
So you guys might be like, a million dollars, that's, that
won't even buy me, you know, 10 years in retirement or whatever.
But if you take that same concept, and then extrapolate it to where
we are now, rather than being.
having $1 million, you're gonna have two and a half or $3 million because of you,
you made these actions and these steps.
And I think that's what's cool because it's completely possible
and you can control that.
You can control all that stuff.
You can't control whether or not you win the lottery.
You can't control what family you're born into and whether or
not gonna get inheritance, but you can totally control how much money
you spend, what your lifestyle is, how you wanna live your life.
Like those are all things that are within your control.
And that's what I like because you can actually, you can affect
the change that you want to see.
And a lot of this is small, simple steps.
We're not talking about a grand overhaul of your life.
Like a lot of these are just small little behavioral changes that you can make.
A lot of this has to do with automation, setting things up.
And then literally not touching it.
Just letting it go.
Louie: it go
Jon: And, in 30 years come back and be like, wow, I would've never envisioned
I had that much money in that account by just putting away this money every
couple weeks, not touching it, and then being like, okay, I am ready to retire.
And looking at that and being like, that's a lot of money.
I can't believe that happened over 30 years.
Louie: and this is where, so this is where it's like where Oz kind of
pulling back the curtain here, because.
John and I told you from the very beginning when we started doing this
podcast, EPIs, this podcast episodes, we were like, we want to see people
become financially independent.
that was the word that we always used.
And then we give our little car salesman pitch, and we give this to the new guys.
When we're at the academy, we give this to you guys on the podcast and other
people that we come in contact with.
We say, there's three things that we try to teach people in order to
become financially independent, and that is to live below your means.
Get out and stay outta debt and then invest early and often.
And everything that we've talked about, I feel like fits
into one of those categories.
Whether it's the debt episode or the investment episode, or the retirement
account episode, it fits into one of those three because at the end of the
day, if you do those three things, that is how you build wealth, and that is
what John and I have been trying to get.
You guys listening to this to do is build wealth, set yourself up and
your family up for future success.
And this whole wealth study and this whole all these wealth studies and these things
that we are bringing to your attention is just a way to motivate you that it is
possible and that there is an end goal.
And I think sometimes it's hard to keep that end goal in mind because
you're like, I'm saving this money and I don't know what I'm saving it for.
Or I have this future, you know, somewhere off in the distant retirement,
post-retirement, life that I'd like to get to, but I don't actually know what
that means and I don't actually know what I want to do or when I wanna retire.
and I get that that's okay.
But at the end of the day, if you have saved money and you've built
your lifestyle in a way that you can easily fund it by with your salary and
still save, you're gonna give yourself options for when you wanna retire, how
you wanna retire, what you wanna do in retirement, and how much kind of fruitful
life you wanna live in retirement.
and not everyone has that.
It's sad to say that we've seen a lot of guys that don't have that,
that leave, the fire service.
and we don't want that to be any of our coworkers now.
Jon: no, I think that's, I think that's well said, Lou.
And it's one of those things, it's easier on this side of it.
Both Louis and I are close in age and we're more towards
the latter end of our career.
I wish I would've, I shouldn't say I wish I would've had something like this when I
was younger, 'cause I don't know if that would've really changed honestly, my,
my lifestyle, how I went about things.
But it, I'm telling you right now, looking at where I am now and because
of the changes I made when I was a little bit younger, and just seeing it
start to pay off now, like some of that compounding really make a difference.
It is totally worth it, but it's really frustrating at the beginning where
you're putting in, you know, five, six, $7,000 into your 4 57 and then
next year, it's okay, now I'm at 10.
Yeah.
And then I'm at like 16.
Louie: gonna, I'm never gonna get rich.
Never
Jon: gonna get there.
And I think that is the hardest thing to stick with.
Is believing in the process and just man at that very beginning, it just
takes some time for that to add up.
But then there's just a magic of math that happens at a a certain point in
time when all of a sudden you're like.
Wow.
now that thing is really working for me.
And it just, it's staying the course.
It's like, you know, physicians, I've always admired physicians not
because of their intellect, typically.
they are smart, but really it's their tenacity to stick with something for 15
years to be able to operate on someone.
That's really what it's about.
And investing is no different.
It's the tenacity to stick with something, even when you're not seeing
a huge, a change in your account value.
But just knowing and believing in the process that if it keep sticking with
this over time, this is gonna pay off.
it's having that faith in the system, which is just really hard when you're
younger and you've got, you've got competing priorities for everything
that you wanna spend your money on.
it's that balance of living life now versus delaying gratification
that every, everyone's gonna handle that a little bit differently.
Louie: Yeah.
and there's never, there's not necessarily a, I'm not gonna say that there is a
wrong way to handle it, which is like not saving or not thinking about it or
not trying to address those problems.
But I think that you don't have to be discouraged if you don't save 40% of
Jon: Yeah, 100%
Louie: And that's why we've never advocated that.
We've never sat here and been like, if you don't save loser a thousand
dollars a month, you're a loser.
You're gonna retire poor.
Like you're not gonna have any money.
We've never tried to say that.
but we do think that the, you know, like John was just mentioning, we think that
the consistent, sacrifice now of money into your investment accounts every month,
every paycheck, makes a huge difference.
And it takes a while to see it, but when it, when you do see it at the
end of your career, you are shocked by how much you have and how wonderful
that's gonna make your retirement.
Jon: Yep.
No, so when if you want to kind of, you know, tie this in a bow, so to speak.
So rich basically equals money right now.
High income type stuff, right?
Whereas wealthy is more about having a high net worth,
and then financial freedom.
So you're getting your money through passive sources and, you have
the ability to do what you want, when you want on your own terms.
So there's a couple different ways that you can think about wealth.
and this is actually a book, that just came out not too long ago.
I kind of just got some of the cliff notes, but I really want to, I
really wanna read this book because I like the framework for which this
guy thought about wealth and he basically frames it in five different
dimensions or what he calls pillars.
and the first pillar is time wealth.
And this is one, maybe I'm just getting old Louie.
This is the one that to me like that struck with me.
And I think it strikes a lot of people as they get a little bit older, their
kids get a little bit older and they get a little bit closer to kind of
hanging up, the spurs, so to speak.
But it's, time, wealth is the ability to control how you spend your time,
who you spend it with, what you do.
Who you are and you're basically take a trading time intentionally
rather than letting it slip away.
And I was like, man, that thing really resonated with me because it's really
the one resource out of all the resources that you, that we talk about that you
cannot earn more of, you're maximizing your autonomy over its foundation.
So that one, I was like, dude, that one's a
Louie: that hits hard, man.
Jon: one hits hard as And I try to keep up with a lot of our retirees
and have conversations and, you know, the universal truth that I
have found time and time again.
people that I talk to six months a year, four years after their
retirement, like, how's it going?
And almost universally they're like, man, if I knew this is
what it was gonna be like.
I would've left three or five years ago.
I just, I was scared.
I didn't know if I had the money.
All these other things come into play.
Yeah.
but the one thing they realize is that time is the one thing
that you can't get back.
so the other pillar is social wealth.
And I think this is, really important.
And that's keeping quality of your relationships, some sense of a
community, your social capital.
This is something here at the FD we hold dearly.
This is one of the best parts of the job is who you get to work with in
spending time with your coworkers.
so I don't know if that one's so much, of a factor for a lot of us
because we really, for the most part, really enjoy the people we get
to work with and have a lot of fun.
Yeah.
so I don't think, I think that's more for jobs where you're really
beat down by your coworkers and just really hate coming to work.
Louie: we're beat down by our coworkers,
Jon: but in a
Louie: different, we like cums for it
Jon: Yes.
In a meaningful way.
the other one is, mental wealth.
and that's having, a clarity of purpose, growth, emotional health and curiosity,
engaging in meaningful mental work.
so this is one that I think when Louie was talking about, like, you know, having
philanthropy or setting up a foundation, if you came into a big windfall, I think
this is the one, they really, I think this is really framed around purpose.
Like, what are you, what are you spending your time on this earth to do?
And a lot of our work though is purposeful, although sometimes
it doesn't always feel that way.
Yeah.
But I think most of us have a sense in value in what we do, physical wealth.
this is one, once again, as you get older, man, you sit there and this
one becomes, you take it less and less for granted because you start to have
ailments, you start to have injuries, you can't quite do what you used to.
thinking about your health and vitality, energy, how you're
spending your time, taking care of your body, what you're putting into
your body, all those other things.
dude, once again, this is not a 20-year-old temple anymore.
dude, I can't eat those sweets like I used to.
Louie: I think that the other, the other important thing notice about your,
or to remember about your health is that if it's gone, I mean, very often
it's hard to get back, especially as
Jon: you get older.
Oh, 100% it's not coming back.
Louie: So if you.
If you have bad health now, or you neglect your health now, then you are
going to be paying some of your money that you've been saving up in retirement
and you're not going on vacation, you're not gonna go do really cool things or
have a great time, golfing or doing whatever you wanna do on vacation.
You're gonna be spending it on dialysis treatments and you're gonna
be spending it on medications and on things related to your health.
So if you don't make an investment in your health now and get financially
wealthy or financially healthy now, you will pay for it later.
You will money.
And I, when I say pay for it, I mean financially, you will pay for it.
Jon: Yep.
And then his last pillar, is this concept of, financial wealth.
And really that is, more traditionally what we think about
when we think about wealth, right?
So money, assets, income, financial, freedom.
and really the thing about this one is, thinking about.
When you have enough, and this is the one that I think most of our folks
struggle with the most, and this is what typically keeps people working here
longer than they probably need to, is they haven't quite defined what enough is.
so really it's all about, no longer just the accumulation phase, but
really what are you gonna do and how do you want your money to
support your other types of wealth?
And the one thing I really like that he focuses on is these five pillars.
Are gonna change depending on where you are in your life cycle, right?
It's just, it's natural to happen as you're younger.
You feel less about the time wealth 'cause you still have many years in front of you,
so you're not so concerned about that.
You're probably more concerned about building up your financial temple, so to
speak, and some of these other, the social wealth is probably really important.
And then as you get to middle age, like three or four of these
become equally important and you're trying to balance those.
And then as you get a little bit older and a little bit closer to retirement
or in retirement, then man time, wealth is your number one priority.
So these things will change as you age and as you grow up.
But I think being really mindful of what wealth is and.
Thinking about that, I think is a really good thought exercise.
I think if more people thought about why they were spending money or how
they were spending money, I think it would, I think they'd get more happiness
on the things that they actually did buy because it would have some
more purpose and meaning behind it.
So, kind of a deep thought exercise on some of that stuff.
But, I would incur you guys, and sorry, I wanted to look, about what this guy's,
book was, I believe his name was Sahil Bloom, was the author and it had something
to do with the five Elements of Wealth.
So I'm probably butchering that, but I'm sure if you just Google some of
those things, his book will pop up.
I wanna read a little bit more about it, but I really liked the framework, in
which he addressed some of those things.
So the difference between being rich versus being wealthy.
here at the fiscal firehouse, we want you guys to be wealthy.
Yeah.
Not so much rich
Louie: in every area of your life.
Jon: That's right.
Yeah.
That's right.
Cool.
Anything else you want to add to the, podcast, Louis?
Once again, we're coming up on about our hour of, conversation and dialogue,
so hopefully this one wasn't as heady.
It was a little bit more lighthearted, thinking about the lottery and
odds and rich versus wealth and how to achieve some of those things.
but, nonetheless, good conversations.
Louie: I thought it was great.
I had a good time.
I think it's fun talking about it.
I would still talk to you if I won the lottery, just so you know, if I won the
Jon: you would probably still reach out to
Louie: I'll probably reach out.
I, or I'd have someone reach out on my
Jon: Yeah, your people would call my people.
Louie: yeah, exactly.
I'd have them call you and tell you that I'm doing all right.
Just so you know that everything's
Jon: I don't know how a country club would look on you.
I don't know if you could quite assimilate into the country club love
Louie: I'd get kicked out.
I'd get kicked out
Jon: wearing, yeah.
Wearing your wife.
Beat her on the golf course.
Yeah.
Probably wouldn't cut the, wouldn't cut it.
Louie: no, I think I'd get kicked out and I'm okay with that.
I, I'll never be that kind of guy and I'm okay with that, even if I
won $80 million in the Powerball,
Jon: There you go.
No, you got a big heart.
Louie.
I've definitely, I know that much about you and, we'll wrap this up.
As always, guys, you know how to get ahold of us by now.
we are gonna have a little bit of a teaser, coming up for you guys.
starting, next year.
We're, thinking about, taking this onto some video.
We're thinking about doing some video platform.
We've gotten a lot of requests and we also know this is once again,
just the media in which a lot of our folks are consuming content.
Louie and I are, considering, slash intentionally, maybe
putting this on the old YouTube.
So we're working on getting some equipment set up and
Louie: completely unrelated.
We're also getting Botox
Jon: injections.
Yeah,
Louie: we got a lot of work to do between now and then.
Jon: we do, I know I've got a phase for radio.
so you guys will get to see it in the flesh.
Those of you that, dunno who Louie and I are, but we are looking forward to that.
we're not gonna promise a date yet, because, we still gotta get some
stuff, in the pipeline, so to speak.
So that'll be coming.
But other than that, continue to listen to the podcast.
please send some likes, some subscribes, all that stuff.
I actually, I don't understand how the algorithms work, but if you feel like a
lot of this stuff is valuable for people to at least just noodle over, you know,
give us a like, or something that might, just put this in front of someone's
ears that didn't even know we existed.
Yep.
All right.
Louie: All right.
we appreciated guys.
Thanks for your time.
Thanks for listening.
Stay safe and keep saving.
The Fiscal Firehouse Podcast is a podcast curated specifically
for local 1309 members.
This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only,
and should not be construed as professional financial advice.
Should you need professional advice, consult a licensed
financial advisor or tax advisor.
The opinions of John Beatty, Louis Barilla and their castmates are
solely their own, and don't reflect that of West Metro Fire Rescue.