From Here to Maternity === [00:00:00] Claire Fisher: Hello and welcome to Carried Far, far Away, a podcast project where we're watching and reading everything that Carrie Fisher did during her short life and storied career. I'm Claire Fisher, Katie Marinello: I'm Katie Marinello. Claire Fisher: And today we are talking about the punnily named From Here to Maternity . Katie Marinello: Yes. Yes, we are. Claire Fisher: Have you seen, I forget if you and I watched this together, I know that our parents had the VHS, but did you ever watch From Here to Eternity the movie for which this is? Okay. Katie Marinello: No. I mean, I vaguely knew that that's what it was named after, but I actually don't know anything about From Here to Eternity. Claire Fisher: Okay. Well, it has a subplot about infertility actually, which I thought was sort of ironic here as far as names. Katie Marinello: they were thinking that deep or if they just wanted a pun title. It seems like they didn't go past the punny title like writing a script or anything, Claire Fisher: No, no. There's a script here. I I, when we get to trivia, I'll tell you more about how this is put together. Katie Marinello: want me to [00:01:00] summarize Claire Fisher: Yeah, you do the 54 second recap, and then we'll get into when this happened and why. Katie Marinello: Yes. My favorite thing about this movie was the fact that it was 48 minutes long, so 54 seconds shouldn't be that hard. Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Katie Marinello: Carrie Fisher plays Veronica, the chairman of the board of some nondescript company. one day, She spots apparently the first. Photo of a baby she's ever seen in her life and decides she's nothing without motherhood. She wanders into a church of motherhood where she meets two other women who give testimony. Judy, who can't seem to get her husband to fuck her. And Caroline, who has been told her biologic clock has 48 hours left on it, through an IRS scam. A restaurant like sperm bank and a good old fashioned sleeping with the valet after too much champagne, they all managed to get pregnant. Take a birthing class from Richard Simmons and then I guess live happily ever after. This movie is weird. Claire Fisher: I didn't even know that was Richard Simmons. Okay. Katie Marinello: Really? Claire Fisher: I didn't recognize him. Katie Marinello: Oh my goodness. Claire Fisher: The copy we have is very poor quality. Katie Marinello: I mean it said and featuring Richard Simmons in the beginning, Claire Fisher: Oh, Katie Marinello: I [00:02:00] recognized Claire Fisher: well, I probably should have read the credits more closely. Okay, so do you want to hear about when this movie and why this movie? Katie Marinello: I wanna know why this movie so Claire Fisher: Okay. All right, so this aired March 25th, 1986 on Cinemaxx, then a 6-year-old network. Katie Marinello: Cinemax, isn't that? Oh, not the skin Max is the Claire Fisher: Get your mind outta the gutter, Katie. Katie Marinello: I don't know what Cinemax is. I don't think I've ever watched anything on it. Claire Fisher: I don't think we've ever lived in a house that had that channel, but it, Katie Marinello: exist? Claire Fisher: I probably, that's. Katie Marinello: Let me use my super fast typing skills here. Oh, it's owned by HBO. Claire Fisher: Okay. So, Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: As that fact would suggest they were competitors in the eighties. And as we have already discussed when we talked about the Frankenstein that Carrie Fisher was in cable networks, like paid cable networks that [00:03:00] wanted to do prestige stuff, did not have the funding to do that in the eighties. So instead they made stuff like this cheaply made, he's, Katie Marinello: Yeah, they didn't really need a Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: just kinda Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Katie Marinello: on, on the screen. You know? She's running through like weird graphics and Claire Fisher: Okay, so that ties into the why of this movie. this movie Has set pieces and sequences that are references to other more famous movies that Cinemax viewers would know. Because if you were subscribing to Cinemaxx in 1986, you had to be a movie buff, right? There was no other reason to be paying for it. Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: they did was show movies, right? Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: the there is a scene in this movie where she. Is in such despair over wanting a baby that she's like wandering down a street and things are flying past her that say, new mom's sale and baby pictures and everything. That's actually a reference to The Lost Weekend, the best picture of 1946 Katie Marinello: Huh. Claire Fisher: in which a man is experiencing delirium, tremon after running out of alcohol and is like wandering up third avenue, looking for [00:04:00] somewhere to pawn his typewriter to buy. More booze. Yeah, Katie Marinello: Oh. Claire Fisher: kind of a weird reference, but that like setup of a character walking and things flying at them that remind them of what's upsetting them, sort of became like a shorthand for insanity in movies, I guess, Katie Marinello: didn't know the exact Claire Fisher: right? Katie Marinello: I obviously Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: recognized Claire Fisher: There's obviously the, the title is a reference From Here to Eternity. So are is the when they all are having sex, the waves crashing on the beach. The famous scene from, From Here to Eternity, Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: Is two people kissing in the waves as they crash on the beach. Right. There are so there's a couple of things here that are really references to other things, like the Richard Simmons exercise videos, right? And yeah. So, it's somewhat funny. That they picked this as a thing to do, but it's when we get into synopsizing, I'm gonna say I didn't hate it. 'cause some of this was actually very hilarious actually. Katie Marinello: Really. Okay. Claire Fisher: Um, Katie Marinello: Hate it either. I just [00:05:00] thought Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: I couldn't explain why it was happening. when I explain, when I summarized it to a friend, she said, it sounds like you're describing a dream that you had, Claire Fisher: So let's talk about the political why, which is always gonna be separate from the artistic why. Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: Okay. When you and I were young, we did at one point watch the 1987 movie Baby Boom with Diane Keaton. Um, Dunno if you remember that one. Her cousin dies and she ends up having to take in the baby and then Katie Marinello: yes. You know what? That one did come into my brain a Claire Fisher: right. Katie Marinello: during this. Claire Fisher: So this was a year before that. But that movie notably opens with a voiceover where the woman says, I'm of the generation where instead of growing up to marry a doctor or a lawyer, I grew up to become a doctor or a lawyer. In the mid eighties, there was a lot of anxiety because these yuppie women of the baby boom generation had decided not to have as many children as their mothers had had. Katie Marinello: [00:06:00] Right. Claire Fisher: Falling birth rates were causing a lot of anxiety because they were worried about a population bust which has implications for who's gonna pay into the social security system and all of that. What is true statistically but overlooked politically and socially is that these falling birth rates were falling from the high watermark of the baby boom. So the rates weren't low, they were just lower. Than they had been. Right. I did look at some data to back this up for people who like numbers. In 1960, the US birth rate was 3.65 babies per woman. By 1986, it was 1.84 babies per woman. So it had halved in a single generation. So that was what was causing people to be like, oh no. What happens if we don't have enough children Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: now? That ain't. Katie Marinello: that that is such an old fashioned attitude and there's nobody out there saying that we should, You know, be relying on our mothers in-law to take care of our babies, because that's all that women over 45 are good for. Claire Fisher: [00:07:00] Would you care to take a guess at what the US birth rate is today or as of 2023, which is apparently the most recent year you can look up. Katie Marinello: No, I would've guessed probably 1.8 well, so, Claire Fisher: is 1.62. So it has, Katie Marinello: really not that low Claire Fisher: it has come down even relative to the eighties, but it really not as far as people were worried that it would. Right. I mean, the major problem, you know, lies, damn lies, and statistics. If you look at these statistics without, as if they're going to. The future flawlessly, it would've looked like by the year 2000 people would be having zero babies and we would all die out. Katie Marinello: right. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: so Katie Marinello: I also read recently that the birth rate is declining among everyone except women in their forties. Claire Fisher: well, yes, the technology and medical interventions that allow people to have babies later have come some way in the. Katie Marinello: why I am 36 and the vast Claire Fisher: majority of my friends have kids under 5 Katie Marinello: You know? Whereas I [00:08:00] think by the time mom was 36, I was 10. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: Yeah. So on the subject of the medical interventions, the world's first baby carried by a non-related surrogate mother was born April 13th, 1986. So three weeks after this movie came out. Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: other words, the first time that an embryo formed by the genetic material of mom and dad was implanted into a different woman's uterus, and then she gave birth the surrogate was paid $10,000 for her services and People Magazine ended up describing the child as follows. To her parents, Shera is a miracle; to science, She's a marvel and to ethics professors and lawyers. She's a cute brown-eyed hot potato. Because this did raise questions about like custody and biological parenthood. And and you know that in the state where I live actually paid surrogacy is illegal to this day because shortly after this, an unrelated surrogate who'd [00:09:00] been paid for her services, tried to file for custody of the child, and created a whole miche. And Katie Marinello: messy, but hey, I read a headline today that they're making a robot that can give birth to babies. Claire Fisher: I look forward to that day. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. It seems less messy. Claire Fisher: I mean, if there's anything that we ought to bring automation into, it's something that straight up kills people, I think, Katie Marinello: Right, exactly. Let us create art and poetry and let the robots give Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Yeah, exactly. Katie Marinello: especially in a world where abortion is illegal in much of the states. Okay. Claire Fisher: Okay, let's not get into that, but yeah. Katie Marinello: I mean, I think we're going to, but artificial insemination, we talked about this in the last episode. Claire Fisher: Two episodes ago Katie Marinello: ago. and remind me again when that started. Claire Fisher: that commercially in the early seventies unofficially before that you could ask a friend, Katie Marinello: you could ask a friend. Claire Fisher: okay? Katie Marinello: of course. There's always a phone, a Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Katie Marinello: I wonder how often that happens [00:10:00] in real life it happens an awful lot on TV where you just ask your male friend if he'll donate. Claire Fisher: It is never happened to me. Katie Marinello: Well, no, you don't have sperm. That would be Claire Fisher: Well, no, I mean I've never asked any of my male friends for sperm, is what I'm saying. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Well, me neither. Claire Fisher: Yeah, see, so I mean, it must not happen at all two data points. Katie Marinello: go. Well, so the birth rate on this podcast is zero. So we have no experience, Claire Fisher: The dedication to this movie said to all women everywhere who are beginning to feel the vague stirrings of motherhood. The story is affectionately dedicated, and the credits also said it was based on the book From Here to Maternity. But I could find out nothing about this book. I, I couldn't find it. Copy. I couldn't find a summary. I, I don't know where this, I know nothing about this book. I couldn't find anything about. Katie Marinello: oh my goodness. There was a book. Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Katie Marinello: This seems like something we need like a Library of Congress subscription to or something. 'cause I mean, they'd have to have a copy, Claire Fisher: I guess the Library of Congress [00:11:00] almost certainly does have such a copy. Katie Marinello: I know someone who works there. I'll Claire Fisher: Okay. Let us, Katie Marinello: an update if Claire Fisher: yeah. Re report back if you find out anything. So anyway, into the world of the 1980s where, you know, it was a fact women weren't having as many babies as they had used to have even married couples. As I think Judy in the movie is talking about, like her husband doesn't want one 'cause he's worried it'll be a financial liability. Right. It is a, a fact that economists have studied that the fewer children, American families had, the more money they spent per child. Katie Marinello: Oh, interesting. Claire Fisher: this, I read that this means you can class children with durable luxury goods, such as things like refrigerators or cars where you're not likely to buy additional refrigerators if you're rich, but you might buy a nicer model refrigerator if you're rich. You don't necessarily have more or fewer children if you're rich or poor in America, but the quality of [00:12:00] life you provide for that child can. Vary with your income level um, Katie Marinello: sense. The amount of money you make is probably gonna stay pretty, not flat, but like within the Claire Fisher: right. Katie Marinello: so you're gonna be splitting it between more Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. But so, you know, wealthier families get the as as happens in this movie. The prenatal Japanese lessons and the, intensive piano instruction and the yuppie flashcards, which mom and dad did have flashcards, but fortunately not as their only method of providing us with instruction. Katie Marinello: Yeah, exactly Claire Fisher: In the 1980s the birth rate had fallen, but the level of intensity expected of engagement with a child and money spent on a child was rising. Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: factors we still see today, right. You know, people say, I would have a kid if I could treat them the way parents treated their kids in the seventies. Katie Marinello: Right, Right. Claire Fisher: did not have to be attached to them at all hours of the day and night. Right. Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: [00:13:00] What the extent to which. Katie Marinello: the, the lights turn Claire Fisher: Right. Yeah. Katie Marinello: lights turn on. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: didn't work for us 'cause we had none. Claire Fisher: Well, my mom had a big old bell. She would ring if she needed us. I, Katie Marinello: Yes. But you and I were not really a go out till the street lights. Turn on type of child. We were more of a read until they yell at us to turn the lights out. Claire Fisher: we did sometimes go out until we heard the dinner bell ring, though. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: I told someone that recently, and they asked me if I was a cow. Katie Marinello: Well it was really our next door neighbor though, who rang that bell every single night to let to call her children in. It didn't happen to us that often. Claire Fisher: Okay. We digress. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: This movie came out of the idea that people weren't having children. Or at least not as many or as early. And some people were just not happy with that. And so these three women represent people who were told, oh, put your career first. Or, oh, wait until you're financially stable. Now [00:14:00] they're implied to be in their they're implied to be older than they actually are. They don't look like they're in their late thirties, but it's implied that they are. And it's well, now do we do it or not now or never. Right. Katie Marinello: I was thinking about this. So Carrie would be what, is she even 30 at this point? Claire Fisher: 32, I believe. Katie Marinello: 32, yeah. Okay. So that's around the time that all of my Facebook ads turned into either freeze your eggs or give them away. I hated that and I eventually told Facebook never show me this again. Yeah, I mean, 32 is not old. It's certainly not beyond the realm of possibility for fertility, but it is when I think the pressure starts to heat up. Claire Fisher: Right, because. Katie Marinello: makes some sense. Claire Fisher: It doesn't get easier to have and raise a child when you get to be 40. Right? Katie Marinello: No, it doesn't get easier. But also there's this societal, like women over 30 year expired. That's why I had a funeral for my 30th birthday. Claire Fisher: And what a lovely funeral it was too. Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: I gave an excellent eulogy. Katie Marinello: [00:15:00] Such a good Claire Fisher: Okay. Katie Marinello: Anyway, Claire Fisher: Anyway, so the movie Katie Marinello: yes, the movie. Claire Fisher: already described the major plot points in your summary. 'cause as we've noted, this was a one hour TV special. It wasn't like a huge long movie. Katie Marinello: They didn't waste a lot of time on details. Claire Fisher: To some humorous effect, I think. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: So, shall we go over who else is in it besides Carrie? Katie Marinello: Sure. Do you wanna do that all at once or do you wanna go through the. plot a little Claire Fisher: We can go through the plot a little bit. Yeah. The plot, such as it is. So, Carrie Fisher's character is the voiceover narrator, and it starts with her doing a voiceover as she's in an ambulance in labor and making business calls from the car phone. Katie Marinello: Yes, Claire Fisher: then, her voiceover narrator saying, I never thought this could happen to me. I'm the CEO of a corporation. Katie Marinello: yes, and then we kind of flashback to, it say nine months Claire Fisher: It doesn't say that, but you know, it is 'cause it's nine months [00:16:00] earlier and she's suddenly having these feelings. Katie Marinello: She's on her way to a meeting about a merger. So they say though, once they get there, it seems to be a meeting about marketing eggs. She sees a photo of baby on, someone's on like the receptionist desk and can't stop looking at it. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: Gets to the meeting, they're talking about eggs. She picks up the fake egg that they're using as a model and starts cuddling it and then starts cuddling at bald man's head. Claire Fisher: And then she says, I'm finally ready to have my baby. Right. Katie Marinello: Yes. So then we never see her at work again. Claire Fisher: No, she's, she's making calls while she's in labor later, right? Katie Marinello: see her at Claire Fisher: Oh, yeah. At work. Yeah. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Because after that, it's all about, wandering the streets until she ends up at the baby Claire Fisher: Yeah, so she's wandering through the streets as baby rabbles and baby dolls fly past her head and then finds herself at the maternity mission. And a woman is preaching Preacher: You all know why you're here? Yeah. [00:17:00] It's that urge. It comes barreling down like a locomotive, and it hits you like a hammer over your head. You want it and you don't want it, but mainly you are on it. What do you want a baby? Hallelujah. You are here because of your need. That's your God-given urge. You are here to face your God-given needs as a woman and face them proudly. Yes, yes. Yes. Oh. Oh. You can keep your careers. Yes, you can keep your Porsche. Yes. You can keep your fellow wardrobe. Yes, and you can have the baby. Claire Fisher: Then she says you can keep your career so you can keep your Porsche and you can have a baby. Katie Marinello: Right. [00:18:00] So it's that women can have it all Claire Fisher: Yes. So this was the very beginning of have it all discourse, she calls up testimony from Judy, who is played by Katie Marinello: Arlene Sorkin, who's known for portraying Calliope Jones on the NBC daytime serial Days of our lives, and for serving as the real life inspiration and voice for the DC Comics character Harley Quinn on Batman, the animated series. She wrote on such programs as the Tiny Tune Adventures, and she was also married to Christopher Lloyd, the producer of Frazier, not the actor. she died in 2023. Of complications of MS. Claire Fisher: Oh, sorry to hear that. Katie Marinello: Judy gets up, she says she's having trouble getting her husband to have sex with her. Now that she wants a When she didn't want a baby, he wanted to have sex all the time. Claire Fisher: so in other words, when she was on the pill and there was absolutely no risk to him, it was all about it. Right? Katie Marinello: Right. Now he's very worried about, the [00:19:00] financial burden of having kids. Things you should talk about before you get married. Claire Fisher: Well, as we mentioned, the financial burden of having kids seems to be the inverse of how many kids you actually have. When you have five kids, you don't even worry about it. Katie Marinello: right, Claire Fisher: like, oh, another one. Katie Marinello: for it. Yep. Claire Fisher: Okay. They can wear the hand me down split dessert with their older sister. Okay. Katie Marinello: Right, right. Yep. Split a beer five Claire Fisher: Yeah. So the next person who comes up to testify is Caroline. Katie Marinello: Who is played by Lauren Hutton moved to New York in her early adulthood to begin a modeling career. And she was actually dismissed by agents at first 'cause she had a gap in her teeth, which eventually became her signature. but she signed a modeling contract with. Revlon in 1973, which at the time was the biggest contract in the history of the modeling industry. So fight the power down with big orthodontics. She made her film debut in the sports drama Paper Lion in 1968 opposite Alan Alda. She played essential roles in the gambler and American [00:20:00] Gigolo, and later appeared on the television in the net. Later appeared on television in the network series, Paper Dolls, Falcon Crest, central West, and Nip Tuck. She continued to model into her. Seventies appearing in numerous advertising campaigns for H and M Lord and Taylor and Alexander Wang, and performed the runway for Tom's Ford Spring 2012 collection, as well as the 2016 New York Fashion Week. So that's awesome. Fight the power. She's still thriving in her later years. Claire Fisher: Was she the oldest of these three actresses at the time then? Because it sounds like if she'd been active since the sixties. Katie Marinello: She's 81 now, so 1943. So she's a good decade. 15 years Claire Fisher: So she was 43 when she made this movie. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: so she's, then it makes sense a little bit that she says, you know. Katie Marinello: 48 hours left on her return. So I actually did, I, I enjoyed a little bit the scene where she. Discovers that she [00:21:00] needs to have a baby, right? Would you please stop the metronome, Ms. How come we don't have any children? Well, I guess I just haven't found the right man to have children with yet. Besides, I'm married to my music. Can you please stop the metronome. No, but I did Ms. Jarvis. It's you, Ms. Jarvis. It's you! you're ticking Katie Marinello: So she's, she's a piano teacher. She's sitting at the piano with a student. There's a metronome going, right, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. And then her student says, why don't you have any kids? And she's well, I guess I'm married to my music. And then she says, turn, turn off the metronome. And the ticking continues. And she says, turn off the metro. And he's I did. It's you ticking. Claire Fisher: It's you, Ms. Jarvis, you are ticking. Katie Marinello: I don't like it, and yet I do. Claire Fisher: So by the time they get out of the maternity mission, Caroline, [00:22:00] Veronica and Judy sit down for tea. And Caroline says, I have 32 and a half hours to develop a meaningful relationship and, and conceive a baby Mozart. Katie Marinello: Okay. I just, to me, this is both a commentary on. I mean, obviously it's supposed to be satirical, right? That's not actually how biological clocks work. You don't actually have a an hour, but also kinda speaks, 'cause she says her doctor told her she has 48 hours. So to me, I'm like, well that just shows how little we actually know about women's Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: And I, I know that many a fertility doctor or many of OB GYN has said similar things with as much dubiousness as Claire Fisher: Yeah. Veronica says, we're not gonna leave this room until we figured out a way to get pregnant. And Katie Marinello: Which again, doesn't seem extremely useful. If you only need 32 hours left, maybe spend less time in the room with these other women. Much as I appreciate female friendships and you know, women [00:23:00] relationships everywhere, you're not gonna get pregnant in that room, so she just should. Claire Fisher: It was just to set up that it goes, they tap their chins as they're thinking, and it goes Katie Marinello: Yes. Yes. So she decides she's going to throw a salon, right? Throw a party for male pianists. Claire Fisher: No she doesn't throw it. Katie Marinello: Oh, she just goes to it. Oh, I thought she was hosting it. Okay. Claire Fisher: No, it's, this is, you see her invitation, it's the Society of Male pianists is having a Katie Marinello: Okay. So she goes to a cocktail party for the Society of Male pianists, which is Claire Fisher: they're going for the Katie Marinello: yes, obviously. And as soon as she gets there, she immediately starts chugging champagne. I knew exactly what was gonna happen as soon as she picked up the first glass of champagne. Did you? Claire Fisher: Yeah, I kind of saw it coming. 'cause she walks in and it's mostly Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: So she starts drinking Katie Marinello: Or Claire Fisher: and she Katie Marinello: like rec or they are with, there with their wives or they're gay,[00:24:00] Claire Fisher: yeah. One holy stereotyping, this guy says one Katie Marinello: and she's oh, I'm out. Claire Fisher: And walks out. But anyway, passes out And she is awakened. By a valet who's saying the party's over and we would like to go home, miss Katie Marinello: And the Claire Fisher: and he is played by. Katie Marinello: That's Marco, right? Yeah, Paul Reisner who is a former standup comedian before having his breakout film role in 1982 when he appeared in Diner. He was then in Beverly Hills Cop and Beverly Hills Cop two. All of those were before this movie, I believe. And then in the same year that this came out, he would become. More famous for Aliens. The second alien movie. I, of course recognized him from Mad About You, which is one of the shows that I've seen lots of clips of, but wasn't actually allowed to watch as a child. But as you know, I will always have a thing for Helen Hunt, especially in a tank top. Anyway Reisner's role in Mad About You earned nominations for an Emmy, a Golden Globe, and an American Comedy Award, and a Screen Actor's Guild Award. He's written three books, [00:25:00] couplehood, babyhood, and Familyhood. And Couplehood is unique in that it starts on page 1 45. He explained this is his method of giving the reader a false sense of accomplishment. He also coined the term olive theory. Have you heard of this? Claire Fisher: No. Katie Marinello: the olive theory of relationships is that any two individuals who are compatible either romantically or platonically. You know, they're compatible when one of them pretends not to like olives and gives their olives to the other person so that they can enjoy more olives. Yeah, Claire Fisher: okay. Katie Marinello: I would argue like I don't particularly like olives, so I would also be compatible with somebody who liked olives. But anyway, that is his term and has its own Wikipedia page, so I thought that was interesting. Claire Fisher: I mean, for olives, put in anything Katie Marinello: Obviously. Claire Fisher: what my husband's going to a Star Trek convention Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: uh, Even though he doesn't even want to meet anybody who's Katie Marinello: right. Yes. Claire Fisher: He does eat my tomatoes [00:26:00] though. Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: Although he recently called me a picky eater and I don't know what he's Katie Marinello: You're not a picky eater. Claire Fisher: I declined his mother's offer of pickled beets. Katie Marinello: Oh, you shouldn't have. They're very good. Claire Fisher: I don't like beets. So sue me Katie Marinello: Anyway. So she is passed out on the couch. She's woken up by Paula Eisner, and she is, he says, I wanna go home. Claire Fisher: wants to go home, Katie Marinello: He says it like Numerous times. Claire Fisher: so she jumps into his arms and says, yeah, let's go home. Katie Marinello: Yep. And so that's how baby number one is conceived? Claire Fisher: Meanwhile, Veronica has gone to Le Stork Club, artificial Insemination, which she's imagining. It's a Katie Marinello: Yep. Claire Fisher: She sells the Maer Katie Marinello: Or I don't know if she's imagining it. It is a restaurant in this movie. Claire Fisher: A waiter comes in with the menu tells her about the specials, and she says, I'll just have number 12 with a glass of red. And he puts up the donor's photo, she [00:27:00] raises her glass to it. Tears looking at you And the doctor comes in to inseminate her while the waiter is playing the violin with a Katie Marinello: Yes. I thought that was funny Claire Fisher: modesty. Katie Marinello: modesty. And they also have this like really nice sheer curtain around each table so that it looks like a doctor's. Curtain Hospital Curtain. Claire Fisher: And that's baby number two's Katie Marinello: Yep. Claire Fisher: Is this a good time to bring up the anecdote that Carrie Fisher told about in real life? Debbie Reynolds suggested that she should have an artificially ins intimidated baby with her stepfather. Katie Marinello: Oh my God, I forgot about that. Yes. Tell that. Claire Fisher: Okay. if anyone wants to hear this told in a much more funny style, since obviously I'm not a professional go look up Wishful Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: the one woman show that Carrie Katie Marinello: Yes, watch it repeatedly because it's gonna be a while before we get to it, but it is fabulous. Claire Fisher: when debbie Reynolds was at a point where she was too old to have children, but she felt it was sad that her current husband hadn't had any of his own. So when she heard about [00:28:00] artificial insemination, which as we've covered was sort of new at this point, she said Carrie, maybe you should have a baby with so and so by artificial insemination so that he can have one of his own. And in wishful drinking, Carrie says, in my mother's defense, it turns out she thought they inseminated you with a shot. If she had known there was anything southerly involved, she probably wouldn't have brought it up. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Okay. Claire Fisher: So meanwhile, Judy Katie Marinello: Judy. Claire Fisher: has to get her husband on Katie Marinello: Yes. So her husband is obsessed as all straight men are with the stock market. Claire Fisher: When she comes in to try to seduce him, he says, not tonight, Judy. It's the weekend Wall Street summary. Katie Marinello: Yeah. And so she hooks up a telephone, Claire Fisher: She hacks his Katie Marinello: right? Claire Fisher: Like in the Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Incident of infamy, What? Claire Fisher: and [00:29:00] the max headroom incident where like hackers just took over a TV station in Katie Marinello: yeah. Okay. Claire Fisher: For a Okay. She hacks the TV feed and makes a fake announcement, breaking news. The IRS is gonna offer more tax breaks for Katie Marinello: Right. And he is, they're sleeping in 50 style, like separate twin beds. So he like comes over to her bed once he hears that. Claire Fisher: tie. Katie Marinello: Yes. And that's how baby number three is conceived. And then Claire Fisher: Cue the Katie Marinello: Yep. We catch the waves. Exactly. Claire Fisher: I did think that was interesting because, now today they are talking about, cash incentives for people to have more Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: except they're offering like $5,000. And I'm like excuse me, surrogates get $10,000. Katie Marinello: $5,000 doesn't even cover the cost of having a baby in a hospital. Claire Fisher: Yeah. So first of all, we wanna talk about like free maternity Mm-hmm. And with postnatal and yeah, obviously prenatal and postnatal. So we want free maternity care and you know, [00:30:00] free Katie Marinello: daycare Claire Fisher: And you pay me $10,000 and then Katie Marinello: we talk Claire Fisher: Right? Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: Alternatively, we Katie Marinello: it. Claire Fisher: alternatively, we wait until I'm bored enough and then I have a baby, right? You know, some night when there's nothing good on tv Katie Marinello: Okay. Any who, Claire Fisher: and you, so Judy wakes up at the valet's house and she has to double check what his Katie Marinello: right, because she's on the phone with her mother. Claire Fisher: she's on the phone with her mother saying she's gonna marry this guy. She met, and he's still asleep, but he's asleep with a valet parking manual on his face, which is very cute his only personality is that he Katie Marinello: That he is a valet. Yes. And that comes into play later when she goes into labor. Claire Fisher: Yeah. So then they have a gestation ahoy sequence, which is, like I said, a reference to another movie, the Why We Fight serials from the Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: Yeah, they're all like Katie Marinello: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Claire Fisher: Tough. And then they go to the prenatal exercise class with Richard Simmons. Would you like to summarize a little bit about how awkward that is? Katie Marinello: Yes. So [00:31:00] Richard Simmons for those of you who are like Claire, not familiar, he's actually really hard to summarize because I just feel like he was everywhere for so long. He was a fitness personality. He was obsessed with weight loss. Unfortunately , having grown up as a chubby kid, he made frequent appearances on talk shows, cameos and just about everything. He formed really personal relationships with a lot of his students 'cause he also had, a series of studios. It appears that he eventually emotionally burned out and then retired in 2014. And. Basically was absent from public life for the last decade of his life, which is probably fine, but caused a huge hubbub and led to the podcast Missing Richard Simmons, which is kind of where I became familiar with his life. And then that then led to a big conversation about what we really are owed by celebrities and is it okay for them to just decide they don't wanna see anybody anymore? But at this point he is. Best known for his Sweatin' with Simmons kind of [00:32:00] workout videos. And so this scene is a parody of that. They're doing I guess Pilates or some sort of eighties style exercise for maternity. And then he goes into this. Really weird thing about how the baby is like a fish and they bring out a fish and then they season the fish water. Explain Claire Fisher: I Katie Marinello: Was this another reference I didn't understand? Claire Fisher: if it was, I missed it. He says, the fish tank is a uterus and the fish is a baby, and we're gonna get it out of there in a natural, non-traumatic Katie Marinello: And. You give it the right food and exercise, you can have a painless birth. Which, and then he has them like recite the steps to birthing and Claire Fisher: while doing a ballet Katie Marinello: And then practice saying no to, to pain medicine. [00:33:00] And all the whole time I'm thinking, you know, a big part of Missing Richard Simmons and all of. Stuff around him is, he never actually came out of the closet, so we don't know for sure, but like that was always the kinda wink, wink, no nod behind his persona. So Claire Fisher: Oh Katie Marinello: it's an interesting yeah, the birthing coach has never seen a vagina, I think is the implication here. Claire Fisher: yeah. I know you make fun of. We have compared notes many times. The fact that I went to a Catholic high school and therefore had a Christian sexuality class instead of a health class to explain Katie Marinello: That seemed to be better than my public school sex ed in the world of George W. Bush. Yes. Claire Fisher: yeah. One thing that I have remembered from that class for nearly 20 years now is Mrs. Kamenitzer a mother of five and grandmother to six at the time saying. If you have a male ob GYN and you might, and you ask him how much something's going to [00:34:00] hurt, his first words had better be well, I don't know, but my patients Katie Marinello: right, right, right, right, right. Claire Fisher: um, And I have kept that in mind. I've had, as a wide variety of medical providers, some of which I didn't get to choose 'cause I met them in an Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: And you know, that's, I often gauge their answer to that question Katie Marinello: Yeah. That's fair. That's fair. Yep. Claire Fisher: them. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: So now they go into, the voiceover says everybody had advice for Katie Marinello: Oh, yes. Claire Fisher: heads float through shouting contradictory advice. Don't breastfeed, definitely Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: Don't do this, do that. And I mean, I think we can all sing a verse of that because even though we're not parents, we have been witness to how much terrible advice is out Katie Marinello: Even Claire Fisher: how Katie Marinello: because we don't have kids and we're in our thirties, I mean, the advice that's thrown our way too. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: Again, it wa it's not just Meta that has told me that I should freeze my eggs. Claire Fisher: I used to keep a list of [00:35:00] random people who had asked me when I was going to have a baby, but I ran out of mental space to store it. The day that a casual acquaintance of our late grandma got my phone number off my mother's Christmas newsletter and called me to ask what I was Katie Marinello: That was so weird. Claire Fisher: her Katie Marinello: That was so weird. Claire Fisher: It was Katie Marinello: Yeah. Yeah. Claire Fisher: Yeah. I mean, I make a point of telling all my friends who are parents I'm sure you're Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: I know you get bombarded with advice. Keep in mind there are very few things you can do that will actually permanently screw things up. You know? Katie Marinello: I usually add a, the thing that they're gonna talk to the therapist about is not even gonna be anything that is on your radar. Claire Fisher: right. Yeah. We put so much pressure on individuals Katie Marinello: Absolutely. Claire Fisher: none on systems Very Katie Marinello: of the time most of the time, and obviously there are terrible exceptions, but most of the time everything is fine whether you choose to Claire Fisher: who are doing their Katie Marinello: Whether you have a glass of wine [00:36:00] or you know, tea that has caffeine in it, or you know, don't eat anything other than, you know, vegetables and protein for the whole time. Claire Fisher: And the whole, the one that like stuck out to me was people saying you breastfeeding's the only way to bond with your baby. No, don't bother breastfeeding. It'll ruin your figure. It's I mean, I know personally two people who just could not Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: It's so then what? So then they bottle fed and it was no big deal. And their kids grew up to be, normal, Katie Marinello: Yeah. I had one friend who literally didn't produce milk and she found out that her mother and grandmother also didn't produce milk. So thank God for formula. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: None of those babies would've made it. So Claire Fisher: So anyway, if there's any mothers listening Katie Marinello: you're doing a great job. Claire Fisher: It's gonna be Katie Marinello: Hi Kitty. Hi Alicia. Claire Fisher: Yeah. As dad sometimes says, crack addicts sometimes have healthy children. You have just as Katie Marinello: I mean, there's a multi-season show called I Didn't Know I Was Pregnant, and those shows, those episodes always [00:37:00] end with, and then the baby was fine. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: So anyway Claire Fisher: Anyway, Katie Marinello: of advice and then they skip straight to birthing day. Claire Fisher: Yeah, Carolyn goes into labor and Marco has stored their car keys on the valet rack and Katie Marinello: Can't find them. Claire Fisher: to drive her to But then when he gets, whether he is coaching her, he says straight Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Which is very funny. He is doing the, yep. Little bit more. A little bit more. Claire Fisher: Which I thought was hilarious. 'cause you know, they give him no characterization outside of being a valet except that apparently he sticks with Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: And Katie Marinello: does marry her, which I think is interesting. Claire Fisher: and he is right there with Then Judy meanwhile gets the exorcist reference. Obligatory Katie Marinello: She becomes a demon. Demanding painkillers and her husband's so helpful. Jack, I can't I imagine Jack will be just such an engaged and helpful father. He's no, you didn't want any. She's [00:38:00] give me the drugs, which I've always said that if I give birth, I want cocaine. Claire Fisher: How would cocaine help Katie Marinello: Heroin. There's some, there are some countries in which you can have heroin during And I want that, Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: maybe cocaine, just to make it more interesting. I've heard there's a lot of hurry up and wait around labor. Claire Fisher: I don't think cocaine makes that go any faster though. Katie Marinello: And then Carrie, as you said, is she is taking work calls in the ambulance, and as she is pushing, she's also saying, sell. Sell. Claire Fisher: And when the doctor says it's a girl, the, her, the assistant says it's a Katie Marinello: Yep. Claire Fisher: So now we get a title card six months later, and Marco: Okay. Back it in. Back it in. Please swing it around. Swing your end around please. Ho Sw. Perfect. Hold that. Okay. Watch the [00:39:00] birdie and, okay. And smile. Claire Fisher: Marco, the valet is saying, all right, a little to the left. A little to the right. Okay. Okay. And then you find out he's lining up a photo Three Katie Marinello: five of them. Yeah. With the five of them, with their babies yeah. Claire Fisher: And Veronica says The maternal urge was replaced by our three beautiful babies, Veronica: And so we had done it together. The maternal urge was replaced by our three adorable babies completing our journey from here to maternity. Claire Fisher: And then it ends with the future of each baby being predicted with Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Oh, we skipped, we almost, we forgot to mention Veronica was teaching her kid prenatal Japanese, putting Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: Her tummy and playing the language tapes. So the baby Veronica Tessich the second says, thank you for watching in Katie Marinello: Yes, yes, Claire Fisher: Card tells us, [00:40:00] she'll be the first female Katie Marinello: yes. Yeah. A couple questions. So I just kind of thought that after they gave birth, there might be any conflict or adjustment period whatsoever, but it's just six months later, everything's fine. Everything's fine. And now the movie's over. Claire Fisher: You know, if you survive the first six months. Katie Marinello: Yes, but I wanna I guess I didn't really wanna see what the first six months were like because maybe they'd run outta movies to reference, but Claire Fisher: Hardly. Three Men and a Baby came out the same Katie Marinello: yeah. Claire Fisher: had seen it If it had come out a year later, there would've been a Three Men and a Baby reference. I Katie Marinello: Probably, yeah. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: I feel like most media since Three Men, Men, a Baby, has just been Three Men and a Baby. Claire Fisher: Most media. Katie Marinello: Well, a full house on Fuller house. Claire Fisher: Oh, okay. Katie Marinello: I heard a Fuller House reference on a podcast about Gaza. The other time I was like, see, that I did not see coming. Claire Fisher: When time to be Katie Marinello: [00:41:00] Right. Claire Fisher: Uh, So that is from here to maternity. It's kind of could come across as a little bit of like pro-birth propaganda Katie Marinello: I wrote there's some serious natalist overtones here. I will say that the church that she wanders into is very ethnically diverse, so at least it's not like just about having white babies, though all three main characters are white. I wasn't sure what Paul Reisner's character was, but I think he's supposed to be Italian. Claire Fisher: Yeah. She says to her mother on the phone that Katie Marinello: Right. Yeah. I wasn't sure at first if he would. Yeah. So it's still about having white babies ultimately Claire Fisher: Now the thing is that the world must be peopled. people having Katie Marinello: Sure. Claire Fisher: like important to the future of the human race. But yeah, I mean in 2025, if you made this movie, it would be very problematic because right now a lot of people who are like, have more [00:42:00] babies, what they actually mean is you know, stop asking for And get Katie Marinello: Get back in the kitchen. Claire Fisher: and you know, Katie Marinello: Repeal. The 19th Amendment. By the way, we are recording this on the hundred and fifth anniversary of the 19th Amendment and people are trying to repeal it. Yay. Um, Claire Fisher: Should women need to vote? Katie Marinello: yes. Claire Fisher: can Katie Marinello: One vote per household is an actual proposal that has been put forth. Claire Fisher: That's how they do it In Bahrain. I don't know what anybody's complaining about. Katie Marinello: and obviously you got the Elon Musk of the world and the Nick Cannons of the world. Claire Fisher: many babies as possible, but don't actually provide, take care of any Katie Marinello: Yeah. Elon Musk is fascinating to me because he has 14 children and I'm truly believe he's never had sex. Doesn't he give off big incel energy? Claire Fisher: I do not presume to comment on the connection between people's sex lives and their level of creepiness, but um, Katie Marinello: Well, his daughter has come out and said that all of [00:43:00] her siblings, at least with his first wife, were sex selective IVF. Claire Fisher: That certainly explains why he keeps having boys. Katie Marinello: he's so mad about his daughter. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to dwell too much on the thought of Elon Musk without his clothes on, Katie Marinello: Ah, Claire Fisher: let's just move all right. Past that. Katie Marinello: I hadn't gotten that far. Thank you. Claire Fisher: So let's just step past that Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: uh, Say that I did think this movie was funny. It didn't really. Develop a Katie Marinello: No. Claire Fisher: I mean, it was 48 minutes long, but I thought it was funny. And certainly Veronica is a go-getter have it aller goes what she wants, A hut slayer in shorts. You know, for Katie Marinello: I guess Claire Fisher: a step Katie Marinello: For Carrie, yes. It was for a character played by Carrie, she had a lot of agency, even though. Somehow it still felt like a whole lot of things were just happening to her, but I did that they didn't make her find a man, right? Like she was allowed to be a single mother. I [00:44:00] thought it was interesting that they still had Caroline get married because obviously they're okay with single motherhood in this movie and but, or just like co-parenting, you know, but she specifically says they're gonna get married. They don't actually show if they do or not, but. Claire Fisher: I mean, they're Katie Marinello: They're still together. Yeah. Exactly. Claire Fisher: car. Katie Marinello: Co-parenting. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. So are you giving this a five? Claire Fisher: I think Veronica gets five hutt slayers Katie Marinello: Wow. Yeah. I think she might in a very short period of time. Claire Fisher: I mean, what we see is her knowing what she wants. She wants to keep the job, keep the Porsche, and have the Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And she does those Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Right. Uh, That some people will choose that route to Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: We are now, since we're on the other side of it, [00:45:00] we now are seeing like, the grandkids of these women in the eighties who went to sperm banks Katie Marinello: though I am curious because you and I both know people who have done. Single parent by choice insemination in the last like decade or so. I'm curious if that is more common now than it was in the eighties. Claire Fisher: Almost certainly because it's just more Widely Katie Marinello: More affordable and yeah. Claire Fisher: Yeah. and I mean this was made before, the whole idea of IVF was really mainstream. Katie Marinello: This would've been artificial insemination per IUI. Claire Fisher: Yeah, IUI and like then within 10 years, the whole, test tube baby Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: happen as well, and, then it would become possible to a lot of people having children who would not Katie Marinello: She's a, she's on TikTok by the way. She talks about being the first test tube baby in, in the United States. I think she is like our age. She's not that old. Claire Fisher: No. When I was in school, [00:46:00] people would tell you, oh, I was a test tube baby. That was news. And I feel like that's not really a thing anymore. Katie Marinello: Also, she likes to point out it was a Petri dish. There's no test tubes involved. Claire Fisher: They also they don't grow you in the test Katie Marinello: No. How would you would break it immediately. Okay. Claire Fisher: Exactly. You know, this robot that they're trying to invent how far along in the r and d is it Katie Marinello: Here's what I wanna know. Every time I read a Reddit post, when are we gonna figure out how to let two women have a baby? Because these cannot be the men of which we are supposed to procreate with. Claire Fisher: hey, my Katie Marinello: Present company, excepted. He's not here. Claire Fisher: Well Then he can't be present Katie Marinello: Well, I'm just saying is anybody working on this? And if not, I will fund it with my $28 an hour. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Or you should do the reverse passport, bro. You should go abroad in [00:47:00] search of a better class of man. Katie Marinello: No thanks. I'm good. Claire Fisher: Recently met a very lovely couple from the Netherlands who were honeymooning at a campground in upstate New York for God only Katie Marinello: Which is called spectator or Speculator. Claire Fisher: Speculator New York, population 406. There was a booth at the craft fair this year where someone was selling like baby outfits made out of old dish towels. I thought Katie Marinello: Oh, that's cute. Yeah. Claire Fisher: upcycling, Katie Marinello: cute. Love it. Did you get one? Claire Fisher: No, I don't have any Katie Marinello: There are children in our life. Claire Fisher: None that I am comfortable saying Hey, do you wanna wear a dish towel? Katie Marinello: It feels very house elf doesn't it? Claire Fisher: Yeah, exactly. But it could be cute and clever and upcycle in these tariff heavily tariffed times. Katie Marinello: Yes. Upcycling iss about to become our new go-to. Use it up, [00:48:00] wear it out, make it do or do without. Claire Fisher: without. I was gonna ask if you wanted to sing that song. Katie Marinello: Oh, sorry I didn't ask for consent. Claire Fisher: For the people listening who aren't direct relatives of ours that was a song in the school play that our mother directed for us when Katie was in fifth grade, and I was in Katie Marinello: Nine 2000. Yep. Spring 2000. Claire Fisher: 2000, and it was all about how to win World War ii. You have to use it up, wear it up, make it do or do without, Katie Marinello: Keep those victory gardens growing, keep those war bonds flowing. Claire Fisher: And to this day when I am insisting on mending a pillowcase that Katie would like to throw out, we sing that Katie Marinello: I just, yeah. Okay. I believe this podcast is over. Claire Fisher: Yes. Next up we are supposed to be watching a TV movie called Liberty, but I haven't been able to find it. Katie Marinello: Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Claire Fisher: Not that one. I, as far as I could tell, just not out on [00:49:00] DVD. I have not found it on YouTube. Katie Marinello: All right. I will do a preliminary search and if we can't do that one, what would be after that? Claire Fisher: the novel Postcards from Katie Marinello: Oh, shoot. Which you have recently read. I have not recently read, so I need to locate my copy, which I'm pretty sure I own one and get on that. Claire Fisher: Okay, then we have our assignments and until then, just remember if my life weren't Katie Marinello: It would just be true. Claire Fisher: and that's unacceptable. Katie Marinello: Thanks for listening to another episode of Carried Far, far Away. This podcast is hosted, produced, edited re-edited obsessed over and loved by Katie Marinello and Claire Fisher. You can follow the show on Facebook and Instagram at carriedawaypod You can email us at awaycarriedpod@gmail.com You can follow Claire deadfictionalgirlfriends and Katie katiedaway We are proud to be part of the 12 & 24 network. You can join fans and creators from the Network on Discord by clicking the link in the show notes. All clips used in this podcast are done so under the protection of fair use. Have a wonderful week, and may the force be with you. And [00:50:00] now our space, grandma wisdom of the week. Claire Fisher: Resentment is drinking poison waiting for the other person to die.