WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:08.040 Welcome to the Hot Dish, comfort food for rural America. I'm Heidi 2 00:00:08.040 --> 00:00:11.560 Heitkamp and Joel is AWOL. Not sure what he's doing. 3 00:00:11.560 --> 00:00:15.240 Maybe planting his pumpkin patch, maybe sitting out there with a lawn 4 00:00:15.240 --> 00:00:19.080 chair and a beer, watching it grow. I have no idea. But 5 00:00:19.080 --> 00:00:22.320 I'm on my own this week. We're joined today 6 00:00:22.720 --> 00:00:26.480 by some amazing guests for an episode analyzing anything that's going 7 00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:29.780 on in the world of rural. Later, I'll be speaking with the 8 00:00:29.780 --> 00:00:32.860 amazing Jess Piper about breaking Republican 9 00:00:32.860 --> 00:00:36.300 supermajorities in red states like Missouri and North Dakota. 10 00:00:36.620 --> 00:00:40.140 You'll also hear a fantastic conversation between our 11 00:00:40.140 --> 00:00:43.780 producer Richard Fawal and the independent journalist Bryce 12 00:00:43.780 --> 00:00:47.420 Oates, who writes for Barn Raiser and on Substack 13 00:00:47.420 --> 00:00:51.020 about rural America's desire for information and where we can 14 00:00:51.020 --> 00:00:54.780 all find hope. But first, let's listen to Isaac Nehring. 15 00:00:54.780 --> 00:00:58.120 He, he is a promising young man who is the 2025 16 00:00:58.120 --> 00:01:01.840 Montana recipient of the Truman Scholarship. I 17 00:01:01.840 --> 00:01:05.400 am well familiar with that program, having given many 18 00:01:05.400 --> 00:01:09.120 speeches and being inspired by all these young people who 19 00:01:09.120 --> 00:01:12.920 want to commit their life to public service. Isaac is using his 20 00:01:12.920 --> 00:01:16.280 scholarship to help rural communities in his home state of 21 00:01:16.280 --> 00:01:19.840 Montana and nationwide. Let's hear from him in his own 22 00:01:19.840 --> 00:01:20.320 words. 23 00:01:26.040 --> 00:01:29.080 I'm Isaac Nehring. I grew up in Helena, Montana 24 00:01:29.720 --> 00:01:33.560 and I'm now a student at Stanford University. I 25 00:01:33.720 --> 00:01:37.560 spent all the first 18 years of my life in Helena and 26 00:01:37.960 --> 00:01:41.560 grew up in sort of the western Montana area, spending a lot of time 27 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:45.720 outside and doing various activities with my family. 28 00:01:46.280 --> 00:01:50.080 I think what led me to Stanford from there was, you 29 00:01:50.080 --> 00:01:53.120 know, I was lucky to get in, and then I really wanted to stay in 30 00:01:53.120 --> 00:01:56.960 the West and be able to focus on issues in this part of the 31 00:01:56.960 --> 00:02:00.660 country. And so, so that's how I ended up down in California. I worked for 32 00:02:00.660 --> 00:02:04.500 Senator Tester Winter to Spring of my sophomore year of college and I 33 00:02:04.500 --> 00:02:08.260 got a great view of his view of advocating for 34 00:02:08.260 --> 00:02:11.780 rural issues and advocating for Montana. And that 35 00:02:11.860 --> 00:02:15.620 small town connection to all the work the Senator was doing was 36 00:02:15.620 --> 00:02:18.660 really cool and important to me being in his office. 37 00:02:19.460 --> 00:02:23.100 So he was a really great advocate for Montana and rural issues 38 00:02:23.100 --> 00:02:26.670 at large in this country. And I think losing him is really significant 39 00:02:26.750 --> 00:02:29.390 and really challenging for those of us who 40 00:02:29.790 --> 00:02:33.550 appreciated a moderating voice and a laser focused 41 00:02:33.550 --> 00:02:37.150 voice on local issues, not the nationalization stuff we see now. 42 00:02:37.710 --> 00:02:41.310 And so some of the big controversies from 43 00:02:41.310 --> 00:02:44.950 my political view out of D.C. right now are these efforts to sell 44 00:02:44.950 --> 00:02:48.670 off public lands, these efforts to turn, I think, too 45 00:02:48.990 --> 00:02:52.740 much of our public land into, you know, places for drilling 46 00:02:52.740 --> 00:02:56.540 and, and extracting, as opposed to other values like recreation 47 00:02:56.540 --> 00:03:00.260 tourism, like agriculture, and, you know, just the 48 00:03:00.420 --> 00:03:04.260 softer values of what public lands give us. They feed our souls in a 49 00:03:04.260 --> 00:03:07.980 lot of places in rural America. I've come to advocate for 50 00:03:07.980 --> 00:03:11.580 rural conservation issues just by realizing 51 00:03:11.580 --> 00:03:15.260 how important the land is to me and how, how 52 00:03:15.260 --> 00:03:18.880 critical it has been in shaping who 53 00:03:18.880 --> 00:03:22.680 I am through just exposure to it, being outside, camping, hiking, 54 00:03:22.680 --> 00:03:26.480 fishing, skiing even, like all these things 55 00:03:26.480 --> 00:03:30.080 that rely on public lands in my experience. And 56 00:03:30.480 --> 00:03:34.080 I also, when I think of conservation, it is an inherently 57 00:03:34.080 --> 00:03:37.680 rural topic to me because the people who are close to 58 00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:41.360 the land, which in Western states is vastly owned by the 59 00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:44.990 federal government, are those who live in rural communities and, 60 00:03:45.220 --> 00:03:48.900 and farm or work for the agencies or just 61 00:03:49.220 --> 00:03:52.580 interact with the land. Rural development has been sort of a 62 00:03:52.580 --> 00:03:55.860 budding and recent passion of mine and it 63 00:03:56.260 --> 00:03:59.860 stems not from really focusing on it in my own 64 00:04:00.100 --> 00:04:03.620 professional experience, but having just observed it in 65 00:04:03.620 --> 00:04:07.380 communities that are really important to me, that I grew up in. 66 00:04:07.460 --> 00:04:11.140 I think my main foray into rural development per 67 00:04:11.140 --> 00:04:14.780 se is trying to lead where I'm at here at Stanford 68 00:04:14.780 --> 00:04:17.940 and advocate for awareness on that issue, 69 00:04:18.420 --> 00:04:22.060 for the most part, because Stanford itself, it's about 3% 70 00:04:22.060 --> 00:04:25.900 rural students, which is quite low. The country's, I 71 00:04:25.900 --> 00:04:29.580 don't know, almost seven times that I'd say, and so not 72 00:04:29.580 --> 00:04:33.340 very well represented here. But I'm supposedly in this breeding 73 00:04:33.340 --> 00:04:36.940 ground for future world leaders and private and public and 74 00:04:36.940 --> 00:04:40.680 everything. And so it was really important to me pretty 75 00:04:40.680 --> 00:04:44.480 much the minute I got here and had this realization that there were not 76 00:04:44.480 --> 00:04:48.120 a lot of folks from states like mine, "flyover country," "heartland," whatever you 77 00:04:48.520 --> 00:04:52.320 want to call it. And so it's really been a mission 78 00:04:52.320 --> 00:04:55.840 of mine to make people care about it here at Stanford as 79 00:04:55.840 --> 00:04:59.320 students, when I feel like we're open-minded as college students 80 00:04:59.320 --> 00:05:02.840 and bring speakers to campus and other leaders 81 00:05:03.080 --> 00:05:06.820 who can really distill their passion and years 82 00:05:06.820 --> 00:05:10.500 of experience, which I don't have yet, to get people interested in 83 00:05:10.500 --> 00:05:14.220 investing in rural communities and visiting and just considering them 84 00:05:14.220 --> 00:05:17.700 politically. I was recently awarded the Truman scholarship 85 00:05:17.940 --> 00:05:21.619 and the 2025 Scholar for the State of Montana. And this 86 00:05:22.180 --> 00:05:26.020 is the living memorial to President Truman. He wanted 87 00:05:26.020 --> 00:05:29.660 to give the gift of education to future public service leaders, 88 00:05:29.660 --> 00:05:32.820 in his words. And so every year 89 00:05:33.300 --> 00:05:37.140 at least one scholar from every single 90 00:05:37.220 --> 00:05:40.900 state and a couple of the territories is awarded a $30,000 91 00:05:41.140 --> 00:05:44.820 grant for graduate education. And that's a 92 00:05:44.820 --> 00:05:47.459 big deal. But I think what's more awesome and 93 00:05:48.100 --> 00:05:51.940 important with this scholarship is the network of people 94 00:05:52.020 --> 00:05:55.580 in public service from all over the country that I might not already be 95 00:05:55.580 --> 00:05:58.910 crossing paths with. And so, I mean, it was 96 00:05:59.310 --> 00:06:03.070 drilled into our heads by the Foundation that once you're a Truman Scholar, you're 97 00:06:03.070 --> 00:06:06.670 always a Truman Scholar. And so there's this great 50 year long 98 00:06:06.670 --> 00:06:10.390 sort of network of folks who've received this award who can 99 00:06:10.390 --> 00:06:14.110 serve as mentors in all sorts of spaces, from things 100 00:06:14.110 --> 00:06:17.910 like ag and conservation that I'm interested in to a 101 00:06:17.910 --> 00:06:21.630 lot of folks in healthcare and public health, to 102 00:06:21.630 --> 00:06:25.360 folks in the legal profession, but all over. And so 103 00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:29.200 it's a big honor to get to represent Montana, especially to receive 104 00:06:29.440 --> 00:06:30.280 this award. 105 00:06:36.080 --> 00:06:39.640 We're so proud of Isaac and we wish him absolutely the best of 106 00:06:39.640 --> 00:06:43.440 luck and we will check in occasionally with how he's doing. 107 00:06:43.840 --> 00:06:47.480 Now here is Richard and Bryce Oates. Bryce is such an interesting 108 00:06:47.480 --> 00:06:51.230 guy. You're going to love this. I'm Richard Fawal. I'm a producer here at 109 00:06:51.230 --> 00:06:54.990 the Hot Dish. And today I am thrilled to be speaking with Bryce Oates 110 00:06:54.990 --> 00:06:58.710 who writes the Cocklebur on Substack. You can find that at 111 00:06:58.710 --> 00:07:02.470 thecocklebur.substack.com and by the way, be 112 00:07:02.470 --> 00:07:05.131 sure to check out the One Country Project on substack at 113 00:07:05.132 --> 00:07:08.550 onecountryproject.substack.com. Bryce is also a 114 00:07:08.550 --> 00:07:12.350 contributing editor at Barn Raiser, which is a twice weekly newsletter 115 00:07:12.350 --> 00:07:15.750 that delivers independent reporting from rural and small town 116 00:07:15.750 --> 00:07:19.510 America. Bryce, thank you for joining the Hot Dish. It's good 117 00:07:19.510 --> 00:07:22.630 to be here. It's good to be here. Let's start by telling people a little 118 00:07:22.630 --> 00:07:26.310 bit about who you are, where you come from. You cover all these 119 00:07:26.310 --> 00:07:30.030 rural issues. You write about rural communities and the issues affecting rural 120 00:07:30.030 --> 00:07:33.870 communities and the politics and the policies. But did 121 00:07:33.870 --> 00:07:36.550 you grow up rural? Did you come to rural later in life? Tell us about 122 00:07:36.550 --> 00:07:40.310 yourself. I grew up country, man. Country. I grew up in a butcher 123 00:07:40.310 --> 00:07:44.100 shop and on a farm. So that's where I 124 00:07:44.100 --> 00:07:47.780 come from. West Missouri country people. I'm actually 125 00:07:47.780 --> 00:07:51.580 the first person in my family who ever graduated from college. 126 00:07:51.580 --> 00:07:55.260 My older brother went before me, but I 127 00:07:55.260 --> 00:07:59.100 graduated before him. But we, 128 00:07:59.100 --> 00:08:02.820 we had a butcher shop growing up, you know, Meat Locker we called it. It 129 00:08:02.820 --> 00:08:06.500 was awesome. We had a farm too. I mean ever- 130 00:08:06.500 --> 00:08:10.310 everybody farmed. I don't know, is it, it was just sort of like what you 131 00:08:10.310 --> 00:08:13.790 did in West Missouri. You know, on the one side of my family, 132 00:08:14.590 --> 00:08:18.430 farming people. On the other side of my family, people who 133 00:08:18.910 --> 00:08:22.710 did construction work. So it's just working class country 134 00:08:22.710 --> 00:08:26.310 people. You don't live there now. You're not, you don't live in Missouri anymore. So 135 00:08:26.310 --> 00:08:29.030 how long did you live there and where did you go and, like, what were 136 00:08:29.030 --> 00:08:32.230 your travels to get you where you are today? I went to college and then 137 00:08:32.230 --> 00:08:35.590 I stayed in Columbia, Missouri, which is a 138 00:08:36.070 --> 00:08:39.510 cool college town. Lived around there for a while, got 139 00:08:39.590 --> 00:08:43.390 married to a city girl, had kids, and 140 00:08:43.390 --> 00:08:47.110 then moved back home and, and did the farming thing. Like, we did the 141 00:08:47.110 --> 00:08:50.710 homesteading thing. We built a house, raised organic vegetables. 142 00:08:50.870 --> 00:08:53.350 I mean, we did all that stuff and then 143 00:08:54.150 --> 00:08:57.830 moved to the Pacific Northwest after. So 144 00:08:57.830 --> 00:09:01.560 that. That's what we did. Did, did you study writing in 145 00:09:01.560 --> 00:09:04.800 college? Was that what you, what you did? Were you a journalist 146 00:09:05.120 --> 00:09:08.640 or did you come into that later? I was not a, a "journalist" 147 00:09:08.640 --> 00:09:12.400 journalist, but I was in the English program and I took every 148 00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:16.040 writing class you could take in terms of, I was more of a fiction 149 00:09:16.040 --> 00:09:19.760 and prose sort of person rather than...At 150 00:09:20.160 --> 00:09:23.920 the University of Missouri, it's a big journalism school, as you probably know. 151 00:09:23.920 --> 00:09:27.540 But I didn't go through that professional thing. 152 00:09:29.140 --> 00:09:32.900 What got you into writing about politics and rural 153 00:09:32.900 --> 00:09:36.580 issues specifically? I'm an activist, frankly, so 154 00:09:36.580 --> 00:09:40.180 it's like, I'm really into the politics of 155 00:09:40.180 --> 00:09:43.380 peace and the politics of local 156 00:09:43.380 --> 00:09:46.740 democracy. Right? And so I've always been the writer 157 00:09:46.980 --> 00:09:50.780 for, like, every group I've ever been involved with, which is all kinds of 158 00:09:50.780 --> 00:09:53.380 groups. So where I come from is 159 00:09:54.560 --> 00:09:56.960 rural people, working class, 160 00:09:58.080 --> 00:10:01.600 small towns. And I find that the 161 00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:04.800 politics doesn't make all the sense 162 00:10:05.600 --> 00:10:09.120 for them. It doesn't make sense for the people. Right? Like, they don't understand 163 00:10:09.360 --> 00:10:13.080 how they're getting screwed over. They don't understand who's in charge 164 00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:16.800 or they don't understand how it all goes. And so 165 00:10:17.200 --> 00:10:20.410 luckily, I have been able to get 166 00:10:20.490 --> 00:10:24.090 educated and also activated to 167 00:10:24.330 --> 00:10:28.050 connect with some of those people, right, who are in charge of their, of the 168 00:10:28.050 --> 00:10:31.810 decisions that, that matter in their lives. And so that's 169 00:10:31.810 --> 00:10:35.370 why I write about it. That's why I write about it. The politics is what 170 00:10:35.450 --> 00:10:39.170 matters to me because I can kind of see the 171 00:10:39.170 --> 00:10:42.610 connections between who's making the decisions and 172 00:10:42.610 --> 00:10:44.410 who isn't. 173 00:10:47.530 --> 00:10:51.290 Now let's get into that. Let's talk about what's, what's going on, what you're seeing 174 00:10:51.370 --> 00:10:55.090 and what you're writing about. So tell us what you're 175 00:10:55.090 --> 00:10:58.850 seeing about the, about who's making the decisions that impact rural America and what do 176 00:10:58.850 --> 00:11:02.410 those decisions mean for rural folk? Well, 177 00:11:02.730 --> 00:11:06.570 I guess. Where do you start? Right? There's 178 00:11:06.570 --> 00:11:10.330 a lot, right. Right now I'm really pissed off 179 00:11:10.330 --> 00:11:13.530 about, I'm gonna just say, like, I'm fucking pissed about 180 00:11:14.410 --> 00:11:18.170 what's happening in with the budget. I mean, it's 181 00:11:18.170 --> 00:11:21.970 just, it's, you're gonna get like hundreds of thousands of people 182 00:11:21.970 --> 00:11:25.490 kicked off of Medicaid, my kids included, who are on Medicaid. 183 00:11:25.490 --> 00:11:28.970 You're gonna get hundreds of thousands of people losing 184 00:11:29.609 --> 00:11:33.410 their SNAP, nutrition benefits, food stamps, whatever you call, 185 00:11:33.410 --> 00:11:37.010 whatever you want to call it. And I just, I, like, I'm, 186 00:11:37.010 --> 00:11:40.810 my mind is, is boggled, for tax cuts for 187 00:11:40.810 --> 00:11:44.090 billionaires. And I just don't understand how - no one 188 00:11:44.490 --> 00:11:48.250 wants rich kids to get tax cuts to 189 00:11:48.250 --> 00:11:51.930 pay for poor kids to get kicked off of SNAP 190 00:11:52.410 --> 00:11:55.690 and Medicaid. And that's 191 00:11:56.490 --> 00:11:59.610 what's happening. That's what's happening. Like, it's very direct and it's, 192 00:12:00.090 --> 00:12:03.850 it's, it's just maddening. It's just maddening. Aside 193 00:12:03.850 --> 00:12:07.640 from the work that you're doing, obviously, the writing you're doing, you know, 194 00:12:07.640 --> 00:12:11.280 the writing coming from Barn Raiser, the stuff that we're doing here at the One 195 00:12:11.280 --> 00:12:15.000 Country Project, like, how else can we get the 196 00:12:15.000 --> 00:12:18.760 right information to rural folks about what's going on? I mean, I think 197 00:12:18.760 --> 00:12:22.200 we have to get more direct to rural people. 198 00:12:22.760 --> 00:12:26.560 Democrats are horribly unpopular, but 199 00:12:26.560 --> 00:12:30.200 our issues are 100% popular. I guess I'm, 200 00:12:30.200 --> 00:12:33.960 you know, like, I'm not a Democratic insider. Don't get me wrong. 201 00:12:33.960 --> 00:12:37.700 That's not, that's not my thing. Right. But I just, 202 00:12:37.860 --> 00:12:41.460 I can't believe that we 203 00:12:41.460 --> 00:12:45.020 can't get to more people. You know, it's like, how do you, how do you 204 00:12:45.020 --> 00:12:48.860 get to them? Well, where I grew up, we 205 00:12:48.860 --> 00:12:52.460 used to have a small town newspaper and we don't have one 206 00:12:52.460 --> 00:12:56.260 anymore, you know, and all the towns in 207 00:12:56.260 --> 00:12:59.620 my like, home county are like that nowadays too. 208 00:13:00.100 --> 00:13:03.600 So it's like, how do you, how do you end up getting to people? 209 00:13:03.760 --> 00:13:07.360 I don't know. I don't know. Do you have any thoughts about, 210 00:13:07.680 --> 00:13:10.880 and I'm not talking about the politics of this, so I'll be really clear. I'm 211 00:13:10.880 --> 00:13:14.640 not talking about what could Democrats do to reach rural voters. I'm talking about 212 00:13:14.640 --> 00:13:18.359 what can those of us who are producing content about an important to rural. 213 00:13:18.359 --> 00:13:21.960 What can we do? How do you think we could get to 214 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:25.800 your folks and your, you know, your community that you 215 00:13:25.800 --> 00:13:29.240 grew up in? And it could be anything. Like, I just want to be creative, 216 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:32.260 right? Is it billboards, is it planes flying around 217 00:13:32.580 --> 00:13:36.380 pulling, pulling things behind? What do you think we could do? I honestly think if 218 00:13:36.380 --> 00:13:40.020 we produced a newspaper and we sent 219 00:13:40.020 --> 00:13:43.620 it to these people, that would be better. I know that's so 220 00:13:43.620 --> 00:13:47.380 costly. And I know that, like, that's so old school. But if 221 00:13:47.380 --> 00:13:51.180 we produced a newsletter, like 222 00:13:51.180 --> 00:13:54.500 a print newsletter. I'm talking print. I'm serious. 223 00:13:54.740 --> 00:13:58.570 Oh, yeah. And we sent it to people in the country, that would be 224 00:13:58.570 --> 00:14:02.370 the most beneficial thing we could do. And I don't mean like a 225 00:14:02.370 --> 00:14:05.850 mailer where it's just like, you know, politics, politics, 226 00:14:05.850 --> 00:14:09.690 politics. Yeah. Not junk mail. Yeah, it's not junk mail exactly. I 227 00:14:09.690 --> 00:14:12.850 just mean like an actual news 228 00:14:13.490 --> 00:14:17.290 paper, that they would read 229 00:14:17.290 --> 00:14:21.010 it. They do read it. They do. I know my grandma's still alive. 230 00:14:21.330 --> 00:14:24.780 Like my parents, my grandma. Like, they read it, 231 00:14:25.100 --> 00:14:28.620 but they don't read email. You know, they don't read. 232 00:14:28.780 --> 00:14:32.620 And these are country people. Again, I'm not sure why you would do that 233 00:14:32.620 --> 00:14:36.380 other than for politics, connection, all the 234 00:14:36.380 --> 00:14:39.980 things. But they do read it. They do read it. Let me 235 00:14:40.060 --> 00:14:43.820 ask this. If we could do that. And that's, I'm not saying 236 00:14:43.820 --> 00:14:46.340 you could do that or I could do that or One Country Project could do 237 00:14:46.340 --> 00:14:50.100 that, but just, just playing this out. If we could do 238 00:14:50.100 --> 00:14:53.820 that, how much of what we put in 239 00:14:53.820 --> 00:14:56.940 those newspapers would have to be 240 00:14:58.140 --> 00:15:01.820 explaining to people that what they're hearing from the other 241 00:15:02.140 --> 00:15:05.740 media that they're probably consuming and what they're hearing from the Republican 242 00:15:05.740 --> 00:15:09.460 politicians is bullshit. I don't even think you'd have to address that. I 243 00:15:09.460 --> 00:15:13.260 just think they would read it. They want rural content. They 244 00:15:13.260 --> 00:15:17.060 want to know what's happening in their government. They do. These are 245 00:15:17.060 --> 00:15:20.640 people who want to know. They're very active politically. They're 246 00:15:20.640 --> 00:15:24.280 very, like, curious people generally. So you 247 00:15:24.280 --> 00:15:28.000 think, you think that we wouldn't even have to address the 248 00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:31.800 whole misinformation and we just have to tell them the truth and just. 249 00:15:32.040 --> 00:15:35.800 Yeah, just tell people the truth. That's it. That's all. Yes, I 250 00:15:35.800 --> 00:15:38.920 absolutely believe that. Have you ever been to a rural community? 251 00:15:39.400 --> 00:15:43.240 People, they just want the truth. They 252 00:15:43.240 --> 00:15:46.810 want clean water, they want clean air. They want 253 00:15:46.970 --> 00:15:50.090 local democracy to work. You know, these are not 254 00:15:50.490 --> 00:15:53.930 conspiracy theory people. They're just 255 00:15:54.410 --> 00:15:57.530 people, and they just want 256 00:15:58.010 --> 00:16:01.850 their government to work for them, you know? Yeah, 257 00:16:01.850 --> 00:16:05.610 I understand where you're coming from, and particularly 258 00:16:05.610 --> 00:16:08.970 the, he argument you're making about, you know, they're just people. I 259 00:16:09.450 --> 00:16:13.150 - not to inject myself into the conversation too much - but I live 260 00:16:13.150 --> 00:16:16.990 in East Tennessee, near the Smoky Mountains, moved here about two years 261 00:16:16.990 --> 00:16:20.670 ago from the Washington, D.C. area and have been involved 262 00:16:20.670 --> 00:16:24.390 in sort of politics and political policy communication for, for 263 00:16:24.390 --> 00:16:28.070 a long, long time. And now that I know people 264 00:16:28.070 --> 00:16:31.870 who live in these rural communities and I talk to them 265 00:16:31.870 --> 00:16:35.550 all the time. I get really offended when people I know from the city are 266 00:16:35.550 --> 00:16:38.990 like, well, they're the reason Trump won, and they're the reasons, 267 00:16:38.990 --> 00:16:42.820 and, and, and just talk down about people, rural folks and people 268 00:16:42.820 --> 00:16:46.500 in the country. It's like that they're actually all really, really good people. They just 269 00:16:46.500 --> 00:16:50.140 don't know what you know, and there's no effort 270 00:16:50.380 --> 00:16:54.180 being placed into, into helping them know. We just turn up 271 00:16:54.180 --> 00:16:57.700 our noses at them. I mean, Bryce is throwing up his hands. 272 00:16:58.060 --> 00:17:01.340 Everybody, honestly, like, this whole 273 00:17:01.580 --> 00:17:05.180 blame the country people for getting Trump elected is, you know, 274 00:17:05.509 --> 00:17:09.349 rural people voted more for Trump. I know that. That's, you know, 275 00:17:09.349 --> 00:17:12.789 they have since 2016, 2020. 276 00:17:13.269 --> 00:17:16.789 I get it. I get it. But, man, to blame 277 00:17:17.109 --> 00:17:20.869 rural people for Trump, it just doesn't make any 278 00:17:20.869 --> 00:17:24.069 sense. I mean, there's, there's more of a trend, I know, 279 00:17:24.629 --> 00:17:28.429 but what do you, like, who do we blame? Do 280 00:17:28.429 --> 00:17:32.120 we, do we say, oh, well, you know, now Latino and 281 00:17:32.120 --> 00:17:35.720 Hispanic folk are blame, you know, a little bit more for 282 00:17:35.720 --> 00:17:39.360 Trump. Like, do, Black men are a little bit more for Trump. 283 00:17:40.000 --> 00:17:43.760 And that says more about Democrats to me than it does, 284 00:17:44.080 --> 00:17:47.720 like, I'm obviously not for Trump. I 285 00:17:47.720 --> 00:17:51.280 can't stand him. I find him offensive. 286 00:17:51.680 --> 00:17:55.360 I'm like, he's a sexist, racist 287 00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:59.180 prick. But he's a city boy from New York. Like, 288 00:17:59.180 --> 00:18:02.740 that's all you got to say to me, and I'm out. I just, 289 00:18:02.740 --> 00:18:06.460 I can't believe that's where we're at, you know? And 290 00:18:06.460 --> 00:18:10.020 I point out to those folks all the time that, that Trump didn't win because 291 00:18:10.020 --> 00:18:13.660 rural folks voted for him. Trump won because suburban folks and 292 00:18:13.660 --> 00:18:17.460 urban folks voted for him. Yeah, that's right. That's right. All right, I 293 00:18:17.460 --> 00:18:20.340 got one more question for you. This may be hard for you to answer. I've 294 00:18:20.340 --> 00:18:23.980 asked you a lot of tough questions today, but what, 295 00:18:24.300 --> 00:18:27.900 if anything, gives you hope? Well, I got hope 296 00:18:27.900 --> 00:18:31.660 in young people. I got two sons myself. And 297 00:18:31.660 --> 00:18:35.500 they're just cool, you know, they're like, and their friends are cool. 298 00:18:35.740 --> 00:18:39.260 They care about climate change. They care about democracy. 299 00:18:39.660 --> 00:18:43.500 I just find hope in the kids, man. I mean, I'm not, I'm not even 300 00:18:43.500 --> 00:18:46.780 50, so I'm not that old, you know, but, like, I 301 00:18:47.340 --> 00:18:51.120 love this generation of kids coming up. I think 302 00:18:51.120 --> 00:18:54.480 they're good. I just feel like they believe in 303 00:18:54.560 --> 00:18:58.400 democracy. They're active, you know. All right, Bryce Oates, 304 00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:01.600 thank you very much for joining us on the Hot Dish. 305 00:19:01.840 --> 00:19:05.480 Appreciate your having you here. Yep. Glad to be here. Glad to be 306 00:19:05.480 --> 00:19:09.120 here. Once again, folks, you can find Bryce Oates on substack at the 307 00:19:09.120 --> 00:19:12.800 Cocklebur, thecocklebur.substack.com and you should also 308 00:19:12.800 --> 00:19:16.400 definitely check out Barn Raiser, which is a twice 309 00:19:16.400 --> 00:19:20.040 weekly newsletter focusing on rural issues and 310 00:19:20.040 --> 00:19:23.220 rural folks. And you can find that at barnraisermedia.com. 311 00:19:28.500 --> 00:19:31.620 Hey, I am so happy to be here with Jess Piper, 312 00:19:32.180 --> 00:19:35.900 someone that I guess we've been doing this back and forth for 313 00:19:35.900 --> 00:19:39.620 about two, three years now. But she's returning to the Hot Dish 314 00:19:39.620 --> 00:19:43.460 to talk with me and not Joel. I'm a lot nicer than Joel, Jess, 315 00:19:43.460 --> 00:19:47.060 you'll just know that. She travels the country speaking at town 316 00:19:47.060 --> 00:19:50.500 halls about what it's like to live in in a ruby Red state when you're 317 00:19:50.500 --> 00:19:54.220 a rural Democrat. I'm familiar with that. And she writes 318 00:19:54.220 --> 00:19:58.060 about that and other topics in her substack, the View from 319 00:19:58.060 --> 00:20:01.660 Rural Missouri. But she doesn't just speak and write. She 320 00:20:01.660 --> 00:20:05.140 puts her money where her mouth is. She's also the Executive 321 00:20:05.380 --> 00:20:09.140 Director for Blue Missouri, where she leads efforts 322 00:20:09.140 --> 00:20:12.980 to raise money to support Democrats running for the state legislature 323 00:20:13.060 --> 00:20:16.350 in Missouri. Jess, welcome back to the Hot Dish. 324 00:20:16.590 --> 00:20:20.390 Hi Heidi. It's so nice to be back. We have so much in 325 00:20:20.390 --> 00:20:23.390 common and I love talking to you and your audience. 326 00:20:24.030 --> 00:20:27.670 I wanted to start out by just kind of there's an 327 00:20:27.670 --> 00:20:31.270 old, old baseball saying, you know, we coach so good and they 328 00:20:31.270 --> 00:20:34.910 play so bad. Yeah, I know a lot about that. You know what, I 329 00:20:34.910 --> 00:20:38.030 was a coach for a while. I'm married to a football coach. I 330 00:20:38.270 --> 00:20:42.050 totally get it. Exactly. You know, we've been out there talking 331 00:20:42.050 --> 00:20:45.650 about the challenges that we experience in rural 332 00:20:45.650 --> 00:20:49.050 America and reputational damage that's been done to the 333 00:20:49.050 --> 00:20:52.810 Democratic Party because number one, in your case 334 00:20:52.810 --> 00:20:56.490 and your work, we don't run candidates who actually talk about what the 335 00:20:56.490 --> 00:21:00.170 differences are. But also we haven't been as 336 00:21:00.170 --> 00:21:03.890 aggressive in pushing back for the branding and the labels. 337 00:21:03.970 --> 00:21:07.570 And that contagion is now just not a rural American 338 00:21:08.320 --> 00:21:11.920 contagion with the Democratic brand, but you're seeing that brand problem 339 00:21:12.320 --> 00:21:16.000 everywhere. You really are. I mean, we've talked about this for years. 340 00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:19.680 If we can't stop the red that's happening in my state and 341 00:21:19.680 --> 00:21:23.360 states like mine, it's going to spread into the entire 342 00:21:23.360 --> 00:21:27.040 country just like a contagion. And by golly, it did, right? 343 00:21:27.280 --> 00:21:30.920 This has been real problematic because we have been not running 344 00:21:30.920 --> 00:21:34.680 candidates in spaces. I would knock doors in '22 when I was running 345 00:21:34.680 --> 00:21:38.280 and people would say they have never had a candidate knock their door. They didn't 346 00:21:38.280 --> 00:21:42.100 know the Democratic message. They would look at me and be so confused, you know, 347 00:21:42.100 --> 00:21:45.780 because I don't have horns. I don't look like what 348 00:21:45.780 --> 00:21:49.340 Fox News or OAN or Newsmax said I should look like. But 349 00:21:49.420 --> 00:21:53.060 the real problem is we don't have candidates in areas. So when people 350 00:21:53.060 --> 00:21:56.219 say, you know, you get what you vote for, I got nobody to vote for 351 00:21:56.219 --> 00:21:59.780 a friend. And this has been a problem, and it's still a problem in 2025. 352 00:22:01.340 --> 00:22:05.100 So I have a question. Obviously you've been following and I've 353 00:22:05.100 --> 00:22:08.620 been following the Big Beautiful Bill, which by the way, the same 354 00:22:08.620 --> 00:22:12.320 initials as Build Back Better. I mean, it's been confus for me. 355 00:22:12.320 --> 00:22:15.920 Every time I see BBB, I think where they're back to Joe Biden's Build 356 00:22:15.920 --> 00:22:19.360 Back Better. No, it's called the Big Beautiful Bill, if you can 357 00:22:19.360 --> 00:22:23.080 imagine that. That's how we're legislating now, by slogan. 358 00:22:23.160 --> 00:22:26.640 But what's been interesting to me is how aggressive Josh 359 00:22:26.640 --> 00:22:30.040 Hawley has been, the Senator from your state, has been 360 00:22:30.440 --> 00:22:34.040 in talking about Medicaid. Does that 361 00:22:34.040 --> 00:22:37.760 surprise you at all, Jess? No. And we should all know that 362 00:22:37.760 --> 00:22:41.480 he's not doing it for the benefit of people who need Medicaid. 363 00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:45.260 So in Missouri, our lawmakers would not pass Medicaid 364 00:22:45.260 --> 00:22:49.100 expansion. And so we forced their hand by putting it on the ballot as a 365 00:22:49.100 --> 00:22:52.740 Constitutional Amendment. So now they are forced to fund 366 00:22:52.820 --> 00:22:56.500 Medicaid expansion through our Constitutional Amendment. We also 367 00:22:56.500 --> 00:22:59.380 have something called the Hancock Amendment, which means that 368 00:22:59.620 --> 00:23:03.340 lawmakers cannot raise taxes in Missouri unless they put 369 00:23:03.340 --> 00:23:06.460 it in front of the voters and unless we vote for it. So this is 370 00:23:06.460 --> 00:23:10.140 what's happening. Josh Hawley knows his really wealthy people are 371 00:23:10.140 --> 00:23:12.900 about to be in a bind in Missouri because they're not going to get the 372 00:23:12.900 --> 00:23:15.860 tax cut, cuts they've been asking for. They're not going to get rid of the 373 00:23:15.860 --> 00:23:19.220 estate tax, which they have been asking for, because 374 00:23:19.380 --> 00:23:22.660 there won't be enough money to fund Medicaid 375 00:23:22.660 --> 00:23:26.380 expansion if those federal dollars don't come through. So to 376 00:23:26.380 --> 00:23:30.180 act, everybody has been like, oh my God, he's a changed man. He's a 377 00:23:30.180 --> 00:23:33.780 great person. No friends, no friends. He is not. He is still 378 00:23:33.780 --> 00:23:37.300 protecting the wealthiest. That is such an interesting 379 00:23:37.300 --> 00:23:40.720 perspective, Jess. I've been like watching this going 380 00:23:41.520 --> 00:23:45.320 and the inside story is always interesting. But it goes back to 381 00:23:45.320 --> 00:23:49.040 why we need people like you in states like Missouri 382 00:23:49.040 --> 00:23:52.880 to tell the truth. Because we see this at a national state and we think 383 00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:56.680 he's a changed man. He's out there, you know, fighting for the little 384 00:23:56.680 --> 00:24:00.480 guy. And, you know, that's not exactly it, is it? What you 385 00:24:00.480 --> 00:24:03.840 see with Josh Hawley is often not at all what you get. 386 00:24:04.240 --> 00:24:08.080 Because that man, I mean, we know, we all saw him put his fist up, 387 00:24:08.080 --> 00:24:11.800 you know, for the mob and then run away in the Capitol. Josh 388 00:24:11.800 --> 00:24:15.600 is for Josh. Josh is for the wealthy folks. He's not going 389 00:24:15.600 --> 00:24:19.400 to fight for us. He showed up in Wentzville during the campaign because we 390 00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:23.240 see him every six years, right? He finds, he finds a plaid shirt and a 391 00:24:23.240 --> 00:24:26.760 pair of boots, and he hits the circuit and goes to all the county 392 00:24:26.760 --> 00:24:30.560 fairs and state fairs and all that. But we saw him in 393 00:24:30.880 --> 00:24:34.480 a picket line in Wentzville, Missouri, for UAW. And I'm 394 00:24:34.480 --> 00:24:38.210 telling you, those people were so confused because Josh Hawley 395 00:24:38.290 --> 00:24:41.890 is pro Right to Work. He was for years. And now 396 00:24:41.970 --> 00:24:45.570 recently, he's decided that, you know, maybe he needs to back off of that. 397 00:24:45.730 --> 00:24:49.450 But Josh is who he's always been. Don't ever, don't 398 00:24:49.450 --> 00:24:53.289 ever think, oh, my gosh, he's changed his mind. He's a great guy because he's 399 00:24:53.289 --> 00:24:57.050 always fighting for the same people and it ain't us. Yeah. And the, 400 00:24:57.050 --> 00:25:00.730 the reality is that if he wants to be labeled a 401 00:25:00.730 --> 00:25:04.450 populist and not an elitist, these are some good issues. He's taking 402 00:25:04.450 --> 00:25:08.210 a page out of Donald Trump's book. But I want to pivot to the 403 00:25:08.210 --> 00:25:11.730 Big Beautiful Bill and whether you see an opening 404 00:25:11.730 --> 00:25:15.490 for rebranding the Democratic Party or at least having a conversation 405 00:25:15.490 --> 00:25:19.210 with people about difference in values that 406 00:25:19.210 --> 00:25:22.690 are being reflected by that Bill versus the Democratic 407 00:25:22.690 --> 00:25:26.250 agenda. Are you seeing that in Missouri much? 408 00:25:26.490 --> 00:25:30.130 I am. Even Republicans and our Republican 409 00:25:30.130 --> 00:25:33.890 lawmakers are realizing what's going to happen to our state when they cut funding 410 00:25:33.890 --> 00:25:37.500 for SNAP, when they cut funding, funding for Medicaid, when they go after Social 411 00:25:37.500 --> 00:25:41.220 Security. Because all of these are, you know, social safety nets. 412 00:25:41.220 --> 00:25:44.980 But in places like Missouri, 40% of our kids are 413 00:25:44.980 --> 00:25:48.620 born on Medicaid. We're supposed to be a Pro Life state. And now we're 414 00:25:48.620 --> 00:25:52.340 cutting the benefit that poor folks had to deliver 415 00:25:52.500 --> 00:25:56.340 the babies that our state is demanding. They're going to cut that. They're going 416 00:25:56.340 --> 00:26:00.180 to cut SNAP. They're going to try to put in Medicaid work requirements, which we 417 00:26:00.180 --> 00:26:04.020 know don't work. You can look at Arkansas. Sarah Huckabee Sanders tried to do 418 00:26:04.020 --> 00:26:07.400 this. They found out real quick that most of the people on Medicaid were already 419 00:26:07.400 --> 00:26:11.120 working. And the fact is, these people are working for places like Walmart, 420 00:26:11.120 --> 00:26:14.920 who's not paying a living wage, who gets government subsidies 421 00:26:14.920 --> 00:26:18.360 themselves, and then most of their employees end up needing SNAP, 422 00:26:19.080 --> 00:26:22.760 Medicaid and other social services because they're not paying them 423 00:26:22.760 --> 00:26:26.520 a living wage. So this is the part where Democrats can step in and say, 424 00:26:26.760 --> 00:26:29.720 Big Beautiful Bill, like you said, that is an outrageous, 425 00:26:30.040 --> 00:26:33.160 outrageous name. It's so Trumpion and it sounds so, 426 00:26:33.870 --> 00:26:37.670 so weird, but almost every person who has even a 427 00:26:37.670 --> 00:26:41.430 limited understanding of it understands that it's coming after the 428 00:26:41.430 --> 00:26:45.190 most marginalized in our communities. Yeah. And the one thing that I want 429 00:26:45.190 --> 00:26:48.750 to put on the table, because we've been talking about this Big Beautiful Bill 430 00:26:49.070 --> 00:26:52.870 and the changes that it's going to make to the Medicaid system, but the 431 00:26:52.870 --> 00:26:56.630 expanded credits for the ACA, which a lot of 432 00:26:56.630 --> 00:27:00.270 states, including mine and yours, we have a lot of people who have 433 00:27:00.960 --> 00:27:04.800 greatly reduced their premium costs. Those expanded credits 434 00:27:04.800 --> 00:27:08.480 are going to go off even if they're out on the exchange buying 435 00:27:08.560 --> 00:27:12.320 health insurance. Because by the way, employers, not every employer 436 00:27:12.320 --> 00:27:16.080 offers health insurance. That, I saw a Senator recently who 437 00:27:16.080 --> 00:27:19.600 said, oh, you know, they'll just get it from their employer when they go back 438 00:27:19.600 --> 00:27:23.200 to work. I want to say, what don't you people understand about 439 00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:26.680 the struggles are of people that you think, you think are 440 00:27:26.680 --> 00:27:30.520 slackers? I was on Joel's radio show, Jess, and a 441 00:27:30.520 --> 00:27:34.040 guy called in and said, you Democrats, you just want to give away 442 00:27:34.040 --> 00:27:37.440 money to, you know, on daycare and on, you know, food 443 00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:41.280 assistance. And he went through all these, Section 8 housing. And so he went 444 00:27:41.280 --> 00:27:44.680 through all these programs. And I said, let me tell you a story, a story 445 00:27:44.680 --> 00:27:48.480 about somebody who works at a fast food restaurant who makes 446 00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:51.240 $10 an hour. Guess what they make. They make under $25,000 447 00:27:51.320 --> 00:27:54.490 a year. So who are you really subsidizing 448 00:27:54.490 --> 00:27:58.330 when you offer those benefits? You're subsidizing the employer. 449 00:27:58.330 --> 00:28:02.130 You're not subsidizing that person. That person's working 40 450 00:28:02.130 --> 00:28:05.610 hours a week. And it's this failure of people to understand because 451 00:28:05.930 --> 00:28:09.489 they only show up every six years and ask for a vote 452 00:28:09.489 --> 00:28:13.290 and say, I'm a Republican, be scared of Democrats, and 453 00:28:13.370 --> 00:28:17.090 don't have any ideas and don't improve the lives of the people 454 00:28:17.090 --> 00:28:20.850 they serve. That's exactly it. And when I was knocking doors, I would have people 455 00:28:20.850 --> 00:28:24.210 come to the door and talk about their road. We don't have shoulders on our 456 00:28:24.210 --> 00:28:27.870 roads. Our schools are four days a week, our hospitals are closing. And they would 457 00:28:27.870 --> 00:28:31.270 come out and say, well, Joe Biden. I don't know who you're talking about. He 458 00:28:31.270 --> 00:28:35.110 has no idea where you live. That has come from your State Representative and 459 00:28:35.110 --> 00:28:38.750 your State Senator and you have voted for Republicans for 30 years 460 00:28:38.750 --> 00:28:42.430 we have not elected a Democrat from my district in 32 461 00:28:42.430 --> 00:28:46.110 years, never elected a woman. So all of these 462 00:28:46.110 --> 00:28:49.870 problems, by the way, friends, are coming from your State House and the federal funds 463 00:28:49.870 --> 00:28:53.350 we're going to lose are coming from those Republicans up in the Federal Government. 464 00:28:53.350 --> 00:28:57.030 And you are so right to talk about what is happening with ACA. 465 00:28:57.170 --> 00:29:00.890 I'm self-employed and before Missouri expanded Medicaid, I 466 00:29:00.890 --> 00:29:04.610 didn't have health insurance because it was around $1100 a month and I just could 467 00:29:04.610 --> 00:29:07.650 not afford it. Well, a year and a half ago I went and I was 468 00:29:07.650 --> 00:29:11.170 like, I really am going to need health insurance. I'm nearing 50, right? And 469 00:29:11.330 --> 00:29:14.774 I look at the marketplace and now it's $496, $496! I didn't 470 00:29:15.006 --> 00:29:18.650 know what happened. Now I do. It's because Missouri expanded 471 00:29:18.650 --> 00:29:21.730 Medicaid and that brought down, you know, the 472 00:29:22.290 --> 00:29:25.850 co-pays and all that for my health insurance. I, you know, I'm not someone that 473 00:29:25.850 --> 00:29:29.690 people would look at and say, well, Medicaid has benefited you. Medicaid expansion has benefited 474 00:29:29.690 --> 00:29:33.410 every single person in this state, whether they know it or 475 00:29:33.410 --> 00:29:37.170 not. Well, and the other thing is it's kept our rural hospitals 476 00:29:37.170 --> 00:29:40.890 open, which are heavily dependent, operate on a 1% margin 477 00:29:41.450 --> 00:29:45.050 and are heavily dependent on Medicaid and Medicare 478 00:29:45.210 --> 00:29:48.410 expenditures. And think about this, when we have 479 00:29:48.410 --> 00:29:51.850 uncompensated care, who's going to pay? Eventually everybody pays 480 00:29:52.240 --> 00:29:55.440 because you're going to get care and it's going to be even more expensive. And 481 00:29:55.440 --> 00:29:58.960 yes, Joni Ernst, people will die. You know, my husband's a family 482 00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:02.680 physician and he will tell anyone after 483 00:30:02.680 --> 00:30:06.400 the passage of the aca, when people came in and were able to get 484 00:30:06.400 --> 00:30:10.080 screenings for free, it saved people's lives. He was able to early 485 00:30:10.480 --> 00:30:13.760 detect a lot of diseases, particularly colon cancers, 486 00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:17.440 that had it gone unchecked, those people would have been 487 00:30:17.900 --> 00:30:21.180 on the short list for meeting their maker. And so 488 00:30:21.740 --> 00:30:25.300 it's just naive. I mean this whole healthcare thing is just 489 00:30:25.300 --> 00:30:28.980 absolutely naive. And the point that we need to make, 490 00:30:28.980 --> 00:30:32.780 I think over and over again is that there 491 00:30:32.780 --> 00:30:36.060 are struggles out there that we need to understand 492 00:30:36.380 --> 00:30:40.140 better. But as Democrats, we need to talk about what our plan is, 493 00:30:40.300 --> 00:30:43.940 not just why their plan is bad, we do. And we also 494 00:30:43.940 --> 00:30:47.690 need to catch the people who are trying to get fly under the radar. 495 00:30:47.690 --> 00:30:51.250 My Congressman, for example, has been in D.C. for 24 years. Sam 496 00:30:51.250 --> 00:30:54.690 Graves, he's a Congressman for the 6th district, which is the entire 497 00:30:55.010 --> 00:30:58.770 third part of Missouri. He voted for 498 00:30:58.850 --> 00:31:02.649 the big beautiful bill. He voted to take away Medicaid 499 00:31:02.649 --> 00:31:05.930 and he just came out yesterday with a 500 00:31:05.930 --> 00:31:09.730 bipartisan bill to save rural hospitals. And I'm like, 501 00:31:09.730 --> 00:31:13.570 wait, Sam, you just voted to defund those hospitals, 502 00:31:13.570 --> 00:31:17.290 and now you're writing a bill to fund these hospitals? So everything is smoke and 503 00:31:17.290 --> 00:31:21.110 mirrors, everything they do. So he's going to come out and he has, you know, 504 00:31:21.110 --> 00:31:23.990 he's, he's going to try to get reelected next year, and he's going to come 505 00:31:23.990 --> 00:31:27.670 out and say, look, I tried to save these rural hospitals. No, you didn't. You 506 00:31:27.670 --> 00:31:31.230 voted against them. You created a problem. And now you're, you're coming out with this 507 00:31:31.230 --> 00:31:35.030 bill to say that you're saving them. And the reason it's happening is because under 508 00:31:35.030 --> 00:31:38.470 22 years of the GOP super majority in this state, they have 509 00:31:38.470 --> 00:31:42.230 closed 19 rural hospitals. You have to drive an 510 00:31:42.230 --> 00:31:45.950 hour and a half to deliver a baby that you wanted. You're forced 511 00:31:46.190 --> 00:31:49.990 to deliver a pregnancy that you didn't want because, by the way, we 512 00:31:49.990 --> 00:31:53.470 got rid of our abortion ban. And Heidi, what did they do? They. They 513 00:31:53.470 --> 00:31:57.150 negated our vote. They're putting it back on the ballot again. We 514 00:31:57.150 --> 00:32:00.870 raised 380,000 signatures, and we won. And 515 00:32:00.870 --> 00:32:04.510 they're still saying it doesn't matter because, remember, all of this was supposed to be 516 00:32:04.510 --> 00:32:08.150 about States' rights. "Send it back to the States." But not like that, not when 517 00:32:08.150 --> 00:32:11.550 they approve it, right? And so these are all problems with Republicans. 518 00:32:11.550 --> 00:32:15.260 And right now, as far as, as a Democrat, when I'm 519 00:32:15.260 --> 00:32:19.020 knocking doors, I don't even really have time to give them a Democratic message. 520 00:32:19.020 --> 00:32:22.740 I have to unwind everything they've heard from all of these sources 521 00:32:22.740 --> 00:32:26.540 that are incorrect about Republicans. So how do 522 00:32:26.540 --> 00:32:30.220 we fix this? I mean, you know, you and I, I'm not afraid to 523 00:32:30.220 --> 00:32:34.060 go anywhere and mix it up with anyone in North Dakota because I 524 00:32:34.060 --> 00:32:37.020 think I have a story to tell, and I'm not going to fall into the 525 00:32:37.020 --> 00:32:40.820 traps of, 'You Democrats are all this.' No, we're not. We're not 526 00:32:40.820 --> 00:32:44.340 all this. We are different people. But we have a fundamental 527 00:32:44.340 --> 00:32:47.980 belief that when you invest in people, and not 528 00:32:47.980 --> 00:32:51.780 just institutions and wealthy people, that when you invest 529 00:32:51.780 --> 00:32:55.540 in everyone and give everyone a chance, that's when we succeed. But let's 530 00:32:55.540 --> 00:32:59.340 turn to the, the damage that's been done to the Democratic 531 00:32:59.340 --> 00:33:03.100 brand in rural America. And how do we fix that, Jess? We fix it 532 00:33:03.100 --> 00:33:06.900 by being here. We have left rural America, and that 533 00:33:06.900 --> 00:33:10.700 is the fault of the Democrats. I think years ago, they decided that they 534 00:33:10.700 --> 00:33:14.460 could win elections by just paying attention to suburban and urban areas. And they 535 00:33:14.460 --> 00:33:18.000 thought "those people," the rural spaces are so red anyway, it doesn't matter. But 536 00:33:18.080 --> 00:33:21.840 look what has happened. We have also given to, only to races 537 00:33:21.840 --> 00:33:25.320 that we have decided are flippable or winnable instead of investing 538 00:33:25.320 --> 00:33:29.080 in every single district across every single state. And look what 539 00:33:29.080 --> 00:33:32.640 has happened in Missouri. We have only invested in those winnable 540 00:33:32.640 --> 00:33:36.320 races. And now we do not have one Democrat elected statewide. Not 541 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:39.800 one. And we haven't since 2018 when the last auditor 542 00:33:39.800 --> 00:33:43.450 left. So we have this huge vacuum of 543 00:33:43.690 --> 00:33:47.450 leadership of being in the space. You can't win a 544 00:33:47.450 --> 00:33:51.010 rural space when you just have people from other areas come in and knock 545 00:33:51.010 --> 00:33:54.690 two weeks before an election. You can't say, I care about you, but I've 546 00:33:54.690 --> 00:33:57.930 never been here for you. You can't say I care about you, but I'm not 547 00:33:57.930 --> 00:34:01.010 going to. I'm not going to have anyone on the ballot for you to vote 548 00:34:01.010 --> 00:34:04.650 for, because people see through that real quick. We have to actually be in the 549 00:34:04.650 --> 00:34:08.370 communities the Democratic Party needs to support the people who have been on the ground 550 00:34:08.370 --> 00:34:11.820 for decades doing the work that send them funding, send 551 00:34:11.980 --> 00:34:15.820 them money so that they can do even more. And that's how we'll start to 552 00:34:15.820 --> 00:34:19.380 claw our way back. I'm not picking on the 553 00:34:19.380 --> 00:34:23.060 presidential race, but you think about the billions of 554 00:34:23.060 --> 00:34:26.860 dollars that was spent, and you think about the polling before that money 555 00:34:26.860 --> 00:34:30.540 was ever spent. It didn't change any votes because it was done the wrong 556 00:34:30.540 --> 00:34:34.380 way. And, you know, God bless, you know, everyone who worked so 557 00:34:34.380 --> 00:34:37.990 hard on that race. But just, just think of what $100 558 00:34:37.990 --> 00:34:41.710 million invested in rural places would 559 00:34:41.710 --> 00:34:45.550 mean for, number one, telling people who have 560 00:34:45.550 --> 00:34:49.350 been in the fight for a long, long time in rural Nebraska and rural North 561 00:34:49.350 --> 00:34:53.110 Dakota and rural Minnesota, telling them, guess what? You matter. 562 00:34:53.110 --> 00:34:56.750 And we're going to help you build the infrastructure that you need and 563 00:34:56.750 --> 00:35:00.590 develop the candidates that you need. And I think that's the other thing 564 00:35:00.590 --> 00:35:04.310 I want to turn to, which is candidate development. You know, if, if 565 00:35:04.310 --> 00:35:08.030 you know that you don't have any support, you're just out there 566 00:35:08.030 --> 00:35:11.630 like you were. Like you were, Jess, when you were 567 00:35:11.630 --> 00:35:15.430 knocking doors. It really does. That's why I run Blue Missouri. That's 568 00:35:15.430 --> 00:35:19.150 why I, I run an organization where we give money. A lot of 569 00:35:19.150 --> 00:35:22.950 people say, do you endorse candidates? No, I don't. I send them a check 570 00:35:22.950 --> 00:35:26.710 once they have won the nomination for their district or whatever 571 00:35:26.710 --> 00:35:30.190 they're running for. We send them actual cash. We do a 572 00:35:30.270 --> 00:35:33.990 bathtub method from the bottom to the top. So the people who have raised the 573 00:35:33.990 --> 00:35:37.770 least are, get the most from Blue Missouri. And that's why it's hard 574 00:35:37.770 --> 00:35:40.930 for people, because it's flipped it on its head. They're like, yeah, but these folks 575 00:35:40.930 --> 00:35:44.490 aren't going to win. I know they're not likely to win, but you know what? 576 00:35:44.650 --> 00:35:48.330 We've got their back. Asking someone in a rural space to run 577 00:35:48.810 --> 00:35:52.450 is very, it's a huge ask. I know I 578 00:35:52.450 --> 00:35:56.290 lost my job. I can't go back to teaching because I said abortion, because 579 00:35:56.290 --> 00:35:59.530 I said that gay people should be able to be married, because I said education 580 00:35:59.690 --> 00:36:03.340 should be free for folks. And so I can't go back to 581 00:36:03.340 --> 00:36:06.940 teaching. My husband was fired from his teaching 582 00:36:06.940 --> 00:36:10.500 job because I ran for office. You are asking so much of 583 00:36:10.500 --> 00:36:14.020 people, so to ask them to run and then not give them a dime, 584 00:36:14.340 --> 00:36:17.980 that's immoral. That, that - we can't do that anymore. We 585 00:36:17.980 --> 00:36:21.220 can't say, turn your life upside down and by the way, we're not going to 586 00:36:21.220 --> 00:36:24.700 do anything else for you. And that's why I felt called to do this, to 587 00:36:24.700 --> 00:36:28.020 give to the people that are running in the Reddest, the toughest districts 588 00:36:28.020 --> 00:36:31.370 that no one else is going to support. Because you know as well as I 589 00:36:31.370 --> 00:36:34.850 do, Heidi, it's going to take a few cycles. If, if we haven't had a 590 00:36:34.850 --> 00:36:38.650 candidate since 2012, we've taught an entire generation 591 00:36:38.650 --> 00:36:42.250 of people to vote for Republicans because there's not a Democrat on the ballot. And 592 00:36:42.250 --> 00:36:46.090 we've got to do better than that. And we start by making sure there is 593 00:36:46.090 --> 00:36:49.850 a candidate in every single area and then funding those candidates. 594 00:36:49.850 --> 00:36:53.570 Yeah. And training candidates and telling them, look, you know, 595 00:36:53.570 --> 00:36:56.770 here's, here's the best way to approach what you're doing. If you're uncomfortable 596 00:36:56.770 --> 00:37:00.170 defending this position. I, I tell the, you 597 00:37:01.030 --> 00:37:03.990 know, I ran, no one thought I was going to win, kind of similar situation. 598 00:37:04.070 --> 00:37:07.910 And you, you just never know what's going to happen. And you just 599 00:37:07.910 --> 00:37:11.750 don't know. Lightning could strike, right? It could 600 00:37:11.750 --> 00:37:15.590 strike when people have someone to talk to. And that's why candidates on 601 00:37:15.590 --> 00:37:19.430 every ballot are important, because they're out knocking the doors. And, 602 00:37:19.510 --> 00:37:23.230 you know, we have a lot of messaging coming through, and St. Louis messaging 603 00:37:23.230 --> 00:37:27.070 doesn't work in Maryville, Missouri. And so people have to figure that out 604 00:37:27.070 --> 00:37:30.510 as well, too. But by knocking doors, you figure out what's important to people. You 605 00:37:30.510 --> 00:37:33.850 know, what's important to people out here. The schools, the roads, the 606 00:37:33.850 --> 00:37:37.690 hospitals. Not one person did I knock a door and then come out and 607 00:37:37.690 --> 00:37:41.450 say, well, those Trans people using bathrooms - never, not once! 608 00:37:41.450 --> 00:37:45.250 So we have to remember too, that there are issues that, these "Kitchen 609 00:37:45.250 --> 00:37:48.930 Table" issues. Even though Fox News and OAN and all them want to make them 610 00:37:48.930 --> 00:37:52.570 the biggest part. When I knock doors, it has nothing to do with 611 00:37:52.570 --> 00:37:56.250 that. Nobody said, I don't think gay people should be able to be married. Nobody 612 00:37:56.250 --> 00:38:00.090 said, I hope that my tax money goes to a private religious school 613 00:38:00.090 --> 00:38:03.820 that I can't send my kid to. Right? These are things that keep going 614 00:38:03.820 --> 00:38:07.300 through the Missouri House. But no one, no door I knocked 615 00:38:07.300 --> 00:38:11.140 had anything to do with that. So there's this huge disconnect. But 616 00:38:11.300 --> 00:38:15.100 a reason that a lot of people will still vote for a Republican, you 617 00:38:15.100 --> 00:38:18.780 know this as well as I do, is church indoctrination. Because they're 618 00:38:18.780 --> 00:38:22.020 hearing from the pulpit that they can't vote for Democrats, that they can't vote for 619 00:38:22.020 --> 00:38:25.620 people who are Pro Choice. And we work on that message by knocking 620 00:38:25.620 --> 00:38:29.240 doors and actually talking to people. The one thing that I will 621 00:38:29.240 --> 00:38:32.920 say, Jess, is I have a friend who says Democrats approach rural 622 00:38:32.920 --> 00:38:36.000 people as missionaries and not 623 00:38:36.240 --> 00:38:39.960 neighbors. Meaning, you know, they knock a door and say, I'm here to help 624 00:38:39.960 --> 00:38:43.479 you. Look what I'm going to give you. You know what? You need to see 625 00:38:43.479 --> 00:38:47.160 people first. You need to say, I see your hard work. I see your struggle. 626 00:38:47.160 --> 00:38:51.000 I see that you don't have enough money to fix the hot water heater or 627 00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:54.800 to fix the plumbing in your house. How can we make that 628 00:38:55.090 --> 00:38:58.930 better? How can we help? And not how can 629 00:38:59.330 --> 00:39:02.690 I give you something? Because they don't want to be given 630 00:39:02.850 --> 00:39:06.570 anything. They've earned it. And the question is, how can you make 631 00:39:06.570 --> 00:39:10.410 their life better? And that's exactly why deep canvassing works. That's 632 00:39:10.410 --> 00:39:13.810 why I was at doors for an hour, because I was 633 00:39:13.810 --> 00:39:17.530 listening to what was going on with these folks and how hard 634 00:39:17.530 --> 00:39:21.210 it is to live in rural spaces. Listen, if anybody wants to 635 00:39:21.210 --> 00:39:24.850 know what the Trump Administration and what Elon Musk - even though they're fighting right 636 00:39:24.850 --> 00:39:28.110 now - what they want for the rest of country, all you got to do 637 00:39:28.110 --> 00:39:31.190 is look at rural America. They want it hollowed out. And by the way, urban 638 00:39:31.190 --> 00:39:34.510 issues and rural issues are almost identical. We 639 00:39:34.590 --> 00:39:38.350 have the same exact struggle, struggle. And that's why places 640 00:39:38.350 --> 00:39:42.030 like, you know, RUBI, the Rural Urban Bridge Initiative is helpful, 641 00:39:42.030 --> 00:39:45.750 but also in getting a message out. We're suffering from the same 642 00:39:45.750 --> 00:39:49.470 things. It just looks different. But the poverty is the same. The no schools, the 643 00:39:49.470 --> 00:39:53.230 no daycares, the no hospitals, all of these things are very similar. And the 644 00:39:54.110 --> 00:39:57.830 bottom line is that when you approach this as we're so 645 00:39:57.830 --> 00:40:01.550 different, you're going to lose when you approach this. That if I 646 00:40:02.270 --> 00:40:05.750 hear one more Democrat say they vote against their interests. I say, no, they don't. 647 00:40:05.750 --> 00:40:09.110 They don't vote against their interests. Nobody votes against their interests. But 648 00:40:09.110 --> 00:40:12.790 Jess, it is always great to talk to you. It's kind of like, "Yeah!" 649 00:40:12.790 --> 00:40:15.470 And then, "Yeah, that's exactly right!" 650 00:40:18.590 --> 00:40:22.280 Yes, yes, yes. We're both cheerleaders. We're both cheerleaders for the 651 00:40:22.280 --> 00:40:26.080 same exact community. And if folks would just listen and Heidi, you hit on 652 00:40:26.080 --> 00:40:29.880 something that's so important. No one votes against their self interest. When I 653 00:40:29.880 --> 00:40:33.680 knock doors and someone say abortion makes the entire thing for me, it's because 654 00:40:33.680 --> 00:40:37.360 they honestly and truly believe that people are killing babies, right? And so 655 00:40:37.520 --> 00:40:41.280 that's where we have to do this education and unwinding and nothing 656 00:40:41.280 --> 00:40:45.000 happens if there aren't Democrats out knocking doors and talking to 657 00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:48.680 people. Rural people are worth it. We are worth candidates. We are 658 00:40:48.680 --> 00:40:52.220 worth conversations. And if the Democrats would just come back, 659 00:40:52.460 --> 00:40:55.980 we would see a change. Amen. Amen. Jess, 660 00:40:55.980 --> 00:40:59.660 thanks so much for joining me. I just want everyone to know you can 661 00:40:59.660 --> 00:41:03.300 follow Jess on Substack at jesspiper. All one word. 662 00:41:03.300 --> 00:41:07.099 P-I-P-E-R. And good luck with your Substack. Good luck 663 00:41:07.099 --> 00:41:10.780 with your preaching. The bottom line is that if you're not 664 00:41:10.860 --> 00:41:14.580 out there, of course you're going to fail. Exactly. I 665 00:41:14.580 --> 00:41:18.260 appreciate you and thank you for doing all you're doing for rural communities 666 00:41:18.260 --> 00:41:21.900 across the country. Love you, Jess. Thanks so much. Thank 667 00:41:21.900 --> 00:41:22.660 you. Bye. 668 00:41:25.540 --> 00:41:29.020 I learned a lot in today's episode and I hope you did too. It's so 669 00:41:29.020 --> 00:41:32.580 important to support our rural communities. We hope this episode 670 00:41:32.820 --> 00:41:36.660 inspires you to get involved in your community. If there's something you 671 00:41:36.660 --> 00:41:40.380 or a loved one is doing, let's talk about it. Email us 672 00:41:40.380 --> 00:41:42.980 your story or anything else that you have to say 673 00:41:43.860 --> 00:41:44.680 at 674 00:41:44.680 --> 00:41:48.510 podcast@onecountryproject.org. That's 675 00:41:48.510 --> 00:41:51.142 podcast@onecountryproject - all one word - dot org. We're 676 00:41:51.638 --> 00:41:55.110 also on Bluesky and Substack, 677 00:41:55.110 --> 00:41:58.790 so follow us and reach out there too. We'd love to 678 00:41:58.790 --> 00:42:02.430 hear from you because we are optimistic about what can 679 00:42:02.430 --> 00:42:06.150 happen in the next cycle. Hot Dish is brought to you by 680 00:42:06.150 --> 00:42:09.830 One Country Project, making sure the voices of the rest of us are heard 681 00:42:09.830 --> 00:42:12.000 in the Washington. Learn more at onecountryproject.org. 682 00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:15.560 And be sure to register for 683 00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:19.240 the Rural Progress Summit, our online event, which 684 00:42:19.720 --> 00:42:23.080 will be held July 8th through the 10th. We'll 685 00:42:23.240 --> 00:42:26.960 be back in two weeks with more Hot Dish, comfort food for 686 00:42:26.960 --> 00:42:27.560 rural America.