1 00:00:00,300 --> 00:00:01,620 Speaker 3: Welcome to Honest Money. 2 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:05,910 I'm your host, Anja, and today's episode is brought to you by hard block. 3 00:00:11,761 --> 00:00:12,601 Anja: Greetings. 4 00:00:12,631 --> 00:00:16,081 Joining me today is an Australian Bitcoin, Ben Gazal. 5 00:00:16,801 --> 00:00:21,031 Uh, I found Ben on Instagram, so I've asked him to join on the podcast because 6 00:00:21,031 --> 00:00:22,771 his page is doing really, really well. 7 00:00:22,771 --> 00:00:26,071 He's getting over like a million views on some of his posts where he's 8 00:00:26,071 --> 00:00:30,811 trying to educate others about the, the basement of Australian Dollar. 9 00:00:30,811 --> 00:00:32,281 Welcome to Honest Money, Ben. 10 00:00:33,151 --> 00:00:34,571 Ben: Thank you, Anja. 11 00:00:34,591 --> 00:00:37,681 Pleasure to be here and you are one of the, uh, few that 12 00:00:37,681 --> 00:00:38,551 have found me on Instagram. 13 00:00:38,551 --> 00:00:39,181 So good for you. 14 00:00:40,156 --> 00:00:40,696 Anja: Yay. 15 00:00:40,816 --> 00:00:43,696 I love finding Bitcoiners in the wild. 16 00:00:43,936 --> 00:00:48,226 It's like, I feel like it's my special skill and you'll be really surprised 17 00:00:48,226 --> 00:00:54,826 I've found like we have an Australian comedian who's a coiner and I reached 18 00:00:54,826 --> 00:00:58,756 out to him 'cause I saw some of his posts and he wears like a Bitcoin cap. 19 00:00:58,756 --> 00:01:00,436 And I'm like, are you a Bitcoin? 20 00:01:00,436 --> 00:01:02,581 And he goes, stack that and say Humble 21 00:01:03,591 --> 00:01:03,941 Ben: stack. 22 00:01:04,001 --> 00:01:04,901 And say humble. 23 00:01:05,086 --> 00:01:05,416 Yeah. 24 00:01:06,106 --> 00:01:06,646 Anja: I was just like. 25 00:01:07,741 --> 00:01:11,521 There's so many of us in the wild, and I, uh, he lives somewhere near Sydney. 26 00:01:11,521 --> 00:01:13,471 I'm like, how come I've never seen you at a meetup? 27 00:01:13,471 --> 00:01:15,571 'cause I used to go to, to the Sydney meetups. 28 00:01:15,691 --> 00:01:21,841 He goes, I didn't know there were any, and up in Brisbane is a man named peers. 29 00:01:21,841 --> 00:01:26,521 And he says he gets the same thing at a meetup every month is like two 30 00:01:26,521 --> 00:01:30,061 or three people join and be like, I had no idea there were others. 31 00:01:31,666 --> 00:01:33,706 Ben: Yeah, we're, uh, we're a rare breed, right? 32 00:01:33,706 --> 00:01:35,116 We're in the wild until you find us. 33 00:01:35,116 --> 00:01:38,386 And then you discover this cupboard that there's full of these closet 34 00:01:38,626 --> 00:01:39,556 bitcoiners, like you and I. 35 00:01:39,556 --> 00:01:42,286 So no closet, no, no longer, 36 00:01:42,976 --> 00:01:46,906 Anja: yes, coming out of the closet and on that, I'm very keen for my 37 00:01:46,906 --> 00:01:49,696 audience to hear your origin story. 38 00:01:49,696 --> 00:01:51,601 How did you get into Bitcoin? 39 00:01:53,231 --> 00:01:54,046 Ben: How did I get in? 40 00:01:54,046 --> 00:01:58,906 Well, I'm one of those people that, uh, let's say saw it at 700. 41 00:01:59,731 --> 00:02:03,961 Uh, was intrigued by it at a thousand, was intrigued even more by 10,000. 42 00:02:03,961 --> 00:02:11,191 But only only did I buy it at 68,000 in, uh, uh, 2021, late early 2022. 43 00:02:12,031 --> 00:02:16,741 My, uh, initiation into Bitcoin was the 2022 Bear Market. 44 00:02:16,741 --> 00:02:17,581 FTX collapse. 45 00:02:17,581 --> 00:02:20,461 Like everyone I thought, well, what the hell have I done? 46 00:02:20,461 --> 00:02:21,271 What am I doing? 47 00:02:21,361 --> 00:02:22,261 What an absolute idiot. 48 00:02:23,041 --> 00:02:26,461 Um, and bought alt coins and other coins and had everything other 49 00:02:26,461 --> 00:02:29,371 than Bitcoin and eventually fell down the Bitcoin rabbit hole. 50 00:02:30,121 --> 00:02:35,311 Um, and I think, you know, as you learn more about Bitcoin, you start to basically 51 00:02:35,311 --> 00:02:38,191 get a really good understanding of the other problems like, you know, monetary 52 00:02:38,191 --> 00:02:39,631 debasement and those kinds of things. 53 00:02:39,631 --> 00:02:39,841 And. 54 00:02:40,561 --> 00:02:44,611 Uh, led me down the path of trying to educate others on, on the same issue. 55 00:02:44,731 --> 00:02:45,361 Anja: Yeah. 56 00:02:45,361 --> 00:02:50,341 And what has your been, like, what's your impression so far? 57 00:02:50,341 --> 00:02:54,151 Have people respond to your education online? 58 00:02:54,181 --> 00:02:56,101 Like, do people understand the problem? 59 00:02:56,251 --> 00:02:57,451 Ben: Um, do they understand? 60 00:02:57,451 --> 00:03:01,291 I, I don't think you've almost gotta find a bit of a problem and solution first. 61 00:03:01,711 --> 00:03:05,371 And so it's difficult for them to find the problem if you know, 62 00:03:05,371 --> 00:03:07,681 or at least find the solution if they don't recognize the problem. 63 00:03:07,681 --> 00:03:14,251 So they're, they're really, um, they're not sure I suppose, of what monetary 64 00:03:14,251 --> 00:03:18,721 debasement is and until someone really points it out to them, 'cause traditional 65 00:03:18,721 --> 00:03:23,041 advice is, you know, very consistent over the years about what return you 66 00:03:23,041 --> 00:03:26,221 should be getting and what inflation is and all those kinds of things. 67 00:03:26,221 --> 00:03:29,551 And it, and it, it really isn't that, but until someone points it out to them, it's 68 00:03:29,551 --> 00:03:30,961 very difficult for them to understand. 69 00:03:31,996 --> 00:03:32,326 Anja: Hmm. 70 00:03:32,506 --> 00:03:35,476 And have you had any people that have become, I guess, more or less 71 00:03:35,476 --> 00:03:40,036 fans and, and are con, consistently engaging with your content on Instagram? 72 00:03:40,336 --> 00:03:41,086 Ben: Other than me? 73 00:03:41,476 --> 00:03:41,576 Uh, yeah, look, 74 00:03:43,936 --> 00:03:48,016 it was, it was weird to see some videos get, you know, one, one 75 00:03:48,016 --> 00:03:49,606 and a half million, million views. 76 00:03:49,636 --> 00:03:53,236 It was, uh, it was one of the most simplest videos where I held up 77 00:03:53,236 --> 00:03:54,736 a $20 note and said, you know. 78 00:03:55,261 --> 00:03:59,431 30 years ago, it used to be this, and 10 years ago, as it, it used to be this. 79 00:03:59,431 --> 00:04:03,031 And I think that really simple message of honing into people 80 00:04:03,031 --> 00:04:04,351 about what the problem is. 81 00:04:04,771 --> 00:04:08,191 Um, and, and if it's really relatable and they can understand and they can see 82 00:04:08,191 --> 00:04:09,871 it because they can also feel it on you. 83 00:04:09,871 --> 00:04:12,181 They can also feel it on the other end when they go to the. 84 00:04:12,736 --> 00:04:15,796 The grocery store and they go to the shops and they see that their money 85 00:04:15,796 --> 00:04:17,626 just isn't going as far as it used to. 86 00:04:18,106 --> 00:04:24,436 And then when they get told, inflation is, let's say two to 2%, 3%, 4%, it doesn't 87 00:04:24,436 --> 00:04:26,986 really stack up when they look at their energy bills and everything else and they 88 00:04:26,986 --> 00:04:29,746 go, this, this isn't, this isn't true. 89 00:04:29,746 --> 00:04:31,756 So it's almost like don't believe your lying eyes because. 90 00:04:32,971 --> 00:04:36,331 What's in front of you is a really clear display of this dollar 91 00:04:36,331 --> 00:04:37,771 doesn't go as far as it used to. 92 00:04:38,371 --> 00:04:41,221 And so I really focus on the loss of purchasing power of 93 00:04:41,221 --> 00:04:43,116 the dollar rather than the CPI. 94 00:04:43,456 --> 00:04:45,931 And I don't wanna get too technical, I just wanna sort of get the, the 95 00:04:45,931 --> 00:04:50,821 top line is the loss of purchasing power of the dollar compared to 96 00:04:50,821 --> 00:04:52,501 10 years ago or 15 years ago. 97 00:04:52,501 --> 00:04:55,471 That to me, that is the biggest hit home for every people. 98 00:04:55,501 --> 00:04:58,621 'cause they go, every person 'cause they go, you know, that actually 99 00:04:58,621 --> 00:05:02,011 makes more sense than sitting down and looking at inflation and adjusting that. 100 00:05:02,011 --> 00:05:02,221 And so. 101 00:05:03,076 --> 00:05:06,526 When you sort of adjust that and work out what your finances are 102 00:05:06,526 --> 00:05:09,226 and what your future looks like and what your investments are, 103 00:05:09,916 --> 00:05:12,016 you're really going nowhere. 104 00:05:12,021 --> 00:05:16,396 And, and so when people, the penny drops and someone says, well, I have, I don't 105 00:05:16,396 --> 00:05:19,966 think this is right, these returns aren't gonna get me to where I want to get to. 106 00:05:20,716 --> 00:05:24,346 Um, so I sort of fell down two rabbit holes, rabbit holes at 107 00:05:24,346 --> 00:05:25,876 the same time, which was Bitcoin. 108 00:05:26,356 --> 00:05:29,206 But then it led me to what the current system looks like. 109 00:05:29,326 --> 00:05:30,856 And so trying to understand how. 110 00:05:31,576 --> 00:05:36,976 A lot of people do see Bitcoin inside the current system, but it's 111 00:05:36,976 --> 00:05:38,866 actually a completely separate system. 112 00:05:38,871 --> 00:05:40,006 It's, it's like an opt out. 113 00:05:40,006 --> 00:05:40,576 You've heard it. 114 00:05:40,576 --> 00:05:43,726 Everyone in the Bitcoin space has heard it, but it's an opt out of 115 00:05:43,726 --> 00:05:47,746 the current system that is keeping us on the treadmill, keeping 116 00:05:47,746 --> 00:05:51,226 us on the rat race every single day, but we are going backwards. 117 00:05:51,826 --> 00:05:55,396 So I think those kind of messages and those videos that I do that tries to 118 00:05:55,396 --> 00:05:58,936 resonate with the everyday problem and make it really relatable, uh, they're 119 00:05:58,936 --> 00:06:00,406 the ones that seem to do really well. 120 00:06:01,576 --> 00:06:04,756 Anja: Yeah, I was really pleasantly surprised by how well your content 121 00:06:04,756 --> 00:06:08,266 performs, and my background is in marketing, and I haven't been 122 00:06:08,266 --> 00:06:12,796 able to make videos that get that sort of cut through and attention. 123 00:06:12,796 --> 00:06:14,026 I'm like, what am I doing wrong? 124 00:06:14,026 --> 00:06:17,686 But also, I also feel very like embarrassed in a way doing it. 125 00:06:17,686 --> 00:06:20,866 So there's uh, I guess that fear that I need to get over. 126 00:06:21,526 --> 00:06:22,066 Um, 127 00:06:22,636 --> 00:06:22,906 Ben: that's 128 00:06:22,906 --> 00:06:23,266 Anja: natural 129 00:06:23,266 --> 00:06:25,846 Ben: though, because this, the, the, you know, the. 130 00:06:26,956 --> 00:06:30,766 The best videos or, or the best way to, to relate content like. 131 00:06:31,156 --> 00:06:35,596 This, which is so relatable to people in their life, is to give you, give them 132 00:06:35,596 --> 00:06:39,046 the same experience that you are having, you know, give them the same experience 133 00:06:39,046 --> 00:06:42,706 that a lot of people are having around, it's my dollar's just not going as far. 134 00:06:42,706 --> 00:06:46,066 And if you can really simply point it out to them that, hey, when 135 00:06:46,066 --> 00:06:48,766 there's, when there's more money created than more goods produced. 136 00:06:49,391 --> 00:06:50,891 That creates inflation. 137 00:06:50,891 --> 00:06:54,941 And so if your wage isn't keeping up with the, with the increase of those things, 138 00:06:54,971 --> 00:06:56,561 then you're, you are going backwards. 139 00:06:56,621 --> 00:06:59,711 So at, at very least, you need to find out what that problem is. 140 00:06:59,711 --> 00:07:05,291 So for us, we know that it's money printing and, and uh, and so when you have 141 00:07:05,291 --> 00:07:09,671 an excess in money printing, if you just go to the extreme, go to Venezuela, go 142 00:07:09,731 --> 00:07:13,241 to Lebanon, go to the examples that we've seen over the years, like Humar, Germany. 143 00:07:14,026 --> 00:07:20,746 When, when the money supply is manipulated and corrupted to a point where it's 144 00:07:21,286 --> 00:07:25,426 just printed into oblivion, the people that are working for that money, uh, 145 00:07:25,426 --> 00:07:29,326 the people that are saving in that money are getting debased every single day. 146 00:07:29,326 --> 00:07:31,036 And it's the people that don't have assets. 147 00:07:31,486 --> 00:07:36,316 And so I did a video that sort of said to people, look, just don't hold the dollar. 148 00:07:36,346 --> 00:07:38,686 Whatever you do, I don't, you know, I'm not a financial advisor. 149 00:07:38,686 --> 00:07:41,956 I can't give advice on what you should buy, but I did a video one saying, 150 00:07:41,956 --> 00:07:43,126 look, just don't hold the dollar. 151 00:07:43,486 --> 00:07:44,176 Whatever you do. 152 00:07:44,176 --> 00:07:48,286 So if you, even if you save a hundred dollars a week, even if you save $200 153 00:07:48,286 --> 00:07:52,366 a week, buy something that isn't the dollar, because that's the problems. 154 00:07:52,366 --> 00:07:55,036 And see, most people see it as safety. 155 00:07:55,456 --> 00:07:59,656 And so when they see it as safety, I see it as a guaranteed loss. 156 00:07:59,926 --> 00:08:01,121 So it's not safe, it's just. 157 00:08:02,131 --> 00:08:05,731 The system is designed to make you scared of going out into investing 158 00:08:05,731 --> 00:08:07,411 out other things like Bitcoin. 159 00:08:07,801 --> 00:08:10,771 So the narrative around Bitcoin is that it's risky and it's volatile. 160 00:08:10,771 --> 00:08:12,061 Yes, it's volatile, but risky. 161 00:08:12,061 --> 00:08:16,681 I, I don't agree with, but, um, they stay in the safe lane and 162 00:08:16,681 --> 00:08:18,211 that's where they want us to stay. 163 00:08:18,541 --> 00:08:22,981 So I'm very much, if the crowd is going this way, uh, if the crowd is 164 00:08:22,981 --> 00:08:26,131 going one way and, and the talking heads on TV are giving me the same 165 00:08:26,131 --> 00:08:27,046 advice that they're getting, I. 166 00:08:28,081 --> 00:08:31,351 Every single time I looked the other way to try and find some evidence that, 167 00:08:31,351 --> 00:08:33,031 hey, that, that's, that's not true. 168 00:08:34,591 --> 00:08:34,951 Anja: Yeah. 169 00:08:34,951 --> 00:08:37,531 Language is very interesting. 170 00:08:38,491 --> 00:08:42,211 You know, it wasn't until I got into Bitcoin that I just started 171 00:08:42,541 --> 00:08:46,351 seeing the opposition to the narrative that we are fed day to day. 172 00:08:47,401 --> 00:08:52,801 Sometimes you can be, if you are new or to to personal finance even, 173 00:08:53,101 --> 00:08:56,191 you can be really intimidated by some of the traditional finance 174 00:08:56,191 --> 00:08:58,261 terminologies that's thrown around. 175 00:08:58,561 --> 00:09:01,681 You know, your quantitative easing sounds so intimidating, but it's 176 00:09:01,681 --> 00:09:07,321 so simple in practice, and it's not until someone who's a sound man 177 00:09:07,381 --> 00:09:09,091 money advocate comes along and says. 178 00:09:09,501 --> 00:09:13,461 Tries to simplify it in a way that the average person can understand 179 00:09:13,731 --> 00:09:18,231 and just say it in, in, in a way that might even be shocking, but get you 180 00:09:18,231 --> 00:09:21,951 to really think about the underlying mechanics like it's legal counterfeiting. 181 00:09:22,731 --> 00:09:23,031 That's 182 00:09:23,031 --> 00:09:23,211 Ben: what it 183 00:09:23,391 --> 00:09:23,721 Anja: is. 184 00:09:24,021 --> 00:09:24,171 Yeah. 185 00:09:25,411 --> 00:09:25,621 Um, 186 00:09:25,626 --> 00:09:27,631 Ben: you and I, you and I aren't allowed to do, if you and I do 187 00:09:27,631 --> 00:09:29,221 what they do, we go to jail. 188 00:09:29,521 --> 00:09:32,971 Um, if, if you and I, we run our household budgets, right? 189 00:09:33,031 --> 00:09:37,321 We, if we run our budgets over budget and we spend more than 190 00:09:37,321 --> 00:09:39,571 we earn, we end up going bust. 191 00:09:39,631 --> 00:09:41,881 But it's not the same for the people that control the money. 192 00:09:41,881 --> 00:09:45,901 So what is there 160 odd or more currencies in the world? 193 00:09:46,441 --> 00:09:50,281 Why do we need 160 more or more government controlled currencies? 194 00:09:50,281 --> 00:09:54,011 It's all each, each individual nation has their own, and that's why you. 195 00:09:55,666 --> 00:10:01,186 It's hard to sort of portray sometimes because it's, it's, it's just over there. 196 00:10:01,186 --> 00:10:06,436 It's, it's in Venezuela, it's in Turkey, it's in Lebanon, but that's just the 197 00:10:06,436 --> 00:10:07,816 dial that, that's been turned up. 198 00:10:07,816 --> 00:10:10,036 That's the level of debasement. 199 00:10:10,036 --> 00:10:10,096 Yeah. 200 00:10:10,486 --> 00:10:15,436 So if, if the, if the metric is that the debasement is the same. 201 00:10:16,231 --> 00:10:18,241 It's just a path to the same ending. 202 00:10:18,301 --> 00:10:20,611 It's just that it is just that they've done it quicker than us. 203 00:10:20,611 --> 00:10:24,091 It's just that they've had more corrupt and, and, and, uh, more 204 00:10:24,091 --> 00:10:25,471 manipulated money supply than us. 205 00:10:25,471 --> 00:10:26,851 They've, it's the same. 206 00:10:27,286 --> 00:10:30,526 There's no different what Venezuela and what Turkey and what Lebanon and those 207 00:10:30,526 --> 00:10:33,706 countries that have been through over the years is exactly the same as what 208 00:10:33,706 --> 00:10:35,206 Australia and the US are going through. 209 00:10:35,656 --> 00:10:35,776 Anja: Mm. 210 00:10:35,776 --> 00:10:39,166 Ben: It's just that they, you know, our economies are obviously more 211 00:10:39,166 --> 00:10:42,436 developed and they can, um, you know, bandaid it and kick the can as they 212 00:10:42,436 --> 00:10:44,956 say down the road, um, for many years. 213 00:10:44,956 --> 00:10:48,346 So, yeah, it's inflation. 214 00:10:48,346 --> 00:10:49,306 Is this. 215 00:10:50,161 --> 00:10:55,171 Evil, evil thing that has almost been putting in the vernacular of 216 00:10:55,171 --> 00:10:59,671 the, of the common person and the common worker as we need inflation, 217 00:10:59,731 --> 00:11:00,691 you know, and inflation is good. 218 00:11:00,781 --> 00:11:02,251 We need two to 3% inflation. 219 00:11:02,251 --> 00:11:04,771 We can't have deflation, we've gotta have inflation. 220 00:11:04,771 --> 00:11:06,961 But if we have too much inflation, there's, that's too much. 221 00:11:07,021 --> 00:11:09,361 Like it is just madness, you know? 222 00:11:09,361 --> 00:11:11,611 So, um, yeah. 223 00:11:13,621 --> 00:11:16,981 Speaker 2: Quick one for the Aussies listening hard block is offering 224 00:11:16,981 --> 00:11:19,681 a $10 signup discount right now. 225 00:11:19,921 --> 00:11:23,431 And if you're with another exchange, ask yourself this. 226 00:11:23,761 --> 00:11:27,391 Are they Australia's longest running Bitcoin only exchange? 227 00:11:27,601 --> 00:11:30,031 Because if not, maybe it's time to switch. 228 00:11:30,601 --> 00:11:37,441 Head to hard block.com au slash join slash Honest Money and 229 00:11:37,441 --> 00:11:39,361 start stacking stats today. 230 00:11:39,815 --> 00:11:43,475 Anja: Yeah, it's, it's, it's also like, why can't they say it in a 231 00:11:43,475 --> 00:11:46,055 way that isn't managing optics? 232 00:11:46,055 --> 00:11:49,715 Why can't they say instead of, you know, they're increasing money supply 233 00:11:49,715 --> 00:11:52,715 or quantitative easing, or anything like that, why can't they just say to 234 00:11:52,715 --> 00:11:56,075 us, oh, we're going to devalue your savings for the good of everyone. 235 00:11:56,285 --> 00:11:59,735 They don't, because that sounds bad, but that's exactly what they're doing. 236 00:11:59,795 --> 00:12:01,235 That is exactly what they're doing. 237 00:12:01,385 --> 00:12:04,775 And if they said it in a way that was, I guess, more blunt or more honest. 238 00:12:04,815 --> 00:12:05,955 People would listen. 239 00:12:06,225 --> 00:12:10,845 And this is why I think Bitcoin is very important because even if you hate us, we 240 00:12:10,845 --> 00:12:15,765 are teaching you something that, you know, people in, in positions of power are not. 241 00:12:16,125 --> 00:12:16,725 So, 242 00:12:18,075 --> 00:12:18,495 Ben: yeah. 243 00:12:18,585 --> 00:12:23,325 Uh, look, my experience with all of this over six years, uh, started 244 00:12:23,325 --> 00:12:26,985 in 21 into now, so call it five years, five and a half years, and. 245 00:12:27,965 --> 00:12:30,065 It's very, very difficult. 246 00:12:30,275 --> 00:12:32,825 I think one of the videos I did the other day is very tires to try 247 00:12:32,825 --> 00:12:34,325 and explain Bitcoin to someone. 248 00:12:34,325 --> 00:12:38,945 So I, I don't want this talk with you and your listeners to be about me trying 249 00:12:38,945 --> 00:12:42,305 to explain Bitcoin to them because it's really, as you and I both know, it's 250 00:12:42,305 --> 00:12:46,690 not something you can get, uh, in an hour's podcast or a 32nd in instant. 251 00:12:46,955 --> 00:12:50,015 You just have to recognize that, okay. 252 00:12:51,215 --> 00:12:52,265 Is there a problem? 253 00:12:52,625 --> 00:12:53,945 Is my money going? 254 00:12:54,245 --> 00:12:57,365 You know, is my money getting to base and not going as far as it used to? 255 00:12:57,365 --> 00:13:01,415 Is it buying half of what it used to or 90% or what it, you know, if there is a 256 00:13:01,415 --> 00:13:03,575 problem, what is the solution to that? 257 00:13:04,325 --> 00:13:08,525 What can people, so it's just, it's just that you and I have gone 258 00:13:08,525 --> 00:13:11,255 through the same exercise and same problem that most people are going 259 00:13:11,255 --> 00:13:13,505 through today, but you and I have. 260 00:13:14,090 --> 00:13:18,500 Just gone down a corner of the internet or the universe and gone, okay. 261 00:13:18,710 --> 00:13:20,720 Bitcoin seems to be the solution to that problem. 262 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:22,730 Now there's, there's other solutions. 263 00:13:22,730 --> 00:13:23,420 There's gold. 264 00:13:23,420 --> 00:13:25,970 There's other things that people can buy, and I, again, 265 00:13:26,030 --> 00:13:27,350 I don't own any of that stuff. 266 00:13:27,350 --> 00:13:27,825 I'm a Bitcoin. 267 00:13:28,130 --> 00:13:28,745 I'm a Bitcoin only. 268 00:13:30,185 --> 00:13:34,775 But they are solving, or they're down very, very much gold as well. 269 00:13:34,775 --> 00:13:36,185 They're down the same path. 270 00:13:36,215 --> 00:13:40,025 How do I protect my time and energy that I put into work this week? 271 00:13:40,265 --> 00:13:43,055 How do I make sure that I don't wake up tomorrow and the government says, 272 00:13:43,055 --> 00:13:46,145 wait, we want to chase a new policy and spend a hundred billion this year. 273 00:13:46,415 --> 00:13:47,720 Well, where are you getting the a hundred billion from? 274 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:49,925 You already run a $40 billion deficit. 275 00:13:49,925 --> 00:13:53,345 Like, okay, well we're gonna, we're gonna create it through government 276 00:13:53,345 --> 00:13:56,675 bonds and fractional reserve banking and all that kind of stuff. 277 00:13:56,675 --> 00:13:57,275 We're gonna create it. 278 00:13:57,800 --> 00:13:59,180 And juice the economy that way. 279 00:13:59,300 --> 00:14:02,420 Well, all that means is it's just more dollars chasing the same amount of goods. 280 00:14:03,110 --> 00:14:04,385 It's not wealth building. 281 00:14:05,435 --> 00:14:09,185 So, you know, if you, even if you go down the path and, and your listeners should 282 00:14:09,185 --> 00:14:13,385 do this exercise, if they can at some point use gold, use Bitcoin as a metric. 283 00:14:13,385 --> 00:14:16,025 Maybe, maybe don't use Bitcoin as a metric over the last 284 00:14:16,025 --> 00:14:17,885 three or four months, but, um, 285 00:14:18,305 --> 00:14:19,535 Anja: pick along the time horizon. 286 00:14:19,895 --> 00:14:20,225 Ben: Yeah. 287 00:14:20,225 --> 00:14:24,005 Stretch out the time horizon and, and head towards especially gold. 288 00:14:24,425 --> 00:14:25,955 You know, gold's been around 5,000 years. 289 00:14:25,955 --> 00:14:28,680 I just think gold is a really good thing for people to try and maybe. 290 00:14:29,420 --> 00:14:32,420 Uh, wrestle with the problem and solution. 291 00:14:32,510 --> 00:14:33,050 That's all. 292 00:14:33,110 --> 00:14:35,930 You know, because of Bitcoin's volatility and so early. 293 00:14:36,410 --> 00:14:40,040 Um, there are gonna be moments where people are gonna go, look, I, that's 294 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:41,480 just, that just doesn't make sense. 295 00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:42,260 It's too, too risky. 296 00:14:42,260 --> 00:14:42,830 Too volatile. 297 00:14:42,890 --> 00:14:43,490 Volatile. 298 00:14:43,730 --> 00:14:44,540 And I get that. 299 00:14:44,540 --> 00:14:48,200 But if we're going to give someone, uh, some of your listeners anything 300 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:52,040 today, it's use a different metric other than the dollar. 301 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:54,110 Wherever you live in the world, use a different metric. 302 00:14:54,935 --> 00:14:58,115 To measure your wealth other than the dollar that you are, you're in 303 00:14:58,175 --> 00:15:02,165 uk, the pound, the dollar, the Aussie dollar, the Turkish lira, whatever 304 00:15:02,165 --> 00:15:03,845 it is, use something different. 305 00:15:04,085 --> 00:15:08,165 If you just use gold as just to try and find this problem and solution, use gold. 306 00:15:08,435 --> 00:15:12,185 You'll see what Anja and I and others around the world are 307 00:15:12,185 --> 00:15:14,855 seeing this, just that we've chosen Bitcoin to be the solution. 308 00:15:15,095 --> 00:15:17,975 Now you might get there and find Bitcoin is your, is your solution. 309 00:15:17,975 --> 00:15:21,755 You might find something else as his solution, but I want to, I want to. 310 00:15:22,115 --> 00:15:26,945 Talk to the people that are, the workers, the grinders, the ones that don't have 311 00:15:26,945 --> 00:15:30,095 assets, the, they're the ones that the government and this, and this system 312 00:15:30,095 --> 00:15:31,655 of corruption and money printing. 313 00:15:32,075 --> 00:15:35,405 They're the ones that get left behind, and I don't want anyone left, 314 00:15:35,495 --> 00:15:37,295 left behind because it's so simple. 315 00:15:37,295 --> 00:15:39,905 If they just move their time and energy into something that, 316 00:15:39,965 --> 00:15:42,695 that the government can't print, they're at least ahead of the game. 317 00:15:42,700 --> 00:15:45,395 They're, they're in, you know, first or second gear. 318 00:15:46,865 --> 00:15:50,735 Anja: Yeah, I love that and I love that we kind of have the same calling 319 00:15:50,735 --> 00:15:54,785 in life in in, in essence, because that's part of the reason why I started 320 00:15:54,785 --> 00:15:59,945 this podcast is like if I can help the everyday plebs, even just get remotely 321 00:15:59,945 --> 00:16:04,445 curious about it to start studying it, that that's the best thing I can do. 322 00:16:05,495 --> 00:16:09,605 But I'm curious to know, so what was it that finally kind of managed 323 00:16:09,605 --> 00:16:15,005 to, um, convince you that this is something worth worthy looking into? 324 00:16:15,005 --> 00:16:18,065 And are there any particular resources that you'd recommend? 325 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:19,550 Ben: Yeah. 326 00:16:19,550 --> 00:16:26,000 Um, books, podcasts, everything, uh, that, you know, maybe your listeners already 327 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:28,280 do, but just a lot more of the detail. 328 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:33,140 Um, because again, if you've identified the problem and you're wanting to 329 00:16:33,140 --> 00:16:37,760 try and find a solution, for me particularly, I looked at my super, 330 00:16:38,030 --> 00:16:40,790 um, I looked at my investments. 331 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,900 And I looked at everything and I did the numbers around, okay, well 332 00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:48,400 where am I going to be in, you know, I'm 45, uh, so retirement 333 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,650 maybe in 20, 25 years, give or take. 334 00:16:50,650 --> 00:16:54,550 So I, I, I did the numbers and started to adjust all of that for money printing. 335 00:16:54,790 --> 00:16:56,445 'cause I wanted a real snapshot of where I'd be. 336 00:16:56,445 --> 00:17:00,400 And I, I'd like to retire maybe at 55, you know, maybe 10 years time would be 337 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:02,590 nice to have a bit more time on her hands. 338 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:04,570 Um, and, and go traveling and do some things. 339 00:17:04,570 --> 00:17:08,200 So I connected it to a, a tangible. 340 00:17:08,750 --> 00:17:12,020 Goal in our life for my family and I, my wife and I, to go, 341 00:17:12,020 --> 00:17:13,760 okay, where do we want to be here? 342 00:17:14,180 --> 00:17:17,540 So I did the numbers and I love numbers, and I did the numbers and I 343 00:17:17,540 --> 00:17:20,300 adjusted everything for money printing and debasement that's been happening. 344 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:23,150 So I took the average of 8% over the last 60 years. 345 00:17:23,390 --> 00:17:25,940 Now not, it's not direct everywhere around the world, but eight 346 00:17:25,970 --> 00:17:27,260 percent's a good number to use. 347 00:17:27,710 --> 00:17:30,800 And the result that I had was shit. 348 00:17:31,865 --> 00:17:32,255 Oh, sorry. 349 00:17:33,395 --> 00:17:34,320 Anja: No, you can swear. 350 00:17:35,165 --> 00:17:35,645 Ben: Okay, cool. 351 00:17:35,735 --> 00:17:36,275 It was shit. 352 00:17:36,275 --> 00:17:38,495 I, I don't, we're not gonna have enough. 353 00:17:39,335 --> 00:17:43,055 And I was already sort of in Bitcoin, but that's when I owned 354 00:17:43,145 --> 00:17:46,565 some alternative coins as everyone does, the experience is the same. 355 00:17:46,925 --> 00:17:52,085 And, um, so I, I started to listen to people like Jeff 356 00:17:52,085 --> 00:17:54,725 Booth and Jeff Booth really. 357 00:17:55,655 --> 00:17:59,405 Does send it home in a really tangible way. 358 00:17:59,435 --> 00:18:04,595 Like it, it, it does start to challenge your thinking and there's the content 359 00:18:04,595 --> 00:18:07,235 of Bitcoin, which is, I love, you know, that you're, you're putting 360 00:18:07,235 --> 00:18:10,625 this kind of message out there because the more people that can come across 361 00:18:10,625 --> 00:18:13,835 a genuine understanding of why, why do Bitcoiners do what they do? 362 00:18:13,835 --> 00:18:15,665 Why are they so passionate about Bitcoin? 363 00:18:17,285 --> 00:18:20,585 That's, that's the reason is that it connects to a tangible goal of where 364 00:18:20,585 --> 00:18:22,295 you, where you want to be in life. 365 00:18:22,685 --> 00:18:27,665 It's not some crypto token that I want to earn 10 x over the next six months 366 00:18:27,665 --> 00:18:30,815 and then quickly trade out of, I know there's a space for that and people can do 367 00:18:30,815 --> 00:18:32,255 what they want to do, but that's not me. 368 00:18:32,825 --> 00:18:37,115 I go to work, I have a day job, as do you, as do most, and I, I wanna put 369 00:18:37,115 --> 00:18:40,745 my time and energy and my savings into something that is going to be protected. 370 00:18:41,300 --> 00:18:45,980 And so for me, connecting that tangible goal of where do I wanna be, then 371 00:18:45,980 --> 00:18:49,250 number two, doing the numbers on where I currently am and where do I need to be, 372 00:18:49,850 --> 00:18:54,170 and then adjusting for 8%, which I've got, I'll put in, uh, the link, uh, for you 373 00:18:54,170 --> 00:18:55,490 if you'd like, and you can include it. 374 00:18:55,910 --> 00:18:57,530 I put a calculator together. 375 00:18:57,950 --> 00:18:58,280 Uh, nice. 376 00:18:58,280 --> 00:18:58,970 Did I send that to you? 377 00:18:58,975 --> 00:18:59,155 Yeah. 378 00:18:59,195 --> 00:18:59,635 I dunno if I, 379 00:18:59,635 --> 00:19:00,560 Anja: yeah, I tested it. 380 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:00,980 It's great. 381 00:19:01,790 --> 00:19:05,060 Ben: Yeah, so that simply just puts all your investments in a, on an adjustment 382 00:19:05,060 --> 00:19:09,080 level of 8% and you can really work out where you're going to be in, in, you 383 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:10,035 know, the timeframe that you're analyzing. 384 00:19:11,270 --> 00:19:14,390 Uh, for me, I just went, okay, this something's gotta change. 385 00:19:14,420 --> 00:19:17,570 And it was just, I suppose at the right time, I was falling down the 386 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:20,570 Bitcoin rabbit hole and went, hang on, this all doesn't make sense. 387 00:19:21,410 --> 00:19:27,950 Um, I decided I went and put 90% of my net worth into Bitcoin. 388 00:19:27,980 --> 00:19:30,170 Super, the whole lot, everything into Bitcoin. 389 00:19:30,230 --> 00:19:32,060 We have a house, we have a business. 390 00:19:32,150 --> 00:19:37,610 Um, but, and since then, obviously, uh, with fluctuations and ups and downs in 391 00:19:37,610 --> 00:19:39,290 the middle, but I'm not here to check it. 392 00:19:39,935 --> 00:19:42,425 You know, check the price tomorrow and hope for the best. 393 00:19:42,425 --> 00:19:44,015 I'm here to check it in 2030. 394 00:19:44,285 --> 00:19:46,025 I'm here to check it in 2035. 395 00:19:46,025 --> 00:19:49,895 And if, if you can just turn off the internet and turn off the noise and, 396 00:19:49,955 --> 00:19:53,195 you know, store it, pop properly, put it in cold storage, understand 397 00:19:53,195 --> 00:19:57,785 all that and how to do that, then life just becomes a lot more simpler. 398 00:19:58,640 --> 00:19:59,810 Anja: It really does. 399 00:19:59,870 --> 00:20:04,910 I checked the price this morning, um, mainly because it's like it's moving 400 00:20:04,910 --> 00:20:08,360 a lot, so I only tend to check it when, when there's some volatility. 401 00:20:08,630 --> 00:20:13,430 We've been consolidating all of last year, and I just like my, this is my first 402 00:20:13,430 --> 00:20:15,290 bear market, so I checked and I was like. 403 00:20:16,325 --> 00:20:16,355 Ah. 404 00:20:16,355 --> 00:20:17,615 Like that was my reaction. 405 00:20:17,615 --> 00:20:19,355 Like it, it's gone down. 406 00:20:19,565 --> 00:20:19,625 Yeah. 407 00:20:19,955 --> 00:20:21,635 So I've been prepared really well. 408 00:20:21,635 --> 00:20:25,775 I was lucky to be brought into Bitcoin by other Bitcoiners who just 409 00:20:25,775 --> 00:20:30,125 said like, study this, read these books, listen to these broadcasts. 410 00:20:30,485 --> 00:20:33,065 And so I knew this was coming. 411 00:20:33,065 --> 00:20:35,860 I know there's a lot of emotion in the market at the moment, but 412 00:20:35,865 --> 00:20:37,415 I honestly, I don't feel anything. 413 00:20:37,805 --> 00:20:41,495 If anything, I feel like, oh my gosh, I need to find more money to stack. 414 00:20:41,915 --> 00:20:42,425 That's 415 00:20:42,425 --> 00:20:42,500 Ben: yeah, for right. 416 00:20:42,825 --> 00:20:42,885 Yeah, 417 00:20:43,125 --> 00:20:43,965 Anja: that's my reaction. 418 00:20:44,235 --> 00:20:47,175 I'm super curious to know, is your wife a Bitcoin as well? 419 00:20:47,925 --> 00:20:50,025 Ben: Uh, she's a Bitcoin by default. 420 00:20:50,085 --> 00:20:51,315 Um, you know, she But 421 00:20:51,315 --> 00:20:51,855 Anja: proxy. 422 00:20:52,905 --> 00:20:52,995 Ben: Yeah. 423 00:20:52,995 --> 00:20:53,005 Yeah. 424 00:20:53,005 --> 00:20:57,120 She's very, very busy with the kids and, you know, has, uh, we've got a. 425 00:20:57,725 --> 00:20:59,015 Other commitments and things. 426 00:20:59,015 --> 00:21:03,935 So she sort of, and look to the level that I get, you know, involved into Bitcoin 427 00:21:03,935 --> 00:21:07,805 and how much study I've done, it's, it, as you know, it requires a lot of time 428 00:21:07,805 --> 00:21:09,185 and effort to get down the rabbit hole. 429 00:21:09,185 --> 00:21:13,745 But she's, she certainly, we go to barbecues now or we have friends over 430 00:21:13,745 --> 00:21:16,475 and she's well equipped to have the conversation about monetary debasement, 431 00:21:16,475 --> 00:21:19,655 about what Bitcoin does and what it really is and what does it mean to buy it and, 432 00:21:20,195 --> 00:21:21,965 um, and how the current system works. 433 00:21:21,965 --> 00:21:23,195 So I would say she's a Bitcoin. 434 00:21:23,255 --> 00:21:23,495 Yeah. 435 00:21:24,545 --> 00:21:27,785 Anja: Well, if she wants to hear it from someone else other than you, you 436 00:21:27,785 --> 00:21:31,385 can always send her to women in bitcoin meetups in Byron that I organize. 437 00:21:31,745 --> 00:21:32,670 Um, they're always down 438 00:21:32,670 --> 00:21:33,110 Ben: in Byron. 439 00:21:33,340 --> 00:21:33,630 Love 440 00:21:33,630 --> 00:21:33,710 Anja: it. 441 00:21:33,940 --> 00:21:34,230 Yeah. 442 00:21:34,235 --> 00:21:38,465 Well, I figured you're close by somewhere, like within a few hours drive, at 443 00:21:38,465 --> 00:21:40,385 least from my stalking activities. 444 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:42,830 So we, we have local meetups here. 445 00:21:42,830 --> 00:21:44,150 There's meetups in the Gold Coast. 446 00:21:44,150 --> 00:21:45,320 There's meetups in the Brisbane. 447 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:47,330 The Brisbane ones are really good, I've heard. 448 00:21:47,330 --> 00:21:48,680 I haven't been yet. 449 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:53,750 Um, but yeah, there's like a thriving community and there's so many women 450 00:21:53,750 --> 00:21:58,970 here in Byron, like last meetup we had in January 14 women showed up and 451 00:21:58,970 --> 00:22:03,890 it's a mixture of women who've been in it for years and are like fully, you 452 00:22:03,890 --> 00:22:06,350 know, into self custody, into privacy. 453 00:22:07,025 --> 00:22:08,045 Digital privacy. 454 00:22:08,375 --> 00:22:11,525 And then there's women that are like completely new and very curious, 455 00:22:11,525 --> 00:22:15,725 and again, are kind of like coming and taught from an old coin route. 456 00:22:15,725 --> 00:22:19,055 And we're just gently trying to, you know, educate them like, yes, 457 00:22:19,055 --> 00:22:20,705 you can do that, it's your money. 458 00:22:21,005 --> 00:22:21,545 Um. 459 00:22:21,780 --> 00:22:25,380 But we've been down this rabbit hole as well. 460 00:22:25,380 --> 00:22:26,280 A lot of us have. 461 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:32,040 And um, you're better off just sticking to the one thing that works, um, and zooming 462 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:33,780 out, having that long time horizon. 463 00:22:33,990 --> 00:22:36,960 So it's just really nice 'cause they get to hear it from someone other 464 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:39,120 than their husband for a change. 465 00:22:39,630 --> 00:22:40,000 And then. 466 00:22:40,770 --> 00:22:44,070 We also have women who were the ones to orange peel their husbands. 467 00:22:44,070 --> 00:22:47,640 And it wasn't until like Bitcoin hit a hundred thousand that the husband was 468 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:49,710 like, okay, I see you're onto something. 469 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:51,885 Like, let's sell the house and put into Bitcoin. 470 00:22:52,085 --> 00:22:52,165 Ben: Yeah. 471 00:22:52,165 --> 00:22:52,645 That take notice. 472 00:22:53,275 --> 00:22:54,205 What do you mean it's a hundred? 473 00:22:54,265 --> 00:22:56,040 It was 50 grand last time you told me. 474 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:56,580 Now it's a hundred. 475 00:22:56,580 --> 00:22:57,810 Maybe I should take some notice. 476 00:22:57,990 --> 00:22:59,460 Anja: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 477 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:04,500 But, uh, how are you feeling with the, I guess with the current market sentiment? 478 00:23:04,620 --> 00:23:09,450 Ben: Um, uh, look, this is again, F-T-X-I-I, I was, um. 479 00:23:10,475 --> 00:23:15,875 Born in a, uh, just an absolute firestorm, my Bitcoin journey. 480 00:23:15,875 --> 00:23:22,025 So FTX blew up, you know, Celsius block fire, 60, 70%, 80% drawdowns. 481 00:23:22,385 --> 00:23:25,895 Uh, so this to me, the, the intriguing part about this one 482 00:23:25,895 --> 00:23:27,275 is that I can't particularly put. 483 00:23:27,860 --> 00:23:28,760 An event to it. 484 00:23:29,030 --> 00:23:33,080 You can't put a specific thing that happens, so you can't put a collapse, 485 00:23:33,470 --> 00:23:37,940 uh, you can't put, you know, uh, an exchange going under which may 486 00:23:37,940 --> 00:23:39,050 be happening in the background. 487 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:41,990 And the, the selling looks forced. 488 00:23:42,500 --> 00:23:46,100 Um, it looks like someone's been caught offside in a bad position with 489 00:23:46,100 --> 00:23:49,910 leverage somewhere and on a decent size, and they've been forced to sell. 490 00:23:50,390 --> 00:23:53,540 And so, uh, the current market. 491 00:23:54,035 --> 00:23:56,945 If you look at the fundamentals of Bitcoin and what's happened over the 492 00:23:56,945 --> 00:24:04,835 last year or so, um, with, you know, pro Bitcoin, uh, policy and leg legislation 493 00:24:04,835 --> 00:24:08,495 in the states, which is, let's be honest, it's, it's the epicenter for Bitcoin. 494 00:24:08,495 --> 00:24:11,345 Whatever happens in the US has the influence of what 495 00:24:11,345 --> 00:24:12,605 the Bitcoin market will do. 496 00:24:12,935 --> 00:24:16,925 Um, so I think long term certainly is, it's, it's great and the 497 00:24:16,925 --> 00:24:18,275 fundamentals are great, but. 498 00:24:18,980 --> 00:24:19,970 I always look at these. 499 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,660 This is about conviction, and what you're being presented with is an 500 00:24:23,660 --> 00:24:25,160 opportunity to go back in time. 501 00:24:25,700 --> 00:24:29,090 Bitcoin every three, four, maybe five years, gives you an opportunity 502 00:24:29,360 --> 00:24:34,760 to be Ben in 2021 to be Anja in 2022, whatever it might be. 503 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:39,230 That gives you an opportunity to go back in time, but it also asks you in this at 504 00:24:39,230 --> 00:24:41,480 the same time, do you have the conviction? 505 00:24:42,140 --> 00:24:44,750 Do you have the same conviction that you had last week or the 506 00:24:44,750 --> 00:24:46,370 week before to actually buy it? 507 00:24:47,030 --> 00:24:50,660 And so all these opportunities, and you hear it from the people that go, 508 00:24:50,690 --> 00:24:52,850 uh, I'm, I'm too late to Bitcoin. 509 00:24:52,925 --> 00:24:55,850 I'm late, and now I was getting that all last year. 510 00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:56,510 I'm too late. 511 00:24:57,470 --> 00:24:58,730 Prices already run. 512 00:24:59,060 --> 00:24:59,570 That's it. 513 00:25:00,170 --> 00:25:04,670 Okay, so go call those people now and ask them if they think they're too late. 514 00:25:04,850 --> 00:25:07,760 The prices back to the prices that it was four or five years ago. 515 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,800 Would they like to go back in time and and purchase it in 2021 and 2022? 516 00:25:13,370 --> 00:25:13,940 Guess what? 517 00:25:14,120 --> 00:25:17,780 They're getting an opportunity today in 2026 to buy it four or five years ago. 518 00:25:17,990 --> 00:25:21,680 But I, I, they won't, that's where the conviction comes in. 519 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:23,930 That's where the knowledge comes in about what they're owning and what 520 00:25:23,930 --> 00:25:25,130 they're buying and what the problem is. 521 00:25:25,970 --> 00:25:27,500 Bitcoin's not for bystanders. 522 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:28,370 You can click that. 523 00:25:28,370 --> 00:25:28,880 That's a good one. 524 00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:31,250 Um, Bitcoin is not for bystanders. 525 00:25:31,550 --> 00:25:34,310 Uh, it's not for people that are just looking to get in and out. 526 00:25:34,550 --> 00:25:37,250 Bitcoin is for, for people that are looking for long-term store 527 00:25:37,250 --> 00:25:40,370 of wealth, uh, that understand, that are willing to do the work. 528 00:25:40,940 --> 00:25:43,640 Proof of work they save for Bitcoin and you gotta do the work. 529 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:45,770 So I'm fine with the current market. 530 00:25:45,770 --> 00:25:48,050 You know, it'd be great to have some dry powder and buy some more. 531 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:48,710 Um, 532 00:25:48,770 --> 00:25:48,830 Anja: yeah. 533 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,730 Ben: And, uh, you know, so these op this, this is an opportunity. 534 00:25:52,790 --> 00:25:58,310 I, I don't see anything outside the normal Bitcoin fluctuations in its market. 535 00:25:58,550 --> 00:26:01,250 And Bitcoin didn't do this. 536 00:26:01,670 --> 00:26:03,290 Bitcoin didn't create this market. 537 00:26:03,470 --> 00:26:06,620 People did people borrowing money. 538 00:26:07,190 --> 00:26:10,670 To buy Bitcoin and then borrowing more money to buy Bitcoin. 539 00:26:10,670 --> 00:26:12,830 People created this up and down cycle. 540 00:26:12,830 --> 00:26:13,820 It's all people driven. 541 00:26:14,450 --> 00:26:16,640 Bitcoin is still producing a block every 10 minutes. 542 00:26:16,790 --> 00:26:20,510 The difficulty adjustment is still going exactly as it is supposed to. 543 00:26:20,660 --> 00:26:22,310 Algorithm's still working perfectly. 544 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:25,010 My node in there is working perfectly, sending transactions. 545 00:26:25,010 --> 00:26:25,820 I did some this morning. 546 00:26:26,330 --> 00:26:28,070 Bitcoin is operating perfectly. 547 00:26:28,370 --> 00:26:30,320 The only thing that changes is people. 548 00:26:30,860 --> 00:26:31,220 That's it. 549 00:26:32,120 --> 00:26:33,020 You're getting an opportunity. 550 00:26:33,110 --> 00:26:33,655 That's all I would say. 551 00:26:35,525 --> 00:26:40,145 Speaker 5: Need a way to sign, verify and secure your Bitcoin Australia's 552 00:26:40,145 --> 00:26:41,735 one-stop shop for Bitcoiners. 553 00:26:41,885 --> 00:26:46,325 Has you covered from signing devices, nodes, and backup solutions? 554 00:26:46,625 --> 00:26:51,650 To bid access day decor and apparel, visit shop bitcoin.com au. 555 00:26:55,205 --> 00:26:56,255 Anja: Yeah, yeah. 556 00:26:56,255 --> 00:26:59,915 This is the time to stack in build wealth. 557 00:27:00,710 --> 00:27:04,520 Yeah, it's during the bear market, so to speak. 558 00:27:04,850 --> 00:27:06,530 Um, yeah, it was interesting. 559 00:27:06,530 --> 00:27:12,410 My, this is my first bear market and I've been testing some of my 560 00:27:12,410 --> 00:27:16,850 friendships, making fun of like the, you know, I'm looking at kind of how 561 00:27:16,850 --> 00:27:21,530 much my net worth has dropped by, and then I'm, I'm like so cheeky. 562 00:27:21,530 --> 00:27:23,090 I'm going to like some of the OGs. 563 00:27:23,090 --> 00:27:25,220 I'm like, so you must be down millions. 564 00:27:27,450 --> 00:27:29,910 And they're like, if I go down, you're coming down with me. 565 00:27:31,380 --> 00:27:31,560 Ben: Yeah. 566 00:27:31,890 --> 00:27:36,690 Kinda like to, uh, like to sort of recency bias is one of those things where it 567 00:27:36,690 --> 00:27:40,410 doesn't apply if it's going down, but it certainly applies as if, if it's going up. 568 00:27:40,410 --> 00:27:45,030 But, uh, yeah, it's not nice to see your Netwealth, uh, you know, turn down 569 00:27:45,060 --> 00:27:49,860 60%, 50% in the space of three months, but, you know, in the previous two 570 00:27:49,860 --> 00:27:52,140 years we saw it go up two, three, 400%. 571 00:27:52,140 --> 00:27:53,580 So I don't know. 572 00:27:53,580 --> 00:27:53,670 But 573 00:27:54,090 --> 00:27:54,450 Anja: yeah, it's 574 00:27:54,450 --> 00:27:54,630 Ben: just. 575 00:27:55,805 --> 00:28:00,455 Anja: As a new I, I feel like I've learned so much from the, the, I guess, 576 00:28:00,485 --> 00:28:02,525 nearly two years that I've been in it. 577 00:28:02,825 --> 00:28:06,695 And I remember when I was kind of coming in just before the halving in 578 00:28:06,695 --> 00:28:13,385 2024, just being very, um, nervous about, you know, the price escaping 579 00:28:13,385 --> 00:28:18,035 me and that if I don't get in now, I am gonna lose out on potential gains. 580 00:28:18,035 --> 00:28:22,295 And I was just, it was that typical rookie mindset. 581 00:28:22,745 --> 00:28:25,925 Um, now that I've been in it for two years, it's just been 582 00:28:25,925 --> 00:28:28,985 completely changed and I'm very like. 583 00:28:29,900 --> 00:28:32,120 Not as worried about the price. 584 00:28:32,450 --> 00:28:36,440 And I wish I kind of had a little bit more patience when I first 585 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:40,970 started out, um, to do some more d cing rather than more lump suming. 586 00:28:41,390 --> 00:28:44,300 Um, but I guess, yeah, everyone has their own journey. 587 00:28:44,300 --> 00:28:50,480 I've heard people buy at the top of the cycle last time and DCA all the way down 588 00:28:50,750 --> 00:28:52,700 and it didn't waver their conviction so. 589 00:28:53,540 --> 00:28:56,360 This is where that educational piece is so important. 590 00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:56,420 Yeah. 591 00:28:56,930 --> 00:28:58,880 Um, you can't, yeah. 592 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,290 You people who are tourists, they're the ones who don't do the study. 593 00:29:04,310 --> 00:29:04,700 Ben: Yeah. 594 00:29:04,700 --> 00:29:06,200 And I, you're right. 595 00:29:06,260 --> 00:29:10,040 But I also feel that like everyone wants an answer. 596 00:29:11,195 --> 00:29:15,155 In, in this day and age, everyone wants an answer in 30 seconds. 597 00:29:15,155 --> 00:29:18,455 Everyone wants to know like, what did you do, Anja, to get into Bitcoin? 598 00:29:18,485 --> 00:29:21,965 You know, how did you just, just tell me what, what do I need to do? 599 00:29:22,235 --> 00:29:24,635 And I find a lot of that with the videos I do. 600 00:29:24,635 --> 00:29:27,605 And, and the things, you know, the messages I try and get out there, I, I 601 00:29:27,605 --> 00:29:33,785 get so many calls and it's a, it's, it's not, it's not a, a critique of them, uh, 602 00:29:33,785 --> 00:29:36,905 or, you know, we're not bagging them, but it's just, this is the day and age 603 00:29:36,935 --> 00:29:39,215 we're in is you want fast information. 604 00:29:39,755 --> 00:29:43,415 And Bitcoin requires you to have a really low time preference. 605 00:29:43,475 --> 00:29:45,785 And, and I think that goes for your education too. 606 00:29:46,505 --> 00:29:52,085 I don't know, honestly, Anja, I have probably thousands of hours podcast upon 607 00:29:52,085 --> 00:29:58,190 podcast upon podcast book, audio, audio book, just to get, and I'm still learning. 608 00:29:58,190 --> 00:29:58,895 I'm still going. 609 00:29:58,895 --> 00:29:59,465 Okay. 610 00:29:59,525 --> 00:29:59,915 Right. 611 00:29:59,915 --> 00:30:00,965 I didn't understand that. 612 00:30:02,165 --> 00:30:05,825 And so throughout that time, I just think it's a reflection of, 613 00:30:06,125 --> 00:30:08,720 of where the society is about. 614 00:30:09,740 --> 00:30:13,040 I wanna know, just someone tell me what to do and just Bitcoin isn't that, 615 00:30:13,070 --> 00:30:17,090 and if you, so I think in getting to the point it was, if people get in 616 00:30:17,090 --> 00:30:21,290 on that basis that, Hey, I saw one of Ben's videos or on his podcast and 617 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,930 you know, I decided that I like what I heard and I went and bought Bitcoin. 618 00:30:24,170 --> 00:30:26,570 Let's say they did that four or five weeks ago and they listened to 619 00:30:26,570 --> 00:30:29,780 one of your, your podcasts and went and bought $5,000 worth of Bitcoin. 620 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:32,360 Do you think they're still there now? 621 00:30:32,810 --> 00:30:35,420 Do you think they would've made it through the last 72 hours? 622 00:30:36,410 --> 00:30:37,130 I don't think so. 623 00:30:37,490 --> 00:30:37,730 Anja: No. 624 00:30:38,790 --> 00:30:41,105 Ben: Do you think they would've been buying more over that last seven, 625 00:30:41,105 --> 00:30:44,045 two hours and they would've been absolutely shitting themselves going, 626 00:30:44,435 --> 00:30:45,905 I can't believe what I've bought. 627 00:30:46,025 --> 00:30:49,835 But you and I and others that have that, that have got the education, 628 00:30:49,835 --> 00:30:51,185 this is where education is key. 629 00:30:51,185 --> 00:30:56,165 'cause if you know what you, what you're buying, then you had the conviction to not 630 00:30:56,165 --> 00:31:02,255 only just wait through these periods, but also buy like if, if, if, if your street, 631 00:31:02,345 --> 00:31:04,715 uh, or my street, if next door neighbor. 632 00:31:05,525 --> 00:31:08,525 Uh, if my next door neighbor called and said, Hey, look, I wanna sell my house. 633 00:31:08,525 --> 00:31:10,265 It's on sale for 60% off. 634 00:31:11,075 --> 00:31:12,515 You'd be absolutely cheering. 635 00:31:12,785 --> 00:31:15,665 You'd be running around the block, stark us going, how good is this? 636 00:31:15,665 --> 00:31:16,595 I'm gonna buy two of them. 637 00:31:17,315 --> 00:31:21,125 But when it comes to Bitcoin and, and, and, and it's on sale, 638 00:31:21,125 --> 00:31:22,715 it's like, oh, something's wrong. 639 00:31:22,985 --> 00:31:26,555 So it's just, they're not, it's just they don't understand what they're buying. 640 00:31:26,615 --> 00:31:28,745 But if they're buying the house, it's 60% off, they'll buy it. 641 00:31:28,745 --> 00:31:31,875 So, uh, I would just say this is a, these are. 642 00:31:32,570 --> 00:31:38,000 Really good opportunities, uh, to get into an asset that could be, you know, three, 643 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:40,580 four, $500,000 over the next five years. 644 00:31:40,765 --> 00:31:44,655 Anja: Yeah, so if you're listening to this podcast study Bitcoin first. 645 00:31:45,435 --> 00:31:46,535 That's all I've gotta say. 646 00:31:46,535 --> 00:31:47,135 Please, yeah. 647 00:31:47,275 --> 00:31:50,360 Ben: So what, what's on this podcast and go to the sovereign strategy 648 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:54,260 and, uh, I'll try and do my best to get it in 30 seconds, but maybe 649 00:31:54,260 --> 00:31:55,460 watch a few of them that might help. 650 00:31:56,525 --> 00:32:02,915 Anja: Yeah, I, I, I completely understand and can relate to people just wanting. 651 00:32:03,500 --> 00:32:05,180 Information very quickly. 652 00:32:05,210 --> 00:32:10,910 Too often I have people just demanding that I prove to them why Bitcoin 653 00:32:10,910 --> 00:32:15,620 is a thing, like in, in a minute or 30 seconds, like an elevator pitch. 654 00:32:15,950 --> 00:32:20,210 Well, it's like I can say it, but you won't understand what I'm saying. 655 00:32:20,210 --> 00:32:23,330 You'll hear words, but you won't understand the gravity of those words. 656 00:32:23,330 --> 00:32:26,570 Like, so if I say, you know, it's a neutral, decentralized 657 00:32:26,570 --> 00:32:27,860 protocol, peer to peer pro. 658 00:32:28,305 --> 00:32:32,655 That, that, that's just like a bunch of words if you don't understand 659 00:32:32,655 --> 00:32:37,365 what each one of those means and the depth of the importance of it. 660 00:32:38,145 --> 00:32:41,775 Yeah, there's no, there's no short form content that you can 661 00:32:42,135 --> 00:32:43,725 consume on Bitcoin that, um. 662 00:32:45,005 --> 00:32:46,805 That is gonna click in for you. 663 00:32:46,985 --> 00:32:51,455 I did actually see one podcast, not podcast, the YouTube channel 664 00:32:51,455 --> 00:32:52,865 that did a pretty good job. 665 00:32:53,675 --> 00:32:57,215 It was like, I'll explain everything I've learned about Bitcoin in two hours. 666 00:32:57,695 --> 00:32:58,535 Um, and I was like. 667 00:32:59,015 --> 00:32:59,495 I scoffed. 668 00:32:59,495 --> 00:33:00,245 I was like, good luck. 669 00:33:00,245 --> 00:33:04,535 But it was actually really, really good and it was the best too long, didn't 670 00:33:04,535 --> 00:33:10,835 read version of Bitcoin that I've heard, and I still hope that that itself 671 00:33:10,835 --> 00:33:14,525 doesn't replace the education and the proof of work that you need to put in. 672 00:33:14,975 --> 00:33:20,135 But I thought it was a really good entry point where you kind of get the 673 00:33:20,165 --> 00:33:24,305 value proposition without necessarily understanding the depth of it. 674 00:33:24,665 --> 00:33:26,075 And it was, um, yeah. 675 00:33:26,975 --> 00:33:27,755 Bitcoin straight up. 676 00:33:27,755 --> 00:33:33,155 So I interviewed the guy, I actually found him through YouTube and then I nosed him 677 00:33:33,155 --> 00:33:35,135 and I was like, Hey, I love your channel. 678 00:33:35,135 --> 00:33:36,185 Do you wanna be on my podcast? 679 00:33:36,185 --> 00:33:37,565 He replied, within two minutes. 680 00:33:38,405 --> 00:33:39,815 I was like, this is what I love. 681 00:33:40,085 --> 00:33:40,145 Yeah. 682 00:33:40,145 --> 00:33:40,445 And he's, 683 00:33:41,585 --> 00:33:42,515 Ben: I love spreading, I love spreading the word. 684 00:33:43,025 --> 00:33:47,045 Anja: Yeah, just, yeah, it's, it's um, really cool stuff like that. 685 00:33:47,045 --> 00:33:50,825 I think there's definitely, um, I know you are considering doing 686 00:33:50,825 --> 00:33:53,555 a podcast as well, and I will strongly encourage you to do it. 687 00:33:53,555 --> 00:33:58,775 A lot of people think that the market is oversaturated, but I don't think it is. 688 00:33:58,775 --> 00:34:03,095 I think we need more people talking about and creating those network effects 689 00:34:03,335 --> 00:34:07,190 because everyone has their own unique style and their own unique angle. 690 00:34:07,835 --> 00:34:10,145 Um, I'm not even, yeah, 691 00:34:10,145 --> 00:34:10,245 Ben: you're right. 692 00:34:10,670 --> 00:34:12,560 Anja: Entirely sure what mine is yet. 693 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:14,270 I'm just kind of putting stuff out there. 694 00:34:14,270 --> 00:34:16,400 I'm sure it's gonna crystallize in time. 695 00:34:16,405 --> 00:34:16,715 Ben: I love that. 696 00:34:16,745 --> 00:34:17,035 Yeah. 697 00:34:17,090 --> 00:34:17,660 I love it. 698 00:34:17,750 --> 00:34:18,170 You know? 699 00:34:18,170 --> 00:34:18,620 Yeah. 700 00:34:18,710 --> 00:34:21,560 The fact that you're just putting, and yeah, that some amazing guests, 701 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:26,450 some of you know, the biggest names in, uh, in Bitcoin, Twitter, uh, 702 00:34:26,450 --> 00:34:28,430 have recently been on, and I've really enjoyed those interviews. 703 00:34:28,430 --> 00:34:30,530 So I think you're right, the consistency of just putting 704 00:34:30,530 --> 00:34:31,430 the same message out there. 705 00:34:31,430 --> 00:34:35,930 But the thing, uh, when you were talking about, uh, you know, trying to 706 00:34:35,930 --> 00:34:37,670 get that message out in a short form. 707 00:34:39,065 --> 00:34:44,705 When people ask me what Bitcoin is, I don't really, I, I used to try, I used 708 00:34:44,705 --> 00:34:48,155 to be sort of using similar analogy and trying to explain it to them. 709 00:34:48,155 --> 00:34:53,585 And um, and that's when I was very similar, uh, in, in regards to my time, 710 00:34:53,645 --> 00:34:57,395 maybe a couple of years in, and was really, um, passionate about trying to 711 00:34:57,395 --> 00:35:02,765 get the decentralization and the SHA 2 56 algorithms and the difficulty adjustment 712 00:35:02,765 --> 00:35:06,640 and the, everything like that, trying to, and, and now I just tell them it's money. 713 00:35:08,345 --> 00:35:09,185 I just say it's money. 714 00:35:09,590 --> 00:35:09,930 Anja: It is 715 00:35:11,180 --> 00:35:11,530 Ben: money. 716 00:35:12,095 --> 00:35:13,355 Money is subjective. 717 00:35:13,385 --> 00:35:20,135 They used to use shells and you know, they used to use cows and like value, 718 00:35:20,165 --> 00:35:22,745 value and money is, is subjective. 719 00:35:22,745 --> 00:35:27,905 So, you know, trading things or barter, uh, back in the day, like if 720 00:35:27,905 --> 00:35:32,525 you look at the, the, the evolution of money, the, the, where we are 721 00:35:32,525 --> 00:35:36,965 now with this fiat experiment across the world, every single time. 722 00:35:37,385 --> 00:35:41,675 The Fiat paper Money Experiment has failed even since the, uh, 723 00:35:41,705 --> 00:35:43,775 11th century Chinese dynasty. 724 00:35:43,775 --> 00:35:44,885 Now, guess what? 725 00:35:44,885 --> 00:35:45,430 They all did? 726 00:35:46,660 --> 00:35:47,470 They know. 727 00:35:47,940 --> 00:35:48,230 Anja: They 728 00:35:48,605 --> 00:35:51,815 Ben: printed and they printed and they printed until it blew up. 729 00:35:52,595 --> 00:35:55,595 And so, uh, I just tell them it's money and, and some people will 730 00:35:55,595 --> 00:35:57,065 look at me and go, what money? 731 00:35:57,575 --> 00:35:58,025 You're kidding? 732 00:35:58,025 --> 00:36:00,395 It's, it's money's like, I've got $20 in my pocket. 733 00:36:00,395 --> 00:36:01,325 It's not, that's money. 734 00:36:01,595 --> 00:36:02,735 I said, well, that's currency. 735 00:36:02,945 --> 00:36:05,555 Money and currency are supposed to, can be two different things. 736 00:36:05,555 --> 00:36:09,755 You know, money, money should be designed to hold value because 737 00:36:10,565 --> 00:36:12,875 currency, make sure I get this right. 738 00:36:14,780 --> 00:36:16,850 Is whatever we choose it to be. 739 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:21,440 You know, if, if, if you and I choose to, uh, we're living on a deserted island 740 00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:25,640 and I've got carrots and you've got apples, and we choose to exchange, we 741 00:36:25,670 --> 00:36:27,470 we're just using something as a currency. 742 00:36:27,470 --> 00:36:29,510 But money is designed to hold value. 743 00:36:29,510 --> 00:36:31,640 It's where, it's something where you store your time and energy. 744 00:36:32,030 --> 00:36:35,570 It's something where you store your value for the week into. 745 00:36:36,005 --> 00:36:37,985 Uh, you know, whatever asset that is. 746 00:36:37,985 --> 00:36:41,645 And for us it's Bitcoin, but I don't think we've ever had, we've never had 747 00:36:41,645 --> 00:36:43,325 a free money where it's been neutral. 748 00:36:43,565 --> 00:36:47,375 Decentralized at a point where you can go, okay, everyone can use it. 749 00:36:47,375 --> 00:36:48,635 No one gets access to it. 750 00:36:48,635 --> 00:36:50,555 It's rules without rules, all those kinds of things. 751 00:36:50,555 --> 00:36:55,505 And so when I go down the path of just telling them it's money and that, that 752 00:36:55,505 --> 00:36:59,405 tends to resonate a bit and go, and then they sort of go, well, what's money? 753 00:36:59,465 --> 00:37:00,665 What's, what's money supposed to be? 754 00:37:00,665 --> 00:37:02,615 And you're off on another tangent, but Yeah. 755 00:37:02,615 --> 00:37:05,135 Anyway, I just thought I had, I've had that question a few times and. 756 00:37:06,530 --> 00:37:07,070 I love it. 757 00:37:07,075 --> 00:37:07,155 Does. 758 00:37:08,255 --> 00:37:12,305 Anja: Yeah, I love a good tangent, but I, I completely agree with you 759 00:37:12,305 --> 00:37:17,345 and that's why I very intentionally named my podcast Honest Money. 760 00:37:17,765 --> 00:37:21,005 I am talking mostly about Bitcoin, but I'm also talking about sound 761 00:37:21,005 --> 00:37:24,245 money principles, and I'm also talking a lot about everything that's 762 00:37:24,245 --> 00:37:25,895 wrong with fiat, with my guests. 763 00:37:25,925 --> 00:37:29,825 But at the core of it, Bitcoin is not only money, but it is a 764 00:37:29,825 --> 00:37:32,915 more honest form of money, and there's various reasons for that. 765 00:37:33,245 --> 00:37:33,905 Um. 766 00:37:33,985 --> 00:37:38,965 So, yeah, that's kind of the angle that I've taken and, uh, he I'm gonna die on. 767 00:37:40,460 --> 00:37:40,750 Ben: Yeah. 768 00:37:41,305 --> 00:37:41,605 Yeah. 769 00:37:41,695 --> 00:37:42,355 Why not? 770 00:37:42,355 --> 00:37:47,455 Because it's just, you know, as, as Jeff Booth says, we've, we've never really 771 00:37:47,455 --> 00:37:51,895 had a free and open market, but everyone thinks that, uh, there's never been a 772 00:37:51,895 --> 00:37:57,085 time where free and open markets have been, uh, you know, allowed to run free. 773 00:37:57,235 --> 00:38:01,315 There's, there's so much, uh, you know. 774 00:38:02,135 --> 00:38:04,235 Bandaid solution for every crisis. 775 00:38:04,235 --> 00:38:08,435 There was never any creative destruction allowed with, you know, or the only 776 00:38:08,435 --> 00:38:11,915 creative destruction that was allowed in the GFC was for the average worker. 777 00:38:12,095 --> 00:38:13,235 The average, average person. 778 00:38:13,925 --> 00:38:17,585 You know that, and this is what shits you about the, the system sometimes 779 00:38:17,795 --> 00:38:22,780 is that every single time the system gets itself into a, into a mess. 780 00:38:23,495 --> 00:38:27,635 The public has to pick up the bill, but the system comes at the 781 00:38:27,635 --> 00:38:32,285 government and says, Hey, we need to do this, or the system will collapse. 782 00:38:32,885 --> 00:38:37,745 And so GFC still had millions in unemployed and millions lost their 783 00:38:37,745 --> 00:38:41,315 homes across the world, and millions lost their superannuations and 784 00:38:41,315 --> 00:38:43,685 4 0 1 Ks and it still happened. 785 00:38:43,685 --> 00:38:46,865 The thing that they went to the governments about saying, Hey, we've got a 786 00:38:46,865 --> 00:38:51,035 problem, or something bad will happen, it ended up happening to the public instead. 787 00:38:51,530 --> 00:38:56,030 So creative destruction is I, I think creative destruction is beautiful, 788 00:38:56,030 --> 00:38:57,380 especially in financial markets. 789 00:38:57,590 --> 00:38:59,960 This is what you're seeing happening now with Bitcoin at the moment. 790 00:39:00,020 --> 00:39:01,040 There's no backstop. 791 00:39:01,430 --> 00:39:04,700 If you over-leveraged yourself and you, you borrowed money to buy Bitcoin, 792 00:39:04,910 --> 00:39:06,410 there's no one's coming to save you. 793 00:39:06,950 --> 00:39:09,380 If it goes down and goes down further, you don't have to force sell. 794 00:39:09,380 --> 00:39:09,890 That's it. 795 00:39:09,950 --> 00:39:10,610 You're out. 796 00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:15,080 I love that about Bitcoin because it makes you accountable to the decisions 797 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:19,760 you're making at the top of this fiat, rubbish, corrupt money system. 798 00:39:20,495 --> 00:39:24,665 Is a system that is designed not to fail for the for, for the, for the 799 00:39:24,665 --> 00:39:27,695 elites and the massive corporations and the, and the governments and 800 00:39:27,695 --> 00:39:28,535 central banks around the world. 801 00:39:28,535 --> 00:39:31,415 They just know it's not allowed to fail. 802 00:39:32,135 --> 00:39:36,605 So what that allows them to do is it allows them to take more risky 803 00:39:36,605 --> 00:39:39,215 bets and just know that if the government steps in, we are fine. 804 00:39:39,215 --> 00:39:43,025 But Anja and Ben, who, who have a hundred dollars in their pocket from 805 00:39:43,025 --> 00:39:45,275 work today, that'll just turn into $80. 806 00:39:45,275 --> 00:39:46,025 That's no big deal. 807 00:39:46,715 --> 00:39:47,015 Anja: Yep. 808 00:39:47,585 --> 00:39:49,145 The collateral damage is real. 809 00:39:49,325 --> 00:39:53,525 Yeah, that's, that's the thing, like I, I follow a lot of mainstream 810 00:39:53,525 --> 00:39:58,745 economists on LinkedIn and they, a lot of the time talk about trust as if 811 00:39:58,745 --> 00:40:00,965 that's the real currency of the world. 812 00:40:01,505 --> 00:40:07,505 And to me, that is so triggering because that trust that's placed in this system 813 00:40:08,075 --> 00:40:10,505 has been broken many, many times. 814 00:40:10,535 --> 00:40:13,145 This is why Bitcoin was created. 815 00:40:13,145 --> 00:40:14,855 It is in the Genesis block. 816 00:40:15,725 --> 00:40:19,325 The fact that the whole system is based on trust, and that trust 817 00:40:19,325 --> 00:40:24,755 is repeatedly broken, it's, it's like an abusive relationship. 818 00:40:24,755 --> 00:40:26,645 You wouldn't stay in a relationship like that. 819 00:40:26,645 --> 00:40:30,365 So why are you choosing to opt into this system that's 820 00:40:30,365 --> 00:40:34,295 designed to make you lose like. 821 00:40:34,695 --> 00:40:36,270 Yeah, I, no, thank you. 822 00:40:36,510 --> 00:40:39,975 Ben: They've just, yeah, they've just not shown, not been shown an alternative. 823 00:40:40,005 --> 00:40:44,295 And, uh, I don't, you know, Anja, I don't think people opt in. 824 00:40:44,505 --> 00:40:47,175 I think they just, I, I think they bought, they're on default. 825 00:40:47,175 --> 00:40:47,625 Anja: Default, yep. 826 00:40:47,685 --> 00:40:48,045 Ben: Yeah. 827 00:40:48,285 --> 00:40:52,425 I think, um, they're super and their 4 0 1 Ks, wherever they're listening around the 828 00:40:52,425 --> 00:40:55,665 world, they, their money that is designed to go into a system and work for them. 829 00:40:55,995 --> 00:40:59,085 That system is not designed for them, but they've been told that. 830 00:40:59,795 --> 00:41:03,155 Uh, it, it is working for them 8% over 20 years. 831 00:41:03,155 --> 00:41:03,695 You'll be fine. 832 00:41:03,695 --> 00:41:04,535 Everything will be fine. 833 00:41:04,535 --> 00:41:05,735 Don't, just don't look over here. 834 00:41:06,005 --> 00:41:10,155 They use the fancy terms of quantitative easing and, uh, easing and, and 835 00:41:10,155 --> 00:41:14,225 quantitative tightening and yield curve control and all this kinda stuff that. 836 00:41:14,930 --> 00:41:18,650 I just, from the experience I've had, I don't think people really know what to do. 837 00:41:18,650 --> 00:41:23,690 Now, what is, what is becoming really, really relevant is that on telly, there 838 00:41:23,690 --> 00:41:27,410 is the Debasement trade and Bitcoin is around the world are going what? 839 00:41:27,830 --> 00:41:29,180 That's, we've been talking about that. 840 00:41:29,180 --> 00:41:30,230 That's why we buy Bitcoin. 841 00:41:30,500 --> 00:41:32,360 What is the basement Trade is not a thing. 842 00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:35,960 It's, it's been around for a long time and you guys continue to do it. 843 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:36,980 That's why we buy Bitcoin. 844 00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:41,480 Um, and so, yeah, I, I just, I try to focus on the people that 845 00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,010 are going, okay, well, something doesn't smell right here and. 846 00:41:44,615 --> 00:41:50,645 Uh, and I feel for them because, you know, they're just not, they're not, they 847 00:41:50,645 --> 00:41:56,255 don't have a path to financial freedom and there's nothing worse than having no hope. 848 00:41:56,585 --> 00:42:00,365 You know, I don't wanna get too deep, but having no hope of, you know, if you've 849 00:42:00,365 --> 00:42:04,445 got a couple hundred grand in super and you're 50 and you've got 15 years left, 850 00:42:04,445 --> 00:42:06,785 and you sort of do the numbers and you go, well, that's gonna get me maybe 851 00:42:06,785 --> 00:42:08,465 five years of life post-retirement. 852 00:42:09,905 --> 00:42:10,775 It just, yeah. 853 00:42:11,585 --> 00:42:13,895 I think we're on, we're on the verge of something. 854 00:42:14,015 --> 00:42:15,305 Uh, hopefully changing there. 855 00:42:16,296 --> 00:42:18,456 Speaker: Not your keys, not your coins. 856 00:42:18,996 --> 00:42:23,076 If you're holding Bitcoin, your self custody setup needs to be done right. 857 00:42:23,826 --> 00:42:28,326 Mine racks delivers paranoia grade security so that you can sleep at night 858 00:42:28,326 --> 00:42:30,366 knowing that your money is protected. 859 00:42:31,236 --> 00:42:34,116 Take control and secure your money the honest way. 860 00:42:34,506 --> 00:42:37,896 Head to mine racks.com/honest Money. 861 00:42:38,761 --> 00:42:39,841 Anja: I really hope so. 862 00:42:39,841 --> 00:42:40,591 I really hope so. 863 00:42:40,591 --> 00:42:43,136 And this is why I'm willing to cope. 864 00:42:44,146 --> 00:42:49,066 Copious amounts of criticism online from people who question 865 00:42:49,066 --> 00:42:53,506 motives and say you disparaging things about Bitcoin and about me. 866 00:42:53,506 --> 00:42:55,906 Like it's just, it, it's worth it. 867 00:42:56,206 --> 00:42:57,016 Oh yeah. 868 00:42:57,976 --> 00:42:59,656 Especially on LinkedIn as well. 869 00:42:59,656 --> 00:43:02,446 Like I've just recently had a comment on YouTube. 870 00:43:02,776 --> 00:43:07,516 Um, basically someone saying that Bitcoin will need an obituary soon. 871 00:43:07,516 --> 00:43:09,106 We've heard that many times. 872 00:43:09,106 --> 00:43:11,716 At least 460 or whatever it is. 873 00:43:11,841 --> 00:43:12,061 Um. 874 00:43:13,441 --> 00:43:17,851 But yeah, I do get a lot of criticism on LinkedIn, which is just the funniest 875 00:43:17,851 --> 00:43:24,241 from tried five from people in very high positions like C-E-O-C-F-O, um, positions. 876 00:43:24,241 --> 00:43:28,471 But for every criticism, there's also a lot of positives. 877 00:43:28,471 --> 00:43:28,936 So a lot of. 878 00:43:30,106 --> 00:43:33,316 People in those same positions and those same industries, like the 879 00:43:33,316 --> 00:43:37,786 traditional finance industry do follow my content and they do support it. 880 00:43:38,116 --> 00:43:41,776 So it's like we're kind of at that cusp in Australia at 881 00:43:41,776 --> 00:43:44,326 least, where it's still weird. 882 00:43:44,506 --> 00:43:47,776 Like I, I've had so many of my ex colleagues reach out to 883 00:43:47,776 --> 00:43:49,786 me, say, Hania, I'm a Bitcoin. 884 00:43:49,786 --> 00:43:50,986 I've been in Bitcoin for a while. 885 00:43:50,986 --> 00:43:51,651 I really like it. 886 00:43:52,221 --> 00:43:54,381 But they'll never engage with my content. 887 00:43:54,381 --> 00:43:57,681 And I'm not offended by it at all, because they just are still, you know, 888 00:43:57,681 --> 00:43:59,271 the social stigma that's around it. 889 00:43:59,271 --> 00:44:02,331 They just don't wanna have that against their name. 890 00:44:02,541 --> 00:44:03,771 Completely understand. 891 00:44:03,981 --> 00:44:07,101 Um, I think that we'll see that turnaround soon. 892 00:44:07,401 --> 00:44:10,371 Um, but yeah, we're still at that weird place where it's like 893 00:44:10,371 --> 00:44:11,661 everyone's talking about it. 894 00:44:11,661 --> 00:44:13,911 A few people are really against it. 895 00:44:14,211 --> 00:44:18,081 Um, a few people are open-minded and then the majority's just quiet, 896 00:44:18,081 --> 00:44:19,551 like observing what's going on. 897 00:44:20,186 --> 00:44:20,476 Ben: Yeah. 898 00:44:20,691 --> 00:44:20,991 Anja: Yeah. 899 00:44:21,601 --> 00:44:22,261 Ben: I don't think. 900 00:44:22,291 --> 00:44:22,711 Yeah. 901 00:44:22,801 --> 00:44:28,081 And I can't believe, you know, I, the, the world is full of, uh, you know, the 902 00:44:28,081 --> 00:44:29,881 online algorithm loves to show you hate. 903 00:44:29,941 --> 00:44:33,721 That's all I seem to experience sometimes is, uh, the algorithm 904 00:44:33,721 --> 00:44:35,341 just thrives on showing people hate. 905 00:44:35,341 --> 00:44:38,671 So, uh, I would just say ignore the uneducated. 906 00:44:38,821 --> 00:44:44,371 Um, but yeah, it's, it's it, we're still so early in the journey 907 00:44:44,371 --> 00:44:46,291 of Bitcoin that people, um. 908 00:44:47,401 --> 00:44:49,381 Almost see it as an attack on, on them. 909 00:44:49,381 --> 00:44:53,221 If you, if you are, if you're a Bitcoin, you're against the current system or it's 910 00:44:53,221 --> 00:44:57,211 a scam, or it's, you know, so they just view, they put you in a box and they say, 911 00:44:57,211 --> 00:45:00,721 Hey, um, because they don't understand it. 912 00:45:00,721 --> 00:45:02,911 They don't understand what you are talking about and your passion. 913 00:45:02,911 --> 00:45:05,581 And, uh, all they know is that it's a scam. 914 00:45:05,581 --> 00:45:06,721 It's some Ponzi scheme. 915 00:45:06,721 --> 00:45:09,271 And how could you possibly believe in a scam or a Ponzi scheme? 916 00:45:09,271 --> 00:45:13,741 So again, it's just like people trying to understand something that they 917 00:45:13,746 --> 00:45:15,241 don't, they aren't educated about. 918 00:45:15,616 --> 00:45:18,076 Commenting, um, complete rubbish. 919 00:45:18,076 --> 00:45:18,771 So, yeah. 920 00:45:18,776 --> 00:45:18,946 Yeah. 921 00:45:19,126 --> 00:45:19,576 Forget the hate. 922 00:45:19,576 --> 00:45:19,636 So 923 00:45:19,891 --> 00:45:21,616 Anja: who, who told you Bitcoin's a scam? 924 00:45:21,616 --> 00:45:24,286 Did the people who printed trillions of dollars tell you that? 925 00:45:25,321 --> 00:45:25,611 Ben: Yeah. 926 00:45:26,086 --> 00:45:26,866 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 927 00:45:26,866 --> 00:45:31,156 The same people that said you're, uh, a conservative, uh, portfolio of, um, 928 00:45:31,216 --> 00:45:34,726 of, of diversified stocks and bonds will get you to financial freedom. 929 00:45:35,176 --> 00:45:35,806 How's that travel? 930 00:45:36,526 --> 00:45:40,081 Anja: Yeah, but you said something earlier on as well that uh, uh, 931 00:45:40,636 --> 00:45:43,996 again, I'm so triggered by, and that is the whole superannuation thing. 932 00:45:43,996 --> 00:45:47,236 This is another thing I'm really, really passionate about, is just 933 00:45:47,236 --> 00:45:50,896 educating people about their, their option to get their self-managed 934 00:45:50,896 --> 00:45:55,036 super fund and start investing in Bitcoin, even if it's a portion of it. 935 00:45:55,336 --> 00:45:59,416 Um, it's just so important, um, to understand that because. 936 00:45:59,951 --> 00:46:05,441 Another thing that I find immensely triggering is the industry standard 937 00:46:05,501 --> 00:46:07,731 that you are like, I guess. 938 00:46:08,431 --> 00:46:11,881 Told to use as a benchmark that what you need to retire on. 939 00:46:11,881 --> 00:46:15,631 So very loosely, please go validate this. 940 00:46:15,661 --> 00:46:22,651 Um, for individuals it's around 500,000 or 600,004 couples. 941 00:46:22,651 --> 00:46:24,481 It's maybe six or seven. 942 00:46:24,481 --> 00:46:27,451 I can't exactly remember, but it's around there. 943 00:46:27,456 --> 00:46:27,496 And. 944 00:46:27,831 --> 00:46:28,461 Ben: Quite enough. 945 00:46:28,461 --> 00:46:28,611 Yeah. 946 00:46:28,641 --> 00:46:31,251 Anja: When you look at those figures and you look at the cost of living in 947 00:46:31,251 --> 00:46:38,481 Australia and you assume an inflation rate of seven to 8%, um, you are 948 00:46:38,481 --> 00:46:45,141 really gonna have to live, die soon and, you know, live a very frugal 949 00:46:45,141 --> 00:46:47,181 lifestyle where you can't travel. 950 00:46:47,181 --> 00:46:50,181 And as a retiree, you can't afford overseas holidays. 951 00:46:50,181 --> 00:46:52,131 You might not even be able to afford heating. 952 00:46:52,521 --> 00:46:57,111 Like it's just, I I, you have to eat, you know, processed fiat food. 953 00:46:57,991 --> 00:47:03,601 Um, it's, it's just immensely triggering and this is why, um, for the first 954 00:47:03,601 --> 00:47:07,111 time in my life, I found, I have found something where I'm like, absolutely 955 00:47:07,111 --> 00:47:11,941 not embarrassed to speak up about this. 956 00:47:12,391 --> 00:47:15,991 Um, no matter how much criticism I receive. 957 00:47:16,051 --> 00:47:20,371 And yeah, if I, yeah, I, I know I'm on the right side of history, so 958 00:47:22,141 --> 00:47:24,941 Ben: Yeah, I was gonna say, yeah, I won't, I won't swear too much. 959 00:47:25,636 --> 00:47:26,806 Uh, criticism. 960 00:47:26,866 --> 00:47:31,306 The thing is such a polarizing world where we're creating sides, right? 961 00:47:31,306 --> 00:47:33,346 You know, it's blue, blue team, red team. 962 00:47:34,306 --> 00:47:37,516 You're, you're a green or you're a Democrat, or you're a Republican. 963 00:47:38,506 --> 00:47:39,886 Can we just stop with the sides? 964 00:47:40,516 --> 00:47:42,736 Can we stop with the putting everyone in groups? 965 00:47:43,276 --> 00:47:47,206 All, all you are doing, all I'm doing, all the Bitcoiners are doing, and, and 966 00:47:47,206 --> 00:47:50,686 even for the fact that the non bitcoiners, the people that are trying, all we're 967 00:47:50,686 --> 00:47:52,246 trying to do is have a better life. 968 00:47:52,876 --> 00:47:54,226 All we're trying to do is earn money. 969 00:47:54,226 --> 00:47:57,496 Look after our kids if you have them, or look after your family. 970 00:47:57,496 --> 00:47:59,026 You just want for a better life. 971 00:47:59,566 --> 00:48:04,816 And, and that's, that's the deeper value of Bitcoin is that you, when you, 972 00:48:04,876 --> 00:48:10,246 when you recognize that the path to freedom in Bitcoin is you get to control 973 00:48:10,246 --> 00:48:14,626 the, in regards to where you want, you know how you wanna control your money. 974 00:48:15,841 --> 00:48:16,561 And why? 975 00:48:17,041 --> 00:48:17,941 What's wrong with that? 976 00:48:17,971 --> 00:48:21,571 What, what's wrong with, with wanting a better life via Bitcoin 977 00:48:21,571 --> 00:48:26,251 or via Gold or whatever, um, you know, strategy you've got and. 978 00:48:27,451 --> 00:48:31,741 The majority of of people have been told to just how many years did we work? 979 00:48:31,771 --> 00:48:34,411 And, and super was just looked after for us. 980 00:48:34,501 --> 00:48:35,491 But where does that super go? 981 00:48:35,521 --> 00:48:36,601 Where is it invested? 982 00:48:37,111 --> 00:48:40,681 A lot of it's invested in government policies and government funded projects. 983 00:48:41,071 --> 00:48:43,921 A lot of it, a lot of it's invested in, in, uh, bonds. 984 00:48:43,921 --> 00:48:46,291 A lot of it's invested in just standard ETFs. 985 00:48:47,026 --> 00:48:49,066 And how are they performing against Bitcoin? 986 00:48:49,096 --> 00:48:50,626 How are they performing against gold? 987 00:48:50,626 --> 00:48:54,316 How are they performing against hard assets that don't need any management? 988 00:48:54,316 --> 00:48:55,546 It's just a rock in the ground. 989 00:48:55,906 --> 00:48:59,386 Um, the other one's just a, when I say just, it's just a digital monetary 990 00:48:59,386 --> 00:49:01,576 network backed by math and energy. 991 00:49:02,356 --> 00:49:05,086 Okay, well then you start to realize, well, I don't need to 992 00:49:05,086 --> 00:49:07,816 pay you 4% to look after my money. 993 00:49:07,816 --> 00:49:09,736 I don't need to pay all the fees. 994 00:49:09,736 --> 00:49:11,026 All I just need to know is the truth. 995 00:49:11,836 --> 00:49:15,046 And so in seeking the truth, which is what you've done and others, and 996 00:49:15,226 --> 00:49:17,896 Bitcoin is around the world, all they're doing is trying to find a better life. 997 00:49:19,216 --> 00:49:26,596 So, um, having, having that as your basis for, you know, being a someone that wants 998 00:49:26,596 --> 00:49:31,306 to learn about Bitcoin, if you look, if you've got $10 million saved up in 999 00:49:31,306 --> 00:49:34,576 the bank and you're retired, uh, look. 1000 00:49:34,576 --> 00:49:36,436 The life's pretty good for you, right? 1001 00:49:36,736 --> 00:49:39,916 You, you don't really need to start going down the Bitcoin rabbit hole 1002 00:49:39,916 --> 00:49:43,966 if you don't want to, but this is why it's a bottom up, bottom up movement. 1003 00:49:44,176 --> 00:49:48,976 This is why it's a not a top down monetary network network, it's, it's for people 1004 00:49:48,976 --> 00:49:53,386 that are in Zimbabwe or in Turkey, Lebanon, Venezuela, or even in Australia 1005 00:49:53,686 --> 00:49:55,876 that are just going, I can't get ahead. 1006 00:49:56,476 --> 00:50:00,136 So that's the option for people to go, why can't I get ahead? 1007 00:50:00,286 --> 00:50:03,586 And it's around monetary debasement and inflation and corruption around the money. 1008 00:50:04,081 --> 00:50:07,771 And if you, if you then connect all of that to what's my solution to that, 1009 00:50:07,771 --> 00:50:09,451 then Bitcoin is one of those solutions. 1010 00:50:10,201 --> 00:50:12,001 Why do you need to put people on the side? 1011 00:50:12,301 --> 00:50:14,461 Just go, Hey, I'm looking for a better life. 1012 00:50:14,971 --> 00:50:15,481 What do you want? 1013 00:50:15,541 --> 00:50:18,151 Okay, well on financial freedom, when do you want it by? 1014 00:50:18,211 --> 00:50:21,181 I wanna be 50, 55 and I wanna have some financial freedom. 1015 00:50:21,181 --> 00:50:21,511 Great. 1016 00:50:21,541 --> 00:50:22,141 What does that look like? 1017 00:50:22,141 --> 00:50:26,011 What number is that and what return are you going to need with the surplus money 1018 00:50:26,011 --> 00:50:29,101 that you're investing to get that goal? 1019 00:50:29,161 --> 00:50:29,611 That's it. 1020 00:50:30,421 --> 00:50:31,381 That's, that's all it is. 1021 00:50:31,411 --> 00:50:31,621 Okay. 1022 00:50:31,621 --> 00:50:36,061 If you wanna be 55 and you need a million dollars in the bank, okay, great. 1023 00:50:36,061 --> 00:50:36,691 Do the numbers. 1024 00:50:36,721 --> 00:50:39,901 'cause you, and I'll tell you what you do, the numbers, you're not getting 1025 00:50:39,901 --> 00:50:43,531 there on the six to 8% or the 9% that you're getting through your super 1026 00:50:43,531 --> 00:50:46,321 at the moment, after you adjust for monetary debasement not happening. 1027 00:50:47,191 --> 00:50:50,821 So that's why I say in my videos, you know, you need, you need a 15 to 20%. 1028 00:50:51,751 --> 00:50:57,001 Because that is then the true eight to 10% that you are net after debasement. 1029 00:50:57,001 --> 00:51:02,581 So, and you mentioned on that around, uh, super, you, this is 1030 00:51:02,581 --> 00:51:03,661 one of the intriguing things about. 1031 00:51:04,426 --> 00:51:07,966 Managing your own super is that you start to get the control of 1032 00:51:08,176 --> 00:51:09,946 how do I dial up that return? 1033 00:51:09,946 --> 00:51:12,676 How do I dial it up to get 15 to 20%? 1034 00:51:13,066 --> 00:51:16,366 And I've done a few videos on this, on what it would mean to have a diversified 1035 00:51:16,366 --> 00:51:21,676 portfolio of few of, of, let's say Bitcoin gold and maybe some stocks if you wanted 1036 00:51:21,676 --> 00:51:26,776 to just play, uh, play it consistently across a few different, um, asset classes. 1037 00:51:27,256 --> 00:51:29,476 And you don't need to take amazing risk. 1038 00:51:29,476 --> 00:51:33,226 You don't need to be like me or others who have 90% of their net worth in Bitcoin. 1039 00:51:34,336 --> 00:51:37,456 To do that, the, the dial only needs to be turned up. 1040 00:51:38,026 --> 00:51:39,706 And this is not financial advice by the way. 1041 00:51:39,976 --> 00:51:43,816 It's just an example of what I've done in the past and what I've analyzed is 1042 00:51:43,816 --> 00:51:49,816 that you only need to maybe dial up 20 to 25% or 30% of your portfolio of super to 1043 00:51:49,816 --> 00:51:54,106 be allocated to gold or bitcoin across, you know, a 5, 10, 15 year time horizon. 1044 00:51:54,286 --> 00:51:58,006 It gets you 15 to 20% based on historical performance. 1045 00:51:58,726 --> 00:52:01,816 Um, you know, you don't have to go and risk all the, all the 1046 00:52:01,816 --> 00:52:02,746 chickens, is what I'm saying. 1047 00:52:04,231 --> 00:52:04,561 Anja: Yeah. 1048 00:52:05,131 --> 00:52:05,491 Yeah. 1049 00:52:05,521 --> 00:52:09,541 I'm pretty conservative in my estimates in for the next 10 years. 1050 00:52:09,721 --> 00:52:10,476 Like I like to go. 1051 00:52:11,881 --> 00:52:15,781 I think it's gonna be 30% compound annual growth rate, but I even like to 1052 00:52:15,781 --> 00:52:20,761 calculate at 25 and just put up inflation to eight and just, you know, be super 1053 00:52:20,761 --> 00:52:25,051 conservative and then be pleasantly surprised by, I guess better outcomes. 1054 00:52:25,441 --> 00:52:26,971 Um, but yeah. 1055 00:52:27,031 --> 00:52:29,401 I am also conscious of time. 1056 00:52:29,461 --> 00:52:35,191 Um, I wanted to ask you in particular, you know, having been in Bitcoin for 1057 00:52:35,191 --> 00:52:40,261 a number of years now, can you see a difference in your family life? 1058 00:52:40,461 --> 00:52:41,896 Before and after Bitcoin? 1059 00:52:42,489 --> 00:52:43,299 Ben: Yeah, definitely. 1060 00:52:43,359 --> 00:52:43,689 Yep. 1061 00:52:43,779 --> 00:52:47,829 Because I think it starts, it starts at the top, it starts with the family, uh, 1062 00:52:48,219 --> 00:52:53,739 sorry, it starts with, uh, mom and dad or however your family dynamics are set up. 1063 00:52:53,769 --> 00:52:56,499 It's, it starts with the, with us. 1064 00:52:56,589 --> 00:53:01,839 So I found when I was on the journey of, of building my business and 1065 00:53:01,839 --> 00:53:04,639 going the grind and trying to get to the point where I was just. 1066 00:53:05,439 --> 00:53:11,289 You know, flogging yourself at, at, at ridiculous hours and pace to get a number. 1067 00:53:11,409 --> 00:53:14,109 Um, you're not, you're not the best father, you're not the best husband. 1068 00:53:14,559 --> 00:53:19,839 Uh, and so when you have, when you have a clear goal in mind of, of, 1069 00:53:20,169 --> 00:53:25,359 okay, this is starting to really give me some freedom of time, you can start 1070 00:53:25,359 --> 00:53:29,349 to become a better person, better father, better husband, um, and just 1071 00:53:29,349 --> 00:53:30,549 have a better outlook on the world. 1072 00:53:30,729 --> 00:53:34,184 And so I think a lot of the problems in the world today are. 1073 00:53:34,914 --> 00:53:39,204 Around money, around how difficult it's for people, uh, to, to hit 1074 00:53:39,204 --> 00:53:42,444 those, um, you know, to achieve those financial goals that they have. 1075 00:53:42,444 --> 00:53:47,754 So yeah, for us, um, it wasn't immediate, but it was, Hey, 1076 00:53:47,754 --> 00:53:48,834 we're on this journey together. 1077 00:53:49,554 --> 00:53:51,294 And now the kid, the kids even own Bitcoin. 1078 00:53:51,639 --> 00:53:56,814 I, I took their, I took their, um, I took their CommBank, uh, saver accounts. 1079 00:53:56,814 --> 00:53:57,534 I closed them. 1080 00:53:58,134 --> 00:53:59,124 Uh, they were getting it. 1081 00:53:59,454 --> 00:54:01,044 You should have seen the return they were getting on. 1082 00:54:01,044 --> 00:54:01,854 It was amazing. 1083 00:54:01,854 --> 00:54:03,384 It was like a dollar 50 a year. 1084 00:54:03,924 --> 00:54:05,634 I couldn't believe how good the return was. 1085 00:54:06,144 --> 00:54:11,094 Um, and so we, uh, we put it into Bitcoin and so my daughter who's, 1086 00:54:11,124 --> 00:54:16,974 uh, well they're turning, um, turning 17 and 14 over the next few months. 1087 00:54:18,024 --> 00:54:21,684 Uh, they've got their, you know, savings in Bitcoin and they save in Bitcoin. 1088 00:54:21,684 --> 00:54:22,824 I put it in cold storage. 1089 00:54:22,824 --> 00:54:26,304 So, yeah, it's just this fun family journey we've been on 1090 00:54:26,304 --> 00:54:27,864 and hopefully it continues. 1091 00:54:28,374 --> 00:54:29,064 Anja: Yes. 1092 00:54:29,154 --> 00:54:29,934 Love that. 1093 00:54:30,544 --> 00:54:32,134 Love that so much. 1094 00:54:32,134 --> 00:54:36,214 That is just like the, this is what really inspires me the most. 1095 00:54:36,214 --> 00:54:39,034 And these are the kind of stories that I really wanna share with the audience 1096 00:54:39,034 --> 00:54:43,654 because it is everyday families, Australian families, having their lives 1097 00:54:43,654 --> 00:54:46,384 turned around, you know, having more. 1098 00:54:46,429 --> 00:54:47,809 Time with their loved ones. 1099 00:54:47,809 --> 00:54:49,789 Like that's all we want at the end of the day. 1100 00:54:49,789 --> 00:54:54,109 No matter, like you said, where, where you sit on the political spectrum, we all just 1101 00:54:54,229 --> 00:54:58,909 wanna have a better quality of life and this is what Bitcoin helps people achieve. 1102 00:54:58,909 --> 00:55:04,129 But obviously the big caveat is study it, know what you hold, um, because it 1103 00:55:04,129 --> 00:55:08,149 is a very volatile asset and there are so many emotions to manage around that. 1104 00:55:08,509 --> 00:55:09,139 Um. 1105 00:55:09,424 --> 00:55:09,844 But yeah. 1106 00:55:09,844 --> 00:55:11,044 Do you have any final thoughts? 1107 00:55:11,044 --> 00:55:14,944 Obviously I'll share all of your, like links, um, to your website, to your 1108 00:55:14,944 --> 00:55:17,524 social media in the show notes, and yeah. 1109 00:55:17,524 --> 00:55:20,404 Do you have any final messages for the audience that you'd like to share? 1110 00:55:20,464 --> 00:55:21,994 Speaker 7: I've really enjoyed talking with you. 1111 00:55:21,994 --> 00:55:26,884 I would just encourage people to, uh, don't be a sheep. 1112 00:55:27,064 --> 00:55:30,904 Uh, don't take other people's word for it, including minor onions. 1113 00:55:30,904 --> 00:55:35,824 Go and do your research because doing the research can mean that you have, you 1114 00:55:35,824 --> 00:55:39,274 change your future, not just for you, but you change your future for your kids. 1115 00:55:39,274 --> 00:55:42,574 You change, you, you, I'm not talking about generational wealth, but you help 1116 00:55:42,574 --> 00:55:44,314 your kids understand what money is. 1117 00:55:44,824 --> 00:55:48,934 Uh, money isn't everything, but it certainly helps and so especially 1118 00:55:48,934 --> 00:55:50,284 when it's getting stolen from you. 1119 00:55:50,779 --> 00:55:53,869 It's okay if it's not getting stolen from you or if it's not being debased, but 1120 00:55:54,169 --> 00:55:58,279 if you recognize that your hard earned money is being stolen from you, that's 1121 00:55:58,279 --> 00:56:02,209 probably a good point to start to go, Hey, maybe I need to do some research. 1122 00:56:02,569 --> 00:56:06,769 And when you do the research, just find trusted people. 1123 00:56:06,799 --> 00:56:07,819 They're easy to find. 1124 00:56:08,119 --> 00:56:15,229 Go to a's podcast, go to my Instagram channel, um, and fall. 1125 00:56:15,229 --> 00:56:16,189 Fall in willingly. 1126 00:56:16,744 --> 00:56:21,004 Don't, you know, be skeptical, but know that there already, uh, there 1127 00:56:21,004 --> 00:56:26,344 already is a problem that exists and your, your journey is to search and 1128 00:56:26,344 --> 00:56:29,044 find the solution to that problem. 1129 00:56:29,254 --> 00:56:34,024 Might be Bitcoin, might not be, but whatever you do, don't stay where you are. 1130 00:56:34,444 --> 00:56:37,714 Don't stay in, in neutral, going backwards with your money being 1131 00:56:37,714 --> 00:56:39,034 stolen from you, from the government. 1132 00:56:39,064 --> 00:56:42,124 'cause I can tell you it's gonna continue at a pace that you, you 1133 00:56:42,124 --> 00:56:43,894 don't see, but it's gonna get worse. 1134 00:56:43,984 --> 00:56:46,084 So, um, yeah. 1135 00:56:46,399 --> 00:56:50,749 Be, be, uh, be motivated by trying to find a solution for your 1136 00:56:50,749 --> 00:56:52,459 family and, and, and your goals. 1137 00:56:52,459 --> 00:56:53,959 Like, just get out there and have a go. 1138 00:56:54,265 --> 00:56:55,435 Anja: Love that so much. 1139 00:56:55,435 --> 00:56:56,629 Thanks for your time, Ben. 1140 00:56:56,629 --> 00:56:57,319 You're welcome, Manu. 1141 00:56:57,319 --> 00:56:57,859 I enjoyed it. 1142 00:56:57,859 --> 00:56:58,069 Thank you. 1143 00:56:59,501 --> 00:57:01,991 Speaker 4: Still here you are one of the good ones. 1144 00:57:02,471 --> 00:57:05,111 We'll be back next week with a brand new episode. 1145 00:57:05,471 --> 00:57:09,191 If you enjoy how we cut through the noise, consider supporting us 1146 00:57:09,191 --> 00:57:11,441 directly via the Lightning QR code. 1147 00:57:11,951 --> 00:57:13,991 Got a question or a thought to share? 1148 00:57:14,381 --> 00:57:15,731 Comments are wide open. 1149 00:57:16,031 --> 00:57:17,261 We'd love to hear from you. 1150 00:57:17,371 --> 00:57:22,651 For bonus content and updates, follow us on socials at Honest Money Show. 1151 00:57:23,701 --> 00:57:28,531 Until next week, take care of yourself and your money and stay decentralized.