In today's episode, I sit down with Kellen Casebeer, founder of The Deal Lab, and talk about his unique approach to message-market fit testing and GTM strategy.
We dive deep into his unconventional journey from sales rep to fractional VP of sales to agency founder, exploring how he discovered the power of segmentation and messaging before having a product to sell. We discuss the evolution from basic templates to sophisticated Clay workflows, the value of testing beyond just meeting generation, and why he believes most sales teams are missing massive opportunities for optimization regardless of whether they're hitting their goals.
Enjoy 🙂
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00:00) Introduction to Outbound Alchemists
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00:29) What The Deal Lab Does: Message-Market Fit Testing
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03:05) The Birth of Message-Market Fit Testing Concept
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04:32) Kellen's Journey from Sales to Agency Founder
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05:21) Early Days with Smartlead and Clay Discovery
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06:55) Why Segmentation and Testing Beat Volume
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09:01) Client Types and Strategic Applications
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13:15) Testing Value Beyond Early-Stage Companies
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14:30) Outbound as Market Research and Insight Engine
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15:20) Learning Market Language vs Company Speak
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22:08) Building Credibility Through Client Work
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25:13) Contact Information and Closing
📧 Email - saurabh@salesrobot.co
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👋🏼 GET IN TOUCH You can also reach out with any feedback, ideas or thoughts about the lessons you've learned from the episodes on my email.
What is Outbound Wizards by SalesRobot?
This podcast is for anyone curious about the fast-growing world of GTM Engineering — whether you’re an SDR, RevOps pro, or just getting started. We break down the latest news, from Clay’s $3.1B valuation to cutting-edge workflows and Clay tables lighting up LinkedIn. Tune in for real case studies from startups, mid-market teams, and enterprises that are redefining how go-to-market gets done.