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Welcome back to the Laravel news

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creator series today

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We're joined by Tim

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Leland who is the creator of T.ly

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 which is a URL shortening service.

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That's my had been in

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business for a while now, but uh

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Tim welcome to the show and you know, let

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me know if I've missed

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anything there in that little intro

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No, that's that's a pretty good. Thanks

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for having me. Glad to be here

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sweet sweet. Yeah, so you've

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I'm trying to think now you've been in

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Laravel for quite a while, right? You got

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started back in the early days

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yeah, so

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you know graduated college computer

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science degree kind of

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with that standard route and

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You know worked a software development

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job doing that and IT type

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stuff and then started building

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Websites on the side so I

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built some like local businesses

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websites and I started just you know

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trying to figure out what can I use to

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you know build a site and I

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Studdled upon Jeffrey way and you know,

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Lara cast but he was

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doing I think it was net tuts

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Code igniter tutorials way back maybe

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like 2013 2012 and I watched like

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everything he put out and then

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He kind of switched over to Laravel and

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that's when I kind of

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followed him and just you know

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Watched everything on Lara cast that he

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put out and just pretty

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much learned it from from him

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I kind of give him credit for teaching me

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a lot of the my early,

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you know coding styles and

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Get me into Laravel and

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then you know, I'm kind of

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grateful for that because it I would say,

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you know, obviously if you're watching

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this, you know, Laravel

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saves you a ton of time and

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all the advantages of it, so

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You know, I took advantage of all that

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Laravel had to offer back in 2014

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That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah, he was you

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know back in those days

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It was like there was not a whole lot of

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like really good training material out or

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anything and he sort of

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brought everybody on board

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It was sort of it was it was really

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amazing what he was able to do and

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accomplish and then

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you know going from that

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Net tuts over to you know creating Lara

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cast and now it's kind of the de facto

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training resource for all kinds of stuff

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so it's it's

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That's one of the big reasons I think

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Laravel grew in the beginning was because

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of him that was awesome

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Yeah, he just made it

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really easy to learn

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So I mean, you know obviously going

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through school you learn some things

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but then when you start actually doing it

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in the real world how to get

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a you know website hosted and

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You know, I was early like

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Laravel Laravel Forge user

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So I've been I was actually looking at

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that a couple weeks ago and I think I

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signed up in like 2014

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I don't I don't know when it was started,

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but you know, I've been using that to

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host sites and just

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building side projects

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learning

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Trying to learn how to you know grow a

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website or an app or whatever. It's a

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marketing type stuff

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Just that's kind of been my my journey

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That's awesome. Well, so speaking of your

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product is T. L. Y and

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How did that come about like you just

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like one day woke up and be like hey

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I want to make a URL shorter or was there

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like something that

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driven you to create this

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Yeah, so

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You know a lot of developers. It's even

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like a coding, you know challenge that

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they do for like software in software

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Interviews, so they'll say

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hey, how would you design?

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You know a link shortener so it's it's

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kind of like a classic computer science

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The software developer project that

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people always like to build but what got

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me started was a company

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I was working for they needed an

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application for like online

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giving and it was going to be

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through text messages so they wanted to

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build a you know, send it a link and

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In doing that the link the URL had to

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have some encoding in it and some special

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stuff to kind of like log them in

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behind the scenes, so

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They wanted a way to send that but the

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URL so long so that led to well

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We need a URL shorter and we looked at

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you know, some of the options out there

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and decided well, you know

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We could just build our own

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Use our own, you know short domain and I

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think I built like a very

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simple version and you know

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Maybe over a weekend pretty much. It was

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it was a few days. So

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Built that you know kind of saw, you

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know, we we found value

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in it and then fast forward

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I think that maybe was like

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2016 2017 but fast forward

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Google kind of announced that they were

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shutting down their free URL shortener

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and that kind of prompted me to

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Build initially a browser extension. So I

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didn't really plan to

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build my own service

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but I was building browser extensions for

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like Chrome and Firefox and

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It's just like a side project so I built

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a link shortener extension and what it

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did is it used all these other services

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so like bit.ly tiny URL

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in a bunch of other free ones and

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Yeah, so that was kind of where I got so

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I saw that, you know businesses needed it

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Built the extension because Google

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announced they were shutting down their

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service and then the

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extension grew just because

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You know people were looking for

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alternatives once Google

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kind of shut their service down

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Gotcha, yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, so

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I've actually been using

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it man for a few months now

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My use case was you know, we send out

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newsletters and then if we have sponsors

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then they're like well

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You know, can you give me you know stats

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on all my links in your

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newsletter and I'm like

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Yeah, that's always annoying because then

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I have to go to the

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newsletter software and like pull up

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You know that that campaign and and then

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just try to figure out how many people

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clicked and all that stuff

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So I was like, well, there's got to be an

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easier way and then so I

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signed up and now I use the short

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The T to a while links in the newsletter

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and then I can share the stats

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You know from your website over to the

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sponsor and they can just look at

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everything and see see, you know

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How many clicks it got and all the other

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stuff so that's it's been

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really really handy for me

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Just you know having that simple simple

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way of you know, making everybody happy.

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So I really like the

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service. I think it's awesome

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That's awesome. Yeah, it's always great

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hearing you know people using it

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You know if you do a lot of support

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Usually only here like the negative stuff

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and the problems but it's nice always

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nice hearing the positives

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And that's a great use case because it's

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not really you don't really need the

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links to be like short

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And that's what people usually think

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like, you know, obviously

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You know short link

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is called a URL shorter

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But it's also great for if you just need

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something to you know

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Track engagement and like alright how

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many people are clicking

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on links and need that basic

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information versus like having to spin up

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your own software on your

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back end to track clicks and

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You know if you just want something quick

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to track that and it's really useful

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For sure for sure

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You know, so I you know, everybody thinks

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I know I'm probably the same

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way is like oh, well, you know

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We're just mapping two fields in the

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database or whatever

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but it's there there's way more to it

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right behind the scenes like you have I

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Assume you have to have like tons of like

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spam tracking and all this other stuff.

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Is that sort of accurate?

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It's it's like way more

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involved than you think

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Yeah, so initially I built so I built the

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extension this like link shortener extra

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URL shortener extension and

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It implemented it just used API's so that

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was the very first version of the product

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was just an API create a short link

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And then on the actual like domain T dial

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why it would just redirect

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I didn't have like logins or you know,

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any kind of interface

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But then yeah as soon as you you know

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that so that part is what most people

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think of just you know

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In a data base you have one table that

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just stores, you know long

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URL short URL and redirect

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but yeah as soon as you

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get analytics and then

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You know just trying to like scale some

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of that stuff and you get one URL that

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kind of blows up and gets tons

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Of traffic you still got to you know

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Track all that you can't just you know,

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cash it or something like that

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You got to know that you know where the

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users are coming from and how to scale

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that so it gets more complicated for sure

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and then like you said the spam thing,

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you know, there's definitely a lot of

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that a lot of automated bots and

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You know, you got a build-in detection

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for that type of stuff

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Yeah

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that sort of reminds me of

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Just me personally cuz so to give

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everybody a little backstory so I added

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some of the short links to the website

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and just for some of the

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sponsors that we have and

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They were getting just tons of clicks and

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it was like this is a lot, you know

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So I emailed Tim and I was like, you

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know, what's going on here?

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And he's like you got you've got a thing

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hitting it. It was like certain IPs

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So then I went to cloud

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flare and it was like sure enough

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It was like cloud flare was not blocking,

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you know, these three IPs that were just

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like, you know hitting my server so hard

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So that I just create a firewall rule

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block those and now

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everything's back to normal and like

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You know, I'm not

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getting hit hit by all the

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Stuff anymore

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01:09:34,000 --> 01:09:36,125
So, you know all that stuff's super

279
01:09:36,125 --> 01:09:38,250
useful to have and to be able to you know

280
01:09:38,250 --> 01:09:39,875
Track it down the way you you were you're

281
01:09:39,875 --> 01:09:41,625
able to use, you know using your service

282
01:09:42,791 --> 01:09:44,708
Yeah, so that's it. That's good to know.

283
01:09:44,708 --> 01:09:46,375
So you were able to find that out

284
01:09:46,666 --> 01:09:49,333
Mm-hmm, and they were hitting layer of L

285
01:09:49,333 --> 01:09:51,125
news directly. So they were hitting your

286
01:09:51,125 --> 01:09:51,958
service and then like

287
01:09:51,958 --> 01:09:53,333
scanning all the links on there

288
01:09:53,750 --> 01:09:56,083
Yeah. Yeah, it was almost like a like a

289
01:09:56,083 --> 01:09:57,333
scraper bot type thing

290
01:09:57,375 --> 01:09:59,541
Yeah, and so yeah, and then I was able to

291
01:09:59,541 --> 01:10:01,416
block those and just the request just

292
01:10:01,416 --> 01:10:02,958
went, you know way down

293
01:10:04,041 --> 01:10:05,500
Which is interesting. I mean they

294
01:10:05,500 --> 01:10:06,875
wouldn't actually I guess they weren't

295
01:10:06,875 --> 01:10:07,791
using JavaScript so they

296
01:10:07,791 --> 01:10:09,125
weren't making it to my analytics

297
01:10:09,166 --> 01:10:11,250
So they're only coming in through I can

298
01:10:11,250 --> 01:10:12,125
only see them in cloud

299
01:10:12,125 --> 01:10:14,375
flare itself. Not through my own

300
01:10:14,625 --> 01:10:17,083
You know site analytics. So

301
01:10:17,083 --> 01:10:18,208
that was kind of interesting

302
01:10:19,041 --> 01:10:21,375
Yeah, cloud flare is that's a whole

303
01:10:21,375 --> 01:10:23,375
nother piece we can get into but like

304
01:10:23,375 --> 01:10:25,000
what cloud flare does and

305
01:10:25,000 --> 01:10:26,083
you know, I definitely use them

306
01:10:26,708 --> 01:10:29,291
but you know their DDoS protection and

307
01:10:29,291 --> 01:10:31,916
just all of their automated stuff to

308
01:10:32,250 --> 01:10:33,458
Protect your site as

309
01:10:33,458 --> 01:10:34,708
soon as you get a site that

310
01:10:35,458 --> 01:10:37,500
Gets enough traffic. It's

311
01:10:37,500 --> 01:10:40,250
just like a constant target for

312
01:10:41,375 --> 01:10:42,875
DDoS attacks or

313
01:10:44,041 --> 01:10:47,000
You know just automated scraping tools. I

314
01:10:47,000 --> 01:10:48,375
think I had one time some

315
01:10:48,875 --> 01:10:51,875
Automated bot I just had crazy analytics

316
01:10:51,875 --> 01:10:54,833
logs that were just like well, this isn't

317
01:10:54,833 --> 01:10:55,708
normal. What's going on?

318
01:10:56,416 --> 01:10:59,333
ended up being some bot was scraping

319
01:10:59,333 --> 01:11:03,375
every single short URL in my system and

320
01:11:03,375 --> 01:11:05,083
just non-stop just

321
01:11:05,083 --> 01:11:06,875
hammering my servers and

322
01:11:07,666 --> 01:11:10,166
There's a lot of stories like that that

323
01:11:10,166 --> 01:11:12,125
you know, you got malicious people and

324
01:11:12,125 --> 01:11:12,708
then you got people

325
01:11:12,708 --> 01:11:13,833
that are just you know

326
01:11:13,833 --> 01:11:16,666
doing who knows what and a

327
01:11:16,666 --> 01:11:18,208
Lot of times it's in all these other

328
01:11:18,208 --> 01:11:20,625
countries. You're like, all right, what's

329
01:11:20,625 --> 01:11:22,333
going on in Russia or

330
01:11:22,333 --> 01:11:23,250
something like that?

331
01:11:24,250 --> 01:11:26,583
Yeah, yeah that yeah that part's crazy

332
01:11:26,583 --> 01:11:29,083
and well even the DDoS stuff is like, you

333
01:11:29,083 --> 01:11:30,500
know, my website's Laravel news

334
01:11:30,500 --> 01:11:33,041
It's like it's just a news website

335
01:11:33,041 --> 01:11:34,791
Why you know and then one morning I wake

336
01:11:34,791 --> 01:11:35,625
up in club where it's

337
01:11:35,625 --> 01:11:37,375
like you had a DDoS attack

338
01:11:37,375 --> 01:11:39,208
We have you know automatic automatically

339
01:11:39,208 --> 01:11:41,333
mitigated this and I'm like, why would

340
01:11:41,333 --> 01:11:43,125
somebody try to DDoS me? Like what?

341
01:11:44,750 --> 01:11:45,958
It's just crazy

342
01:11:46,750 --> 01:11:49,916
Yeah. Yeah, I I don't understand it, but

343
01:11:49,916 --> 01:11:51,500
it's a problem. I'd be

344
01:11:51,500 --> 01:11:52,375
curious to hear from other

345
01:11:52,791 --> 01:11:54,791
other people I you know, I see it every

346
01:11:54,791 --> 01:11:55,583
once in a while, but

347
01:11:56,000 --> 01:11:58,625
I guess you know, that's cloudflare is

348
01:11:59,333 --> 01:12:02,500
Pretty valuable in that you know to help

349
01:12:02,500 --> 01:12:03,916
stop it. They do a pretty

350
01:12:03,916 --> 01:12:06,416
good job with just detecting it

351
01:12:06,416 --> 01:12:09,166
But then you know, you got to you know

352
01:12:09,166 --> 01:12:10,000
customize and do

353
01:12:10,000 --> 01:12:12,833
different things to prevent it. I

354
01:12:12,833 --> 01:12:14,916
Could go down a whole rabbit hole of that

355
01:12:15,833 --> 01:12:17,208
Some of the stuff I've had to do

356
01:12:18,458 --> 01:12:18,750
For sure

357
01:12:19,041 --> 01:12:22,000
So are you you're still hosting it or

358
01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:23,916
using Forge to provision and do

359
01:12:23,916 --> 01:12:25,250
everything for the for the

360
01:12:25,250 --> 01:12:27,083
service or I know I still

361
01:12:27,083 --> 01:12:30,375
So I still use Forge. I wish I knew

362
01:12:31,041 --> 01:12:34,041
About Laravel cloud about six

363
01:12:34,041 --> 01:12:35,291
months ago. I don't know when

364
01:12:35,958 --> 01:12:39,125
So what I was running into is I was

365
01:12:39,125 --> 01:12:40,583
adding servers and

366
01:12:40,583 --> 01:12:42,375
then you know as you know

367
01:12:42,375 --> 01:12:44,166
I'd start getting more and more traffic.

368
01:12:44,166 --> 01:12:45,375
I was just manually

369
01:12:45,375 --> 01:12:47,083
provision servers which work fine

370
01:12:48,125 --> 01:12:50,166
But I got to a point

371
01:12:50,166 --> 01:12:50,875
where I was like, okay

372
01:12:50,875 --> 01:12:53,000
Let me see what I can do and I

373
01:12:53,000 --> 01:12:55,333
use Forge with digital oceans

374
01:12:55,375 --> 01:12:57,125
And that's what I've just always used for

375
01:12:57,125 --> 01:12:59,541
you know, all these projects and they

376
01:12:59,541 --> 01:13:00,916
digital ocean came out

377
01:13:00,916 --> 01:13:02,916
with I think it's called

378
01:13:02,916 --> 01:13:04,000
app platform, which

379
01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:05,958
is like their automated

380
01:13:06,708 --> 01:13:09,000
scaling system and

381
01:13:09,000 --> 01:13:11,500
maybe six months ago I went through and

382
01:13:12,166 --> 01:13:14,125
They added some new features and stuff

383
01:13:14,125 --> 01:13:16,958
and I was able to migrate it to that so

384
01:13:16,958 --> 01:13:19,000
that I have it to where it will

385
01:13:19,000 --> 01:13:22,083
auto scale and

386
01:13:22,083 --> 01:13:22,791
You know

387
01:13:23,250 --> 01:13:25,208
You know as it needs more servers or

388
01:13:25,208 --> 01:13:26,250
whatever if I get you

389
01:13:26,250 --> 01:13:27,458
know, a lot of traffic one day

390
01:13:27,791 --> 01:13:29,583
It will scale up scale down

391
01:13:30,000 --> 01:13:33,208
I'm so I kind of migrated some of my apps

392
01:13:33,208 --> 01:13:35,333
to it and but I still

393
01:13:35,333 --> 01:13:36,666
use Forge for other things

394
01:13:36,666 --> 01:13:38,333
Some of my other projects I do

395
01:13:39,416 --> 01:13:40,291
Gotcha. Gotcha. Yeah

396
01:13:41,041 --> 01:13:43,458
Yeah, see I've never had to deal with

397
01:13:43,458 --> 01:13:44,583
really auto scaling at

398
01:13:44,583 --> 01:13:46,125
all for for what I do

399
01:13:46,416 --> 01:13:48,541
You know, I can run a cheap box and we

400
01:13:48,541 --> 01:13:49,625
just cash everything

401
01:13:49,625 --> 01:13:50,500
and it's pretty simple

402
01:13:50,833 --> 01:13:53,125
So yeah, that's that's gonna be I think

403
01:13:53,125 --> 01:13:54,958
that will be a really nice use case for

404
01:13:54,958 --> 01:13:56,166
cloud is the auto

405
01:13:56,166 --> 01:13:57,375
scaling and all that stuff

406
01:13:58,166 --> 01:14:00,833
But I've actually not even on digital

407
01:14:00,833 --> 01:14:02,125
ocean where I'm still using

408
01:14:02,958 --> 01:14:05,291
Linode which got bought by

409
01:14:05,958 --> 01:14:07,250
somebody and

410
01:14:07,708 --> 01:14:10,791
So it but Akama I think might have bought

411
01:14:10,791 --> 01:14:12,291
them but let's be working

412
01:14:12,291 --> 01:14:13,458
fine, you know, it's just

413
01:14:14,375 --> 01:14:16,000
Just a cheap server there

414
01:14:16,458 --> 01:14:19,000
But you you mentioned some extensions. So

415
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:20,750
this this brings back memories. I think

416
01:14:20,750 --> 01:14:22,125
the first time I interviewed you

417
01:14:22,958 --> 01:14:25,541
You had a weather extension for Chrome

418
01:14:25,541 --> 01:14:27,375
that was like crazy popular

419
01:14:27,375 --> 01:14:29,833
And and the if I'm not mistaken the back

420
01:14:29,833 --> 01:14:31,958
end was layer Vail, but then the front

421
01:14:31,958 --> 01:14:33,208
end was just the chrome

422
01:14:33,333 --> 01:14:35,583
Whatever you write chroma plugins in

423
01:14:36,416 --> 01:14:40,666
Yeah, yeah, I think that was I

424
01:14:40,666 --> 01:14:41,333
Think you were doing

425
01:14:41,333 --> 01:14:42,666
gonna do a series like this

426
01:14:42,666 --> 01:14:44,583
But on your on layer of El news and it

427
01:14:44,583 --> 01:14:46,000
was gonna be focused on interviewing

428
01:14:46,000 --> 01:14:46,958
people building stuff

429
01:14:47,291 --> 01:14:49,541
So yeah, I started a weather extension

430
01:14:49,541 --> 01:14:51,291
just for my own use case

431
01:14:51,291 --> 01:14:54,375
I was in to building extensions and I

432
01:14:54,375 --> 01:14:56,791
wanted something like a little icon that

433
01:14:56,791 --> 01:14:59,416
shows the current weather in my browser

434
01:14:59,750 --> 01:15:01,375
So, you know, I just

435
01:15:01,375 --> 01:15:03,333
built it and put it out there

436
01:15:04,333 --> 01:15:07,791
I think it was using the dark sky API

437
01:15:07,791 --> 01:15:09,708
originally if you remember that app. It

438
01:15:09,708 --> 01:15:12,666
was a really popular iOS app and

439
01:15:12,666 --> 01:15:15,708
I think I had you know a thousand free

440
01:15:15,708 --> 01:15:18,500
API request and I put it out there and I

441
01:15:18,500 --> 01:15:20,833
was like this will be fine and

442
01:15:20,958 --> 01:15:24,125
Real quickly, you know as it grew that

443
01:15:24,125 --> 01:15:25,458
that ran out real fast

444
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:28,083
So then I was having to figure out.

445
01:15:28,083 --> 01:15:30,625
Alright, how do I you know make money off

446
01:15:30,625 --> 01:15:32,333
this thing because it was just free

447
01:15:32,500 --> 01:15:35,291
So I what I realized is people were

448
01:15:35,291 --> 01:15:37,583
donating money because they just liked it

449
01:15:37,583 --> 01:15:40,000
So people were sending me money on like

450
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:41,416
PayPal for building

451
01:15:41,416 --> 01:15:42,875
it to try to support it

452
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:45,958
So then I put like a upgrade button. So

453
01:15:46,416 --> 01:15:48,791
It's still going it's out there

454
01:15:49,833 --> 01:15:51,208
You know, I

455
01:15:51,916 --> 01:15:53,416
Enjoyed working on it. I haven't really

456
01:15:53,416 --> 01:15:55,291
done a lot of updates recently. It's kind

457
01:15:55,291 --> 01:15:56,166
of been stable people

458
01:15:56,166 --> 01:15:57,416
haven't been asking for anything

459
01:15:57,416 --> 01:15:57,791
but

460
01:15:58,375 --> 01:16:00,791
Yeah, if you go to weather extension calm

461
01:16:00,791 --> 01:16:01,958
and you want to check it out

462
01:16:02,916 --> 01:16:05,833
But it kind of you know

463
01:16:05,833 --> 01:16:08,125
runs itself it covers the bills

464
01:16:08,458 --> 01:16:11,291
I have like an upgrade on there

465
01:16:11,916 --> 01:16:13,166
and

466
01:16:13,166 --> 01:16:14,208
you know

467
01:16:15,041 --> 01:16:17,000
It's built on Laravel the back in

468
01:16:18,083 --> 01:16:20,583
But yeah, so it's one of the reasons it

469
01:16:20,583 --> 01:16:23,583
was growing and then it got hit by

470
01:16:23,583 --> 01:16:25,708
Once again talking about as soon as you

471
01:16:25,708 --> 01:16:27,083
start getting any kind of traffic or

472
01:16:27,083 --> 01:16:28,875
bigger it got spammed

473
01:16:28,875 --> 01:16:30,541
by maybe a competitor

474
01:16:30,791 --> 01:16:31,833
I still don't know to this

475
01:16:31,833 --> 01:16:33,666
day, but it got spanned with

476
01:16:34,000 --> 01:16:36,416
thousands of one-star reviews, so

477
01:16:36,708 --> 01:16:39,541
It was like five star review people liked

478
01:16:39,541 --> 01:16:41,541
it and then overnight Google

479
01:16:41,583 --> 01:16:43,583
I guess they didn't have any kind of spam

480
01:16:43,583 --> 01:16:44,875
protection on their stuff

481
01:16:45,750 --> 01:16:48,208
You know, I went from five stars to like

482
01:16:48,208 --> 01:16:49,875
one star like overnight

483
01:16:49,875 --> 01:16:53,041
and once you get bad ratings, it kind of

484
01:16:53,041 --> 01:16:54,416
demotes it and it doesn't

485
01:16:54,416 --> 01:16:55,500
really show up and it kind of

486
01:16:56,250 --> 01:16:57,625
Stop growing as fast as

487
01:16:57,625 --> 01:16:59,000
it was and then you know

488
01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:01,375
I started building other projects and you

489
01:17:01,375 --> 01:17:03,250
know kind of moved on once I realized

490
01:17:03,250 --> 01:17:04,083
most people expect the

491
01:17:04,083 --> 01:17:05,666
weather to be free like

492
01:17:05,666 --> 01:17:07,958
you know most weather apps are free and

493
01:17:08,625 --> 01:17:11,750
You know what are ad supported and you

494
01:17:11,750 --> 01:17:13,375
can't really do ads inside of an

495
01:17:13,375 --> 01:17:14,458
extension super great

496
01:17:15,083 --> 01:17:17,791
So I kind of moved on to something else

497
01:17:17,791 --> 01:17:20,458
But is it was a fun project and you know,

498
01:17:20,458 --> 01:17:22,083
that's that's type stuff like that

499
01:17:22,500 --> 01:17:24,416
To then building other things

500
01:17:24,416 --> 01:17:26,458
have all kind of built up my

501
01:17:26,833 --> 01:17:28,125
knowledge base on how to

502
01:17:28,125 --> 01:17:30,208
like keep a site like TDI

503
01:17:30,208 --> 01:17:32,833
Oh I even running because of you know

504
01:17:33,250 --> 01:17:35,541
The DDoS attacks or the spam attacks or

505
01:17:35,541 --> 01:17:36,833
you know people trying

506
01:17:36,833 --> 01:17:39,541
to steal your API keys

507
01:17:39,541 --> 01:17:41,583
And all kinds of just malicious stuff

508
01:17:41,583 --> 01:17:42,916
that you have to deal with

509
01:17:42,916 --> 01:17:45,500
I've learned a lot from it. So

510
01:17:46,625 --> 01:17:49,666
That's awesome. The yeah the dark sky

511
01:17:49,708 --> 01:17:51,500
I don't know if you're listening if you

512
01:17:51,500 --> 01:17:52,666
remember dark sky, but it

513
01:17:52,666 --> 01:17:53,833
was awesome back in the day

514
01:17:53,833 --> 01:17:56,666
It was like the best weather app and and

515
01:17:56,666 --> 01:17:57,833
then Apple bought them

516
01:17:57,833 --> 01:17:58,958
and then what shut them down

517
01:17:58,958 --> 01:18:00,500
I guess they integrated it with

518
01:18:01,083 --> 01:18:03,125
their current weather app maybe

519
01:18:03,875 --> 01:18:05,666
What'd you end up having to switch to is

520
01:18:05,666 --> 01:18:07,916
it like a government API you can call and

521
01:18:07,916 --> 01:18:09,916
it's just free now or yeah

522
01:18:10,708 --> 01:18:13,625
There's there's two you can if you if you

523
01:18:13,625 --> 01:18:15,208
upgrade I think you get access to another

524
01:18:15,208 --> 01:18:17,500
one. There's somebody built a like

525
01:18:17,791 --> 01:18:19,541
Pretty

526
01:18:19,541 --> 01:18:21,041
much the same

527
01:18:21,625 --> 01:18:24,916
API in point and similar data sets and

528
01:18:24,916 --> 01:18:26,416
They built it, you know to

529
01:18:26,416 --> 01:18:27,916
kind of take the place of it

530
01:18:28,416 --> 01:18:30,000
Well to come or several companies did but

531
01:18:30,000 --> 01:18:31,125
I kind of integrated with two

532
01:18:31,125 --> 01:18:32,916
of them and they have you know

533
01:18:32,916 --> 01:18:33,541
Pretty good pricing

534
01:18:33,541 --> 01:18:35,416
models and similar data

535
01:18:36,000 --> 01:18:38,958
You know, but people the one complaint I

536
01:18:38,958 --> 01:18:40,791
still get is people emailed me saying

537
01:18:40,791 --> 01:18:43,500
your your extension says, you know

538
01:18:43,500 --> 01:18:44,041
It's not supposed to

539
01:18:44,041 --> 01:18:44,833
rain but it's raining

540
01:18:45,750 --> 01:18:48,833
And I'm like, okay, I have nothing to do

541
01:18:48,833 --> 01:18:51,291
with the weather, you know, I'm just

542
01:18:51,291 --> 01:18:53,083
showing you the data and the API

543
01:18:54,375 --> 01:18:57,208
So it's kind of I get blamed for weather

544
01:18:57,208 --> 01:18:59,041
all around the world from this extension

545
01:18:59,041 --> 01:19:01,500
which I just tell them

546
01:19:01,500 --> 01:19:02,416
Okay. I mean, I don't

547
01:19:02,416 --> 01:19:03,666
really know what I can do but

548
01:19:04,750 --> 01:19:06,750
But yeah, there are there are government

549
01:19:06,750 --> 01:19:08,291
sites and I debated on you know

550
01:19:08,291 --> 01:19:09,916
well, maybe I could just build my own

551
01:19:09,916 --> 01:19:12,416
weather API service in charge for it and

552
01:19:13,250 --> 01:19:15,000
You know, I had this experience with the

553
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:16,125
weather stuff. So I

554
01:19:16,125 --> 01:19:17,958
looked at that and then

555
01:19:18,500 --> 01:19:21,958
You know kind of just decided to

556
01:19:21,958 --> 01:19:23,416
integrate and move on to other stuff

557
01:19:23,416 --> 01:19:25,750
But like, you know, you can for for the

558
01:19:25,750 --> 01:19:26,541
United States at least

559
01:19:26,541 --> 01:19:28,791
you can use the weather APIs

560
01:19:28,791 --> 01:19:29,666
And I think that's what a

561
01:19:29,666 --> 01:19:30,666
lot of these services are doing

562
01:19:30,708 --> 01:19:32,250
They're just government APIs

563
01:19:32,458 --> 01:19:34,333
But to build a service you really have to

564
01:19:34,333 --> 01:19:35,791
integrate any if you wanted to work

565
01:19:35,791 --> 01:19:36,625
worldwide you have to

566
01:19:36,625 --> 01:19:37,500
integrate with all these

567
01:19:37,708 --> 01:19:39,458
weather providers all

568
01:19:39,458 --> 01:19:41,000
around the world and

569
01:19:41,000 --> 01:19:43,500
kind of you take all of their data and

570
01:19:43,500 --> 01:19:46,791
morph it into one single API that's just

571
01:19:46,791 --> 01:19:49,125
like longitude latitude and then

572
01:19:49,416 --> 01:19:53,333
Returned that and I just decided not not

573
01:19:53,333 --> 01:19:54,125
to go down that road

574
01:19:54,125 --> 01:19:55,708
but probably would have been a good idea

575
01:19:55,708 --> 01:19:57,083
and then could have you

576
01:19:57,083 --> 01:19:58,708
know sold it like like

577
01:19:59,666 --> 01:20:01,958
Dark sky did they had an API that you

578
01:20:01,958 --> 01:20:04,166
know was the the best that everybody used

579
01:20:04,166 --> 01:20:06,041
for weather applications

580
01:20:07,500 --> 01:20:07,583
Okay

581
01:20:08,791 --> 01:20:11,041
This is sort of off topic from

582
01:20:11,041 --> 01:20:11,625
L'Hareville or

583
01:20:11,625 --> 01:20:14,500
whatever. But why do all the

584
01:20:15,041 --> 01:20:16,583
local like news

585
01:20:18,083 --> 01:20:20,708
Cast have their own weather apps is it

586
01:20:20,708 --> 01:20:22,583
they're just selling advertising off of

587
01:20:22,583 --> 01:20:23,666
that and that's how they're making money

588
01:20:23,666 --> 01:20:25,916
Is that their whole thing with having

589
01:20:25,916 --> 01:20:27,958
their own weather apps? I?

590
01:20:27,958 --> 01:20:29,625
I don't yeah, I would imagine

591
01:20:29,625 --> 01:20:31,166
they want their own, you know

592
01:20:32,166 --> 01:20:34,500
Branding and a lot of it, you know, a lot

593
01:20:34,500 --> 01:20:35,500
of those sites are all

594
01:20:35,875 --> 01:20:37,958
Advertising like you almost can't even go

595
01:20:37,958 --> 01:20:39,833
to them because the ads are so bad

596
01:20:40,916 --> 01:20:42,166
without an ad blocker

597
01:20:43,833 --> 01:20:45,416
Yeah, I don't really have an answer to

598
01:20:45,416 --> 01:20:46,958
that other than they do claim though

599
01:20:46,958 --> 01:20:47,750
like, you know, your

600
01:20:47,750 --> 01:20:49,708
local weatherman will claim

601
01:20:50,125 --> 01:20:52,958
He's accurate. Don't listen to like I've

602
01:20:52,958 --> 01:20:54,583
seen things don't look at your weather on

603
01:20:54,583 --> 01:20:56,166
your phone because it's not gonna work

604
01:20:56,916 --> 01:20:58,500
And there is a certain

605
01:20:58,500 --> 01:21:00,750
part of that but then you know

606
01:21:00,750 --> 01:21:03,000
What's the one job that you can be wrong

607
01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:04,708
50% of the time and not

608
01:21:04,708 --> 01:21:06,583
get fired as a weatherman?

609
01:21:07,875 --> 01:21:08,541
So

610
01:21:09,291 --> 01:21:11,250
Anyways, I don't I don't know but yeah

611
01:21:11,250 --> 01:21:13,125
the you know, the the

612
01:21:13,125 --> 01:21:15,541
weather stuff is kind of you know

613
01:21:15,541 --> 01:21:17,916
It maybe it'll get better AI may fix it.

614
01:21:17,916 --> 01:21:20,291
Maybe AI will you know be able to read

615
01:21:20,291 --> 01:21:22,208
the weather and make more accurate

616
01:21:22,666 --> 01:21:24,791
Predictions I've heard of that stuff

617
01:21:25,458 --> 01:21:28,875
But that's what dark sky was kind of I

618
01:21:28,875 --> 01:21:30,125
don't know how they were

619
01:21:30,125 --> 01:21:31,000
doing it what they were doing

620
01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:31,375
but they were

621
01:21:31,375 --> 01:21:34,416
supposedly analyzing radar and

622
01:21:34,666 --> 01:21:37,708
We're giving you know, you're back in the

623
01:21:37,708 --> 01:21:38,666
people don't wouldn't

624
01:21:38,666 --> 01:21:40,250
be amazed by this today

625
01:21:40,250 --> 01:21:42,083
but back in the day it was you would get

626
01:21:42,083 --> 01:21:42,833
an alert that it's

627
01:21:42,833 --> 01:21:44,750
gonna rain in 10 minutes and

628
01:21:45,208 --> 01:21:48,166
They were pretty accurate with it and

629
01:21:48,166 --> 01:21:49,375
nobody else was doing that. It

630
01:21:49,375 --> 01:21:50,500
was it was it was neat though

631
01:21:50,875 --> 01:21:52,208
What they were able to do

632
01:21:52,583 --> 01:21:54,125
Yeah, that was awesome because you know

633
01:21:54,125 --> 01:21:56,000
I like to play golf and I would always

634
01:21:56,000 --> 01:21:57,166
have dark sky with with

635
01:21:57,166 --> 01:21:58,541
the alerts on and you know

636
01:21:58,541 --> 01:21:59,625
You'd be playing golf and be like it's

637
01:21:59,625 --> 01:22:01,625
gonna rain in 10 minutes and then and

638
01:22:01,625 --> 01:22:02,833
sure it was pretty

639
01:22:02,833 --> 01:22:04,000
accurate almost every time

640
01:22:04,000 --> 01:22:04,875
It was like, you know

641
01:22:04,875 --> 01:22:06,916
we would run to the trees and hide or you

642
01:22:06,916 --> 01:22:07,583
know run to the little

643
01:22:07,583 --> 01:22:09,166
court board or something and

644
01:22:09,166 --> 01:22:11,666
It was it was pretty accurate. It was it

645
01:22:11,666 --> 01:22:13,416
was very rare that it gave me an alert

646
01:22:13,416 --> 01:22:14,166
and it didn't happen

647
01:22:14,166 --> 01:22:16,125
So I really liked that part

648
01:22:16,125 --> 01:22:17,041
of the app. That was sweet

649
01:22:17,958 --> 01:22:20,083
Yeah, yeah, it was good that's what

650
01:22:20,083 --> 01:22:21,708
that's what got me interested in it with

651
01:22:21,708 --> 01:22:24,291
was wanting that on my

652
01:22:24,541 --> 01:22:26,166
browser in my browser and I was into

653
01:22:26,166 --> 01:22:28,583
extensions and I built you

654
01:22:28,583 --> 01:22:29,875
know a few other extensions in

655
01:22:31,250 --> 01:22:33,875
That you know extensions and Laravel are

656
01:22:33,875 --> 01:22:35,208
kind of what got me into

657
01:22:35,208 --> 01:22:36,916
building, you know side projects

658
01:22:36,916 --> 01:22:39,291
just I always like to build stuff that

659
01:22:39,291 --> 01:22:42,041
got you know, I would get users and

660
01:22:42,333 --> 01:22:45,083
You know, even if it was free just people

661
01:22:45,083 --> 01:22:45,958
using my stuff. I

662
01:22:45,958 --> 01:22:46,750
thought it was really neat

663
01:22:48,291 --> 01:22:49,375
Yeah for sure the

664
01:22:50,250 --> 01:22:51,500
Anything else you've

665
01:22:51,500 --> 01:22:53,791
got out? I know you've got

666
01:22:54,625 --> 01:22:55,833
I'm trying to remember I remember the

667
01:22:55,833 --> 01:22:57,041
weather extension. Yes

668
01:22:57,416 --> 01:22:59,416
We'll back up a bit because you talked

669
01:22:59,416 --> 01:23:00,958
about my first interview.

670
01:23:00,958 --> 01:23:02,166
Yeah, so back in the day

671
01:23:02,166 --> 01:23:03,625
I created a series called the artisan

672
01:23:03,625 --> 01:23:05,833
files and I would just send questions out

673
01:23:05,833 --> 01:23:06,416
to people that were

674
01:23:06,416 --> 01:23:08,208
building stuff in Laravel and

675
01:23:08,416 --> 01:23:10,041
This is sort of like a

676
01:23:10,041 --> 01:23:12,666
video podcast format of that

677
01:23:12,916 --> 01:23:13,500
You know

678
01:23:13,500 --> 01:23:15,000
Maybe I should have renamed this and not

679
01:23:15,000 --> 01:23:15,916
call it the creator series

680
01:23:15,916 --> 01:23:16,916
and call it the artisan files

681
01:23:17,791 --> 01:23:19,291
But yeah, that brings back so many

682
01:23:19,291 --> 01:23:20,708
memories now. I'm glad you

683
01:23:20,708 --> 01:23:22,375
brought that up. That was fun

684
01:23:23,500 --> 01:23:25,750
Yeah, I enjoyed, you know

685
01:23:25,750 --> 01:23:26,791
talking about this stuff and

686
01:23:27,416 --> 01:23:30,875
You know, like I said just putting a lot

687
01:23:30,875 --> 01:23:32,041
most of my stuff was I put

688
01:23:32,041 --> 01:23:33,500
it out there for free and then

689
01:23:33,750 --> 01:23:36,000
You know if it blew up I

690
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:37,291
would figure out how can I?

691
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:40,500
You know make money off this or at least

692
01:23:40,500 --> 01:23:42,125
pay for it and keep it going

693
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:44,250
That's just how I've

694
01:23:44,250 --> 01:23:45,833
always done things. I I

695
01:23:46,458 --> 01:23:48,583
Start what kind of got me into it is I

696
01:23:48,583 --> 01:23:50,833
realized I made a blog

697
01:23:51,333 --> 01:23:54,833
Tim Leland calm and I put a post out and

698
01:23:54,833 --> 01:23:57,416
I guess I was just it was just pure luck

699
01:23:57,416 --> 01:24:00,166
but the post blew up and got shared on

700
01:24:00,166 --> 01:24:02,083
like some big news sites and an

701
01:24:02,666 --> 01:24:05,000
Overnight I woke up and it was like, you

702
01:24:05,000 --> 01:24:06,416
know made several hundred

703
01:24:06,416 --> 01:24:07,375
dollars off of affiliate

704
01:24:08,666 --> 01:24:10,250
Revenue from like Amazon

705
01:24:10,250 --> 01:24:12,125
and stuff and then also

706
01:24:12,500 --> 01:24:14,375
Once I put it like ads on there. I was

707
01:24:14,375 --> 01:24:15,000
able to make money

708
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:16,666
off that so that kind of

709
01:24:17,208 --> 01:24:20,333
Was like wait, I can go to sleep wake up

710
01:24:20,333 --> 01:24:22,041
and have made money overnight

711
01:24:22,833 --> 01:24:24,250
I was like, okay

712
01:24:25,458 --> 01:24:26,916
Maybe there's something else here. I need

713
01:24:26,916 --> 01:24:28,666
to figure out what else can I do and

714
01:24:28,666 --> 01:24:29,666
that's you know, why I

715
01:24:29,666 --> 01:24:30,625
just kept building stuff

716
01:24:31,708 --> 01:24:34,041
Yeah, that's awesome. Do you like if?

717
01:24:34,666 --> 01:24:36,541
Speaking to developers that maybe like

718
01:24:36,541 --> 01:24:38,541
want to get into creating their own

719
01:24:38,541 --> 01:24:39,125
products and stuff

720
01:24:39,125 --> 01:24:40,625
like that. Is that sort of

721
01:24:41,458 --> 01:24:43,666
You know looking back is is that sort of

722
01:24:43,666 --> 01:24:45,000
what you would recommend is like just

723
01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:46,416
build stuff that you like and

724
01:24:46,500 --> 01:24:48,916
See if it takes off and if it does figure

725
01:24:48,916 --> 01:24:50,708
out a way to charge for it versus going

726
01:24:50,708 --> 01:24:52,000
the other route of like spending

727
01:24:52,000 --> 01:24:53,500
Six months and be like, all right, this

728
01:24:53,500 --> 01:24:55,166
is paid upfront, you

729
01:24:55,166 --> 01:24:56,458
know things like that

730
01:24:57,833 --> 01:25:00,000
Yeah, I think so. I mean because you're

731
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:01,000
gonna build stuff and

732
01:25:01,708 --> 01:25:03,916
You know if you put a ton of time into

733
01:25:03,916 --> 01:25:06,000
like planning it and you know

734
01:25:06,000 --> 01:25:07,458
I would talk to people and they'd be

735
01:25:07,458 --> 01:25:08,500
like, yeah, we're gonna start a business

736
01:25:08,500 --> 01:25:10,625
and they would you know, go get a

737
01:25:11,083 --> 01:25:13,875
business plan and they would go make an

738
01:25:13,875 --> 01:25:16,916
LLC for the business and hire lawyers and

739
01:25:16,916 --> 01:25:19,166
they haven't made a penny and

740
01:25:19,166 --> 01:25:21,666
I was like, I'm just gonna build the

741
01:25:21,666 --> 01:25:23,583
thing put it out there and

742
01:25:23,583 --> 01:25:25,041
if it picks up traction then

743
01:25:25,500 --> 01:25:27,708
You know figure out the next steps

744
01:25:28,375 --> 01:25:30,833
Because I've you know, maybe you would

745
01:25:30,833 --> 01:25:32,083
get lucky on the first one

746
01:25:32,083 --> 01:25:34,958
But I've built so many small little apps

747
01:25:34,958 --> 01:25:35,791
and just put them out

748
01:25:35,791 --> 01:25:37,708
there and just kind of you know

749
01:25:38,083 --> 01:25:39,541
And a lot of them like you said are

750
01:25:39,541 --> 01:25:40,875
things I was interested in so the weather

751
01:25:40,875 --> 01:25:43,000
thing I was interested in because I

752
01:25:43,000 --> 01:25:45,000
Wanted a weather extension in my browser

753
01:25:45,000 --> 01:25:46,500
and I want to learn how browser

754
01:25:46,500 --> 01:25:48,291
extensions work because I was you know

755
01:25:48,291 --> 01:25:49,333
I used a ton of

756
01:25:49,333 --> 01:25:50,916
different extensions and then

757
01:25:51,458 --> 01:25:55,000
you know t.ly was created because I saw

758
01:25:55,000 --> 01:25:56,875
Google shutting down their service and

759
01:25:57,291 --> 01:25:58,375
you know, I thought it

760
01:25:58,375 --> 01:25:59,750
would be a neat project and

761
01:26:01,125 --> 01:26:02,375
Originally built the extension

762
01:26:02,958 --> 01:26:05,250
and then so I built the

763
01:26:05,250 --> 01:26:07,541
extension and it grew to like maybe

764
01:26:08,375 --> 01:26:11,416
200,000 users and I was like, okay, you

765
01:26:11,416 --> 01:26:13,625
got 200,000 users if just 1%

766
01:26:14,958 --> 01:26:16,666
converts to paying then you know, I'll be

767
01:26:16,666 --> 01:26:18,750
doing pretty good and

768
01:26:18,750 --> 01:26:20,000
You know, that's just kind of how I've

769
01:26:20,000 --> 01:26:20,916
done things. It's just

770
01:26:20,916 --> 01:26:22,791
you know have an idea

771
01:26:23,333 --> 01:26:26,708
Build it put it out there

772
01:26:27,500 --> 01:26:30,125
And just see you know watch it and see

773
01:26:30,125 --> 01:26:32,375
how it grows if it doesn't go anywhere

774
01:26:32,583 --> 01:26:34,541
You know, I eventually kind of just kill

775
01:26:34,541 --> 01:26:36,500
it off and and then

776
01:26:36,500 --> 01:26:37,791
move on to the next thing

777
01:26:38,166 --> 01:26:39,875
More recently though since I've been

778
01:26:39,875 --> 01:26:41,208
focused on t.io. I've

779
01:26:41,208 --> 01:26:43,125
kind of quit some of that

780
01:26:43,833 --> 01:26:45,833
Because I've you know wanted to make sure

781
01:26:45,833 --> 01:26:47,833
I stay focused on it. But

782
01:26:47,833 --> 01:26:49,750
before this I was you know every

783
01:26:49,791 --> 01:26:51,458
Every week I was

784
01:26:51,458 --> 01:26:52,500
building something different

785
01:26:54,208 --> 01:26:56,333
Yeah, we developers have that problem I

786
01:26:56,333 --> 01:26:58,541
think we we get in this mindset if we got

787
01:26:58,541 --> 01:26:59,708
to keep building stuff building stuff

788
01:26:59,708 --> 01:27:00,833
building stuff and not

789
01:27:01,583 --> 01:27:03,875
focus on the actual business that's

790
01:27:03,875 --> 01:27:05,416
actually working and then and then we

791
01:27:06,500 --> 01:27:08,458
You know that we just kind of let it fail

792
01:27:08,458 --> 01:27:09,750
because of lack of

793
01:27:09,750 --> 01:27:12,541
attention not lack of how good it is

794
01:27:13,083 --> 01:27:14,250
So that's that's a

795
01:27:14,250 --> 01:27:15,083
really good reminder there

796
01:27:16,166 --> 01:27:19,500
The that it sort of reminds me of the way

797
01:27:19,500 --> 01:27:20,916
I started, you know in the whole

798
01:27:20,916 --> 01:27:21,875
development thing was

799
01:27:23,083 --> 01:27:26,041
You know it my first product was actually

800
01:27:26,041 --> 01:27:27,375
a classified script you could

801
01:27:27,375 --> 01:27:28,875
buy it and like run your own

802
01:27:29,500 --> 01:27:30,916
Craigslist I guess but this was way

803
01:27:30,916 --> 01:27:32,708
before Craigslist was a thing and

804
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:34,625
It was all because you know

805
01:27:34,625 --> 01:27:36,291
I was working on a motorcycle dealership

806
01:27:36,291 --> 01:27:37,666
and people would bring their motorcycles

807
01:27:37,666 --> 01:27:39,000
in to try to trade them in and

808
01:27:39,125 --> 01:27:40,541
We're like we can't

809
01:27:40,541 --> 01:27:41,333
take your trade or whatever

810
01:27:41,708 --> 01:27:44,291
and but you can go here in place, you

811
01:27:44,291 --> 01:27:45,083
know put it on my

812
01:27:45,083 --> 01:27:47,416
pre-loved motorcycles website and

813
01:27:47,583 --> 01:27:49,625
So then you know, I just I was like well

814
01:27:49,625 --> 01:27:51,000
I could probably sell this and then it

815
01:27:51,000 --> 01:27:52,583
just kind of picked up steam and you know

816
01:27:52,583 --> 01:27:53,958
lasted a few years made some money

817
01:27:54,791 --> 01:27:56,500
so it's always fun when you build

818
01:27:56,500 --> 01:27:58,416
something that you actually

819
01:27:58,875 --> 01:28:00,625
Are passionate about and enjoy because

820
01:28:00,625 --> 01:28:02,250
that actually keeps you engaged over the

821
01:28:02,250 --> 01:28:03,875
what it's gonna take to build a

822
01:28:03,875 --> 01:28:05,166
successful product. I think

823
01:28:06,041 --> 01:28:08,458
Yeah, that's funny. You say that I one of

824
01:28:08,458 --> 01:28:10,000
the first projects I

825
01:28:10,000 --> 01:28:11,125
built with Laravel was

826
01:28:11,875 --> 01:28:13,041
like a

827
01:28:14,291 --> 01:28:16,375
Craigslist but the goal

828
01:28:16,375 --> 01:28:19,375
It was gonna be you

829
01:28:19,375 --> 01:28:20,750
know, Craigslist was popular

830
01:28:20,750 --> 01:28:22,500
But people were like posting that they

831
01:28:22,500 --> 01:28:24,375
were being like kidnapped and you know,

832
01:28:24,375 --> 01:28:25,583
they would meet up to buy something

833
01:28:25,625 --> 01:28:28,208
So I was like, how can I integrate this

834
01:28:28,208 --> 01:28:30,375
with like social media or something?

835
01:28:30,375 --> 01:28:33,875
so I created a like a Craigslist, but it

836
01:28:33,875 --> 01:28:36,583
required Facebook login and

837
01:28:36,583 --> 01:28:38,541
And then it was gonna be like oh I could

838
01:28:38,541 --> 01:28:40,833
see your Facebook profile and

839
01:28:41,458 --> 01:28:42,916
then I could see your friends with

840
01:28:42,916 --> 01:28:44,083
somebody that I know and

841
01:28:44,083 --> 01:28:46,125
kind of build that trust and

842
01:28:46,125 --> 01:28:48,375
You know, I built it and it grew and it

843
01:28:48,375 --> 01:28:51,083
was you know, a neat project and then

844
01:28:51,083 --> 01:28:52,625
about like, you know

845
01:28:52,625 --> 01:28:54,875
Six months after I built it and it was

846
01:28:54,875 --> 01:28:57,000
and working on it Facebook launched

847
01:28:57,000 --> 01:28:58,041
Facebook Marketplace

848
01:28:58,041 --> 01:29:01,041
Which was pretty much what I built and

849
01:29:01,041 --> 01:29:02,958
that that was kind of the sign. Okay

850
01:29:02,958 --> 01:29:04,583
let me go ahead and shut this down real

851
01:29:04,583 --> 01:29:05,750
quick because you had

852
01:29:06,500 --> 01:29:08,083
Obviously Facebook Marketplace kind of

853
01:29:08,083 --> 01:29:10,166
took off and what it was

854
01:29:10,166 --> 01:29:12,375
pretty much the same idea. So

855
01:29:12,458 --> 01:29:14,958
At least it validated what I was what I

856
01:29:14,958 --> 01:29:16,875
was thinking people wanted. So

857
01:29:17,916 --> 01:29:20,583
Yeah, the even today. I think marketplace

858
01:29:20,583 --> 01:29:22,875
is now taking over Craigslist like I've

859
01:29:23,208 --> 01:29:25,333
Everybody up, you know, everybody locally

860
01:29:25,333 --> 01:29:27,125
is always like Facebook Marketplace and

861
01:29:27,125 --> 01:29:28,625
I've never I don't think

862
01:29:28,625 --> 01:29:29,958
I've heard Craigslist in

863
01:29:30,291 --> 01:29:30,875
years

864
01:29:31,458 --> 01:29:33,041
anybody using it so that's

865
01:29:33,875 --> 01:29:37,041
Yeah, that was pretty that was actually a

866
01:29:37,041 --> 01:29:38,958
really good idea cuz that was a

867
01:29:40,541 --> 01:29:42,916
Unique use case back then when all that

868
01:29:42,916 --> 01:29:44,541
it didn't exist. Yeah, I like that

869
01:29:45,250 --> 01:29:46,583
Yeah, yeah, I'll be interesting what

870
01:29:46,583 --> 01:29:48,666
Craigslist if you look at their traffic a

871
01:29:48,666 --> 01:29:51,583
bit. It's on a just constant decline, but

872
01:29:52,291 --> 01:29:54,583
I think I made money off of selling maybe

873
01:29:54,583 --> 01:29:57,250
like job postings and I'm guessing people

874
01:29:57,250 --> 01:29:58,291
are still doing that but

875
01:29:58,833 --> 01:30:02,541
Yeah, those sites are crazy how like they

876
01:30:02,541 --> 01:30:04,541
haven't updated it in or at least

877
01:30:04,541 --> 01:30:06,875
visually in 20 years

878
01:30:08,500 --> 01:30:10,125
It's a interesting

879
01:30:11,666 --> 01:30:13,708
Thing that they just don't I guess don't

880
01:30:13,708 --> 01:30:16,500
care that's just the business model but

881
01:30:17,416 --> 01:30:19,458
I kind of like it just the nostalgic

882
01:30:19,458 --> 01:30:20,500
look. It's kind of like

883
01:30:20,500 --> 01:30:22,250
the other that news website

884
01:30:23,041 --> 01:30:27,250
It's been around man since the 90s drudge

885
01:30:27,250 --> 01:30:29,500
report, you know, it's just it literally

886
01:30:29,500 --> 01:30:30,916
looks like it was built in front page

887
01:30:30,916 --> 01:30:33,583
It's just like when one page and they

888
01:30:33,583 --> 01:30:34,916
just update links on it all day long

889
01:30:34,916 --> 01:30:37,541
It's like, you know, it's kind of the

890
01:30:37,541 --> 01:30:38,208
novelty is kind of

891
01:30:38,208 --> 01:30:39,458
cool. I kind of like that

892
01:30:40,458 --> 01:30:42,166
Yeah, those are I mean that's the type of

893
01:30:42,166 --> 01:30:43,250
thing like if you could build

894
01:30:43,250 --> 01:30:45,250
I mean be hard to build that today, but

895
01:30:45,250 --> 01:30:47,500
build something that could just get

896
01:30:47,500 --> 01:30:49,000
constant traffic and

897
01:30:49,500 --> 01:30:51,458
Imagine are there ads on there? That's

898
01:30:51,458 --> 01:30:53,500
probably how they make money either that

899
01:30:53,500 --> 01:30:55,125
or like sponsor posts or something

900
01:30:55,125 --> 01:30:57,791
but you know you build something and

901
01:30:58,750 --> 01:31:01,458
That's what one thing if if you could

902
01:31:01,458 --> 01:31:03,041
build something that doesn't require

903
01:31:03,500 --> 01:31:04,125
like

904
01:31:04,666 --> 01:31:08,166
paying users that's always a

905
01:31:08,583 --> 01:31:10,041
Bonus if you can figure out

906
01:31:10,041 --> 01:31:11,500
how to build like, you know

907
01:31:11,500 --> 01:31:14,458
One of these free online tools that you

908
01:31:14,458 --> 01:31:15,458
know are sponsored by

909
01:31:15,458 --> 01:31:16,666
ads or something like that

910
01:31:17,666 --> 01:31:21,083
Those are those are you know, always a

911
01:31:21,083 --> 01:31:22,541
interesting business model

912
01:31:22,541 --> 01:31:24,166
where you don't have users

913
01:31:25,083 --> 01:31:27,333
you don't have a ton of support and

914
01:31:27,708 --> 01:31:29,916
You don't have to worry about all the a

915
01:31:29,916 --> 01:31:31,833
lot of the problems that come with it

916
01:31:32,750 --> 01:31:32,916
true

917
01:31:34,333 --> 01:31:36,083
so to switch gears back

918
01:31:36,083 --> 01:31:37,833
to layer veil like what's

919
01:31:39,375 --> 01:31:41,041
What's your I'm trying to

920
01:31:41,041 --> 01:31:43,000
think of how to word it to kind of

921
01:31:43,458 --> 01:31:45,625
Do something interesting like what's your

922
01:31:45,625 --> 01:31:47,291
favorite level feature? Like what's

923
01:31:47,916 --> 01:31:49,458
What's one thing that variable provides

924
01:31:49,458 --> 01:31:50,500
that you can't live without?

925
01:31:51,958 --> 01:31:56,083
Hmm so I

926
01:31:56,125 --> 01:31:58,583
Mean there's there's a lot that I'm

927
01:31:58,583 --> 01:32:01,666
trying to I could say it go with but I

928
01:32:01,666 --> 01:32:03,333
Think it's just if I want to build

929
01:32:03,333 --> 01:32:05,208
something. I'm trying to think I

930
01:32:06,583 --> 01:32:08,416
threw up a website not too long ago and

931
01:32:09,250 --> 01:32:10,791
Yeah, if you just want to

932
01:32:10,791 --> 01:32:12,416
build a site and you want

933
01:32:13,125 --> 01:32:14,916
authentication and

934
01:32:14,916 --> 01:32:17,333
You want to connect to a database like

935
01:32:17,333 --> 01:32:19,291
not having to rebuild all that

936
01:32:19,791 --> 01:32:22,000
Scaffolding, I guess is is the reason

937
01:32:22,000 --> 01:32:23,916
that I've always used Laravel because

938
01:32:23,916 --> 01:32:25,000
I've worked for you know

939
01:32:25,000 --> 01:32:26,916
software companies where everything is

940
01:32:26,916 --> 01:32:28,541
built in-house and it's like

941
01:32:28,791 --> 01:32:30,541
If you were to build this application

942
01:32:30,541 --> 01:32:31,541
you'd spend, you know

943
01:32:31,541 --> 01:32:34,250
Six months building the groundwork and

944
01:32:34,250 --> 01:32:35,208
I'm like they could just

945
01:32:35,208 --> 01:32:37,166
use Laravel and skip, you know

946
01:32:37,208 --> 01:32:38,916
Six months of work and they're probably

947
01:32:38,916 --> 01:32:41,666
doing it, you know, not as not as good as

948
01:32:41,666 --> 01:32:42,541
how they're you know

949
01:32:42,833 --> 01:32:43,750
If they're building

950
01:32:43,750 --> 01:32:44,583
their own authentication

951
01:32:45,541 --> 01:32:47,375
The the bugs and the

952
01:32:47,375 --> 01:32:49,333
security issues that come with that

953
01:32:50,458 --> 01:32:52,916
So I think you just being all like build

954
01:32:52,916 --> 01:32:54,625
a new application real

955
01:32:54,625 --> 01:32:56,916
quickly and you get all that

956
01:32:58,416 --> 01:33:00,166
Groundwork already done to where you can

957
01:33:00,166 --> 01:33:01,958
just get it and put it live

958
01:33:02,625 --> 01:33:04,333
but some of the stuff I mean I take

959
01:33:05,416 --> 01:33:06,750
Advantage of this is just like the

960
01:33:06,750 --> 01:33:09,791
caching how easy it is to cache stuff

961
01:33:10,208 --> 01:33:13,000
And then obviously like the database and

962
01:33:13,000 --> 01:33:15,833
queues so jobs just I've worked for

963
01:33:15,833 --> 01:33:17,208
companies where if like, okay

964
01:33:17,208 --> 01:33:19,833
We're gonna put this on a job and it's

965
01:33:19,833 --> 01:33:22,833
like this complicated process versus in

966
01:33:22,833 --> 01:33:24,958
Laravel. It's just so easy to do

967
01:33:26,166 --> 01:33:27,625
That's that's I guess my

968
01:33:27,625 --> 01:33:29,833
main reasons for going with it

969
01:33:30,250 --> 01:33:31,708
Makes sense. Yeah. Yeah the

970
01:33:32,166 --> 01:33:33,416
What are you using?

971
01:33:35,125 --> 01:33:37,916
You know anything sort of unique or wild

972
01:33:37,916 --> 01:33:40,458
in any of your apps that you know

973
01:33:40,458 --> 01:33:41,666
We might not know about like do you have

974
01:33:41,666 --> 01:33:42,833
a go-to package that you

975
01:33:42,833 --> 01:33:44,708
always use or anything like that?

976
01:33:45,375 --> 01:33:46,458
Go to package

977
01:33:49,166 --> 01:33:51,541
No, I guess it depends on

978
01:33:51,583 --> 01:33:52,833
you know

979
01:33:53,416 --> 01:33:55,375
The application I try to you know limit

980
01:33:55,375 --> 01:33:57,333
any packages I pull in just because I

981
01:33:57,333 --> 01:33:58,791
know that you know, you add dependencies

982
01:33:59,041 --> 01:34:03,083
I

983
01:34:03,083 --> 01:34:06,875
Mean I think I always you know, I try to

984
01:34:06,875 --> 01:34:08,208
keep it pretty stock

985
01:34:08,416 --> 01:34:11,291
Laravel and not you know build anything

986
01:34:11,291 --> 01:34:13,541
crazy to where if you go to you know

987
01:34:13,541 --> 01:34:15,708
upgrade versions, it's not as difficult

988
01:34:17,875 --> 01:34:19,916
Hmm I guess if you were to

989
01:34:19,916 --> 01:34:22,041
do payments you could you know

990
01:34:22,041 --> 01:34:24,458
Say like a Laravel spark would be the

991
01:34:24,458 --> 01:34:26,250
biggest one. So if I were

992
01:34:26,250 --> 01:34:27,875
to build a new application

993
01:34:29,458 --> 01:34:31,208
You know obviously the

994
01:34:31,208 --> 01:34:32,208
latest version of Laravel

995
01:34:32,708 --> 01:34:34,750
Go with their you know

996
01:34:34,750 --> 01:34:36,958
What I know the the one trouble I've had

997
01:34:36,958 --> 01:34:39,291
recently is if I'm not building something

998
01:34:39,291 --> 01:34:40,375
new and then staying

999
01:34:40,375 --> 01:34:41,583
up to date with like all

1000
01:34:41,583 --> 01:34:44,250
The changes that are coming with like if

1001
01:34:44,250 --> 01:34:45,250
I just want to you know

1002
01:34:45,250 --> 01:34:46,625
build a new application

1003
01:34:46,791 --> 01:34:49,500
You you go to install it and gives you so

1004
01:34:49,500 --> 01:34:51,000
many options and then you're like, okay

1005
01:34:51,000 --> 01:34:52,958
I got a research all the different front

1006
01:34:52,958 --> 01:34:54,083
ends is now supporting

1007
01:34:54,958 --> 01:34:57,541
My favorite time was just when you would

1008
01:34:57,541 --> 01:34:59,250
build it and it was using

1009
01:34:59,250 --> 01:35:01,958
like view I'm a big view JS fan

1010
01:35:03,208 --> 01:35:06,500
But you would build it it was a view, you

1011
01:35:06,500 --> 01:35:08,250
know, that was the one

1012
01:35:09,041 --> 01:35:11,333
Front in and then it was using

1013
01:35:11,583 --> 01:35:14,916
Laravel mix for you know building your

1014
01:35:14,916 --> 01:35:16,583
assets and compiling them

1015
01:35:17,500 --> 01:35:18,500
It just seems simpler

1016
01:35:18,500 --> 01:35:20,791
But maybe it's just because I was doing a

1017
01:35:20,791 --> 01:35:22,833
whole lot more new projects versus now

1018
01:35:22,833 --> 01:35:23,708
there's so many options

1019
01:35:23,833 --> 01:35:27,000
it feels like I

1020
01:35:27,000 --> 01:35:28,208
Don't even know all the options

1021
01:35:29,083 --> 01:35:30,833
Think it's like five or six, you know,

1022
01:35:30,833 --> 01:35:32,625
you know, it steps through everything,

1023
01:35:32,625 --> 01:35:34,041
you know everything from

1024
01:35:34,041 --> 01:35:36,250
what database, you know

1025
01:35:36,916 --> 01:35:39,083
You pick your front-end scaffolding you

1026
01:35:39,083 --> 01:35:40,375
you know, and then once you pick that I

1027
01:35:40,375 --> 01:35:41,166
think you then you pick

1028
01:35:41,500 --> 01:35:43,458
What do you want live wire view or?

1029
01:35:44,333 --> 01:35:46,625
Alp or not whatever the other thing is

1030
01:35:47,333 --> 01:35:49,125
But yeah, yeah, it's it's definitely

1031
01:35:49,125 --> 01:35:50,583
grown, you know from that standpoint

1032
01:35:50,708 --> 01:35:52,708
You know having to pick through all the

1033
01:35:52,708 --> 01:35:53,708
different things as you as

1034
01:35:53,708 --> 01:35:55,041
you go install a brand new app

1035
01:35:56,583 --> 01:35:58,166
Which which is interesting,

1036
01:35:58,166 --> 01:36:01,250
you know, it's it's sort of I

1037
01:36:01,250 --> 01:36:01,875
Don't know if there's

1038
01:36:01,875 --> 01:36:03,041
a good way of doing it

1039
01:36:03,791 --> 01:36:06,083
You know from a create like from a layer

1040
01:36:06,083 --> 01:36:07,375
of L standpoint because they want to

1041
01:36:07,375 --> 01:36:08,041
offer all these things

1042
01:36:08,041 --> 01:36:09,041
and make everybody happy

1043
01:36:09,083 --> 01:36:10,500
It's like, you know, how could you

1044
01:36:10,500 --> 01:36:11,541
simplify all that but

1045
01:36:11,541 --> 01:36:13,208
maybe in layer of L12?

1046
01:36:13,208 --> 01:36:14,541
They'll they'll come up with something

1047
01:36:14,541 --> 01:36:16,000
ingenious and we won't have to

1048
01:36:16,000 --> 01:36:16,791
even think about them anymore

1049
01:36:17,750 --> 01:36:19,791
Yeah, sometimes less options is better

1050
01:36:19,791 --> 01:36:21,625
Just make just go with it and then figure

1051
01:36:21,625 --> 01:36:24,000
out that one and then not you know not

1052
01:36:24,000 --> 01:36:25,375
have to make a decision

1053
01:36:26,583 --> 01:36:29,083
That may be an interesting way, but yeah,

1054
01:36:29,083 --> 01:36:31,000
I liked it when I just you know could

1055
01:36:31,000 --> 01:36:32,208
spin it up and it was

1056
01:36:32,791 --> 01:36:34,708
You know, I knew I knew

1057
01:36:34,708 --> 01:36:35,875
what I was getting out

1058
01:36:35,875 --> 01:36:37,791
I I think like even now you

1059
01:36:37,791 --> 01:36:39,083
can like pick don't install

1060
01:36:39,750 --> 01:36:41,500
Authentication which I guess makes sense

1061
01:36:41,500 --> 01:36:42,041
because there's not

1062
01:36:42,041 --> 01:36:43,583
always gonna be authentication

1063
01:36:44,000 --> 01:36:45,666
not all applications are

1064
01:36:45,666 --> 01:36:48,208
gonna be needing off but

1065
01:36:50,125 --> 01:36:53,208
Yeah, it's tricky I read sometimes where

1066
01:36:53,208 --> 01:36:56,500
Taylor will post, you know, whatever

1067
01:36:57,041 --> 01:36:57,916
You know, he's trying

1068
01:36:57,916 --> 01:36:59,166
to make this person happy

1069
01:36:59,166 --> 01:37:01,458
but then this whole group's gonna be you

1070
01:37:01,458 --> 01:37:03,416
know upset or he wants to have these

1071
01:37:03,416 --> 01:37:05,416
different front-end languages and

1072
01:37:06,458 --> 01:37:08,708
Yeah. Anyways, it's a tough job

1073
01:37:09,708 --> 01:37:12,083
Yeah, yeah, I don't envy that that part

1074
01:37:12,083 --> 01:37:14,208
of building a very successful framework

1075
01:37:14,208 --> 01:37:15,416
it just seems like it's

1076
01:37:16,875 --> 01:37:18,000
No matter what you do

1077
01:37:18,000 --> 01:37:18,958
somebody's gonna be mad

1078
01:37:19,208 --> 01:37:20,833
You just had to make a decision and go

1079
01:37:20,833 --> 01:37:23,291
with it. Yeah, and they get feedback and

1080
01:37:23,291 --> 01:37:24,416
then maybe maybe adjust

1081
01:37:24,416 --> 01:37:25,250
or pivot in the future

1082
01:37:25,250 --> 01:37:28,041
but yeah, that's

1083
01:37:28,291 --> 01:37:29,916
Very true well

1084
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:33,958
Well Tim what anything else that maybe

1085
01:37:33,958 --> 01:37:35,250
we've missed that you want to talk about

1086
01:37:35,250 --> 01:37:37,125
before we close this thing out

1087
01:37:38,166 --> 01:37:38,875
uh

1088
01:37:39,541 --> 01:37:42,541
No, I'd be I think you posted something

1089
01:37:42,541 --> 01:37:44,625
about Laravel cloud. That's something I'm

1090
01:37:44,625 --> 01:37:45,666
kind of interested in

1091
01:37:46,291 --> 01:37:48,666
You know, that's it. That's a neat

1092
01:37:49,083 --> 01:37:51,666
Feature coming or you know option coming.

1093
01:37:51,666 --> 01:37:52,333
That's a little another

1094
01:37:52,333 --> 01:37:53,458
thing of where to host it

1095
01:37:54,458 --> 01:37:55,041
but

1096
01:37:56,291 --> 01:37:57,458
No, I don't really have

1097
01:37:57,458 --> 01:37:58,916
anything else to share

1098
01:37:59,625 --> 01:38:02,250
Gotcha. Gotcha. Yeah the I got to

1099
01:38:02,250 --> 01:38:03,875
speaking of Laravel cloud. I went to

1100
01:38:04,583 --> 01:38:06,500
Upstate PHP, which is in Greenville,

1101
01:38:06,500 --> 01:38:08,875
South Carolina last night and Jason bags

1102
01:38:08,875 --> 01:38:11,500
did a demo of Laravel cloud and

1103
01:38:12,375 --> 01:38:14,375
It's pretty sweet it's it's got a lot of

1104
01:38:14,375 --> 01:38:16,291
the the Forge feel to it, you know

1105
01:38:16,291 --> 01:38:18,000
You can kind of do everything you can do

1106
01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:19,500
in Forge this this is

1107
01:38:19,500 --> 01:38:20,333
from my point of view

1108
01:38:20,333 --> 01:38:23,083
I'm not a I've only ever used Forge so I

1109
01:38:23,083 --> 01:38:24,541
don't know the differences and all the

1110
01:38:24,541 --> 01:38:25,666
the you know, all

1111
01:38:25,666 --> 01:38:27,750
this cloud stuff, but uh

1112
01:38:28,416 --> 01:38:30,500
But yeah, and then it spins up servers

1113
01:38:30,500 --> 01:38:31,625
can hibernate on can

1114
01:38:31,625 --> 01:38:32,458
do all the other stuff

1115
01:38:32,500 --> 01:38:34,541
So it's it's really sweet and the of

1116
01:38:34,541 --> 01:38:37,750
course the UI looks really good. I'm I'm

1117
01:38:37,750 --> 01:38:38,916
sort of interested on

1118
01:38:39,875 --> 01:38:41,375
What they're gonna do with it in the

1119
01:38:41,375 --> 01:38:43,666
future because I think I don't know I

1120
01:38:43,666 --> 01:38:44,666
just get the vibes like you

1121
01:38:44,666 --> 01:38:45,333
You're gonna be able to

1122
01:38:45,333 --> 01:38:46,916
do so much more with cloud

1123
01:38:48,000 --> 01:38:49,875
You know like Laravel new

1124
01:38:50,208 --> 01:38:52,000
Probably that can integrate with cloud

1125
01:38:52,000 --> 01:38:53,583
and then you don't even have to make half

1126
01:38:53,583 --> 01:38:55,458
these decisions anymore cuz it's just

1127
01:38:55,458 --> 01:38:56,500
gonna automatically upload it

1128
01:38:56,500 --> 01:38:58,500
And you've got your site and and you

1129
01:38:58,500 --> 01:38:59,541
know, it just defaults to

1130
01:38:59,541 --> 01:39:00,916
whatever they liked the most

1131
01:39:00,958 --> 01:39:04,625
So I don't know I'm sort of interested

1132
01:39:04,625 --> 01:39:06,041
with the next year year holds

1133
01:39:06,041 --> 01:39:07,750
I know cloud supposed to come out

1134
01:39:07,750 --> 01:39:09,833
sometime this quarter so that that should

1135
01:39:09,833 --> 01:39:11,000
be pretty interesting and sweet

1136
01:39:11,708 --> 01:39:13,291
Yeah, yeah that will be

1137
01:39:13,291 --> 01:39:14,375
neat just to make it simple

1138
01:39:14,375 --> 01:39:16,583
Like, you know, somebody wants to build a

1139
01:39:16,583 --> 01:39:19,125
website and there's so many steps to

1140
01:39:19,125 --> 01:39:20,541
getting a website

1141
01:39:20,541 --> 01:39:22,041
built and putting it online

1142
01:39:22,041 --> 01:39:24,208
But making you know making it easier to

1143
01:39:24,208 --> 01:39:25,000
word that all that's

1144
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:25,791
kind of working together

1145
01:39:26,541 --> 01:39:28,416
It's definitely definitely neat

1146
01:39:29,125 --> 01:39:32,458
But yeah now this were go ahead no,

1147
01:39:32,458 --> 01:39:34,750
that's that's kind of it I was

1148
01:39:34,750 --> 01:39:38,458
What was I gonna say

1149
01:39:39,916 --> 01:39:41,000
Yeah, I don't know

1150
01:39:41,000 --> 01:39:42,708
that's that's really neat

1151
01:39:43,291 --> 01:39:44,416
Yeah, it's always

1152
01:39:44,416 --> 01:39:45,541
speaking of all the steps though

1153
01:39:45,750 --> 01:39:47,500
You know, it's it feels

1154
01:39:47,500 --> 01:39:48,750
like there is a lot now

1155
01:39:48,750 --> 01:39:50,875
But like if you think back into like the

1156
01:39:50,875 --> 01:39:52,958
early 2000s, it was like a whole lot of

1157
01:39:52,958 --> 01:39:55,208
steps and now it's it's you know

1158
01:39:55,208 --> 01:39:56,833
With Forge and all these other things.

1159
01:39:56,833 --> 01:39:57,875
It's it's pretty simple

1160
01:39:58,541 --> 01:40:00,458
But it still is still is a lot of steps

1161
01:40:00,458 --> 01:40:01,625
and it seems like all

1162
01:40:01,625 --> 01:40:02,500
that should be streamlined

1163
01:40:02,500 --> 01:40:04,166
So I'm like in the future

1164
01:40:04,166 --> 01:40:06,791
that we're all headed into. Oh

1165
01:40:06,791 --> 01:40:08,625
Yeah, yeah, it will be interesting what

1166
01:40:08,625 --> 01:40:12,333
they do with I see a lot of like

1167
01:40:13,250 --> 01:40:16,041
Malicious links with the TDI. Oh, I so I

1168
01:40:16,041 --> 01:40:17,625
deal with that but like

1169
01:40:18,083 --> 01:40:19,375
vercel and

1170
01:40:20,083 --> 01:40:21,500
cloud flare like

1171
01:40:22,541 --> 01:40:25,291
their workers pages those are

1172
01:40:25,291 --> 01:40:26,791
constantly targeted for like

1173
01:40:27,666 --> 01:40:30,500
Malicious links and stuff. So I'm curious

1174
01:40:30,500 --> 01:40:32,000
of how how Laravel is gonna

1175
01:40:32,000 --> 01:40:34,583
handle that I imagine they're

1176
01:40:34,750 --> 01:40:36,000
Already know that's gonna be a problem.

1177
01:40:36,000 --> 01:40:37,500
But I think they're gonna

1178
01:40:37,500 --> 01:40:40,500
if they give you a way to see

1179
01:40:40,833 --> 01:40:42,875
You know, if they're

1180
01:40:42,875 --> 01:40:44,375
doing the hosting themselves

1181
01:40:45,750 --> 01:40:48,000
I'm curious of how they're gonna handle

1182
01:40:48,000 --> 01:40:50,083
that because before with Forge they

1183
01:40:50,083 --> 01:40:51,041
didn't really have to handle that

1184
01:40:51,041 --> 01:40:52,791
They kind of just offloaded that to like,

1185
01:40:52,791 --> 01:40:55,083
you know, like Linna or digital ocean

1186
01:40:55,250 --> 01:40:57,291
But that that's gonna

1187
01:40:57,291 --> 01:40:59,500
be a challenge for them

1188
01:41:00,083 --> 01:41:01,375
That's very true. Yeah, that's something.

1189
01:41:01,375 --> 01:41:03,125
Yeah, I haven't even thought about that

1190
01:41:03,125 --> 01:41:05,000
but yeah, that's because you could spin

1191
01:41:05,000 --> 01:41:07,083
up any spam site off of a

1192
01:41:07,625 --> 01:41:09,291
Assume they give you a subdomain or

1193
01:41:09,291 --> 01:41:10,916
something and then just be like, yeah

1194
01:41:11,791 --> 01:41:13,500
That's usually how it is

1195
01:41:13,500 --> 01:41:15,541
I think I've seen that on their platform

1196
01:41:15,541 --> 01:41:18,208
to where it will be like a subdomain and

1197
01:41:18,208 --> 01:41:19,791
that's nice because it's you know

1198
01:41:19,791 --> 01:41:21,875
great you could just you know create a

1199
01:41:21,875 --> 01:41:22,958
new layer of a lot put

1200
01:41:22,958 --> 01:41:23,833
it out there and then

1201
01:41:24,583 --> 01:41:27,958
Get a URL back that's you know live

1202
01:41:28,666 --> 01:41:30,666
But then with that like

1203
01:41:30,666 --> 01:41:31,583
we were talking earlier

1204
01:41:31,916 --> 01:41:35,291
It just comes the the the bad side of the

1205
01:41:35,291 --> 01:41:37,166
internet the malicious side of the

1206
01:41:37,166 --> 01:41:39,083
internet comes out. So

1207
01:41:39,833 --> 01:41:42,125
Yeah, the well this that sort of reminds

1208
01:41:42,125 --> 01:41:43,833
me. Do you remember github pages?

1209
01:41:44,458 --> 01:41:45,500
You know you could host

1210
01:41:45,500 --> 01:41:46,416
your own pay, you know

1211
01:41:46,416 --> 01:41:48,458
You're on site with pages and back in the

1212
01:41:48,458 --> 01:41:50,583
day you could it was actually I think a

1213
01:41:50,583 --> 01:41:52,416
subdomain off of github.com

1214
01:41:52,458 --> 01:41:53,916
But then they found out there was a

1215
01:41:53,916 --> 01:41:55,083
security issue where you could actually

1216
01:41:55,083 --> 01:41:55,833
steal cookies or

1217
01:41:55,833 --> 01:41:57,791
something from the the main calm

1218
01:41:57,791 --> 01:41:59,916
So now then they switched everything it's

1219
01:41:59,916 --> 01:42:01,000
not it's not off of

1220
01:42:01,000 --> 01:42:02,333
github.com. It's off of something else

1221
01:42:03,125 --> 01:42:05,333
And you know all that it's super

1222
01:42:05,333 --> 01:42:07,875
interesting all the the ways, you know

1223
01:42:08,750 --> 01:42:10,458
the cat and mouse of you figure out

1224
01:42:10,458 --> 01:42:11,666
something cool and then they just figure

1225
01:42:11,666 --> 01:42:12,916
out how to break it and

1226
01:42:13,208 --> 01:42:14,291
scam people and

1227
01:42:14,291 --> 01:42:18,666
Yeah, and they probably switched the

1228
01:42:18,666 --> 01:42:20,958
domain because the github domain was

1229
01:42:20,958 --> 01:42:21,875
probably constantly getting

1230
01:42:22,041 --> 01:42:25,000
Flagged and that's the whole topic we go

1231
01:42:25,000 --> 01:42:26,708
down. But the you know domains get

1232
01:42:26,708 --> 01:42:28,125
flagged and they get put on these

1233
01:42:28,916 --> 01:42:31,791
Blacklist and then you know browsers

1234
01:42:31,791 --> 01:42:33,041
block them. It's all kinds

1235
01:42:33,041 --> 01:42:35,291
of crazy stuff happens. So

1236
01:42:35,958 --> 01:42:38,833
Anyways, yeah, yeah deep deep dark rabbit

1237
01:42:38,833 --> 01:42:42,000
hole that we can go down for a day

1238
01:42:42,208 --> 01:42:43,958
Yeah, we do a follow-up sometime

1239
01:42:44,500 --> 01:42:46,250
That sounds good. Well T. M. I don't want

1240
01:42:46,250 --> 01:42:47,291
to hold you up all day

1241
01:42:47,291 --> 01:42:49,166
But man, I appreciate you taking time to

1242
01:42:49,166 --> 01:42:50,708
come meet with me and you know, talk

1243
01:42:50,708 --> 01:42:51,625
about everything you're building

1244
01:42:51,791 --> 01:42:54,666
You know if you're out there and you're

1245
01:42:54,666 --> 01:42:55,875
looking for a nice

1246
01:42:55,875 --> 01:42:57,833
URL shortening service T

1247
01:42:58,041 --> 01:42:59,708
ly is the way to go. I'm

1248
01:42:59,708 --> 01:43:01,833
a customer actually and

1249
01:43:02,375 --> 01:43:04,000
Supporter of it. So so

1250
01:43:04,000 --> 01:43:05,583
go check them out for sure

1251
01:43:06,291 --> 01:43:07,541
Yeah, awesome. Thank you