WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:11.537 --> 00:00:17.557 Jethro Jones: Welcome to Transformative Principle, where I help you stop putting out fires and start leading. 00:00:18.097 --> 00:00:19.557 I am your host, Jethro Jones. 00:00:19.557 --> 00:00:22.317 You can follow me on Twitter at Jethro Jones. 00:00:34.928 --> 00:00:37.853 Jethro D. Jones: Alright, welcome to Transformative Principle. 00:00:38.093 --> 00:00:41.173 I am so excited to have today Will Richardson on the program. 00:00:41.793 --> 00:00:53.613 Um, if you don't know Will Richardson, I don't know where you've been in education for the last, uh, 30 years, but, uh, will someone that I have admired and followed for a long time and uh, learned a ton from. 00:00:53.633 --> 00:00:55.853 So will welcome to Transformative Principle. 00:00:55.853 --> 00:00:56.493 Great to have you. 00:00:56.818 --> 00:00:57.868 Will Richardson: Thanks very much Jethro. 00:00:57.868 --> 00:00:59.968 Your uh, $50 is in the mail for 00:00:59.968 --> 00:01:00.958 that nice introduction, 00:01:01.063 --> 00:01:01.363 Jethro D. Jones: All right. 00:01:01.843 --> 00:01:02.123 Excellent. 00:01:03.033 --> 00:01:10.803 . Well, um, so you've started a new, uh, a new cohort with some people doing some cool stuff, which is what you're always doing. 00:01:11.103 --> 00:01:14.203 So why don't you tell us about this new, uh, approach? 00:01:14.463 --> 00:01:16.323 Um, we'll talk about your manifesto also. 00:01:17.593 --> 00:01:18.043 Will Richardson: Yeah. 00:01:18.043 --> 00:01:32.383 So I mean, one of the things that, as I look back on my career, uh, of almost 40 years in education, but certainly 20 years now, um, speaking, consulting, I. You know, working with schools is that I find that I evolve about every five years or so. 00:01:32.383 --> 00:01:48.583 And so, um, I'm in, in the moment of evolution again where a lot of the reading that I've been doing and a lot of the thinking that I've been doing has been around the context and the realities that are happening in the world right now, and the growing dissonance between what. 00:01:49.193 --> 00:02:02.693 Kids need to be able to do, to navigate these, these challenges and, you know, this kind of interesting future that's coming our way and the still very traditional, um, approaches of, of, of schools, whether that's. 00:02:03.013 --> 00:02:06.043 Pedagogy, whether it's, uh, the experience that they build. 00:02:06.043 --> 00:02:27.793 So, so I wrote the manifesto and I basically, uh, tried to make the case that schools, the purpose of schools right now needs to be able to help kids become spiritually, physically, and emotionally ready, um, for navigating what is going to be, uh, a, a time of chaos, complexity, and collapse. 00:02:27.793 --> 00:02:32.203 Those are the, the three Cs that I kind of framed it as, and that. 00:02:32.313 --> 00:02:48.333 Um, we really have to use that as a lens right now for the, uh, for what we create, for what we do in classrooms and for the outcomes that we, um, that we articulate for, you know, what our kids, what we want our kids to be able to do. 00:02:49.293 --> 00:02:54.453 Um, and so it's a lens that I think is, is pretty, uh, provocative, obviously. 00:02:54.603 --> 00:03:01.143 Uh, I mean, the name of the manifesto was confronting Education, um, in a time of complexity and chaos and collapse. 00:03:01.143 --> 00:03:18.038 So, um, I, I decided that I'd like to, I. Try to put together a group of folks to go into that and dive into that and, and really be a little bit confrontational, um, in thinking about education and schooling and doing it in a, in a safe and trusted space. 00:03:18.038 --> 00:03:22.628 So, uh, I put out the call for, um, people to join. 00:03:22.748 --> 00:03:24.308 I was hoping for about 25. 00:03:24.338 --> 00:03:25.718 I ended up with 68. 00:03:26.248 --> 00:03:33.328 Um, which tells me that there are quite a few people out there I think, who are feeling like this. 00:03:33.508 --> 00:03:42.838 Uh, again, this moment is, is really filled with this, this challenge and are looking for spaces to talk about it, to process it. 00:03:43.148 --> 00:03:46.448 To rub elbows with other people who are feeling it as well. 00:03:47.048 --> 00:03:51.818 The very cool thing is that we've also got nine students from around the world. 00:03:51.968 --> 00:04:02.738 Um, I, I wanted to make sure that we heard the voices of children in these conversations, because obviously when you're in schools or when you're in education, what you're talking about is what? 00:04:02.743 --> 00:04:04.513 It's happening with kids in classrooms. 00:04:04.513 --> 00:04:06.613 So we're in our second week. 00:04:06.613 --> 00:04:10.063 I have, uh, two cohorts going, one on Tuesday, one on Wednesday. 00:04:10.123 --> 00:04:13.033 Did our second week, uh, yesterday with the Tuesday cohort. 00:04:13.633 --> 00:04:16.033 Um, and it's been, I think it's been great. 00:04:16.033 --> 00:04:16.063 I. 00:04:16.513 --> 00:04:25.783 Um, we've, we've really been able to dive into some very difficult and challenging conversations about the state of the world and about the state of education. 00:04:25.783 --> 00:04:39.493 So, uh, I'm hoping that those types of conversations can continue and, and that might grow into something, um, that will be really worthwhile for, for all educators who are feeling it at 00:04:39.493 --> 00:04:40.003 this moment. 00:04:40.588 --> 00:04:41.438 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah, that's good. 00:04:41.578 --> 00:04:52.198 So I, I have a link in the show notes to the manifesto itself and, uh, to your substack, uh, future Serious School, um, that people should definitely go and check out. 00:04:52.970 --> 00:04:58.485 But I want to ask a key question that I get frustrated with all the time and. 00:04:59.905 --> 00:05:09.045 One of, one of the problems that we have with the world we live in right now is that it seems like everything is political and. 00:05:10.405 --> 00:05:21.745 And there, there is that aspect of it that everything's political, but then there's a separate aspect, um, which is that people align themselves to politics like it's a religion. 00:05:22.525 --> 00:05:35.425 How do you, how do you go beyond that and, and talk about these things without the, uh, the, the problem that we often fall into, which is, well, if 00:05:36.225 --> 00:05:37.585 A different person we're in power. 00:05:38.135 --> 00:05:48.185 This wouldn't be the problem because the reality is it doesn't matter who's in power, uh, and especially, uh, focused here in the United States. 00:05:48.205 --> 00:05:49.665 It doesn't matter who's in power. 00:05:50.075 --> 00:05:56.945 These problems have been going on for a long time, and they will continue to persist regardless of who comes into power in the future. 00:05:57.725 --> 00:06:01.425 So how do you keep that political aspect? 00:06:02.245 --> 00:06:07.105 Out of it or make that not the, the complaint that, that, that is the problem. 00:06:07.325 --> 00:06:08.505 How, what's your approach to that? 00:06:08.505 --> 00:06:08.785 Will 00:06:09.310 --> 00:06:13.540 Will Richardson: Well, I think that despite the politics, and I agree, it's hard, it's really hard. 00:06:13.720 --> 00:06:17.650 Um, but despite the politics, there are still, there is still common ground here. 00:06:18.250 --> 00:06:28.945 I. Um, I know one of the things that home and I did in the Big Questions Institute, um, you know, in kind of the work that I was doing up until this point, um, we had a nine now a 12 big questions book. 00:06:28.945 --> 00:06:30.655 And the first one is, what is Sacred? 00:06:30.745 --> 00:06:31.075 Right? 00:06:31.075 --> 00:06:34.255 And we'd go and we'd ask schools and parents and communities. 00:06:34.615 --> 00:06:42.115 Well, when you think about this particular school, 10, 15, 25 years down the road, what do you wanna make sure still exists? 00:06:42.115 --> 00:06:45.775 If you came back in 50 years, what, what do you want? 00:06:45.785 --> 00:06:48.335 To make sure is still there. 00:06:48.905 --> 00:07:03.695 And there was wide consensus relationships, community care, um, that, you know, that there was relevance, that, you know, all the things that I think we all, when we think about kids and we think about the future, we all say those same things. 00:07:03.695 --> 00:07:07.085 We want them to flourish, we want them to thrive. 00:07:07.175 --> 00:07:07.685 And at 00:07:07.685 --> 00:07:12.875 the very core, there's a lot of coherence and a lot of shared, um, thinking about that. 00:07:13.670 --> 00:07:28.910 Um, where it gets a little bit sticky is obviously when you begin pushing back against traditional narratives where people find comfort, um, where a lot of it is pol politically driven in terms of, you know, again, here in the states how we measure success. 00:07:29.360 --> 00:07:35.270 Um, what we are actually having kids become educated for, all of those things, right? 00:07:35.840 --> 00:07:40.520 Um, but again, I think that there is enough of a, of a starting point. 00:07:41.035 --> 00:07:42.625 Where we can go in. 00:07:42.625 --> 00:07:46.705 I think any of us can go to our school communities and say, can we just talk? 00:07:47.275 --> 00:08:05.635 Can we just have a chat here, you know, about some of the really important questions, uh, acknowledging that this is a little bit of a different moment in the world, obviously, and maybe not going into those particulars, but just saying things are changing right now, and what does that mean for our children moving forward? 00:08:06.085 --> 00:08:16.405 We, I, I think also, uh, at the end of the day, if you can get people to talk and have a conversation about it, I think we all realize we can't, we can't go backwards, right? 00:08:16.405 --> 00:08:22.645 We can't hold on to a lot of those things that, again, if we're honest about it, have brought us to this moment. 00:08:22.645 --> 00:08:24.445 Look, schools are complicit, right? 00:08:24.445 --> 00:08:25.345 We're all complicit 00:08:25.555 --> 00:08:27.535 in, in what's happening right now. 00:08:27.535 --> 00:08:29.365 And I'm not talking about politics per se. 00:08:29.365 --> 00:08:31.525 I'm talking about the climate. 00:08:32.335 --> 00:08:40.195 You know, aspects, the challenges that we have environmentally, the, the, the, the challenges that we have with the loss of biodiversity equity issues. 00:08:40.285 --> 00:08:42.025 Um, you know, all of those things that, 00:08:42.625 --> 00:08:43.705 uh, we can't ignore. 00:08:44.005 --> 00:08:57.115 And so, uh, yeah, I think that there is some enough common ground to get these conversations started, but I'm not gonna sit here and tell you that it's really easy to, um, to talk about these things at depth because they get really uncomfortable 00:08:57.445 --> 00:09:00.685 and, um, people, people have to be willing to stick with it. 00:09:01.255 --> 00:09:03.785 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah, they, they really do get uncomfortable. 00:09:04.005 --> 00:09:24.025 And as, as I was working in Fairbanks, Alaska, designing a K 12 magnet school, and I had all these conversations with parents, with community members, with school board members, uh, with employees, that question of what do you want to still exist in 50 years was really powerful. 00:09:24.285 --> 00:09:31.385 And, and what you're looking at there is . What do you want to be true for your grandchildren? 00:09:31.965 --> 00:09:36.465 And it's, it's not just about like, what's in it for me? 00:09:36.695 --> 00:09:41.465 What, what am I gonna get from myself right now or for my own kids? 00:09:41.845 --> 00:09:49.305 But really, what do, what do I want to be true for my grandkids, assuming they still live here, but even if they don't. 00:09:49.880 --> 00:09:52.445 What do I want for the grandkids of my community? 00:09:52.705 --> 00:10:05.405 And, and this, this perspective, I think is really important because one of the things that I've, uh, one of the stakes I've put down on the ground is that education is the responsibility of the family. 00:10:06.045 --> 00:10:14.530 I. They are the core unit of society and it's their responsibility to educate their children and raise them up to be adults. 00:10:14.670 --> 00:10:24.090 And we can't ask anybody to do that unless we're saying we want to take away kids from their parents, which I don't think anybody truly wants to do. 00:10:25.975 --> 00:10:40.675 But if we take that perspective that it's the parent's responsibility and then we enlist other people to help the parents with that responsibility, and particularly that they enlist other people to do that, then that changes the dynamic. 00:10:41.225 --> 00:10:43.235 What, what's your thought on that perspective? 00:10:44.690 --> 00:10:50.270 Will Richardson: Well, I, I do think that obviously parents are the fundamental educators in a child's 00:10:50.270 --> 00:10:51.200 life, right? 00:10:51.350 --> 00:10:57.920 Um, no matter what happens in a classroom, when kids come home, they learn more probably about what it means to be in a relationship. 00:10:58.250 --> 00:11:02.900 What it means to be, you know, a good person, a good community member, whatever. 00:11:02.960 --> 00:11:06.140 They learn that from their families more than they learn that from schools. 00:11:06.140 --> 00:11:06.890 There's no question. 00:11:07.520 --> 00:11:15.590 I would again, though, suggest that there's a lot of, of, of common, uh, feelings about what it means to be a good ancestor. 00:11:15.590 --> 00:11:19.100 To go to your point about, you know, really thinking further down the road. 00:11:19.640 --> 00:11:24.290 And I, I think all of us, none of us want kids in the future to suffer. 00:11:24.290 --> 00:11:26.295 None of us want the earth to be. 00:11:26.920 --> 00:11:30.730 You know, polluted and to be, uh, under duress. 00:11:30.730 --> 00:11:35.980 None of us want any of those things that currently feel like they're in the mix. 00:11:36.670 --> 00:11:48.190 So I think it becomes, again, a question of where can we start with some shared language, some shared beliefs, some shared, you know, some common, um, vision for what an education is. 00:11:48.190 --> 00:11:50.680 And I think that's where it kind of comes off the rails, Jethro, to be 00:11:50.680 --> 00:11:51.460 honest with you. 00:11:51.465 --> 00:11:56.380 You know, I think that a lot of times, especially as you've mentioned before, already, the politics of it. 00:11:57.190 --> 00:12:07.600 Um, get in, get in the mix in ways that make it difficult for all parents to feel like schools are a partner in the educating that 00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:08.350 they're doing at home. 00:12:08.440 --> 00:12:08.740 Right. 00:12:09.250 --> 00:12:17.830 and and so, um, yeah, I think, you know, one of the things you're seeing right now is, is people trying to find the partner that fits with their worldview. 00:12:18.340 --> 00:12:23.980 Um, and, uh, you know, I mean, there's a sense of separation that happens in that, that. 00:12:24.535 --> 00:12:26.305 Ultimately is not gonna be good for us. 00:12:26.305 --> 00:12:33.475 So again, it's like how do you come back to those, those shared those shared beliefs and those, those kind of shared visions 00:12:33.475 --> 00:12:34.615 for what we all want. 00:12:35.305 --> 00:12:44.125 I think we all want a world where kids can feel happy and, and healthy and to, to thrive and feel safe and all that kind of stuff. 00:12:44.125 --> 00:12:48.625 So how do we do that together is, uh, is the really important question, 00:12:49.165 --> 00:12:49.735 but it's hard. 00:12:50.085 --> 00:12:50.375 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah. 00:12:50.515 --> 00:12:51.695 It, it certainly is. 00:12:52.035 --> 00:13:09.940 And, and the key thing that I've found with this is like what you said in here, none of a, like being a good ancestor, . that that takes some intention and takes some some time to think about that and say, well, what does that mean for me to be good, be a good ancestor because we don't think about that, you 00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:11.440 Will Richardson: And that's the problem, right? 00:13:11.470 --> 00:13:11.560 I 00:13:11.560 --> 00:13:14.080 mean, it is something we kind of go, oh, what a question 00:13:14.320 --> 00:13:16.420 instead of, well, that's the way I live my life. 00:13:16.480 --> 00:13:16.780 You know? 00:13:16.780 --> 00:13:19.390 I mean that's, that, that factors into everything that I do. 00:13:19.720 --> 00:13:21.280 It's very, very rare. 00:13:21.690 --> 00:13:31.770 Um, you go to indigenous communities, obviously, and, and there's much, much more of that, where there's this long-term thinking about, you know, again, the community, the world, all of that. 00:13:31.770 --> 00:13:38.580 But for a lot of people, you know, in this, uh, kind of global north, very weird, you know, the acronym, right? 00:13:39.090 --> 00:13:42.505 Um, that's not something that we think about very much at all. 00:13:43.110 --> 00:13:43.310 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah. 00:13:43.690 --> 00:13:58.065 Uh, so my, um, I'm in a men's group right now where that is what we are intentionally . Focusing on, not on making things good for us, but the, the plan is how do we make it good for our grandchildren? 00:13:58.455 --> 00:13:59.465 What does that look like? 00:13:59.565 --> 00:14:09.825 And we're looking at all aspects of, of society, our ourselves, our, our religious adherence, our uh, our physical fitness are. 00:14:10.490 --> 00:14:16.310 You know, what we do for work and how we provide for families long term and, and all that kind of stuff. 00:14:16.310 --> 00:14:32.875 And it's something that, you know, I look at my ancestors and what they taught me and I had this really cool experience to, uh, edit and update a. A biography about my great-grandfather, um, whose name was Tracy Buchanan. 00:14:33.015 --> 00:14:36.795 And he was a, an organist and he ran a school of music. 00:14:37.095 --> 00:14:39.635 And it was, it was really fascinating. 00:14:39.755 --> 00:14:49.275 I didn't do much, I didn't add anything new to this, but I just got it ready so that, so that his descendants could buy the book and, and learn more about him. 00:14:50.175 --> 00:14:52.635 And what was really fascinating going through that. 00:14:54.005 --> 00:15:09.145 is, I had this gratitude for what he did to to help out his descendants, and one of those things was a love of music and my mom plays the organ and played the piano and has followed in her grand. 00:15:09.805 --> 00:15:12.785 Her grandfather's footsteps, but I have not. 00:15:13.205 --> 00:15:22.185 And I, after I did that, I felt this compulsion that I need to start, uh, playing the piano and, and tapping into this musical heritage that I have. 00:15:22.805 --> 00:15:24.905 And I haven't done that effectively. 00:15:24.965 --> 00:15:29.905 And I started taking piano lessons and learning again, and, and it was great. 00:15:29.965 --> 00:15:35.945 But the, the reason that I bring this up is I don't think he was thinking about that for me. 00:15:37.670 --> 00:15:41.110 I want to start thinking like that for my grandchildren and great-grandchildren. 00:15:42.090 --> 00:15:45.670 And so that has to change how I do some, some things that I'm doing. 00:15:45.770 --> 00:15:49.910 And one of the things that I have changed is how I talk to my kids about what really matters. 00:15:50.650 --> 00:15:54.390 And, and for me personally, this has been huge. 00:15:54.410 --> 00:15:56.630 And this is what cemented that idea of. 00:15:57.825 --> 00:16:11.555 parents are the primary educators because it, it helped me see how what I was doing was going to impact them and what I was doing at work and helping children at school, uh, can impact them as as well. 00:16:12.095 --> 00:16:21.555 But I still have to recognize that the parents are first and foremost, and I stopped asking parents to partner with us and I started asking, how can we help you raise your children? 00:16:22.145 --> 00:16:24.285 How can what, where do you need support and help? 00:16:24.745 --> 00:16:34.765 And, and that made a huge difference also because people would start saying things that aren't really in the purview of school, but that schools have been asked to adopt. 00:16:35.105 --> 00:16:43.725 And it's a lot different when society is saying, schools need to do this, than when a parent is saying, I need help teaching my kid about how to use technology appropriately. 00:16:43.995 --> 00:16:46.245 There's a big difference between those two approaches. 00:16:47.482 --> 00:16:52.342 Will Richardson: But I think what you said in the beginning of that response is really important too. 00:16:52.342 --> 00:17:02.782 And that is that you're willing to kind of unpack your life and take a look at it, step back from it and ask the questions about, you know, what, how is this impacting the future? 00:17:02.782 --> 00:17:04.072 How is this impacting 00:17:04.552 --> 00:17:05.272 my family? 00:17:05.332 --> 00:17:05.872 All of that. 00:17:05.872 --> 00:17:07.612 And I think that, um. 00:17:07.852 --> 00:17:11.812 You know, we don't do enough of that type of reflection because it's really hard. 00:17:11.932 --> 00:17:12.112 Right. 00:17:12.142 --> 00:17:12.652 Again. 00:17:12.682 --> 00:17:13.042 Right. 00:17:13.312 --> 00:17:14.302 It's just really hard. 00:17:14.302 --> 00:17:24.682 And so, you know, the question becomes how can we, and because I really just believe we all need to do this personally, but then we all need to do it in the context of education if we're concerned with that. 00:17:24.682 --> 00:17:24.982 Right. 00:17:25.687 --> 00:17:36.667 But, you know, how do we again, bring those hard conversations like, um, you know, Vanessa TI and Hospice in Moderna calls them these denials that we have 00:17:36.667 --> 00:17:46.117 about, um, what's happening in the world, our, our contribution to it, what's happening in schools, and how do we, how do we create spaces where we can sit with those things, right? 00:17:46.177 --> 00:17:49.057 And, and really, and really think about them deeply. 00:17:49.567 --> 00:17:52.477 And take time to reflect on our own practice. 00:17:52.837 --> 00:18:00.517 Um, which is again, one of the reasons that, you know, I I, I'm trying to start these, these cohorts because I just, it is personal work first, right? 00:18:00.607 --> 00:18:06.097 Um, we, we had a phrase, Homan, and I have this phrase where we called it soul work before schoolwork, 00:18:06.187 --> 00:18:06.487 right? 00:18:06.547 --> 00:18:11.587 And it, it really is about, um, just interrogating our own. 00:18:12.772 --> 00:18:19.612 Position our own kind of interaction in this moment and um, and asking questions like you're asking about. 00:18:19.852 --> 00:18:21.562 Well, how is this impacting 00:18:21.682 --> 00:18:23.122 and is this helping? 00:18:23.632 --> 00:18:28.972 Um, or is this contributing to things that, that I really don't want to see continue? 00:18:29.032 --> 00:18:29.422 So, 00:18:29.722 --> 00:18:32.002 um, to me that's a, that's a huge question. 00:18:32.002 --> 00:18:33.382 You know, how do we create those spaces? 00:18:33.382 --> 00:18:36.262 Margaret Wheatley calls 'em, I think islands of sanity, 00:18:36.322 --> 00:18:36.592 right? 00:18:36.622 --> 00:18:43.017 Where, where we can come together and be good humans with one another and really try to work on those things that we, we think are most important. 00:18:43.792 --> 00:18:53.962 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah, so I, a few years ago I did a, a podcast where I was on somebody else's podcast about, uh, environmental, uh, climate change type stuff. 00:18:54.182 --> 00:19:00.242 And, um, and, and my whole premise for that conversation was that, um. 00:19:01.927 --> 00:19:09.947 My belief is we need to change the phrasing around that, that it is really about stewardship of the natural resources that we have. 00:19:10.537 --> 00:19:24.747 That, and this goes back to that value thing that you were talking about before, that if we recognize that we are stewards of the land and the natural resources that we have, I think we'll look at it in a different way. 00:19:25.127 --> 00:19:28.307 We have to use the things the earth gives us. 00:19:28.757 --> 00:19:29.217 To live. 00:19:29.957 --> 00:19:38.777 And, but we have to do it in a way that is, uh, being a good steward of that and providing for, for our children in the future. 00:19:39.117 --> 00:19:46.097 And, um, and, and so what do you think about that idea of, of using stewardship as the focus. 00:19:46.657 --> 00:19:53.632 Will Richardson: Yeah, I think that that's a, a, a. A good framing of how we need to operate in the world. 00:19:53.752 --> 00:20:01.642 I also think that we need to acknowledge and we need to get to the reason why we need to be good stewards. 00:20:01.642 --> 00:20:05.812 And, and I think it's not just to take care of nature 00:20:06.082 --> 00:20:07.492 in order to be sustainable. 00:20:07.552 --> 00:20:12.477 You know, I think it's because, um, we are the collapse that I'm talking about. 00:20:13.387 --> 00:20:16.087 Um, is really a relationship collapse. 00:20:16.537 --> 00:20:23.947 Um, we are out of relation with one another, by and large as human beings, and we are certainly out of relation with other living things on the planet. 00:20:24.577 --> 00:20:30.097 So if we are to really be stewards, then we really need to feel a kinship. 00:20:30.532 --> 00:20:36.772 With, um, those other living things and not make it just like, well, it's my responsibility, you know, and 00:20:36.862 --> 00:20:38.992 I, I have to take care of these things. 00:20:39.292 --> 00:20:41.662 No, we're taking care of our kin. 00:20:41.662 --> 00:20:46.222 We're taking care of one another, and that should be the way we operate in the world. 00:20:46.672 --> 00:20:52.312 Um, but again, schools have contributed to this by making nature something out there 00:20:52.702 --> 00:20:53.782 by not. 00:20:54.127 --> 00:20:59.227 Giving kids much time to go out and be in nature to connect with their kin. 00:20:59.827 --> 00:21:15.397 Um, and, and so, you know, I, I, again, we need to unpack and really take a look at, you know, how are we in relation with one another and, and with, uh, with the rest of all the life on the planet. 00:21:15.397 --> 00:21:18.547 And I know that gets really kind of meta and kind of wooey and, you 00:21:18.847 --> 00:21:19.627 know, sometimes. 00:21:19.842 --> 00:21:21.342 People kind of roll their eyes a little bit. 00:21:21.342 --> 00:21:23.892 But look, that is the challenge that we have right now. 00:21:23.892 --> 00:21:27.612 That is the metris, the metris, all these other things are symptoms. 00:21:27.612 --> 00:21:33.432 If we were in relation to one another and to all the other living things on the planet, climate change wouldn't be happening right now. 00:21:33.612 --> 00:21:35.262 There wouldn't be inequity in the world. 00:21:35.502 --> 00:21:44.202 There wouldn't, you know, all of those things are because we are not in a caring relationship in with one another and, and with the rest of the planet. 00:21:44.262 --> 00:21:49.662 And so, again, for me, the, the role of schools. 00:21:50.002 --> 00:22:02.872 By and large right now is to begin to really focus on building, rebuilding, regenerating those relationships, um, and, and thinking about how we can restore that sense of connection. 00:22:03.502 --> 00:22:07.462 Uh, because right now we are, we are just kind of splicing it out. 00:22:07.737 --> 00:22:17.427 Um, we, we make, by the way, our connections to one another in schools fraught by making it about competition by seeding, you know, sorting kids and all that kind of thing. 00:22:17.727 --> 00:22:22.377 And then, like I said, we don't wanna give them any chance to go out and really explore and connect to nature. 00:22:22.377 --> 00:22:26.937 So, um, to me that's the fundamental challenge that we have right now. 00:22:27.462 --> 00:22:27.752 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah. 00:22:27.902 --> 00:22:28.192 Yeah. 00:22:28.422 --> 00:22:30.392 Well, I, I appreciate that. 00:22:30.392 --> 00:22:43.952 And if, if there's nothing else we get from this conversation, that idea of being out of relation with each other and with the world as, as a whole and every living thing in it, um, I think that is definitely, uh. 00:22:45.177 --> 00:22:52.627 Like you said, the core problem that everything else is a, is a symptom of that and that's a good place to start. 00:22:53.207 --> 00:22:59.507 Um, so I mentioned I've got the manifesto in your substack in the show notes@transformativeprinciple.org. 00:22:59.887 --> 00:23:01.547 Um, what else? 00:23:02.047 --> 00:23:06.547 How would you like people to get in touch with you about doing one of these cohorts with you, uh, in the future? 00:23:06.577 --> 00:23:07.427 What does that look like? 00:23:07.582 --> 00:23:07.882 Will Richardson: Yeah. 00:23:07.882 --> 00:23:14.902 well, so I'm right now actually putting dates together for the summer and, um, I think I have about 50 people on a waiting list 00:23:14.902 --> 00:23:15.232 already. 00:23:15.232 --> 00:23:23.392 So, um, looking forward to making that happen, uh, if that, all that information is at Future Series School, so it's pretty easy. 00:23:23.782 --> 00:23:29.302 Um, you can see everything that is entailed in, in the, um, workshops. 00:23:29.302 --> 00:23:30.952 It's six, uh, six. 00:23:31.162 --> 00:23:37.072 75 minute sessions with a 45 minute post game if anybody wants to just stay and talk and process. 00:23:37.162 --> 00:23:39.052 And we do that over every other week. 00:23:39.052 --> 00:23:42.172 So it's about about three months, over three months that that happens. 00:23:42.172 --> 00:23:44.122 But anyway, yeah, I, I mean. 00:23:44.437 --> 00:24:00.067 You know, I would say to people if they're listening to this and they're feeling, um, they're feeling a, uh, uh, the, the challenges that are happening in the world, they're feeling a little bit just this dissonance that's, that's going on in terms of schooling and education and it's relevance to the world. 00:24:00.547 --> 00:24:06.217 Um, and if you're feeling like you're ready to, to go there and sit with it, you know, um. 00:24:06.712 --> 00:24:21.952 Come on and join us because, uh, like I said, it's, it's been two weeks, but the conversations so far have been, uh, really, really meaningful and I think, uh, really helpful to a lot of people who are feeling stress and anxiety right now. 00:24:22.312 --> 00:24:23.242 It's not Therapy. 00:24:23.392 --> 00:24:24.652 Don't wanna say it's Therapy. 00:24:25.252 --> 00:24:29.152 but it is a place to come and process, which I think is really important right now. 00:24:29.252 --> 00:24:29.542 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah. 00:24:29.802 --> 00:24:32.662 And, and it's not necessarily going to make you feel any better, 00:24:33.412 --> 00:24:33.682 Will Richardson: No. 00:24:33.682 --> 00:24:35.392 In fact, I think the first couple weeks 00:24:35.392 --> 00:24:37.222 have made people feel a little bit worse, you know? 00:24:37.222 --> 00:24:41.032 'cause I said to 'em at the beginning, I said, you know, we take this kind of in two sessions. 00:24:41.092 --> 00:24:43.612 Uh, one, the first two sessions are getting real, you 00:24:43.612 --> 00:24:43.852 know? 00:24:43.852 --> 00:24:45.802 And it's like, so let's face this stuff. 00:24:45.802 --> 00:24:48.712 Let's just kind of be the Marines where we break you down. 00:24:49.012 --> 00:24:55.732 And now, you know, sessions three through six will be kind of, let's build us, build ourselves back up here and see what we can really do with. 00:24:55.767 --> 00:25:00.357 The acknowledgement that, you know, all of this stuff is happening and that it's really hard right now. 00:25:00.652 --> 00:25:01.582 Jethro D. Jones: Yeah, for sure. 00:25:02.092 --> 00:25:08.582 Well, uh, check out Future sirius.school and, uh, will thank you so much for being part of transformative principle. 00:25:08.582 --> 00:25:16.382 It is always great to talk with you and, uh, been a big fan of your work for many, many years and grateful every opportunity I have to chat, so thank you. 00:25:17.157 --> 00:25:17.697 Will Richardson: Thanks, Jetta. 00:25:17.702 --> 00:25:18.807 It was really great to reconnect.