1 00:00:05,450 --> 00:00:07,910 Hello, and welcome to Chattering With iCatCare. 2 00:00:08,010 --> 00:00:11,430 I'm Yaiza Gomez, iCatCare Veterinary Community Coordinator 3 00:00:11,450 --> 00:00:12,630 and host of this podcast. 4 00:00:13,780 --> 00:00:17,430 Today our clinical spotlight is focused on treatment tools. 5 00:00:17,740 --> 00:00:22,080 Dr Kelly St Dennis will be interviewing William Whitehouse and Katrina Viviano 6 00:00:22,080 --> 00:00:27,370 on a JFMS article about updates on feline clinical therapeutics, but 7 00:00:27,370 --> 00:00:31,640 before Sam Taylor will be interviewing Gabriele Ratti, who was awarded 8 00:00:32,150 --> 00:00:35,880 the ABCD Young Scientist Award this year for his study focused on 9 00:00:35,889 --> 00:00:39,180 emerging infectious threats in cats. 10 00:00:43,180 --> 00:00:45,730 Welcome Dr Ratti and thank you for joining us. 11 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:50,640 What is it that you find so fascinating about feline infectious diseases? 12 00:00:51,610 --> 00:00:55,680 Infectious disease are interesting because they are ever changing. 13 00:00:55,910 --> 00:01:00,000 If you think about emerging pathogen especially, we work with 14 00:01:00,470 --> 00:01:06,880 microorganism that are in evolution run, so they change a lot over time. 15 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:10,839 This is the main thing that I found so interesting about infectious 16 00:01:10,839 --> 00:01:15,329 disease apart also from the pathogen to host interaction. 17 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:22,460 cats in this topic are really, really strange if you think about compared to 18 00:01:22,460 --> 00:01:29,450 other animals, we have a lot of virus with strange biological characteristic 19 00:01:29,639 --> 00:01:32,640 or biological behaviour, such as FIP. 20 00:01:32,970 --> 00:01:35,220 cats are so interesting. 21 00:01:35,220 --> 00:01:39,820 So picture, when you think about infectious diseases and they also 22 00:01:39,820 --> 00:01:44,639 have zoonotic pathogen, for example staphylococcus aureus is more common 23 00:01:44,639 --> 00:01:46,489 in cat compared to other species. 24 00:01:47,090 --> 00:01:51,350 And is that to do with their lifestyle and their varied lifestyles as well 25 00:01:51,350 --> 00:01:55,930 as their physiology, is it to do with the fact that cats live differently 26 00:01:55,930 --> 00:01:57,039 in different parts of the world? 27 00:01:57,070 --> 00:01:58,460 Is that part of that? 28 00:01:58,470 --> 00:01:58,560 Absolutely. 29 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:04,129 If you go to the evolution of felids in general, you will see a lot of fun stuff. 30 00:02:04,150 --> 00:02:10,920 For example, lion have FIV, such as cat, but its not a pathogen for that species. 31 00:02:11,620 --> 00:02:15,510 And of course cat have a lifestyle. 32 00:02:15,580 --> 00:02:22,330 I used to work with stray cats and I try to understand by reading article and 33 00:02:22,330 --> 00:02:27,880 stuff like that, how stray cat behave, where did they roam within the territory? 34 00:02:28,220 --> 00:02:33,650 They have, they, they are really fascinating by a ecological point of 35 00:02:33,650 --> 00:02:39,399 view also and yes, absolutely, these are things to keep in mind when you 36 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:46,160 study cat in general because cats are so different compared to other animal, 37 00:02:46,670 --> 00:02:51,300 especially by ethological points of view and this kind of ethology 38 00:02:51,330 --> 00:02:56,410 every precaution on feline infectious disease epidemiology, for example. 39 00:02:56,990 --> 00:02:57,640 Okay. 40 00:02:57,950 --> 00:03:01,450 It is, that is fascinating and you brought up then your work with stray 41 00:03:01,450 --> 00:03:04,700 cats, and I think you've done quite a bit with unowned cats, haven't you? 42 00:03:04,700 --> 00:03:07,709 So people who are not aware of some of your research, obviously would 43 00:03:07,710 --> 00:03:12,500 encourage them to go and read all your papers, but you have published a number 44 00:03:12,500 --> 00:03:16,110 looking at E. coli in unowned cats. 45 00:03:16,119 --> 00:03:16,829 Is that correct? 46 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:20,570 Could you tell us a bit about why, and also I'm really interested 47 00:03:20,570 --> 00:03:22,760 in how do you study unowned cats? 48 00:03:22,790 --> 00:03:27,299 Because they're not known for being cats that you can catch easily or handle or. 49 00:03:27,309 --> 00:03:31,680 We got fortunate about stray cats because when I was in the 50 00:03:31,690 --> 00:03:34,070 University of Lodi we have a 51 00:03:36,860 --> 00:03:39,780 contract with the health care system that work with the stray cat population 52 00:03:40,220 --> 00:03:46,590 and in order to do nurturing program for population control, we used to capture 53 00:03:46,639 --> 00:03:51,860 a lot of stray cat, put that on the generalisation to perform a sterilisation 54 00:03:52,260 --> 00:03:59,220 and so we were able to collect sample for screening of SARS-CoV-2, antimicrobial 55 00:03:59,250 --> 00:04:00,890 resistance and stuff like that. 56 00:04:01,530 --> 00:04:06,730 Because at that time we were in the early stage of pandemic and 57 00:04:06,730 --> 00:04:11,750 we actually, in Lodi, we had the first  SARS-CoV-2 cases reported 58 00:04:12,170 --> 00:04:13,750 in Europe, if I remember correctly. 59 00:04:13,750 --> 00:04:18,770 And so we had a lot of interest, especially in the early stage of 60 00:04:18,810 --> 00:04:24,320 pandemic because there was a paper that say that under experimental condition 61 00:04:24,690 --> 00:04:29,720 cats were able to contract  SARS-CoV-2 and transmit it to other cats. 62 00:04:30,449 --> 00:04:34,950 We were really curious about the epidemiological stuff 63 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:36,710 going on, feline colonies, the 64 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,310 stray population in general after that paper and so we start 65 00:04:41,310 --> 00:04:44,130 to collect swab from both stray 66 00:04:47,119 --> 00:04:50,819 cat and also by owned cat that were admitted to the veterinary hospital 67 00:04:50,869 --> 00:04:54,050 for general practice, basically. 68 00:04:54,780 --> 00:04:58,973 And yes, we do a little bit of comparison with the antimicrobial 69 00:04:58,973 --> 00:05:02,280 resistance between the two population in our study basically. 70 00:05:03,290 --> 00:05:06,760 Before I let you go, obviously we're all cat lovers here, but you have done some 71 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,770 work with lions and tigers and big cats. 72 00:05:10,940 --> 00:05:13,830 I wondered if you could tell us about your work looking at infectious 73 00:05:13,830 --> 00:05:16,000 diseases in the non-domestic cat. 74 00:05:16,500 --> 00:05:18,456 Actually, it was my graduation thesis, the search for feline coronavirus 75 00:05:18,456 --> 00:05:18,471 of Tiger Lion and stuff like that. 76 00:05:18,471 --> 00:05:21,060 But we search also for 77 00:05:28,300 --> 00:05:29,620 other pathogen in 78 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:34,730 that kind of animal, which are really interesting also by 79 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:36,710 the infectious point of view. 80 00:05:37,179 --> 00:05:41,429 And basically, once again, we don't find nothing because when you 81 00:05:41,580 --> 00:05:46,229 think about captive population, they are really, really controlled by 82 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:53,109 not only by the diagnostic point of view, so biosecurity and stuff like 83 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:56,270 that, but also for the breeding lion. 84 00:05:56,940 --> 00:06:03,590 So you will get a lot of struggle to find infectious diseases in this 85 00:06:03,590 --> 00:06:10,410 animal, but because the, there is a big detection to biosecurity in zoo, 86 00:06:10,860 --> 00:06:12,730 which is really good in my opinion. 87 00:06:13,210 --> 00:06:20,290 And there are a lot of diagnostic going on this animal to keep this 88 00:06:20,290 --> 00:06:24,250 population free from pathogen, which is really good because if you think 89 00:06:24,260 --> 00:06:30,240 about these species of feline, they are greatly in danger basically. 90 00:06:30,300 --> 00:06:37,679 So you had to work a lot on disease prevention in this animal species rather 91 00:06:37,939 --> 00:06:40,900 than cure when the disease is manifested. 92 00:06:42,110 --> 00:06:43,289 So do they get FIP? 93 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:44,060 Yes. 94 00:06:44,070 --> 00:06:46,749 It is really rare, I have to be honest. 95 00:06:46,750 --> 00:06:50,630 But there are a lot of reports, particularly in cheetah. 96 00:06:51,139 --> 00:06:56,530 They got a lot of genetic problems, genetic issue, and they are 97 00:06:56,540 --> 00:07:01,200 susceptible of a lot of infectious disease and particularly FIP. 98 00:07:12,990 --> 00:07:16,110 Did I hear you mention lions can get FIV as well? 99 00:07:16,510 --> 00:07:16,990 Yes. 100 00:07:17,020 --> 00:07:18,020 Yes, but it's not pathogenic? 101 00:07:18,030 --> 00:07:23,840 Pathogen in lion, they, they used to search for viral lymphocy depletion, 102 00:07:24,380 --> 00:07:30,500 but at the end of the day, they use the integration of FIV to track the breeding 103 00:07:30,660 --> 00:07:37,000 in Africa between lion from different group because you search for the viral 104 00:07:37,580 --> 00:07:42,750 transmission light to understand the behaviour of this animal, but in general, 105 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:50,440 big cat are quite strange in infectious disease epidemiology because they are 106 00:07:50,860 --> 00:07:56,680 like dog and like cat in the meaning that they can get this type of virus. 107 00:07:56,680 --> 00:07:58,980 This is pathology typical of dog. 108 00:07:59,380 --> 00:08:01,400 They get FIV, but it's not pathogen. 109 00:08:01,450 --> 00:08:03,129 They, for example, lynx have 110 00:08:05,509 --> 00:08:05,669 FLD. 111 00:08:05,729 --> 00:08:11,430 But it is really amazing because you think about lion, tiger and stuff like that as 112 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:15,950 big cat but, but the infectious disease point of view, they are not, they're more 113 00:08:15,950 --> 00:08:19,349 or less a bridge between dog and cat. 114 00:08:19,700 --> 00:08:21,860 So they are so interesting. 115 00:08:22,350 --> 00:08:23,170 Oh, that's fascinating. 116 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:30,390 Now, Dr Kelly St Dennis will be interviewing Katrina Viviano and 117 00:08:30,390 --> 00:08:34,010 William Whitehouse on their recent JFMS article titled 'Clinical 118 00:08:35,130 --> 00:08:38,860 Therapeutics in Feline and Medicine, Updates for Old and New Drugs.' 119 00:08:42,919 --> 00:08:46,800 One of the things I found very exciting in my career is that the advancement 120 00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:51,200 of analgesics in cats and our ability to detect pain in cats with different 121 00:08:51,370 --> 00:08:52,829 things like feline grimace scale. 122 00:08:52,830 --> 00:08:56,120 So you covered 12 different drugs or drug classes. 123 00:08:56,150 --> 00:08:59,900 Some of them are analgesics, anxiolytics, diabetes medications 124 00:08:59,949 --> 00:09:02,320 and treatments for FIP and HCM. 125 00:09:02,860 --> 00:09:05,320 How did you end up narrowing it down to these 12? 126 00:09:05,670 --> 00:09:11,480 It was a pretty collaborative effort between kind of Dr Viviano and 127 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:17,449 myself, I guess it was, oh, a little over a year ago, and I did a locum 128 00:09:17,449 --> 00:09:19,560 at the University of Wisconsin. 129 00:09:19,580 --> 00:09:24,480 We were talking about one of the drugs we covered, but we had previously done 130 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:29,230 a review article about a decade ago now on kind of new therapeutics in 131 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:34,430 feline medicine at that point in time and just with the influx of new agents 132 00:09:34,459 --> 00:09:39,990 that are coming onto the market, getting approved for cats, as well as learning 133 00:09:40,010 --> 00:09:42,610 about kind of new uses for old drugs. 134 00:09:42,650 --> 00:09:47,979 We thought it would be a great time to revisit this and explore 135 00:09:47,980 --> 00:09:51,110 and summarise again what is out there for feline practitioners. 136 00:09:51,589 --> 00:09:56,380 We started off with, I guess, just looking at what is new and then trying to think 137 00:09:56,380 --> 00:10:01,290 about what important papers have come about for more traditional drugs, and 138 00:10:01,580 --> 00:10:07,959 there are probably those out there that we just weren't aware of or didn't include, 139 00:10:08,009 --> 00:10:10,250 but these are the 12 we ended up with. 140 00:10:10,260 --> 00:10:11,380 I think it's an amazing list. 141 00:10:11,389 --> 00:10:15,980 Some diseases that were previously not treatable, HCM and FIP probably being 142 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,290 the most notable based on the, the drugs that you have in this article, 143 00:10:20,900 --> 00:10:24,760 like what are your thoughts on drugs that are changing the way we do things? 144 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:30,969 I remember early in my career like having to help so many families 145 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:35,110 say goodbye to their cat, like after diagnosing them with FIP. 146 00:10:35,110 --> 00:10:39,550 It's remarkable that we have a treatment that works quite well. 147 00:10:39,620 --> 00:10:44,890 It's wonderful to see the complete 180 and prognosis for these patients 148 00:10:44,940 --> 00:10:47,020 happening during our lifetime. 149 00:10:47,590 --> 00:10:48,469 Mm-hmm. 150 00:10:48,469 --> 00:10:50,569 I think for HCM is a similar thing. 151 00:10:50,570 --> 00:10:52,250 We're starting to see exciting advancements. 152 00:10:52,310 --> 00:10:54,960 As someone who practices in Northern Ontario, we don't have 153 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:56,240 access to a lot of referral. 154 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:57,820 We don't have echocardiogram here. 155 00:10:58,170 --> 00:11:01,330 So when we diagnose heart disease in a cat, we don't always, in the 156 00:11:01,330 --> 00:11:05,270 past, have gone for any diagnostics because there wasn't a lot for us to 157 00:11:05,270 --> 00:11:07,250 do if they did receive a diagnosis. 158 00:11:07,310 --> 00:11:10,950 But now things that, again, that has changed where we can say to people, 159 00:11:10,950 --> 00:11:14,879 look, if we can get the diagnosis, then there's probably some things we can do. 160 00:11:15,420 --> 00:11:18,910 And I wondered if you wanted to touch on the new drugs available for HCM? 161 00:11:20,750 --> 00:11:21,100 Yeah. 162 00:11:21,100 --> 00:11:26,480 So that I would say with regards to rapamycin, I think is still something 163 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:30,320 that is, is truly up and coming and we're still learning about. 164 00:11:30,710 --> 00:11:35,590 So the initial studies look very promising with regards to what it does for 165 00:11:35,610 --> 00:11:38,234 progression of ventricular hypertrophy. 166 00:11:38,500 --> 00:11:42,800 I do know a lot of cardiologists who are really excited to see 167 00:11:42,820 --> 00:11:44,870 the results of the HCM study. 168 00:11:44,910 --> 00:11:48,680 There really is a lack of evidence for kind of benefit of other 169 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:51,630 therapeutics for that disease. 170 00:11:52,190 --> 00:11:55,390 I haven't treated a lot of HCM, but I have treated a lot of kind of chronic 171 00:11:55,420 --> 00:12:01,420 kidney disease in cats, and we all know that there's a lot of negative prognostic 172 00:12:01,430 --> 00:12:04,100 indicators regarding disease progression. 173 00:12:04,190 --> 00:12:11,619 Of all the things we do only a small handful of things show improved outcomes. 174 00:12:11,710 --> 00:12:15,900 It would be great to have another agent in our arsenal to help them. 175 00:12:16,660 --> 00:12:21,000 I think as you kind of alluded to, its use is most optimal in 176 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:23,960 association with subclinical HCM. 177 00:12:24,450 --> 00:12:28,520 Reaching out to get that diagnosis earlier to intervene is probably gonna 178 00:12:28,570 --> 00:12:30,250 change how we approach these cats. 179 00:12:30,420 --> 00:12:33,209 I think it's something that's gonna evolve with time. 180 00:12:34,309 --> 00:12:38,110 Yeah, and I think it's gonna be even just understanding when a cat has heart 181 00:12:38,110 --> 00:12:42,089 disease is such a challenge with murmurs and no murmurs, a percentage of diseased 182 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,830 cats walking into my office every day, and I don't know if they could have HCM. 183 00:12:46,510 --> 00:12:50,740 So that even and of itself is trying to get those cats identified as a 184 00:12:50,759 --> 00:12:54,610 potential issue so that we can send them for diagnostics is something 185 00:12:54,799 --> 00:12:57,949 I'm looking forward to learning more about as we see research unfold. 186 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:02,080 Dr Whitehouse, since you are focusing on kidney, did you wanna 187 00:13:02,380 --> 00:13:06,300 talk about the agent that helps with feline chronic kidney disease? 188 00:13:07,009 --> 00:13:12,670 Traditionally, Darbepoetin has been used as an erythrocyte stimulating agent to 189 00:13:12,730 --> 00:13:16,240 treat anaemia associated with CKD in cats. 190 00:13:16,260 --> 00:13:17,790 It does seem to be effective. 191 00:13:17,790 --> 00:13:20,760 It does have some side effects as well. 192 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:25,679 One of the biggest limiting factors, especially for the cases that kind of, 193 00:13:25,759 --> 00:13:31,170 I've Personally seen is the cost kind of associated with that medication. 194 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:34,910 It can be cost prohibitive for a lot of clients. 195 00:13:35,340 --> 00:13:40,319 So it's great to have another option, an oral option in a liquid, which we 196 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:44,869 know for the majority of cats, usually it's a little bit easier to administer 197 00:13:44,889 --> 00:13:52,510 than tablet or pill form, but it's also shown to be beneficial for treating 198 00:13:52,510 --> 00:13:57,310 anaemia, which we again know is a negative prognostic indicator and is something 199 00:13:57,310 --> 00:14:01,979 that does contribute to a decreased quality of life with them as well too. 200 00:14:02,650 --> 00:14:10,000 So there's no kind of head to head right now showing which one is better but 201 00:14:10,020 --> 00:14:16,540 having varenzin, which is molidustat, does offer an alternative option for these 202 00:14:16,599 --> 00:14:19,410 patients and is comparably less expensive. 203 00:14:19,469 --> 00:14:23,019 I know we have so many drugs to talk about and not enough time, but I wanted 204 00:14:23,019 --> 00:14:25,250 to just look at analgesics in general. 205 00:14:25,250 --> 00:14:28,500 But Frunevetmab was one of the things I wanted to talk to you about today 206 00:14:28,500 --> 00:14:30,189 because it's been around for a while. 207 00:14:30,250 --> 00:14:33,750 Everyone's generally very happy with its outcome and how it helps 208 00:14:33,750 --> 00:14:37,100 quality of life for patients with degenerative joint disease. 209 00:14:37,670 --> 00:14:41,929 As with everything we start to see cautionary tales, rightly or wrongly. 210 00:14:41,940 --> 00:14:45,220 I wanted to talk about your feelings about the drug safety profile. 211 00:14:45,220 --> 00:14:47,990 If we do see some concerns, what are those concerns? 212 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:51,620 It's one of those drugs that really addresses a need. 213 00:14:51,670 --> 00:14:56,319 A lot more cats have osteoarthritis than we clinically appreciate and this 214 00:14:56,349 --> 00:15:02,000 giving us an alternative option to NSAIDs makes it exciting because most of the 215 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,880 cats that, not all of them, but a large majority of them are gonna be older 216 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:10,400 cats and they have comorbidities, and I think that's where the challenge is. 217 00:15:10,990 --> 00:15:17,100 When they look at a drug and working on approval, they're looking not only 218 00:15:17,100 --> 00:15:22,230 at safety and toxicity, but they're also looking at a specific clinical 219 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,900 population that otherwise are healthy cats that just have osteoarthritis and 220 00:15:26,900 --> 00:15:31,709 then it gets put out into the public in terms of use, once it's approved, 221 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:36,310 there's probably a lot of diversity in the patient population that gets treated. 222 00:15:36,310 --> 00:15:36,321 What you're alluding to is the discussion that's come up with librela in dogs. 223 00:15:36,321 --> 00:15:36,332 That's one of the post-approval reporting information that's out there, which is 224 00:15:36,332 --> 00:15:36,343 super important for any drug because now we're using it in a lot,broader 225 00:15:36,343 --> 00:15:37,770 population of dogs or cats and then we may see things that didn't show 226 00:15:37,770 --> 00:15:40,040 up initially on the approval study. 227 00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:40,065 So I think they're all warranted and important to report and investigate. 228 00:15:40,065 --> 00:15:40,088 The challenging thing is we're using a monoclonal antibody against nerve 229 00:15:40,088 --> 00:15:40,120 growth factor, and we have to remember the target is thought to be that nerve 230 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:40,145 growth factor is increased in joints of patients with osteoarthritis, and that's 231 00:15:40,145 --> 00:15:40,173 our target, is the inflammatory piece or the inflammatory role that's sort of 232 00:15:40,173 --> 00:15:40,181 negative associated with osteoarthritis. 233 00:15:40,181 --> 00:15:40,207 But nerve growth faster also has other roles in terms of neuroprotection. 234 00:15:40,207 --> 00:15:40,211 It's neurotrophic. 235 00:15:40,211 --> 00:15:40,234 Can we potentially see adverse effects that we didn't actually predict? 236 00:15:40,234 --> 00:15:40,251 And that's always possible with a new drug. 237 00:15:40,251 --> 00:15:42,730 So I think it's an exciting area and it offers another way to 238 00:15:42,730 --> 00:15:44,370 treat osteoarthritis in cats. 239 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:48,470 Anecdotally, the cats I've known that have had it, it helps quite a bit. 240 00:15:48,849 --> 00:15:53,839 And so I think it's just like any other drug or even a drug that's known, 241 00:15:54,139 --> 00:15:58,170 is having your clinical criteria of what is effective and what isn't. 242 00:15:58,390 --> 00:16:00,708 And then also close monitoring, especially when you're starting to use it in an 243 00:16:00,708 --> 00:16:00,774 individual patient, knowing that a lot of our cats with osteoarthritis 244 00:16:00,774 --> 00:16:00,847 are gonna have comorbidities, probably on other therapies, and so is there 245 00:16:00,847 --> 00:16:00,925 also the risk that we may see more adverse effects than we anticipate? 246 00:16:00,925 --> 00:16:00,949 And that's always possible. 247 00:16:00,949 --> 00:16:04,020 I would say know your patient population, baseline kidney function, 248 00:16:04,020 --> 00:16:08,320 but like their level of pain, their level of activity, so you can make 249 00:16:08,330 --> 00:16:10,750 objective assessments as is it working? 250 00:16:11,020 --> 00:16:16,250 And always balancing that risk benefit ratio for any drug. 251 00:16:16,260 --> 00:16:18,410 It's exciting in that it's another way. 252 00:16:18,510 --> 00:16:22,280 Maybe it's gonna end up being an adjuvant therapy in some cats. 253 00:16:22,670 --> 00:16:24,879 It's yet to be determined as we use it more. 254 00:16:30,039 --> 00:16:30,959 Thank you for listening. 255 00:16:31,059 --> 00:16:35,000 If you’re an iCatCare Veterinary Society Member,  don't forget that you can access 256 00:16:35,020 --> 00:16:38,810 all member benefits, including the full version of this podcast episode and 257 00:16:38,830 --> 00:16:42,270 other recordings at portal.icatcare.org. 258 00:16:43,009 --> 00:16:46,540 If you're looking for more free CPD from International Cat Care, we have 259 00:16:46,540 --> 00:16:48,189 several open access webinars coming. 260 00:16:48,709 --> 00:16:53,360 On the 3rd of November, Cat Henstridge and Dr Cecilia Villaverde will discuss 261 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,290 misconceptions in feline nutrition. 262 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:59,720 On the 12th, Gonzalo da Graca will share some tips on how to make veterinary 263 00:16:59,740 --> 00:17:01,999 visits less stressful for cats. 264 00:17:02,780 --> 00:17:06,220 We'll be back again next month with more from the world of feline medicine and 265 00:17:08,870 --> 00:17:09,020 the journal of feline medicine and surgery.