Welcome to the Soul Touched by Dogs Podcast, the show for dog lovers who
see dogs not as toys or tools, but wise souls worth our respect and care.
I'm an Herrmann, and I'm your host.
I talk to poor some humans, people who do great work for dogs and their people.
So come and join us for today's conversation.
Hello
Anke: and welcome, Daphne.
I'm so excited to have another Leo Mom here.
Yeah, we'll give that away in a second, what this is all about.
But before we get there, why don't you share with people where you're from, where
you're based, and what's your business?
Daphne: Anke, thank you so much for having me on your wonderful podcast.
It's a pleasure.
So, um, I am from Um, Germany as yourself, but I've been living in Spain for the last
12 years and I'm based now in Barcelona.
So here is where I do most of my business, but I also work online
with people all over the globe.
And, um, yeah, that's my story.
Anke: Love it.
Love it.
It's funny.
It feels like we've sort of followed each other almost
around the world a little bit.
Right.
So, so.
Bye.
Ciao.
Why don't, why don't you share like, you know, we just have like a, almost like
a little teary moment when you share how you, how you got into working with dogs.
Daphne: Right.
So, um, I, I showed this picture before we hit record.
I'll show it again.
So what you see here.
is Little Daphne with Leo, um, just as the Leo that you rescued years ago.
That's how I got in touch with dogs.
It was my grandparent's dog and I just, I was in love with this animal.
And, um, I received so much love that.
It was really difficult to comprehend sometimes why Leo was treated a very
old school way, um, with a lot of punishment, a lot of screaming going on.
And even as I was so small at that time, I, there was something in me that
said, it, there has to be another way.
There just has to be another way to treat these animals that give us so much.
Yeah.
Anke: So how did you go about finding that other way?
Because like, when I look back at, you know, when I first met Maileo,
it was, you know, oh, here is the, you've got to be the alpha dog, right?
You've got to be, you know, and you have to walk through the door
first and you have to tell him who's boss and why, you know, and then
there was like clicker madness.
I don't know who goes nuts first with this, right?
And so it wasn't easy to find.
that other way.
How did you do that?
Daphne: Um, I guess stumbling at first.
Very innocently, I started fostering when I got to university and I was
like, hey, we'll just swing this with a couch and, and walk three times a
day and it's going to be just fine.
It was not fine.
Spoiler.
So then I got started with, um, behavior modification and what that meant, and we
all know these little Skinner diagrams and reinforcement and positive negative stuff.
Um, and funnily enough, I don't know if I can name drop here, but I
started with Martin Ritter, who is a very known trainer over in Germany,
um, but with time I understood that this was again a balanced method.
So we're going to treat and be nice up until the point we don't
know what to do anymore and then we'll scream and punish again.
So that wasn't the way.
And, um, it was mind opening to get in touch with trainers in the US with, um, I,
I formed myself in the UK, um, with other programs here in Spain and in the US.
And that got me each time a little bit closer to how actually we're living
with another human being, um, human being, with another living being.
But almost treatable as a human being, right?
We want to look at the relationship.
We don't want to be like, clicking like mad until one loses their ear.
But we want to see, who am I living with?
What does this other living being need?
And how can we create a relationship that we can both enjoy and
Anke: I love that.
You know, I, I mean, actually funny, funny you mention Martin Luther.
My dad is a big fan, you know, and I kind of don't like the guy,
right, because it is that, you know, it's like I'm nice until I'm not.
So, and so I think the part that I've seen, you know, with Leo
and the three that came after him was that, Trust gets broken.
And then you have to work really hard to recover it.
I mean, dogs are like, you know, they are like little angels, like they do forgive
more than, than people often deserve.
But, but it is like every time you kind of yell at them or every time you You
know, do something harsh, you know, next time they'll think twice whether
they'll come when you call, right?
So now the question I think that people were, you know, especially, you know,
the pushback you get from that, right?
It's like, oh, but like, that's all fine if the dog's kind of like,
but what do you, how do you go with that lovey dovey approach, you
know, because that's what people do.
You know, push back on, you know, how do you handle a dog that, you know, is
anxious and that is reactive and you know, where you normally kind of like
traditionally, oh, like my grandparents might, yeah, maybe not so much, but like,
you know, a Martin Luther kind of guy where he dealt with the dog, you know.
Daphne: So I always take it from a perspective of saying, um, how
would you treat Your partner, how would you treat your best friend?
How would you treat your mom who's anxious, nervous, fearful?
Because all of these behaviors that we label as bad, which also
there's a shift when we use these.
Bad words to describe our dog's behaviors.
That also gets ingrained in us and creates distance, but these
bad behaviors are only symptoms.
So if we only cut through the symptom, and if we only want to shut the dog down,
we're not doing anything about why this Simpton has come up in the first place.
So you want to dig deeper and ask yourself, why does
my dog need to act like that?
What emotion lies underneath?
And you need really a lot of empathy for that because imagine,
I hate cockroaches, right?
Barcelona is full of them.
When I see one, I run across the street screaming, waving my hand.
And if my boyfriend then yelled at me and called me stupid or, or, God
forbid, slapped me in the face, I would not learn anything from that
but, as you rightfully said, to not trust him anymore when I am fearful.
So, it's not a lovey dovey approach.
It's really, it's common sense.
There's fear on the base.
This is not a bad dog.
It's not an aggressive dog.
It's a dog that needs your empathy and needs you to understand what
is Where is this behavior coming from and what does the dog need?
Anke: Yeah, I love that.
I mean, I have like one Mr.
Sensitive, you know, and he would, you know, he would be
when I lived in Granada, right?
And I lived in the Yad Vashem, like historic part of town or
like, you know, the, the widest street is like two meters wide.
It's like noises coming from all angles.
There's like tourist groups coming, there's mountain bikes chasing them,
there's cats jumping around, there's like bells coming from who knows where, right?
Yeah.
And, and he was kind of like, he'd pull on the leash like a crazy, like a maniac.
And I, you know, initially I'd get frustrated.
You know, I look like this idiot here gets dragged along by the dog, you know, until.
I realized, no, he isn't annoying or whatever, like he has sensory overload.
He's just really sensitive because we saw that like once when, when
there was like, I don't know, it was a thunderstorm or like a tiny
grade two earthquake, 500 miles away.
And he senses it.
And I'm like, Oh my God, if he's that sensitive, like that amount of
sensory input in his face, 24 hours.
You know, like of course that would be too much and he's on edge all the time so it
just takes a tiny little bit and he'd be like You know, now where I'm like in the
middle of nowhere and it's all quiet, this dog is the calmest dog ever, you know,
and I have not trained him at all, like haven't taught him anything else that,
you know, like, and he doesn't pull, he doesn't, you know, like, it's just seeing
it for what it is, you know, and I love that, that you kind of dig in there.
Daphne: I completely agree and I think that's so thoughtful of you to, to go
that process because it would be so much easier to just tug the leash 20
times until the dog says, well, I can't express myself in this way for sure.
So, but that anxiety would have just gone on.
Anke: Yeah.
And it shows up in other ways.
And I think it's like, you know, it's like a pressure cooker, you know, and I think
this also depends on what the dog is.
And I think sometimes you have these dogs that, you know, like
that are strong willed, like your Terriers or your Pudinkas, like
they don't take that shape, right?
They kind of will not back down.
They will be difficult to last minute.
Whereas like, I think I've seen people with Golden Retrievers,
you know, they just kind of get yelled at twice and they, Right.
You know, they just kind of back down.
And if you have dogs that are more strong willed who won't back down,
like, well, you either learn or you're
Daphne: And then we're back to this labeling of good dog, bad dog.
Um, I get that a lot with my clients at some point.
They're like, Oh, but you know, our neighbor has the same kind of
dog and they're such a good dog.
I'm like, Oh, careful there.
Because what looks like a good dog to us can very well be a shut down dog.
Because if you break.
An individual's mind so much, if you're so harsh and unforgiving and
unjust to them, they just give up.
This is called learned helplessness.
It, it happens with humans as well.
Um, and then you just go like, you know what, I'm not
going to do anything anymore.
And that to us looks like a good dog, but I always say I prefer
a happy dog than a good dog.
Always.
Anke: Totally.
Totally.
So how do people work with you?
You said you work, you know, you work obviously locally,
but also, you know, virtually.
So how does that work?
Well, how do people come to you and then how
Daphne: does that work?
Right.
So, um, I do both.
Most of my business is here in Barcelona, but I do work online even
with people in Barcelona because, um, there are some behaviors that are best
worked when I'm not another factor that is bothering in the situation.
So many people don't know that, but online training is amazing for a lot of dogs
because you don't get in their space.
You don't, you know, change the picture.
Um, People can find me on Google Maps if they type in DOC training
Barcelona or Saving Slippers, which is my brand Barcelona.
And um, I have a website, savings slippers.com, and I'm
on Instagram with the same name.
So at Savings slippers, you'll find me.
I do some reels, I give some tips, people can reach out to me.
Anke: Very cool, very cool.
What's, what's the story behind the name?
Daphne: So, uh, I work a lot with, with puppies, um, each time a little
bit more, which is gorgeous because then I can intervene at the beginning.
I set the people and the dog up for success and that's just, that's Amazing.
I get emotional about it every time.
Um, so I thought about the name Long and couldn't find anything and it was
again my partner who helped there.
He has a marketing background, bless him.
And, um, we thought about what's a big problem that people have with dogs
and especially puppies steal slippers because when they're teething they
need textures that are interesting.
They need to get this mouth going.
So slippers are A well known victim of dogs and I'm the one saving your slippers.
It
Anke: makes me laugh because like Leo was like, like, Oh, he was super efficient.
You know, like he taught me to never, ever leave shoes anywhere or socks.
Right.
So yeah, totally.
I had lots of slippers who needed saving from him for sure.
Yes.
Oh, thank you.
Thank you so much.
And I think I'm just like always delighted to.
meet people who do work in that space and to help change that narrative, you know,
because I think these dogs do deserve all the love and all the respect that,
that, you know, that we can give them.
And so many don't, don't have yet.
Daphne: So thank you.
That is so true.
Thank you for the work you're doing.
Thank you for putting a platform out there where people can educate themselves
and connect with other stories.
And hopefully I could contribute to that today.
You're so good.
Thank you.
Thanks so much for listening.
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That's A N k E at Soul touched by dogs.com.