Or is it Peta?
No. Is it Petum? Nope. It's not Petoa.
It is not. Well, is it Adum? No.
Adomia. I Don't think so.
E pluribus Adameas. I
Don't believe it is. Is
it Mingah? Mm-hmm. Is it Mingum? No. It's Mingus.
Boom.
I am Adam Maness. And I'm Peter Martin.
And you're listening to the You'll Hear podcast
Music, Explored. Explored
brought to today by Open Studio.
Go to open studiojazz.com for all
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What's happening over at Open Studio? There's
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Peter. Yeah.
Exciting. That was an ad read. I know. High
Five. I know. We never
do these.
Did we get in some comments about, we got some comments,
guys, for guys like sponsor your own show.
This podcast is honestly just an extension of Open Studio.
Yeah. All we do here is like, talk about music we love
and talk about how to play it.
Yeah. But this show is all about listening
to the music we love, including today's album, which is,
Charles Mingus is 1959 Mingus. Ah. Um,
And it's not called Mingus mga
mgu, but we're gonna get into that.
Could have been called, that could have been,
Could have been called. Uh,
first of all, what a great title. That's great. Come on.
Yeah. I have to, I'm gonna up my accoutrement score just based
upon that, but we'll get to that later as well.
Yeah. Oh, such, such, such a great album. Okay.
Let's talk about a certain year,
1959. 1959.
Have we ever mentioned that we might have's
A great year? It's a giant
steps here,
Kind of, kind of 1959, probably not just
for Columbia records of which this album is on,
but just talking about Columbia Records.
We got day Brubeck timeout. Yep. Yep. 1959.
Little thing called kind of blue,
maybe you've heard us call it KOB
by Miles Davis. Miles Davis kind
Of blue on Columbia Records. That's
right. Uh, Mingus Ah Um. All these records were recorded
with a lot of overlap, if not total overlap, actually,
of the studio, the producer, the record label for sure.
A couple of 'em with the same, um, graphic designer or, and
or photographer on the cover.
Like, this was really a huge year for Columbia Jazz
and really for kind of, dare I say, if I'm allowed
to say commercialized jazz.
Yeah. Not smooth jazz. Well, no,
I mean, there are all kinds of jazz. Yeah.
I mean, you also have Ornette
Coleman's the Shape of Jazz to Come. Yep. Which is the
Most commercial free jazz record I ever made in my
Book. Yeah. Well, and that's coming
to this show very, very soon.
Ooh. Uh, but you have even like, some, some lesser known,
but equally like important ones.
Thelonious Monk, Thelonious. Oh.
Alone in San Francisco, one of our favorite albums. I
Think that's his finest, uh, solo
Piano record. It's incredible.
You've got, uh,
you've got things from Horace Silver Blowing the Blues Away
and Finger Popping two albums that year, I believe.
Portraits and Jazz, uh, portraits of Jazz, bill Evans
Portrait and Jazz from Bill Evans, uh, is this year,
it was 59 as year as well as Kelly Blue, one
of my favorite Wynton Kelly albums.
So great. So an incredible year. Yeah. For the music.
And this album sits on top of that heap.
I mean, this is one of the Mount,
when you talk about the most important albums of that year.
Yeah. This is in that top four
that usually people talk about, kind of blue timeout,
Mingus a, um, and probably Portrait in Jazz
or Shape of Jazz to Come, depending on
how you wanna frame it.
But man, what an album.
Yeah. And actually I'm thinking like Mingus,
a show has showed up for years, uh,
which I think is super interesting, uh, on these lists
of like the 10 greatest jazz albums of all time.
And sometimes even just like the a hundred
greatest albums ever made.
I mean, this is really a beloved iconic album,
and it's been so much fun for me to kind of go back
and listening to this over the last couple days
and be reminded why.
But this is a very adventurous album.
Super. I forgot how like, this is a deep record.
Well, and it, it's so different from
everything else on the list.
I mean, it's closest might be Time Out just as far
as like its conception Yeah.
Of the music as it's almost like a soundtrack
to a movie that doesn't exist.
You know what I mean? Yeah. It's like, it's very, very,
uh, visual almost.
Yeah. You can hear things happening, which is by the way,
a consistent theme in a lot of Mingus music.
He's so good at sort of like using arranging
as a soundscape, which I want to get into here.
Yeah. But Mingus himself, man, if we can just build up
to this album, like where he was.
Yeah. The first gig he ever got
as a professional musician was in Lionel Hampton's band,
where he immediately was a standout.
And he started writing music,
including this tune called Mingus Fingers, which was sort
of his feature in Lionel Hampton's band.
Check it out.
You could already hear, right? Yes. Swing it in. Weird.
Ah, that sound already.
How great is that? Ah,
and that's, so this is pre like
Duke Ellington pre late forties.
Exactly. So he goes from Bird, right? Yeah.
Next up we got is Bird actually. Okay.
So he starts playing with, uh, bud Powell. Yeah.
Charlie Parker, max Roach, dizzy Gillespie, sort
of those fathers of of Bebop.
Yeah. They make this live album, uh, under,
I think it's under Bud Powell's name, live at Massey Hall.
It was actually under, it was just called The Quintet.
It was the Quintet. Yeah. That's right. Yep.
And so what's interesting about this recording, Peter, uh,
we're gonna listen to Perdido from that, is
that this MCUs started a record label Perdido,
Did you say Perdido Perdido Perdido
Perdido Per diem per, um,
I call it Perdido Mingus Ming Ming.
Exactly. Per per diem. Per per diem.
Uh, no, but this is with Charlie Parker.
Disney Gilles Bud po.
What's interesting is, like, so Mingus put this on a
label as a young man.
He created this own record label. Yeah.
Put this album on a label, this a version
of this album on a label.
And he rerecorded his bass.
'cause it's from a live recording, right? That's right.
He rerecorded retraced his bass part, which was not like now
with Pro Tools where you just punch it in.
No, it would've been an incredible undertaking to do.
And he did it. And he, I'm thinking it probably would've
included physically playing the record while he recorded.
I think so. 'cause there was no like,
multi-track punch in situation.
But this version became the version,
the popular version of the album
Max, That bass.
Yeah.
Hey, when you own the Label, that's what you do.
This is what bass players love to do.
Anyway, I love highlighting that
because I just, it just goes to show like Charles Mingus.
I think when I think about him as a musician,
I think about someone who was constantly
thinking outside of the box.
Yes. Was constantly sort of swimming upstream,
going against the grain, whatever you wanna call it.
Mm-hmm. If, if a bunch of people were into it, he was like,
nah, I'm gonna do my own thing.
I I wanna make the music I wanna make.
He was a very intense individual. Yeah.
And could be, I think a handful
for like a band leader especially.
Yeah. When you hear about like,
his interactions with Duke Ellington.
Yeah. Um, and some other
folks that we'll talk about, I'm sure.
But what, uh, an incredibly huge personality.
A an incredibly, uh, a genius musician
and a very thoughtful forward-thinking musician on one
of his very first, uh, albums.
Is that, I'm sorry. I just wanted, just as a side note on
that live at Massey Hall, uh, that record.
Like, I think Mingus became sort of like,
there was this lore about him
as being like the bebop bass
player just because of that record.
That was an important record. It was the last time Dizzy
and Byrd played together.
Yeah. Um, or at least record.
I believe it was the last time they played together too.
But Mingus was not like the bebop bass player. Actually.
He was, I mean, he came in at the tail end of that.
He was super young. Um, like
that was never his main kind of a thing.
He could do it. He could do it. Yeah. Yeah.
But I mean, he was, and I remember when I was coming up
and I, that was the first record I heard
of Charlie Mingus, that record.
And I was like, oh my God. In fact, I heard this story.
This is back when lore and myths and, and
and stuff were flying around.
I heard that the bass was so loud. This was pre-internet.
I don't know if you knew this, Adam.
I grew up before the internet.
Really? Unlike some people.
No, but I was told the story by some St. Louis musicians.
They're like, oh, he had a portable tape recorder.
And the bass was so loud. 'cause he had it set up
by the base, which is of course we find out later.
It's not true. He overdubbed it
and it was recorded by the Canadian Jazz
Society or something like that. Amazing. It's a great
Record though. Amazing. It's
a great record. Also
Fun fact about the record, it was supposed
to be Lenny Tristano on piano, and,
but Lenny told them when he heard the lineup
and what they were gonna do, he's like,
I think Bud Powell would be better if you can get him.
I think Lenny was right. Yeah.
Um, next up, this is one of, from one, from one
of his very first albums as a leader.
And this again shows you sort
of the creativity that we're working with here.
Someone who's not afraid to mix things up. Show me what
You working with.
It's called All the Things You Can See Sharp.
Oh yeah. This is like music to a silent movie.
Very theatrical. Very cinematic.
Oh,
A little rock mounted off.
Yeah. And a little Jerome Kern. Yeah.
Mixed together A little Charlie Parker, dizzy Gillespie.
And what year was this Ish?
This would've been in the early fifties. Okay.
This is it from an album called, uh, Mingus The Bohemia.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think 1953, I believe. 54. Nice.
Yeah. Isn't that cool though? Yeah.
So cool. So he's like 20 years old, or 21
Or so. 21. Yeah.
Wow. Incredible.
Well, apparently when he was a teenager,
he was already writing a lot of what later would be coined
as third stream music.
Um, you know, ALA Miles birthday, cool.
Gunther Schuller, all that kind of stuff.
Like Mingles was doing that in the forties as a teenager.
His big breakout though, was on this album,
Pithecanthropus Erectus.
I'm glad you said it. Never that. Correct.
Traffic Traffic Jam. New York City
Or London, England.
I see a mate. No, Australia. Sorry.
Yeah. The Woo. Birds are out.
You know what's interesting,
man, that dancing baseline.
Oh,
Just the traffic continues.
Yeah.
Like, I think we're gonna see this like
as we get into Mingus a like the big mystery for me
has always been like how some of his records
and his, not so much his music.
'cause he's got some incredibly accessible, beautiful, some
of the most beautiful jazz standards,
of which a couple at least we're gonna be listening
to today, were written by Charlie Mingus, Charles Mingus.
Um, but a lot of his performances, um, were very out there.
Right. And especially at a time when like jazz was, I mean,
this is still kind of the big band era.
You know, we're gonna get into the Duke Ellington
connection and this kind of a thing.
But like, he was very aggressive in terms of like,
expectations of the audience almost in a way
that like modern classical music
might have been at that time.
Um, but I think the fact that he was able to, like,
he's obviously firmly, you know, steeply, um,
firmly steeped in the bebop tradition in terms
of like his line and how he approaches things.
That's why he fits in so good with Max Roach. Sure.
But like Max Roach always looking around the corner too.
Right? That's right. And we're gonna get into, into that.
Um, like Max Roach, you know, the main influence for
that part of their, their artistic minds was Duke Ellington.
Yes. Who Mingus played very
briefly in Duke Ellington's band.
We're gonna talk about that a little bit later
'cause it's a great story we're gonna get to here in a bit.
But, uh, that last foggy day, that's from 1956,
um, the Pithecanthropus Erectus is from 1956.
Yep. And just three years later in, there's,
there's the clown that happens in between, there's a couple
of other things that happen, which are really, really great.
But this album, uh, Mingus, um, is the one that sort
of like cements his legacy as a forward thinking.
Really. I mean, New York City legend too.
Can we be honest here? Like, this is just like a,
this everything he does.
You said New York as soon as you heard the Foggy Day. Yeah.
It all feels very downtown Manhattan, doesn't it? Right.
I mean, there's, and also like, the fact that he was like
friends with Fran Lebowitz. Oh yeah.
Who still, who still talks about it. I know. Yeah.
To this day, like in Martin Scorsese documentaries, like,
uh, it just, he just feels like a very east coast
personality to me as a Midwest boy.
I'm like, man, that's like how people in New York are,
are like intense and gruff and like committed to their art
and like doing things outside
of the box. You know what I mean? Yeah.
And it's, I mean, he came across in his personality
and most importantly in the personality of his instrument,
his, you know, his riding for sure.
But even you just hear him walk in the baselines.
It's different, you know, for sure.
But it's fun fact, he grew up in LA That's
the amazing thing about it too.
He, he is, he's such a New York presence,
but he grew up in Los Angeles.
And Watts, I believe was born in, um, Arizona
and just had a very, very interesting lineage.
A lot of different ethnicities, um, of more
of which than we can list here
and understand what, when it's his kind of personal lineage
of his family, uh, ties and stuff.
So that's, that's his pedigree right there.
I mean, he, he really, he played with all the greats.
He played with Lionel Hampton, Charlie Parker,
bud Powell, duke Ellington.
He co-founded debut records with Max Roach in 52
and was already a, a business person, already an an artist
and executive in this industry
by the time he made this album.
Uh, this album comes out
and it begins with, um, something
that we've heard a lot here on this podcast from a lot
of different kinds of music.
And that is church. Yes. It starts with church.
You know, whether that's, we've heard it from all corners
of the music that we've listened to that Yeah.
That church music just, uh, well,
it gets in your soul. Yeah. Doesn't it?
You better. Well, Good one.
Horace Parlan piano. Amazing. Horace Parlan.
Oh,
The backgrounds on this song.
All the backgrounds on this album.
All the solo so intricate.
Yeah, you're right. The whole album Yeah.
Is full of like, very precisely arranged Yes.
Backgrounds and timed. Yeah.
And going into the walking here, the walking baseline,
we're still in three or in six.
Yeah. 2, 4, 5, 6, 1 2. Yeah.
But that's that underlying bead. Now we're back to it.
Horace Parlan.
Woo. I want
to put a pin in this 'cause I want to talk about Yes.
Real quick. I wanna put a pin in this
and apply it to all my playing.
For sure.
Woo.
Is that Mingus yelling out as he's playing?
I always thought it was. I thought it was too.
I don't know who's yelling at though. Yeah. I just assume
this is very different from a lot of those other 1959
jazz records in that there's so much just like vamp.
Like this is not really, I mean this is kind of solo,
but it's more like shout stuff.
Collective improv. That's what I'm saying.
It's not about going from solo to solo to solo.
That's what makes it so appealing for Right.
It's not all of blue, which is great too.
I love this breakdown.
Hm.
Bebo.
Woo.
That's the correct way.
This Is the blues, of course, in six
with the gospel groove.
But you got all that bebop in there because of the tempo
and because Mingus goes into the walking.
Um,
Oh, Dannie Richmond.
But the form on this is, is like the,
the almost every track on here,
there's a couple more conventional ones,
but, um, this drone on that edge,
The drone is so sick, man. The drone is so
Sick. Oh, the dynamics
they're playing there.
Oh man, it's got that ding tank sting.
He's playing around with that two against
three or four and six
Correspondents.
2, 3, 4, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6.
So Imagin, it's so simple. It's so imaginative.
And then this is like a Max Roach bebop
soul kind of. Totally.
Yeah. Totally. Great. Call Lakey
Man.
Ugh. This is nasty.
Then back to, and then like a variation on the drone
and then the chanting.
I mean,
And You could tell this was
a straight through recorded track.
Like I, I will, I'll put that flag pole in the sand.
I mean, they did have editing at that time,
but you can just feel it.
Right. There's some other stuff
on the album that's edited.
Yeah. But not this. No, probably. But I mean,
Because of how like complex the form is
with the different sections.
I don't know if he was queuing that as he went.
I don't think they have that written out where
It's like, they sound so tight with this.
Too tight. It sounds so natural and smooth.
It's almost like going through a church service
where like everybody knows.
Yeah. You don't know what's gonna happen,
but you know what's gonna cue the next part.
This is the Blues Bridge.
4 1 2 5.
Simple.
Oh, Woo.
Come on. Now. They're just letting it
Break down. Seven and a half
minutes. Genius. The bottom there. So
Good on that. Bottom F. Yeah.
How long Is it? Seven
and a half minutes. Yeah,
but it flies by, there's so much little amen at the end.
So good. It's so good. One thing I just wanna point out
for all the nerds out there is Nerd Nook is like, you know,
it's a blues form Yeah.
When they get into it, right.
And you can hear Horace Parlan doing this kind of thing.
Yeah. Or this going up sort
of f major try and the B flat thing. Right.
Like a little inlaid one to four. Right.
Ah, amen. Reverse. Ah, amen.
But I want everyone
to notice if you're a beginner piano player out,
when when they go to the four court, he doesn't go
No, no. He
Goes to, That would be corny.
F minor, essentially.
Yep. Right.
Same, same little melodic riff, but major to minor. It's
Something you hear again and again
with great blues musicians.
I mean, they're treating that four chord
as almost like it's one minor.
Yeah. In the language that they're playing
and the voicings that they're playing around it.
Just something that you should note.
It doesn't have to be as cookie cutter
as like F seven B flat seven.
It's really about this push and pull. Always
We, using my voice. You
imitating my voice a little bit. Talk like
That a little bit. A little bit. But,
but the push
and pull between that major and minor all the time.
Yeah. And the four chord in, uh, can be used as just like
that one minor in a lot of situations.
And and also the five chord. Yeah.
Playing like F minor over that cc Oh, absolutely.
In the bass all the time. It sounds incredible. Yeah.
Great stuff. I mean, I think you're already hearing it on,
on this track, probably the most
consistently of any track on here.
But, but it, but it permeates the entire album.
I think Mingus ability to set the table, I mean,
in the side side man on this are incredible.
Obviously we're gonna talk about them,
but I mean, Mingus in terms of the composition,
he wrote everything on this record,
but he had that ability to combine blues, gospel jazz,
but specifically in terms of jazz, like bebop in a way
that's actually very tricky on something like this.
Like he's pushing the tempo a little bit on this.
It's, it's not like typically like kind of a,
I mean this could be at as a church group, it could be a lot
of different tempos, but typically this be like,
like that kind of a thing, you know? Oh, that
Little, all the all blues kind of situation.
Another another instance of, by the way,
the one minor on the for chord, kinda
Exactly. Exactly.
With, with a three
or a six as opposed to a two or four.
But I mean, he's pushing it.
So, and then he's pushing into
that walking baseline pretty quickly,
Which is great. And then
He brings it back as like this part of the story.
Yeah. And then everybody's picking up in terms
of like bebop language and stuff.
And so it's very, actually very hard
to seamlessly combine all those different styles without it
sounding like, like a corny kind of thing of like,
now I'm doing jazzy, now I'm doing bluesy,
now I'm doing r and b or whatever.
Like, it's just kind of his thing.
I mean, there's a lot you could say about
Gospel's, kind of the overlay. Maybe there's
A lot you could say about Charles Mingus,
but Corny is not one of Thoses.
No. Kind of the opposite of corny.
He's sort of the ultimate, like, he
Might pull a shotgun out on you, cool
Guy, guy. Calm, corny. You
know what I'm saying? Um,
alright, next up is,
But there was such like the beauty, like his intonation,
the playing, the dynamics.
He was, he was a tough guy. We have all the legendary
stories, which might have been overblown a little
bit, but I mean Yeah.
But he had this like, beautiful, nuanced approach to music.
We're gonna hear that for sure on the next track.
That really was obviously a huge part
of his musical personality as well.
So the next track is called Goodbye Pork Pie Hat.
This is a tribute to Lester Young, who had passed away
just a couple of months before they recorded this album.
Yeah. Uh, Lester Young,
if you haven't heard much Lester Young,
go listen to Net Lester Young.
I recommend the Lester Young Trio.
I'm with Nat King Cole and Buddy Rich,
which is like, unbelievable. Unbelievable. That'd
Be a fun one. Um, we
should do that actually at some point. Um, but, uh,
Les Young was so great that other saxophonists nominated
him and called him President.
That's right. Was that was his
nickname. Was president. Was President. That's
Right. Um, I love
this song so much, man. And yeah.
Let's have a listen by the way.
I just wanna, but I wanna point out too, this is the first
of, I think 80% of this album, the titles, the,
the songs themselves are written about someone.
Yeah. So there, there's tribute to Lester Young.
There's an open letter to Duke.
There's bird calls about bird calls. Charlie Parker.
Charlie Parker. There's even like some, you know, the fables
of Faubus, which is not Oh, yeah.
A flattering picture
Of this. But it's about somebody specific.
There's a call song called Jelly Roll. Right.
There's Jelly. There's even self-portrait in Three Colors
about Mingus himself, a song
called Pussycat Dos, which we don't know.
We know who that's for. Know who
that's for. We're not gonna one.
So was speculate on that last Young had he just died when
they made the record, or when he wrote this or something?
I mean, I know it's it's a good buy,
so I'm assuming it was Yeah.
No, he died. He had just died
before the recording of this album.
Okay. He died in March of 1959. Oh, wow. He was Goodbye. My,
And Then they're gonna split.
Hmm.
Now they're in octaves. Oh, such great. Arranging simple.
You know, what I love about this one too, is like,
I consider these two contemporary composers to be some
of the most Im important composers of this era of music.
Charles Mingus and Felonious Monk. Yeah.
And like this,
the Monk has written ballads in this sort of style Yeah.
And this sort of feel, and they're completely different.
They're like, yeah. Completely opposite harmonically,
melodically what they choose to do.
But somehow, like they, there's a authenticity to both
of them as artists that is really so appealing.
Like, you can hear the Mingus one
and just know like, that's the Mingus thing.
Yes. It's like he does all those like dominant
sevens down a minor third.
You know what I mean? Yeah. And the melodies are
always very singable, always very memorable.
Not that monks aren't, but Monk,
you can hear just like rhythmically,
he's got harmonic concepts that just bring 'em out.
I consider those two to just be like, uh,
they're working on a same similar plane in their own
sandboxes kind of.
Yes. I mean, really. Really. I don't even know.
Did they ever play together? I don't
Think. I'm sure
they did. I I can't think.
I'm, I'm sure they would've crossed paths, but no, I we're
Definitely swinging and missing on that.
Put in the comments if there's been a Monk
Mingus, I know it's probably gonna be like
Yeah. It'll be, oh, you remember the,
the Great Monk Mingus duo
at, at Mossy Hall in Montreal.
Totally. Totally. Yeah.
And I mean, like, you, you touched on it a little bit,
but like, there's a lot
of this Sharp nine, which is really, yeah.
Yeah. And blues, there's a lot of blues inflection in terms
of how Mingus you can hear it when he's improvising his
baselines on all of his stuff.
Yeah. Like, that was a deep part of his thing.
But what you alluded to in terms of like the dominant
chord movement was very unique.
Like with this, that's like e-flat, uh,
seven to go up to the four.
Like he did, that's a very gospel kind of blues thing.
But then he goes down Yeah.
To that DFL seven, which is like, that's kind
of like later on was like a Stevie Wonder.
Like Stevie Wonder loves to do. Yeah. At this time.
That was a little bit, um, I mean, it just,
it really gives the personality of like how he heard music,
how he'd float those melodies on top.
And then also, man, the details
with having the two saxophones in unison for
that whole melody and then split and then splitting 'em.
And they have one note.
And I'm thinking that it was just one
of 'em made a little mistake.
But I love it so much in that first melody
where they're not in unison,
but I'm also like, maybe Mingus
wrote it like that. I don't know.
We don't know. It works. I love that
that stayed on the record.
Yeah. And is like part of it, you know, I mean, like,
when you play it, do you have to do that?
No. No. But I mean, like, that's part of the moment.
And I mean, the level and,
and shout out,
we didn't shout out enough on, I think on one of the others.
First of all, Teo Ero Yeah.
Producer on this, who also at least
co-produced both those other records.
We talk about Columbia in 1959,
timeout and kind of blue and kind of blue.
And also Fred Lau who engineered all of 'em.
The sound is just stellar.
Shout out Fred and shout out 30th Street, Columbia Studio.
The church where they, where, I mean,
you can hear how beautifully it's captured. Yeah. And
The band on this too is pretty ridiculous.
We got Dannie Richmond on the drums. We've Dannie
Richmond. Bad Bad dude.
Bad dude. We've already talked about Horace Parlan,
which I wanna talk about more on the next song.
Yeah. Uh, John Handy, the third on the Ounce
of Saxophone, who is still with us?
Yes. I believe he's, is he the only one on here?
Probably still with us. I think so.
I apologize if I'm, if
somebody on this record, but I think so.
He's 92 years old. Shout out to the Great John Handy.
Um, yeah. Ho Parley, you know where Horace Parlan is from?
Pittsburgh? Pa Pittsburgh pa,
which we know is a great music town.
Incredible. But Piano
Town In Incre.
I mean, yeah. I'm always thinking about all the great
musicians, but just the pianist.
I compiled a little list. Okay.
Am I, am I, am I, am I even getting into some people
that just traveled through Pittsburgh airport?
I don't think so. No. Sonny Clark ever heard of
Him? One of my face. Oh,
You want go to a, a real big dog? How about Errol
Garner? That's
A big dog. That's a big dog. Yeah.
Johnny Costa,
Uh, Mr. Right.
Drew fans. It doesn't get any more
Pittsburgh than that big dog.
Ahad Jamal. Um, often associated with Chicago,
But one of the greatest
artists who ever lives. Yeah. Yeah.
Oh. Oh, well, you know what?
Let's go, let's go even more og.
Let's, let's go up even higher.
I like where you're going. Earl
Hines father, the father
considered the father of jazz piano.
Of course. Earl Hyz from Pittsburgh. Oh, I'm sorry.
Let's go to even more legendary. Mary Lou Williams. What?
Pittsburgh? Yeah. That one I'm almost sure is correct.
I'm on right side on that one. No, I think it is. We'll
Get letters. Oh. Send
'em to johnny costa.com.
Let's just talk about just great composers in general. Oh.
And they're also great jazz panels from Pittsburgh.
Sure, sure, sure. But legends. Yeah. Like
Who?
William Strayhorn.
William Strayhorn. Billy Strayhorn. Billy Stray.
Jerry Allen. This is the one I'm not sure about.
I love Jerry. We love Jerry Allen. J Jerry Allen.
One of the greatest jazz pianists of the class.
Could be from Pittsburgh, Either.
Well, she definitely taught there and hung out.
I believe she's from Pittsburgh.
I just love saying her name. Anyway. And,
And yeah, shout out
Jerry Allen. Man, the little list. Sammy,
Sammy Nest. Okay.
Sorry. Now I'm just naming names. But yeah, this all
Pittsburgh. Keep going.
Uh, and Horace Parlan is one of them. Yeah.
And you know, Horace Parlan born in Pittsburgh, uh, in his
first year on this earth was stricken with polio.
Yeah. That was the polio Time.
And that resulted in a partial crippling of his right hand.
Which if you play piano, you know, kind
of an important hand.
Yeah. I mean, they're both pretty important. Yeah.
The right hand though, especially.
Um, but partial only had partial use of his right hand.
Yeah. Which he made into his sound, which like,
it just goes to show you stop using excuses.
Right. I know. Like Horace Parlan sounds amazing. Yeah.
And he was crippled on his right hand
with polio when he was a child.
Yeah. And developed his own sound.
Became this whole, this whole artist unto himself had an
amazing life, amazing career.
Um, and this is Bookie
Stop Shuffle, which we're gonna hear a little
Horse. David Sandborn too.
That's right. David Sandborn also
from Polio. Correct. Yeah.
Yeah. Ey Stop Shelf.
Ah,
Oh. As Duke
Ellington right there. Influence.
Woo.
Dannie Richmond So much Duke Ellington in Mingus.
I mean, Mingus talks about this too.
His primary compositional influence.
Keeping that line going underneath. Ooh. Counter point.
Ah, Oh, can Minga swing
When he walked?
Yes. What a sound too big bass sign.
I mean, the comping is just continuing the lines.
So genius Bass and piano.
Oh, More background sipping. Right. Go to swing.
But with the background,
we start rushing there.
And I, I'm here for it.
Mia, Mia threw, had a rush. Not a problem.
Some of our favorite bass players. That's right.
Our Famous rushers.
Oh, Again, more of that blues thing.
Oh, Horace Parlan.
Oh, the background.
Ah,
oh, play. So tasteful
Piano, Not pianist mode. Not piano.
Ah, Swing
activated
blues has been activated. Been done activated.
Oh, That reminder.
Oh yeah. Hell, that's a pro Move. That's right.
You gotta be advanced to pull that off. You
Gotta be ready to be like, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So just for our listener here about what just happened. So
That's what we were saying he didn't do
before. Yeah, yeah. No, but he
Waited on it. But what we, yeah. What
we said before.
But he, he just picked a right moment, didn't he?
So, uh, uh, a b flat minor Blues. Right. Yeah. Right.
So all minor. Yeah. Minor Blues minor.
So, uh, and on that one time,
on the four court, he goes up to
The blue scale of the four. He goes,
Amazing, amazing stuff. So good.
Um, yeah. And this one's so cool too
'cause it's obviously, uh, it's called Boogie Stop Shuffle.
So it's, it's got like bebop undertones.
It's bluesy, obviously it's even got some churchy stuff.
It's not really a shuffle,
but like Dannie Richmond is so like, flexible with, with it.
It's got the undertones of that
and then it's got this Boogie Woogie line.
But it's not like your typical like, oh, you know,
um, down there.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, it's up here. Right.
You know, it, it's, man, it's just like all woven together
and it's very, man, this could be like,
this could be like a Chase scene in,
in like the French Riviera in North
by Northwest Alfred Hitchcock or something.
You know, where they got like the slick car.
I'm glad you mentioned that because the next track on the
album Self portrait in, why are We taking
A trip To France together? We
Could. Glad you mentioned that. Take
it.
Open Studio France.
Uh, the next track is self portrait in Three Colors,
which is originally written for the film shadows,
but wasn't included due to budgetary concerns.
Come on. And we are all the Hollywood, we're all the benefit
because I'm sure you watch Shadows a couple times a year.
Like we all do. Wow. Never heard of it, of it either,
But we No, but John Caves isn't this John
Caves actually movie, I think. Yeah. But
Self-Portrait in Three Colors.
We listen to all the time. Gorgeous song.
This would've been good. I haven't seen a movie.
Hold on, check my imdb real quick.
Is that the John? I think so.
Unison Melody again. Of course.
Marlin.
Yeah. John Ca Shadow. You're totally right.
Yeah. Actually this movie looks dope.
He was an actor too. He was in a bunch of,
did he direct this or was he starring in it?
I don't know. He
Directed It. Yeah. But he was an
actor too.
I, I can't remember what It's big stuff. Big stuff.
Yeah. This was around that period where there was like jazz
and this kind of thing.
I could see like, 'cause you got Anatomy
of a Murder I believe was right around this maybe the year
before Duke Ellington.
I mean, shout out Auto Preminger, shadow Out
Shadows. I'm gonna go look
it up on Tuby tonight and tell you what
Tuby Sponsor maybe
Never heard of it. So
is that Netflix?
It's so, man, you, you really nailed it. The beginning.
Jimmy Neper, you nailed it
with is Mingles.
Like, is he on the m Mount Rushmore of the little big band
of like, small, small,
what would you call it? Small big band arrange
Would have to be, yeah. But
yeah, for, for such a small quote unquote
band of just Yeah.
Three or four horns and a rhythm section.
I mean, the colors that he's able to get. Yeah.
I mean in this tune specifically three. But in general.
In general, so many different colors to all of this.
And he learned it, Peter from his mentor,
the great two Ellington,
Edward Kennedy Ellington, Edward Kennedy Ellington.
And the next track is a tribute to that open letter to Duke.
Well, we don't know if it's a tribute, it's an open letter
because they had
Checkered Pad quite a relationship.
So, uh, Mingus joined Duke's band and,
and was fired from Duke's band all in 1953. All in
Like a couple weeks I think for
Allegedly swinging an ax at Trombonist, Juan Teel, who,
uh, in MGA's defense might have called Mingus a racial
slur and pulled out a knife.
We don't know, because there's several different accounts
of the interaction.
There's one from Mingus. Yeah. There's one from Juan Teel.
Yeah. There's one from Duke Ellington.
And there's even one from the trumpet player,
one of the trumpet players in the band.
St. Louis, his own Clark Terry. I'm gonna
Trust Clark Terry. I
Actually would trust Clark as well, because he's
kind of a, he's
The only one of those that I knew a little bit in
Real life. He's an angel cartoon.
Yes. Yeah. So it,
But the only thing in common with all those stories,
I think, was that Char Charles Mingus swung a large iron
or steel object at Juan Tessel.
Like that's not in dispute. Everybody,
Including Mingus, that he grabs something.
Right. And Acts, some say it was a piece of iron, something
Like from the state on the side of the stage.
On the side of the stage. Yeah. But, uh,
there was apparently an altercation about, uh,
Juan Teel playing something of Duke's or writing.
He had written something. Yeah. And he didn't, like,
he said something to Mingus about, you're not reading it.
Right. But apparently it went back deeper than that.
Like when Mingus was coming up, he really wanted
to play cello and some other instruments too.
Yeah. And like, because of, you know, the times
and everything, he wasn't afforded, um, in,
in equal musical education, even though he really wanted it.
So he didn't learn to read real Well. He did later on.
But he could play, he could write, he could arrange,
but he had some of these barriers put up.
And um, so he might have had a little chip on his shoulder
as you would for people saying,
oh, you can't read that correctly. What you mean
Music Sheet music read. Yeah.
Right. Notation. He's like, oh really?
Lemme go get this, um, steel pipe
and see if you can read that buddy.
Um, but We are not jazz,
we are not journalists, by the way.
So No, but, but let's put that out there.
But, uh, duke, apparently, the way I love this part
of the story too, the way that Duke fired him.
Mingus said, you feel like he just like shook your hand
and said some nice things about you
and you felt great about it. Which like, and
He resigned. Yeah. And then,
yeah, and then he resigned.
But that's so tracks for
what everybody would say about Duke Ellington was he was,
he was just the UAEs man.
The most like, incredible gentleman in the world.
Uh, Mingus loved Duke so much.
Uh, the aforementioned Fran Leitz, who
is New York City icon author Fran.
It says that Mingus used to say to that, uh,
Ellington could get away with things
that no one ever could like calling him Charlie.
Apparently he Mingus hated when people call him Charlie.
Yeah, I know. I said it earlier. I was like, yeah,
he's gonna, he might, he might take that out. Andy,
Chuck Don't, don't use Chuck for
Sure. And he'd let, he'd
let, he'd even let Duke Ellington steal
bites out of his dinner, which he would else.
I'm not sure the validity of that,
of Fran's recollection, but, but a
Couple years after this was, um, the money jungle.
Well, which is such an interesting, we don't have to Well,
I mean, we can divert if you'd like
One of the tracks. So Money
Jungle is Duke Ellington Max Roach. Yeah.
So the guy that Mingus started the label
with incredible bebop drummer, uh, and Mingus recorded
One of the greatest trio on Low Key, one
of the greatest Trio piano Trio records ever made.
I think it's such a great record. It's such
a weird, weird record.
It's a record. It's awesome. Should do that.
And what I love about it, are we
Gonna become a jazz podcast again?
We are. We, there's
a little bit of a battle in the
comments. Go on. So let us know.
It's always guys with bebop in their
names though, that are And
With Fedor. No,
not a Fedor Beret.
Yeah, no. But, um, what's interesting about Money Jungle,
one of the tracks that they put on this album,
Juan Teal's Caravan.
Oh, that's right. What best track. I know
They put Caravan on
It. What is that all about?
Maybe Megan said had he buried the
hatchet, buried the steel pipe. Right.
Can't say that. You can't say that here. We can't.
Sorry. This is Money Jungle from 1963.
Man, dude, duke, Dude. Killing.
I know we should do Money Jungle. Honestly,
One of the most aggressive, beautiful,
weirdest jazz trio records ever.
But great, but great
Incredible Actually approach.
This is what you have to love about Duke Care.
Like that record shouldn't have worked as good as it did.
I love records like that. Can we just say
That almost the entire last 15 years
of Duke Ellington's recording career shouldn't have worked.
I know. And some of his best stuff. Yeah.
I mean, talk about a visionary and you can see Orleans
Suite. That's a weird,
that's a weird piece. That
Duo album with Ray Brown is so odd.
That's in the seventies. I
Think Incre in the seventies, right before he passed away.
Passed away. But this is
where I think you can tell Mingus is inspired
by his hero is from this kind of stuff.
Like making these really interesting things
that are not straight down the middle,
that are curve balls. And both even
Duke Ellington and John Coltrane
shouldn't have worked as good as it did. It worked so well.
I feel a Duke Ellington streak coming
on for next season, Peter.
So, um, anyway, this is, uh, uh, MGA's open letter to Duke.
This Swinging is hail by
The, okay.
Pause. Sorry, I haven't done that in a while.
We're gonna go back and listen to the beginning again,
because a bunch of, first of all,
the way this whole record starts
with better get in your soul, like, kind of,
it's very like, what's going on?
Almost like voodoo where it's just kind of like congeals
and what's gonna happen now.
Just like, what's Going on? Yeah. What's going on?
I mean, for like one of the most popular jazz records
of all time, it's crazy, but this track,
like MGA's decision now, did he make it at that moment?
Was it calculated? Who cares?
But his decision to wait to come in
and start walking kill to me just like draws you in.
And it's like, oh yes, I'm here for it. I
Mean, this is the run of the album of this album that I,
I think makes it so immortal.
Yeah. Is the open letter to Duke Bird calls and,
and fables of Fabi, I think takes, it's the meat of it.
It breaks open the album. Yeah.
I mean, the first four tracks are
amazing. They're also, they're all great.
The first three, I would say, well,
really the first two are like the most I can
understand why they put those first.
All nine of these tracks Peter are incredible, honestly.
Yeah. But I'm saying the first two are the most like
potentially crossing over to anybody that for sure.
I don't know if I like jazz. Okay. I like
That. This is good jazz.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The s nter starts very high or very
Low. We're not stretching. It starts very
low,
but now it starts to get high. 'cause this s**t is,
But the way he comes, just check out
you guys when Mingus comes in.
Oh, Little countdown.
Foreshadowing. Yeah. Little countdown.
Fores. Same here. Well,
Next year,
M lets Dannie Richmond coming.
Oh,
Ah. Dannie
Richmond still. Horse Parley here too.
Yeah.
Are Horse Parley and Dannie Richmond the most underrated
rhythm section players probably.
Yeah.
Don't sleep on open letter to Duke.
That is just Yeah. And it goes so many different places.
This is almost like a mini suite, the whole
Track. And it's something that
we kind of haven't had yet. Right?
We've had all this like, intricate backgrounds
and these back and forths between the rhythm section
and the horns and dropping out and clapping.
Yeah. And now we just get like, no, we're just gonna burn.
We can also tip. Right.
You know, but the way they come in, man, I, I can't, like,
I'm always, whenever I hear something else,
I remember I was like, oh, little silly things
are actually actually super important.
Like, when do you come in?
When does like, 'cause we,
I mean, how would we have done this?
We probably be like one, two altogether. Bam, you know?
Yeah, yeah. Which is fine. But,
So next up is bird calls.
Now Peter, we mentioned that this is a tribute
to Charlie Parker, however not true. Did you know that?
I didn't, I never totally assumed.
I mean, I, I always assumed it was,
but I've never had any definitive Oh,
so we are jazz journalists. Is that what you're saying?
This is not a tribute to Charlie Parker. Lemme see
Your card. Lemme see
your jazz police card.
Hold on. I got it right here. Hold on. I got my badge.
A badge. It's a badge. Uh, this is, uh, bird call. Yeah.
Can it have a dual meaning? I always
just assumed it was about Bird.
Yeah.
Oh, Definitely about
bird. Both birds.
I think so. Yeah.
Why do you say it's not about Charlie Parker?
Because That's what my, that's what our producer
Thoughts here. Am I
supposed to be reading this?
No. Shout out Liz, our producer for the, the research
that us knuckleheads don't
Do. She is a jazz journal.
I don't know about
that. You know, maybe it is.
It's gotta be in there somewhere. I mean,
Mingus probably said, nah, that's not for Charlie Parker.
Yeah, but come on, you.
Next up. So this is, I think probably when people think
of this album, they probably think of this song as one
of the quintessential songs of the album.
Fables of Fbu, which was a protest against Arkansas Governor
Orville Fbu.
He sounds shady.
I don't know a lot about Orville Fbu just, I mean,
I like Orville Redden Barker.
So he makes some fine popcorn.
It sounds like the Orville
Falba sounds like he was up to some bad
Things. He sounds like the bad
guy In a John Grisham novel, uh,
he sent the National Guard to prevent black students.
The Little Rock nine. Yeah.
From attending Little Rock Central High School in
1957. Fun fact.
The Little Rock nine, one of the the children
was a young girl, um, whose name, I apologize,
I'm forgetting, but she used to, I saw her for years.
She was PBS NewsHour. One of the original anchors. Yeah.
Um, she's retired now. Was wonderful.
She was actually one of the little
Orville, you're f*****g up man.
Come on. Son of a b***h.
Oh. So the original had lyrics,
but Columbia wouldn't allow Mingus
to publish the song with lyrics.
So they released it as an instrumental. Come on, Columbia.
Yeah. Come on. Stand up Columbia. See,
We're always like 1959.
What a glorious year. We
Forget. Yeah. Not quite. No.
But Mingus did release a version of it
with the lyrics the following year as
original Faubus fables.
He started off the song saying it's dedicated to the first
or second or third, all American heel.
Heel. HEEL. This is by the, I'm now I'm gonna stop,
Stop it.
This is one of the greatest compositions of the fifties.
This is an incredible piece of music. Yeah. I'll say that.
Orchestration we
Have.
It's tell the story too, right?
Orchestration. Damn.
But there's like a, there's a little bit of a
military action element to this.
Ah,
sharp knives.
Ah,
Unbelievable. MEUs Master
the segue. Unbelievable. I mean,
And that's a, it's not a
complicated thing you just did there.
No, it's very sophisticated though. Very effective.
The way the trombone comes in on the second note there.
Ah, Jimmy kn
mine with a major seven.
Oh, Unbelievable.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you think this has influenced the
musicians over the I meanly how many,
And I mean, oh yeah.
This is, and I mean,
to make such a overt political statement
of such beauty, but there's also like, um,
there's a certain, is it mockery?
There's a disdain that's built into this even as beautiful.
It is. Yeah. You know, and he named it.
So this is not supposed to be like obscured or anything.
And jazz, the stands as, as a piece of beautiful art.
100%. Which is something that's always been in jazz.
Right? It's always been a part of the music.
Is it still, is it
Falling off? There's,
I mean, there's corners. We need more of this.
There's corners for Sure. Me
and Charlie Mingus out here.
Oh, it's a masterpiece.
It's a masterpiece. Yeah.
I love this horse, Parlan.
Oh yeah.
And when they come out of it, ah,
ah,
it's supposed to be
uncomfortable too, when they're like, it's
Not supposed to feel Smooth now.
Oh man. Thank you. Charles Mingus.
So right there, that effect
that he's getting is on the base.
He's slapping the base itself.
Yeah. Which has a whole history guard back
Jimmy Blanton pre that.
Um, ah, yeah.
I mean, Mingus had such a dramatic flare, like for
infusing the music with this like, drama,
but then also just very like, beautiful swinging stuff.
Bluesy, like, there's some, there's like comfort food,
but then it's like some really
challenging stuff put in there.
I mean, it, it helps this cause
that this band is so swinging.
It, it makes it, oh, you think? Yeah. No, I mean, oh, great.
Great. Players contribute to the, to the
expedition. You're
Mocking me now.
Like I am Orval. Th
Orval. Or come
on Orville.
Um, I do want to, I actually do wanna try to bring up the,
uh, version with lyrics because I think it's, oh yeah.
But how great it, so the orchestration of the beginning of
that with the, the Baba
and that trombone is not playing on the first note
of the phrase, but on the second notes of the phrase.
And you know, with orchestration, your goal is
to make new instruments by combining instruments.
Mm. And that's what Mingus is doing there.
Like any great orchestrator, whether it's
for an orchestra in classical music or for a film score,
or for a rock band or for this kind of music,
Mingus is top tier at getting new instruments.
Yeah. There's even a new, there's an instrument that happens
with those, uh, the comping that happens behind
that saxophone solo of, of Horace Parlan
and dun dun with the slap on the base
with the slap. Right. That's a new rhythm
Instrument That he's making by combining those things.
Absolutely.
Oh man, this is great. And I love,
like his first big label, big budget.
I know Columbia. He's like, we're going,
we we're going with, uh, FBU. Fables.
No Fear. Fables of Fbu.
All right. Here we go. Thank you ladies and gentlemen.
Remember no applause. And keep it down your drinks.
Don't rally your ice and your glasses.
And don't ring the cash. Richard, you got it covered.
All right. I'd like to, um, continue, continue,
continue this set with a competition dedicated to the first
or second or third, all American Hill fathers
and it's title, the Fables of Fathers. Oh
Lord. Don't
let us, oh Lord.
Don't let
no more
Mm. No more
squashes Doesn't seem like that big
of an ask. No,
I know. And I love
this, this kind of like militaristic undertone,
police state kind of a thing, even though it sounds great,
you know, gonna swing like that dichotomy.
Right? I mean, Mingus man a giant, not, not the voice
of an angel, we wouldn't say, but like he's he's singing it.
He's singing it while he's playing. Uh,
Next up Pussycat dos.
Oh Yeah.
He's a great track.
The sound of this album to and shout out to
And, uh, Fred Plow. Yeah.
Shut out Freddy. Hard pan on those horns. I love it.
Ah,
ah, that's,
that's a Mingus progression right there. Ah,
Incredible. Next
up is a tribute. Another tribute. This is the
Last track. This is the last
track track. We're
Moving through this album. Last
track on the album is a tribute
to Jelly Roll Morton called Jelly Roll.
I love playing this song.
I've got to do this album a little
bit with our own Bob Debu.
Uh, Bob hosted a 1959 day at our very own Jazz St.
Louis years. Did you play Giant Steps? We did not play Giant
Steps Now 'cause it was released 1960.
Um, question for you on this.
Are we gonna listen to,
'cause we can start to get into categories
or we can listen to this and then,
but I just want a question.
Are we gonna listen to the original version of this,
the four minute-ish version?
I, I don't,
Because this is like a Spotify thing where they kind of,
I think this is six minutes here. Yeah.
So this is not the original version. Yeah.
This is really good.
I get more slapping here on the base. This
Is so great.
Yeah. There was, in the original version, there was a,
a splice where like two minutes and 40 seconds was taken
Out. Yeah. It's like one of
the worst.
Well, I shouldn't say it's one of the worst for 1959.
It's not bad. It's my only equivalent
With They fixed it though. Yeah.
Well they,
but it's such a part of the record.
New Orleans
Very fancy. Yeah.
I'm gonna give Room Killed
At Age. I'm
already, we on one of those PBS parties
for those corny shows that comes on to
Quote Bobby Hill.
I'm gonna give Room service the jangle
and order up some A two Fey. That's
Okay.
We might have to call our friends to make sure we can
De Bossier and de Quis b******t.
I don't know if our new fans know about De Bossier.
Oh. But man Mangoes could like bring this like,
old timey new, but, but it's not corny.
It's not at all corny. If I try to write
Some in lesser hands in Cornier
Hands Oh my God.
Because he's always got a little mingus twist to it.
Man, guy as cool as hell. There's no doubt about it. It
Man, his baseline, like under not, I mean, oh,
Charlie Mingus is a great bass player that, okay.
I'm no genius to say that,
but it's always, look, it's, it's baseline.
And so like Mingus,
I do feel like sometimes we don't quite put him in the,
like, Paul Chambers, Ray Brown, Jimmy Blanton category,
but I think he maybe should be it.
It's because he is probably the greatest
bass jazz bass playing composer.
Mm-hmm. Of all time. Yeah.
You know, you could say put, make a easy case for that.
But we forget like he's in kind of the Mount Rushmore.
Of course he is. You know, top five, top 10,
just bass players buddy abilities
and swing intonation. Bo you know,
It's Charles mga. It's
Charles mga. Sorry. Come on man.
Okay, let's get to some categories.
Peter, what's your desert Island
track? From this album Goodbye
Pork by Hat Man, I think that's one of the most beautiful,
gorgeous, to me it's kind of like, it's gorgeous, you know,
a horse silver piece.
It's kind of like, um, Wallford Debbie.
It's just a beautiful, and it's truly a jazz ballad, right?
Yeah. It's not a, it's not a, it's not even like,
like sometimes there's beautiful jazz ballads
that are written in the style of, um,
great American songbook, and this is not that.
You know what I mean? Yeah. It's got that kind
of like ballad beauty and stuff.
But it's very much an instrumental jazz ballad.
Standard. Standard. What
You got from me? I got, uh,
fables of faus.
I just think it's an incredible work of art.
I think it's a, it is beautiful protest song. Apex
Moment. Are you gonna, but you're gonna
be p****d off on
that desert island every time you hear that.
Every day. You gotta remember about
listening to that. Is that how you wanna go out? No.
I'm gonna remember that human beings, uh,
there are human beings out in the world
that make incredible art to stand up, uh,
to actually abuse of power.
And I think that's important. It gives me hope.
And maybe like, oh, maybe there's someone out there standing
up for me on this desert island
trying to get me off this thing. You know?
See, that's, that's deep man. Can be inspiring me.
See how I'm on, I'm on my desert island.
Just want to hear some, most, most beautiful ballet.
What does that say about me versus
you? You're still standing up.
Okay. Apex moment. What do you got?
Okay, so we listened to it already,
but if you want to go back to it on Boogie Stop Shuffle.
I love the beginning of Horace Parlan solo.
Like with the backgrounds. Like this is, yeah.
Coming out of the, coming
Out of The sax solo
and those really quiet lines underneath.
And He, it's so killing man.
And he keeps going. He goes up there
And Doing the same
line and then here.
Oh, I mean,
great, great moments in swing.
Remember that CBS great moments in history.
I also, I have Horace Harlin's solo on
Better Get It in Your Soul.
Yeah. So like two Harlan
HHorace Parlan steal this record.
Horace Parlan. We used to have a category.
Did who stole the record? Yeah.
Horace Parlan might have stolen this.
I know. But Mingus Mingus is so killing,
so it's back up here bit.
All this stuff, the same kind of thing
that he's doing on the, on
The, it's so cocky to play a solo
where you're not really soloing, you know?
So great. Super, super inspiring. Well, okay.
Bespoke playlist title. What do you got, Peter? Well, I'm
Really gonna go out a limb on this one.
I'm gonna surprise you. I'm gonna go off cuff
and call it 1959.
Exclamation point. Exclamation
Point. You're so creative, which
is what I love about you.
I'm gonna call it the Golden Year,
which is pretty much the same thing.
A little bit, a little bit shinier. Yeah.
Uh, quibble bits. What do you got? Well,
On that original version, the edit coming out of the, uh,
the sax solo going into the Mingus is one
of the most abrupt, weird edits on a record
that feels like it was just,
they came in and just did all first takes.
I don't know that they did. Yeah, they probably didn't.
But it's got that feel that it's so abrupt
and weird, I would say.
But it's such a part of it.
So when I listen to the Spotify version
now, I was like, wait, where was that?
Or earlier today. And I was like,
oh yeah, of course they would've fixed that.
So that's one of the advantages.
But I'm also like, man, that's some of the magic.
It's like the last track. It's a weird edit.
I'm sure it was because I mean,
I think this record's like 46 minutes or 45 minutes.
Yeah. Which is getting on the long side for an lp.
Yeah. It needs to be like 43. Yeah.
Yeah. For, I mean, not, I don't think it's getting
musically, it's just the qua, you know, how they used,
especially in the late fifties.
Yeah, yeah. With LPs the Qua, the longer it was, the more,
um, qualitative decisions they had to make
to degrade it a little bit.
So that, that's probably why they lopped it off.
'cause the plane's great on it, but that's a little
Equipment. I mean, my only equipment
is with Columbia Records
for not allowing the lyrics to fables
of Alvis on there. Oh, why?
That's what are You're not a company, man. Come on.
Uh, speedometer.
So here, Peter, interesting thing about the s Nobo in this
case, I wrote down five oh number,
and then, then next to that you wrote down,
ha haha. And I'm just
No, no, no, just two ha's. Ha ha. Oh,
Sorry. Haha. Haha.
Why Wait, you say five? I say five because, haha.
I was say five. I Never say five.
I know You always say five.
And I, I put nothing.
'cause I wanted to like, go through this experience.
I think this is a five.
I would've to agree, because this is your classic.
Like how could it, I mean,
there's certainly like a snobby level to be like, I like,
so if you're with like, general company
and you're like, what's your favorite record?
Someone's like, uh, Phil Col, uh, Genesis, uh,
three Sides Live,
and someone else is like Michael Jackson off the Wall.
Then you say Mingus.
Ah, you're, you're off the speedometer, right?
You're off the charts. You're 10. Yeah. Right.
I guess so. But For jazz records,
this is a one actually,
because it's, it's very, it's on Rolling Stones,
500 greatest albums of all time,
Which is kind of incredible. This
is 100%. It's pretty far up. And you know
What's, it's not four, nine.
You know what's so crazy is depending on the personality
type of the person that you're trying to, to introduce jazz
to any of those sort of big five albums from 1959, kind
of blue, blue timeout, mga, aam, timeout, shape of jazz com,
and portrait and Jazz.
I think you could find one of those
as the entree into the music from that, that year.
Yeah. Because they're all so accessible.
I would put this as the snobby of those five.
You even shape of jazz to come, I
Would put Shape of Jazz to come as
a little bit more snobby than this.
But, but this is, but that's such
An obvious, like real snobs would be like, oh,
that's not even top five for Ornette Records.
I don't know about that. Um, better than KOB kind of blue.
No, no, I
Different.
He can't commit. I'm gonna say no.
Why though? Why, like, hearing this again,
experiencing this with you and our dear listeners, like,
I'm more excited about this record now, which is crazy.
'cause what do we talk about going into this?
I was like, I don't know if I love this album.
I like this album. Yeah.
To quote a very good friend of mine
who shall remain nameless.
I like this album. I don't love,
but I mean, I, I almost feel like I,
it's like deeper than love or like for me with this record.
Mm. Like, there's, there's an authenticity,
there's a vibrancy.
Like this is the least dated piece of art from any year
Of I You're right about that 20th century
I've ever heard. I think you're right about that.
It's crazy. Like how much this stands up.
It's almost like, it's exactly like it came out then.
Now could you, is kind of blew a more beautiful record. Yes.
Is it a more romantic record? Yes.
Is it a better record though? Yes. Oh, okay.
I'm gonna say maybe. Okay.
I want, if there are any static statisticians listening,
please compile how many maybes
or evens Peter's done with kind of blue
and how many fives Peter's put on the speedometer.
Because I think it's pretty much every episode, if
You look at my resume, you might think I was a part-time
smooth jazz musician.
'cause some of the artists I've worked with,
but I am not a smooth jazz guy.
Sorry. That you're a smooth jazz guy and you love KLB.
Oh, okay. Because I always say that. Like,
that's the first smooth jazz record acc
Months, Man.
I'm gonna go 10 on this one.
I'm going 10 as well. No, You have eight. I'm you
Have nine. You have nine. But
I, I'm excited about this.
I opted, I'm now excited. And I think the cover, I mean
The, the, the re the cover's Perfect. Cover's perfect.
I, I, you know, um, I, I mean nine 10, so shout out s Neil
Fujita, who was the, an incredible graphic designer.
He did, um, timeout from this
and a bunch of other Columbia records.
He did this one. He was a very interesting man.
He was born in Hawaii American,
but of Japanese descent, both of his parents.
And like during, he was in art school in California.
He was during World War ii. He was interned.
I mean, you talk about injustices that are all over this,
you're being addressed in this record.
He was sent to an internment camp for several years, um,
and then volunteered for the US Army, the very country,
his country that put him in an internment camp.
Um, and went and fought in in Europe for the US
and then went to the Pacific Theater
and was an interpreter, was integral with the war there.
And then when he came out,
finished design school was incredible.
I mean, he's actually designed the cover for the paperback,
or I, I guess the hard cover too for The Godfather,
the First Godfather, which is one
of the most iconic novels ever.
Um, artwork.
He did Cold Blood, the book by Truman Capote In Cold
Blood. Uh, in
cold Blood. Exactly.
And, uh, did a bunch
of amazing things at Columbia Records. So it's
Wanted, it's an incredible cover.
Beautiful cover. Yeah.
Because we look, we talk about the musicians, the art.
That is the crux of it.
But when we talk about the engineers, the producers,
the cover up, we don't give that enough.
Do sometimes. And that's, that's, that's our bad. But,
Um, Peter, what do you got up next?
Man, I got just
'cause of the Duke Ellington, like hovering above,
like this, you talked about the orchestration,
the composition, the influence.
I got Duke Ellington piano in the background,
which came out I believe in Right.
The next year. Either 60
or 61, same year as as, um, anyway, that's one
of Duke Ellington's weirder records,
but I love that record. Can
We, we gotta do An episode on, I think that is the,
like if I was gonna recommend a Duke Ellington record Yeah.
To anyone. One record, if you
haven't checked that on piano in the
background. Incredible record. We
Gotta do all the weird Duke Ellington albums from
the era on an episode. I actually
Got weird too on this one. Well,
I'm gonna, I I kind of, I'm calling an audible here,
so I'm gonna put, I have a couple of suggestions.
I would put Money Jungle Up next. Oh.
I think after hearing that. Yep. Caravan.
I think that would be a great call.
I'm also gonna make a, a bold prediction here.
So Cecile McClure, Salvan friend of the show. Yes.
Hopefully friend of the pod. Yeah. Incredible vocalist.
Yeah. Um, released an album this year called O Snapp. Yeah.
And she is just as, I think Mingus is so theatrical
and so incredible with his themes on his, on his albums.
Like that O Snapp album is one
of the best albums I've heard in years and years and years.
And like her, she paints such vivid pictures
with everything she does.
But the album before this too, the French album. Yeah.
That was incredible. Misal or something like that. Yeah.
All in French. Also just like captivating. Yeah.
And I just wanna shout out Cecile, I've never met Cecile.
I'm such a huge fan.
I hope eventually that she comes
and does something here with us at Open Studio.
'cause she's so amazing. And, uh,
I just think she has this thing too, of like, not just like,
we're gonna now,
now we're gonna just burn on some tunes,
which she can do. Yeah. But I'm
Gonna, yeah. She has an amazing voice
where she
could just, she could do whatever
She wants that. Yeah. But she
really is an incredible
storyteller and incredible artist.
And I think you could tell she cares passionately about
actually saying something going against the stream Yeah.
Of what a lot of her contemporaries would not be doing.
Agreed. Which would be just like,
I'm just gonna do straight down the middle every time.
Yeah. She is almost
never straight down the middle. She's always, Hey
Lou, we will, man.
She's always thinking outside the, outside the box.
And so I just wanna shout out Cecile on that one. Great.
That's a fantastic call. Yeah. Oh, Snap's great.
I'm voting for that. I'm sure it'll be on the ground.
I'm gonna be voting for that. It's incredible.
I'm sorry, I'm not supposed to say what I'm voting for.
It's unbelievable. Yeah. Anyway.
Um, how about some, uh, how about a little,
how about a little, uh, little gala?
Love gala. So we've,
we've been getting some great podcast reviews.
Thanks everybody who's left a rating and review.
We do have an agreement here.
We give you this podcast for free.
Except it's, it's not free. It's not free at all.
It's not free, sir. It's expensive. It's
Af it costs you your time and effort
because wherever you, Hey,
Look, our listeners hey, are so great.
Their time and effort. They, they Bill listen,
Like our Friends at De bo de bo,
they billing 500 an hour wait, that's probably low nowadays.
No, we have, we have Rich folks as listeners.
Rich in both, I'm sure monetarily and
Spirit Easily.
Um, but please take your valuable time and leave us a rating
and review wherever you get your podcast from.
Whether that's YouTube, apple Podcasts, Spotify,
here's one from Stitcher.
Nope. Here's one from Strange Brain Pure Music.
Nerdism at its finest. Oh, your Nerdism needs.
That was just for you. Strange Brain. Yeah.
And here's one from hell. Yo.
Super hell you Oh, but an Umla on the o
Hell.
Super. Various topics. Incredibly well researched.
Shout out Liz. And always enriched by personal views.
Amazing. Uh,
I like that. That's, that's,
is that
a compliment sandwich there? A little
Bit. It might be, it
might be
Enriched by personal views.
They're not journalists.
Here's one, uh, here's a review.
Uh, five stars from Sings
and drinks in the UK as a lifelong museo muso
and sometime part-time jazz singer.
This podcast gets perfectly for me.
I love the raw enthusiasm these guys have for the music.
Then there are probably two levels of music geek up from me
so I can enjoy their harmonic analysis
and historical nuggets.
I spent a long train journey doing a deep dive on Stevie
Wonder with their album reviews, which got me hooked.
That makes me feel great.
Combo of jazz, popular jazz, jazz influence. Pop.
It's perfect. I think Youo just like, or sings
and drinks UK Just nailed it there. Yeah. So thanks.
Can I do this last one? Yeah, please. That was great.
Uh, thank you. From Bimo Bimo Bimo, uh,
you both have enriched my musical life so much
by turning me on to things I may have overlooked over the
years and reminding me of the amazing records I
wore out years ago.
I'm sorry. Are you texting somebody?
You, have you got another podcast to go to?
Sorry, I wasn't paying attention. What'd you say?
I love experiencing for the first time
and re-experiencing music with you both.
I can't thank you enough. Well, you know what, your review
and your adherence to gala, the gentleman
and ladies agreement is much appreciated.
Mo Yeah, Peter, I'm sorry, I am on my phone,
but I was just looking up something here.
Hold and it says right here, it says, um, until next time
You'll hear It.
Yeah, that's what it says. Oh,
Okay.