WEBVTT

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Hé

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Maarten.

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Hoi

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Lisa.

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Alles

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goed?

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Ja

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hoor.

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Ik

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zat

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net

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te

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denken,

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ik

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sprak

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gisteren

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mijn

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oma

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en

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die

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had

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het

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over

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haar

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AOW.

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Ze

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klaagde

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dat

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de

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boodschappen

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zo

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duur

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worden.

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Oh

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ja,

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de

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koopkracht

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van

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gepensioneerden

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is

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wel

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een

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dingetje,

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ja.

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En

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voor

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ons

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is

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de

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vraag

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überhaupt

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wanneer

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we

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AOW

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krijgen.

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Precies!

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Daar

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wilde

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ik

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het

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dus

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over

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hebben.

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Die

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hele

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AOW-leeftijd.

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Ja,

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die

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schuift

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telkens

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verder

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op.

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Het

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is

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een

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direct

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gevolg

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van

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de

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demografie

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van

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Nederland.

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De

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demografie...

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je

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bedoelt

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gewoon

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de

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vergrijzing,

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toch?

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Dat

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woord

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alleen

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al,

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ik

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krijg

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er

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de

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rillingen

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van.

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Ja,

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precies.

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De

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vergrijzing

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en

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de

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stijgende

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levensverwachting.

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We

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worden

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met

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z'n

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allen

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ouder,

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en

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blijkbaar

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ook

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gezonder,

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dus

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mensen

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leven

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langer

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na

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hun

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pensioen.

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Wat

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op

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zich

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natuurlijk

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fantastisch

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nieuws

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is!

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Maar

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financieel

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is

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het

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een

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drama.

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En

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minder

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werkenden

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moeten

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de

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premie

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ophoesten

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voor

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steeds

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meer

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gepensioneerden.

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Precies.

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Dat

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is

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de

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kern

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van

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het

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probleem

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met

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ons

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omslagstelsel.

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De

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werkende

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generatie

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betaalt

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direct

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voor

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de

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AOW

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van

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de

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gepensioneerden

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van

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nu.

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Ik

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vind

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dat

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idee

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van

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solidariteit

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tussen

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generaties

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op

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zich

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heel

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mooi.

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Maar

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het

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moet

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wel

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in

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balans

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zijn.

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Nu

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voelt

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het

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alsof

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wij

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de

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rekening

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gepresenteerd

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krijgen

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voor

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de

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welvaart

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van

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de

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babyboomers.

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Dat

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is

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misschien

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wat

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kort

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door

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de

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bocht,

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maar

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ik

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begrijp

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je

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gevoel

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wel.

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Het

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systeem

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is

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bedacht

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in

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de

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jaren

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vijftig,

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toen

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de

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bevolkingsopbouw

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totaal

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anders

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was.

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De

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AOW

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was

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een

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enorme

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stap

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vooruit

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in

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de

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welvaart.

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Oh

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wacht,

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dus

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toen

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was

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het

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juist

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een

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revolutionair

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goed

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idee?

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Omdat

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er

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heel

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veel

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jongeren

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waren

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en

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weinig

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ouderen?

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Eigenlijk

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wel.

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Toen

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was

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het

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een

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heel

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houdbaar

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systeem.

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Niemand

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had

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toen

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kunnen

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voorzien

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dat

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de

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levensverwachting

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zo

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extreem

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zou

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stijgen.

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De

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demografische

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voorspellingen

00:02:00.851 --> 00:02:01.141
zaten

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er

00:02:01.391 --> 00:02:01.591
flink

00:02:01.591 --> 00:02:02.110
naast.

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Oké,

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dat

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relativeert

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het

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wel

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een

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beetje.

00:02:05.108 --> 00:02:05.408
Maar

00:02:05.408 --> 00:02:05.897
toch.

00:02:05.897 --> 00:02:06.267
Als

00:02:06.267 --> 00:02:06.637
zzp'er

00:02:06.637 --> 00:02:06.777
voel

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ik

00:02:06.927 --> 00:02:07.147
die

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druk

00:02:07.586 --> 00:02:08.106
extra.

00:02:08.106 --> 00:02:08.376
Ik

00:02:08.376 --> 00:02:08.526
bouw

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geen

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pensioen

00:02:09.365 --> 00:02:09.675
op

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via

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een

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baas,

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dus

00:02:10.584 --> 00:02:10.694
ik

00:02:10.694 --> 00:02:10.904
ben

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als

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de

00:02:11.394 --> 00:02:11.533
dood

00:02:11.533 --> 00:02:11.793
voor

00:02:11.793 --> 00:02:12.448
een

00:02:12.448 --> 00:02:13.102
pensioengat.

00:02:13.102 --> 00:02:13.372
Ja,

00:02:13.372 --> 00:02:13.462
dat

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is

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de

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keerzijde

00:02:14.122 --> 00:02:14.341
van

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die

00:02:14.651 --> 00:02:15.101
vrijheid.

00:02:15.101 --> 00:02:15.391
Voor

00:02:15.391 --> 00:02:15.600
mij

00:02:15.600 --> 00:02:15.960
wordt

00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:16.170
het

00:02:16.170 --> 00:02:16.590
via

00:02:16.590 --> 00:02:16.670
het

00:02:16.670 --> 00:02:17.519
ABP-fonds

00:02:17.519 --> 00:02:18.099
geregeld.

00:02:18.099 --> 00:02:18.369
Dat

00:02:18.369 --> 00:02:18.678
geeft

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wel

00:02:18.898 --> 00:02:19.118
een

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stukje

00:02:19.668 --> 00:02:20.097
rust,

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al

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moet

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je

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ook

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daar

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maar

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afwachten

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wat

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de

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koopkracht

00:02:22.506 --> 00:02:22.605
straks

00:02:22.605 --> 00:02:22.785
nog

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is.

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Precies,

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want

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dat

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is

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het

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volgende.

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Je

00:02:25.363 --> 00:02:25.583
kunt

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wel

00:02:25.883 --> 00:02:26.083
een

00:02:26.083 --> 00:02:26.663
bedrag

00:02:26.663 --> 00:02:27.462
hebben,

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maar

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als

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alles

00:02:28.201 --> 00:02:28.411
twee

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keer

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zo

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duur

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is,

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schiet

00:02:29.391 --> 00:02:29.441
je

00:02:29.441 --> 00:02:29.530
er

00:02:29.530 --> 00:02:29.740
niks

00:02:29.740 --> 00:02:29.830
mee

00:02:29.830 --> 00:02:30.090
op.

00:02:30.090 --> 00:02:30.360
Dat

00:02:30.360 --> 00:02:30.500
is

00:02:30.500 --> 00:02:31.089
waar.

00:02:31.089 --> 00:02:31.349
En

00:02:31.349 --> 00:02:31.359
de

00:02:31.359 --> 00:02:31.939
discussie

00:02:31.939 --> 00:02:32.328
gaat

00:02:32.328 --> 00:02:32.448
nu

00:02:32.328 --> 00:02:32.658
ook

00:02:32.658 --> 00:02:32.918
steeds

00:02:32.918 --> 00:02:33.498
vaker

00:02:33.498 --> 00:02:33.568
over

00:02:33.568 --> 00:02:33.817
de

00:02:33.817 --> 00:02:34.067
vraag

00:02:34.067 --> 00:02:34.177
of

00:02:34.177 --> 00:02:34.407
we

00:02:34.407 --> 00:02:34.457
niet

00:02:34.457 --> 00:02:34.637
naar

00:02:34.637 --> 00:02:35.012
een

00:02:35.012 --> 00:02:35.386
individueler

00:02:35.386 --> 00:02:35.616
stelsel

00:02:35.616 --> 00:02:36.086
moeten.

00:02:36.086 --> 00:02:36.356
Dat

00:02:36.356 --> 00:02:36.446
de

00:02:36.446 --> 00:02:37.315
solidariteit

00:02:37.315 --> 00:02:38.084
afneemt.

00:02:38.084 --> 00:02:38.344
Dat

00:02:38.344 --> 00:02:38.354
zou

00:02:38.354 --> 00:02:38.434
ik

00:02:38.434 --> 00:02:38.654
zonde

00:02:38.654 --> 00:02:39.084
vinden.

00:02:39.084 --> 00:02:39.353
Ik

00:02:39.353 --> 00:02:39.613
geloof

00:02:39.613 --> 00:02:39.803
wel

00:02:39.803 --> 00:02:39.943
in

00:02:39.943 --> 00:02:40.143
een

00:02:40.143 --> 00:02:41.482
basisvoorziening

00:02:41.482 --> 00:02:41.562
voor

00:02:41.562 --> 00:02:42.351
iedereen.

00:02:42.351 --> 00:02:42.361
Maar

00:02:42.361 --> 00:02:42.571
het

00:02:42.571 --> 00:02:42.871
moet

00:02:42.871 --> 00:02:43.061
wel

00:02:43.061 --> 00:02:43.650
eerlijk

00:02:43.650 --> 00:02:44.080
zijn.

00:02:44.080 --> 00:02:44.600
Misschien

00:02:44.600 --> 00:02:44.949
moeten

00:02:44.949 --> 00:02:45.059
we

00:02:45.059 --> 00:02:45.579
vermogen

00:02:45.579 --> 00:02:45.969
zwaarder

00:02:45.969 --> 00:02:46.538
belasten

00:02:46.538 --> 00:02:46.558
in

00:02:46.558 --> 00:02:46.878
plaats

00:02:46.878 --> 00:02:47.398
van

00:02:47.398 --> 00:02:47.408
alleen

00:02:47.408 --> 00:02:48.077
arbeid.

00:02:48.077 --> 00:02:48.497
Poeh,

00:02:48.497 --> 00:02:48.637
nu

00:02:48.637 --> 00:02:48.777
ga

00:02:48.777 --> 00:02:48.917
je

00:02:48.917 --> 00:02:49.056
de

00:02:49.056 --> 00:02:49.646
politiek

00:02:49.646 --> 00:02:50.076
in.

00:02:50.076 --> 00:02:50.346
Maar

00:02:50.346 --> 00:02:50.376
je

00:02:50.376 --> 00:02:50.575
hebt

00:02:50.575 --> 00:02:50.725
een

00:02:50.725 --> 00:02:51.075
punt.

00:02:51.075 --> 00:02:51.345
Er

00:02:51.345 --> 00:02:51.375
moet

00:02:51.375 --> 00:02:51.575
iets

00:02:51.575 --> 00:02:52.074
veranderen

00:02:52.074 --> 00:02:52.164
om

00:02:52.164 --> 00:02:52.304
het

00:02:52.304 --> 00:02:52.724
houdbaar

00:02:52.724 --> 00:02:52.824
te

00:02:52.824 --> 00:02:53.124
houden

00:02:53.124 --> 00:02:53.523
voor

00:02:53.523 --> 00:02:53.553
onze

00:02:53.553 --> 00:02:54.373
generatie

00:02:54.373 --> 00:02:54.393
en

00:02:54.393 --> 00:02:55.132
die

00:02:55.132 --> 00:02:55.372
na

00:02:55.372 --> 00:02:56.071
ons.

00:02:56.071 --> 00:02:57.071
Inderdaad.

00:02:57.071 --> 00:02:57.121
We

00:02:57.121 --> 00:02:57.281
willen

00:02:57.281 --> 00:02:57.361
ook

00:02:57.361 --> 00:02:57.440
nog

00:02:57.440 --> 00:02:57.640
een

00:02:57.640 --> 00:02:57.680
beetje

00:02:57.680 --> 00:02:57.840
kunnen

00:02:57.840 --> 00:02:58.070
genieten

00:02:58.070 --> 00:02:58.550
als

00:02:58.550 --> 00:02:58.590
we

00:02:58.590 --> 00:02:58.879
oud

00:02:58.879 --> 00:02:59.099
en

00:02:59.099 --> 00:02:59.619
grijs

00:02:59.619 --> 00:03:00.069
zijn.

00:03:00.069 --> 00:03:00.338
En

00:03:00.338 --> 00:03:00.458
niet

00:03:00.458 --> 00:03:00.858
alleen

00:03:00.858 --> 00:03:01.108
maar

00:03:01.108 --> 00:03:01.617
grijs

00:03:01.617 --> 00:03:01.977
werken.

00:03:01.977 --> 00:03:02.337
Haha,

00:03:02.337 --> 00:03:02.857
'grijs

00:03:02.857 --> 00:03:03.376
werken'.

00:03:03.376 --> 00:03:03.496
Die

00:03:03.376 --> 00:03:03.636
is

00:03:03.636 --> 00:03:03.858
goed.

00:03:03.858 --> 00:03:04.081
Laten

00:03:04.081 --> 00:03:04.303
we

00:03:04.303 --> 00:03:04.525
het

00:03:04.525 --> 00:03:05.065
hopen.

00:03:05.065 --> 00:03:05.335
Dat

00:03:05.335 --> 00:03:05.755
woord

00:03:05.755 --> 00:03:07.064
'omslagstelsel',

00:03:07.064 --> 00:03:07.463
dat

00:03:07.463 --> 00:03:07.543
vind

00:03:07.543 --> 00:03:07.573
ik

00:03:07.573 --> 00:03:07.783
zo'n

00:03:07.783 --> 00:03:08.383
typisch

00:03:08.383 --> 00:03:08.742
Nederlands,

00:03:08.742 --> 00:03:09.542
bureaucratisch

00:03:09.542 --> 00:03:10.301
woord.

00:03:10.301 --> 00:03:10.331
Het

00:03:10.331 --> 00:03:10.761
klinkt

00:03:10.761 --> 00:03:10.921
zo...

00:03:10.921 --> 00:03:12.060
ingewikkeld.

00:03:12.060 --> 00:03:12.610
Haha,

00:03:12.610 --> 00:03:12.969
ja.

00:03:12.969 --> 00:03:13.619
Maar

00:03:13.619 --> 00:03:13.629
het

00:03:13.629 --> 00:03:13.989
idee

00:03:13.989 --> 00:03:14.448
is

00:03:14.448 --> 00:03:15.058
simpel:

00:03:15.058 --> 00:03:15.328
de

00:03:15.328 --> 00:03:15.617
premie

00:03:15.617 --> 00:03:15.847
die

00:03:15.847 --> 00:03:15.967
ik

00:03:15.967 --> 00:03:16.107
nu

00:03:16.107 --> 00:03:16.627
betaal,

00:03:16.627 --> 00:03:16.877
wordt

00:03:16.877 --> 00:03:17.436
meteen

00:03:17.436 --> 00:03:18.036
'omgeslagen'

00:03:18.036 --> 00:03:18.375
en

00:03:18.375 --> 00:03:18.705
gebruikt

00:03:18.705 --> 00:03:18.965
voor

00:03:18.965 --> 00:03:19.095
de

00:03:19.095 --> 00:03:19.355
AOW

00:03:19.355 --> 00:03:19.485
van

00:03:19.485 --> 00:03:19.615
je

00:03:19.615 --> 00:03:20.054
oma.

00:03:20.054 --> 00:03:20.634
Oké,

00:03:20.634 --> 00:03:20.934
dat

00:03:20.934 --> 00:03:21.133
is

00:03:21.133 --> 00:03:22.053
helder.

00:03:22.053 --> 00:03:22.323
En

00:03:22.323 --> 00:03:22.842
'vergrijzing'

00:03:22.842 --> 00:03:23.122
klinkt

00:03:23.122 --> 00:03:23.282
ook

00:03:23.282 --> 00:03:23.622
zo

00:03:23.622 --> 00:03:24.531
dramatisch.

00:03:24.531 --> 00:03:24.621
Alsof

00:03:24.621 --> 00:03:24.851
het

00:03:24.851 --> 00:03:25.370
hele

00:03:25.370 --> 00:03:25.530
land

00:03:25.530 --> 00:03:26.260
grijs

00:03:26.260 --> 00:03:26.350
haar

00:03:26.350 --> 00:03:27.049
krijgt.

00:03:27.049 --> 00:03:27.499
Eigenlijk

00:03:27.499 --> 00:03:27.649
wel,

00:03:27.649 --> 00:03:27.849
ja.

00:03:27.849 --> 00:03:27.999
Het

00:03:27.999 --> 00:03:28.618
beschrijft

00:03:28.618 --> 00:03:28.648
het

00:03:28.648 --> 00:03:29.048
probleem

00:03:29.048 --> 00:03:29.398
wel

00:03:29.398 --> 00:03:29.497
heel

00:03:29.497 --> 00:03:30.047
beeldend.

00:03:30.047 --> 00:03:30.317
Dus,

00:03:30.317 --> 00:03:30.447
we

00:03:30.447 --> 00:03:30.916
hebben

00:03:30.916 --> 00:03:31.396
het

00:03:31.396 --> 00:03:31.616
gehad

00:03:31.616 --> 00:03:31.866
over

00:03:31.866 --> 00:03:32.096
die

00:03:32.096 --> 00:03:32.575
steeds

00:03:32.575 --> 00:03:33.025
hogere

00:03:33.025 --> 00:03:34.044
AOW-leeftijd,

00:03:34.044 --> 00:03:34.314
de

00:03:34.314 --> 00:03:34.834
vergrijzing

00:03:34.834 --> 00:03:34.954
die

00:03:34.954 --> 00:03:35.293
daar

00:03:35.293 --> 00:03:35.413
de

00:03:35.293 --> 00:03:35.673
oorzaak

00:03:35.673 --> 00:03:35.843
van

00:03:35.843 --> 00:03:36.043
is,

00:03:36.043 --> 00:03:36.323
en

00:03:36.323 --> 00:03:36.522
de

00:03:36.522 --> 00:03:37.362
solidariteit

00:03:37.362 --> 00:03:37.372
die

00:03:37.372 --> 00:03:37.582
een

00:03:37.582 --> 00:03:38.341
beetje

00:03:38.341 --> 00:03:38.351
onder

00:03:38.351 --> 00:03:38.691
druk

00:03:38.691 --> 00:03:39.041
staat.

00:03:39.041 --> 00:03:39.310
En

00:03:39.310 --> 00:03:39.340
over

00:03:39.340 --> 00:03:39.490
het

00:03:39.490 --> 00:03:39.830
belang

00:03:39.830 --> 00:03:40.070
van

00:03:40.070 --> 00:03:40.310
zelf

00:03:40.310 --> 00:03:40.550
sparen

00:03:40.550 --> 00:03:40.610
om

00:03:40.610 --> 00:03:40.934
een

00:03:40.934 --> 00:03:41.259
pensioengat

00:03:41.259 --> 00:03:41.449
te

00:03:41.449 --> 00:03:42.038
voorkomen.

00:03:42.038 --> 00:03:42.308
Best

00:03:42.308 --> 00:03:42.458
een

00:03:42.458 --> 00:03:42.878
serieus

00:03:42.878 --> 00:03:43.607
gesprek,

00:03:43.607 --> 00:03:44.037
eigenlijk.

00:03:44.037 --> 00:03:45.036
Zeker.

00:03:45.036 --> 00:03:45.306
Nou,

00:03:45.306 --> 00:03:45.356
ik

00:03:45.356 --> 00:03:45.446
ga

00:03:45.446 --> 00:03:45.636
maar

00:03:45.636 --> 00:03:45.826
eens

00:03:45.826 --> 00:03:46.215
mijn

00:03:46.215 --> 00:03:46.605
pensioen-app

00:03:46.605 --> 00:03:47.035
checken.

00:03:47.035 --> 00:03:47.285
Tot

00:03:47.285 --> 00:03:47.305
de

00:03:47.305 --> 00:03:47.674
volgende

00:03:47.674 --> 00:03:48.034
keer!

00:03:48.034 --> 00:03:48.734
Haha,

00:03:48.734 --> 00:03:49.603
goed

00:03:49.603 --> 00:03:50.033
plan.

00:03:50.033 --> 00:03:50.303
Tot

00:03:50.303 --> 00:03:51.032
horens!