Happily Ever After === Katie Marinello: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to Carried Far, far Away, a podcast where we are watching and reading everything Carrie Fisher did in her shirt, life and story career. I'm Katie Marine, Claire Fisher: I'm Claire Fisher, Katie Marinello: and today we are watching Claire Fisher: happily ever after, or maybe Molly and the Skywalkers, it was released under two different Katie Marinello: or Molly in the Skywalks Colon Happily Ever After. Claire Fisher: As best I can tell, it was happily ever after on original airing. But Molly and the Skywalks, when it was released on VHS, Katie Marinello: Interesting. Because then there's a second Molly in the Skywalks film Claire Fisher: yeah. And Katie Marinello: that Claire Fisher: together on the, Katie Marinello: Got it. Claire Fisher: video release, so that's why they were Katie Marinello: so what's going on in your life, Claire? Before we get started, Claire Fisher: Oh, you know, I'm working on reading and watching everything that's up for Hugo Award this year. Katie Marinello: cannot believe the amount of work you're doing for that. That is so cool. Claire Fisher: The Philadelphia Science Fiction Society was kind enough to invite me to be on their Hugo Review panel where we're gonna get together on, July [00:01:00] 18th and, basically say what we think should win, before the actual results , are announced a few weeks after that. Katie Marinello: Yeah. That's so cool. I've been getting text updates from you on what's doing well in your estimation? Claire Fisher: so much stuff. Um, what's new in your life, Katie? Katie Marinello: my goodness. So we're recording this, I don't know, a month after we said we were going to, more or less because well, a couple of reasons. First, there's some reason I couldn't do it the week we were supposed to and that we were gonna do it on Monday. And then I don't remember why we had to cancel that Monday, but we decided we were gonna do it when I came back from visiting you. So I was in your house and we weren't able to find a time to sit down and record because I was back and forth to New York City a lot. And then, we were gonna record this past Sunday and I went to a pride event and the sun is homophobic. Claire Fisher: The sun is homophobic. Do [00:02:00] tell, what did the sun do to you, Katie? Katie Marinello: I got heat stroke and I gotta tell you as far as what you're supposed to do to prevent that. I really thought I had it covered. I was drinking constantly. We were in the shade. I didn't like. Wander around to the other booths or anything like that. , And I was really worried about getting sunburn because as you know, I have a tendency to get sunburn when like the wind blows the wrong direction. So I was like really, focused on sunblock and staying in the shade and covering up and all that good stuff. And I forgot to focus on the, apparently you can get really sick from the sun. That is the sickest I think I've ever been. Like, I've had COVID twice. When I had COVID, I could at least sit at my computer and look at stuff, even if I wasn't working. I didn't open my computer at all on Monday. I could barely look at my phone. I only looked at my phone to text you basically. So, PSA everyone, [00:03:00] well, Claire, you're the former ENT. What are you supposed to do in order to avoid, , getting sun sickness? Claire Fisher: Well, I'm glad you asked Katie. It's very important if you're going to be in the heat and sweating as you might, if you are outdoors on a 90 degree day, that you balance your salts. It's not just about drinking water to stay hydrated Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: if you are sweating out salt plus water, drinking, just water pulls more salt out of your tissues and can make you extremely sick. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: that's why electrolyte sports drinks are manufactured and marketed the way that they are, or as we learned in a pinch Katie Marinello: Pickle Juice. Claire Fisher: it pains us to admit that this, because it involves admitting that our grandmother was right about something, Katie Marinello: Our grandmother always write about a lot, but this feels like it should be an , old wives tale and it's not. Claire Fisher: many healthcare old wives Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: treat my husband's nosebleeds by rubbing , a nickel down his back.[00:04:00] Katie Marinello: We don't know. Maybe it works. Claire Fisher: Okay, well, it turns out pickle Katie Marinello: Pickle juice does work. Claire Fisher: it can be a good substitute for an electrolyte drink in an emergency. Like for example, if your older sister texts you, Hey, I was hot all day and now I'm shivering uncontrollably. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: you, I, what I learned from Claire, who is a former EMT, my instinct to go run a hot bath and get under the heated blanket is literally the opposite of what you're supposed to do. Claire Fisher: that would've killed you. Katie Marinello: Yeah. So glad we talked before I did all that. But I'm a hundred percent now. I have my Gatorade stash ready to go in case of further emergency or also just because it is hot. Claire Fisher: it is really hot outside. So people, I mean, not to turn this whole thing into some sort of a extended PSA, but we mean it when we say, please check on your elderly neighbors or elderly relatives. Please keep track of your own health. If you're gonna be out in the sun or at least out [00:05:00] in the heat, which we understand is unavoidable. Like you actually need to be hydrating in a way that will not cause you a salt imbalance. You Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: very, very sick from those. Um, Katie Marinello: And a couple of other things. Indoor air conditioned pride events. I just really think as a community, Claire Fisher: I mean, we all love a parade. Katie Marinello: who doesn't love a parade, but this wasn't even a parade. It was an outdoor like bender event. Indoor air conditioned pride, events for the wind. I think pride next year, pride bowling. I. Claire Fisher: June is getting hotter on average from year to year. And so if we wanna continue having good, healthy pride months with a population of L-G-B-T-Q folks who are varied in their ages and medical statuses, we may have to introduce air conditioning to the equation. Katie Marinello: I am telling you I understand that it's like limiting because you can't have as many people. But anyway, Claire Fisher: pride Beach days, Katie Marinello: pride Beach days. [00:06:00] Woo. Claire Fisher: in the ocean. Katie Marinello: Yes. So speaking of extended PSAs, Claire Fisher: Yes. Katie Marinello: It actually works really well with this week's movie, I think. Claire Fisher: All right. Are you ready for a 54 second summary? Katie Marinello: Oh my god. I am so ready. Claire Fisher: Carrie plays Alice Conway, A woman in an unhappy marriage with an imaginative 9-year-old daughter in Molly when her husband Carl asks for a divorce. Alice and Carl try to break the news to Molly gently. Molly, however, takes it hard and falls into a depression. Molly eventually comes to accept the situation with help from her friend club, the Skywalkers, her teacher, her school counselor, and her loyal dog ribbon. In the end, Carl makes it to Molly's school play, finally fulfilling his promise to be an involved father while Alice and Carl navigate an amicable custody swap. The final reveal is that this is all being narrated by Molly, who has grown up happily married and telling the story to her own daughter. Katie Marinello: Wow. Okay. Very good. So, Claire, um, Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: how and why this movie, Claire Fisher: Yes.[00:07:00] Katie Marinello: and why I should say upfront? I actually didn't hate it. I just think it's actually really cute. It's just like, yeah, why, how, Claire Fisher: Um, Katie Marinello: come the internet has all but forgotten this? Claire Fisher: this was directed by Bill Melendez, who's more famous for creating the Charlie Brown Christmas special and other various peanuts adaptations. Katie Marinello: Yeah, I saw something that said that this was supposed to be like the grownup peanuts kind of thing. Claire Fisher: uh, yeah, I mean, it was supposed to be dealing with some real world kid issues. Peanuts like to do a lot through allegory, which is great, but this was more of a here's how to cope with Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: , Do you want me to just go over the times briefly and like why this was necessary as a PSA? Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: Okay. So for Katie Marinello: I'm assuming no fault divorce has something to do with it. Claire Fisher: does. This is a made for TV movie that aired October 20th, 1985. and by the way, I assemble, I [00:08:00] for this, had to look at some statistics that were assembled by Bowling Green State University. Katie Marinello: Thank you. Bowling Green State University. Claire Fisher: The US divorce rate reached its peak of 22.6 divorces per 1000 married women in 1980. Katie Marinello: Okay? Claire Fisher: It has since gone down to 14.6 divorces per 1000 married women. They counted by married women in those days because it was easier because women traditionally changed their names when married and changed 'em back when divorced. Katie Marinello: Mm. Claire Fisher: to track on the census who was getting Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: For a little history, US divorce laws were pretty much always more liberal than the laws in most European countries, Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: uh, Reno, Nevada was the divorce capital of the world Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: however, Katie Marinello: Get married in Vegas. Get divorced in Reno. Claire Fisher: Exactly. Yeah. This comes up in the Shawshank Redemption where he says to, he's convicted of murder. 'cause he said to his wife, I'll see you in hell before I see you in Reno Katie Marinello: Mm Claire Fisher: after she was gonna leave him. Katie Marinello: mm Claire Fisher: That came up actually because Nevada, the, [00:09:00] this was Nevada's big innovation. Are you Katie Marinello: mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: It started taking your word for it, that your spouse had done something to deserve it. Katie Marinello: Whoa. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: So you didn't have to prove that he was a jerk or that she was cheating or that this, that or the other thing. Claire Fisher: If, if you testified to those facts, your testimony would be accepted as proof. Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: This does go to show though you did have to prove fault and you had to prove that your filing spouse was innocent, Katie Marinello: Mm. Claire Fisher: he's a jerk. It had to be I'm a good wife and he's still a Katie Marinello: So you mean prior to Nevada and then eventually the rest of the country doing no fault divorce, you had to prove Claire Fisher: well, no, no, no. So Nevada still required you to prove that, but your proof was testifying to it. Katie Marinello: Oh, okay. So all 50 states required you to prove that, but Nevada accepted your word for it. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: Okay? Claire Fisher: In 1969, California became the first US state to come up with the concept of no-fault divorce law. In Katie Marinello: Mm. Claire Fisher: a divorce, you could file for a divorce.[00:10:00] Katie Marinello: That's probably because of all the many divorces that were happening there during the golden age of Hollywood. Claire Fisher: of which carrie's mother and father had been several actually. Katie Marinello: yes. Claire Fisher: looked this up when this was made. Uh. Debbie Reynolds had just gotten married for the third time. Katie Marinello: Oh, mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: the mother in this movie. Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: no Katie Marinello: So she was familiar. Yeah. Claire Fisher: why she was familiar with these conversations. Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: Okay. So the majority of states did create a no fault divorce option in the 1970s, but the last holdout, which was New York State, didn't create a no fault option until, would you care to guess the year Katie Marinello: Uh, 2014. Claire Fisher: 2010 Katie Marinello: Okay. Wow. New York. Claire Fisher: New York? You had to, you still had to have a reason. In New York, though, they had broadened the range of reasons Until the 1980s, you could only get a divorce in New York State if you could prove adultery, Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm.[00:11:00] Claire Fisher: lawyers would actually offer a package where you could hire a sex worker then have them interrupt and have them take pictures of you with the sex worker. If you and your spouse both wanted to get a divorce, you Katie Marinello: Have you seen the, um, the scene? I've never watched The Marvelous Miss Maisel, but there's a scene that keeps popping up that's like when they, when she and her husband try to go in and get a divorce Claire Fisher: Hmm. Well, and , our great-great grandparents, , although they had been separated for like 25 years, didn't get a divorce until the rules around how to get a divorce were. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: slightly. anyway, divorces became simpler to get in the 1970s, they also became more popular. And, , at the same time, custody laws began to change to be more gender neutral. , Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: mothers were usually granted default Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: But then it became a shared custody became the standard. And, you know, with the whole weekend, father trope. And then, you know, now the goal is [00:12:00] 50 50 whenever practical, of Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: So interestingly, among couples with children, in 19 75, 70 1% of divorce cases were filed by the wife, by 19 88, 60 5% were being filed by the wife. So at the time this movie was made, it was actually less common for a husband to request a divorce, which is interesting. In this movie, it stated that it's Carl's idea. In other words, this movie was made at a time where more American couples than ever before, since we're getting divorced, Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: than ever before, we're splitting time between their parents' households. And this represented a massive change from just like 15 years Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: it was huge generational shift. And so parents who were going through divorces were navigating these conversations, never having seen it happen to anyone they knew. Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: used to be rare, right? Katie Marinello: Where, what was it that dad wasn't, was dad not allowed to watch? I Love Lucy. 'cause they got divorced. Claire Fisher: uh, I don't remember. I [00:13:00] know that dad had like a first grade classmate whose parents weren't together and it became like a, Katie Marinello: Yeah, Claire Fisher: so it was very much not talked about, not common. And it, that's weird to think about. 'cause of course, you know, you and I grew up in. know, the aftermath of this Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: divorce, right? And we had friends whose parents were split up and parents who had never been together and parents who co-parented, you know, for various reasons. And like, it was not really seen as a horrible at Katie Marinello: Right? Claire Fisher: community, Katie Marinello: more than I did. I was just thinking about that. I remember when the first like single mom. Was in my class and that was like a big deal But yeah, obviously, we've all now since met plenty of divorced. I mean, some of my friends have already been divorced 'cause I'm in my late thirties, mid to late thirties. Yeah. Claire Fisher: so these, when they came this movie, and then it has a sequel, which is Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: to Love Me Katie Marinello: Yeah, I was really hoping that that was a [00:14:00] pride movie, but no, it's about the stepfather. Claire Fisher: it's about getting a stepfather. Yeah. So they would've been pretty like groundbreaking for the time Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: about divorce on TV was, , something that was evolving. And especially how to talk to children about divorce. Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: when you think about like the classic divorce movie was the parent trap and the happy ending is that these people who hated each other so much, they didn't speak for 14 Katie Marinello: They split up their children. Claire Fisher: get back together. That's the happy ending. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: so, to treat it's like to be a child of divorced parents without the artificially contrived, happy ending, Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: was interesting and groundbreaking in 1985. Their only home video release was in 1998 though, and it's never been rerun and it's never been rereleased. Katie Marinello: So interesting. And Claire Fisher: listed on the Lost Media Katie Marinello: yeah, I saw that. Claire Fisher: we learned, Katie Marinello: Yes. Okay. So on the was Las Media Wiki, I [00:15:00] saw, yesterday when I was doing research that it had been on YouTube and then had been taken down and then there was like an addendum that said so and so has re-uploaded it, and that's how you and I watched it. Then today I went to rewatch it because it's been three weeks since I saw it. And it had disappeared from YouTube. So somebody's still out there holding that copyright despite the fact that they're not making any money off of it. It's not streaming anywhere. Claire Fisher: Let me just say fair use supplies. Katie Marinello: fair use, fair use, fair use. Claire Fisher: Yeah, and I mean this is kind of obscure,, but even going by the standards of Carrie's career Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: some obscure things so far. Katie Marinello: What's sad is most of the ones that I have really enjoyed were ones that we found on YouTube that have never gotten like a wide release. Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: The other one I'm thinking of is Leave The Yesterday Behind, which I really, really enjoyed and isn't streaming anywhere. Claire Fisher: Right, Katie Marinello: So all that said, the fact that it got as far as we can tell, no [00:16:00] publicity, right? No. Wide release didn't even get put on VHS until. 10 years after it came out, right, or 12 years after it came out. Um, the cast Claire Fisher: The cast is Katie Marinello: just like mind boggling. So , let's go through this real quick. I'm not gonna do too much because these are big names, as they say. Claire Fisher: All right. Katie Marinello: So it's narrated by Carol freaking Burnett, Carol Burnett. Had breakout success, uh, once upon Annette Mattress, on Broadway. And then she made her television room debut for the next three years, and got her first Emmy award in 1962. She's best known for the Carol Burnett Show, an hour long variety show. She was the first woman to host a variety show. And honestly, as I wrote that down, I was like, and how many have there really been? Because yeah. It's interesting to me that I've never seen a full episode of the Carol Burnett Show, have you? Claire Fisher: Yeah, [00:17:00] sometimes Katie Marinello: feel like it, those skits are still like a part of the culture, kind of not in like a, like you, you don't necessarily clipse 'em all the way. But the Carol Burnett show is it's got this lasting power and I was supposed to do a stage version of one of them back in, college, but it got canceled. She has been honored with the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the Mark Twain Prize for American Humor, screen Actors Guild Life Time Achievement Award. She's been married three times and had three kids. One of them whose name was also Carrie, unfortunately died and also had drug issues. She married her third husband in 2001, and he is 23 years younger than her. So feminism. Claire Fisher: well we've seen Warren Beatty go through that. Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: Carol Burnett. Katie Marinello: Carl Conway, Molly's father. So mother, Carrie Fisher, father Henry Winkler. Like, Claire Fisher: grandpa. Katie Marinello: mean, what a dream pairing of parents. Right.[00:18:00] Claire Fisher: know. Katie Marinello: Claire and I went through a significant happy days phase when we were younger, Claire Fisher: who didn't. Katie Marinello: right. Everybody does. So that was Henry Winkler's, breakout role obviously. So that was from 1974 to 1984. Then it was really hard for him to get roles after that. So what do you do when you can't get acting roles? He became a producer. And what did he produce? Claire Claire Fisher: MacGyver Katie Marinello: MacGyver, Claire's favorite show. Shout out to making Fun of MacGyver, a podcast that has featured Claire numerous times. Claire Fisher: and even got me to go to Vancouver. Katie Marinello: Yes. So he helped develop that. He was the executive producer. He also directed, um, a couple of movies, memories of me and Cop and a Half. And then in the nineties he really had a renaissance. He frequently collaborated with Adam Sandler. And John Ritter, which I feel like is a ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Third time we've mentioned John Ritter. Claire Fisher: Three is company Katie Marinello: Woo. And then he was, he got some pretty [00:19:00] impactful, TV roles. You may remember him on Arrested Development. He was great on Arrested Development Parks and Rec. And Barry most recently, which I think is either still on or just ended not that long ago. Claire Fisher: All Katie Marinello: Among his many awards, he's won three Emmys, two Golden Globes, and two Critics Choice Awards. All right. And then these characters barely even appear. George Johnson and Rose Johnson. I had to ask Claire to rush through my memory on who they were. And we'll get to them, but they play , the parents of one of. Molly's friends, and they're played by Danny DeVito and Ray Pearlman, who are not only dream parents, but are impact parents. Danny DeVito gained prominence for his portrayal of, Lou De Palma in Taxi from 1978 to 1983, which won him a Golden Globe Aboard and an Emmy Award. He's made so many movies. One Flew Where the Cocos [00:20:00] Nest Terms of Endearment, twins. The War of the Roses, Batman Returns, Matilda Hercules, the Lorax. And since 2006, he's been on, it's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. A show that I always forget is still on. Um, and I was gonna s Claire Fisher: an episode. Katie Marinello: yeah, me neither. I was going to say that he's married to Ray Perman, but apparently doing research, I found out that no, they did not get divorced, but they did separate in 2012. Then they got back together and separated again in 2017. , In 2019, Perman was on Watch what Happens Live. Hey, my other favorite, , series comes up, you know, anything Bravo. And she told Andy Cohen that she and DeVito ha are closer friends, separated than they were in their final years as a couple and have no interest in filing for divorce. So technically they've been married since 1982. Ray Pearlman, obviously best known for playing the head waitress Carla in the sitcom. [00:21:00] Cheers. She was nominated as outstanding supporting actress in a comedy every year she was on the show except for 1992. What happened in 1992? And she won four times. She's also appeared in films. Probably the one that is most familiar to us as kids is Matilda. And then of course, most recently. Barbie, , which is my comfort movie now. Not that I have time to watch it because I'm always watching Carrie Fisher movies. And then the only other person I felt we should probably mention was, Molly,, who was played by Cassandra Kitz. She, this is her only credit and I could find absolutely nothing else about her. She was nominated for a young artist award as outstanding young actress animation voiceover. I think she's very good. So I hope she's living a fabulous life away from the hustle and bustle of Hollywood. Claire Fisher: I guess this wasn't really what she wanted to do with her life. Katie Marinello: Googled her and I found an [00:22:00] artist with the name, but I had no way of knowing if that was Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: the same person, Claire Fisher: Well, bill Melendez famously, like for the Charlie Brown actors insisted on , kids should be voiced by kids. Katie Marinello: like actually children. Yeah. Claire Fisher: So, you know, you hire a kid for a voiceover, you don't know what they wanna be when they grow up. Right? Katie Marinello: Which is why Sally always sounds like she's actually just repeating what somebody says in the peanut specials. Claire Fisher: Feeding her her all I want is what I have coming to me. All I want is my fair share. Claire Fisher: right, so let's go through the plot. Katie Marinello: So we open on a very extended, kind of circus act. Claire Fisher: Which turns out to all be a dream. Katie Marinello: yes. But what's she doing? She's like on a tightrope, and then she's like falling from the tape rope, and then Claire Fisher: She wakes up Katie Marinello: she wakes, Claire Fisher: out of bed. Katie Marinello: yeah. She falls outta bed. Claire Fisher: She wakes up to her mother hollering at her to get out of bed Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: and when she gets down the stairs to eat Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: father is already saying to her mother, if she got to bed earlier, you wouldn't have this trouble every morning. I said if she, I heard [00:23:00] what you said. Claire Fisher: And then, her parents are sniping at each other over the breakfast table , 'cause her father missed parents night at school. And it's becomes immediately clear that the problem here is that the Katie Marinello: All is not well. Yeah. Claire Fisher: the Katie Marinello: Well, yes, but she's not really noticing because she is very focused on the school play. Claire Fisher: Tryouts are today. Katie Marinello: Tryouts are today for the school play, so, Claire Fisher: she gets on the bus and they introduce all of her friends. I love this It was Mary O'Connell and Tommy Johnson and Darlene Cushy Tani and Joy Fabrizio and Woody Coleman and what's his name with the glasses. Claire Fisher: And what's his name with the glasses? Katie Marinello: the glasses. Claire Fisher: Who becomes my favorite character? Katie Marinello: By far. What's the name of the glasses for sure. Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: Um, does she say that they're the skywalkers yet? Claire Fisher: No, not yet. They just are setting the scene. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: [00:24:00] kid. She's doing well in school. She knows that the teacher doesn't call on her if she always has her hand up first. So she like kind of pretends like she's not paying attention. You know, the way you didn't grade Katie Marinello: Right? She is, yeah. She's a little extra, but she is definitely well liked. Claire Fisher: Yeah. And seemingly well adjusted. Right? Loves her dog, loves her parents, loves the school play. , Wanted them to do streetcar instead of Cinderella. And then Katie Marinello: That's, that was very funny. Claire Fisher: turns out, she means the streetcar that could, not a streetcar named desire. So that day they find out that the tryouts are gonna consist of being measured because the Katie Marinello: Oh, right. So it's not about, Claire Fisher: year's costumes. Katie Marinello: So it's literally who fits in the costume gets the part, and she's very sad about this because she really wanted. To be Cinderella. And to be fair, that is a ridiculous way to do it. Claire Fisher: well, you know, Katie Marinello: I mean, listen, I've been an elementary school teacher with no time and no resources, but I don't [00:25:00] know, I would be mad too, Claire Fisher: you've also directed elementary school. Tivity plays Katie Marinello: and I always made the costumes work, no matter who was playing the part. Claire Fisher: that's true. that donkey did start to look a little thread bear after the Katie Marinello: I don't know what you're talking about. Claire Fisher: The, when she goes home and tries to complain to her mother, her mom is obviously just checked out Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: like on the verge of tears, and the next morning parents say, after school today, we're gonna go out to dinner and we're gonna go to out for pizza. You can have any pizza topping you want. She says, Ooh, can I have a, a split too? And they say, yeah, absolutely. A banana split. And she immediately, as she's walking to the school bus, says to the dog, didn't that sound gorpy to you? Did you hear that? Not one. No, not even for the banana malt. Something is really gorpy. Katie Marinello: Py. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: [00:26:00] Then she's goes to the clubhouse and tells them about how her parents wanna talk to her, and they're like, uhoh, you know what this means? You're getting a baby sibling. Claire Fisher: This is where we find out that they are, these friends call themselves the Skywalkers Straight. We win the race to outer space and have a lot of fun. Look Easter West, but we're the best in all sand done to celebrate. It's really great to know you. Number one sky walker's rule. Hey for one for all and all for one. We'll set a loyal crew. When times are rough and things are tough, we'll always see you through. 'cause if you always stick with us, we'll always stick with you. Skywalk rule. Hey. Katie Marinello: No explanation as to why. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Um, no explanation as to why. , And they get in and out of their clubhouse by climbing onto a tire swing and shouting, beam me up and their friends haul them up. Katie Marinello: So maybe some explanation why. Claire Fisher: well, okay. [00:27:00] I mean, it was the eighties. What were the coolest sci-fi franchises? Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: Um, anyway. Katie Marinello: your mom's Carrie Fisher, Claire Fisher: Right. Exactly. Your mom and dad were extra nice to you and they're taking you to dinner, and I can have whatever I want to eat. How does that sound to you? Goby? Oh, Molly, what? The same thing happened to me when I was just a little kid. What happened? He did what? Yep. I gotta tell you, Molly, they're gonna buy a baby. Claire Fisher: So, I don't know, Katie, would you like to share the trauma of how our parents broke the news to you, that you were getting a baby Katie Marinello: I have absolutely no recollection of this. Absolutely none. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: my first memory is, are you being born? So if there was trauma, it has been long buried. Um,[00:28:00] Claire Fisher: Where? I don't think Dad has completely forgotten your reaction though. Katie Marinello: I've heard stories of how I was after you were born, but I don't remember stories of how I reacted, so finding out you were coming Claire Fisher: You don't remember the knife drawer? Katie Marinello: No. That was after you were born? Claire Fisher: after I was born. Katie Marinello: Yeah. Uh, I absolutely tried to kill my baby dolls and walked around going, kill the baby. Kill the, but why would I do that when it, there was no baby. That was after you were born Claire Fisher: Anyway, so she goes to this pizza meeting with her parents She's like, I think this is a great idea, but where's it gonna Katie Marinello: Right. Where's it gonna sleep? Yeah. Claire Fisher: Only it turns out it's not that her mom is pregnant. Katie Marinello: Nope. Claire Fisher: Is that they're getting a divorce and try to do the whole, you know, we'd be happier if we weren't together. We can't be happy the way we are. We've tried to talk to counselors. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: we both really love Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: and mom are gonna stay in the house and dad's got an apartment with a [00:29:00] room set up just for you. You'll, you'll get to have both,\ Well, honey, daddy and I are just having a lot of trouble. We, uh, we just don't get along with each other anymore, so. I don't think I'm gonna like this. I try to understand. We don't do this on purpose, but we can't seem to stop hurting each other. Uh, so, uh, we just can't go on the way we are. Well, why don't you be different? Oh, baby. We've tried, we've, we really have. We've gone to counselors, you know, people that we talk to, and they've helped us all. They could. But, uh, we've decided, daddy and I, that we just can't live together anymore. I don't want to hear this. Molly, please try to understand it. We're getting a divorce. I knew I didn't want hear this, but for the, but we want you to know that we both, we love you very much. That's very [00:30:00] important. We love you so much. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. She's not having it. Claire Fisher: No, she, she immediately, it breaks her heart and she immediately thinks, tries to think of ways she can get them to stay together. Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: Right. And I mean, this is such a cliche, but first thing is she figures, well, maybe if I was a better kid, Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: as much, Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: conflicts over parenting style can be a contributor to a divorce. But you know, they go, they Katie Marinello: It's never the kid's fault. Claire Fisher: not about Katie Marinello: It's never the kid's fault. Claire Fisher: just us. Katie Marinello: You're right.​ Claire Fisher: Then the next idea she has is to try to save up and get her mom a present from her father. 'cause she saw a TV commercial where, a guy gave his wife an expensive present Katie Marinello: And this is when she gets the Skywalkers involved, right? So they're trying to find the money to buy. An expensive piece of jewelry. The Skywalkers did a pretty good job of raising money for a present. Mary [00:31:00] opened a small business. Joey went on a treasure hunt and all the upholstery in his house. He even looked behind the seats in his father's car, got quite a few nickles and dimes, plus an occasional something extra. Little dom walked around the block looking for money that people might dropped. Tommy Johnson collected empty aluminum cans sometimes even before they were empty, and what's his name with the glasses? Use the old table knife trick on his piggy bank. I didn't wanna go to college anyway. Katie Marinello: And so it's cute. They're all like, kind of operation, get, , Molly's parents back together is a group effort. And if it were a different movie, Claire Fisher: yeah. Katie Marinello: but it is not Claire Fisher: When her mother Katie Marinello: I, Claire Fisher: the present, she says, oh, that's a lovely present. And Molly says, who's it from Mommy? 'cause of course she signed, love Daddy. Katie Marinello: right, right.[00:32:00] Claire Fisher: And sees right there, she says, it's from you and it's beautiful, and I love it. And why don't you call your father Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Molly, I, I know it's hard for you to accept, but it's all decided. What does Daddy say about it? Why don't you ask him? Here's his phone number. You can call him anytime. Nine years with a daddy and I wind up with a phone number. Claire Fisher: And Molly says, nine years with a daddy. I end up with a phone number. Katie Marinello: God, I'd forgotten that line. Claire Fisher: Which just, ugh. Katie Marinello: Oh, Claire Fisher: I know, right? And, and you know, I, I appreciated that because this is hard on kids, even though we as adults know, Hey, it's not really about the kid. Katie Marinello: it is really about the kid. This is the thing. Claire Fisher: the Katie Marinello: The kids are the only ones in the situation who didn't make the decision, Claire Fisher: Right. Katie Marinello: haven't contributed to the situation, and tend to [00:33:00] be the ones that have to split the time. Claire Fisher: Right. Katie Marinello: And so, and I guess we should have said this up top. Neither of us has any firsthand experience with this, so we're not Claire Fisher: are, mean, they're sickeningly cute in how they're still Katie Marinello: Yeah, , they're really married, like, ugh. Married. Claire Fisher: Oh Katie Marinello: but anyway, so yeah, so it is, it's a trauma and I think because you and I grew up a decade after this it was kind of just like, in media at least, it was kind of just like, oh yeah, then they get divorced like on TV shows that used to drive me crazy that when they wanted to keep the main couple, you know, the couple, everybody's root for apart and one of them will get married and you know, they're gonna get divorced. And it was just treated as a plot device and. Yeah, it's a big deal when you have kids. It is, you know, it is a trauma, obviously it's a different kind of trauma for different kids and blah, blah, blah. Depends on how old they're, but yeah, Claire Fisher: on the severity of the unhappiness that [00:34:00] led up to it, shall we Katie Marinello: that too. Yeah, of course. Claire Fisher: obvious to the kids that their parents could not live together happily, then uh, presumably the separation introduces some peace to the situation. Katie Marinello: we've all met people as adults whose trauma is that their parents should have gotten divorced and didn't. Right. So, Claire Fisher: Oh yes. But that this is not that story. This is Katie Marinello: No. Claire Fisher: of how a 9-year-old copes, Katie Marinello: Yes. So she's very subdued in school. She's really changed her kind of outgoing personality. Claire Fisher: And they get their parts based on the clothing sizes and she has to be the fairy godmother Katie Marinello: Which is a great part, which. Claire Fisher: Yeah. But one of the kids says, my uncle says, there are no small parts, only small actors. And Molly says, if I were smaller, I'd be Cinderella. 'cause she Katie Marinello: Because she would fit. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: in the costume. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And but the problem with her being the fairy godmother is actually she's lost faith in the happily Katie Marinello: Right, right. There is no happily ever after. I can't say this. What? [00:35:00] I promise that you'll live happily ever after. That's just dumb. Why? Because it doesn't happen. That's why it just doesn't happen Claire Fisher: she won't say the line at the end, I promise you. And the prince will live happily ever after. She's refusing to say it and bursting into tears Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: right. Katie Marinello: And God bless these teachers. Claire Fisher: Yeah. I mean, teachers end up having to deal with all of the at home drama, right? Because it all comes through. Katie Marinello: Friday afternoons were so rough, man, because, you know, some of my kids would be going to the other parent or like there'd be some anxiety about being home for the weekend. Like it was definitely a thing, when I was a teacher. But yeah, so the teacher picks up on what's going on Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: and recommends that she see the school counselor. She Claire Fisher: she won't go. Katie Marinello: won't go. Claire Fisher: She just says, she promises the teacher, I'll give this part all I've got. And the teacher says, well, maybe just a little bit less than that. Which was the only moment where I was [00:36:00] like, Hey teacher, listen, because you and I were told so often that we were a little much Katie Marinello: a little much. Claire Fisher: was like, Katie Marinello: Okay. Claire Fisher: that Katie Marinello: But to be fair, we were, and so is Molly. Claire Fisher: Okay, fine. So the next thing that Molly decides to do is to try to run away from home, Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: She gets off the bus with her friend Tommy and tells him she's running away. And as they're, as she's walking to run away, she walks past his house and his parents are inside having an argument. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: A loud one? Katie Marinello: And we'd heard that we've heard them fight one, one time before this, I think. Claire Fisher: think so, Katie Marinello: When he was Claire Fisher: like, looking Katie Marinello: looking for the money. Yeah. Claire Fisher: Yeah. Um, so Katie Marinello: So this is Danny DeVito on Ray Perlin's. Big moment, I guess. Claire Fisher: yeah. Well Tommy decides he'll run away with her Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: the narrator knows, but it's more of a slow walk. 'cause these are two nine year olds. Katie Marinello: Right, Claire Fisher: Right. Katie Marinello: right, Claire Fisher: Eventually they, they like, don't know what to do next, so they just end up pacing around in front of the police Katie Marinello: right. They're waiting for the police to pick them up Claire Fisher: And [00:37:00] send them back to their parents. Katie Marinello: Officer's like, Hey, Tommy and Molly have walked by like three times. Should we check that out? Hey, that's the 10th time those kids have gone fast. Yeah. Hey, Tracy. Isn't that the little Conway kid? Yeah. We heard any calls about her? Not yet. Why don't you give the house a call before they start to worry? Claire Fisher: Yeah. So they call their parents and then the parents all come down and, Tommy's parents are like, Hey, we were only, we were just disagreeing. We weren't like mad and like, that's just how we communicate. Yeah. Come on. We'll talk about it when we get home. We love you too, Tommy. Let's go say you love him. I. What do you mean? Say I love him. Love him. Tell a kid you love him. Boy, I gotta, well, I say I love you. What do you, what? What do you want from me? You never say it. Know. Love him. I say it. What? He doesn't say it to you, Tommy. It's important that he says it to me. Come on. What are you talking about? I say him all the time. That I love him. I that I [00:38:00] always, you never even say you love me. Katie Marinello: So then they, they're picking at each other again? Claire Fisher: So they're immediately bickering Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Meanwhile, Molly's parents are just trying to say, don't keep doing this. Don't keep trying to run away. There's nothing you can change. And she says, I hate you both. I guess we better go home and talk about it too. Huh? We've already talked about a pumpkin a long, long time. We just can't talk anymore. Well, what am I supposed to do? I can't. You just don't. I hate you. Katie Marinello: don't they say we've already talked about this, or something like that. And I was like, dude, if the kid's not getting it, you need to have as many conversations as she wants. I thought that was kind of cold. Claire Fisher: this is a one hour special, Katie. Katie Marinello: Nope, Claire Fisher: Yeah. Katie Marinello: don't get to do that. You're the adults. You get to answer as many questions as she has, Claire Fisher: So then she [00:39:00] has the circus dream again. She falls outta bed and she says to her dog, oh, ribbon. I wish we'd get another dream or a parachute. Katie Marinello: which is so good. Claire Fisher: And so she finally musters up her courage and goes to the school counselor for help. Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: I did that once. Katie Marinello: the school counselor's office is an actual office in this version. Claire Fisher: know I got the janitor's closet. Katie Marinello: Yes. Again, God, if you wanna God bless teachers, school counselors, the shit they put up with and the way that they are always stuck in some corner somewhere. God bless 'em. Claire Fisher: mine wasn't all that helpful. I could have talked to the janitor though. He was very, Katie Marinello: You know, the janitor was quite empathetic at that school. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: emotional intelligence and located us the day we ran away from hope, which Katie Marinello: Which we did not actually run away from home, but Claire Fisher: to add, we walked to school without mom realizing we had left. Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: happened. Katie Marinello: There was not us running away. Claire Fisher: But the janitor did find us before anyone else, including the police Katie Marinello: Yes. [00:40:00] He was great. Anyway, Claire Fisher: anyway. the Mrs. Wilson, the counselor, did you find out who plays her? Katie Marinello: you know, I didn't see her on there, Claire Fisher: okay. Well maybe she's doubled by one of the other actresses. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: sure. But anyway, Mrs. Wilson actually has a very productive conversation with Molly. We don't get to see all of it. Part of it is just them like in silhouette talking at the, in the Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Well, from what you've told me, you have a lot of people who really care about you, I guess. So why not let them that don't get it? That's all right. I'll see you next time. Amali, as we grow up. All our dreams may have to change, but the nice thing about dreams is if one doesn't come true, we can always dream another [00:41:00] one. Claire Fisher: But then that night, Molly dreams of unicorns, so she did get a new Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And then just like that, it's the night of the class play. Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: And I may not have any trauma around divorce or fighting parents, but I have so much trauma around class plays. Katie Marinello: Really? Trauma Claire Fisher: A lot of it is actually from high school, but I I just wanna point out things that happened in this movie that have also happened to me. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: costume falling off, mid scene, Katie Marinello: Mm. Claire Fisher: a little kid, refusing to go on, Katie Marinello: Yep. Claire Fisher: getting a piece of your costume stuck. And in my case, knocking over the set because I was trying to unstick my costume Katie Marinello: Yep. Mm-hmm. Well, the show must go on. Claire Fisher: if the show must go Katie Marinello: So what does Molly decide to do? Claire? Claire Fisher: So Molly's anxiously waiting to see if her dad is gonna make Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Because he missed parents night. Katie Marinello: Yep. Claire Fisher: But he promised Katie Marinello: Which caused the divorce, apparently. Claire Fisher: but he promised he'd be there for this. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: meanwhile, the audience can see that he did [00:42:00] get held up at work, but at the last possible minute, like rushed out being like, I still have to make it to my kids to play. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: across town. And he gets there with seconds to spare. Right. And she and the skywalks have a plan for how this fairy godmother is gonna knock everyone's socks off. They're gonna do an unplanned stunt entrance Katie Marinello: Why Claire Fisher: so that the fairy godmother could fly Katie Marinello: I can actually fly. Yeah. Claire Fisher: they've rigged up a pulley, and instead she crashes straight through the set. Katie Marinello: Honestly, like Claire Fisher: Where was the supervision? Katie Marinello: Where did the pulley come from? Claire Fisher: And so here's my other trauma, is that I've had to supervise small children backstage Katie Marinello: Oh yeah. Same. Yep. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And so the very real possibility that children will attempt a stunt with a no warning or preparation is frightening. Katie Marinello: True. That. Claire Fisher: yeah, prince Charmings [00:43:00] tights fell off. My skirt fell off during the Oklahoma Dream Ballet. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: little kid refused to go on. My dance partner refused to go on in a dance recital when I was four years old, and I dragged her on an event, immortalized my mom's,, camcorder Katie Marinello: Right. Right. Mm-hmm. And probably the professional VHS that we also bought. Claire Fisher: yeah, probably though Lord knows where either of those recordings are now. Katie Marinello: And Nora, shout out. Nora offered to lend me a VHS player today, and I said we used to call those bcr. Claire Fisher: aw, Nora has a VCR. That's good to know for future reference Anyway the show went on, everybody claps, right? Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: and she asks for the first time Katie Marinello: If she can stay over, Claire Fisher: at Daddy's Katie Marinello: because we didn't say, but I think he asks if she wants to at some point, and she's like, absolutely not. Claire Fisher: He takes her to see his new apartment Katie Marinello: Oh. And he says, you can spend the night. And she's like, I wanna go home. Claire Fisher: I [00:44:00] just wanna go home. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: he's trying to say, this is your home. Katie Marinello: Right? Claire Fisher: this is, I made a room for you. Which, you know, that I'm sure is hard on the parents 'cause like. To have to make up a room for your kid in a new space and like try to convince them that they like it Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: no matter how justified your decision to divorce. That's gotta be a hard conversation to have with a little kid. Kids are famously attached to their space, Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: right? Katie Marinello: So there's stuff. Yeah, absolutely. And yeah, the going back and forth thing is hard no matter how close you may be. Claire Fisher: Right, Katie Marinello: by you, maybe, which it seems like he's purposely set it up so that he's within, you know, the school district. Claire Fisher: right. Because she says, can I stay over at daddy's apartment? And her mom says, well, tomorrow afternoon we're supposed to go do whatever it Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And the dad very maturely says, well, how about I get her back by 10:00 AM? Like, can you do Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: And which goes to show that they are navigating this dynamic Katie Marinello: Right? Claire Fisher: [00:45:00] and are willing to co-parent in a healthy way. Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Okay. Uh, ready to go, honey. I'd like to stay with daddy tonight. Is that okay with you? Uh, well, but. Well, but tomorrow, uh, Saturday I promised mother that I'll bring her back real early. Yes. Yeah, sure. That that, that's fine with me. Claire Fisher: Next scene is Daddy helping her say her prayers she goes to bed in the new house. And she asks if she can have a sleepover soon to show her friends her new Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: He promised that she can, Katie Marinello: Yes. Claire Fisher: and then time skip. Turns out the narrator Katie Marinello: Yes. So Carol Burnett is grown up. Molly. And who did she marry? Claire. Claire Fisher: what's his name, with the Katie Marinello: What's his name with the glasses? Claire Fisher: They're living happily ever after. And that's the story of Molly Conway. She didn't get to play Cinderella, but she learned to live with that [00:46:00] and her mother and father got their divorce, but she learned to live with that too, wasn't it? All the kind of life she thought she was gonna live, but it was just fine. Molly. Molly, I'm in here. Molly, that was you mom. You were Molly. Were she still is night love? And who were you, dad? What do you mean? Who was I? You, what's his name with the glasses? I am mom. Did you live happily ever after? Well, not yet, but I'm working on it. And so what's his name?[00:47:00] Oh, Molly. Claire Fisher: Did make me smile. 'cause you know our dad forgets our mom's name sometimes. Notwithstanding that they've been married 37 years and absolutely adore each other. Katie Marinello: I don't remember this. I don't remember forgetting her name. Your, your, your name and my name. Absolutely. All the time. Claire Fisher: He, when he was giving the welcome speech at my wedding, Katie Marinello: Uh, Claire Fisher: and he ended up saying, my wife, the mother of the bride, Katie Marinello: He was very nervous at your wedding. Claire Fisher: introduced her for her citizen of the year award, he said, my wife, the water lady, because he froze up. So when dad is public speaking, he sometimes forgets mom's name Katie Marinello: Okay, so that is that. And so Happily Ever After is in this case, divorced parents with a healthy co-parenting relationship and a kid who's adjusting to her new normal Claire Fisher: and who doesn't grow up to be cynical about Katie Marinello: right? She ends up falling in love. Yep. Claire Fisher: do find love. Katie Marinello: And have a little girl their own Claire Fisher: right. [00:48:00] Yay. Yay. Katie Marinello: monogamous heterosexual marriage. Claire Fisher: hey, don't knock it Katie Marinello: It's the last Sunday of Pride. Claire Fisher: I'm in a heterosexual, monogamous marriage. Katie Marinello: I know. Claire Fisher: I mean, my husband has to hang up the bi pride flag for me in Pride month, Katie Marinello: Yes. Anyway, shall we, rank Mrs. Conway? Claire Fisher: Yeah. So Mrs. Conway isn't an interesting, you know, this is obviously being told through the eyes of the daughter, right? So mom is always the hero, Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: But also this is a mom who has to give her daughter some really bad news, right? I would say that she handles it all around maturely, that she is a good parent. And yeah, I mean, I think this is actually a pretty solid Katie Marinello: If we're just doing it based on, agency, I would say she might actually make it up to a [00:49:00] five. Claire Fisher: Yeah, I was gonna say five out of five Katie Marinello: Five out of five, she makes that choice to strike out on her own rather than stay in a unhealthy marriage. And by the way, shall we just say your grandparents did not necessarily stay together because of the power of love? Claire Fisher: The lack of no fault divorce options was a factor in why people stayed married. Um, that no fault divorce exists, there are still barriers to leaving unhappy marriages, but not the same Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Let Katie Marinello: Yeah. Claire Fisher: say. Katie Marinello: And there's lots of people trying to make more barriers to getting divorced. Including, project 2025 included, ending no fault divorce. And three states, Arizona, Arkansas, and Louisiana have instituted covenant marriages. Have you heard of these? Claire Fisher: yes, Katie Marinello: So, it's a legally distinct kind of marriage in which the spouse has agreed to do premarital counseling and accept more limited grounds for speaking [00:50:00] divorce, , later. The least strict of which is that their, , legal separation has to be two years instead of whatever, you know, sometimes it's six months, sometimes it's not anything at all in different states. So, you know, obviously something that people can opt into, but it's definitely like a sign of Claire Fisher: Mm-hmm. Katie Marinello: Christian nationalism and there's a reason it's Louisiana, Arizona, and Arkansas that have instituted that, so. Claire Fisher: Having lived, albeit briefly, with a family that was going through a divorce in Katie Marinello: Mm-hmm. Claire Fisher: Can say there are, places in the world where it might be too easy to get a divorce. And then there are places in the world where it may be too hard to get a divorce, and somewhere in the middle is where I'd like to live. Katie Marinello: I don't think there is a such thing as too easy to get a divorce. I think making it easier for women, and let's be honest, it's mostly women who are leaving bad marriages. [00:51:00] Um, Claire Fisher: My objection in Jordan was that, women have to go through court and men can just announce, I divorce you, I divorce you, I divorce Katie Marinello: right. Claire Fisher: and then drop the woman off at her mother's house. Katie Marinello: Yeah. I strongly. The idea that courts are involved in this at all and that they can say, no, you can't get divorced, is just like mind boggling to me. I know it doesn't happen that much anymore, but I also know that we are putting more and more conservative judges in positions of power. So once again, this tiny little TV movie has brought up rights that we thought were kind of settled. Law. Claire Fisher: well, yeah, I mean, if, if most states had no fault divorce starting in the seventies, I didn't really think that was the hill that people were gonna die Katie Marinello: I know. Claire Fisher: what's happening now is that people are so, so worried about the birth rate, but like, Hey, you don't have to be married to have kids Katie Marinello: And you don't have to have kids. If you're married, Claire Fisher: If you're unhappily married, you are Katie Marinello: you're likely not doing the things. Mm-hmm. Probably not doing the [00:52:00] things that lead to children. Yeah, Claire Fisher: Um, Katie Marinello: yeah, it's mind boggling. 'cause everybody. Who's making these laws? All these like good Christians have all been divorced, Claire Fisher: right. And I mean also, I mean there's more to it than that. 'cause like there's some states that haven't yet criminalized spousal rape Katie Marinello: right? Claire Fisher: situations. Right. So like to say that you want to end no fault divorce is basically to say that you want to remove the legal remedy for people who are being abused by spouses. Katie Marinello: You're basically re legalizing domestic violence. Claire Fisher: yes. And they have re legalized domestic violence in Russia within the last 20 years. And from what I'm told by my Russian students, that may have been a mistake. Katie Marinello: Really a mistake. I can't imagine. Claire Fisher: Well because now people. Russia, don't wanna get married and have children because if Katie Marinello: Mm. Claire Fisher: turns out to be an abusive asshole, they'll have no remedy. So if your Katie Marinello: See that, Claire Fisher: birth [00:53:00] rate, Katie Marinello: right, Claire Fisher: once again, Katie Marinello: Right. Claire Fisher: if your concern is that people don't get married and have children quickly enough, the solution is actually not make marriage scarier. Katie Marinello: Right. Right. Good point. So what are we watching next week? Claire Fisher: Ah, one I've actually heard of though not yet seen Katie Marinello: Same. Claire Fisher: Hannah and her sisters, I am terrified Katie Marinello: Why? Claire Fisher: because it's directed by Woody Allen. Katie Marinello: Oh, I did not realize that. Claire Fisher: Yeah. So I don't know whether the plot of this one has aged any better than the plot of some Morty Allen films. We could name Katie Marinello: Well, we will discuss next week, but perhaps we can watch it together at the beach next weekend. Claire Fisher: Perhaps we could. Katie Marinello: Alright, well, until then, Claire Fisher: Just remember Katie Marinello: if your life wasn't funny, it would just be true. Claire Fisher: and that's unacceptable. Katie Marinello: Good night. Claire Fisher: Goodnight. Katie Marinello: Thanks for [00:54:00] listening to another episode of Carried Far, far Away. This podcast is hosted, produced, edited re-edited obsessed over and loved by Katie Marinello and Claire Fisher. You can follow the show on Facebook and Instagram at carriedawaypod You can email us at awaycarriedpod@gmail.com You can follow Claire deadfictionalgirlfriends and Katie katiedaway We are proud to be part of the 12 24 network. You can join fans and creators from the Network on Discord by clicking the link in the show notes. All clips used in this podcast are done so under the protection of fair use. Have a wonderful week, and may the force be with you. ​ Katie Marinello: And now our space, grandma wisdom of the week. Mark Hamill: Carrie came to see me in a play on Broadway and she goes, what's with your bio? I said, what's wrong with my bio? And I listen all my theater credits, every single one of them. And at the end I said something along the lines of, And he's also known for a series of popular space movies without ever mentioning the actual titles. [00:55:00] And she said, get over yourself. Look, I am Princess Leia. You are Luke Skywalker. Get used to it. I thought, you know what? I should enjoy this. What territory do I occupy that nobody else does enjoy that? ​ Claire Fisher: This is a made for TV movie that aired October 20th, 1985. and by the way, I assemble, I for this, had to look at some statistics that were assembled by Bowling Green State University. Katie Marinello: Thank you. Bowling Green State University. Sorry about the massacre. Claire Fisher: Okay. There we're gonna cut that. Katie Marinello: You forgot about the Bowling Green Massacre, didn't you? Claire Fisher: Nothing Katie Marinello: she was saying everybody was going to do Claire Fisher: Yeah, I know. Katie Marinello: [00:56:00] anyway.