Pete Wright: I'm Pete Wright.
Andy Nelson: And I'm Andy Nelson.
Pete Wright: Welcome to the next reel. When the movie ends
Andy Nelson: Our conversation begins.
Pete Wright: Roadhouse 20 24 the Jake Gyllenhaal one, is over.
Pete Wright: Looky here. We got our own little octagon.
Trailer: Before we start, do you have insurance? What? Your coverage good? Like, you have dental? Oh, Is there a hospital nearby?
Is it, like, too far? About, like, twenty five minutes, I'd say. I just slapped you. Are you alright? What?
So
you like to fight. You ever win? No one ever wins a fight. This ain't the Holiday Inn, pal.
I I'm I'm moving.
Friend of mine suggested I come talk to you. I own a roadhouse out in the Florida Keys. Lately, it's been attracting the wrong clientele. I can pay you good money. Judging by your car, you need this.
Well, I like my car. Think about it.
I know who you are. That would Dalton big banner.
You guys got a knife under his shirt. You just take a big step back and pop me in the face. He can do it. Tell me about this fountain. Yeah.
It's all nice. Like, he's mister Rogers or something, but then
he'll haul off.
Really interesting guy overall. Bran wants to take the roadhouse away from me. He wants to build some resort. I should warn you, people have a certain way of getting things done around here. Hey, fellas.
Looks like you're having a smacking night. Duncan, I got a tip for you. Don't let no one get this close. Come on, bro. Let me get this.
I'm gonna threaten me. Tell me to get out of town. I get the impression that you can't be threatened. Once Nox is on the job, it's over, baby. It takes a lot to get me angry, but when I am, I just can't let go.
People seem
a little aggressive around here.
Is that one in front of yours? No. I just broke his arm.
Pete Wright: You're gonna have to get ready for more bad Conor McGregor accents cause there's more coming.
Andy Nelson: Oh, great. Okay.
Pete Wright: Yeah. No. You should be more excited than that.
Andy Nelson: Oh, great.
Pete Wright: You might say, oh, great. Oh, great.
Andy Nelson: Oh, man.
Pete Wright: I you know, it's interesting. I feel like this is my bet. My bet is you and I are coming in to this movie with a probably a similar perspective. Is that what do you think? Would you wanna lay odds?
Andy Nelson: My hunch is that you read my letterbox review and are basing your opinion on that.
Pete Wright: Well, you outed it. Yeah. I was going to be prescient. But, yes, I was gonna tell you later. I already read your letterbox review.
And I think you said in your letterbox review something I have not been able to put my finger on how I felt about this movie. And I think it describes better than any other review I have read Wow. The way this movie got made, Andy. I it it is it's a perfect way to think about this movie. That somewhere along the line, someone thought there were things that needed to be fixed about the original Roadhouse.
And so they fixed them, and they were wrong. I mean, does that sum it up? Is that kind of generally where you are on this?
Andy Nelson: Yeah. Although I didn't not it makes me makes it sound like I didn't like the movie though. Like, I still had fun with the movie, but I it I it did leave me scratching my head several times. Like, why that we didn't need that the first go around. Why did they think we needed it the second time, etcetera.
Yeah.
Pete Wright: Yes. So it's it's interesting because the first time this was the first time you watched this movie. This was the second time I watched it. Gotcha. I watched it right when it came out, and there was that whole controversy.
Lyman was so mad that they didn't give it a theatrical release. So mad. He was octagon mad, you might say. And Is that okay.
Andy Nelson: Glossary. Glossary. Make a note.
Pete Wright: Okay. Okay. Octagon mad. Make a note about octagon mad. I'm gonna put it right here.
So I did not care for the movie then. I didn't care for it at all. I really didn't. I was I was an antagonist for the movie. And I think it's safe to say, I've come around.
I have come around.
Andy Nelson: And that's interesting because, like, this was your pick. Like, this series Uh-huh. Coming back to movies and the remakes and doing this. Did you want to return to this to see if you thought it was any better? Or what was your initial draw to, like, revisiting this film for this reason?
Pete Wright: There was not a little bit of that. I wanted because there's because you look at this movie and you think, my goodness. This is kind of the stuff that I like in movies. Why did I react so poorly to it the first time around? But second, you know, Chrissy and Nathan had done the original Roadhouse on the most excellent eighties movies podcast that we write here on True Story FM.
And I have not watched I had not watched that movie in a very long time. And so I thought this would be a great opportunity to revisit this as a part of our movies and their remakes and actually see what was I remembering that I had just told told myself a story when I watched the the remake without having the benefit of the original? And what actually you know, what do I really need to get worked up about and feel strongly about? The truth is they made choices. They made choices that I wouldn't have made.
But the bottom line is I'm here this time for the fights. I'm here for Doug Lyman's camera. Like like, I'm here for this kind of over the top stuff. How much does it bother me that they felt it important to give us Dalton's backstory and give Dalton a first name and give Dalton's first name, Elwood? Like, come on.
That that just that didn't that stuff didn't play for me this time much as it didn't last time. But the sum of the movie, does it succeed doing what it sets out to do, be an action movie about that that that fills the archetype of the rogue ronin coming into town to clean up the the mess and protect the villagers. Like, it's it's another seven samurai. It's just one of them. It's a spin off.
It's the black pink version of of, like, one of the samurai come come around. And on that front, it actually works. And I think Gyllenhaal the first thing out of the gate, does Gyllenhaal fit the bill as our protagonist? I think the answer for me is ultimately yes. And once I'm on that train, the rest of it just kinda falls in line.
Andy Nelson: I think that's a great way of describing it. I think Jill and Hall I mean, so much of the first movie really held together because we had Patrick Swayze at the core. Swayze, especially at that point in the eighties, has had already kind of like that Zen dancer energy that he was bringing to his projects. And, I mean, you definitely see that in a number of them. And here, I mean, or in that film, he was doing tai chi and he, you know, he like, everything was like his whole philosophy.
Like, he had a philosophy about how to work as a bouncer or a, cooler as he was. So you walk into this film, and Gyllenhaal's already kind of filling some big shoes taking on that Patrick Swayze role. But he brings his own I mean, Jake Gyllenhaal also has kind of this kooky energy about him. Yes. You know?
And he's got those big eyes, and he can be so, like, the smiley and charming. And there's this way about him that is incredibly just easygoing and light. And I think he kind of taps into that quirky that quirky congeniality that he has and just makes, like, that whole be nice philosophy from the first film just kind of becomes his own personal essence. And he's just always, like, super friendly, nice the way that he does it. He doesn't espouse that philosophy or have a training session to teach everyone about it.
But at the same time, he's living it from the beginning. From jump, he's he is that character. And and it plays. I thought it played really well, and it worked as it evolved, especially up to that turning point when suddenly he's just like, you know, cross the line. It takes a lot to get me mad.
Well, I'm there now. And I thought that was a nice shift.
Pete Wright: Did that did that work for you? That transition worked for
Andy Nelson: you as his character pivots? Yeah. It did. It did. I thought it worked.
And, you know, I I think that it also worked in the way that the relationship evolved because we get to that point in the first film where, you know, she closes herself off to him because she doesn't she sees what he is. He rips people's throat out throats out and everything, and doesn't want any of that. And then, of course, they come back together. Here, she sees what he's capable of, you know, the two supposedly dead bodies lying on the the floor of the bar, and and they don't get back together. He does get on the bus.
He does leave town at the end of the film. And I thought that was actually a logical progression for this character from 89 to now to see him as that as you said, you don't wanna get to know me. I'm not a great guy. And we see, you know, he is this lone Ronin character, and now he needs to leave and and let the villagers return to their own way of life. And he needs to go back to whatever it is he's gonna do.
Pete Wright: Which I I think, again, as the as the the mythical hero, and this is largely where I the the challenge of the character and the things they decided to fix don't work for me, which is we have this character who in the first movie is much more in line with the mythical hero, and we don't have a history. We don't really have a background. We have we have people making nods to experiences, but we don't need to know kind of where he came from. This movie leans heavily into his life before to the point where we have some extraordinary flash flashbacks where, you know, reportedly, they got to shoot for, like, ten minutes in the actual octagon during a during a fight, and that that material looks really good. And when you think about, like, the intensity of filming those sequences, the fight sequences, the, you know, the entering the ring sequences, and and to do it as effectively and efficiently as they did.
I I thought that was really cool. But I didn't need I didn't find that was missing. I don't think that fixed anything wrong with the movie, and it takes it grounds Dalton in 2024 in as as a human being in a way that I I don't think Swayze ever needed. He he could be this kind of phantom that comes in, fixes problems, and leaves again. He is kung fu.
Andy Nelson: One of the things about that that I do think is interesting is that we have I mean, we have characters, we have moments in that first film that allude to the past. We don't really spell it out. We just know at some point, especially when Sam Neil's character arrives.
Pete Wright: Sam
Andy Nelson: Elliot. Yes. Sam Neil would be a very different different version of that film. Sam Elliot. Would you like
Pete Wright: to come see my dish?
Andy Nelson: It's because of the it's because of the lack of the mustache. Yeah. You're clearly throwing me now. But he's, like, talking about that past story. So we have moments where they start bringing up and digging into whatever had happened in the past, but that's all we need.
We just know that there was something there. We don't have that Wade character in this film, so we don't have somebody that he can kind of bounce us off. Although, clearly, it's all over YouTube. So we we could have just had conversations about it with other characters where they had seen it and and we didn't necessarily need to go into dream sequences that actually gave us all of that. I just don't know.
Other than the fact that, oh, they actually filmed at the fight. Like, I I don't know if it really gave us anything, you know, to one of our earlier points. But I I think that there's an interesting element to just the way that they they choose to develop his character and have those moments of darkness because this is definitely something we didn't see in the first film. I mean, this guy starts the film near suicidal, which kind of surprised me. I mean, took kind of a dark moment for a bit where he's actually parking on a rail railroad tracks as a train is coming.
And then at the last minute decides, no. This is stupid. I wanna keep on going. And then, of course, the train.
Pete Wright: Ar arguably, it's the Exactly after the last minute in order to avoid any damage.
Andy Nelson: Yeah. Right? Yeah. So it doesn't quite get out get out unscathed, but he does survive. Anyway, the point is, like, that's an interesting element.
We're walking into this character where now they're also making him potentially suicidal. I mean and and for me, I I wasn't sure if that actually played, you know, especially the way his character is the rest of the film.
Pete Wright: It seems very 2024. Right? Like, it seems like we're investing so much more emotional weight because everything has to be explained. There's no room for any sort of mystery, and his mood needs to be felt and grounded in a way that that I don't feel like I needed. That was that was not a thing I needed.
And in that regard, you know, I I just, just as we record this, I had lunch with our, with our friend Ocean and, from the Adrian moment. And, you know, they cover sports movies, and he also is a big UFC fan, and so he has lots to say. And you know Ocean's bit. Like, he says, I did not care for that movie, but had you changed the name and not made it a Roadhouse movie, it probably would have been great. Right?
And because he, like many, felt very strongly about what the original Roadhouse meant because we're people of a certain age. And this movie did things that that didn't feel honorable to those characters. And I think that's a that's a perspective I have a hard time disagreeing with. You know? As a Roadhouse movie, they took our central character and, you know, there I think there's a line between is Dalton a seminal enough figure in movie history that you can't mess with him anymore?
I I think they took the line the filmmakers, Doug Lyman, took the line that he's not. Like, he's we can play with him. He can be Batman.
Andy Nelson: I think most filmmakers would argue that it's their Yeah. Right to do that if they're doing a remake. And, you know, I mean, I I honestly don't have a problem with virtually everything or anything in the film. I mean, I questioned some of their decisions to change things, but in the end, I still think that they made a really fun movie. Yeah.
Like, it didn't make sense to have Dalton have that suicidal moment early in the film. But still, like, I like Jake Gyllenhaal. I thought his development as a character was interesting. Why did they not name it the double deuce? That was the stupidest thing.
And then they have this whole, like, meta joke about it's called the roadhouse because it's stupid because roadhouse, as we know, is one word. It's like, are they doing a meta joke making fun of the fact that the original movie was just called road space house? Like, it was like, I think they have these moments.
Pete Wright: Somebody felt strongly about that in a way that I never did. Yeah. Can I ask you a question, though, on that regard? What did you think of Jessica Williams? Because some of these scenes like that, for example, felt to me like ham fisted attempts to to allow her to do funny work.
And this does not feel like an opportunity for Jessica Williams to be funny in this movie.
Andy Nelson: I thought she was fine in the film, and I guess I didn't think of any particular funny beats, you know, because those conversations, it's not like she was being funny. They're just they're having a scene about a funny thing with the name and her funny uncle and how he names things like the roadhouse, the boat, the obvious names for things. So I didn't I didn't look at her character and what they were doing with it as trying to give her more comedic moments.
Pete Wright: I I it's hard for me not to see her and not imagine her in comedic moments because I think she's a very talented performer. And she's also at her best does some of her best work as a comedian. When she is being a funny character, I think she just shines. This movie, she was fine. And it it felt like they didn't quite know how to use her in this movie at her best.
I don't think she was miscast. I just think she was underutilized.
Andy Nelson: Well, that's like saying Kevin Teague should have had more screen time in the first film. That's what the role is. You know? I mean, he was an actor of of name at the time, kind of a character actor and had been in plenty of things. Did you could you argue that his part was too small?
Like, I think it just it fits the bill, and it is what
Pete Wright: it is. I'm not saying that her part was too small. I think her part was perfectly sized. I think they it the part was too dramatic for the casting.
Andy Nelson: Well, I don't I mean, I guess I don't know her from comedic work as much as you do. Like, I thought of her as like, oh, that person from the fantastic beasts movies. Like, you know, so I come at her from a totally different
Pete Wright: Okay.
Andy Nelson: Perspective. And so I think to that end, I guess, you know, she's just showing range. She's given the opportunity to different types of projects.
Pete Wright: Yeah. That's that's very true. Yeah. You should we we should put together some daily show clips from when from her time on staff there, or, you know, her work in shrinking is fantastic because it's range, but it's also really leverages her comedic prowess. She's just very funny.
Andy Nelson: Yeah. I have seen her in funny and, like, she was the teacher in Booksmart. So
Pete Wright: Yes.
Andy Nelson: You know, there are times. Yeah. But it's like, yeah, it's just it's an actress who is given opportunity to be different types of characters.
Pete Wright: So
Andy Nelson: Yeah. But as far as the Roadhouse goes, you know, we have a similar setup story wise. We start in a different bar in a different location. We meet Dalton at this location as he is kind of doing some cleanup. Oh, no.
No. Not at a bar. Sorry. At a at a fight. He goes to this fight and she's trying to find this guy at a fight and decides not to go with the guy he'd that she'd been told about, but about Dalton because he was so well known that just the fact that he was who he was, the other person backed down from the fight immediately and didn't bother fighting.
So that's the setup. And that sets her off on going, yes, I wanna hire you. And then, of course, the whole suicide thing, which which triggers him to say, you know what? I'm just gonna go down to the Florida Keys, and I'm gonna do this little cleanup job at, at, Frankie's Roadhouse. And and then we kind of, you know, get into this job of of him doing the work.
And it starts similarly where the first time is just him sitting there watching everything going on until it kind of gets to a point where he jumps in and and takes care of stuff. And that's right out of the gate with kind of these tough guys that come into town. So as far as that kind of like that similar setup for this story, because there definitely are some other changes. I mean, how does that play as far as the way that they're remaking it for you?
Pete Wright: It plays fine for me. It really does. As much as I did, want at least a cameo of a giant monster truck in this movie, I think that's one thing that they broke. Overall, I I feel like the it this is a straight across the bow pillage and vengeance movie, P and V as they call it in the in the business. Someone comes to pillage, someone gets vengeance.
P and V. That's gonna be a thing. We're gonna we're gonna take that to Glossary. Heights. Glossary.
Oh, for crying out loud. Octagon mad and the P and V.
Andy Nelson: What about okay. So in the original film, we also get a car parts shop owner who happens to be the doctor's dad, who ends up befriending Dalton and becomes kind of a place that kind of gives us a clue as like, what's going on with the big picture with this area. You've got this one percenter who's trying to buy everything up and, well, he's not even trying to buy everything up. He's just trying to get control, and he makes everybody pay him a cut of their earnings, basically. It's a little different here because they're basically trying to buy everybody out.
And instead of the car parts owner, we get just a bookshop owner and his daughter who is very very keen on just approaching strangers with with free books. Precocious. Precocious. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Pete Wright: How else are we gonna learn about those frogs though? If we don't have an ad a frog advocate. A frog vigate.
Andy Nelson: And Fred the tree. And Fred the tree.
Pete Wright: I think she I think she was great. I I really like her energy. She's a nice way to to bring him into the town. And I love all the moments when he walks past and people just know him because it's a small town, and they all say, hey, Dalton. Like, I think those are charming little little beats in the thing.
That what's interesting to me, while I love the bookshop connection, I think it's it's great, she doesn't become a buddy to him, not like, you know, Iron Man three where it's it this becomes a buddy movie with a kid. This is a she's she's just kinda there. She lets him use the computer, helps him kinda book of the vampire every now and again. Like, here's something you need to learn about the city about the town. But she's not really in it that much until the bookshop is burned down, and it becomes a message that triggers him to go completely Dalton.
The father relationship, like you mentioned, the the doctor's father, In this movie is Joaquin de Almeda, who clearly had a day free
Andy Nelson: to go shoot. Like,
Pete Wright: that it was the weirdest bit of, like, stunt casting. I it felt like stunt casting, but to what end? I don't know if he's the if he's the draw that they think he is.
Andy Nelson: I well, my wife was she was very irritated about the fact that Ellie says that she was born here born and raised here in The Keys. And she's like, there's no way she was born and raised here. She with that accent, there's no way. Like, she would she would not have that accent. And then her father.
And then her father. And I'm like, okay, well, with her father, like, did they cast him because he has an accent? Are they trying to say that she has an accent still because he has an accent? It was a strange beat to call her out as somebody who's a local, who has, you know, a heavy accent like that. I mean, it didn't bug me too much, but it is kind of funny.
I guess it only makes sense because, because Joaquin Delmeda is her dad. But even then, it's like, yeah. But, you know, born and raised, would she still have it?
Pete Wright: Yeah. I I guess I agree with that. I think Almeda's like, his part is such a weird waste of film time. They got Latin Jack Ryan, and they made him this.
Andy Nelson: It was odd to have him in this, but only because I just I was trying to figure out, like so and this was another of those changes, like, where they're like, well, we should fix it. We wanna like, we need to bring in more of the the fact that the the cops are owned by these people. Because they talk about that in the first movie how, oh, they own the politicians, they own the cops. And here it's like, oh, well, we need to show that. So instead of the local car parts owner, let's let them be their own thing, and we're gonna make it the sheriff.
So now we can tie that in. And it really didn't need to happen, and it just didn't bring anything extra to the story. To the point where we have that, it really just kind of is played for laughs at that final moment on the boat on, what's his name? Brandt's yacht as it's like, oh, you know, twist, you know, as as, you know, he reveals I never actually, know, I totally lied to you. And then, and Brant is like, well, I actually lied to you.
And, you know, it's, yeah. I I don't think it helped that much for the story to to have all of that.
Pete Wright: I don't think so either. I think that was it just didn't didn't play quite as as well as maybe they expected. I mean, it didn't detract. It was just like, he's obviously a face, and he took me out of the movie.
Andy Nelson: I I mean, yeah, he didn't take me out except for the fact that if all of these people are meant to be local, it's it's it's hard to buy the accents when it's a local person. You know?
Pete Wright: Yeah. I mean, I don't I guess, I don't know that part of Florida. I I don't even know what I would possibly expect.
Andy Nelson: Well, I I I guess I would just think that if if, like, you're born and raised in a place, you kind of have that accent, you know, as opposed to I mean, I guess her father had he actually come from Portugal, then you could buy him having that accent still over time. But anyway, minor point. But it was an odd change though to have him as the sheriff there. You know, and I did mention, Brandt, Billy Magnusson, who I feel is born to play this type of role.
Pete Wright: Billy Magnusson is kind of like, he's just a super charming actor, and I think he's he's he's doing great. He needs to keep just do it with no notes for Billy Magnusson. I loved him in Into the Woods as Rapunzel's prince. He can sing. I loved him in Game Night.
That's one of my very favorites. He's in you know, he was in the franchise, which is a wonderful Iannucci project that I think he's very, very funny. He he goes back and forth from being able to play a complete doofus to this entitled punchable face one percenter son in a way that that is it it's just effortless what he's able to do. And he's had a hell of a career already. Like, he just he's been in a ton of stuff already.
And I every time I see him, I'm surprised. Like, we should keep an eye on that Billy Magnussen. But he's been around for for a long time. He just ages incredibly well.
Andy Nelson: Yes. He does. He is fun in the role. I think that he works as the main villain, I guess. You know?
But, of course, that leads us to Knox, Conor McGregor, who comes in, hired by Brandt's dad who's still in prison.
Pete Wright: Who played Brandt's dad? Do we know who the voice was? We never meet him.
Andy Nelson: No. I don't know. Then we only hear the voice when he calls Knox. Right? Yeah.
Yeah. I'm not sure.
Pete Wright: Real time research.
Andy Nelson: But Brant Brant was fun. Like, the shaving bit and everything. Like, it just it's very stereotypical the way that they write the character, the way that he plays the character. And I don't know. Sometimes I'm more bothered by such stereotypical stuff.
This was a movie where I thought it all played into exactly the essence of kind of the eighties film. And so, you know, I I didn't really have problems with it. I thought, you know, it it it's playing into the stereotypes in a way that made it fun.
Pete Wright: He's one of the things and I'll just say, like, the it looks like Gerald Brandt's that that's the dad's name, has not yet been disclosed who the voice was.
Andy Nelson: That means it's probably Doug Lyman.
Pete Wright: Exactly. I actually thought, Conor McGregor, this is one of the things that I I actually didn't care for the first time around that I like much better this time. And I think it's because I let go of any expectation that a movie that isn't a cartoon should intro should probably not introduce a character that is a cartoon. I think Conor McGregor is so over the top in this movie that he was on first viewing a real turn off Interesting. For me.
And now I I love him. I've completely turned around.
Andy Nelson: That's so interesting. I, yeah, I can't imagine walking out of this movie feeling like he was a turn off because he was so over the top and goofy in his super smiley way. Weirdly, and I don't know if it was a decision to say, Jake Gyllenhaal Hall smiles great and it'll be fun to have him smiling through all this stuff. Let's make sure that Knox is also always smiling because it really weirdly puts you off when you have like such a tough person who is your villain, who just is beaming always. And it was to the point where it was funny, especially because, I mean, we meet him in some Latin American country where he's just finished leaving a situation where he was apparently caught screwing a married woman, and he just is running off completely naked through the town.
And, gets the call and has to find some clothes, and and we cut to the moment afterward, and everything's on fire, and he walks away in his new duds. It played for great laughs. Like, it was super well crafted and designed. I had so much fun with him. I could have had even more of him.
Pete Wright: I don't think we can can talk about him and his portrayal in this without at least acknowledging he's a deeply problematic individual and has been arrested a number of times. What he doesn't like, he's taken people's phones, sexual assault. I in Ireland in 02/1819, he was accused of sexual assault. I I mean, he's just a trash talking like, what you see in the movie is pretty much what you get in his real life. And that was a very controversial thing for this movie.
And the fact that Amazon and the filmmakers didn't say a word about his all like, this just litany of off screen controversies is was noticeable, I think, for a lot of people. He brings a terrific authenticity to this character of Knox largely because that's who he is in real life. He just doesn't kill people for money as far as we know.
Andy Nelson: It's good to point out because there's I mean, you just go to his Wikipedia page, and it's just like lists of item after item after item after item after item of of different incidents where, he attacked somebody, hit somebody, accused of racism, driving offenses, god only knows. And then on top of it all, he also announced at one point that he was going to run for the office of president of Ireland. Yes. So on top of everything else, there's that. Yeah.
Pete Wright: He's in you know, he's in he's definitely in the, the Joe Rogan club. Like, they're they're apparently friends, UFC friends. And so he's he's a he's a polarizing individual, and he is doesn't sound like he's a great guy, and it doesn't sound like he cares all that much. Does he add to this movie? I you know, For for my money, this time around watching it, I was entertained by him.
Andy Nelson: I had a great time watching him. He was so much fun. And I and, you know, I came into this not really know I mean, I don't follow UFC fighting. I don't follow any of that sort of stuff. And so and I don't think he's been in anything else.
I think this was kind of his film premiere. I mean, he'd been in some doc like documentaries that followed him in his wrestling days and everything.
Pete Wright: But Right.
Andy Nelson: So I just for a new face to me, like, I had a blast watching him. I thought it was a great casting choice. And pitting him against Jake Gyllenhaal, I thought that they just, you know, worked well going toe to toe.
Pete Wright: Well, in everything I've heard from Gyllenhaal's perspective is that he was an enormously generous, you know, scene partner. And, yeah, he's a big guy, you know, in personality, but he was always willing to slow down, to help teach, to train, to make sure the fights, you know, to his to his best the best of his ability would would feel authentic. And and that has been a controversial point about this movie. There there are, you know, the degree to which people find the fights not looking that great. And I think there are sequences that I did you know, I had had said when I first saw the movie that it felt like in that big final fight, there was a lot of telegraphing of punches and things that just felt less improvisational and much, much more staged.
I was kinda down with it this time around. Like, I I saw the same stuff, and I actually was able to let that go.
Andy Nelson: I can see people's issues, but I also think that's Lyman's style, you know, or or I should say he's evolved his style because it's it's funny. I mean, he's we talked about him. We've talked about it a number of times, but way back when we did the Bourne trilogy, he did the first one. And then it was Paul Greengrass who came in and really did the Jiggly Monkey style camera work for like, that's his thing. Like, fights were so shaky.
That shaky cam is intense. And it almost felt like Doug Lyman took a page from Green Grass's style notebook and used it himself to start developing a lot more of that intense style himself because it definitely feels that way. I mean, right out of the gate, that very first fight that we see, we're in POV. We're watching kind of like this POV fight. At a certain point of the fight later in the film between Gyllenhaal and MacGregor, the camera it's like one shot, but then suddenly, like, the camera almost like steps into Gyllenhaal's place, and you have MacGregor actually, like, swinging punches directly at the camera before it then kind of moves out of it.
So he's really playing around with that and putting us into the perspective and everything. And and and yeah. I mean, it sometimes it is pretty intense and shaky. Sometimes it may be a little too much, but largely, I I think it just allowed for the energy to play quite well.
Pete Wright: There's a bit in the last fight where it changes to Jill Knoll's POV, and MacGregor growls at him and comes at him directly at his face. And I find that as as a fantastic sort of jump scare moment. Like, it is it it does take me a little bit out of my body. It makes me a little bit sick to my stomach, the the feeling of that POV. And I think that's one of the things in this movie.
Those opportunities to make those POV switches, it really sets this movie apart. It's one of the things that is different that I've never seen before done this way, and I think the movie can be celebrated for that. It actually is doing something that feels novel. You know, all the trappings, you know, that that we don't care about, that the the fights do things different in a way that I think is really satisfying.
Andy Nelson: Yeah. I agree. My last little note that I had is I just wanted a few other things that are changes from the original film, and I wanted to get your opinion on them. We don't have as I've called out before, we don't have Dalton kind of walking the bar crew through how to how he wants them to run things. What do you think?
Pete Wright: I think they tried to pad that same feeling by having Dalton recruiting a little bit. Right? He recruits from inside. He says, you're gonna, you know, do this, and he has he has that sequence where he he's kind of helping, you know, this guy with a knife. If he pulls it, take a big step back and punch him in the face.
Right? Those kinds of moments of mentorship moments are one on one. And then he meets the other guy who did a little boxing in college in the banana stand, and, he was able to recruit him. I think that serves the same narrative purpose as the, you know, here, we're all gonna sit down and have a meeting. I run the bar, that kind of a thing.
And I I think it fits Gyllenhaal's portrayal of the character not wanting to run the bar. Right? He's just doing his thing. He's he's much more sort of a drive by hero, I think, and and didn't invest as much as as Swayze's Dalton did.
Andy Nelson: Okay. What about the a big part of the first one is the fact that, Jeff Healy is performing always. Like, he is the band for
Pete Wright: House band.
Andy Nelson: The house band for this roadhouse for the double deuce. Here, it's like a new bar new performers every time we come. How does that work for you? Do you like that change?
Pete Wright: No. I you know, I really liked the fact that they had Jeff Healy do it. And I think, you know, the the fact that we get Post Malone contributed horsepower to his song to the soundtrack, to the movie, and it's featured prominently. And Post Malone gets a cameo. Would it have been too much to put Post Malone in the cage?
Probably. I don't know. Maybe that would have been too much. But Puya and Saint John, they're all contributors to the soundtrack. They're all used in the film and not seen in the film at all.
And so I think, you know, they made this choice to make this less of a music movie by not building in the same kind of band vibe. I miss that. I really do. I thought that was something that really set the first movie apart. Maybe it would have been too derivative to actually make that a thing that they also double in this movie by by finding a band that would play fake band.
Andy Nelson: Right. But it's a remake. And so it's like, I I think it's okay if they're if they're repeating those things, you know. But anyway, that was one of the
Pete Wright: things. I
Trailer: just yeah.
Pete Wright: I mean, I think they just treat it like a traditional action film soundtrack. And it's too bad because there's opportunity lost, I guess. That's the feeling.
Andy Nelson: Right. Right. What about, the cleaning out of bad seeds at the bar?
Pete Wright: It's there's an actually an interesting kind of method to to that in this movie. The cleaning out of the bad seeds, we get a montage of it, but it's not actually Dalton doing the cleaning out. It's his proteges.
Andy Nelson: No. But it's not I I mean, employees. I mean, employees, though. Like like, he cleans out he cleans out dirty employees out of it. Sorry.
Yeah.
Pete Wright: Yeah. No. That's that's right. You I misinterpreted. I think we had a better sequence in the first one where we have the the fight in the office, where they come back and say, you're gonna rehire him as the bartender, and there's that great fight.
I think that was a a better execution.
Andy Nelson: Did would this have been better had we had, like, somebody who worked at the roadhouse who was, you know, skimming, you know, corrupt in some way?
Pete Wright: I don't know. Maybe that just feels weirdly outside of the scope of this movie where they clearly I think by by putting the the people and the actors in the parts that they had in this movie, wanted to create a much more sort of familial atmosphere with no like, they're not employees. They're all in it together, or they're all rebuilding the bar after the car goes through it. They're all, you know, are you open? Well, yeah, we're open.
I know we don't have any liquor and tables, but sure. You know?
Andy Nelson: None of these employees exist outside of the roadhouse. Exactly. Exactly.
Pete Wright: You know, and we didn't we didn't talk about the Joel Silverness of it. Do you have a a stance on the Joel Silverness of this movie?
Andy Nelson: It just it it feels very much like, you know, a lot of action scenes. Like, it it feels, again, like he wanted to make sure that we were getting the quota of action because there's just there's a lot, and some of it works better than others. I rolled my eyes at the multiple callouts to the fact that there was a gator, and then I'm like, how long is it gonna be before we get the gator? Sure enough, timed perfectly for a Joel Silver action beat. So it's yeah.
I mean, it plays exactly like you would expect with the Joel Silver movie.
Pete Wright: Well, it's like our it's like what we're doing for our member bonus series. What's his name and the the quota for sex scenes? Roger Corman and his ten minute quota for breasts. That's it's this it it feels very much the same thing. And and interestingly that Silver did did not have a great relationship with Amazon and apparently went to the mat with, you know, on this decision to use this as a as a subscription mechanism for Amazon Prime versus giving it a a theatrical rollout.
And and I will say, anecdotally, the first time I watched this movie, I watched it on my TV. The second time, I watched it on the headset, on the Vision Pro, and it was a a vastly different experience. Like, I just you know, there's no way to no other way to say it. It it is you know, watching it on a on the bigger screen was really much more entertaining. And maybe that's a part of of why I liked it the second time.
But the fact is Silver's attitude was problematic because he used the opportunity to share his enthusiasm by verbally abusing Sue Kroll and Courtney Valenti, head of film and head of marketing at Amazon Studios. And that wasn't great. So he was fired from this and a second film, Play Dirty, which I haven't seen. But his lawyer says that this he didn't leave because of any misconduct conduct. Of course.
Again, you know, he kept the producer credit, so I don't know. It it I don't think it's surprising at all just knowing his history, but I you know, it's it is, you know, too bad.
Andy Nelson: It makes me wonder how far into the process that was. I mean, it's a strange thing. We'll talk about this a little bit, with with the budget and everything, but they agreed to like, they were given the option of if you want this to be theatrical, you can have this much money. If you want it to just go straight to streaming, we'll give you more money. And that's what they went with.
They took the more money and went with the streaming route. And so it's funny that then they they come into this whole thing about, like, I mean, Lyman wrote a whole thing in Deadline Hollywood, criticizing it and everything. And and they like, he wasn't gonna go into South by Southwest for its premiere because he was protesting it. Like, there were all these different things. And I can I can see it?
Like, this was the first film celebrating MGM's one hundredth anniversary that was released under that new logo, the new banner and everything at the start of the movie, and then to not release it. Like, I can see that. Like, it's it's your hundredth anniversary. This is the first film you're using to celebrate your hundredth anniversary, and it's MGM, and you're not going to release it theatrically. Like, I can see their perspective.
But at the same time, if they made a deal, it's like, well, then it's on you. Right?
Pete Wright: Yeah. This and and I think your the question is is really appropriate. Like, how far into this conversation was it? Is it that we took the money to make the movie and we still feel really bad that you don't agree this should get a theatrical release? Right?
Like, that's I get that that you're bruised, but, you know, you made the movie you made. Would it have been, would it have been good for a theatrical release? I think so. I absolutely think so.
Andy Nelson: Well, and and here's the thing. Like, I think I think the thing is that it's Amazon. I think other movie studios, like a director could make an agreement with the studio and come to some terms of production. Like, this is what we're gonna do. This is the result.
And then excitedly, when it's ready or close, you can show them and say, look how good this is. This is this would be a great thing to show theatrically. It's gonna be a big draw. It's gonna make its money back. It'll be big.
And Hollywood history proves that there are plenty of times this conversation happens where the studio is like, wow, maybe you're right. Like, okay, let's do it. And they despite whatever was agreed upon, they change the terms and they do something else. And I think that I don't know. My hunch is that Lyman and Silver were looking at it in kind of that older Hollywood way.
And here we have an example of the new Hollywood where you have these studios that just don't care. Like, they really don't care about theatrical at all. And they're like, screw that. You made a deal. This is what the deal is.
We're gonna get our money back, and that's that.
Pete Wright: Yeah. In so many ways, it's it's actually really funny if you're not watching the studio yet on Apple TV plus. It's they're I mean, they're covering this very topic. This age old argument, which will not go away, is is still very very present. So
Andy Nelson: Absolutely. Alright. Well, I suppose that is it. So we'll be right back. But first, our credits.
Pete Wright: The next reel is a production of True Story FM, engineering by Andy Nelson. Music by Everett Z, Rasberg, Russo, Oriole Novella, and Eli Cap. Andy usually finds all the stats for the awards and numbers at d-numbers.com, box office mojo Com, IMDb Com, and Wikipedia.org. Find the show at truestory.fm, and if your podcast app allows ratings and reviews, consider doing that for our show.
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Pete Wright: Sequels and remakes, Andy. Sequels and remakes. So it's already a remake. Is there more? Is there a comic book version, a graphic novel?
Is there a podcast? I would like the Roadhouse podcast, please.
Andy Nelson: The Roadhouse podcast. Right. Actually, they are in talks, right around the time this was, in production. Gyllenhaal expressed interest in reprising and starring in the sequel. By May of the same year, a sequel was announced and, in development, and Gyllenhaal was gonna be reprising his role.
Amazon MGM studio head Jennifer Salke stated, work on the project is ongoing. As of April 2025, so this month, it was reported the guy Richie was in talks to direct the sequel. So they're not necessarily I mean, I kind of figured that it wouldn't be Doug Liman after the little tiff that they had. So but Guy Richie, that could be fun. It could be an interesting interesting way to go.
Little yeah. We'll see.
Pete Wright: Yeah. That could play. Where did they take him? Do you think they stay in the Florida Keys, or do they find another roadhouse further up the coy coast?
Andy Nelson: I hope they actually go to the Double Deuce. Like, that would make me happy if they made it to the Double Deuce.
Pete Wright: Yeah. Because either they head west and look at the, you know, some back to road houses across Texas, Oklahoma, you know, those are some serious roadhouses. No dainty, you know, Hawaiian shirts there.
Andy Nelson: You know what I think they do with Guy Ritchie at the helm? I think they take him across the pond.
Pete Wright: It's a road pub.
Andy Nelson: It's a road pub.
Pete Wright: Okay. So you were saying there's another one? Nope. Does that it? Did you finish it?
I finished it. Alright. How did you do an award season?
Andy Nelson: It actually had one win with two other nominations over the American Cinema Editors' Eddie Awards. It was nominated and won for best edited feature film non theatrical. So they've actually hit a point with the that award where they now have they've created a category specifically for feature films that are non theatrical. At what point does that happen to the Oscars? Best feature film,
Pete Wright: non Non theatrical. Yeah. It's I mean, it'll be another thirty years given how long it took us to get stunts.
Andy Nelson: Jeez. No kidding. No kidding. Anyway, so there's that at South by Southwest where it premiered. It was nominated for the Headliners Audience Award, but lost to Monkey Man.
And at the Michigan Movie Critic Guild Awards, it was nominated for best stunts but lost to Monkey Man, which is interesting because Monkey Man also beat the Fall Guy, which is about Don't
Pete Wright: just move me about stunts.
Andy Nelson: I guess Monkey Man stunts are fantastic. Anyway
Pete Wright: Well, you haven't you haven't seen Monkey Man?
Andy Nelson: I haven't seen it yet.
Pete Wright: Okay. We're gonna that's got just we're that's gonna be on our series next year. We need to talk about Monkey Man.
Andy Nelson: Okay. You you've got so many
Pete Wright: series to Now that god. This is gonna be a hard one. Alright. How to do at the box office. This isn't gonna be easy.
Andy Nelson: No. According to reports, Lyman and Gyllenhaal, we talked about they had a choice. Open theatre theopen theatrically and get a budget of $60,000,000 or go straight to streaming and get a budget of $85,000,000. They chose the latter even if Lyman didn't seem to remember that when he went off on Amazon in his Deadline Hollywood piece. After its, premiere at South by Southwest March eighth twenty twenty four, it had its streaming premiere on March 21.
And then because it never went theatrical, that is all I have, unfortunately.
Pete Wright: This segment is a real bore when it just goes streaming.
Trailer: I know.
Andy Nelson: Makes it tough.
Pete Wright: At least we have some Lyman drama.
Andy Nelson: That's it. Yes. That always helps. Well,
Pete Wright: again, I is it a perfect movie? No. It's not a perfect movie. But does it does it achieve what it sets out to do? On second viewing, I'm thrilled to say, yes, it does.
I had a good time.
Andy Nelson: Yeah. It's a fun film. I enjoy the first one more, but I was surprised because I I'd heard things about this and I thought this is gonna be one of those just terrible remakes where it just didn't need to happen at all. I think that Gyllenhaal and O'Connor are bringing enough to it. And I think Lyman has some good energy that they make it a lot of fun.
I I had a lot of fun with it. McGregor, not O'Connor. McGregor.
Pete Wright: I was gonna say, who's this O'Connor you're talking That'd be good to work that in.
Andy Nelson: Yeah. Alright. Yeah. So anyway, I had a great time and, that's it. So we'll be right back for our ratings.
But first, inspired by our discussion of the omega man in our disease film series, we are launching a new exploration of Richard Matheson's I Am Legend adaptations. Here's the trailer for next week's movie from 1964. It's the last man on Earth.
Trailer: We switch you to the state capital where his excellency, the governor, is speaking from the Executive Mansion. Further, I have, in conjunction with the federal government, declared this state to be a disaster area.
Trailer: I was sent to keep you here until they come.
Trailer: To kill me. Vampires, alive among the lifeless, that make the night hideous with their inhuman cravings. If they are not destroyed in the flaming pits of hellfire, or staked to the ground in the light of the sun, Will the unbelievable become real? A world of inanimate zombies by day? Irresistible, horrifying attackers by night?
Can a zombie woman's hunger for love repopulate the earth?
Pete Wright: Oi, you legends. Listen up. Yeah? If you're not part of the next real's inner circle yet, what are you even doing with your life? You like sitting on the sidelines where the real champions feast.
No, mate. Step into the octagon with us at treestory.fm/join and claim what's yours. We're talking early access to every episode, periodic bonus episodes that'll hit you harder than a lift hook in episode bonus content because you deserve more than the amateur. Your own personal podcast feed tailor made like a sharp suit with no pants. And free versions of select episodes, none of that sponsor jab are throwing you down.
Front row seats to livestream recordings. See the chaos as it happens. VIP access to exclusive Discord channels where only the finest minds roam. And most importantly, the satisfaction of knowing you're not just a bystander, you're directly supporting the podcast you love the way real champions back their crew. So what are you waiting for?
Move your ass to truestory.fm/join, and let's show the world how it's done.
Pete Wright: Letterbox, Sandy. Letterbox, where we assign our stars and hearts to the movies we love. As you no doubt recall, no half stars, and you have a fixed number of stars across the universe to use. Appoint them accordingly. What are gonna do?
The last film, Roadhouse 1989, initially knew it
Andy Nelson: was like three stars, and then I went up to four stars. This film, I think I think that this is I'm gonna say three and a half. I mean, I had a lot of fun with it. I'll I'll say three and a half and be okay with that. I don't enjoy it as much as the first one, but
Pete Wright: Well, you're not okay with it. You're not okay with it because you've already violated no half stars rule. I am going to give
Andy Nelson: Andy half stars, Nelson. You're Pete half stars. Right?
Pete Wright: In my mind and my heart, you are no half stars, Nelson. You may not live it. I'm three stars in a heart. This is a right down the middle fun action film. I'm not not gonna watch it again someday.
There's a sales pitch. Yeah. Yeah. That's the poster line. Right?
I won't not watch this movie, Pete, the next reel.
Andy Nelson: It's it's a very fun movie. This would be a very easy movie to to watch again. Were it on? I think that the key is, like, it's an easier one to just rewatch if it's on. But I mean, you don't just watch TV anymore.
Nothing's just on anymore. So it's like, you know, I mean, I would would I hit play on it again? Sure. But it's I may not watch it as immediately as if it was just something that happened to be on. Yeah.
So there you go.
Pete Wright: The the what's interesting about it is I'd probably watch it again sooner than the original Roadhouse just because it's newer and and more different.
Andy Nelson: I would totally watch the original first.
Trailer: Yeah.
Andy Nelson: But there you go. Alright. Well, that averages out to 3.25, which will round up to 3 and a half and a heart. You'll find that over in our account on Letterboxd at the next reel. You can find me there at Soda Creek Film.
You're gonna find Pete there at Pete Wright. So what did you think about Roadhouse 2024? We would love to hear your thoughts. Hop into the ShowTalk channel over in our Discord community, where we will be talking about the movie
Pete Wright: this week. When the movie ends
Andy Nelson: Our conversation begins. One one little note that I didn't even realize that I was gonna call it out. There is I mean, you mentioned, the cameo of the guy at the beginning post Malone. Right? Yeah.
In the Roadhouse, there's also a cameo that I would never have been able to point out to you. Who's that? It's it is a it's a couple that's dancing. And I'm watching, and my wife is like, oh, that's Miranda Derrick and her husband, B Dash. And I'm like, who?
Pete Wright: She just made up those people.
Andy Nelson: It sounded like it. Apparently, they are TikTok dance influencers. And so I think that Doug Liman probably purposely, you know, stunt cast them to be in a dancing scene here. I guess also my wife said there's a Netflix documentary about her being in a cult that is all of these different TikTok dance influencers.
Pete Wright: Oh, Andy. I know who these people are. You do. Okay. There you go.
They are dance influencers. I've seen their videos.
Andy Nelson: Have you?
Pete Wright: I don't have TikTok, so when so it has to be, like, reposted somewhere. But I totally know. I'm watching them get, jiggy with it right now.
Andy Nelson: There you go. We're gonna do a little TikTok dance. Yeah. Yeah. So they are in Roadhouse.
I'm trying to find a clip right now. Of course, it's on it's on TikTok. So but yeah.
Pete Wright: Yeah. So it's just hard to do. Alright.
Andy Nelson: Holding their drinks and they're dancing to the music. Yeah. There you go.
Pete Wright: Letterbox giveth, Andrew. As Letterbox always doeth. Okay. This the reviews some of the reviews are are quite funny.
Andy Nelson: Yes.
Pete Wright: You I why don't you go first?
Andy Nelson: Okay. I'm going first. I'm reading a, Matt Singer's, full review. You can find it at ScreenCrush, but here's three and a half and a heart from Matt Singer. Roadhouse became a cult classic because it was fun to watch on cable.
None of it was hard to understand, or at least none of it made any less sense if you flip to it halfway through. No matter where you started or stopped watching it, you were guaranteed to see some thrills, some violence, some sex appeal, and probably a couple laughs, intentional or otherwise. While the cable TV movie ecosystem seems to be going extinct, the new Roadhouse would have thrived in it as well. This is the kind of consistently entertaining movie you could happily watch a hundred times without ever actively intending to watch it twice. I love that line.
By its conclusion, it accumulates the atmosphere of a great bar, a place you go less to get drunk than to soak in the vibes of the music and the regulars. It is so much better than it has any right to be. Okay.
Pete Wright: Yeah. Well, I have I'm gonna do two from two different people, and they just are a celebration of Jake Gyllenhaal. Here you go. Two and a half stars from Sophie who says, Jake Gyllenhaal, please go back to playing weird little freaks. Your eyes are still so full of untold horrors and dread.
I know you can still do it. And another from a different person, Cobb, with three stars in a heart who just says, I miss when Jake Gyllenhaal played weird little freaks. There's a there's a whole weird little freak corner of Jake Gyllenhaal's catalog. I I I think it's been a little while since he played a little freak, and people are still down for it.
Andy Nelson: Clearly. Fantastic.
Pete Wright: Like to see a completely roided out, like, shredded Donnie Darko?
Andy Nelson: Right. Or or Nightcrawler as he's, you know Yeah. Lifting weights when he's not laid out Right. Out late at night.
Pete Wright: Oh, that's funny. Well, thanks, Amazon. Wait. Letterboxd. Well, thanks, Letterboxd.
And Amazon, you did great too bringing this movie too. And, you know, Jake and Joel, sorry about the job, man. Stop being a dick.
Andy Nelson: I'm done. Oh, good.