1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:03,730 Welcome to Digication Scholars Conversations. 2 00:00:04,210 --> 00:00:05,530 I'm your host, Jeff Yan. 3 00:00:06,100 --> 00:00:09,739 In this episode, you will hear part one of my conversation with Sylvia 4 00:00:09,789 --> 00:00:13,700 Spears, Provost and Vice President for Lifelong Learning at College Unbound. 5 00:00:14,860 --> 00:00:18,649 More links and information about today's conversation can be found on Digication's 6 00:00:18,860 --> 00:00:20,340 Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. 7 00:00:21,224 --> 00:00:24,474 Full episodes of Digication Scholars Conversations can be found on 8 00:00:24,485 --> 00:00:25,805 YouTube or your favorite podcast app. 9 00:00:27,895 --> 00:00:30,305 Welcome to Digication Scholars Conversations. 10 00:00:30,495 --> 00:00:31,715 I'm your host Jeff Yan. 11 00:00:32,284 --> 00:00:37,065 My guest today is Sylvia Spears, Provost and Vice President for 12 00:00:37,075 --> 00:00:39,144 Lifelong Learning at College Unbound. 13 00:00:39,780 --> 00:00:40,610 Hello, Sylvia. 14 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:41,720 Good morning. 15 00:00:41,730 --> 00:00:42,590 How are you? 16 00:00:43,350 --> 00:00:44,010 Good, good. 17 00:00:44,010 --> 00:00:46,370 I love your, I love your energy. 18 00:00:46,370 --> 00:00:51,570 You know, um, first of all, Sylvia, I've been such a big fan of College Unbound. 19 00:00:51,570 --> 00:00:55,729 I think that you've, you've, I think you know at this point because I, I 20 00:00:55,729 --> 00:01:00,980 keep showing up to, to your events and to, to, to, to your campus and 21 00:01:00,980 --> 00:01:02,450 then to all, to your locations. 22 00:01:02,980 --> 00:01:07,509 Um, I, I, um, I want to share really quickly. 23 00:01:08,210 --> 00:01:16,560 To people, um, with, with listeners, uh, how I first met you in person, I don't, 24 00:01:16,590 --> 00:01:18,090 you wouldn't, you may not remember this. 25 00:01:19,119 --> 00:01:22,980 It was actually last fall at a, I think I met you before 26 00:01:22,980 --> 00:01:24,269 online, but never in person. 27 00:01:24,949 --> 00:01:31,490 Um, and last fall you were hosting a, um, um, a session at 28 00:01:31,490 --> 00:01:37,499 an amazing, um, conference, um, called, um, Imagining America. 29 00:01:38,270 --> 00:01:44,220 Um, And, uh, you hosted a session, um, and it was also early in the morning. 30 00:01:44,220 --> 00:01:45,990 I think it was getting an 8 AM session. 31 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:53,319 And, um, and a lot of people were packing this room and, uh, it was at a local, 32 00:01:53,330 --> 00:01:58,589 it was located at a local high school and, um, and it was, we were packed in 33 00:01:58,589 --> 00:02:05,270 this room, sitting in this, you know, giant circle kind of, and, uh, you had. 34 00:02:05,665 --> 00:02:07,975 Um, music playing. 35 00:02:08,015 --> 00:02:10,105 It was John Batiste, Drink Water. 36 00:02:10,225 --> 00:02:11,805 I, I, I remember every bit of this. 37 00:02:13,355 --> 00:02:18,025 And I was sitting in one of the corners and you were just dancing 38 00:02:18,035 --> 00:02:19,704 in the middle of this room. 39 00:02:21,465 --> 00:02:24,105 And we were all sort of waiting for the session to start. 40 00:02:24,135 --> 00:02:28,549 And, and it was just like, wow, she's, she's this super energetic lady. 41 00:02:28,549 --> 00:02:34,920 And, and just, she, you know, It's just enjoying life and it was infectious. 42 00:02:34,920 --> 00:02:39,440 And all of us were just starting to like, man, we want to get up and dance. 43 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:40,940 And then you're like, get up and dance. 44 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:42,009 You can't stop it. 45 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:43,090 You have to move. 46 00:02:43,100 --> 00:02:45,400 Your body wants to move, move. 47 00:02:45,870 --> 00:02:50,519 And we all started getting up and dancing and it was 8am. 48 00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:51,970 There was no coffee needed. 49 00:02:52,300 --> 00:02:53,180 It was amazing. 50 00:02:53,220 --> 00:02:54,100 And that was my. 51 00:02:54,345 --> 00:02:56,525 Very first impression of you, Sylvia. 52 00:02:56,575 --> 00:02:57,215 Wow. 53 00:02:57,605 --> 00:02:58,635 That's amazing. 54 00:02:58,705 --> 00:03:05,064 Um, thank you for, for just reflecting on that moment because it was fun. 55 00:03:05,084 --> 00:03:10,944 And, um, you know, conferences can be really meaningful and great. 56 00:03:10,955 --> 00:03:15,845 And, you know, there's the transmission of lots of interesting insights and ideas. 57 00:03:16,255 --> 00:03:19,325 And at eight o'clock in the morning. 58 00:03:19,590 --> 00:03:25,570 It's kind of a little bit of judgery to get to a conference session, and we all 59 00:03:25,570 --> 00:03:31,800 know that you can walk into a conference session and it can be the driest, most 60 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:36,799 boring, almost painful experience, and if you're stuck in a room that's 61 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:38,750 crowded, you know you can't escape. 62 00:03:39,130 --> 00:03:45,130 And so for me, how people come into a space, is really important because it sets 63 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:50,370 the tone for the journey we're about to go on in any workshop or in a classroom. 64 00:03:50,709 --> 00:03:54,619 Um, and so, I, I felt like dancing. 65 00:03:54,619 --> 00:03:56,280 It seemed like it was a good day. 66 00:03:56,350 --> 00:04:01,190 John Baptiste, that song, Drink Water, is one of my favorite songs. 67 00:04:01,609 --> 00:04:04,920 And, uh, it seemed like a good time to dance. 68 00:04:05,499 --> 00:04:11,890 And, uh, I think it, Help people to both be in their bodies and be ready 69 00:04:11,890 --> 00:04:16,670 for whatever we were going to do, uh, together, uh, in a dynamic mode. 70 00:04:16,750 --> 00:04:21,370 So, uh, thanks so much for, for just remembering that, uh, that moment. 71 00:04:22,280 --> 00:04:26,609 Uh, well, I also want to thank you that you also did, you know, and lift 72 00:04:26,610 --> 00:04:30,549 up to the, to the, to the opening, all the way through your session, because 73 00:04:30,550 --> 00:04:34,920 you did not then spend, um, 20 minutes telling us about, you know, like a 74 00:04:35,210 --> 00:04:40,670 really long bio of both you and your institution, but we went straight into it. 75 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:45,260 And by the way, the conversation was about how can we reimagine higher education? 76 00:04:45,930 --> 00:04:48,509 And I think it was really, I mean, it was really apt way for 77 00:04:48,510 --> 00:04:50,200 us to think about it because. 78 00:04:50,695 --> 00:04:54,735 And just so people know, you are the provost at College Unbound. 79 00:04:54,795 --> 00:04:55,685 Yes, indeed. 80 00:04:56,235 --> 00:05:00,505 There are people who are listening to this right now who might be, um, high 81 00:05:00,505 --> 00:05:05,364 school students, who might be people who, um, who are not familiar with, 82 00:05:05,855 --> 00:05:08,784 you know, What the heck is a provost? 83 00:05:09,474 --> 00:05:12,805 What's a provost at a college and tell us a little bit about what a 84 00:05:12,805 --> 00:05:17,964 provost is and, and what is what is college unbound in your role there. 85 00:05:18,004 --> 00:05:19,274 And then we'll, we'll start there. 86 00:05:19,275 --> 00:05:23,025 And then we'd love to dig deeper into how you come to be Sylvia. 87 00:05:23,135 --> 00:05:23,705 Okay. 88 00:05:24,105 --> 00:05:25,934 Um, perhaps I'll start with. 89 00:05:26,345 --> 00:05:30,255 College Unbound because being provost at College Unbound could 90 00:05:30,255 --> 00:05:33,935 be a little different than being provost at a traditional college. 91 00:05:33,935 --> 00:05:34,774 And you're right. 92 00:05:34,825 --> 00:05:40,455 Um, so College Unbound, uh, is indeed an accredited colleges for people who, 93 00:05:40,814 --> 00:05:42,535 uh, for whom that's really important. 94 00:05:42,924 --> 00:05:45,545 Um, it's a college that is young. 95 00:05:45,595 --> 00:05:47,975 It's about 14 years old. 96 00:05:48,435 --> 00:05:54,495 Um, Co founded by Dennis Litke, who is a high school educator, principal, and 97 00:05:54,495 --> 00:05:59,225 the founder of a whole group of schools. 98 00:05:59,225 --> 00:06:02,755 I think there's more than 150 high schools in that network now. 99 00:06:03,175 --> 00:06:11,164 And Adam Bush, who is an incredible educator, jazz historian, social justice 100 00:06:11,194 --> 00:06:14,760 advocate, just a Wonderful human being. 101 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:20,410 So they founded a school, um, and over time it's involved into a school 102 00:06:20,410 --> 00:06:27,640 specifically designed to, um, one, reinvent higher education so that it 103 00:06:27,669 --> 00:06:30,089 actually meets the needs of all students. 104 00:06:30,679 --> 00:06:37,294 Um, two, to ensure that there's access to education, um, For students who are 105 00:06:37,294 --> 00:06:42,585 typically marginalized from education, who are on the edges of education, who have 106 00:06:42,585 --> 00:06:45,245 had negative experiences in education. 107 00:06:45,565 --> 00:06:50,515 And so, so much of our work is around helping people fulfill 108 00:06:50,515 --> 00:06:53,135 their dreams of obtaining a degree. 109 00:06:53,634 --> 00:06:58,164 And not just for the purpose of getting a degree, but a degree that allows 110 00:06:58,215 --> 00:07:02,195 them to create change in their own lives, change for their families, 111 00:07:02,234 --> 00:07:03,755 and change for their communities. 112 00:07:04,465 --> 00:07:06,474 So, it's this. 113 00:07:07,840 --> 00:07:11,910 that functions in a way that's very different from a traditional college. 114 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:16,240 We value student learning that happens outside of the classroom. 115 00:07:16,790 --> 00:07:21,810 We value the lived experience of individuals and communities and credit 116 00:07:21,910 --> 00:07:28,030 that experience, uh, without a lot of hoops, um, but with a sense of, um, 117 00:07:28,230 --> 00:07:32,310 Reflection and quality around what was the nature of their experience 118 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:38,620 and the college is just grounded in an environment of deep relationship 119 00:07:38,820 --> 00:07:45,839 with people and a community of care, a cohort based model, uh, projects. 120 00:07:46,045 --> 00:07:50,815 That, um, students do over the course of their time at CU where they 121 00:07:50,815 --> 00:07:55,445 develop projects, cultivate them, and many of them implement afterwards. 122 00:07:55,535 --> 00:08:02,264 So if I were to, um, think about how to capture CU in a nutshell, I would say it's 123 00:08:02,264 --> 00:08:05,205 a, a college committed to relationship. 124 00:08:06,110 --> 00:08:11,040 Relevance of the curriculum to the students who go to school with us 125 00:08:11,540 --> 00:08:17,370 and rigor that it's academically, um, challenging and meaningful to students. 126 00:08:18,650 --> 00:08:24,879 At CU, the provost is, um, responsible for and facilitating and 127 00:08:24,879 --> 00:08:28,660 supporting all of the life of the college that's related to learning. 128 00:08:29,490 --> 00:08:33,040 So all of the things that are, what's the array of courses? 129 00:08:33,660 --> 00:08:34,789 Who's teaching? 130 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:36,760 What does teaching look like? 131 00:08:37,659 --> 00:08:43,600 Is it the kind of teaching where a faculty member walks into a room with old yellow 132 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:49,069 lined, um, pad of paper, you remember those professors who did that, and reads 133 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:52,759 the same notes semester after semester? 134 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:54,149 That's not CU. 135 00:08:54,890 --> 00:09:00,950 At CU, education is dynamic, it's lots of discussion, uh, lots of, uh, 136 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:07,050 connecting theory to practice, to lived experience, and so I have the, the 137 00:09:07,050 --> 00:09:13,159 joy, the honor of working with faculty and staff and students to create a 138 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:18,989 robust learning environment in which students can thrive rather than survive. 139 00:09:19,380 --> 00:09:26,420 In my career, I've watched students at all kinds of institutions, public 140 00:09:26,420 --> 00:09:32,640 institutions, private institutions, Ivy League institutions, come to 141 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:36,699 campus with all kinds of aspirations, and some can be highly successful. 142 00:09:37,209 --> 00:09:42,770 And I've also watched some students come to those campuses, and actually 143 00:09:42,770 --> 00:09:49,530 I watched the light go out of their eyes, and they either disappear, or 144 00:09:49,530 --> 00:09:55,320 they graduate, but they graduate not because of what the college did for them. 145 00:09:56,170 --> 00:09:58,740 They graduate in spite of the college. 146 00:09:59,209 --> 00:10:04,570 And so I've spent my entire career working in traditional educational 147 00:10:04,590 --> 00:10:09,935 spaces, trying to ensure that we can create an environment that creates less 148 00:10:09,935 --> 00:10:12,224 harm and actually supports students. 149 00:10:12,395 --> 00:10:13,604 And then I found CU. 150 00:10:14,555 --> 00:10:19,045 For years, I was saying, I don't know if you can change institutions. 151 00:10:19,645 --> 00:10:21,734 Can you change them from the inside out? 152 00:10:22,224 --> 00:10:25,655 Or are you tinkering on the edges of a college? 153 00:10:26,334 --> 00:10:33,195 And even at my last institution, I said to my team, my staff, my kindreds, 154 00:10:33,235 --> 00:10:36,955 I have to say, you know, we would sit in deep discussion sometimes 155 00:10:37,015 --> 00:10:39,340 and think, You can't change them. 156 00:10:39,940 --> 00:10:42,150 You can reduce harm, but you can't change them. 157 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:47,740 And one of the folks on my team said, Sylvia, we have to build a college. 158 00:10:48,710 --> 00:10:50,240 You have to start your own college. 159 00:10:50,580 --> 00:10:53,550 And the good news is I didn't have to start my own college 160 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,460 because Adam and Dennis had already started College Unbound. 161 00:10:57,730 --> 00:10:59,910 And it is unbound. 162 00:11:00,935 --> 00:11:04,165 That's not just a throwaway part of our title. 163 00:11:04,655 --> 00:11:09,395 It's embedded in everything we do to try to unbind it, to loosen it, 164 00:11:09,635 --> 00:11:13,824 to make it an innovative space where students can come in and really 165 00:11:13,834 --> 00:11:15,555 be them best, their best selves. 166 00:11:16,314 --> 00:11:17,444 They're the magic. 167 00:11:18,165 --> 00:11:19,454 They're already talented. 168 00:11:20,020 --> 00:11:21,390 They already have expertise. 169 00:11:22,849 --> 00:11:24,520 I, I love this, Sylvia. 170 00:11:24,620 --> 00:11:29,460 And I, I think everyone can hear the passion that comes from just your voice. 171 00:11:29,540 --> 00:11:31,300 You know, it's, it's, it's so awesome. 172 00:11:31,820 --> 00:11:35,760 Um, there is something that you were, you know, you were talking about the 173 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:43,460 yellow line paper, you know, sort of, I think that there is a lot of people 174 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:52,300 who have, I would, I would say even the, you know, like many people considered, 175 00:11:52,340 --> 00:11:58,480 you know, If you go to someone who's been out of school for 20 years, maybe a 176 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:02,400 parent, the idea of education is about. 177 00:12:04,310 --> 00:12:05,830 Acquiring more content. 178 00:12:06,460 --> 00:12:12,800 It's a content acquisition exercise and that the professor has a lot of content. 179 00:12:12,809 --> 00:12:15,510 It's almost like they have a lot of products that you need and they're 180 00:12:15,510 --> 00:12:19,670 just gonna sell it to you and they'll, they'll, they'll, you're supposed 181 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,189 to just transfer that content to your, from their head to your head 182 00:12:23,869 --> 00:12:25,809 and then, and then you're educated. 183 00:12:27,250 --> 00:12:32,080 And, and that seems to be in my mind, always have this almost like this, like 184 00:12:32,100 --> 00:12:38,240 almost cartoonish, you know, like all that they want to do is to say, I have all this 185 00:12:39,179 --> 00:12:42,449 content that someone transferred to me and now I'm going to transfer it to you. 186 00:12:42,599 --> 00:12:45,089 And I, you just keep passing it on as education. 187 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:49,290 But when I hear about how you talk about education. 188 00:12:49,930 --> 00:12:51,850 It's just not that at all. 189 00:12:52,490 --> 00:12:56,500 It's actually about each person going out to live. 190 00:12:56,530 --> 00:12:58,949 They go dance, they go enjoy themselves. 191 00:12:58,949 --> 00:13:01,639 They go solve problems in the community. 192 00:13:01,650 --> 00:13:04,270 They go and be friends with another person. 193 00:13:04,660 --> 00:13:07,090 They go and help another person. 194 00:13:07,090 --> 00:13:12,690 They go in and, um, be the, be the, be the daughter or the son that they 195 00:13:12,700 --> 00:13:14,480 should be for their, for their parents. 196 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:18,849 And by doing so, by those lived experience. 197 00:13:19,869 --> 00:13:27,390 Themselves, you learn and become, um, educated and that's a really different 198 00:13:27,449 --> 00:13:29,920 model of thinking about education. 199 00:13:30,140 --> 00:13:32,019 I'm by the way, clearly on your camp. 200 00:13:34,500 --> 00:13:40,079 I think I too, I don't, I think I was like fairly good at being a student. 201 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:41,840 I never enjoyed it. 202 00:13:41,890 --> 00:13:48,480 I would say that I probably, I grew up in Hong Kong, um, when I was a kid and, 203 00:13:48,530 --> 00:13:54,545 um, I, I felt like there was like a huge amount of education trauma, you know, 204 00:13:54,584 --> 00:14:00,785 just like, like you literally have to do this or you, you literally get physically 205 00:14:00,795 --> 00:14:02,464 beatings for not doing something. 206 00:14:03,345 --> 00:14:04,645 Could be from your teacher, by the way. 207 00:14:05,555 --> 00:14:09,105 Um, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's, it's crazy in my mind. 208 00:14:09,105 --> 00:14:09,294 Right. 209 00:14:09,455 --> 00:14:11,845 But it's all about like, they gave you the content. 210 00:14:11,855 --> 00:14:13,395 Why don't you know it already? 211 00:14:13,445 --> 00:14:13,845 Right. 212 00:14:14,375 --> 00:14:19,365 And if you don't know it, maybe beating you will somehow get you to know it. 213 00:14:19,910 --> 00:14:21,170 Now you know, right? 214 00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:25,280 So it's completely, so like from that, like, you know, for me, 215 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:29,300 then I, I sort of learned to be a good enough student, right? 216 00:14:29,330 --> 00:14:34,400 But that kind of education never really, in my mind, never 217 00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:35,969 really benefited me very much. 218 00:14:36,659 --> 00:14:40,834 It always feels like it's the kind of thing where They're supposed to give you 219 00:14:40,844 --> 00:14:46,475 all this content and somehow you know how to reflect on them and internalize 220 00:14:46,485 --> 00:14:49,785 them and turn it into your own experience and that's when you learn, but you just 221 00:14:49,785 --> 00:14:51,765 go, well, why don't we just bypass that? 222 00:14:52,114 --> 00:14:53,984 Why don't we just go straight into the experience? 223 00:14:54,295 --> 00:14:54,625 Right? 224 00:14:54,725 --> 00:14:55,085 Yeah. 225 00:14:55,135 --> 00:14:57,085 I think that sounds so lovely. 226 00:14:57,255 --> 00:15:02,604 Yeah, and, and, you know, there's all, everything we know, everything 227 00:15:02,604 --> 00:15:04,474 educators know about learning. 228 00:15:04,655 --> 00:15:08,244 And so we've got the people who study the brain, we've got people 229 00:15:08,244 --> 00:15:12,154 who study cognition, we've got study, people who study the acquisition of 230 00:15:12,154 --> 00:15:14,894 information, all of that research. 231 00:15:15,129 --> 00:15:20,250 Tells us that that kind of education, that traditional model of education, 232 00:15:20,449 --> 00:15:26,160 where we're depositing content into people's brain does not work. 233 00:15:27,019 --> 00:15:31,019 It means, yeah, you can recite that information back. 234 00:15:31,090 --> 00:15:36,180 And then, maaan!, you know, a day or two after you took that 235 00:15:36,180 --> 00:15:38,230 quiz or did that test, it's gone. 236 00:15:38,260 --> 00:15:39,240 It's not yours. 237 00:15:39,930 --> 00:15:43,480 It was a temporary visitor that came and went, and if it's not 238 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:45,029 relevant to you, you let it go. 239 00:15:45,459 --> 00:15:51,719 Um, one of the most powerful readings for me when I was, um, uh, in my own 240 00:15:51,749 --> 00:15:55,580 educational journey was reading Paulo Freire's Pedagogy of the Oppressed. 241 00:15:56,885 --> 00:16:02,885 And, uh, I think it's in the first chapter, Frere talks about the, the 242 00:16:02,895 --> 00:16:11,454 banking method of education and really just, um, dismantles the notion that 243 00:16:11,464 --> 00:16:18,734 that kind of education actually is useful, meaningful, has long term, um, 244 00:16:19,245 --> 00:16:24,905 you know, value and talked about how important it is to be with students 245 00:16:25,055 --> 00:16:28,375 in community and unveil reality. 246 00:16:30,170 --> 00:16:36,350 People's lived reality in the context of new material, new ideas, and that's 247 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,540 something people construct together. 248 00:16:39,189 --> 00:16:45,050 Um, and, and so for me, it's just the space of College Unbound is 249 00:16:45,050 --> 00:16:47,010 exactly the opposite of that. 250 00:16:47,419 --> 00:16:51,050 Um, we don't even like to use words like teachers and instructors. 251 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:56,240 Um, you know, our accrediting agencies think that's important, but we're, 252 00:16:56,425 --> 00:17:02,845 We think about facilitators, and conveners, and supporters, and guides, 253 00:17:02,895 --> 00:17:09,804 and how we can create a learning environment that's co created together 254 00:17:10,085 --> 00:17:12,085 in community with students and teachers. 255 00:17:12,745 --> 00:17:18,835 And it's out of that kind of relationship, that space, that learning occurs. 256 00:17:19,115 --> 00:17:23,510 Not just learning for students, It's reciprocal in that it's 257 00:17:23,530 --> 00:17:27,060 learning for instructors, um, and folks who are teaching. 258 00:17:27,409 --> 00:17:33,319 Um, and those moments that happen together in a class or in a cohort or in community 259 00:17:33,319 --> 00:17:39,469 time breaking bread together, um, are distinct and magic all of their own. 260 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:42,380 And then you just, just watch them grow. 261 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:45,460 Uh, and so it's really quite, uh, quite beautiful. 262 00:17:45,470 --> 00:17:49,490 It is how education should always be. 263 00:17:49,645 --> 00:17:53,875 No matter the age of the student, from little people to folks who might be in 264 00:17:53,875 --> 00:17:56,475 their 60s and 70s going back to college. 265 00:17:58,815 --> 00:17:59,754 I love that Sylvia. 266 00:18:00,405 --> 00:18:06,555 Sylvia, I, I think that we will definitely circle back to some of the magical parts 267 00:18:06,564 --> 00:18:13,185 of College Unbound, but first I wanted to maybe go Deeper into your own history. 268 00:18:13,255 --> 00:18:13,645 Sure. 269 00:18:13,765 --> 00:18:17,385 Because I'm just fascinated how, how does Sylvia come to be? 270 00:18:17,385 --> 00:18:20,185 Where, where did you grow up? 271 00:18:20,205 --> 00:18:22,965 What is the journey that leads you to this point? 272 00:18:22,975 --> 00:18:26,385 I mean, you, like you said, you were in many different kinds of institutions. 273 00:18:26,695 --> 00:18:32,625 So for people that just think, well, you know, this, Very like, um, you know, this 274 00:18:33,284 --> 00:18:37,555 really just this person just out there talking about reinventing education. 275 00:18:37,565 --> 00:18:40,774 She, she may or may not know what education is supposed to be. 276 00:18:41,115 --> 00:18:42,825 You know, I think that's not true. 277 00:18:42,825 --> 00:18:46,134 You've been through a lot of different models as well. 278 00:18:46,134 --> 00:18:46,614 I think it's. 279 00:18:46,755 --> 00:18:49,575 Through that perspective that you can find these models that 280 00:18:49,585 --> 00:18:50,695 you can really make comparison. 281 00:18:51,045 --> 00:18:55,205 So why don't you tell us, give us a little insights to, to, you know, 282 00:18:55,225 --> 00:18:59,035 your, your upbringing and what, what made you the way you are? 283 00:18:59,075 --> 00:18:59,645 Yeah. 284 00:18:59,655 --> 00:19:00,095 Wow. 285 00:19:00,355 --> 00:19:04,504 I think my, uh, my kids probably would have an interesting insight 286 00:19:04,504 --> 00:19:08,465 on that, uh, or, you know, uh, my parents rest in peace. 287 00:19:08,795 --> 00:19:11,825 Um, but, uh, I grew up, um. 288 00:19:12,030 --> 00:19:18,419 In Rhode Island, by the ocean, uh, I, uh, love the environment of being near water. 289 00:19:18,679 --> 00:19:22,689 Um, for me, it's just, um, helps me to breathe. 290 00:19:22,689 --> 00:19:26,540 As a matter of fact, already this morning, I did a 45 minute 291 00:19:26,540 --> 00:19:29,255 walk, uh, By the, by the ocean. 292 00:19:29,615 --> 00:19:34,275 And so there's something about the ocean that, um, even growing up reminds me of 293 00:19:34,275 --> 00:19:39,775 the vastness of the world that I can't, you know, I just look to the horizon. 294 00:19:39,865 --> 00:19:43,055 So there's something grounding about that, which always has me 295 00:19:43,095 --> 00:19:44,914 as a, as kind of a disparate. 296 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:50,480 of my personality, looking out, looking far, looking past 297 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,689 what is, to what might be. 298 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:57,289 Um, and so I grew up in this area, went to, you know, your local public 299 00:19:57,289 --> 00:20:02,439 school here in town, and early, like in second grade, had a really interesting 300 00:20:02,439 --> 00:20:09,900 experience here that I, now reflect on as having shaped a lot of my experiences 301 00:20:09,900 --> 00:20:13,620 in education and why I ended up in education, to be perfectly honest. 302 00:20:13,999 --> 00:20:19,689 Um, I was painfully shy as a little kid, like really, really shy. 303 00:20:20,039 --> 00:20:24,529 Um, you know, visitors would come to see my parents and I'd run upstairs and sit 304 00:20:24,529 --> 00:20:26,379 at the top of the stairs and just listen. 305 00:20:26,639 --> 00:20:28,319 You know, I wouldn't come downstairs. 306 00:20:28,319 --> 00:20:28,949 I don't want to see them. 307 00:20:29,279 --> 00:20:31,289 Um, so I was painfully shy. 308 00:20:31,505 --> 00:20:39,525 And in school, I was really shy, and so I was quiet, um, and my mother was 309 00:20:39,525 --> 00:20:45,124 called to a parent teacher meeting, and if you can imagine back in the day, 310 00:20:45,125 --> 00:20:50,985 those meetings were really kind of an exercise of power, uh, for some teachers, 311 00:20:51,324 --> 00:20:53,965 um, where they made parents feel small. 312 00:20:54,525 --> 00:20:59,815 And my mother might have been five feet tall, but she was not small in, in, 313 00:20:59,815 --> 00:21:02,200 uh, Kind of personality and stature. 314 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:05,660 Um, she was a mighty tiny woman. 315 00:21:06,150 --> 00:21:10,850 Anyhow, this particular teacher said something like, um, Sylvia 316 00:21:10,850 --> 00:21:13,219 is very smart, but she's lazy. 317 00:21:14,519 --> 00:21:18,699 And I remember sitting out, I was sitting in a tiny chair outside of that 318 00:21:18,709 --> 00:21:21,290 door to that classroom and I heard it. 319 00:21:21,590 --> 00:21:25,750 And even though, you know, you're a little kid at, you know, in the second 320 00:21:25,750 --> 00:21:28,490 grade, I remember the feeling of hurt. 321 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:31,390 I, I, I wasn't lazy. 322 00:21:31,390 --> 00:21:37,610 I was Paralyzed with fear because the environment was so uncomfortable. 323 00:21:38,260 --> 00:21:41,139 My mother, of course, also taught me about advocacy. 324 00:21:41,139 --> 00:21:46,290 She left that meeting, took my hand, went straight down to the principal's 325 00:21:46,290 --> 00:21:52,139 office, explained that interaction and talked about no to Teacher should 326 00:21:52,199 --> 00:21:57,620 ever think any child is lazy and, um, I was immediately removed from 327 00:21:57,620 --> 00:22:00,520 that class, put in a different class. 328 00:22:00,830 --> 00:22:07,519 The environment was supportive and warm and friendly and, and I was 329 00:22:07,909 --> 00:22:11,720 happy, did great and apparently I wasn't late, late, lazy. 330 00:22:12,070 --> 00:22:14,560 Um, the interesting thing is. 331 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:22,090 Decades later, when I went back to get my doctorate, uh, in education, in 332 00:22:22,090 --> 00:22:29,440 my, uh, dissertation, uh, introduction or, or acknowledgement page, there's 333 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:34,740 a long acknowledgement page where I acknowledge my parents for, you know, 334 00:22:34,780 --> 00:22:36,689 teaching me the value of education. 335 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:42,330 I acknowledge my kids for demonstrating all of the excitement of learning. 336 00:22:42,770 --> 00:22:44,550 I acknowledge that teacher. 337 00:22:46,135 --> 00:22:50,264 Not in a warm and fuzzy way, but in a way where there was a line that 338 00:22:50,264 --> 00:22:52,655 said, Do you think I'm lazy now? 339 00:22:54,044 --> 00:22:59,935 And so as a learner, I, in most situations, whether it was the 340 00:22:59,935 --> 00:23:03,685 Catholic high school that I went to, or the public institution that 341 00:23:03,685 --> 00:23:10,970 I got my bachelor's at, um, I, I'm a kind of, um, Voracious learner. 342 00:23:11,090 --> 00:23:12,370 I love to read. 343 00:23:12,390 --> 00:23:16,080 I love to be in community with people and learn new things. 344 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:22,300 So the pivot for me to, to higher ed actually occurred 345 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:24,570 after I graduated from college. 346 00:23:25,089 --> 00:23:29,830 I was out in the world working, um, believe it or not, working at, 347 00:23:29,939 --> 00:23:32,920 uh, health and fitness centers. 348 00:23:35,085 --> 00:23:37,975 Don't ask me, that's the job I got, you know. 349 00:23:38,815 --> 00:23:42,565 So, working at health and fitness centers for a long time and managing them. 350 00:23:43,094 --> 00:23:48,674 And, um, I came back to Rhode Island, um, when my daughter was about 3 years old. 351 00:23:49,064 --> 00:23:51,854 And, because it's important to be near your family and your grandparents. 352 00:23:51,855 --> 00:23:57,665 And started to work, um, for a tribal community here, 353 00:23:57,665 --> 00:23:59,675 which is part of my heritage. 354 00:24:00,275 --> 00:24:05,225 As, um, uh, I think I was Personnel Director and then went 355 00:24:05,225 --> 00:24:06,825 on to be Tribal Administrator. 356 00:24:07,145 --> 00:24:11,095 One day I was looking at some data about the educational levels 357 00:24:11,135 --> 00:24:13,195 of, of people in the tribe. 358 00:24:14,165 --> 00:24:19,490 And I discovered, um, that, The percentage of people who had 359 00:24:19,490 --> 00:24:25,690 attended college, not just graduated, attended, was so incredibly low it 360 00:24:25,710 --> 00:24:30,339 almost couldn't be represented by a, by a number, by a percentage. 361 00:24:30,339 --> 00:24:34,530 It was, uh, on the chart I was looking at, it was less than one percent. 362 00:24:36,180 --> 00:24:43,429 We're in a tiny little state with like 13 colleges and one that is actually sitting 363 00:24:43,429 --> 00:24:47,889 in the midst of, you know, uh, native land that belongs to the folks here. 364 00:24:48,120 --> 00:24:49,480 Or historically would have. 365 00:24:50,500 --> 00:24:54,610 And then I started to dig more and I started to look at national data. 366 00:24:55,360 --> 00:25:00,909 Less than four tenths of a percent of, um, native folks in the country 367 00:25:00,909 --> 00:25:03,110 at that time had bachelor's degrees. 368 00:25:04,139 --> 00:25:05,540 And I was like, this is outrageous. 369 00:25:05,540 --> 00:25:06,659 What is happening? 370 00:25:07,179 --> 00:25:13,250 And that day I decided to go to back to school, um, to get my master's degree 371 00:25:13,730 --> 00:25:21,275 so that I could be kind of, uh, A runner, an intermediary between higher 372 00:25:21,275 --> 00:25:25,635 ed spaces and, um, communities of color. 373 00:25:26,414 --> 00:25:32,164 A translator, um, because so often folks would say, I'm not going to 374 00:25:32,165 --> 00:25:33,744 college, why would I go to college? 375 00:25:33,745 --> 00:25:35,184 There's nothing for me there. 376 00:25:36,234 --> 00:25:43,635 Um, or even my, my, um, master's research, the findings of the study that I did 377 00:25:43,875 --> 00:25:48,575 was that, um, Native American students felt like they were making a choice. 378 00:25:49,534 --> 00:25:53,715 Between being a, uh, a good student or a good Indian. 379 00:25:54,575 --> 00:25:57,465 That's literally what the students would say to me. 380 00:25:58,065 --> 00:26:03,355 And so, for them, college was not feeling like a place that valued their culture, 381 00:26:03,925 --> 00:26:10,530 the way of, um, gaining knowledge, uh, And so that set me on a whole career 382 00:26:10,550 --> 00:26:16,170 of working in multicultural student services, working on pluralism efforts, 383 00:26:16,469 --> 00:26:20,800 um, teaching, um, but teaching in human development with an emphasis on 384 00:26:20,820 --> 00:26:27,159 equity and, uh, and justice, um, all of the roles I've ever had, whether 385 00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:32,490 they Faculty roles or administrative roles have always been about how do 386 00:26:32,490 --> 00:26:38,979 we create a more humane, inclusive space of education for all learners. 387 00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:44,740 And so that's a, that's a, you know, about 30 years of, of, of work 388 00:26:44,740 --> 00:26:46,979 for me has been focused on that. 389 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:51,319 I don't know how to do anything else except shape change in higher ed. 390 00:26:53,089 --> 00:26:56,359 What was it like to be doing that? 391 00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:03,500 In and I, I believe that you were at one point at Dartmouth, for example. 392 00:27:04,430 --> 00:27:04,820 Am I right? 393 00:27:04,820 --> 00:27:05,390 Yeah. 394 00:27:07,010 --> 00:27:09,340 Um, when was that? 395 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:09,970 Yeah. 396 00:27:09,970 --> 00:27:10,660 Let's see. 397 00:27:10,990 --> 00:27:14,740 2007 to 2012. 398 00:27:14,860 --> 00:27:16,360 So five years I was there. 399 00:27:17,740 --> 00:27:18,670 And what was your role there? 400 00:27:18,850 --> 00:27:19,331 I, I. 401 00:27:20,120 --> 00:27:26,240 The role I went into when I started was, um, Associate Dean of Student 402 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,800 Life and Director of the Office of Pluralism and Leadership. 403 00:27:30,139 --> 00:27:38,670 So, embedded in Student Affairs, doing a lot of, um, uh, work in their framework to 404 00:27:38,670 --> 00:27:45,480 support BIPOC folks, um, but to create a robust campus environment around students. 405 00:27:45,915 --> 00:27:49,995 Issues of equity, the Native American program reported to me, Center 406 00:27:49,995 --> 00:27:54,784 for Women and Gender reported to me, some advisors for different 407 00:27:54,784 --> 00:27:57,074 affinity groups, uh, reported to me. 408 00:27:57,074 --> 00:27:58,815 So that's, that's how I started there. 409 00:27:59,114 --> 00:28:03,315 And then very quickly was asked to be Senior Associate Dean of the 410 00:28:03,315 --> 00:28:08,874 College, which had more responsibility for working with academic affairs. 411 00:28:09,254 --> 00:28:14,180 And then I The last role was Interim Dean of the College, which was kind 412 00:28:14,180 --> 00:28:20,290 of a major, um, a major role with a team of about 500 staff or so. 413 00:28:20,290 --> 00:28:23,689 It was a fascinating environment, Jeff. 414 00:28:24,900 --> 00:28:29,469 Yeah, how, how is, I mean, I, this is why I, I think it's so amazing. 415 00:28:29,530 --> 00:28:35,790 You know, you had, you know, you had a huge staff, you had huge responsibility 416 00:28:35,810 --> 00:28:38,320 at an Ivy League institution. 417 00:28:39,550 --> 00:28:48,054 Um, It's a, it's a dream job for many educators, um, but 418 00:28:48,124 --> 00:28:49,134 you're shaking your head. 419 00:28:49,175 --> 00:28:51,054 Maybe, maybe it wasn't for you. 420 00:28:51,154 --> 00:28:52,254 Why, why is that? 421 00:28:52,794 --> 00:28:58,214 Uh, it's a really complex space. 422 00:28:58,915 --> 00:29:05,404 It is a place that has incredible students from all over the world. 423 00:29:06,065 --> 00:29:09,855 Deeply talented, some really cynical, 424 00:29:11,875 --> 00:29:18,254 it's also a place where power and privilege is not just something you have 425 00:29:18,254 --> 00:29:21,124 to contend with, but it's perpetuated. 426 00:29:22,594 --> 00:29:32,145 and It can be an environment that for anyone who is not, uh, attuned 427 00:29:33,044 --> 00:29:40,115 to kind of spaces where that kind of activity is cultivated, rewarded, 428 00:29:40,895 --> 00:29:42,414 you're like a fish out of water. 429 00:29:43,214 --> 00:29:49,995 And the interesting thing is when I took the first job there, The, the president 430 00:29:49,995 --> 00:29:54,385 of another college, uh, was a colleague of mine and a friend of mine and he said, 431 00:29:54,385 --> 00:29:56,915 Sylvia, are you sure you want to go there? 432 00:29:57,995 --> 00:30:04,875 You're going into the belly of the beast and I said that's where people like me 433 00:30:04,875 --> 00:30:11,235 need to go so we can create change and I do think I created a lot of change. 434 00:30:11,265 --> 00:30:15,945 Um, I do think students and staff and faculty who felt like they were on 435 00:30:15,945 --> 00:30:19,825 the margins were positively affected by some of the work we did together. 436 00:30:20,650 --> 00:30:26,620 And it took a huge toll on me. 437 00:30:27,550 --> 00:30:34,680 And so, it was so interesting that I was interim or acting dean 438 00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,050 of the college for two years. 439 00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:38,350 And that was by contract. 440 00:30:38,610 --> 00:30:43,070 I said, you know, I can't get anything done if I'm there for a year, so 441 00:30:43,070 --> 00:30:44,550 I need to get some stuff done. 442 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:52,300 And Um, was invited to apply for the position formally and decided not to, 443 00:30:53,810 --> 00:30:58,930 and the students could not understand it, like, because it is the dream job. 444 00:30:59,490 --> 00:31:04,300 If you have a certain inclination, students were just like, Crazy, they 445 00:31:04,300 --> 00:31:08,560 started petitions and, you know, hundreds of students were, you know, 446 00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:12,930 signing petitions in electronic, and I was like, what is happening? 447 00:31:12,930 --> 00:31:16,940 And the school newspaper was calling me for an interview, Sylvia, 448 00:31:16,940 --> 00:31:19,800 what do you mean you're, you're not going to apply for the job? 449 00:31:20,750 --> 00:31:25,880 They were just Shocked, absolutely shocked because they couldn't understand 450 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:27,940 why somebody wouldn't want it. 451 00:31:28,930 --> 00:31:37,050 And for me, the title wasn't what made the job, uh, interesting or important. 452 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,800 It was my ability to shape change. 453 00:31:40,130 --> 00:31:44,170 And if I'm somewhere where I can't shape change, and change is needed, 454 00:31:44,970 --> 00:31:46,740 I will give as much as I can. 455 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:51,320 And then, um, when I see, okay, I've pushed the institution 456 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:52,869 as far as it can possibly be. 457 00:31:53,090 --> 00:31:56,290 Go it's time for somebody else to come and shape change. 458 00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:02,290 And so, um, I still have so many relationships with students who 459 00:32:02,290 --> 00:32:07,650 are now married with kids and, um, successful in their, in their fields 460 00:32:07,650 --> 00:32:09,450 and so many faculty and staff. 461 00:32:09,810 --> 00:32:11,890 Um, and so it was a. 462 00:32:12,525 --> 00:32:17,515 Uh, probably the, a time of my greatest professional growth was in that role. 463 00:32:18,365 --> 00:32:19,475 Really powerful. 464 00:32:19,885 --> 00:32:20,555 Um, yeah. 465 00:32:20,655 --> 00:32:21,475 Really powerful. 466 00:32:22,295 --> 00:32:31,485 I think it's amazing to sort of contrast, like you were saying, the, the, the 467 00:32:31,535 --> 00:32:36,455 types of students, the expectation, the privilege, the, the, the, um, 468 00:32:37,655 --> 00:32:42,105 the, even the path that they, they must have taken in order to get into. 469 00:32:42,455 --> 00:32:44,725 To get admitted into a school like Dartmouth. 470 00:32:45,835 --> 00:32:46,675 It's not easy. 471 00:32:46,735 --> 00:32:49,655 It's a path that takes many years to shape and you kind 472 00:32:49,655 --> 00:32:51,315 of have to walk a certain way. 473 00:32:51,315 --> 00:32:54,675 You have to, you know, especially these days, right? 474 00:32:54,675 --> 00:32:58,525 I mean, like, I think you really have to, you have to have that, that 475 00:32:58,525 --> 00:33:03,945 much prove in your co curricular work as well as your academic 476 00:33:03,945 --> 00:33:05,705 work and, and all of these things. 477 00:33:05,705 --> 00:33:09,235 And you have to, you have to play the game perfectly. 478 00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:12,830 Right, in order to, to get in. 479 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:13,390 Yeah. 480 00:33:13,780 --> 00:33:21,050 Um, and, and like you said, you know, some students, you know, 481 00:33:21,230 --> 00:33:24,990 would find that they don't belong because they just, they just can't. 482 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:31,590 It's not a, you know, if the game isn't what it's about, then it doesn't belong. 483 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:32,080 That's right. 484 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:32,840 Then you don't belong. 485 00:33:35,580 --> 00:33:41,600 And contrasting to your current student body at College Unbound, I 486 00:33:41,610 --> 00:33:44,310 think that's what's so amazing to see. 487 00:33:44,780 --> 00:33:50,480 I can see why you, you are, you are like, thriving at College Unbound 488 00:33:50,490 --> 00:33:51,710 because these are your people. 489 00:33:51,935 --> 00:33:52,915 Yeah, that's it. 490 00:33:53,305 --> 00:33:54,465 That's exactly it. 491 00:33:54,755 --> 00:33:56,285 That is exactly it. 492 00:33:56,305 --> 00:34:02,335 Um, before I, um, took the job at College Unbound, I went 493 00:34:02,335 --> 00:34:05,185 to visit, um, a cohort night. 494 00:34:05,255 --> 00:34:10,055 So an evening when all of the students are gathering, they, the college provides 495 00:34:10,065 --> 00:34:13,565 dinner because so many people are coming from work or they just picked 496 00:34:13,565 --> 00:34:15,065 up their kids and dropped the kids off. 497 00:34:15,065 --> 00:34:19,315 And, and so there's always a half an hour or so where we're in community. 498 00:34:19,630 --> 00:34:24,390 Having a meal together, uh, so it can be, you know, groups of 70 students on 499 00:34:24,390 --> 00:34:29,320 any given night, um, eating before they go into class, and I remember going 500 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:34,750 to visit and just looking around the room and was like, Oh, my goodness. 501 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:37,540 Look at the beauty in this room. 502 00:34:38,550 --> 00:34:43,260 And these are the students who would have never had access to a Dartmouth. 503 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,890 And yet they are the people who will also make change in the world. 504 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:53,780 So smart, so talented, so committed to one another. 505 00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:59,560 You know, when they make their way through College Unbound, I really 506 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:03,190 believe it is the power of relationships that they have with one another. 507 00:35:04,130 --> 00:35:07,840 That, that supports them through the college, of course, does 508 00:35:08,190 --> 00:35:09,410 what it's supposed to do. 509 00:35:09,710 --> 00:35:12,430 But I think the glue is that relationship. 510 00:35:12,930 --> 00:35:18,240 Um, and that's very different than the experience of someone 511 00:35:18,240 --> 00:35:19,790 who is third generation. 512 00:35:20,055 --> 00:35:26,765 Ivy League student versus, um, some of the students I saw at, um, Dartmouth who 513 00:35:26,765 --> 00:35:31,965 were first generation college students, who, brilliant, but didn't have the 514 00:35:31,965 --> 00:35:34,385 cultural capital to navigate that space. 515 00:35:35,135 --> 00:35:37,235 Um, I'll share just one. 516 00:35:37,535 --> 00:35:41,325 story about the kind of pressure and then why we do the opposite. 517 00:35:42,225 --> 00:35:47,815 There was a, a student that I don't think I'll ever forget, um, who was a 518 00:35:47,815 --> 00:35:54,525 first generation college student, young white guy, um, from kind of a rural 519 00:35:54,525 --> 00:36:03,220 area, struggling parents, was there on scholarship, um, And he worked at, 520 00:36:03,260 --> 00:36:10,140 um, like a, about five miles away at a local Burger King and would try to 521 00:36:10,140 --> 00:36:14,510 schedule his hours so that the hours were not when Dartmouth students were 522 00:36:14,510 --> 00:36:16,920 out cruising around going to Burger King. 523 00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:24,380 He shopped at the local thrift store for his clothes because there he could 524 00:36:24,380 --> 00:36:27,260 get the throwaway designer clothes. 525 00:36:28,460 --> 00:36:34,090 Um, that students and faculty had, um, dropped in the thrift store so 526 00:36:34,090 --> 00:36:38,140 that he could be wearing the designer labels that the other folks in his, 527 00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:42,010 uh, fraternity were wearing so they wouldn't know that he was struggling. 528 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:49,060 Imagine the amount of work it was taking for that student to put on 529 00:36:49,070 --> 00:36:51,340 the persona of somebody who fits in. 530 00:36:53,230 --> 00:36:54,930 Whereas at College Unbound, 531 00:36:57,420 --> 00:37:00,160 we don't even, we're not even thinking about that stuff. 532 00:37:01,435 --> 00:37:07,885 It's a come as you are, be who you are, because who you are 533 00:37:07,885 --> 00:37:10,145 is, is what is valued there. 534 00:37:10,765 --> 00:37:14,495 And so students, you know, come from all kinds of backgrounds, 535 00:37:14,585 --> 00:37:16,425 first generation college students. 536 00:37:17,665 --> 00:37:20,675 There's the average age of students is 36, 37. 537 00:37:22,415 --> 00:37:25,915 Some have college credits before, some have no credits. 538 00:37:26,815 --> 00:37:29,625 And what they're doing there is. 539 00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:36,660 Actually unlearning what education is, and learning what education can 540 00:37:36,660 --> 00:37:46,270 be, and re Orient them, orienting themselves to themselves as a learner, 541 00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:50,710 and that they've always been a learner, despite any negative messages 542 00:37:50,770 --> 00:37:54,820 that they were giving earlier in their, in their time in education. 543 00:37:55,140 --> 00:38:01,030 So it's a vibrant, lively, spacious place, and they are my people. 544 00:38:01,290 --> 00:38:02,070 They really are. 545 00:38:02,100 --> 00:38:03,230 It's fantastic. 546 00:38:05,390 --> 00:38:09,550 Here's a preview of what's coming up next in part two of my conversation with 547 00:38:09,630 --> 00:38:14,150 Sylvia Spears, Provost and Vice President for Lifelong Learning at College Unbound. 548 00:38:14,720 --> 00:38:20,240 Look at the beauty in this room and these are the students who would 549 00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:26,240 have never had access to a Dartmouth, and yet they are the people who 550 00:38:26,240 --> 00:38:28,100 will also make change in the world. 551 00:38:28,670 --> 00:38:33,020 So smart, so talented, so committed to one another.