1 00:00:01,350 --> 00:00:04,190 Welcome to Digication Scholars Conversations. 2 00:00:04,270 --> 00:00:05,970 I'm your host, Kelly Driscoll. 3 00:00:06,300 --> 00:00:11,799 In this episode, you'll hear part two of my conversation with Kyle Hewson, Vice 4 00:00:11,799 --> 00:00:16,159 Chair and Clinical Associate Professor in the Doctorate in Physical Therapy 5 00:00:16,189 --> 00:00:18,570 program at Stony Brook University. 6 00:00:19,199 --> 00:00:24,180 More links and information about today's conversation can be found on Digication's 7 00:00:24,230 --> 00:00:26,270 Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. 8 00:00:26,810 --> 00:00:30,530 Full episodes of Digication Scholars Conversations can be found on 9 00:00:30,540 --> 00:00:33,480 YouTube or your favorite podcast app. 10 00:00:34,650 --> 00:00:39,860 You know, I feel like the role of physical therapist and healthcare is so different 11 00:00:39,870 --> 00:00:45,199 than the kind of relationship that one has with a doctor, for instance, where 12 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:50,915 you have a really kind of Define period of time that you're with them and, and 13 00:00:50,915 --> 00:00:56,805 sometimes physical therapist you may work with for months or years and really 14 00:00:56,805 --> 00:01:01,615 become your partner in rehabilitation. 15 00:01:01,745 --> 00:01:06,685 And you spend a lot of time together often, um, depending on the extent 16 00:01:06,715 --> 00:01:08,875 of, um, rehabilitation needed. 17 00:01:09,455 --> 00:01:15,035 And it really does become a more personal relationship, I think, because 18 00:01:15,035 --> 00:01:16,885 you have that amount of time together. 19 00:01:18,015 --> 00:01:21,695 And you're often having a lot of time together when you as the 20 00:01:21,695 --> 00:01:26,685 patient are in pain and already vulnerable because of that. 21 00:01:27,085 --> 00:01:32,964 And they become, you know, your cheerleader and your support person. 22 00:01:32,965 --> 00:01:37,464 And as you mentioned, also your teacher, um, because they're trying to give you 23 00:01:37,464 --> 00:01:41,714 the tools to be able to kind of take care of yourself when you're not well. 24 00:01:41,825 --> 00:01:48,625 Right there with them and educate you on why certain movements or exercises 25 00:01:48,625 --> 00:01:53,975 or, um, even breathing techniques, you know, are so important in your healing. 26 00:01:54,474 --> 00:02:00,965 Um, and I was curious as the students are kind of going through the program, there 27 00:02:00,965 --> 00:02:07,475 is Is this kind of storytelling something that's encouraged with their patients? 28 00:02:08,145 --> 00:02:11,995 Um, because I think it's something that we don't often hear about with doctors, for 29 00:02:11,995 --> 00:02:16,235 instance, you know, because of the limited time that you're with them, really. 30 00:02:16,235 --> 00:02:16,535 Yes. 31 00:02:16,745 --> 00:02:17,075 Yes. 32 00:02:17,725 --> 00:02:17,745 Yeah. 33 00:02:18,165 --> 00:02:18,225 Yeah. 34 00:02:18,275 --> 00:02:19,435 I think there's two parts to it. 35 00:02:19,435 --> 00:02:23,645 I think that we want to get I think all the things you said are spot on. 36 00:02:23,655 --> 00:02:27,835 I mean, the sense of we, we want to encourage, we want to know them more. 37 00:02:27,845 --> 00:02:31,725 So we want to hear about their, we always, we'd say that every patient, 38 00:02:32,245 --> 00:02:36,654 a diagnosis can be very similar, but their role in life, they could be a 39 00:02:36,654 --> 00:02:39,955 mother, they could have a job in the city that they have to take, you know, 40 00:02:40,104 --> 00:02:43,585 two subways and then go up three, four, five or four flights of stairs. 41 00:02:43,825 --> 00:02:48,405 They could, um, they could have, uh, you know, they could be an athlete that 42 00:02:48,405 --> 00:02:49,905 they're trying to get a scholarship. 43 00:02:49,915 --> 00:02:51,985 And, you know, this is like, are you kidding me? 44 00:02:51,985 --> 00:02:52,754 This happened to me. 45 00:02:52,775 --> 00:02:57,714 So we, the injuries are all the same, but the stories behind it and all the roles 46 00:02:58,244 --> 00:03:03,875 are complex and how they handle their injury and where they are in this, you 47 00:03:03,875 --> 00:03:06,125 know, so you have the Cycles of grief. 48 00:03:06,685 --> 00:03:10,585 I say, Oh, you, we tend to get them at like the anger and depression time, 49 00:03:11,125 --> 00:03:14,795 you know, so, and then how do you, cause it's a huge change in their life. 50 00:03:14,824 --> 00:03:18,975 Um, so how they cope and what we, so definitely. 51 00:03:19,005 --> 00:03:21,860 So a lot of times we can, Connect. 52 00:03:22,150 --> 00:03:26,269 So this, as I mentioned, so it's kind of where they're at, but then also what can 53 00:03:26,269 --> 00:03:29,840 we do in our experience of what we've seen, how other patients have coped? 54 00:03:30,209 --> 00:03:33,920 Can we bring someone in that might've, Oh, you know what? 55 00:03:34,149 --> 00:03:36,650 You know, this person, this person over there on the other 56 00:03:36,659 --> 00:03:41,059 side of the gym, she was just in the same spot as you a month ago. 57 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,070 I'm going to bring you two together and just talk a little bit. 58 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:46,380 So that's really important. 59 00:03:46,410 --> 00:03:50,470 Um, and then, you know, you, you never say as a therapist, I know. 60 00:03:50,525 --> 00:03:54,895 You, you can say, I've had a lot of patients that have 61 00:03:54,925 --> 00:03:56,595 struggled with what you have. 62 00:03:56,955 --> 00:04:01,225 Um, sometimes there's a cycle, like a person gets better really fast 63 00:04:01,365 --> 00:04:05,444 and then they kind of hang out and takes a while to get, and this is 64 00:04:05,445 --> 00:04:07,794 the boring and the tedious part. 65 00:04:07,825 --> 00:04:09,935 And then like, do I ever get sex? 66 00:04:10,435 --> 00:04:13,535 And then, and it's also hard for a therapist to say, you know, I'm 67 00:04:13,535 --> 00:04:17,894 not sure if you're ever getting back to the baseline that you want. 68 00:04:18,060 --> 00:04:18,380 Right, right. 69 00:04:18,435 --> 00:04:22,694 You know, to that athlete or to that, you know, the person that has a neurological 70 00:04:22,694 --> 00:04:24,419 disorder or whatever, so, right. 71 00:04:24,419 --> 00:04:24,739 I mean, yeah. 72 00:04:24,770 --> 00:04:25,059 Yeah. 73 00:04:25,304 --> 00:04:29,354 So they do learn, I think it's a little difficult for them that all, they're 74 00:04:29,354 --> 00:04:33,465 not gonna help everyone and they're helping them, but not what they think. 75 00:04:33,469 --> 00:04:37,064 That everyone's not getting back to a hundred percent that they're, they're at. 76 00:04:37,390 --> 00:04:40,500 This is what I explained to them, they're shifting a phase, they're now 77 00:04:40,500 --> 00:04:44,510 at a different phase in their life and what, how you influence and they 78 00:04:44,510 --> 00:04:49,439 never, they never forget you as a therapist at that time, that's for sure. 79 00:04:50,029 --> 00:04:50,569 Yeah. 80 00:04:50,729 --> 00:04:51,119 Yeah. 81 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:51,930 So true. 82 00:04:51,979 --> 00:04:57,350 And I also think, I'm sure for your students, there's also conversations 83 00:04:57,350 --> 00:05:02,770 about how the patient has to be a big, you know, they have to make 84 00:05:02,770 --> 00:05:05,830 decisions about how they're going to take care of themselves too. 85 00:05:05,890 --> 00:05:06,150 Absolutely. 86 00:05:06,885 --> 00:05:09,275 Yeah, yeah. 87 00:05:09,555 --> 00:05:10,325 I agree, yeah. 88 00:05:10,505 --> 00:05:15,205 So, how do we motivate and how can we help them adhere and, you know, be successful. 89 00:05:15,799 --> 00:05:19,099 Give all kinds of suggestions and human nature, of course, is a biggie. 90 00:05:19,100 --> 00:05:20,989 Yeah. 91 00:05:20,989 --> 00:05:21,340 Absolutely. 92 00:05:21,380 --> 00:05:21,650 Yeah. 93 00:05:21,650 --> 00:05:30,090 Are they introduced to, um, some kind of, kind of psychology around that process? 94 00:05:30,099 --> 00:05:34,610 So you mentioned that very often they're meeting people at this kind of grieving 95 00:05:34,619 --> 00:05:40,979 stage and may be depressed because, you know, it's a big transition probably from 96 00:05:40,979 --> 00:05:42,969 where they were to where they are now. 97 00:05:43,099 --> 00:05:47,519 So what, what kind of, how is that introduced in the curriculum? 98 00:05:47,969 --> 00:05:50,069 So that's right up my alley too. 99 00:05:50,309 --> 00:05:56,309 So of course, one of the requirements of coming to the program and Stacia 100 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:59,429 wide is they have to take a psychology class of some kind in undergrad. 101 00:05:59,710 --> 00:06:02,830 So that could be normal development or it could be abnormal or, 102 00:06:02,830 --> 00:06:04,109 you know with child, whatever. 103 00:06:04,130 --> 00:06:09,520 So that's Many of them actually can be in any kind of bachelor's degree 104 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:13,950 when they come, they can be musicians, they can, so psychology is a great one 105 00:06:13,950 --> 00:06:16,479 if they are doing that because they know they're going to work eventually 106 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:17,620 with people that are in crisis. 107 00:06:18,410 --> 00:06:23,575 Um, so this, In the first, uh, summer that I mentioned that class, we do one course 108 00:06:23,615 --> 00:06:28,945 on, um, one class on communication and a little bit on culture and why culture, 109 00:06:29,784 --> 00:06:31,775 you know, you may come across this way. 110 00:06:31,775 --> 00:06:33,085 I'm a, I'm a loud person. 111 00:06:33,085 --> 00:06:35,815 I'm a, I talk fast, high energy. 112 00:06:35,854 --> 00:06:39,619 That could totally not work with someone who is just Just, you know, from a 113 00:06:39,619 --> 00:06:42,950 different culture or not understanding, I'm giving too many directions. 114 00:06:42,950 --> 00:06:43,039 Right? 115 00:06:43,039 --> 00:06:43,099 Yeah. 116 00:06:43,099 --> 00:06:44,390 So we just talk generally about that. 117 00:06:44,390 --> 00:06:45,500 And again, they're still new. 118 00:06:45,950 --> 00:06:47,659 Um, we share different experiences. 119 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,229 In the second year, we have a class and it's just started, um, it's called 120 00:06:51,229 --> 00:06:53,960 psychosocial aspects of disability. 121 00:06:53,965 --> 00:06:54,164 Mm-Hmm. 122 00:06:54,244 --> 00:06:56,484 . So we look at all the parts, what. 123 00:06:56,860 --> 00:07:00,500 You know, what are all the different avenues and areas, I should say, 124 00:07:00,500 --> 00:07:04,349 that are affecting why a patient is having difficulty or they're 125 00:07:04,349 --> 00:07:05,710 bringing this to the table. 126 00:07:06,130 --> 00:07:08,080 So again, culture is mentioned again. 127 00:07:08,280 --> 00:07:09,799 We look at spirituality. 128 00:07:09,939 --> 00:07:12,469 We look at avenues that might not be good. 129 00:07:12,630 --> 00:07:13,669 Substance abuse. 130 00:07:14,170 --> 00:07:16,629 Um, we look at pain. 131 00:07:16,839 --> 00:07:20,655 How pain, you know, like, so people that are chronic pain, their 132 00:07:20,655 --> 00:07:25,114 families seems kind of like, Hey, you know, come on, you can handle it. 133 00:07:25,145 --> 00:07:27,165 One day they can another day they can't. 134 00:07:27,175 --> 00:07:32,185 So all the different aspects of how we would be challenged, um, as a therapist 135 00:07:32,645 --> 00:07:34,204 and that we have to understand. 136 00:07:34,235 --> 00:07:35,775 And, you know, that's a lifelong process. 137 00:07:36,205 --> 00:07:41,845 Um, I always say, I, I only am as as the experiences that I've had, you know, I 138 00:07:41,855 --> 00:07:47,765 tell them if I had my choice go work in a large city, in a clinic or a hospital 139 00:07:47,765 --> 00:07:52,965 and be involved with as many types of patients and types of diagnosis and ages 140 00:07:53,465 --> 00:07:56,605 just explode and be like, you know, Wow. 141 00:07:56,605 --> 00:08:00,034 There's 16 languages being spoken in this room, you know, so that 142 00:08:00,034 --> 00:08:03,025 would be that really, it can be difficult, but what, what a great 143 00:08:03,025 --> 00:08:04,395 challenge and you'd learn so much. 144 00:08:04,814 --> 00:08:08,404 So that is really, and so they learn about that from each other. 145 00:08:08,705 --> 00:08:15,215 Um, I get it's not, there's no recipe book for this, but we also give them the 146 00:08:15,244 --> 00:08:20,564 two things are as a therapist, how does this area about substance abuse or even 147 00:08:20,614 --> 00:08:23,564 suicide, what do you do in your role? 148 00:08:23,735 --> 00:08:26,315 How do you say something to the patient? 149 00:08:26,325 --> 00:08:30,175 You know, I've noticed recently, Kyle, that you seem extremely down. 150 00:08:30,175 --> 00:08:34,634 You're usually able to just handle our session together, but som... 151 00:08:34,664 --> 00:08:35,745 is something is going on? 152 00:08:35,745 --> 00:08:39,625 And then they say something like, Yeah, I really, you know, I'm done with this. 153 00:08:39,925 --> 00:08:43,515 And you're like, Okay, so then what do you say and then, so what are the 154 00:08:43,595 --> 00:08:48,655 supports and then how do you refer and to our other mental health professionals 155 00:08:48,685 --> 00:08:50,624 and what's available in the community? 156 00:08:50,624 --> 00:08:54,825 I say your job also when you end up wherever you may be, you need to know 157 00:08:54,825 --> 00:08:57,275 in that community all the resources. 158 00:08:57,314 --> 00:09:02,525 So if you're a small clinic, you know you can call 9 1 1, but who else is around? 159 00:09:03,165 --> 00:09:04,955 Yeah, like the relationship with your physician. 160 00:09:04,995 --> 00:09:06,625 Do they have a counselor? 161 00:09:06,635 --> 00:09:08,095 Do they have, you know, all these things. 162 00:09:08,145 --> 00:09:10,585 What's, what are your resources in your library? 163 00:09:10,755 --> 00:09:15,295 What are your resources in associations that maybe someone has multiple sclerosis? 164 00:09:15,515 --> 00:09:16,084 Well, guess what? 165 00:09:16,085 --> 00:09:19,734 They have this fantastic chat room meets every Mondays. 166 00:09:20,265 --> 00:09:24,985 And everyone just vents about, this is an awful diagnosis, you know, so that 167 00:09:24,985 --> 00:09:30,655 is really your job to be an advocate and know where you kind of can't be 168 00:09:30,655 --> 00:09:34,294 a counselor, but who can help you. 169 00:09:34,295 --> 00:09:39,694 So, I think that's again, that is again, I'm going to say the problem solving part. 170 00:09:39,695 --> 00:09:44,205 of being a physical therapist and your brain is always thinking about, 171 00:09:44,255 --> 00:09:45,625 Oh, I got to make sure, make sure. 172 00:09:45,715 --> 00:09:46,255 Oh, you know what? 173 00:09:46,255 --> 00:09:49,165 You, you'll be really great with some new orthopedic shoes 174 00:09:49,655 --> 00:09:51,175 because you have diabetes. 175 00:09:51,695 --> 00:09:56,395 You need this and you know, all you are the reference and referral source, 176 00:09:56,455 --> 00:09:58,564 which is really, really an honor. 177 00:09:58,715 --> 00:10:03,805 to be able to kind of help them in these other areas of life, even finances, right? 178 00:10:03,865 --> 00:10:05,445 Finances are huge. 179 00:10:06,005 --> 00:10:07,235 We can't fix that boat. 180 00:10:07,545 --> 00:10:12,024 Oh, do you know that there is this association that maybe could get your 181 00:10:12,025 --> 00:10:16,115 child a power wheelchair, you know, like there's, there's things out there. 182 00:10:16,605 --> 00:10:17,155 Yeah. 183 00:10:17,315 --> 00:10:17,835 Yeah. 184 00:10:18,355 --> 00:10:24,765 And as you were speaking, I was also reminded of a slightly different topic, 185 00:10:24,775 --> 00:10:29,775 but another thing that's really core to you and your background and your teaching 186 00:10:29,795 --> 00:10:33,944 is around ethics in working with patients. 187 00:10:33,975 --> 00:10:35,544 Could you speak to that a little bit also? 188 00:10:35,545 --> 00:10:39,295 So I always joke around that, you know, how did I get involved in this? 189 00:10:39,334 --> 00:10:44,944 This is usually one of those very dry topics, but, um, it's so important. 190 00:10:45,995 --> 00:10:46,464 Yeah. 191 00:10:47,415 --> 00:10:51,155 It doesn't necessarily always mean I'm going to say doing 192 00:10:51,165 --> 00:10:53,135 the right thing all the time. 193 00:10:53,154 --> 00:10:57,094 It's actually just knowing, and this is how, again, how I present it, that in 194 00:10:57,125 --> 00:11:00,060 any situation, You have many options. 195 00:11:00,199 --> 00:11:02,979 So my goal in the third year is I'll give them a case. 196 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:07,880 I'll be like, okay, think of every single option that you could do in this case, 197 00:11:07,939 --> 00:11:10,319 including the big one is do nothing. 198 00:11:10,699 --> 00:11:11,719 Just not going to do anything. 199 00:11:11,930 --> 00:11:14,650 I'm going to pretend I never heard this and then you go through them. 200 00:11:14,659 --> 00:11:17,469 So maybe you have ten, five of them. 201 00:11:17,610 --> 00:11:19,673 There's no win win. 202 00:11:19,673 --> 00:11:21,970 It doesn't make a change. 203 00:11:22,170 --> 00:11:25,530 It's really kind of doesn't follow the legal, uh, you know, the 204 00:11:25,530 --> 00:11:27,710 legality of your practice act. 205 00:11:27,980 --> 00:11:29,009 So you cross those out. 206 00:11:29,009 --> 00:11:30,620 Okay, now you're down to your five. 207 00:11:30,650 --> 00:11:33,869 Okay, so which one would be the most powerful? 208 00:11:33,870 --> 00:11:35,310 Which one for you would be the most powerful? 209 00:11:35,330 --> 00:11:35,930 Difficult. 210 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:38,360 A lot of times it's confrontation of any kind. 211 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:42,360 Who, how could, who could you trust that you could talk to about the 212 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:46,040 situation and could really keep confidence and be able to guide you? 213 00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:50,440 And I've had students send me an email way after they're graduated, you know, Hi 214 00:11:50,460 --> 00:11:54,530 Kyle, I'm not going to give you the name of this person, but I have this scenario. 215 00:11:54,540 --> 00:11:55,590 What do you think? 216 00:11:55,610 --> 00:11:56,610 And I'd be like, you know what? 217 00:11:56,610 --> 00:11:57,720 You are spot on. 218 00:11:58,050 --> 00:11:58,870 Great idea. 219 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:00,520 This is a three step thing. 220 00:12:01,030 --> 00:12:03,130 You're going to go first with your supervisor. 221 00:12:03,525 --> 00:12:06,435 Then you're going to go together and talk to the patient and then you're, 222 00:12:06,645 --> 00:12:08,365 you know, so it's that kind of thing. 223 00:12:08,365 --> 00:12:13,164 So it's, again, it's really communication, but in a larger scope and a little 224 00:12:13,164 --> 00:12:16,935 bit more of pressure on them that you may be like, I don't want to 225 00:12:16,935 --> 00:12:18,394 deal with this, but guess what? 226 00:12:18,425 --> 00:12:21,484 You have to, because this is a big thing. 227 00:12:21,525 --> 00:12:22,875 So we talk about fraud. 228 00:12:23,345 --> 00:12:27,995 We talk about people not practicing, uh, you know, the practice act, which is a 229 00:12:27,995 --> 00:12:32,600 little different in each state, kind of how, how, um, Physical therapy assistants 230 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:37,560 can work and aides and different, you know, um, boundaries that they have. 231 00:12:37,620 --> 00:12:43,629 So you have to be, and it's tough, um, some of these are easy to fix and some 232 00:12:43,629 --> 00:12:47,880 are more that you say, you know what, this is not going to be fixed and I've 233 00:12:47,900 --> 00:12:49,950 tried and I'm going to leave this job. 234 00:12:50,299 --> 00:12:52,000 So that, you know, that is kind of a big thing. 235 00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:54,360 But, um, so I've kind of broken it down. 236 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:57,300 I mean, there's so many beautiful books on ethics and 237 00:12:57,530 --> 00:13:00,370 healthcare and working together. 238 00:13:00,450 --> 00:13:01,960 So it's a good blend. 239 00:13:01,980 --> 00:13:05,369 Um, some of my students are, they're like, Oh, they're able 240 00:13:05,369 --> 00:13:07,040 to figure it out right away. 241 00:13:07,070 --> 00:13:09,079 And they're kind of probably in the back of the room like, Kyle, 242 00:13:09,079 --> 00:13:10,340 really, we have to go over this. 243 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:14,350 And then all the students are like, I have no idea how to fix this. 244 00:13:14,450 --> 00:13:18,210 So, you know, that's kind of how we, we do group discussions 245 00:13:18,210 --> 00:13:19,630 and cases and things like that. 246 00:13:19,690 --> 00:13:19,890 Yeah. 247 00:13:20,060 --> 00:13:20,320 Yeah. 248 00:13:20,370 --> 00:13:24,680 Well, and I'm sure sometimes, you know, hearing about it and thinking that you 249 00:13:24,690 --> 00:13:31,040 know how you might respond, um, you know, can be different in theory than when, 250 00:13:31,119 --> 00:13:35,050 you know, you're out in the field and you have, you know, various hierarchical 251 00:13:37,100 --> 00:13:41,130 relationships and, um, yeah. 252 00:13:41,130 --> 00:13:46,130 And your income is dependent on things, you know, it really changes, changes 253 00:13:46,150 --> 00:13:48,430 things and how wonderful that they. 254 00:13:49,050 --> 00:13:52,689 You know, have the opportunity to kind of break it down with you while 255 00:13:52,689 --> 00:13:57,580 there's still students and then coming back to you as a resource afterward 256 00:13:57,580 --> 00:14:02,830 and knowing that, um, you can give them some continued mentorship. 257 00:14:02,930 --> 00:14:04,559 I'm, I'm sure that that makes. 258 00:14:04,680 --> 00:14:09,950 You're heartful to knowing that, yeah, that they can come to you 259 00:14:09,950 --> 00:14:13,370 and do, um, that's very powerful. 260 00:14:13,370 --> 00:14:20,730 Um, so I also wanted to talk a little bit about, uh, some of the project-based 261 00:14:20,749 --> 00:14:24,849 learning that happens as the students are moving through your program. 262 00:14:25,559 --> 00:14:27,470 Um, could you talk about some of the projects? 263 00:14:27,470 --> 00:14:32,130 It seems like they have some that are at each of the different, um, kind of years. 264 00:14:33,150 --> 00:14:33,590 there. 265 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:36,930 Well, how is that kind of designed and presented? 266 00:14:36,930 --> 00:14:41,410 So I'll talk a little bit about the template and just explain that. 267 00:14:41,410 --> 00:14:46,209 So they, you know, as I said, they do kind of that first year, uh, 268 00:14:46,209 --> 00:14:48,060 welcome and all about themselves. 269 00:14:48,090 --> 00:14:50,880 And then they have first, second and third year and they get to 270 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:54,750 choose, um, the first year and the second year, uh, two or three. 271 00:14:55,069 --> 00:14:58,970 I think it's three classes that they really enjoyed and did some 272 00:14:58,970 --> 00:15:00,680 kind of project like you mentioned. 273 00:15:00,710 --> 00:15:04,799 So, um, you know, I, I always say to them, by the time you graduate, after 274 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:09,290 three years, you'll have every type of learning, uh, methodology, teaching 275 00:15:09,290 --> 00:15:12,669 methodology to you, you know, there's group work and there's presentations 276 00:15:12,670 --> 00:15:15,120 and there's, um, going out to a clinic. 277 00:15:15,140 --> 00:15:18,650 Uh, so we use our, um, veterans home right on campus. 278 00:15:19,130 --> 00:15:22,189 And so you learn something in neurology, neurological. 279 00:15:22,250 --> 00:15:26,040 Physical Therapy, but now you actually go and try it and connect 280 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:29,060 with one of our residents and Chris, they have a great time. 281 00:15:29,060 --> 00:15:33,745 And then you debrief and be like, Oh my gosh, I was, my hand was shaking as I was 282 00:15:33,745 --> 00:15:38,330 trying to touch his arm or something, you know, and you don't realize, you know, 283 00:15:38,330 --> 00:15:39,629 all those things, how nervous you are. 284 00:15:39,629 --> 00:15:46,020 So I, we also have a patient simulation, um, So you have to go in, and you don't 285 00:15:46,020 --> 00:15:48,980 know what's going to happen, and you're in a, you're being watched by your 286 00:15:48,980 --> 00:15:54,209 classmates in another room, and it's really, you know, you have your, you have 287 00:15:54,209 --> 00:15:58,160 your laptop, and everyone's listening, and you know, so, and, and it's usually, 288 00:15:58,390 --> 00:16:03,070 so there's There's just so many great things now in education to, to look 289 00:16:03,070 --> 00:16:04,830 at it from different ways, you know. 290 00:16:05,980 --> 00:16:10,290 So the projects, we have a kinesiology project, they have to, they're given 291 00:16:10,430 --> 00:16:13,829 an area of the body, the hip joint, or something that's interesting to them. 292 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:18,650 And they have to create a project actually out of wood or plastic or 293 00:16:18,650 --> 00:16:20,780 something to actually demonstrate. 294 00:16:20,830 --> 00:16:24,760 And then we have a fair and they stand in front of their object. 295 00:16:24,770 --> 00:16:29,350 And then they have to explain to us how they use pipe cleaners Or they use 296 00:16:29,350 --> 00:16:34,680 pulleys or whatever it may be, a Play Doh, or to make a point of how this 297 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,000 joint works and, you know, the mechanism. 298 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,480 So, so they've taken pictures of that and sometimes they've 299 00:16:39,490 --> 00:16:40,900 written a little bit about that. 300 00:16:41,180 --> 00:16:44,790 Um, I actually have my curriculum map here, so let me take a quick 301 00:16:44,790 --> 00:16:45,709 look if there's anything else. 302 00:16:45,769 --> 00:16:50,300 Um, Yeah, I love that that's actually shown also. 303 00:16:50,310 --> 00:16:55,189 So people have the opportunity to really go in and see the entire curriculum. 304 00:16:55,229 --> 00:16:57,589 Yeah, and then they learn a lot about physical therapy by just 305 00:16:57,639 --> 00:16:59,050 looking at the different topics. 306 00:16:59,490 --> 00:16:59,660 Wow. 307 00:16:59,990 --> 00:17:02,829 You know, the each clinic, uh, clinical experience, they do 308 00:17:02,839 --> 00:17:05,820 have to do a presentation so they can put that in service up. 309 00:17:06,210 --> 00:17:08,569 And I always say that, listen, you know, you already did 310 00:17:08,610 --> 00:17:10,190 something in one of these classes. 311 00:17:10,190 --> 00:17:14,670 You can, Take that wonderful presentation and use it as in services. 312 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:16,700 You kind of get a twofer out of that. 313 00:17:16,780 --> 00:17:24,880 So, um, we also have, um, patients come in to our, um, you know, to our university 314 00:17:24,900 --> 00:17:27,830 as an example, uh, share their stories. 315 00:17:27,830 --> 00:17:32,150 Um, also in neurological physical therapy, someone that might be, uh, have a spinal 316 00:17:32,150 --> 00:17:38,109 cord injury might share how, again, their kind of grieving cycle and kind of how 317 00:17:38,110 --> 00:17:42,070 they found their place and, if it was hard to find work they wanted to do and 318 00:17:42,070 --> 00:17:45,639 then they did and or whatever it may be that, again, that share their road. 319 00:17:45,679 --> 00:17:47,469 I mean, pediatrics, same thing. 320 00:17:47,649 --> 00:17:52,599 Our teacher brings, um, some of, she's had some of these, uh, children since 321 00:17:52,599 --> 00:17:54,380 they were babies all the way now. 322 00:17:54,380 --> 00:17:58,440 She knows them in their teenage years and they're growing up so she'll have that. 323 00:17:58,550 --> 00:17:59,640 Come in and share. 324 00:17:59,930 --> 00:18:04,350 So we have baby day in the summer, uh, where all the babies come in because 325 00:18:04,350 --> 00:18:05,830 we're learning normal development. 326 00:18:06,150 --> 00:18:09,639 So anyone from zero to three, these kids are, you know, 327 00:18:09,639 --> 00:18:11,830 they try look at the reflexes. 328 00:18:11,889 --> 00:18:17,330 So the more you can kind of integrate, uh, You know, like lectures and PowerPoints 329 00:18:17,330 --> 00:18:21,050 that you have to memorize and understand and make it become, you know, come alive. 330 00:18:21,050 --> 00:18:22,070 And again, that's used. 331 00:18:22,370 --> 00:18:26,420 But that is a typical thing in many physical therapy programs, 332 00:18:26,420 --> 00:18:28,160 all different ways of interacting. 333 00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:31,160 And then now, you know, the buzzword is interprofessional practice. 334 00:18:31,700 --> 00:18:33,650 So we've been doing that with. 335 00:18:34,260 --> 00:18:36,340 Occupational Therapy and Physician's Assistant. 336 00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:40,700 Our school has a large event now every spring. 337 00:18:41,100 --> 00:18:46,020 Uh, last year was on ethics and we've done one, I think, on communication. 338 00:18:46,069 --> 00:18:49,749 So, I don't know what the topic is this year, but, uh, you know, how can we all 339 00:18:50,149 --> 00:18:55,737 add our piece to it if we're a respiratory therapist or we're, you know, uh, Applied 340 00:18:55,737 --> 00:18:59,030 Health Informatics, whatever we may face. 341 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:00,190 Yeah. 342 00:19:00,580 --> 00:19:03,730 Uh, let me see, I'll look at one more thing and give you another example. 343 00:19:03,750 --> 00:19:09,459 Um, yeah, um, in health and wellness, which is in their third year, they 344 00:19:09,460 --> 00:19:13,429 actually do a project on, I think it's over an eight week period. 345 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:19,270 They have someone in their life that might have want to do something to get well. 346 00:19:19,499 --> 00:19:20,859 It could be anything, smoking. 347 00:19:21,299 --> 00:19:24,149 It could be trying to get their cholesterol down. 348 00:19:24,439 --> 00:19:28,919 So actually, um, The professor, uh, gave me, uh, sent me an 349 00:19:28,919 --> 00:19:30,459 email about that recently. 350 00:19:30,490 --> 00:19:36,888 It was one of the students sister is a skier and wanted to get fit to go back 351 00:19:36,888 --> 00:19:40,919 on the slopes, you know, and every year, you know, it's kind of like, Oh my gosh, 352 00:19:40,919 --> 00:19:44,870 I didn't do, I didn't get in shape and this is tough and I might injure myself. 353 00:19:44,919 --> 00:19:49,649 So they put her on a eight week exercise program and she sent 354 00:19:49,649 --> 00:19:50,949 an email, she went to Colorado. 355 00:19:50,949 --> 00:19:53,310 She sent an email to her sister. 356 00:19:53,469 --> 00:19:54,980 You have no idea. 357 00:19:55,949 --> 00:19:57,990 I am doing fantastic.. 358 00:19:57,990 --> 00:20:00,419 I feel limber and I feel strong. 359 00:20:00,740 --> 00:20:02,000 So, so things like that. 360 00:20:02,010 --> 00:20:03,860 So that's a health and wellness course. 361 00:20:03,969 --> 00:20:07,080 And it's trying to just show that it doesn't necessarily 362 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:08,750 always have to be an injury. 363 00:20:08,779 --> 00:20:11,819 It could be a preventive type of look at that. 364 00:20:11,819 --> 00:20:16,270 You can have a PT practice that is all about prevention and, you know, 365 00:20:16,270 --> 00:20:17,870 trying to avoid some of those things. 366 00:20:18,010 --> 00:20:21,600 Things that, you know, you might have in your family or in your workplace. 367 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:22,119 Yeah. 368 00:20:22,120 --> 00:20:23,760 Yeah, absolutely. 369 00:20:23,810 --> 00:20:24,050 Yes. 370 00:20:24,590 --> 00:20:24,910 Absolutely. 371 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:25,440 That's good. 372 00:20:25,470 --> 00:20:28,496 You know, there's a lot, as I said, it's packed. 373 00:20:28,496 --> 00:20:31,449 Definitely packed. 374 00:20:31,450 --> 00:20:35,329 And you can see, yeah, you can see it as you kind of go through it. 375 00:20:35,330 --> 00:20:40,800 And I kind of think about it as kind of unfolding the layers of, of their story 376 00:20:40,810 --> 00:20:47,995 really, and, um, You know, right from that welcome page, you know, you often get to 377 00:20:48,825 --> 00:20:50,895 get a little, you know, a little picture. 378 00:20:50,925 --> 00:20:53,785 There's actual pictures, but you also just get a little picture 379 00:20:53,785 --> 00:20:57,245 of who the individual student is. 380 00:20:57,394 --> 00:21:02,755 So, as you go through the various pages, you have in mind that kind 381 00:21:02,755 --> 00:21:04,739 of history and background and. 382 00:21:04,870 --> 00:21:10,070 Passion for what they're doing and you can, you can literally see that growth 383 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:16,879 just being kind of manifest as you're going through and viewing their work. 384 00:21:17,389 --> 00:21:22,719 And you mentioned that there's, um, certain points, uh, in some of the 385 00:21:22,719 --> 00:21:27,829 courses where the students do have the opportunity to actually utilize 386 00:21:28,019 --> 00:21:34,050 the technology in the classroom and sharing things with other peers. 387 00:21:34,605 --> 00:21:42,924 Um, do they give feedback on each other's work in those spaces or is it more of a 388 00:21:43,025 --> 00:21:48,684 informal kind of sharing and storytelling and connection kind of building? 389 00:21:48,684 --> 00:21:50,105 I'm curious how. 390 00:21:51,060 --> 00:21:54,679 You know, what levels of kind of assessment or review of the student 391 00:21:54,679 --> 00:21:57,870 experiences may be happening throughout the program, too? 392 00:21:57,989 --> 00:21:59,110 Yeah, so that's a great idea. 393 00:21:59,110 --> 00:22:00,699 And it's kind of changed through the years. 394 00:22:00,699 --> 00:22:02,530 It's usually has been more informal. 395 00:22:02,780 --> 00:22:08,289 Um, sometimes we've had, uh, you know, we can, it's the first and the last 396 00:22:08,289 --> 00:22:11,269 years, uh, kind of their beginning and, you know, pre and post of how 397 00:22:11,269 --> 00:22:12,519 they gather everything together. 398 00:22:12,550 --> 00:22:16,099 Those are part of my courses and it's just a percentage and they, it's. 399 00:22:16,939 --> 00:22:19,689 This is what you need to do and this is what you want to put into it. 400 00:22:20,020 --> 00:22:23,439 And then we definitely have, you know, take a look at each other's 401 00:22:23,439 --> 00:22:27,419 and, and check, um, you know, see, see, again, learn about someone new. 402 00:22:27,449 --> 00:22:30,389 And at the end I mentioned like, you know, someone that you, you, you 403 00:22:30,389 --> 00:22:31,689 didn't know maybe about that person. 404 00:22:32,149 --> 00:22:34,769 We've done it in the middle on the second year course. 405 00:22:34,799 --> 00:22:37,699 We have done it in the past kind of like as, okay, you're adding 406 00:22:37,699 --> 00:22:39,814 this to um, your second year. 407 00:22:39,814 --> 00:22:41,604 Sometimes it's just been an email from me. 408 00:22:41,804 --> 00:22:45,974 Hi guys, you're at the midpoint now of, of our, um, you know, program. 409 00:22:46,254 --> 00:22:47,184 Please update. 410 00:22:47,444 --> 00:22:49,724 And then sometimes I've been like, oh, you just hold on to it, 411 00:22:49,724 --> 00:22:51,054 but then you lay it at the end. 412 00:22:51,084 --> 00:22:53,224 So it's been different, but I think that's a great point. 413 00:22:53,514 --> 00:22:57,374 I think there is usually more of a surprise of like, Oh, I didn't know. 414 00:22:57,444 --> 00:22:58,404 So that kind of thing. 415 00:22:58,424 --> 00:23:01,294 Um, but yeah, I mean, it's, it's a very good suggestion. 416 00:23:01,314 --> 00:23:07,689 Um, I usually, I do have, um, more of a rubric of just kind of, you 417 00:23:07,689 --> 00:23:12,679 know, uh, the, what did you include and you were, you know, you were 418 00:23:12,679 --> 00:23:15,289 meaningful or you went above and beyond. 419 00:23:15,289 --> 00:23:20,099 And I do ask, um, usually about five or six of students of the classes, look, 420 00:23:20,110 --> 00:23:26,249 can I use your portfolio next year as examples to show to the new students, you 421 00:23:26,249 --> 00:23:28,269 know, what, uh, what, what you've done. 422 00:23:28,279 --> 00:23:31,369 And, you know, some of them are just because you can change the banner and 423 00:23:31,369 --> 00:23:35,779 this and that and the colors and, you know, so, Um, I was trying to, I was 424 00:23:35,779 --> 00:23:40,309 trying to go back to see when did I actually switch from paper to ePortfolios 425 00:23:40,329 --> 00:23:44,039 because I only have, I only have a certain amount of years on this computer. 426 00:23:44,089 --> 00:23:48,769 Um, we started in, we, we always had a large program, about 50 or 60 students 427 00:23:49,149 --> 00:23:55,199 and in 2013 we split to two campuses, uh, close by within an hour and we have, uh, 428 00:23:55,239 --> 00:23:58,839 so I'm out here in Southampton and then we have Stony Brook, our main campus. 429 00:23:59,179 --> 00:24:00,860 So it's 50 and 35. 430 00:24:01,229 --> 00:24:04,059 So I actually went back in and I remember that first class was 431 00:24:04,059 --> 00:24:09,309 out here, which would have been 2013 and they were 2016 graduates. 432 00:24:09,729 --> 00:24:16,689 One of our students put a video of her doing like aerial dancing with this 433 00:24:16,889 --> 00:24:20,149 ribbon and I'm like, what is this? 434 00:24:20,189 --> 00:24:21,979 So we've just laughed and you know, she is. 435 00:24:22,254 --> 00:24:25,764 Super strong and she's a really just a great student. 436 00:24:25,774 --> 00:24:26,554 So that was, I remember her. 437 00:24:26,554 --> 00:24:33,314 So that was definitely 2013, you know, just a decade already. 438 00:24:33,334 --> 00:24:33,764 Yeah. 439 00:24:34,024 --> 00:24:34,185 Yeah. 440 00:24:34,364 --> 00:24:39,074 These incredible experiences that your, your students have had. 441 00:24:39,134 --> 00:24:44,334 And, um, it's wonderful that you're kind of connecting with the students 442 00:24:44,334 --> 00:24:48,889 before they graduate to kind of see who's, Ready to become an 443 00:24:48,889 --> 00:24:52,010 exemplar for the incoming cohort. 444 00:24:52,129 --> 00:24:59,140 And I'm sure as the, the program has kind of involved, and as you know, Digication 445 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:04,999 keeps evolving too, as we're working with different schools and, and learning 446 00:25:04,999 --> 00:25:09,330 how, you know, different educators and students, and even alumni are kind 447 00:25:09,330 --> 00:25:11,660 of putting it, putting it to work. 448 00:25:11,690 --> 00:25:17,175 So it's been such a joy to have this Kind of long term partnership and 449 00:25:17,175 --> 00:25:21,715 collaboration with, with Stony Brook so that we can all kind of celebrate 450 00:25:21,735 --> 00:25:23,855 that, that evolution together. 451 00:25:23,935 --> 00:25:27,695 It's, it's always so much fun to see what the students are doing 452 00:25:27,765 --> 00:25:34,675 and it's very inspiring to us to, to see that and to also have the 453 00:25:34,675 --> 00:25:37,105 opportunity to connect to educators. 454 00:25:37,300 --> 00:25:43,310 Like you who are really providing this incredible opportunity for your 455 00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:49,010 students and giving them a space where they can really celebrate who they are 456 00:25:49,010 --> 00:25:51,110 and everything that they're learning. 457 00:25:51,180 --> 00:25:54,629 And, um, I was curious if you've heard from any. 458 00:25:54,760 --> 00:26:00,820 Students after graduation, if they've been able to share it with any 459 00:26:00,830 --> 00:26:03,380 audiences outside of the institution. 460 00:26:03,380 --> 00:26:07,250 I know that some have opted to make them public, but we don't often 461 00:26:07,250 --> 00:26:11,251 hear, you know, what that, you know, next step is when they public. 462 00:26:11,251 --> 00:26:11,623 Yeah. 463 00:26:11,623 --> 00:26:12,739 I actually don't. 464 00:26:12,900 --> 00:26:14,660 I can't recall anyone now. 465 00:26:14,660 --> 00:26:19,110 I know that, um, you know, when people are kind of the hot area 466 00:26:19,140 --> 00:26:22,330 for posting information about yourself is LinkedIn, of course. 467 00:26:22,380 --> 00:26:28,419 So, um, sometimes, you know, the idea of moving some material over, um, I 468 00:26:28,420 --> 00:26:34,800 know that they, Can download the whole portfolio and and take it with them. 469 00:26:35,010 --> 00:26:40,049 We give them, I think it's an extra six months after graduation to have access. 470 00:26:40,610 --> 00:26:44,470 Um, you know, because then they, they will not have their Stony Brook emails. 471 00:26:44,470 --> 00:26:47,530 And most of them, as I said, if they, Decide to make it public or not. 472 00:26:47,540 --> 00:26:50,430 And usually it's within the university initially. 473 00:26:50,750 --> 00:26:51,120 Yeah. 474 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:51,780 No, it's okay. 475 00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,130 Cause I, I had, sorry to say, I don't have any specifics for that. 476 00:26:56,010 --> 00:26:56,600 Yeah. 477 00:26:58,730 --> 00:27:03,169 But I also, I wanted you to be aware too, that, um, Digication does 478 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,019 provide unlimited alumni access. 479 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:12,660 So if they did want to update their account to be with their personal 480 00:27:12,660 --> 00:27:16,669 credentials, if they lose access to this, you know, that's great. 481 00:27:16,669 --> 00:27:17,510 I didn't know that. 482 00:27:17,580 --> 00:27:18,570 No, that would be great. 483 00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:19,060 Okay. 484 00:27:19,580 --> 00:27:19,850 Wonderful. 485 00:27:19,970 --> 00:27:20,280 Yeah. 486 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:24,059 It's definitely something that they can continue using after graduation. 487 00:27:24,069 --> 00:27:28,690 We do have those options to download and of course they could get to individual. 488 00:27:29,020 --> 00:27:31,570 files as well anytime. 489 00:27:31,650 --> 00:27:35,960 Um, but yeah, we, we're very happy to continue hosting it for them. 490 00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:39,310 There's some other programs that take advantage of that too. 491 00:27:39,340 --> 00:27:39,590 Okay. 492 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:40,720 That's good to know. 493 00:27:41,050 --> 00:27:41,330 Great. 494 00:27:41,340 --> 00:27:43,040 Yeah, absolutely. 495 00:27:43,499 --> 00:27:47,759 Well, I know we're getting close to the end of our time today, Kyle, and I just, 496 00:27:47,850 --> 00:27:54,129 I just really, again, wanted to thank you so much for, for joining me to share your 497 00:27:54,159 --> 00:28:01,820 experience, uh, again, over a decade now, uh, using this kind of technology with 498 00:28:01,820 --> 00:28:08,419 your students and, um, so excited to be able to share what they have done and, 499 00:28:08,429 --> 00:28:10,759 and their extraordinary stories as well. 500 00:28:11,779 --> 00:28:12,669 Thank you so much. 501 00:28:12,769 --> 00:28:13,359 My pleasure. 502 00:28:14,169 --> 00:28:14,889 Absolutely. 503 00:28:14,949 --> 00:28:15,999 Talk to you soon. 504 00:28:16,099 --> 00:28:16,289 Okay. 505 00:28:16,979 --> 00:28:17,379 Bye.