WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:07.145 --> 00:00:09.695 Candace Dellacona: Welcome to the Sandwich Generation Survival Guide. 00:00:09.695 --> 00:00:14.615 I am your host, Candace Dellacona, and I am thrilled today to be 00:00:14.615 --> 00:00:17.545 joined by writer Beth Pinsker. 00:00:18.145 --> 00:00:23.035 Beth is a certified financial planner and a columnist at MarketWatch, 00:00:23.035 --> 00:00:26.275 which is actually how Beth and I met most recently though. 00:00:26.275 --> 00:00:32.395 And importantly, Beth wrote a book called My Mother's Money that was released 00:00:32.515 --> 00:00:34.915 just last month to great fanfare. 00:00:34.915 --> 00:00:35.575 Welcome, Beth. 00:00:36.555 --> 00:00:37.450 Beth Pinsker: So nice to be here. 00:00:37.450 --> 00:00:38.050 Thank you. 00:00:38.755 --> 00:00:40.555 Candace Dellacona: Thanks so much for joining us. 00:00:40.555 --> 00:00:47.020 As I mentioned, you and I met, I think I was a source for one of your articles. 00:00:47.110 --> 00:00:51.700 I think there are so many people who look to you as a thought leader 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:55.060 in the space of personal finance. 00:00:55.340 --> 00:00:59.610 But before we get there, I know you had a bit of a roundabout way finding 00:00:59.610 --> 00:01:05.490 yourself in this area of being what I think is an expert in sort of 00:01:05.490 --> 00:01:08.250 the aging retirement money space. 00:01:08.250 --> 00:01:13.425 So can you give us the inside scoop of how you landed in 00:01:13.425 --> 00:01:15.675 this very specific niche, Beth. 00:01:16.195 --> 00:01:19.165 Beth Pinsker: Yeah, no, it doesn't make sense to me or anybody else. 00:01:19.275 --> 00:01:21.195 I started out as a film critic. 00:01:21.625 --> 00:01:27.025 So I have really no rational way of explaining how I ended up being an 00:01:27.025 --> 00:01:29.635 expert in this particular subject matter. 00:01:29.635 --> 00:01:35.685 I just know I got more serious about my reporting subject matter as I went along, 00:01:35.775 --> 00:01:42.075 and I ended up at Reuters as a retirement columnist, and that is when the CFP became 00:01:42.075 --> 00:01:48.355 available to me, and I took the coursework and I got my CFP designation after passing 00:01:48.355 --> 00:01:52.945 the test, and I just sort of dove in head first to all the subject matter. 00:01:52.945 --> 00:01:55.855 I just really liked it and engaged with it. 00:01:55.975 --> 00:02:00.445 And when it came time to take care of my mom, I knew all of these 00:02:00.445 --> 00:02:02.605 things that were book learning. 00:02:03.215 --> 00:02:06.205 And it turns out that when you have to take care of a of 00:02:06.205 --> 00:02:07.945 somebody in your life who's ill. 00:02:08.465 --> 00:02:11.885 It takes more street smarts than it does book learning. 00:02:12.185 --> 00:02:16.335 And so I wanted to be able to help people through that, given that the 00:02:16.335 --> 00:02:20.595 financial knowledge that I have and the way that the backend of the systems 00:02:20.595 --> 00:02:26.045 work, I was, sort of able to explain it to people in real human terms, how 00:02:26.045 --> 00:02:30.455 to get through the rest of this stuff that nobody ever talks about and nobody 00:02:30.455 --> 00:02:32.865 ever, has an instruction manual for. 00:02:33.570 --> 00:02:34.140 Candace Dellacona: I love that. 00:02:34.140 --> 00:02:37.250 And what you kind of glossed over, which I think you should be 00:02:37.550 --> 00:02:43.730 bragging a bit more, is to become an expert in your field as a writer. 00:02:43.730 --> 00:02:49.670 You took the CFP, which is the Certified Financial Planning Exam 00:02:49.670 --> 00:02:54.260 series, which for those of you who don't know, is no easy feat. 00:02:54.290 --> 00:03:01.330 So, kudos to you Beth, for really taking on that role and kind of 00:03:01.330 --> 00:03:07.330 diving in head first to become extremely educated in this area. 00:03:07.650 --> 00:03:12.070 Because it is so vast and one of the things that you just said that. 00:03:12.160 --> 00:03:15.280 I think is so true for all of our listeners and all of us in the 00:03:15.280 --> 00:03:18.970 sandwich generation, is that there is no guide, there is no manual. 00:03:18.970 --> 00:03:24.400 And what I hope with this podcast is to provide people a survival guide. 00:03:24.700 --> 00:03:27.670 And that's why we have experts like you. 00:03:27.670 --> 00:03:34.720 So talk to me a little about making the jump from a CBS Market Watch 00:03:35.200 --> 00:03:41.320 columnist to actually putting the pieces together as an author. 00:03:41.835 --> 00:03:45.870 And the overview of the book and how that process started for you. 00:03:47.320 --> 00:03:51.380 Beth Pinsker: It really started with my column because I had just started at 00:03:51.380 --> 00:03:54.530 MarketWatch when my mom had her surgery. 00:03:54.530 --> 00:03:59.360 So I started at MarketWatch in like September of 2022, and my mom's 00:03:59.360 --> 00:04:01.400 surgery was in November of that year. 00:04:02.165 --> 00:04:04.565 So I was really brand new to this job. 00:04:04.565 --> 00:04:08.925 I had been at Reuters for many years before I had been, various other places 00:04:09.255 --> 00:04:13.515 doing personal finance journalism, but I was new to Market Watch. 00:04:13.575 --> 00:04:19.705 And I'm sitting there, by my mom's bedside in Florida and I have a column due and 00:04:19.705 --> 00:04:22.075 I'm thinking like my brain was just mush. 00:04:22.125 --> 00:04:25.710 Like when you're sitting in a hospital room time stops. 00:04:25.710 --> 00:04:28.860 Like you can't think about anything else but the task in front of you. 00:04:29.370 --> 00:04:31.180 And I thought what am I gonna write about? 00:04:31.180 --> 00:04:32.590 I need to turn something in. 00:04:32.590 --> 00:04:34.990 And I was looking around, I'm like, I'll just write about this. 00:04:35.420 --> 00:04:40.030 This is what retirement and, this is what it looks like in America these days. 00:04:40.280 --> 00:04:42.500 Somebody's gotta take care of somebody else. 00:04:42.950 --> 00:04:43.940 And so I did. 00:04:43.940 --> 00:04:48.080 And that first column was about, all the information my mom had assembled 00:04:48.080 --> 00:04:50.210 for me before she went and had surgery. 00:04:50.420 --> 00:04:54.170 She had this like cheat sheet that she put together, this one sheet of paper that 00:04:54.170 --> 00:04:59.490 was just like absolutely essential to me that had all of her pertinent information. 00:04:59.490 --> 00:05:03.320 The healthcare, insurance coverage information, her Medicare information, 00:05:03.630 --> 00:05:08.070 all her doctors, all her conditions, all her surgery, previous surgeries, all the 00:05:08.070 --> 00:05:14.160 stuff you, as a 52-year-old woman at the time that I did not know about my mother. 00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:18.400 Because, like I knew all those things about my own children, but 00:05:18.400 --> 00:05:19.720 I didn't know them about my mother. 00:05:19.720 --> 00:05:22.330 Like, what year was my mother's appendectomy? 00:05:22.870 --> 00:05:24.805 You know who knew I wasn't around? 00:05:25.465 --> 00:05:27.685 So she had all that stuff on a piece of paper. 00:05:27.685 --> 00:05:32.305 So I wrote about that and I heard from so many people after I wrote that column. 00:05:32.635 --> 00:05:36.075 And so each time I went through something with my mom that was 00:05:36.075 --> 00:05:39.875 significant that I thought people needed to hear about, or, that if I 00:05:39.875 --> 00:05:43.445 was having a hard time with it, other people were having a hard time with it. 00:05:43.865 --> 00:05:45.540 And so I started to write about these. 00:05:45.540 --> 00:05:50.850 I had the spine of my narrative starting with those columns. 00:05:51.210 --> 00:05:55.900 And then my mom got really sick, and she went home on hospice and we had 00:05:55.900 --> 00:05:57.910 about nine months of ups and downs. 00:05:57.910 --> 00:05:59.230 And then she passed away. 00:05:59.620 --> 00:06:02.110 And then I couldn't write any more columns 'cause I couldn't 00:06:02.110 --> 00:06:04.695 face, writing about that. 00:06:04.695 --> 00:06:08.760 I, like I had been writing about her illness for, a length of time. 00:06:08.760 --> 00:06:11.070 And then it was like, okay, now I'm gonna have to, if I write about 00:06:11.070 --> 00:06:14.070 this again, I'm gonna have to write a sentence that's like, I'm sorry 00:06:14.070 --> 00:06:17.110 to have to tell you, but my mom has passed away and I couldn't do it. 00:06:17.590 --> 00:06:21.740 Candace Dellacona: Yeah, I think that that's such a common emotion for so many 00:06:21.740 --> 00:06:26.460 of us, where, we're sort of identified in some ways as a defacto caregiver, whether 00:06:26.460 --> 00:06:31.200 it's financial or otherwise, and filling people in or even admitting to ourselves 00:06:31.200 --> 00:06:32.760 that that part of our life is over. 00:06:32.760 --> 00:06:37.665 But going back to what you said about creating the spine of this book, you 00:06:37.665 --> 00:06:41.175 know, the infrastructure of this book with each of your articles, and for those 00:06:41.175 --> 00:06:47.685 of us who are devotees of your work, it's pretty easy to see how you came 00:06:47.685 --> 00:06:55.305 up with a book from all of the subject matters that you really were able to 00:06:55.455 --> 00:06:59.745 attack and then translate for the rest of us trying to make our way through. 00:07:00.245 --> 00:07:05.195 I think what's so unique about this book, Beth, is that you were a caregiver 00:07:05.195 --> 00:07:09.015 for your mom, for her physical being and her daughter and her advocate. 00:07:09.015 --> 00:07:12.145 But you really talked about and this book really became 00:07:12.145 --> 00:07:14.095 caregiving in a financial sense. 00:07:14.735 --> 00:07:17.465 And I think that that's really unique about your book. 00:07:17.465 --> 00:07:21.725 I don't think that there's another book on the market that provides this depth. 00:07:22.770 --> 00:07:28.650 Of exploratory and explanatory information into someone else's finances. 00:07:28.800 --> 00:07:33.070 We all play roles where the daughter or the niece or the next door 00:07:33.070 --> 00:07:36.880 neighbor who loves your elderly neighbor and trying to look out. 00:07:36.880 --> 00:07:43.120 So when you think about that list that your mom started with, is that 00:07:43.125 --> 00:07:47.365 where most of us in the middle, in the sandwich generation, is that 00:07:47.365 --> 00:07:51.625 where we should begin with our aging parents asking them to start? 00:07:52.645 --> 00:07:55.770 Beth Pinsker: Well, I think it actually starts a little bit earlier than that. 00:07:55.965 --> 00:08:00.175 Because what we needed most of all, and this was like the second column 00:08:00.175 --> 00:08:04.765 I wrote was the power of attorney and the healthcare proxy and a lot 00:08:04.765 --> 00:08:10.045 of people skip over this, and I think it is the caregiver's, motive, 00:08:10.105 --> 00:08:15.265 like the caregiver should be the one motivated to get this done. 00:08:15.745 --> 00:08:20.015 And what I have been telling people to do and what I did it was as soon as my 00:08:20.015 --> 00:08:25.085 father died, I said to my mother, you need take care of a few things for me 00:08:25.385 --> 00:08:27.755 because now I'm responsible for you. 00:08:28.235 --> 00:08:28.535 Right. 00:08:28.535 --> 00:08:30.095 My, my mom and dad were both alive. 00:08:30.125 --> 00:08:31.805 They were responsible for each other. 00:08:32.435 --> 00:08:36.365 But when my father died, my mom became my responsibility. 00:08:36.365 --> 00:08:39.575 If something happened to my mother, they're gonna make a phone call, 00:08:39.605 --> 00:08:42.485 somebody's gonna make a phone call, and that phone call's gonna come to me. 00:08:42.735 --> 00:08:46.455 And not just because I'm the daughter, although that is usually what happens 00:08:46.725 --> 00:08:51.185 in American families these days, or families everywhere, I think is, the 00:08:51.185 --> 00:08:54.545 core, I mean, some families have multiple daughters and some families don't have 00:08:54.905 --> 00:08:59.250 daughters at all, but there's always somebody in the next generation and the 00:08:59.250 --> 00:09:02.190 caregiving generation who is the doer. 00:09:02.920 --> 00:09:04.380 The person who gets stuff done. 00:09:04.380 --> 00:09:07.110 The person who assigns the dishes at Thanksgiving. 00:09:07.410 --> 00:09:12.310 The person who tells everybody what to bring or where to go for the holidays. 00:09:13.210 --> 00:09:17.350 That plans of vacations and that makes the phone calls and connects everybody. 00:09:17.530 --> 00:09:21.610 There's always that person no matter what gender they are 00:09:21.640 --> 00:09:23.620 in the family who is the doer. 00:09:23.620 --> 00:09:26.740 It just happens that in, in many families, that that is a daughter 00:09:26.740 --> 00:09:28.660 and it's often the eldest daughter. 00:09:28.660 --> 00:09:32.360 I happen to be the only daughter in the family, and I have a brother but 00:09:32.510 --> 00:09:34.520 I'm the one that gets stuff done. 00:09:34.520 --> 00:09:38.790 And this is financial stuff, is my expertise anyways, so, if my mom 00:09:38.790 --> 00:09:42.360 needed facts about Abraham Lincoln while she was sick, my brother 00:09:42.360 --> 00:09:44.070 would've been fantastic at that. 00:09:44.730 --> 00:09:45.060 Candace Dellacona: I wonder. 00:09:45.100 --> 00:09:47.890 So that's interesting, but I wonder what he does, but, going into, 00:09:48.070 --> 00:09:48.970 Beth Pinsker: college professor 00:09:48.970 --> 00:09:50.230 Candace Dellacona: well that, okay. 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:52.790 Beth Pinsker: Like, go find a practical application for 00:09:52.790 --> 00:09:54.470 that in a caregiving scenario. 00:09:54.960 --> 00:09:56.370 So I can handle bills. 00:09:56.370 --> 00:09:57.390 That's what I'm good at. 00:09:57.490 --> 00:10:01.570 So I want caregivers out there, or potential caregivers, the doers in 00:10:01.570 --> 00:10:06.760 the family to like email everybody that they are responsible for and 00:10:06.760 --> 00:10:10.930 say, if you want me to be able to help you, I need these two documents. 00:10:10.930 --> 00:10:13.540 I need a power of attorney and a healthcare proxy. 00:10:13.540 --> 00:10:18.195 And I know in your business you would never do a plan for somebody 00:10:18.195 --> 00:10:21.675 or plan for a family that did not include those two documents. 00:10:21.945 --> 00:10:26.175 But there are people out there practicing estate planning, who 00:10:26.175 --> 00:10:29.510 will do a will for you and won't and you come out of the process and 00:10:29.510 --> 00:10:31.040 you don't have those two documents. 00:10:31.550 --> 00:10:33.590 I don't understand how that happens. 00:10:33.690 --> 00:10:37.200 And also, people go to their financial planners and their financial planners 00:10:37.200 --> 00:10:38.480 say, you should have a trust. 00:10:38.480 --> 00:10:40.970 You should have a what a will, you should have all these things. 00:10:41.810 --> 00:10:44.720 And they leave out the power of attorney and the healthcare proxy. 00:10:45.245 --> 00:10:50.975 And, it's not like a standard part of the package that you're necessarily getting. 00:10:51.275 --> 00:10:55.835 And to me, the caregiver is the one under deadline, right? 00:10:55.835 --> 00:11:00.575 If somebody dies and you don't have these documents, they're already dead. 00:11:00.995 --> 00:11:04.275 And, you've got all the time in the universe to settle everything. 00:11:04.635 --> 00:11:07.845 But when somebody's sick, everything's on a deadline. 00:11:07.875 --> 00:11:09.465 Their mortgage still needs to be paid. 00:11:09.465 --> 00:11:12.735 Their electric bill still needs to be paid, that you need to keep up 00:11:12.735 --> 00:11:16.425 on their life insurance and their long-term care policy and all of these 00:11:16.425 --> 00:11:17.895 things, and everything's on a deadline. 00:11:17.895 --> 00:11:21.565 If you don't have the right paperwork you're like hitting a brick wall. 00:11:21.895 --> 00:11:22.225 Candace Dellacona: Yeah. 00:11:22.255 --> 00:11:23.965 And thank you for bringing that up, Beth. 00:11:24.005 --> 00:11:28.445 As an estate planning attorney by trade, my first place is documents. 00:11:28.445 --> 00:11:32.085 And I know that that's not everybody's first place, but as you point out, and for 00:11:32.085 --> 00:11:37.065 those who are unfamiliar with what those documents are, a healthcare proxy and a 00:11:37.065 --> 00:11:41.205 power of attorney are part of a category of documents called advanced directives. 00:11:41.595 --> 00:11:44.775 And the reason why they call them advanced directives is because 00:11:44.775 --> 00:11:50.580 it's your directive to say who's in charge in advance of your incapacity. 00:11:50.940 --> 00:11:54.060 So a healthcare proxy is exactly what it sounds. 00:11:54.060 --> 00:11:57.300 Some states call it a healthcare power of attorney. 00:11:57.580 --> 00:12:00.820 There are other states who only have living wills, but in 00:12:00.820 --> 00:12:02.080 essence they're the same thing. 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:06.850 It's appointing a person to speak for you in the event that you cannot articulate 00:12:06.850 --> 00:12:08.195 your wishes in a healthcare setting. 00:12:09.200 --> 00:12:12.860 And a power of attorney is similar, you're appointing a person to 00:12:12.860 --> 00:12:14.660 make financial decisions for you. 00:12:14.960 --> 00:12:18.740 So that's your person in the finance world and the healthcare proxy or 00:12:18.740 --> 00:12:22.460 your healthcare power of attorney is your person in the healthcare world. 00:12:22.730 --> 00:12:26.520 And I think one of the things that you said is really important, Beth, because 00:12:26.880 --> 00:12:31.740 you talked about when the first spouse passed away, and I think you're right. 00:12:31.740 --> 00:12:36.305 I think that kids think about these things, or sandwich generation 00:12:36.305 --> 00:12:40.475 members if you will, think about these things almost a step too late. 00:12:40.925 --> 00:12:46.255 You thinking about it and you having that direct conversation with your mom when 00:12:46.255 --> 00:12:51.785 your dad passed away was so smart and it probably set you up for such success. 00:12:51.785 --> 00:12:56.775 But, being a daughter and being a writer and being somebody who's pragmatic, 00:12:57.315 --> 00:13:03.285 how do you start that conversation in a family that maybe doesn't talk about 00:13:03.285 --> 00:13:05.205 such things for all sorts of reasons? 00:13:05.505 --> 00:13:10.185 What's your best advice to our listeners to have that conversation after 00:13:10.185 --> 00:13:11.955 something happens to the first spouse? 00:13:12.670 --> 00:13:17.400 Beth Pinsker: My best advice to people is to ask your parents for their advice 00:13:17.800 --> 00:13:21.940 because I found that the one universal thing about the older generation is that 00:13:21.945 --> 00:13:26.050 they like for people to ask their opinion on things or to ask for their help. 00:13:26.390 --> 00:13:31.760 And you get a lot further with older people if you ask them for their help. 00:13:31.760 --> 00:13:36.010 For instance when I was going, when my father died slightly before that, 00:13:36.010 --> 00:13:37.880 I had gotten my own estate plan done. 00:13:38.390 --> 00:13:44.130 And I named my mother as the executor, the trustee, all of those things for me. 00:13:44.280 --> 00:13:48.280 So I had to go to her and say, Hey I'm filling out all these 00:13:48.280 --> 00:13:49.810 papers, I just got divorced. 00:13:50.170 --> 00:13:54.520 And I don't wanna name my ex-husband as the trustee on any of these documents. 00:13:54.520 --> 00:13:55.840 I wanna name you. 00:13:56.180 --> 00:13:57.290 What do you think about that? 00:13:57.340 --> 00:13:59.020 Can you take care of that for me? 00:13:59.530 --> 00:14:02.440 And you know what's been your experience with this? 00:14:02.440 --> 00:14:04.540 Have you ever done this for anybody else? 00:14:04.540 --> 00:14:08.780 And, we had that conversation because I made it about her helping me. 00:14:09.905 --> 00:14:13.685 And so when it came time when my father died, shortly after that, I was like, 00:14:13.685 --> 00:14:15.425 okay, you know how you did that for me? 00:14:15.785 --> 00:14:17.735 I wanna be able to do that for you. 00:14:17.975 --> 00:14:20.735 You have all these documents you're gonna have to fill out, just like 00:14:20.735 --> 00:14:25.835 me as a divorce person, suddenly single in the legal universe, you are 00:14:25.835 --> 00:14:27.755 suddenly single in the legal universe. 00:14:27.755 --> 00:14:31.175 You have to do the same thing that I just did, so you know, 00:14:31.205 --> 00:14:32.555 what are you gonna do about it? 00:14:32.645 --> 00:14:36.515 And it made that conversation go better because I asked her first to help 00:14:36.515 --> 00:14:39.605 me before I offered my help to her. 00:14:40.170 --> 00:14:42.390 Candace Dellacona: I love that because I think what you did was 00:14:42.390 --> 00:14:47.060 symbolize your action symbolized that you appreciated her. 00:14:47.750 --> 00:14:52.760 Respected her input and you weren't trying to take control away. 00:14:52.760 --> 00:14:57.830 And I think that oftentimes the conversations with aging loved ones can 00:14:57.830 --> 00:15:02.780 go awry because the conversation can sort of devolve, if you will, into sort 00:15:02.780 --> 00:15:08.890 of an accusatory situations saying that you don't have the ability to do this 00:15:08.890 --> 00:15:11.020 anymore, and I need to take that from you. 00:15:11.020 --> 00:15:16.330 So, I love that, Beth, that you reframed it and a and sought 00:15:16.330 --> 00:15:17.770 that advice from your mom. 00:15:17.770 --> 00:15:22.930 So even for those out there who necessarily might not appoint their parent 00:15:23.390 --> 00:15:27.740 as their agent under a healthcare proxy or a power of attorney, seeking their 00:15:27.740 --> 00:15:32.360 advice on appointing someone, I think is a really beautiful way to, to do it. 00:15:32.935 --> 00:15:36.655 And once you have those documents in place, Beth, you've had the 00:15:36.655 --> 00:15:40.945 first conversation with mom or dad or your aging loved one. 00:15:41.215 --> 00:15:43.315 You have that requisite authority. 00:15:43.855 --> 00:15:46.825 What should the adult children do next? 00:15:46.975 --> 00:15:52.885 How do they get into the nitty gritty of the finances without having a parent 00:15:53.185 --> 00:15:57.300 feel like you're interfering or prying, especially when it comes to money. 00:15:58.490 --> 00:15:59.570 Beth Pinsker: It can be difficult. 00:15:59.570 --> 00:16:02.900 It think about it in terms of the conversation you have to have 00:16:02.900 --> 00:16:07.110 when a parent should no longer be driving, taking away the car keys. 00:16:07.500 --> 00:16:10.530 I like to, if you can baby step it a little bit. 00:16:10.870 --> 00:16:15.945 The analogy I like to use is that all of this financial documentation 00:16:15.995 --> 00:16:20.115 the power of attorney for financial stuff and also the healthcare proxy 00:16:20.535 --> 00:16:24.715 are like having a spare key to the car or a spare key to the house. 00:16:24.715 --> 00:16:28.645 Like you would never you would never expect your neighbor who has your 00:16:28.645 --> 00:16:32.935 spare key for emergencies to come over and let themselves in at three 00:16:32.935 --> 00:16:36.365 o'clock in the morning to make a cup of coffee uninvited, right? 00:16:36.365 --> 00:16:38.525 That key is there in case you get locked out. 00:16:38.915 --> 00:16:43.325 And so the really, the financial powers that you give somebody 00:16:43.445 --> 00:16:47.015 for emergency purposes should really just be for emergencies. 00:16:47.015 --> 00:16:51.000 They shouldn't be you shouldn't necessarily need a family member 00:16:51.150 --> 00:16:54.600 right away to come in and take over. 00:16:54.940 --> 00:16:58.600 'Cause then like you're obviously getting to it too late, right? 00:16:58.600 --> 00:17:03.340 Like you should have those documents in place at for emergency purposes, from the 00:17:03.340 --> 00:17:07.620 time a person is 18 years old, like, I have a power of attorney for my son who's 00:17:07.620 --> 00:17:10.350 19 and we did it as soon as he turned 18. 00:17:10.810 --> 00:17:13.810 Like this is just something an adult human being needs to have 00:17:13.810 --> 00:17:16.090 on hand in case of emergencies. 00:17:16.120 --> 00:17:20.620 And so if you normalize it so that it's just there in case you need it, then 00:17:20.890 --> 00:17:22.435 you've already taken one little baby step. 00:17:23.590 --> 00:17:27.820 Then when an emergency happens usually there's some sort of 00:17:27.820 --> 00:17:29.770 mistake that's happened, right? 00:17:29.800 --> 00:17:31.870 In, in my book I have various examples. 00:17:31.900 --> 00:17:35.350 In one family, the mom forgot to take her required minimum 00:17:35.350 --> 00:17:38.860 distribution one year 'cause she's having some cognitive problems. 00:17:39.280 --> 00:17:42.760 And so her son, and, it's a big mess if you forget to take your required, 00:17:42.980 --> 00:17:43.325 Candace Dellacona: Yeah, sure is. 00:17:44.300 --> 00:17:45.320 Beth Pinsker: You, there are penalties. 00:17:45.320 --> 00:17:48.510 You have to fill out paperwork and you wanna make sure it doesn't happen again. 00:17:49.560 --> 00:17:53.980 So her son was able to step in and say, Hey mom, do you want some help with this? 00:17:54.250 --> 00:17:55.000 I can help you. 00:17:55.000 --> 00:17:56.110 I'm good at this stuff. 00:17:56.510 --> 00:17:58.250 Other families, it's taxes. 00:17:58.560 --> 00:18:00.840 In other families, it's a scam situation. 00:18:00.910 --> 00:18:07.390 You realize that the adult family member is somehow giving away money or getting 00:18:07.390 --> 00:18:11.710 money scam from them, and they need to have limited, more limited access to their 00:18:11.710 --> 00:18:15.110 phone or to their, account disbursements. 00:18:15.170 --> 00:18:18.140 Like you, you need to step in and say, Hey, you just lost, 00:18:18.770 --> 00:18:21.500 almost lost, hopefully $10,000. 00:18:21.810 --> 00:18:24.750 Let's try to see what we can do to make sure that doesn't happen again. 00:18:25.310 --> 00:18:28.970 And sometimes taking away a phone is like taking away the car keys. 00:18:28.970 --> 00:18:32.360 If a parent is getting in trouble because they have access to their 00:18:32.360 --> 00:18:36.680 phone and they're answering scam phone calls, or they're making transactions 00:18:36.680 --> 00:18:39.180 on their phone, they're clicking on links that they shouldn't, you know. 00:18:40.040 --> 00:18:43.310 It's, it might be time to talk about taking away the phone. 00:18:43.935 --> 00:18:45.470 Candace Dellacona: So let's talk about that a little bit. 00:18:45.500 --> 00:18:50.460 'cause I did recently have a cybersecurity expert on one of the past episodes. 00:18:50.790 --> 00:18:54.970 And when these scams, that sort of seep into our aging loved 00:18:54.970 --> 00:18:57.700 one's lives are so sophisticated. 00:18:58.120 --> 00:19:02.010 What is your best advice to those sandwich generation members out there 00:19:02.010 --> 00:19:07.240 that are looking to shield their parents from falling victim to things 00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:10.910 like that without taking away their car keys slash phones o r freedom. 00:19:11.210 --> 00:19:12.530 Do you have any advice? 00:19:12.755 --> 00:19:16.195 Beth Pinsker: Yeah, no, I recently had to talk a family member out 00:19:16.195 --> 00:19:17.875 of a scam as it was happening. 00:19:18.145 --> 00:19:23.065 Like he was on his phone with the scammers and I called on his wife's phone and I'm 00:19:23.065 --> 00:19:24.925 like, put them on hold and talk to me. 00:19:25.225 --> 00:19:28.555 And I, he was literally convinced he was dressed and ready to go 00:19:28.555 --> 00:19:30.055 to the bank and take out cash. 00:19:30.595 --> 00:19:37.775 The best way to forestall that is to be a trusted contact on, certain 00:19:37.775 --> 00:19:41.945 accounts like a brokerage account, life insurance, that sort of account where 00:19:42.065 --> 00:19:47.745 somebody at the institution can call you if there are, the known red flags. 00:19:47.965 --> 00:19:53.755 If my relative had gone over to the bank and tried to withdraw $40,000 in cash, 00:19:54.115 --> 00:19:59.135 some teller over at the bank should be trained enough to say, why is this ill 00:19:59.135 --> 00:20:05.020 80-year-old man trying to take out a large amount of cash something is wrong. 00:20:05.410 --> 00:20:09.760 And they if they see a trusted contact on the account, they will call that 00:20:09.790 --> 00:20:14.750 trusted contact and say, your loved one is here, doesn't look well, and 00:20:14.930 --> 00:20:16.700 they're trying to take out money in cash. 00:20:16.800 --> 00:20:22.190 The brokerages in particular are trained to listen to people's voices on phone 00:20:22.190 --> 00:20:28.150 calls and say, if they're asking for money in untraceable denominations of some 00:20:28.150 --> 00:20:33.475 kind gift cards, money wire transfers, stuff that can't be pulled back in 00:20:33.475 --> 00:20:37.495 cases of fraud, they're supposed to call the trusted contact if there is one. 00:20:38.065 --> 00:20:40.645 Candace Dellacona: And so you can add a trusted contact 00:20:40.975 --> 00:20:42.595 to any account, right beth? 00:20:42.815 --> 00:20:43.955 Beth Pinsker: Really any account. 00:20:44.005 --> 00:20:48.325 On a bank account, if you are the power of attorney on record with the 00:20:48.325 --> 00:20:50.245 bank account, it acts in the same way. 00:20:50.575 --> 00:20:54.475 But you can also then look in on the bank account where the daily 00:20:54.475 --> 00:20:56.035 transactions are taking place. 00:20:56.395 --> 00:20:59.995 And, you can have the bank app on your phone and you can check 00:21:00.045 --> 00:21:01.485 what that parent is up to. 00:21:01.535 --> 00:21:03.305 It's a little bit like spying. 00:21:03.670 --> 00:21:07.720 It feels like it, but think about it from the reverse, sandwich generation, 00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:09.800 reverse parenting perspective. 00:21:09.800 --> 00:21:15.170 Like I would never hand my 19-year-old a credit card without teaching 00:21:15.170 --> 00:21:17.240 him how to use it first, right? 00:21:17.240 --> 00:21:21.230 And so the way you start out as a parent doing that is you have 00:21:21.230 --> 00:21:24.320 them as an authorized user on your credit card, and then you 00:21:24.320 --> 00:21:25.820 see what purchases they're making. 00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:29.900 Then they get their own credit card where you might be a joint signer on 00:21:29.900 --> 00:21:33.415 the credit card and you, you look over their bills with them and you make 00:21:33.415 --> 00:21:35.245 sure that they're spending responsibly. 00:21:35.845 --> 00:21:37.015 Same thing in reverse. 00:21:37.015 --> 00:21:41.485 When somebody's 80 and they're experiencing a little bit of cognitive 00:21:41.605 --> 00:21:46.455 decline, because everybody is at 80, you wanna keep an eye on things. 00:21:46.455 --> 00:21:49.455 Like you don't have to interfere if nothing is going wrong, but 00:21:49.455 --> 00:21:50.775 you can sort of spot check. 00:21:51.235 --> 00:21:55.925 With my own mom, when I went to look at her bills and her statements and 00:21:55.925 --> 00:22:00.705 stuff like that, I saw that she was giving away a lot of money to political 00:22:00.705 --> 00:22:03.315 causes of her political denomination. 00:22:03.795 --> 00:22:08.275 And she was on every mailing list and she literally, whoever asked her for money, 00:22:08.275 --> 00:22:13.105 she just gave them money and it wasn't a great amount of money to each person. 00:22:13.105 --> 00:22:15.205 It's not like she was giving away thousands and tens of 00:22:15.205 --> 00:22:16.525 thousands of dollars at a time. 00:22:16.525 --> 00:22:22.135 Whoever asked her got $25, $50 and it just added up to a bigger number than 00:22:22.135 --> 00:22:24.415 I'm sure she was calculating in her head. 00:22:25.075 --> 00:22:28.570 And the solicitations were just endless. 00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:34.210 She had obviously triggered some mechanism in the system that just constantly 00:22:34.210 --> 00:22:35.830 asked her for money and she gave it. 00:22:35.830 --> 00:22:41.020 And I thought, there's something going wrong here, and I have to help 00:22:41.020 --> 00:22:43.420 her moderate her impulse control. 00:22:43.555 --> 00:22:43.975 Candace Dellacona: Yeah. 00:22:44.035 --> 00:22:44.455 Yeah. 00:22:44.600 --> 00:22:44.930 Beth Pinsker: In some way. 00:22:45.265 --> 00:22:48.745 Candace Dellacona: And so, seeing a change in spending, for example, 00:22:48.745 --> 00:22:52.465 is definitely something that people should look out for in terms of a red 00:22:52.465 --> 00:22:57.695 flag, delaying on things like your required minimum distributions that 00:22:57.695 --> 00:23:01.905 could have pretty significant financial consequences if you don't comply. 00:23:01.905 --> 00:23:05.465 What are the other red flags, Beth as a sandwich generation member from a 00:23:05.465 --> 00:23:09.485 financial perspective that we should look out for with our aging parents? 00:23:09.925 --> 00:23:14.055 Beth Pinsker: Past due bills or just the inability to manage incoming 00:23:14.055 --> 00:23:15.855 and outgoing correspondence. 00:23:16.275 --> 00:23:19.975 My mom had been showing warning signs before her surgery that 00:23:19.975 --> 00:23:21.115 we didn't know anything about. 00:23:21.115 --> 00:23:26.155 And the biggest one was that she was in the middle of a long-term care 00:23:26.565 --> 00:23:29.235 long-term care insurance claim, right? 00:23:29.235 --> 00:23:34.215 So she had a the home health aide that was paid for through the long-term care 00:23:34.215 --> 00:23:36.435 insurance, but she had to file receipts. 00:23:36.485 --> 00:23:36.965 For that. 00:23:36.965 --> 00:23:42.665 And the receipt filing process was like the most tedious and onerous thing I've 00:23:42.665 --> 00:23:44.435 ever encountered in my entire life. 00:23:44.645 --> 00:23:48.905 And I don't blame her for not being able to keep up on it, but she wasn't 00:23:49.235 --> 00:23:51.305 telling us that she wasn't doing it. 00:23:52.025 --> 00:23:56.105 And so with the long-term care claim, in her particular circumstance, 00:23:56.435 --> 00:24:00.280 if you lapsed the paperwork for 90 days, you went out of claim. 00:24:01.295 --> 00:24:05.555 So when you go out of claim, the consequence is that you 00:24:05.555 --> 00:24:07.265 then owe them a premium. 00:24:07.835 --> 00:24:11.915 Because when you're in claim, when you're getting money from them, they don't 00:24:11.915 --> 00:24:13.595 expect you to pay them the premiums. 00:24:13.595 --> 00:24:15.755 And these premiums are pretty steep, right? 00:24:15.855 --> 00:24:18.405 One of the benefits of being in the middle of a claim is that 00:24:18.405 --> 00:24:19.695 you don't owe them any money. 00:24:19.695 --> 00:24:23.145 They owe you money, but she had stopped filling out the paperwork. 00:24:23.145 --> 00:24:27.175 So suddenly when I got to her desk after her surgery there was a past 00:24:27.175 --> 00:24:32.995 due notice from the long-term care and it was for almost $7,000, um, 00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:36.150 that needed to be sent immediately. 00:24:36.420 --> 00:24:41.270 They were very upset with this process and, there was a trusted contact 00:24:41.270 --> 00:24:42.320 and they had reached out to us. 00:24:42.330 --> 00:24:46.090 It all happened simultaneously, so at some point we would've 00:24:46.090 --> 00:24:47.980 been notified like that week. 00:24:48.030 --> 00:24:49.830 But we found out about it that week anyway. 00:24:50.290 --> 00:24:54.790 And so the average amount that a caregiver spends out of pocket per 00:24:54.790 --> 00:24:59.765 year according to AARP is about $7,200. 00:25:00.425 --> 00:25:04.475 So in the first three weeks of taking care of my mom, I had 00:25:04.475 --> 00:25:06.605 to send down a check for 6,800. 00:25:07.185 --> 00:25:09.775 And then, if you consider my flight down there that was 00:25:09.775 --> 00:25:11.035 my second flight down there. 00:25:11.035 --> 00:25:13.135 So two flights, Ubers 00:25:13.455 --> 00:25:14.025 Candace Dellacona: Meals. 00:25:14.175 --> 00:25:14.685 Yeah. 00:25:14.925 --> 00:25:15.585 Beth Pinsker: all of it. 00:25:15.875 --> 00:25:21.845 I was over the yearly average in a month of out-of-pocket spending. 00:25:21.845 --> 00:25:24.005 Now, I was gonna get that money back eventually. 00:25:24.425 --> 00:25:28.325 But I had to write a check and like I don't keep that much money around in 00:25:28.325 --> 00:25:30.765 my checking account on a normal basis. 00:25:30.765 --> 00:25:35.015 And I have my own expenses and my own inflows and outflows, and it was hard 00:25:35.015 --> 00:25:40.305 for me to put my hands on an extra, seven grand on a moment's notice. 00:25:40.485 --> 00:25:42.735 But I had to FedEx a check the next day. 00:25:43.335 --> 00:25:48.085 And of course the money came back to me like four months later, and it wasn't 00:25:48.085 --> 00:25:50.005 FedEx to me, it was regular mail. 00:25:50.060 --> 00:25:50.780 Candace Dellacona: course not. 00:25:50.840 --> 00:25:51.560 Of course not. 00:25:51.860 --> 00:25:54.350 Beth Pinsker: But you know, this is what a caregiver has to do. 00:25:54.350 --> 00:25:58.130 And like sandwich generation, like I've got kids, I've got household 00:25:58.130 --> 00:25:59.900 expenses, I've got my own life. 00:26:00.320 --> 00:26:04.730 And, it's hard to juggle that sort of thing going on. 00:26:04.880 --> 00:26:10.770 And, that's to me what like the sandwich generation pressures came mostly 00:26:10.770 --> 00:26:16.470 financially from that sort of thing where I had to put my time and my own 00:26:16.470 --> 00:26:21.590 money on the table when that money and time was needed elsewhere as well. 00:26:22.060 --> 00:26:25.030 Both for my job and my life and my kids. 00:26:25.100 --> 00:26:27.120 Candace Dellacona: And you bring up an important point, Beth, 00:26:27.120 --> 00:26:29.130 in that we can't do it all. 00:26:29.460 --> 00:26:32.880 And there is sort of a day of reckoning where you feel it, 00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:34.230 or many days of reckoning. 00:26:34.560 --> 00:26:37.740 And so you talk about your brother not necessarily being 00:26:37.740 --> 00:26:39.450 the doer in this situation. 00:26:39.820 --> 00:26:45.310 How do you recommend a sibling like you when you're the doer, how do you go to 00:26:45.310 --> 00:26:50.545 your sibling and ask for help in a way that they actually wanna provide it. 00:26:50.545 --> 00:26:54.895 What's your best advice for getting that extra assistance from 00:26:54.895 --> 00:26:58.435 a sibling or someone else in the family to help you carry the load? 00:26:58.885 --> 00:27:02.605 Beth Pinsker: Yeah it really requires communication and I know that some 00:27:02.605 --> 00:27:04.435 families are not good about that. 00:27:04.445 --> 00:27:07.385 My brother's very private and doesn't like to be brought into things. 00:27:07.725 --> 00:27:11.235 So I left him out of the story mostly on purpose. 00:27:11.715 --> 00:27:15.280 But we worked out a schedule that worked for both of us. 00:27:15.340 --> 00:27:20.150 I had a remote friendly job and he doesn't but we worked out a schedule 00:27:20.150 --> 00:27:24.350 so that he could go to visit my mom at the times when he was available 00:27:24.350 --> 00:27:26.380 and I could go when when he. 00:27:26.930 --> 00:27:30.650 We just worked out a leapfrog schedule, so we were never there at the same time. 00:27:30.950 --> 00:27:32.810 'cause that would've created redundancies. 00:27:33.170 --> 00:27:36.230 But he was there, as much as I was there. 00:27:36.230 --> 00:27:39.200 And we were able to communicate well enough with each 00:27:39.200 --> 00:27:40.760 other to make that happen. 00:27:41.300 --> 00:27:46.285 And the thing about a lot of siblings is, from a lot of people, there's one sibling 00:27:46.285 --> 00:27:52.035 in proximity and one sibling who has, moved away and the sibling in proximity 00:27:52.035 --> 00:27:57.605 gets stuck with a lot of the daily tasks, and sometimes there's a sibling 00:27:57.605 --> 00:28:01.960 that has money, and a sibling that's nearby, and they're not the same person. 00:28:02.230 --> 00:28:05.170 And then, so the sibling who has money feels like the family, 00:28:05.170 --> 00:28:09.560 ATM, like everybody's always getting money from that person. 00:28:09.950 --> 00:28:13.210 And, whenever there's an emergency, they turn to that person and 00:28:13.210 --> 00:28:17.350 that person then feels a little alienated that, that they're only 00:28:17.350 --> 00:28:19.570 good for whatever, they can pay for. 00:28:20.080 --> 00:28:21.040 And it's difficult. 00:28:21.040 --> 00:28:24.125 The only way through any of these things is communication. 00:28:24.665 --> 00:28:26.005 And the knowledge. 00:28:26.055 --> 00:28:28.995 One of the things I was trying to do with my book is tell people 00:28:28.995 --> 00:28:32.925 when they had an obligation and didn't have an obligation, right? 00:28:32.925 --> 00:28:38.340 So there's no obligation, legally or financially to support your aging parents. 00:28:39.310 --> 00:28:41.500 You are not on the hook for any of this. 00:28:41.500 --> 00:28:43.510 You're not on the hook for their credit card debts. 00:28:43.720 --> 00:28:46.180 You're not on the hook for paying for their medical care. 00:28:46.510 --> 00:28:50.310 You are not, required to pay for a fancy nursing home. 00:28:50.720 --> 00:28:55.460 You can outsource a lot of the hands-on physical care. 00:28:55.840 --> 00:28:59.520 The thing is that when it comes to having that trusted person, that 00:28:59.520 --> 00:29:03.120 trusted contact, the name you're gonna put on all those documents, 00:29:03.630 --> 00:29:04.950 it's hard to get outta that one. 00:29:05.360 --> 00:29:05.790 Candace Dellacona: Yeah. 00:29:06.460 --> 00:29:08.830 Beth Pinsker: I don't know, like how many times have you seen it 00:29:08.830 --> 00:29:13.330 in your practice that they put some random third party stranger? 00:29:13.400 --> 00:29:14.090 It's rare, 00:29:14.225 --> 00:29:15.035 Candace Dellacona: It is rare. 00:29:15.035 --> 00:29:15.575 It is rare. 00:29:15.575 --> 00:29:17.525 I think you bring up an important point, particularly with the 00:29:17.525 --> 00:29:19.295 siblings and the communication part. 00:29:19.295 --> 00:29:23.075 I think in every family we play a role, fortunately or unfortunately, 00:29:23.465 --> 00:29:26.675 and whether that role is of financial support and that's what you're 00:29:26.675 --> 00:29:27.940 known for or you're the doer. 00:29:28.505 --> 00:29:30.635 I think it's really hard to break out of those roles. 00:29:30.885 --> 00:29:33.585 What I found in my practice, particularly asking for help with 00:29:33.585 --> 00:29:35.745 siblings is be specific in the request. 00:29:36.315 --> 00:29:39.075 And share the fact that you can't do it all. 00:29:39.075 --> 00:29:40.485 You're also raising kids. 00:29:40.485 --> 00:29:43.410 In your case, you were, a full-time writer and a parent. 00:29:44.260 --> 00:29:49.000 A single parent, and so you had to have your brother pitch in, and 00:29:49.000 --> 00:29:50.950 I'm thrilled to hear that he did. 00:29:51.400 --> 00:29:55.130 I think in some families it's incredibly difficult to cross 00:29:55.130 --> 00:29:58.600 that bridge particularly if siblings have been reluctant. 00:29:58.940 --> 00:30:03.380 And that's why really asking specifically for the things that you need and maybe 00:30:03.380 --> 00:30:05.905 finding the skill that they're good at. 00:30:05.905 --> 00:30:10.055 And that could be, doing long distance bookkeeping and being the person in 00:30:10.055 --> 00:30:11.855 charge of making sure bills are paid. 00:30:11.855 --> 00:30:13.445 So thinking outside the box. 00:30:14.105 --> 00:30:17.695 And before I let you go, Beth, one of the things that I liked so much about 00:30:17.695 --> 00:30:22.015 your book that I think is a really important distinction that is lost on a 00:30:22.015 --> 00:30:24.445 lot of people, even well-meaning people. 00:30:25.165 --> 00:30:27.445 You called your book My Mother's Money. 00:30:28.865 --> 00:30:33.005 And I think that for those of us in this space, one of the hardest 00:30:33.005 --> 00:30:37.985 things to get through to many family members is that it's not your 00:30:37.985 --> 00:30:40.505 money, it's your mother's money. 00:30:40.925 --> 00:30:46.400 And so what is your best advice for those of us who perhaps would not have 00:30:46.400 --> 00:30:50.720 made the same choices that our parents did from a financial perspective and 00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:56.060 finding a way to respect their choices while still caring for them in the best 00:30:56.060 --> 00:30:58.550 possible way and respecting their agency. 00:30:59.300 --> 00:31:00.350 Beth Pinsker: Yeah, it's really hard. 00:31:00.350 --> 00:31:04.800 It's a really weird feeling and having gone through it, I, I don't have all 00:31:04.800 --> 00:31:08.785 the answers to the emotional part of it because I'm still sorting through all 00:31:08.785 --> 00:31:13.410 of that now that you know what, whatever was left of my mom's money became my 00:31:13.410 --> 00:31:16.290 money, and that still feels weird to me. 00:31:16.340 --> 00:31:19.620 Because, especially 'cause my mom was relatively, young for 00:31:19.620 --> 00:31:20.970 an old person when she died. 00:31:21.430 --> 00:31:25.030 And I would rather have had her around to spend that money herself 00:31:25.030 --> 00:31:28.930 than have it for me or to send my kids to college or whatever. 00:31:29.380 --> 00:31:34.300 But for my mom had been careful about her finances for her whole life. 00:31:34.750 --> 00:31:42.425 And so when I took over managing her daily ins and outs, I wanted to respect that. 00:31:42.425 --> 00:31:45.455 It was important to me to take care of things the way that, that 00:31:45.455 --> 00:31:48.605 she took care of things herself. 00:31:48.655 --> 00:31:50.305 But I broke the rules a lot. 00:31:50.405 --> 00:31:53.585 My mom didn't believe in online banking, like many older people. 00:31:54.045 --> 00:31:57.255 And there was just no way I could function without online banking. 00:31:57.255 --> 00:31:59.905 So I just did it and hoped that she wasn't mad at me. 00:32:00.445 --> 00:32:03.325 But there were things that I spent money on that I know that she 00:32:03.325 --> 00:32:04.555 would not have spent money on. 00:32:05.755 --> 00:32:08.815 And then she was worried about spending money on, and she was worried about 00:32:08.815 --> 00:32:11.125 the money running out constantly. 00:32:11.125 --> 00:32:14.785 And I think a lot of people have that fear and that fear goes both ways. 00:32:14.835 --> 00:32:19.455 Because I understood the mechanics of the money, I knew how long 00:32:19.455 --> 00:32:22.545 the money would last because I was able to run those numbers. 00:32:22.545 --> 00:32:26.255 And I think part of there's a whole section of my book about 00:32:26.255 --> 00:32:27.775 how to figure that part out. 00:32:27.775 --> 00:32:33.955 And I think that if people had a more realistic understanding of the financial 00:32:33.955 --> 00:32:39.455 picture that they would make better choices that would make everybody happier. 00:32:39.705 --> 00:32:45.315 There would be less emergency selling of houses and moving to lesser 00:32:45.315 --> 00:32:47.505 facilities or getting less help. 00:32:47.505 --> 00:32:52.095 I think there would be better care for people if people were felt 00:32:52.095 --> 00:32:55.275 free to spend the money and weren't afraid that it was gonna run out. 00:32:55.735 --> 00:32:58.525 'Cause in these circumstances when somebody is sick, you have to 00:32:58.525 --> 00:33:00.385 make the money last for less time. 00:33:00.385 --> 00:33:03.085 And I think that's a reality that some people don't wanna face 00:33:03.445 --> 00:33:04.555 when they're going through it. 00:33:04.645 --> 00:33:09.005 But, I knew my mom's money was gonna last long enough for her 00:33:09.005 --> 00:33:10.385 because she was really sick. 00:33:10.415 --> 00:33:14.565 And the reality was is that, I wasn't planning for 20 years. 00:33:15.385 --> 00:33:17.245 I was planning for six months. 00:33:17.875 --> 00:33:21.985 And so I knew that we could have whatever she needed, even though she 00:33:21.985 --> 00:33:25.195 was saying like, we can't afford all these caregivers, we can't afford 00:33:25.525 --> 00:33:27.445 for me to stay in this facility. 00:33:27.745 --> 00:33:28.925 And I was like, no, we can. 00:33:28.925 --> 00:33:30.365 What are you saving the money for? 00:33:30.415 --> 00:33:31.795 That's what this money is for. 00:33:32.575 --> 00:33:34.225 And I think if people understood. 00:33:34.795 --> 00:33:37.975 The greater financial picture and were able to run the numbers and got 00:33:37.975 --> 00:33:41.965 some help with that when they needed it, that the caregiving would be 00:33:41.965 --> 00:33:45.925 better and everybody's needs would be better suited because people 00:33:45.925 --> 00:33:47.545 wouldn't be so afraid of running out. 00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:53.410 Candace Dellacona: And that's why everyone should buy Beth's book because she has 00:33:53.410 --> 00:33:59.500 really provided all of us with the guide that we need to figure out how to best 00:33:59.500 --> 00:34:04.560 advocate for our parents from a financial perspective, which leads to all of it, 00:34:04.650 --> 00:34:10.640 the best care and how to make sure that as we age our loved ones are cared for. 00:34:10.880 --> 00:34:14.190 I think the other thing, Beth, that you've done really well is you 00:34:14.190 --> 00:34:18.600 have two kids and you've done an incredible job of modeling for them 00:34:18.960 --> 00:34:21.360 how best to advocate and to take care. 00:34:21.360 --> 00:34:22.980 So bravo to you on that. 00:34:22.980 --> 00:34:27.800 And really your book is truly the resource that so many of us need. 00:34:27.800 --> 00:34:32.000 We will have in our show notes how to get it, but it's available at your 00:34:32.000 --> 00:34:36.900 local bookstore on Amazon and any online platform where you buy your book. 00:34:36.900 --> 00:34:39.960 So thank you so much, Beth, for joining us today. 00:34:40.465 --> 00:34:41.140 Beth Pinsker: Thank you. 00:34:41.200 --> 00:34:42.010 It was great to be here. 00:34:42.210 --> 00:34:42.900 Candace Dellacona: Thanks.