Welcome back to the
Laravel Community Creator Series.
Today we are joined by Alfred Nutile,
and he has, you know, he's been a pillar
of the community forever.
I think I've known about him for, man, 10
years now? Does that sound about right?
But, you know, Alfred, welcome to the
show, and if you don't mind, sort of
introduce yourself to
those that might not know you.
Right, no, thank you. Yeah, it's been a
while. I kind of realize I'm
not in the background a lot,
especially I was hidden away at Pfizer
for a while. I introduced Laravel
there eons ago, 10 or
more years ago, 4.2.
And I worked there for like 11 years as a
contractor, kind of hiding away.
But for the past three years, I've been
on my own and just producing more content
for the public
because of being on my own.
It's a lot easier just
to share things. So, yeah.
That's awesome. Yes, yes. I've, man, it's
funny how like, you know,
the community's been, you know,
it's just so big from all these years and
like you don't get to meet everybody just
because it's, you know, now it's so
global and worldwide.
So it's awesome, you know, for you to
come on board and do this with us.
That's awesome. Yeah. Thanks. So you have
a project which is pretty interesting.
It's called Lara Llama.
Did I pronounce that right? Kind of like
the animal? Yeah, yeah.
It was called Lain Chain before that or
Lara Chain, sorry. But people got to
confuse with like
Bitcoin and that type of stuff.
So and I made it after Lain Chain, the
Python version, but now it's just called
Lara Llama just because again, naming's
hard and I just tried to rename it.
That's good, though. I mean, that seems
memorable, you know. It's
like, oh, that's simple.
And, you know, it stands out because it's
not something you hear very often. So
what exactly is the project?
So and that's the thing. So two years
ago, Lain, so basically it all started
out of being scared out of my socks one
night learning about Lain Chain.
Lain Chain is the Python project that
builds automations and workflows and
makes it really easy for developers to
say, hey, I want to connect all these
things together with LLMs and workflows
and all this stuff to then make things
happen, projects and, you know, agents
and stuff that can really automate stuff.
And I'll talk about that later because
with your workflows, we could talk about
that. And I was like, wow, what's going
to happen to me, a PHP Laravel developer?
Do I have to start learning Python?
Where do we fit into this next era of web
technology? So then like around that
time, I started making Lara Chain to just
prove to myself we still have a place.
And when you come down to it, one of the
biggest things with open AI is they made
an API that was really easy to use. And
we, Laravel is really,
really good with APIs.
And so when it comes to building web
stacks that can have scheduling,
batching, automations, we still have a
foot in the game or whatever they say,
because we can do all that and use these
APIs and get all the benefits of this AI
or more importantly, or more
specifically LLM integrations.
So that's where Lara Llama is at now at its
core, it is a rag system, but where it
helps to retrieve data from a vector
database augmented with the LLM and
generate more data
from that or more output.
But it's more than that, the goal was
actually to go beyond making it for
developers, but making it for business
owners or not no code level people as
well who can log in, click, click, click,
and do things to automate like checking
your email boxes or scraping websites to
gather data about their clients and then
generate more content.
So it really started to grow into more
than a rag system because I'm seeing
workflows and automations around that.
And one of the most recent ones I'll talk
about after is how it can be a personal
assistant around projects
and planning around that.
So that's the gist of where it came from
and what it's about.
That's awesome. Yeah, it's the whole
like, you know, for me sort of very new
to that side of the tech stack, you know,
tell this the future
of LLMs and everything.
Like, say you had to explain LLM to
somebody that's not even big into coding.
How would you even
describe that, I guess?
I know a lot of people are saying it's
auto correct on steroids. I think I think
a good way to look at it is, you know,
it's just a way for us to feed a prompt
to or a question with some information
and get results and it basically, you
know, people are fearful about
hallucinations, but it doesn't have to be
a problem once you get
better at these tools.
So an LLM is just an API or system or we
can use to basically hand it a question
and get results. So, for example, I have
a lot of I'll use it. Here's a nice one.
We send recipes to Lera Lama via the
email address it makes for you.
It takes all those recipes and at the end
of the week, it sends a summary of the
recipes and what we like, you know, it
then summarizes them by title, by cook
time or whatever we want, because we tell
the LLM in the prompt, you know, at the end of the week, send us an email.
Summarize all the new recipes this way
and then it produces that output that
way. So does that
answer your question there?
It does. It does. That's pretty good.
That was a good explanation, I think. So
I think my next question just about the
project is you can actually use sort of
any back end, right?
As far as like, yeah, or called or. Yeah,
that's a good question.
There's so more, right?
Oh, yeah, yeah. And it's endless because
again, we're like once this became an API
thing, it's endless and we shouldn't lock
ourselves down to a API
like open AI, especially.
So the goal here is two things. One is by
being agnostic to the LM where we can
talk to any API and get the results, just
like we do with storage or cash or
anything in Laravel.
We talked to an LM. We get the results in
we format them like the same for any LM
you're talking to any API.
And so at that point, it doesn't matter.
You can just keep spitting out these HTTP
driven drivers in Grok, Claude, Olama,
which that's why I really want to talk
about an open AI are the ones
that I have working right now.
But then you get into the more important
thing coming up down the road is like
within two years, like recently, PCs have
released chips that are good with AI.
So you can run Olama. Have you heard of
Olama at all? I have not known so Olama.
Olama. Yeah, Olama is like the engine X
of LLMs. Okay, you run a llama on your
machine, just like engine
X download, click running.
But then you pull in a model. So I'm
going to pull in the model, llama 3.1. So
now you can then run that model on your
machine and ask it questions.
It makes an API. So just like engine X,
it's a proxy. That proxy has an API, you
talk to that API, it happens
to match opening AI exactly.
So now you could just point your driver
there. Right. So now you have a local LLM
that you can talk to, more importantly,
for a lot of people, a, it costs nothing
besides your machine and B, you don't
have fear of like your data leaking out,
because you're running a local LLM.
So that's another win here is that when
you're working as a developer locally, or
if even for privacy reasons, you can use
that local API. So it's another key thing
there. So that's awesome. Yeah. Yeah, it
is amazing. Yeah. Yeah.
I was gonna say, yeah, it's, well, let's
just, while we're talking about this,
let's talk about some
use cases. Yeah. Right.
You know, for me as a sort of a content
creator, the first thing that comes to
mind is like, article summaries for
sharing on socials. Yeah. That's sort of
the first one I think about, but there's
like so many use cases you can use this
for. Right. I mean, it's, it's sort of
endless, whatever you, you
can dream up, you can do.
It's good. It's yeah. And it's so let's
talk about use cases. And then along the
line, let's keep in our minds that, hey,
chat, you can do that. I can go to their
website, paste this in, and it can do it.
So we'll always keep
that in mind as we talk.
And then another thing to keep in mind is
like, no matter what it can do today,
we're always going to be ahead of it,
because we're developers, we're creating,
we're thinking ahead of things. So we'll
always be able to offer our customers and
ourselves an edge because
we're always ahead of the case.
And I've proven this with myself for
years, at least two years now with
opening AI, I'm always way ahead of them
on some ideas and abilities. So back to
your point. You could use like, like, let
me specifically talk about mine. And then
you'll see your overlap.
I made a project in Leralama. That
project is basically me with a prompt
saying, hey, help me market this book.
What are some key things I can do? Build
me a plan. And then the project says,
okay, here's your plan.
Here's all the tasks you have to do. And
when they're due, I'll remind you every
morning what's going on this week. Right.
And then in the background, I can have a
bunch of other stuff happen because
Leralama has these plugins or these ways
to send data to the system, which is
another thing to keep in mind is all day
long, we're collecting
data or we like things.
And if you can send them somewhere
consistently and then have that be your
repository, then that's a big win. Where
it's opening AI or chat, GPT and all
these web interfaces, it's kind of hard
to just keep it up to date and keep your
data in there. So
another short term win there.
So now all week long, I can send it via
email, a link to a news article I like.
So 10 articles later, it's collecting all
this stuff when it gets the email, it
goes, oh, there's a link in here. I'm
going to go his prompt says go get the
website from that link.
And I'll go get it goes, it gets the
website downloads it and puts it into the
system, right? So now by the end of the
week, I have a collection of emails that
are now websites I wanted
to talk about or think about.
I have a system that could help summarize
them for me. I could potentially have the
system plugged in the LinkedIn or Twitter
to help post for me consistently,
especially once I build trust with it.
And that's another thing I talked about
in another article of like, you can automate a lot of things, but we can't do that.
We can automate a lot of things, but we
have to build that trust meter in the
specific task. So for you, it's it kind
of overlaps what you're doing, right? You
can start collecting information in one
place, you could start helping it, it can
even know your voice and your tone.
So there's an area in Laryllama where you
can say, this is how I speak, this is how
I write, I mean, right? So then when it's
repeating things or building things for
you, you can say use
my voice or use my tone.
And when the LM is building that response
or building that summary, it can then use
your tone to help do that.
So that's that's pretty sweet. Because
one thing just using like chat GPT is the
when I write prompts, I try to be really
specific, but it's like it will still
come out weird a lot of times.
Yeah, so as an example, so like when we
publish a new post on the on the Laryll
news website, I'm just using Zapier right
now and it pulls down the article tags.
Yeah, it runs it through chat GPT and
supposed to summarize it into a tweet.
And then it pushes out to like threads
and LinkedIn or whatever.
But a lot of times it'll come out like,
like in a first person, you know, like
I'm writing about something Larylla
Incorporated did. And it'll be like, look
what we did. And it's like, but that's
not that's not even how I wrote the
prompt. Like it should never do that. But
you know, look what we made in this
package. But I've still been struggling
with the trust issue on
the way I've been doing it.
Yeah, in in one thing to mention there is
prompt engineering seems like a silly
concept. But I think you'll see you have
to get better at it. Right. So just sit
there and hammer away in the in the chat
GPT UI or Claude, I like Claude better.
Throw your prompt at it, get your
responses, get them right, keep messing
with the prompt, ask it to help you fix
the prompt to get the right answer
because you're what you're asking isn't
hard, impossible. I mean, it's just, you
need to keep refining your
prompt to help with that.
And you know, the concept of multi shot
versus one shot, like you can give it
multiple examples of what you want
multiple examples of what you don't want
so that it can keep learning and not
learning is a bad word. It can keep using
the context of your prompt to
not do the wrong thing again.
So yeah, awesome. Yeah, yeah.
Not to sort of derail too much. But as
far as like deploying like say I want to
run this on my own on my side, I can just
deploy it as a normal level app or is
there like a lot of stuff involved like
I'm thinking like a
forge or something like that.
Yeah, yeah, forge.
It's really that easy. So, you know,
ideally it would be a bunch of easy like
filament ideally it would be like
filament but it's not like, listen, my
goal is to inspire
people to think about this.
Right, we have it, we have, look at I was
pulling up some numbers about lane chain
there's 72,000 stars and
GitHub versus level 78,000.
This is a popular thing that no one's
talking about in our community very few
people that I meet even know what lane
chain is. Okay, yeah, I've never heard of
it. Right. So my point is, there's
something going on here it's more than
hype, it's a new way of thinking about
tools just like WordPress was a CMS.
We have a new era of like I call it a CRS
a content retrieval system but it's more
than that it's automation it's workflows.
And so, ideally, it would be like
filament where you can plug it in your
level package and go right right now it's
a, it is like WordPress where it's like
the whole thing or nothing, and that's
not ideal, whatever.
But honestly forage deploy use a Postgres
database on forage in everything should
just work because it's that simple just
Laravel Postgres with its vector ability
which is awesome horizon to run q jobs
in, and that's pretty much
it in web sockets reverb or
to get a little bit of the dynamic UI.
But then what you get after that is you
get the the awesomeness of Laravel with
the scheduling where you
can have tasks waiting to run.
You can tell it to go check an email box
so that's another thing.
I have an email box so you can make a,
you know, like an info at your email
domain and then you can say
okay go get emails from there.
And so every time you make a new email
box it will just put the email plus 12345
at that domain so you can just keep
creating on the fly more and more places
to send different types of emails.
These are my emails about news articles
these are my emails about things I want
to look into, blah blah blah so before
long you can use these
different techniques.
Or how about this one you have five
projects and they're all in GitHub and
every time you commit the webhook sends
back to Lara llama the results so now at
the end of the week, you can sum up your
change log for five projects
because it's all right there.
So you got webhooks you get web scraping
with browser shots you
can set up browser shot.
And you have web search with a brave API
right now so you get all these things
like you said by just forge deploy
postgres which forge will do for you and
it should be that easy honestly.
Yeah, that's that's really good. That's
what I like to hear is the easy side of
it. That's the goal in it hasn't so
there's the concept of output is there as
well where you can say hey make an API
API around this collection of data so now
you have a collection of news articles,
or more importantly.
I was talking to someone like, well, I'll
just say like there's a company I know
that has articles online. And they're
like, how do we make this whatever like
like so it's using this modern technology
but you could be
sending all that stuff here.
And then you could say, make this an API
click a button, and now you have an API.
So now on your website somewhere else you
have a chat widget that talks when the
user asked a question that actually is
asking it from your API and layer llama
and gets the results so you can actually write away.
Plug in this LLM API to any website you
want, but using your data that makes it
chattable. So yeah, you can go in a lot
of directions there
with with layer llama.
And again, this is all to inspire ideas
if layer llama has gone in five years. I
don't care. It's to get us thinking as a
community. What can we be doing in I
think what we need to be doing this state
may be relevant relevant relevant to
relative in this next era, you know.
Yeah, for sure. I mean, that's, I mean,
that's all you keep hearing about
probably the last what five years is, you
know, is open AI and lms and everything.
Yeah, I'm engineering so it's I feel like
it's going to be it's one of those things
that that's definitely
going to be here to stay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I have a question. This
is totally off the wall but you know, as
you're describing all this so one feature
of the Louisville news site is we have a community link section.
And it's, it's sort of hard to keep up
with because you know I'm only one person
and then what I normally do is every
Sunday is when I go in and
approve them, it would be nice.
I don't even know if this possible but it
could could it's good. Yeah, I am or not
spam. No, that's beautiful. Like, 100%
like you could say hey, go look at these
URLs go parse them so layer llama and again, you can grab the code.
Just use it so layer llama will take your
URL if you use so so lms have a tool
ability and the tool says the LM says oh
he wants a URL turned into a website so
sometimes I'm going to use my tool, you
know, URL to website and
it just knows it right.
So then it would get that data and your
prompt will say then verify if this is
spam or not and then the prompt.
The results would be like yes or no like
whatever you want. Right. So you could in
one prompt. Say, check these URLs for me.
If it's spam return false
if it's not spam return true.
And then even you know do the next thing
if it's okay then your next tool would be
then go set it to approved in my database
because it could query your database but not magically.
Think about tools dependency injection.
Right. So when it says
use the get URL tool.
There else dependency injection system
gets past that line that then renders
that class and it's past the arguments or
the information and then do what it needs
to do and then return whatever it needs to return. So there's no magic here. It's just it knowing what tools you have what steps to take and what to what what to do with the results of that tool. Right. So yeah, I think that's awesome.
You could do that and that's a brilliant.
These are the things I want people
thinking about though you just like it's
not to take away your job or many jobs
but it's to assist us in getting this
stuff done that we don't want to do or grunt worker. You know we can be doing something else. Yeah, we mean the way you describe it could even you know it could see if it's spam.
But then secondly it could be like can
you make sure this article is actually
about Laravel? Yeah, 100% by that. Yes, I got I got to have to research this more because that would be awesome to have that more automated. And I think what you saw there hopefully one thing I am writing the book in in will talk about in a moment, but basically we're empowering you to do that.
I got to have to research this more
because that would be awesome to have
that more automated. And I think what you
saw there hopefully I one thing I am
writing the book in in will talk about
that in a moment, but basically we're
empowering users to like like not only is
business owners like yourself, but when
you build an application and you could
say to a user number all those things you
had to do to query the database or to
filter or do this. No,
just type in that prompt.
Find me people who live in California who
went to the school and it does it all for
you. You're empowering users to get their
jobs done without horrible interfaces or
tons of steps. You know, so it's that
prompting ability is a
key thing here. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, well, actually, this might lead
into your book, but as far as tips for
good prompt writing the best is it best
just to sort of just trial and error and
ask it. Like you said,
just ask it to help you.
Um, yeah, I mean, I would. What I there's
a lot of bad information out there where
everything gets more complicated than it
needs to be. If you stick to a particular
structure, you'll do pretty well.
And then there's the deep learning dot AI
site where it's written by or run by
Andrew and G. I think I
forgot to say his last name.
And there's a lot of good trainings
there. Even one of the ladies who works
at open AI had a good prompting training,
but in the end, basically start off with
the role in brackets and say, hey, you're
my assistant who's helping me parse this
information to find good or bad links.
And this is, you know, these links are in
explain what it's about. Right. And then
your task is the next bracketed area.
Your task is to find the links that are
good and ignore the ones that are not in
at the end, you're going to return to me
an array of results.
And then the format is the last bracket
second to last where you're like, do this
format. Like we just said, it's an array
in the object with the URL, the title,
and maybe a TL DR or all the content.
So it's role task format. And then the
last one is just context
where you're handing it.
If you're in your case, you'd be handing
it the links, right? Where you're like,
here's all the links I want you to look
at. So it's that particular format that
is a good starting point to then just
start cranking away.
And then, you know, you have examples
like don't do this, do this, you know, I
didn't like this. And then you can learn
from those. Like one thing I, that's kind
of interesting is when you
use chat activity or cloud.
And you're typing in that prompt. And you
say check if you go do this, there's a
system level prompt that's probably this
big that's telling chat activity what not
to do what to do how to answer you how to
treat you how to think like, it's not
just an LLM getting your question.
It's an LLM who has a prompt around your
prompt. Okay, so, so you got to remember,
you know, it is a big deal prompting and
you can give it a lot of information.
So it can be helpful to give it a sense
of what it's doing, why it's doing it and
the task to be done. Does that make
sense? It does. It does. It's, it's, it's
funny. It almost reminds me of a back
when I was in school, one of our
projects, this was like middle school was
like we had to write down how to tell
somebody to make a peanut butter jelly
sandwich if they, oh, yeah, and they can
only follow the steps
that you tell them to take.
Just I just remember how hard that was.
And then like, yeah, so specific, like
you pick up the knife, you dip it in the
jar. So it has a lot of, to me, it has a
lot of feel of that to this, you know,
yeah, don't give up. No, it's a good way
to put it. So don't give up because you
told it to do something you thought was
obvious. But keep going and keep it
giving it more details.
There was a funny video on what you just
said. And the guy had his kids doing just
that. And he followed the directions. And
it was just silly. Like, you're like,
yeah, okay, I see. You know, it was a
good one. You know, that's awesome. So
you mentioned, you mentioned the book. So
you're writing a book on PHP and LLMs.
Yeah, tell us a little bit about that.
And like, you know, how
that came about, like, right.
Right. So basically, it's been a couple
years now. And I use it every day, not
just to help get my work done, but with
clients. I have a lot of moments where it
just it's a tool that solves a lot of
problems for me or gets me, you know, to
solve a problem, because I didn't
understand like how to do GIS in a
database and actually know it has me
doing everything I need to do. And I was
able to pull it off or format emails,
data from emails that were coming from
random people to then generate JSON
consistently without having to do that.
And I was able to do that consistently
without having to write all the text
parsing I was trying to write. So I just
wanted to start sharing those as
practical solutions in this book, almost
like a recipe book. But at the same time,
help the developer understand how this
works with prompts, how this works with
drivers and APIs and how we can build or
work in this way that we don't it doesn't
matter what API reason because it's, you
know, and it will continue to do that
where it shows all these
examples, explains it in
hopefully at the end, the person can just
start to see real like day to day
examples, I can use it in for work. And
it just it's, it's really interesting
stuff because, you know, it's a lot of
stuff is changing. And so I want to it's
kind of the foundation. So you can keep
ahead of things and not wait for things.
Like, if you're waiting for open AI to do
something or our PHP, open AI driver,
you're gonna be waiting. And you
shouldn't be because these are just API's
and code just make stuff happen. So
hopefully, we'll help people get
ahead and just understand the root of
things. So that's awesome. So, so the
book, it's, it's still in in development,
right? Yeah, it's still working. Not not
officially launched yet. Yeah, it's about
five chapters in, it's there to buy. It's
there to see some sample chapters. And
there's a newsletter that you can then
keep up to date with the articles and
stuff going on. And I will I continue to
release some of the chapters or articles
about the chapter to just show
you some information while I go. So
that's awesome. Yes. And, and so where
are you? Where are you publishing the
book? Are you using right? Yeah, I went
with lean pub for no good reason. I'm old
school. Yeah, I saw I could think of. So
yeah, I don't know if anyone uses them
anymore. So yeah, lean pub, PHP, LLMs
should be able to find the book pretty
easily. Or we can share a link after.
Yeah, yeah, it will definitely have links
of all this in the
show notes when we when we
push it up. And then I guess, you know,
as far as the the book, the PHP, LLMs, is
it? Yeah. I mean, if you know, Laravel,
you know, PHP. So it doesn't it just
raising the title PHP gives your
audience, right? Then yeah, this is it.
And I didn't want to deal with any legal
stuff. But it's so Laravel. It's insane.
I'm a Laravel. It's what I know. You
know, so but it is, you know, at the end,
I want all PHP developers to
kind of be aware of, like, the
Python community. Let's embrace this like
the Python community did, let's make
tools around these APIs and, and so
forth. But yeah, it's a good point. It is
very Laravel centric. That's awesome. Are
you thinking of sort of like creating
like a community around all this as and
being like the the thought leader of the
LLM PHP LLM? I don't know if I have the
control to do all that. Like, I think
this stuff just happens
organically who you know,
who you know, where you are in the
community. For me, I'm just going to keep
I have clients, I'm working on things for
people, things come up like, you know,
it's just amazing the stuff I've been
solving for people lately that I couldn't
have done before. And it's just fun.
Because when you were like, Oh, crap, we
can do this, you're like, this is
awesome. Like, even one client, like they
have this list of data, they have to get
in the client in the customer with them
export it because it's, they're hoarding
your data. You know, she can take
screenshots and it gets translated
into the system. Right? Just from a
screenshot. And it's like, yeah, this
saved our butts. You don't have to hand
enter this. This was awesome. So there's
all these little moments that come along
where problems are getting solved that I
couldn't solve before. So I'll keep doing
that. I'll keep blogging. I'll keep
putting stuff on YouTube. And I'll have a
video course eventually after the book to
just help people go deeper, hopefully, or
just continue to hopefully learn this if
they don't like reading, they rather
learn through videos, some people like
that better. So yeah,
the community thing.
I hope, but it's a tricky one, right?
Like, it's there for the open sources
there to be a community. And hopefully
people can drive it to that next level. I
don't know how they did it with filament.
I don't know if it was just good stuff at
the start, or like, but that's a great
example of a success in my book, that I
would like to strive for with it. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, actually, I don't know. I'm
feeling that, you know, I know, Laervel
itself, you know, I was there in the
very, very early days, and it was
basically, you know, our C, and it was
just like, that's how we communicate and
talk to everybody. And then sort of. And
then, then we then they switched to
something else. I can't
maybe it was so like, or not.
Telegram.
Telegram, yes, Telegram. And then from
there, it went to Discord, I guess. But
yeah, it's, it's sort of, you know, I
think just, you know, as a project owner,
just having some place to go and be like,
where can I go ask a question when I
don't understand what
is really beneficial. But
now it's a good point. I'll keep that in
mind. I was using GitHub's discussion
area, but it's not I don't think it's the
same because it's not real
time. So it's a good point. Yeah.
So,
you know, speaking of on that, this is
totally on a tangent. Now, the one thing
I hate about discord and all these other
things is you can never search like the
search is never good. Like, you know, in
the old days when everybody used like old
style forums, you could just go to Google
and type in like
whatever and it was there.
Because it was all, you know, indexable
and searchable. And it was like, ah,
well, this is the answer. But I guess, in
theory, we're actually in this
transitionary phase of searching right
now, you know, because you can still use
the Google and you still get the, you
know, whatever. But now it's like,
everybody's going to chat GPT or going to
all these things and searching instead of
actually going to Google, you know, if
it's something that they can explain, and
you're getting better results.
Yeah, I mean, they're going to release
something soon about that. Yeah, I talk
about tangent. Yeah, I just discourse and
I always get the mix up as a discord or
discourse because there's that one where
the stack overflow guys were released,
which was a great forum software. But
then there's the one
everybody uses for everything else.
And I always click the video button. So
in the moment, I'm like, panicking
because I'm like, I just started to call
with this person. I don't know.
Yes, yes, I think yes, discord, C O R D
is the one with the call button and then
discourse like the form.
But I'm going to follow up later, because
I think you're spot on. I need a more
dynamic place if I want to build
community where people can come in and
ask any question. Yeah, that's a good
point. Like with native PHP, I joined
that one. So I get to do one,
too. Yeah, it's a great idea.
I love that. And now the book when when
you're expecting, I guess it's for sale
now, and then you just release new
chapters, you just if you purchase the
book, you get the chapters as you write
them. And as they come out,
yeah, they come out every week, one or
two on Monday. And then if at the rate
I'm going, it will be done by early
November. And if I remember, right, and
but along the way, I've been adding
chapters, I think you asked it recently,
you said, Well, why why LMS? I'm like, I
don't even have a chapter on that. I just
assumed people know why. So I built out
that chapter. And so that's a good
example. Sometimes I think things are
kind of come in as I as I do this stuff.
You know, so but by early November, it
all should be done. Yeah.
Awesome. And, and then this, I don't know
if your website says this or not. But
let's just say I want to hire you to be
an LAM for something is that is that is
that a possibility? Are you? Yeah, of
course, of course, you do custom stuff.
I always do. That's all I do. So I full
time, I'm a freelancer who just does
custom stuff for for customers. I'll give
you my bit.ly link at the end, because it
goes to all these, these things,
including how to get me a calendar
invite. So you can just talk to me
sometime. But yeah, if you ever need
consulting, or more importantly, build
something fun, I can help out. I mean,
some of the stuff I don't want to talk
about, because it's kind of NDA, but just
the stuff you can do, it's just, it's
just like with you and you're automating
your workflows, like,
you'll be amazed at what you do. It's
cool you're using Zapier, I never think
about them, because I'm too busy trying
to make that thing. But I forget how easy
it can be if I would just stop being so
stubborn, you know, well, I mean, it has
its benefits. But it's also very
expensive to run. It's it's
not good. Good point. Yeah.
Because now they charge you by the like, you get so many tasks, tasks run by month or something in the way it works is every link we approve goes out to, you know, for social services or, you know, five, it goes out everywhere. And then, and then we publish posts that goes out everywhere. So it's like, we're running tons of tasks. And it's all like, yeah, probably 1000s of months, I guess, is pushing all that stuff out. But well, we should look at
we'll look at lara llama together, I'll
show you my hosted versions, my training
version, and then we can just see what
can I do? What could it do? And then
maybe we can play around. Because in the
end, I love these real use cases, right?
This is how products succeed is they have
real use. I think that's why Laravel
succeeded. It wasn't trying to solve
imaginary problems. It was a SAS focused,
like product from the start, you know, it
was solving real problems that, you know,
paid off. So like with you, if you want
to talk about it, we can just, you know,
I'll show you around.
And show you it hosted and show you all
that. And then you can see what can you
do now? And what could it do easily? If
you just think about
it? Yeah, so it'd be fun.
I love that. Yeah, that's a that's a
wonderful idea. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we'll
definitely have to get that scheduled.
Um, so sort of to wrap up the call.
Anything else I missed that you know,
might be you'd like the
community to know or anything?
Right. I mean, I will start a place to
talk more about this. But I guess the
only thing I just keep saying or
hopefully showed in this or explain this
like it like it, there is hype and the
hypes gonna fade because hype fades, I
think it's what it has to be hyped to
fade. So, but I think in the end, this is
a real this is a new tool that we can use
today to do some cool stuff for our
clients and for ourselves.
Like, like a total home project I can do
now. There's so many of them. But like,
like, just a side note, like just how
cool this is, like now you're a
developer, you're thinking you're
tinkering, you want to do things. Like no
one ever in my household says, hey, we
ran out of oatmeal order some more empty
box, they don't even take the box down.
It's empty. But just say they took the
box down, threw it away. And then
tomorrow, they're like, hey, there's no
more. I'm like, yeah, you ate it all. No
one told me to buy more. Right. So, so
like, what I did was I put on a
I haven't finished this yet. This is just
an idea. I have this top row of all the
backup food. This is our when this is
gone, I have to order more. And now you
take a stupid little camera on a
Raspberry Pi, and you point to that and
take a photo. Or every time motion
happens, and the LM could say, Oh,
oatmeal is missing. I'm going to now
order more. Because it happens to be
right next to Alexa. And it can say,
Alexa, order more oatmeal, like, you
know, the fun stuff we can do at this
next level for for just
messing around. It just it's kind
of cool. So I would just say, like, just
see this stuff is like, it can help do
some really cool stuff we couldn't
imagine before. You know, yeah, that's
such an awesome use case. Because every,
every week when we go to order groceries,
always like, what do you want? I'm like,
I don't know, just normal stuff. And then
she's like, Well, what is that? Like, I
don't know. Like, look, I now made this
project, one of mine's a meal assistant.
So it's a meal planner, we send our
recipes, we tell it we like, and every
week, it can build up a
plan. It can send us a memo,
email saying this is your shopping list
for this week. And then every week, it
does another plan, hopefully not
repeating everything. Because that's what
I always do. I'm like, let's have this we
had that last week. Okay, like, so it's
just fun stuff. I know there's so many
other ways to solve these problems. But
to me, it's just kind of fun to use these
tools like that. So I love that. Yeah.
But my family's the same way. It's like,
we have four staple dinners. That's every
week. It's like what day do you want?
Yeah, what day do you want tacos? What
day do you want spaghetti?
That's funny. It's funny how we we all
have sort of the same shared problems
across. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so they're
fun to solve and do this creative stuff
to just kind of add a whatever a twist to
it. So, so yeah, that's the that's the
point I want to get across is it really
is here, I think, for good and it can do
some things now that are, are fun and
practical. So yeah, that's amazing. I
love this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're gonna
have to Yeah, you have to do more videos
on on you making all this
stuff, you know. Yeah, I know. I know. I
try. I got lighting and everything. I
just got to do it. I don't know what
happens. But then we'll talk. We'll talk
soon as well, because it'd be fun to
watch your process and see what can be
done there. So for sure. Yes. And, and
yeah, that's, but yeah, I want to, I
think we'll wrap it up here because I
feel like I can talk to you all day about
this stuff. And I know the listeners want
to keep it tight. So, but, you know, I
want to, I want to thank
Alfred for coming on the show.
You know, I've learned so much today and
really enjoy like finding these new
packages and these new things within the,
within the literal community and PHP
community. It's awesome. You know, all
these links will be in the show notes.
Alfred will, he does consulting and he's
got a book for sale. So you need to go
and check out all of that too. If you,
you know, if you're having ideas on this
stuff that your company needs that, you
know, maybe you're, you don't want or
don't have the time to implement yourself
and would prefer a professional to do it.
Thanks for joining us. Until next time.
Cool. Cool. Thank you.