Trey: Hello, and welcome back to another episode of MCU Need to Know a podcast
dedicated to the Marvel Cinematic Universe and everything you need to know.
I'm Trey.
Jude: I'm Jude.
How are you doing Trey?
Trey: Well, Jude, I'm excited because today we get to welcome a
podcasting duo whose Marvel scope extends beyond Disney plus and the
movies, you can find them rewinding and reviewing every week on the podcast
MCU Rewind, but today I'm delighted to welcome Al, and Tony to the show.
Welcome guys.
Jude: Welcome guys.
Al: Hey, hey!
Tony: Hey,
Trey: Hey, how's it it going?
Tony: Thanks for having us.
Jude: Yeah.
Thanks for coming.
Trey: Yeah.
So you two have been running MCU Rewind since July of 2017.
First of all.
Congratulations, because that is an incredible amount of time.
And it's
so cool.
Al: Yeah, we, we did our, uh, four-year episode recently and, uh, I think at the
end I kept saying to Tony, like, thanks.
There are only so many things that I've done this long because of Tony.
Trey: Oh man.
It's funny how, whenever you dedicate to a project that long,
it really puts into perspective.
You know, when you're dealing at large gaps of time like that,
Jude: So four years, what got y'all started?
What, what made you to decide, Hey, we're doing a podcast.
Tony: Um, I have been wanting to do a podcast for a long time.
Uh, I actually was, this was in the heyday of the movies by minutes
podcast, you know, Star Wars, minutes Back to the Future minutes
I went to Al saying, I want to do a Marvel cinematic universe minutes.
So start with Iron Man one minute at a time, three or five days a week.
And thank God, Al talked me out of that.
Yeah, that was going to be my first podcast, our first podcast.
And I was thinking well it's not going to be that hard.
Um, since then Al and I have both independently tried to do second podcasts
and we figured out that was too much work, doing more than one episode a week.
But I do like the like complete I'm a completionist I will play every
spinoff of Kingdom Hearts I will watch every minor episode of Star Wars.
So I wanted to like fully in depth into Marvel.
So we decided to do all of Marvel, all of everything.
This is how to consider it now, everything that was intended to be
in the Marvel cinematic universe.
So when it was made, it was planned to be that way.
Trey: So even from the beginning or the Genesis of MCU rewind,
the Marvel television shows were on the docket as well.
Al: Oh yeah.
Trey: That's awesome.
It's really interesting to hear you frame it as like being a completionist
like, I like that approach to tackling this behemoth of a franchise.
Al: Yeah.
It's daunting.
We have it planned out to what?
2026.
We don't have any of the Disney plus stuff scheduled yet.
Jude: Now I look at your schedule and you had 2026 are y'all ending
there or are you going to keep going to extend that schedule?
Al: Well, to be honest, uh, I mean, I don't, I don't think we even know
if we're gonna make it that far.
I mean, like, and I'm not saying like, oh, we just want to give up some day,
but you know, like in our mind, It's it's very easy to like plan out the
episodes cause we do the one a week.
Um, but we we've kinda talked like, all right, well, at some point maybe
something with life will get in the way and maybe we'll just stop.
Maybe this is a good spot to stop or something like that.
So, I mean, we have absolutely no idea.
We're just going, we'll see what happens.
That's kind of our current mindset.
Tony: In my mind, we will make it either to the end of The Infinity Saga
or few months after that Agents of Shield finish or we can go on forever,
Jude: Alright, hey forever is good.
That's okay.
Trey: Yeah.
If I'm not mistaken, I was listening to the Spider-Man part one and y'all
were joking about like once y'all finish up with the MCU, then I think
there was like star wars on the table or other, other franchises as well.
So it's cool that you'll have that plan moving.
Tony: Yeah.
Um, we have a running joke that we're going to cover the
Scorpion King Movies.
Trey: That one should be worthy of the minute by minute.
Jude: Yes.
Trey: So I'm assuming there was a connection before the podcast, but how
far back does that love of Marvel go?
And if we can start with you, Al.
Al: Oh, yeah.
Um, I mean, it goes back to, as a kid, pretty much watching the cartoons on
Fox, uh, just fell in love with those.
And then, uh, as a teenager, uh, I pretty much just started going
to a comic shop on weekends.
A friend got me to go for, uh, like playing tabletop games and
then that just kind of expanded into like, well, I'm here.
What are these cool comic books that I've never actually read, but
I've only seen them in cartoons.
And so that just kind of expanded from there.
Uh, and then as soon as the movies came out, it was just
like, love at first sight.
Trey: Yeah.
The hook line and sinker with that.
What was the, what was the first one that got your attention?
Is it pre iron man or was iron man the one to do it?
Al: I mean, I mean, as far as the, the movies.
Yeah.
I guess Ironman was the first one that really got me into the Marvel movies.
You know, see, I, I know I watched all of the other ones before, but I
never, never cared as much, you know, for years I just liked the cartoons
way, way more because, you know, as a TV show, you can do kind of more and
they're their cartoon, so it's easier to do cool graphics, that kind of stuff.
Right.
So, um, it wasn't until iron man came out.
And I, I know I've told Tony this a ton of times, but just seeing the
cool animation of just the gears, the first time he's putting the suit on
the one that he makes, not the one in the desert, like, oh, that is so cool.
I could just, I could just watch that all day.
Trey: Yeah.
Well, what about you, Tony?
Tony: How I got into it was ago was this going to be pretty
heretical on this podcast?
And my podcast as a little kid, I was more of a DC guy.
I'm, you know, I was into a Batman, the animated series Justice League that,
but when I was 12 years old, this movie called X-Men, came out and blew my mind
because like, they can all have different powers and there are hundreds of them.
And I kind of fell into the comics around that time.
And my older cousin, he's about 12 years older than me was a huge Spider-Man guy.
And he just gave me like loads of Spider-Man comments.
Trey: Oh, wow.
Tony: Like he kept like the ones that he loved, but I got a bunch of like
part two of seven and stuff like that.
Um, so I kind of fell into it and like from the first X-Men movie,
cause Blade just went right past me.
I was too young for that.
From the first X-Men movie.
I was like, every time it was superhero, even though it's a superhero, I've never
heard of, I'm going to go see this movie and we'll find out who they are and
their backstories and stuff like that.
Yeah.
And it's just like, since, since then with very few exceptions, I still love
DC, but Marvel on screen has blown everything DC's done out of the water.
So
Jude: Yes.
Trey: Yeah,
Tony: Yeah
Trey: Yea that's cool.
And what a, what an interesting way to, to dive into it by having a gift
of those comics to get you started.
So that's awesome.
Jude: I had a very similar experience, but I didn't know, like
I didn't realize Blade cause I, I really stuck with the mainstream.
Like when I was younger, I had X-Men comics and I was more DC comics.
Um, and I collected comics right around the whole doomsday Superman.
Storyline.
And so when Blade came out, I remember seeing the movie, I loved
it, but I had no idea cause I, cause I had read more DC comics
Trey: Do either of, y'all still keep up with the comics today?,
Tony: Um, in the last, well, during the pandemic, I've subscribed to Marvel
unlimited and I've been catching up cause I fell off for a long time.
Jude: Completionist on that?
Tony: It's too much, man.
You got to have limits.
That's my that's my hardest thing with, uh, comics in
general is like, I'll read this.
Well, actually I need to start back here at this event.
Well, actually these seven things started this event.
I keep going back further and further.
I have like anything that's over 20 years old, unless it's like dark,
Phoenix saga or something huge.
I just have to live with myself somewhere.
Al: I complain often about disliking time travel, but I gotta say, uh, you know,
keeping track of the, the comic book storyline of, you know, which thing to
read first and second and, and waiting to read something else first, before you
can read the next thing in the story.
Like, I think that's harder, that's harder to deal with in your mind.
Keep tracking of those stories.
Those timelines.
Trey: It is 100%.
The reason why it wasn't until the MCU movies that I finally got into the
superhero side of stuff, like diehard, because it's what you described as
like, I don't know where to start.
And so I just, you know, uh, analysis paralysis just stopped.
I didn't get to choose any of them.
Yeah.
Cool.
So if you haven't already, you should definitely be checking out their show.
MCU rewind.
You can find it on most podcast platforms, or if you go to www.mcurewind.com, you
should be able to find their show there.
Of course, if you've downloaded this episode, then you know, we're going
to be discussing, bringing in the Marvel television stories to the MCU.
So just to set the stage a little bit, a few weeks ago, James Gunn
put out a tweet that essentially stated that all shows prior to Disney
plus were not cannon to quote him.
He said there was never any coordination between the earlier TV stuff and
the cinematic side of Marvel.
Like there is now that they're all under the purview of the Marvel studios.
So even before James Gunn's stirring of the pot, uh, the connection
between the MCU and the other shows have always been a debate.
So knowing that you two have been championing, the often shunned
shows, we really wanted to take some time to talk about them today.
I think the easiest place to start is by defining the personal
importance of the MCU cannon.
So, starting with you, Tony, what do you think?
Tony: Well, I have a conflicting feelings about quote unquote canon.
Um, I love the vast majority of the Marvel TV shows.
So even if they're not cannon, I still, there's still stories I enjoy.
And I still love those characters.
I love the characters and shield.
I love I'm most of the Netflix characters, but we'll talk
about some of them later, but
Trey: I can, I can feel that the stay and I'm excited
Tony: if there was ever a shred of this could be.
And I'm clinging onto that with all my mind, because I would love these things.
I already loved to be part of, to be recognized by the vast majority of fans.
So it's fine that they're not cannon, but they are candidates.
That would be amazing.
That's where my mind,
Trey: I like that.
Yeah.
I think it's when we guessed it on your show.
I can't remember the exact.
Context at which it came up, but it was the discussion of the Sokovia Accords.
And you, I think Tony, you were going to bat for it in the episode.
And I was like, this is awesome.
I love, I love how much you were.
It's like you said, trying to hold onto that shred of continuity.
So that's cool.
Tony: Yeah.
Our biggest headache.
Al: Oh yeah.
So often it's just used as this, like, oh, this has to happen.
Why?
Uh, because of the Sokovia Accords.
Oh, okay.
And then like, they kind of say that and then they don't really go
back to it and it happens a lot.
Trey: It seems like a real easy catchall for any of those hiccups in the show.
Yes.
But yeah.
What about you Al?
Al: Yeah.
Um, okay.
I mean, Similar to what Tony said.
I, you know, I love the fact that we have more stories that are already there.
And so I'm, I am very, very desperately clinging onto the fact that the TV shows
that previously existed are part of the MC especially my absolute favorite
show agents of shield, because one of the main stars Colson was in like all,
but one of the phase, one MCU movies, there were some cameos by two other
characters in the first two seasons.
This isn't really a.
Like a spoiler or anything, but I mean, even, uh, Nick fury shows up as like
a, an after credit scene in, um, in the first season and when one of the
episodes, and there are a couple, a couple of other characters too, who
were in the movies and then we get like a small cameo of them in that show.
And so.
You know, that kind of just really takes it away.
If you know, they started as, Hey, this is MCU.
Uh, well maybe never mind.
I mean, yes, they were separate.
They were made by separate groups.
Um, I don't fully understand that.
I know toady can explain that way better.
Yeah.
Uh, but different studios made them, uh, and there was probably like, you
know, internal politics involved with, well, what characters can we use?
What we want to use this one, well, too bad.
We're going to use this character here, you know, that kind of stuff.
And so Kevin fi he had a quote, um, back in, uh, February of this year.
Uh, and I forgot where it was, but the quote from him was, um, when in
relation to the, the MCU shows being on Disney plus was, uh, for the first
time with Interlake or with interlink.
Uh, so the MCU will be on your TV screen at home at Disney plus and interconnect
with the movies and go back and forth.
Which, uh, I mean, from there, he's basically saying like, this is the first
time because it's the one studio, uh, we don't have to fight with anyone else.
So.
I, I get that the, uh, wanting to like start fresh kind of concept with
some of these characters, like not have to deal with the, uh, you know,
uh, I guess legacy is the phrase that I would use, even though the
legacy is like two or four years old.
Jude: Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, no, it's interesting because star wars went that way, where
you have the legacy and what is Canon or is it legacy or legends?
It's like all this stuff prior to Disney owning it.
Yeah.
Tony: It's legends.
And I mean, I understand that because just like in comics, I was really.
Uh, hesitant to get into when the pre Disney acquisition, all the star
wars stuff, but since they rebooted it, I mean, I'm in completion, that's
with that, I've been trying to read them novels and keeping up with
the comments and stuff like that.
Al: Yeah.
And, and unfortunately that is also kind of different too.
Right.
Cause, um, with star wars, the different TV shows are still part of
the, the same cannon, at least now that you know, everything Disney makes.
Um, so like, uh, trying to think of an example, like the current show that the
cartoon, the bad batch, the clone wars, um, you know, all the movies they are,
even though those are made by, I'm pretty sure they're made by different studios.
Uh, they're all still within the same cannon.
Tony: Yeah.
Um, uh, uh, star wars is doing it right because.
What I want, going back to the cannon question is like in rogue
one, you see the robot from star wars rebels going just in the background.
He has, there's no bearing on the story, anything but me as a fan, who
knows who that droid it is, it's just like his chopper does all I want.
Jude: Right.
Well, the seat ghost and the, you know, the ship and Scott Walker.
Tony: Yeah, exactly.
If we could see, um, unreal bitter about, uh, in age of Ultron,
when the hell carrier comes up.
The easiest way to get one or two agents of shield characters just in the
background, out of, um, at a station on the carrot, the Heller carrier.
But
Trey: yeah, I think to kind of sum up my feelings with it after, after listening
to you too, is there is this clear feeling that at one point they were
trying to make this all interconnected.
And so, uh, ally, when you were mentioning that quote about Kevin,
FYGI saying for the first time they're interlinked it, is this, this feeling
of like, somebody's like, all right, I'm going to take my toys and go home.
Like, it's just kind of shunning off the, what was once there.
And Tony, it is.
It's hard to see that because the way you described it, I know there
are others out there that are like, when they see those little nods back
and forth between the shows or the movies, it is that feeling of elation.
And so I think that's, what's always fascinated me about this limbo, I guess,
is the best way you can put it between the Marvel television and Marvel studios.
Were those the two?
Al: Yes.
I think those were the two.
Yeah.
Trey: And so, yeah, I've always been fascinated to see how that gets
reconciled, especially within the fandom
Tony: as well.
I can wrap my head and we'll talk to me.
And I talked about this.
I can like weave my mind around it to like justify yes, they are still Canon
because this doesn't conflict with this and this doesn't conflict with that.
So it's like, in my mind, even though I know it's kind of BS,
Trey: you know, what it feels like we're kind of dancing around it.
So I think this might be a good place to go to the spoiler zone.
So normally whenever we set this up, this is with regards to the
movies and the Disney plus shows.
But with this spoiler zone, we are going to be getting into the
discussion of the Netflix and Marvel television shows as well.
You're going to hear an audio cue and on the other side, it'll be fair game
for all spoilers of those criteria.
So we'll see you on the other side, right?
Like I mentioned earlier, I feel like the easiest.
Wait for me to describe it is this feeling of limbo with Marvel
television and Marvel studios.
But with that in mind, if you're in charge of choosing, do you bring
in complete shows or would you pick and choose the characters that get
brought in from the Netflix and Marvel television side of the Marvel universe?
If we can start with you this time, Tony.
Well,
Tony: it's really, I think a case by case basis.
Um, there are some shows like definitely Daredevil and Jessica
Jones where their third season ended.
And they're kind of at the end of that journey, but really ready to start a
next adventure just has decided to be part of New York city and stay there
and continue with our investigation.
And, uh, Matt Murdock has decided that he's reconnected with foggy
and Karen, and is, but still going to continue to be there level.
Those are great, starting off points like, so we can have a
Spiderman style introduction where we don't need a backstory.
If you care about his backstory, you can go back and watch the shows, right?
So with Matt and Jessica, you can just pluck those characters and maybe
some supporting tasks, if you really want to and put them in the MCU.
Luke and iron fist, the Cajun iron fist ended their seasons, kind of, both of them
cliffhanger is ready for a third season.
So if you pluck those characters out for those fans of the TV show, it would not
be satisfying because I don't see Marvel studios wine to continue those stories
in a feature film, or even a Disney plus.
Cause it's kind of too dark for Disney plus.
Yeah.
Trey: You know, that's the one of the first hangups, because as far as my
familiarity with the Netflix shows, Daredevil's the only one that I've
seen the, uh, season and a half of.
And.
And that's the thing that I always get stuck on is like, man, totally.
I don't know how it fits into the MCU, which generally leans more
towards cheery little comical.
Like they get serious, but nowhere near as serious as Daredevil
gets at least of what I've seen.
But I got to say, I really appreciate the way you had framed it.
Cause I've never thought about it that way of a Daredevil.
And I think you said Jessica Jones, their stories are complete, but when
Luke cage and iron fist, not so much.
So I never thought about that before, and that's an
interesting way to think about it.
Jude: Well, I'm going to just say what that Luke cage.
Man the way season two ended I'm I'm still, I'm still
wishing to see the end of that.
It was, it was a really good cliffhanger.
I, I completely agree with you on that, on that idea though, that, um, I don't
think if they did that, they would want to, that they would finish it.
Um, yeah, totally.
And just, it just doesn't seem like something that they want to, they would
pick up, which is unfortunate actually.
Al: Yeah, exactly.
I mean maybe if they, you know, brought those characters in, they
might reference something about that.
Um, or, you know, just ignore.
You know, th that, that kind of style, you know, I kind of wonder also, like, you
know, let's say they bring in any of these characters from any of the shows, you
know, especially let let's talk about the specifically these, uh, the ones on the
Netflix shows, like if they bring these characters in and they recast them, like
that gets hard to like, have that head Canon and say, okay, well, it's the same.
Like you could, you could say it.
Okay, well it's okay, mate.
Maybe they got one of the, the accurate to say the same, but it
gets a little, a little hard to like then say like, well, are these
actually the same characters, right?
Because, you know, you could make the argument that, yeah, maybe
these characters have just changed.
It's been some number of years.
All of the Netflix shows happened before, uh, the events of infinity war.
And so maybe you could say that they were, they stuck around during the snap.
Maybe they've had more time to grow and change that kind of thing.
Um, and so now this is just a completely different part of their lives.
It's been.
Eight years or something to that effect.
I mean, you could just make up a number really.
So, and, you know, at that point, like yeah, their, their life is
going to be very different from the stories that they left off with.
You know, maybe you could just mention that someday, that previous story, uh, if
they want to, or really, they can probably get away with just never mentioning it.
Like that's also entirely possible.
And then, you know, those of us who were really clinging to these being
part of the MCU at least get to keep telling ourselves that, well,
Jude: you know what, they could probably use the blip to their
Trey: advantage, the blip, or, I mean, even Loki, the multi-verse like, I mean,
various, like it, it could be a wink and a nod of like, Hey, this is the one, you
know, a variant of the one in the Netflix shows, but slightly different or, you
know, wholesale it's the entire case.
Tony: And if we do, like in the comics, a like a secret war, um, devil world thing
where everyone kind of conjoins like how they would get people are theorizing,
how they would get the X-Men in there.
If they want to keep doing old man Logan stuff.
Uh, in the comics, they pulled just popular characters from their universities
and put them in the main timeline.
I mean, I feel like if they were going to do that, that is SES seven of
Marvel is not famous for, but it's a
Jude: waiting.
No, you're right.
Because Marvel, Marvel is good at that slow burn.
Al: Yeah.
And that kind of storyline, I mean, that is a complete reboot, right?
Like that's one of those things like, well, Hey, it's been 30 years.
Um, let's bring iron man back or bill spring, Tony start back.
Right.
That kind of thing.
Cause that happens in the comics and like that kind of thing is like, that's,
that's a, full-on like, all right.
We're, we're basically starting over.
We'll keep some of this stuff so that the storyline still goes, but
you get to kind of start fresh.
And I don't know.
I mean, so far.
They haven't done any kind of real rec Connie, uh, within the MCU.
Like they they've done a little bit and you know, there there's
some stuff where they, they, uh, clarify and that clarification,
um, just kind of adds to stuff.
Or maybe it does change things a little bit, but, but not at all, like the,
the spirit is still there and this is why I'm a little bullish on all the
multi-verse stuff that's coming in.
Because, because I, I like the one-time light.
I don't like the, the alternate stuff.
It doesn't feel as real to me.
Jude: Okay.
I think, I think you're the first I've heard.
Not really excited about that.
Al: Oh, well, uh, that's good.
I'm holding back.
Tony's heard me complaining many, many, many times that in time for,
Jude: well, I mean, when everybody I've talked to yeah.
Is excited about the multiverse.
So that's what I'm saying.
I think you're the first that, that I've come across and haven't been excited about
the multiverse I was with you though.
Especially the way they took it, like watching Loki in the beginning.
And just that whole, it's weird, like the sacred one timeline, what they,
what it took to set up to get there.
I felt like it kind of diminished everything we already did.
And so that was, that was a struggle for me, you know?
So that, that was so I, I, I understand where you're coming
Al: from.
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, and I'm, I, you know, I, I do want to say, I love everything within the MCU.
Uh, some things less than others, but for the most part, you know,
even Loki, I love the show.
I feel like it left on, um, a number of cliffhangers.
And I think that one kind of bothered me with, as far as the TV show goes, but
yeah, I'm still keeping my mind open.
Uh, we'll see where things go.
This is, it's kind of the introductory part, so we'll, we'll see how it ends up.
But, uh, but yeah, so far, um, I'm just very bullish on that kind of stuff.
Trey: So.
I apologize cause I'm throwing this on you on the spot, but y'all mentioned
how there aren't that many conflicts between Marvel television and Marvel
studios off the top of y'all's head.
Do y'all know if some of the bigger conflicts that do arise?
Um,
Tony: yes, definitely.
The last two seasons of Asia shield context for agents of shield
at the end of the fifth season, they thought it was in the show.
They have a beautiful ending.
In my opinion, like would have been an amazing scenario.
And the finale ended with them talking about a fan was his invasion of Wakanda.
So it was winding up with infinity war.
They ended like the last shots were
Al: before the snap.
Oh
Tony: wow.
Well, they get renewed for two more things.
Uh, huh.
And there wasn't this nap.
Oh, they don't refer to it at all.
Um, well,
Al: I mean, in my mind there that th those two seasons take place during the
snap and they just choose never to say it, but there's, this goes back to that
whole separate studios and it's just, uh, it's just way easier to, to not do that.
Yeah.
Trey: I mean, I'm assuming it's pretty traumatic to live through the snap,
so maybe it was just repression on the character's part to just never
bring up the snap within the show.
Al: Yeah.
I
Tony: feel like shield agents who are to do a deal with superhero crisis.
I think they mentioned it.
So that's my biggest difficulty.
We love those shields as we call them, but that would be the biggest
difficulties to bring in those characters,
Trey: which is so funny because I think between.
Netflix and Marvel television.
They were the ones that had the most ingrained hooks between.
But yeah, it's, it's, it's a little sad to see that it's the one that
has the most complications of getting back into the stories now.
Jude: Well, it's interesting because season five of agents of
Cyril is the last season I saw.
Yeah.
So I ended up a good spot
Trey: for personally, for you.
It's still fit
Jude: for me.
It's fine.
Like I'm good.
Tony: And um, like I can make, we can make it work because seasons five and season
seven rely heavily on time travel and they actually go use quantum time travel in
the, I think the finale of season seven series finale to go back to the presence.
I don't remember, they were like 1960s or something like that.
So we can say in like the multi-verse time travel, like they did an end game
where the past doesn't affect the future.
However, Bruce
Trey: banner explained it.
The past becomes your
Jude: future.
Your present.
Right, whatever your present is because you continually make choices.
The choice you just make is now your future.
So even if you try to travel back to the past, you are experiencing the present.
You always experienced the present because you continue to make choices.
Trey: See, this is why if, if time travel were real, I would be very
much a Scott Lang because my only references would be to movies.
And that's how I would understand time.
Tony: I love talking about the stories, but I completely
understand why Al hates them.
Trey: Well, you know, it's funny.
Yeah.
Now, when you were speaking on paper, I'm right there with you, dude.
We talked about it whenever the potentiality of a
multi-verse is on the horizon.
I mentioned.
Feeling like you can't have steaks with a multi-verse because it's like, okay, if
something bad happens with this one, just go to the next multi-verse and it's fine.
Like you lose that element to it.
But, and I've had similar feelings with time travel because it also
gets really messy and it just feels complicated storytelling wise.
But for whatever reason, I guess this is the fan boy in me, Marvel
just won me over with it because I ended up loving end game.
And I'm totally fine with where we are with low-key at least so far.
But yeah, go ahead.
I was just all that to say you're not alone Al I just did it.
The
Jude: mouse, the mouse as well.
I was going to say into the spider verse, I think one of the
reasons why that works so well is.
The, the stakes, like all the universities were at stake because of
kingpins machine and it wasn't just, they're coming to help one universe.
And that, and to me, like you're setting the stakes, that's going to
be the trick of, is there a universe that is universe prime, so to speak,
you know, that like, if that goes away, everything else goes away because
cause otherwise you do get into that.
Oh, I'll just jump to the next.
And we're all good.
Well, like I said, this is kind of what the secret most, um, current run of
secret wars was a way to pull in, you know, characters from other verses and
just to get them together in the comics.
And I don't know if that's satisfying in the shows,
Al: you know, I guess it kinda depends on, on how they, they
show it to us as the audience.
Right?
Like, you know, there, there can be some of those things where the story like.
Like, yeah, maybe it's a little, uh, cheap in that, that regard of like, oh, it was
all a different universe kind of thing, but if they show it right, uh, and I fully
trust, uh, Marvel studios to be able to do this, then it would work out well.
I mean, going with your example right into the spider verse, like we really only
got the perspective of miles Morales and he happened to get help from the spider
characters from different universes.
And not that it matters, right.
Because we only cared really about miles Morales and the story
was all really self-contained.
It only happened to involve a alternate universe.
It didn't like threaten everyone and all of this stuff.
Uh, also, it, it didn't give us a lot of details.
I think one of my complaints, a lot of time with time travel and alternate
universes is the amount of details.
They're like, we'll, we'll get a line here or there with some details.
And then later on, we'll get something that kind of
contradicts that thing earlier.
And then that just, that's where it really pulls me away.
Tony: Keep it vague.
And then you can say everything is possible.
Jude: Yeah.
Hey, you know what, through low-key that was one of my things I kept getting bogged
down in the mechanics, you know, like, like it was, well, the prime example was
the nexus event or momentous, you know, and it was just like, you've already
established, this is an apocalypse.
There can't be an ex-US event, you know?
And so to have a nexus event that didn't change the fact that it was going to be
an apocalypse shouldn't have happened.
Like, you know, and so it's all like, I, I kept getting bogged down into
those little, those things, the details.
Yeah.
Tony: This isn't what this episode's about, but I can, I've
explained to Al multiple times how that next event makes sense.
In the context of the show, if we
Jude: want to get into that.
Well, no, well, I'm going to say this, like I think at the con I think
you're right in the context of the show that that makes sense, but I kept
getting bogged down to the mechanics to like, bring it back topic wise.
I think that's one of the difficulties when you start talking about what's
Canon and how to bring things in, because you get us who remember these little
things and you're like, wait a minute in this season of this, this happened.
So, you know, why is this happening here when you bring in this character?
Uh, you know, and so I, I think, I think that's what makes that, that
idea difficult, you know, because just the details there and the
things that us as fans remember.
Al: Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, in the, you know, bringing us back to star wars,
I I'm going to bring up a thing.
Tony has told me many times, but I get the wording wrong.
So he's going to correct me now.
Who's
Trey: time
Al: traveling.
Uh, but no, um, you know, in, in star wars they have a person whose job it is to
literally keep track of all of this stuff.
All of the details, things that are set in by different characters, like
what are the facts that this character established, you know, when did that
happen and, you know, in relation to the timeline and that kind of stuff.
And as far as I know, that doesn't really exist within, within the MCU.
Um, we, we've gotten a couple of weird timing, things that have
happened, like just in the movies too.
Um, yeah.
Some of the timing with Spider-Man far from home got really weird,
uh, with like the years and stuff.
But when we know that happened in relation to the Avengers, uh, in that.
Yeah, his name's Leland.
Tony: She keeps her in the holler.
Crown.
Also, Marvel has a story.
I couldn't, you were right out, but I couldn't go on without correcting.
You
Trey: need to keep the sacred timeline of this podcast.
So thank you, Tony.
Oh, really?
Well, you know, I asked you all about any of the conflicts between
Marvel television and Marvel studios.
I'm curious.
Now, do y'all have any moments where they connected that is your
favorites, like little payoff moments,
Tony: um, to come to my mind first.
And always, it always goes, TV shows reacting to the movies.
It's never gone with exception one time and any other way, but, um, lady
SIF, guest, starring in agents of shield, uh, especially the one with
her sister Lorelei, which was the last episode before the fall of shield
and season one, I think was amazing.
Anytime the show, it happened only a few times, but when the shield is interact
with, as guardians I think is great, but more importantly, the one-time, it was
referenced in the movies in end game.
When we see Howard stark and his Butler Jarvis played by the same actor who
was Jarvis in the agent Carter TV show.
And I had the same reaction like I had in the roadblock.
It's like, oh my God, it's a guy.
Trey: You know, that moment stands out to me so much because I've seen
agent Carter, but I wasn't as connected to the Marvel television side.
But I remember sitting into the theater and seeing Jarvis pop-up on the screen.
Like I was that, that movie already had me in tears so much just
because I get so emotional and movies, but that moment happened.
And it was just like a silent, happy tear because like everybody
was getting a piece of what they wanted in that farewell of a movie.
And it was just so cool to see that they paid it off even as
little as a moment as it was.
Tony: Yeah.
And that's what I mean, it's just like, we don't need a big scene with,
uh, Fitz and Simmons from agents of shield having their actions.
No, just having them in the background and that's literally good enough.
Jude: Yeah.
I I'm I'm the same way.
Like what would you think about the Netflix shows?
That they did connect simple things like the newspaper on the wall about the
Avengers event and, and those types of things like that, that alone was exciting
like that that's all you needed, you know?
So it's, it's a shame that, that didn't follow through because
clearly agents of shield season wine, you mentioned lady surf.
You've already mentioned fury showing up Maria Hill, the connection
to winter soldier like that.
They were clearly.
That the idea was those were connected.
I mean, that, I don't think they, I don't think they fully thought
through Colson, but they were clearly,
Al: they had a, they had a whole storyline for that to, to explain it.
But that was, and that was an early storyline.
Uh, first season was rough to get through.
Trey: No, it's, it's so funny.
You mentioned that Jude, because that first season is everybody's
milestone of like, just get to the winter soldier connection.
Like that's all you need to, and agents of shield.
And then from there it becomes, uh, like legitimately good watching.
Really, really good.
But yeah.
I'm sorry I cut you off.
You were saying,
Al: oh no, no, no, you're fine.
I was just gonna, um, kind of expand a.
You know, you're, you're talking about the, you know, the, the small
connections of things that are mentioned in the, in the Netflix shows.
And, you know, we, it was kind of funny.
It's like a little running joke that, you know, within a Netflix shows, they'll
reference the other characters in the movies, but they don't say them by name.
They'll talk about the, you know, the, uh, From space with a hammer.
Yep.
Yeah.
And so, you know, we, uh, but every so often they will actually say the name.
I think, you know, once or twice we've heard someone say Tony
stark, uh, that kind of stuff.
So we, we at least get that, you know, the.
Towards, I guess, towards the end, uh, some of the TV shows did have a little
bit of a crossover with themselves or with their, the other shows within the MCU.
So like, you know, they were still part of that separate studio and
these were really small things like, uh, in cloak and dagger, there's
a reference to Luke cage there.
Like there's a, I think he shows up in a newspaper or, or a video of someone's
looking at a phone, something like that.
Um, there was a little crossover in the, uh, the Hulu show, uh, the
runaways between them and the cloak and dagger characters, that kind of stuff.
And, you know, I, I don't expect anything like that, you know, exactly
like we've been saying, right.
I don't, I don't need the crossover, but you know, just, just
something where, where it matters.
You know, so one of the big twists that happens, um, at the end of season,
two of agents of shield and, um, I, I know we said spoilers zone, uh,
but, uh, you know, just giving you a heads up in case you still haven't.
Uh, but you know, when one of the big twists is that the coast.
Who at the time is running field has kind of been running
this like secondary shield.
And that is the set of shield people that he sends to help
during age of Ultron, their
Tony: whole job, their secret mission was to refurbish the hella carrier.
That theory shows up in that little trunk.
Al: And just the acknowledgement of that alone, like, like that,
that storyline fits so perfectly within the movie and the TV show.
And we didn't say mentioned, didn't
Jude: say it didn't say also within that mentioned the Avengers
in terms of finding structure,
Tony: they found structures, allies and called Maria Hill to tell
the Avengers where struck her.
Jude: Yeah.
Yeah.
And like you said, I just, in the movie, you would have been, it would
have been nice to have that little nod.
Al: And I gotta say I'm a little surprised that they didn't do something like that.
Cause you know, it's, it's like if the movie mentions, Hey, here's this
TV show kind of surprised they didn't do that to say, Hey people, you
should also watch this other TV show.
Yeah.
Tony: Well the problem behind the scenes of the problem was the head of Marvel TV.
I pro mother and then Kevin did not get along.
And they been pretty much fighting for years about who has the rights to what?
And it was finally around civil war where they completely split Disney was
just tired of their bickering and just like, all right, your five-year in charge
of all things, Marvel and whatever.
She can give the, the shows whenever they're not using them.
I promise her and his group.
So you could tell that they were going on great in 2013 at the beginning of the
shield, but the further you get along, the closer you get to civil war, you can
tell that the connections are getting more and more strained until they're almost
no connections at all after civil war.
Trey: Yeah.
Yeah.
I was going to say art appropriately,
appropriately.
That relationship lasted until civil war, which is a perfect way to put it to you.
Well, you know, it seems like we've got a, a good sampling of things that connect
and don't connect, but that's going to bring us to our last point, which
is simply, which are the shows do you think is the easiest to bring in as is?
So if we can start with you this time, Al, which one would you bring in.
Al: Oh boy.
So I had to think about this.
Uh, all right.
Um, so I have, I have two shows in mind and the first one that I'm
going to say is really just a cheap, so it's the Hellstrom TV show.
Oh, wow.
Which I thought was a.
A bad show.
Tony: I didn't know if you picked off my scarf of disgust from the Hills.
Al: And if I remember correctly, Tony, you still have not seen it.
This is like the one MCU thing you have not watched.
One
Tony: thing I haven't finished on five out of 10 since we're covering the show.
But so far it's the only like even iron fist, which is known
as the worst Netflix show.
I have redeeming factors for that show.
There's nothing about Hellstrom that I enjoy.
Trey: Yes.
When you scoffed at the beginning, I 100% that you were talking about iron fist.
So to hear it was actually about health service.
Tony: Well, and I had talked and I knew he was going to bring this up.
Al: Well, yeah, he was
Trey: ready.
I am completely outside the wheelhouse of this.
What?
Just as a brief overview, what is Hellstrom?
Al: Oh, okay.
So, um, So just before all of the, um, like the Marvel television stuff, like
ceased to exist, pretty much like the, like, because now all, any TV shows are
all Disney plus and that kind of stuff.
They had a plan to create.
Um, I forgot what the actual term is, but they were calling it like their, their
horror series or something like that.
Tony remember worlds of darkness.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
And so, um, so that's where the Hellstrom TV show came from.
There was going to be a ghost writer, TV show, starring Gabriel Luna, who
was a ghost writer in agents of shield.
And, uh, I think there was at least a third show.
I don't remember, but they had a plan for this and all of
them were going to be on Hulu.
So Hellstrom, like they, they made Hellstrom, they got, uh, the first
season, then all of the, uh, Marvel television shows just stopped.
Like he snapped.
Yup, exactly.
Uh, so I mean, th this show itself is.
You know, I've already forgotten the names of the characters.
You have this, this brother and sister who are, uh, paranormal, essentially.
They, they both kind of have some, some powers, uh, and
then they are investigating like paranormal type of stuff.
Uh it's it's been a while since I've watched it.
And it was, it was tough to get through.
It is not that good of a show.
Say that over and over the reason I said this as a cheat is because of
this show really has absolutely no connection to anything else in the MCU.
And it is just a blank slate.
They can say anything.
Um,
Tony: there's one Easter egg connecting it.
They have rocks on the first episode, but just in the background.
Al: So that's, that's it.
But like my real answer is, uh, one of the shows that was on ABC.
Might've still been ABC family at the time.
I don't remember, but either way the cloak and dagger show, I
thought it was actually really good.
I really enjoyed that show.
Uh, and these are two characters.
They're teenagers.
They're like still growing, they just got their powers and some of the
storylines do get pretty adult, you know, for, for teenage storylines.
Um, you know, not nowhere near as adult, as like Jessica Jones or, or
Daredevil those, those went alcohol, but, uh, but you know, they have powers.
Uh, they mentioned a couple of things.
Uh, the, the dark dimension that kind of pops up that pops up in a
handful of, of the TV shows, um, they just kind of kept reusing them.
And considering, you know, some of the magic that we're
starting to see in the movies.
I feel like bringing in these two kinds of characters who have a little bit
of a connection already to magic type of stuff, or at least other dimension
things like that's kind of an easy one to, to bring them in, especially how
season two ends, uh, with, with those two characters, just kind of leaving
home and going on their own adventures.
Um, I, I guess kind of like what Tony was saying earlier about, you know, Daredevil
and Jessica Jones, you know, at the end, their story is essentially complete or
they're they end in a spot where they can just be brought in, I mean, same
thing with these two characters from
Jude: yeah.
Well, and cloak and dagger is our fan favorites, like from the comics and stuff.
So, so that would also be a good reason to
Trey: bring them.
Yeah, that's a, that's a really good answer.
I have not personally seen it, but on like, I follow a lot of film
critics, TV critics, and then people who are appreciating Marvel and I
constantly saw praise for that show.
So yeah, that, that seems like a really good fit to just bring in, especially
framing it the way you did about it.
Being a complete story and ready to be plugged.
Al: Yeah.
And just kinda like throwing something out there about the show, like it's, you
know, it's, it's teen stuff, teen drama.
That's, that's pretty heavy in the show, which I normally do not like
at all, and it's still pulled me in.
So just kind of throw that out there.
That's awesome.
Trey: So what about you, Tony?
Um,
Tony: well, I've got kind of a cheat, not, not Hellstrom,
not yet.
It would ever make any impact on anything, but like agent Carter can
be pooled fully formed into the MCU, especially since it ended in 1947.
Even considering that cap goes back in end game in the script, it
says he went back to 1954, so she aged and same amount of he did.
Um, so there's no reason why all those events didn't happen, but that would,
I think they no impact in the water.
So, um, in my mind, yes, that's the only one.
That's a hundred percent.
Um,
Trey: and if I'm not mistaken, I think the writers of infinity war
and end game worked on agent Carter.
So it feels like such a nice leap between those two.
Tony: I think that's why also they had the pool to get, um, uh, the actor
who played Jarvis into the movie.
But, uh, as much as I like my defenders or too many conflicts to bring them out
fully forms, unless you just plucked them in like molded their style.
Um, but yeah, it's, I've got to go agree with Al is, um, Coke and
dagger is probably the best one because it ended before the snap and
it takes place outside of New York.
It takes place in new Orleans.
Oh, wow.
Um, so you don't have to worry about that.
Um, also easy to take in would probably be runaways, but I have real
conflicting feelings about runaways.
Like personally, I would not bring that version into it because runaways
is my favorite Marvel comic book.
Oh, wow.
Okay.
And I, yeah, it was the first one that came out when I was like 14 or 15.
It started coming out.
It's the first one I ever collected issue by issue and they did not
do it justice in my opinion.
So I would really just selfishly I'd want to see Marvel do
another chance on that one.
Do another pass on that.
Jude: No, that makes, that makes a lot of sense.
When you say, when you have a, that, that connection to the source material,
it makes sense that you'd want to it.
Wasn't done right.
Al: Yeah.
Yeah.
One of the things that I, I say pretty regularly about like some of this stuff
is, you know, we're, we're getting to the point now with the MCU where a
lot of the fans who know the comics, like you have a lot of people who
want to see, you know, a certain thing happened, but you know, they, they
don't always enforce that to happen.
Right.
Like, um, we, you know, the example that I'm always bringing up is, uh,
captain Marvel, where, you know, w we know that the scrolls are, oh,
they're evil, shape-shifting people, but we get this complete curve ball
that, oh, no, the scrolls in this case are essentially the good guys.
Right.
Or at least the ones that we see, they're like the refugee character.
Jude: Yeah.
So, yeah.
What I'm curious about is would you consider, because in my mind, when I,
when I thought of this question, part of me thought, well, could I pull in say
Daredevil, if I ignored season three, Like could that, you know, which, which
in my head brought in Punisher and like, yeah, yeah, no, but that's, I'm
saying if we ignored season three and brought in Daredevil after season two to
the MCU, do you think that would work?
Tony: I think it would considering where he was at the end of season two,
where he has given up being Daredevil, but him like re re-evaluating, like
the need for Daredevil would be a great, like hero's journey for a first
movie or first Disney plus series.
Yeah.
It was before, right before the defenders crossover, which like, if
we're not real people, everyone from the Netflix shows that'd be perfect because
then we could recast say Danny Rand.
Jude: Yeah.
And the thing is, it's a weird question for me, because season three
is my favorite of the Daredevil run.
But just thinking about like, what could I pull in seamlessly?
You know, God, that gets you two good stories there.
Yeah, the Punisher, but even still the Punisher was while
his, his own series were violent.
You get Punisher.
I mean, he's violent in season two, but I don't know if season two
Daredevil Punisher violence was the same as his own season violence.
Tony: That is true.
He
Al: ramped it up.
Tony: Ken a much more straightforward journey of people killing
people who deserved it in the first one or in Daredevil.
And then I think, I don't know.
It's been a while since I've seen the Punisher.
It's not, he's not my favorite character and the offenders, the rest of defenders
are all fresh in my mind because ally just recorded all the defenders episodes,
rewinding those, the first stuff that comes out next week, or probably
on Monday the same day, this stuff.
So drops.
Al: Oh, fantastic
Jude: tenders Kelly.
For that, I loved the defenders.
I know, I know there's people that didn't I really enjoyed it.
Tony: Yeah.
I, and then I like if we're being the Netflix and we keep talking about
Netflix people, cause it's on top of my head, but like people want to,
don't like Finn Jones is casting as Danny Rand and I understand that, but
he bounces off the other defenders, so well, so it's like, if you go.
I don't think it would be right to bring in Mike Colter, Kristen Ritter,
and, uh, the guy, Charlie, Charlie Cox.
Um, I feel bad bringing those three perfect casting, not bringing in the Finn
Jones, even like for heroes or higher type
Trey: show.
Al: Yeah, that's interesting.
Cause I kept thinking that like Finn Jones, I thought he was a perfectly good
actor that he just like the character he was playing or like the, the way
that that character was played for the show was just, I didn't like that style.
Like the, you know, the it's a very, um, man boy type of character or childish
is probably a better description.
I don't know why I said, man,
Trey: I'm glad we got to record it for the first time.
But uh, no, like I, I didn't see iron fist, but I remember
being on the outskirts of it.
Like, cause they've got a second season, there was a lot of talks that it was
almost close to redeeming itself.
And that was part of the shame of like not getting a next season.
So I see, I see you the points of like the actor being fine.
It was just the handling of the show.
Tony: Um, I have a huge soft spot for season two of iron fist because, uh,
that the year, the summer previous to that, I went to San Diego comic con 2018.
Yeah.
Marvel studios wasn't there.
It was very depressing,
Jude: but that's awesome.
I did go.
Tony: Iron fist panel and the cook and Decker panel.
So I have a huge soft spot for it.
Yeah.
Al: Yeah.
And, and, you know, just to kind of want to add, you know, back to
the question about, you know, what, if we bring in a character from,
you know, only, partly through the, the series that we've already seen.
Uh, I feel like that just gets hard to describe to people like w when you
go that route now, It's just harder to keep track of, like, imagine, you
know, talking to your friends who don't understand or don't really, you know,
they don't follow the stuff like we do.
Um, so like, oh, Hey, those old X-Men movies from 20 years ago,
are they, are they part of the MCU?
Oh no, they don't it's anything from this year and oh, okay.
And then all of a sudden, oh, Hey, there's this guy, uh, Daredevil.
He had some, uh, seasons on Netflix.
Cool.
I'll go watch them by the way.
We don't watch the third season because that one doesn't first.
And then he also showed up in this other one defenders don't so just,
just season one and two, and then they character there, the Punisher ignore him.
He doesn't exist.
So I feel like that just
Tony: gets difficult.
I yeah.
I'm but Disney plus has been able to kind of mitigate that because
they have, uh, Marvel legends.
Now just show them that 10, 8, 10 minute video, and then jump into the new
Daredevil show on Disney plus or whatever.
Trey: Yeah.
Those Marvel legend episodes have become such a smart move on Marvel's
part because it is such an easy, like dip in dip out like under
10 minutes, I think, per episode.
And you kind of get all you need, uh, and that one viewing at least to have
a functional knowledge of whatever the characters are gonna appear in.
But I D I do want to say circling back a little bit, Al you were talking about
the frustration of like, is this part of this or this part of that just don't
watch this season so on and so forth.
I like there's nothing definite yet, but there are rumblings of
the Sony villain verse that is maybe potentially linking up.
I'm bracing myself for the frustration that that's about to bring in about
what is or isn't part of the story.
Jude: Yeah.
Yeah.
Tony: That's why at the top of this episode, the icons that
we cover everything that was intended to be in the model.
So if you bring in, like, if the rumors are true and they bring in.
Uh, characters from Sam Raimi.
Spider-Man the amazing Spider-Man movies.
We're not going to go back and cover all the Spider-Man movies
or we're not going to cover.
I mean, we're not going to cover venom unless it's for a joke
episode on winners and love that
Trey: they only cover the movies that doesn't make Kevin side-eye when
someone says it's part of their care.
Jude: Well, there was that famous for you between Kevin and Amy Pascal when she's
like, oh, it's going to be adjacent.
And Kevin was like, what?
Trey: You were arrested development
Al: theme song.
Tony: Well,
Al: I think that'll
Trey: wrap it up for the bulk of the episode there.
I want to say thank you.
This has been a very enlightening conversation about the Marvel television
and Netflix side of the Marvel universe.
Al: But yeah.
Tony: Thanks for having us.
Yeah.
I mean, any chance to talk about this?
The super nitty-gritty nerdy stuff about the characters that only like
a handful of people care about.
Trey: Speaking of getting nitty-gritty and nerdy, we do have what if premiering this
week, when this episode drops August 11th, so do whatever what's everybody expecting?
What are you most excited for on this upcoming Disney plus show?
And if we can start with you, Tony, what are you excited about?
Tony: Well, first of all, it's my birthday.
So
Al: I'd like to thank Marvel for,
Tony: for giving me that.
Um,
yeah, it was, um, August is usually a dead zone for all superior stuff.
So.
One of my favorite lesser known comics is the exiles, which is about a bunch of
heroes from alternate universe is teaming up and like protecting universities.
That's what I hope to see in this.
There's been the rumors of it, of like the version of multi-verse Avengers
or the exiles, like plucking cool characters out of their multiverse
and having star wars and captain Carter and whoever else teaming up.
Maybe Kang, maybe someone else, but I think that'd be really cool.
I'm hoping to see that.
Trey: Yeah.
That's cool.
What about you Al?
Al: Yeah.
Uh, you know, to be honest, I am very much looking forward to not having any
idea what's going on with all these shows that, you know, the Disney plus shows
come out, uh, the movies come out and, you know, you get all that, that lead up.
You're like, okay, you know, this, uh, what, what, what do
you expect is gonna happen?
And you just make, start making assumptions.
And I'm, I'm really looking forward to the fact that because there are so many,
you know, different characters and so many shows like the trailers that have
come out have been so light on the actual details that I just can't even get into
my own head for, for the show, like.
Know, back when Juan division first came out.
I kind of had some of that, but, you know, with trailers, all that,
it's still so easy to just start making assumptions and we all did it.
Yeah.
I don't know if I've made any for this show.
You know, I saw a headline saying that apparently this is going to be MCU cannon.
I have no idea if that's true or not.
I, you know, keep getting things pointed at me.
They're like, oh, this is a rumor that's going on.
And I try very hard to just ignore rumors because there are so many, so many rumors.
Oh yeah.
But yeah, I'm really just looking forward to just sitting down and watching it
without going into the over analyzing that we do as people who spend our
free time talking to other people about this stuff in a recorded fashion.
Trey: I gotta say, I really liked that answer because in
this like constantly connected.
Internet that we live in it's it is like a privilege to be able to go into
a show without knowing as much as we do.
And that's such a great point to bring up about the, what if, because
we really don't know that much.
So I like that one.
Al: What about YouTube?
Jude: I was going to say, I feel the same way.
Like I have some glimpses of like the challah in the Ravagers,
you know, things like that, but.
I'm I'm having a hard time piecing it together because what F right?
Like in this alternative universe, what if this happens?
What if that happens?
And there's so many different things you can tweak and change that I don't know
what you expect in terms of what they decided to tweak and change, you know?
And I hadn't watched any trailers that, because I think they've released
some episode specific trailers.
Now, I haven't seen any of those trailers.
Only the big broad ones, just to kind of introduce the idea.
Yeah.
So I'm, I'm having a hard time, like, and not in a, not in a bad way.
Right.
And just like putting it together.
So it is exciting too, in a weird way.
I think that it levels that elevates my expectations of like, oh, I
I'm, I'm expecting to be blown away by what they're going to do.
You know?
So I don't know if that's a good thing for the show, but I know
that that is happening for me.
Trey: I know for me, And I feel like this is in direct contrast of the two great
points that you all brought out about the lack of expectations, but flying in the
face of reason, I am expecting this to be a lot closer to the MCU Canon than I think
people are expecting just based off my, this is my own personal speculation and
feeling, but I'm going out on that wire.
I don't think it's a coincidence that it's happening right after low-key.
And so I, I don't know.
I have this expectation of feeling like by the end of this, we're going
to be like, oh, these, these aren't just like whatevs, but glimpses into
what could be and maybe moving forward.
Tony: Yeah, I totally agree.
I'm just hoping for the episode where it's just an animated version of
the pilot and shield and make that
Jude: well, it makes you wonder, like, you know, when, when quake shows up in episode
one, you know, we know all bets are off
Al: and y'all can
Trey: point back to this episode and say y'all called it Sarah.
That's fantastic.
Al: Yeah.
Tony: That's the thing you make every possible prediction.
One of them will be right.
Trey: Okay.
Well, Tony and Al, I got to say this has been an absolute blast.
Thank you two so much for coming on to this.
Al: Oh, yeah.
No, thank you for having us.
We're very excited to be here.
Um, it's a good show.
So I'm looking forward to hearing my voice on something else again.
Awesome.
Trey: Well, if you want to hear both of their voice, you can find
their podcast MCU rewind on it.
Most podcast catchers, or if you go to MC rewind.com, you can find a lot
of information on their shows there, or you can follow them on Twitter, MCU
underscore, rewind really great people.
You should definitely be subscribed and following to them.
But of course, if you have any questions or comments about this episode, you can
always reach us at MC you need to know on Twitter and Instagram, or if you'd like
to join our discord, there's a link to the discord in the show notes as well.
Once you get
to
Al: discord,
Jude: make sure you go to the role of sign, click on the eye emoji.
So you can have access to all the spoiler channels, be sure to
follow or subscribe, whichever your podcast catcher of choice does.
And the best thing you can do for us is share with a friend.
Trey: Yeah.
We'd also like to thank Nick Sandy for the use of our theme song, which is
his rendition of the Avengers theme.
You can find more of his work on his SoundCloud, which is linked in the show.
All right, that's going to do it.
Thank you so much for listening out Tony and June.
Thank you so much
Al: for doing this.
Thank
Jude: you tray.
Thank you,
Al: Tony.
Thanks
Trey: for having us.
We'll see you all next
Tony: week.
Jude: Okay.
See, I was going to jump in and then I kept waiting for trader Joe's.
I was like, wait,
Trey: we were doing so good for this whole episode too.
It's always the slight little noises where I go and it's like,
wait, is he about to do it?
And we just kind of psych ourselves out.
Does that ever happen to you too?
And you'll show,
Al: oh no, we just talk over it.
Tony: That's our biggest problem is we'll talk over each other.
Trey: So after four years, it's just like, yeah, screw
Jude: it.
Well, yeah,
Tony: we've also, we've been friends since we were 10 years old, so
Al: yeah,
Trey: that's fantastic.