{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":5.4,"endTime":10.17,"body":"Welcome to Demystifying Instructional Design, a podcast where I interview"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":10.17,"endTime":13.86,"body":"various instructional designers to figure out what it is instructional"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":13.86,"endTime":14.79,"body":"designers do."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":15.57,"endTime":17.52,"body":"I'm Rebecca Hogue, your podcast host."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":18.18,"endTime":20.28,"body":"If you or someone you know would like to be"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":20.28,"endTime":24.6,"body":"a guest on demystifying instructional design, please complete the Be"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":24.6,"endTime":29.46,"body":"My guest form available on demystifying instructional design dot com."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":30.15,"endTime":33.39,"body":"I'm particularly looking for guests who do not work in"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":33.39,"endTime":34.26,"body":"higher education."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":34.86,"endTime":38.22,"body":"If you enjoy this podcast, please subscribe or leave a"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":38.22,"endTime":40.17,"body":"comment in the show notes blog post."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":40.47,"endTime":43.92,"body":"And consider helping to support this podcast with a donation"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":43.92,"endTime":45.18,"body":"to my Patreon account."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":46.47,"endTime":49.41,"body":"Welcome, Greg, to demystifying instructional design."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":49.89,"endTime":51.9,"body":"To begin with, can you start by introducing yourself?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":52.41,"endTime":53.05,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":53.07,"endTime":54.33,"body":"Thanks so much for having me."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":54.39,"endTime":56.55,"body":"So my name is Greg Dillon, and I've been in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":56.55,"endTime":59.55,"body":"the instructional design field for the past five years."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":60.06,"endTime":64.379,"body":"I'm currently working as a learning designer at Brown University"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":64.379,"endTime":68.16,"body":"in Providence, Rhode Island, and I was your student at"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":68.16,"endTime":70.2,"body":"UMass Boston, where I got my master's degree."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":70.68,"endTime":74.01,"body":"Learning designer is an interesting new term."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":74.46,"endTime":78.9,"body":"How is that different from what you've done previously as"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":78.9,"endTime":80.1,"body":"an instructional designer?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":80.61,"endTime":83.4,"body":"I think essentially the role is the same."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":83.91,"endTime":85.53,"body":"I only started a month ago."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":85.83,"endTime":90.03,"body":"My colleagues, they're all instructional designers before, and they changed"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":90.03,"endTime":93.45,"body":"the term to learning designers because they specifically wanted to"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":93.45,"endTime":97.62,"body":"have a focus on the student experience as opposed to"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":97.62,"endTime":98.77,"body":"the instruction itself."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":98.77,"endTime":101.58,"body":"So moving the focus from the teacher to the student."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":102.18,"endTime":104.07,"body":"What would you describe as your origin story?"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":104.1,"endTime":110.1,"body":"How did you find instructional design? Around 2014 2015?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":110.13,"endTime":113.58,"body":"I was working in Rhode Island School of Design Global"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":113.58,"endTime":117.3,"body":"Department, and I worked on a really unique project."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":117.48,"endTime":121.35,"body":"The Princess of Abu Dhabi donated a substantial amount of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":121.35,"endTime":125.37,"body":"money to create an emerging Abu Dhabi artists program."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":125.67,"endTime":128.399,"body":"A few weeks of the year, the faculty would visit"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":128.399,"endTime":131.25,"body":"the UAE or the artists would visit campus, and I"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":131.25,"endTime":133.53,"body":"was responsible for organizing these trips."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":133.68,"endTime":136.56,"body":"However, the majority of the year the artists would work"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":136.56,"endTime":139.95,"body":"with the faculty online and for this RISD, needed to"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":139.95,"endTime":141.63,"body":"hire an instructional designer."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":141.78,"endTime":143.94,"body":"And I had never heard of an instructional designer before,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":143.94,"endTime":146.31,"body":"and I was fascinated and I learned so much from"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":146.31,"endTime":149.31,"body":"this person who was hired and decided that I was"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":149.31,"endTime":150.36,"body":"interested in learning more."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":150.63,"endTime":153.57,"body":"So I started taking classes at UMass Boston, and that's"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":153.57,"endTime":156.57,"body":"where I met you, Rebecca, in my very first class."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":156.93,"endTime":158.37,"body":"And the rest is history."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":158.67,"endTime":162.06,"body":"How would you describe what your typical day is, and"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":162.06,"endTime":163.92,"body":"I know you're into a new job at the moment."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":164.19,"endTime":166.73,"body":"How you envision your typical day?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":166.74,"endTime":167.08,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":167.1,"endTime":168.6,"body":"As you mentioned, I've only been there."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":168.6,"endTime":169.41,"body":"I haven't been there too long."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":169.41,"endTime":172.77,"body":"I've only been there a month, but my position is"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":172.77,"endTime":176.76,"body":"very faculty facing and from what I've done so far"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":176.76,"endTime":178.67,"body":"and what I anticipate that I'll do in the future,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":178.68,"endTime":181.38,"body":"it's going to be meeting with faculty to discuss goals"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":181.38,"endTime":184.83,"body":"for their courses, collaborating with them to build the courses,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":184.83,"endTime":189.9,"body":"collaborating with the media and technology departments to create content"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":189.9,"endTime":192.57,"body":"and use tools that meet the faculty goals."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":192.57,"endTime":195.84,"body":"For the courses, I'll be doing quality control on courses"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":195.84,"endTime":198.54,"body":"in the learning management system, which is Canvas and then"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":198.54,"endTime":202.26,"body":"researching different pedagogical approaches that might be helpful for faculty"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":202.26,"endTime":203.65,"body":"at Brown Research."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":203.67,"endTime":204.54,"body":"That's interesting."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":204.99,"endTime":207.63,"body":"That's been a really nice part of my job because"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":207.63,"endTime":210.03,"body":"I really haven't had too much time for that in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":210.03,"endTime":211.26,"body":"previous positions."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":211.26,"endTime":214.17,"body":"And as I'm a huge fan virtually connecting and you"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":214.17,"endTime":217.59,"body":"and I have an item and I love just being"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":217.59,"endTime":220.14,"body":"a part of the community of practice and learning about"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":220.14,"endTime":223.8,"body":"what everybody's doing and how those kind of ideas that"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":223.8,"endTime":226.92,"body":"are being discussed could be helpful to the faculty at"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":226.92,"endTime":227.58,"body":"my institution."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":227.61,"endTime":230.82,"body":"How do you describe what you do if we're talking"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":230.82,"endTime":233.34,"body":"about, how do I describe what instructional design is?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":233.34,"endTime":236.13,"body":"And this is a question that comes up literally every"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":236.13,"endTime":239.28,"body":"single time I tell someone my job, no one knows"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":239.28,"endTime":240.34,"body":"what instructional design is."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":240.69,"endTime":245.88,"body":"I usually discuss the history in training of instructional design,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":246.12,"endTime":249.33,"body":"and I'll go to something that pretty much everyone is"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":249.33,"endTime":249.98,"body":"familiar with."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":249.99,"endTime":252.18,"body":"So just to start off, I'll say any job you've"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":252.18,"endTime":255.39,"body":"ever had, you've probably taken some kind of module on"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":255.39,"endTime":259.29,"body":"sexual harassment or on boarding and something along these lines."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":259.29,"endTime":262.26,"body":"And this is something that's very commonly developed by instructional"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":262.26,"endTime":265.02,"body":"designers and that kind of serves as a base for"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":265.02,"endTime":267.66,"body":"people who have no idea what the position is."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":267.66,"endTime":270.3,"body":"But I'll talk a little bit about instructional design in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":270.3,"endTime":274.28,"body":"the corporate world and health and developing modules for training."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":274.29,"endTime":277.47,"body":"And then I'll talk about instructional design in higher education,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":277.47,"endTime":280.44,"body":"which is I've only had positions in instructional design in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":280.44,"endTime":283.32,"body":"higher education, which tends to be more along the"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":283.32,"endTime":286.94,"body":"lines, of course, development and faculty support."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":286.98,"endTime":290.94,"body":"And for me, for personally, for me, it's been very"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":290.94,"endTime":293.16,"body":"different in all of my positions."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":293.34,"endTime":297.21,"body":"One position was faculty support for educational technology."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":297.45,"endTime":303.42,"body":"Another was specifically focused on developing interactive lectures using Camtasia"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":303.42,"endTime":304.41,"body":"or Storyline."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":304.88,"endTime":308.48,"body":"Then in my current position, I primarily advise faculty on"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":308.48,"endTime":311.81,"body":"best practices for their online courses and work with them"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":311.81,"endTime":313.19,"body":"closely to build those courses."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":313.76,"endTime":315.95,"body":"What kind of projects do you find fun?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":316.34,"endTime":318.23,"body":"Well, the projects that I find to be the most"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":318.23,"endTime":321.05,"body":"fun are really based on the people, the faculty that"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":321.05,"endTime":324.77,"body":"I'm working with and the best ones are when faculty"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":324.77,"endTime":328.64,"body":"are really passionate about effectively teaching their students."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":329.03,"endTime":332.42,"body":"And when I get to learn about their unique strategies"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":332.42,"endTime":336.32,"body":"and unique assignments that they employ because this then becomes"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":336.32,"endTime":338.54,"body":"a part of my pedagogy, it adds to me and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":338.54,"endTime":342.56,"body":"I really like how I can facilitate a certain culture"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":342.56,"endTime":343.43,"body":"of the institution."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":343.43,"endTime":345.83,"body":"The more I learn about what faculty are doing and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":345.83,"endTime":349.25,"body":"what they think is effective, the more I can recommend"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":349.25,"endTime":350.81,"body":"those things to their colleagues."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":350.81,"endTime":353.81,"body":"And if faculty know that their colleagues are doing certain"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":353.81,"endTime":356.27,"body":"things that's helpful, then it's way more likely that they"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":356.27,"endTime":358.61,"body":"will adopt those practices themselves."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":358.7,"endTime":361.4,"body":"And so I really like when I work with a"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":361.4,"endTime":364.01,"body":"faculty member who has those kinds of ideas."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":364.34,"endTime":367.01,"body":"For instance, when I was at Gordon, there was one"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":367.01,"endTime":371.51,"body":"professor who used 360 cameras to develop a virtual map"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":371.51,"endTime":372.5,"body":"of Jerusalem."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":372.53,"endTime":376.79,"body":"Gordon is a Christian college, and then in another instance,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":377.0,"endTime":380.66,"body":"for a critical thinking course, I created a simulation that"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":380.66,"endTime":384.02,"body":"students would go through so that they could experience cultural"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":384.02,"endTime":384.66,"body":"bias."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":384.77,"endTime":387.08,"body":"And these are kinds of things that I would also"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":387.08,"endTime":389.45,"body":"talk about with other faculty members who come to me"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":389.45,"endTime":391.25,"body":"asking, What can I do with my course?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":391.25,"endTime":393.8,"body":"And I'll say, Oh, your colleague had a lot of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":393.8,"endTime":394.73,"body":"success with this?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":394.73,"endTime":395.69,"body":"And they'll say, Oh, really?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":395.69,"endTime":398.48,"body":"He did or she did, and I really appreciate those"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":398.48,"endTime":399.41,"body":"projects the most."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":400.07,"endTime":403.7,"body":"That's actually a really useful strategy for finding somebody who"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":403.7,"endTime":406.52,"body":"would be a peer, in essence, another faculty member that's"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":406.52,"endTime":408.59,"body":"doing it so that you can call upon."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":408.83,"endTime":410.84,"body":"Oh yeah, your peer is doing this."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":410.84,"endTime":414.68,"body":"And it's not just coming from random instructional designer."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":415.34,"endTime":416.09,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":416.12,"endTime":417.2,"body":"Because it's one thing."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":417.23,"endTime":420.5,"body":"I'm sure they trust my expertize, but it's one thing"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":420.5,"endTime":422.51,"body":"when I say this is a best practice and you"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":422.51,"endTime":423.05,"body":"should use it."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":423.23,"endTime":426.35,"body":"And it's another thing when I say, Oh, your colleague,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":426.35,"endTime":428.6,"body":"who is your friend and someone that you, you respect"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":428.61,"endTime":431.48,"body":"and have known for many years is doing something that's"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":431.48,"endTime":433.87,"body":"really effective with with her students."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":433.88,"endTime":436.04,"body":"That's going to be and that's going to work way"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":436.04,"endTime":436.4,"body":"more."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":437.21,"endTime":439.04,"body":"You've been at this for a few years now."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":439.07,"endTime":442.04,"body":"What area would you describe your niche to be?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":442.46,"endTime":446.72,"body":"That's a complicated question, I would say, because I have"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":446.72,"endTime":449.9,"body":"certain things that I'm good at and instructional design and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":449.9,"endTime":452.93,"body":"then certain areas that I'm very interested in growing."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":452.96,"endTime":455.66,"body":"And so for me, the past three years, I've been"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":455.66,"endTime":460.07,"body":"doing a lot of work with creating simulations and interactive"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":460.07,"endTime":461.33,"body":"lectures with Storyline."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":461.33,"endTime":464.42,"body":"So that's something that has been my niche the past"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":464.42,"endTime":464.99,"body":"three years."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":464.99,"endTime":467.15,"body":"I've always been the go to person for that."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":467.15,"endTime":470.72,"body":"I've also worked a lot with doing open educational resource"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":470.72,"endTime":473.63,"body":"workshops with faculty, and that's actually I've really enjoyed that"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":473.63,"endTime":476.09,"body":"and I would consider continuing to do that in the"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":476.09,"endTime":476.59,"body":"future."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":476.6,"endTime":480.2,"body":"But in my current position, I feel like we have"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":480.2,"endTime":484.04,"body":"yet to create the kind of experiences in online courses"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":484.04,"endTime":489.08,"body":"that replicate social presence, the social presence of in-person classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":489.62,"endTime":491.96,"body":"And I think this will be accomplished by focusing on"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":491.96,"endTime":495.59,"body":"community building, and I hope to invest more of my"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":495.59,"endTime":497.6,"body":"time in that in the current position."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":498.14,"endTime":500.57,"body":"So that's where I hope my niche to be."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":501.2,"endTime":502.58,"body":"That's pretty much what I do, right?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":503.06,"endTime":506.24,"body":"Yeah, I've always felt my experience in your classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":506.24,"endTime":508.28,"body":"I always felt that there was a great sense of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":508.28,"endTime":509.78,"body":"community and social presence."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":510.05,"endTime":514.729,"body":"And so I definitely model my practices off of my"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":514.729,"endTime":515.27,"body":"old teacher."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":516.14,"endTime":518.84,"body":"What are some of the biggest challenges you face as"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":518.84,"endTime":519.979,"body":"an instructional designer?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":520.159,"endTime":523.7,"body":"The challenges I face are related to the challenges faculty"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":523.7,"endTime":524.12,"body":"face."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":524.54,"endTime":528.92,"body":"When faculty try something different in their courses that they"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":528.92,"endTime":532.46,"body":"feel will benefit, their students can sometimes submit negative feedback"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":532.46,"endTime":536.51,"body":"and evaluations because the pedagogical approach is different than what"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":536.51,"endTime":537.29,"body":"they're used to."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":537.8,"endTime":540.92,"body":"Students can rely on the comfort of a consistent format"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":540.92,"endTime":544.79,"body":"across their curriculum that might include long lectures or limited"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":544.79,"endTime":545.69,"body":"student input."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":545.99,"endTime":548.06,"body":"And this is just something if they're used to it,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":548.27,"endTime":549.67,"body":"then it's a comfort for them to see."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":549.68,"endTime":550.67,"body":"They know what to expect."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":550.85,"endTime":551.69,"body":"That makes sense."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":551.9,"endTime":557.09,"body":"But then when the teacher receives those negative reviews, administration"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":557.09,"endTime":560.39,"body":"tells them to stop introducing new methods so that they"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":560.39,"endTime":563.51,"body":"can keep course evaluations up and then faculty are no"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":563.51,"endTime":567.11,"body":"longer willing to try anything new or innovative in their"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":567.11,"endTime":567.74,"body":"courses."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":567.92,"endTime":571.76,"body":"When faculty are not supported by the administration, it also"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":571.76,"endTime":573.41,"body":"makes my work more challenging."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":573.42,"endTime":575.54,"body":"That's what I would say is a challenge for my"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":575.54,"endTime":575.78,"body":"work."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":576.56,"endTime":581.09,"body":"That's the challenge with the way tenure works at universities"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":581.48,"endTime":586.22,"body":"and colleges, because typically those that have that desire for"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":586.22,"endTime":589.55,"body":"most innovative pedagogy are the newer instructors."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":590.0,"endTime":592.94,"body":"But they are also the instructors that can't afford to"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":592.94,"endTime":595.07,"body":"not have great ratings."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":595.58,"endTime":598.55,"body":"They have that pressure to appeal to the administration and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":598.55,"endTime":600.82,"body":"to because they have that tenure lingering over."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":600.84,"endTime":603.38,"body":"Yeah, they need the performance numbers in order to make"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":603.38,"endTime":604.04,"body":"their tenure."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":604.31,"endTime":604.79,"body":"And so."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":604.97,"endTime":608.69,"body":"That also drives a lack of innovation."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":609.59,"endTime":613.49,"body":"What skills would you find most useful in the work"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":613.49,"endTime":613.97,"body":"that you do?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":614.48,"endTime":617.33,"body":"The most valuable skills are empathy and patience."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":617.78,"endTime":621.41,"body":"One concept I really appreciated learning about during the pandemic"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":621.68,"endTime":625.43,"body":"is the pedagogy of care, and it's generally applied or"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":625.43,"endTime":626.84,"body":"was applied to students."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":627.11,"endTime":630.26,"body":"But as an instructional designer, I also find it helpful"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":630.26,"endTime":632.45,"body":"to apply it to my relationship with faculty."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":632.78,"endTime":635.42,"body":"And there's no telling what experiences they've had in the"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":635.42,"endTime":638.81,"body":"classroom that directs their teaching approach or what they might"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":638.81,"endTime":640.01,"body":"be dealing with otherwise."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":640.37,"endTime":643.28,"body":"So I'd say empathy and patience in my interactions with"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":643.28,"endTime":645.02,"body":"them really benefits my work."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":645.86,"endTime":646.58,"body":"I really like that."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":646.58,"endTime":648.38,"body":"You called on the pedagogy of care."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":648.53,"endTime":651.35,"body":"I think that's something that really came out with the"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":651.35,"endTime":652.13,"body":"pandemic."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":652.4,"endTime":654.32,"body":"It was something we were playing with a little bit"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":654.32,"endTime":658.13,"body":"earlier, but really got highlighted at the beginning of the"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":658.13,"endTime":658.73,"body":"pandemic."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":659.21,"endTime":659.92,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":659.93,"endTime":661.61,"body":"And I think like a lot of things in the"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":661.61,"endTime":665.93,"body":"pandemic, it's bringing certain concepts to light or pushing forward"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":665.93,"endTime":667.49,"body":"certain things like online learning."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":667.49,"endTime":670.37,"body":"There's a lot more online learning now, and it's creating"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":670.37,"endTime":671.12,"body":"a new normal."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":671.42,"endTime":674.57,"body":"And so it's bringing these ideas to light like pedagogy"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":674.57,"endTime":677.99,"body":"of care, but knock on wood things slowing down or"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":678.02,"endTime":679.4,"body":"however, things will proceed."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":679.7,"endTime":681.74,"body":"I think pedagogy of care is something that we should"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":681.74,"endTime":684.11,"body":"continue to keep in mind in the future, because it's"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":684.11,"endTime":687.86,"body":"a really helpful concept and something that just keeps us"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":687.86,"endTime":689.95,"body":"conscious of our students and their experience."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":689.96,"endTime":692.93,"body":"And then, like I mentioned, the experience of faculty members"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":692.93,"endTime":693.32,"body":"as well."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":694.13,"endTime":696.68,"body":"Yeah, I think that's also very critical in the work"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":696.68,"endTime":698.84,"body":"that we do is, you know, not just the student"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":698.84,"endTime":699.74,"body":"remembering the teacher."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":699.8,"endTime":700.37,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":700.37,"endTime":701.31,"body":"Yes, absolutely."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":701.33,"endTime":701.69,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":702.62,"endTime":704.63,"body":"What do you wish you knew sooner?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":705.38,"endTime":707.75,"body":"I would say the thing that I wish I knew"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":707.75,"endTime":711.41,"body":"sooner in instructional design is giving faculty the benefit of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":711.41,"endTime":711.92,"body":"the doubt."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":712.28,"endTime":715.67,"body":"And I think in instructional design, it's a career that's"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":715.67,"endTime":719.57,"body":"focused on best practices and hypothetical ideals in the classroom."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":720.05,"endTime":720.68,"body":"And that's great."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":720.68,"endTime":723.26,"body":"I think we should always shoot for the ideal and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":723.26,"endTime":726.47,"body":"be critical, but sometimes we can forget that teachers are"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":726.47,"endTime":728.78,"body":"the ones with the applied experience."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":729.17,"endTime":731.9,"body":"They know what works and what doesn't, and the barriers"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":731.9,"endTime":734.63,"body":"to success because they deal with them every day."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":735.14,"endTime":737.93,"body":"So it's important to keep their opinions in mind and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":737.93,"endTime":740.87,"body":"trust that they have their students best interests at heart."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":741.88,"endTime":744.04,"body":"It goes along with the empathy, actually."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":744.49,"endTime":745.15,"body":"I think so."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":745.75,"endTime":749.89,"body":"That type of remembering that instructors are human."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":750.52,"endTime":754.84,"body":"Yeah, I think with critical pedagogy and we're always shooting"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":754.84,"endTime":758.14,"body":"for the ideal, we often shoot for the ideal in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":758.14,"endTime":761.08,"body":"instructional design based on research, but we need to remember"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":761.08,"endTime":763.75,"body":"that it's not always going to go perfectly in every"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":764.14,"endTime":766.99,"body":"situation in the classroom is not always going to be"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":766.99,"endTime":767.63,"body":"the same."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":767.65,"endTime":770.59,"body":"The students are dealing with stuff going on outside the"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":770.59,"endTime":772.93,"body":"classroom and they have their own issues that they're dealing"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":772.93,"endTime":773.12,"body":"with."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":773.12,"endTime":775.87,"body":"The faculty member has things that they're dealing with, and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":775.87,"endTime":779.02,"body":"even if we have these strategies that we introduce as"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":779.02,"endTime":781.84,"body":"best practices, that might even be a subjective term like"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":781.84,"endTime":784.03,"body":"best practice, it's really it's not going to be best"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":784.03,"endTime":785.26,"body":"practice across the board."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":785.71,"endTime":787.27,"body":"We need to leave it up to the teachers and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":787.27,"endTime":789.97,"body":"trust that they have their students best interests and they"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":789.97,"endTime":793.12,"body":"are going to choose the best path forward in their"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":793.12,"endTime":794.71,"body":"teaching and their students Learning"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":794.71,"endTime":798.1,"body":"A term that I've used or that I've learned"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":798.1,"endTime":801.0,"body":"and I'm working on using is better practices that, yeah,"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":801.01,"endTime":804.34,"body":"it's better, not best because there isn't a best practice."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":804.82,"endTime":805.21,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":805.78,"endTime":807.9,"body":"And but some practices are better than others."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":807.91,"endTime":810.22,"body":"It's like how we describe design, right?"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":810.52,"endTime":813.07,"body":"There isn't one solution, but some solutions are better than"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":813.07,"endTime":813.46,"body":"others."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":813.88,"endTime":814.54,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":815.35,"endTime":818.08,"body":"What advice would you give to new instructional designers?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":818.53,"endTime":822.25,"body":"The advice I would give new instructional designers is actually"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":822.25,"endTime":825.16,"body":"something I learned on day one with you at UMass"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":825.16,"endTime":828.73,"body":"Boston, which is to find a community of practice. Even"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":828.73,"endTime":831.03,"body":"at times in my career where I felt there were"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":831.04,"endTime":833.38,"body":"few opportunities to grow in my job."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":833.65,"endTime":837.19,"body":"I always felt inspired by the many brilliant, talented people"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":837.49,"endTime":840.13,"body":"in my community of practice, which in this case is"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":840.13,"endTime":843.1,"body":"people I met in Virtually Connecting. People I met"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":843.13,"endTime":846.64,"body":"on Twitter through those Virtually Connecting channels in different conferences"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":846.64,"endTime":847.75,"body":"that I participated in."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":847.76,"endTime":850.12,"body":"And I think this may be even more important than"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":850.12,"endTime":852.97,"body":"the degree itself after my colleagues have continued to teach"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":852.97,"endTime":856.33,"body":"me long after I graduated with my degree."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":856.33,"endTime":859.06,"body":"And so that's something that I learned very early on"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":859.06,"endTime":859.61,"body":"with you."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":859.63,"endTime":864.07,"body":"I know you brought in Autumn and Michael Berman, right?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":864.16,"endTime":866.41,"body":"I think lots of different people you brought into your"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":866.41,"endTime":866.95,"body":"classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":866.95,"endTime":868.99,"body":"And this is the first time that really happened to"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":868.99,"endTime":872.26,"body":"me in my education that the teacher introduced experts in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":872.26,"endTime":872.83,"body":"the field."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":872.98,"endTime":875.01,"body":"And that was really encouraging for me."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":875.02,"endTime":878.08,"body":"And then I would immediately after that, meeting those people"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":878.08,"endTime":880.54,"body":"and talking with them, I would immediately connect with them."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":880.54,"endTime":882.16,"body":"And all of a sudden I was part of this"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":882.16,"endTime":886.24,"body":"greater conversation that wouldn't even end with my higher education"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":886.24,"endTime":887.5,"body":"that is at the university."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":887.5,"endTime":890.04,"body":"I really find a community of practice so valuable."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":890.05,"endTime":892.3,"body":"I found it valuable when I was in school, and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":892.3,"endTime":894.23,"body":"I continue to find it valuable until now."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":894.25,"endTime":897.04,"body":"So that is absolutely the advice that I would give."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":898.42,"endTime":900.61,"body":"Is there anything I haven't asked you about?"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":901.09,"endTime":903.76,"body":"One thing I always found really valuable in your classes"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":904.09,"endTime":908.02,"body":"is that you each week you presented a number of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":908.02,"endTime":909.94,"body":"resources where you could do research."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":910.36,"endTime":912.88,"body":"That was something I always found valuable is just like"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":912.88,"endTime":917.08,"body":"always looking for new resources that might help you"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":917.08,"endTime":917.83,"body":"om instructional design."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":917.87,"endTime":919.54,"body":"That was probably not my class."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":920.02,"endTime":921.16,"body":"No, it was."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":921.16,"endTime":921.85,"body":"Yeah, it was."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":922.03,"endTime":925.18,"body":"You included like the hour of Oh yeah, yeah, yeah,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":925.24,"endTime":927.52,"body":"yeah, like stuff like that where it was like a"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":927.52,"endTime":930.1,"body":"page where the students had to choose, like maybe a"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":930.1,"endTime":933.07,"body":"four or five resources or skills you had till you"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":933.07,"endTime":936.13,"body":"would have to like, essentially learn like different skills."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":936.13,"endTime":937.06,"body":"So one of them?"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":937.21,"endTime":937.8,"body":"Oh yes."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":937.87,"endTime":940.45,"body":"Yeah, OK, I did that that choose your own adventure."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":940.57,"endTime":942.73,"body":"I can't even remember which class I did that in."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":943.3,"endTime":945.06,"body":"We now do technology."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":945.07,"endTime":948.01,"body":"I call it this week in Ed Tech, but I"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":948.01,"endTime":951.97,"body":"introduce ed tech that is directly related to the topic"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":951.97,"endTime":952.66,"body":"of the week."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":953.2,"endTime":956.65,"body":"For example, when we're talking about doing task analysis, I"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":956.65,"endTime":961.6,"body":"might introduce mind mapping at the same time or a"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":961.6,"endTime":963.34,"body":"flow charting or something like that."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":963.34,"endTime":967.45,"body":"So introducing tools that might support that given lesson."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":967.87,"endTime":970.54,"body":"And for me, I believe it was in the introduction"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":970.54,"endTime":974.5,"body":"class, and I thought that was really great pedagogically because"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":974.5,"endTime":977.98,"body":"in that first class, you're getting a general understanding of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":977.98,"endTime":981.31,"body":"instructional design and how it can go in many different"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":981.31,"endTime":981.79,"body":"directions."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":981.79,"endTime":986.05,"body":"You can be many different kinds of instructional designers, and"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":986.11,"endTime":989.5,"body":"based on those skills, they might be skills for subset,"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":989.5,"endTime":992.14,"body":"like a certain niche of instructional design."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":992.38,"endTime":994.54,"body":"And I find that I found that to be really"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":994.57,"endTime":998.26,"body":"helpful in guiding me down my instructional design path, like"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":998.26,"endTime":1000.81,"body":"learning the skills that I felt would be most helpful"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1000.81,"endTime":1003.51,"body":"for me, put me in the right direction that learning"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1003.51,"endTime":1004.08,"body":"how to learn."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1004.35,"endTime":1007.05,"body":"Yeah, yeah, that's a big part of 601."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1007.05,"endTime":1008.58,"body":"Actually, that's a big part of the first course in"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1008.58,"endTime":1011.7,"body":"the program, especially because a lot of students come to"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1011.7,"endTime":1013.86,"body":"it, not having been in the classroom for a long"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1013.86,"endTime":1018.6,"body":"time and never having learned online."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1018.6,"endTime":1019.8,"body":"This might have been my first online class."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1019.8,"endTime":1020.58,"body":"I'm trying to remember."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1020.61,"endTime":1021.38,"body":"I think it was."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1021.42,"endTime":1021.86,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1021.87,"endTime":1023.93,"body":"So there's a big learning curve there."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1023.94,"endTime":1026.97,"body":"I actually have a note to self every semester that"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1026.97,"endTime":1030.48,"body":"says, do not underestimate the amount of learning how to"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1030.48,"endTime":1034.47,"body":"learn that happens so I don't overload the course."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1034.589,"endTime":1037.319,"body":"Remember that there's a whole lot of that going on."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1037.319,"endTime":1039.689,"body":"I think about that quite a bit like how you"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1039.689,"endTime":1043.89,"body":"might not even understand how much learning your student is"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1043.89,"endTime":1044.67,"body":"going through."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1045.03,"endTime":1046.98,"body":"For me, I like you probably didn't know it was"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1046.98,"endTime":1048.56,"body":"like a really impactful time for me."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1048.569,"endTime":1051.3,"body":"And so, yeah, I completely agree."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1051.99,"endTime":1053.04,"body":"There's a lot going on there."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1053.64,"endTime":1055.5,"body":"We'll get to the last question, which I like to"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1055.53,"endTime":1056.84,"body":"leave everyone off with."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1056.85,"endTime":1058.98,"body":"I love this question as a last question, and that's"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1058.98,"endTime":1061.89,"body":"what's your prediction for the future of instructional design."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1063.01,"endTime":1066.04,"body":"I had mentioned before there's been a huge pickup in"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1066.13,"endTime":1070.39,"body":"online education during the pandemic, and I think it's likely"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1070.39,"endTime":1072.7,"body":"that it will continue to be a popular option that"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1072.7,"endTime":1074.13,"body":"is online education."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1074.14,"endTime":1076.66,"body":"And I feel that the future of instructional design"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1076.87,"endTime":1080.86,"body":"will focus on creating the same level or better of"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1080.86,"endTime":1085.9,"body":"social presence and community in online courses that is created"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1085.9,"endTime":1086.89,"body":"in-person classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1086.92,"endTime":1089.53,"body":"I think that's something that we really need if we"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1089.53,"endTime":1092.86,"body":"want online learning to be on the same level as"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1092.86,"endTime":1093.85,"body":"in-person learning."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1094.21,"endTime":1099.82,"body":"We really need to figure out community building and creating"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1099.82,"endTime":1103.48,"body":"that sense of social presence that sometimes just organically happens"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1103.48,"endTime":1104.35,"body":"in-person classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1104.35,"endTime":1108.31,"body":"We need to be conscious about creating that in online"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1108.31,"endTime":1108.82,"body":"classes."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1108.85,"endTime":1110.86,"body":"So I think that's going to be really important for"},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1110.86,"endTime":1111.34,"body":"the future."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1112.73,"endTime":1116.18,"body":"Thank you, Greg, for joining us on demystifying instructional design"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1116.18,"endTime":1119.66,"body":"and helping to enlighten us on what it is instructional"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1119.66,"endTime":1120.35,"body":"designers do."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1120.83,"endTime":1121.44,"body":"Thanks so much."},{"speaker":"GREG:","startTime":1121.46,"endTime":1122.9,"body":"It's been such a pleasure to be here."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1124.79,"endTime":1128.3,"body":"You've been listening to Demystifying Instructional Design, a podcast where"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1128.3,"endTime":1131.06,"body":"I interview instructional designers about what they do."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1131.66,"endTime":1133.58,"body":"I'm Rebecca Hogue, your podcast host."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1134.24,"endTime":1136.19,"body":"If you or someone you know might like to be"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1136.19,"endTime":1140.09,"body":"a guest on demystifying instructional design, please complete the Be"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1140.09,"endTime":1143.06,"body":"My guest form available on demystifying instructional design"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1143.06,"endTime":1146.63,"body":"Dot com. Show notes are posted as a blog post"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1146.63,"endTime":1148.82,"body":"on demystifying instructional design dot com."},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1149.27,"endTime":1151.64,"body":"If you enjoyed this podcast, please subscribe or leave a"},{"speaker":"REBECCA:","startTime":1151.64,"endTime":1153.53,"body":"comment in the show notes blog post."}]}