I'm Travis Bader, and this is the Silvercore Podcast.
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I'm
sitting down with Jesse Bone Jesse's with filter studios, and he said, Travis,
I've got a new movie putting it out.
It hasn't been released yet.
It's called transmission.
I'd like to watch it with you first in the studio.
And as we roll credits, we can then turn the recording on and talk about it.
So this is a very interesting movie, extremely well done.
You guys did a fantastic job putting this together.
Thank you.
It's called transmission and it talks about movie or, uh,
Michael plasma of over pneumonia.
Did I say that the
pneumonia, pneumonia, mycoplasma.
Pneumonia.
Okay.
Can you first give me a little bit of a background on yourself and
then about the movie, and we're going to talk about both of these.
Okay.
Um, yeah.
So again, well, first of all, thanks for having me here.
Um, thanks for trying something new, um, and viewing the film and, um, yeah.
Going through it this way.
Um, being.
Unprepared, I guess.
Um, and, and just kind of looking at the film and then talking about it.
So, um, background on me, um, I don't know how far back do you want to go?
Well, you're a pilot,
aren't you?
Okay.
Let's start there.
So, um, yeah, coming out of high school, I knew I was dead set on becoming a pilot.
So that was my, that was my career path.
I, uh, I was a bit of a dummy in high school and I was a C plus student.
So I, I, uh, worked extra hard and got my math up and then applied to flight
school in Abbotsford to, it was the university college of the Fraser valley.
Now UFE, um, and did, uh, worked pretty hard to get into the program.
I remember going through a big application process and interview, which was crazy,
but got in, um, for the bachelor of business administration in aviation.
And, uh, I got my pilots license there.
Um, and then, um, after that became a flight dispatcher to not become a pilot.
Um, so I got a little preview into the industry and, uh, I
was a flight dispatcher for, for awhile, for a small airline.
And I really found out that being a pilot and, uh, being away a long time
and just that lifestyle wasn't really, it wasn't really, for me, not for everybody.
Yeah.
I love flying.
Um, the, the idea of flying, you know, flying small planes is.
Is a, is a big passion.
Um, but uh, the career path didn't work out.
So I, uh, um, just kind of messed around in the lower mainland, had
a bunch of miscellaneous jobs.
And I remember I was in Ikea furniture, um, installer for a while.
That was fun out of the Ikea here in Richmond.
Um, and, uh, yeah, and then, uh, my wife and I got married and we moved
to the island and kind of put roots down there unintentionally, but
we just kind of, we call it on the island, we call it barnacle cling.
So we just barnacled on the island and, uh, haven't really, haven't really
stopped, loving it, loving living there.
It's a local island term.
Is it Barney,
Barney tickling our barnacle.
I don't know.
You just don't go anywhere because we're, we're pretty happy on the island.
So it's, uh, it's difficult to, to get us to come off of the islands.
Okay.
Um, and then, yeah, just to just kind of found fuddled around
for a little while, and then I.
After we had my son, um, I decided to, as, as we have a new baby,
decided to start a new career in my own business as a photographer.
So it was a photographer for three years, you know, started out in weddings,
got, uh, did portrait photography.
Did you have a background of that?
Or you just pick up a camera and say, I'm going to be a photographer.
That's
pretty much it learn DIY trained myself,
just watching Peter McKinnon
on the YouTube.
Again, didn't exist.
When I was starting, I was re I was like that part of that new wave of
when digital cameras started to come out, like when the, when the five D
came out, that was like, Revolutionary.
It was.
Yeah, but they also brought in, so the five D and five D mark
two brought video to the variety.
Exactly.
So you got a little flavor for video at the same time as doing
well.
I, I was pretty, I was pretty deep in the wedding photography scene.
I even hosted some, uh, some like gatherings and workshops who brought
some friends from New York, some pretty high end wedding photographers.
And the weird thing that was happening around that time was this thing called.
So it was where, um, wedding photographers or photographers are starting to roll
video clips while they were shooting.
And then they do like a slideshow and then they'd show like the bride
and the groom pictures of their first viewing, but then they'd roll
a little clip in there as well.
So it was like this like mix of videos, like an awkward stage for video and photo.
Right.
Because never had a photographer, had the ability to roll video so easily, right.
From the same camera that they could get the same pictures
from.
That was revolutionary when they came out with that.
Yeah.
So I was part of that.
And so, you know, me being a photographer, um, the way that, you know, kind of
filter started, um, Tasha and I knew each other from the photography scene.
Um, we were both on the island in an IMO and, um, I was starting to get a bunch
of clients, ask for video projects.
And then he, he was working at the news station and he was getting
a bunch of side jobs and people asking him to do side work as well.
Cause he did like, you know, the, you know, come down and pick up a car and
come down to Bob's junkyard and you know, we'd give you a car for $500
or whatever he did those commercials and it wasn't really fulfilling his
creative side, I would have thought.
Yeah.
So it, um, so yeah, it was just this, this weird time where this fusion was
happening, video and photo were melding.
And I was like, I know how to shoot photos.
I got a ton of people asking me to do video, like should, can
we work together or something?
And then we just kind of sat down and decided.
Heck let's just do it.
Let's just jump right in and start doing video.
Yeah.
I remember the day peeling, my Jesse bone photography stickers
off the side of my truck.
And, uh, and then the next, we were just all of a sudden the video
production company, your filter studios.
That's right.
Oh man.
It took us forever to find a name forever.
Well, w again, it was, um, you know, we looked at what we kind of do and
we, we kind of filter things through and we, we, cause what we really
do is take a lot on from the client and help by the translate that, or
remind them more or help build out.
Um, I don't like to say strategy, but it is a strategy to accomplish their goal.
So we kind of filter things just a little cheesy, but whatever it works, it works.
It works.
Yeah.
So that's kind of, um, how filter started and then Tasha and I, uh, Started
filter and we were a be all and end all.
We just did video production to pay the bills.
That's all, all we kind of did.
Um, and about fi I would say about six years into it.
Um, we, um, it was, it was actually kind of crazy.
We, I emailed some, some well-known people in the industry and I just said, Hey, we
have a client that said they, um, they wanted to do a feature length documentary,
not this one, a previous client.
And I'm like, can you help us?
Can you, like, I don't have a mentor.
We don't, we don't look, we don't know what to do, so we'll figure it out.
But is there anything you have to offer?
And they're like, come on down to Portland, um, we'll sit you down
for four or five days and we'll talk it through and we'll work it out.
And, um, through that, they kind of mentored us and we kind
of started a mentorship with.
But through that, um, they kind of asked us some key questions about looking
a little bit deeper into what we do.
And so we, um, you know, came back from that mentorship, um,
and just kind of evaluated.
They essentially asked us one question.
They said, what do you want your work to say, when you put the
cameras up at the end of your career?
And he said, we never thought about that.
We'd just been like heads down, grinding to pay bills.
Right.
Like we've never come up for air and said, uh, I don't know that we could pay bills
what a game changer.
So Mindshift.
Yeah.
And it was just one small question because to them, it was
like, yeah, what do you think?
And we're like, oh my gosh, we haven't even thought about that.
So then we, then we, um, we came back.
Um, Tasha and I both love to hunt and fish and be in the outdoors.
And so we said, okay, let's focus in on the hunting and fishing industry.
Cause that's, what's closest to us.
So whatever's near and dear to us can really, um, translate better as a
creative and um, those types of things.
Um, so then, so it's been about five years.
Yeah, we've been, we've been a production company for coming up on 10 years now.
So for about five, four or five years of it, um, we've really focused on doing, you
know, conservation minded work, whether that's on the ocean or the mountains.
Um, and it's just translated into doing more meaningful, uh, more
passion-driven work, which depending on the goal, but most, most, uh,
most clients want that kind of thing.
Does that pay the bills?
That's the, that's the golden question.
Um, and that's, that's the waters you're navigating, right?
So.
Yeah, it doesn't fully pay the bills, but we're getting close.
Right.
It's um, just because, especially when you deal with the nonprofit
world, which is a lot of what these are, and you just have to put your
passion first and know things that will kind of work out towards the end.
So
the universal and folders, it should.
Yes, exactly.
You know, I honestly do believe that if you put whatever your goal is,
make it a worthwhile goal, make it something that's worthwhile to you
and he make that your guiding light, your north star, everything else will
figure itself out in the process.
If you're worrying too much about, is that going to pay the bills and
make that your motivator and make that your driving light, you're
going to lose art in the passion.
And you're probably not going to have the money that you're chasing anyways.
You're going to be behind that.
Yeah.
It's so true.
And it's such a, I think an underrated mentality.
Um, towards, especially self-employment, uh, creative self-employment is like
grind yourself into a pulp and try to get the job done and put it out
there.
Well, you start setting boundaries, both for yourself and for your
clients boundaries as to what you will do where you'll go or, uh, sure.
The money's good, but is this something I really think is going to be worthwhile?
Will I feel good about myself after I finish this or yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
And.
Uh, you know, I, I did a podcast with, uh, Lucas Hogue.
He's a country music star, and he's talking about a very similar concept.
He's been very successful with what he's done.
He says, you know, P people come up and they want me to do a, B or C.
They'll say, I want, can you give me a hundred grand?
We've got this big thing that we're, we're putting together.
We need some donations.
He says, no, but I have some talents and I can lend my talents to you.
And through that, we can build, we can grow some revenue for you.
We can build something for you, but he's making so many, both personal
and business connections and he's doing something he truly loves.
And it sounds like.
A very similar sort of thing.
You're looking at what it is that you love to do, and you're surrounding
yourself with other like-minded people.
Yeah.
That's key.
And, and a big thing that, um, a few years ago, Tasha and I really,
um, as a company and as, I mean, we spend so much time together.
My wife always, um, jokes, you know, when I say, oh, we're going to this place.
Oh, we, we were going to Haiti for it.
I'm like, oh, we're going to Haiti.
And she's like, we're going to hit.
I I'm like, oh no.
I mean, Tasha and I, and she always jokes and says, I remember when we was us.
So we'd spent a lot of time together and we've kind of.
Grown a lot.
We've made like, like we started hunting again at the same time
together and kind of grew into that.
Um, but it's, uh, yeah, it's just, it's been, uh, a crazy evolution.
So you're now marrying your passion for the outdoors and for
hunting and fishing with your work.
You've been doing that for, so you've been doing the work on
the video side for 10 years.
How long have you been doing the mostly outdoors?
Yeah, that's probably been about, uh, Five solid years of that,
of really putting, putting out.
I mean, we still have corporate work that we do, or you know, that we have
to, I mean, we still have bills to pay, so, and it's, it's not like I'm doing
nonprofit work, pays all the bills and pays some bills, but not all of them.
So there's, there's other stuff that we do, um, along the way, but we've
really tried to highlight this as the work that we want to do and, and
for good reason, because it means something and therefore the work can do.
And it's, it's honestly, um, When you get to do stuff that you're passionate about.
And I mean, you're creative as well.
You know that when, when you have, um, you know, when you get back from a shoot and
you know, that you just loved the images so much, you're in there, you're starring,
you're like, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
Quick edit.
Oh yeah.
It does look like you're just energized by it.
Totally.
So it's the same thing on, on a, on a, on a bigger scale when you're dealing
with, you know, film, production and stuff, that means something to you.
Um, and, and it kind of has these energizing moments along the way.
So it's an issue that you're passionate about, but then all of a sudden,
somebody that is also passionate about an issue, but then they also let you
in, into their inner circle and share their story and share their passions.
Then it's just, oh, there's another level of engagement and like of,
of, of how it just touches to your core and a different level.
Um, and it energizes.
That's why I started this Silvercore Podcast, so people can
share their passion with others and for my own selfish reasons.
So I can share that as well.
Right.
Because that's, it's, it's infectious.
It's contagious.
Yeah.
But do you find, do you find that having the camera with you outdoors takes you
out of the outdoors that you love so much?
Yeah.
I think that's a maturing process.
Um, there's, there's, it's like a.
It evolves.
I think in my, in my like, best way to put it, um, yes, there's been like a
big thing that we did to start was we do a lot of productions and fishing,
lots of we're on the river all the time.
Um, I remember we were up fishing on the Nass river
filming a steelhead fishing show.
Um, and, um, I was like desperate to just, can I just grab the rod?
And, um, up here there's like steel head, the size of Chinook salmon up here.
Like it's just amazing.
Um, and it was like four or five days and.
It does get in the way a bit, but you're also like grad, you have gratitude and
thankfulness that you are where you are and you're getting paid to be there.
Sure.
Um, and, and again, it's, it's a mix of, in my mind, just putting
yourself in a different mode, like, okay, I'm here to shoot this.
I'm not here to get, you know, I'll get what I can out of it by
doing a good job shooting this.
Uh, I'm not gonna be like bummed out or, you know, I'm not gonna sacrifice
getting the shot because I'm like, oh, just put the camera down for a minute
and I'll just go, you know, float one, one, swing, one fly over here.
Um, and then meanwhile, you know, the guy gets a fish on and you
missed the shot or whatever.
It's like, I'm in this mode.
Just be grateful for what you can get.
So this movie that you just did, how long did it take you to do?
Ah, that's the, actually the funny one about it, let's
start at the beginning.
Like how you got into it.
Like you're interested in that.
So, yeah, it, it all started back in, I think it's June of 2019, um,
where, uh, Sabrina from the wild sheep society BC contacted us through,
I think, a mutual contact, um, in the industry and just said, Hey, we
have this, um, issue that's going on and we want to do a film about it.
We don't know what the film is.
We don't know what all we want to do.
The main goal is to raise awareness about this, uh, disease
mycoplasma over pneumonia.
Um, and so we just dug in and we just learned about it.
Um, there was, um, like when the, the farmers moved down, um, we just went and
shot some stuff cause we didn't know.
So we did this big discovery mission along the way of just like learning
what the real issues are, learning what, um, this disease is and how it works.
Uh, and so, um, back then, yeah, the society.
We need to raise awareness of this.
That's our number one goal is to raise awareness, but it
needs to be a balanced message.
It can't, can't say hunters are blaming farmers or vice versa.
We need to just lay this out there as it's an issue that we can all collaborate
with and we can all deal with at the same time when we're supporting each other.
So.
Some time working on us.
You and I just watched a movie.
The listeners might not know what movie is.
Yes.
Well, I mean, that's, that's the whole point of, of what the film is.
So mycoplasma over pneumonia or movie for short is, uh, as a bacteria.
So it's a bacteria that, um, originates in domestic sheep, um, and domestic
sheep for thousands of years have been in close contact with each other.
Um, they've learned and learn.
I don't know if they've learned, but they've evolved and kind of, uh, grown
with this bacteria and can live with it.
Um, the issue that happens and it's similar to, you know, how we
were dealing with COVID, um, is that it's spread through droplets.
So, so nose to nose, contact or sneezing or sharing grazing grounds, grazing.
Grazing grounds.
Yeah, that's right.
Graze grows
brows on it's always remember grease stuff grows, browsing branches.
Oh good.
I like that.
I can't remember that.
C PhD learning tips.
So you have a flock of domestic sheep, um, in, and this is where it really, um,
comes into contention is when they're in big horn range, like the Coutnies
and like the Fraser river systems, um, all of these where there's populations
of people and that kind of overlap with where typically big horn ranges are.
There are some thin horn overlaps up north and stuff like that, but yeah,
it's mainly, it's mainly a big horn thing maze, basically, just because of
the density and the close proximity.
Mainly when the, when the user in estrus during the rut, um, the big horns, which
will also be around because there's really good grass and grazing, um, food all over
where domestic sheep are, but specifically when they're in estrus and when the ruts
happening, the Rams will come in and they'll send the use sometimes even mate.
Um, and so that's where the contact happens.
That's where domestic sheep and wild sheep will, um, either sneeze or like I said,
share grazing, um, spots and, um, uh, you know, actually physically touch noses
because they're checking each other out.
Um, and that's where those droplets are transmitted.
That's where the bacteria goes from domestic sheep to wild sheep.
And then essentially the wild sheep just don't have the immune
system to deal with that bacteria.
Um, and it typically leads to a pneumonia.
Now there are a lot of, um, mature.
Uh, Rams and use of wild sheep that can, um, live with it for a while.
Some can't live with it and are dead quickly.
Um, but the big concern, the big evidence that they see on
the ground is a lamb production.
So a mom will, will have the bacteria and be living with it, but
constantly shedding it from the nose.
So when she has that lamb and sheds the back too, because I mean,
they're licking and nosing their lambs, especially when they're born.
So a newborn lamb that gets this bacteria, and then that bacteria
usually leads to some sort of infectious disease, which is most common.
The most common one is, uh, pneumonia.
Um, and then.
No two week old lamb with pneumonia doesn't last too long.
Um, no,
there's up there.
What were they saying?
Six to eight weeks was sort of the average expectancy of any
lamb for, from a U that has movie.
Exactly.
So that's one of the, that's one of the key signs that they see
on the landscape is they'll see herds with no lambs coming through.
So, uh, when they go for their lamb counts, if they see very little land
production or zero land production, which is, you know, one of the, the, the herd
that we talked about in the film they've there were two years with zero lambs or
three years previous, um, zero lamps.
They've been counting them.
So there's a big alarm bells going off like, okay, these lambs aren't surviving.
Um, and there there's probably multiple factors, but you know,
the fact that zero lambs are surviving is, is cause for concern.
So you started this pre COVID when you started
the felony.
Yes, exactly.
So we, we started, um, basically did our first filming 20 the fall
end of summer and fall of 2019.
And then, um, had a plan of the film.
We were out filming it and then COVID hit.
Um, and then we had to, you know, a lot of our, um, initial plan
was we were doing door knocking.
We were going in people's houses, you know, stuff like that.
And you just couldn't, you couldn't even approach with COVID.
Um, so we just had to just kind of roll with it, you know?
Um, and thankfully the society was very patient and they, they, they
told us from the start, make it good.
Don't worry.
We'll work through these delays.
We'll work through these other issues.
Just make it good.
We need to tell the right story.
That's how important this issue is and how important it is
to raise awareness about it.
So, uh, we, I mean, we had like, you know, COVID had a little
bit of a break and everybody was kind of okay with it for a bit.
So we did a little bit more filming and essentially my job was to just constantly
be communicating with people and like gauging comfort levels and, oh, well, this
person's comfortable to shoot outside, so let's go get this scene shot or whatever.
And, um, but, uh, then we finally, um, got most of it done towards the
end of COVID and then for the past, uh, for the past six, seven months,
um, has been just solid postpartum.
Just full.
Like my partner Tash is the lead editor.
He's a, he's a wizard at editing.
Um, and I essentially locked him in his editing room since October.
And
basically just him doing all the other thing.
No.
Well, it's a close collaboration with him and Dan, our director.
So Dan Minsky's the director, he's an amazing writer.
He's an amazing director.
He was, you know, you can see him in the film when he's drinking
and she runs the interviews.
Um, he's like, uh, um, I've said this before, but I'll say it again.
He's like a drill bit when we need to get to the core of something Dan comes
out and then he can go right to the core.
He is a really, it's a, it's a, it's a very good talent and it
helps translate that film into.
Something that's actually the core and the deep meaning that it needs to be.
Um, so, um, so it's essentially Dan and Tash, um, working in
the editing room for months.
And, um, Dan being the director, he helped, uh, he basically is a, it turns
into a story editor once we get into post-production and helps direct hash
on, okay, we need to put this part here, this part here, and then Tash will build
the scene and then they'll look at it and revise it and revise it and revise it.
And it's just been essentially Tash and him and editing for six to eight weeks.
So I'm watching the production.
It looks flawless.
Looks fantastic.
What are you thinking who, and we're watching it the side from
one of our cameras or one of our screens here having a bit of leg
in it.
Yeah.
Well, that's, you know, as I want it to be presented well, so that's, that's my
main thing when I, when I present it, um, I've seen it so many times, um, to Ashton
Dan, like all of us have seen it so many times there've been so many revisions and
so many iterations of, of how it's going.
So I'm, I'm curious to see what, how it's going to be received by people.
Um, we just had our, um, cast and crew screening where we had, um, the majority
of our cast out and everything, and we're just, we're able to share it.
And thankfully, most of our, um, cast and crew, it was our first time seeing it.
And so it was, uh, it was super, it was pretty emotional.
Um, but it was, it was great to see that validation from people,
um, about the messaging and how we've put it together and how we've
crafted it because it's a very.
Delicate subject.
And in the conservation world, we talk all the time that we need to, um, share
the message you want me as hunting and fishing, uh, people, um, when we come
back from those adventures, we always talk about how there's that, like that thing
that we can't quite explain, like, there's that like feeling, you know, when you step
out, when you, when you go hunting, you take that first step into the Bush and
you're like, Ooh, there's a magic here.
Ineffable feeling.
Yes, exactly.
So we talk about that.
So we're, we're.
So as a, as a film production company, we've always been trying to
explain that, uh, to people and to, to try to convey that it's not easy.
It's one of the most difficult things ever.
Um, this one because of the client, because of the time, because of the
story, because of the characters we have in there, we feel like it finally helps
relay some of that emotion that needs to be relayed in this conservation space,
because in conservation there's no black.
It's all gray, it's all nuance.
It's all about just sitting down and having these meaningful conversations.
And maybe you have that conversation and don't draw a conclusion out of it,
but you have to have those conversations and they need to be at that deep level.
It's V there's so many different factors with all of these things.
So that's why it was, that's why we did the film, the way that
we did that, it's emotional.
And it, it is, it goes to those right places, um, that we need to for,
for conservation, because as, as you know, conservation is worth it and it
deserves, um, these kinds of things.
It's,
it's a difficult dichotomy because they talk about.
It shouldn't be based on science.
There should be no emotion.
You shouldn't be basing your opinions on emotion, but in order for people
to care, to begin with, to look at the science and look at what solutions could
be, there has to be some emotional tug.
They have to care.
Well, that's the thing is, is we're human beings.
Like we are emotional beings.
Um, in a, as a kind of ethos of storytelling that we do is, um, you know,
there are, we love animals and there's lots of things that people connect to.
People will connect to us in the wild sheep society, connect to sheep very
deeply because we care about wild sheep.
Um, other people connect to other animals, but at the core being, we all connect
to people most above anything else.
And that's because we're emotional motive, people and human beings.
And so that needs to be.
A big part of it.
The, the, the problem is, is that we think emotion is just B is just this
one thing, but it's not it's war.
It's like a marbled swirl into everything that we do and how we exist.
So it's, it is part of the conversation.
It's just, this whole conversation is more complicated than just, oh,
I understand this in this, right.
Yeah.
So,
and you know, I'm, I'm, I'm looking at, it's an interesting idea too.
So you're, you're telling the emotional connection with the
wildlife and the outdoors.
But you're using people as the catalyst or is the carrier here too?
Yeah.
That's well, that's, that's the big thing is there's really no secret to what we do.
Um, in film is we just, we look at these situations and go through these, um,
scenarios and these conversations and these complications through people's eyes.
And if you can see through people's eyes and you can connect in that human,
and then that's the same as when we talking in like hunting and fishing
trips, when we're like, oh, that connection that I can't quite explain.
Right.
It's that same kind of, uh, emotional connection.
A lot of people are scared of their emotions.
So
you funny how that is, even though that's such a big part of how we interact
and why we make our decisions, how we respond to things and how we just,
what formulates our thought processes.
Oh, emotional based.
Yeah.
People try to divorce, see emotion from the intellectual side of things.
Really you're right.
It is a marbled sort of a marble quagmire.
Interesting.
So there with this movie, you didn't make this movie for
hunters necessarily you, yes,
that's correct.
That's the, so one of the big things that we, it was mainly our
D the direction from the society.
They said, we need to, um, share this with, uh, domestic sheep producers.
One of the things we've been battling movie, especially in
the states for a long time.
And the typical process with battling mobi is removing it out of the wild sheep
population so that it can stop that cycle, stop that spread so that the moms can
pass it onto their, um, lambs, moms, or use can't pass it onto their, um, lambs.
And then they stop that cycle.
So it's usually a calling, you're calling out the wild sheep, the positive sheep.
Um, and that's how we've kind of dealt with a movie on the landscape.
Um, the new thing that's that, that we're working on now is, um, and what Helen's
kind of going through in this story is potentially, um, creating science that can
study if we can remove it from the source, because if you remove it from the source.
And you don't have to worry about keeping them separate.
You don't have to build these fences.
You don't have to worry about separation as much as you do now.
Um, so that's, that's the big, vague, um, thing with that we're
kind of talking about in this
story.
So separation requires.
A hundred percent and that's right now, the best cure for all of
this is let's keep them separated.
Right? Yeah.
It's like the, yeah.
Well, and that's the big thing is, um, you know, I spent, I spent
a lot of time with Jeremy from the BC sheep separation program.
Um, and he's essentially that outreach tool.
So he'll go to farmers and say, Hey, do you know that domestic sheep have this
bacteria called mycoplasma pneumonia?
And that it's a potential deadly, um, can be a deadly
disease passed onto wild sheep.
And for the most.
People are like, I had no idea, uh, willing to help.
Um, but there also are a lot of people that just say, get off my land.
Don't tell me what to do.
So it's a delicate thing to, uh, communicate and it
usually stops at the wallet.
So if we say, okay, well, these are the suggested ways that you can keep
your sheep separate, but you know, building a, you know, 16 foot double
fence is not really something that someone's willing to do for free.
Yeah.
So enter wild sheep society, BC, where they've stepped up
and said, okay, that's good.
You find.
Well, raise money will buy those fences.
So they've actually spent, you know, 50, $60,000 on fence lines.
So they install these fences on these farms, but then, you know, what's, and it
has happened on farms where a farmer will be like, oh, I don't want cheap anymore.
And so they spend this money on these, these fence fences and a year later, the
farmers like, oh no, I sold my sheep.
Great. That's not, and it's not the fix, right?
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, it's a bandaid, it's a bandaid.
Exactly.
So the, the, the potential excitement throughout everyone that, that we've
talked to with all the wildlife biologists is, you know, if we can eliminate
it from the source that changes the game, that changes the game that a lot
of people have been at for a lot of
years,
because right now, if I understand this correctly, if I was paying
attention properly, there is no mandatory regulated or legislation.
Uh, testing on importing of the, uh, domestic sheep of owning
domestic sheep for, for movie.
Yeah.
That's, it's not even a part of the conversation.
And I think one of the people is saying, you know, we need more than legislation.
We need policy.
So legislation is basically the teeth that the government creates to enforce
policy, but policy would have the sort of systemic buy-in from interested
parties and groups from the people.
And it's created by all of them, including the government.
So I guess what the individual's saying is he wants, he wants a
Mo uh, a fundamental shift in how people approach us to be normalized.
Right.
And that's where I see this film as having some really good power because.
When you're talking about telling the story, telling the story through
other people's eyes, there's a fundamental principle in rhetoric
and in philosophy called charity.
And essentially, I guess, more the archaic term with charity
relates to love as opposed to giving money to, to other people.
And, uh, in rhetoric and philosophy, they say somebody says something that
you don't see eye to eye with either it's not even on your radar or you
don't agree, completely disagree.
Try and think about it from the most charitable position, putting it in the
strongest possible position on their side and see how it stands up to analysis.
And that way you can kind of recalibrate where you're coming from.
If all of a sudden you hold a particular belief and you've now used
this principle of charity, and you're looking at it from the other side and
you say, well, I can see their point.
I can see their background that allows you to recalibrate your approach.
Right?
And likewise, if you say, no, my, my position doesn't change.
If anything has gotten stronger, it allows you, it gives you the, uh, the,
sort of the roadmap, your mental roadmap of how you continue to comport yourself.
And that's what I see you doing in this, by introducing the.
Uh, characters as you call them, right?
These are people, this isn't a play, but by introducing the different characters
and perspectives, you get a real good opportunity to look at it from actual
stakeholders, different indigenous groups, uh, conservation officers, farmers, uh,
scientists, biologists, um, the, uh,
hunters.
Yep.
Yeah, exactly.
And that's why presentation and the way it's crafted was so important.
And that's why it took us so long to make this film and especially in
post-production and, and because it was such a delicate issue that has to be
presented properly, because if you present that in a different way, if you say,
um, Hey farmers, this is what's wrong.
This is really important.
You need to do this, this, this, this, this, because it's
causing real impacts on the land.
Um, we're saying that.
But we're not saying it's your fault, right?
We're not saying this is your fault.
How dare you?
We're saying listen.
Like, and, and, and it's evident with the people we've talked to people we've
worked with in the film and the more people we talk to, and that's the whole
point of this, this film is to have those conversations to say, it's not your fault.
It's not anyone's fault, but this is what's actually happening.
And it's really serious.
So define really serious.
I heard a number about
90%.
Yeah.
So, um, I have an example of a, of a herd.
I was talking with, um, Chris Proctor, who's our senior wildlife biologist.
He's, he's been the main movie, um, uh, biologist on the Fraser herd.
Um, and he was telling me about a herd that, um, they've tested.
Um, it was a herd of around 200.
And within, um, a year and they, they tested, um, uh, uh, from the necrosis
she's so they could, they could test actually the strain of movie.
Um, just like, um, uh, COVID there's different strains, same with this.
So that.
Not necessarily that they have them all categorized and they know what
they all are, but at least they know like, okay, this strain is, this is
a single strain that killed off this many sheep, which could in theory,
say that came from one source.
So one farmer, one exposure.
Um, and this herd in, um, I believe it's been about three years.
Uh, they were at 200 now they're now at 11 sheep from one senior trained
one single strain of, uh, of movie, which we're not saying that it is, but
potentially that's from one exposure.
Sure.
So it's, it's similar to influenza and smallpox.
When, you know, Europeans came where, you know, the other population doesn't
have the immune system live with it and that's how rampant it just spreads.
So if domestic sheep have Mojave and they're able to kind of live with
it, Is that something that would be of concern for the domestic farmers?
Like, does it change the taste of the meat?
Is it going to change the life cycle of that animal to being
subbed up optimal for profit?
Yeah. Yeah.
Well, that's interesting because what we discovered along the way, and as
the, kind of the farm we were working with discovered as well along the way is
that movie's actually more detrimental to their herd than they thought.
So having their domestic sheep movie positive, um, actually they've
been seeing significant die-offs within their domestic flock.
There was another, so, um, we follow Helen along her trial, um, with one farm,
she actually did another farm in BC and that farm almost lost their entire flock
from a domestic sheep farm from movie.
Wow.
Thankfully with treatment and eliminating movie out of the herd.
I heard flock heard wild flock domestic.
I keep those mixed up.
Um, and now her flocks bounce back and they're healthy.
So there's a lot of complications that it's even, uh, that domestic farmers
are finding out that, you know, having rampant Mojave within their domestic
sheep is actually causing detrimental, um, a detrimental impact on their flock.
And, and you know, a lot of, um, these sheep are not necessarily a lot of the
sheep that we've kind of done or for wool production, which is, you know, you
want more and you want good quality wool.
So even Moby positive, um, sheep, their wool production is weak.
So they produce wall, but it's very thin and it's, it's pretty much sheared off and
putting the compost bin is interesting.
So there's, there's, there's detrimental impacts for the domestic world as
well.
So that, that creates policy buy-in as well, even if it's
just talking to the pocketbook.
Yeah.
And in order to treat them, we're watching, it's what a five day process
currently there is nasal flushes, which looked just delicious where they're
injections as well.
Yeah.
So there was an injection and a nasal flush.
And so this, and this is just, it's interesting getting to learn about,
um, Helen and doing her trial.
Um, I feel for her because what, she, she's a scientist trying to
produce a paper that says this either works or this doesn't work.
Right.
But she going down that path to just create the science, to say it works or
doesn't work, she's getting roadblock after roadblock, whether that's
funding, whether that's politics, whether that's people's step stepping
in and saying, oh, this isn't right.
You shouldn't be doing this.
And she's just like, whether it's right or wrong, I need to see this through to the
end so that we can determine if it is yes.
A viable solution or not.
Um, yeah.
Yeah.
That's I I'd say that's difficult because so often I find that
people look at solutions.
Without looking at what the actual problem is, or the level of impact
on it, because yes, they might be correct in their solution.
Their solution can work and the solution is worthwhile for that problem.
But where does that problem stack up against what what's the buy-in
from the scientific community?
What's the emotional buy-in from the public.
I mean, there's some important things out there that people just don't care about.
Right. Because they just don't know.
And that's where having these conversations here on the podcast,
having these videos out is, uh, helps reach more people and at
least puts them on the radar.
Like somebody in the UK might turn around and say, what do I care about wild sheep.
Yeah.
Well, that's, it's, uh, you know, when we talk about, you know, having movie
free flocks and, and, you know, kind of testing animals, and we talk about, you
know, the, the biggest issue is like, oh, uh, she only domestic sheep that
are within range of wild sheep are a concern, but then you have the idea of.
Um, the farmer that we, that we, that was in our film, they got
movie into their head because they imported a sheet from Ontario.
There's no mandatory testing.
There's nothing like that.
So someone on the island say where there's no sheep sells a sheep to, um, a
farmer in Kamloops where there are sheep.
They don't care.
They don't care about movie or don't want them, them to be tested or whatever.
All of a sudden, the import of sheep unknowingly into sheep range
and that's where things can happen.
So, so
I had two questions that kind of popped up into my mind, which
he might not know the answer to.
Maybe, maybe I should ask him okay with that.
But first one was, we watched Helen and her team go through and, uh,
treat these sheep and had a massive reduction of movie after putting the,
uh, the nasal flush and the injections.
Can they be reinfected?
Well, yeah, that's the complicated thing.
It can be for sure.
It can happen at any point.
And it will, unless there's policy and there's a process in place of if,
uh, if a sheep is coming into a flock, um, or you're buying a sheep from
otherwise, they have to be tested.
So as Jeremy said in the film is like, yeah, you can have sheep wherever
you want, but let's just make sure they're, you know, free of this
deadly disease that, that affects wild populations on a very serious level.
Um, so yes, reinfection can happen and it can, and I mean, but I don't want to speak
out of turn because we're getting into a bit of science and stuff from right.
From what I understand it can reoccur and it can happen.
So.
That's that's, that's the thing, as we're getting into a world of like
unknown and development, so we need to be patient and we need to like, uh,
just, just go along with what the science is saying and that, which science, I'm
not going to try to define science, but science is constantly evaluating
and reassessing trust the science.
Come on.
Trust the science it's in stone here.
Exactly.
That's not science.
No, that's not exactly.
That's exactly not science.
It's the exact opposite of science, right?
Yeah, exactly.
I guess the other one was okay for the wild sheep.
There was a, uh, a capture and test process, and that was a pretty cool to
see, pretty cool to watch a lot of hard work and people that, um, big hearts.
Now, obviously, if you capture one that has movie it's out in the wild,
if we don't have some sort of a cure for it, your only other option is.
To put that animal down to euthanize it.
Now what's the stop.
The sheep that are being, let go that have been tested as negative from now
being handled by humans who have touched movie positive sheep and being, let go.
Is that
transmission like that?
I mean, like during the capturing call events, everything's
very, um, clean steroidal.
So there, you know, everybody there is designed it's, it's, it's a design
process to not transmit from, you know, for handling a wild sheep and, you know,
working around there knows that we're not going to cross-contaminate sheep.
Um, so during that event, it was.
Scientific.
It was very kind of, it was basically a lab in the field.
So, um, it was a very, you know, Helen was the lead on that and
she was very, um, let's see.
Amazing thing about Helen is that, um, she's an amazing leader.
Um, but she can, she can also be a bit of a goofball, um, you know, and, but people
follow her, uh, like when, when she says this goes this way, everybody says, yes.
You know, like it's just, it's, she's just so well-respected
because she knows what she's doing.
And because she knows how to, how to basically command a group in
a very respectful, meaningful way to get everybody on board, which
is the definition of a leader.
Good leader.
Right. So,
yeah, leadership's the art of influencing human behavior.
So as to accomplish a mission in the manner, so desired
by the leader, there you go,
here you go.
That's kind of said it better myself.
I couldn't have said it like that.
Um, but.
Th so, so that's, but that's the crazy thing when, like, when I was getting
into this, when you're having these conversations with biologists, I'm
like, okay, well then, you know, we, we capture and call, we call out all
the positive sheep what's to say that a farmer just doesn't bring in some
sheep and then they're exposed again.
He's like, nothing says that, like that could happen.
Right.
That's what we're dealing with on the lens.
So, again, it's not to say that it's all domestic sheep or domestic farmers
problem or issue and they're to blame, but it's just to say, if everyone was
aware of this and knew, and we tested animals to know if I bought, even if
they're Mo movie positive, you know, to isolate them or, you know, to
keep them out of, um, sheep brains.
So if an island, uh, domestic farmer on the island has Mo mobi positive sheep,
we're not saying you have to have them all treated and, and, and done, but
like don't sell that cheap to a, um, a big horn range or, or a thin horn
range farm, you know, like, just be aware of, of what's going on and the
impacts that it could be it's avoidable.
And as one person said, it's absolutely avoidable in the movie there.
Exactly.
Interesting.
So when does
the movie come out?
Yeah, that's the golden question.
So that's, that's what we're doing.
Um, and thankfully the society is on board with it.
As they're doing this a little more unique because the goal is
to have engagement beyond our hunting conservation echo chamber.
Echos pretty, pretty loudly.
You know, we, we speak to each other a lot.
Um, so we want to reach beyond that.
So actually one of the things that they really asked us to do was to go after
film festivals, because that has potential to then reach outside and go beyond.
And we really did.
We did a conscious decision to focus on the human element of this, of this
whole story so that it can reach beyond.
So we're going through the festival circuit, which typically happens in
the fall and winter, and right now as the application process for festivals.
So it's basically just getting submitted, nonstop, the festivals fun.
Yeah.
And so, but instead of it just being on lockdown until festivals come out, um,
we're going to do a private tour events throughout the kind of spring and summer.
So, um, on the website movie, free.org, we're going to be releasing
kind of the event dates and, and where we're going to host it.
Um, and the first screening, which is a wild sheep society
of BC membership only event.
Um, but it's in prince George and April 23rd.
Um, it's horn aging with bill jacks.
And then at the same time, um, what we're going to do horn aging, I think
things start around two o'clock and then in the evening we're going to
have dinner and watch the movie.
So that's kind of our very first like public, uh, kind of
members only screening, right.
Um, but then like, basically we're just securing locations and dates,
um, through the spring and summer, um, all to be announced, uh, because
things are being secured, so yeah.
So who do you most want to get this message in front of?
Um, it's the farming community.
That's who we're, that's who we're, um, that we want to,
that's what we want to watch it.
Um, it's so four H clubs.
Um, that's a big one.
Um, anyone in agriculture, um, fall fair events, uh, stuff like that.
Anybody that's that's deals with the agriculture industry or
farming or, or anything like that.
That's our target audience.
So we're not, we're not speaking to.
W we are speaking to the hunting community, but everybody, I think
in the hunting community is going to understand and love this message.
And we're not going to have a difficult time.
So we're really going after the domestic sheep producers,
that's our target audience.
Interesting.
So what could people listening to this podcast do to help
get that message further?
If the video's only going to be shown in a few private places?
Well, I mean, that's the thing, like it's still, we we're, we're, we're not trying
to, um, be a blocker and we're not trying to be a roadblock to, you know, oh, this
is exclusive, but what we're trying to do, and it's kind of worked out well that.
Right now, I think everybody is craving getting out and doing
things and going to events.
So, um, by having these screener events, we can, we can put seats in,
uh, in the, I don't want to say it's going to be a theater, but other, that
location that the filming's at, and the main goal from that is that we
have people like we're doing right now.
We watched the film and now we're talking about this issue and we're
talking and raising awareness about it so we can show the film and then
we can have, um, you know, in certain locations we'll bring people out
that were in the film and we have a meaningful discussion about what's next.
And what's going, going on moving forward and, and just help solidify
and clarify, um, what this issue is and what they can do about it.
So let's say.
The universe unfolds as a shed, everything happens in a way where it's, uh, it
gets the message out and people become aware of movie and steps are taken
to introduce policy and legislation.
So it can be either a radicating or properly controlled.
Um, what's next?
Well, the, the big plan or, or what's happening is that the
movie is still in the landscape.
You know, if everything by tomorrow, the, the switch flipped and now we're,
we're, we're working on, you know, treating and basically creating a
movie free domestic population movies already, still on the landscape.
So there's a lot of work to be done.
And the, you know, as we highlighted in the Fraser river
system, there's a lot of work.
There's a lot of sheep there and it's very rampant throughout the entire system.
Um, so there's a lot of work on the landscape.
It's still needs to be done, done to, to eliminate that from the landscape.
Um, moving forward, I think.
It's it's about, um, not bringing those preconceived ideas into conversations,
but being open and collaborative on, on, on working towards the same kind
of goal of, you know, making sure that we have healthy domestic sheep
and we have a healthy, uh, wild sheep population, um, out on the landscape.
So, well, again, like we've kind of talked about how these con con
conservation conversations, oh, that's a,
that's a good one.
It's like say Irish wristwatch
attempt that, but it's about, um, just knowing that we're working on this
together, it's not like, okay, it's fixed, boom, move on to the next one.
It's like, okay.
Yeah, it's still complicated and there's still, and now there's
going to be people turnover.
And then we're going to probably deal with a new government essentially.
Um, at some point, you know, a new ministry will come in and,
you know, so we just have to be collaborative and work together on it.
Yeah, well, having that conversation, getting, keeping it open and open
to critical review because maybe somebody turns around and says,
no, there's a completely different approach that we can be taking.
Right.
But that doesn't happen without having the conversation 100%, but it
also raises a level of awareness for just caring for what's happening.
And the impact that we have is humans by sticking our finger in the bowl
of water and not expecting to see ripples because there will be ripples.
We've had our fingers in the water for a long
time, so long that now we have to make the, uh, the difficult decisions of
if we take our finger out completely, what effects are we going to have?
Right, right.
Yeah.
That's a good, and you know, Shane Mahoney said, well, I thought he says, um, uh,
you know, people have this idea about there's us in those, the animals, and that
somehow we have dominion over the animal.
That's not the question.
It's we are an animal and we are just so much a part of this
earth as they are a part of it.
And we work with them and they work with us.
So finding a way to be able to, like I say, stick the finger in the water.
I was Steven MacGyver and he's a biologist and regulatory.
Sorry, you said, um, analyst to regulation analyst and oh yeah.
Uh, oh, I'm going to get myself in trouble.
Anyways.
He's a smart guy works for, he works for the provincial government here.
And, uh, he was talking about, uh, the impact of let's say, just bear
hunting on, in the high-tech Y and when Leh was introduced, they were
looking at the numbers of bears that were being taken out of there.
And it was, you know, not many at all, but a second they introduced Leh.
Put it on the radar, they're looking at like 200 applications coming through.
Like everybody kind of wanted to go in and hunt bears and on the high
Dugway, the second that they raise the awareness that, Hey, maybe there's
this bear hunting app right here.
Yeah.
So, uh, that was an unintended consequence of, um, enacting
some policy and legislation.
I guess the other side of this is.
There is a possibility of bringing in everyone saying,
holy Crow, look at these sheep.
I better get to them before they're gone.
Right.
I better come out of talking to a friend in, in the U S he was like, man, you have
a general open season for sheep up there.
That's insane.
Right?
Yeah.
Um, all of a sudden having an unintended consequence of people
rushing to, um, to, to fill that.
Yeah.
Interesting.
Wow, man, if we want to get into
it, it's a rabbit hole, but it's just sort of a side aside thought on, on
just trying to navigate how we conduct ourselves as people who love the
outdoors and love the wildlife and how we have these conversations, uh,
in a way that will affect a positive
repercussion.
Yeah.
And I think that's, that's a big message.
Um, we're trying to cultivate and kind of show is that it, it takes this
conversation and it takes, it does take emotion as much as most people
don't want to touch on their emotions.
If you cry in this film, which a lot of people do, that's completely okay.
You don't have to suck that tear back in, just let it flow.
It's human.
You know, we are humans, we are emotion, right?
So, um, the delicate balance is, you know, emotions also go the other
way when we get frustrated and when we get angry and when we get up.
So it's like, we're emotional beings.
We're allowed to get upset.
We're allowed to get angry.
We're allowed to get emotional.
It's just about how you deal with that and how you kind of
cultivate those situations.
So, yeah.
Is there anything else we should be talking about before we look
at wrapping things up here,
man, I think we got it.
Like we we've talked about the film.
I was kind of in my head thinking about, okay, well one, but, and you're good at
this, you know, you know, when to queue and winter asked the right question, so
I'm still figuring it out.
I die every, everyone's a learning, a learning experience,
each person, each one.
It's a, but
it's fun.
That's good.
This is a bit of like what we do in film too, as we kind of.
Have these little houses I was saying before, when somebody kind of lets you
into the circle and you get to know them, it's a little energizing and
it's, these are like a pressure cooker of, of that, where you can sit down
and get to know someone and have these kind of the, like coming into this.
I didn't know, or how, I didn't know how our conversation would go or where we
go, but man, we went to some, some great places that are meaningful and, and, uh,
it's a symbol of all.
He was a past podcast guests.
He says, you know, meaningful conversations with meaningful
people just absolutely love it.
And all I really knew about you was that you were the, a recent
recipient of the Sitka diverge, Tim, you won, you won the top place in
your category, then the big game on.
Yeah. That was amazing.
And I'm looking at life like that.
That is such a
cool picture.
Uh, yeah, that well, um, I can tell you a story about that picture if you want.
We'll end on the story.
So.
Um, we were up filming in the, in the Yukon.
Um, uh, it was myself Tash and, um, the guy that did all the post-production on
audio, on our film here, Mike Patterson, he was doing field audio for us up there.
So it was the three of us plus two hunters.
And we were going out, we were just supposed to get foot.
We were doing this film on this, um, this hunter, um, and it was
a story of him being a vegan.
So he was vegan.
Probably seen it if you've been on one campfire.
Um, and, uh, we were up there and we said, we've said to Carl, we said, listen, I,
we just need footage of you going out.
You know, if we see a bison, great.
We had a day, we rented some snowmobiles.
We'll just go out and we'll just get some atmosphere and just get
a general vibe of you hunting.
Um, and, uh, so we're out in the Yukon boreal.
We're in the morning, we're from the south.
We're not used to minus 35, 40 degrees, Tash and I in the morning as we're
gearing up, we were both freaking out.
Tasha was a bit more vocal.
And um, the other hunter said, oh, Tash, I got some tracked and
in the truck, I'll get you some he's like, yeah, yeah, please.
And we all kind of stopped and looked at him and he goes, tracked.
And like a man.
And, uh, so it was cold.
And we were like outside of our element.
Um, anyways, we were, we were out, we felt we got great footage of him.
Hunting quote unquote, but they actually were hunting.
That was, we got what we needed and then sure enough, like three, I
think it was towards the afternoon, like four o'clock in the afternoon.
Oh, there's there's six or seven bison on that Hilltop.
It's two kilometers away.
And we're like, yeah.
I mean, yeah, we're not going to say don't go because we want to go home.
Let's uh, let's do it.
So we go down to the lake, we park the snowmobiles and we do like
a two and a half kilometer hike.
And Carl and his hunting buddy are like, Carl's a beast.
Like we are like sweating and like trying to keep up with Carl.
And he's just like beast mode hiking, but like calmly through the snow and
we're just going up and we get up to the bedside and the bites and her slowly walk.
So we're just tracking them quietly, quietly, quietly.
Sure enough.
Right around sunset.
Um, we come across and there's the big bison head, just leaning
over, looking right at us.
And, um, the hunter that was with Carl.
So Carl didn't have the bison tag, the other guy did.
Um, and he had a clean shot, took a shot and it was the craziest thing.
And you can see it in the film.
Um, they all went head to toe.
I think there's about six or seven.
It felt like 20, but there was like six or seven of them and they just went
like a true, you train, just like rape.
Like past us just went like one.
Um, and so we were like, did you get like how he's like, yeah, it's shot felt great.
Everything felt good.
Massive animals, big target, big target, but they're also,
they can suck up a 300 win mag.
No problem.
So we, we go along the train and we're seeing these little splits of blood,
like, okay, we've got confirmation.
So we're tracking and tracking, tracking, but they're light.
They're like, like not it wasn't like, oh, this bison is going to be down soon.
Um, so we're tracking, tracking, tracking on foot and then it gets to a certain
point where like, okay, let's go back and get the snowmobiles and it's dark.
Um, we'll come back.
We get the snowmobiles and we're tracking, tracking, and then it's
just like, it's getting late.
And, um, me Tasha and Mike are just like, okay.
Yeah.
Well, I think we're going to wrap this up because we're not finding this bison.
Right.
And, uh, we pull over.
And Carl's like, yeah, just go, he's talking to the
other guys, go, go grab that.
And then that, and then he comes over to us again.
So let's go start collecting firewood and MOA.
And we're like, what?
We're going to have a fire.
What?
Like, aren't we going back to the trucking, like going home, this is
like probably 11, 12 o'clock at night.
Or like, and it's still like a three-hour snowmobile ride back to the truck.
It's like, no, no.
We're spending the night here.
Um, and we're going to go keep looking.
We're not going to leave an injured by this a note on the mountain.
We're like, oh, nobody argued.
No, everyone was like, okay, we're good.
I guess we had no food.
We had no tent, no sleeping bags.
We were there for a day trip.
Carl had one.
How was it?
How cold was it?
Minus.
Okay.
W exactly, exactly.
And, uh, he had one mountain house as like an emergency in his snowmobile.
So the five of us shared one mountain house around a fire.
We kind of found where there were two trees and, you know, read
where the wind was coming from and essentially built a fire and five
guys spooned out, spooning out in the middle of the boreal in minus 35.
So you're like spooning.
And you get really cold and you stand up and you go over tesserae around the fire.
We keep the fire going all night.
The good thing about the boreal is it's dry, everything burns.
It's great.
And the trees are so frozen that you just shake them and you can knock them down.
It's amazing.
Um, it's way different than, you know, growing up in a rainforest, knowing
that nothing burns nothing at all.
Yeah.
So he was so nonchalant.
I was like, stressing out that we're going to keep a fire going,
how are we going to start a fire?
Well, it was fun.
So we had a fire we're spooning.
We're doing this routine all night where, you know, you might get 20
minutes of sleep and then you're up.
Cause you're so cold.
Get to the close to the fire.
And then I remember waking up, we're all spinning and over the Ridge of my
friend's back of Mike's back, I see the Aurora Borealis and I'm sitting there.
We're in an all survival mode.
It's a pretty good group.
We're all pretty positive.
Nobody's freaking out.
It's all good.
Um, I had this conversation with myself.
I'm like, oh, that's so beautiful.
I have to go get my camera.
So I like slugged up.
Everybody's sleeping at the fire.
I went over like the key.
And of course the cameras packed away in the case.
It's in the snowmobile.
I go to the snowmobile.
I'm like, what am I doing?
What am I doing?
And I get the camera.
And the, the, the sky is just so inspiring.
We're talking about being a creative and energizing.
And I was just like, I, like, I took my gloves off.
I could feel all my fingers.
I was just energized by it.
It was so gorgeous.
And, uh, I go and I'm walking around in the Bush and, um, I'm like, I don't
even care if there's something lurking at me, I have to get this photo.
And I took a bunch of different photos in that one.
That, that one, the prize was, was it, so the fire that you see there, that's
where all five guys were spooning.
You can kind of see, my Gators are hanging, they're drying out.
Um, and then the Royal Borealis and the stars and the boreal tree, like,
it was just, it was amazing that just
made that picture a thousand times better.
Now, when I look at it with that
story.
Yeah.
And then, and, and then, um, we got up the next week.
And, uh, no bison.
Yeah.
Carl Carl was very, um, he kind of taught us more about how that was.
And he said like, if, if it was injured, it would have broken off from
the herd, but it was a strong, the blood disappeared and it was a strong,
they were all together moving away.
So unfortunately, no bison, but, um, uh, I can't remember the coffee shop, but
we went there and had this, like when we got out, cause everybody was starving.
We had a coffee and a cinnamon bun, the size of a pie, and each of us had one
and that was, yeah, it was, uh, it was
amazing.
So for fight club at breakfast, if he has some oral would be the best days
of breakfast he's had in his entire
life.
Yeah.
So we all had some tracks and then we all made it out.
Awesome.
Great story, Jesse.
Thank you so much for sharing the video with me.
The movie with me.
Thank you for being on the Silvercore Podcast.
Thank you.
Um,