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guests like the one we have today.

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So without further ado, let's
get on with this podcast.

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You may remember today's guest from
Silver Corps Podcast, episode one 17.

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He spent three weeks in a German hospital
after an IED explosion in Afghanistan,

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recovering from no fewer than 47 broken
bones, including a massive skull fracture.

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Since then, he's helped countless
others overcome personal trauma and

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PTSD by sharing his story today.

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He's the trusted presence behind Breta
Defense Technologies as a manager in the

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defense and law enforcement division.

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Welcome back to the Silver
Core Podcast, David McDonald.

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Hey Travis, for having me again.

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Uh, yeah, it's just, it's uh,
great to be back, honestly.

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Uh.

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Thank you for inviting me.

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As I said, I've been kind of,
uh, been following, uh, you since

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I left from my last podcast.

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You've had an amazing series of
guests, so honestly, I feel a little

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inadequate being here today, but, uh,
uh, let's, I'm excited to get back.

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Let's do this again.

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Hey,

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you're one of those amazing
guests that's for, for sure.

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Appreciate

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that.

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So

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what is it that brought you over here?

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So, uh, so we're in, uh, b
BC this week, or like that.

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There's the, uh, Canadian
Association of Chief of Police,

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uh, conference and Trade show.

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Uh, it happens every year in August.

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It actually, it rotates
throughout the country.

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So last year was in Halifax,
and then they circle back and

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they do it in va uh, Victoria.

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So I've spent the last, uh,
three days out on the island.

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Yeah.

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Uh, just, uh, doing the trade show,
meeting with the chiefs, the deputies.

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Uh, there's some, you know,
the superintendents, uh, uh,

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promoting the brand defense brand.

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Yep.

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Uh, which we'll get to
in a second like that.

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But, uh, 'cause last time I was here
we were talking about Stoger Canada.

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This is, uh, now there's a whole new
branding we, you know, we can talk about.

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But, uh, just, and, and then
came in today, took the ferry

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over this morning like that.

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Then now I'm in Vancouver.

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I'm here to meet with some of my existing,
uh, clients, if you wanna call it that.

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So, Vancouver Police, uh, new Mess,
Winster Surrey Police, and just, uh,

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kind of get some face time with them.

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Yeah, that's good to do.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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The, so.

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I had brand new branding with
Beretta Defense Technologies.

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Mm-hmm.

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And, uh, what, what was
the move behind there?

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Probably some confusion when
people are think thinking like

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Stoger, how does this fit into

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things?

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Yeah.

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So, uh, so I, so it's kind of twofold.

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So first of all, at the international
side level of it, uh, bread of

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Defense Technologies has been a, a
brand for a little while, but it's

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not really been all that recognized.

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So a co in the last year, uh, Breta
kind of branched off the DEF defense

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military law enforcement side of the
business into a whole own legal entity.

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Uh, and now we, every company
that had a defense or law

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enforcement, uh, business sector.

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Yeah, we've all been required
that you, now, now you're gonna be

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renaming and rebranding under the
brand defense technologies' name.

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So in the last year we've been,
uh, really hard at work separating

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Stoger Canada from Brand Defense
Technologies, Canada, everyth like that.

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So, uh, brand new booth, uh, brand
new, uh, well brand new patches.

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Brand new brand, well
branding across the board.

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Yeah.

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Uh, we are in the process of actually, uh,
legal making it a legal entity in Canada.

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Okay.

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Under, under that, under that name.

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Yeah.

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And, uh, my email just, uh, this past
week changed from Stoger Canada to

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Debra Defense Technologies Canada.

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So gotta find a new place to

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send

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all these memes to you.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Um, so.

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Breta.

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Interesting.

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What 500 years coming up Next year will
be the 500th anniversary, so they're one

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of, if I'm not mistaken, three, maybe like
I did a little bit of research before,

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I should probably just plug it into ai.

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But there's like three family run
businesses that have been around

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for that length of time or longer.

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Some, some crazy small number.

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Oh yeah, it's, it's, I mean, I think
you can count on one hand how many

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actually are still that, and then I
think we're on our 15th generation.

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It's still run by the Saxon family.

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Uh, they're, they are, uh, they're,
the next generation is getting ready,

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uh, to come up and start taking
some more interest in the business.

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So, uh, and they're
still heavily involved.

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Uh, I'll be at a show next month Yeah.

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Out in the London uk.

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And typically the one, the brothers
just will show up like that.

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And, uh, and y you, you would, you
think they'd be coming in, in like

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an entourage, but he just randomly
shows up in like, just either a suit

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or even just jeans and a dress shirt
and next thing you know, you're

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talking to Franco or Pietro and you're
like, oh, oh, how are you doing, sir?

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Not, not surrounded by

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security.

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No, not at all.

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No, they're, they're, but, uh, uh,
it's, uh, just incredible that we, we

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working for still such, it's one of
the things that I would say gives us

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a bit of advantage in the industry.

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We're not owned by a shareholding group or
a, uh, you know, a, a, a, uh, you know, a

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credit, uh, you know, group of companies.

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We're we, we we're still owned
by a family, owned by brother.

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Led, uh, company that, uh, we answer to
ultimately to the, to two to two people.

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Um, and so it's, it's, it's just that,
it's really, it's really an interesting

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company to work for in that regard,
considering we, you know, if you

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really ever have an issue with like
that, it's, it's a real streamlined

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process to order to get an answer.

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No.

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Yeah.

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You know, I've worked with some family
businesses in the past and I've seen

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some really good benefits to that, but
I've also seen the, the difficult side

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of the family business and for a family
business to be around for 500 years.

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Yeah.

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Like, holy crow, those Italians know
something about family, that's for sure.

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Right?

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That's

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for sure.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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And, uh, it's almost they're bred into
it at this point or like that, but Yeah.

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Um, and you know, Andretta mean,
we, we, we call it Breada everyone.

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A lot of people know the company,
obviously the manufacturer of

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Beretta, but the holdings group.

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Hope it just contains so much
more, uh, within the group.

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And like that a lot of
people don't rec realize.

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So,

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okay.

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So let's break it down.

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'cause I don't even think I know
all the things that happens within

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the, in the full holding group.

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I know that they're a large company.

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I know that they've got their fingers
in a bunch of different, uh, pies.

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What, what's their

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totality?

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Uh, so, you know, a lot of people
are surprised to learn that, uh,

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Beretta, uh, uh, owns Benelli
competitors in the market.

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Yeah.

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You know, uh, just as an established and,
uh, you know, the leg like legacy company

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within fi with the farms community.

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Yeah.

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Uh, but they're, they're we're
all sister companies together.

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So they're sister companies.

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Um, you go, they're, they're not that far.

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They're in two different
valleys within Italy.

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You go down to the us they're literally,
the offices are next to each other, uh,

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down in, uh, side in Washington, DC Yeah.

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Uh, we also, they own, uh, probably two.

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What?

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Well, two of the probably
Great, you know, best.

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Bolt action precision rifle companies in
the world, they own Sacco, Antica, Uhhuh.

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Uh, and in that, you know, you can't
have a, you know, a, a precision rifle

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company without an optics company.

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So they also own Steiner.

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Mm-hmm.

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00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:56,715
And bur the, you know, uh, so you got
both the precision, the high end real of

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super precision military and precision
hunting scopes, and you got, you know,

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burst, which is excellent scopes in their
own rights, everyth like that within the

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00:08:03,285 --> 00:08:04,995
tactical and the, the hunting community.

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00:08:05,025 --> 00:08:05,295
Yeah.

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00:08:05,715 --> 00:08:09,945
Uh, and the most recent acquisition,
uh, I'm not even touching on all of

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00:08:09,945 --> 00:08:13,695
them or like that, but the most recent
acquisition was in the last end of 2023.

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Uh, just after, actually
I was last year like that.

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Yeah.

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00:08:17,595 --> 00:08:22,515
Uh, Breta purchased the RUAG group, so
five of the world's largest ammunition

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00:08:22,515 --> 00:08:26,955
manufacturers, which closed that gap
on Holy Crow, on what we can provide.

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So really, we all, we are
a full service provider.

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00:08:29,595 --> 00:08:29,805
Yeah.

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00:08:29,865 --> 00:08:34,095
And, um, where does, you know, brand
defense technologies or Stoger Canada,

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00:08:34,125 --> 00:08:36,945
which is the commercial side come
into play, is that we are owned.

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We're not, you know, we don't have
to, we don't, we're not a, um, a

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partnership agreement with Breta where
we're under a contractual agreement,

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00:08:43,799 --> 00:08:48,270
which can, you know, you know, end or
be, uh, or be terminated or like that.

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00:08:48,660 --> 00:08:52,350
Breta purchased our company years
ago, back in the early two thousands.

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So, um, we are owned directly.

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00:08:54,450 --> 00:08:57,180
We actually represent, we are
essentially the factory of all

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00:08:57,180 --> 00:08:58,740
those companies within Canada.

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00:08:59,250 --> 00:09:02,939
So I've told, I've told, you know, some
of the services, I'm gonna meet with a

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00:09:02,939 --> 00:09:04,380
couple of them tomorrow and like that.

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00:09:04,380 --> 00:09:06,090
And it's, um.

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00:09:07,260 --> 00:09:08,940
If they have an issue or
they want something or they

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00:09:08,940 --> 00:09:10,050
need, you know, a detail.

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00:09:10,050 --> 00:09:13,230
Just today I was talking with a
service, uh, needed a detail on

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00:09:13,230 --> 00:09:14,730
one of the tikas rifles they had.

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00:09:15,060 --> 00:09:15,090
Mm.

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00:09:15,330 --> 00:09:19,230
And uh, it was more of a technical
question involving, you know, what

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00:09:19,230 --> 00:09:21,780
kind of, you know, powder on the round
they should be using or like that.

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00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:22,080
Yeah.

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00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,220
And the bench I have is, it's not
me, you know, sending an email

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00:09:26,220 --> 00:09:28,890
through a, you know, a direct list
of chain of middlemen or like that.

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00:09:28,890 --> 00:09:32,640
It's literally just calling the,
you know, the production manager

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00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,760
over at Teka or, and saying, Hey,
I, you know, I have this question.

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00:09:36,090 --> 00:09:38,730
And he gets back to me within,
you know, based on his own

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00:09:38,730 --> 00:09:39,900
timeframe and the time zones.

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00:09:39,900 --> 00:09:42,060
'cause we're dealing with Finland
here, which is, you know, a

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00:09:42,060 --> 00:09:43,405
couple hours ahead of us hours.

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00:09:43,410 --> 00:09:43,620
Yeah.

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00:09:44,010 --> 00:09:46,140
But, uh, based on that, he can
usually get an answer within a day.

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00:09:46,555 --> 00:09:46,845
Yeah.

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00:09:46,845 --> 00:09:47,245
That's crazy.

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00:09:47,505 --> 00:09:51,240
So, yeah, I went over, I, so I
was in Finland, went over to, uh,

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00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:55,650
the factory there, and I saw their
operations and I was, I was blown away.

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00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:56,940
Blown away by a few things.

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00:09:56,940 --> 00:10:00,540
So the Finnish culture is,
uh, a little different than

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00:10:00,540 --> 00:10:01,470
what we're used to over here.

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00:10:01,500 --> 00:10:01,680
A little

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00:10:01,680 --> 00:10:01,860
bit.

234
00:10:01,860 --> 00:10:02,130
Yeah.

235
00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:02,580
A little bit.

236
00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:04,770
Similarities in, in their own right.

237
00:10:04,770 --> 00:10:09,930
Which is interesting like that there's,
there's, it's almost like it's, yeah.

238
00:10:11,430 --> 00:10:15,930
Well, you'll tell a joke and they'll just
look at you and then later on they'll

239
00:10:15,930 --> 00:10:17,130
say, that was a really funny joke.

240
00:10:17,195 --> 00:10:17,485
Yeah.

241
00:10:17,910 --> 00:10:18,180
Yeah.

242
00:10:18,185 --> 00:10:19,560
They, they do do that.

243
00:10:19,590 --> 00:10:22,560
Um, but I find that the culture of
kind of, you know, obviously they're

244
00:10:22,560 --> 00:10:25,380
really big on their saunas and, but
they're really big on being in nature.

245
00:10:25,439 --> 00:10:25,650
Yeah.

246
00:10:25,710 --> 00:10:29,160
Uh, but I, I literally heard last
time I was over there, we were, uh.

247
00:10:30,090 --> 00:10:32,580
We were jump, we were going into
this lake or like that, and they

248
00:10:32,580 --> 00:10:34,740
warned me ahead of time, Hey,
it's not so bad once you get in.

249
00:10:34,740 --> 00:10:36,480
And I'm like, that, no,
that's our saying, man.

250
00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:40,110
That's, that's a, so a bunch
of Americans were with us and

251
00:10:40,110 --> 00:10:40,920
they're like, what does that mean?

252
00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:42,420
I'm, I'm like, well,
you're about to find out.

253
00:10:44,850 --> 00:10:45,210
Yeah.

254
00:10:45,270 --> 00:10:47,850
You know, everyone looks at jumping
in a lake as being a terrible thing.

255
00:10:47,850 --> 00:10:48,870
Oh, it's gonna be so cold.

256
00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:53,250
I don't know if it's freezing outside and
the top is frozen, you know, the water

257
00:10:53,250 --> 00:10:55,140
underneath is actually gonna be warmer.

258
00:10:55,145 --> 00:10:55,205
Yeah.

259
00:10:55,205 --> 00:10:55,845
Than, yeah, exactly.

260
00:10:55,845 --> 00:10:56,045
Yeah.

261
00:10:56,310 --> 00:10:56,610
Yeah.

262
00:10:57,150 --> 00:11:00,030
But, uh, yeah, the, the cul
factory is, is incredible.

263
00:11:00,030 --> 00:11:05,370
Now, uh, did they, did you get to see the,
the meeting room upstairs, Uhhuh where

264
00:11:05,370 --> 00:11:07,260
the all all the, the history of the guns?

265
00:11:07,260 --> 00:11:07,920
Yeah, that was great.

266
00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:09,720
So that was recently
redone, they said Yes.

267
00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:09,990
Yeah.

268
00:11:10,170 --> 00:11:14,189
So that, and that was like part
of their original, um, yeah.

269
00:11:14,189 --> 00:11:16,920
So they had all, all their
old guns, their whole museum.

270
00:11:17,250 --> 00:11:21,960
Um, we got the, the full tour of
it and the, the history of it and,

271
00:11:22,380 --> 00:11:25,050
uh, learned about the different,
uh, models that they're making.

272
00:11:25,050 --> 00:11:28,204
Actually one of the guys there, um, Mika.

273
00:11:28,725 --> 00:11:29,265
Was it Mika?

274
00:11:29,355 --> 00:11:29,445
It's

275
00:11:29,445 --> 00:11:30,075
probably Mika.

276
00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:30,460
That's it.

277
00:11:30,460 --> 00:11:30,580
Yeah.

278
00:11:30,585 --> 00:11:34,945
It's usually either Mika USO or
Mika Tuka, or, yeah, that's, so

279
00:11:34,945 --> 00:11:37,700
it's, it's very, very, very standard
finished names, but yeah, Mika, uh,

280
00:11:37,900 --> 00:11:38,475
m Mika, yeah.

281
00:11:38,475 --> 00:11:39,945
Was Oh, so Mika, or Mika?

282
00:11:40,425 --> 00:11:44,865
Mika given the, uh, given us a tour
around and, uh, he was showing, like,

283
00:11:44,865 --> 00:11:47,835
I guess when he was in university, he
approached 'em and he says, you know,

284
00:11:47,835 --> 00:11:51,405
I've got some design ideas and I got
some, uh, things that can make it better.

285
00:11:51,405 --> 00:11:52,905
And I said, okay, come on in.

286
00:11:52,905 --> 00:11:53,655
Show us what you mean.

287
00:11:53,685 --> 00:11:53,775
Yeah.

288
00:11:53,775 --> 00:11:56,295
And then a lot of the new things
that are coming out are things

289
00:11:56,295 --> 00:11:58,305
that, that he brought into fruition.

290
00:11:58,455 --> 00:11:59,925
Some of their top sellers actually.

291
00:12:00,195 --> 00:12:02,085
But yeah, that was, that was a neat place.

292
00:12:02,115 --> 00:12:04,065
Uh, the history behind
everything was neat.

293
00:12:04,305 --> 00:12:08,595
I went in, I wanted to take some pictures,
I wanted to do some video, and, um, they

294
00:12:08,595 --> 00:12:10,215
said, Nope, no, we don't want any of that.

295
00:12:10,220 --> 00:12:10,300
Yeah.

296
00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:10,580
Oh.

297
00:12:11,219 --> 00:12:11,579
Okay.

298
00:12:11,579 --> 00:12:12,599
Well like what?

299
00:12:12,959 --> 00:12:15,360
You know, like I'd, I'd love to
show people what you're doing.

300
00:12:15,390 --> 00:12:15,750
No, no.

301
00:12:15,750 --> 00:12:16,439
Just come on in.

302
00:12:16,439 --> 00:12:17,130
This is cool.

303
00:12:17,550 --> 00:12:19,170
We, we want you to come in.

304
00:12:19,170 --> 00:12:20,370
The hospitality was crazy.

305
00:12:20,370 --> 00:12:20,430
Yeah.

306
00:12:20,430 --> 00:12:21,240
I guess that's what I'm getting

307
00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:21,420
at.

308
00:12:21,959 --> 00:12:22,229
Yeah.

309
00:12:22,229 --> 00:12:24,719
Uh, it and don't and so you
don't Yeah, don't feel bad.

310
00:12:24,719 --> 00:12:25,829
I'm not allowed to take
photos there either.

311
00:12:25,829 --> 00:12:27,150
And I work for 'em directly like that.

312
00:12:27,150 --> 00:12:29,849
So it's like, so don't, don't,
don't feel bad there at all.

313
00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:30,719
Uh, yeah.

314
00:12:30,719 --> 00:12:33,930
If there's a strictly no for, you know,
photography rule in a lot of places.

315
00:12:33,930 --> 00:12:36,599
'cause they want you to actually come
in and actually witness with your

316
00:12:36,599 --> 00:12:38,520
own eyes not stuck behind a camera.

317
00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:40,110
And you get like, kind of
almost a disconnect there.

318
00:12:40,110 --> 00:12:43,770
They want you to see the craftsmanship and
the skill they're putting into their pro.

319
00:12:43,829 --> 00:12:47,160
Like, uh, a lot of people
don't realize like their, their

320
00:12:47,310 --> 00:12:48,420
ammunition of their factory.

321
00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:48,750
Mm-hmm.

322
00:12:49,680 --> 00:12:54,839
Every cartridge is inspected a hundred
percent before it leaves a factory.

323
00:12:54,839 --> 00:12:58,770
My average check rates are, you know,
less than 10% on most ammunition.

324
00:12:58,770 --> 00:12:59,069
Lots.

325
00:12:59,069 --> 00:13:01,925
They check a hundred percent every
single one to make sure it is.

326
00:13:03,119 --> 00:13:06,479
You know, meets the standards or
like that every barrel from the SA

327
00:13:06,719 --> 00:13:10,500
factory is inspected by a person
before it gets installed on a gun.

328
00:13:10,890 --> 00:13:13,109
That was one of the things
that I thought was interesting.

329
00:13:13,140 --> 00:13:13,229
Mm-hmm.

330
00:13:13,469 --> 00:13:17,280
Because you look at the crazy machinery
they have for automation, for precision,

331
00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:21,569
CNC, and then you get down to the
human inspection part and they say,

332
00:13:21,569 --> 00:13:25,349
you know, we put 'em through the
machines, but you still can't beat

333
00:13:25,619 --> 00:13:30,270
the human eye for being able to spot
some of the, uh, variances, like if

334
00:13:30,270 --> 00:13:33,329
you're barrel bending or straightening
or whatever you're gonna be doing.

335
00:13:34,500 --> 00:13:37,140
And I don't, I don't really
understand how that is.

336
00:13:37,140 --> 00:13:42,209
I don't understand how we can have
AI and space age machinery yet.

337
00:13:42,209 --> 00:13:45,750
We still can't match the precision
of what a human can be able to.

338
00:13:46,109 --> 00:13:46,290
Yeah.

339
00:13:46,290 --> 00:13:48,390
I I, I don't, I don't know either.

340
00:13:48,449 --> 00:13:51,599
I mean, and a lot of the machinery in that
shop is actually still relatively new.

341
00:13:51,869 --> 00:13:52,170
Yeah.

342
00:13:52,260 --> 00:13:55,439
Uh, a lot, some of it, up until 10
years ago, those, those rifles were

343
00:13:55,439 --> 00:13:58,290
still made essentially by hand.

344
00:13:58,589 --> 00:13:58,949
Yeah.

345
00:13:59,339 --> 00:13:59,849
Um.

346
00:14:01,095 --> 00:14:03,375
Production and demand has grown
to the point where they needed

347
00:14:03,375 --> 00:14:04,455
to bring some machinery in

348
00:14:04,755 --> 00:14:04,785
Uhhuh.

349
00:14:05,085 --> 00:14:09,345
But, uh, I was just, I was having another
email this morning with one of actually,

350
00:14:09,345 --> 00:14:11,745
uh, a Montreal, uh, service member.

351
00:14:12,735 --> 00:14:17,325
So one of the things that we have to
keep on, we're always stressing on the

352
00:14:17,325 --> 00:14:21,195
guise, is that, uh, when you're, when
you're buy a sack or you're buying a tika,

353
00:14:22,275 --> 00:14:24,585
the barrel is not like another rifle.

354
00:14:25,365 --> 00:14:25,935
Mm. The cold thing.

355
00:14:26,175 --> 00:14:28,725
They've, they've figured out a way,
some sort of magic how to do it.

356
00:14:28,725 --> 00:14:30,765
They're cold heel for
they're cold hammer forged.

357
00:14:30,765 --> 00:14:30,945
Yeah.

358
00:14:31,965 --> 00:14:37,005
And so at today they, the, the guy contact
me saying, I put 3000 rounds to the gun.

359
00:14:37,815 --> 00:14:39,900
I've been told this is, now it's
time to change the barrel uhuh.

360
00:14:39,975 --> 00:14:40,755
So how do I do that?

361
00:14:40,755 --> 00:14:43,575
And I'm like, uh, your barrel light's
not even at the halfway point yet.

362
00:14:43,725 --> 00:14:49,725
Mm. But it's, uh, I, I've
personally tested, uh, a SCO TRG.

363
00:14:49,845 --> 00:14:50,085
Yep.

364
00:14:50,625 --> 00:14:53,475
And we had 30,000 rounds of
3 0 8 through that barrel.

365
00:14:53,565 --> 00:14:55,575
And it was still shooting just fine.

366
00:14:55,965 --> 00:14:58,695
It's to the point now actually
Sacco no longer does, they no longer

367
00:14:58,695 --> 00:14:59,985
bother doing round counts anymore.

368
00:15:00,810 --> 00:15:01,199
Really,

369
00:15:01,260 --> 00:15:04,949
they ran out of ammo before they blew
the bur before they burn the barrel out.

370
00:15:05,339 --> 00:15:05,939
That's crazy.

371
00:15:05,970 --> 00:15:10,560
Uh, so instead the the way actually,
and this, anyone who's listening to this

372
00:15:12,060 --> 00:15:15,750
remember this because I, you know, uh,
it saves me a lot of time on my email.

373
00:15:15,870 --> 00:15:17,430
I not having to explain
this anymore like that.

374
00:15:17,939 --> 00:15:23,550
So the way Sacco determines a barrel
has reached the end of its life mm-hmm.

375
00:15:24,030 --> 00:15:27,480
Is if you have more than six
centimeter shift of point of

376
00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:29,069
impact from point of a. Mm-hmm.

377
00:15:30,449 --> 00:15:36,360
And not, or at, and a more than
five, 10% drop of velocity mm-hmm.

378
00:15:36,420 --> 00:15:36,930
At the muzzle.

379
00:15:37,470 --> 00:15:37,890
Okay.

380
00:15:37,890 --> 00:15:39,420
If those, and it has to be consistent.

381
00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:40,050
Okay.

382
00:15:40,650 --> 00:15:43,740
We all know that muzzle velocity
changes has lots of other

383
00:15:43,740 --> 00:15:44,939
factors that can affect it.

384
00:15:45,630 --> 00:15:50,310
Uh, so it has to be consistently happening
repeatedly over and over in time again.

385
00:15:50,310 --> 00:15:52,980
Or like that if it, if that
happens or like that, and you have

386
00:15:52,980 --> 00:15:54,240
those, both, those things happen.

387
00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:55,290
That's an indication.

388
00:15:55,290 --> 00:15:56,579
Something's going on with your barrel.

389
00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:57,959
It's time to come in and get it inspected.

390
00:15:58,305 --> 00:15:59,445
So say that again.

391
00:15:59,445 --> 00:16:02,475
It was 6% and so it's six, six

392
00:16:02,475 --> 00:16:03,285
centimeter shift.

393
00:16:03,285 --> 00:16:04,635
Six centimeter in point of impact.

394
00:16:04,725 --> 00:16:04,935
Okay.

395
00:16:04,935 --> 00:16:05,655
From your point of aim.

396
00:16:05,745 --> 00:16:05,985
Yeah.

397
00:16:06,465 --> 00:16:09,555
And a 10% drop in velocity at the muzzle.

398
00:16:09,585 --> 00:16:09,795
Hmm.

399
00:16:09,855 --> 00:16:09,975
So

400
00:16:09,975 --> 00:16:10,545
you need both of

401
00:16:10,545 --> 00:16:10,845
those things.

402
00:16:10,850 --> 00:16:12,615
Both things, things happen consistently

403
00:16:13,335 --> 00:16:15,075
across the board over multiple shots.

404
00:16:15,105 --> 00:16:15,465
Okay.

405
00:16:15,465 --> 00:16:18,915
So anyone getting the rifle to begin
with should get things zeroed in, have

406
00:16:18,915 --> 00:16:22,125
a decent idea of what their average
velocity's gonna be like, and that

407
00:16:22,125 --> 00:16:24,045
way they can then have a baseline on

408
00:16:24,045 --> 00:16:24,105
it.

409
00:16:24,105 --> 00:16:24,255
Yeah.

410
00:16:24,285 --> 00:16:24,555
Just

411
00:16:25,035 --> 00:16:25,410
like, yeah.

412
00:16:25,415 --> 00:16:26,985
And there's always outside
factors, you know, like that.

413
00:16:26,985 --> 00:16:29,564
Like if you're hand loading and you're
hold loading super hot rounds, it's

414
00:16:29,564 --> 00:16:30,944
gonna burn your barrel lot faster.

415
00:16:31,095 --> 00:16:31,275
Yeah.

416
00:16:31,305 --> 00:16:35,565
That's an unknown factor that we can't
speak to or like that because, uh,

417
00:16:35,565 --> 00:16:39,765
there's certain powders that work better
than others and like that, uh, but when

418
00:16:39,765 --> 00:16:42,405
you're dealing with commercial grade
ammunition or like that, I can tell you

419
00:16:42,405 --> 00:16:45,885
these things, these barrels can go for
thousands more rounds than what, uh.

420
00:16:47,189 --> 00:16:49,890
They, you know, and get the
other thing, get off the forms.

421
00:16:51,085 --> 00:16:51,930
Oh yeah.

422
00:16:52,050 --> 00:16:54,840
You will hear 10 different
re uh, things from people on.

423
00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:56,189
Oh, it's kind of changed it.

424
00:16:56,189 --> 00:16:56,610
No, it's not.

425
00:16:56,610 --> 00:16:57,000
Yes it is.

426
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:57,420
No it's not.

427
00:16:57,420 --> 00:16:57,810
Yes it is.

428
00:16:57,810 --> 00:16:58,260
No it's not.

429
00:16:58,260 --> 00:17:01,410
I'm telling you, I'm the
from the factory guy.

430
00:17:01,980 --> 00:17:02,040
Yeah.

431
00:17:02,189 --> 00:17:04,230
This is this, this is the golden rule.

432
00:17:04,379 --> 00:17:05,069
Like that, those two

433
00:17:05,069 --> 00:17:05,550
factors.

434
00:17:05,879 --> 00:17:08,910
It's funny how, um, you get on
these forums and there's a lot

435
00:17:08,910 --> 00:17:11,250
of experts on there and you
know, there are people mm-hmm.

436
00:17:11,490 --> 00:17:11,984
Who know what they're doing.

437
00:17:12,264 --> 00:17:12,345
Absolutely.

438
00:17:12,345 --> 00:17:13,200
They know what they're talking about.

439
00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:19,950
But, uh, I, people just go a
little overboard into the minutiae

440
00:17:19,980 --> 00:17:22,470
and all these little things that
don't actually move the needle.

441
00:17:22,470 --> 00:17:22,560
Mm-hmm.

442
00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,020
When it comes to accuracy,
when it comes to issues.

443
00:17:25,450 --> 00:17:30,760
Uh, and very often what I find is
human factor plays such a big role, but

444
00:17:30,790 --> 00:17:35,050
everyone's so quick to point out, oh,
it's gotta be this, it's gotta be that.

445
00:17:35,110 --> 00:17:38,290
And I think you and I were talking about
this before and I was given the example

446
00:17:38,290 --> 00:17:43,480
of a, uh, certain agency that I was
doing some gun plumbing for and getting a

447
00:17:43,510 --> 00:17:45,400
phone call saying, oh, hold on a second.

448
00:17:45,700 --> 00:17:49,030
One of our guns isn't working
properly, only to show up and find

449
00:17:49,030 --> 00:17:52,420
out that none of the instructors had
testified it, they're going off the

450
00:17:52,420 --> 00:17:57,340
word of one of their students, and
they weren't able to reproduce it.

451
00:17:57,340 --> 00:17:58,210
They had me fire it.

452
00:17:58,210 --> 00:17:59,380
I wasn't able to reproduce it.

453
00:17:59,380 --> 00:18:03,790
Then I had to do the tap dance of being
able to help the instructors save face

454
00:18:03,850 --> 00:18:07,630
for not doing the first basic checks
that you should do, which is if you're

455
00:18:07,630 --> 00:18:09,340
having an issue, give it to somebody else.

456
00:18:09,340 --> 00:18:10,480
Do they have the same issue?

457
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:11,680
Can they replicate the same thing?

458
00:18:11,685 --> 00:18:11,775
Yeah.

459
00:18:11,950 --> 00:18:12,160
Yeah.

460
00:18:12,764 --> 00:18:17,175
Because the human factors is pretty crazy,
and he, and you get on the forums and

461
00:18:17,175 --> 00:18:19,064
they're gonna tell you, send it back.

462
00:18:19,064 --> 00:18:22,155
Use a thing as a club that's no good
anymore, or whatever it might be.

463
00:18:22,455 --> 00:18:26,355
Well, and, and, and, you know, and you're
right, I mean, I've run across agencies

464
00:18:26,355 --> 00:18:31,034
and, you know, my almost 10 years of
doing this, that they've identified an

465
00:18:31,034 --> 00:18:34,629
issue, which, okay, we have, we, we take
everyone seriously because of course we,

466
00:18:34,635 --> 00:18:38,084
we have to, especially when you're dealing
with law enforcement or military because,

467
00:18:38,084 --> 00:18:41,324
you know, potentially lives are at right
at at risk here or anything like that.

468
00:18:41,324 --> 00:18:44,235
You know, you, you need, they need to
know their equipment's gonna be good

469
00:18:44,625 --> 00:18:45,735
when it needs to be earth like that.

470
00:18:46,905 --> 00:18:49,665
But inevitably we, we hear what
the problem is and we're like,

471
00:18:49,665 --> 00:18:54,074
okay, uh, well that hasn't been
seen anywhere else in the world.

472
00:18:54,074 --> 00:18:54,675
Mm-hmm.

473
00:18:55,935 --> 00:18:58,395
Okay, so send it in, we'll take a
look at it, everything like that.

474
00:18:58,395 --> 00:19:00,915
And then one, one or one or two times.

475
00:19:00,915 --> 00:19:01,305
Okay.

476
00:19:01,305 --> 00:19:02,415
That's, that's maybe indication.

477
00:19:02,415 --> 00:19:05,745
There might be, you know, maybe
a potential defect or something

478
00:19:05,745 --> 00:19:06,615
that we weren't aware of.

479
00:19:06,615 --> 00:19:09,705
So, uh, everyone, even the best
manufacturer in the world, keep

480
00:19:09,705 --> 00:19:10,785
in mind, we're still human.

481
00:19:11,235 --> 00:19:11,775
Of course

482
00:19:12,165 --> 00:19:15,915
mistakes do happen, but when it
happens, t and if it's a 16 problem

483
00:19:15,915 --> 00:19:18,405
happening multiple times, that's
when I started being like, let's

484
00:19:18,405 --> 00:19:19,605
look at your procedures here.

485
00:19:19,635 --> 00:19:20,775
Well how are, how are you actually doing?

486
00:19:20,775 --> 00:19:24,225
'cause maybe it's something here that
could be fixed with just a simple

487
00:19:24,945 --> 00:19:26,385
tweak in the training or something.

488
00:19:26,385 --> 00:19:27,225
Or Yeah.

489
00:19:27,225 --> 00:19:29,685
Or we need to maybe review
your torque settings.

490
00:19:29,715 --> 00:19:33,225
Uh, 'cause sometimes, especially
when we're getting from Europe and

491
00:19:33,225 --> 00:19:36,105
all what's in nanometers, they don't
necessarily understand how that relates

492
00:19:36,105 --> 00:19:39,765
back to inch pounds or god forbid,
foot pounds, you know, like that.

493
00:19:39,765 --> 00:19:41,805
If they decide to go with that,
if they get really confused.

494
00:19:41,805 --> 00:19:44,265
So if you, if you can get foot
pounds outta the inch pounds and it's

495
00:19:44,265 --> 00:19:46,185
still, it doesn't snap on you holy

496
00:19:46,185 --> 00:19:47,835
crow, like you're asking for trouble.

497
00:19:47,865 --> 00:19:48,105
Yeah.

498
00:19:48,795 --> 00:19:49,575
But, uh.

499
00:19:50,129 --> 00:19:53,820
But yeah, I mean, we, we run across, uh,
you know, that it's all, but education

500
00:19:53,820 --> 00:19:58,590
is why, and it's making sure that,
uh, not only is the initial cadre.

501
00:19:59,205 --> 00:20:02,715
That, you know, if they receive a new
weapon system or a new site trained on

502
00:20:02,715 --> 00:20:06,285
it, we gotta make sure that training
is maintained within that service.

503
00:20:06,315 --> 00:20:07,725
'cause guys retire.

504
00:20:08,175 --> 00:20:08,895
Yeah, let's move on.

505
00:20:08,985 --> 00:20:13,845
I think that's the, so, you know,
a gun manufacturer sends a lot of

506
00:20:13,845 --> 00:20:17,385
time and energy to research what's
gonna make it absolutely the best

507
00:20:17,385 --> 00:20:20,865
possible product that they put can
put out in a way that's replicable.

508
00:20:21,375 --> 00:20:23,895
And then people get in their hands
and the first thing they want to do is

509
00:20:23,895 --> 00:20:27,195
like, okay, I'm gonna change the stock
on it, get some chassis, and uh, maybe

510
00:20:27,195 --> 00:20:30,105
I can get a different barrel and I'm
gonna get a threaded for a muzzle break.

511
00:20:30,105 --> 00:20:31,275
What kind of trigger can I put on?

512
00:20:31,275 --> 00:20:34,395
And they start taking all of these
things out and putting something else in.

513
00:20:35,125 --> 00:20:37,615
And it's, I get it.

514
00:20:37,645 --> 00:20:38,575
It's fun.

515
00:20:38,635 --> 00:20:43,465
And the gunsmithing portion seems to
have gone by the wayside over the year,

516
00:20:43,465 --> 00:20:44,995
and it's more parts replacement mm-hmm.

517
00:20:45,235 --> 00:20:47,785
Or armor type stuff that people
are doing, but, but it's,

518
00:20:47,785 --> 00:20:49,045
it's like tinker toys, right.

519
00:20:49,045 --> 00:20:52,255
For adults, they'd like to get in there
and kind of move it around, but you can

520
00:20:52,255 --> 00:20:56,995
expect to stick your finger in the bowl of
water and not expect to see some ripples.

521
00:20:56,995 --> 00:20:57,175
Yeah.

522
00:20:57,235 --> 00:20:57,445
Right.

523
00:20:57,715 --> 00:20:59,275
Uh, you know, that's a
great way of putting it.

524
00:20:59,275 --> 00:21:02,515
And I can tell you like, some of the
guns we get coming back to our service

525
00:21:02,515 --> 00:21:07,675
and warranty center, uh, it, it's
barely a bread of product anymore,

526
00:21:07,675 --> 00:21:10,615
potentially like that, where it's
like, okay, well, we'll, we'll service

527
00:21:10,615 --> 00:21:15,475
what we can, but half the stuff like,
it's such a Frankenstein gun at this

528
00:21:15,475 --> 00:21:18,445
point, like, and as you said, I get it.

529
00:21:18,445 --> 00:21:21,835
And especially I would, I would say in
a lot of the, uh, movies in the last 10

530
00:21:21,835 --> 00:21:27,205
years that have come out where you see
the really high speed, low drag guns that

531
00:21:27,205 --> 00:21:29,065
have been really, really customized and.

532
00:21:29,820 --> 00:21:32,130
It, you know, for the movie to
make it look good and guys want to

533
00:21:32,130 --> 00:21:33,150
do that, and I don't blame them.

534
00:21:33,150 --> 00:21:35,790
I, I'm, I, I see it and I kinda
wanna do it as well like that.

535
00:21:35,790 --> 00:21:35,880
Sure.

536
00:21:36,420 --> 00:21:37,205
Um, I get it.

537
00:21:37,410 --> 00:21:40,770
I totally understand it, and if it
works, it works and that's great.

538
00:21:40,770 --> 00:21:44,010
But when something doesn't work
and we, you don't necessarily

539
00:21:44,010 --> 00:21:46,770
know what you actually did in
terms of how much work you've done

540
00:21:46,770 --> 00:21:50,685
to, it's, it's like the, uh, oh.

541
00:21:50,865 --> 00:21:53,940
Uh, not to offend anybody here,
but it's like the, it's like the

542
00:21:53,940 --> 00:21:56,400
girl who can't remember what her
original hair color is anymore.

543
00:21:56,430 --> 00:22:00,330
Like that, like the, the gun is
no longer in its original states.

544
00:22:00,915 --> 00:22:03,585
And for us to fix it, we kind of
need to figure out what you did.

545
00:22:04,550 --> 00:22:07,485
I, I think the training side, well,
I mean, I'm gonna be biased here.

546
00:22:07,485 --> 00:22:10,965
I've got a training company, but
I, I think that's a huge thing from

547
00:22:10,965 --> 00:22:14,115
a, um, an OEM manufacturer side.

548
00:22:14,145 --> 00:22:20,145
From a marketing side, I, it's amazing
what you can accomplish from just a,

549
00:22:20,655 --> 00:22:24,945
a gun straight outta the factory and
use it the way it was properly designed

550
00:22:24,945 --> 00:22:27,735
to be used before you start putting
all of these different things onto it.

551
00:22:28,155 --> 00:22:33,675
I remember, uh, Bourne Identity when, uh,
uh, Matt Damon there, Jason Bourne, and

552
00:22:33,675 --> 00:22:37,875
he's, uh, got himself a, I think it was a
break action shotgun, and he's gotta use

553
00:22:37,875 --> 00:22:41,625
a, probably using, uh, seven and a half
shot bird loads or something like that.

554
00:22:41,625 --> 00:22:41,715
Right.

555
00:22:41,715 --> 00:22:46,965
But it's not about the, uh,
high speed, low drag gun the

556
00:22:46,965 --> 00:22:47,925
person's got in their hands.

557
00:22:47,925 --> 00:22:50,235
It's about the tactics that
they employ and their ability

558
00:22:50,235 --> 00:22:51,375
to actually hit a target.

559
00:22:51,375 --> 00:22:51,465
Mm-hmm.

560
00:22:51,705 --> 00:22:52,425
And use these things.

561
00:22:52,425 --> 00:22:54,765
And I watched Meg pull.

562
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:58,320
Do this back in the day where they
started putting out training videos

563
00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:02,160
and they made some nice produced
glitzy kind of training videos.

564
00:23:02,670 --> 00:23:06,660
Uh, basically if you use our products and
you put 'em on the gun, you're gonna be

565
00:23:06,660 --> 00:23:08,790
able to shoot faster and shoot straighter.

566
00:23:09,390 --> 00:23:12,690
But really all they're doing is showing
people how to properly use again.

567
00:23:12,750 --> 00:23:12,900
Mm-hmm.

568
00:23:13,140 --> 00:23:15,480
It didn't really have anything to
do with the products, although that

569
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,400
was a great sales vehicle for them.

570
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:21,780
And it also allowed them to circumvent
advertising issues because they say,

571
00:23:21,780 --> 00:23:24,600
well, this is product safety and
this is training that they have.

572
00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:26,460
This is not, we're not advertising it.

573
00:23:26,670 --> 00:23:27,030
Right.

574
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:31,680
So I, I thought that using the education
piece was important and you see it

575
00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:34,740
with like, you know, some of the
handgun manufacturers that have, uh.

576
00:23:35,970 --> 00:23:40,620
Their, uh, one day course, which
could be done in half an hour.

577
00:23:40,740 --> 00:23:41,040
Right.

578
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:44,490
But it's, they spend the entire
time talking about the history

579
00:23:44,490 --> 00:23:45,840
and the this and the that.

580
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,800
And, uh, what they're doing is they're
creating salespeople themselves out

581
00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:51,090
of every person that comes on through.

582
00:23:51,450 --> 00:23:51,750
Well, yeah.

583
00:23:52,020 --> 00:23:55,110
And, uh, you know, we're, we're a little
guilty of that as well, and we do Sure.

584
00:23:55,110 --> 00:23:58,320
Do a whole briefing of the, because that
it is important to know the background

585
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,020
behind the company and the manufacturer
when we're doing, like, say like a Teeka

586
00:24:01,020 --> 00:24:02,160
Armor course or something like that.

587
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:02,220
Yeah.

588
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,860
But it'd be, you know, a
lot of people are surprised.

589
00:24:04,860 --> 00:24:10,020
One, one of my favorite facts about,
uh, Teeka is that, you know, they're one

590
00:24:10,020 --> 00:24:11,340
of the only gun companies in the world.

591
00:24:11,340 --> 00:24:14,040
Well, they are the only gun company in the
world to have been owned by the Red Cross.

592
00:24:14,955 --> 00:24:15,435
That's right.

593
00:24:15,435 --> 00:24:19,605
They were to, to avoid being, you know,
sucked in during, during the Soviet

594
00:24:19,605 --> 00:24:20,655
occupation or anything like that.

595
00:24:20,655 --> 00:24:20,745
Right.

596
00:24:20,745 --> 00:24:20,835
Yeah.

597
00:24:20,835 --> 00:24:24,330
So, um, that's just a cool,
that's just a cool factor, like,

598
00:24:24,375 --> 00:24:25,575
like fact about the company.

599
00:24:25,575 --> 00:24:25,845
Right.

600
00:24:25,845 --> 00:24:29,385
But, but going back to the point is
that like, I, I, I wanna make really

601
00:24:29,385 --> 00:24:31,965
clear, I'm not hating on anybody
that wants to customize their gun.

602
00:24:31,995 --> 00:24:32,235
Oh.

603
00:24:32,445 --> 00:24:33,405
That's what makes it fun.

604
00:24:33,645 --> 00:24:33,655
Yeah.

605
00:24:33,675 --> 00:24:33,855
Yeah.

606
00:24:33,855 --> 00:24:34,245
Totally.

607
00:24:34,245 --> 00:24:37,005
It's the same reason why people,
you know, customize their cars.

608
00:24:37,005 --> 00:24:39,495
They custom, like, there's
a reason why parts exist.

609
00:24:39,735 --> 00:24:39,945
Yeah.

610
00:24:40,005 --> 00:24:43,935
And especially at, I would say in the
current environment we have in Canada

611
00:24:43,995 --> 00:24:48,765
surrounding guns and gun legislation,
uh, where you dely can't buy.

612
00:24:49,005 --> 00:24:49,305
Yep.

613
00:24:50,100 --> 00:24:52,080
Uh, any more of a certain
product or something like that.

614
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:53,700
But you still own it and you can use it.

615
00:24:53,700 --> 00:24:54,120
Well, what else?

616
00:24:54,150 --> 00:24:54,480
Where am I?

617
00:24:54,570 --> 00:24:55,710
Where am I gonna put my money here?

618
00:24:55,710 --> 00:24:56,040
Like that?

619
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,970
I'm gonna probably put maybe making it
a little more customizable for myself

620
00:24:59,970 --> 00:25:03,120
or like that, and make it, make it
a little easier or a little more fun

621
00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:04,830
to fire or a little more fun to use.

622
00:25:04,890 --> 00:25:05,250
Um,

623
00:25:05,430 --> 00:25:09,120
so you're talking about certain things
that we maybe can't own anymore.

624
00:25:09,330 --> 00:25:13,230
Um, how has that, if we're
talking about, let's say the

625
00:25:13,230 --> 00:25:15,090
handgun freeze in Canada mm-hmm.

626
00:25:15,390 --> 00:25:20,850
How has that affected things for
stoger, for Bri defense technologies,

627
00:25:21,180 --> 00:25:25,260
and do you have any thoughts on where
things might be moving in the future?

628
00:25:26,220 --> 00:25:26,580
Yeah.

629
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:27,360
Okay.

630
00:25:27,570 --> 00:25:29,460
Um, excellent question.

631
00:25:29,490 --> 00:25:30,120
A tough one.

632
00:25:30,270 --> 00:25:30,510
Mm-hmm.

633
00:25:31,020 --> 00:25:35,730
Uh, and I, I'll preface of saying
that this is simply my opinion when

634
00:25:35,730 --> 00:25:37,650
it comes down where it would head
to the future, anything like that.

635
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,100
Uh, 'cause you talk to 10 people,
10 guys in a room, everyone's

636
00:25:41,100 --> 00:25:42,690
gonna have a different opinion
of where this is gonna go.

637
00:25:43,380 --> 00:25:45,480
Uh, but in terms of how
it's affected us first.

638
00:25:46,530 --> 00:25:50,850
You know, I, we've been lucky enough at
Stoger and at Breaded defense that, uh,

639
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,040
it really hasn't affected us too much.

640
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,500
Is that, uh, the hand
it, it, it, it did hurt.

641
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:56,135
Uh, sure.

642
00:25:56,135 --> 00:25:59,670
You know, it was about, it was a big
segment of our business that has,

643
00:25:59,970 --> 00:26:01,230
you know, now is no longer there.

644
00:26:01,860 --> 00:26:05,940
Uh, but our bread and butter's been
more what a lot of people would

645
00:26:05,940 --> 00:26:08,310
consider the safe firearms like that.

646
00:26:08,310 --> 00:26:10,260
I guess if you wanna call
it, if call you safe.

647
00:26:10,290 --> 00:26:10,440
Got it.

648
00:26:11,070 --> 00:26:14,010
Uh, your bolt actions, your, you
know, you're over under shotguns.

649
00:26:14,010 --> 00:26:16,230
There is, you know, but we,
we we're like everyone else.

650
00:26:16,230 --> 00:26:17,730
We also do a lot of semi-autos.

651
00:26:17,730 --> 00:26:21,990
We have, we, we, we've been just as a
nervous and, but also advocating within,

652
00:26:22,050 --> 00:26:27,300
you know, the different circles that,
uh, you know, that we, we do serve a,

653
00:26:27,300 --> 00:26:29,215
you know, a distinct and important.

654
00:26:30,360 --> 00:26:35,190
Part in the community, or like that is,
and, and in society with, in terms of

655
00:26:35,190 --> 00:26:39,419
conservation, in terms of, you know,
hunt responsible and respectful hunting

656
00:26:39,419 --> 00:26:40,800
responsible and respectful shooting.

657
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:42,750
This is not a scary thing.

658
00:26:42,810 --> 00:26:42,899
Mm-hmm.

659
00:26:43,139 --> 00:26:45,540
And we're trying to, you know, uh,
advocate for that as much as possible.

660
00:26:46,980 --> 00:26:50,100
But, uh, yeah, there's definitely
other manufacturers and, and

661
00:26:50,100 --> 00:26:51,389
distributors and dealers out there.

662
00:26:51,389 --> 00:26:53,280
The dealers are, you know, the worst hit.

663
00:26:53,909 --> 00:26:54,629
And we feel for them.

664
00:26:54,629 --> 00:26:58,889
And we see that in, you know, in our
dealer network and like that, that this

665
00:26:58,889 --> 00:27:02,580
is, and these are just people trying to
run a business just like anybody else.

666
00:27:02,580 --> 00:27:06,030
They're trying to, you know, uh, they
just decided to get into this business

667
00:27:06,210 --> 00:27:09,540
because it's, I mean, they're passionate
about, which I think anybody who's runs

668
00:27:09,540 --> 00:27:12,330
a successful business must be passionate
about what they're doing like that.

669
00:27:12,450 --> 00:27:12,960
Yeah, I agree.

670
00:27:12,990 --> 00:27:16,050
Um, and it doesn't necessarily
mean they're, you know, bad

671
00:27:16,050 --> 00:27:16,800
people in the community.

672
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:20,520
They're just trying to run a business
and, you know, create a sport.

673
00:27:21,705 --> 00:27:24,255
Just like any other sport out there,
like dad and help support that.

674
00:27:25,035 --> 00:27:27,045
Uh, and they, you know, they pay taxes.

675
00:27:27,045 --> 00:27:30,075
They, you know, they're just any other
like, you know, uh, business pillar

676
00:27:30,075 --> 00:27:31,035
in the community as they should be.

677
00:27:31,755 --> 00:27:34,455
Uh, so, uh, yeah, it, it
definitely has hurt them.

678
00:27:34,455 --> 00:27:36,465
Where I see where, you know, this might go

679
00:27:39,795 --> 00:27:42,615
if you, if you asked me, you know,
six, seven months ago mm-hmm.

680
00:27:42,735 --> 00:27:45,315
We knew kind of where we saw where
it was kind of going like that.

681
00:27:45,315 --> 00:27:49,095
Now with new government, with new
government, well, newer newish

682
00:27:49,095 --> 00:27:50,955
government, it's really hard to say.

683
00:27:51,495 --> 00:27:56,595
Uh, we know with all the commitments that
have been announced for defense spending,

684
00:27:56,715 --> 00:27:57,045
Hmm.

685
00:27:57,555 --> 00:27:59,325
That money just doesn't come from nowhere.

686
00:27:59,565 --> 00:27:59,655
Mm-hmm.

687
00:28:00,525 --> 00:28:05,865
And, uh, I don't, you know, it's, it's
billions of dollars they're gonna have to

688
00:28:05,865 --> 00:28:08,625
put to make the 2% NATO margin by March.

689
00:28:09,345 --> 00:28:12,375
Billions even more to spend to
get to the 5% they say they're

690
00:28:12,375 --> 00:28:14,805
gonna hit by 2030, so, mm. Um.

691
00:28:15,225 --> 00:28:16,455
They're gonna have to do cut somewhere.

692
00:28:16,635 --> 00:28:19,185
And I just read an article on
the way here, actually it was on

693
00:28:19,185 --> 00:28:19,905
the fer or anything like that.

694
00:28:19,905 --> 00:28:22,514
And they're talking and it
was just a article of, uh,

695
00:28:22,905 --> 00:28:23,835
well, a great place to start.

696
00:28:23,835 --> 00:28:25,695
That cut is by this gun grab.

697
00:28:25,940 --> 00:28:26,660
I read that as well.

698
00:28:26,660 --> 00:28:26,980
Right.

699
00:28:27,139 --> 00:28:28,815
I read that was in the
National Post, I think.

700
00:28:28,935 --> 00:28:32,055
So it, it, to have, there's
been no forward movement on

701
00:28:32,055 --> 00:28:32,685
it really.

702
00:28:33,555 --> 00:28:37,965
So, um, they had a, so they had a
buyback program in place for businesses.

703
00:28:38,475 --> 00:28:38,565
Mm-hmm.

704
00:28:38,835 --> 00:28:38,845
Yeah.

705
00:28:38,845 --> 00:28:38,855
Yeah.

706
00:28:38,855 --> 00:28:42,435
And I didn't look at what the actual
numbers were on it, but I, I, from what

707
00:28:42,435 --> 00:28:47,655
I understand, the numbers of firearms
that were bought back far exceeded

708
00:28:47,835 --> 00:28:49,545
what they even thought was out there.

709
00:28:49,545 --> 00:28:50,475
Mm-hmm.

710
00:28:50,476 --> 00:28:54,645
And these are all guns that are tracked
and they should know of because of the

711
00:28:54,645 --> 00:28:57,254
business license conditions and, um.

712
00:28:58,635 --> 00:29:02,505
If they're estimating a number for the
civilian population, they have no idea.

713
00:29:02,625 --> 00:29:06,045
They have no idea what's out there,
and the number's gonna far exceed

714
00:29:06,045 --> 00:29:06,915
anything they ever thought of.

715
00:29:06,915 --> 00:29:10,095
And there's no way to tell when
they've achieved their goal either.

716
00:29:10,155 --> 00:29:10,245
Sure.

717
00:29:10,245 --> 00:29:10,305
Yeah.

718
00:29:10,335 --> 00:29:13,215
So they're gonna have to
start a program and leave that

719
00:29:13,215 --> 00:29:14,985
program running indefinitely.

720
00:29:15,975 --> 00:29:19,875
I mean, it's, it, it doesn't,
it doesn't make sense.

721
00:29:20,265 --> 00:29:23,145
I see the gun bag buyback
program as something that's

722
00:29:23,145 --> 00:29:25,155
not going to, uh, be effective.

723
00:29:25,785 --> 00:29:28,245
Uh, both because it's gonna
cost way too much money.

724
00:29:28,245 --> 00:29:28,755
Like it's mm-hmm.

725
00:29:29,685 --> 00:29:33,555
Incredibly, incredibly expensive
to offer a proper buyback program.

726
00:29:33,555 --> 00:29:33,615
Yeah.

727
00:29:34,215 --> 00:29:38,115
Uh, they could just decide they
wanna ban it instead and backtrack

728
00:29:38,115 --> 00:29:40,785
on a bite on the, um, buyback.

729
00:29:40,785 --> 00:29:43,035
But again, they don't know where all these

730
00:29:43,035 --> 00:29:43,725
guns are.

731
00:29:43,785 --> 00:29:47,595
Well, and, and the, the, you know,
I'm sure there'll be people out there

732
00:29:47,595 --> 00:29:51,045
that will correct me in the comments
or like that, but that even, you know,

733
00:29:51,435 --> 00:29:54,435
from my understanding, the way it works
also in, in the Canadian, you know,

734
00:29:54,735 --> 00:29:58,215
system, is that when you decide to
ban something that's legally purchased

735
00:29:58,215 --> 00:30:01,005
property, you can't just say it's banned.

736
00:30:01,005 --> 00:30:03,735
You can't use it anymore, and that's it.

737
00:30:04,065 --> 00:30:07,755
Um, they have to offer fair,
like when they, when they go in

738
00:30:07,845 --> 00:30:09,075
eminent domain, your property.

739
00:30:10,005 --> 00:30:12,105
They still have to offer you fair
market value for that property.

740
00:30:12,105 --> 00:30:15,135
You still have to get, they can't just
take it and say, get out, see you later.

741
00:30:15,195 --> 00:30:16,965
Like that, like, um.

742
00:30:17,295 --> 00:30:20,295
Which might be why they talk about
grandfathering, but of course

743
00:30:20,295 --> 00:30:21,555
that brings in another issue.

744
00:30:21,555 --> 00:30:26,625
And recently the CCFR put out this urgent
video on, I think it was last Friday.

745
00:30:26,625 --> 00:30:31,095
So whenever this podcast comes out, people
will have a bit of a timeline and man,

746
00:30:31,095 --> 00:30:32,835
they came under a lot of heat, everyone.

747
00:30:32,835 --> 00:30:32,925
Mm-hmm.

748
00:30:33,165 --> 00:30:37,755
And their urgent thing was, uh, go
talk your mps and here's a PDF you

749
00:30:37,755 --> 00:30:41,055
can give them, and we're gonna try
and push for a grandfathering program.

750
00:30:41,115 --> 00:30:41,265
Mm-hmm.

751
00:30:42,375 --> 00:30:43,875
Well, in order to grandfather,
you also have a defacto

752
00:30:43,875 --> 00:30:45,045
registry that you're gonna need.

753
00:30:45,045 --> 00:30:45,135
Yep.

754
00:30:45,225 --> 00:30:45,975
They're gonna need to have.

755
00:30:46,005 --> 00:30:46,185
Yep.

756
00:30:46,785 --> 00:30:52,665
And, um, there are a lot of question
marks of over why that organization

757
00:30:52,665 --> 00:30:56,505
decided to go this route and announce
such a thing on a Friday night.

758
00:30:56,535 --> 00:30:56,955
Yeah.

759
00:30:57,135 --> 00:30:58,095
And then push it out.

760
00:30:58,095 --> 00:31:01,545
I mean, there's, there's a lot of
internal drama and, you know, the

761
00:31:01,545 --> 00:31:04,395
firearms community's known to be
able to fight within itself and

762
00:31:04,815 --> 00:31:05,415
uh, yeah.

763
00:31:05,415 --> 00:31:05,805
Right.

764
00:31:06,170 --> 00:31:08,085
We are our own, we all
our own worst enemy.

765
00:31:08,085 --> 00:31:08,505
Sure.

766
00:31:08,715 --> 00:31:13,050
Um, I. Was at a, uh, a town hall
a couple years ago in Pickering.

767
00:31:13,380 --> 00:31:13,560
Okay.

768
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,610
With, uh, and there was a couple of
the, the local mps from the conservative

769
00:31:17,610 --> 00:31:21,665
party there, and it was a, you
know, a really well attended mm-hmm.

770
00:31:21,975 --> 00:31:22,265
Hall.

771
00:31:22,470 --> 00:31:26,790
And we got through about three questions
to the mps before a verbal, you know,

772
00:31:27,060 --> 00:31:30,510
shouting match happened between two of the
attendees with each other or like that.

773
00:31:30,540 --> 00:31:33,900
Mm. And it just kind of, and I'm
like, yeah, that didn't take long to,

774
00:31:33,900 --> 00:31:36,810
for, you know, one guy to accuse a
guy from some about something else.

775
00:31:36,810 --> 00:31:38,940
And then, you know, and then of
course there's the one old guy that

776
00:31:38,940 --> 00:31:40,920
stands up and when are you gonna
bring back the, you know, maybe you're

777
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,510
gonna make 12 sixes legal again.

778
00:31:42,510 --> 00:31:44,145
And it's just like, I. Yeah.

779
00:31:44,504 --> 00:31:48,465
It's like, guys, we get on track
here with the, with the, the

780
00:31:48,465 --> 00:31:49,544
message or like that, right?

781
00:31:49,544 --> 00:31:53,024
Like it's, everyone has their,
their own skin in the game.

782
00:31:53,024 --> 00:31:56,145
And I, and it's, it's understandable,
but it's, you kind of need to be

783
00:31:56,145 --> 00:31:59,024
united at this exact same time or like
that, which is very difficult, uh,

784
00:31:59,084 --> 00:32:00,345
amongst our community, unfortunately.

785
00:32:00,345 --> 00:32:00,584
Right?

786
00:32:00,584 --> 00:32:00,855
So,

787
00:32:01,034 --> 00:32:04,125
yeah, I, I don't see it, you know,
everyone says, well, it doesn't affect me.

788
00:32:04,155 --> 00:32:05,475
It's only for the handguns.

789
00:32:05,475 --> 00:32:06,465
I don't have handguns.

790
00:32:06,465 --> 00:32:07,784
It doesn't, it's only for the hunters.

791
00:32:07,784 --> 00:32:08,385
I don't hunt.

792
00:32:08,385 --> 00:32:13,185
It's only for, so the hand gunner are an
important piece of the puzzle for the gun

793
00:32:13,185 --> 00:32:17,804
stores because talk, talking with the gun
stores, they say the hunters, they come

794
00:32:17,804 --> 00:32:21,554
in, they buy their rifle, they get it all
kitted out, and that was a great sale.

795
00:32:21,945 --> 00:32:24,075
And they come in once a year and
they get more hunting ammunition.

796
00:32:24,105 --> 00:32:24,375
Yeah.

797
00:32:24,555 --> 00:32:24,855
Right.

798
00:32:24,855 --> 00:32:28,095
The, uh, the sports shooters are the
ones that are coming in, getting lots

799
00:32:28,095 --> 00:32:31,395
of ammo, getting new kit, getting
accessories, and the handguns, of

800
00:32:31,395 --> 00:32:32,805
course, is a big portion of that.

801
00:32:33,165 --> 00:32:37,605
And so if people want to have a place
where they can get their hunting rifle

802
00:32:37,605 --> 00:32:41,685
and their hunting shotgun, they're
gonna want to speak up when the hand

803
00:32:41,685 --> 00:32:45,675
gunners who are basically subsidizing
this store to be able to stay open.

804
00:32:45,945 --> 00:32:50,595
So when you, we talk about, hey,
people gotta rally together and

805
00:32:50,595 --> 00:32:56,535
get on the same page, you know, I,
I did a podcast, uh, with a fellow

806
00:32:56,535 --> 00:33:01,065
who owns a suppressor manufacturing
manufacturer business, uh, KGM mm-hmm.

807
00:33:01,065 --> 00:33:01,605
In the states.

808
00:33:01,605 --> 00:33:04,275
And I, I got some people trying chime in.

809
00:33:04,275 --> 00:33:07,275
It's like, oh, that's all well and good,
but seriously, why are you talking about

810
00:33:07,275 --> 00:33:09,255
suppressors and why they should be legal?

811
00:33:09,255 --> 00:33:12,675
And like, you should be looking at
these issues right here and now.

812
00:33:12,765 --> 00:33:13,095
Right.

813
00:33:13,690 --> 00:33:16,725
And okay, we're always gonna need
people to hold the line, but you're

814
00:33:16,725 --> 00:33:20,264
also gonna need people who can
push things further and forward.

815
00:33:20,325 --> 00:33:20,475
Yeah.

816
00:33:20,475 --> 00:33:23,235
'cause if all you're ever concerned
with is holding that line, that line

817
00:33:23,235 --> 00:33:24,465
moves back, okay, hold it there.

818
00:33:24,465 --> 00:33:25,485
That line moves back again.

819
00:33:25,485 --> 00:33:25,725
Okay.

820
00:33:25,725 --> 00:33:26,325
Hold it there.

821
00:33:26,715 --> 00:33:29,175
Someone's gonna have to push
that line in the other direction.

822
00:33:29,235 --> 00:33:29,445
Yeah.

823
00:33:29,565 --> 00:33:36,675
And what I could see is the, uh, when I
try and look at this and I don't have the

824
00:33:36,675 --> 00:33:40,425
answers, and I try and find out, talk to
other people who might have the answers,

825
00:33:41,175 --> 00:33:43,754
I see some of our gun advocacy advocate.

826
00:33:44,325 --> 00:33:50,715
I see some of our gun advocacy groups
as being very, very good at raising,

827
00:33:51,225 --> 00:33:59,264
uh, donations and memberships by
speaking to their base and perhaps

828
00:33:59,355 --> 00:34:03,705
not putting the same efforts in, in
areas that could actually move the

829
00:34:03,705 --> 00:34:05,805
needle forward or unite communities.

830
00:34:05,925 --> 00:34:06,014
Mm-hmm.

831
00:34:06,254 --> 00:34:07,365
They'll fight with each other.

832
00:34:07,995 --> 00:34:08,955
They'll, uh, uh.

833
00:34:11,220 --> 00:34:14,010
You know, I'm, I'm gonna be cautious
about how I go here 'cause I don't wanna

834
00:34:14,010 --> 00:34:15,659
be tearing down certain groups because

835
00:34:15,659 --> 00:34:16,170
everyone does.

836
00:34:16,380 --> 00:34:16,710
No, listen.

837
00:34:16,710 --> 00:34:20,040
Every every group has its place and
advocacy is incredibly important.

838
00:34:20,310 --> 00:34:21,000
I agree with you.

839
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:24,600
Uh, one of the things though that
I've always thought that we should be

840
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:28,770
advocating more towards is it's really,
it's, it's really simple to send me, you

841
00:34:28,770 --> 00:34:32,610
know, email blasts and you're advocating,
as you said to the base, but why?

842
00:34:32,639 --> 00:34:36,150
But we need to be advocating and
speaking to the non firearms owners.

843
00:34:36,179 --> 00:34:41,429
'cause there's lots of uneducated people
out there that don't understand the,

844
00:34:41,429 --> 00:34:43,740
the, the, i, I know a lot of people.

845
00:34:43,740 --> 00:34:46,290
I think, actually, I think last time
we heard, we talked about during COV,

846
00:34:46,380 --> 00:34:49,110
a lot of people got educated about what
it means to actually own a firearm.

847
00:34:49,170 --> 00:34:52,260
Because I know I was getting contacted
by people saying, I wanna buy a gun.

848
00:34:52,620 --> 00:34:53,040
Cool.

849
00:34:53,310 --> 00:34:54,030
Uh, what's your pal?

850
00:34:54,210 --> 00:34:56,280
You know, just gimme, I need
your pal so I can verify it.

851
00:34:56,310 --> 00:34:57,030
What's a pal?

852
00:34:58,155 --> 00:35:00,105
They just didn't know, like they
didn't know they needed a license.

853
00:35:00,105 --> 00:35:02,505
They didn't know they needed
to go through like training.

854
00:35:02,505 --> 00:35:05,475
They didn't know that to take the, you
know, the, the pal, the PAL course.

855
00:35:06,045 --> 00:35:09,585
They didn't know all, you know that
oh, your weekly, you know, your daily

856
00:35:09,585 --> 00:35:13,125
is subjected to a background check or
like that, like we say these things,

857
00:35:13,515 --> 00:35:17,895
but how much of that is getting out
beyond just the base of the firearms

858
00:35:17,895 --> 00:35:19,335
owners and now to the general public.

859
00:35:19,905 --> 00:35:23,655
But at that town hall meeting, I remember
I talked to the MP and I said in my

860
00:35:23,655 --> 00:35:27,015
previous experience with, uh, wounded
Warriors, uh, when Winters Canada,

861
00:35:27,015 --> 00:35:30,945
where was, uh, we talked about, you
know, advocacy for, uh, veterans with

862
00:35:30,945 --> 00:35:34,545
PTSD and first responders with that
as well as their fa as the families.

863
00:35:35,265 --> 00:35:39,915
And we found a huge component of
that was education, not only of to

864
00:35:39,915 --> 00:35:43,335
the families what was out there, but
also to groups, the regular everyday

865
00:35:43,335 --> 00:35:46,695
population, but also to the government
of kind of, this is actually what

866
00:35:47,565 --> 00:35:48,795
these men and women are facing.

867
00:35:49,335 --> 00:35:51,075
Um, here's what you need to improve.

868
00:35:51,825 --> 00:35:55,125
And so I asked, I told the mp and I'm
like, one of the things that I think

869
00:35:55,125 --> 00:35:56,895
would be really helpful as a government.

870
00:35:57,810 --> 00:36:02,010
Would be to create a simple
information portal of anyone who's

871
00:36:02,010 --> 00:36:04,140
interested in owning a firearm.

872
00:36:04,770 --> 00:36:07,830
Here's the steps you have to do, which
is, it's all government run, you know,

873
00:36:07,830 --> 00:36:09,150
the PAL course, the safety course.

874
00:36:09,150 --> 00:36:09,360
Yes.

875
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:13,620
It's, it's run by the F-S-C-S-O, but
it's essentially, you know, government

876
00:36:13,620 --> 00:36:19,200
mandated and, you know, regulated or like
that to provide an education platform for

877
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:23,280
anyone who's interested in, you know, you
know, purchasing and owning a firearm.

878
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:24,720
What it takes to get there like that.

879
00:36:25,260 --> 00:36:28,530
Uh, unfortunately I was told, well,
that's, that's your responsibility,

880
00:36:28,530 --> 00:36:32,250
not the government's responsibility
to, you know, provide that education.

881
00:36:32,940 --> 00:36:35,760
Uh, so advocating for
the base is excellent.

882
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,040
Firing it up is great because
you need to have that.

883
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,280
But, you know, as you said, we do
kinda need to unite a bit better, but

884
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:47,130
we also need to educate the population
that doesn't understand what's what

885
00:36:47,130 --> 00:36:50,310
we, what we go through to own a
firearm, what we go through to be

886
00:36:50,310 --> 00:36:51,570
part of that community, or like that.

887
00:36:52,050 --> 00:36:55,470
I, I think there's a number of steps
that are already in place that people.

888
00:36:55,875 --> 00:36:58,635
Like you say, they don't understand,
but you know, I don't know.

889
00:36:58,635 --> 00:37:00,525
You're not gonna convince the
people who don't like them.

890
00:37:00,610 --> 00:37:01,215
No, no.

891
00:37:01,275 --> 00:37:03,735
Uh, the people who do like 'em,
you don't have to convince.

892
00:37:03,885 --> 00:37:04,095
Right?

893
00:37:04,095 --> 00:37:04,155
Yeah.

894
00:37:04,155 --> 00:37:07,455
Because they, they already like 'em
for whatever their reason's gonna be.

895
00:37:07,965 --> 00:37:14,865
But the, the political side, I, I,
I think personally, uh, educating.

896
00:37:15,285 --> 00:37:19,635
The base as to how to
properly approach politicians.

897
00:37:20,175 --> 00:37:20,265
Mm-hmm.

898
00:37:20,505 --> 00:37:20,565
Yeah.

899
00:37:20,565 --> 00:37:21,675
In a respectful way.

900
00:37:21,675 --> 00:37:21,735
Yeah.

901
00:37:22,095 --> 00:37:24,105
How to apply pressure properly.

902
00:37:24,105 --> 00:37:30,195
And so that if, let's say, and how, how
to form a, a cogent argument or a, uh,

903
00:37:30,195 --> 00:37:34,815
something that would be politically,
um, distasteful for, uh, somebody

904
00:37:34,815 --> 00:37:39,525
to want to wear if the conversation
shifts, if it's, Hey, we're gonna ban

905
00:37:39,525 --> 00:37:40,995
guns because look at all the shootings.

906
00:37:41,085 --> 00:37:42,525
Uh, no more guns, some more shootings.

907
00:37:42,525 --> 00:37:42,825
Right?

908
00:37:43,125 --> 00:37:47,115
That logic flow is easy to digest.

909
00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:47,290
Yeah.

910
00:37:47,355 --> 00:37:47,535
Yeah.

911
00:37:47,535 --> 00:37:48,705
In a quick tag line.

912
00:37:49,005 --> 00:37:49,335
Right.

913
00:37:49,575 --> 00:37:53,475
But the reality of it is, okay,
we've been taking all these steps

914
00:37:53,475 --> 00:37:56,565
to ban and shootings are going
up, or crimes going up, right?

915
00:37:56,565 --> 00:37:56,655
Yeah.

916
00:37:57,285 --> 00:38:01,845
Where is our, uh, where are
our efforts best served?

917
00:38:01,845 --> 00:38:06,495
And I think it has to become politically
convenient for, uh, people to.

918
00:38:07,260 --> 00:38:09,660
Uh, to be able to speak
out in a certain way.

919
00:38:09,660 --> 00:38:12,840
'cause I, I think there's a, like,
we look at cancel culture, right?

920
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:17,280
And, uh, I see cancel culture
kind of going by the wayside.

921
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:20,820
Uh, people are, that was at,
at least it doesn't have the

922
00:38:20,820 --> 00:38:22,350
same push that it had before.

923
00:38:22,890 --> 00:38:22,980
Mm-hmm.

924
00:38:23,220 --> 00:38:26,490
Uh, but people like to belong and
they want, they don't want to be found

925
00:38:26,490 --> 00:38:28,470
on the wrong side of an argument.

926
00:38:28,470 --> 00:38:30,630
And, uh, everyone else is
saying a certain thing.

927
00:38:30,630 --> 00:38:32,040
And I guess it's easy enough to do.

928
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:33,420
Like you see that often enough.

929
00:38:33,780 --> 00:38:38,340
How do you make it easy for the
masses to push together in a way

930
00:38:38,340 --> 00:38:42,240
that's gonna be beneficial for
everybody, for, for the masses, right?

931
00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:42,250
Mm-hmm.

932
00:38:42,250 --> 00:38:43,890
And including the gun owners.

933
00:38:43,895 --> 00:38:47,100
And, and I think, uh, that's
where our efforts have

934
00:38:47,100 --> 00:38:47,610
to be.

935
00:38:47,610 --> 00:38:48,570
Uh, uh, yeah.

936
00:38:48,660 --> 00:38:49,530
I would, I I would agree.

937
00:38:49,590 --> 00:38:52,020
And, uh, to your comment, uh, that,
you know, you're never gonna convince

938
00:38:52,020 --> 00:38:53,460
someone who doesn't like him.

939
00:38:53,460 --> 00:38:54,330
And you, you're right.

940
00:38:54,570 --> 00:38:56,220
I, like, I, I liken it to this.

941
00:38:56,700 --> 00:39:00,840
When I was in, um, college and I was
taking, uh, I was in firefighter training

942
00:39:01,500 --> 00:39:04,890
and I was part of my medical training,
they said, uh, 10% of the people.

943
00:39:05,370 --> 00:39:07,980
No matter what you do are gonna die.

944
00:39:08,550 --> 00:39:08,760
Sure.

945
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:11,310
10% of the people you run
across, no matter what happens

946
00:39:11,310 --> 00:39:12,000
to them, are gonna live.

947
00:39:12,390 --> 00:39:12,570
Sure.

948
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:14,130
It's that 80%.

949
00:39:14,130 --> 00:39:16,380
That's the, that's the group you
need to deal with with like that.

950
00:39:16,380 --> 00:39:20,160
And I, I, you know, I just a quick, you
know, point before we get to the second

951
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:25,740
one you said, but I've been in the
homes of, you know, I, I die a diehard,

952
00:39:25,950 --> 00:39:29,160
you know, some diehard, you know,
liberals or diehard anti-gun people.

953
00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:31,140
And then they ask, well,
why do you need a gun?

954
00:39:31,140 --> 00:39:32,220
And I'm like, I don't need one.

955
00:39:32,225 --> 00:39:32,535
Mm-hmm.

956
00:39:32,730 --> 00:39:34,680
I, I enjoy having it.

957
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:36,960
It's, it's a privilege I've earned
and this is the steps I've taken to

958
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:40,590
do it, but I can't just walk around
with it, you know, in my, like, on my,

959
00:39:40,950 --> 00:39:43,855
it's not like in the US I can't walk
around with it on my, like, I, I don't,

960
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:46,830
I don't have a carry permit or like
that, like that doesn't exist so much.

961
00:39:46,830 --> 00:39:49,740
And it, it's hard, extremely
difficult to get in Canada.

962
00:39:50,310 --> 00:39:51,720
I don't just walk around.

963
00:39:51,780 --> 00:39:53,940
There's a, there's rules
to transporting these guns.

964
00:39:53,940 --> 00:39:54,870
There's rules to storage.

965
00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,180
And after explain all this
to the person, they're like.

966
00:39:58,004 --> 00:39:58,904
Well, that makes sense.

967
00:39:59,055 --> 00:39:59,325
Hmm.

968
00:39:59,564 --> 00:39:59,805
Okay.

969
00:39:59,805 --> 00:40:02,745
Like, I understand that and I'm like,
they didn't know that before and all

970
00:40:02,745 --> 00:40:06,375
of a sudden it, they may still not
think, oh, I, I don't want a gun.

971
00:40:06,645 --> 00:40:06,944
Hmm.

972
00:40:07,530 --> 00:40:09,420
But I understand necessarily
why you want one.

973
00:40:09,420 --> 00:40:13,020
I understand the steps you have to take
then to get one so you're not convincing

974
00:40:13,020 --> 00:40:16,710
them, but they're not necessarily,
and then now, so diehard kind of like,

975
00:40:16,740 --> 00:40:18,180
well, I didn't know that had to happen.

976
00:40:18,180 --> 00:40:18,990
If that's the case.

977
00:40:18,990 --> 00:40:19,350
Oh, okay.

978
00:40:19,350 --> 00:40:20,220
I guess I'm okay with it.

979
00:40:20,220 --> 00:40:23,370
If you guys want one, they don't
necessarily need to be the one, they don't

980
00:40:23,370 --> 00:40:25,800
wanna necessarily want to have to have
the, be the one that actually buys it or

981
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:30,630
own it, but all of a sudden they're no
longer as hardcore about me owning one.

982
00:40:31,025 --> 00:40:32,040
And I, and I think you're right.

983
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:35,160
You don't have to convince
other people of your side.

984
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:37,050
And I think that's a, a losing battle.

985
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:37,320
Mm-hmm.

986
00:40:37,590 --> 00:40:39,390
Um, but having them.

987
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:40,890
Asking some questions.

988
00:40:40,890 --> 00:40:41,130
No.

989
00:40:41,130 --> 00:40:41,850
Opening them up.

990
00:40:42,030 --> 00:40:42,150
Yeah.

991
00:40:42,210 --> 00:40:42,990
Why do you need a gun?

992
00:40:43,020 --> 00:40:45,180
Well, some people actually
do need a gun, right?

993
00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:47,340
Like some people, not
everybody lives in the city.

994
00:40:47,370 --> 00:40:47,550
Yeah.

995
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:50,340
And some people who live in
the city probably need a gun.

996
00:40:51,690 --> 00:40:52,020
Yes.

997
00:40:52,020 --> 00:40:52,140
Yeah.

998
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:54,570
But, uh, but definitely, but
like, yeah, you're right.

999
00:40:54,570 --> 00:40:58,200
I, I have friends who are farmers and
like that, and they have, you know, they,

1000
00:40:58,470 --> 00:40:59,760
they, they need one on their property.

1001
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:02,640
Why do they want, well, because they need
to defend their, you know, what their,

1002
00:41:02,700 --> 00:41:05,130
their, you know, their, uh, their animals.

1003
00:41:05,130 --> 00:41:07,620
They need to defend, be able to defend
their property from large breeders.

1004
00:41:07,620 --> 00:41:08,970
They need to be able to themselves.

1005
00:41:08,970 --> 00:41:12,210
If they go out with like that,
uh, you know, why do you hunt?

1006
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:13,200
Well, 'cause I enjoy it.

1007
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:13,770
Or like that.

1008
00:41:14,190 --> 00:41:16,500
Well, aren't, don't you feel
bad about, you know, taking,

1009
00:41:16,500 --> 00:41:17,430
you know, killing a deer?

1010
00:41:17,670 --> 00:41:21,090
No, because I have a tag, because
they've done studies to realize that

1011
00:41:21,090 --> 00:41:23,550
we're allowed to take this many deer
without affecting the population.

1012
00:41:23,550 --> 00:41:24,180
In fact.

1013
00:41:24,705 --> 00:41:27,405
We're making sure that everything's
in a, in a healthy balance.

1014
00:41:27,435 --> 00:41:30,225
'cause if there's too much of a
certain, you know, animal like that,

1015
00:41:30,615 --> 00:41:33,195
it's no longer a healthy ecosystem
or like, you know, same thing.

1016
00:41:33,195 --> 00:41:33,885
Why do you fish?

1017
00:41:33,885 --> 00:41:35,805
Well, because I enjoy it.

1018
00:41:36,045 --> 00:41:36,105
Yeah.

1019
00:41:36,135 --> 00:41:36,645
For one.

1020
00:41:37,185 --> 00:41:40,335
Um, and two, it's because
I'm allowed to do it.

1021
00:41:40,395 --> 00:41:42,975
And because you can't have
too much of one thing.

1022
00:41:43,380 --> 00:41:46,185
It's like you, you can't eat
too much pizza or you can't

1023
00:41:46,185 --> 00:41:48,105
have too much McDonald's 'cause
you're not gonna feel good.

1024
00:41:49,605 --> 00:41:49,665
Yeah.

1025
00:41:49,665 --> 00:41:50,025
It took me a long

1026
00:41:50,025 --> 00:41:51,105
time to put that correlation

1027
00:41:51,105 --> 00:41:51,265
of it.

1028
00:41:51,265 --> 00:41:52,670
Of course we can do
whatever we feel like that.

1029
00:41:52,675 --> 00:41:52,785
Yeah.

1030
00:41:52,785 --> 00:41:56,145
Like, like we still do it, obviously,
but, uh, but you know what I mean, it's

1031
00:41:56,145 --> 00:42:00,135
that it's the whole, a lot of people
don't understand like that, that the

1032
00:42:00,135 --> 00:42:03,975
conservation, you know, and hunting isn't
just about going and killing an animal.

1033
00:42:03,975 --> 00:42:04,455
It's a one.

1034
00:42:04,455 --> 00:42:09,345
You know, and people ask me, uh, I'm
not really a, a waterfowl hunter.

1035
00:42:09,555 --> 00:42:09,765
Sure.

1036
00:42:10,065 --> 00:42:11,385
'cause I don't really like duck.

1037
00:42:11,715 --> 00:42:11,985
Sure.

1038
00:42:12,345 --> 00:42:13,335
I'm a big, I'm a thing.

1039
00:42:13,335 --> 00:42:15,495
I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna hunt
something that I'm not gonna eat.

1040
00:42:15,510 --> 00:42:15,630
I

1041
00:42:15,630 --> 00:42:15,750
agree.

1042
00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:16,110
Uh,

1043
00:42:17,250 --> 00:42:18,630
I have friends that
love waterfowl hunting.

1044
00:42:18,630 --> 00:42:19,980
It's just not really my
thing or anything like that.

1045
00:42:19,980 --> 00:42:24,060
I like, you know, I'll hunt deer, I'll
go Turkey hunting, uh, you know, and I'll

1046
00:42:24,240 --> 00:42:26,279
go, you know, farm it and stuff like that.

1047
00:42:26,279 --> 00:42:29,400
I help out a friend's, uh, farm and he's
like, you can hunt on my property, but if

1048
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:31,529
you see a coyote, you got, you shoot it.

1049
00:42:31,529 --> 00:42:31,620
Yep.

1050
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:32,190
Okay.

1051
00:42:32,250 --> 00:42:32,610
No problem.

1052
00:42:33,029 --> 00:42:34,920
'cause there's rules.

1053
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:35,279
Yeah, there's rules around that.

1054
00:42:35,310 --> 00:42:39,480
I'm helping 'em out, but, uh, I,
by not just a, you know, it's just

1055
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:41,640
not really, it's just not my thing.

1056
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,730
And again, I might get some hateful
comments there, but that does, it's just,

1057
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:48,090
but it's because I have a, I have, I have
a rule in my head that I will, I'm not

1058
00:42:48,090 --> 00:42:49,350
gonna kill someone that I'm not gonna eat.

1059
00:42:49,350 --> 00:42:49,500
Right.

1060
00:42:49,500 --> 00:42:49,620
Yeah.

1061
00:42:49,620 --> 00:42:50,340
No, I don't think you get a

1062
00:42:50,340 --> 00:42:51,299
hateful comments for that.

1063
00:42:51,299 --> 00:42:51,310
Yeah.

1064
00:42:51,630 --> 00:42:54,840
You know, there's, I'm still
surprised by the number of people

1065
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:57,930
who don't know that you can actually
still buy handguns in Canada.

1066
00:42:57,930 --> 00:42:58,230
Mm-hmm.

1067
00:42:58,665 --> 00:42:58,884
Um.

1068
00:43:00,134 --> 00:43:04,725
So for employment reasons, if you need
it for your job or for work, you can,

1069
00:43:04,785 --> 00:43:06,375
you can go ahead and still buy hand guys.

1070
00:43:06,375 --> 00:43:06,645
You can.

1071
00:43:06,645 --> 00:43:06,950
Yep, yep.

1072
00:43:06,955 --> 00:43:09,464
There are provisions there and
there's a lot of people who

1073
00:43:09,464 --> 00:43:13,035
don't actually understand the
totality of what that means.

1074
00:43:13,125 --> 00:43:16,935
And if they, so I've, I, without going
too far into it, if they're interested,

1075
00:43:17,265 --> 00:43:19,004
they can listen to past podcasts.

1076
00:43:19,064 --> 00:43:19,995
They, with Rachel Atilla.

1077
00:43:19,995 --> 00:43:20,084
Mm-hmm.

1078
00:43:20,325 --> 00:43:20,415
Yep.

1079
00:43:20,415 --> 00:43:23,115
She got her authorization to
carry, purchased some pangan.

1080
00:43:23,444 --> 00:43:27,825
I put together, I think it was
30 pages of, um, material for the

1081
00:43:27,825 --> 00:43:29,294
National Firearms Association.

1082
00:43:29,325 --> 00:43:32,924
You can download that for
free, step by step shows you,

1083
00:43:32,984 --> 00:43:34,185
will, you meet the criteria.

1084
00:43:34,185 --> 00:43:35,504
What do those criteria look like?

1085
00:43:35,504 --> 00:43:39,584
And, 'cause I think it's important
that people like absolutely don't

1086
00:43:40,424 --> 00:43:42,765
push things in, in a way that
they're not supposed to be pushed.

1087
00:43:42,765 --> 00:43:43,035
Yeah.

1088
00:43:43,095 --> 00:43:45,794
Don't find a workaround in a way
that you're not supposed to find

1089
00:43:45,794 --> 00:43:49,365
a workaround, but be educated as
to what the rules actually are.

1090
00:43:49,365 --> 00:43:49,424
Yeah.

1091
00:43:49,484 --> 00:43:56,234
And, and, uh, I think people can be pretty
surprised at how many, uh, individuals.

1092
00:43:56,850 --> 00:43:59,160
Still qualify for purchasing a handgun.

1093
00:43:59,550 --> 00:43:59,670
Yeah.

1094
00:43:59,670 --> 00:44:03,390
Now I will say, going back to the
defense and law enforcement side of

1095
00:44:03,390 --> 00:44:06,540
this, ever since they decided to put
this freeze and this ban, 'cause they

1096
00:44:06,540 --> 00:44:12,810
froze handgun sales, but they also banned
imports, uh, initially right now with

1097
00:44:12,810 --> 00:44:14,490
the exception of government agency.

1098
00:44:14,940 --> 00:44:15,420
Sure.

1099
00:44:16,595 --> 00:44:19,080
But, but when they banned the
imports, they actually banned it.

1100
00:44:19,230 --> 00:44:20,850
They just blanket banded earth like that.

1101
00:44:20,850 --> 00:44:23,040
So everything, it took a little
while for us to figure out how

1102
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:26,400
to actually get handguns back in
the country, and it is still very

1103
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:29,280
difficult really to bring handguns in.

1104
00:44:29,460 --> 00:44:32,340
Uh, so what they've, by doing it,
they've also made it very difficult

1105
00:44:32,340 --> 00:44:34,110
to bring handguns in to support.

1106
00:44:34,710 --> 00:44:37,439
Law enforcement agencies and
military agencies within Canada.

1107
00:44:38,009 --> 00:44:41,879
Um, it's, uh, an ex, there's a,
used to be, I'd just be able to

1108
00:44:41,879 --> 00:44:45,240
apply for an international import
certificate, an IEC, right?

1109
00:44:45,750 --> 00:44:46,770
That's no longer allowed.

1110
00:44:47,250 --> 00:44:47,640
Really?

1111
00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:51,029
I have to apply for what they call an arms
ammunitions permit from Global Affairs.

1112
00:44:51,029 --> 00:44:54,540
Well, I can't, but I, as a, as a
manufacturer, I can't apply for that.

1113
00:44:54,779 --> 00:44:57,149
I have to get my customs
broker to apply for it.

1114
00:44:57,270 --> 00:44:57,870
Right?

1115
00:44:57,899 --> 00:45:00,600
And to do that, I have to
have commercial invoicing.

1116
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,810
I have to have FRT, which is
the registration completed.

1117
00:45:03,810 --> 00:45:06,299
I have to have list of serial
numbers from the manufacturer.

1118
00:45:06,299 --> 00:45:07,740
It's a whole long list of stuff.

1119
00:45:07,770 --> 00:45:10,980
Is it something we've kinda worked
out now and we kinda guys, we've

1120
00:45:11,310 --> 00:45:12,810
as a smooth trajectory to do now?

1121
00:45:12,810 --> 00:45:15,810
Yes, we do, but it's an extra,
it's a couple extra steps.

1122
00:45:16,740 --> 00:45:19,859
That initially, I remember when
they first, when they first put the

1123
00:45:19,859 --> 00:45:22,919
freeze in, and I had a client come
to me and say, okay, we're we wanna

1124
00:45:22,919 --> 00:45:24,120
order a thousand more handguns?

1125
00:45:24,149 --> 00:45:26,339
And we literally told 'em,
we don't know how to do this.

1126
00:45:27,149 --> 00:45:27,210
Wow.

1127
00:45:27,210 --> 00:45:29,069
'cause now there is no vehicle to do it.

1128
00:45:29,310 --> 00:45:29,819
Wow.

1129
00:45:29,879 --> 00:45:32,940
And it took us six months with working
with Global Affairs to figure it out.

1130
00:45:32,940 --> 00:45:33,130
Six months.

1131
00:45:33,990 --> 00:45:37,799
And meanwhile you have an agency that
can't get their duty issued firearms

1132
00:45:38,129 --> 00:45:41,430
because, uh, so when that, when
that occurred or like that it's all

1133
00:45:41,430 --> 00:45:42,839
No, it's all been smoothed out now.

1134
00:45:43,109 --> 00:45:44,250
But again, are you surprised?

1135
00:45:45,029 --> 00:45:48,029
Well, no, but you know,
because, uh, it always.

1136
00:45:49,290 --> 00:45:49,950
I, I don't know.

1137
00:45:49,950 --> 00:45:52,830
It, it always makes me scratch my
head a little bit as to like, number

1138
00:45:52,830 --> 00:45:54,870
one, why it would end up like that.

1139
00:45:54,870 --> 00:45:56,310
Like the, that no one can bring it in.

1140
00:45:56,310 --> 00:46:01,470
Number two, what had to happen in order to
be able to, uh, figure out a way around,

1141
00:46:01,650 --> 00:46:03,480
would that be policy interpretation?

1142
00:46:03,510 --> 00:46:04,800
Was new law created

1143
00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:06,480
and, uh, not that I'm aware of.

1144
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:09,060
Or like the arms, the arms
emissions ity existed, right?

1145
00:46:09,060 --> 00:46:11,160
I guess they just found, okay,
here's a vehicle where we can

1146
00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:12,030
do it now with, like that.

1147
00:46:12,030 --> 00:46:15,330
So they kind of switched over to
this, but, uh, it just, it, when you

1148
00:46:15,330 --> 00:46:18,720
put a blanket ban on something, you
don't realize that it affects, you

1149
00:46:18,720 --> 00:46:22,140
don't, it's hard to exempt something
when you, when you, you know, like,

1150
00:46:22,140 --> 00:46:25,290
so it was an interesting, uh, a
couple years, a couple years ago.

1151
00:46:25,290 --> 00:46:27,480
It was an interesting couple
of months there like that, but

1152
00:46:27,570 --> 00:46:28,020
I believe it.

1153
00:46:28,020 --> 00:46:30,930
But I, I guess that goes to
the point which, and most

1154
00:46:30,930 --> 00:46:31,890
likely they found another way.

1155
00:46:31,890 --> 00:46:33,180
There's already something in there.

1156
00:46:33,180 --> 00:46:36,750
So there's the letter of the law
and there's the intent of the law.

1157
00:46:36,755 --> 00:46:37,005
Mm-hmm.

1158
00:46:37,290 --> 00:46:39,270
And, um.

1159
00:46:40,710 --> 00:46:43,500
If they're able to find a
different way around it, that means

1160
00:46:43,500 --> 00:46:48,450
basically the intent of the law
is being applied through policy.

1161
00:46:48,509 --> 00:46:48,600
Mm-hmm.

1162
00:46:48,870 --> 00:46:52,379
Uh, through civil servants
whom we don't elect in or out.

1163
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:52,680
Nope.

1164
00:46:52,685 --> 00:46:52,955
Nope.

1165
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:59,069
And who will maintain through governments,
and I'm finding just not on the business

1166
00:46:59,069 --> 00:47:04,770
side, but the individual side, the
ability to navigate the, the civil servant

1167
00:47:04,770 --> 00:47:08,040
bureaucracy is, uh, it's an art form.

1168
00:47:08,220 --> 00:47:09,060
It's not something Yes.

1169
00:47:09,089 --> 00:47:11,580
It's definitely not something that
I would, that comes natural to.

1170
00:47:12,060 --> 00:47:14,850
To me, and I've gotten a lot
of coaching and assistance

1171
00:47:14,850 --> 00:47:16,050
in how to be able to do that.

1172
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:20,520
But that's another area where I think
the, uh, the general firearms wanting

1173
00:47:20,550 --> 00:47:22,410
public can use help from their mm-hmm.

1174
00:47:22,800 --> 00:47:23,310
Uh, different.

1175
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:26,430
Well, and, and I'll tell you like
Travis, so over nine years of this

1176
00:47:26,430 --> 00:47:32,340
job, that's something I've had to, uh,
really work on trying to navigate and,

1177
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,235
uh, work to, you know, I work with all.

1178
00:47:34,825 --> 00:47:35,544
The government agencies.

1179
00:47:35,544 --> 00:47:36,415
'cause I, I have to

1180
00:47:36,654 --> 00:47:36,955
Mm.

1181
00:47:37,075 --> 00:47:40,555
Uh, and the government no bureaucracies
because otherwise nothing gets,

1182
00:47:40,825 --> 00:47:41,964
nothing gets done on my side.

1183
00:47:41,964 --> 00:47:42,145
So.

1184
00:47:42,149 --> 00:47:42,299
Mm-hmm.

1185
00:47:42,625 --> 00:47:45,625
Uh, I'm pretty, you know, you learn to be
pretty well versed on it, but it's taken

1186
00:47:45,685 --> 00:47:47,245
years to get, figure it out like that.

1187
00:47:47,245 --> 00:47:51,415
So it is not the average person, unless
you are constantly bidding on government

1188
00:47:51,415 --> 00:47:54,865
contracts or like that, why would you
know about the bureaucracy process to,

1189
00:47:55,075 --> 00:47:55,404
but it's a

1190
00:47:55,404 --> 00:47:56,395
game to go through it, right?

1191
00:47:56,424 --> 00:47:56,634
Yeah.

1192
00:47:56,694 --> 00:47:57,174
It's no

1193
00:47:57,174 --> 00:47:57,895
hate against the

1194
00:47:57,895 --> 00:47:58,794
individuals in there.

1195
00:47:58,825 --> 00:47:59,274
Absolutely not.

1196
00:47:59,274 --> 00:48:01,075
It's no hate against, they're
doing, they're doing a job.

1197
00:48:01,134 --> 00:48:02,154
They're just like anyone else's.

1198
00:48:02,154 --> 00:48:02,665
So like that.

1199
00:48:02,665 --> 00:48:06,085
And it's not that they're, you
know, they're not trying to make,

1200
00:48:06,145 --> 00:48:07,254
you know, things harder for you.

1201
00:48:07,285 --> 00:48:10,915
They're just working in one
office in a, in a very big system.

1202
00:48:11,185 --> 00:48:15,205
Every once in a while you'll find
that one individual who will, uh,

1203
00:48:15,234 --> 00:48:16,495
make things really difficult for you.

1204
00:48:16,734 --> 00:48:20,424
You'll find that one individual who
will make things really easy for you.

1205
00:48:20,424 --> 00:48:20,575
Right.

1206
00:48:20,575 --> 00:48:20,964
It's just like.

1207
00:48:21,884 --> 00:48:23,055
Policing or anywhere

1208
00:48:23,060 --> 00:48:26,355
you, you would find that in at, at a
line, at the drive, anywhere Starbucks

1209
00:48:26,355 --> 00:48:26,805
or like that.

1210
00:48:27,045 --> 00:48:30,915
You're always gonna find that
1% policing or just switched

1211
00:48:30,915 --> 00:48:32,295
straight off Somebody like that.

1212
00:48:32,295 --> 00:48:32,535
Yeah,

1213
00:48:32,595 --> 00:48:37,245
that 1%, that's terrible, but
that 98% that the masses are

1214
00:48:37,245 --> 00:48:40,095
going to be just, we're humans.

1215
00:48:40,305 --> 00:48:40,964
Animals.

1216
00:48:41,055 --> 00:48:41,174
Yep.

1217
00:48:41,415 --> 00:48:43,694
There's a reason why
animals have game trails.

1218
00:48:43,875 --> 00:48:46,035
It's because they find a safe path.

1219
00:48:46,214 --> 00:48:47,535
They take that safe path.

1220
00:48:47,565 --> 00:48:47,625
Yeah.

1221
00:48:47,654 --> 00:48:49,125
It's a path of least resistance.

1222
00:48:49,530 --> 00:48:54,900
And that's the area that I think that
individuals in the firearms community

1223
00:48:55,140 --> 00:49:00,780
can use the most help on is how do you
understand that game and that safe path.

1224
00:49:01,110 --> 00:49:04,740
So you can allow the civil servant
to do their job in a way that doesn't

1225
00:49:04,950 --> 00:49:07,980
make them look bad, allows 'em to
do it in a way that they've got

1226
00:49:07,980 --> 00:49:10,860
accountability and defensibility and
they're showing the public they're

1227
00:49:10,860 --> 00:49:14,040
doing the right thing, but also allows
you to get where you need to go.

1228
00:49:14,100 --> 00:49:14,250
Yeah.

1229
00:49:14,370 --> 00:49:19,470
And now I remember Dave Tomlinson, uh,
deceased many years ago, but he started

1230
00:49:19,470 --> 00:49:23,280
the NFA, I think he started it, but
he was basically the NFA for a number

1231
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:29,820
of years, and he put out this, um,
authorization to transport a cheat sheet.

1232
00:49:30,450 --> 00:49:33,090
And prior to him putting that out.

1233
00:49:33,810 --> 00:49:37,770
The firearms program says, okay,
you've got a restricted firearm.

1234
00:49:37,980 --> 00:49:41,400
You, if you want to transport it,
you're gonna need a separate document.

1235
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:42,810
An authorization to transport.

1236
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:43,050
Yep.

1237
00:49:43,055 --> 00:49:43,065
Yep.

1238
00:49:43,140 --> 00:49:43,980
So you fill this out.

1239
00:49:43,980 --> 00:49:46,410
Your, your firearms license
is good for five years.

1240
00:49:46,590 --> 00:49:49,320
Your a TT is good for
one, two, or three years.

1241
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:50,670
How long do you want it to be good for?

1242
00:49:50,700 --> 00:49:50,940
Right.

1243
00:49:50,940 --> 00:49:52,080
And so people have to fill it out.

1244
00:49:52,410 --> 00:49:54,450
What time of the day do you
think you're gonna transport it?

1245
00:49:54,450 --> 00:49:56,910
So they fill it out, where are
you gonna transport it from?

1246
00:49:56,910 --> 00:49:58,890
Well, and from my house over to the rings.

1247
00:49:58,890 --> 00:50:01,260
And they fill out the name of the rings
and they go through this whole thing.

1248
00:50:01,260 --> 00:50:03,390
Dave Tomlinson says, hold on a second.

1249
00:50:03,690 --> 00:50:05,670
If it's good for three
years, pick three years.

1250
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:07,080
When are you gonna transport it?

1251
00:50:07,260 --> 00:50:10,410
Well, why would you want to be a
criminal if you're transporting

1252
00:50:10,410 --> 00:50:13,500
outside of the hours that you put
down because your car broke down

1253
00:50:13,500 --> 00:50:14,730
or because there's a traffic down.

1254
00:50:14,910 --> 00:50:14,970
Yeah.

1255
00:50:14,970 --> 00:50:16,530
2,400 to 2,400.

1256
00:50:16,890 --> 00:50:18,210
Uh, what range?

1257
00:50:18,210 --> 00:50:19,590
All approved gun clubs are ranges.

1258
00:50:19,590 --> 00:50:21,240
So he created this sort of thing.

1259
00:50:21,645 --> 00:50:24,615
The firearms program looks
at it and says, yeah, okay.

1260
00:50:24,615 --> 00:50:25,635
I guess that makes sense.

1261
00:50:25,635 --> 00:50:29,265
And after a while, nobody had
to fill out by this cheat sheet.

1262
00:50:29,295 --> 00:50:30,580
They just knew how to issue it.

1263
00:50:30,580 --> 00:50:31,100
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1264
00:50:31,105 --> 00:50:32,145
It was easy for them.

1265
00:50:32,175 --> 00:50:32,925
Made sense.

1266
00:50:32,925 --> 00:50:34,275
It was easy for the individual.

1267
00:50:34,275 --> 00:50:37,575
They play, played by the rules, but
you always need those outliers who

1268
00:50:37,575 --> 00:50:43,335
can objectively look at it and find
a way that allows the, um, civil

1269
00:50:43,335 --> 00:50:44,865
server to do their job and save face.

1270
00:50:44,865 --> 00:50:48,615
And that's something, that's why I
created that template on a, on ATCs.

1271
00:50:48,645 --> 00:50:48,735
Mm-hmm.

1272
00:50:48,975 --> 00:50:49,635
It's not a cheat.

1273
00:50:49,635 --> 00:50:50,685
It's not a workaround.

1274
00:50:50,955 --> 00:50:54,135
It just tells people who's
actually eligible for it.

1275
00:50:54,140 --> 00:50:54,180
Yeah.

1276
00:50:54,180 --> 00:50:55,275
And, and, and how to do it.

1277
00:50:55,545 --> 00:50:57,075
And I think if we can start pushing.

1278
00:50:57,585 --> 00:51:02,145
Those sort of things, we might
find more effective change on,

1279
00:51:02,174 --> 00:51:04,665
uh, our ability to use guns.

1280
00:51:04,694 --> 00:51:04,845
Yeah.

1281
00:51:04,995 --> 00:51:05,265
Yep.

1282
00:51:05,325 --> 00:51:07,935
As opposed to that one,
the civil server one.

1283
00:51:07,935 --> 00:51:11,384
And then the, of course, the
political side of which I'm,

1284
00:51:11,565 --> 00:51:12,555
I'm not a political guy.

1285
00:51:13,424 --> 00:51:15,555
I, I talk to other people
much smarter than myself.

1286
00:51:15,555 --> 00:51:15,795
It is an

1287
00:51:15,795 --> 00:51:18,105
art, uh, to manage politics
or anything like that.

1288
00:51:18,105 --> 00:51:18,495
And yeah.

1289
00:51:18,495 --> 00:51:22,964
That's, it's not something a lot
of people don't have a lot of PA

1290
00:51:22,964 --> 00:51:25,665
lot of politicians don't have the
ability to work the political system.

1291
00:51:25,665 --> 00:51:25,815
Right.

1292
00:51:25,815 --> 00:51:26,625
That, let's face it.

1293
00:51:26,629 --> 00:51:26,690
Sure.

1294
00:51:26,710 --> 00:51:29,234
So it's a, it's, it is an art
form and there's some, there's

1295
00:51:29,234 --> 00:51:31,665
some people out there that can
just do it expertly like that.

1296
00:51:31,665 --> 00:51:32,444
Mm-hmm.

1297
00:51:32,446 --> 00:51:35,205
Uh, and they have my respect that
actually that they can actually

1298
00:51:35,924 --> 00:51:37,725
survive in that, that that arena.

1299
00:51:37,725 --> 00:51:38,234
Because

1300
00:51:38,265 --> 00:51:39,569
if they can do it with
integrity, well, yeah.

1301
00:51:39,569 --> 00:51:39,930
Hell yeah.

1302
00:51:39,950 --> 00:51:41,325
As long as it, yeah, that's, I say as

1303
00:51:41,325 --> 00:51:44,085
long as they do with
integrity because Wow.

1304
00:51:44,145 --> 00:51:47,325
Um, but, uh, but it, it's a
difficult, difficult system.

1305
00:51:47,325 --> 00:51:49,484
But I agree, I agree with basically
everything you're saying is that like,

1306
00:51:49,484 --> 00:51:52,154
you know, that you, you need, we need to
be able to be a little more educated, a

1307
00:51:52,154 --> 00:51:55,515
little more ability to work within the
system that unfortunately we have to.

1308
00:51:56,325 --> 00:51:59,415
That we live with in Canada
and we need to be able to, um,

1309
00:52:01,484 --> 00:52:04,995
you know, utilize it to the, uh, our,
our, our benefit a bit more like that.

1310
00:52:04,995 --> 00:52:05,174
Right?

1311
00:52:05,174 --> 00:52:07,694
So, but by educating
ourselves on how to do it,

1312
00:52:07,740 --> 00:52:10,725
and I, and I think if people look
at it from a different perspective,

1313
00:52:10,725 --> 00:52:13,545
'cause there's just us against I
mentality that I quite often see

1314
00:52:13,935 --> 00:52:15,435
and I get where it comes from.

1315
00:52:15,495 --> 00:52:18,375
I mean, when there's so many rules
that are put on an individual or

1316
00:52:18,375 --> 00:52:20,805
on a group, all of a sudden they
start making their own rules.

1317
00:52:20,805 --> 00:52:22,279
'cause they wanna feel
like they have Yeah, yeah.

1318
00:52:22,285 --> 00:52:24,525
Their own control over things.

1319
00:52:24,525 --> 00:52:27,884
And then they, you find
these different subsections.

1320
00:52:28,154 --> 00:52:33,765
But if you can learn how to use the
rules or change the rules politically

1321
00:52:33,765 --> 00:52:38,475
or through, uh, the civil servant
process, uh, maybe people will

1322
00:52:38,475 --> 00:52:41,295
start playing together because they
understand how that game is played.

1323
00:52:41,295 --> 00:52:41,759
And yeah, maybe.

1324
00:52:41,759 --> 00:52:42,000
Yeah.

1325
00:52:42,420 --> 00:52:45,705
And, you know, I don't have it
fully fleshed out on the, the path

1326
00:52:45,705 --> 00:52:48,645
forward, but it's something I've
been thinking about lately as to.

1327
00:52:49,455 --> 00:52:57,555
How businesses, organizations, individuals
can, uh, achieve an ends that meets

1328
00:52:57,555 --> 00:53:01,185
public safety needs and allows civil
servants to show their due diligence.

1329
00:53:01,275 --> 00:53:01,515
Yeah.

1330
00:53:01,515 --> 00:53:01,525
Yeah.

1331
00:53:02,235 --> 00:53:06,225
Well, and, and I think, uh, you know,
most gun owners out there agree that,

1332
00:53:06,225 --> 00:53:09,705
you know, like we, we play a huge part
in the public safety aspect of it.

1333
00:53:09,825 --> 00:53:09,915
Mm-hmm.

1334
00:53:10,155 --> 00:53:12,825
And we need to, in order to, we need
to, you know, like in order, because

1335
00:53:12,825 --> 00:53:15,435
it's important for us to, to have
everyone to, you know, for us to

1336
00:53:15,435 --> 00:53:17,835
be seen as we're agents of safety.

1337
00:53:17,835 --> 00:53:19,605
We're not agents of chaos
or anything like that.

1338
00:53:19,605 --> 00:53:23,295
Like we're, we're here to, yeah, we
wanna defend our right to own these

1339
00:53:23,295 --> 00:53:27,105
things and use 'em, but in a safe
and respectful manner to everyone

1340
00:53:27,105 --> 00:53:27,975
involved, something like that.

1341
00:53:27,975 --> 00:53:32,835
So, uh, we need to be, have, we need
to be on, you know, the, on that, a

1342
00:53:32,835 --> 00:53:35,985
voice on that board of public safety,
uh, you know, with everyone, you know,

1343
00:53:35,985 --> 00:53:37,470
with within the conversation because.

1344
00:53:38,610 --> 00:53:40,260
We need to prove, you
know, that's part of it.

1345
00:53:40,260 --> 00:53:43,350
The, the whole talk and communication
everyth, like that we, you know,

1346
00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:45,930
well it's, it's how you comport
yourself, I think is big.

1347
00:53:45,930 --> 00:53:49,140
But I also think that the more
that people harp on a certain

1348
00:53:49,140 --> 00:53:52,890
issue, the more they make that
issue the thing in the spotlight.

1349
00:53:52,890 --> 00:53:52,900
Yeah.

1350
00:53:52,900 --> 00:53:53,460
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1351
00:53:53,490 --> 00:53:57,150
It, it's like I, I've always been
advocating for like, why, why

1352
00:53:57,150 --> 00:53:58,410
do we make the gun the issue?

1353
00:53:58,740 --> 00:54:01,920
Like if, if shootings are a
problem, the gun's not the problem.

1354
00:54:02,130 --> 00:54:02,940
The shooting's a problem.

1355
00:54:03,030 --> 00:54:03,090
Yeah.

1356
00:54:03,270 --> 00:54:03,600
Right.

1357
00:54:03,900 --> 00:54:07,230
Gun violence is just violence
and someone chose to use a

1358
00:54:07,230 --> 00:54:08,640
gun or whatever it might be.

1359
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:08,700
Yeah.

1360
00:54:08,730 --> 00:54:10,200
Why don't we look at the violence issue?

1361
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:11,370
What, what's that coming from?

1362
00:54:11,370 --> 00:54:11,610
Right.

1363
00:54:11,700 --> 00:54:11,760
Yeah.

1364
00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:14,880
Is it, um, um, is it low income?

1365
00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:17,820
Is it, um, uh, lower education?

1366
00:54:17,820 --> 00:54:19,350
Is it, um, drugs?

1367
00:54:19,350 --> 00:54:21,180
Is it at risk?

1368
00:54:21,180 --> 00:54:25,170
Like, all, all of these different, like
how do we approach it without falling

1369
00:54:25,170 --> 00:54:29,550
into the same trap of looking at the tool,
the implement as opposed Well, it's, it's

1370
00:54:29,610 --> 00:54:30,090
easier.

1371
00:54:30,090 --> 00:54:31,200
It's really easy to blend the tool.

1372
00:54:31,860 --> 00:54:32,190
Yeah.

1373
00:54:32,340 --> 00:54:33,090
It, it is over.

1374
00:54:33,960 --> 00:54:36,180
A, the larger problem as
a, as a whole or like that.

1375
00:54:36,180 --> 00:54:38,730
And, you know, I, I, I, I, yeah.

1376
00:54:38,820 --> 00:54:45,810
It's, it's a men mental health
is a, it's a tricky, I haven't

1377
00:54:45,810 --> 00:54:46,620
worked in it for years.

1378
00:54:46,620 --> 00:54:49,320
It's a, it, it is a tricky,
tricky thing to try to wrap

1379
00:54:49,320 --> 00:54:50,400
your head around or like that.

1380
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:53,700
And it is so many, it's
a, such a layered problem.

1381
00:54:54,210 --> 00:54:54,810
Um, let's

1382
00:54:54,810 --> 00:54:57,150
talk about, so you had a child mm-hmm.

1383
00:54:57,390 --> 00:55:01,470
Last time that we were
here and, and, uh, so

1384
00:55:01,770 --> 00:55:03,030
what about three years old now?

1385
00:55:03,090 --> 00:55:04,680
Uh, he is three and three and a half now.

1386
00:55:04,710 --> 00:55:04,920
Yeah.

1387
00:55:04,950 --> 00:55:05,220
Yeah.

1388
00:55:05,580 --> 00:55:07,770
Just, uh, three, three
and a half going on 10.

1389
00:55:07,860 --> 00:55:11,100
Uh, it, it feels like, uh, yeah.

1390
00:55:11,550 --> 00:55:12,390
How's that working out?

1391
00:55:12,540 --> 00:55:12,720
Yeah.

1392
00:55:12,720 --> 00:55:16,740
You know what I, I mean, I,
it has completely changed

1393
00:55:16,830 --> 00:55:18,210
my entire outlook on life.

1394
00:55:18,390 --> 00:55:21,540
I mean, you hear this from lots of parents
and like that, but it, it really has.

1395
00:55:21,570 --> 00:55:21,750
Okay.

1396
00:55:21,750 --> 00:55:22,860
Why and how, tell me,

1397
00:55:25,230 --> 00:55:25,800
uh,

1398
00:55:28,110 --> 00:55:30,690
prior to having him, I would exp you know.

1399
00:55:31,770 --> 00:55:34,380
My de I was dedicated to my,
you know, my, my partner.

1400
00:55:34,380 --> 00:55:35,550
I was dedicated to my job.

1401
00:55:35,940 --> 00:55:39,030
But, you know, both those things can
trade off each other, what I was doing

1402
00:55:39,030 --> 00:55:43,020
that day, or like that, I can honestly
tell you that, and, you know, this

1403
00:55:43,020 --> 00:55:46,200
isn't, my boss may be listening to
this or like that, so it's nothing, I'm

1404
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:47,790
not dedicated to my job there, George.

1405
00:55:47,820 --> 00:55:53,220
Uh, it hasn't, but it's, my entire
life is now, everything I do is

1406
00:55:53,220 --> 00:55:54,690
basically dedicated to hammer like that.

1407
00:55:54,690 --> 00:55:54,780
Mm-hmm.

1408
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:58,230
Uh, you know, with both also trying
to maintain myself and, you know,

1409
00:55:58,230 --> 00:55:59,280
my relationship and like that.

1410
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:01,710
So, but it's, um,

1411
00:56:03,750 --> 00:56:08,820
and it's, it's, it's, it's
difficult, especially like I can't

1412
00:56:08,820 --> 00:56:09,960
raise in the way I was raised.

1413
00:56:11,655 --> 00:56:12,735
I was born in the early eighties.

1414
00:56:12,735 --> 00:56:13,335
I grew up Sure.

1415
00:56:13,365 --> 00:56:14,865
I grew up to, to boomer parents.

1416
00:56:14,955 --> 00:56:15,315
Yeah.

1417
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:15,330
Yeah.

1418
00:56:15,945 --> 00:56:18,885
Um, you know, they, they, if you wanna
call me, I guess you would call me

1419
00:56:18,885 --> 00:56:22,395
a millennial or like that, but, uh,
what they call the el, you know, I've

1420
00:56:22,395 --> 00:56:23,655
heard that term, elder, millennial.

1421
00:56:23,655 --> 00:56:26,595
I grew up, you know, I grew up still
being able to, you know, go home and

1422
00:56:26,805 --> 00:56:29,175
come back when the, you know, when
the lights turned on or like that.

1423
00:56:29,175 --> 00:56:33,495
And there was no, you know, smartphones
didn't exist that my fir when I went

1424
00:56:33,495 --> 00:56:36,225
on my tour, you know, at Afghanistan,
smartphones didn't exist yet.

1425
00:56:36,230 --> 00:56:39,255
Like that, like, so, like iPods
were around, but that was 2008,

1426
00:56:39,255 --> 00:56:41,055
I think 2008, 2009 was like that.

1427
00:56:41,055 --> 00:56:41,065
Yeah.

1428
00:56:41,065 --> 00:56:43,935
Like I didn't get my first smartphone,
I think till 2011 or something.

1429
00:56:44,025 --> 00:56:44,085
Yeah.

1430
00:56:44,085 --> 00:56:47,085
So I didn't grow up with, you know,
that, that, that type of technology.

1431
00:56:47,085 --> 00:56:53,415
And, uh, so, you know, like I, I admit
like, you know, like if I opted out

1432
00:56:53,415 --> 00:56:54,315
or anything like that, I got hit.

1433
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:54,640
Sure.

1434
00:56:55,305 --> 00:56:59,155
Well, you can't do that anymore like that,
I guess based on if you've You can, you

1435
00:56:59,155 --> 00:57:01,035
can, but, but that's, it doesn't work.

1436
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:02,085
It's, it's not seen the same way.

1437
00:57:02,085 --> 00:57:03,134
It doesn't work like that.

1438
00:57:03,134 --> 00:57:07,515
So I'm trying to navigate this
much i's a bunch of parents out

1439
00:57:07,515 --> 00:57:11,235
there and, um, yeah, and it's just.

1440
00:57:12,240 --> 00:57:12,930
He, he's great.

1441
00:57:12,930 --> 00:57:14,700
You know, his personality's
coming out now.

1442
00:57:14,700 --> 00:57:15,660
It's, you know, it's fun.

1443
00:57:15,660 --> 00:57:19,650
Like, uh, I was on the way over here
actually driving over from, uh, from,

1444
00:57:19,770 --> 00:57:23,430
uh, we're staying downtown, uh, yeah,
Vancouver and I was driving over

1445
00:57:23,430 --> 00:57:24,510
here and he was talking on the phone.

1446
00:57:24,900 --> 00:57:27,090
He's back in Ontario, so this is
the three hour difference he's

1447
00:57:27,090 --> 00:57:28,080
getting ready for bed and he,

1448
00:57:30,090 --> 00:57:33,840
not, not a proud moment for me
necessarily, but he drops his first FBO

1449
00:57:33,840 --> 00:57:35,430
F-bomb to me about that on the phone.

1450
00:57:35,430 --> 00:57:36,930
And I'm like, oh God, buddy.

1451
00:57:37,200 --> 00:57:38,220
What'd you learn that word from?

1452
00:57:38,220 --> 00:57:40,170
I like dad thinking fully,
well, it's probably me.

1453
00:57:41,460 --> 00:57:45,420
Uh, it's hard to take the army out of
the guy or like that, and I, I, I have

1454
00:57:45,420 --> 00:57:48,150
to be really, I have to watch my, my
wife's constantly telling me, you know,

1455
00:57:49,050 --> 00:57:50,280
watch your French or anything like that.

1456
00:57:50,285 --> 00:57:50,875
I don't take the

1457
00:57:50,875 --> 00:57:51,450
guy outta the army.

1458
00:57:51,450 --> 00:57:52,620
Can't take the army outta the guy.

1459
00:57:52,680 --> 00:57:52,980
Yeah,

1460
00:57:53,070 --> 00:57:55,680
but you, you talk about,
you know, you can't hit him.

1461
00:57:55,680 --> 00:58:00,630
When I, um, had my first kid, I looked
and I was like, why would anybody

1462
00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:02,610
want to hit, that's their child.

1463
00:58:02,670 --> 00:58:03,930
I have no interest in doing it either.

1464
00:58:03,930 --> 00:58:04,500
Like, yeah.

1465
00:58:04,500 --> 00:58:08,130
Before I had my child, I was like,
well, I just, I guess that's normal, I

1466
00:58:08,250 --> 00:58:09,510
guess, how, that's how things are done.

1467
00:58:09,510 --> 00:58:10,230
And I thought about it.

1468
00:58:10,230 --> 00:58:10,800
I says, well.

1469
00:58:11,310 --> 00:58:13,109
Like I was stubborn.

1470
00:58:13,319 --> 00:58:14,700
Stubborn, stubborn, stubborn.

1471
00:58:15,359 --> 00:58:17,310
Maybe ODD, what do they call it?

1472
00:58:17,310 --> 00:58:18,480
Oppositional defiance.

1473
00:58:18,660 --> 00:58:19,254
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

1474
00:58:19,254 --> 00:58:20,370
Like super stubborn, right?

1475
00:58:20,730 --> 00:58:21,839
Uh, and A DHD.

1476
00:58:21,839 --> 00:58:26,670
So that was diagnosed at grade three,
severe A DHD, and, and I look at it.

1477
00:58:27,029 --> 00:58:30,330
Okay, so you hit your kid
and do you get compliance?

1478
00:58:30,509 --> 00:58:32,790
Maybe, maybe When that threat
of hitting is over top of them.

1479
00:58:32,940 --> 00:58:33,029
Yeah.

1480
00:58:33,060 --> 00:58:35,400
What happens if you don't,
then what do you do?

1481
00:58:35,674 --> 00:58:36,569
Do you hit harder?

1482
00:58:36,870 --> 00:58:37,109
That's it.

1483
00:58:37,109 --> 00:58:37,379
Right?

1484
00:58:37,560 --> 00:58:39,120
Well, at what point do you stop?

1485
00:58:39,180 --> 00:58:39,420
Yeah.

1486
00:58:39,480 --> 00:58:39,779
Right.

1487
00:58:39,779 --> 00:58:43,500
So if at some point you gotta
stop, maybe just don't start.

1488
00:58:43,529 --> 00:58:43,770
Yeah.

1489
00:58:44,069 --> 00:58:47,759
And it's amazing how much, um,

1490
00:58:49,830 --> 00:58:55,109
better I found the ability
to raise a child by.

1491
00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:59,790
Giving them a layer of control and
that that doesn't mean that they've

1492
00:58:59,790 --> 00:59:01,140
got, they, they run the show.

1493
00:59:01,140 --> 00:59:01,200
Yeah.

1494
00:59:01,260 --> 00:59:01,950
They, everything.

1495
00:59:01,950 --> 00:59:03,780
They go, it's like, do you
wanna go to bed now or do you

1496
00:59:03,780 --> 00:59:04,950
wanna go to bed in 10 minutes?

1497
00:59:04,950 --> 00:59:06,300
Like, either way they're going to bed.

1498
00:59:06,750 --> 00:59:11,370
But if you take away their control,
they no longer have the ability

1499
00:59:11,370 --> 00:59:13,650
to be able to do things 'cause
you're bigger and stronger.

1500
00:59:14,160 --> 00:59:16,500
Um, they don't learn how
to deal with problems.

1501
00:59:16,735 --> 00:59:19,140
It's a world of hurt for yourself.

1502
00:59:19,140 --> 00:59:19,200
Yeah.

1503
00:59:19,205 --> 00:59:19,890
And, and for them.

1504
00:59:20,280 --> 00:59:25,770
Well, and have found, like, it, it,
I mean, I, I shouldn't be surprised

1505
00:59:25,770 --> 00:59:26,760
that already a three and a half.

1506
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:28,020
He's stubborn as all hell.

1507
00:59:28,020 --> 00:59:30,900
He's, he's, he's a mixture of
my, my, by myself and my wife.

1508
00:59:31,080 --> 00:59:31,680
He's Irish.

1509
00:59:31,680 --> 00:59:33,630
I'm, I have s Scottish
and Norwegian background.

1510
00:59:33,810 --> 00:59:36,630
Not exactly the most cl known to be
the most compliant people on earth.

1511
00:59:36,630 --> 00:59:42,060
So, uh, so he's, he, you know, and
already he's uh, you know, pretty,

1512
00:59:42,060 --> 00:59:43,290
pretty stubborn with of stuff.

1513
00:59:43,290 --> 00:59:45,210
But is he testing my patients?

1514
00:59:45,210 --> 00:59:45,750
Absolutely.

1515
00:59:45,750 --> 00:59:46,710
Like every day, anything like that.

1516
00:59:46,710 --> 00:59:48,090
But it's also found that it's.

1517
00:59:48,525 --> 00:59:54,225
You know, I improving myself in order
to be patient, which I wasn't really

1518
00:59:54,225 --> 00:59:55,965
all that, uh, not my strong suit.

1519
00:59:55,965 --> 00:59:56,805
I will fully admit.

1520
00:59:56,805 --> 01:00:00,555
It's not, uh, uh, the only time I've ever
been patient up till now, essentially,

1521
01:00:00,555 --> 01:00:03,435
is when I'm behind, you know, a rifle
scope on a long distance range where

1522
01:00:03,435 --> 01:00:06,165
I actually have the ability to kind of
just calm down on a little bit like that.

1523
01:00:06,165 --> 01:00:08,985
But when he's yelling and screaming
and crying and I have to sit there

1524
01:00:08,985 --> 01:00:11,205
and just kinda hold him while he
gets through his fit or like that.

1525
01:00:11,290 --> 01:00:11,529
Mm-hmm.

1526
01:00:11,610 --> 01:00:14,955
That's, that's a whole other,
that's something I, I, I wasn't

1527
01:00:14,955 --> 01:00:16,035
capable of until I had him.

1528
01:00:16,904 --> 01:00:17,415
But

1529
01:00:18,195 --> 01:00:19,425
that pushings important too.

1530
01:00:19,545 --> 01:00:19,725
Right.

1531
01:00:19,725 --> 01:00:24,615
And when you reframe the, uh, the problem,
so you've done it in, in a couple ways.

1532
01:00:24,615 --> 01:00:28,455
So, uh, sometimes I look at people
that are really difficult to deal with.

1533
01:00:28,455 --> 01:00:29,265
I'm like, wait a minute.

1534
01:00:29,265 --> 01:00:31,005
They're teaching me how to
deal with difficult people.

1535
01:00:31,005 --> 01:00:31,245
Right?

1536
01:00:31,245 --> 01:00:31,545
Yeah.

1537
01:00:31,545 --> 01:00:31,555
Yeah.

1538
01:00:31,575 --> 01:00:33,495
So if I can deal with this
person, everything else is gonna

1539
01:00:33,495 --> 01:00:36,975
be gravy, little mental reframe,
same situation, but easier.

1540
01:00:36,975 --> 01:00:37,305
Right.

1541
01:00:37,695 --> 01:00:43,095
For me and for them, uh, when they push,
like I tell my kids, you know, it's good.

1542
01:00:43,095 --> 01:00:44,055
I'm glad you're pushing.

1543
01:00:44,055 --> 01:00:46,965
It's important you push because
if you're not, you're not growing.

1544
01:00:46,965 --> 01:00:47,055
Mm-hmm.

1545
01:00:47,390 --> 01:00:47,610
Um.

1546
01:00:48,675 --> 01:00:52,005
However, there's ways that you can push
and find success and there's ways that

1547
01:00:52,005 --> 01:00:54,795
you can push that's gonna define your
getting your head against a brick wall.

1548
01:00:55,095 --> 01:00:55,155
Yeah.

1549
01:00:55,155 --> 01:00:58,785
And so really quickly you start teaching
'em how to push and how to push in a

1550
01:00:58,785 --> 01:01:03,885
way that'll, like, I want nothing more
than my kids to not need me and Yeah.

1551
01:01:03,915 --> 01:01:08,085
Be a hundred percent want to be
with me, not need to be with me.

1552
01:01:08,115 --> 01:01:08,325
Yeah.

1553
01:01:08,415 --> 01:01:08,745
Right.

1554
01:01:08,745 --> 01:01:13,395
And, uh, I think they both reached
that, that have at an early age, and

1555
01:01:13,395 --> 01:01:14,865
thankfully they still want to be with me.

1556
01:01:14,925 --> 01:01:18,105
Well, I, I, I'm, I hope one
day he gets to that point.

1557
01:01:18,105 --> 01:01:19,785
'cause there is, there is definitely
times through the day where

1558
01:01:19,785 --> 01:01:22,095
I'm like, just gimme a second.

1559
01:01:22,095 --> 01:01:22,335
Okay.

1560
01:01:22,815 --> 01:01:23,895
Like, could you not?

1561
01:01:24,375 --> 01:01:27,075
But again, he's probably still really
young, but, uh, but yeah, I mean,

1562
01:01:27,495 --> 01:01:33,585
but when it came, like, one thing
I was not prepared for was, uh, and

1563
01:01:33,585 --> 01:01:38,025
I, we had read all up about, uh, you
know, like, uh, about postpartum.

1564
01:01:38,235 --> 01:01:38,445
Yep.

1565
01:01:38,445 --> 01:01:41,805
Getting ready for potentially with,
you know, with my partner like that,

1566
01:01:42,105 --> 01:01:43,755
supporting her during the process.

1567
01:01:45,045 --> 01:01:50,325
I was not prepared for myself Mm. To
go through a battle with depression.

1568
01:01:50,355 --> 01:01:50,475
Hmm.

1569
01:01:50,715 --> 01:01:51,075
Right.

1570
01:01:51,795 --> 01:01:52,035
Yeah.

1571
01:01:52,035 --> 01:01:53,444
No, that's it.

1572
01:01:53,450 --> 01:01:55,035
It people don't look at the guys Yeah.

1573
01:01:55,035 --> 01:01:55,845
When they, when they go through it.

1574
01:01:55,875 --> 01:01:56,115
Yeah.

1575
01:01:56,115 --> 01:02:00,075
And I, I mean, as we talked about in the
last time I was here, anyone who you know,

1576
01:02:00,285 --> 01:02:01,815
was, is meeting me for the first time.

1577
01:02:01,875 --> 01:02:07,845
Uh, I, you know, have PTSD related to my
mil military service from my last tour.

1578
01:02:07,965 --> 01:02:08,085
Yep.

1579
01:02:08,205 --> 01:02:10,185
I battled, I've been battling for years.

1580
01:02:10,275 --> 01:02:14,475
Uh, it was back in 2012, I
almost lost my battle with it.

1581
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:14,819
Mm-hmm.

1582
01:02:14,904 --> 01:02:17,865
And I attempted to, made
a, made a suicide attempt.

1583
01:02:18,255 --> 01:02:19,095
Thank God it failed.

1584
01:02:19,485 --> 01:02:19,575
Mm-hmm.

1585
01:02:19,725 --> 01:02:26,535
And, uh, but I was at one of my lowest
moments at that moment, um, was,

1586
01:02:26,745 --> 01:02:28,154
you know, I can't even kill myself.

1587
01:02:28,154 --> 01:02:30,735
Like, how much of a loser am I that
I can't even do this or like that.

1588
01:02:31,154 --> 01:02:35,174
And I managed to, we, you know, through
help from outside sources as well as,

1589
01:02:35,654 --> 01:02:39,165
uh, just, you know, being who I am,
I was able to pull myself out of it.

1590
01:02:40,100 --> 01:02:40,830
Thank again, thank God.

1591
01:02:40,830 --> 01:02:40,840
Mm-hmm.

1592
01:02:42,465 --> 01:02:46,335
But, and I've been, I've been really good
for the last couple years and then, yeah,

1593
01:02:46,365 --> 01:02:52,095
all of a sudden it was maybe a year ago
that I just suddenly kind of fell back

1594
01:02:52,095 --> 01:02:56,535
into a pretty deep depression earth like
that I realized I was kind of, I felt

1595
01:02:56,535 --> 01:02:57,855
just kind of alone in the whole thing.

1596
01:02:57,855 --> 01:03:01,005
I thought that of how did you realize
that you're falling into the depression?

1597
01:03:01,035 --> 01:03:01,755
What did that look like?

1598
01:03:06,105 --> 01:03:07,455
Really compensating throughout the day?

1599
01:03:08,355 --> 01:03:08,925
Compensating.

1600
01:03:08,925 --> 01:03:11,535
Compensating throughout the day,
acting like everything was good.

1601
01:03:11,535 --> 01:03:14,865
'cause I felt I needed to, I
felt I really needed to around

1602
01:03:14,865 --> 01:03:16,005
my partner to be supportive.

1603
01:03:16,005 --> 01:03:17,205
I really felt I needed to be right.

1604
01:03:17,205 --> 01:03:20,925
I, around my son, showing him a strong,
you know, uh, character and a strong

1605
01:03:20,925 --> 01:03:23,415
person in front of him that would, you
know, kind of lead him through some

1606
01:03:23,415 --> 01:03:28,695
stuff, uh, being, you know, reactive and,
but being, you know, present at work.

1607
01:03:29,055 --> 01:03:31,095
But then when I had my times.

1608
01:03:31,950 --> 01:03:35,550
She'd put, you know, when he'd gone to
bed and sometimes, often when my wife

1609
01:03:35,550 --> 01:03:37,680
would put him to bed, we, we'd take
turns to do it and everything like

1610
01:03:37,680 --> 01:03:39,690
that, but sometimes when she'd put him
in bed, she would fall asleep as well.

1611
01:03:39,690 --> 01:03:41,940
'cause it's really easy to fall
asleep with a little child on top

1612
01:03:41,940 --> 01:03:45,270
of you when they're nice and calm
and they're nicely breathing.

1613
01:03:45,270 --> 01:03:48,960
It's really, it's really like, that's even
better than, that's better than any calm

1614
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:50,460
app or anything in front of you like that.

1615
01:03:50,460 --> 01:03:54,960
Like, uh, so it's really, really, you
know, that's, that's like her happy place.

1616
01:03:54,960 --> 01:03:57,480
But then I'm by myself for a
couple hours and after I've done

1617
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:01,200
all the dishes and the cleaning,
I've realized the house is quiet.

1618
01:04:01,470 --> 01:04:01,710
Hmm.

1619
01:04:03,420 --> 01:04:07,290
And then all of a sudden I
realized that the house is quiet,

1620
01:04:07,290 --> 01:04:09,390
but it's not quiet in my head.

1621
01:04:10,470 --> 01:04:15,600
And, uh, just, you know, I felt
like alone or like that and kind of

1622
01:04:15,600 --> 01:04:19,980
just like, uh, and I, I recognize.

1623
01:04:20,370 --> 01:04:20,910
This path.

1624
01:04:20,940 --> 01:04:22,290
'cause I'm like, I've
been down this before.

1625
01:04:22,290 --> 01:04:25,410
I don't like, I, I know, I know
where this is going or like that.

1626
01:04:25,440 --> 01:04:28,110
But, uh, why, why am I feeling this way?

1627
01:04:28,110 --> 01:04:29,760
I have a great job.

1628
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:30,510
I have a family.

1629
01:04:30,510 --> 01:04:31,290
I have my son.

1630
01:04:31,290 --> 01:04:32,310
They're all awesome Earth like that.

1631
01:04:32,310 --> 01:04:36,720
What, why am I feeling
like I'm not needed?

1632
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:37,530
Why am not wanted?

1633
01:04:37,535 --> 01:04:37,675
Why?

1634
01:04:37,675 --> 01:04:39,720
Like, why am I feeling
I'm not good enough?

1635
01:04:40,350 --> 01:04:41,280
And this is why I ask.

1636
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:42,990
Because you've been down the path.

1637
01:04:42,995 --> 01:04:43,235
Mm-hmm.

1638
01:04:43,500 --> 01:04:44,790
Not everybody has.

1639
01:04:45,000 --> 01:04:48,150
And if they start going down
that path, they might not realize

1640
01:04:48,150 --> 01:04:49,290
they're actually on a path.

1641
01:04:49,500 --> 01:04:49,560
Yeah.

1642
01:04:49,560 --> 01:04:51,180
And, and being aware.

1643
01:04:51,180 --> 01:04:54,030
And the other thing I find in our
community, in the gun community,

1644
01:04:54,840 --> 01:04:56,130
nobody wants to reach out for help.

1645
01:04:56,250 --> 01:04:56,400
Yeah.

1646
01:04:56,430 --> 01:04:57,930
Nobody wants to talk to a doctor.

1647
01:04:57,930 --> 01:04:58,320
Why?

1648
01:04:58,320 --> 01:05:02,880
Because secondly say, oh, having
some issues, is a doctor gonna now

1649
01:05:02,880 --> 01:05:04,740
say, oh, firearms license gone.

1650
01:05:04,740 --> 01:05:07,230
And maybe that's, maybe
that's your big hobby.

1651
01:05:07,230 --> 01:05:08,610
Maybe they've got a big
investment in there.

1652
01:05:08,610 --> 01:05:11,430
Maybe it's a big part of their social
group and their life and all the rest.

1653
01:05:11,850 --> 01:05:13,120
And I'll say this much.

1654
01:05:14,234 --> 01:05:15,524
Most doctors won't.

1655
01:05:16,004 --> 01:05:16,455
Oh, yeah.

1656
01:05:16,785 --> 01:05:21,194
Most, uh, psychiatrists, most, there's
always gonna be an outlier, but the

1657
01:05:21,194 --> 01:05:26,145
vast majority of them realize that
there is a separation between these two.

1658
01:05:26,145 --> 01:05:27,825
And that worry that the gun community has.

1659
01:05:27,825 --> 01:05:27,915
Yeah.

1660
01:05:28,064 --> 01:05:28,904
Go talk to someone.

1661
01:05:28,904 --> 01:05:28,995
Well,

1662
01:05:28,995 --> 01:05:32,234
it is no different from all the
advocacy I did prior to when I was

1663
01:05:32,234 --> 01:05:34,875
still with wound Warriors, and still
to this day still do a little bit.

1664
01:05:35,145 --> 01:05:38,955
It like that is that a lot of, a lot of
police officers, a lot of firefighters,

1665
01:05:39,705 --> 01:05:42,285
a lot of military members, they,
they think if I come forward with

1666
01:05:42,285 --> 01:05:43,785
my prom, that's the end of my job.

1667
01:05:43,814 --> 01:05:44,654
That's the end of my career.

1668
01:05:44,685 --> 01:05:44,774
Mm-hmm.

1669
01:05:45,044 --> 01:05:46,004
They're gonna boot me out.

1670
01:05:46,004 --> 01:05:46,964
They're gonna see me as weak.

1671
01:05:46,964 --> 01:05:50,895
They're gonna see me as, it's the
same, you know, I, my site, when

1672
01:05:50,895 --> 01:05:53,085
I, when I finally, you know, when I
reached back out and I got help with my

1673
01:05:53,085 --> 01:05:55,544
psychiatrist, it was never the question.

1674
01:05:55,875 --> 01:05:55,995
Mm-hmm.

1675
01:05:56,355 --> 01:05:57,495
Well, you shouldn't have guns then.

1676
01:05:58,214 --> 01:05:59,145
It never even came up.

1677
01:05:59,265 --> 01:05:59,535
Right.

1678
01:06:00,105 --> 01:06:02,115
It was just, okay, how can,
how can we help you right now?

1679
01:06:02,115 --> 01:06:03,405
Like that she knows I own guns.

1680
01:06:03,405 --> 01:06:03,945
We've talked about it.

1681
01:06:03,975 --> 01:06:05,475
She knows what I do for
a living or like that.

1682
01:06:06,045 --> 01:06:08,655
It was, wasn't even because of changed.

1683
01:06:08,835 --> 01:06:09,465
It's not gonna change.

1684
01:06:09,465 --> 01:06:12,405
She, it's nothing's, that's not gonna
be a factor or anything like that.

1685
01:06:12,405 --> 01:06:12,615
Right.

1686
01:06:13,155 --> 01:06:17,595
We know historic, historically
and statistically suicides are

1687
01:06:17,595 --> 01:06:20,805
not actually, people don't choose
guns to kill themselves with.

1688
01:06:21,645 --> 01:06:25,245
Statistically it's many other factors
they can choose, but the majority of

1689
01:06:25,245 --> 01:06:27,105
suicides are not done through a gun.

1690
01:06:27,855 --> 01:06:30,915
Um, see, even though, even
if you have one in the house,

1691
01:06:31,485 --> 01:06:36,315
so I, some of the statistics, and I
might not be up to date, women typically

1692
01:06:36,315 --> 01:06:41,715
offer pills and men, uh, will typically
opt for a firearm from what I've seen

1693
01:06:41,730 --> 01:06:43,575
if, if they've got that availability.

1694
01:06:43,575 --> 01:06:44,205
But it's possible.

1695
01:06:44,295 --> 01:06:46,065
Um, but, but a rope is a lot more common.

1696
01:06:46,065 --> 01:06:46,125
Yeah.

1697
01:06:46,155 --> 01:06:50,925
I have found, and, and, uh, you know, um,
I, I told you before I came out here than

1698
01:06:50,925 --> 01:06:52,785
my dad, so since I was last year mm-hmm.

1699
01:06:53,145 --> 01:06:57,950
Uh, I've lost two more friends and
I can tell you neither of them.

1700
01:06:58,605 --> 01:07:01,815
Chose a gun because they wanted to leave.

1701
01:07:01,845 --> 01:07:04,455
You know, like I, I've talked
to people who've survived it.

1702
01:07:04,634 --> 01:07:04,845
Mm-hmm.

1703
01:07:04,875 --> 01:07:09,464
And myself, having survived my
attempt, I wanted to leave my

1704
01:07:09,464 --> 01:07:12,165
body intact for whoever found me.

1705
01:07:13,515 --> 01:07:13,875
Yeah.

1706
01:07:14,234 --> 01:07:16,395
I didn't want it to be a closed
casket for them Earth like that.

1707
01:07:16,395 --> 01:07:18,075
If they, so they wanted, if
they wanted to say goodbye.

1708
01:07:18,165 --> 01:07:20,805
I don't, I didn't, I don't like the idea
of an open casting myself, but it was

1709
01:07:20,805 --> 01:07:23,265
still something I didn't wanna leave.

1710
01:07:23,270 --> 01:07:23,984
Well, you don't really

1711
01:07:23,984 --> 01:07:25,754
want somebody coming in
and cleaning up that mask.

1712
01:07:25,754 --> 01:07:26,024
No.

1713
01:07:26,085 --> 01:07:28,935
And if that's part of the
thought process, that's good.

1714
01:07:28,935 --> 01:07:29,535
That's healthy.

1715
01:07:29,535 --> 01:07:32,145
That's, uh, I, I think, um.

1716
01:07:33,240 --> 01:07:35,459
Some people, they just reach a
point where they just don't care.

1717
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:35,580
Yeah.

1718
01:07:35,580 --> 01:07:38,669
And, and I've said this one on the
podcast before, but I remember one

1719
01:07:38,910 --> 01:07:42,600
doctor saying, you know, I've taken this
approach and I haven't lost anybody yet.

1720
01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:43,290
Knock on wood.

1721
01:07:43,290 --> 01:07:47,129
And he says, somebody comes in and they
say, you know, I've got suicidal ideation.

1722
01:07:47,490 --> 01:07:49,859
I am, um, I'm really depressed.

1723
01:07:49,890 --> 01:07:52,500
I don't see why I belong here.

1724
01:07:52,500 --> 01:07:54,029
No one's gonna miss me if I'm gone.

1725
01:07:54,509 --> 01:07:56,939
I think, um, I'm doing
more harm than good.

1726
01:07:56,970 --> 01:07:58,620
All all the typical
stuff that comes up Yeah.

1727
01:07:58,620 --> 01:08:00,930
Which is completely off base,
but that's your perspective.

1728
01:08:00,959 --> 01:08:01,109
Yeah.

1729
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:01,770
At the time.

1730
01:08:02,640 --> 01:08:04,620
And the doctor says, you might be right.

1731
01:08:05,100 --> 01:08:05,250
Yeah.

1732
01:08:05,850 --> 01:08:07,950
Maybe killing yourself
is the right option.

1733
01:08:08,189 --> 01:08:13,740
However, right now is, you're not in the
frame of mind to make a proper decision.

1734
01:08:13,980 --> 01:08:16,290
Let's, let's circle back
three months from now.

1735
01:08:16,500 --> 01:08:17,729
Let's try a few different things.

1736
01:08:17,729 --> 01:08:21,149
If it still comes back and it, it
turns out that you are actually a big

1737
01:08:21,149 --> 01:08:24,569
loser and the world would be better
without you, then uh, then we can

1738
01:08:24,569 --> 01:08:26,910
take a look at next steps for you.

1739
01:08:26,915 --> 01:08:27,064
Yeah.

1740
01:08:27,825 --> 01:08:30,194
He says to date never lost somebody.

1741
01:08:30,194 --> 01:08:30,255
Yeah.

1742
01:08:30,285 --> 01:08:34,425
If they're able to just push
forward past that and provide

1743
01:08:34,425 --> 01:08:38,684
a little bit of an alternative
perspective as to their situation.

1744
01:08:38,715 --> 01:08:38,774
Yeah.

1745
01:08:38,774 --> 01:08:41,865
Because like another friend
of mine, Jay Bud, he's talking

1746
01:08:41,865 --> 01:08:43,184
about, you know, the darkest days.

1747
01:08:43,184 --> 01:08:47,654
He has, he likens it to, um, and he
said this on the podcast, so it's

1748
01:08:47,654 --> 01:08:50,085
not like I'm out outing someone.

1749
01:08:50,175 --> 01:08:54,734
Um, he was in Afghanistan and
um, was a sniper with them.

1750
01:08:54,974 --> 01:08:57,644
So he likens it to being in
the hills in the mountains.

1751
01:08:58,215 --> 01:09:02,894
He'll go out and it's a big old storm and
it's dark and it's blowing and it's hard.

1752
01:09:02,894 --> 01:09:07,634
And he gets into his shelter and some of
the best blueboard days he's had is the

1753
01:09:07,634 --> 01:09:09,585
day after that when it's all blown over.

1754
01:09:09,615 --> 01:09:09,675
Yeah.

1755
01:09:09,689 --> 01:09:13,184
And you have that comparison and if you
know that there's gonna be something

1756
01:09:13,184 --> 01:09:14,594
else on the other side, but yeah.

1757
01:09:14,654 --> 01:09:16,604
You just gotta be able
to hunker down for now.

1758
01:09:16,844 --> 01:09:17,054
Yeah.

1759
01:09:17,054 --> 01:09:22,500
And like, uh, so I, I remember I, I saw
there's this video that every once in

1760
01:09:22,500 --> 01:09:25,094
a while creeps up, but like it stuck
in my head is that it was just a.

1761
01:09:26,415 --> 01:09:28,605
It was, uh, just asking
out there into the ether.

1762
01:09:29,025 --> 01:09:34,365
Um, you know, men, who do you talk
to when you're, when you're sad?

1763
01:09:34,785 --> 01:09:37,425
Nobody, every single
guy interviewed No one.

1764
01:09:38,025 --> 01:09:39,765
Or they're like, no one,
no one gives a shit.

1765
01:09:40,125 --> 01:09:40,305
Yeah.

1766
01:09:40,365 --> 01:09:43,785
Or the, or the ones I don't tell
anybody 'cause it'll be used against me.

1767
01:09:44,985 --> 01:09:45,015
Uhhuh.

1768
01:09:45,021 --> 01:09:48,105
And it's just line, a line of men just
going like, one guy's, like, we can talk

1769
01:09:48,105 --> 01:09:49,275
to people like, whatcha you talking about?

1770
01:09:49,275 --> 01:09:49,695
Like that.

1771
01:09:50,445 --> 01:09:53,145
And, you know, and that kind
of leads down, you know, the

1772
01:09:53,145 --> 01:09:55,425
algorithms in social media.

1773
01:09:55,425 --> 01:10:00,855
Then that leads down a just video upon
video of guys just saying, uh, not

1774
01:10:00,855 --> 01:10:04,965
necessarily all bad videos, but just,
uh, of like the videos we see where it's

1775
01:10:04,965 --> 01:10:08,175
just men, not men being misunderstood
or men not being understood about

1776
01:10:08,175 --> 01:10:11,775
like, why, or being emotional and
like that, but no one can, they can't

1777
01:10:11,775 --> 01:10:12,975
talk about it or things like that.

1778
01:10:13,455 --> 01:10:16,425
And then, or, or you get the,
the, the Chris Rock video where he

1779
01:10:16,425 --> 01:10:18,960
is like, you know, only I. Yeah.

1780
01:10:18,974 --> 01:10:21,855
Three things in life or love
unconditionally like that.

1781
01:10:21,855 --> 01:10:22,004
Sure.

1782
01:10:22,335 --> 01:10:24,375
Your wife, your dog, your child.

1783
01:10:24,405 --> 01:10:24,495
Mm-hmm.

1784
01:10:24,794 --> 01:10:27,285
Men are only loved for what they
provide and stuff like that.

1785
01:10:27,285 --> 01:10:30,585
And like, but like you start hearing
these things and stuff like that.

1786
01:10:30,585 --> 01:10:34,094
And that's where it's kind of, it's fun at
first, but this is also, if you're already

1787
01:10:34,094 --> 01:10:37,905
in that depressive state, I can tell you
that's where, that's where social media

1788
01:10:38,775 --> 01:10:42,195
starts becoming an ugly thing and not, you
already are in a bit of a fragile state

1789
01:10:42,195 --> 01:10:43,724
and now you really start believing it.

1790
01:10:43,724 --> 01:10:45,974
And that's what, that's kinda what
was happening to me a bit as well.

1791
01:10:47,504 --> 01:10:51,585
And I just felt, so I have, you know,
and I, I have two or three friends out

1792
01:10:51,585 --> 01:10:53,684
near where I live out in Durham region.

1793
01:10:54,105 --> 01:10:55,214
All of us, I have young kids.

1794
01:10:55,455 --> 01:10:55,754
Yep.

1795
01:10:57,014 --> 01:11:01,065
And I started, you know, and a lot, all
of us had served in the army together.

1796
01:11:01,065 --> 01:11:03,014
We were the closest
friends back in the day.

1797
01:11:03,075 --> 01:11:05,115
We, like dad, we all had
worn the uniform together.

1798
01:11:05,115 --> 01:11:08,264
Some of us are, one of 'em even works
in the same industry as me, like in,

1799
01:11:09,585 --> 01:11:14,714
and we're probably no more than 15,
been a drive away from each other and.

1800
01:11:15,855 --> 01:11:18,315
Other than the occasional call
during the year, we never talk.

1801
01:11:19,065 --> 01:11:19,485
Yeah.

1802
01:11:20,655 --> 01:11:23,715
Why don't we get together,
you know, and hang out.

1803
01:11:24,855 --> 01:11:26,295
No one makes the call, no one decides.

1804
01:11:26,295 --> 01:11:28,395
They like, well, no, we're busy
or anything like that, but I

1805
01:11:28,395 --> 01:11:31,695
guarantee, but like, why, why
can't, why can't we do that?

1806
01:11:32,535 --> 01:11:34,425
But I guarantee if you did reach
out and call, they wouldn't

1807
01:11:34,425 --> 01:11:35,985
say, they wouldn't say no.

1808
01:11:36,045 --> 01:11:36,285
No.

1809
01:11:36,585 --> 01:11:40,605
Like, so it, it got me, like, and
then that got me and it got me

1810
01:11:40,605 --> 01:11:42,825
kind of thinking like, why, why
can't we do this kind of stuff?

1811
01:11:42,825 --> 01:11:49,965
And, um, during the, like the, my
partner, you know, God bless her with like

1812
01:11:49,965 --> 01:11:54,045
that, she, uh, uh, I say I'm not really
religious, but I'm saying God bless her.

1813
01:11:54,045 --> 01:11:54,105
Yeah.

1814
01:11:54,135 --> 01:11:56,865
Because, uh, she, she's not
oblivious or anything like that.

1815
01:11:56,865 --> 01:11:59,505
She knew I was going through a tough
time and like that, but she didn't

1816
01:11:59,505 --> 01:12:00,885
quite know how, how to deal with it.

1817
01:12:00,885 --> 01:12:06,555
And something that like, that shakes
me into my core today is that she

1818
01:12:06,555 --> 01:12:10,675
told me that, uh, lemme turn up a
little bit here, but she told me.

1819
01:12:11,640 --> 01:12:13,770
Yeah, I know you're going through
a hard time and every time you

1820
01:12:13,770 --> 01:12:16,200
would go back in the house after
we went out to the cart mm-hmm.

1821
01:12:16,200 --> 01:12:21,240
And were in there for a couple minutes,
I was, I was terrified I'd walk in

1822
01:12:21,240 --> 01:12:22,380
and you would be no longer with us.

1823
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:22,860
Yep.

1824
01:12:25,290 --> 01:12:28,620
I wasn't suicidal at this
point, at this time around.

1825
01:12:29,010 --> 01:12:30,000
I can say that for a fact.

1826
01:12:30,000 --> 01:12:32,400
I, I wasn't, I wasn't gonna kill myself.

1827
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:35,910
I was just going through a deep
depression and it got me, and I started,

1828
01:12:35,940 --> 01:12:37,410
you know, researching a bit more.

1829
01:12:37,410 --> 01:12:41,460
And it's like, well, I, I ran into one
of the, my buddies that said that one

1830
01:12:41,460 --> 01:12:44,310
of the trade shows, 'cause he was also
there and we were just kind of talking

1831
01:12:44,550 --> 01:12:45,720
and I said, well, you know, how you doing?

1832
01:12:45,720 --> 01:12:46,440
He's like, oh, I'm good.

1833
01:12:46,440 --> 01:12:49,530
You know, like the girls and this,
and Karen's like this and my friends.

1834
01:12:49,530 --> 01:12:51,390
I'm like, cool, but how
are, how are you doing man?

1835
01:12:51,390 --> 01:12:51,480
Right.

1836
01:12:52,410 --> 01:12:53,010
I'm fine.

1837
01:12:53,790 --> 01:12:54,150
Cool.

1838
01:12:54,330 --> 01:12:55,500
How are you doing?

1839
01:12:55,500 --> 01:12:56,310
Mm-hmm.

1840
01:12:57,535 --> 01:12:58,140
And he is like,

1841
01:13:00,480 --> 01:13:04,200
um, kind of kinda lonely, man.

1842
01:13:04,560 --> 01:13:04,860
Yeah.

1843
01:13:04,980 --> 01:13:05,220
Yeah.

1844
01:13:06,495 --> 01:13:07,125
Let's hang out, man.

1845
01:13:07,125 --> 01:13:09,705
I, so am I. Let's go, let's
go to the range someday.

1846
01:13:10,365 --> 01:13:10,635
Yeah,

1847
01:13:10,815 --> 01:13:11,175
right.

1848
01:13:11,625 --> 01:13:14,025
I'm a member at like three
different ranges or like that.

1849
01:13:14,025 --> 01:13:14,684
Let's go shooting.

1850
01:13:15,585 --> 01:13:16,815
We used to do it a all
the time in the army.

1851
01:13:16,815 --> 01:13:17,625
Why can't we do it now?

1852
01:13:17,625 --> 01:13:18,405
Or like that, right.

1853
01:13:19,005 --> 01:13:19,514
You got some cool

1854
01:13:19,514 --> 01:13:20,085
guns too.

1855
01:13:20,264 --> 01:13:22,695
Yeah, well, well there's
that too, like that.

1856
01:13:22,695 --> 01:13:26,025
But yeah, the guns, I can still use on
the range as well, but I'm like, why can't

1857
01:13:26,025 --> 01:13:28,635
we, why can't, why can't we do this now?

1858
01:13:28,845 --> 01:13:31,365
Just 'cause we have kids doesn't mean
we can't hang out anymore like that.

1859
01:13:31,365 --> 01:13:33,224
We can't hang, let's go hang out together.

1860
01:13:33,675 --> 01:13:36,224
And it just got me kind of thinking.

1861
01:13:36,224 --> 01:13:38,985
There's lots of different groups
out there, and this is, I wanna

1862
01:13:38,985 --> 01:13:43,005
preface this by saying this is not,
you know, at any point, bringing

1863
01:13:43,005 --> 01:13:46,905
down mothers, women, our wives, our
partners, and like that they need

1864
01:13:46,905 --> 01:13:48,525
support just as much as anyone else's.

1865
01:13:48,525 --> 01:13:48,825
But

1866
01:13:50,925 --> 01:13:53,264
you know, like you hear, I, you, you see
like, there's lots of groups out there,

1867
01:13:53,745 --> 01:13:59,535
uh, mommies and me and uh, mommy and me
groups and stuff like that, and where

1868
01:13:59,535 --> 01:14:02,355
they all get together and they hang
out with their kids, but, and I see.

1869
01:14:03,030 --> 01:14:04,440
I, I've taken my kid to gymnastics.

1870
01:14:04,440 --> 01:14:05,370
I've taken to swimming lessons.

1871
01:14:05,370 --> 01:14:08,160
There's more and more fathers are more
and more involved in their child's

1872
01:14:08,160 --> 01:14:09,330
lives than they ever have been before.

1873
01:14:09,390 --> 01:14:09,570
Oh yeah.

1874
01:14:09,570 --> 01:14:10,620
Historically, huge.

1875
01:14:10,620 --> 01:14:11,250
A generation.

1876
01:14:12,090 --> 01:14:17,910
But there's no father and me hangouts,
father, toddler hangouts are like that.

1877
01:14:17,910 --> 01:14:19,710
Like we don't get together and do that.

1878
01:14:19,710 --> 01:14:22,380
We take our kids to the thing, we are
involved in their lives or like that.

1879
01:14:22,920 --> 01:14:25,200
And then when everything goes to
sleep, we're kind of left our own

1880
01:14:25,200 --> 01:14:28,110
devices and everyone's gonna say,
Hey, he, he's being quiet downstairs.

1881
01:14:28,110 --> 01:14:32,040
He's relaxing, he is gonna go work,
or, or he is gonna go out and, you

1882
01:14:32,040 --> 01:14:34,985
know, mow the lawn or work out or work
on his car, or something like that.

1883
01:14:35,010 --> 01:14:38,610
Like the, the typical stereotypical, you
know, bullshit, whatever it is like that.

1884
01:14:39,870 --> 01:14:44,400
But why can't we, you know, form
support groups for ourselves as, as

1885
01:14:44,400 --> 01:14:49,380
men, and acknowledge the fact that
being a father is a, despite all the

1886
01:14:49,380 --> 01:14:52,320
great things, it is being a father and
a partner, it is lonely as hell, man.

1887
01:14:53,355 --> 01:14:54,195
It really can be.

1888
01:14:54,705 --> 01:14:55,095
Yeah.

1889
01:14:55,155 --> 01:14:55,695
Well

1890
01:14:56,265 --> 01:15:00,615
it depends on how it's approached.

1891
01:15:00,825 --> 01:15:00,945
Yep.

1892
01:15:00,974 --> 01:15:05,684
Um, I think it's lonely quite often
because we make it lonely for ourselves.

1893
01:15:05,684 --> 01:15:05,805
We do.

1894
01:15:06,045 --> 01:15:06,465
Absolutely.

1895
01:15:06,585 --> 01:15:13,815
Some people don't have a relationship with
a partner that is their force multiplier.

1896
01:15:13,875 --> 01:15:13,995
Yeah.

1897
01:15:14,265 --> 01:15:19,035
Uh, I think putting that time
in ahead of time to find a force

1898
01:15:19,035 --> 01:15:24,075
multiplier that you can work with
at both of you guys together Yeah.

1899
01:15:24,075 --> 01:15:25,365
Is gonna be ma massive.

1900
01:15:25,485 --> 01:15:27,315
A lot of people, they
don't, they don't have that.

1901
01:15:27,315 --> 01:15:31,245
When I, uh, uh, look at different
friend groups, I've, I've made a few

1902
01:15:31,245 --> 01:15:32,400
notes as you're talking through here.

1903
01:15:32,400 --> 01:15:32,519
Yeah.

1904
01:15:32,519 --> 01:15:32,640
And

1905
01:15:32,894 --> 01:15:36,195
I just wanna say like, you know, 'cause
again, I know my wife's gonna listen

1906
01:15:36,195 --> 01:15:41,025
to this and Annie, like, she is my,
my solid rock with like that real,

1907
01:15:41,025 --> 01:15:43,065
like, we, she's the the best person.

1908
01:15:43,215 --> 01:15:43,519
I want.

1909
01:15:43,519 --> 01:15:44,565
The fact that she can identify

1910
01:15:44,565 --> 01:15:45,255
these things and.

1911
01:15:45,675 --> 01:15:49,800
It, it doesn't make it any less of a
thing that sometimes I just feel like I'm

1912
01:15:50,100 --> 01:15:51,780
by myself in certain things like that.

1913
01:15:51,780 --> 01:15:56,010
And it's not, nothing that she has
done or not done has caused that.

1914
01:15:56,040 --> 01:15:58,650
It's just Well, we do it to ourselves.

1915
01:15:58,680 --> 01:15:59,880
Yeah, we do as this man, we a hundred

1916
01:15:59,880 --> 01:16:00,180
percent.

1917
01:16:00,180 --> 01:16:04,920
And, uh, and there's, okay, so have
you seen, I think it was Saturday Night

1918
01:16:04,920 --> 01:16:08,460
Live, they did this skit and there's a
group of guys and they're all hanging

1919
01:16:08,460 --> 01:16:12,059
out together and there's one of the guys,
he is like, well, I guess I gotta go.

1920
01:16:12,059 --> 01:16:14,730
And they all call, start calling
him names and throwing stuff at him.

1921
01:16:14,730 --> 01:16:14,894
Yeah, yeah.

1922
01:16:14,970 --> 01:16:16,170
You're the worst and blah, blah, blah.

1923
01:16:16,170 --> 01:16:17,519
And like, just really get mad.

1924
01:16:17,610 --> 01:16:21,150
And the second the guy leaves,
they're like, man, I love that guy.

1925
01:16:21,210 --> 01:16:21,330
Yeah.

1926
01:16:21,330 --> 01:16:22,769
He, he's my reason for living.

1927
01:16:22,890 --> 01:16:24,059
I, and, and they just ask.

1928
01:16:24,059 --> 01:16:24,120
Yeah.

1929
01:16:24,135 --> 01:16:24,255
Yeah.

1930
01:16:24,450 --> 01:16:25,530
They do the same thing again.

1931
01:16:25,530 --> 01:16:26,250
Group of women.

1932
01:16:26,250 --> 01:16:28,230
And this woman was
like, oh, I gotta leave.

1933
01:16:28,230 --> 01:16:30,660
And they're like, oh, I'm so
soon, we don't wanna see you go.

1934
01:16:30,660 --> 01:16:32,250
The second she's out
the door, they're like.

1935
01:16:32,670 --> 01:16:32,910
Okay.

1936
01:16:32,910 --> 01:16:35,010
Now that she's gone, can
we really talk about that?

1937
01:16:35,100 --> 01:16:35,700
Yeah, yeah.

1938
01:16:35,700 --> 01:16:35,710
Yeah.

1939
01:16:35,790 --> 01:16:40,110
And but you know, it's funny
because it's, it's true.

1940
01:16:40,110 --> 01:16:43,410
There, there are these little boundaries
in these, uh, games that we play.

1941
01:16:43,410 --> 01:16:47,760
And as guys, sometimes people think that
what's happening when everyone's making

1942
01:16:47,760 --> 01:16:53,280
fun of 'em or calling names or saying
these things isn't because they, they

1943
01:16:53,280 --> 01:16:55,140
think, well, maybe that's how they feel.

1944
01:16:55,170 --> 01:16:55,230
Yeah.

1945
01:16:55,230 --> 01:16:57,030
Because they don't see what's
happening behind closed doors.

1946
01:16:57,150 --> 01:16:57,210
Yeah.

1947
01:16:57,210 --> 01:17:00,090
Like, I mean, there's a, there's
a, uh, I remember there was a class

1948
01:17:00,090 --> 01:17:03,990
I thing where it's, uh, like a, a,
a guy, a guy who was an army guy's

1949
01:17:03,990 --> 01:17:06,720
gonna go visit his buddy, his buddy in
the hospital who was hurt, you know,

1950
01:17:06,720 --> 01:17:07,620
in the line of duty or like that.

1951
01:17:07,620 --> 01:17:09,240
And he walks in, what's up, dipshit?

1952
01:17:09,240 --> 01:17:09,750
You know?

1953
01:17:09,750 --> 01:17:09,760
Yeah.

1954
01:17:09,900 --> 01:17:12,270
You can't believe you got outta
that one or like that, you know,

1955
01:17:12,270 --> 01:17:13,800
you really had to blah, blah, blah.

1956
01:17:13,800 --> 01:17:14,850
Just ripping on each other.

1957
01:17:15,060 --> 01:17:15,120
Yeah.

1958
01:17:15,120 --> 01:17:16,530
And then like, and the nurse walks in.

1959
01:17:16,530 --> 01:17:16,980
Who is that?

1960
01:17:16,980 --> 01:17:17,730
Oh, it's my best friend.

1961
01:17:18,030 --> 01:17:18,210
Yeah.

1962
01:17:18,420 --> 01:17:19,170
And it's, it's true.

1963
01:17:19,530 --> 01:17:20,790
But we are.

1964
01:17:21,780 --> 01:17:22,920
Harsher on each other.

1965
01:17:22,920 --> 01:17:26,130
Like, 'cause that's just like, that's,
I guess that's what we, who we are.

1966
01:17:26,130 --> 01:17:27,540
Like it's just, it is.

1967
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:30,540
And a lot of people didn't have
a proper role model growing up.

1968
01:17:30,570 --> 01:17:30,630
No.

1969
01:17:30,630 --> 01:17:32,730
As to how to, how to interact properly.

1970
01:17:32,760 --> 01:17:32,880
Yeah.

1971
01:17:33,300 --> 01:17:37,740
And so, uh, when you, and
I'm just kind of Yeah.

1972
01:17:37,740 --> 01:17:38,340
Putting a few notes.

1973
01:17:38,340 --> 01:17:39,870
'cause I think you raised
some really good things.

1974
01:17:40,110 --> 01:17:44,490
So when we talk about social media and
you know, how, how you can start feeding

1975
01:17:44,490 --> 01:17:48,600
into all of these things, there is that
other side and it's all about perspective.

1976
01:17:48,600 --> 01:17:50,880
The second that perspective
shift happens mm-hmm.

1977
01:17:51,000 --> 01:17:54,030
Um, things get better, right?

1978
01:17:54,035 --> 01:17:54,075
Yeah.

1979
01:17:54,075 --> 01:17:54,420
Oh yeah.

1980
01:17:54,420 --> 01:17:57,750
And, and that's where talk docs come
in because they can say, well, yeah,

1981
01:17:57,809 --> 01:17:58,559
you're looking at it like this.

1982
01:17:58,559 --> 01:18:01,080
Like a friend of mine, he is,
uh, his father recently passed

1983
01:18:01,080 --> 01:18:04,410
away and he's finding that he's
getting frustrated at work.

1984
01:18:04,410 --> 01:18:06,000
He holds a, uh, high.

1985
01:18:06,375 --> 01:18:09,135
Level job in a leadership
position with the government.

1986
01:18:09,135 --> 01:18:12,945
And anyways, he is like, I don't have
time for this, and my family don't have

1987
01:18:12,945 --> 01:18:14,565
time for, and I'm getting frustrated.

1988
01:18:14,565 --> 01:18:17,715
And the doc's like, well, do you think
maybe this is how you process grief?

1989
01:18:17,925 --> 01:18:19,665
Oh, didn't see it like that.

1990
01:18:19,665 --> 01:18:19,724
Yeah.

1991
01:18:19,724 --> 01:18:20,415
All of a sudden.

1992
01:18:20,715 --> 01:18:21,675
Okay, fair enough.

1993
01:18:22,155 --> 01:18:23,115
Different way of looking at it.

1994
01:18:23,115 --> 01:18:25,605
Same way with your wife.

1995
01:18:25,845 --> 01:18:28,665
I wasn't sure you'd be with
us when you went out to the

1996
01:18:28,665 --> 01:18:30,195
vehicle and you came back again.

1997
01:18:31,095 --> 01:18:34,095
You probably didn't realize
at that time that that's what

1998
01:18:34,095 --> 01:18:35,565
was going through her head.

1999
01:18:36,915 --> 01:18:41,535
And the, so Viktor Frankl, man, searcher,
meaning writes a book and he had a, uh,

2000
01:18:41,535 --> 01:18:45,945
a guy come in and he's like, you know,
my wife died and it's an older fellow.

2001
01:18:45,945 --> 01:18:48,465
And he says, I, I have no
reason for living anymore.

2002
01:18:48,465 --> 01:18:54,735
And, and, uh, Victor Father, modern
logo therapy says, uh, okay, well

2003
01:18:54,735 --> 01:18:56,175
what would've happened if your wife.

2004
01:18:56,580 --> 01:18:59,370
If you died first, would you like
to see your wife take her life?

2005
01:18:59,400 --> 01:18:59,910
Well, no.

2006
01:19:00,270 --> 01:19:01,680
Like, would you like to see her be happy?

2007
01:19:01,680 --> 01:19:01,950
Yeah.

2008
01:19:01,980 --> 01:19:05,010
Well, maybe you spared her this
grief that you're going through.

2009
01:19:05,010 --> 01:19:05,430
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

2010
01:19:05,430 --> 01:19:09,120
And it's about fi about
finding meaning in life.

2011
01:19:09,180 --> 01:19:09,360
Yeah.

2012
01:19:09,360 --> 01:19:10,410
Through, through adversity.

2013
01:19:10,410 --> 01:19:10,680
Absolutely.

2014
01:19:10,680 --> 01:19:10,890
Yeah.

2015
01:19:11,010 --> 01:19:16,320
And sometimes it's, man, I don't want my
wife or my loved ones to feel that way.

2016
01:19:16,650 --> 01:19:20,310
Okay, maybe I gotta start
addressing how I'm looking at this.

2017
01:19:20,310 --> 01:19:21,540
Does that mean I change my diet?

2018
01:19:21,540 --> 01:19:24,840
Or I talk to someone or I reach out,
or we have this conversation because,

2019
01:19:25,260 --> 01:19:30,360
um, now I've got a little bit more
purpose in a way to approach it.

2020
01:19:30,360 --> 01:19:32,460
So I, I thought that was an
interesting thing just to,

2021
01:19:32,520 --> 01:19:32,700
yeah.

2022
01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:36,660
And, and you said something earlier is
that, you know, we don't, we necessarily.

2023
01:19:37,695 --> 01:19:41,175
Our generation over hasn't had necessarily
that role model to teach us like,

2024
01:19:41,445 --> 01:19:43,155
it's okay to be vulnerable as a man.

2025
01:19:43,515 --> 01:19:43,815
Right.

2026
01:19:44,295 --> 01:19:46,965
That in fact, you should be, I,
I was never, I can honestly tell

2027
01:19:46,965 --> 01:19:48,045
you I was never taught that.

2028
01:19:48,105 --> 01:19:48,285
No.

2029
01:19:48,465 --> 01:19:51,165
Because if you showed
any emotion, you're weak.

2030
01:19:51,165 --> 01:19:51,765
You're weak.

2031
01:19:51,795 --> 01:19:52,275
That's right.

2032
01:19:52,275 --> 01:19:56,265
Like, what are you, uh, like what are
you girl, I know what you're gonna say.

2033
01:19:56,370 --> 01:19:59,750
You, you did, you want me to go get
you a dress for your, you know, like,

2034
01:19:59,755 --> 01:20:02,775
like, like, like that's the way we
were kind of raised with like that.

2035
01:20:03,165 --> 01:20:06,045
And now that I have, you know,
my son and stuff like that, it's

2036
01:20:06,045 --> 01:20:09,225
how do you, you know, now kinda
about, okay, how do I break that?

2037
01:20:10,875 --> 01:20:12,345
How do you show healthy emotion?

2038
01:20:12,375 --> 01:20:12,435
Yeah.

2039
01:20:12,435 --> 01:20:12,735
How do you

2040
01:20:12,735 --> 01:20:15,735
show working through things in a
way that they can then emulate?

2041
01:20:15,735 --> 01:20:15,915
Yeah.

2042
01:20:15,915 --> 01:20:17,205
Because you've never had that emulated

2043
01:20:17,385 --> 01:20:17,595
for you.

2044
01:20:17,595 --> 01:20:17,715
Yeah.

2045
01:20:17,805 --> 01:20:20,325
And you know, I'm, I'm thinking,
okay, like I have to be able to,

2046
01:20:20,475 --> 01:20:21,765
you have to be able to show emotion.

2047
01:20:21,765 --> 01:20:25,185
I have to be able to show vulnerability,
especially to your, you know, to, like

2048
01:20:25,395 --> 01:20:28,035
I was always told, the only person
you ever become vulnerable to is your

2049
01:20:28,035 --> 01:20:30,315
partner, your wife, and even then.

2050
01:20:31,740 --> 01:20:32,460
Do it cautiously.

2051
01:20:32,940 --> 01:20:33,000
Yeah.

2052
01:20:33,000 --> 01:20:33,210
Right.

2053
01:20:33,210 --> 01:20:34,110
You don't want to use against yet.

2054
01:20:34,110 --> 01:20:34,350
Yeah.

2055
01:20:35,070 --> 01:20:37,890
And so you gotta be able to
show your, you know, your, our,

2056
01:20:37,920 --> 01:20:38,850
you know, our, our children.

2057
01:20:38,850 --> 01:20:40,140
It's okay to be vulnerable.

2058
01:20:40,230 --> 01:20:41,490
It's also okay to be strong.

2059
01:20:42,090 --> 01:20:44,520
And some of the, some of the
strongest thing you ever do is to be

2060
01:20:44,520 --> 01:20:45,840
vulnerable to someone with like that.

2061
01:20:46,230 --> 01:20:50,610
Uh, but also, you know, with the, you
see, I see it on, you know, with all

2062
01:20:50,610 --> 01:20:54,000
this whole thing with, again, social
media going back to like, how do we get

2063
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:56,370
'em also into loving the outdoors again?

2064
01:20:56,610 --> 01:20:56,850
Hmm.

2065
01:20:57,120 --> 01:21:00,270
Loving the, you know, going out, loving,
you know, being camp, you know, go

2066
01:21:00,270 --> 01:21:04,590
camping, go like, get away from your
phones and start living life again or

2067
01:21:04,590 --> 01:21:07,050
like that, um, in that environment.

2068
01:21:07,050 --> 01:21:09,450
And what can we learn from, you
know, being in nature and stuff

2069
01:21:09,450 --> 01:21:11,760
like that, that is healthy not
only for your mental health, but

2070
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:12,960
also for your own physical health.

2071
01:21:12,990 --> 01:21:17,250
And, uh, I, I take that back to
what I was saying with my buddy.

2072
01:21:17,250 --> 01:21:19,800
Like, Hey, let's go, let's,
let's go to the range some day.

2073
01:21:21,195 --> 01:21:25,965
Uh, you know, there is a mental
health aspect that's positive well,

2074
01:21:25,965 --> 01:21:29,295
to hunting, being outdoors, and
the whole firearms committee, which

2075
01:21:29,295 --> 01:21:32,025
is never addressed, is that this
actually can be a positive thing.

2076
01:21:32,025 --> 01:21:37,305
It actually, uh, for many people it can
be a source of bonding for some of us or

2077
01:21:37,305 --> 01:21:38,835
like that, that, have you heard of the

2078
01:21:38,835 --> 01:21:41,445
Men's Shed Society in Australia?

2079
01:21:41,505 --> 01:21:41,775
No.

2080
01:21:42,045 --> 01:21:42,375
Okay.

2081
01:21:42,375 --> 01:21:44,985
So, uh, it started in Australia.

2082
01:21:44,985 --> 01:21:46,575
I think it's in a number
of other countries now.

2083
01:21:46,575 --> 01:21:47,865
It's probably in North America.

2084
01:21:48,375 --> 01:21:54,495
But, um, some bright individuals over
there looked at it and said, women will

2085
01:21:54,495 --> 01:21:56,115
talk about their problems face to face.

2086
01:21:56,144 --> 01:21:58,275
They'll sit down and say
he's, here's what's going on.

2087
01:21:58,485 --> 01:22:00,165
Men, they don't do that.

2088
01:22:00,224 --> 01:22:03,495
They don't feel comfortable doing
that, but they will talk shoulder

2089
01:22:03,495 --> 01:22:07,905
to shoulder, and so you're at
the range, shoulder to shoulder.

2090
01:22:08,295 --> 01:22:10,425
The Men's Shed Society was.

2091
01:22:10,815 --> 01:22:12,945
Okay, we've got a lawnmower.

2092
01:22:13,035 --> 01:22:14,054
We have to rebuild.

2093
01:22:14,415 --> 01:22:19,125
Hey, you've got a belt grinder, you've
got a socket set, you've got this.

2094
01:22:19,485 --> 01:22:20,445
Let's do this project.

2095
01:22:20,445 --> 01:22:22,514
And the men get together
and they work on a project.

2096
01:22:22,815 --> 01:22:24,615
They're not there to talk
about their problems.

2097
01:22:24,884 --> 01:22:26,384
They're not there to vent about things.

2098
01:22:26,384 --> 01:22:29,384
It's not a therapy session, but you
know what men are gonna end up doing?

2099
01:22:29,985 --> 01:22:30,849
Little things will come up.

2100
01:22:30,910 --> 01:22:33,165
Oh, you know, I had a
rough time the other day.

2101
01:22:33,165 --> 01:22:34,275
My kid was doing this.

2102
01:22:34,275 --> 01:22:37,184
I didn't know how to, someone else
says, oh yeah, I had the same thing.

2103
01:22:37,184 --> 01:22:37,394
Right.

2104
01:22:37,394 --> 01:22:37,455
Yeah.

2105
01:22:38,115 --> 01:22:43,844
And it's, it goes back to that
Harvard study, 80 years followed,

2106
01:22:44,775 --> 01:22:49,424
uh, people from all different, uh,
ethnicities, backgrounds, religions,

2107
01:22:49,424 --> 01:22:52,695
genders, all the rest for 80
years, longest study on happiness.

2108
01:22:52,755 --> 01:22:57,674
And the number one predictor of
happiness that they found was

2109
01:22:57,674 --> 01:23:00,014
having strong social connections.

2110
01:23:00,045 --> 01:23:00,105
Yeah.

2111
01:23:00,315 --> 01:23:02,049
And that's one of the first
things that starts to go out the.

2112
01:23:02,580 --> 01:23:05,070
Door when depression kicks in.

2113
01:23:05,070 --> 01:23:05,160
Yep.

2114
01:23:05,220 --> 01:23:05,940
Because mm-hmm.

2115
01:23:06,300 --> 01:23:06,480
Oh yeah.

2116
01:23:06,480 --> 01:23:07,530
You'll self isolate.

2117
01:23:08,040 --> 01:23:08,220
Yep.

2118
01:23:08,490 --> 01:23:09,360
You have kids.

2119
01:23:09,360 --> 01:23:09,720
Okay.

2120
01:23:09,900 --> 01:23:11,640
My, my priority's a
hundred percent my kid.

2121
01:23:11,640 --> 01:23:12,780
And I, and I did that.

2122
01:23:12,780 --> 01:23:14,880
I went and I looked and I said,
okay, if I'm gonna have kids, I

2123
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:16,290
made this decision ahead of time.

2124
01:23:17,340 --> 01:23:21,330
My life's over and I'm gonna
give everything I have to my kid.

2125
01:23:21,690 --> 01:23:26,010
And it took me a long time to realize
that's not the proper approach.

2126
01:23:26,010 --> 01:23:26,070
Yeah.

2127
01:23:26,070 --> 01:23:29,670
Because if I'm not looking after myself
properly, I'm not given a hundred percent.

2128
01:23:29,675 --> 01:23:29,865
Well, it's

2129
01:23:29,865 --> 01:23:33,690
like if, if I there, you know, there was
a, and to this day to a point, I still

2130
01:23:33,690 --> 01:23:38,880
do if I decide, hey, I know I usually I
take him to gymnastics on Saturday morning

2131
01:23:38,880 --> 01:23:42,990
or like that, but I really want to go
and visit a buddy who is in town for.

2132
01:23:43,335 --> 01:23:44,445
You know, the weekend.

2133
01:23:44,505 --> 01:23:44,745
Mm.

2134
01:23:45,045 --> 01:23:47,085
Can I go do, and I, so I asked
my wife, can I go do that?

2135
01:23:47,115 --> 01:23:49,665
Like, just outta courtesy, I'm gonna, I'm
not gonna be like, I'm gonna go do this.

2136
01:23:49,665 --> 01:23:50,415
It's your problem now.

2137
01:23:50,415 --> 01:23:52,785
Like, no, you're a team, but
we're a team, so can I go do that?

2138
01:23:52,785 --> 01:23:53,775
And she's like, absolutely.

2139
01:23:53,775 --> 01:23:58,785
And then I immediately feel guilty
because I should be taking my son.

2140
01:23:58,815 --> 01:24:02,325
Like why, how dare I decide to
put myself first or like that?

2141
01:24:02,330 --> 01:24:02,400
Mm-hmm.

2142
01:24:02,480 --> 01:24:04,845
Like, I should be, I should be
here for my son or like that.

2143
01:24:04,845 --> 01:24:07,785
And he doesn't understand
why, why Even right now my,

2144
01:24:07,875 --> 01:24:09,135
he's back, I'm here for work.

2145
01:24:09,224 --> 01:24:09,495
Hmm.

2146
01:24:09,795 --> 01:24:11,055
I had no, there was no choice.

2147
01:24:11,085 --> 01:24:12,585
I had to come here for work or like that.

2148
01:24:12,795 --> 01:24:15,014
I had to come up to bc
It was a trade show.

2149
01:24:15,165 --> 01:24:18,224
We knew about it months in advance or
like that we knew this was happening.

2150
01:24:18,255 --> 01:24:19,305
We knew this was happening last year.

2151
01:24:19,305 --> 01:24:22,575
'cause we, we bought our booth space
last year when it was in Halifax.

2152
01:24:22,575 --> 01:24:22,845
Yeah.

2153
01:24:22,875 --> 01:24:23,865
For the Victoria show.

2154
01:24:24,375 --> 01:24:27,525
And on my, on the flight out
here, I felt guilty leaving.

2155
01:24:28,275 --> 01:24:29,715
Be even though, because why?

2156
01:24:29,715 --> 01:24:30,495
Why did I feel that way?

2157
01:24:30,495 --> 01:24:33,135
Because I'm not my prioritizing
my son at that point.

2158
01:24:33,135 --> 01:24:34,515
I'm, I prioritizing my wife.

2159
01:24:34,515 --> 01:24:36,615
I am, I'm prioritizing my job.

2160
01:24:37,125 --> 01:24:41,055
But when you start looking at the reality
of it, when you take that different

2161
01:24:41,055 --> 01:24:45,195
perspective, it's like, what kind of
person would I be if I didn't leave home?

2162
01:24:45,465 --> 01:24:47,055
If all I'm doing is spending that time?

2163
01:24:47,055 --> 01:24:47,065
Yeah.

2164
01:24:47,385 --> 01:24:47,655
Yeah.

2165
01:24:47,805 --> 01:24:48,945
My kid would be sick of me.

2166
01:24:48,945 --> 01:24:50,325
I wouldn't be my best self.

2167
01:24:50,325 --> 01:24:52,275
I need to be able to have
these different things.

2168
01:24:52,275 --> 01:24:55,005
And that took me a while

2169
01:24:55,005 --> 01:24:55,485
to figure out

2170
01:24:55,485 --> 01:24:55,815
too.

2171
01:24:55,820 --> 01:24:55,840
Yeah.

2172
01:24:55,905 --> 01:24:55,965
Yeah.

2173
01:24:55,965 --> 01:24:56,265
You know,

2174
01:24:56,865 --> 01:25:00,915
so I'm, and, and another thing like,
you know, that, uh, I learned from my

2175
01:25:00,915 --> 01:25:06,315
previous, you know, journeys through this,
uh, through, uh, PTSD and depression, is

2176
01:25:06,315 --> 01:25:11,055
that another thing that I think needs to
be, you know, definitely addressed and

2177
01:25:11,505 --> 01:25:15,855
understood, especially, you know, amongst
the, the, this community like that is

2178
01:25:15,855 --> 01:25:18,795
that it's okay to sometimes be depressed.

2179
01:25:19,485 --> 01:25:19,755
Yeah.

2180
01:25:20,294 --> 01:25:21,285
It's nor it's, it's normal.

2181
01:25:21,315 --> 01:25:21,945
It's a part of it.

2182
01:25:21,974 --> 01:25:22,514
It's part of it.

2183
01:25:22,605 --> 01:25:22,815
Yeah.

2184
01:25:22,964 --> 01:25:24,044
You're gonna be depressed.

2185
01:25:24,585 --> 01:25:25,844
Um, it's okay.

2186
01:25:26,294 --> 01:25:26,445
Yeah.

2187
01:25:26,535 --> 01:25:28,665
Don't think of it as that
I've, I'm, I failed again.

2188
01:25:28,665 --> 01:25:31,245
Or like that like, 'cause I, that, that
definitely was going through my head

2189
01:25:31,245 --> 01:25:37,365
is that how could I, you know, I, I've
worked so hard for a decade to get out

2190
01:25:37,365 --> 01:25:40,094
of this PTSD, you know, thing like that.

2191
01:25:40,094 --> 01:25:41,115
And now I'm here again.

2192
01:25:41,115 --> 01:25:44,924
And like that, how, even knowing full
well it's chronic, it doesn't go away.

2193
01:25:44,924 --> 01:25:45,884
It may wear its ugly head.

2194
01:25:45,915 --> 01:25:48,285
This is all this, all this, I
all knew this ahead of time.

2195
01:25:48,434 --> 01:25:51,615
Mm. And yet it still felt like a failure
when I was going through like the

2196
01:25:51,615 --> 01:25:54,315
really, when it's starting to really
sink down deep into it like that.

2197
01:25:54,315 --> 01:25:57,254
And it had to pull myself
back out of it again.

2198
01:25:57,254 --> 01:25:58,660
But understand that, no, it's, it's.

2199
01:25:59,340 --> 01:25:59,970
This is fine.

2200
01:25:59,970 --> 01:26:01,440
You're gonna be depressed
every once in a while.

2201
01:26:01,440 --> 01:26:01,830
Like that.

2202
01:26:01,830 --> 01:26:02,190
It's,

2203
01:26:02,730 --> 01:26:05,940
well, if you look at a physical
injury, we didn't choose, most

2204
01:26:05,940 --> 01:26:07,560
people don't choose to break an arm.

2205
01:26:07,650 --> 01:26:11,010
Most people don't choose to to be injured.

2206
01:26:11,310 --> 01:26:13,590
But you realize, man, that sucked.

2207
01:26:13,680 --> 01:26:13,860
Yeah.

2208
01:26:13,890 --> 01:26:16,710
Okay, well, I guess I'm not gonna be
able to use that arm for a little bit.

2209
01:26:16,710 --> 01:26:20,820
I'm gonna modify how I work for the next
little bit, and in a certain amount of

2210
01:26:20,820 --> 01:26:23,640
time it's gonna be better and I should
have a hundred percent functionality

2211
01:26:23,640 --> 01:26:27,030
back by this time, or X percent
functionality back by whatever time.

2212
01:26:27,780 --> 01:26:31,380
There's a roadmap in place and people
understand that and they appreciate

2213
01:26:31,380 --> 01:26:35,580
it and they expect it, but with the
emotional, psychological type things,

2214
01:26:35,760 --> 01:26:37,710
there isn't any visible indicator.

2215
01:26:38,220 --> 01:26:43,020
And I don't know why people don't
take the same approach as, oh, okay.

2216
01:26:43,080 --> 01:26:44,010
Indicators are here.

2217
01:26:44,010 --> 01:26:44,700
I feel it.

2218
01:26:44,700 --> 01:26:45,540
I can see it.

2219
01:26:45,540 --> 01:26:45,780
Right.

2220
01:26:45,780 --> 01:26:48,150
It's not like I've got a big sign
out that everyone else can see it.

2221
01:26:48,150 --> 01:26:48,210
Yeah.

2222
01:26:48,240 --> 01:26:49,290
Maybe, maybe not.

2223
01:26:49,290 --> 01:26:53,910
Like, depending on where someone's
at, but there's a process here.

2224
01:26:53,910 --> 01:26:56,580
I'm gonna set my tent up, I'm
gonna get find some shelter.

2225
01:26:56,610 --> 01:27:00,240
I'm going to take these, I'm gonna
cook up some food and make myself Yeah.

2226
01:27:00,240 --> 01:27:00,250
Yeah.

2227
01:27:00,300 --> 01:27:00,540
Right.

2228
01:27:00,540 --> 01:27:02,640
And you know what's gonna
happen in a little bit.

2229
01:27:02,640 --> 01:27:04,950
I'm gonna start feeling better
and the sun's gonna come out.

2230
01:27:05,430 --> 01:27:05,730
Yeah.

2231
01:27:05,735 --> 01:27:06,570
I, I can, well, sure.

2232
01:27:06,570 --> 01:27:09,390
I can sell, tell you that
from personal experience.

2233
01:27:09,690 --> 01:27:09,930
Okay.

2234
01:27:10,950 --> 01:27:12,690
You just said you break your arm.

2235
01:27:12,900 --> 01:27:13,110
Yeah.

2236
01:27:13,830 --> 01:27:14,100
You know what?

2237
01:27:14,100 --> 01:27:14,460
That, you know what?

2238
01:27:14,460 --> 01:27:16,080
That, that cast does everything like that.

2239
01:27:16,230 --> 01:27:17,070
That's a cool story.

2240
01:27:17,455 --> 01:27:17,855
Mm-hmm.

2241
01:27:19,500 --> 01:27:20,759
You're not doing so well in your head.

2242
01:27:21,030 --> 01:27:21,719
There's shame there.

2243
01:27:21,780 --> 01:27:23,160
Nobody wants to talk about that one.

2244
01:27:23,160 --> 01:27:23,219
No.

2245
01:27:23,549 --> 01:27:23,820
Right.

2246
01:27:23,825 --> 01:27:25,080
There's there's no cool story there.

2247
01:27:25,080 --> 01:27:28,230
Anything like that I can tell
you because I literally built

2248
01:27:28,230 --> 01:27:29,820
a, a, a, a slight career off it.

2249
01:27:30,750 --> 01:27:34,110
My story about how I got my PTSD and my
journey, my, the story of how I got it.

2250
01:27:34,589 --> 01:27:35,700
It's, it's, it's fun.

2251
01:27:36,150 --> 01:27:36,509
It's cool.

2252
01:27:36,509 --> 01:27:37,500
I mean, I deployed overseas.

2253
01:27:37,500 --> 01:27:39,059
I got to do really cool
things with the military.

2254
01:27:39,059 --> 01:27:39,540
That's cool.

2255
01:27:39,599 --> 01:27:39,809
Yeah.

2256
01:27:40,589 --> 01:27:42,780
The story, how I climb myself out of it.

2257
01:27:43,559 --> 01:27:45,540
That's a cool, that's
a fucking cool story.

2258
01:27:46,620 --> 01:27:48,509
And I'm happy to tell
that to people like that.

2259
01:27:48,719 --> 01:27:52,440
And people look at me, they're like,
when they hear what, what I did to

2260
01:27:52,440 --> 01:27:54,150
get there, they're like, damn man.

2261
01:27:54,150 --> 01:27:54,780
Like that.

2262
01:27:54,839 --> 01:27:57,509
Like, not every, that's a
really cool thing like that.

2263
01:27:57,509 --> 01:28:00,540
So it's, it's way cooler than
any bone I've ever broken.

2264
01:28:00,870 --> 01:28:04,320
And as you said, I've broken, I've
broken my, a fair share of bones last.

2265
01:28:04,320 --> 01:28:06,929
I'm like, that's cooler than
any bones I've ever broken.

2266
01:28:06,929 --> 01:28:09,900
Like I tell the story about, well,
I, I heal my body after, like

2267
01:28:09,900 --> 01:28:11,910
that, that was the easy part.

2268
01:28:11,940 --> 01:28:13,830
Mm. Healing my, my head after.

2269
01:28:14,370 --> 01:28:17,310
That took years and like that
and real struggle, but here's

2270
01:28:17,310 --> 01:28:18,570
what I did to do it like that.

2271
01:28:18,750 --> 01:28:22,080
How many times can you tell this
story without it wearing a bit of

2272
01:28:22,080 --> 01:28:23,880
a rut into that emotional side?

2273
01:28:23,970 --> 01:28:25,380
It, you know what, it definitely does.

2274
01:28:25,680 --> 01:28:29,610
Um, and that's one of the reasons why
I kind of pulled back from doing some

2275
01:28:29,610 --> 01:28:32,940
of the veteran's advocacy because I
realized that I kind of felt like my

2276
01:28:32,940 --> 01:28:34,860
story was no longer becoming my story.

2277
01:28:34,860 --> 01:28:36,060
It just was becoming a sales pitch.

2278
01:28:36,930 --> 01:28:40,710
Uh, and then so now then, but now I
then had to look at it again and saw,

2279
01:28:40,710 --> 01:28:42,420
well, now I get to reclaim my story.

2280
01:28:43,320 --> 01:28:47,040
It's no longer just a sales
pitch to try to, you know, raise

2281
01:28:47,040 --> 01:28:49,050
awareness and funding for veterans.

2282
01:28:49,680 --> 01:28:55,680
It can be, this is a story that should
inspire other people who are potentially

2283
01:28:55,680 --> 01:28:58,230
at a, a pretty dark part of their
lives and like that, that it's, you

2284
01:28:58,230 --> 01:29:01,920
know, you can come out of it and you
could be the person telling this to

2285
01:29:01,920 --> 01:29:03,930
someone who finds it really inspiring.

2286
01:29:03,960 --> 01:29:05,160
So, so

2287
01:29:05,160 --> 01:29:07,560
are you able to spot it in others?

2288
01:29:07,740 --> 01:29:10,590
Are you finding it a little bit
more in tuned to see other people

2289
01:29:10,590 --> 01:29:12,780
or do you maybe projecting or.

2290
01:29:12,870 --> 01:29:12,930
I,

2291
01:29:13,650 --> 01:29:16,800
I, you know what I, I want to
say I, I, I, I think I can.

2292
01:29:16,920 --> 01:29:22,470
Mm. But, uh, when I lost my buddy
this past year or anything like that,

2293
01:29:22,470 --> 01:29:23,910
that one, that one really shook me.

2294
01:29:24,450 --> 01:29:29,670
'cause looking back now, I'm like, damn.

2295
01:29:30,420 --> 01:29:31,740
The signs were there, but you didn't see.

2296
01:29:32,070 --> 01:29:32,309
Yeah.

2297
01:29:33,269 --> 01:29:34,140
What were the signs

2298
01:29:36,180 --> 01:29:39,120
he was, you know, it was just one
of those things, and I'm not gonna

2299
01:29:39,120 --> 01:29:41,640
mention names outta respect for the
family, but it was one of those, uh,

2300
01:29:41,760 --> 01:29:44,700
every time I was in town, he, we didn't
live in the same town as each other.

2301
01:29:44,700 --> 01:29:45,720
We were hours away.

2302
01:29:45,750 --> 01:29:48,990
But every that time was in, I was coming
up, he was always like, Hey, let's you

2303
01:29:48,990 --> 01:29:50,610
know if you have time, let's hang out.

2304
01:29:50,910 --> 01:29:53,040
Not, Hey buddy, let's hang out.

2305
01:29:53,040 --> 01:29:55,170
Like the way he used to, like, let's
just hang, let's go get some beers.

2306
01:29:55,170 --> 01:29:56,160
Let's have a great time with that day.

2307
01:29:56,160 --> 01:29:57,420
It was more, if you have time.

2308
01:29:58,365 --> 01:30:02,265
Kind of cau a little, a little cautious
little, you know, like, not if you

2309
01:30:02,265 --> 01:30:05,655
have time, kinda looking back it was
like, if you have time for me mm-hmm.

2310
01:30:05,895 --> 01:30:06,915
Was the full kind of sentence.

2311
01:30:06,915 --> 01:30:11,115
I, you know, you kind of could
infer there, uh, just wasn't

2312
01:30:11,115 --> 01:30:14,325
quite as responsive to as, as
what he used to be with like that.

2313
01:30:14,325 --> 01:30:14,925
Still fun.

2314
01:30:15,195 --> 01:30:17,685
Mm. Still like, I've known this
guy since day one in the Army.

2315
01:30:18,105 --> 01:30:25,725
We literally left on the bus together to
bootcamp to, to our, our basic, um, and

2316
01:30:25,725 --> 01:30:28,845
right from day one, cracking jokes and
just, you know, a fun loving guy or like

2317
01:30:28,845 --> 01:30:30,285
that we, we didn't, we didn't deploy it.

2318
01:30:30,375 --> 01:30:31,515
He didn't, we didn't deploy together.

2319
01:30:31,515 --> 01:30:36,495
He never actually deployed, but uh, we
fold each, you know, we were, we were, you

2320
01:30:36,495 --> 01:30:40,605
know, turn, you know, star skiing hutch
for most of the trade or like that, right.

2321
01:30:40,605 --> 01:30:42,345
It's like if he was getting
in trouble, I was pretty much

2322
01:30:42,345 --> 01:30:43,515
beside him for most of the time.

2323
01:30:43,515 --> 01:30:43,815
Right.

2324
01:30:44,370 --> 01:30:48,210
Um, and so just this
fun loving, great guy.

2325
01:30:48,210 --> 01:30:52,350
Always there to be a helpful hand,
everybody, and looking back as just

2326
01:30:52,350 --> 01:30:53,790
kinda like, was he in the end there?

2327
01:30:53,790 --> 01:30:57,090
Was he more trying to be a helpful
hand as kind of a way to reach out,

2328
01:30:57,269 --> 01:31:04,650
just see if he could get some help and,
uh, I just, I, I, I regret not, you

2329
01:31:04,650 --> 01:31:05,760
know, it's hard to live, it's hard.

2330
01:31:05,790 --> 01:31:07,800
You always say like, don't
live, don't blame yourself,

2331
01:31:07,800 --> 01:31:09,240
and you don't do with regrets.

2332
01:31:09,240 --> 01:31:12,300
But it's, it's, I regret not maybe
trying to be there a little more

2333
01:31:12,300 --> 01:31:15,870
form or trying to make more time
in order to try to, you know, uh,

2334
01:31:16,110 --> 01:31:17,220
hang with them when I wasn't town.

2335
01:31:18,240 --> 01:31:23,040
And, uh, so it, it's, it's difficult.

2336
01:31:24,390 --> 01:31:31,470
Uh, the ones that you can see the
signs on are they're being obvious.

2337
01:31:31,470 --> 01:31:35,880
They're, they're, they're, it's really,
it's unlikely they're gonna, they're at

2338
01:31:35,880 --> 01:31:37,560
a risk of actually taking their lives.

2339
01:31:37,590 --> 01:31:38,250
That's what I've seen.

2340
01:31:38,550 --> 01:31:39,780
That's what the ones that are.

2341
01:31:40,200 --> 01:31:41,310
They can hide it really well.

2342
01:31:41,430 --> 01:31:41,550
Mm-hmm.

2343
01:31:41,880 --> 01:31:44,700
Are the ones that you're gonna be at
a funeral atd and you're like, and

2344
01:31:44,700 --> 01:31:47,490
you're asking, holy shit, this sucks.

2345
01:31:48,270 --> 01:31:50,280
You ever hear the poem Richard Corey?

2346
01:31:50,640 --> 01:31:50,880
No.

2347
01:31:51,450 --> 01:31:55,410
Uh, Edwin Arlington Robinson, I
think was, uh, the guy's name.

2348
01:31:55,410 --> 01:31:59,550
He, I don't think he had a, uh, a
name for the first, I think year

2349
01:31:59,550 --> 01:32:05,910
or two of his life until um, um,
I guess his parents or someplace.

2350
01:32:05,910 --> 01:32:09,600
And they, they threw names
into a, a hat and someone out

2351
01:32:09,810 --> 01:32:10,920
there at a hotel or something.

2352
01:32:10,980 --> 01:32:12,210
He said, your kid should have a name.

2353
01:32:12,210 --> 01:32:15,690
And anyways, he came up with Edwin,
I guess a guy was from Arlington,

2354
01:32:15,690 --> 01:32:17,040
so that was his middle, middle name.

2355
01:32:17,370 --> 01:32:19,170
But he wrote a poem called Richard Corey.

2356
01:32:19,530 --> 01:32:22,110
And I said, um, I'll see
if I can remember it.

2357
01:32:23,010 --> 01:32:23,610
Um.

2358
01:32:25,005 --> 01:32:29,205
Whenever Richard Corey went to town
with people on the pavement, looked

2359
01:32:29,205 --> 01:32:33,255
at him, he was a gentleman from sold
a crown clean, favored and imper slim.

2360
01:32:33,495 --> 01:32:37,275
And he was always quietly iray and
he was always human when he talked,

2361
01:32:37,275 --> 01:32:38,775
but still he fluttered pulses.

2362
01:32:38,955 --> 01:32:42,615
When he said good morning and he glittered
when he walked and he was rich, asked

2363
01:32:42,615 --> 01:32:46,335
Richard that a king and admirably,
schooled in every grace and fine.

2364
01:32:46,335 --> 01:32:49,365
We thought him to be everything to
make us wish we were in his place

2365
01:32:49,725 --> 01:32:54,375
and on We work and went without
the meat and cursed the bread.

2366
01:32:54,465 --> 01:32:57,825
And Richard Corey went calm
summers night, went home and

2367
01:32:57,825 --> 01:32:58,875
put a bullet through his head.

2368
01:32:59,475 --> 01:33:02,865
And that poem was always
kind of stuck with me.

2369
01:33:03,285 --> 01:33:06,135
And it's the Richard Coreys
that you have to Yeah.

2370
01:33:06,165 --> 01:33:06,855
Watch out for.

2371
01:33:06,885 --> 01:33:07,095
Yeah.

2372
01:33:09,165 --> 01:33:17,505
As I said, uh, 10% of the population,
no matter how little the injury is.

2373
01:33:18,990 --> 01:33:19,799
You can't save them.

2374
01:33:21,120 --> 01:33:22,410
It's the 10 and 10%.

2375
01:33:22,709 --> 01:33:26,700
No matter how horrific or traumatic

2376
01:33:26,849 --> 01:33:27,959
they're gonna be better in spite of it.

2377
01:33:27,964 --> 01:33:28,144
They're, they're,

2378
01:33:28,144 --> 01:33:30,389
they're just gonna be smiling through
it and they're, they're gonna survive

2379
01:33:30,389 --> 01:33:31,320
anything that throws their way.

2380
01:33:31,410 --> 01:33:36,660
Mm. It's that 80% in between Mm.
Uh, that we really have to strive

2381
01:33:36,690 --> 01:33:38,309
to really work to try to save.

2382
01:33:39,240 --> 01:33:45,570
Um, and I learned that is that, you
know, I, unfortunately, the, you know,

2383
01:33:45,809 --> 01:33:49,589
this is not the only two friends I've
lost to two this, you know, to suicide.

2384
01:33:50,129 --> 01:33:51,629
Uh, this is not the only, you know.

2385
01:33:52,349 --> 01:33:54,840
There's been others before I hit my
last podcast or anything like that.

2386
01:33:54,840 --> 01:33:57,690
I've also lost another, another
buddy with the two like that.

2387
01:33:57,690 --> 01:34:00,179
And every one of 'em hurts.

2388
01:34:00,269 --> 01:34:00,450
Mm-hmm.

2389
01:34:00,690 --> 01:34:03,330
You know, you question, you know, I, I've
learned not to question it anymore of

2390
01:34:03,330 --> 01:34:06,630
like, what, what could I have done to fix
it or anything like that, because probably

2391
01:34:06,630 --> 01:34:09,450
nothing realistically, if they really
wanted to do it, they're gonna do it.

2392
01:34:09,870 --> 01:34:10,830
It's not for you to fix.

2393
01:34:10,830 --> 01:34:11,009
No.

2394
01:34:11,070 --> 01:34:12,330
There's nothing that you can fix.

2395
01:34:12,330 --> 01:34:14,759
You can't take an alcoholic
and make them sober.

2396
01:34:14,759 --> 01:34:14,955
No, you're right.

2397
01:34:14,969 --> 01:34:17,610
You can't take a drug addict, but you
can't take a depressed person and ta-da.

2398
01:34:17,849 --> 01:34:18,269
Yeah.

2399
01:34:18,269 --> 01:34:18,929
It made you laugh.

2400
01:34:18,929 --> 01:34:19,500
Now you're better.

2401
01:34:19,559 --> 01:34:19,860
Right.

2402
01:34:19,920 --> 01:34:23,160
But you definitely, I think
it's this as a group as a whole.

2403
01:34:23,165 --> 01:34:23,355
Mm-hmm.

2404
01:34:23,550 --> 01:34:30,690
As, as men, we need to do better than,
and you hear this multiple podcasts.

2405
01:34:30,690 --> 01:34:32,550
You hear this and I, I listen to
podcasts all the time where they're

2406
01:34:32,550 --> 01:34:33,570
like, men need to be better.

2407
01:34:34,679 --> 01:34:34,769
Yeah.

2408
01:34:34,769 --> 01:34:35,490
What does better look

2409
01:34:35,490 --> 01:34:35,580
like?

2410
01:34:35,580 --> 01:34:36,269
What does better look like?

2411
01:34:36,300 --> 01:34:37,230
What does, what does better mean?

2412
01:34:37,230 --> 01:34:37,650
Anything like that?

2413
01:34:37,650 --> 01:34:38,849
Do we be better to each other?

2414
01:34:39,840 --> 01:34:42,179
No, because you know what I, I, I
what we were talking earlier about,

2415
01:34:42,179 --> 01:34:43,800
uh oh, like, you know what's up?

2416
01:34:43,800 --> 01:34:46,620
You know, you know, you
call each other names.

2417
01:34:46,620 --> 01:34:47,315
You like that, that.

2418
01:34:48,330 --> 01:34:50,394
Does have a place, there is some
sort of bonding there like that.

2419
01:34:50,700 --> 01:34:51,930
I think that actually that's important.

2420
01:34:51,930 --> 01:34:55,260
'cause it kind of is part of our, our
If it's done, done in good spirit.

2421
01:34:55,290 --> 01:34:55,500
Yeah.

2422
01:34:55,530 --> 01:34:55,890
Right.

2423
01:34:56,310 --> 01:34:58,710
Uh, it does actually have a place
and it makes you kind of feel a

2424
01:34:58,710 --> 01:34:59,970
little comradery there like that.

2425
01:34:59,975 --> 01:35:00,115
Mm-hmm.

2426
01:35:00,195 --> 01:35:03,090
You know, I, I still call, you know, guys
I've seen the years and in the Army I

2427
01:35:03,090 --> 01:35:04,170
see him again and I'm like, what's up?

2428
01:35:04,170 --> 01:35:05,100
You know, like, yeah.

2429
01:35:05,100 --> 01:35:05,355
Dumb ass.

2430
01:35:05,775 --> 01:35:06,394
You dumb ass.

2431
01:35:06,480 --> 01:35:09,360
Or remember that time you, you
know, you did this or like that.

2432
01:35:09,900 --> 01:35:11,460
You share funny stories
and stuff like that.

2433
01:35:11,460 --> 01:35:11,790
Right.

2434
01:35:12,690 --> 01:35:13,530
There is value to that.

2435
01:35:13,530 --> 01:35:20,970
But, um, so recently, uh, I, I, uh,
this, this guy, I know he went up on

2436
01:35:20,970 --> 01:35:24,600
a camping trip, boys, boys weekend.

2437
01:35:25,769 --> 01:35:27,750
What do you think is gonna happen on
a boys' weekend, on a camping trip?

2438
01:35:28,710 --> 01:35:30,180
Shenanigans drinking.

2439
01:35:30,300 --> 01:35:30,600
Sure.

2440
01:35:30,630 --> 01:35:31,500
Maybe some golfing.

2441
01:35:31,680 --> 01:35:31,769
Sure.

2442
01:35:31,890 --> 01:35:34,110
Hopefully no one, you know,
you know, gets burned by a

2443
01:35:34,110 --> 01:35:35,310
firecracker or something like that.

2444
01:35:35,310 --> 01:35:37,230
But Shena shenanigans is a good way.

2445
01:35:37,230 --> 01:35:39,900
Like, uh, Tom Foolery had shenanigans.

2446
01:35:39,900 --> 01:35:39,960
Yeah.

2447
01:35:39,960 --> 01:35:42,930
And all of this was
happening or like that.

2448
01:35:45,165 --> 01:35:50,685
And, uh, I, I, I took my son to go,
uh, meet some of his family members

2449
01:35:50,685 --> 01:35:52,965
and like that, and they were at
like this house at a pool party.

2450
01:35:52,965 --> 01:35:56,325
And then one of, one of the, the, the
guy that I know, or like that, this

2451
01:35:56,325 --> 01:35:58,515
friend of mine, he was married to
one of the, the girls and like that.

2452
01:35:58,515 --> 01:36:03,585
So it was me and my son and, uh, and
a and a bunch of, and my wife and

2453
01:36:03,765 --> 01:36:04,995
some of her cousins are like that.

2454
01:36:04,995 --> 01:36:08,085
And all of them were girls and they're
all, I was doing the barbecuing.

2455
01:36:08,235 --> 01:36:08,445
Mm-hmm.

2456
01:36:08,451 --> 01:36:09,675
Because they asked me, I was like, okay.

2457
01:36:10,185 --> 01:36:14,385
And then we were all having dinner and
one of the girls said, yeah, he is up

2458
01:36:14,385 --> 01:36:17,655
there, he is having a, you know, a,
a, a great cabin weekend or like that.

2459
01:36:17,655 --> 01:36:19,305
He's hanging out with his,
with his brother, with his,

2460
01:36:19,305 --> 01:36:20,445
with his, with his boys.

2461
01:36:20,745 --> 01:36:22,965
They're like, oh, I wonder what's gonna
be happening up there, blah, blah.

2462
01:36:22,965 --> 01:36:24,075
And then she's like, yeah.

2463
01:36:24,075 --> 01:36:26,685
And they're, they're all gonna sit
around a, the campfire and tell each

2464
01:36:26,685 --> 01:36:28,125
other what they love about each other.

2465
01:36:29,175 --> 01:36:29,415
Hmm.

2466
01:36:29,685 --> 01:36:32,625
And I was like, oh man, that'd be amazing.

2467
01:36:32,955 --> 01:36:33,375
No kidding.

2468
01:36:33,375 --> 01:36:35,985
That'd be, and all the, all
the, the women at the table were

2469
01:36:35,985 --> 01:36:38,505
just like, yeah, they're shot.

2470
01:36:38,835 --> 01:36:39,165
Yeah.

2471
01:36:39,525 --> 01:36:42,945
Because, and I, and what took me
back was, why are they shocked?

2472
01:36:43,844 --> 01:36:46,724
Because they're, we, they
also know what this isn't.

2473
01:36:46,724 --> 01:36:51,825
This is not manly behavior according to
what we've been led to be grown up and

2474
01:36:51,825 --> 01:36:57,315
believe or like that meanwhile, that that
was probably more therapeutic for anyone.

2475
01:36:57,315 --> 01:37:00,405
Those, if one of those guys was going
through something at that, that moment

2476
01:37:00,405 --> 01:37:02,925
or like that probably would've been
more therapeutic and more helpful.

2477
01:37:03,495 --> 01:37:03,735
Mm-hmm.

2478
01:37:04,455 --> 01:37:04,815
But,

2479
01:37:07,005 --> 01:37:08,865
and everyone's like, my
God, that's so progressive.

2480
01:37:08,894 --> 01:37:10,995
And I'm like, that it
shouldn't be progressive.

2481
01:37:10,995 --> 01:37:11,745
It should be the norm.

2482
01:37:12,720 --> 01:37:12,870
I'm

2483
01:37:12,870 --> 01:37:15,780
wondering when it's stopping being
the norm because I, you know, I

2484
01:37:15,780 --> 01:37:21,900
remember, uh, podcast I did with EB
Levo, ex-head of BC's, ERT mm-hmm.

2485
01:37:22,140 --> 01:37:29,670
For, um, division and, uh, black
Belt, jiujitsu, martial artist, super

2486
01:37:29,670 --> 01:37:32,190
Fit, uh, Mr. Tactical, all the rest.

2487
01:37:32,190 --> 01:37:36,810
And, uh, he is done his research
on, uh, different cultures and the

2488
01:37:36,810 --> 01:37:41,670
warrior culture, and he's a big
advocate for, uh, having a strong

2489
01:37:41,670 --> 01:37:43,645
heart and strong mind and Yep.

2490
01:37:44,010 --> 01:37:45,510
Uh, to accompany everything.

2491
01:37:45,510 --> 01:37:51,360
And, um, you know, you, for a long
time, you look at like, let's say

2492
01:37:51,420 --> 01:37:54,210
Canadian military, if you're strong,
that means you, you're physically

2493
01:37:54,210 --> 01:37:55,470
strong and you can keep pushing.

2494
01:37:55,470 --> 01:37:55,530
Yeah.

2495
01:37:55,530 --> 01:37:56,610
And then you don't complain.

2496
01:37:56,610 --> 01:37:56,850
Right.

2497
01:37:56,850 --> 01:38:02,100
And, and I was like, um, you know, I,
I gotta wonder, uh, why people haven't.

2498
01:38:02,490 --> 01:38:06,120
Been incorporating the, uh, the
psychological and the emotional

2499
01:38:06,120 --> 01:38:07,620
and the spiritual side to all this.

2500
01:38:07,620 --> 01:38:11,040
And he says, you have to ask yourself
the question why they stopped, because

2501
01:38:11,040 --> 01:38:15,509
that used to be a regular part of how
society worked, and your warriors were

2502
01:38:15,509 --> 01:38:16,769
gonna go out and they're gonna fight.

2503
01:38:16,769 --> 01:38:21,690
But they also had, uh, faith,
spirituality, uh, like they, they

2504
01:38:21,690 --> 01:38:25,860
had these other pillars to be
able to help support resilience.

2505
01:38:26,339 --> 01:38:31,620
And we, I guess in humanity got
really, or at least in North America,

2506
01:38:31,620 --> 01:38:36,389
it got really lopsided on one side
of what we considered to be strength.

2507
01:38:36,629 --> 01:38:39,179
And I see that changing.

2508
01:38:39,330 --> 01:38:40,230
And it's an asset change.

2509
01:38:40,230 --> 01:38:40,290
Yeah.

2510
01:38:40,290 --> 01:38:42,330
It's changing because of these statistics.

2511
01:38:42,330 --> 01:38:44,910
It's changing because
it's, it's untenable.

2512
01:38:44,910 --> 01:38:46,860
It doesn't sustain itself
over the long term.

2513
01:38:46,865 --> 01:38:47,054
Yeah.

2514
01:38:47,099 --> 01:38:47,309
Yeah.

2515
01:38:47,460 --> 01:38:51,690
No, I, I, and I agree with you is that,
you know, when I, when I first did, when

2516
01:38:51,690 --> 01:38:55,799
I joined the Army, it was very much a
kind of like, as you said, strength was.

2517
01:38:57,345 --> 01:39:00,345
You're physically strong, you can ruck
marks forever, everything like that.

2518
01:39:00,345 --> 01:39:04,425
You can, you can just take it and come
out the other side or something like that.

2519
01:39:04,425 --> 01:39:04,435
Yep.

2520
01:39:04,435 --> 01:39:09,495
You, but nothing was a, you know, and
then again, and if it wasn't, you'd

2521
01:39:09,495 --> 01:39:12,315
be called all sorts of different
names and like, that you're weak.

2522
01:39:12,315 --> 01:39:15,974
You're, you know, you're, you're, you're
not fit to be, you know, in the, in, in,

2523
01:39:15,974 --> 01:39:19,035
in, you know, like things like, you're
not fit to be nothing in the army.

2524
01:39:19,035 --> 01:39:22,365
You're not fit to, you know, be, you know,
like, uh, in this, wearing this uniform,

2525
01:39:22,365 --> 01:39:23,565
in this service and stuff like that.

2526
01:39:23,565 --> 01:39:25,215
And there, there's a
time and place for that.

2527
01:39:25,215 --> 01:39:25,514
Sure.

2528
01:39:25,519 --> 01:39:25,800
Mm-hmm.

2529
01:39:26,745 --> 01:39:27,945
But, but those are

2530
01:39:27,945 --> 01:39:28,934
typically tests.

2531
01:39:28,995 --> 01:39:29,715
Those aren't tests.

2532
01:39:29,745 --> 01:39:30,165
Right.

2533
01:39:30,165 --> 01:39:31,875
But not everybody knows it's a test.

2534
01:39:31,875 --> 01:39:33,135
Nobody knows why they do it.

2535
01:39:33,135 --> 01:39:35,115
They see other people do
it and they buy into it.

2536
01:39:35,120 --> 01:39:35,240
Yeah.

2537
01:39:35,240 --> 01:39:36,585
And some people take it too far.

2538
01:39:36,615 --> 01:39:36,855
Yeah.

2539
01:39:36,885 --> 01:39:40,394
But there, those are typically a
test to see, are you gonna belong?

2540
01:39:40,514 --> 01:39:40,605
Yeah.

2541
01:39:40,610 --> 01:39:42,764
Are are you gonna be beside
us when we really need it?

2542
01:39:42,769 --> 01:39:42,880
Yeah.

2543
01:39:42,880 --> 01:39:42,890
Yeah.

2544
01:39:42,890 --> 01:39:43,455
Well, that's it.

2545
01:39:43,455 --> 01:39:43,724
Right.

2546
01:39:43,724 --> 01:39:49,155
But, but a hu you know, I, I would say the
strongest thing I've ever done is admit

2547
01:39:50,325 --> 01:39:51,915
that I got a problem and I need help.

2548
01:39:52,005 --> 01:39:52,425
Mm-hmm.

2549
01:39:53,535 --> 01:39:59,025
And no one, you know, no one I was,
that I knew me at the time that I

2550
01:39:59,025 --> 01:40:01,155
was aware of judged me for, for that.

2551
01:40:01,304 --> 01:40:04,094
And so that's the, you know, that's
something we, we definitely need to still

2552
01:40:04,455 --> 01:40:06,764
keep stressing to the, the population.

2553
01:40:07,245 --> 01:40:08,535
And I, I'm focusing on men here.

2554
01:40:08,535 --> 01:40:11,924
I think that because it's my own
experience, I, I can't speak to what

2555
01:40:11,924 --> 01:40:14,505
a woman feels like or what she feels
during depression or like that.

2556
01:40:14,505 --> 01:40:16,065
I'm sure it's not that dissimilar.

2557
01:40:16,575 --> 01:40:18,315
They need help just as
much as we do or like that.

2558
01:40:18,315 --> 01:40:25,065
But, um, there's a reason why eight out
of 10 suicides are committed by men.

2559
01:40:25,934 --> 01:40:30,884
And typically men's suicide attempts
have a greater level of finality Yeah.

2560
01:40:30,884 --> 01:40:32,115
Than women's suicide

2561
01:40:32,115 --> 01:40:32,505
attempt.

2562
01:40:32,505 --> 01:40:32,565
Yeah.

2563
01:40:33,255 --> 01:40:37,605
So like, and as a, you know, we just, we
need, we need to do better as a society.

2564
01:40:37,605 --> 01:40:39,674
And I'm trying to think, you
know, I'm trying to think of,

2565
01:40:39,674 --> 01:40:41,985
okay, how can me and my role.

2566
01:40:42,465 --> 01:40:47,745
As manager of defense law enforcement,
uh, and as, as a manager, and as you

2567
01:40:47,745 --> 01:40:50,895
say, like a bit of a industry leader
within the firearms committee mm-hmm.

2568
01:40:51,135 --> 01:40:57,495
How can we incorporate this into
somehow helping that in a responsible,

2569
01:40:57,825 --> 01:40:59,655
safe, and effective manner?

2570
01:41:00,615 --> 01:41:03,555
And we've heard of, you know,
there's groups out there that

2571
01:41:03,585 --> 01:41:08,205
want to run hunting, you know, pay
basically guided hunting trips for

2572
01:41:08,505 --> 01:41:10,275
veterans with PTSD veteran hunters.

2573
01:41:10,275 --> 01:41:10,395
Yeah.

2574
01:41:10,395 --> 01:41:14,625
Veteran hunters, Todd, he, um, there's
always that little kind of like,

2575
01:41:14,715 --> 01:41:17,265
unfortunately that Chris, Kyle mm-hmm.

2576
01:41:17,505 --> 01:41:19,665
Incident that like, sure, if
we do this, that could happen.

2577
01:41:19,995 --> 01:41:22,275
Well, you, you go to any range
that could happen or like that.

2578
01:41:22,275 --> 01:41:25,515
So I, I get it As a, as a, as an
organization, especially as a charity

2579
01:41:25,515 --> 01:41:28,155
that wants to support something like
that, they have to be very, very

2580
01:41:28,155 --> 01:41:32,895
careful about the potential liability
like that, about something about.

2581
01:41:33,135 --> 01:41:37,605
But I can honestly say that, that, that
a case of that is so few and far between.

2582
01:41:37,695 --> 01:41:37,935
Mm-hmm.

2583
01:41:39,015 --> 01:41:41,025
Um, but it's.

2584
01:41:41,594 --> 01:41:42,554
Veteran hunters vent.

2585
01:41:42,644 --> 01:41:45,825
Like also like how can we get conservation
groups maybe involved or like that,

2586
01:41:46,065 --> 01:41:49,094
how could we get potentially even the
government, like Park Parks Canada

2587
01:41:49,094 --> 01:41:52,575
organization or like that involved in
supporting not just veterans and first

2588
01:41:52,575 --> 01:41:53,985
responders, but now men as a whole.

2589
01:41:54,075 --> 01:41:54,884
Mm. Running,

2590
01:41:57,134 --> 01:41:59,384
we were talking like, uh,
my, my son's at summer camp.

2591
01:41:59,384 --> 01:42:05,625
My son goes to, why can't we have adult
summer camps for, for, for, for men for

2592
01:42:05,625 --> 01:42:08,955
like, you know, a week where we go away
to a summer camp just to be a kid again.

2593
01:42:08,960 --> 01:42:09,360
Everyth like that.

2594
01:42:09,360 --> 01:42:09,599
Mm-hmm.

2595
01:42:09,900 --> 01:42:10,599
That'd be amazing.

2596
01:42:11,540 --> 01:42:12,120
That'd be fun.

2597
01:42:12,480 --> 01:42:12,639
Yeah.

2598
01:42:12,639 --> 01:42:12,799
Right.

2599
01:42:12,799 --> 01:42:13,000
Like

2600
01:42:13,964 --> 01:42:15,075
you're on the zip line again.

2601
01:42:15,495 --> 01:42:19,815
When I was, uh, when I was, you know, when
I was 14 years old or like that, there's

2602
01:42:19,815 --> 01:42:26,474
a, uh, place in, in Ontario up in Al Park
called SOES or Kearney, and you go there,

2603
01:42:26,684 --> 01:42:31,485
you go there for the summer and I mean,
it's a full like four, five week program

2604
01:42:31,485 --> 01:42:34,240
or like that, but you go there and you've
been going there for a couple years as,

2605
01:42:34,875 --> 01:42:39,224
as you know, as a kid or like that, but
my final year there when I was 14, it was.

2606
01:42:39,660 --> 01:42:42,300
Two weeks at the thing learning,
you know, learning portaging

2607
01:42:42,300 --> 01:42:43,050
swimming and something like that.

2608
01:42:43,050 --> 01:42:46,050
And then you did a two week
portage through Algonquin Park.

2609
01:42:46,470 --> 01:42:46,950
Cool.

2610
01:42:47,160 --> 01:42:47,550
Right.

2611
01:42:48,360 --> 01:42:50,130
One of the, one of the most
memorable experiences of my life,

2612
01:42:50,130 --> 01:42:53,130
or like that, uh, I mean, I've had
some pretty good ones like that.

2613
01:42:53,135 --> 01:42:53,145
Yeah.

2614
01:42:53,150 --> 01:42:56,550
But, you know, waking up every
morning going canoeing and like that.

2615
01:42:56,845 --> 01:42:57,145
So Cool.

2616
01:42:57,145 --> 01:43:00,090
And, uh, oh, and you know, it
helped the fact that I was 14.

2617
01:43:00,090 --> 01:43:03,720
I got my very first kiss there
on my birthday of all things,

2618
01:43:03,720 --> 01:43:05,310
like, it's a birthday present.

2619
01:43:05,340 --> 01:43:05,730
Oh yeah.

2620
01:43:06,210 --> 01:43:08,700
It was like, it was, it was
great Or like that, but, uh,

2621
01:43:08,820 --> 01:43:10,140
dumb that down to a little bit.

2622
01:43:10,230 --> 01:43:12,450
Why can't we do that now?

2623
01:43:12,450 --> 01:43:15,150
Or like that, like we can, I, I
mean, we can't because we have,

2624
01:43:15,330 --> 01:43:16,500
we're like, no, we have priorities.

2625
01:43:17,310 --> 01:43:18,510
Well, I, I need to look after my son.

2626
01:43:18,510 --> 01:43:19,650
I need to look after my wife.

2627
01:43:19,650 --> 01:43:22,050
I need to make sure the groceries are,
I need to make sure the bills are paid.

2628
01:43:22,050 --> 01:43:27,300
I need to, but what's the harm, as
you said, if I take a week or even

2629
01:43:27,510 --> 01:43:32,700
a couple days and not have, and
not, not worry about that, I. If

2630
01:43:32,700 --> 01:43:35,309
you have a partner that's a rock.

2631
01:43:35,460 --> 01:43:39,629
Mm. My, you know, I, I traditionally would
always do all the meal prep and stuff

2632
01:43:39,629 --> 01:43:40,830
like that before I go away on a trip.

2633
01:43:40,860 --> 01:43:40,980
Mm-hmm.

2634
01:43:41,670 --> 01:43:43,080
I didn't do that this time around.

2635
01:43:43,650 --> 01:43:44,190
You know why?

2636
01:43:44,580 --> 01:43:46,980
Because I looked at my wife and
I said, you have, you got this?

2637
01:43:47,009 --> 01:43:47,849
And she's like, 86.

2638
01:43:47,849 --> 01:43:48,990
She's like, hell yeah, I do.

2639
01:43:49,170 --> 01:43:49,410
Yeah.

2640
01:43:49,650 --> 01:43:50,580
And she, I know she does.

2641
01:43:50,585 --> 01:43:50,775
Mm-hmm.

2642
01:43:50,910 --> 01:43:55,049
I needed to, to understand, I need,
I needed to accept the fact that

2643
01:43:55,349 --> 01:43:58,019
she can handle this without, for
a couple days without me there.

2644
01:43:58,860 --> 01:44:00,750
It's amazing how capable we all are.

2645
01:44:01,320 --> 01:44:01,379
Yeah.

2646
01:44:01,379 --> 01:44:01,889
I mean, I need

2647
01:44:01,894 --> 01:44:04,710
to, I need to understand that
my son will be okay if I'm not

2648
01:44:04,710 --> 01:44:05,790
gonna be there for a couple days.

2649
01:44:05,790 --> 01:44:08,429
And like that he has supports.

2650
01:44:08,639 --> 01:44:11,370
Now, not everyone is in that situation.

2651
01:44:11,400 --> 01:44:13,620
There is people out there that
don't necessarily have that.

2652
01:44:13,625 --> 01:44:17,219
And I, and I get that it's not gonna
be a solution for everybody, but how

2653
01:44:17,219 --> 01:44:22,980
can we incorporate our community, not
only to try to better our community and

2654
01:44:22,980 --> 01:44:26,639
better speak for our community within
the groups and at for advocacy, but

2655
01:44:26,849 --> 01:44:31,080
how can we also potentially be involved
in a greater hole in proving society?

2656
01:44:31,980 --> 01:44:32,280
Hmm.

2657
01:44:32,910 --> 01:44:37,980
We should, uh, talk offline here
because I know a fellow who's, uh,

2658
01:44:38,040 --> 01:44:40,679
been looking at something very similar
to what you're talking about here.

2659
01:44:40,679 --> 01:44:44,730
And I think, uh, um,
I'll reach out to him.

2660
01:44:44,820 --> 01:44:45,000
Yeah.

2661
01:44:45,000 --> 01:44:49,410
And, uh, he's talking about a, um,
some, something that was very successful

2662
01:44:49,410 --> 01:44:52,050
when I was, and I think they still
exist, but I'm not, I'm not sure.

2663
01:44:52,050 --> 01:44:54,840
But, uh, what were they called?

2664
01:44:55,019 --> 01:44:57,570
Uh, outdoors Canada or
something like that.

2665
01:44:57,570 --> 01:45:03,059
But, uh, they, they ran, it started out
here actually in bc um, and it's what

2666
01:45:03,059 --> 01:45:07,200
I went through, but before I went on my
climbing Nepal, they did climbing tours.

2667
01:45:07,200 --> 01:45:09,554
It's like climbing trips
for veterans with PTHD.

2668
01:45:09,559 --> 01:45:09,570
Okay.

2669
01:45:09,690 --> 01:45:10,019
Okay.

2670
01:45:10,170 --> 01:45:13,080
And they eventually branched out across
Canada, so now they do, like on the East

2671
01:45:13,080 --> 01:45:16,469
Coast, they do like kayaking trips into
the Bay of Fundee and stuff like that.

2672
01:45:16,469 --> 01:45:16,530
Hmm.

2673
01:45:16,650 --> 01:45:21,240
And they do, uh, in Ontario they
do Portaging and you know, I go

2674
01:45:21,240 --> 01:45:23,400
in Alka Park or There you go.

2675
01:45:23,400 --> 01:45:26,309
Uh, you do hiking up in
like an Outward Bound.

2676
01:45:26,639 --> 01:45:26,700
Yeah.

2677
01:45:26,700 --> 01:45:27,179
Outward Bound.

2678
01:45:27,179 --> 01:45:27,509
That was it.

2679
01:45:27,509 --> 01:45:28,019
Outward Bound.

2680
01:45:29,025 --> 01:45:32,895
And, uh, but it was specifically
fo kind of focus more towards

2681
01:45:32,895 --> 01:45:34,125
veterans and first responders.

2682
01:45:34,125 --> 01:45:37,365
But why, why couldn't we expand
that to society as a whole?

2683
01:45:37,395 --> 01:45:37,995
Mm-hmm.

2684
01:45:39,315 --> 01:45:40,395
It honestly is benefit.

2685
01:45:40,395 --> 01:45:41,355
We know the benefits.

2686
01:45:41,355 --> 01:45:45,825
It obviously was super beneficial to
the veteran community that was suffering

2687
01:45:45,825 --> 01:45:51,105
from mental health, but I can tell you
it's just a small segment of we know how

2688
01:45:51,105 --> 01:45:53,835
much there is maybe a, maybe a higher.

2689
01:45:54,375 --> 01:45:59,895
Cases of PTSD amongst at the time
coming out of Afghanistan amongst

2690
01:45:59,895 --> 01:46:03,645
the veteran community of with p with,
with, with, uh, postex disorder.

2691
01:46:03,645 --> 01:46:05,535
Due to the nature of
what it, it was a combat.

2692
01:46:05,835 --> 01:46:06,945
It was 10 years.

2693
01:46:06,980 --> 01:46:07,300
PSD

2694
01:46:07,300 --> 01:46:11,085
is still trying to, no one
knows no really what PTSD is.

2695
01:46:11,085 --> 01:46:12,135
They got ideas about it.

2696
01:46:12,135 --> 01:46:15,675
They got, but even the last DSM
has changed how they approach.

2697
01:46:15,675 --> 01:46:15,735
Yeah.

2698
01:46:15,740 --> 01:46:15,860
Yeah.

2699
01:46:15,915 --> 01:46:19,215
And they, I think they added complex
P-T-S-D-C-P-T-S-D and, but it doesn't even

2700
01:46:19,215 --> 01:46:21,735
have to be PTSD, just simple
depression or like that.

2701
01:46:21,740 --> 01:46:21,750
Right.

2702
01:46:21,750 --> 01:46:23,625
It can be, it can be debilitating
or anything like that.

2703
01:46:23,655 --> 01:46:25,455
It doesn't need, doesn't
really even need a label.

2704
01:46:25,455 --> 01:46:27,345
It doesn't need to have a
label and it doesn't need to be

2705
01:46:27,345 --> 01:46:28,545
caused by trauma necessarily.

2706
01:46:28,545 --> 01:46:28,665
Right.

2707
01:46:28,755 --> 01:46:32,505
So my second bout of my, my bout of
depression or happened last year,

2708
01:46:32,505 --> 01:46:33,380
had nothing to do with trauma.

2709
01:46:35,895 --> 01:46:36,975
It is cumulative though.

2710
01:46:36,975 --> 01:46:37,395
It is.

2711
01:46:37,485 --> 01:46:41,835
No, it is, but like it, but it wasn't a
singular point of trauma that caused that.

2712
01:46:41,835 --> 01:46:41,925
Right.

2713
01:46:41,925 --> 01:46:45,255
Whereas in before, when I had
my p it was a PSD, my P was

2714
01:46:45,255 --> 01:46:47,025
caused by a singular incident.

2715
01:46:47,205 --> 01:46:51,915
In my case, it doesn't always have to
happen that way, but when I was going,

2716
01:46:51,975 --> 01:46:55,935
like the, my, my blast bit of depression
was caused by many different factors

2717
01:46:55,935 --> 01:46:57,075
that were not that, or like that.

2718
01:46:57,075 --> 01:47:00,135
It was, it was a cumulative of, you
know, effort of kind of feeling I

2719
01:47:00,135 --> 01:47:04,605
was losing my who I was and who am
I gonna be as a person or like that.

2720
01:47:04,605 --> 01:47:10,215
But you know, I think as a whole,
like, you know, uh, how do we better

2721
01:47:10,215 --> 01:47:13,335
ourselves as firearm owners and as
firearms community, we have to be able

2722
01:47:13,335 --> 01:47:15,105
to become pillars of the community.

2723
01:47:16,005 --> 01:47:20,235
Well, maybe we put that question out to
the audience as well, and if people have

2724
01:47:20,235 --> 01:47:22,215
had similar experiences, if they've.

2725
01:47:23,250 --> 01:47:26,940
Had experiences that have led
to a positive outcome, that

2726
01:47:27,120 --> 01:47:28,379
things have worked well for them.

2727
01:47:28,889 --> 01:47:30,120
I'd love to hear about it in the comments.

2728
01:47:30,120 --> 01:47:30,480
Yeah, me too.

2729
01:47:30,565 --> 01:47:30,844
I would.

2730
01:47:31,290 --> 01:47:36,120
And if there are groups like the Mens
She Society or like, uh, adult, uh,

2731
01:47:36,144 --> 01:47:41,400
uh, camp sort of thing that they've
found value from that, uh, that

2732
01:47:41,400 --> 01:47:42,780
have worked well, I'd love to see.

2733
01:47:42,929 --> 01:47:46,440
Yeah, I mean, I think that would
be a really, and you know, as well,

2734
01:47:46,440 --> 01:47:49,169
if there's within the firearms
community, if there are actual

2735
01:47:49,169 --> 01:47:50,190
endeavors that are going forward.

2736
01:47:50,250 --> 01:47:52,980
So I know Todd Eey has
got the veteran hunters.

2737
01:47:53,099 --> 01:47:53,280
Mm-hmm.

2738
01:47:53,370 --> 01:47:53,519
Yep.

2739
01:47:53,519 --> 01:47:55,349
He's helped with that of Alberta.

2740
01:47:55,349 --> 01:47:56,849
I think it's spread across Canada.

2741
01:47:57,389 --> 01:48:00,509
Um, but not everyone's gonna be a veteran.

2742
01:48:00,660 --> 01:48:00,870
No.

2743
01:48:00,870 --> 01:48:02,519
And not everyone's gonna
be a first responder.

2744
01:48:02,519 --> 01:48:02,580
No.

2745
01:48:02,849 --> 01:48:06,030
But it doesn't mean we can't
have these same conversations.

2746
01:48:06,120 --> 01:48:07,740
I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a veteran.

2747
01:48:08,490 --> 01:48:13,860
Um, I know, I, but I'm also, that
was, I'm, I'm a veteran, I'm a, you

2748
01:48:13,860 --> 01:48:18,570
know, a former soldier, but I'm also
now a, I'm a spouse and a father.

2749
01:48:18,575 --> 01:48:18,964
Mm-hmm.

2750
01:48:19,184 --> 01:48:20,980
And the, and you know, and.

2751
01:48:21,405 --> 01:48:23,894
Someone who works as a, you know,
a business manager like that.

2752
01:48:23,894 --> 01:48:24,165
Right.

2753
01:48:24,554 --> 01:48:25,934
That's who I, that's who I am now.

2754
01:48:26,535 --> 01:48:27,674
I don't It's what you do.

2755
01:48:27,735 --> 01:48:27,795
Yeah.

2756
01:48:27,795 --> 01:48:28,335
It's what I do.

2757
01:48:28,485 --> 01:48:31,094
But I don't, people think, well,
you're a veteran or like that.

2758
01:48:31,094 --> 01:48:32,804
But that's, that's a, that's,
that's, that's what you did.

2759
01:48:32,804 --> 01:48:33,434
That's what I did.

2760
01:48:33,615 --> 01:48:33,855
Yeah.

2761
01:48:34,545 --> 01:48:36,134
That doesn't mark who I am
now or anything like that.

2762
01:48:36,134 --> 01:48:38,684
And my current stresses and my current
life, who I am now or like that.

2763
01:48:38,684 --> 01:48:43,275
But now does that make me, you know,
does that mean I'm, you know, like I

2764
01:48:43,335 --> 01:48:46,214
now need something that's maybe a little
more, you know, attuned to who I am.

2765
01:48:46,214 --> 01:48:50,745
But I know people who even served in the
military, but because they didn't deploy,

2766
01:48:50,775 --> 01:48:51,974
they don't consider themselves a veteran.

2767
01:48:51,974 --> 01:48:53,355
So they don't apply for the programs.

2768
01:48:53,415 --> 01:48:53,745
Hmm.

2769
01:48:55,275 --> 01:48:58,875
Does there are no less of, their
service was no less than mine.

2770
01:48:58,875 --> 01:49:01,844
Just 'cause I got, I was talking
to a guy just recently, uh, he was,

2771
01:49:02,025 --> 01:49:05,174
we run a, so a quick, quick plug.

2772
01:49:05,684 --> 01:49:06,075
Sure.

2773
01:49:06,134 --> 01:49:11,594
Uh, our so breaded defense technologies,
we do run a, uh, individual officer.

2774
01:49:12,420 --> 01:49:15,390
Officer, I say that, but an Indi Digital
Officer Discount purchase program.

2775
01:49:15,840 --> 01:49:16,020
Okay.

2776
01:49:16,050 --> 01:49:19,500
So if you were current or ex-serving
mil Canadian farm forces of any

2777
01:49:19,500 --> 01:49:24,630
branch, uh, law enforcement or first
responder, you can contact myself

2778
01:49:24,810 --> 01:49:27,150
or I have now have a new associate.

2779
01:49:27,150 --> 01:49:28,050
I finally have some help.

2780
01:49:28,050 --> 01:49:32,610
After nine years, uh, I have a associate
underneath me and you can purchase

2781
01:49:32,640 --> 01:49:37,440
firearms, optics, uh, anything with done
are supported brands at a discounted rate.

2782
01:49:37,470 --> 01:49:37,740
Fantastic.

2783
01:49:37,890 --> 01:49:40,800
And f We do this, we do this
as a thank you for what?

2784
01:49:40,800 --> 01:49:45,120
For your service, because no matter,
but the Kia, that is your service.

2785
01:49:45,270 --> 01:49:45,480
Mm-hmm.

2786
01:49:46,230 --> 01:49:49,770
I just recently talked to a guy who
got back from Latvia, and when he found

2787
01:49:49,770 --> 01:49:52,350
out I was, 'cause I was just kind of,
you know, ask, you know, asking how

2788
01:49:52,350 --> 01:49:55,680
it was, and I kind of, he was like,
oh, it's a little weird coming back.

2789
01:49:55,680 --> 01:49:56,250
And I explained, yeah.

2790
01:49:56,250 --> 01:49:58,950
It was weird for me when I first came back
from Afghanistan too, and instantly, once

2791
01:49:58,950 --> 01:50:02,460
he heard I had been to Afghanistan, he
immediately downplayed his tour as it Oh.

2792
01:50:02,460 --> 01:50:02,970
It was nothing.

2793
01:50:03,030 --> 01:50:05,100
It, like, it was nothing
compared to Afghanistan.

2794
01:50:05,100 --> 01:50:06,990
You guys really were it the shit.

2795
01:50:08,085 --> 01:50:09,884
And I'm like, first of all, you didn't
know what it did in Afghanistan.

2796
01:50:09,884 --> 01:50:11,415
I could have been a
clerk just working Sure.

2797
01:50:11,474 --> 01:50:14,505
In Kro, you know, or like, or you know,
I could have been in Dubai or like that.

2798
01:50:14,565 --> 01:50:14,625
Yeah.

2799
01:50:14,625 --> 01:50:17,054
Like, like not to take anything
from what those people did.

2800
01:50:17,054 --> 01:50:18,434
'cause they did excellent jobs.

2801
01:50:18,855 --> 01:50:20,775
But you automatically go to,
you serve, you, serve you

2802
01:50:20,775 --> 01:50:21,615
automatically go to the thing.

2803
01:50:21,615 --> 01:50:24,554
I was in combat every damn day,
which was not, not the case.

2804
01:50:24,764 --> 01:50:24,795
Hm.

2805
01:50:26,565 --> 01:50:30,075
Dude, you left your home for six
months to serve your country.

2806
01:50:30,075 --> 01:50:31,605
To serve your country
with a question mark.

2807
01:50:31,665 --> 01:50:31,934
Yep.

2808
01:50:32,175 --> 01:50:35,565
People, I've lost friends in training
just as much as I lost friends.

2809
01:50:35,570 --> 01:50:35,679
Right.

2810
01:50:35,684 --> 01:50:39,884
In, you know, in, in life
situations, in operations overseas.

2811
01:50:40,755 --> 01:50:42,705
Um, hurt is hurt.

2812
01:50:42,795 --> 01:50:43,394
Dead is dead.

2813
01:50:43,844 --> 01:50:43,995
Yeah.

2814
01:50:44,655 --> 01:50:46,304
Doesn't matter how it
happened or like that.

2815
01:50:46,815 --> 01:50:49,875
And you came back and you served
your country proudly like that.

2816
01:50:49,875 --> 01:50:52,724
You should never, I told 'em, you never,
you should never diminish what you did.

2817
01:50:54,105 --> 01:50:58,934
Whether you earned a medal, whether you
earned the CD or a sacrifice medal or

2818
01:50:58,934 --> 01:51:00,764
the, or the Victoria Cross or like that.

2819
01:51:00,764 --> 01:51:02,085
You never should diminish what you did.

2820
01:51:02,085 --> 01:51:02,625
'cause service.

2821
01:51:02,625 --> 01:51:03,825
Your service is your service.

2822
01:51:04,035 --> 01:51:04,155
Yeah.

2823
01:51:04,934 --> 01:51:05,925
So just be honest.

2824
01:51:05,925 --> 01:51:06,200
If, if.

2825
01:51:06,960 --> 01:51:11,190
If you think you could benefit from one of
these programs, it doesn't matter whether

2826
01:51:11,190 --> 01:51:14,610
you consider yourself a veteran or not,
like that, everyone else also side does.

2827
01:51:14,610 --> 01:51:14,820
Yeah.

2828
01:51:14,910 --> 01:51:18,210
It doesn't matter whether like, who,
like, and, but unfortunately as well

2829
01:51:18,270 --> 01:51:21,060
there is gonna people within that, in
that group that is gonna maybe look down

2830
01:51:21,060 --> 01:51:25,020
on you because, 'cause it's happened
to me where, uh, I, you know, I, my

2831
01:51:25,020 --> 01:51:28,200
service was Afghanistan and I've had
guys who surf in Bosnia that for some

2832
01:51:28,200 --> 01:51:30,750
reason looked down on my service 'cause
I wasn't in Bosnia earth like that.

2833
01:51:30,755 --> 01:51:30,835
Mm-hmm.

2834
01:51:30,920 --> 01:51:34,380
We're, again, we're whole, we're horrible
to each other as ve as as veterans

2835
01:51:34,380 --> 01:51:35,550
we're horrible to each other as men.

2836
01:51:35,550 --> 01:51:36,150
Earth like that.

2837
01:51:36,300 --> 01:51:36,840
Sorry, I wasn't

2838
01:51:36,840 --> 01:51:37,800
fighting in grade school.

2839
01:51:37,860 --> 01:51:38,130
Yeah.

2840
01:51:38,790 --> 01:51:39,240
Sorry.

2841
01:51:39,360 --> 01:51:42,480
I was, yeah, I was eight years old
when that, when that war happened.

2842
01:51:42,480 --> 01:51:44,040
Sorry, I couldn't join
you on that one like that.

2843
01:51:44,040 --> 01:51:44,280
Right.

2844
01:51:44,280 --> 01:51:49,170
But, uh, but the fact of the matter
is, is that, you know, we never

2845
01:51:49,170 --> 01:51:52,710
should have to de to lower ourselves
or diminish our ourselves down

2846
01:51:52,770 --> 01:51:54,900
thinking that we we're not worthy of.

2847
01:51:55,335 --> 01:51:56,025
Being happy.

2848
01:51:56,235 --> 01:51:56,355
Mm-hmm.

2849
01:51:56,415 --> 01:52:01,395
And being healthy and being, being,
being present and being just as much as

2850
01:52:01,785 --> 01:52:03,255
present in our lives as we are in others.

2851
01:52:03,255 --> 01:52:03,765
Something like that.

2852
01:52:03,885 --> 01:52:07,425
So, um, I, I, I can't think I
can say it any better than that.

2853
01:52:07,545 --> 01:52:07,905
So

2854
01:52:07,910 --> 01:52:10,065
I, I was just gonna say, I
really like how you said that.

2855
01:52:10,065 --> 01:52:10,245
I,

2856
01:52:12,045 --> 01:52:14,685
so, I, I, I like your, I wanna
put it out to the community.

2857
01:52:14,715 --> 01:52:16,305
Firearms community, outdoor community.

2858
01:52:16,965 --> 01:52:21,735
One, have you had success, you know,
within your own, with your own mental

2859
01:52:21,735 --> 01:52:22,605
struggles, something like that.

2860
01:52:22,605 --> 01:52:23,595
And finding yourself out of it.

2861
01:52:23,625 --> 01:52:26,325
'cause I don't wanna be the only guy
who's yelling from the rooftop or

2862
01:52:26,385 --> 01:52:29,085
like, here about my, you know, like
I've been there, I've done that.

2863
01:52:29,085 --> 01:52:31,515
I've, as you said, it does put
a little dent in the thing.

2864
01:52:31,515 --> 01:52:36,225
I wanna know, have you been able to pull
yourself out through positive means,

2865
01:52:36,285 --> 01:52:39,675
either within the firearms in, uh,
committee or with it being outdoors?

2866
01:52:40,125 --> 01:52:42,885
And for those of them that are running
those programs or those that'd be

2867
01:52:42,885 --> 01:52:44,265
interested in starting a program?

2868
01:52:44,265 --> 01:52:47,955
I wanna hear from you as well,
because as you said, there's some

2869
01:52:47,955 --> 01:52:49,845
groups out there that do it, but.

2870
01:52:50,759 --> 01:52:54,240
You know, we need, we need more
people willing to participate

2871
01:52:54,240 --> 01:52:57,780
and more people willing to, to,
you know, facilitate as well.

2872
01:52:58,830 --> 01:52:58,889
The

2873
01:52:58,889 --> 01:52:59,730
question is out there.

2874
01:52:59,849 --> 01:52:59,940
Yeah.

2875
01:52:59,940 --> 01:53:00,900
Challenges out there.

2876
01:53:01,710 --> 01:53:03,570
Um, let's see what we come back with.

2877
01:53:03,660 --> 01:53:03,870
Love it.

2878
01:53:04,679 --> 01:53:07,320
David, thank you so much for
coming back much on the podcast.